lusty musk
@fickle yew Would it be possible for poe.ninja to add a 'minimum stock' dropdown to pages that list bulk items (anything that can be traded on https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/exchange/ )? The prices would reflect the results you would get from filling the minimum stock option on the bulk trade site. Mockup:
to prevent a lot of dynamic database queries from happening I would suggest only a couple limited values in the dropdown, e.g. 1 (the default), 10, 100, 1000, which means you 'only' have to compute cache and supply 4 sets of numbers for each currency (another more expensive option which might help people more is 1, 10, 25, 100, 250, 1000)
the reason why I ask is because poe.ninja is sadly quite useless for establishing the 'real' price of certain commodities like fossils, scarabs, essences, etc, which (to me at least) are only interesting when traded in bulk
and the bulk price is very much different than the single price, in a lot of cases
e.g. poe.ninja says that a shrieking essence of greed costs 2 chaos, great, but if I want to actually buy any decent amount and put minimum stock to 25 suddenly it's 4 chaos
fickle yew
Yep that one is already on my list. It's not trivial, but I'll try to move it up a bit on the priority list 🙂
worthy cape
‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Ecosystem Where This Regularly Happens
Got to love that the actor seems incompetent at actually deploying the trojan smoothly, I wonder if most of anyone would've noticed if it didn't blow up initially.
frank drift
yep, and attacker only targeted Windows machines
frank drift
seemingly they just added everybody
worthy cape
"we pondered for the longest while whether to let zensei in but in the end figured that if that's where we put the bar, might just let everyone in"
simple ravine
hah
if this sucker can make it work, then everyone else will too, so what the heck, here ya'll
frank drift
maybe trying to distract from the news of original CEO leaving and Microsoft guy taking over
simple ravine
nah that has been planned for quite a while now
copilot trolling u back, i like it
thinking about it, this tech could potentially be used in code reviews to find common mistakes better than sonarqube etc
mortal bone
Anyone happen to know if there is a 4k version of the MasteryPassiveIcons?
the normal assets are ~70% the size of the 4k assets. The mastery icons are the limiting factor now...
worthy cape
Art\2DArt\SkillIcons\passives\MasteryPassiveIcons\PassiveMasteryAccuracyActive.dds and friends? Seems like just the 256x256 one.
worthy cape
Has anyone looked at how the allocation VFX is wired up yet?
mortal bone
What allocation vfx?
worthy cape
The trailer showed some fancy effects when allocating masteries. Was that just pretend or are those effects in the actual game, and if so, how are they done?
mortal bone
Ohh, yeah I thought those were super cool. I just assumed those are some after effects or something
.9858 is the best we can do. I haven't messed with any of the other assets yet though
It does look like they are using a shader for the tree now though
worthy cape
Looking in my in-game tree, there's some subtle animation on masteries while allocated.
mortal bone
Yeah, the connections even have something over the top
there is a subtle "wavey" thing on them
mortal bone
Oh there is a little flash of light
worthy cape
Y'all owe me an Orb of Regret 😄
mortal bone
haha I have a ton of standard characters that I can mess with
also, you can see that the "can allocate" nodes kind of pulse
worthy cape
Oh yeah, subtle.
mortal bone
when a node isn't skilled but selected there is a glow
worthy cape
Oh right, there was all the entrypoints in Shaders/PassiveSkillScreenEffects.hlsl we found already, including distortion from shockwaves.
mortal bone
I love that you can see the comments in the shader code 😄
// TODO: base on the source image size
simple ravine
Deallocation + allocation
Looks like lens flare / bloom stuff happening
snow whale
anyone know if a data dump for which vendors sell particular gems (e.g., hydrosphere is sold by the act 4 vendor) is available somewhere?
worthy cape
It was removed from game files a few leagues ago, not sure if the contents of the newly appeared rewards DAT have been extracted and interpreted.
rapid pagoda
It was removed from game files a few leagues ago, not sure if the contents of th...
a quick analyze on the data file doesn't look terribly promising
snow whale
i hope @velvet fog doesn't have to maintain https://poedb.tw/us/Quest#QuestReward manually :\
mortal bone
sadly, I can't take a proper screenshot because the tree is massive now, but this is all the way zoomed it at .9143 scale 😄
I still need to work on all the assets, but the export works at any scale under .9143 (not using 4k assets yet) for sprite sheets
grizzled seal
@fickle yew not sure if you've noticed already, but Kalguuran Delirium Orbs currently show up on the wrong page (they're at the bottom of Currency instead of the Delirium Orb page)
velvet fog
i hope <@!212745961657597952> doesn't have to maintain <https://poedb.tw/us/Ques...
QuestReward.dat is back, but the Gem Vendor maintains it manually.
mortal bone
the Resistance and Ailment Protection Mastery have the wrong base icon 😄
"17127": {
"name": "Resistance and Ailment Protection Mastery",
"icon": "Art/2DArt/SkillIcons/passives/MasteryPoison.png",
...
}
lunar crypt
theres also a glowing animation on the mastery ring before you click "apply points"
fickle yew
<@!179224234923524096> not sure if you've noticed already, but Kalguuran Deliriu...
Oops. I'll move it. Thanks!
long sky
One to watch for folks using cookie consent mechanisms on their websites https://www.iccl.ie/news/online-consent-pop-ups-used-by-google-and-other-tech-firms-declared-illegal/
frank drift
they'll tweak one part of it and it'll be another four years before anything happens, I'm sure
simple ravine
ah yes I read this yesterday, a big smack-down on advertisers and a win for privacy
i recall when running an affiliate marketing business (we spent an absurd amount on advertising), and real time bidding mechanisms were the new hot thing back then
it's a complete sham
empty venture
Imo it just shows how stupid the whole GDPR is. It has no effect on actually protecting ur data - if a shady company wants to get ur data they will and very often there is very little u can do about it. It is mostly an annoyance for normal ppl (eg. u have to click 5 different popups to read a stupid webpage) and regular companies (consent required for basically anything), no much else.
Example of a shady company getting ur data: some time ago my phone number and probably some other data got collected by some company and they are selling it to others. Now, every now and then, I get spam called with some bullshit offers (record was like 15 phone calls in a single day). Sometimes they clearly know where I live (they are calling from some far away city regarding a presentation in my home town). Very often those are just some bots, some recordings. They won't tell u the company's name, u can't talk to a real person. U can't really track who is calling so u can't request them to delete ur personal data. GDPR is worthless here, there is nothing u can do about this crap.
mortal bone
theres also a glowing animation on the mastery ring before you click "apply poin...
There are a few glow effects in the assets. I am not sure if they are actually used or if it is all in the shader
long sky
Imo it just shows how stupid the whole GDPR is. It has no effect on actually pro...
The regulation itself is fine, but the various European regulatory bodies have so far proven to be completely toothless - mostly because they're all underfunded or in the case of Ireland, trying to turn a blind eye because tech companies represent significant tax income for them.
What sucks, as someone who works directly in marketing, is seeing how many of my colleagues just flat out don't give a fuck.
mortal bone
I have a lot of the basic assets done. The tree looks really nice 😄
Ignore the incorrect drawing of the mastery...that is just a layer issue haha
empty venture
The regulation itself is fine, but the various European regulatory bodies have s...
Idea is cool but there are many holes ppl are using and it's very hard to enforce it
worthy cape
One of the big effects I've seen is that it makes serious players consider what data they keep and distribute instead of hoarding and sending anything and everything through email.
Kind of intermingled with information classification at work of course, so hard to pick them apart but when you've got the ability for individuals to request "all the shit you've got on me", you sort your systems out quickly after the first few.
Human-based DoS.
simple ravine
I am very annoyed with GDPR and how it has been played out especially with Schrems II and everything
But what is more dumb is the US CLOUD (Clarifying Lawful Overseas Use of Data) Act
which makes it difficult for US companies to serve European customers
worthy cape
Maybe they should work out of countries with better consumer laws 😉
But yeah, we're shutting our gapps down hard next year due to Google not being interested in addressing concerns.
simple ravine
well, for a company like Microsoft which was started in the 80s, and is a publicly traded company, they can't just "hop over" to EU
worthy cape
MS are way more interested in fixing stuff.
simple ravine
they are, but there's only so much they can do when the swedish SOU (goverment's official investigations) deem encryption at rest and in transit as insufficient for protecting private data.
did you read the white-paper which the swedish insurance agency wrote a couple of years ago?
simple ravine
it's rabid, diplomatically speaking
there is an executive summary for tldr
both Social Insurance Agency and Tax Authorities are extremely against all hyperscalers (azure, aws, gcp) because if FISA 702, NSA, and at the time the political scene with Trump etc
so, now a lot of public sector actors in Sweden, are scrambling to find collaboration tools and such
because they can't use the best-in-class tools, such as O365 or G Suite because their legal department just hands them a blanket no
the incompetence from the people investigating this is glaringly obvious
worthy cape
Self-hosted NextCloud/OwnCloud, ho!
simple ravine
Problem is then you're back to capital expenditure (capex) instead of operational expenditure (opex)... you need to invest in hardware and capacity planning
and you lose all the added value of all the 'as a Service' offerings provide
worthy cape
simple ravine
operating "cloud platforms" for production systems on the same level as "the big 3" are is very difficult, so a lot of organizations who don't have the capabilities of that, will be left at the sidelines
worthy cape
Was gonna say that you consults are gonna have a field day, but that kind of assumes there's actual solutions.
simple ravine
microsoft invests $1 billion per year in cyber security alone, which is unfortunate you can't leverage
I mean, I'm not happy about it. I just want the best stuff available
I rather us spend time bringing actual business value, and able to "innovate" rather than solving all this nonsense
The bad part is... GDPR has negligible effect, comparing with the cost it has caused all companies
the law text is vague and sloppy
long sky
the law text is vague and sloppy
Disagree there, it’s not at all vague
simple ravine
Oh really, if you can make sense of it, you're one of few that can make bank on saying what and how to deal with certain sections, as opinions are many
Hence a lot of blanket statements from both inside and outside counsels are issued, saying even with proper information classification and RSAs conducted, they cannot leverage certain services at all
long sky
That’s not a legislative problem though, that’s a product one
worthy cape
Kind of indirectly if the company/department attitude is that unless the legal grounds are completely clear, we can't do shit.
simple ravine
That’s not a legislative problem though, that’s a product one
sure, whatever you say
worthy cape
Lawyers love saying "no".
long sky
Kind of indirectly if the company/department attitude is that unless the legal g...
Ultimately it’s risk management, plenty of businesses attention following the letter or the spirit of the law because they see it as another cost of business
Companies running their own email infrastructure isn’t anything new though, even if spinning up an MTA is a fucking mess and becoming ever harder as email is consolidated behind a few tech giants who control inbox placement
simple ravine
I've spoken to plentiful of legal experts who disagree with your sentiment that it's "not at all vague".
I've read it a couple of times, and can't make a lot of sense to what the expectations are. What do they mean when they say "adequate" in some context, as an example? Only a court can rule on that.
long sky
Sure, but that’s true of any law, the legislative body can’t be expected to explicitly state what can and can’t be done when the technology moves st the pace it does
And regulatory bodies have shown that they are willing to work with businesses to resolve issues rather than going straight for the nuclear option
simple ravine
And regulatory bodies have shown that they are willing to work with businesses t...
Examples? All I have seen are huge fines and rulings
e.g. British Airways etc
long sky
You know the BA fine@got walked back?
simple ravine
Sure, but that’s true of any law, the legislative body can’t be expected to expl...
Technology moves quickly in certain ways, but some things are still the same as they were 10+ years ago. Data locality and sovereignty won't change much.
long sky
simple ravine
You know the BA fine@got walked back?
I didn't, that's interesting.
long sky
So did the other large fine issued by the ICO
simple ravine
£20M is still a huge fine
long sky
And frankly, BA deserved an 180 million pound fine for putting customers at risk in the way they did
They couldn’t even secure their payment infrastructure
simple ravine
Cybercriminals will always be able to breach well-secured infrastructure. I don't like that rhetoric
long sky
The Marriott fine was hugely reduced too https://ico.org.uk/about-the-ico/news-and-events/news-and-blogs/2020/10/ico-fines-marriott-international-inc-184million-for-failing-to-keep-customers-personal-data-secure/
long sky
Cybercriminals will always be able to breach well-secured infrastructure. I don'...
It’s complicated though, someone has to pay the piper, it’s either the business that fucked up, their insurance provider or us
I’d rather the business that fucked up paid up
simple ravine
A fine doesn't make it any better for the people who were affected
long sky
Cybersecurity insurance is going through a whole thing the last couple years, enforcement is coming
simple ravine
unless it's directed towards the data subjects who suffered
long sky
I work for a cybersecurity startup so have fairly strong opinions on the subject 😅
simple ravine
good for you
Then you should know that organizations such as Revil will always be able to attack companies, steal and threaten them. This means that only the most tech-savvy people should be allowed to conduct business on the Internet who can stand a chance against such criminals.
long sky
I mean, the reality right now is that the bar is set exceptionally low for business deploying even the most basic of practices
simple ravine
Is there even a set bar?
simple ravine
So if you follow these Cyber Essentials, and still get your data stolen, you're not fined by ICO?
long sky
covers real basic stuff. Firewalls, secure configuration, access control, malware protection and patch management
The ICO isn't fining businesses that are hacked, as far as I'm aware
Insurance providers might not protect businesses that don't cover themselves though https://searchsecurity.techtarget.com/news/252507932/Cyber-insurance-premiums-costs-skyrocket-as-attacks-surge
simple ravine
simple ravine
BA as well then I guess
long sky
BA allowed an attacker to inject javascript in their payment gateway for months
simple ravine
well, not what i was asking
simple ravine
if you're following the low bar you were referring to, does that mean that you won't be fined if your data is breached?
simple ravine
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/british-airways-data-breach-gdpr-fine
hindsight is always 20/20
long sky
Large businesses are or should already have iso 27001
if you're asleep at the wheel then yeah, you can probably expect to get fined
simple ravine
take it from someone who've developed software for 20+ years... it takes a single mistake or a 0-day you missed for whatever reason, and ur business can be doomed
worthy cape
"we'll fix this the next time the waterfall loops, no worries" 😛
long sky
I mean, BA, Marriot, Equifax, Solarwinds, Kaseya, etc are all still around
Oh and that Target payment breach from quite a few years ago, that one was a doozy
simple ravine
again, developer mistakes will always happen, even with the best of intentions and great developers behind the wheel
it's easy to laugh at companies who've made mistakes
long sky
sure, but mistakes != organisational failures
underinvestment in cybersecurity for years, lack of training, etc, that's what'll get you fined. Not making a mistake
In the BA example, they hadn't updated a piece of code with known vulnerabilities since 2012
that's not a mistake
simple ravine
it's a lack of knowledge
long sky
right, organisational failure
to be clear I'm not pointing fingers at any individual devs, the system there was clearly the problem
It does highlight some issues we'll likely see a lot more of in this age of npm everything tho
simple ravine
if the tech people said "we believe it's all good" and management trust their employees, you can consider it organisational failure
we try to educate our customers every day about this
then they go buy some off-the-shelf ERP system which has a 6-month+ at best patch cycle, and voila
hollow sorrel
Is oAuth mandatory or is there still an accepted, simpler way if I just want to fiddle around with my own item filters using the poe-api for example? (assuming python+requests-lib, no selenium-funk)
worthy cape
Many endpoints still talk with you if you auth via session ID cookie, don't forget to set a nice user agent.
grave wren
"zao's special tool v1" 😉
worthy cape
often imitated, never duplicated
I'm baffled and and surprised today, it turns out that "I should use a browser as frontend for this" was the correct choice for a tool.
Breaking apart some HTML into a nice JSON blob, using Python on the backend with soup, visualising the fragments and the parses on a webpage fed over fastapi.
mortal bone
anyone else notice that the shadow is completely misaligned?
All of the other classes are spot on 😄
mortal bone
Also, I think I might have to generate the curves on my own...I don't think the 4k images can make up for the difference in scale which really sucks
civic crane
I'm (still) waiting 
compact isle
same
velvet fog
@worthy cape https://www.artstation.com/artwork/qQLG9L
violet surge
The attributes on the Sanctity node in Pob are different than ingame
mortal bone
just pushed up all the assets except curves at the 0.9013 zoom level (or 1.0 for non-zoom level assets): https://github.com/poe-tool-dev/passive-skill-tree-json/tree/feature/zoom-level-1/3.16.0-zoom-level-1
I will work on orbits probably tomorrow. I just need to slice them properly from the tile map then scale them down. They are the full size which is nice
worthy cape
🪐
mortal bone
I am really sad because not everything has 4k assets
Although, I could use the 4k assets where possible and compress them down.
velvet fog
hazy fog
fuck yo books
mortal bone
just finished up adding orbits 🙂
all the "tree assets" are done. If there are other assets that you want me to generate I can
Sadly, I can't generate a screenshot from the canvas because the thing exceeds 2gb 😄
mortal bone
warning this eats up a massive amount of ram: https://poeskilltree.com/?v=3.16.0-z0.9013
I definitely need to optimize my stuff 😄
mortal bone
Yeah, I wasn't joking 😄
civic crane
f for canvas
mortal bone
oof
worthy cape
Minification is a bit icky:
Is this mipmapping much or is it criminally undersampled?
mortal bone
so, I honestly don't know. I am currently using a library called pixijs, and pretty much everything on screen is a Sprite
worthy cape
I wonder if an analogous PoB would need a 64-bit process.
mortal bone
The total assets are like ~140mb
worthy cape
Still haven't figured out how to make Lua be able to leak more than two gigs in 64-bit, must either be failing to use GC64 or holding it wrong.
mortal bone
It is about ~100mb bigger than 0.3835
uses just under 2gb
Although connections aren't drawn like they are in pob
worthy cape
I wonder if you can spritesheet oddly sized DDS files or if the right/bottom sides are likely to misrender.
mortal bone
That would be interesting. The problem with spritesheeting the DDS files is you would have to process them into the correct target sizes
Not all the assets are sized correctly
I do find it interesting that the frames are such are spritesheets though...
carmine merlin
Wonder how much stuff would need to change in PoB to get those textures working
worthy cape
Runtime-side there might be a bit of compat problem if sheets are too large given GPU texture restrictions, and also eating more VRAM for users.
Lua-side, heaven knows.
mortal bone
I might be mistaken, but I didn't really see zoomlevel aware code. there is a lot of scaling this oddly that happens
hazy fiber
for PoB we currently only use the largest image we have atm right? so we would defs atleast need to get it to dynamically use the smaller textures
mortal bone
Well, most applications only use the biggest asset when rendering. There isn't a way to dynamically use other assets. Skill Sprites are all there though
I definitely could generate all resources and stick them in a folder with their zoom level. There isn't really a point though if you use the biggest zoom level
mortal bone
@worthy cape I fixed the memory issues...the website doesn't destroy your gpu anymore either 😄
civic crane
ivory echo
am i misunderstanding something or bug? I frenzy charge of 1 seems to not differ from unchecked "use frenzy" box
also no way to set 0. so what does a frenezy charge set to 1 mean?
abusing 0 - a clearnly possible anwser - as the "default everyrtihng" value seems glitchy
grave wren
its not abusing when having 0 frenzy charges is the default
you also can aset it to 0 in pob and theres a difference between 0,1,2,3,...
hazy fiber
am i misunderstanding something or bug? I frenzy charge of 1 seems to not differ...
this could be becouse you have a minimum frenzy so it cant go to 0
ivory echo
oh nice
but zero is special?
bc i dont have a mim power chrg but it seems to itnerpret it that way
kind of makes it hard to pob not having a min charge too, yo would thnk that would override
similar to if you put the number above your max
hazy fiber
shouldnt be, if your sure you have no min power charges, and 0 and 1 charge is the same, report the bug on github
ivory echo
0 is the same as max. have to uncheck the use box to see 0
hazy fiber
ahh, it treats it the same as not having anything in the box
yeah, I guess just unticking the charge is the same as setting it to 0 🤷♂️
if you really need the functionality of setting it to 0, go make a feature request on the github
lusty musk
that's it, thanks
lusty musk
regarding the X-Rate-Limits, how are these computed? say the request limit window is 5 seconds, I make a request which arrives at the server at time t and the server takes 10 seconds to fully answer (because overloaded and/or big reply like public-stash-tabs)
does my limit state go from 0 to 1 at t (request start), or at t + 10 (request answered)?
does my limit state go from 1 to 0 at t + 5 (5 seconds after request start), or at t+15 (5 seconds after request fully answered)?
or something else?
@compact isle I guess you would know this
civic crane
you already asked #tooldev-general message
oak estuary
I'm more interested in how @civic crane remembered this from almost 18 months ago
lusty musk
I think to be conservative I should only start ticking down the throttle timer when I receive the first response byte from the server
inland kestrel
@velvet fog if you don't mind me asking, where did the weights of veiled modifiers come from? I don't see the values mentioned in the latest ggpk data and I was wondering if you are assuming from historical data or if it's specified outside of the Mods data. What caught my eye was % chance to Suppress Spell Damage which appears to be reusing the JunMaster2SpellDodgePercentage1 id.
ref: https://poedb.tw/us/Veiled_modifier#VeiledModifiers
ref: https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Modifier:JunMaster2SpellDodgePercentage1
velvet fog
<@!212745961657597952> if you don't mind me asking, where did the weights of vei...
veiled modifiers come from ModDomainsID=28
inland kestrel
Oh. I overlooked 28. I'm still a little confused because I see "_key":16860,"Id":"JunMasterVeiledSpellDodgePercentage__" which I believe matches the "+(18–21)% chance to Suppress Spell Damage" body armor mod, however, my ggpk shows "Stat1Min":12,"Stat1Max":14 instead of the 18-21 I see on poedb. Is this just a case of those values needing to get thrown the one of the many display functions to render the display value?
civic crane
yes, it's a new stat in this patch, added exclusively for purposes of "migrating" existing items, and it has quantifier (12*1.5=18)
inland kestrel
okay, I was actually hoping that was the case (because I know how to handle that... just don't have coded in yet)
lusty musk
@compact isle minor nitpick on https://www.pathofexile.com/developer/docs/reference#type-Item, item -> extended -> subcategories has type "array of string" when it should have "?array of string" since it can be missing
compact isle
ah good catch
lusty musk
other than that I just wrote this which hasn't broken on at least a couple pages yet: https://gist.github.com/orlp/afc64ebab07fac5b28fb706fa47200e4
velvet fog
description
1 base_spell_suppression_chance_150%_of_value
1
# "{0:+d}% chance to Suppress Spell Damage" times_one_point_five 1 reminderstring ReminderTextSuppression
you need to handle times_one_point_five parameter @inland kestrel
compact isle
welcome to the miserable world of stat description functions
clever thistle
anyone know of a way to use an appveyor.yml file to make a local development install? (python)
delicate ore
did rasmuskl leave
hazy fiber
no?
delicate ore
nvm discord just buggin out
worthy cape
Cat ate their face.
timber path
anyone know of a way to use an `appveyor.yml` file to make a local development i...
I have some limited experience with AppVeyor from getting it to build an Electron app; so it's not really python, but shouldn't be too different I think?
clever thistle
I have some limited experience with AppVeyor from getting it to build an Electro...
i was hoping there was a plug-in for vscode/etc to interpret the file for dependencies at least, but alas i can't find anything at all. i ended up just rewriting the yml file to work(ish) from powershell (a powershell shell? a power-shell?)
timber path
i was hoping there was a plug-in for vscode/etc to interpret the file for depend...
Nope, there is no such thing. I had to google quite a lot too and look at other actually working examples and use their validator a lot to see if my syntax was fine or not. If you're interested and want to take a look: https://github.com/PoE-Overlay-Community/PoE-Overlay-Community-Fork/blob/master/appveyor.yml
Most of the commands I used are just windows cmd commands, there's only like a single powershell command (prefixed with ps: )
clever thistle
yeah, the only minor hiccup was Start-FileDownload which is a custom appveyor module
timber path
https://github.com/bleachbit/bleachbit/blob/master/appveyor.yml
You seem to be installing quite a bit of stuff, aren't those things included with a new "image" of the builder? Yours runs on VS 2013, which is quite old tbh. https://www.appveyor.com/docs/windows-images-software/ contains info on what software is contained in each image. Proabably you got your reasons to run on a such an out-dated builder image...
clever thistle
that's not mine btw, i'm just following the instructions for "running from source" in the bleachbit repo. i think it uses an old pygobjectwin32/gtk/pygi which only works with python3.4 32bit ...
i've only installed the bits i think i'll need, haven't done anything further yet, just enjoying the smell
timber path
@fickle yew Blight-Ravaged maps are listed under the normal Maps section, perhaps they should get their own section (just like "normal" blighted maps have) ? -- Maybe scourged maps too?
fickle yew
<@!179224234923524096> Blight-Ravaged maps are listed under the normal Maps sect...
Yep I'll try and get it done tonight. Should blight ravaged go in blighted or seperate?
timber path
Yep I'll try and get it done tonight. Should blight ravaged go in blighted or se...
I would say, make it its own category (i.e. separate), since there are a ton of "blighted" maps to begin with and the ravaged maps will likely always be worth more than a normal blighted map, so it would push blighted maps to the bottom of the list anyway.
fickle yew
I would say, make it its own category (i.e. separate), since there are a ton of ...
There you go. They'll disappear from the main Maps catagory as they populate over the next day or so.
grave pilot
How would I set up an Energy Blade with pob?
hazy fiber
iirc theres a working PR with it, you can just use his branch with a develop setup
or an easier option is, you can paste a "cheat" weapon that mimics energy blade
strong otter
Question, is anyone actively working on poe.py anymore? Looks like the answer is no, but wanted to know if people were actively working on updating before I just wrote my own/updated/etc.
worthy cape
Not sure which project you refer to.
strong otter
worthy cape
Never looked at it, heh.
lunar crypt
This is our (wiki) fork of PyPoE https://github.com/Project-Path-of-Exile-Wiki/PyPoE
lunar crypt
If there is an alternate item parsing library, I'm all ears.
If you need help getting started I recommend checking the GitHub wiki pages, and feel free to join the discord or ask here
strong otter
If you need help getting started I recommend checking the GitHub wiki pages, and...
Thank you will dive in!
stuck edge
Quick question, would I be breaking ToS if I were to screenscrape and autoclick whilst crafting?
frank drift
yes
worthy cape
Very much so, multiple different actions from a single user action or from no user action.
safe quartz
Quick question, would I be breaking ToS if I were to screenscrape and autoclick ...
The autoclicker is a problem, since TOS specify that you can only do 1 SERVER side action per button click.
The screenshot itself is a CLIENT side action and is totally fine, to my understanding of the TOS, but IANAL
worthy cape
It's sketchy in that the user action (take screenshot or start recording) cannot result in different actions based on non-user supplied state.
safe quartz
Hmm?
worthy cape
It's like a flask cycle macro that on each player press drinks a different bottle.
If the user invokes something, that something has to do the same thing every time and can't leverage state information gathered to do different things.
So something that takes a screenshot in response to user input and does different things based on what it can "see", that's not good.
safe quartz
Yeah, that's a bit weird, and tbh. I don't think that's enforceable, even tho it's against ToS
worthy cape
All this is about the spirit of the rules, detection and enforceability are quite orthogonal concerns.
safe quartz
Do ToS disallow account selling?
safe quartz
Because if they do, ToS do not apply legally to EU citizens at all.
worthy cape
I'm not going to go into a discussion about whether inapplicable clauses in a ToU invalidates the whole thing or not.
safe quartz
That also depends on where you are in the world.
worthy cape
Also point 20, regarding MTX points/items.
safe quartz
Might wanna have a look on EuGH C-128/11
worthy cape
I leave this to the people who think it's a fun time to fuck with service providers and start legal battles that only result in animosity.
(that is, the type of person you meet at FOSDEM)
safe quartz
Kekw I saw that
safe quartz
As a German, i can agree, we break the internet with lawsuits.
Anyways I think people should stick to ToS, GGG made a great game, and doing something against ToS is really disrespectful.
worthy cape
Side note, manual invocation is required - screen reading is called out as explicitly not allowed: https://www.pathofexile.com/developer/docs
empty venture
Because if they do, ToS do not apply legally to EU citizens at all.
based on what it doesn't apply?
safe quartz
EU laws basically say; you as a citizen are allowed to sell virtual goods and companies can't deny that with their ToS, therefore the ToS is possibly invalid for EU citizens. But I am not a lawyer, therefore take my statements with a grain of salt.
worthy cape
In general in contract law, unless the invalid term is essential to the contract, the rest still stands.
The loophole of finding some tiny "gotcha" glitch that would invalidate the whole agreement, that's not really a thing in most jurisdictions.
tiny cargo
Severability: If any provision of these Terms of Use is held to be invalid, void, unenforceable or illegal for any reason, such provision shall be deemed to be severed from these Terms of Use, but only to the minimum extent necessary to avoid such issue and the remainder of any such provision as well as all other provisions of these Terms of Use shall continue in full force.
it's actually in the ToS too, 35.. In Germany they are often called "salvatorische Klausel" and quite common for most contracts
worthy cape
Ah, figured there was one of those in there somewhere.
empty venture
The question is if those virtual goods/account are urs in the first place. If you don't have ownership of it you can't demand ability to sell it
but what do I know, I'm a mere programmer
simple ravine
As a German, i can agree, we break the internet with lawsuits.
You and Austrians... Max Schrems come to mind
golden bane
I've filed a complaint to the European Commission before... You might be onto something here 😄
ebon kernel
@compact isle - are there any API plans for forum posts/threads* 🤔? can't really find anything related to this topic
rapid pagoda
EU laws basically say; you as a citizen are allowed to sell virtual goods and co...
What law are you referring to? I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist, or doesn't mean what you think it means
(In particular, this isn't what the "data portability" articles of GDPR mean.)
safe quartz
What law are you referring to? I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist, or doesn't mean...
As i said, im not a laywer, but if i understand this:
EuGH C-128/11
Lawsuit correctly, it means that selling of used licenses (i.E. account data and therefore the license for that account) can not be forbidden.
the right to distribute a copy of the Program is exhausted upon the first sale of such copy of the Program by the copyright holder or with its consent
rapid pagoda
No, you haven't understood that correctly. An account, or a virtual good, is not a software license.
safe quartz
i think the answer to that question isnt that simple and should be kept to a professional lawyer, tbh.
especially since account in this case implies that you have a license (not in programming terms, but in law terms) to use the game
rapid pagoda
It's already settled case law in Germany. http://juris.bundesgerichtshof.de/cgi-bin/rechtsprechung/document.py?Gericht=bgh&Art=en&Datum=2010-2&Seite=4&nr=52877&pos=136&anz=313 (some translation may be required, but the TL;DR is a consumer group sued Steam to try to allow transfer of games on that platform, or transfer of accounts, and lost)
stoic mason
Anyone familiar with how to use poedb's XHR features?
safe quartz
It's already settled case law in Germany. http://juris.bundesgerichtshof.de/cgi-...
i know that case, but that one is for revoking a steam license if you want to sell a single game and not for the account as a whole, so its a different case imo.
doesnt really matter in the end tho, since this is getting really out of hand
rapid pagoda
i know that case, but that one is for *revoking* a steam license if you want to ...
If my grasp of the language is correct, the ruling also recognizes that, if a platform doesn't contractually allow for accounts to be transferred, you can't violate that for the purposes of resale
south plinth
hola soy nuevo no entiendo nada
alguien que hable español y tenga algun gremio que me pueda ayudar o enseñar ?
porfavor
pseudo ocean
does anyone know if exilence is still working? mine is giving me code 401
pseudo ocean
yes! is not working, maybe website is down?
velvet fog
they have a discord, try to join
hazy fiber
I dont know if people have come up with a proper fix to the issue, but I do remeber that being a fix
velvet fog
on the github page
pseudo ocean
I dont know if people have come up with a proper fix to the issue, but I do reme...
deleting appdata worked haha
ebon kernel
deleting appdata worked haha
feel free to tag me next time should you encounter any issue
pseudo ocean
@ebon kernel will do mate! love your work also, been using exilence since forever hahaha
civic crane
just need to tweak parameters to keep size reasonable 😅 😅
worthy cape
Late last night I think I ran into a problem with ooz (and bun_extract_file) on x64 Linux.
It seems like the files extracted there may be subtly different compared to on Windows where on some specimens some bytes differ in patterns later on in the file.
If you're relying on this tooling for some of your tools, be aware.
For example, Data/GrantedEffectsPerLevel.dat has the following SHA256 hashes:
adefc689304cae69a731471a1a79c1fb2173c648a0e08c59963744a80529e3a9 linux (bad)
bd9377dec4451e53f14fafcd5436726a9daaec3a1a16d42cda582eb5261d656e windows (good)
worthy cape
Smells like a bit of fallout from optimizing sketchy code, produces the correct output in Debug and RelWithDebInfo but not Release.
worthy cape
-O2 -ftree-vectorize (or -O3), bane of marginal code everywhere \o/
worthy cape
I found a culprit. { *(uint64_t*)(d) = *(uint64_t*)(s); } misaligned across a page boundary.
worthy cape
Yeah, so, until fixed and audited more, I recommend never building ooz with more than -O2 on Linux GCC. Turning this into some memcpy:s fixed my sample but haven't checked the whole corpus.
pseudo ocean
Is there a list of tools like Awakened POE Trade & Exilence?
pseudo ocean
Thanks!
rapid pagoda
Yeah, so, until fixed and audited more, I recommend never building `ooz` with mo...
really wish ooz had been optimized for readability over speed :X
golden bane
I'm still putting up 200€ for whoever comes up with an Oodle decompressor spec to allow new clean room implementations
simple ravine
I think we will have to pool some, because I looked at it, and it's... a lot
clever thistle
list = list
pair = tuple
dict = dict
does that look ... problematic to anyone else or just me? (python, can link the source for context)
worthy cape
really wish ooz had been optimized for readability over speed :X
Core problem in this particular case was that copy-via-wider-type trick in conjunction with -ftree-vectorize at higher optimization levels, where it was transformed from a naive 8-byte read+write into what appears to be a 16-byte wide one via SSE registers.
The compiler seems to have assumed (probably rightfully so due to UB around aliasing and alignment) that the sequences cannot overlap.
I got to learn some new techniques this time around, both reverse debugging (WinDbg Preview's Time Travel Debugging) and the novel idea of putting output buffers at a fixed place in memory so I can reliably put data breakpoints on the erroneous bytes.
auto weLiveHereNow = (void*)0x1'0000'0000;
simple ravine
oof
golden bane
```python
list = list
pair = tuple
dict = dict
```
What this code does depends on the scope these built-ins are shadowed and the the scope they are called. If these are assignments at the top-level of a module, assignments 1 and 3 just do nothing when called from a more local scope, say a function defined in the module. Whether you use the built-in list or shadow it with a variable in the current scope, they both compile to a LOAD_GLOBAL Python bytecode instruction. If they are assigned in a local scope, calling list, etc. results in a LOAD_FAST instruction instead, which is indeed faster my some marginal value.
Now, should you do this in your code? No. Especially when you would be creating lots of collections, looking up the built-in functions is not the bottleneck. For performance tuning, look elsewhere. The second assignment is much more egregious. Please don't invent your own language, thank you.
I take it that this isn't code you've written yourself? If it's a teaching example, I would suggest looking elsewhere.
clever thistle
What this code does depends on the scope these built-ins are shadowed and the th...
thanks! correct, not mine. appears as an example in online docs, author said it looked fine to them
wind garden
https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Scourge/K5P8rpEs5
anyone seen this before where search results appear out of order?
Meaning, they're sorted by price but the lowest price isn't at the top.
worthy cape
Novynn is currently running the Big Heccin' Query to update ex/chaos correspondency prices, isn't he?
A bit odd that it hoses the order of ex vs. ex, but I guess it's working off some hidden values?
Or distinct glitch 😄
wind garden
ah that'd do it
so it should sort (no pun intended) itself out
that is a fantastic pun though 🙂
civic crane
A bit odd that it hoses the order of ex vs. ex, but I guess it's working off som...
can be a result of sharding or another refactoring happened in Ritual when every item in window was price checked 😅
civic crane
guess what will happen when someone bricks poe.ninja again if I'd normalize prices
wind garden
A couple of days ago the Plague of Frogs prophecy was showing on Poe.ninja as 2ex, kinda weird
frank drift
stuff like that happens all the time, wrangling accurate prices out of the chaos is a hard problem
rapid pagoda
A bit odd that it hoses the order of ex vs. ex, but I guess it's working off som...
presumably every listing has an internal "converted chaos value" field, and that's currently being updated with the new ratios
lunar crypt
forest wadi
Hey, does anybody know where does PoB obtain the base HP value(s) for Animated Guardian? They don't seem to relate to the values in poedb at all, for one example.
young wedge
Hi, I am trying to access to the content of my unique stash tab through the API and all I get is an empty array of items. Reading though the history of the channel it seems that this is a known issue. At the same time I know there is a ladder for collectors of unique items, any clue how they get it done?
worthy cape
Maybe they've got some ancillary submission scheme, or do something like require contestants to list for public trade and index through the river?
civic crane
Hi, I am trying to access to the content of my unique stash tab through the API ...
you need to use oauth api, unofficial character api doesn't support this tab
young wedge
oh ok good to know, thanks
oak estuary
Hey, does anybody know where does PoB obtain the base HP value(s) for Animated G...
There's an allied minion table that is full of HP values here: https://github.com/PathOfBuildingCommunity/PathOfBuilding/blob/master/src/Data/Misc.lua The value at the level requirement for the gem is multiplied by the life percentage for the minion (4.5 or +450% as seen on poedb) to get the base value. Not sure what poedb is doing, but my guess is using the regular monster life table that is used for spectres instead of the allied one
forest wadi
There's an allied minion table that is full of HP values here: https://github.co...
right - I was asking what's the source for that data
worthy cape
DefaultMonsterStats DAT
Oh hey, there was even a comment in the data, completely missed that 😄
forest wadi
DefaultMonsterStats.dat is from the game installation somewhere then?
worthy cape
Yeah, dat files are from the game files, they're a row-based table format with guessed field boundaries and meanings.
forest wadi
I see, thanks
worthy cape
simple ravine
Ok so a bit off topic.
I have 31 young developers coming to a meetup tomorrow, that we recruited and started a 9-week pretty intensive program to learn more about cloud / development.
Part of the program, they're in groups of 4-6, developing a 'product' where each team is owning a part of it.
I have them for 4 hours on Thursday as part of a 2-day event, and was thinking of some kind of team-building exercises. Probably something to do with programming.
Ideas?
silent tree
while i was at uni we used to do hackerrank racing during hackathons, maybe there's something there?
wise copper
Is it possible to export item info (stats, base types, etc.) for unique equipment?
I haven't found anything promising glancing over the .dat files.
I know the stats/mods (and buffs from the stats) for the items exist in the .dats, but I haven't found anything linking unique items to those stats/mods
wise copper
Is it possible to export item info (stats, base types, etc.) for unique equipmen...
Found https://discordapp.com/channels/174993814845521922/175290321695932416/875659605110321152, so it seems like this info isn't in client files -- but names are?
If someone could point me to where the names are stored that'd be awesome
velvet fog
Found https://discordapp.com/channels/174993814845521922/175290321695932416/8756...
Words.dat:WordlistsKey=6
lunar crypt
worthy cape
Well that's their problem, they use poe.nonja 😉
fickle yew
<@!179224234923524096> fyi https://reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/r12vud/psa_...
Cards aren't missing.. the date problem is solved - only a few stray fetch dates are wrong. Upgrade of ORM went crazy on timestamp columns.
But thanks for the heads up 🙂
lunar crypt
Cool, I just wanted you to know. I can leave a reply on the thread if you’d like me to
fickle yew
Cool, I just wanted you to know. I can leave a reply on the thread if you’d like...
I'll do it 🙂
civic crane
another interesting item in STD 😅 has unid vendoronly ring
lunar crypt
How
worthy cape
They seem to pop out unid from the vendor if I read this right.
civic crane
oh, I thought they are unid in vendor window and as soon as you accept become id, guess listed time and only one available fooled me
worthy cape
I guess that they come out unid to give people a bit more agency and excitement, as they have the random mods.
lunar crypt
oh, I thought they are unid in vendor window and as soon as you accept become id...
i thought the same
silent tinsel
Anoint for +1 Maximum Frenzy charge Savagery and Fervour not working
worthy cape
Anoint for +1 Maximum Frenzy charge Savagery and Fervour not working
Is this in regard to a specific tool? If so, which one?
If it's for the game itself, this is the wrong venue, please use the bug report forums.
hazy fiber
I guess that they come out unid to give people a bit more agency and excitement,...
its so you cant game the system by swapping which rings you vendor and seeing the result beforehand
which would make it trivial to get +max charges etc if you could ee what youd get
worthy cape
Like normally there's the gift-wrap box system for variable outcomes, isn't there?
hazy fiber
that was added way later (outside of the prophecy) iirc
but yes that serves the same purpose as unid
ivory echo
any way to fix the pob when it stops detecting a node i picked up? It still shows in the reports table, and no amount of releasing and acquiring seems to fix it.
and is there away to get of the slowdown when you push the window into the background? that's a killer for productivity
worthy cape
and is there away to get of the slowdown when you push the window into the back...
Heh, I've never looked at this code before as I replaced most of it in my fork.
The sleeps when defocused are there to make it less demanding on the system, primarily to not steal quite as much performance from PoE.
In what way is it harming productivity?
ivory echo
i know. i talked to somebody, but he should really let to OS handle that. It makesit so slow forcing me to keep in fg
worthy cape
What again, is slow?
ivory echo
it throttles itself too hard
worthy cape
Background processes like power reports or full DPS?
worthy cape
I'd love to know what the "OS can handle" around frame pacing and not consuming CPU and GPU cycles.
ivory echo
rregardless, is there a way to turn tha off?
worthy cape
Not outside of building your own SimpleGraphic.
ivory echo
i have to dedicate a screen to pob to run it now
how about when pob stops detecting nodes taken? is hter a way to force a refresh?
this seems to be a very common problem too so it can't just be me, can it
worthy cape
Never heard of it, is there a bug reported?
Kind of hard to "force a refresh" if you don't know the underlying effect.
ivory echo
no bug really? I have it daily. maybe it isomething specific ot my use
worthy cape
On decoupling subscript processing from the framerate, that's something I'd like to look at eventually but that's faaar away, if ever possible.
I'm asking you if there's a bug reported on it.
And yes, it's the first time I hear about the program glitching out and not accepting changes anymore.
ivory echo
i didnt see one, so thoughjt there might be a workaround ppl were using
cehcking now
i dont see anything close
let me try to submit
the prob is for example is that i'll be messing with the tree and gen a report for life then click on a life node identified by the report, it will say regen'ing but the next report will still list as unallocated.
no amount of fuckery fixes it either
and oom errors too, anyway to give it more memory?
worthy cape
For you, no. For me, yes.
ivory echo
not way to fuck with launch options?
worthy cape
Current PoB is limited to 2 GiB of process memory by virtue of being a non-LargeAddressAware 32-bit program.
If you recompile it LAA or in 64-bit mode, Lua itself gets 2 GiB and PoB the rest.
If you recompile it with current beta LuaJIT in GC64 mode, it can leak as much as it wants.
I think we give Lua as much as we can, even to the detriment of the native side that can exhaust at unfortunate places.
ivory echo
unfortunate indeed
worthy cape
LAA would yield around 400 megs of additional headroom.
worthy cape
There's no traditional leaks here, the common memory exhaustion problem discovered recently was that the undo stack never expires, so it eats more and more memory the more you make changes that has undo history.
ivory echo
i love live leaks
worthy cape
We mess a bit with how Lua does garbage collection, but it can't really GC things that are referenced.
nom nom nom
worthy cape
That screenshot was from when I tested the boundaries of the code with the reproducible memory consumption.
ivory echo
with the fault churn hard to say if too much or too little
worthy cape
shitty gc
It can't really go eat data that you actually use.
Page faults aren't really a problem, they occur naturally in all sorts of code paths.
ivory echo
the fault delta i was referring to. looks like it is picking though a lot of old data, something modern gen collectors really try to avoid so much that go build around not doing it
worthy cape
System could've been under some pressure, heaven knows I have a lot of stuff running especially when investigating things.
This was violently scrolling back and forth between items in PoB, which caused it to duplicate the whole item tab I'm told.
Best repro instructions ever ^_^
ivory echo
then they should still both be in mem
i guess the gui creates a lot of garbage on changes
not a gui person, hate doing them
worthy cape
There's initiatives to make it do less, but it does a fair bit of immediate-mode rendering-type stuff.
ivory echo
im entirely way way back end
serch more but no issue, so trying now
my updates might not be working (the prob preceeds this though)
worthy cape
Eh?
worthy cape
Update checking is done in the background with a subscript, it should talk a bit in the console.
ivory echo
click "check for update" wait comes back with "no update available... you are running the lastest"
tab on bottom left says 2.11.0 (beta)
worthy cape
Are you running some sort of weird build sourced from heaven knows where?
ivory echo
no
worthy cape
We don't (to my knowledge) have an active beta program.
Consider installing 2.11 from installer or extracting the portable to get the proper version.
ivory echo
might be some holdover when i had the dev branch installed, but i deleted it
worthy cape
(which then would auto-update itself)
ivory echo
i know it has worked since then though
the protable is statically linked and slow af or somethig?
worthy cape
Same codebase, same functionality, just without an installer pretty much.
For people who like self-contained installations with the builds dir and everything with it.
ivory echo
any performance diff or funcitonality dff?
worthy cape
Modulo any bugs, same thing.
worthy cape
2.13.0, but the last installer/portable is 2.11 and updates itself.
ivory echo
where are the builds so i can make sure it doesnt delete them or i dont
ivory echo
docs folder gets backed up daily pretty much
worthy cape
You can also see the path by hovering the path in options:
ivory echo
mostly on a nother machine
i tried to mess with that adn it caused issues. "hard links" on widows arent' completely transparent
now it says 2.13
updated were hosed i think
It the alloc issue shows itself ill submit it
worthy cape
There's been some thoughts about having a "beta" channel that has advance content for testing, but I don't think we've done much with that. If you had a manifest stuck on that version or someone else's attempt at a build, the lack of updates might be obvious.
ivory echo
i blew away the dev dir a while ago so that hsouldnt have been the issue.
windows last update has some perm issues that cause some issues for me and im a terrible windows person
worthy cape
The program is keen to use the centrally installed files if it can't quite find what it needs in the install dir, so you might've tainted it.
(there's some init step that attempts to find the Lua source tree to use, and it can easily fall back to the wrong place if you have screwed your dev tree up)
ivory echo
windows locked down soem "system" dirs and even i couldn't modify them
had to change perms, and turn off the virus detection in those folders
worthy cape
I'd rather just pave the machine if I had screwed something up that core.
ivory echo
it was a comon enough issue it was the update.
i do them very late bc im not a sysadmin, and i gerally suck with windws
so i try to do as little as possible
common enough for them to have a numbr of pages on how to fx it. it was related to their ransom ware detection
whne will the raports include masteries? any plan for that?
worthy cape
I have two responses 😄
Don't they?
I don't really touch the logic side of things.
ivory echo
i don t see them, but i was running on a 2.11 apparently
worthy cape
Probably hard to show too.
ivory echo
and multiple paths i thought might be diffocult
i might have just had a krangled install somehow
nope, can cause the issue by just cliking a lot while it is calculating
and it doesn't go away
i cant seem to force it to see a that i too k a node
worthy cape
Extra fun is that node power is a coroutine IIRC.
worthy cape
Not much choice for background computation apart from subscripts, and those have a lot of marshalling going on.
ivory echo
sounds like eveyrhign was build around the rendering so it gets the backseat
not a fan of threading everyhting, but this seems liek a good choice for that.
but im guessing lua has something to do with that
should i submit a bug?
worthy cape
Yep. Gonna be an icky one for someone to look at, but try to include as much context as possible at least.
ivory echo
there's niot much to go on realy
let me see if the program changes the stats elsewhere when i take the node
worthy cape
On threads - that's what "subscripts" are.
The Lua interpreter is single-threaded and can only run one thing at a time. Coroutines let you weave in and out of a separate execution frame as you're probably familiar with.
ivory echo
oh yeah, it updates properly on the left side, but it is just the reports that fuck it up
I graduated in CS at Berkeley. Im aware of what they are.
I worked for an investment company on trading backendds
worthy cape
PoB has a "subscript" system in which there are worker threads in which a completely separate Lua interpreter is hosted, one per subscript. The subscript gets an initial function to run with the data bundled and has the ability to make fire-and-forget and roundtrip calls into the main interpreter. These are serviced in the frame loop, and these are the ones that are slowed down by the framerate.
worthy cape
I graduated in CS at Berkeley. Im aware of what they are.
On the internet, I find it good to assume less 🙂
All these calls have the data serialized into intermediary storage on the C++ side for it to dispatch on the correct interpreter again, so limited to more primitive scalar data.
ivory echo
sounds like someone had really wanted to make his own message passing sysem regardless if called for
worthy cape
It's a somewhat elegant solution to non-cooperative threading, I found out how it worked the fun way when it made assumptions about the termination of my data in an experimental fork.
All in all, there's some warts in the codebase and if you do a greenfield development of a successor, it'll probably be quite differently shaped.
ivory echo
why lua after already the c++ work? how much is split between the two?
worthy cape
Alas, we're here with what we have.
ivory echo
sounds massively over engineeried
people do that same everywhere - it is the most common issue i see in code bases it seems
bronze kestrel
Can always fork it and try to refactor it entirely in C++ 😛
worthy cape
The roots of the tool is some personal build vis for Arl, built upon whatever mini game engine they had at hand.
ivory echo
go or javascript could prob handle it too.
for c++ the gui would take too long for me to do
worthy cape
That most of it is in Lua is a very strong point, as it makes it extremely malleable for the changes the game throws at us.
ivory echo
go has rudimentary bindsing foir webview and javascript too ob
worthy cape
Could you pivot to something less immediate? Probably.
Would it be extremely costly and introduce a lot of bugs? Probably.
Could you spend less effort on say a spreadsheet engine and a new UI? 
ivory echo
gui rust sounds painful, i dont know how to do guis in pythion
and im out of languages
wha do you mean by less immediate?
worthy cape
Immediate as in the popular term "immediate mode GUI", rebuild a lot of state on a per-frame basis with minimal memory of what you had before.
bronze kestrel
Why all this anti-lua talk anyway? All of the maintenance and dev work is clearly being done in Lua and contributors already know the language and are working using it. What sort of horrendous drawbacks do you see that threaten the immediate future/functionality of the codebase should it remain Lua @ivory echo
worthy cape
vs. retained-mode UI, where you work with windows of controls that have some ancillary data binding and event handlers.
ivory echo
can you give me an example of retained mode?
worthy cape
WinForms, Win32 UI, Qt, all the usual ones.
ivory echo
not anti lua - it is just generally slow and hard to deal with it seems. maybe back in the day it was quicker (when redis used it), but seems to have been blown by in perf and features
worthy cape
Even HTML if you squint enough 🙂
bronze kestrel
Mmmyeah except most python dev's who work with GUI can't tell their arse from their elbow and end up mucking it all up. Anything can be fast if done properly enough, tbh. Frankly the biggest challenge you face is getting people to switch from one lang to another, not any inherent lang quirk or any tech debt; Not at first anyway.
ivory echo
true. python was single threaded for years and still is in parts.
the GIL just has another name at times
bronze kestrel
And in over a decade of experience, I have seen few projects achieve this with success and countless failures. Because, well.. you work with people, some get annoyed when you change stack or lang. There can be an exodus, and with that - there goes your momentum. And who's gonna use a tool that isn't up-to-date with the main game version within the first week of release (when there's not enough devs to contribute work to it)
worthy cape
The amount of people we successfully onboarded this league is staggering.
Many new contributors for Scourge.
bronze kestrel
My two cents - more focus on clearing tech debt and optimising would do far better than an outright uprooting. But that's just one person's opinion.
ivory echo
i think you're at the end of the line on this architecture
somethign else will rise up and overtake when p2 comes
maybe a side proj by someone alredy on the team
worthy cape
I'm quite curious to what positive changes I can make within the constraints of the engine like:
ivory echo
dont do your own renderer
its a very poe thing though to rerwite the parts that arent in the core biz of the program
worthy cape
maybe a side proj by someone alredy on the team
You might've missed the bit where there's thoughts about "PoB next" with a completely different architecture, and yes, language.
ivory echo
usefulness isnt coming from the html canvas, but from the rest
worthy cape
dont do your own renderer
renderer as in more robust context creation or ANGLE, which is the definition of invented elsewhere.
ivory echo
ANGLE?
worthy cape
Google's GLES-on-any-API emulator, powers all graphics in Chrome f.ex.
PoB's use of regular OpenGL is a major compatibility problem.
ivory echo
that even seem too low level. the program doens't need real time 3d.. any webview shoudd be fine - more than qualified.
i couldn't imagine drawing being a bottlenext
worthy cape
See again: minimal impact on existing code
ivory echo
I downloadded to look at the code a little but didn't have time earlier. I wanted to work on some more essoteric things like being able to hellp route plan better.,
worthy cape
ANGLE is feasible and it took one evening to PoC.
ivory echo
the most successful place i have ever been at rewrote every other year
worthy cape
Running on some broken vendor webview or shipping an Electron? Heck no.
Wouldn't even solve the internationalization problems we have.
ivory echo
i don't know why that would be so bad
bronze kestrel
Why have an extra abstraction layer for rendering?
bronze kestrel
Especially when Electron has been proven time and time again to be outperformed by native
worthy cape
Anything that doesn't consume the layered command buffers of the current renderer is kind of out for me.
ivory echo
native / electron / whatever
in go for exmaple i've a couple electron-less webviews like kits
bronze kestrel
It's not whatever.. Electron is horribly inefficient when compared to other renderers (which it technically isn't but for the sake of argument...). And far too resource intensive compared to competition as well. So I don't get why you'd want to consider it when seemingly there's only losses to be had for.. what? The pleasure of using an untyped, dynamically interpreted language which breaks at a sneeze and does weird shit all over the place because it HAS to maintain backwards compat for the web otherwise someone's 1990's blog will break or half the npm ecosystem will shit itself? Mmmmyeah, JS is not the godsend everyone thinks it is
worthy cape
Electron/JS clusterhug aside, I don't know where to even start bridging things.
I'd rather spend my effort on seeing if the existing widget system can be sufficiently rigged to work with more native UI, while also decoupling it from ticks.
I really want IMEs.
ivory echo
language zealot?
there are other similar things than electron that will thow up html/css, and that's about all the interface is.
bronze kestrel
Not one thing in there was an opinion. It's all fairly well-know truths. And I use JS/TS extensively for projects, I just don't gloss over faults of the language for the sake of evangelising it
bronze kestrel
That's not what I said
ivory echo
"The pleasure of using an untyped, dynamically interpreted language which breaks at a sneeze and does ..."
ivory echo
you should learn the diff bw fact and opinion
bronze kestrel
and more
Mmmkay Imma leave you in your la-la land where you're always right. I have better things to do than argue with a "Brekeley" grad. Surely I am at a disadvantage.
Enjoy the win 😉
ivory echo
not rihgt, you are the one trying to say yo are sating nothing but facts. im well wawy things are opinions
worthy cape
Thanks for reporting the issue, btw.
ivory echo
who tf was that?
can you look at it and see if any other info is needed before i move on?
oh and in that buld i did a custom copper sword (but the problem occurs besids that in other buils too)
it is there ti look like a energy blade sword
since 2.11 didnt support it, lol
does 2.13 support energy blade? (doesnt seem to)
worthy cape
Seems to have something to get started off at least.
Energy Blade still has an open tracking issue.
ivory echo
didnt undersand "Seems to have something to get started off at least"
worthy cape
On the amount of information in the power report ticket.
worthy cape
I don't use the feature - is the "click on node" in the tree or in the report itself?
ivory echo
the click on node just centers the view
(feature req: should highlight the node too)
seems liek the reports view of three never updates.
the distances arent updating for other nodes anymore
@worthy cape if you change reports it fixes the issue (not permantly, it gets jammed again)
worthy cape
I recommend noting it in the issue, I don't touch these things.
worthy cape
Hehe... base64-encoded deflated XML.
ivory echo
xml. wordy
worthy cape
Alphabet requires a substitution of the final two characters to decode with vanilla tools.
ivory echo
why?
worthy cape
URL compatibility maybe?
ivory echo
ah makes sense
worthy cape
Triggers the markdown formatting on Github, for bonus points 😄
ivory echo
updated bug report
worthy cape
That's why we have the build code in a textbox these days in the template.
ivory echo
is there a command line to start wtiha pob file?
i want to get windows to launch pob for pastebin links
worthy cape
Yes, but also no. It has functionality to be used as an URL handler.
worthy cape
Not sure how wired up that is, was primarily intended for a custom URL schema as that's the easiest way to get it set up for browsers.
ivory echo
still have the bug for no way to say zero frenzy charges wihtout unchecking the box
0 = full changes
i have no shame - for me i was just going to make the script take all pastebin links
whatver the windows equiv of wcat is to a file and launch pob on it
ivory echo
\\] huh? is that lua thing bc isn't a regex thing
ivory echo
oh
worthy cape
\\ is just an escaped \, to help with "helpful" launchers converting the separators.
ivory echo
when you say that you mean ... ? regex in the academic way or as in similar to regex libraries?
oak estuary
Just catching up on this convo. The automated beta build mucks with the version number for some reason, haven't had time lately to figure it out. 2.11 (beta) == 2.13.0 iirc. If you had unchecked the beta option in Settings it would redownload from the main branch
ivory echo
oh, so dont check that?
worthy cape
Ooh, didn't know we had a setting for that these days.
oak estuary
I've been keeping the beta branch up-to-date sporadically, but the automated build doesn't always work fully, so having it on is functionally the same as having it off for the time being
ivory echo
ok, unchecked
oak estuary
<https://github.com/PathOfBuildingCommunity/PathOfBuilding/blob/438b89aa877d4e6e...
Hmm, now that we support other websites for builds I wonder how this should be updated...
ivory echo
so keep it checked and it should update now
we'll ill be aware of it at least now if it fucks up again
oak estuary
There hasn't been an update pushed for beta or for mainline, so you won't see an update either way. If you swap the checkbox it'll "update", but just download the files from the other branch
ivory echo
why wasn't it updating?
oak estuary
2.11.0 (beta) is the same version as 2.13.0, just a visual difference in version
2.13.0 is the latest
worthy cape
Hmm, now that we support other websites for builds I wonder how this should be u...
Not sure if we ever pushed much for the URL handler stuff in the past, probably pending pobcodes work.
ivory echo
oh so i was up to date you're saying
oak estuary
Yep
ivory echo
filed the nug on the report table not updating that started this whole thing
oak estuary
Not sure if we ever pushed much for the URL handler stuff in the past, probably ...
We have the protocol get registered via the installer. Now that rasmuskl is working on a URL for poe.ninja, I imagine we'll want him to generate pob:// urls of some form
ivory echo
bigger problem than i first saw, so actually seems easier to fix thinking baout it
worthy cape
Probably a good driver to get some work done indeed.
civic crane
why (mostly) these two guys have demigod uniques in challenge league, looks sus
golden bane
Catching up with the latest conversations...
There indeed is a "PoB next" in the works.
If you have experience with any of:
young wedge
Hello, I am trying to develop some desktop app in python for PERSONAL use. After asking for access to the required scopes I already have access to my client credentials. In the docs there is this point for desktop apps:
"Interacting with our web APIs on behalf of other users requires a private service hosted elsewhere to store your OAuth client credentials securely. Embedding your client secret in the executable in this case is not allowed."
I am guessing this will not apply for personal use? I am a complete noob using oauth btw 🙂 thanks
ivory echo
whats up with the custom modifiers box. its accepts all kind of this, some not even words.
worthy cape
Just wait for the Unicode version 😄
oak estuary
it literally doesn't care what you put in it, only some things get parsed as a mod though
ivory echo
am i doing somethign off?
worthy cape
It's an escape hatch for user-sourced modifiers that would otherwise be hard to express, things that people previously grafted onto flasks or other gear.
ivory echo
why not use the mofiers list things from the items area?
then you can see if it is red at least
oak estuary
Make a PR 😄
ivory echo
i using for its intended purpsoe
worthy cape
In particular, the free-text-ness allows for mods that are not in the crafting information, but may be parsed to some extent.
You could indeed visualise whether they do parse, that'd be a neat addition.
ivory echo
Not really a fan of that response. i asked that bc maybe there is a reason that wasnt used or maybe already tried
just red it is it doesn't parse
worthy cape
There is no "just" in dev.
ivory echo
i started adding random leteter and still parsed fine
then one other small iseu made it parsse completely different
thought i was doing something wrong like i needed seom syntax
is there any way to make a sword with 0 base phys?
im doing 100% less now but that messed some things up
oak estuary
I don't know what issue you saw specifically, but PoB just tries to find a mod that best matches the text, so iirc it'll do a partial match if it finds one
oak estuary
is there any way to make a sword with 0 base phys?
Just add "no physical damage" to the sword itself
ivory echo
so i'm not inputting it wrong, just making sure
t can do phys
just has no base
did that as first attempt
if no way, that's cool. it is a rahter different request
are all those weapon models embeded into the program oir is there a datafile i can hack up?
oak estuary
Did you add the mod to the sword itself?
worthy cape
Everything's Lua.
worthy cape
Plain data tables generated from data files offline, perfectly editable but will be clobbered on update.
oak estuary
No, you can edit them all just fine, just don't accept an update
ivory echo
i assume an update at some point will handle energy lblades
these are all small chnges
worthy cape
Energy Blades are complicated.
ivory echo
i just wanted to get the phys off the base weapon
ivory echo
so pob actually parses these "Adds 3 to 60 Lightning Damage per 40 Maximum Energy Shield" and understands them to some extent?
oak estuary
Yes
ivory echo
i thought it would have just template matdched
interesting
and you set it up as a rare?
oak estuary
It does template match. ["Adds %d to %d Lightning Damage"] + ["per %d Maximum Energy Shield"]
Yes, you can just copy that text straight in a new custom item
ivory echo
ahh got it
thats what i assumed it was doing
simple, easy
templates covering others could be a problem
oak estuary
That's from the pre-buff version, btw, it looks like. You'll want to change the 80% less to 50% less
ivory echo
i have the values
i had to fgure them tou
i built mine off copper sword so have to figure it out again
shit its done a different way
is ther e a awya to add to minimium and maximum independeant;ly
?
oak estuary
Why? That reddit post has all the numbers correct except for 80%, you should be able to just copy those.
ivory echo
the per 20 is correct?
oic it is doing it the was going to
you can add independantly
ivory echo
this looks like from before the rework
surreal quiver
word of warning for pob devs - i used https://i.imgur.com/q8RDvtQ.png in PoB community fork (private character import with poesessid), and got banned a few hours later for third party software
after ban appeal explaining the situation, i got unbanned several hours later, but because responses are automated and support does not explain their decisions - i do not know if that was a coincidence (unlikely) and if they contacted pob devs as i suggested
fluid wave
Think I accidentally got my IP blocked by PoEs api yesterday 
Ran the BPL backend locally to fetch the stashes and calculate the final score, but that didn't really work out 😦
carmine merlin
Known issue
carmine merlin
manually delete the lines or create a PR to fix the parsing if you figure it out
ivory echo
i would totally do the second, but no build environment. I'm not a good windows person so after grabbing the repo I just ducked out the rest. I might be able to give the build environment another attempt.
this seems like a recent thing too -like days not months.
carmine merlin
no its been quite a few months
ivory echo
that's weird. If I take those lines out on the create custom dialogue, it fucked up the creation (ob bc it doens't know that data), but if I do a faulty creation, then delete those lines in the edit dialigue, it still rememebrs the lines i removed.
carmine merlin
I know the exact pr that broke it too
ivory echo
hash?
carmine merlin
it was fixing one issue that created another
Was made to fix inspired learning which seems to have broken again
ivory echo
fuck oom
carmine merlin
Trying to find what the PR was called
carmine merlin
hash?
Pretty sure its this https://github.com/PathOfBuildingCommunity/PathOfBuilding/commit/09a878112c8090f52abd4068b7f9800c8168acf2
oak estuary
What do people call a link to a PoB build? We have "build code" in our issue template, but people don't always know what that means, apparently.
simple ravine
base64encodedxmllink
sleek nacelle
I've definitely seen people say stuff like "got a pastebin?"
"import code" might be more clear?
ivory echo
a "pob"
most commongly you'ree see "do you have a pob?" or something
it would be nice if the pob had a short unique prefix and length to make easier to yank from a messy file or page. (i guess you would also want a couple crc bytes to validate at at the end too).
parsing stuff is a pain in the ass
magic barn
s
rapid pagoda
it would be nice if the pob had a short unique prefix and length to make easier ...
a somewhat joking proposal:
-----BEGIN PATH OF BUILDING EXPORT-----
Version: 3.16
d2h5IGFyZSB5b3UgcmVhZGluZyB0aGlzIHdoeSBhcmUgeW91IHJlYWRpbmcgdGhpcyB3aHkgYXJl
IHlvdSByZWFkaW5nIHRoaXMgd2h5IGFyZSB5b3UgcmVhZGluZyB0aGlzIHdoeSBhcmUgeW91IHJl
YWRpbmcgdGhpcyB3aHkgYXJlIHlvdSByZWFkaW5nIHRoaXMgd2h5IGFyZSB5b3UgcmVhZGluZyB0
...
-----END PATH OF BUILDING EXPORT-----
@hushed relic FilterBladeContact at gmail is the preferred way to send in bug reports, correct? Just making sure before I fire this email off
hushed relic
@grizzled seal best to send it in the filterblade discord
grizzled seal
😅 already sent it, there was some vaguely personal info in there anyway
also wasn't even aware there was a FilterBlade-specific Discord
I'm now in 5 different PoE-specific Discords 👀
hushed relic
those are rookie numbers
grizzled seal
this server, PoE Trading, PoB Community, Project PoE Wiki, and now FilterBlade
I know about TFT but don't like or use it, and I didn't count another server I'm in that has a PoE channel because it's just me and a couple friends, not primarily for PoE anyway
oak estuary
Local kept mentioning PoB issues brought up on discord that I didn't see here, so I had to join TFT to see what was going on.
ivory echo
TFT is really well done i thought
delicate ore
@fickle yew opengraph on poeninja is broken https://poe.ninja/challengehcssf/builds/char/ログよし/gbasfwecszf
no social media embeds
fickle yew
<@!179224234923524096> opengraph on poeninja is broken https://poe.ninja/challen...
I know. It's not trivial to fix though with the way the site works. What would you like in the social media embed?
delicate ore
idk, something like Zana's embed would be good
civic crane
I think you already have a good one
delicate ore
i like that
for reference, github's og:image https://github.com/PathOfBuildingCommunity/PathOfBuilding
rapid pagoda
rendering text in opengraph preview images feels a little weird, but damn if it isn't effective
ivory echo
can anybody help me with vscode? never done any windows dev at all and the instructions on github skipped a few steps i think
ive been strictly linux/unix for most of my career
fickle yew
I think you already have a good one
Yeah I've been working on that actually but it has to be converted to an image which takes a bit more effort. Probably will end up not using the html as the base but draw something similar.
ivory echo
how do i create or import a workspace?(project?) from the git checkout of pob?
i basically dont knwo what do do between "git pull" and "Create a new debug config"
hidden kernel
SOme one know about, the widget from path of exile racing, i get it run it , and have like a 20 mintues booting up... reloaded it etc
ivory echo
even simple shit i suck at on windows - how do i copy afile name from explorer?
civic crane
hold shift, or F2 for just name @ivory echo
hidden kernel
?
ivory echo
shift, neat. im a terrible windows dev, thx
hidden kernel
?
ivory echo
whats your question?
i dont know anything about it, but someone else might, but i t hnk the question was a litle unclear.
hidden kernel
SOme one know about, the widget from path of exile racing, i get it run it , and have like a 20 mintues booting up... reloaded it etc
ivory echo
i never run it. i wonder if it is trying to connect to someting
hoepfully someone else will hav some experience with that
ahahah the java installer has no text box for the installation location. i need to change the drive letter, but i cant so have to go though all the file heriarchy making intermediate folders when needed. wtf?
civic crane
the ahk script generated on poe-racing doesn't even contain this text in it, idk what you've downloaded named "widget from path of exile racing"
ivory echo
wow the java installer is shit
can't drill down into folders that dont exist
apparelty it wont even install on a second drive
grave wren
ivory echo
all this for vscode for pob
grave wren
just use pycharm + emmylua
ivory echo
better?
ivory echo
emmylua wants java installed
never used either
oh pycharm is the jetbrains ide which prob also wants java installed
civic crane
pob uses java? in what place
ivory echo
emmylua does
civic crane
https://www.java.com/en/download/help/silent_install.html
use INSTALLDIR if it's happy with java 7 or use config file for java 8
grave wren
pretty sure pycharm comes with jdk included
ivory echo
hoping it insalls on second drive
i forced it by making a mount point so it looks like c: but isn't
bad hack
and i wonde rwhy my machine is unstable at times
connection refused
lua is bitching at me about the #@ on the first line
ivory echo
ill tyr pycharm later
oak estuary
You're not going to be able to run Launch.lua directly anyway, as all the functions provided by the exe will not exist
ivory echo
so how do i run from my local code?
oak estuary
https://github.com/PathOfBuildingCommunity/PathOfBuilding/blob/master/CONTRIBUTING.md See "setting up a development installation"
worthy cape
SOme one know about, the widget from path of exile racing, i get it run it , and...
This channel isn't (typically) for end-user support as the channel title mentions. You should probably use whichever support venue (Discord, GitHub issues, etc.) that your tool provides.
ivory echo
@oak estuary that doesn't relaly say much beyond install pycharm./vscode that i saw.
uninstalled vscode and installed pycharm , same error on the directive on the first line.
i have no windows dev experience and never touched lua so the buid instructions arent what im expecting i guess
i work almost entirely in c++/rust on linux
can someobdy conotrl-C me an item pls
ivory echo
how do i reload after making alua code change?
thx
i wantged one from the game since that is where i get the error. got it though.
oak estuary
ivory echo
I was looking for rebuild instructions. Not when that is needed though.
anyways, the prob was easy to find, but trying to get the debugger running now.
just there is a lot of confusion if you dont already know how thongs run (project specific knowledge, not general dev knowledge)
why does those 3 lines in the launch script have to go after the OnInit def? and nost just at top or bottom?
following the iinstructions gets me a conn refused problem when run from pyharm and errors when run from the exe
most web page in chinese so not much help either
oh shit
you put it in the func defn
might want to make that a little clearer (also answers prev question i had)
oak estuary
Gonna be honest, I have no idea what you're talking about now. Put those lines where CONTRIBUTING.md says to, run the debug config from VSCode, press F5 whenever you've made changes, you're done
ivory echo
whwy it says to can juust be interpreted in two ways
i chose the wrong one
after functiuon launch:onInit() can be interpreted as etiehr after the function defn or at the startr of it
oak estuary
"Paste the following code snippet directly below function launch:OnInit() in ./src/Launch.lua:"
I don't know how that can be any clearer
ivory echo
yes
below the function or the exact line both seem correct
it isntthat big of a deal just the text might be interpeted buy others in a differnt way
ivory echo
There is a parsing issue where adding a new items throws off adn djmps everything after the failure into the explicit mod section.
foudn the problem , but the code there makes no sense to me:
-- Anything else is an explicit with a colon in it (Fortress Covenant, Pure Talent, etc) unless it's part of the custom name
elseif not (self.name:match(specName) and self.name:match(specVal)) then
foundExplicit = true
gameModeStage = "EXPLICIT"
the comment is just wrong i think
so it sees thinkgs like "Chance to Block:" and gets confused af, then tassumes the rest are explicit mods and fubars the item
I delete them iwthout noticable issue, but those seem a fix to something else. that i probably rebroke
main flame
@fickle yew Dunno if this is correct place to report this but "The Scout" https://poe.ninja/challenge/prophecies?name=The Scout Is not, prophecy but Div Card
Awakened Poe Trade Grabs the Prophecy for some reason instead of the card https://poe.ninja/challenge/divination-cards?name=The Scout
civic crane
@main flame poe ninja supports both well, awakened not yet tho
main flame
Well the wiki link on poe.ninja links the Wiki for Card
not prophecy
So yeah mb, I guess only wiki link is wrong there
worthy cape
Hover infocard is a bit of both:
fickle yew
Wiki link has to be fixed manually.. but yeah tooltip looks a bit wonky 🙂
Thanks for the heads up @main flame
hazy fiber
good news, prophecy is gone soon, so ignore the issue and itll just go away
fickle yew
Ah, that's a great plan.
dense shore
ah procrastination
eternal cosmos
Hello esteemed devs,
Inspired by this post https://redd.it/rkp9f1 , I'd like to attempt making a tool that monitors client.txt and plays the appropriate soundtrack for the area.
I have some basic python knowledge, but it sounds simple enough to be doable(?)
If anyone could give me tips or pointers on where to start I'd be eternally grateful
keen dragon
a few question regarding poedb data for monster life, poedb lists a life mod as (for example) +120% doing some math using the actual values it displays in the graphs below it seems the mod is infact + ie. additive to some base 100%, so eg. for monsters with mods of +560% and +130% the difference in health is 6.6/2.3 ~ 2.87
additionally and this is poedb vs pob data, the two disagree on the base life value (pob has it as a table in Misc.lua), pob data seems to have been last updated ~5 month ago
grizzled seal
@fickle yew there's some RMT ads showing up on poe.ninja, I can send you a screenshot + some relevant info if it helps
I reported the ad to google but honestly I'm not sure if they give a shit
fickle yew
<@!179224234923524096> there's some RMT ads showing up on poe.ninja, I can send ...
Thanks I'll see what I can do.
high pumice
hey guys, does anyone here have experience in poe bot writing? (without injection)
worthy cape
No. Extremely against all ToU and you will see no help here, even if it’s “for research” as no one wants to advance knowledge there.
hazy fog
simple ravine
I guess I am not in tech 😄
frank drift
I have good shirts and bad chair
lunar crypt
Was literally just looking at some chairs earlier lol
carmine merlin
Can recommend the chairs. Had one for 4 years now and have gotten 5 others so buy them too. Best purchase I’ve probs ever made
lunar crypt
This gave me a good laugh
golden bane
Quite expensive for a chair. You could even get one of these for less: https://www.buerostuhl24.com/24-hours-leder-xxl-drehstuhl.html
24 hours sitting time vs. ? hours sitting time on HM chairs
ivory cipher
hi question, poe overlay github issues are private now?
the highlight object thing is misaligned when you have stash tab folders, wanted to report that but I can't
golden bane
hi question, poe overlay github issues are private now?
On GitHub, there is no concept of "private" issues. They're just disabled altogether for https://github.com/Kyusung4698/PoE-Overlay
However, there's a new PoE overlay project led by different developers: https://github.com/PoE-Overlay-Community/PoE-Overlay-Community-Fork
ivory cipher
great thanks
simple ravine
Quite expensive for a chair. You could even get one of these for less: https://w...
Yeah I don't get the whole Herman Miller hype either
frank drift
I get it but they are expensive af
not like many startups failing anymore you can get cheap ones from
carmine merlin
I got that same one for $750 aud second hand. Never needed a neck rest imo
oak estuary
Yeah, I got a similar looking chair with the mesh seat and backing for ~$150 at a general office store. Never put the arms or headrest on, haven't had a single issue with it so far
frank drift
Hyken yeah
the office store mesh chairs
as good as it gets for $150 but nowhere near a HM
worthy cape
I'm running an IKEA Markus and it's not optimal 😄
simple ravine
I sit here an watch some tv shows and movies, so I want something more... cozy than an Hemran Miller without neck rest
worthy cape
In the distance, a stampede of armchair ergo peeps descent on the channel chanting something about curved shoulders.
long sky
I got work to buy me a Steelcase Gesture, so comfy
simple ravine
I got work to buy me a Steelcase Gesture, so comfy
That does indeed look comfortable. Did you get the one with headrest or without?
long sky
Without, though I don’t find myself really feeling the need for one. Admittedly I’ve not tried a chair with one though
simple ravine
At work, we have Kinnarps (a swedish coveted maker) with really great adjustable headrest (and other things), and it's really nice to have. I have a traditional gaming chair at home with head/neck rest. I would personally miss it I think.
inland kestrel
Over the last decade or two I've spent a fair amount of time in many of the fancy HM models and they're alright... but honestly, I'm happy in my tempur-pedic chair from Staples more than any of them. (I've liked the idea of a chair headrest but when I've had them... I rarely actually use them).
https://www.staples.com/Tempur-Pedic-TP4000-Fabric-Computer-and-Desk-Office-Chair-Black-Fixed-Arm-TP4000/product_324022
and after many, many years... I threw armrest covers on and have been enjoying them so far https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01M8F9IYC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
frank drift
idk I'd rather have a Hyken mesh chair, I feel like too much padding is bad for posture
inland kestrel
To each their own. 🙂 Just wanted to share my experience for anyone who might think their alone if they preferred a padded seat over mesh
frank drift
for sure
hazy fog
I thought I liked my aeron and I do a lot more than I liked my awful amazon basics chair
but... I don't even sit up straight I shoulds get achair made for sitting terribly 
worthy cape
A squirrely ferret? I am very surprised.
gilded tree
candid ridge
