1┃general

[full kraken]

I liked using asenaths + 2x foulborn witchbane, it was sufficient to delete everything

[cobalt blade]

you dont need to curse

[full kraken]

yeh but asenaths just solves that inherently ez

and helps with the booms

[onyx adder]

Do we know which bosses drop what

[cobalt blade]

and now youve lost glove slot

[full kraken]

worth it for mapping

[cobalt blade]

hard disagree lol

[crystal talon]

You can guess pretty easily for a lot of them based off flavor text

[cobalt blade]

youd need to have some real shit gloveslot for that

[full kraken]

mapping, for the most part, isnt that hard to cap out damage so you just nuke everything in one hit

[surreal musk]

witchbane cant self chain unspeakable gifts can

[grave vine]

Guys, has anyone realized the MASSIVE problem with the new djin mtx, 2 gift sub reward?

[full kraken]

it can with curse on hit source

[surreal musk]

killing hits dont apply a curse

[full kraken]

it definitely works, I can personally confirm it

[crystal talon]

and mark explicitly mentioned a few. like frostmage being neglect

[full kraken]

I used curse on hit corrupt gloves (not even asenaths just rare gloves) for several weeks with 2x foulborn witchbane orb, and it chained plenty

[cobalt blade]

what mkcsop means is that if your explode has enough damage to kill it will kill before cursing

[full kraken]

never had that issue

[grave vine]

Don't tell andrew

[cobalt blade]

then you havent scaled builds enough

p regular issue occys run into high end iirc

[grave vine]

Bo way u said that

[full kraken]

okay, I mean... figure it out lol, its not hard to lower specific types of damage, go take the atlas passive keystone if its an issue XD

[sonic vault]

I forget is Bino's still a t0

[grave vine]

Yee

[cobalt blade]

or just dont lose your glove slot and get unspeakable gifts moved to good clusters with the new currency :p

and get jewel sockets back which are p big power too

[full kraken]

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Guide:Analysis_of_unique_item_tiers#Daggers

[cobalt blade]

will say we dont know its possible they made it more common

but it would be weird if they buffed it and did that

[onyx adder]

Okies

[full kraken]

its more "get one implicit on glove slot back" which is cool and all if you have a few mirrors to spare

[onyx adder]

Finally a reason for poe's writing staff to exist

[sonic vault]

huh, I dunno if I've ever gotten a bino's but I've definitely gotten plenty of Divinarius and Arakaalis

or at least, since it's been in t0

[full kraken]

T1 is, what, like... 10x? 20x? more common than T0? its a lot

[cobalt blade]

thats a wild statement

[onyx adder]

Divinarius has bounced around a lot in rarity as well historically, though it's been very rare for a little while now

[cobalt blade]

we have no clue how expensive the currency's gonna be and you can always just run chaos dmg clusters anyway

[full kraken]

when has ggg ever released game altering power creep chase currency like that and it wasnt on the scale of mirror tier

[cobalt blade]

• getting good gloves with curse on hit implicit will cost you a good few div if you arent using unique ones

[full kraken]

.... recombinators I guess lol

[cobalt blade]

ichors /embers

[finite quail]

standard flask moment

[sonic vault]

the secret currency that gives you 7% more damage when rolled and smoked in your hideout

[full kraken]

Im gonna go ahead and assume fancy crafted cluster jewels like that are gonna run you a few mirrors to produce

you need to fracture the mod (good luck), then you need to blow who knows how many rerolling the enchant, and then craft the new one too, which is non trivial

cuz youll wanna hit your target enchant and 8 passives

[cobalt blade]

why are you saying good luck on a 1/4

thats not hard

[full kraken]

so its prolly gonna take dozens and dozens of the new currency, and Im just gonna assume its rare

[merry marlin]

The synth ones are going to be expensive

[opal ingot]

offer 20c

[full kraken]

take a wild stab in the dark on how expensive fracture orbs are going to become

[final owl]

for sure comboing clusters with notables from different types is not going to be easy or cheap. that's chase item stuff surely

[cobalt blade]

not very expensive because sanctum d rops them

[opal ingot]

i bet 3d

[full kraken]

did ggg make fracture orbs global drops btw

[cobalt blade]

yes

global drops and in sanctum

[sonic vault]

he's starting to believe

[full kraken]

does sanctum drop shards or whole ass fracture orbs

[cobalt blade]

shards gone

for fracture afaik

[finite quail]

[sonic vault]

[cobalt blade]

and if they arent they said orbs anyway

[full kraken]

okay so, fracture orbs are gonna be like 30D easy, calling it now

[finite quail]

shardes gone

its full orbs

[finite quail]

wrong

[opal ingot]

3d.

[finite quail]

they will be cheaper

[cobalt blade]

but when it comes to the currency lets say its 5d per attempt and never changes passives (because i hope it doesnt) its a 1/17 then to hit your correct base on using orb

[finite quail]

since they drop from global loot now

[full kraken]

like Im putting bets on fracture orbs being ultra rare, the SHARDS were already rarer than divines, an ENTIRE ORB is gonna be extremely rare

[full kraken]

yeah so do hinekoras locks and mirrors

[cobalt blade]

since yknow 17 possible bases

[opal ingot]

3 divine orbs.

[split maple]

Frac orbs were 1 per 20 maps on avg with full scarbs...

[full kraken]

*5 passive outcomes, so thats a 1 in 85 chance to hit it

[cobalt blade]

thats really not a bad craft imo

[split maple]

Like it rly wasn't hard to get them

[cobalt blade]

please read

[sonic vault]

and there's the new rare 'crafter' rogue exiles that drop a bunch of currency

[merry marlin]

My guess is 10ish divine for fractures

[full kraken]

you are coping hard if you think it doesnt change passive count

[cobalt blade]

i mean you can say that but we literally dunno

[full kraken]

yall coping hard on fracture orbs being common, and coping hard if you think it wont reroll passive count too

[sonic vault]

dont you want it to reroll passive count

[full kraken]

this is ggg we are talking about yall think this stuff gonna be easy to get haha

[cobalt blade]

and even if it is 1/85 that means currency will be cheaper

[sonic vault]

othewise its defo gonna be rare as absolute fuck lol

[cobalt blade]

no you want 8p

[full kraken]

Im gonna guess baseline, prolly 5d/attempt, maybe 4

[split maple]

That's kinda allright tho

[sonic vault]

they'd make it 100x rarer if it didnt reroll passive count, trust

[full kraken]

prolly gonna cost an average of a bit less than a mirror to hit a specific enchant with it

[split maple]

Like you go for these clusters when minmaxing

[cobalt blade]

if its a 1/85 it wont be 5d imo

[sonic vault]

with what seed

[full kraken]

thats with streamer rng :p

[sonic vault]

oh jesus

I'm lucky but I'm not that lucky

[cobalt blade]

2d maybe

[tranquil sedge]

even if frac orbs aren't terribly common in base pool i think sanctum will pick up a bit again

they said frac orbs added to sanc reward pool

[cobalt blade]

and yeah i really think fractures will be fine just because of sanctum

[tranquil sedge]

so it should help a little bit

[cobalt blade]

even if its sacred orb rarity sanctum still gives a shit ton of those

and i doubt its above sacred

[grizzled lily]

this challenge reward set is so cool

[sonic vault]

they should give us a bunch of different crafting goals and up currency drops 🥹

[tranquil sedge]

certainly not right?

[tranquil umbra]

how would you even be getting the cluster jewel enchantment currency

delirium?

[cobalt blade]

mirage deli

[merry marlin]

Mirage delirium

[cobalt blade]

would be weird as hell

[tranquil umbra]

would it drop over like actual clusters

I suppose

[sonic vault]

how hard would you bust if SSF in PoE got the Circle of Fortune (Last Epoch) treatment

[full kraken]

reminder: this is ggg so if you have to ask the answer is "take whatever you thought was reasonable and halve/double it"

[cobalt blade]

my guess is dropping from mobs random in miraged deli

But we rly dunno

[split maple]

Horrible, would drop the gamemode

[tranquil sedge]

aint that the truth

[tranquil sedge]

terrible

[split maple]

No challenge no point

Like Just go trade if you want that

[tranquil sedge]

would be out of place and not useful in poe

just play trade ^ if you want that

or self-imposed semi-restricted trade

[sonic vault]

but trade is for trade

I want more currency so I can craft lol

[split maple]

Point of ssf is brag rights

[tranquil sedge]

and ssf is if u want a challenge not 'custom arbitrary boosted droprate gamemode'

[split maple]

So farm more currency lol

[sonic vault]

couldn't be

[tranquil sedge]

just limit your trade to what you think you're comfortable with getting away with

its not that hard

[split maple]

Read the manifesto why they added it

[full kraken]

we got the exact opposite of that, ruthless ssf as a further option you can toggle on

and if you wanna toggle it even harder you install poe2

[sonic vault]

but trade reduces everything down to farming whatever is most efficient

[split maple]

Literaly for that

[cobalt blade]

eitherway tho tbh im not rly worried about the cost of hitting those clusters if it is above a mirror you just make the cluster for other people to mirror anyway

[tranquil sedge]

only if you want it to

[cobalt blade]

or mirror it once someones done that

[sonic vault]

but ssf players only ever get shit on

[tranquil sedge]

i farm suboptimal shit every league and still print mirrors, metachasing is a skill issue if you do it and don't like it

[cobalt blade]

You won't be the only person who wants say arcane heroism schint or unspeakable gifts+overlord or whatever random bases

[sonic vault]

maybe if you dont have a job lol

[final owl]

I imagine some things are just going to be harder to obtain than expected because reasons and that will be tweaked in later leagues. We don't really believe GGG nothing but netted 3.28 do we?

[split maple]

Rayne if you don't like ssf why Play it

[tranquil sedge]

even the most casual shit in this game prints at least 10d/hr and if u played a couple hours a day you'd have a mirror within a month

and if u are someone who chases mirrors you would certainly be printing at least 15-30d/hr doing any one of a few fun strats

[full kraken]

people think SSF players have to mention they are SSF constantly because they are bragging

they reality is SSF players have to keep reminding people they are SSF because anytime they discuss an issue they are facing everyone is like "bro just buy a better item bro" and you have to sigh and point to the letters "SSF" in your name

[tranquil sedge]

literally nothing is stopping you crafting in trade league

[sage falcon]

this might be the most pointless discussion ever

[split maple]

I have it more so People don't think I rmt

[cobalt blade]

the cluster one or ssf

[tranquil sedge]

lole

[final owl]

do you keep a score, I feel like there has to be some really strong competition regularly here

[tranquil sedge]

funny how this is true in every single game

[stoic horizon]

we all know ssf in your name means solo self funded

[tranquil sedge]

runescape has its 'ironman btw' meme

poe has 'ssf btw'

and whatever other games are there im sure have their respective names too

[sonic vault]

ironmen actually managed something kek

[sage falcon]

recency bias

[full kraken]

when I play ssf its not about self imposed challenge, but by changing my mentality and encouraging me to play stuff I wouldnt try normally, IE if you get a really cool drop in SSF it makes you go "oh snap, maybe I should try this build out now... I got the item for it..."

Meanwhile in trade league it drops, you price check it, 1c, and toss it in the garbage

[sonic vault]

the GE ruins RS, trade makes PoE good, entirely different worlds baby

[tranquil sedge]

im ngl if you think that's the case then you have no idea what you're talking about
droprates in runescape aren't balanced around respecting one's time at all either lol, you play ironman because it is a challenge

[grizzled lily]

this marks the 3 week anniversary of chatting and not finding anything useful out of it here

[sage falcon]

something something circular logic

[tranquil sedge]

this take is pretty braindead

[final owl]

thats fair.

[tranquil sedge]

like unironically, brain damage kind of take

[full kraken]

for example, I got an arakaalis fang my first time I tried SSF, never ever wouldve tried that build out, hadnt even been on my radar, but I was like "oh shit this is a build enabler right? lemme try it" and it was a blast, loved it

[sage falcon]

ssf is bad because it's bad and that makes ssf bad, if it was good then ssf would be good which would make it good

[cobalt blade]

in trade you filter it out since your only showing good uniques and then just memorize every unique for x bases price checking isa time waste

[tranquil sedge]

if he thinks ironman mode in runescape accomplishes something and ssf in poe does not he has no logic to begin with

and the grinds in that game are even worse, esp. in osrs

[stoic horizon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1469387892588548128.webp?size=96&animated=true

[sage falcon]

im sorry ssf is a waste of time

no point in furthr discussion ig

pack it up

[sonic vault]

if you think poe is the same is runescape why aren't you playing runescape right now

[cobalt blade]

poe is a waste of time

technically

[full kraken]

yeah which is its own sort of fun, but I do enjoy ruthless SSF every now and then, mostly cuz it just so substantially shifts your perspective on fun and what counts as "good loot"

[cobalt blade]

Its just fun

[sonic vault]

it's in the thing tho

[sage falcon]

if you're dealing with the base supposition that ssf is a waste of time there is no point in discussion

[stoic horizon]

a lot of people actually play both

[sonic vault]

even ggg claims as such, that's what the other guy said

[tranquil sedge]

the reason im being rude, which i'll stop now, is because the kind of thing fans of a game hate the most is 'why can't your game be more like <other game>'

[full kraken]

like in RSSF, getting triple resist boot drop with life on it is omgwtfbbq

[gritty epoch]

🪤

[cobalt blade]

Holy

[shrewd ember]

back in my day righteous fire was a hard build to make where you damage yourself

now it's the easy one!

[full kraken]

and you link it inchat and everyone is like "brrrro what the FUCK ARE THOSE?!"

[cobalt blade]

i would enjoy ruthless if it werent for the gem system

Thats the only thing that turns me off it

[final owl]

i am definitely hungry because that cheese looks kinda good ngl :I

[full kraken]

its honestly not too bad nowadays with lab fixing it

[cobalt blade]

Fucking despise having no supports forever

[finite quail]

huh

[cobalt blade]

I refuse to farm lab

[tranquil sedge]

https://klipy.com/gifs/cheese-kase-1

[neon veldt]

how expensive do we think will the blight annoint belt be?

[sweet wagon]

do we know if holy flame totem's 6 projectiles scale wth gem level or is the same

[finite quail]

I definitely do not have 5k of those div cards

[tranquil sedge]

look at lambie flexing his stash tabs on us

[full kraken]

you pretty quickly can assembly at least a half assed 5L that isnt optimal but like... good enough to take down pinnacles

[sonic vault]

sure but why does that mean a game mode without trade and with more currency so you have to craft stuff on your own bad

[finite quail]

3-6 proj as it levels up

[cobalt blade]

eh fair enough

[tranquil sedge]

because ssf can be migrated to trade

[stoic horizon]

they don't shotgun anyway so it doesnt matter much

[sweet wagon]

god damnit man

[stoic horizon]

helps very slightly with clear

[cobalt blade]

Havent tried it in a while maybe if i get bored of this league ill do a run

[sonic vault]

but then trade reduces everything to being about efficiency

[tranquil sedge]

that's the number 1 reason
the number 2 reason is of course its meant as nothing more than a self-imposed challenge

[finite quail]

doing some standard cleanup

[tranquil sedge]

again - only if you let it

[sonic vault]

you're kinda entirely missing the point lol

[sage falcon]

another false base presumption

[tranquil sedge]

you feeling forced to chase a meta does not impose that on everyone

[finite quail]

its not like it'll make that big a difference early on

[gritty epoch]

Poe2 tag

[tranquil sedge]

most of us just do whateverthefuck we want and get away with it

[sonic vault]

you falsely assume everyone has unlimited time

[cobalt blade]

this can still apply in ssf btw

[sweet wagon]

i just wanted an excuse to skip rolling magma

[tranquil sedge]

my guy if you dont have a lot of time to begin with and you think even in trade its not much idk what to say about even a boosted ssf

[cobalt blade]

You can be feel obligated to do kingsmarch or sanctum for div

[tranquil sedge]

like poe isn't a game people play if they dont have time in the first place

[full kraken]

what I still greatly dislike and think should be fixed is, bare min, the gems just up to brutus should be sold by npcs for currency. past that quest drop only, but before that there isnt much of a good reason to gate lv 1 to 8 gems behind walking your ass over to brutus 20 times

[cobalt blade]

or farm rogue exiles for uniques etc

[stoic horizon]

setups often actually use these both together for early damage

[sonic vault]

thats why I wish there was an option to get extra currency so you can experiment more but apparently wanting to fuck around is vorboten even in an ssf void mode

[cobalt blade]

sinfe anything else just isnt an efficient use of your time if you wanna meta mod craft

[sage falcon]

are we serious

[hoary scarab]

"respect your time" is always a flawed argument, cause if you would, you wouldnt be playing video games

[full kraken]

like if you wanna play ruthless optimal you gotta go get your brutus act time down to sub 18min cuz its critical, you wanna asap have 6 copies of your gem in weapon swap levelling

[sonic vault]

do you play ruthless?

[full kraken]

it suuucks

[gritty epoch]

I don't have time to play Poe I have 3 wives and 10 kids

[sage falcon]

this is literally a quagmire worse than vietnam

[shrewd ember]

wait a minute, what happened to that frostmage support?

[tranquil sedge]

even in an ssf void mode
that won't exist for the same reason you can't put that as a modifier on paid private leagues, and the same reason you don't get a phrecia every league

[sweet wagon]

yaeh but im too lazy... maybe ill try hft for fun either way

[hoary scarab]

do you wipe?

[cobalt blade]

I think thats bad for both transfer to trade and the self imposed restriction half the fun is being limited on stuff lmfao

[tranquil sedge]

its also bad because that would set a standard that affects player perception of other leagues lol

[full kraken]

its why I usually stick to playing skills that either:

1. I can get from Breaking some eggs or earlier
   or
2. Dont care about needing to be corrupted for vaal or +1 level

[cobalt blade]

yea

[sonic vault]

if you dont play ruthless then your entire argument collapses

[grizzled lily]

i once saw a guy int stack on ruthless with a mageblood

[tranquil sedge]

which is why we dont get affliction loot every league

and we dont get phrecia every league

[hoary scarab]

so you dont wipe, understood

[tranquil sedge]

you don't need to play ruthless to know how shit it with respecting a players' time

[cobalt blade]

Ye i kinda wish it worked like this too over just 3 gems from siosa you need to do multiple character to level multiple gems

[full kraken]

if you need a gem that wants +1 gem corrupt, or vaal, and its from brutus or god forbid cavern of wrath lv 12... you'll quickly come to despise act 1

[sonic vault]

wait why would you be able to transfer a bonus currency ssf character to trade that's honestly a low iq presumption

[full kraken]

cuz you gotta do that shit 7 times >_<;

[tranquil sedge]

you know migrating from ssf is a thing?

[sonic vault]

so respecting the players time is a factor, see

[tranquil sedge]

yea and if you think ssf doesn't respect yours, its easy, just don't play it and go trade instead

[full kraken]

I mean, theres a difference between "this is slow but fun and grindy" and "this is just 4 entire hours of walking my ass to brutus over and over"

[tranquil sedge]

this is path of exile not last epoch

[sonic vault]

regular ssf could be a different thing

[cobalt blade]

^ and theres alot of people who like to doa week of ssf migrate to trade

[grizzled lily]

hc ssf r challenge to settle this conversation, whoever gets to act 10 kitava wins the conversation

[sonic vault]

I don'

[tranquil sedge]

waste of developer time

[full kraken]

like walking to brutus 7 times isnt fun, its boring as hell

[hoary scarab]

why even play the challenge mode in the first place if its less of a challenge

[neon veldt]

yea, in last epoch ssf is actually fun, in poe it is hell

[cobalt blade]

Yep hard this^^

[sonic vault]

takes 5 minutes and would be more popular than ssf

[sage falcon]

good

but now consider this

[cobalt blade]

well no it wouldn't?

[tranquil sedge]

'takes 5 minutes' shows that you understand nothing about game development

[full kraken]

and theres no like, challenge to it.... you are just walking to brutus, its zero skill involved its just slow and boring

[sonic vault]

why play ssf over ssfhc?

[sage falcon]

if ggg wss given the option to make ssf easier, and they knew it would bring more players to ssf

would they do it

[hoary scarab]

cause some people dont like hc? what the fuck kinda question is this

[sonic vault]

its already a stat in the game

[sage falcon]

if you know ggg, the answer is no

[sonic vault]

like this one thing actually would take 5 minutes

[tranquil sedge]

certainly not lol when the game is primarily balanced around trade

[tranquil sedge]

it wouldn't, but go on

[sage falcon]

because it would compromise the vision of ssf

[full kraken]

kingsmarch did happen 🤔

[sage falcon]

even if it would be more popular

a lesser and weaker company might do it

[cobalt blade]

You do know how many man hours go into yknow balancing how currency drops feel

[tranquil sedge]

like the only people who think something takes 5 minutes are people who've never done software development in their life

[sonic vault]

there's a stat in the game called item quantity

[gritty epoch]

Why are we seriously trying to debate with a troll

[tranquil sedge]

"5 minutes"

[finite quail]

[cobalt blade]

Im bored

[sage falcon]

if you enjoy trade you're a metaslave
if you enjoy ssf you're a nolifer

[sonic vault]

Currency Quant 300%, yes like actually 5 minutes

[gritty epoch]

[full kraken]

the sprint planning meeting is already 5~7 peoples time multipled by 45 minutes burnt away alone XD

[final owl]

I mean the dunning kreuger effect plays a pretty big role in how internet gamers talk about game development. Just fix it bro.

[sage falcon]

can we not

[tranquil sedge]

fine

[split maple]

Rayne you would have a lil bit of point if ssf was about folks who dont like trade, but please can you read https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1823776

[sonic vault]

can you be a little less bad faith it comes off as weirdly defensive bro, like it's chill

[tranquil sedge]

can you try to apply some logic

you are asking for essentially a custom mode

and you might want currency boosted

someone else might want gear boosted

[sage falcon]

you accused me of assuming you have infinite time when i was responding to something else

[tranquil sedge]

someone else might want uniques booste

like what kinda dumb logic is that

[sage falcon]

you're preseting an impossible false dichotomy that i can't win

[stoic horizon]

logic in my ragebait channel? impossible

[sage falcon]

and you're accusing me of bad faith

[sonic vault]

brother private leagues are already a thing 😭

[tranquil sedge]

and you can't boost droprates in them

even tho you literally pay for them

you realize thats for a reason?

[cobalt blade]

someone might want boss fragments boosted

[sonic vault]

bro chill, you assume I want to like remove ssf and replace it with something else lol

[full kraken]

damn if only ggg made some kind of thing we can invest points into or something to modify the sort of stuff that our endgame experience was weighted towards rewarding us with

like a... passive tree or something, right? XD

[final owl]

the way you get to play with more things and try more things is by playing the game more init

[sonic vault]

getting this defensive over asking for more options is wild as fuck

[tranquil sedge]

if only i could play a gamemode where i can choose to farm whatever i want but also skip the boring parts and acquire currency quickly

i bet we could implement a 'trade' system for that maybe?

and it could be optional?

[sonic vault]

ok now hear me out, do you know what a "void league" is

[cobalt blade]

holy the innovation

[tranquil sedge]

ggg knows what that is and even they haven't offered it with boosted droprates, im sure this thought of yours has never occured to them before

[sonic vault]

the technology is THERE

[tranquil sedge]

nobody said the tech isn't there

[sage falcon]

if all you can do is resort to the "you're defensive" card that's pathetic

[tranquil sedge]

we said nobody is dumb enough to implement it

[split maple]

can we get swap lifeforce to random lifeforce harvest recipe please

[tranquil sedge]

for good reason

[sonic vault]

they're legitimately waiting for LE to die before they copy it kek

[cobalt blade]

that would actually be nuts in trade and ssf lol

[tranquil sedge]

LE seems to be managing that on its own just fine

[grizzled lily]

what if they can make ssf but party mode, you can start the ssf journey as a coop or smth, outside of trade league, like a singleplayer game, we alr have private leagues but oh well yk

[sonic vault]

It's not a card I just think it would come off better

[full kraken]

nah I dont think "an option to boost self found loot" can be compared to trade

trade fundamentally alters the psychology of reward loops in poe, you cant really argue this

no one cares about "div/hr" in SSF, but its the metric you are magnetically drawn to naturally in trade whether you like to or not, even if you dont want to, you subconciously know if you are doing something "suboptimal" in the rat race

[buoyant jungle]

If I allocate this keystone, will Hive Fortress no longer appear as well?

[cobalt blade]

fortress's are hives

so theyll appear

[finite quail]

fortresses are hives

[sage falcon]

good way to respond to literally nothing that i said

[finite quail]

they have hives in the name

hive fortress

[split maple]

idk folks do care about efficiency in ssf a whole lot - if nothing else you have to kinda do what 100k tradies do in two weeks in 4 months alone

[sonic vault]

it's ok bro you don't have to try and explain it I think it's impossible at this point lol

[tranquil sedge]

kinda agree with you, but ironically the boosted ssf loot would actually be worse off overall i reckon

ur conditioning players to expect a new baseline and that's just unhealthy

[split maple]

single player economy is still economy

[cobalt blade]

affliction

[sonic vault]

easy bro I'm a Destiny fan too but I'm not tryna debate rn

[tranquil sedge]

like have you seen how people have withdrawal symptoms after a temp league in runescape LOL

[finite quail]

you've done nothing but debate

[sonic vault]

ok now THAT is a great point lol

[full kraken]

I think ruthless is actually this mode, amusingly, its one of those things you have to experience yourself and then you're like "I get it now"

[tranquil sedge]

dude i already said this earlier lol

[full kraken]

You genuinely get more loot per map in ruthless mode, which I know, its counterintuitive, but its very much true

I usually have to, on unjuiced maps, haul out like 2.5 entire inventories of loot per map when I hit T16s

[sonic vault]

I just suggested a different game mode and a mod thought I was trying to ruin his life 😭

[tranquil sedge]

the worst part is i would unironically be down to give ruthless a go if it was only worse droprates/slower progression

but nah it fucks with too much of the game to be worth trying

way too many unnecessary changes

[opal ingot]

did someone mention destiny

[full kraken]

I think the roughest part is the flasks, it takes getting used to your flasks being way less reliable, thats the hardest part to get past

[cobalt blade]

this is just because you dont want to filter out the shit items

[sonic vault]

I probably missed it because half a dozen people dogpiled me lol

[tranquil sedge]

its way more than just that i think

[cobalt blade]

if you were willing to ID every rare outside of ruthless you'd experience the same thing lol

[spice pecan]

i think that gem scarcity is fine in roofless, but the weird things like no vendor recipes/pantheon/bench/reduced util flask charges/flasks dont gain charges while in effect/talking to npc in town to refill flasks

[full kraken]

sorta? its more like stuff that used to be trash is now actually worth picking up and you genuinely get more "oh nice!" moments per map

[spice pecan]

is what stops me from playing it more

[sage falcon]

wait there's literally no defense to this

he can just make stuff up and im fried

[spice pecan]

i didn't even finish campaign in roofless in 3.27

[tranquil sedge]

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Ruthless_mode#Brief_comparison_of_changes like holy shit is this a big wiki page lmao this screenshot is just the summary

[cobalt blade]

Ya

[full kraken]

well yeah but... doesnt that sound... good?

isnt that what people want? rares to feel valuable and worth IDing?

Btw tho its actually magic items you care more about! (recombinator goes brrrr)

[sage falcon]

i guess the mistake was replying in the first place

[sonic vault]

sorry, I wasn't meaning to shit on SSF I was just wanting another option for it lol. Like yeah it being transferable to trade league would be op for sure

[hoary scarab]

wait eternal orbs are in roofless

[slow niche]

Eating chicken with rice for a month and seeing a burger in front of you type shit

[sage falcon]

sorry, I wasn't meaning to shit on SSF

[split maple]

I am so sorry

[sonic vault]

I haven't heard about this one actually

[tranquil sedge]

you can't transfer them out so it doesn't matter

[full kraken]

but like, you get like 8~10 magic "good" bases of your ideal weapon per map, for example

and then you get to scratch lotto tickets and ID an entire stash tab of your ideal base and you usually hit a handful of T1 mods and get to be like "fuck yes, progress, time to craft!"

[hoary scarab]

frick that, roofless is the better mode

[spice pecan]

i like roofless every now and then, usually late leg

[merry marlin]

Locks are kinda better eternal orbs anyway

[cobalt blade]

ay and in trade theres a strat not many people do but ita actually decently good for recomb fodder is reduced rarity magic item farming w/ tawmr isley for auto id (although i did only know just realize it got nerfed with woke scarab gone)

[sage falcon]

I don't because it's literally a waste of time lol
im sorry ssf is a waste of time
n-nooo my self imposed challange is too hard and you guys wont let me braagg

[full kraken]

its more a case of essences and fossils being kinda shit, so recombinator is really really good and thus you care way more about gear drops than currency drops

[spice pecan]

can you even filter for specific mods on items that drop id'd?

[slow niche]

Did they change how orbs and stuff works as well?

[cobalt blade]

yes

[full kraken]

Like instead of "woohoo a divine" its "fuck yeah I got 8 crafting bases to recombinator this map, nice haul"

[split maple]

yea

[finite quail]

yes

[cobalt blade]

neversink has a section for it

[tranquil sedge]

i linked a wiki page above, have a look

[split maple]

was handy for provisioning wombs

[spice pecan]

that's pretty cool

[cobalt blade]

Its also how strongbox loot gets filtered

[hexed mountain]

do i smell a drama that will occupy me at least 30 seconds to wait for mirage?

[full kraken]

yeah and I kinda hate it, specifically, essences and fossils can only be used on normal items, not magic/rare

[hexed mountain]

[tranquil sedge]

its over now u missed it

[hexed mountain]

dammit

[spice pecan]

well i figured box loot got filtered by base type/links/quality, the normal stuff

[slow niche]

Tbh that's way too much to bother with ruthless

[cobalt blade]

Its one of the more funky niche strats

[tranquil sedge]

exactly, see? thats what i mean

[cobalt blade]

Nah its item mods :p

[sonic vault]

Yeah this seems like fake news, I hadn't heard about this anywhere else

[full kraken]

I have a major gripe that you cant at least use fossils/essences on magic bases

And the reason is because fractured mods still exist and matter

(in ruthless)

[spice pecan]

it's fun if you've done everything you want in the league but still want to play some poe

[cobalt blade]

like the weird bluey purple hue glow is +1 amulets

[hexed mountain]

i did ruthless to maps once , didnt like it but bragging rights i guess

[cobalt blade]

idrk how to explain it

[sage falcon]

what's the punchline

[slow niche]

I can just wait for phrecia tbh, or idk play anything else

[spice pecan]

done it a couple times, a10 kitava is your best friend

[full kraken]

Id say once you start doing pinnacle fights it starts to pick up and you start to really hit the stride of "damn I came so far and now Im kinda kicking ass"

[hexed mountain]

might enjoy it in a few decades

[sonic vault]

that I wish the last 3-4 lines I used didn't work so well irl

[tranquil sedge]

nah you need to do ruthless blindfolder with only your left hand using a controller and do it in less than 12 hours while also completing the all ears and no stone unturned achievements in one go

then you get to brag

[slow niche]

I rarely make a second build even, at most reroll the current character

[hexed mountain]

i still need my dashes and fast gameplay

[full kraken]

hey we have a dash now!

[acoustic hull]

Any Linux users here? I'm trying to get Awakened PoE Trade to work but I'm having trouble, if anyone can offer some advice.

[cobalt blade]

i did ruthless to i think act 6? on a 1 link and just said fuck this after dropping no supports that were useable

[tranquil sedge]

if you get a good twink gear setup before you start ur second build it can be a few hours of fun ngl

[cobalt blade]

It was interesting

[full kraken]

Im a linux user but havent setup woke trade yet

[tranquil sedge]

like a zoomy campaign is a nice change of pace after a month of endgame farming

[sonic vault]

[hexed mountain]

dash from temu

[tranquil sedge]

and then u get to make a new class endgame build

[sage falcon]

good way to come into the conversation acting like you have a point and leave it admitting that you're a troll

[slow niche]

Yeah but getting a character to 95 is not that fast

[tranquil sedge]

unfortunately im still a windows user 😄

[hexed mountain]

i really like leveling

[cobalt blade]

is your problem it mentioning wayland global hotkeys

if so gimme a sec

[sage falcon]

that's all that i can do anyways

[sonic vault]

two feets...two....boots

[tranquil sedge]

pay for 5 ways and put on a tv show for 1-2 hours

[slow niche]

Lmao

[hexed mountain]

its not rare that i get 6-8 chars to maps in a league

[tranquil sedge]

even after the nerfs, they're still incredible xp

[full kraken]

come join us in linux land, where your os isnt spying on you and hasnt replaced your search box with ads

[tranquil sedge]

its worth paying for em as soon as you hit the level requirement to join them in tft

pay to like 90-95 with 5-ways

[final owl]

if things you wanted didn't take time there wouldn't be much of a game

[tranquil sedge]

then just do the rest in maps

and its not that expensive either

early levels come real fast

[cobalt blade]

@acoustic hull ^

[tranquil sedge]

speaking of that

[slow niche]

Tbh i might play more this league only due to the new belt. I want to play with it and the hideen king ascendancy

[tranquil sedge]

lemme link u this article i found lol

[sonic vault]

I mean I mostly just wanted something like CoF, some opt in SSF shit with more orbies. I did get a little snarky when people assumed I meant that regular SSF should be DESTROYED and all SSF players sacrificed to baal

[acoustic hull]

I moved over to #linux-🐧 if we want to go over it there

[tranquil sedge]

https://www.windowslatest.com/2026/03/05/microsoft-isnt-launching-a-subscription-based-windows-12-ai-os-in-2026-the-rumors-are-just-ai-hallucinations/ this shit is funny

[cobalt blade]

ah k

[tranquil sedge]

i can't believe how low microslop has fallen, they outdo themselves every time

[hexed mountain]

too late , i think you two have to fight it out in a ring

[sonic vault]

I promise I don't think SSF players should be thrown in a volcano

[final owl]

be nice if that wasn't a completely believable outcome for the next generation of microslop windows anyway.

[sonic vault]

yet

[hexed mountain]

i heard he said things about your mom

[tranquil sedge]

meanwhile apple's just put out their $600 macbook with macos

[hexed mountain]

[sonic vault]

when sacrifice time coems I mean

SSF Sacrifices right

[slow niche]

Shit like this is why i modded the base win 11 to remove all the slop and telemetry

[sage falcon]

yeah the backpedaling doesn't work after

"a mod thought I was trying to ruin his life 😭"
if you're going to be a troll commit to it

[tranquil sedge]

im still on windows 10 LOL

[hexed mountain]

get him

[tranquil sedge]

i should probably sign up for the long term security updates at some point

[sage falcon]

ok gtg bye and gn

[golden moat]

im on windows 1

[hexed mountain]

🍿

[sonic vault]

I mean when a mod joins in the dogpiling it is a little weird lol, but I shoulda been less troll, it's chill brother

[slow niche]

I went on 11 for windows defender, ehich sucks ass btw, malwarebytes discovered shit WD didn't

[tranquil sedge]

hasn't malwarebytes gone to potato also nowadays?

[slow niche]

Doesn't look like it

[tranquil sedge]

is there even any av software that's worth paying for at this point?

[gritty epoch]

Overexageration (no one has unlimited time)
Blanket statement (all trade players is all about efficiency/ssf players nolife)
Strawman argument (u don't play ruthless your argument don't stand/no one has unlimited time)
Answers question with questions and bring in Y (ruthless, hardcore, private league) to stir more shit
Selective reply
Attack person rather than debate (to a mod )

[final owl]

windows defender doesn't suck. if it did windows machines would all immediately be part of a giant botnet.

[tranquil sedge]

im sure there's better stuff than defender but it doesn't seem bad for the casual user at least

i am a casual user

[sonic vault]

this is definitely fake news

[slow niche]

I would say no, it either chokes tf out of your pc or it doesn't do shit

[golden moat]

https://pobb.in/IidiGGrASHVt is this build worth investing into?

[tranquil sedge]

im stingy with paying for stuff and i'd still pay for good security software if it would be a strict upgrade over win defender

quiet and low overhead and just does its job and nothing more

[tranquil sedge]

theoretical pob or what is this?

[slow niche]

Less likely to detect trojans, i like to pirate a lot

[full kraken]

well, they didnt do anything, this is how far "news" has fallen, for example that developer who endured a robot writing a hit piece on him wrote a whole blog post on how after that happened, some other news articles started AI hallucinating misquotes on his blog post about how AI hallucinations in news cycles are bad

(ironic, right?)

[golden moat]

its imexiles char imported and changed some stuff

[stark badger]

I was just about to say WD is more than enough if you're not willingly doing risky shit

[slow niche]

Same, but i doubt there's one

[final owl]

3rd party paid AV loves to ring alarm bells about nothing so it looks like it is being wildly more effective.

[slow niche]

Hell i paid for startallback for pure convenience

[sonic vault]

Do you think the AI secretly revere AM

[tranquil sedge]

gonna be a pretty expensive build but that's good i guess, lots of room for investment

does this have ailment immunity?

i suppose i could open pob and check

[slow niche]

True, but at that time i also lost access to all of my accounts, WD didn't detect it and malwarebytes didn't

[final owl]

The best AV is, and always has been, not being a complete doofus on the internet. And none of them save you from that.

[golden moat]

purity of elements

[slow niche]

Nowadays i am intentionally downloading malicious content to check it with both WD and malwarebytes

[tranquil sedge]

yea its just more about how shit everything's becoming

sad and funny

[tranquil sedge]

but i want my dragon scimitar mouse cursor!

[sour wadi]

ya, at least i got like 5 desktop ai girlfriends now >: )

[full kraken]

An LLM is just a box that plays a game of family feud about 30 times per second, thats all it is, its the easiest way to understand how it doesnt think or feel or etc, its merely producing the next nth most likely word to come after <prior words> based on <all the prior words that came before> and das it, das all it does, but it just does it so good people mistake it for "thought"

[sonic vault]

what if I use that double poison ring and then take purity of elements from reliquaryist to offset the negative resist

[tranquil sedge]

very nice pob 😄

[sonic vault]

huh, weird, it keeps returning "KILL ALL HUMANS"

[full kraken]

sounds like it was trained on twitter

[surreal musk]

"alot of these options have incredibly implications"
average brain of reliquarian believer

[split maple]

oh i was pobbing fross pf in mercs iirc - just a mf version so like 10% of dmg there

[sonic vault]

fuuuck, you got me good with that one

[split maple]

rly nice to see it becoming a thing 😄

[tranquil sedge]

Cast when Damage Taken
Frostblink
this is funny ive never seen this before

is that useful? 😄

[heady cliff]

that is not true for about 1.5-2 years

[tranquil sedge]

seems interesting for afk/automatic 'dodging' lol

[sonic vault]

twitter is only useful for learning new slurs these days 😢

[full kraken]

I will say, theres some potential in being able to double up on "dual wielding" some uniques you normally couldnt use 2 of

IE a second source of "debuffs expire 100% faster" and etc

[golden moat]

?

[slow niche]

"incredible implications"
The fucking terminus est node with 10% as and frenzy on crit

[tranquil sedge]

dis

[onyx adder]

Its just poison fross it'll do poison fross things

[tranquil sedge]

ohhh

its immortal cool unticked

nvm

[split maple]

you can call me visionary 😄

[golden moat]

its for immortal call bud

[split maple]

it will still proc frostblink

[tranquil sedge]

my bad

but also like, now im curious

[split maple]

gonna be funny

[tranquil sedge]

how would it be using that for frostblink

[onyx adder]

This is a good hc setup but imo theres better things to do with ur money in softcore

[tranquil sedge]

[full kraken]

Ive not seen anything to indicate this is anything more than what even the most sophisticated of LLMs are, theyre still just selecting the top most likely vectorized tokens given prior tokens cycled into their recursive context

[golden moat]

if ur dumb enough to have it linked yea i suppose

[split maple]

for alvas cwdt lwarp/fb was kinda handy

[sonic vault]

Man I do love some of the slurs tho

like "jingakh"

[split maple]

when you lag out to still clear around

[sonic vault]

or "grave walker"

[surreal musk]

cbt larp

[sonic vault]

"ezomyr's rot"

like god damn bro chill

ezomytes are people too

[golden moat]

is anyone starting reliquarian that shit looks so ass

[final owl]

no way nobody trying a new ascendancy

[sonic vault]

its good for um

[surreal musk]

looks at assasian and warden rework playrates

[sonic vault]

that one build

[slow niche]

Would you need the map nodes after getting to t16? Not the ones for higher tier but just the generic ones

[onyx adder]

Its pretty narrow

[sonic vault]

its a new ascendancy

[full kraken]

one time buddies and I, working in the kitchen, came up with a new word to describe the act of fuckin around as "rice juggling", which literally came from a time I got bored and started trying to juggle 3 bagged portions of rice cuz business was that slow, no customers in like 2 hrs

Later that week one of the same of my buddies, (who was asian), was fuckin around and I was like "stop being a rice juggler dude" and my sous chef flipped out cuz they thought it was something racist and we both had to calm them down and be like "no no no thats... no... not what it means"

[onyx adder]

U need to want to play specific builds like say pyroclast mines

[final owl]

i mean it's not zero eh?

[onyx adder]

Or madness boot

[sonic vault]

not that warden isn't new tbf lol, it just make raider die

[split maple]

idk why warden is so unpopular rly, it has its place

[onyx adder]

If ur clicking it for [insert generic build here] ur going to have a bad time

[split maple]

ass rework was halfbaked tho

[stark badger]

yeah reliquarian has interactions, not numbers

[heady cliff]

reasoning models have different loss in a final stages of training, and they are equivalent to next tier in theoretical complexity

[onyx adder]

Ppl hate clicking the resurrect in town button

Assassin is the same

[sonic vault]

I think raider was my most played starter in old poe 😅

[onyx adder]

Efficient damage nodes and u just die all the time

[hexed mountain]

i think pyroclast is the only solid reliquarian STARTER , everything else needs specific items

[sonic vault]

xp loss makes me puke

physically ill

[split maple]

idk i feel like ass still has this issue of wanting to be both inquis and pathfinder at same time and kinda missing both

[heady cliff]

they crudely use this reasoning as kind of a stack to keep track of intermediate computations

[elfin shale]

No idea what youd play on Reliquarian besides Pyroclast tbh

[full kraken]

they... still output a selection of top n vector values afaik, how they get to that answer has changed, but thats still their output today

[sonic vault]

yeah I feel that

[onyx adder]

Bleed is probably also ok because brassdome into jack the axe is strong

[stark badger]

considering how much people go on about 6 portal defenses I imagine with even squishier builds they just brick regular ass maps

[split maple]

while warden yea you need some defence work, but its enough dmg you can actually invest into defence

[onyx adder]

It just doesnt scale at all

[sonic vault]

like it doesnt go far enough any one way

[heady cliff]

this "how" is the difference between simple function and a loop

[full kraken]

like just cuz the machine does a triple backflip before spitting out "heres the top n most likely next tokens" doesnt change the fact its output is still the same form factor

[heady cliff]

not exactly that, but this is the closest analogue

[onyx adder]

Well what are u going to invest into in like the first three weeks, is the problem

[sonic vault]

how good is assassin's escape artist node really

[full kraken]

sure, its output can be measurably better quality, but its still serving the same purpose

[slow niche]

Due to the 100% more damage node?

[hexed mountain]

warden would be more played if barkskin branch was a 2 pointer and a bit weaker , you can't use 4 points and get the good barkskin node because you dont have 4 points left

[split maple]

yeah i wouldnt legstart it if you pay me

[split pagoda]

is jack the axe even that good, 10% life reserve lol

[full kraken]

like... a car that drives twice as fast as anothe car is still a car

[onyx adder]

Suppression is table stakes, everyone already gets that

[tranquil sedge]

good earlyleague wep for bleed builds, cheap and strong

[onyx adder]

Evasion is like half a defensive layer on its own, maybe

[stark badger]

raider was a good poverty/ssf leaguestarter, warden is ????

[heady cliff]

if you ask non-reasoning old models what 2^5 would be, it would guess; if you ask reasoning model what 2^5 would be, it can actually calculate it step by step

[tidal trail]

all of my characters have been migrated but I still have a trade stuck in phrecia 2.0...any ways to fix that?

[onyx adder]

U cant really access block or maxres easily

[full kraken]

you can go on and on about how it has a better engine and better horsepower or better steering

but... its still a car

[dry tree]

10% is not really a big penalty for that buff

[heady cliff]

this is fundamental difference between those classes

[hexed mountain]

warden is probably a very solid starter caster for some build tho especially with its recent buff

[sonic vault]

still pretending to be human vs actually forming thoughts

[tranquil sedge]

aren't those just calling tools under the hood tho, like a call to a calculator?

[golden moat]

warden is for snoobae to boast about his tornado shot building prowess xD

[onyx adder]

So u need enough budget to go ghost dance ES with at least one more defensive layer

Or ur just gonna walk of shame every map four times

[split pagoda]

I mean the reliquarian node in particular i havent looked at the weapon itself

[hexed mountain]

like ball lightning warden sounds kinda nice as starter but... you need to mule the gems

[heady cliff]

if they are trained to do so, i am speaking about theoretical class of tasks that is possible to complete

non-reasoning are one class below

[edgy shard]

what MTX spell effect is this

[golden moat]

herald

[sonic vault]

automaton iirc

[slow niche]

Herald of ice?

[heady cliff]

if you cant write intermediate computations to the reasoning part, you are fundamentally limited to guessing the answer

[full kraken]

Im not aware of a model, on its own, that has this capability, just the model

the framework overtop of the model, which uses aother model, and in fact uses several distinct models, can achieve this

but thats no longer the model doing that sort of thing

[heady cliff]

if you can, you can reliably find the answer

[sonic vault]

https://youtu.be/9Dz2sw4JK30?t=16

[split maple]

Okay Ig warden actual niche is the two dudes who both do highinvest builds and don't mind clicking two more dmg buttons it's certainly Best in that design space tho

[slow niche]

Yeah but why would you ask an AI to do calculator things, it's like asking a youtuber to not bait

[hexed mountain]

people who just want fucktons of damage too

[onyx adder]

Well at that level what u really want is to run very fast and warden isnt the best at that either

[hexed mountain]

also the fastest your build hits the better warden is

[full kraken]

but just one single language model on its own, all it does is "given prior tokens, here are the top n next likely tokens that would come next" thats all they do

[onyx adder]

Because u can solve damage and defenses with a large bag of divines

[dry tree]

Wardens niche is being the first full ascendancy replacement to be entirely worse than the predecessor despite that seeming impossible

[onyx adder]

But u cant shove extra quicksilvers up ur ass

[hexed mountain]

insanely wrong

raider didnt scale at all

[onyx adder]

Wrong only because raider was horrendous

[split maple]

Accel shrine belt trust

[onyx adder]

Not because warden is good

[sonic vault]

wait isnt warden gonna be good now or is that what people were saying

[hexed mountain]

warden is good at what he does

[slow niche]

All raider needed was some damage beside frenzy charges

[hexed mountain]

and thats dealling hilarious damage

[onyx adder]

But because if u clicked raider right before the rework u were actually blind or trolling

[heady cliff]

you can always ask any chat model that question

[sonic vault]

the rework was fuck awful yeah

[dry tree]

Raider at least pretended to look compelling for people trying to play flicker and people who said hey look I can run fast

[slow niche]

And what does she do best?

[heady cliff]

2^5 is likely too easy to see the difference

[dry tree]

Warden doesn't even bait you

[hexed mountain]

x5 your damage

[sonic vault]

right before rework yeah iirc deadeye outright beat it

[onyx adder]

Make cool pobs

[sonic vault]

didnt deadeye have tailwind before raider got reworked and it was superior

[hexed mountain]

some setups make it give even much more

[slow niche]

Where is that 5 times coming from?

[onyx adder]

Warden pobs are heaps fun until u try and make maxhit number go up

[hexed mountain]

two buffed tinctures and oath of spring

[onyx adder]

Then u uninstall pob and go for a walk

[sonic vault]

yeah, with the new belt you can maybe go for double tincture action

[split maple]

if you dont go for two tinctures warden dont make any sense already rn

[noble sleet]

Not sure what to league start with, I guess this league is all up in the air. Last time I played was vsof and I guess that build was pretty op asf for a league starter and everyone was playing that. But now hmm idk lol. Maybe I should wait a few days to see if there’s any new discoveries?

[split maple]

tho yeah shrine belt buffs that

[onyx adder]

It does

[sonic vault]

true ye, but now the belt can guilt trip you into going it kek

[dry tree]

You know an ascendancy is good when people say "maybe with this new chase unique and insane rolls it could be playable"

[grim pivot]

Recombs stil the same? Planning to play next league

[onyx adder]

Theres probably a spot this league for accel shrine warden

[sonic vault]

more like "god tier"

[onyx adder]

I can give credit where its due

[split maple]

unknown, recombi changes were not in patchies in 3.26

[sonic vault]

as in "for gods only"

[full kraken]

1. Take any model, even latest and greatest

2. Ask it to start computing a simple math formula

3. pause it halfway through the production of the formula

4. edit its own context in memory to be incorrect now, near the start of its "reasoning"

5. Allow it to resume and observe what starts to happen, observe it start to fold itself into a pretzel

[slow niche]

Ah tinctures

[dry tree]

If you have that item every ascendancy looks good

[onyx adder]

Warden does look relatively better tbf

[hexed mountain]

for example on my warden i go from 3.5M to 37M from tincture + oath of spring

[slow niche]

Yeah or any other character probably

[heady cliff]

pause any process in your pc, then edit his memory with any cheat and watch it crash

[onyx adder]

Since u get to run around very fast and tailwind is only additive with accel shrine so deadeye is relatively less interesting

[sonic vault]

think about how much better your flask slots look with double tincture tho

[split maple]

lets not forget that 3.27 made game much more forgiving to being glassy and 3.28 doesnt look that different (especially with some more t17 mods removed)

[sonic vault]

hoh baby

[heady cliff]

how is that different?

[sonic vault]

glass cannons dont like rippy

[full kraken]

no... not the same lol, you arent crashing the program, you are just causing the llm to enter a state where "fucked up stuff" is the statistically most likely next outcomes

[dry tree]

Hey I'm all for you guys crashing out about AI but can you stop burying our shitty warden discussion I really don't give a shit about AI thanks

[gritty epoch]

Warden bad, next

[hexed mountain]

warden good people dont like clicking tinctures

[slow niche]

Assassin bad

[sonic vault]

tell me when an AI can play ssfhc

[surreal musk]

warden bad d4 dogshit

[heady cliff]

warden > d4

[hexed mountain]

at least warden does what you pick it for and that's damage

[dry tree]

Warden < war now

[hexed mountain]

assassin struggles to get the damage you'd pick it for

[muted ledge]

Do map mod effect nodes affect unique maps like synth?

[sonic vault]

Terraria > Warden > d4

[full kraken]

If I take this first few lines of a play:

Actor 1: Hello sir!
Actor 2: mjksadnksadnkan
Actor 1: Wonderful, and what are you up to today?
Actor 2: nmflkmdflgnfdkgnkd
Actor 1: Fascinating. And how will you do that?
Actor 2:

And I hand that to 1000 people and ask them to guess what comes next, thats not "crashing" a program

People will simply just say "Well Im gonna guess Actor 2 says even more gibberish I guess"

[slow niche]

The problem is that i would have to look when they are done

[split maple]

no, unique maps dont give a fuck about atlas

[wispy flicker]

do we know when pob might update?

[split maple]

#2┃general

[hexed mountain]

you see it in the buff bar and you get used to the timing with auto deactivation

[heady cliff]

okay, modify your vram and look at trash at your screen

[hexed mountain]

also you notice if your dps suddenly gets divided by four

[onyx adder]

That is true, and 3.28 is probsbly easier on top because not having to run t17 layouts means ur spending less time in the same postcode as mobs

[full kraken]

not the same thing, the program didnt crash or break, it is still doing exactly what it would do and performing as expected

[slow niche]

Noone looks there unless you have an echoing shrine on you

[sonic vault]

so, archmage heiro

[heady cliff]

modifying vram would not crash the game either

[hexed mountain]

you see the buff disappearing , dont be dense

[heady cliff]

it would just look... "funny"

[full kraken]

If I give an LLM the prior context of

banana
banana
banana
banana

And ask it to fill in what happens next, its gonna say "banana"

[gritty epoch]

Markov chain something something veritasium

[full kraken]

cuz thats what llms do lol

thats not "breaking" them thats just literally what they do as a box, they take prior tokens and guess the next one

[split maple]

are there any cliffnotes for yesterday interview?

in text form

[heady cliff]

and you would prove that llms could do simple things, why would they not be able to?

[sonic vault]

@cobalt blade so like, if you did get echo shrine belt first week do you think you'd survive

[spice pecan]

new vaal orb, that's kind of about it

it was a strange interview

[heady cliff]

test them on hard things instead, look where their limits are

[cobalt blade]

wot

[split maple]

more scared bout that stat stacking planed nerfs stuff in 3.29 😛

[sonic vault]

a poe player ate this diet for his league start, this is what happened to his kidneys

[sonic vault]

from busting that hard

[slow niche]

Maybe if there was a visual cue on your character, but looking for it in the buff bar would be a drag

[golden moat]

to the dude who drops accel shrine on the new belt first, gz on mirror

[hexed mountain]

its your last buff since its temporary its in the middle of the screen

[sonic vault]

wait shit what do I eat for league start

[hexed mountain]

pasta

[sonic vault]

do I make a bunch of taco meat tomorrow

[full kraken]

anything you observe them "doing" is just a statistical simulacrum of "wisdom of the crowd" producing something that creates the illusion of doing that thing, which is fine but important to understand the distinction of

[hexed mountain]

pasta is always the play when you need to last

[slow niche]

Banana

[sonic vault]

i made a vat of pasta sauce two weeks ago lol

it all got et

[golden moat]

just order delivery all weekend like me

[sonic vault]

I'm too chef to order takeout

[surreal musk]

jar of peanut butter

with spoon

[hexed mountain]

going to buy some diced bacon later to make unholy carbonara for leaguestart

[elder marlin]

Does rf or annihilation count as having burning on u for wrapped in flames?

[sonic vault]

also my gf likes my food so I should have a few days ready lol

[full kraken]

I still have like 6 gallons of tonkotsu I gotta work through, might have some ramen tomorrow ❤️

[spice pecan]

rf gets turned off if you use a flask with remove burning suffix

[dry tree]

Burning is just any fire dot on you so yes

[sonic vault]

oh true could render down an abusive pan of bacon

[tribal rose]

is there a way to extend the duration of the 20 second line shrine buff you get from guardian ascendancy every 10s?
does self curse temp chains do that or is that removed

[heady cliff]

how good stastistical simulacrum of predicting next word could be? not very, it was an interesting chatbot with gpt3.5 or similar; how good statistical simulacrum of formalized problem solving is? ask IT juniors... wait, where are they?

[cobalt blade]

i just wouldnt do that im ex pecting to farm the currency for it week 1 maybe 2

[sonic vault]

I hear that's lucky

[split maple]

self curse should work yea

[cobalt blade]

its not that hard to farm some mirrors in that time

[hexed mountain]

unironically cooking better on leaguestart days simply because i try to pass time and prep

[slow niche]

Prepare a stock and marinate a bunch of eggs in soy sauce, ez soup for when you need it

[elder marlin]

So if i have rf im counted for wrapped in flame?

[sonic vault]

he thinks he'll be able to afford echo belt

[heady cliff]

this is what thinking models allowed, automatic problem solving training instead of next word prediction training

[full kraken]

my wife has started taking a lil bit of it to work each day to drink hot, says its actually really good for her voice (music teacher)

[sonic vault]

imagine the utopia the world would be if you could greentext on discord

[full kraken]

?

[heady cliff]

because added theoretical complexity from having memory, even if write-only - allowed them to be capable of such task

[sonic vault]

oh shit wait I can prolly mod it to make that text green

[full kraken]

▲
▲▲

[cobalt blade]

she* and yes https://poe.ninja/poe1/builds/keepers/character/Nacasatú-2245/NacaMarauderKeepers example keepers character

[spice pecan]

newfriends can't triforce

[heady cliff]

even more modern context compression techniques come close to making that memory modifyable at will, at which point that is pretty much turing complete

and it would learn any task you could strictly formulate for it

[golden moat]

bro is teaching a computer class in chat

[cobalt blade]

(you can check week 3) https://poe.ninja/poe1/builds/phrecia2.0/character/Nacasatú-2245/NacaAristocatW?i=0&search=name%3Dnaca&timemachine=week-1 or phrecia week 1

[full kraken]

I havent seen any models boasting this capability you speak of, feel free to link me one tho Id love to read about it

I wont say you are wrong, but I will say I feel like such a thng is something I wouldve heard about

[sonic vault]

ok ok, I get it you're a God. I guess if ya want you can buy me an echo belt

[full kraken]

but maybe I missed it /shrug

[golden moat]

fk it imma just start uber dans blorbit build

[cobalt blade]

nah

just flip to one if you cant farm

[heady cliff]

it is currently in research, keywords to look for is context compression

[pastel crystal]

is perfect agony on spells a thing

[sonic vault]

what does she think of serj tankian

[heady cliff]

i am not claiming that it is solved

[split maple]

some people are actually good at the game, news at 7

[golden moat]

fireball

[sonic vault]

you wouldn't think they'd be on the poe discord at midnight tho

[spice pecan]

i would guess it's too point intensive for PA spells

[golden moat]

or rolling magma mines

[onyx adder]

I take it u havent met shax

[pastel crystal]

i mean there isnt a lot of sources of crit multi in shadow area that isnt daggers or mines or smth

[cobalt blade]

have you considered time zones and thati havent slept

[pastel crystal]

who

[stoic horizon]

+ green text log in

[golden moat]

saw jung pob for it once, can't say it was ever played tho xD

[stoic horizon]

bruh doesnt work

[cobalt blade]

works onpc

not mobile

[stoic horizon]

ah makes sense

[onyx adder]

Usually if u say perfect agony 3 times he appears and starts spamming pobs with ungils harmony its like beetlejuice

[sonic vault]

how can you be in the UK and think I wasn't taking the piss

[cobalt blade]

ireland

fuck the uk

[full kraken]

I would say most of our knowledge of SoaD is limited to surface level stuff, top 5 hits maybe tops, not active listeners of em

[pastel crystal]

can u ping him for me

[sonic vault]

uk-zealand

[cobalt blade]

Also bored and just taking stuff seriously for fun

[pastel crystal]

since this downside doesnt affect poisons

[cobalt blade]

like actually dont though

[onyx adder]

@finite otter #1┃general wants your latest perfect agony abomination

[soft perch]

the downside is perfect agony already

[pastel crystal]

true

[sonic vault]

ireland needs an arpg studio

[pastel crystal]

but its easier to scale crit multi that dot multi im assuming

[leaden quiver]

It is

[grizzled lily]

https://tenor.com/view/pigeon-doctor-pigeon-doctor-walking-t-mobile-gif-7871406254764076813

[leaden quiver]

But yiu have to scale crit

Thats the problem

[onyx adder]

U cant click that node on perfect agony surely

[gritty epoch]

The real perfect agony is the agony we suffered allocating the keystone

[leaden quiver]

Why

[cobalt blade]

if an arpg studio does move here it would be for tax reasons lmfao

[leaden quiver]

Forbidden it

Looks like straight damage

[onyx adder]

Since u really want 100% crit chance

[sonic vault]

if nz is making godly arpg then the other dank bonus island needs one kek

[leaden quiver]

Eh, if youre at 60-70 with marylenes its okay is it not

[pastel crystal]

^

[dry tree]

Is 70% accuracy okay?

[leaden quiver]

No

[full kraken]

how does lucky crit work with forced 50% chance on that one uh... helm or whatever

[dry tree]

Okay so 70% chance to apply ailments is bad

[full kraken]

or weapon?

the thing that forces crit chance to 50%

[hexed mountain]

it ignores it

[full kraken]

blah

[hexed mountain]

you roll twice

[split maple]

winds of fate?

[dry tree]

Just cap your chance if you're going PA don't try and get cute with lucky

[pastel crystal]

u lose like 2% effective poison chance but u gain like 200% dot multi from marylenes so

[leaden quiver]

88%

With lucky

[dry tree]

Yeah that's trash

[leaden quiver]

If you hit with a multihit you dont care

[full kraken]

okay hear me out... azadi crest

[hexed mountain]

lucky winds of fate is just 75% crit

[full kraken]

oh wait its a staff isnt it

[hexed mountain]

yeah

[leaden quiver]

There is a build hidden somewhere in the game with dance with death, azadi, glad and actum

[dry tree]

Lucky crit chance is neat on 50% crit builds that deal damage when they don't crit

[leaden quiver]

FYI lucky lets you ignore actums set crit, allowing you like 77% free flat crit

[spice pecan]

maybe i just play rolling magma mines

[golden moat]

poe 2 vaaling incandescent heart for damage immunity might be the play tbh

[leaden quiver]

Problem? Shitty aspeed and only ok damage

[fallow escarp]

For bound by destiny can you get the same influence multiple times for the amounts or no?

[leaden quiver]

Upside? Marylenes with no investment into % crit

[leaden quiver]

U mean 4 and 4?

[cobalt blade]

If defiled was still in the it could've been fine tbh

[split maple]

wdym?

[stoic horizon]

but then you have to use actum

[leaden quiver]

Its always 2 4 6

[cobalt blade]

without defiled thats gonna feel iffy

[sonic vault]

👀

[leaden quiver]

Yeah thats why I said its a downside

[pastel crystal]

im aiming for like 95%+ crit rate with marylenes and lucky dw

[sonic vault]

If I got this name does that mean I have to play archmage herio

[leaden quiver]

The attack speed is bad

[split maple]

oh if you can get 2 shaper, 4 shaper, 6 shaper at same time bdd? idk prolly not

[fallow escarp]

No. I meant 4 warlord 6 warlord but the answer is no it seems

[full kraken]

not bad crit chance tbh

[leaden quiver]

It is no

[split maple]

" It cannot roll more than one modifier with the same type of influence." https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Bound_By_Destiny

[leaden quiver]

Yeah

The flat damage is pretty okay

But aspeed is atrocious

[golden moat]

30 ele as chaos with the poe 2 vaal orb, gimme that

[full kraken]

this is hilarious btw

[cobalt blade]

Alternatively a loreweave with has 7 sockets

[pastel crystal]

is there any sources of cast speed scaling for mines? like slave drivers for traps

[fallow escarp]

You can get like 88 max res on loreweave and use transcendence. It’s just better.

[leaden quiver]

Kekw

[hexed mountain]

hm eye of winter warden miner

[cobalt blade]

if its x1.22 it should goto 90

[fallow escarp]

Even better

[pastel crystal]

🤢 warden

[leaden quiver]

Isnt that modifier on loreweave unscalable

You really should check the tags lol

[hexed mountain]

the two good oaths and barkskin , getting 100% shock and permafreeze

[fallow escarp]

It’s 76-78

[golden moat]

welp guess im trauma stacking

[leaden quiver]

Yeah, but is it affected by tailoring orbs?

Dont think so

[cobalt blade]

Yeh but iirc it works by changing the divine range in 2

[slow niche]

i don't think i ever saw a build with actum

[hexed mountain]

in good area for proj based mine too

[leaden quiver]

If its not, new vaal orb doesnt affect it either

[sonic vault]

gods have 87%

[candid moon]

New vaal orb?

[full kraken]

poggers

[cobalt blade]

in which case id assume it bypasses unscaleable but we need to see in game to know

[full kraken]

it actually can be tailor orb'd

[leaden quiver]

It can?

[hexed mountain]

like EoW mine hoarfrost might be the nastiest freeze build possible

[full kraken]

n e a t

[leaden quiver]

I have never seen anyone tailor orb it

That would be popular wouldnt it?

[full kraken]

yeah I dunno why you wouldnt

wait does it math out to less than 1%?

[fallow escarp]

Yeah. New static strike with trauma stack and replica moon bender sounds nutty

[golden moat]

but but but.... 4% increased melee per 10 str....

[leaden quiver]

Yeah thats why that leads me to believe it has 'Unscalable modifier' when you hover Alt over it

[hexed mountain]

does someone have ANY idea how to calclulate EoW damage on PoB?

[leaden quiver]

Not even the devs do

[hexed mountain]

[golden moat]

ask jung

[leaden quiver]

Anyway new totem with foulborn searing touch

Looks pretty k

[sonic vault]

wait yeah would "sets to" scale

i feel like usually no but i honestly dunno

[hexed mountain]

do i unironically last day flip a warden miner

[full kraken]

how do you see this in poedb?

[hexed mountain]

[short prairie]

Override

[leaden quiver]

Ashes give you like +50% more per totem

[cobalt blade]

you dont afaik

[stoic horizon]

2 mil dmg with 1 item is pretty k yeah

[cobalt blade]

i just logged in game and found one

[full kraken]

is it this part?

[stoic horizon]

[pastel crystal]

it rolls up to 120% of the original apparently, and u only need 115% to hit 90% max res with volatile vaal orb

[leaden quiver]

Yeah, a bit annoing tho, unless u trap it?

[pastel crystal]

[hazy kiln]

tbh I'm not even sure what "calculate EoW damage" even means, it's probably the finickiest skill in the game with regard to hit rate

[split maple]

nebulis "(60-120)% increased Implicit Modifier magnitudes" + vaalie orb + idk explodey implicit or whatever you want

[golden moat]

replica rumis with the poe 2 vaa orb? no way flasks work with it right? progenesis?

[hazy kiln]

tiny changes in distance/positioning/etc can cause massive differences in hits per cast

[stoic horizon]

ye mythic had a trap pob

[leaden quiver]

Best bet would be to write a tool that simulates the hits

Like spark lol

[sonic vault]

orb of winter was the one where someone wrote a dissertation on the shotgunning damage scaling right

[full kraken]

nah nevermind its unscalable

[hexed mountain]

i meant have any idea of what damage you can expect

[hazy kiln]

I feel like spark is small potatoes compared to EoW 🤣

[full kraken]

WAIT THEY ADDED POE2 CORRUPT TO POE1?!?!?!?!

[pastel crystal]

oh

[leaden quiver]

Sounds like a challenge

[leaden quiver]

Yeah

[full kraken]

oh jesus fuck thats a huge deal for Twisters

[leaden quiver]

From yday stream

[pastel crystal]

it is but EOW doesnt give u the same level of screen cancer

doesnt hit the same

[leaden quiver]

Be mindful of unscalable values though

[sonic vault]

maybe touhou players can compute it?

[hexed mountain]

wdym poe2 corrupt? the one changing rolls?

[full kraken]

"reduced skill effect duration" is scalable but tagless

[candid moon]

Can you like, roll higher skill gem levels that uniques give?

[sonic vault]

they know something about 7 trillion projectiles

[sonic vault]

usually no because it doesnt round up

[dark sequoia]

What is a good skill for taking advantage of herald of ash's overkill damage?
Other than like, discharge.

[split maple]

there is a funny mirage vaal orb yea

[full kraken]

so I can get up to 24% reduced skill effect duration on each of my uniques now

[pastel crystal]

replica dragonfangs? no since its fixed at +3 afaik

[split maple]

just prayge it doesnt fuck up your divine like poo2 version 🙏

[candid moon]

Lvl30 x1.2 would be 36, no?

[stoic horizon]

check on the stat description if it says unscalable or not, and even then it might change when update rolls out

[leaden quiver]

Yeah

That would be affected

[pastel crystal]

oh u mean shako?

[golden moat]

no way any of these stat modifiers change with poe 2 vaal orb right? besides arm/eva

[sonic vault]

oh yeah the ones with enough numbers... probably?

[surreal musk]

this new vaal probably works in WE mods id think

[sonic vault]

is it unscalabale lemme see in game