1┃general

[tight plinth]

right

[coral summit]

31k base fire damage, with 70% more and 300% more

[whole bluff]

Anyone dissected secrets pinnacles/ubers? Also, are t17 bosses biased to something or have any pen?

[coral summit]

211.6k base damage

[frigid wedge]

poedb?

[coral summit]

ubers dont have hidden more multipliers, they usually just have higher base numbers you can see on poedb and sometimes added stats on skills

[cobalt blade]

Its not bad

[whole bluff]

Yeah, I just wondered if someone had an estimate

[cobalt blade]

easier to tank than brain blast if that gives you a rough estimate

Slightly harder than memory game

(iirc)

[whole bluff]

Plus had cross referenced all the funny names to specific abilities

[cobalt blade]

the fun one to tank imo is inescapable doom

[loud geyser]

i miss losing my sanity on this game :(

[frigid wedge]

right

[coral summit]

we barely live it with VMS

[loud geyser]

poe2 just doesn't hit the same after playing poe1

[coral summit]

and sap+basalt flask

[frigid wedge]

im losing my sanity and poe isn't fixing it

[loud geyser]

😂

[frigid wedge]

it should be

[cobalt blade]

Nb

[coral summit]

i think the thing with inescapable doom is that it's both a way bigger hit and the aura from standing in his channel makes you take inc damage per stack, right?

[cobalt blade]

yeah

Iirc its close to a mil cold/light at the top end

[loud geyser]

i hope they update the breach boss models

[coral summit]

it's basically impossible to tank unless you're doing some hilariously degenerate stuff

[cobalt blade]

(total damage)

[loud geyser]

that would be a spicy surprise

[frigid wedge]

if i fully lock im how long u all think it would take me to finish acts with twink gear from here

[cobalt blade]

ive tanked it conditionally a few times

[loud geyser]

15 minutes

[coral summit]

5 stack immortal call with like, purity of fire conversion+giant hit pool and arctic armour

[cobalt blade]

The uh solaris half damage from area

[frigid wedge]

no like

act 10

[coral summit]

oh yeah that too

[frigid wedge]

thats a4

[loud geyser]

oh

1 hour

[coral summit]

thats just rng tho

im thinking if you wanted to do it without RNG it's a lot harder

[cobalt blade]

i dunno how well you know layouts but hour 30?

[cobalt blade]

yeah

Well

Excluding vaal arctic

Vaal arctic isnt real

[frigid wedge]

i hate the knowledge that these r probably decent guesses

consider i got there in an hour 25

[coral summit]

unless in keepers you did the really funny thing where you took two corrupted overcap colds grafts+saboteur node

[loud geyser]

i mean im thinking of it as

if you are on a build that is going to walk over campaign

and you dont have to press button

[cobalt blade]

god no it was just on a jugg sublime setup out of curiosity

[loud geyser]

then yeah 1 hour?

[coral summit]

yeah that'd do it

[frigid wedge]

in theory it should, in practice idk yet

[coral summit]

when in doubt throw jugg at it lmao

[whole bluff]

When I do mageblood + forbiddens lvl of twink gear, I usually got dominus around 50-60min 2-3 times. Then a full time of maybe a bit below 3h. So if you use reasonable twink gear rather than absurd, I could probably guesstimate 2h+ if it were me

[cobalt blade]

and i think i only tanked it because of Solaris not actually completely sure

[frigid wedge]

im testing a variation of a twink setup i haven't used in the last year

[cobalt blade]

Acc stacker fun :3

[coral summit]

I'm genuinely confused that more people in HC don't run vaal arctic armour in lieu of logs

[frigid wedge]

naca did u end up pobbing mfa yesterday

[coral summit]

it seems like such a hilariously good one socket panic button

[cobalt blade]

i tried but i determined its a skill you need to play not pob

[coral summit]

to stay in a fight

[loud geyser]

do you guys reckon the teaser for the new league is showing a new scion ascendency?>

[frigid wedge]

or u got better things to do

[cobalt blade]

Like to actually math out its damage you just need to make a character and test shit

[brazen vector]

Its a changed scavenger, so yea

[frigid wedge]

i wanna use hiero but aoe per mana kinda bricks normal storm rain

[cobalt blade]

and i couldnt be fucked to craft bow items

[coral summit]

mfa seems like the strongest skill I will never ever play

because I cannot be fucked to do math to figure out my damage output

I don't mind doing it for defenses

[frigid wedge]

its mfa in norm league

not phrecia

[coral summit]

yeah

[loud geyser]

maybe every character is getting one of their phrecia ascendencies?

[coral summit]

that's gotta be even harder to solve right

cuz you dont get to just run indigon

[frigid wedge]

not really

nono

[brazen vector]

No idea

[frigid wedge]

u still get to just run indigon

[cobalt blade]

Indigon is still a few thousand % more damagae

[frigid wedge]

u just don't use the spell dmg

[coral summit]

oooh

OH i see

[cobalt blade]

mfa has 1% more damage per 1 mana spent

[coral summit]

mana costs

[cobalt blade]

Its really fucking stupid

[coral summit]

yeah I forgot

[frigid wedge]

ur just cost scaling

[coral summit]

it's specifically whisperer that takes that shit to the moon for no reason

[leaden quiver]

Yeah

[coral summit]

because it gets to double dip

[frigid wedge]

flat is the big issue tbh

[loud geyser]

praying my merc returns

[cobalt blade]

bring back pre nerf battlemages smh

[loud geyser]

i wanna run another merc build

[cobalt blade]

i was thinking if it's worth running wrath spectre for mapping

[coral summit]

You'd be int stacking for the flat and base mana anyways, wouldn't you?

[cobalt blade]

I dunno how well they live on a 3-4l

[brazen vector]

They live pretty well

[coral summit]

or is int stacking not great for that

[cobalt blade]

For sure and lightning res stacking if choir lives

[coral summit]

oh yeah

[cobalt blade]

its your best source of flat mana by a mile

[coral summit]

choir is how you solve inc mana% there

[cobalt blade]

hmmic

[coral summit]

yeah thats what i forgor

[frigid wedge]

probably either hybrid stacking inquis, int deadeye or smth on scion, but at 4k int I only actually get 2k flat to work with

[coral summit]

i genuinely cant believe they released choir live like that

[frigid wedge]

which is kinda small

[grizzled lily]

the quiet tease

[coral summit]

i think it might? be the most busted unique they've ever dropped

[split maple]

2k flat mana is kinda a lot of mana tho

Like flat is pain in the ass to get

[cobalt blade]

Im still sad its internal value is a 1 so cant scale with qual

[cobalt blade]

Nah foulborn hotm beats it :p

[frigid wedge]

esm dont u have like 6k flat from jewels

no wait

its another 2k

[coral summit]

okay thats fair

[split maple]

I have 80*6 from adorned jewels

[coral summit]

I really hope they dont take a nerfbat to foulborn red dream

to get the most out of it you already have to pay a huge point tax

[frigid wedge]

but 4k int is way too much

[coral summit]

for 76% life

[cobalt blade]

im hoping they decide to let hotm live

I know they wont but hopefully

[frigid wedge]

unless i went mana int adorned idk how tf id get 4k

[cobalt blade]

prolly not possible on a choir setup but doable on non choir?

[coral summit]

it's like 6-7 extra points plus having to get ten fire res tattoos

[whole bluff]

Isn't MFA using inquisitor forbiddens (or inquisitor with hiero forbiddens) + shapers touch + dual attri stack?

[coral summit]

and those fuckers are not cheap at start of the league

correction, ten points

[split maple]

Choir setup you can reasonable get what 1k? 2k? Int

[whole bluff]

For free crit cap and mana

[split maple]

Since you want suffixes for lightres

[frigid wedge]

yep

[cobalt blade]

non choir you get simplex 3p smalls with flat int and flat att and alot more suffix space for all att

[frigid wedge]

i did say dual stack inquis

honestly non choir might be worth spamming 3p genius clusters

[whole bluff]

Ah, gotcha. Just wanted to mention that str gives mana in that case too

[split maple]

Ig if you go small cluster choir you can squeeze in a tad more than on adorned

[coral summit]

so if they decide to specifically target int stackers in 3.28 how do you guys think they'll choose to do it

[cobalt blade]

idunno about genius i feel like the int out weighs

[frigid wedge]

genius is 5% int and like 20% mana

[cobalt blade]

oh im dum i thought that was the leech one

[frigid wedge]

is wall of muscle for mana clusters

[cobalt blade]

leech is fuckin daring ideas oops

[coral summit]

my bet is them cutting the scaling on ES for int stackers per int

from 1% per 5 to like 1% per 8

[cobalt blade]

hmm yeah i guess genius worth

[cobalt blade]

1% per 1

[coral summit]

could also see them halving ES leech

[frigid wedge]

the number per for all 3 attrib is 1 is every 2 and 1 is every 5 tho, so dex and str would change

[frigid wedge]

they already nerfed the support

[coral summit]

naw i mean like

just generic baseline ES leech

[frigid wedge]

im hoping ci sees smth like 20% Less energy shield

[cobalt blade]

i doubt it es leech is already worse than life without gr

[coral summit]

goes from half of life leech's base value to a quarter

[split maple]

Ghost reaver nerf to not 2x Leech maybe

[coral summit]

it'd be a pretty big nerf to instant leech

[cobalt blade]

Yeah this maybe

[frigid wedge]

honestly int stacking was fine till u could get 200 extra flat es per gear piece

[coral summit]

cuz rn the problems mainly are just building fuckhuge pools for no reason and still being able to recover all of it

faster than life builds :V

[cobalt blade]

300-400 flat no? new bases and quality being more instead of inc

[coral summit]

CI gets to both not have to care about an extra resist baseline and use that freed up space to just make its hit pool even bigger

[frigid wedge]

was tryna average out for helm gloves and boots

[cobalt blade]

ah fair

[split maple]

Yeah these slots all get 300+ no?

If all prefixes es

[coral summit]

life builds if they want to not have to build chaos res have to use a light of meaning in a big primo spot

[cobalt blade]

Ye pretty easily hat gets to 613 perfect

[coral summit]

which is usually timeless jewel fodder

[frigid wedge]

they get 600 es on a mirror tier piece

ish

[cobalt blade]

613 perfect without synth* since influ better

[coral summit]

hmm

[split maple]

Surely they Will double flat mana on gear next league :p

[coral summit]

okay i've been tossing the math back and forth on a separate thing actually

[frigid wedge]

my favourite builds will always be hybrid life es builds that recover both comfortably

[cobalt blade]

readd max mana per int haunted mod

[frigid wedge]

such as my current

[leaden quiver]

poofinder and inquis

mm

[cobalt blade]

ive only really liked inquis for this tbh

[coral summit]

do you guys value 2% max chaos res (84>86) more on a divine flesh+fourth vow build when you're already at 60k armour, or would you take 80% inc armour+8% pdr

[cobalt blade]

everyone else it feels sketchy

[cobalt blade]

max chaos

[leaden quiver]

pathfinder with sorrow of the divine

or burden of truth

[frigid wedge]

playing elementalist, i just recovery both on kill

[cobalt blade]

both of those is no mageblood

[frigid wedge]

body sorts es cinderswallow sorts life

[coral summit]

cuz i've been looking at the max phys hit and I know that not many things actually get to hit as hard as uber shaper

[cobalt blade]

Or 3 flask mageblood for sorrow

[coral summit]

especially with crit immunity

[cobalt blade]

your getting 14% less damage taken from anything going to ur chaos from that +2 max res if I remember the math right

[coral summit]

yeah

[cobalt blade]

imo more valuable

[coral summit]

for ref this is no sap, lunaris pantheon in maps, no flasks or guard skill on my setup rn

so pretty much the worst it'd be

[cobalt blade]

arctic?

[coral summit]

no arctic or flesh/stone, no room for em

[cobalt blade]

ah fair

[coral summit]

just 36k armour+4 end charges and determination pdr mod

[cobalt blade]

i do think id still value the max chaos there more

[coral summit]

goes up to 47k>26k max hit with a double pdr glorious vanity

[cobalt blade]

big phys is 90+% guard skillable+it looks like you have some amount of block from that ehp

[coral summit]

but it drops the chaos max hit from 108>95k and ele from 110>103

[cobalt blade]

so wont die to phys shotgun

[coral summit]

26/26 block and zerker defiance

[cobalt blade]

Ah

[coral summit]

eternally suffering from not enough points on the fucking tree

to take block nodes

[cobalt blade]

have you looked into weird impossible escapes

[cobalt blade]

theres some decent block ones

[coral summit]

thats the current tree layout

[cobalt blade]

guessing thats an armour light of meaning inthe middle left

[coral summit]

nope

foulborn red dream

[cobalt blade]

oh fair

[coral summit]

76% inc max life bb

2.4k life worth of jewel

correction, 2k

[whole bluff]

Otoh, that is clearly OP. Otoh, it's not cuz it's life

[cobalt blade]

mildly surprised your not doing the es to armour jewel at templar socket but i guess too point starved

[coral summit]

it's a jewel slot plus ten point tax

[cobalt blade]

Think its like 200% inc armour or something

[coral summit]

well i can just link it so you can see what's going on

https://pobb.in/3WykK_x109et

[cobalt blade]

I am on mobile

[coral summit]

o

yeah dropping any of the rare jewels

means going below 90 max lightning

it's divine flesh+font of thunder

so only taking lightning/chaos dmg

[cobalt blade]

Ye figured that from your tank things

[coral summit]

most of the actual armour % is from warning call with sione's on a medium cluster

i could go energized armour but i'd need to drop 12% life from juggernaut and then dig out another 3 points somewhere

on top of a life jewel+max res+multi

[tight plinth]

you can ignite with minion instability right?

[leaden quiver]

yeah

[tight plinth]

and scale it with gems

[cobalt blade]

have you looked into utmost over leaderships? assuming you can crit cap without leaders ofc

would get you extra max res for jewel sockets bunch of pen and as

[coral summit]

it is not crit capping without that

[cobalt blade]

ah

[coral summit]

goes from 98.5% to 60% crit

xdd

[tight plinth]

hes cheating his crit with brittle

[coral summit]

it's a shotgun skill with always applies on hit

give it a break lmao

[cobalt blade]

its perma with leaderships more or less

[coral summit]

and i did actually check the thresholds on ubers

to see if it would actually get full effect

fist of war makes it a lot easier to apply full effect

to get it going

[cobalt blade]

will say that fortify corrupt is gonna be pretty fake with that attack speed i think

[coral summit]

grey wind is like a 40% drop rate from the breach boss

if I have to farm it myself I will lmao

[cobalt blade]

(and i dont think the area damage from spikes proc on melee hits)

[coral summit]

and if I absolutely had to I could swap awed for it

until it hit

[cobalt blade]

but not 100% sure there haven't actually played earthshatter

Ye fair

[coral summit]

spikes proc fortify still

[cobalt blade]

Ah isee

marginally less shit but still gonna be bad uptime lol

[coral summit]

it's smite specifically that janks out with melee/area modifiers

i mean if it wasnt a five point tax for fortify on the tree

[cobalt blade]

Yee

[coral summit]

fucking everything good on the left side of the tree is like

a 5-6 point tax

[cobalt blade]

I really dont get the staff clusters that want you to 8 points or w/e

they are good nodes but god its so many after pathing to it already

[coral summit]

energized armour? five points plus a jewel socket
fortify? five points
+1 strikes with tribal fury? 5 points.
anything in the vicinity of glancing blows? really bad area to path through in general baybeeeee

escalation+natural authority wheel if you made the mistake of playing chieftain slams instead of zerker? that'll be SEVEN POINTS PLUS A MASTERY BAYBEEEE

AND MEASURED FURY PLUS AS THE THUNDER

Like, I know that attacks scale way harder than spells so they gotta pay for it somewhere.

But like... bruh.

Left side of the tree you gotta take fourteen different wheels and file in triplicate for the fucking IRS

[cobalt blade]

Dont you also want admonisher for another 5 points

[coral summit]

if you go right side of the tree all you do is stack one stat.

:V

[cobalt blade]

(for chief)

[coral summit]

yes

admonisher usually ends up being an anoint tho

[cobalt blade]

fair

[coral summit]

cuz the route to path to it is bad

and you dont actually need more warcry speed than you get from it

[cobalt blade]

i just know early on the pathing is cursed as fuck for them

[coral summit]

It's cursed as fuck in general.

Slammer builds want so many things

and grey wind because it's allowed to use shields suddenly wants even more.

and because it scales off your life

guess what it wants to pay taxes for

that's right, foulborn red dream

and you can't use blood magic cuz there's too much shit you have to reserve

[cobalt blade]

zhp greywind full life reserve

[coral summit]

funny thing the very first thought I had when I was thinking of how to deal damage with font of thunder+divine flesh+purity of lightning

was playing chaos dot trickster, figured the damage req for div scarab of plenty farming wasn't that high

but if you're locked out of ES scaling on trickster

and still want spellbreaker benefits

you would go wicked ward+eternal youth

looking at the pathing for that made me quickly decide it was not worth it LOL

you would need skin of the lords with eternal youth on it

[leaden quiver]

double will of esh rings

smite + wrath

[whole bluff]

Is div scarab of plenty using altars btw? Cuz eater altars would be an argument to take dmg as fire

[coral summit]

I have no clue, but probably.

I'd have to ask my friend

[leaden quiver]

taking damage as fire is the prefered way already

[coral summit]

You can always just overcap your lightning res enough

[leaden quiver]

thats why sublimes are 1 mirror

xd

[cobalt blade]

doesn't rly matter but you go blue altars for chance at div

[coral summit]

it only goes up to what, -80 lightning res on altar?

[whole bluff]

Ah, then not important

[coral summit]

and the build is at +30 already without much effort

[cobalt blade]

Ye smth like that

[coral summit]

so if you wanted to altar-proof it you'd drop crit multi on a ring for more lightning res

you would need more to proof it against exposure though

two suffixes instead of one

[silent leaf]

https://cdn.7tv.app/emote/01KFJYMZPR147JQK3NHFAZ01KP/4x.avif

[cobalt blade]

clear solution here

Reflected ring

[coral summit]

eater altars are already kinda pain for this build tho

cuz -phys DR on echoes of creation

charge penalties

it's definitely more of a maven boss rusher

deli+boss rush

[cobalt blade]

ye id just play exarch on that build

[coral summit]

exarch you would need to overcap chaos res

[cobalt blade]

Near identical for plenty bit less quant though

[coral summit]

and you just cant pick the -160 chaos res altars

aint enough overcap on the planet for that

[cobalt blade]

so fun fact if you see a -chaos res altar you can just leave it and another cant spawn in that map

Same with any other player downside

[karmic kraken]

Heyo, how long do u need for the campaign guys? I need 6+- hours but i saw tuadh on yt he only need 4 hours and want now try it also.
Do u guys got some Tips?

[cobalt blade]

People just always take the opposite side instead of leaving

[coral summit]

speeding up your campaign takes a lot of practice

and usually speedrunners are committed to one build

so they know inside and out when they actually have to do certain things

[cobalt blade]

me overcapping my fire sublime setup for -160+curse+exposure(albiet accidentally)

[coral summit]

i'd set aside at least 8 hours for a leaguestart campaign if you don't want to practice it outright

[finite quail]

depends on what kind of campaign run you mean

leaguestart runs and twink runs are different

[coral summit]

if you're willing to practice it, you could reasonably get a campaign on leaguestart down to 6 hours

[finite quail]

but basically, for both you do some preparation

[coral summit]

i think my fastest time if i didn't get up at all from the pc was about 6h40

but usually on leaguestart it's about 8

[cobalt blade]

lil bit over res cap

[opal ingot]

R u implying that if there's a nasty downside and you picked opposite choice, that nasty downside can appear again?

[cobalt blade]

yes

[coral summit]

yep

[opal ingot]

That's Crazy lol

[cobalt blade]

if you leave it there it won't show up

[finite quail]

you setup a pob, you remember what gems you need to get, you remember where to get items with sockets/links from, you avoid places you dont need to go, dont do quests you dont need to do, and dont stay in town too much

[coral summit]

stupid question

do people speedrunning early on skip the side skill point quests and go back for them later?

[cobalt blade]

they usually grab them unless its just a speedrun to end of campaign

[finite quail]

no idea

[astral shadow]

Ye but there is no point in rushing

[finite quail]

I always grab em all

[surreal musk]

also ignore gear other than socket colors just craft res on shit and run purity of elements for act 6-10 if u want , only click dmg nodes from level 1-50

[cobalt blade]

ends up being faster than backtracking

[coral summit]

im thinkin like the dudes who somehow pull a 3-4 hour campaign clear on leaguestart to get to maps

do they try to break in there asap and go back when they've got actual movespeed for more points with builds that just need less?

[cobalt blade]

yea ppl like Ben/exile etc do that grabbing all points

[astral shadow]

They skip labs, blue quests etc, and just rush main quest

[opal ingot]

My speedrun guide has me take point quests asap when I'm in the area

[surreal musk]

most leaguestart 'speeedrun' runs are all passive points + merc lab

[pulsar dune]

I do think aurabot and carry points are going to save more time for endgame than skipping them in campaign

[surreal musk]

like if u search on youtube a10 speedrun most them are all passive+merc

[coral summit]

okay so they're just playing two completely different games

[opal ingot]

How about havoc Vids

[astral shadow]

Imagine using speedrun guide

[coral summit]

the dudes doing it as fast as possible arent doing it cuz it's better, they do it for the sake of going fast?

[cobalt blade]

fast as possible ye but 3-4 hours is doable grabbing all and ascending :p

[opal ingot]

Thanks to it I got a 5 hour run when I always take 8 to 10 hours for a campaign lol

[coral summit]

damn well then I need to get better lmao

[opal ingot]

I still could be faster, I'm never happy until I get a sub 5 hour run

[coral summit]

honestly act 1 and 3 are the ones that trip me up timewise the most

cuz of certain layouts

act 1 any caves+shipyards i'm terrible at navigating

act 3 I only just learned the lunaris temple layout indicator recently

[astral shadow]

Im fine with 8hr leveling, no pob just my own build until i can swap to what i want to play

[cobalt blade]

https://youtu.be/ULNWhqMMP2Y

Found a jung vid as an example

[coral summit]

2947 hours in this game btw

[split maple]

I am legit planning to do a few practice runs for first time after keepers ends

[surreal musk]

i tried my first 4stone run on ssf standard past couple days, got maven voidstone + UE frags rdy at 14 hrs in but died out on UE 😭

[split maple]

Like irl doesn't allow me enough time rn to afford my current legstart time

[astral shadow]

Practice in enraged gauntlet xD

[cobalt blade]

anyway ima dissapear to sleep o/

[split maple]

I legit had better time in hc event than usually

[coral summit]

ok no i have an even dumber question, wtf do people do to rush elder stone early cuz I find getting the maps to be the hardest part

[split maple]

Turns out having 40 deaths a campaign is slow

[split maple]

Destru play first atlas

[coral summit]

yee, just like at what point do you start running certain things

cuz usually my map experience is like

having to fill out a decent number of lower tier completions to start getting enough points to not fall down map tiers around the 12-13 range just from running out of maps

taking +1 clusters and kirac missions

[split maple]

I skip most of map sustain nodes and kinda usually don't have too bad issues on prog

Maybe I am Just lucky

Tho this league I had Royal issues sustaining vaal orbs for red tier map completions

[coral summit]

yeeep, same

[astral shadow]

Dying slows down the act speedrun, so must practice it in hcssf

[coral summit]

my early league experience is "please don't give me a brick map mod"

reflect

on corrupting maps for completion lmao

[split maple]

Unironically I have empty stash in hcssf standard

So either doing that or no stash runs

[opal ingot]

Transmute > regal > vaal

Turns to an 8 mod map with reflect

[surreal musk]

generally u get like 30 atlas points boss rus hing up to reds which is enuf to get all the kirac + shaping atlas nodes

even without unwavering

then u full clear red maps whenever u get to a new tier for more map drops , can get unlcuky and get stuck for a few maps

[coral summit]

huuuh, 30
okay i am obviously going way too slow then in terms of waiting around in lower tier maps for more completions

[surreal musk]

throw in the random scarabs u get whenever u get toa new red tier for more mobs = more maps

[whole bluff]

The vizzion

[split maple]

i just run highest tier uncompleted map i got

assuming meta legstarter

[opal ingot]

Damn my leaguestarts gotta be dogshit lol I can't rush to red maps ASAP

[coral summit]

usually i go 1>2>3>start filling out 1s a bit then go 4>do a couple more 2s and so onto fill it out

[split maple]

flashback to armabrand conq guardians in mercs

[opal ingot]

The only time that happened was daughter of oshabi eb lol

[grizzled lily]

on keepers league start i got to red maps day 1 then quit for a week

[coral summit]

i think usually by the time i hit t14s i'm at like 60-65 completions

[opal ingot]

Same but for me I quit for 2 weeks

[split maple]

my issue is rn i cannot spend more than 2-3h on poe per day, so if i keep my current 7h or so fresh campaign thats like a week for just atlas completion

and i rly dont like that

[coral summit]

which is like prolly way too slow

[opal ingot]

Then a couple days before ending I get 4 voidstones and quit

[surreal musk]

doing atlas completion all the way up and getting ur voidstones a bit slower isnt really worse , depends what u wanna do for ur day 2

[split maple]

then after two weeks multimirr tornado shot 🥺

[coral summit]

well this time I'd like to try rushing to boss farms asap

[opal ingot]

The dream 🥹

[surreal musk]

then yeah u wanna rush 4stone

[coral summit]

want to see how fast I can assemble my build to start farming uber bosses/feared

[grizzled lily]

yea well i got 2 voidstones got the rest in phrecia xdd

couldnt be bothered

[coral summit]

the actual problem is i'm not sure how fast certain items come up on the market

[split maple]

idk if it isnt more efficient to just do sanctum start then

assuming trade

maybe roll watchers and shite a tad

[coral summit]

cuz I need font of thunder to come up first, then leadership's price and apparently barely anyone actually does the heist questlines

[whole bluff]

For practice runs, I should do HCSSF rather than Keepers right? Or maybe HC is bad?

[coral summit]

i know legion runners start printing timeless jewels on day 2 so that's not too bad

[split maple]

i would skip keepers until we know how badly tree is nerfed and that sure isnt gonna be in patchies

[coral summit]

do you think i'd have to actually have to do heist myself

[whole bluff]

Yeah

[coral summit]

to fish for those

[native abyss]

news?!?!!

poe news?!!?1 teaser?!

[split maple]

getting any roll leadership price is pretty trivial

[native abyss]

https://tenor.com/view/welding-laying-down-twinkle-toes-josh-speech-bubble-gif-25658288

[split maple]

but annoyance is you prolly have to run heist cache map device

and thats pricy early

[coral summit]

legit the only roll that matters for me is the max lightning res roll

and early on I can settle for one that's not negative

[native abyss]

wait thats the wrong one

[surreal musk]

do u have a way of generating power charges in that pob u linked >?

[split maple]

like you just need to finish questline for that unique contract then it starts droping

and leadership is guranted from unique contract

[coral summit]

mob mentality on cluster jewel

[split maple]

issue is all other crap from quest contracts and bps are in cache pool

[coral summit]

plus forbidden flame/flesh

guarantees a charge generating every warcry

[split maple]

assuming you cannot buy unique contracts since folks dont bother doing questlines so dont drop them

[surreal musk]

ah

[coral summit]

it gets smoother the more warcry cdr you have

since your autoexerts go more often

or the more stuff you have on them

as is on that pob autoexerts alone generate 2 charges every 4.2 seconds

not including manual exerts

[grizzled lily]

vigilant strike league start

[coral summit]

so occasionally i think with that little cdr investment they'll drop a stack of something now and again

[grizzled lily]

watch

watch me quit next league also

with these ideas

[coral summit]

i think getting the cooldowns to about 3.2-3.3 would make it a lot comfier but again, there is a shitton of pressure on points lol

[split maple]

idk what even to practice tbh, like okay we will get patchies soon but still

like if earthshatter is dedge bonezone

[coral summit]

can always swap out fire dmg tattoos for warcry cdr tattoos

since some of the custom config is just for stuff i did not want to do forty clicks to configure properly regarding that

[surreal musk]

my league routine is spend 3weeks practicing/thinking about builds/pob-ing all to try and come out ahead in the economic rat race for the first week, then get bored of chasing divs and reroll ssf after a week

[split maple]

yea i decided to skip that step this league ^

[coral summit]

doing tattoos manually in pob is terrible.

[split maple]

like i always burn out of trade week2 at the latest

[coral summit]

i just count the number of them i can afford to put in

-X stat +tattoo stat in custom config

[split maple]

and ssf i legit dont want to lose 2 weeks, leagues feel short in it as it is

[coral summit]

Sunder's still pretty gg for clear at least

and on stone bosses you can run perforate

it's a bit clunkier and unrunnable if you have a source of knockback

but with no kb perforate does slightly more damage than earthshatter does with less rng

it's just absolutely worthless dogshit by comparison to earthshatter for clear

honestly the hardest part early on for this build is just gonna be attribute requirements

font of thunder and purity of lightning both want high dex/int lmao

[grizzled lily]

sunder is so good

but it has no mechanics

to scale the dmg better

thats why earthshatter is so op

[coral summit]

earthshatter just naturally does like 50% more damage cuz of shotgunning even in an empty room

in tiny rooms it only gets better

[grizzled lily]

yep

[coral summit]

honestly i think they should buff the slower slams to its level

or close to it

make ice crash do like 80-90% of earthshatter's dmg cuz it's slow as shit

[grizzled lily]

if earthshatter isnt getting nerfed ill league staty it again (into accuracy stacking if the stars allign and it doesnt get nerfed)

[coral summit]

sunder is fine being on the lower end cuz it's a clear monster

[grizzled lily]

start*

[coral summit]

but like if we were looking at each slam

[opal ingot]

What propelled accuracy stack, isn't it just the foulborn hotm?

[grizzled lily]

yes

the op claw

its so easy to start it

[coral summit]

double earthquake's damage straight up, it's the clunkiest slam in the game
ground slam is kinda okay, maybe smol buff
give ice crash like 30-40% more damage
just make perforate's sand stance slam not miss half the monsters around you and it's a good skill
give tec slam like 50% more damage it's so fucking weak as it is
give VFS back its more aoe, it's actually just terrible now

[grizzled lily]

tree stays foulborn uniues stay

if they wont nerf the uniques uard enough

ill play that

[coral summit]

consecrated path of endurance specifically is okay, normal conspath could use a small buff

cuz reg cons path is only like 542 effectiveness and even on 80% speed instead of 70 thats just like

bad

[whole bluff]

Would cutting hotm in half even be enough? More like cut in 4?

[finite quail]

yes

[frigid wedge]

without foulborn choir is it harder to get flat mana or % mana

[whole bluff]

Dual wielding caster weapons is usually a big bunch of mana. I assume this is for bow?

[coral summit]

but yeah i was following this video for the +2 diagonal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-fr4mFBoGI
is this bad if you're specifically trying to rush 4 voidstones

[grizzled lily]

cutting it in half will barely hit it properly

i think

hitting 1bil dmg on high end investment

is not that good for the game

[surreal musk]

yeah this strat is specifically for atlas completion

[whole bluff]

Cutting it in 4 would make the absurdness when people reach 2 frames per attack (seems reachable anyway) be cut in 4 down to 16.5 which is very fast but reasonable. And dmg cut in 4 too

[surreal musk]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSxVUOLMV4M

[whole bluff]

Idk, if cutting hotm specific scaling in 4 cuts both affected stats by say 66.7%, then you only got 1/9 of the dps left. Might be too harsh?

Maybe they just BMC it. Complete removal or rework of a required part

Otherwise, I'd say that "per 25" should be "per[60-90]"

[frigid wedge]

they just swap the foulborn to like str or smth

so u get way less flat

[whole bluff]

Could do yup

[coral summit]

ooh ty for the link

[surreal musk]

essences arent worth anymore imo when rushing stone , just gamble faustus for all ur slots

[coral summit]

ye

or maybe breach if breach is really strong still

i might gamble on that

if it's easy to access the block walls node

[frigid wedge]

breach is gonna be on every single atlas tree i use and it will be the scarab+content blocker

because i want my native mobs

[slender slate]

decided to try out a phrecia build

xd

[coral summit]

i also want breaches still because I need to farm a grey wind+foulborn red dream if they arent nerfed into the dirt

[split maple]

imo for claws to be ok you need to hit like 2k int - issue is that its trivial to get 2k int

[frigid wedge]

what build is that

[surreal musk]

yeah if breach is ever good its gonna be at start , its great exp too

[split maple]

like 2k str isnt that easy

[slender slate]

einhar

but capped out break with beasts

lol

[coral summit]

2k int is easier cuz you need less uniques+less suffix pressure, right?

[coral summit]

or is that a bad assumption

[split maple]

you just slap on tree 4 25% effect int large clusters

done gg

[coral summit]

oh thats true

you dont get to do that on str stacking

[slender slate]

just playing a dex stacker

[grizzled lily]

itll make people quit the build but its gonna be kinda like how lightning strike got a slight nerf and everything just quit the skill

itll still be dominant highend

[surreal musk]

what if they remove the int=accuracy mastery

[grizzled lily]

NOOOOO

[past rain]

heyy

[whole bluff]

That would be kinda valid though. Int does too much

[past rain]

i just saw pohx leveling rf guide

[coral summit]

hooonestly they should nerf the int eva and int accuracy masteries

or remove them

[rancid tendon]

i have a question why do jugg str stackers use kinetic bolt instead of blast?

[past rain]

is there any reason NOT to use holy flame totem in his rolling magma flame wall setup?

[coral summit]

no

[whole bluff]

Gimme dex life mastery

[coral summit]

hft is most of your early single target

[past rain]

ye fr

[whole bluff]

And remove some int OP masteries

[onyx adder]

The int eva mastery is a legit problem

[past rain]

he aint using it tho

[split maple]

to not need nimis

[onyx adder]

The int accuracy mastery is fine imo

[split maple]

so one more str ring

[coral summit]

yeah the int evasion mastery should be removed outright

int accuracy could be halved

but int evasion has to go imo

[rancid tendon]

why is nimis a necessity on blast?

[coral summit]

int stackers just hit like 85-88% evasion with a decent necrotic armour

for free

with no grace or blind

[whole bluff]

Dex life, dex ES, rise of the Dex

[grizzled lily]

eacape artist trickster should be gutted

ngl

[coral summit]

no not even with escape artist

[whole bluff]

Also my nephew's name is Dexter so that sounds cool

[coral summit]

you can run a champ int stacker

(why would you, i was fucking around on pob and it was not good)

[grizzled lily]

no i just want trickster dead

[coral summit]

(but it hit like 65k evasion with a necrotic chest at 2.5k int and 0 other flat evasion other than a jade flask)

[grizzled lily]

no reason why i said that i just want that ascendency chanegd

[whole bluff]

Trickster already is dead

[grizzled lily]

more

[whole bluff]

Not good for the game

[grizzled lily]

nerf trickster buff elementalist pls ggg

[split maple]

elementalist is tad too strong rn already

[grizzled lily]

exactly

[split maple]

but idk how to nerf it without fucking it over 😄 pretty much all notables are strong on it

[whole bluff]

Elementalist is imo fine. Trickster too weak. Assassin too weak. Guardian wtf. Occultist too weak. Sabo idk I got skill issue

[grizzled lily]

more herald power

[coral summit]

im not even sure it's elementalist being too strong

just that most other self-casts are shit

for league start

[opal ingot]

MAKE TORNADO SHOT GREAT AGAIN

[brazen vector]

Buff hinekoras deathfury

[split maple]

issue with ele is its kinda a lot of generic power

[coral summit]

occultist doesnt get the stuff that would make wintertide good

[split maple]

pdot? do ele, dot in general? do ele, attacks? do ele, selfcast? do ele

its good at everything

[opal ingot]

Man I'm so excited for next league

[coral summit]

and chaos dots are not on the great end of the spectrum

necro is... minions

it has some selfcast stuff but needs unique item interactions to work

so not leaguestartable

[grizzled lily]

what if hinekora pops from 5% to 10%

[coral summit]

elementalist just has everything you want for a leaguestart

[whole bluff]

Trickster was imo fine. It would have been healthy if EE turned back into old school version and casters had 2 good options that don't attri or mana stack

[grizzled lily]

will that be a rf season

[coral summit]

you can play anything on an elementalist and it works

[split maple]

buffing ee back to old state and keeping tricky in current shape could be pretty ok

[coral summit]

which can be considered to be a problem imo

[split maple]

with ee being t0 its kinda price limited if it gets popular anywayse

[whole bluff]

But trickster died for its sins

[split maple]

i legstarted hit based earthshatter on ele

honestly yeah, its decent if not good at everything

and good at too much stuff

[whole bluff]

And now ele just uses it instead

[coral summit]

yeah

its like

slayer is kind of in the same boat imo?

[whole bluff]

EE can't keep getting away with it

[bold scarab]

There no good ascendancy for phys spells

[coral summit]

slayer you can play basically anything that's not a spell at leaguestart

and it works

[bold scarab]

I mean there are but it's only super generic stuff

Meanwhile ele has everything

[coral summit]

i think the top 3 leaguestarts in terms of generic "it just works" power are like

[rancid tendon]

why does kinetic blast need nimis

[coral summit]

elementalist>slayer>zerker

[split maple]

idk why slayer werent more popular this league

[coral summit]

in terms of 0 thought involved

[split maple]

zerker is the strongest legstarter rn, but it isnt generic

its slams and thats it

[bold scarab]

Take 10% more dmg succ

[split maple]

but it sure is good at them 😄

[past mantle]

Nothing beats elementalist in terms of no brain starters.

[grizzled lily]

berserk

[whole bluff]

What is stronger, 3.27 elementalist or 3.26 trickster, mercs and foulborns aside

[brazen vector]

LA deadeye

[grizzled lily]

is p damn stupid also

[past mantle]

What part of nothing are we not getting?

[split maple]

slap 700 pdps axe on bersekrer and you can do ubers

[brazen vector]

CA pathfinder

[split maple]

kinda hard to compete with that

[coral summit]

deadeye is a really strong starter as well but it's also like

[bold scarab]

3.14 trickster

[coral summit]

by far the squishiest

[past mantle]

They do completely different things.

[split maple]

3.27 ele by far, 3.26 ee was nerfed already

and tricky was hard carried by merc to have any dps

[grizzled lily]

berserker 50 rage kinda strrong

[coral summit]

i tried a deadeye LA starter and I had to very much start paying attention

cuz like

[split maple]

comparing 3.25 tricky to 3.27 ele is interesting then 😄

[surreal musk]

trickster
elementalist is op on low budget but its not that insane otherwise, just generally good for many builds

[past mantle]

Trickster could do like 2 things but did them really well.

[coral summit]

until you hit level 90ish deadeye has a habit of randomly falling over dead

[finite quail]

first time I see the per point turn red lmfao

[coral summit]

from lack of max hit

[past mantle]

One trick or jack off all trades type of deal.

[whole bluff]

Tbf, trickster also did mines, aside from EE

[split maple]

mines rly werent that good out of legstart

[coral summit]

also playing wildspeaker in phrecia makes me wish that acrobatics was easier to cap 75% spell dodge on

[bold scarab]

Elementalist or Inquisitor for firestorm (preferably meteor)?

[coral summit]

75% spell dodge is surprisingly comfy

but i think requiring 150 suppress is stupid

[finite quail]

Eh, mid

[whole bluff]

Like removing EE. Just who would be the best wander. Not-gutted&demolished trickster, ascendant, hierophant, or elemetnalist?

[finite quail]

1 in 4 chance to die isnt nice

[bold scarab]

Or something else

Ofc

[grizzled lily]

daughter of the oshabee lightning strike pls ggg i can trade the raider for that ascendency

[surreal musk]

inquis for sure , eblade op

[finite quail]

what raider

[past mantle]

Ascendant.

[finite quail]

[coral summit]

idk i had like 80 maxres and 2.5k es+4k life

[finite quail]

there is no raider

[coral summit]

and endurance charge gen

[grizzled lily]

whats the name

[past mantle]

If the question is what does best with money then the answer is ascendant.

[coral summit]

it was pretty good

[finite quail]

Warden

[grizzled lily]

the snoobae special

a yea

[split maple]

gonna bet on hiero if this league uniques and shite, tho guardian prolly even better

[bold scarab]

Ye just thinking of playing firestorm next season and don't know where to start (or now)

[whole bluff]

Fair enough

[finite quail]

the what special

[coral summit]

man they need to rework warden

[split maple]

like you get a lot of mana rn

[grizzled lily]

THE MESSIAH OF MAGIC FIND

[coral summit]

warden is literally budget slayer

[finite quail]

y tho

[past mantle]

Warden is good.

[finite quail]

Warden is nice

[coral summit]

except with no defensive nodes worth a shit

[past mantle]

There's nothing to rework about warden.

[coral summit]

it's all damage

[surreal musk]

its good at dying

[finite quail]

Not exceptional but nice

[finite quail]

The opposite

Barkskin goes hard asf

[split maple]

i like idea of warden, i dont play it, but it feels in ok shape rn

[bold scarab]

All they need to do is merge both the barkskin passives into 1 ... And make the ranged tincture passive a keystone instead ... Then it would all be fine

[whole bluff]

Sounds to me like trickster that was a high budget ascendancy anyway (I think?), was actually fine? It died for EEs sins?

[coral summit]

trickster was op as shit

[past mantle]

Bark is no longer 10% reservation and the follow up node is great.
It also has hoarfroast.

[coral summit]

both it and EE were broken

[finite quail]

merging barkskin passives would be like what they did to the elementalist golemancer node

So that's not happening

[past mantle]

It'd be better than that.

[finite quail]

It would be

[split maple]

spellbreaker used to be one of its weakest ascends and its currently the strongest tricker ascend

[finite quail]

Precisely why its not happening

[split maple]

and trickster is still playableish

[surreal musk]

trickster is still really good for int stack builds ona high budget just no point in playing it when hotam jugg exists rn

[split maple]

like it was rly op

[bold scarab]

Well taking barkskin by itself is completely shit and bad design for an ascendancy

[past mantle]

Why?

[split maple]

issue with tricky rn is that at the budget you want to play it its not worth playing it

[bold scarab]

You need to take both passives to make it even worth taking

[coral summit]

hmm

[past mantle]

No you don't?

[normal hedge]

if u're playing warden theres no reason to take barkskin even if it was a 1 pointer

[coral summit]

I think the thing with barkskin if it was 1 notable is the 3% suppress below 1 maximum?

[grizzled lily]

what if we do

TINCTURE STACKING

[coral summit]

if you get shotgunned quickly its like

70% prevention

[past mantle]

Tincture stacking is very good.

[coral summit]

kinda wild

(you have to not die in the process, but still)

[bold scarab]

There would be a reason if they merged it

[past mantle]

The only actual issue with warden is that using tinctures with ranged weapons is never worth it.

[normal hedge]

no

lol

[past mantle]

I beg people to play things they talk about.

[surreal musk]

i think warden scion for dual tincture could be good cause of how strong tinctures are

[finite quail]

good ol immortal call

[coral summit]

regular barkskin would be fine going back to a 25% aura if it also wasn't locked to an ascendancy point

and had slightly higher values

[past mantle]

The values on barkskin are very high already?

[grizzled lily]

true

[fossil mural]

Vaal immortal call called

[finite quail]

actually

[coral summit]

flat -phys taken with even a bit of armour/phys dr can be insane

[whole bluff]

So it's more an overnerf on trickster then? I just think the baseline for things suited to be casters is way too low though. And when those ascendancies manage to combine ES which is OP with attacks in a synergistic way, they just explode

[grizzled lily]

problem with warden is, deadeye is just better most of the times :(

[bold scarab]

Also it's probably kinda bad that if you go the ele route on warden you are very pressured to take all 4 ele passives together

[coral summit]

that too yeah

[past mantle]

Warden and deadeye don't do the same thing?

[coral summit]

and if you're trying to take barkskin you would be kinda shoehorned either into only taking 2 ele passives or into doing something ultra jank like tinctures+bleed bow

[grizzled lily]

depends if u go the same skill

[coral summit]

which sounds terrible typing it out

especially when slayer with frenzy stacking exists in that archetype

[grizzled lily]

deadeye just seems a liiiitle better

[frigid wedge]

warden is similar to elementalist in the sense that it has so many strong nodes that it wants to forbidden its own points

barkskin is not one of them

[past mantle]

What same skill?

[split maple]

basically souldrinker was nerfed to be just overleech which you can get elsewhere, escape artist was nerfed to not beat anymore twilight regalia, spellbreaker enables that wicked ward thing but thats pretty much it (which is a cool mechanic just isnt often used), so what remains is charge duration for pdot stuff and that mastery thingie which is kinda middest point. but yea, its overnerf - especially when it lost like 1/4 of dps in 3.26 ee nerf and also energy leech support was nerfed etc

[coral summit]

ok no im gonna talk about elementalist for a second

[bold scarab]

It has so many redundant nodes too tho

[coral summit]

theres a lot of really good notables on it, but there's also some insane bloodline shit

[frigid wedge]

such as?

[grizzled lily]

lets say ele hit of the spectrum

[coral summit]

chaos conversion off lycia and zealotry+profane ground and chaotic might

[split maple]

like on the budget where trickster would make sense to play (so fancy heist jewelry and shite) you have so many stronger options than it...

[past mantle]

Okay so the bow skill asc is better for bow skills?

[coral summit]

like if you want to do storm burst on elementalist with an 8 link helmet

[bold scarab]

Like we don't need 4 elemental passives when the passive that it's locking requires all 4 ... Also barkskin being 2 passives instead of 1

[split maple]

if i wanted to cook good old ee style build ngl i would do sabo + farrul rather than tricky

[frigid wedge]

the tinctures linger node is fucking broken btw bc it enables 100% uptime

[grizzled lily]

idk what to use warden for besides bows

[fossil mural]

Wicked ward thing is the recharge on spell suppression?

[past mantle]

What?

Read tinctures.

[split maple]

yea

thats the one part of tricky you cannot fake

[frigid wedge]

honestly ive def played warden and ignored the unbound node

[past mantle]

This one.

[coral summit]

you want to take both profane ground and chaos conversion, then also want to take shaper of storms because it's still more damage and golem nodes because why not
and now you want mistress of sacrifice for self bone offering to cap block and the 40% increased duration for more storm burst damage
AND THERE'S STILL COMPETITIVE NODES ON ELEMENTALIST

AFTER THAT.

There's just so much good shit

[frigid wedge]

why is that a bad node tho

[stuck phoenix]

You very much also don't need to grab all 3 elemental ones just because you want avatar

[coral summit]

Elementalist is legit "please let us just take the entire thing"

[frigid wedge]

like it shouldn't be its own node but its very enabling

[past mantle]

Opportunity cost of needing 2 asc points to use it on ranged weapons is just too high.

[stuck phoenix]

Ngl it's a stupid node

[past mantle]

I'd rather it be on the tree as a keystone with a downside.

[frigid wedge]

last warden i played took 3 tincture notables and 2 elemental ones

[past mantle]

Or rolled into one of the other tincture nodes.

[stuck phoenix]

Slap it on barkskin

[bold scarab]

-Merge the 3 lab 1 elemental passives into 1 (keep unbound as a lab 2 passive)
-Remove ranged tinctures from warden and just put it on the tree as a keystone
-merge both barkskin passives into 1
-add some new passives

[stuck phoenix]

Xd

[stuck phoenix]

How about no

[opal ingot]

-66% less damage when tinctures are not active

[stuck phoenix]

The elemental ones are way too strong as one node

[past mantle]

Tinctures have perma uptime for warden?

[coral summit]

yep

[stuck phoenix]

And I don't want them nerfed

If I want to hard commit

[frigid wedge]

oh no my 100% tincture build loses dmg without them

[coral summit]

that plus turns off tinctures at 12 stacks

[past mantle]

You have no idea what you're on about.

[stuck phoenix]

Barkskin is sad to look at but it's funny to have something you can't really ff

[coral summit]

means you get perm uptime as long as you press the button

[frigid wedge]

sage my warden lost 120m dps without tinctures

it had 180m

[stuck phoenix]

[bold scarab]

Lol

[frigid wedge]

warden has no reason to be buffed bc its batshit insane already

[past mantle]

Tinctures.

[bold scarab]

But seriously that ascendancy is Soo bloated ... But at the same time so empty compared to others

[past mantle]

No tinctures.

[coral summit]

warden frontloads eighty morbillion damage and the hoarfrost notable seems really good for cc

[whole bluff]

Ngl, elemental nodes on Warden are imo the stuff that don't need fixing. Maybe give them some defence you can build around and/or buff barkskin

[past mantle]

It is.

[split maple]

Y'all stop baiting me into 3.28 warden

[coral summit]

but maybe i've become judgy by "if the build can't take one hit it's dogshit"

[past mantle]

Barkskin doesn't need a buff.

[frigid wedge]

hoarfrost means there's no chance to be hit anyway

[onyx adder]

U will regret it

[finite quail]

There is no bait

[whole bluff]

Like Oath of Summer:

• What it currently does
• 10% phys taken as fire
• something vs fire dmg
  Etc

[fossil mural]

Thats what a master baiter would say

[stuck phoenix]

Can you name the last buff barkskin got

[split maple]

i consider it last month of league ascendancy anyways 😛

[coral summit]

theres always something that gets you from offscreen

if theres anything i learned playing wildspeaker

[past mantle]

Barskin is better than 10% phys taken as fire.

[frigid wedge]

zish made pobs for frost blades warden and frost blades trickster in settlers and the trickster had like 200m dps and the warden had 1.5b

[finite quail]

https://tenor.com/fjhF1A8xpHc.gif

[karmic gust]

barkskin definitely needs a buff

[stuck phoenix]

Bro

[split maple]

but okay is there anything rly interesting on warden lategame that isnt wands?

[past mantle]

It's 600 flat phys reduction and makes itself more valuable as it drops.

[whole bluff]

That would be on a node that already gives double scorch cuz wardens problem imo is defence

[past mantle]

Ele hit.

[coral summit]

ah christ right people play fucking wands on warden to get the offscreen shit huh

[finite quail]

Yes bro?

[stuck phoenix]

How about no

[karmic gust]

yea and thats surely why everyone happily clicks it

[coral summit]

cold take but they need to take wands out back with a shotgun

[finite quail]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1367601419204432054/1473542442945871894/IMG_7332.gif

[past mantle]

I don't trust anyone to click good things.

[finite quail]

Anyways

[stuck phoenix]

Better

[frigid wedge]

can we leave warden as is and never change it? thanks

if we actually balance warden it will be so ass

[bold scarab]

If you merged both the passives into 1 it might finally be comparable to Bastian of elements which is the worst passive that is still actually relevant for defense

[frigid wedge]

xD

[karmic gust]

its pretty much impossible to get actual dr on warden where the -flat damage taken actually starts becoming good

[finite quail]

https://pobb.in/T_KWCJoVc9My

The funny bone shitter

[grizzled lily]

broddys talking like WE are GGG

[karmic gust]

and yea it costing 4 passives on top if you want both parts is just ass

[bold scarab]

Tru

[frigid wedge]

yes but elementalist doesn't have the freedom to get 6x dps for clicking 1 button

[karmic gust]

thats why everyone copes on freeze instead because trying to build defenses on warden is completely useless effort

[past mantle]

Idk, sap is doing wonders for me.

[karmic gust]

as barkskin has no synergy with the ascendnacy

[bold scarab]

Idk ... Golems + shock is about as good as warden already

[onyx adder]

Its more that it has no synergy with that whole side of the tree

[bold scarab]

For offense

[whole bluff]

I just feel like Warden and tinctures is a complete design error cuz GGG design around wishful thinking that just leads to frustration, repetition, RSI, etc

[past mantle]

What?

[frigid wedge]

20m -> 180m dps for clicking tinctures

[past mantle]

Tinctures are completely busted.

[karmic gust]

yea it would make 10 times more sense on jugg lol

[frigid wedge]

u sure?

[finite quail]

Barkskin should be a skill gem and not an ascendancy

[coral summit]

Tinctures are busted as shit and it makes me want to redo my current earthshatter build to actually figure out how to fit in mana leech+more than 17 unreserved mana for it

[pulsar dune]

Warden damage nodes are all completely absurd.

[coral summit]

but I don't think it's worth it

[finite quail]

no point for phys builds that arent bleed

[coral summit]

berserker praying for 130 passive points

[karmic gust]

yea warden damage nodes are absurd, just like assa damage nodes are absurd

[coral summit]

at all points in the game

[karmic gust]

doesnt make for good ascendancy

[coral summit]

not phys, grey wind so pure fire

[fossil mural]

And tunctures to ranged should be a keystone

[coral summit]

so a pen prismatic tincture would be like 40% more damage

[split maple]

if you have any points leftover after taking -mana cost they go into life smalls 😛

but thats a big if

[finite quail]

the only good tincture node for melee phys thats not bleed is the attack speed during effect one

[bold scarab]

Then we would just never have ascendancy skills ever ... Cuz you could make that argument for any ascendancy skill

[pulsar dune]

Yea, tho at least warden damage nodes largely have synergy with each other

[past mantle]

It's 4 points to have this on my build. I am more than happy to take that.

[karmic gust]

damage is not hard to get defense is

[whole bluff]

Warden is flasks they already removed cuz bad design + no defences. It's fun for like 1 char imo

[onyx adder]

Doubly true in bottom right corner

[coral summit]

the reason this build gets away with this

[whole bluff]

Yeah it deals like 500% more dmg printed on the ascendancy

[coral summit]

is because earthshatter costs 3(3) mana to use and nothing else costs ANYTHING

other than cwdt molten shell

[past mantle]

Good. Fuck ascendancy skills.

[coral summit]

and lifetapped flammability on battlemage's cry

[bold scarab]

Your biggest defense in the bottom right is off screening ... But then they nerfed that kek

[past mantle]

Ascendancy skills always sucked, they can become rare gems for all I care.

[karmic gust]

if they give us actually good defnsive bloodline that do not takesso much effort to enable then both warden and assa might be playable but after seeing the bloodline ascendancies kinda doubt it

[stuck phoenix]

MORE WALLS

[bold scarab]

Lol

[frigid wedge]

the only reason im even reading this is it's more to read than i can actually process

[fossil mural]

People drooled at olroth

[lean urchin]

from the enemies perspective the walls really worked

[bold scarab]

The bloodlines are weird

[karmic gust]

yea that one is good defense but it falls into category too much effort to enable

[split maple]

kinda needs a lot of hits

a lot

[bold scarab]

Some of them have uniform identities ... While others just feel like they slapped 3 random passives together

[karmic gust]

and yea limited to certain setups

[split maple]

and like if you dont use yndas its hard to get relevant amount of ward

[coral summit]

if only but literally cannot figure out how to actually make the tincture not feel terrible to use when blood stance plus mastery is just like 18% more damage and everything else is either unclicking life nodes and/or having to use shitty clusters

[split maple]

and yndas is a belt so sucks

[karmic gust]

and breach isnt good enough imo

and thats the only other defensive bloodline

that isnt deli

[split maple]

even if we forget yndas is fucking unobtanium

[coral summit]

i can fit runegraft of treachery with one point but it costs me a life nodes

[karmic gust]

deli is good but it locks you out so much

and breach is effort to enable as well anyway

[onyx adder]

Deli bloodline is really good in low powered league formats fwiw

Its so good in ssf and would be good in hc if simu didnt kill ur ass so much

[split maple]

i wonder how will they adapt breachlord bloodline or replace it next patch

[bold scarab]

Like Lycia had all the minions and like fight with your minions stuff ... But then you have that one herald ascendancy that's like ... Herald passive + 50% osin

[onyx adder]

I hope they throw it out

And replace with new league bloodline

[stuck phoenix]

Breach bloodline
Otherwise unchanged

[brazen vector]

Probably just gonna swap the grafts for breach rings

[karmic gust]

would be funny to always have league related bloodline ngl

[bold scarab]

Oh and the unleash one is also weird like that

[split maple]

timelord bloodline 😛

[bold scarab]

Forget what ascendancy that's in

[split maple]

oshabi?

[past mantle]

Oshabi.

[bold scarab]

Bloodline sorry

[coral summit]

wait ok im stupid it literally cost me just a random 4% damage mastery and a cluster swap

ok tincture has been fit

[brazen vector]

https://tenor.com/view/10th-doctor-time-lord-victorious-david-tennant-chuck-mc-gill-gif-26113260

[whole bluff]

This could make a lot of sense. You had 2 grafts. You have 2 rings

[bold scarab]

Ah

[split maple]

would make sense if breach bloodline didnt already have ring stuff on other nodes

makes it a tad weirdge

[stuck phoenix]

What if I have 3 (totally possible)

[brazen vector]

Plus its not bricked by the 3rd ring bloodline as its also a bloodline

[split pagoda]

deli node is preeeetty good but limits options alot yeah

[brazen vector]

Its a ring bloodline, so why not

[split maple]

coz there is already a ring bloodline

[bold scarab]

Would have been super troll if one of the paths was -1 ring to get to +1 ring

[coral summit]

...o my god they need to up the speed on grey wind god DAMN

[split pagoda]

fits right into slammer tho or even boneshatter

[coral summit]

that leap slam is SO SLOW

[split maple]

lets swap nameless to two ammyes 😄

[stuck phoenix]

Because the breach bloodline already has breach ring nodes

[karmic gust]

ring bloodline node is funny because grabbing it is always wrong choice

my favorite bloodline

[stuck phoenix]

Or something