2┃build-planning

[frigid hill]

meat shield gives life to minions

[muted charm]

I don't know sorcs tree so i'm not looking at specifics

[wintry prism]

Ah ok thx

[frail jay]

One of the soceress ascendancies main build people will play uses a mace

[muted charm]

i specifically left her untouched

buuuuut

"Bloodmage can't use minions guys"

"Blood mage isn't a minion ascendancy."

"Why is there only one minions witch ascendancy."

.........Sorry needed to get that out of my system.

[frail jay]

What's the blood mage minion synergy?

I still think blood mage looks bad for minions

[muted charm]

Look at how bone skills work

they all interact with minions in some way

[silent prawn]

No one is a minion ascendancy. Just one works better than the other

[muted charm]

and witches tree inherently gives her minion damage no matter what

[keen turtle]

You think its worth taking both Unbound Avatar and Elemental Expression as Invoker Monk?

[muted charm]

she may do a lot of damage with bone skills

[unreal girder]

Seems like Sorc Ward is barely supportable by anything

[keen dagger]

Doubt it, the survivability nodes at the top seem too good

[muted charm]

but she needs minions help to captalize on them

[snow sierra]

Dam whats the verdict on Minion Builds now if i look at the tree playing anything else then witch seems kinda foolish

[frail jay]

I mean not if you just don't take minion damage nodes, and also what does that have to do with blood mage?

[muted charm]

blood mage is a phys caster primarily

for reasons

[frail jay]

Plus other classes can just path to minion stuff

[frail jay]

???

[muted charm]

i can't look at the tree right now

[frail jay]

one of the main nodes is literally "you are an ele caster"

[muted charm]

but bone skills are crit based she uses gore spike

[frail jay]

ice skills are also crit based

[muted charm]

yeah

ice is oslo blood mage

[silent prawn]

Anyone can still do it.

[muted charm]

bone is minion

like infernalist

"both"

[frail jay]

she has like no synergy with minions though

[muted charm]

she has synergy with bone skills

therefore she has synergy with minions

[frail jay]

Her synergy with bone skills is that she is a good selfcast spec

[snow sierra]

dude it isnt bloodmage can work with minions for sure but it will only provide you with defensive support, and scaling 2 ways to dmg is not the best idea historical

[muted charm]

no

her synergy with bone skills

is phys spells are the best at crit

meaning sorc runs them like ass compared to her

[snow sierra]

yes but they missing what 100% minion dmg 15% minion life 10% minion attackspeed or something, that dos not seem "whatever"

[frail jay]

I mean why would you run bone skills on sorc lol

well stormweaver

bonestorm is cracked on chrono

actually insane ability

[muted charm]

yeah

but sorc doesn't get witches start so she cant do the hybrid minion stuff bone skils want easily

[frail jay]

bro the start nodes literally don't matter

it's like 20% increased damage difference

[muted charm]

1000% minion damage

hella fucking matters

don't know what your smoking

[frail jay]

??

[muted charm]

yeah

its that much

100%

for free

[frail jay]

oh also

why would you play minion sorc

lol

[snow sierra]

its 100% minion dmg 15% minion life and 10% minion attackspeed or something its kinda alot

[frail jay]

I never said minion sorc is good

[snow sierra]

i thought about minion chronomancer

[muted charm]

what i've been trying to tell people but they wouldn't listen 😛

[frail jay]

Maybe with spectres if they have big cds

[scarlet stream]

Why does everyone want to play minion

[frail jay]

minions are good

[scarlet stream]

Source?

[snow sierra]

chronomancer can do more then playing around cds

[frail jay]

math

[frigid hill]

what defences are y'all picking up on tree? struggling to evaluate 20% increased armour etc

[scarlet stream]

[muted charm]

but yeah i don't see bonemancer going like lord of horrors ever

but girl definetly likes her scepters

[frail jay]

Bloodmage is still really bad with minions compared to Infernalist, and probably Gemling/Warbringer too

[icy dirge]

minion with what energy shield? on infernalist?

[muted charm]

yeah

bloodmage gets empowered by minons

infernalist empowers the minions

[frail jay]

I mean I can see using minions just for minion pact I guess

and maybe there will be some funky debuff spectres

[muted charm]

just in general

[limber gate]

Is there any confirmation on whether chill is 35 or 70 max with stormwesvers heavy snows node? 🧐 Information i find seems to be contradictory so far

[frail jay]

but that's not really something special for bloodmage

[muted charm]

lit's a "The skill already has me have some to use it so why not more

[eternal pilot]

Is bleeding going to be good on titan? it doesnt seem like bleeds will benefit from increased damage against stunned enemies/armor break etc according to its wording

[frail jay]

like idk if you realize this but "minion bloodmage" getting gore spike means that node is doing nothing for your minions

[muted charm]

yeah its just the skills shes designed to work best with

[frail jay]

Sacrifice DD Blood Mage however

[muted charm]

really like minions

[icy dirge]

what do you run for surviving on a witch minion build?

[sacred sparrow]

There were 122 talent points in POE1 right?

[muted charm]

and she just so happens to get a lot of syenrgy for free

[lofty grotto]

so support gems doesn't level in poe2 right?

[frail jay]

I don't think it's real synergy

because she doesn't have synergy with the minions

[muted charm]

i think 100% damage in a skill tree where 300% damage

[icy dirge]

you get uncut gems

[muted charm]

is already synergy

[frail jay]

yeah but infernalist exists

on that same tree

[muted charm]

shes already half way toa full minon build

right

and hers aren't for damage

[frail jay]

blood mage doesn't make her minion stronger or get more minions

[muted charm]

tehir damage is to help her out

think of it like this

[icy dirge]

blood mage has life leech tho so shes tankier since you can stack health no?

[muted charm]

you cna't armor break as a phys caster

[frail jay]

what minions actually make blood mage stronger in a way unique to minions

[muted charm]

its not something your allowed to do

but your stupid fucking skele warriors

they can do that

[snow sierra]

The Acendency blood mage dosnt have minion senergy whats so hard to see here ? it CAN still work as a minion build, but the Acendency dos NOT support Minions

I would even assume it works

[frail jay]

Are we having another "they removed all the life leech" moment? And forgetting weapon swaps exist?

[muted charm]

are we forgetting accuracey exist?

[frail jay]

not really for melee

[drowsy crane]

anyone playing archmage shock/chill stormweaver fuckery (and is decent at build planning) hmu, I need a co-cook

[frail jay]

also that support works on phys spells

so....

[icy dirge]

I am not talking about the ascendancy having to buff the minions, I am saying the ascendancy is just tankier and has better defense then a infernalist? The hell hound taking damage is nice but what else are you really running for defense on the infernalist.

[muted charm]

oh neat your right

[languid oasis]

lowkey considering dropping monk now for stormweaver

[small flare]

Anyone starting with the monk?

[eternal pilot]

Its mainly a stat if you are planning to be far away from bosses

[frail jay]

I'm feeling this way too man these mana costs are fucked

[snow sierra]

oh bloodmage, bonestorm, minions and break armor could be a cool idea while not beeing the best build ever 😛

[sacred sparrow]

I don't know if I should be looking forward to Hulking Form Warrior -> Titan

[languid oasis]

it just feels like everything doesnt fit with monk

[keen dagger]

Just throw mana leech on a ring

[frail jay]

Here I go casting EI comet for 1746 mana

[languid oasis]

stormweaver seems quite natural with the whole CI, eldritch battery, MoM + ascendancy nodes and mana stacking... if mana stackung is good

[muted charm]

but like

why do that on your damage skill

when you can just hafve an army of idiots do it for free

[frail jay]

don't? Put it on an armor breaking skill

[muted charm]

yes your fast cast speed armor breaking spell

hehe

[frail jay]

Also why reserve all your spirit on shit ass minion you don't invest into when you can spend it on stuff that actually increases the damage of your spells

[keen dagger]

Are there even any decent spell reservations?

[snow sierra]

because minions are cool 😛

[frail jay]

or CoC

[keen dagger]

I couldn't see any besides triggers, and CoC is tier 14 afair

[muted charm]

because they sitll do half damage evenwithout investing in them and they auto trigger my skills forf me

isn't the point of spirit uatomation

minions are uatomating thihngs for me

[frail jay]

Oh CoC is t14

[snow sierra]

But i am hopping more and more on the minion RF train tbh

[frail jay]

Idk feel free to try it but it's not going to be good, there's a reason no one does that in PoE1 even if they're playing like a DD necro that gets a lot of free minion damage

[muted charm]

because poe1 doesn't support this kind of playstyle whatsoever well?

different games

[magic thicket]

anyone theorycrafting ED / contagion build?

[frigid hill]

damaging ailments look so bad

[snow sierra]

Well necro in poe1 is a bit diffrent imo, necros buff in poe1 where so strong that minions without it rarely worked

[frail jay]

I mean I don't think this one does either

I think you're really overestimating the synergy that's specific to bloodmage

[muted charm]

Yeah its just spirit

what would spirit do for a bloodmage

[snow sierra]

Auras ? Cast on ?

[rough kelp]

Is more% dmg better than increased%

[muted charm]

auras only effect allies

cast on what?

your a phys caster

[snow sierra]

Cast on Crit for example

[muted charm]

why dont we play invoker than?

he has much better phys trigger synergy

[snow sierra]

i dont know where you came to the conlcusion that bloodmage is only a phys caster

[lone temple]

Guys, what is attack time in "Charges for 800% of Attack Time before firing if used when you have no Heat" of rapid shot ?
Attack speed only goes up is attack time the time for one attack ?

[muted charm]

she ius heavily encourages to be a phys caster

like

HEAVILY

[eternal pilot]

How the fudge are you supposed to get endurance charges? most passive skill nodes are just max stacks/benefits when you consume them?

[frail jay]

I mean if you want to play minions why not infernalist

Well tbh, minions probably are a good thing to have on bloodmage

I just don't think it's a minion build

[muted charm]

But you dont want to play minions

you want to be a phys caster

[frail jay]

they're for utility

[muted charm]

your moving the goal post

[frail jay]

no?

[muted charm]

blood mage is the pordigal phys caster

thjat's her main theme/role

[vagrant hollow]

How would the crit rate be with flicker strike? If it was 3 attacks would it end up being all 3 attacks if it crit? Or would crit chance be applied to each individual attack within the flicker strike?

[muted charm]

phys casters have a lot of syenrgy with minions

[drowsy crane]

how do supports that increase curse activation delay interact w blasphemy

[frail jay]

I said I don't think minion bloodmage is good, a build where you get 99% of your damage from selfcast spells and you have minions that do utility things isn't minion bloodmage it's just bloodmage with utility minions

[native widget]

Like, honestly, you can get level 31 elemental skills with relative ease

[snow sierra]

what do you have in mind for "utility" minions ?

[frail jay]

well they said there's one that can break armor that seems fine

idk about the others

specters probably once we have them

[native widget]

with the possible spirit from body armor, we might not even need sceptre now

actually pog

spirit from bodyarmor + runes might just give enough to cover my build

[muted charm]

you don't use them for damage

they're pure automation

non damage minions exist

[velvet blade]

Hand of Chayula not in EA?

Not seeing it anymore on db

[snow sierra]

Well then minion dmg notes are a waste to take

If you dont play a scepter you dont take minion dmg notes

[frail jay]

the spell damage nodes give you minion damage for free, earlygame you are gonna be a lot more hybrid

[snow sierra]

One the early ones right ?

[frail jay]

yeah

[snow sierra]

yea sure taking those makes sense, pathing for minion notes dosnt

[muted charm]

you just sort of have 100 of it cause whatever existing

[snow sierra]

is it me or dos it seem like minion dmg notes are kinda rare ?

[frail jay]

Alright well I finally reviewed all the support gems and have my build sorta finalized, time to do laundry and then sleep

[native widget]

how come we dont have majority of the uniques?

[frail jay]

12 hours left

[frigid hill]

gn

[frail jay]

uniques aren't dataminable

still takes 90min to do laundry

[native widget]

wait what

why hto

[muted charm]

think of it like good girl points on your unearth

[frail jay]

because they don't have text in the files until someone drops it ingame

idk its always been that way

[muted charm]

half damage is better than no damage other classes get from the minions

same for bonestorm

free tirggers are better than no triggers

[snow sierra]

Yes but you wont run a scepter and minions wont be a big part of your dmg

And you surely wont go for a minion armey

[muted charm]

and then detonate dead, and whle its chaos dark pact

the minion was already there anyways

i just named 5 of the skills she uses better than anyone else. idk what more you want there fam

[rough kelp]

I dont understand the term chain from terrain? df this does

Mybad for the ping accidental touch I hate mobile

[muted charm]

Hit a wall it ricochets off into an enemy.

[rough kelp]

so that only works if I miss? or do the ground count?

[muted charm]

don't know. Projectiles that can do this hitting the ground is a new concept.

probably not.

[halcyon charm]

anyone know if a spear can be used with a shield with titans grip? like 2h spear int 1h spear and shield

[snow sierra]

are Int/Str travel notes gone ?
Or is it just we dont know what stat the travel notes give yet ?

[frigid hill]

No spears in EA yet

[halcyon charm]

ah okay

[slender wolf]

https://www.twitch.tv/fubgun/clip/AnnoyingColdbloodedOysterBloodTrail-N8IT_2bCirdUnrL3 can some1 explain what this means?? im confused

[royal trench]

do we know of any good recovery methods for infernalist

im thinking ill do some culling strike raging spirits with vitality and cannibalism but it seems very inconsistent

want to find out how to sustain demon form by second lab

[rough kelp]

do we know how much hp you get per points in vitality?

[frail jay]

vitality, font of blood, regen nodes

[sullen wasp]

you get 2 per strength, 4 if you pick the gemling node that doubles stats gain

[rough kelp]

so vitality doesnt give hp? only strength I see

[dapper marten]

what ascendancy is the best with giant's blood?

[sullen wasp]

vitality the buff? that's just life regen

[warped jackal]

Idk what build i should do now .. Does elemental synergies well with chaos? is that possible with converting, or is phys still the best way? end of the day i want to use flame of chayula

[sullen wasp]

probably titan with hulking because the strength requirement will be high even with -req items

[dapper marten]

i see :3 thank you :D

[frail jay]

apparently hulking doesn't work on the str nodes

real answer is gemling

[sullen wasp]

why wouldnt it work?

[frail jay]

because they made it not work

[sullen wasp]

it's a small passive node

[frail jay]

ask GGG

[sullen wasp]

it works on jewels

[frigid hill]

titan gets 8% more strength to be fair

[snow sierra]

oh that makes it somehow reasonable again^^

[frail jay]

that's what the CBT playtesters said

[sage sorrel]

anyone got any good idea about blood mage builds? im looking into something spell selfcasting with maybe minions just as slight support.

[jagged thunder]

are Totems considered as Minions?

[languid oasis]

do charges have a base duration?

[frigid hill]

no

[frail jay]

no

[sullen wasp]

cbt wouldnt know

[frail jay]

???

[sullen wasp]

pretty sure the version that is being datamined is different than what they all played

[frail jay]

the cbt was like the last 3 days

[sullen wasp]

because old leaks from cbt have changed

im going to say small passive = small passive

[frail jay]

you think in the last day they went "actually maybe hulking form should affect the attribute nodes"?

because I think a tester leaked that yesterday

[sullen wasp]

show source

[royal trench]

is cold to fire in this

[dapper marten]

oh so it boost stuff like "more phys dmg" small ones but not stat?

[royal trench]

the support

[maiden karma]

Saw a big datamine, gonna start warbringer after all

[rough kelp]

is there no way to check what attributes gives?

[proud canopy]

2 life, 2 mana or 5 accuracy

[frigid hill]

armour break is bad 🙁

[sullen wasp]

2/2/5 life/mana/acc

[rough kelp]

theres only 3 att?

[maiden karma]

What part of inverting armour is bad?

[sage sorrel]

yes

[hollow turret]

Guys, what's the skill called in PoE2 that's is like Earthbreaker Support from PoE1?

[rough kelp]

oh so attributes more useless than I though I might have to change build a bit

[frail jay]

idk I can't find it, too many messages about hulking

[hollow turret]

I saw the "trailer" it shows totem uses melee skill ... ?

[muted charm]

ancestral warchief totem

[frigid hill]

the part where u can't scale it to -90 PDR

[muted charm]

its very very end game

but very very good

very very very good.

[hollow turret]

wait .... so no earthbraeker type?

[sage sorrel]

the totem seems to have inbuilt it

[hollow turret]

hmmmm ok

[muted charm]

earthrbeaker got its name changed to warchief

[sage sorrel]

you place the gem you want to use on it

[proud canopy]

you expected one ascendancy node to give you like 90% dmg?

[sage sorrel]

but it must be a Mace gem, it seems

[hollow turret]

poedb have the info?

[frail jay]

meanwhile at chonk

[maiden karma]

It was obvious that shit wouldn't happen

[hollow turret]

Hmmmm

[wind needle]

they gutted the monk by removing harmonic generator, generating power charges now will be clucky af

[frigid hill]

you do you, to me it looks awful

[random nymph]

unknown gems?

[modern heart]

What was harmonic generator

Btw

Also where is cyclone

I don't see it anywhere

[sullen wasp]

probably an axe skill

or sword

[wind needle]

generated power charges by shocking chilled enemies, at 20% chance

[slender wolf]

anyone know where tier 14s drop from?

[hollow turret]

ya forgot to mention, seems no cyclone in early EA

[proud canopy]

basically pinnacle bosses I think

[keen dagger]

Do we know if spirit reservation scales with supports?

[modern heart]

I knew something was missing

I looked everywhere

For a power charge node

[keen dagger]

It seems like we have too much spirit available compared to ways to use it outside of minion builds

[frail jay]

doubt it

[modern heart]

On ascendency and there wasn't available

[frail jay]

get some minions

[sullen wasp]

stuff like vitality/clarity etc have a flat cost now according to viper

[keen dagger]

They don't exist according to data mine

[sullen wasp]

i'd trust a dev over the datamine

[modern heart]

Is this cyclone?

I can't hold it for ever ? That's lame

[muted charm]

@frail jay add to the list

no one else but bloodmage can use sacrafice well.

[frail jay]

well that's not true

[muted charm]

no its quite true

[frail jay]

DD ignite infernalist?

[muted charm]

where do they get the crit chance from?

[frail jay]

Basically any zombie build?

Why do you need crit chance

[muted charm]

why woulnd't you need crit chance?

[wintry oracle]

what class would be best for a flicker strike build?

[frail jay]

because you don't have to have crit?

[muted charm]

also infernalist does nothing to buff the minions life

[hollow turret]

Ah found it

[muted charm]

like

actual nothing

[hollow turret]

rip endgame skill...

[frail jay]

infernalist lets you ignite

[silent prawn]

likely monk

[muted charm]

true

[frail jay]

and gives extra fire dam

[muted charm]

so i guess they're different flavors on that one

[frail jay]

also doesn't infernalist havea crit thing?

[muted charm]

but bloodmage sitll definetly has her own flavor there

[wintry oracle]

gotcha

[hollow turret]

wait no

[frail jay]

Also DD poison probably better on chonk

[hollow turret]

i'm pretty sure those "TIERS" mean level unlock

[proud canopy]

what's the problem?

[hollow turret]

skill have been separated into tier unlocks, not by map "tier"

[frail jay]

zombies with sacrifice also make a lot of sense on warbringer

[hollow turret]

so basically is level/quest based

[frail jay]

since you have less spirit

[pastel forge]

stormweaver who?

[frail jay]

but can get minions with totems

[pastel forge]

let me get free buffed arcane surge on crits

[hollow turret]

cuz i saw somone mention is from pinacle boss i was like HUH?

[frail jay]

where are those nodes

[proud canopy]

pinnacle boss is archmage

[frail jay]

those nodes are so far away

man I'm gonna get my invoker set up and not be able to sustain mana and reroll stormweaver lol

maybe I should just theorycraft stormweaver now

invoker

[pastel forge]

right above mom

made for them pretty much

xd

[modern heart]

Idk monk seems ass

[frail jay]

invoker would be really good if it wasn't going to delete all my fucking mana in half a second

"but wait, there's the node that gives mana back when you invoke spells"

and you get that on stormweaver too

[undone ingot]

just punch kick it back to full

[frail jay]

no thanks

[undone ingot]

its very monkly

[frail jay]

I mean what I would probably do is have an EI ember fusilade with level 1 ember fusilade to cast ember fusilade 18 times for no mana and recover 54% of my mana

[somber valve]

hello, im all new about poe.
I found some really cooooool skins from 'poe1' shop.
Does anyguy knows if i buy them,could i use them in poe2?

sry, wrong channel

[frail jay]

or I could just play stormweaver and recover 30% of max mana per second

[polar zealot]

What's the best website to see poe2 skills? Poe2skills . com has a different description of vine arrow than poe2 database so I don't know which one is accurate

[upbeat flax]

poe2db.tw

[frail jay]

I guess actually the downside of stormweaver is I have to invest into a ton of max mana but no MoM

[hollow turret]

This gonna be FUNNY with melee totem

[sterile sinew]

Bonestorm says "Debuffed enemies take additional Physical damage from next Attack"

Is it applied after all modifiers or before like other +flats?

[signal ivy]

What are people's thoughts on bloodmage vs infernalist for a minion and melee build? I was having trouble deciding between minions and flicker, and decided to try both.

[royal trench]

is there a shotgun attack for lightning
theres one for fire and cold

[drowsy crane]

thoughts on actually not taking mind over matter on archmage and just speccing into all the damage taken from mana nodes (34% total)

[unreal girder]

Specify shotgun attack

[sterile sinew]

Galvanic shards

[unreal girder]

There are like 5 lightning xbow skills

[royal trench]

stuff like incendiary shot

[plain oyster]

You can actually get more from jewels, so possibly viable later on?

[drowsy crane]

feel like unless you go eternal youth and pseudo life-based you will not be able to sustain all damage from mana + using mana to cast

[unreal girder]

Galvanic shards sounds close enough

[plain oyster]

Was thinking to transition to jewel setup and ditch MoM later on, but will be rough - max roll is 4% on a Jewel

[unreal girder]

Do we know if skills that consume armour break benefit from broken armour before breaking it?

[drowsy crane]

yeah but I feel like 34% damage buffer to mana on a CI build with a (presumably) high ES pool, chilling everything, and blasphemied enfeeble/temp chains is

enough. maybe?

[proud canopy]

I mean the target will be taking more phys dmg

[drowsy crane]

and then push that to like 50% with jewels if possible

[proud canopy]

like the hit removes the buff so the armor penalty has to be part of the calc

[plain oyster]

Might be the better play, reminiscent of the old Archmage cremation era 🤔

[modern heart]

Can't u just go 15 78 blood mage go mele and fuck shit up

Crit damage , max hp and

Peogensis

[lone temple]

Is quality not on support gem at all ?

[modern heart]

Progensis

[snow sierra]

what are link skills ?

[frail jay]

wtf you can't bind capslock in poe2

[proud canopy]

correct

[lone temple]

support skill that provide buff to one ally. Not in the game for EA at launch

[cerulean bear]

Thoughts on Incinerate (CwC/CoI) firestorm?

[crisp summit]

https://poe2db.tw/us/Heft#HeftSupportGemHeft
this is just a castrated volatility from poe1 it seems... strictly for bleed fishing... with lucky hits against heavy stunned could be solid

[lone temple]

That kill the gemling a bit.

[frail jay]

eh not really

quality not even good on gemling

[proud canopy]

it's not like they didn't know that before they made the node

[lone temple]

it does when you expect it to affect 12*6 gems 🤣

[royal trench]

hmm... the tree looks ok for the lightning ranged gemling
a lot of pen, lucky lightning damage, easy path down to polymathy

[frail jay]

I stand by totem grenade gemling being the real menace

[hollow turret]

Erm ..... skeleton ... loop?

[frail jay]

no

[hollow turret]

have anyone talk about this?

there's no cooldown .... huh?

[frail jay]

no, because people read the gem first

and other skills

[delicate fern]

can't wait to play support pf

[frail jay]

tier 14

[delicate fern]

well not like you can sustain flasks early on anyway

[simple acorn]

triggered skills cant generate energy

[delicate fern]

this is meant for late game

[royal trench]

will recoup cause you to recover life lost by demon form degen

[hollow turret]

ya, just make minion constantly die

[frail jay]

yeah just do that

[delicate fern]

the cooldown is the minions taking time to revive

[frail jay]

reward: ?

[hollow turret]

Since this a thing

[hollow turret]

auto cast skill

"loop"

[frail jay]

how does it loop

[frigid hill]

no

[simple acorn]

you cant self cast triggered skills

[primal oasis]

are wanders still going to be a thing

[frail jay]

you get like 1-2 casts every 10 seconds

that's a pretty bad loop

[simple acorn]

if your skeleton dies while linked to that skill, it will not trigger

[delicate fern]

you need to read on minion revive mechanic

[simple acorn]

triggered skills cannot generate energy

[delicate fern]

you will understand why that can't work

[frail jay]

I mean you can't even trigger skeletons

[hollow turret]

minion auto revive in PoE2 yes?

[frail jay]

after 4sec

[simple acorn]

yes

[delicate fern]

also that 4 seconds resets every time another minion dies

so they either have to die together

[outer abyss]

what do you guys expect to be strong starters from the current data mines
?

[delicate fern]

or you wont get any revives happening

[hollow turret]

have ... different minion?

do they shares same revive time?

[simple acorn]

minions are not spell skills

[snow sierra]

well with the Infernal Legion support they mostlikely will die together

[simple acorn]

yes they share a respawn timer

[frail jay]

poison crossbow chonk

[delicate fern]

same minions are shared but not sure about different ones

problem is how are you gonna kill multiple different minions

[hollow turret]

you don't loop for minion ..

[delicate fern]

automatically to create a "loop"

[simple acorn]

minions get revived by default if no minions have died for 7 seconds

[frigid hill]

isnt that 12 seconds?

[royal trench]

damn its looking like, from tree at least, sustaining demon form isnt going to be possible

[hollow turret]

hmmm i'ma use gemling, so can have at least 2 infernal minion

[delicate fern]

idk they have changed this multiple times i have no idea what will be live

[outer abyss]

nice nice, i am still deciding on a starter, i like the look of merc but ill probably struggle so was looking for the next fun strong starter hehhe

[hollow turret]

and some minion revive passive

[maiden karma]

Warbringer has the best infernal minions

[silent prawn]

well in showcase they had it activ a long while

[delicate fern]

that points to a bigger issue that a lot of people overlook, sustain is very scarce

[rancid karma]

I thought about going minions but decided to go merc and probably try some freeze/ignite thing

[hollow turret]

hmmm good idea but ... hmmmm

[delicate fern]

and why i am starting pf, probably the least popular ascendancy

[royal trench]

i was planning to start infernalist demon form and rush regen but it looks impossible to get 10% life regen, even at max level

im definitely doing some form of ignite caster though

[true gulch]

infernalist or bloodmage for chaos skills?

[proud canopy]

I mean what is the base life of a totem

[frail remnant]

Will we have link skills in EA?

[delicate fern]

there are ways though to get around the demon form degen

[plain oyster]

Just had a thought, Archmage...Firestorm? With Overabundance you can have 2 active storms. Sort of a bootleg Cremation 🤔 That would mean you don't cast so much.

[proud canopy]

the ghost base life is the totem base life

[hollow turret]

i think auto-casting build is possible in PoE2

[proud canopy]

in poe 1 totem base life sucks ass

[delicate fern]

you can use EY and rely on es as your primary hp pool

[limber flume]

Anyone know if Armour Break has a duration? I don't think it does?

[hollow turret]

just gonna find a way sustain the mana spend, it'll be very fast

[delicate fern]

or maybe mom, that can work too

[hollow turret]

if wanna make a fast looping-build

[frigid hill]

fully broken is base 6 sec

[limber flume]

Thanks

[drowsy crane]

I'm currently only casting 1 thing as it stands, and then a lightning storm every 8 seconds (linked to hourglass, overabundance, spell echo so it drops both storms) and cast on shock conduit

[polar zealot]

Do you guys think you'll be able to make a build revolving around this skill? It probably can't be poisoned multiple times to stack it right?

[keen dagger]

Do we know if each aura gem you run takes up one of the 9 slots, or if you can put multiple auras in the same slot?

[delicate fern]

as long as you dont get any damage to life recharge will be perma up so it counters the demon degen

[frigid hill]

NDA-breaker says it didn't work in-game

actually i can prob get the tooltip from db, 1 sec

[delicate fern]

weird, that's how it works in poe1

but they may have changed it

[hollow turret]

I think is too good to be true .... compare to PoE1 you need armour for the self cast loop tech

[frigid hill]

yea they changed it

[snow mist]

What is "Slow Magnitude?"

[delicate fern]

oh damn

[snow sierra]

dunno if rageing spirit death counts but you could maybe cast on minion death a fireball, that spawns a rageing spirit and so on not sure if a autocast can trigger rageing spirits

[uneven sleet]

how can u guys alr talking about build 👀, do the skill tree / available passive become available ?

[delicate fern]

recharge stops if you get any loss not just damage

rip

[frigid hill]

ya it was the only saving grace for demon form imo, it looks rly bad now 😦

[frigid hill]

https://poe2db.tw/us/

spoilers ofc

[uneven sleet]

Thank you

[hollow turret]

true .... I think of 5 different spell into it instead

[silent prawn]

are snaps from PoE2DB allowed? or considered leak

[maiden karma]

What other endurance generators are there besides magma barrier?

[plain oyster]

Ah I forgot bout Lightning Storm, it doesn't show up on the Skill Gem List. Have to look for it via search.

Think it will be okay with giga-boosted Arcane Surge if you do 2 Firestorms and 1 Lightning Storm since you don't have to refresh them often.

[hollow turret]

like a classic ward-loop build-ish

[simple acorn]

as of the witch gameplay reveal, the minion revive timer is shared across all minions, and it only revives a minion if none have died for 7 seconds by default

[hollow turret]

ah ... make sense, fair enough

or else this auto cast is too good to be true

[snow sierra]

Well there is rageing spirits that dont use the timer

And counts a minions

And so do the totem thingys from warbringer

[simple acorn]

theyre not permanent minions

[delicate fern]

yeah i don't think "loop" builds are possible, at least for now

[hollow turret]

no no he saying the revive timer thing

[simple acorn]

only perma mininons can auto revive

temp minions cannot

[delicate fern]

that support will mostly be used to trigger some utility gems

[hollow turret]

wait ....

infernal minion ... with only 1 minion seems achievable loop

[hollow turret]

like instead of an army of minion

[snow sierra]

the idea is not auto revive, its casting a fireball that procs a rageing spirit, that dies and procs a fireball, and this fireball spawns a minion again

[delicate fern]

problem is still the long revive time

[hollow turret]

you make a consistent 1 minion, to loop

[delicate fern]

i wouldnt consider a skill that casts once every 7 seconds or so

[hollow turret]

there's passive to reduce it

[delicate fern]

a "loop" build

thats true but not enough to make it viable imo

[simple acorn]

the raging spirit itself is a temp minion

[delicate fern]

unless its some sort of big damaging skill that is fine to use on a longer cd

[hollow turret]

and raging is not a skill either

[simple acorn]

and again, triggered skills cannot generate energy

[hollow turret]

you can't META gem an ascendancy skill ... ?

[delicate fern]

yeah you can't

[royal trench]

bros keep in mind top right skill tree has 50% TO FIRE 2 ADDITIONAL PROJECTILES

[delicate fern]

in order to meta it you have to move it in the meta slot which you cannot do for ascendancy skills

[royal trench]

for spells

[simple acorn]

ascendancy skills arent gems that can be socketed into something afaik so no

[hollow turret]

i wonder chrono can reduce the revive time further 🤔

[snow sierra]

Rageing spirit dos not need energy it dos need a fire aoe spell cast ? who says it cant be proced with "cast on" stuff ?

[simple acorn]

probably?

[simple acorn]

raging spirit is a triggered skill

when it dies it cannot generate energy

[snow sierra]

ok makes sense

If even the spawned minion counts as "cannont generate energy"

[hollow turret]

but then even if the loop is fast

[proud canopy]

pretty sure any granted skill can be supported

including ascendancy ones

[hollow turret]

the mana isue though to auto-cast 5 spells ... holy moly

[simple acorn]

with supports yes

meta gems arent supports, you need to socket a skill gem into them

[proud canopy]

oh you mean putting one into a meta I see

[royal trench]

jesus i might actually be playing stormweaver as a fire caster

[hollow turret]

but ya, is too good to be true compare to PoE1 loop-tech

no damage penalty, no cooldown

no mana multiplier?

[livid hamlet]

the whole architecture is anti loop tho right ?

since the triggered skills don't generate energy

[hollow turret]

you use minion to generate energy, not skillspell

[livid hamlet]

means they can't actually keep triggering each other

oh then yeah this usecase can work

[hollow turret]

you don't trigger each other, only minion

[snow sierra]

i doubt you can get the minion respawn timer short enough for it to be good

[delicate fern]

i assume flask effect is gonna work similar to poe1 which adds another multiplier to life flask recovery?

[final cliff]

will witch minion builds be okay even without spectres and a ascendancy focused on them?

[snow sierra]

we hope so, and there will be no ascendancy that only focus minions atleast that was said

[delicate fern]

i think so

[hollow turret]

and there's only 1 wheel reduce mana cost ...

[frigid hill]

minions look strong to me, hard to say before playing though

[hollow turret]

ya I guess the mana is the biggest problem for the loop to work

[frigid hill]

there's more

[snow sierra]

Kinda bummed out the "only witch" notes for minions look way to strong to pass up but maybe i am overestimating them

[hollow turret]

ya ... not much

[delicate fern]

theres also generic reduced cost

[undone ingot]

yeah you are

[delicate fern]

but yeah its gonna be rough

[livid hamlet]

yeah i dislike the whole - different trees for different classes setup

[hollow turret]

unless there's gears that -mana cost ...🙏

[livid hamlet]

but maybe it will work

[final cliff]

maybe i shouldn't then , big noob maybe i go for something more friendly

[delicate fern]

imo there wont be simply cause it would make archmage broken, the 5%ish base mana cost is gonna be very hard to deal with and why they probably won't add that many reduced mana cost sources as those scale better the more you have

not to mention the reduced mana cost wheels atm are on the right side of the tree

pretty far away for most mom builds

[autumn knoll]

anyone know how the Skill Gem tier work? like tier 14 uncut will drop in high level zone, correct?

[hollow turret]

there's a lot of increase mana cost passive though

[snow sierra]

Minions atleast in poe1 are noob friendly because they are easy to scale

[frigid hill]

people are saying pinnacle bosses, im not so sure myself

[royal trench]

hmmm.... ignite caster with fireball as a base crit gem is like
not very good is it

[keen dagger]

Destroyed means explosions don't proc, right?

[sleek niche]

might do reap bloodmage to start

[delicate fern]

they wanna make archmage very hard to deal with and no the defacto way to play spellcasters

[autumn knoll]

woah that would suck lol

[hollow turret]

dont think so .... is like PoE1 previous version of archmage, and is pretty powerful

if there's a lot of tool increasing the mana cost

[autumn knoll]

Was planning a Decompose Poison Infernalist or Chalupa but I guess I'll play something else until I know I can get those

[delicate fern]

before the rework it was hardly played because there was no good way to sustain it

[undone ingot]

i think more that archmage is supposed to be like a pinnacle build

[royal trench]

is my maths just stupid or is fireball (7% base crit) with 271 increased crit chance only 19% chance to crit lol

[hollow turret]

and this gem exist

[delicate fern]

there were some gimmicky ways but yeah, i think people are getting baited with archmage builds

[hollow turret]

you wanna make a shortgun-spell archmage

[delicate fern]

yeah i think those will work well

[hollow turret]

you don't spam skill

[delicate fern]

or duration based spells like firestorm

[frigid hill]

25,97 no?
edit: admittedly low for a lot of investment, i'm not big on non-guaranteed crits personally

[tawdry marten]

so far as we know, are there any huge meta differences between classes? or all balanced

[hollow turret]

yup that's the gist of it

[royal trench]

im trying to find an elemental projectile spell that can take advantage of 50% chance to fire +2 projectiles and that also doesnt have terrible base crit

[hollow turret]

that's why stormbrand was OP in the old days with old archmage

basically bypass the "constantly casting" skill

[livid hamlet]

eye of winter ?

or whatever the name is

[delicate fern]

yep that's true, that's why i think poe2 archmage will play similar to old one

[royal trench]

you can only have 1 projectile active at a time of that no?
or does the eye itself fire more proj

[delicate fern]

you won't play it like it is right now in poe1 slapping it on any skill and scaling cast speed

it will be literally impossible to sustain something like that

[hollow turret]

and is not gonna make it into full game unless they nerf it, old archmage is too OP

[undone ingot]

lol oops, yeah add a 100 to your crit val to get to 1 (so will be 25.97)

[royal trench]

wait if you recast eye of winter does it immediently detonate

[delicate fern]

idk tbh i think new one is more broken

and why almost every top spellcaster build is exclusively archmage

even after the recent nerf

[undone ingot]

sure doesnt

what is a remote skill ?

nevermind

[hollow turret]

i wonder can it stack with unleash 🤔

[formal junco]

while checking some stuff for my build, i was looking on poedb2, and there is a node for mana recovery rate instead of regen rate, is there a difference on that?

[hollow turret]

ya ... sounds like PoE1

[formal junco]

i mean, recovery rate vs regen rate

[frigid hill]

recovery helps mana flask and mana recoup

and mana regen too ofc

[hollow turret]

IF it works like PoE1

[unreal girder]

Recovery is any form of gaining mana

[sudden crown]

who is going warrior ? who is chad among chads here ?

[hollow turret]

is chad a " build"?

[sudden crown]

its called going melee

this kinda build O.O

[native zinc]

i only have eyes for rapid shot/grenade launcher

[sudden crown]

warrior the best I'm so hyped to try my concept build

[analog prism]

I was going to select witchunter but with subtractem tier now I'm doubting my decision

[formal junco]

i see, if i understood right, recovery is like, whenever i gain 10 mana, that gain happens faster? and regen increases the ammount of the passive regeneration effect

[royal trench]

is ember fusillade literally just winter orb but fire

[austere cedar]

Hey guys, thoughts on this stormchaser tree for a starter with fire damage, then switching to ball liughtning?

https://poe2db.tw/us/passive-skill-tree/AAAABgcBef0VMMitxKYawCUioxxOmSSvRxKDSZ3Z_xoex_BXKnM-DKro9DXJCM48MLjLjc6E1naKywDIh-tG3mfhbiGotuPn4sFoFMJxUSdf7-uzPfTVtdq6j8aAjhthwg3vJ6986RLcKEo_gPHjgkFKZJqPlFbGQ0ubWjPU-TThwS-tC5TZF3b2LZpbW5oCLixmmTz0i00DD7EydmdPPg0XMFenm0iDXx0AcdwaYIgYBZm96pHPhcg9pnoGs17df3Cn3boDyBzSs0tS1pCCBx9jE6xCD91y-CqBcjiBWC4-EWhgT6JlpI8tmJh9AHQaO6Gcu54CBSWqAAA=

[sudden crown]

its still mindblowing to me how MELEE is at the top of every S tier list xd

[lofty flame]

bro, titan is amazing

[analog prism]

that %50 small passives is no joke

[lofty flame]

im confused should i go infernalist or titan... i want minion thoughl...

[hollow turret]

have yet to see, could be special case like relying unique item to make it powerful

[hollow turret]

meanwhile i'm going for gemling as minion

[analog prism]

my joke was that subtraceem known for bait build

[midnight bolt]

what the heck does this sentence mean?

[unreal girder]

For example recovery affects leech and recuperate

Regen only affects the specific mechanic of "mana regen"

[sudden crown]

ye is it 50% on skill tree or ascendancy ?

[analog prism]

aint no way its ascendancy, 4 points to get %50 more on 4 mediocre nodes ?

[sudden crown]

ye I think too

its for sure your skill tree passives

bcs then it would be pointless

[austere cedar]

what are small passive SKILLS tho xD on the tree are small passive NODES arent they?

[midnight bolt]

its 50% on ALL small passives

[plain oyster]

Things like increased fire damage doesn't affect.

[midnight bolt]

lmfao

[frigid hill]

not sure. I read it as "you don't double dip"

which we knew already, but they had to put it in the tooltip

[analog prism]

if there was another tag with the skill tree we would know it since datamine is already out

[midnight bolt]

i hope so

[lone temple]

it means the ignite is not affected by debuff on the enemy

[frigid hill]

personally damaging ailments look vry uninspiring to me

poison is ok on pathfinder i guess

[sudden crown]

small passives

not notables

not big

[covert rain]

How does passive tree respeccing work? Can you just remove some nodes in the middle?

[midnight bolt]

ya and its super strong

[midnight bolt]

no

[frigid hill]

nope, gotta cut at the ends

[royal trench]

wait eldritch battery just converts all energy shield to mana
isnt this crazy good

[frigid hill]

cant scale it with %es nodes

[royal trench]

oh

[frigid hill]

it's probably good though

[daring roost]

gonna try and do my very own first build of Sorceress Stormweaver

[warped jackal]

Chonk F tier damn

[vivid meadow]

Lel

Hidden S Tier trust

[royal trench]

LOL i was saying how shit ancestral bond is before
but fking totem gets TWO nodes that give +1 totem right near eachother

[warped jackal]

Yea i still go for chonk idc

[royal trench]

ok nevermind why the fuck am i trying to work out a caster tree when this is right here

[sharp glade]

why is all the minion dmg so far from witch start

[vivid meadow]

Where do you see the tree?

[frigid hill]

bloodmagetraveling.jpeg

[frigid hill]

https://poe2db.tw/us/passive-skill-tree/

it doesnt always load

eventually worked for me on chrome

[sharp glade]

tree looks like a mess

so much travelling

[frigid hill]

yea no kidding

[silent prawn]

thats what EA is for

[hollow turret]

What?

[sharp glade]

those are mostly minion tankiness nodes

south side has the big dmgg % nodes

[warped jackal]

I will go with chonk with MoM, CI, Ghost Reaver, Whispers of Doom and socket Blasphemy with Despair and Decaying Hex

[snow sierra]

Well witch has some right at the start

[hollow turret]

ok ... tell me which class are much more near them?

[sharp glade]

110% increased minion dmg....

[silent prawn]

balista or totems, no?

[sharp glade]

no minions

north side has a lot of minion % life and resist tho

[snow sierra]

if you roll witch is has a good amount of dmg too

[random summit]

is attack based bloodmage looking viable?

[snow sierra]

most likely

[frigid hill]

working on it right now, the traveling is rough

[hollow turret]

those are 6 x 10% minion damage ....

[sharp glade]

and 25% notables....

[balmy fable]

Do we know if exploit the elements works for bleed? IIRC it's an ailment, and the node doesnt specify elemental ailments

[sharp glade]

two of them...

[hollow turret]

hmm filter didn't highlight them weird

[frigid hill]

half of it specified elemental ailments, no?

[sharp glade]

minion tree looking messy, depending on if you can get % minion dmg on gear

[hollow turret]

Oh well, is still EA, you still can complain about it till it change before official release

[sharp glade]

if you can get a lot of % minion dmg you might not need to path down

i guess we need to see affixes now

[hollow turret]

probably there's duelist minion archetype later on who knows

[snow sierra]

doubt as witch you have plenty minion dmg near

And some atk speed etc

[sharp glade]

ok

[hollow turret]

still ... minion damage ... near duelist?

[balmy fable]

Right nodes say ailments, not elemental

[sharp glade]

but 110% increased assuming no convoking wand is a lot to pass up you are gonna have to path down

[hollow turret]

templar, make sense

[silent prawn]

PoE1 also has spread out nodes,...
why are you confused about the tree now?
nothing is set in stone

[warped jackal]

Where do you get this layout from?

[hollow turret]

but .... a "duelist"?

[snow sierra]

ill assume druid stuff maybe ?

[hollow turret]

https://poe2db.tw/us/passive-skill-tree/AAAABgEAAAAA

[snow sierra]

for later

[frigid hill]

u get the chance but not the damage

[sharp glade]

poe 1 has champion summoner

[balmy fable]

im probably getting hard jebaited by rainbow bleed blood mage

[keen dagger]

https://pastebin.com/raw/zfmgKZJh
Thoughts on trigger invoker?

[frigid hill]

so if u have 77% chance to bleed u go to 100

[dreamy tree]

anyone playing Mercenary?

[hollow turret]

oh probably .... wait, ain't druid more like templar/marauder?

[undone ingot]

lol theres druid wheels on the left side of the tree that are just generic damage rn

[hollow turret]

hmmm aurabot .... but PoE1 duelist there have minion node?

[opaque zodiac]

Is Max Shock still 50%?

[undone ingot]

thats definitely not imbalanced

[frigid hill]

imo think of damaging ailments as u would Impale, a nice bonus but difficult to make ur main damage
edit: except PF poison

[hollow turret]

whelp, time to write essay about it on reddit when launch

[sharp glade]

poe 1 tree is smaller, less travelling

[hollow turret]

so they change it

[royal trench]

what exactly does each attribute give in poe2?

[balmy fable]

Brother I know how damaging ailments work LMAO

[analog prism]

are crossbows 2 handed weapons ?

[balmy fable]

It isnt difficult to make your main damage, but rainbow bleed MIGHT cap out early

[sharp glade]

all u need to know is: stack strength as logn as you hit requirements

[balmy fable]

depends on whether it's as easy to scale as rainbow ignite was in 1

[snow sierra]

with the tree out im abit lost how to build tho^^

[hollow turret]

huh?

[frigid hill]

that's what im saying, u can't scale it as u would in poe1

[balmy fable]

there's enough bleed chance by witch, question is more do we have enough scaling

[balmy fable]

Why the hell would blood mage have a rainbow bleed node then

[silent prawn]

crossbows are crossbows. only one can be equipped

[balmy fable]

Doesnt make sense for it to be there if it isnt meant to be a main damage avenue

[frigid hill]

because jonathan hates damaging ailments or something

it's clear (to me) they don't want us using it for our main damage

[balmy fable]

Do we have a source on damaging ailments not being usable as a main damage source?

Again, if bleed wasnt possible to use as a main damage souce, i HIGHLY doubt blood mage would have rainbow bleed

[undone ingot]

so disappointing, but also means i give much less of a shit about getting giants blood

[frigid hill]

its right in front of u mate, look at the numbers haha

[balmy fable]

that's just a dead node otherwise

[hollow turret]

but they let us .... double ailment?

[frigid hill]

no its impale

[sharp glade]

so they lied about EB not being like this in EA, this seems OP with mom

[random summit]

can bleeding be caused by any phys damage? new player

[frigid hill]

impale wasnt dead in poe1, it just wasnt ur main damage

[balmy fable]

i mean a lot of power got shifted to items, no?

[silent prawn]

we can't test numbers yet ...

[frigid hill]

that's fair

[undone ingot]

ignite is literally going to delete bosses idk what you mean

[balmy fable]

There's 0 reason to take rainbow bleed then, it isnt like impale where it cashes out lmao

[frigid hill]

but we can scale all other ways to deal damage on the tree decently

[snow sierra]

could still be disabled

[frigid hill]

yea i cut it

[balmy fable]

so we'll have to see

[royal trench]

this tree i just pobbed is 329 strength
5% inc strength, 16% attributes

with double attribute effect from gemling, hefty unit (stun immune), +2 totems

[balmy fable]

good news is if u start blood mage bleed and it falls off a cliff, u just respec into a life stack

[silent prawn]

whats Rainbow? just ailment stacking?

[frigid hill]

i mean bloodmage sunder hit-based build looks good

its just uninspired since we cant (seemingly) scale ailments very well

[royal trench]

MAN how bad is the zoom on this site

its either so close or so far u cant screenshot this shit

[balmy fable]

Well, we'll see

[undone ingot]

travel builds are always going to be something that happens later on

[balmy fable]

there seems to be enough scaling on tree to MAYBE have rainbow bleed work

[royal trench]

but yeah this looks pretty good

cant provide a picture with reasonable zoom because the zoom on this website is coded like shit

[frigid hill]

the problem is, ailments are based on ur base hit, so why scale magnitude when u can scale the base hit?

[undone ingot]

you know you can just copy and paste the url

[royal trench]

truuue!

[balmy fable]

you scale both lmao

thats the same as poe1

[frigid hill]

my bad, should have said damaging hit not base hit

[balmy fable]

ah

well then

u scale that i guess idk

[royal trench]

https://poe2db.tw/us/passive-skill-tree/AAAABgkDdohCBaLPdI_W5N8tedke63_qCx49pgTp6W-MQGnS7EUWqjeiKL24aKKlCts2QGS27knrYVpC3peeGFZLWFMa_JnKh1VvhLZ51ZPwhZl1v3i5tyJDpPYK6w0QjkUmx2jlvtn602_TU7DYpShS1ayQ3tchLeMF-9duD84K04QJu26QyWn0ImLgXHNew_uVZuP0kUfzDXZpyn5daGVgRu_hMxPE2FOL6YFqoFSmcq4Dlf6I9orR1-Fn1NVjiuzMs6hChZGKfJ-S7ER8X52Hb70iNg__BxXM-owPkVYpj8hLjQm2DDvEYbsV4a7B-dSRAAA=

theres wasted nodes on the tree too because idk if im going 1h or 2h
probably 2h cause if totems dont scale off your weapon i can just dual wield 2 fuck off big 2hander weapons with really high strength

[balmy fable]

look point is there's enough bleed magnitude and ailment stuff on tree

to scale the damaging hit up and have large bleeds

[frigid hill]

power to u mate

i just dont see it

[balmy fable]

main issue I have is that a lot of the ailment stuff is south side of the tree

like u would want stuff like fast acting toxins

[royal trench]

but this has got to be the most powerful part of the tree
remember that fking ancestral bond wants to charge you THREE HUNDRED SPIRIT for these 2 nodes

[balmy fable]

also wonder whether armor will impact bleed

[frigid hill]

ya those make ancestral bond look pretty bad ngl

[undone ingot]

ailments shmailments. we doing hit damage htis patch

[balmy fable]

i guess so if its based off the damaging hit now

in which case, grab some armor shred

[frigid hill]

yea

[balmy fable]

since shred can make armor negative now iirc

you have a free % more multi

[frigid hill]

only warbringer afaik

[royal trench]

i wonder if i should start +1 gems or if i should start double attribute effect

[frigid hill]

its his ascendancy (and its bad imo)

[unreal girder]

Theres only 1 phys taken as node on the tree,kinda worried about WH defenses now

[edgy hollow]

anyone doing a block character with merit of service pelage

[undone ingot]

its not exactly free, it costs 2 asc points, and its capped at the negative value of the mob's original armour value ]

[undone ingot]

its not bad

[balmy fable]

oh right forgot it was ascendancy

[frigid hill]

im not having this discussion again lol

[balmy fable]

It potentially isn't bad if its uncapped, but you would have to invest a lot into break

which might not be worth the trade off

[frigid hill]

its capped

[balmy fable]

What's it capped at

do we know

[undone ingot]

i just explained the cap

[balmy fable]

the fuck does that mean lmao

[stark vector]

Has anyone been looking at chonk? A lot of streamers other than wudi are shitting on it for the 'eat a flame' playstyle and there being like no mana leech chance (just increased mana leech) anywhere on passive tree

[frigid hill]

if they have 1000 armour they cap at -1000

[balmy fable]

it can only be -N where N is their base armor?

[frigid hill]

yea

[balmy fable]

yeah okay

[glass mesa]

Hello there is there any content created regarding to duo ? All I see is solo build and I hope poe2 will make grp expérience enjoyable not like the first

[balmy fable]

that's like

mediocre

[frigid hill]

ya its bad

[balmy fable]

not awful but not amazing either

Eh idt it's bad bad, just not amazing

[frigid hill]

u need 4 points total to make it to that node

[undone ingot]

it means if they had 30% pdr before you hit them then they have 30% more phys dmg taken once you cap the neg value

[balmy fable]

how good it is will depend directly on how much armor the boss has

which is going to be VERY inconsistent

but idt id say it's outright bad

just seems eh

[undone ingot]

why are you xing me, that is exactly what it means

[frigid hill]

it's not that simple mate

the worse ur build is, the better the node is, sure

[balmy fable]

do we know how that works when u get into the negatives

[frigid hill]

anyway im not having this discussion again u cant bait me

[balmy fable]

i assume just invert it

[unreal girder]

Ok but armour is based on hit dmg right?

So how does that scale negatively?

Bigger hit even bigger hit?

[balmy fable]

tbf that DOES mean that on harder bosses itll be more effective

but still probably not enough so to be worth the investment

[warped jackal]

Can you guys give a quick look at this; 57/122. Any recommendations to make it better or is this utterly shit

[frigid hill]

yes but they'd have to have so much armour it's absurd, or you'd have to be doing so little damage it's not worth it

[balmy fable]

ya thing is we dont know how much armor endgame bosses will have

[frigid hill]

and even then, just breaking their armour would be such a massive increase in damage, it'd be overkill

[balmy fable]

which is kinda what it depends on to be good

but yeah, chances are youre correct

i would wager on it being mediocre at best

[frigid hill]

yea i cant be 100% confident ofc

[unreal girder]

We still dont know for sure whether Iron reflexes scales with inc % eva right?

[frigid hill]

u can travel at the top left instead of middle left

should save some points

[balmy fable]

u said ailment is based on the base hit now right

so increased spell damage should scale it?

[undone ingot]

yup

[frigid hill]

damaging hit

[unreal girder]

Yes

[balmy fable]

okay that's a bit nutty

[frigid hill]

so yea

[balmy fable]

wym there's no ailment scaling on tree LMAO

that makes practically everything ailment scaling

[unreal girder]

Except pen

[balmy fable]

thing is youll be doing enough base hit damage too

[frigid hill]

once again, it's not ur main damage

[balmy fable]

to clear super easily

[balmy fable]

it is if you craft your gear around it and build your tree for it lmao

[frigid hill]

it's just super uninteresting to me, same as impale

[balmy fable]

it sure seems like u can quite easily make it ur main damage source

obviously we dont know what spells we have to work with

but i dont see why u couldnt

[frigid hill]

we do though?

[balmy fable]

only downside is there doesnt seem to be a good way to aggravate bleeding with spells

[frigid hill]

https://poe2db.tw/us/

[balmy fable]

o

snap

didnt know the info was out

datamined i guess

[frigid hill]

based chuan

[stuck ember]

do we know how cost multipliers on supports interacts with spirit reservation

[balmy fable]

huh exsanguinate made it over

[stuck ember]

if i have cast on ignite which is a 60s reserve, support it with firestorm, and then add a 120% cost multiplier support for firestorm

[frigid hill]

anyway if u can show me a build where ignite/bleed is >90% of ur damage and it's not shit ill concede im wrong

i would be very happy to see it

[balmy fable]

i mean i have no idea if it will be LMAO

[stuck ember]

does cast on ignite cost 60 oe 72

[balmy fable]

tbf im only just looking at the tree

i might shift focus from interesting ascendancies

[undone ingot]

does it have to be a good build?

[balmy fable]

to looking at the skills

u have to admit

[frigid hill]

"and it's not shit" yea

[balmy fable]

bleed comet would be great

humor wise at least lmao

[frigid hill]

that would be sweet yea

[undone ingot]

i want a comet triggered build

i just feel like thats what the world needs

[balmy fable]

i might unironically try that

and if it doesnt work

[lapis plume]

Are there any self-harm spells that are persistent or can be easily triggered? I'm working on the best way to maintain permanent demon form with MoM and self damage with recoup seems promising since regen is gonna be hard

[balmy fable]

pivot into a non bleed version

[rough kelp]

Do phys,skill,proj dmg all stack on top of each other or add each other

[sleek depot]

add to eachother

as long as they're all %inc damage

[unreal girder]

Anything that says "increased" is added together

[stuck ember]

a proj skill dealing physical damage would have all those stack additively together

[rough kelp]

Ig most of the tree gives inc so

[delicate fern]

increased = added together
more = multiplies

[stuck ember]

20% inc phys, 50% inc damage, 30% increased proj damage = 100% increased damage for phys damage from proj skills

[balmy fable]

oh boy lacerate support is only 30% bleed not 60%

so yeah capping bleed gonna take investment

[sleek depot]

There's no way this is actually 100% right??

[balmy fable]

it isnt 100% ignite chance, its 100% more ignite chance

[frigid hill]

ailments are based on thresholds now

so it is 100% but not in the way u think

[delicate fern]

it doubles your ignite chance pretty much

[balmy fable]

how does flat chance interact with that, you still need to pass an application check right

[sleek depot]

I see, kind of disappointed now but it makes sense haha

[fast slate]

new gems out

[frigid hill]

bleed is still flat

for whatever reason

[delicate fern]

its a weird new system and depends on monster ailment threshold

[sleek depot]

Is there base ignite chance on fireball though?

[rough kelp]

I didnt find any node that gives more% for phys build should I try any of the ele proc gives more% node?
Am not going bleed

[stuck ember]

if a boss has an ailment threshold of 1000, then a hit of 1000 has a base chance to ignite of 25%. a hit of 3000 = 75% chance. 1000 hit on 1000 threshold with 100% increased ignite chance = 50% chance

things of that nature

[delicate fern]

more % are scarcer cause they multiply each other

[sleek depot]

Ew, alright haha ty

[balmy fable]

shame living bomb looks like something u cant really m ake a build around due to the seed limit

[frigid hill]

u can hover on poedb to get tooltips

[pastel forge]

so i know we can't dual wield sceptres, but what about wand + sceptre?

[sharp glade]

whaaaat

where does it says its flat

oh u meant flat chance not flat dmg LUL

[frigid hill]

yea

[stuck ember]

the hover tooltips we're getting in poe2 like that one are seriously hugely goated

it will help explain so much

[frigid hill]

#2┃general message

[sleek depot]

The infernalist ascendancy ignite magnitude nodes actually make sense to take now then

[balmy fable]

sad thing is idk how you get aggravation on spells

or if u can really

[fast slate]

finally a skill for chonk

[balmy fable]

hmm there's also a 75% more bleed magnitude but 25% less hit damage support