2┃build-planning

[daring jay]

1 hp or 0hp? xD

[native widget]

0.2hp

[daring jay]

can it actually have less than 1 life?

:o

[native widget]

[bold raft]

Sceptres are mainly for characters that want more spirit, so they can use more persistent , minion, or trigger gems

[gaunt violet]

sorc scepter may be a thing

[velvet blade]

How does the Stormweaver node "All damage from hits contributes to shock chance" work? Does this basically mean all damage hits can shock or is it different?

[native widget]

yes

all damage means all damage lol

[velvet blade]

Well yes, but I'm curious about the wording "contributes to shock chance" vs "can shock"

It seems like "contributing to a chance" might be different than just now having the ability to shock

[gaunt violet]

there is no chance to shock, its a bar that charges

[daring jay]

Cast on crit with a spell that shocks and a spell that chills will be insane for flicker

[gaunt violet]

how much spirit for that

[native widget]

your mana bar just went poof

[daring jay]

hmm maybe

maybe its just an endgame thing

Cast on (ailment) is just worse than cast on crit for bosses right?

[native widget]

humm

maybe

[velvet blade]

Depends on how consistently and often you can crit vs apply an ailment

[elder osprey]

is the „cast on ailment“ just from applying the ailment or when the target HAS an ailment?

[daring jay]

im talking about stuff like cast on freeze or cast on shock

stuff like that

[elder osprey]

ah ok

[velvet blade]

There's a guage that buids up when you apply the ailment to monsters and when the gauge is full the spells are cast

[hidden tartan]

Anyone knows if Mana Tempest can be supported with gems?

[native widget]

[sure

[hidden tartan]

Are you sure, coz seems like a perfect spell to put Arcane surge on

[native widget]

no?

it takes 100 seconds for it to drain 100% of your mana

[hidden tartan]

not if you use lightning spells?

[native widget]

if you use lightning spells how will it be supported by arcane surge

you already put it on mana tempest

[hidden tartan]

30% of Mana Spent on Lightning Spells while in the storm is added to this Skill's Mana Cost per Second

so if you do few spells you can burn it out really quick?

[native widget]

hum

idk

the wording is real confusing

[misty shell]

This is incorrect. Your 'chance to shock' is 25% x DMG of hit/monster ailment threshold

Ignite is the same

[hidden tartan]

I mean seems straight forward to me if spell costs like 100, and you use it once should burn 30 mana per second just from that spell

and stacking?

[native widget]

it feels like your mana would be gone in like 2 casts lmfao

idk

IF you combine it with archmage

[hidden tartan]

yea, I don't think it was intedend to be used with lightning spell directly

But if you wana use it to pop arcane surge could be good, coz arcane surge also gives mana regen after it burns you down to 0 ^^

But then again there is : causes Beams from Lightning Spells that Cost Mana to also Chain to +2 targets when Chaining so who knows

[native widget]

"Buff causes Beams from Lightning Spells that Cost Mana to also Chain to +2 targets when Chaining, but not Chain further from those targets"

what the hell is that even supposed to mean

im so confused

[hidden tartan]

Yea, it's definitelly a bit weird on wording

@native widget What do you think about Meta gems are special types of skill gems that can be supported by both support gems and other skill gems.

Do support gems only affect trigger gem itself, or also spell you want to trigger with a trigger gem?

[native widget]

i dont think there are skills that can support BOTH meta gem and skill gem

[hidden tartan]

Well that's what it says on poe2db, example being Cast on Shock, and then you put like Arc in it for example, and in other slots support gems, when cast on shock triggers socketed spells do those supports work on arc is basically my question

[native widget]

yes

those support gems in theory support both the meta gem and the sloted skill gem

but there isnt support gems that CAN support both

MAYBE the decrease cost?

not sure

[hidden tartan]

Ye ye, I know I just ment if Spells that can get triggered from those Meta gems which "can be supported by either support or skills gems"

It would make sense that they do get the support bonuses, but would feel werid coz you aren't directly socketing in to them

[shrewd socket]

any guesses how much max hp a bloodmage will be able to get?

[native widget]

my guess is less than 10k

huh

[true gulch]

will archmage work well with bloodmage? with a cast on freeze Comet guaranteed crit setup, and with the %crit dmg node from bloodmage, it would triple the dmg at around 4k hp?

[midnight bolt]

It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities 🧙‍♂️

[modern tangle]

Yer a stormweaver, Harry!

[ancient geyser]

potentially, but unless bloodmage has some very good nodes i doubt it, the ones we've seen are mediocre and stormweaver seems the go to for archmage (possibly chronomancer too)

jonathan also said in the latest ziz interview that if you wanna reach 100% crit it's possible but you will have to sacrifice a lot, meaning it won't be efficient to do so

[native widget]

regardless bloodmage will still be very very strong with biting frost builds

which is why its hard for me to decide between stormweaver and bloodmage for my build

ill prob be able to make a decision after datamined ascendancy nodes comes out

[ancient geyser]

mana stacking and hp stacking for an archmage build is more of a lategame thing though, and we still don't know if the blood orbs you spawn can be obtained from bosses without adds, which would make the ascendancy relatively weak, blood mage will definitely have its use but better to wait for ascendancy reveals

i was advocating for bloodmage archmage on the theorycraft but certain potential ascendancy leaks for stormweaver make it the go to for mana stacking caster

[native widget]

Wait what?

Link?

[ancient geyser]

https://youtu.be/dUXz7NkfkqA?feature=shared

5:18

keep in mind it is not confirmed

it's not a leak like the ranger one

i also am not convinced this traditional form of mana stacking is that good early compared to the lifetap setup but we will see, it's definitely the go to for endgame

[native widget]

yeah holy shit wow

if these are real def, CI MoM EB all the way

ill prob take the later 2, and the 2 shock nodes

oh wait

EB is disabled in EA right

i forgot

😔

[ancient geyser]

yeh no EB but it doesn't matter

MoM CI mana stacker looks solid

as a lategame choice

id just rather not rely on ES and mana as early game defensive layer because if you somehow can't cast it's doomed

lifetap relieves a lot of stress from the build and allows you to keep casting through ignite bleed etc if it somehow gets you there

[modern tangle]

Doesn't EB have unknown last minute rework rather than disabled?

[native widget]

nah they said disabled until reworked

[ancient geyser]

no idea, people are saying it's disabled because they are reworking it

[modern tangle]

ok cheers both

[lofty grotto]

I wonder how endgame for PoE2 buildwise will look like
A lot of skills have built in combos, some even 2 layer combos.
However when your action speed/attack speed gets insanely fast, there's no way you'll able to input combos as that fast.
We may be back to just focusing on one goated move spam and that's all
🤔

[native widget]

nah

one skill spam will never be as strong as in poe1 anymore

[ancient geyser]

values are gonna be lower than poe1 but even then there will be 1 button setups, not because comboing isnt functional but because you can tailor your build for it

[lofty grotto]

you can setup meta skills though

[ancient geyser]

yeah to a limit and by reserving spirit

a limited resource that is also gonna make you choose between cast on X or curses or whatever else you could be running there

[lofty grotto]

arent spirit stuff just auras/pasives (+ minions)

[ancient geyser]

cast on crit/ailment will also reserve 100 spirit

plus multipliers

archmage also reserves 100 spirit

spirit is just gonna be a highly demanded resource overall

[modern tangle]

-50 dkp spirit!

[ancient geyser]

and afaik spirit after completing the story is gonna be 180

we don't know if we can go higher than that without running a sceptre

[lofty grotto]

gib me 190 and I'm fine

[modern tangle]

there are small amounts on non-sceptres. We've seen amulet implicit.

[lofty grotto]

190 allows on one meta/cast on X and 3 auras/pasives

since pretty much all pasive auras cost 30

[ancient geyser]

that's without multipliers

if you wanna juice your cast on crit for example

it might end up taking 150 spirit

[lofty grotto]

by juicing up we mean more slots right?

[ancient geyser]

more supports ye

[lofty grotto]

tough cookie, sigh

[ancient geyser]

should be doable lategame but i think they don't want to make it too easy early

[lofty grotto]

also I may be crazy, but it does seem that spirit gem cutting is locked behind classes (for passives at least), while others must be just found in the wild

[ancient geyser]

it's not

you can choose from any class

they're just separated by tabs

but you can be a warrior lvl 1 find uncut gem and unlock fireball lvl 1

same with any other aura or support

you just need to meet the tier requirement

[lofty grotto]

realy? 🤔 just let me find screenshot

[pastel forge]

Does that actually affect reservation cost tho? Wouldn't only supps like clarity affect reservation costs?

You should just be affecting the spell costs themselves

[ancient geyser]

not 100% sure but if say multiple projectiles is 1.10 mod and cast on crit is 100, that should put reservation cost on 110

but don't quote me on it

[pastel forge]

Multi proj also has a specific tag that meta gems don't have generally

Would be really bad if that affected the spirit costs tbh lol

[ancient geyser]

you might be right and it's only affecting mana

but we haven't seen spirit interactions yet iirc

besides the minion management stuff at least

[lofty grotto]

oh nevermind, spirit gem cutting has separate tab and are sorted my classes

[native widget]

its just how they are sorted

not that theres a limit or anything

[ancient geyser]

yeah they're gonna be extremely flexible with gem selection unlike poe1 which is weird

might confuse a lot of people but ig if you're clueless and pick the ones suited for your class can't really go wrong

[lofty grotto]

yeah

[maiden karma]

EAT THING

[lofty grotto]

!

[maiden karma]

I was thinking more about the jade club

And came to the conclusion that you can do a mace monk with it

[lofty grotto]

i don't think it will have use

[ancient geyser]

this seems like a good defensive for evasion ranged playstyle

[maiden karma]

45% MORE EVASION FOR ONLY 30 SPIRIT WON'T HAVE USE?

[ancient geyser]

in some of the gameplay we saw people getting circled by mobs and dying

[lofty grotto]

The thing is that you loose all stacks if you get hit in melee

[ancient geyser]

so aoe knockback seems good

well yes this is meant to be used as ranged

but im sure some melee might be able to use it if you can have very high evasion values

[maiden karma]

I didn't want to do an evade starter but now this alone is making me reconsider

[olive tide]

will acrobatics affect this wind dancer skill? id assume it does right?

[maiden karma]

Don't see why it wouldn't

[olive tide]

but still 22.5% evasion is nice

[maiden karma]

More

Not just an increase

[ancient geyser]

45% more evasion is kinda crazy

considering how weak the defensive skills ive seen look so far

this is the best one, not even close

[olive tide]

yeah more is nice, but acrobatics says less right? was thinking about it if u have that keystone

[maiden karma]

I don't see the point of acrobatics

[olive tide]

hits are spells now too

[maiden karma]

It just makes you gamble on aoe hits, which you shouldn't stand inside of regardless

[midnight bolt]

its for people with 400ms reaction time

[olive tide]

im wondering if by hits it means like boss slams that you wouldnt be able to block as well..

[midnight bolt]

yep

[olive tide]

not sure if we have seen evasions description yet, well anything defintive

[maiden karma]

Oh man

PF with acrobatics and a shield

[olive tide]

and the keystone that turns rolls into 30% less damage

or is it reduced

oh its less

[maiden karma]

Think it was less but that's not needed here

The point is avoiding melee at all cost

[ancient geyser]

this seems so bad if you ask me

[olive tide]

i think its bad for melee

[maiden karma]

Good thing nobody asked you

It's good for giga tanks

[ancient geyser]

but what's the point of rolling for less dmg

don't you wanna roll to avoid dmg

even if gigatank

or are you just gonna facetank everything while timing your roll

[maiden karma]

The evade window is tiny

[olive tide]

in aoe's

[maiden karma]

This keystone implies you get damage reduction for the entire roll

[olive tide]

im shit at the game so i think 30% less damage guaranteed is better than me timing to avoid 100% for 0.1 sec

[ancient geyser]

ok that's fair

[olive tide]

also curious to know how this works with the chest that turns your roll into a tele

[ancient geyser]

i still prefer the 0.1 100% even if i was giga chonky because i don't expect to be able to facetank certain stuff

[ancient geyser]

tele isn't an iframe id imagine

just a faster roll

[maiden karma]

Now how do I do poison with a shield

[ancient geyser]

you can still get hit in it

[olive tide]

concoctions

lame

[ancient geyser]

weapon swap?

[maiden karma]

Is the poison conc even gonna be worth it

[olive tide]

doubt it

can you make seismic cry poison

[maiden karma]

Cause they all imply to just apply the ailment straight up, in which case shock would basically be best in slot 90% of the time

[spring mesa]

Yo, what happen if i put 2 support gem together both consume Freeze ?

[olive tide]

you know if aggravate is a hard mod to get for bleeds ill end up playing poison pf

i think only one of them consumes a freeze.. which one not sure. my first theory craft was hotg with frostfire and the support to guarantee crit while consuming a freeze

[native widget]

Wait what?

What chest

Send link

[olive tide]

just figured only one freeze is eaten at a time

[maiden karma]

It should be on DB

[native widget]

Ahh

[spring mesa]

how did you figured out that?

[native widget]

Meh

Looks really shit tho

[olive tide]

figured there is a stack when it comes to those sort of things.. doesnt make sense to me that 1 skill can have 2 modifiers to consume 1 freeze

could very well work that way but i wrote it off as not working that way for me to league start into it

[spring mesa]

yep make sense

[native widget]

Soo i assume consume freeze would instantly remove freeze on them right? But if the skill you have biting frost on also inflicts freeze, how would it work? Does it remove freeze before hitting or after?

I have so many questions

[olive tide]

well the thing is youd have to apply freeze at the same time

[maiden karma]

Ah fuck, didn't see that wind dance requires a martial weapon

[olive tide]

so consume freeze, freeze and consume freeze again

[ancient geyser]

it's removed before hitting, then you would build freeze on hit again

[native widget]

That sounds like a possible freeze loop

[olive tide]

lol yeah i saw that.. but could weapon swap away from it right?

[ancient geyser]

or well before hitting isn't the right explanation here

[ancient geyser]

it should be doable

hexblast works like that in poe-

1

hexblast with curse on hit applies the curse first then consumes it

[native widget]

Infinite comet from the sky is funny

[spring mesa]

I was wondering can i use spell echo to freeze twice and consume freeze inbetween

[olive tide]

freeze loop on bosses doesnt seem like itll be easy to achieve.. they have a much higher freeze threshold

doubt freezes overlap

[ancient geyser]

as long as you are freezing after consumption yes

and i assume consumption of the freeze takes place on the initial dmg calc

then you build ailment after

otherwise it wouldn't make sense

[olive tide]

the real question we are all asking ourselves is if barrage works with rain of arrows

[native widget]

🤨

[ancient geyser]

from a coding standpoint that freeze interaction should look like this:

• spell hits
• check for ailments on target
• target is frozen, consume freeze and apply your guaranteed crit
• roll dmg
• build ailment based on dmg dealt

[maiden karma]

The real question I'm asking myself is whether we'll get a skill similar to mamba strike

[olive tide]

if barrage affects rain of arrows ull melt every boss

so i doubt it does, but we will see

mamba strike would be sick, can you use it with 2h?

[maiden karma]

You can use regular viper with a 2h sword

[woven sinew]

The real question I’m asking myself is will my beloved divine ire be in PoE2 and will it be good self cast?

[maiden karma]

Never tried that with mamba since hitting with bost weapons at once is stronger

[olive tide]

but poison works differently in poe 2 right? you want a big phys/chaos hit

never even seen idivine ire before lmao

[ancient geyser]

most likely, i assume all spells from poe1 (that have a mtx effect) will come sooner or later since all mtx are planned to be transferred over, how will it work and when will it come out though tough to say

[silent prawn]

No holy spells yet. Likely coming with templar

[olive tide]

im wondering if using leap slam on a weapon swap will be worht it to just get around.. planning on using it

[ancient geyser]

if it's fast to weapon swap and you have good attack speed most likely

i thought of doing it with shield charge as well

[olive tide]

i just always think about how bad it feels in act 2 of poe1 when you dont have a skill to get over the river

[spring mesa]

builds using crossbow will heavily rely on weapon dmg right? should i go spell build for starter hmmmm...

[olive tide]

makes me want to scream

[ancient geyser]

me when flame dash vs no flame dash

weapon swap leap slam shield charge tech

[olive tide]

if u dont have flame dash in the spider lair, i think act 8, you are so f'd.. its basically mandatory

[maiden karma]

Spells will rely equally as much on weapons now

[spring mesa]

oh, really?

[silent prawn]

Start crafting early and try to get a crossbow with phys DMG

[modern tangle]

What was the source of the Wind Dancer hover? Is there any chance that they showed the Gale Force part of the tooltip too...

[lofty grotto]

Nope. Gale force is knockback i think

Source is ||fextra deleted vid||

[maiden karma]

It literally says in the tooltip damage and knock back

[silent prawn]

I wouldn't say rely on. As you can cast spells independently from weapons.
If you talk about +dmg% on weapons that was always the case.

[maiden karma]

Jonathan said they're equalising attacks and spells in terms of weapons

[modern tangle]

Let's say your normal mitigation is like this: 80% passive chance to avoid hits from evasion, 100% if you dodge roll at right time (first half of dodge duration), oneshot by any must-dodge boss aoe.
With the 30% less dmg from roll: still 80% passive chance against everything you were able to 100% roll before, even during the roll. But now dodge roll can be used to take 1 hit from "must-dodge" boss aoe. Also the 30% may work for the entire duration of the roll.
In both scenarios, if you dodge fully out of the way before hit comes you avoided anyway. Sounds worth if it works out this way, no?

[olive tide]

do we know if dodge rolling slows you down?

[modern tangle]

We know that dodge rolling a distance takes the same time as running the distance. Movement speed makes dodge rolling faster. (Or distance longer?) But during dodge roll, the first half moves faster than you run and second half moves slower.

[olive tide]

so basically if ur not attacking or casting spells u should just be dodge rolling everywhere

[ancient geyser]

it sounds better in paper but my question is, would you still be able to facetank those big aoes with that 30 less mod? because the way i see it you are just wasting a skill point for a git gud issue that would also require you to roll regardless, it's not like your roll is gone and you take less dmg while standing still or something similar to enable proper facetank + blasting

[olive tide]

in the offchance u accidentally dodge a projectile from off screen

[modern tangle]

That's not how it usually works out in action games. This will prevent you from starting a dodge roll at right time, because you're recovering from previous roll. One well timed roll is more important than spamming it randomly.

[ancient geyser]

there's recovery frames after rolling

you can't perma iframe

and the window is tight, you will get blasted if you brainlessly panic roll

[olive tide]

well what i was saying is if you're just running somewhere that mobs could be attacking you.. youre better of dodge rolling to potentially dodge something you dont see coming... idk

[modern tangle]

That'll be subject to testing, and EHP stacking.

[olive tide]

as opposed to running where you have no chance of that happening

[ancient geyser]

but i definitely see where you're coming from, sort of enlightened me a bit about the usage, especially when learning boss mechanics it will be quite forgiving to have on a char with lots of EHP

[ancient geyser]

i don't think this will happen in poe2

everything's quite telegraphed

you can clearly see what's coming your way

in poe1 it's a different story

[olive tide]

i was more or less meaning like running from pack to pack to avoid takign a stray proj.. not that itll kill you but by spamming dodge roll on the way there u have a chance to avoid something you wouldnt otherwise have

thinking too much about it probably

[ancient geyser]

i think that will come to you by trial and error in a few days when we're ingame

and you'll realize whether it makes sense or not

but as someone who's played games with iframes where you get punished if you don't iframe correctly, my assumption is that it's always better to not iframe things preemptively because you need to have your iframe ready for the things you actually need to dodge, so if you're kiting and rolling some projectiles you don't know if next pack is gonna throw a charger at your throat that you wish you had been able to roll

[olive tide]

i wouldnt be doing it preemptively.

its like if rolling doesnt slow you down, and you have to be running somewhere where you could be getting attacked.. doesnt it make sense to spam roll on the way there because if you're just running you have 0% chance to dodge something. as opposed to a 100% dodge every so often

[modern tangle]

Spamming roll is like constantly putting your iframe on cooldown with ~50% uptime. Better have it when you need it.

[olive tide]

i do understand the case you're making tho.. like if i get somewhere and iframe cd is on i have no chance of dodging it

[ancient geyser]

i just feel as if you expect the game is gonna throw bs at you that you can't react to like poe1

[olive tide]

yes

thats exaclty what i think XD

[ancient geyser]

or that you can't even see bcs of screen clutter

but from what we've seen poe2 is quite clean

[modern tangle]

that design in poe1 was a result of player recovery being out of control

if they manage to keep player recovery in control (not filling our hp every second, or multiple times per second) then the gameplay can happen at a pace where we can react

[olive tide]

idk those clips of the werewolves being on ur ass makes me think ill be focused on them and not the skeleton shooting shit at me from across the pond

[ancient geyser]

i wouldn't be surprised if giga blaster low ehp builds in poe2 end up being very strong when piloted by a skilled player because of that

[ancient geyser]

you probably take way more dmg from a werewolf than a skelly arrow

[modern tangle]

yeah the skilled players will have active defenses and skimping on passive defenses could allow very high damage

really want to see if Warbringer's jade scales from defense stats, or if it's good on glass cannon. People could have that + active block + dodge roll.

[ancient geyser]

isn't it a full iframe?

[modern tangle]

No, sounded like you get jade stacks over time and you can tap jade on/off at any time. The amount of damage it can absorb somehow depends on your jade stacks. It's a resource.

[ancient geyser]

okay yeah that makes way more sense

[modern tangle]

I guess if jade stacks gave iframe duration then it'd work like that.

[olive tide]

so jade scale thorns build is what youre after

can thorns apply ailments, or is it not a hit

[ancient geyser]

zdps boss killer

[olive tide]

any idea why this subset of chats for poe2 "help" is below the poe1 help channels?
makes me wonder if half the people who get into this discord server even realize theres more poe2 stuff below

[modern tangle]

Their channels & roles settings worked a bit weirdly too with which channels you get. Still, anyone who collapses and mutes the poe1 categories will know.

[light fractal]

we don't know, it's a new fifth damage source

not even sure what mitigates it yet

or if mobs do thorns

[modern tangle]

That reminds me, no more entire maps with reflect on them. 😁

[olive tide]

well thats not helpful

jk 😄

[olive tide]

im not even able to collpase the poe 1 channels.. it just closes like the sub channels

[modern tangle]

This is what mine looks like on PC. Maybe we mean the same thing.

thanks to muting the category it doesn't show those poe1 channels even if there are new messages

[olive tide]

ohh u can mute it

ty

[modern tangle]

yw

[cinder raven]

Does anyone have a vid of bonestorm spell?

[modern tangle]

isn't it spammed in most witch videos, at least early game ones?

[grand roost]

yep

[next lava]

Bonestorm is the one they channel then throw at enemies

[modern tangle]

ok the livestream class highlight used Unearth instead. Here you go: https://youtu.be/82CGiyshJ0c?t=21 (spoils a boss , sorry)

[cinder raven]

Thank you!

I wanted to figure out the radius of the explosion but it's a bit hard

[modern tangle]

didn't even realize it had a power charge thing

@cinder raven

• explosions without power charges: https://youtu.be/82CGiyshJ0c?t=284
• with charges: https://youtu.be/82CGiyshJ0c?t=356
  At least they're clearly bigger.

[cinder raven]

Ayy you're goated

Thank you

[lofty grotto]

Still not decided if I want to go pathfinder or deadeye.
In one hand posion looks comfy and you can't go wrong with it. But there's not a lot to choose from - since in early access, bow is only weapon which can focus on poison
In other hand deadeye is so much fleshed out

you have way more skills to pick from, way more spirit gems to work with

[silent prawn]

how does channel spells work with "cast on ..."

[lofty grotto]

prob wont work

[modern tangle]

there is Cast while Channelling

[compact atlas]

Question from non PoE player, is increased critical chance from support gems multiplicative or additive with increase crit chance from passive tree and gear?

[modern tangle]

oh you mean when slotted in. Yeah, maybe it just doesn't work

[modern tangle]

For weapon skills, if it's on the weapon then it's multiplicative because it modifies the weapon's crit chance locally before global modifiers are applied. In other cases, the global increases are additive with each other.

Local vs global modifiers are not 100% confirmed I suppose, but no reason to assume this has changed either.

Items giving base crit instead of increase like this one from poe1 are great:

[median gulch]

You cant have more then one support skill on a build right? Cant put lifetap on everything to do a manaless blood magic build ?

[silent prawn]

supports are unique, meaning only one instance possible

[modern tangle]

that's right, 1 lifetap support gem on your character

[median gulch]

thanks

[silent prawn]

but you may be able to use Blood Magic Keystone

[modern tangle]

@median gulch there's this

[compact atlas]

Let me throw an example out there. If I want to build crit Fireball and I put the support gem that gives increase crit chance that would make it Fireball skill gem crit* support gem increased crit chance. Now would increased crit chance from passive tree nodes multiply the result of Fireball+support gem or be added to the support gem and result in Fireball *(support gem increased crit chance + passive tree increased crit chance + gear increased crit chance) ?

[modern tangle]

Unfortunately I believe it would be the latter, where they're all additive. Stacking crit for spells is hard. Specific uniques that added flat crit were popular for that in poe1.
Note that for poe2, they made Fire spells have bad base crit and cold high.

[compact atlas]

Saw that I just used fireball as an example but I want to build frozen orb style build similar to D2.

[modern tangle]

We mostly know about gems atm and not about the various itemization. Most realistic spell crit plans probably use critical weakness from Eye of Winter atm. https://www.poe2wiki.net/wiki/Critical_Weakness

Ambush support doubles your crit multiplicatively. It's suitable for clear in some builds, not bossing.

[maiden karma]

Isn't it crazy how it has gotten to the point where people expect crit chance to be 100% in basically every game?

[modern tangle]

"all yellow numbers" in some games is a very feel-good goal. And for combo builds that depend on critting, anything less can feel iffy.

[compact atlas]

I don't expect 100% crit chance ~60% will be amazing but you will need something in the range of 500-600% increased crit chance to reach that based on most spells innate crit chance.

[modern tangle]

that why you need more flat, or a cheat mechanic, like mentioned above

or want anyway

[compact atlas]

Might just build an Ignite build.

[modern tangle]

dmg ailments derive base dmg from the hit that applies them, crit helps 😛

[raw flower]

Jonathan said in his more recent interview that they don't expect crit builds to try to reach for 100%. I think having a balanced approach is more reasonable in poe 2 indeed.

[modern tangle]

yes, design intent seemed to be that average dps will be higher without reaching 100%

[raw flower]

I'd even say that, despite everything poe 1 has taught us, it's better to not overspecialize in poe 2. It feels like the best dps is gonna be achieved by mixing a bit of crit, a bit of ailment, a bit of base damage, a bit of triggering other skills, etc...

[minor tree]

what sounds more fun?

deadeye with bow+quarterstaff with sniper's mark + barrage and power charge generation/expenditure (deadeye has bonuses to charge generation and consumption)

or invoker/stormweaver elemental invocation with ember fuselage (max energy = 10 embers instantly) and ailment spam to charge it up?
(invoker can use meditate + barrier invo for a similar effect too)

[raw flower]

Seeing how ailments work, i don't see any reason to not at least try to be able to apply them, since they'll scale on just increasing your damage like normal

[compact atlas]

Are spells affected by enemy Armour?

[modern tangle]

Armour works against physical hits, including spells. If you find physical non-ailment dot spell then it could avoid armour.

Bleed avoids armour because base is derived from pre-mitigation damage, then when they're actually bleeding armour shouldn't work.

[sterile sparrow]

I wonder why they went for such a large difference in spell crit chance based on element. Thematic or balance? Like do they think fire spells with high crit would be too good for big Ignite application?

[modern tangle]

Probably just trying to create meaningful differences. Fire spells might get balanced for highest avg non-crit dmg, and lightning spells have highest non-crit max but also lowest min, for high variance.

chaos and phys spells will probably be all over the place

[compact atlas]

I think it's to compensate for ailments. Cold gets freeze (non dmg) , fire gets ignite(dmg) and lightning get shock which is dmg too.

[spring mesa]

how will Additional projectile work with crossbow? will it consume double ammo?

[modern tangle]

I thought this was a cute little node. It could've been 7.5% more lightning damage... but it's not. 😉

[sterile sparrow]

It's not? Isn't lightning still tiny min huge max?

[modern tangle]

I mean that statistical result is same as 7.5% more... but they did it by only increasing max. Yes it is.

[covert rain]

So if your weapon has the lightning keyword but no + to shock chance. Will it shock when it crits?

[modern tangle]

Crits don't automatically apply ailments anymore. They just help because it's more hit dmg. For ignite and shock, the higher the hit dmg is relative to target's ailment threshold the higher the chance. As for all lightning damage being able to apply shock... I'd give that a high probability but stuff is hard to fully confirm.
Some of our tooltips are from older versions when things worked differently etc.

[covert rain]

Oh wow that's good to know and actually I like this approach more

[modern tangle]

All damaging ailments also derive their base damage from the pre-mitigation hit damage that applied them. Even bleed and poison, where application chance does not depend on the damage. So we won't really have builds fully focusing on ailment damage only.

non-ailment dot skills could still deal dot only

the passive tree doesn't seem to have any increased damage over time, so far

only increased attack/spell damage and increased effect of [ailment], to combine into higher ailment damage

[knotty spruce]

Soon i get homw and get to cook my chronomonk propperly

[covert rain]

So did I get this right, there are no + ailment dmg mods as far as we know?

[toxic ether]

The increased effect of [ailment] are the increased damage mods now

essentially the same as damage over time multiplier, but for one ailment

[modern tangle]

They're free to do "increased effect of elemental ailments" or something. I won't mind. 😁

[raw flower]

It's not equivalent to 7.5% more damage. It depends on the actual range you have. For example if you have 5-100, it's close to 15% more damage. If you have 50-200, it's close to 6% more damage. The wider the range is, the more you get out of it.

[modern tangle]

Do the math with those numbers and you'll find in both cases avg increase is 7.5%.

[dawn saddle]

do we know if cast on crit can proc itself ? and is it limited to 1 crit per skill or not ? because if I hit 20 enemies with spark and it's all crit, wouldn't that cause exponentially more spark casted ? or does it have a little cooldown maybe ?

[raw flower]

(5 + 100) / 2 = 52.5 || (5 + 115) / 2 = 60
That's 14% more damage.

[modern tangle]

yeah trying to type it out I find I'm wrong

Sorry!

[raw flower]

That's okay 🙂

Math is hard, poe is worst sometimes 😄

[modern tangle]

I can't find any more multiplier notables for fire or cold, so far.

[sterile sparrow]

Do we have confirmation that penetration is still for hits only?

[raw flower]

No, but that was the case in PoE 1, that's quite safe to assume

[sterile sparrow]

I think it's pretty likely, yeah. But since they changed how penetration works in other ways (going past 0), who knows...

So even though Ignite is based on hit dmg, penetration still doesn't help since it's pre mitigation hit damage. Correct?

[modern tangle]

yes, that should be correct

[shrewd socket]

does it increase the curse aoe when used in blasphemy?

[raw flower]

It should, but no one can guarantee it

[shrewd socket]

will it be possible to leech from dots?

weird questions i know xD but any guesses?

[dawn saddle]

pretty sure you won't be able to

[shrewd socket]

i think it might be possible

[modern tangle]

You have to be specific about the leech source. For example, Life Leech support is for physical attacks. It's unlikely to work for ailments applied by those attacks, so you'd need an attack that leaves behind a non-ailment phys dot. Then maybe. I can't find one atm.

Blood Mage can get "10% of Spell Damage Leeched as Life". Again, probably not ailments left by spells. But with Essence Drain? It could work.

[zealous swift]

i'm not sure if the dot part of skills like essence drain was ever considered spell damage anyway

[shrewd socket]

im not that deep into how leech worked in poe 1 but they removed " regenerate % of debuff damage as lfie" from essence drain. thats why i asume you will be able to leech from it with "spell damage leeched"

[zealous swift]

at least for the sake of scaling it would always include a line like "the damage over time part of this skill can be scaled with spell damage"

[modern tangle]

we'll struggle to scale it in poe2 if it's not.

[zealous swift]

yes, but the point is i would think the dot part wouldn't work with leech

i would assume leech is only for hits, until we have confirmation of the opposite

[modern tangle]

could be

[shrewd socket]

i mean they simplify alot in poe 2. as long a skill does damage i think you will be able to leech from it.. but yea i dont really have a clue, just a feeling

[zealous swift]

hmm maybe

perhaps it could work with spell dots following this logic yes

[modern tangle]

[lofty grotto]

They simplyfied stacking, but put way more combos in
Resulting in less auto optimisation and actual more player gameplay input.
Which I like

[shrewd socket]

yeh combat will feel alot better

[worthy dagger]

if you have 100% evasion does that mean you cant get hit at all by enemys???

because im just trying to make a 100% evasion build

[modern tangle]

evade caps at 95%. If you have more evasion rating than it takes to reach 95% evade, it'll help you against enemy's accuracy in the formula.

[lofty grotto]

PoE was scary to look at becouse at the endgame yoir single dps skill spew out 20 novas, 30 projectiles, 20 dots while shooting it like from machine gun.

[worthy dagger]

thanks

[lofty grotto]

There are unevadeable attacks which to dodge you need Acrobatics keystone, which cuts in half your evade rate

[worthy dagger]

I see by keystone. is that in the passive skill tree?

[zealous swift]

also evasion depends on the enemy accuracy so some monsters just might hit you anyway, also aoe stuff cannot be evaded, unless you take the keystone yeah

[alpine vigil]

there was a cap, I don't think they changed that

[alpine vigil]

do we know if monster accuracy ever caps in poe2?

[modern tangle]

this is from poe1

[knotty spruce]

cant wait to try goin ice chronomancer monk

[zealous swift]

no idea

[knotty spruce]

and fail horribly

[worthy dagger]

thanks just theory crafting

[alpine vigil]

given there is a hard coded cap at 95%

[worthy dagger]

you need so much evasion wtf

[alpine vigil]

yes it's super hard to reach the cap

[modern tangle]

It does seem nice. Though I'd say qstaff chronomancer 🙂

[alpine vigil]

monsters don't have 2000 accuracy usually tho

[worthy dagger]

true

[zealous swift]

getting 50k-100k evasion in poe1 isn't that hard on a dexterity character

[knotty spruce]

that does work better lol

im hoping to god that elemental dmg stacking would compensate for the low base attack dmg id get from beign a chronomance

[zealous swift]

and you would mostly evade everything, but i doubt we ever gonna get anything close to 100% evasion

[alpine vigil]

although that doesn't hit 95% evasion on lvl 83 monsters

[worthy dagger]

well im new so I dont know much about poe xD im just reading the skills and thinking up some builds

[zealous swift]

some hits will go through no matter what

[alpine vigil]

the 538 accuracy on the table is the base monster accuracy in endgame

this is probably the only relevant line

[zealous swift]

chronomance being the ascendancy or something else?

[knotty spruce]

the acendancy

favorite powerfantasy so im hard forcing it lol

[zealous swift]

your base attack damage doesn't come from class or ascendancy, it is only based on the weapon you use

[knotty spruce]

oh

[alpine vigil]

or the spell level

[knotty spruce]

so i have an even better chance of making it work than i thought!

[alpine vigil]

oh attack damage

[modern tangle]

my qstaff monk will probably be taking nodes in chrono starting area anyway. You can take monk nodes. (Though I still might go another ascendancy like chrono.)

Ascendancy mana reset and maybe cooldown reset are indirect damage for chrono. The nodes we haven't seen yet might offer some stats.

[knotty spruce]

yee im really liking the idea of stopping time hitting a nasty combo then untimestoppin em

ik its basically an aoe stun

but its just damn cool

[modern tangle]

Mace has some pretty nasty skills to use during time stop too. Not tempted? 😁

[fervent locust]

Yea that' sounds wicked

[knotty spruce]

ay i might be cooking a hammer of god chronomancer

[lofty grotto]

Literally slap on cooldowns class

[sterile latch]

we saw 3 actives, i expect to see ONLY stats from now 😂

[modern tangle]

Teasing nodes that give skills without showing skill tooltips is an atrocity.

[sterile latch]

true

[raw flower]

Afawk, no. Leech is for hits, most sources of leech are from physical attack damage or spell, dots are neither and are not hits. It's highly unlikely that in the future, poe 2 introduces a feature that makes it possible, hell, it could even be a unique stat present in the game now, but I doubt that you will be able to use that this week end anyway even if it does exist 😉

[lofty grotto]

A lot of skills got changed anyway. Don't take deep dive tooltips as granted

[modern tangle]

Everything pre-launch can be kind of treated as leaks and rumors. Even what developers have said isn't confirmed. They've changed their minds on multiple things quite quickly, and design intent is not always how the game works due to bugs. A different standard of reliability can gradually be expected in answers post-launch.

[median mist]

Does anyone know if enemy's dieing with a curse or a dot count as the dot expiring for skills that cause them to explode when they expire

[olive tide]

***Everything ***said in this channel shouldn't be taken as granted. We are all just spit balling cause we are bored out of our minds and excited to play the game. XD

[stuck perch]

I see a lot of people hyping up Blasphemy + double curse for the low low price of 60 spirit. Correct me if I'm wrong on part of this:

Quarterstaff weapon swap allocates Whispers of doom (you can apply additional curse). Attack with Hand of Chayula with 2 curses and a mark linked. 0 spirit.

The node doesn't say "monsters can have an additional curse" so swapping back to main weapon should leave both curses on.

[olive tide]

isnt whispers a keystone? you cant weapon swap off of it

[modern tangle]

Keystones can't be taken with weapon set points.

[stuck perch]

..

oh, i see.. yah, keystone. Okay, so have it allocated all the time. Hand of Chayula > Blasphemy?

[olive tide]

for bosses maybe.. but blasphemy is nice in aoe

[modern tangle]

It'll depend on build etc. You can certainly use Hand, go ahead.

[olive tide]

even tho i think we will see much higher spirit res for blasphemy curses

[stuck perch]

yeah the wording of hand of chayula makes it seem like maybe single target but it has the AoE tag, so I'm thinking it will work in an area and can be supported with inc AoE?

[olive tide]

the wording is weird on that skill. "Dash to an enemy and Strike them with an unarmed Attack" seems like it could be worded better.

like Dash to an enemy and Strike IT with an unarmed Attack maybe
or Dash to ENEMIES and Strike them with an unarmed Attack

[modern tangle]

I think I've seen someone cull 2 enemies with 1 Killing Palm. But the aoe around the target is going to be very small.

[olive tide]

i think itll only strike 1 dude.. but who knows

[stuck perch]

Is the base max spirit just from quest rewards/leveling 180? no gear or nodes (if there are any)

[olive tide]

if there is one question i wissh theyd answer, its that

[stuck perch]

I can't remember where I saw that (consuming too much info!) but it seemed to make sense at the time

[modern tangle]

I'm still not trusting 180 but 100-180 seems likely

[lofty grotto]

Base 100

[modern tangle]

source?

[stuck perch]

https://poe2db.tw/us/Spirit - has the 180 figure. 6 acts x30 spirit avail per act

I originally was avoiding all top of the tree classes, but Enfeeble+Temp Chains is a strong enough defensive layer to make up for their lack of base defense options.

[modern tangle]

If you can sacrifice off-hand, slapping on lowest attribute requirement shield for active block might be the cheapest defense. Everyone seems to need stun threshold anyway.

If you have attributes for better shield, even better.

[sterile sparrow]

Blasphemy is basically a meta gem, right? Are there any supports worth linking to the curses in it?

[stuck perch]

Yup. I just saw that you can't dual wield sceptres so that avoids the temptation and can just go shield for minions

[stuck perch]

maybe, but if there is any way to scale the effect, it will multiply the spirit cost.

[sterile sparrow]

Yeah true. Unless it's one of the few support gems which doesnt have a mana multiplier.

[alpine vigil]

heightened curse and encumbrance are amazing but heightened curse doubles the spirit cost to 120 so it's tough

encumbrance doesn't have a multiplier on poe2db, don't know if it's going to change

[shrewd socket]

does anyone know if dark effigy does "hit" enemies?

[alpine vigil]

it does

confirmed during LA playtest

[shrewd socket]

is there a video on yt?

[alpine vigil]

yes let me get it

[shrewd socket]

thanks

[alpine vigil]

https://youtu.be/rAVJPKS2phQ?t=170

timestamp relevant

[sterile sparrow]

I think its only 90. On poedb it has a reservation modifier which is just 150%, while cost is 200%. I assume the 150% is used for blasphemy?

[alpine vigil]

oh yeah I can't read, I initially saw the 150% but assumed it got nerfed pre launch

[sterile sparrow]

Might very well happen

[alpine vigil]

I expect the cost per curse to go up on blasphemy if it turns out to be mandatory

maybe to 45

[sterile sparrow]

I agree

Although whispers of doom is fairly inaccessible to a lot of classes

And can't be anointed anymorr

[lofty grotto]

Poison Ranger x Witch Curses be like

https://tenor.com/view/predator-arnold-schwarzenegger-hand-shake-arms-gif-3468629

[modern tangle]

that is marks and curses in hand of chayula

[shrewd socket]

can i trigger bow skills when im i using wand via cast on ignite

[ancient geyser]

only spells can be triggered from cast on X, so you'd have to use a bow skill and then you'd cast fireball or whatever else

[distant dome]

Do minions inherit any of our stats? Like does this node buff them at all, or do they ONLY inherit minion damage stats:

[shrewd socket]

they dont

[velvet blade]

I think only minion damage and there's a node that gives your amulet stats to your minions instead of you

[lofty grotto]

charms

[woven sinew]

What are support gems I should use with Power Offering?

Cast on minion death is one

[proven quest]

Multiple charge might be nice

[woven sinew]

Oooo yes good call

[proven quest]

and less duration might work and be nice qol as well

[lofty grotto]

charms doesn't come with stats
their modifiers only modify their procs
like faster recharge, multiple stacks, etc.
They don't affect any main stat

[woven sinew]

Okay. That gives me a pretty good looking 4l

My build is going to be a bonestorm one so I need to generate power charges to increase the bone zone. What would be good support gems for bonestorm?

I’m thinking

Multiple projectile at least but beyond that I’m unsure. I’m scaling crit chance and damage.

[ancient geyser]

increased area of effect

it won't do anything without the power charge, but with the power charge you could make the explosions overlap

[woven sinew]

Maybe addt accurate area of effect

Yeee

[ancient geyser]

but that also depends whether the explosions have indenpendent dmg

from the actual projectile

because otherwise you can just shotgun in melee

[woven sinew]

The explosion I think will spread the secondary shrapnel further

No they’ll explode on impact so I wonder if that will take the impact damage and secondary damage and make it one

[ancient geyser]

you could run spell echo, not sure if it works on channeled skills though

nvm it doesn't

wildshards perhaps

controlled destruction potentially

though not really because the skill has the highest crit mod

[modern tangle]

It's sad how bad the information regarding possible targets for Window of Opportunity support is. I'd try that with any channeled skill I guess.

[ancient geyser]

good point, that actually sounds very good

[woven sinew]

Right I want the focus to be on the crit

Ooooo

Yeah I like that. It’s worth checking out

[ancient geyser]

window of opportunity, faster casting, multiple projectiles, minion pact, pierce

[modern tangle]

it can't exist only for Perfect Strike

[woven sinew]

Two of my skills down

[ancient geyser]

tornado shot weapon swap as well

this is lowkey broken

if you can somehow meet the dex requirement

nvm it's only attack projectiles

😭

all the fun things are gutted

[lofty grotto]

tornado got updated
It works ONLY on crossbow and bow projectiles

there's new tooltip

[ancient geyser]

ye i just saw

[modern tangle]

Join the attack side, we have all the fun.

[ancient geyser]

[woven sinew]

Bonestorm - addt accuracy (can swap if not very good), area of effect, wildshards, mp, minion pact (run the big chunky minions if their life is that much higher)

[lyric palm]

I'm having a hard time seeing the point of not using giant's blood for any melee builds

it looks a little too strong

[ancient geyser]

you don't need accuracy for spells

[static plinth]

Youre massively underestimating how much attributes you need

[woven sinew]

I thought I read that projectiles work on accuracy regardless

Hard to keep track of everything that’s come out

[thorny path]

Only attacks need accuracy

[lofty grotto]

• tornado it's not that broken if you don't have chaining/large AoE projectiles.
  Those are 3 projectiles scattered in triangle formation, meaning without large AoE or big monster back, you won't hit with all of them

[ancient geyser]

nope, only attacks, you can replace it with this though

[modern tangle]

I'd tell you that you could be just far from the keystone, but this exists 🤭

[lyric palm]

unless attributes don't really give inherit bonuses anymore that doesn't exactly seem difficult

[static plinth]

They do but tree points are only +5 instead of +10 and % inc seems a lot rarer

[woven sinew]

Oh you’re a beautiful human for finding that

[lyric palm]

are they trying to tone down stat stacking builds?

[woven sinew]

I know it’s going to be hard but I’m going to at least try to str stack

[fleet blaze]

anyone wanna debunk my attempt at making a stormweaver in POE2? https://poe2skills.com/share?data=N4IgdghgtgpiBcIBiAnA9gZwC4AIDKAFmgMYDW+WaKUA7jBAG4wo4C0AfDgJJgMkRYAlmjA4AQpgw4ARgBs0dFgFcADiuYA6EABoQ0pYNkATBAG1QGUodkIQAM3TZpaWVh0gMqlVSwYzIKCVXQRVZGBwVdAArGGIhML9dOwhsZhxiFKEwAHN3IxgYFRwHAoAvOF1pQSzs9JcTAF0AX20LK1kbRBgw2DAsCFkcQV5+IRF3TzUfP3hTEGIRYhg+lAEYIxwYOztYt11umF7+wbsSJUT5lGrBDMGjaAhsir1rnOLHPfn6nAxIFRBmq0PO1OvNMjgRO8ys9Jt4UL5-DdwmA0AwIO4ICh6BC7JttrsMUZ8hsFsYcPcoI9nqSNuowDAsKsxmAdGAgrJAW1rLYaT8-hMvNMzJzgdzELJBNkCFgwMNajRMf9dLChbMRZYxfYsTBSnKcJSUKQBVN4TNTOqQbYHJhcM4oNJjXCEWqWlyOrYMFQligAJ44BUoEzKwWm4Wu0XuxCYuI3HCYqBoJQoR2q81NZpAA

that's all ive cooked so far. never really made my own build in poe

[modern tangle]

tip: if you wrap url in <> symbols like this <https://google.com> it won't do previews

[lyric palm]

is there any confirmed visual for hammer of god?

like how fast the skill casts, etc.

[shrewd socket]

there are videos about it on yt

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/D-PZGW7-FJE

[woven sinew]

https://poe2skills.com/share?data=N4IgdghgtgpiBcIByMDuACAQgVwJYBsATEAGhACM8iEBtUAZwGsD8EKB7MGegF3YCcopEPWwAHMQJ71aIXFwBuuHhHL4Y6AMb9luTRFZkI-GBHTsAZuhgWLMTT2GoChegAtjr4VGz4euMXV0MX52ACt7f3UZMih5XE5giAcQAF0AXxIGZnxWRElUGH5zWyL5AHNhUQkpGXgaEH1eczB0OLAE1sJTHjdvX39AjU0PfnK4Mmj6dEJsfgh-TjTM7JY2Jhh1FXx0cn5sHgmRcUl+aVl2zraIXiKAT28e9HdcTeJY+MT5XlUCZQeMlkRDk8mBfPgyNVTud6oDVrkEGDcpCTrVaHDgWt4EiIccamc6jQMUwsTiUfiYUSVpiEdjweToYTiSDEfS8Yz0ekMkA

[distant dome]

Really? that's very good to know

[lyric palm]

oh thanks. That looks like a nasty delay

I knew there was no way that skill could be instant

[shrewd socket]

still good for bosses

[lyric palm]

yeah but it looks like the chronomancer + hammer of the gods combo is justified then

[shrewd socket]

ohhh

[worthy cliff]

Sorry, I know this doesn't answer the question but I've been seeing this skill name everywhere but no idea what it is. Is it a specific weapon skill? Item? What weapon?

[lyric palm]

still not completely sold on chrono though

[shrewd socket]

i like that chrono + hammer combo

[ancient geyser]

chrono might be the trickster of sorceress

might be a defensive oriented ascendancy

[lyric palm]

very, very strong melee skill where a giant hammer falls from the sky and deals over 1000% damage

[ancient geyser]

it's either gonna be very broken or mid

[lyric palm]

lots of people are probably going to abuse it for either free stuns or ignite

[worthy cliff]

Do you need to have a specific weapon equipped to use?

Or be a specific class?

[modern tangle]

it's a mace skill

[lyric palm]

mace

[worthy cliff]

Ty!

[modern tangle]

1-h, 2-h, dual 1-h, dual 2-h... your choice

[woven sinew]

How many minions skills should I be running in a standard build do you think?

[ancient geyser]

hard to tell, i think raise spectre has potential to be the most broken minion skill by far

[woven sinew]

Any idea which one has the most life?

[lyric palm]

honestly, and I know alpha information is limited, but GGG devs confirmed that monk and warrior basically dominated the ladder during that playtesting so I have a feeling melee will be in a very strong spot from day one.

[ancient geyser]

you'll probably have to trial and error ingame for minions depending on your needs and your builds, though hp wise i'd say skeletal brutes probably have the highest

[lyric palm]

minions look very cool though

[distant dome]

I'm questing a bone storm build like this. The Mobility/momentum stuff is more about not dying to mechanics by staying more mobile, might not be needed.

To get Power Charges, I'm looking to get Cast While Channeling or Cast on Critical combined with "power Offering." to automate power charge production. I also might run "Lust for Power" to further improve production of power charges.

[ancient geyser]

they've also had to nerf bleeding multiple times within their own inhouse testing

[lyric palm]

interesting

[modern tangle]

Monk has also dominated the death counts.

[midnight bolt]

going back in time is a superior mechanic to dodge roll, and dodge roll is already the best defense layer in the game, that alone puts chrono among the best choices, things like 20-40% more dmg dont really matter in comparison

[woven sinew]

Physical mastery looks good. Who gets the lust for power? Is that a sorc?

[lyric palm]

yeah, that's kind of how I'm reading it too. Utility that replaces the need for some hard defenses.

[ancient geyser]

generic node between monk and witch

[distant dome]

It's pretty far east on the tree, down in the shadow/rogue nodes

[ancient geyser]

ok nvm it's closer to monk than it is to witch

[modern tangle]

Even if you don't go there in the passive tree, anyone can choose 1 notable modifier from the tree to put on their amulet in endgame. Choose wisely because notables are 🔥 in poe2.

[distant dome]

won't neede this though, whoops, that was near by

[lofty grotto]

Is it me, or Dex/Int tree part have shit ton of good nodes compared to the rest of the tree?

[ancient geyser]

100%

[distant dome]

we also don't have full tree to be fair?

[woven sinew]

Might be worth pathing if there’s some easy defensive modes

[midnight bolt]

2 clusters of max res in warrior alone give you +4 max res 🙂 i have yet to see anything remotely close defensively in int/dex area

[distant dome]

to lust for power? Only some Crit chance and cast speed noded along the way... and some stun/energy shield

[woven sinew]

Energy shield is good for my build

[distant dome]

i guess some evasion stuff too

[distant dome]

https://marcoaaguiar.github.io/poe2-tree/?a=bloodmage&p=ModgDAnANMBsECYawBwEYoDkFlstArDASEpmqcWmFhXsAYjACxrMtoDMMnrPzZakmCcEeTBCIiwNYAgjQJ7OQXaYUshBphayIbuQL1VwziGVjuc2MIQgimVDrQY5YC9RhcUXhFZfQwC5Wklicri62kDpgPiIIpuA6sLKcKFKc8Dw2tJ7kCK4ozPQo%2BjAg5uV25WBSIFzIIIGwsCDIqu0GOG1wJFgFrrBG5ZwOCcLmagjMYx3AKGIsZXBmtBDGuMRgPa2DzG3kCjBHcuFeFFAA0ghAA

[worthy dagger]

ngl i just want flicker strike build on monk

[distant dome]

I have no idea how to rate energy shield/evasion

[worthy dagger]

https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app

[ancient geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/flicker-fight-battle-gif-16083869

[woven sinew]

Blood mage with a high ES chest should give me massive life with proper nodes

[distant dome]

oh shit

[worthy dagger]

thats not poe2

[lyric palm]

isn't flicker absent from poe2? It doesn't seem to fit the theme of the game's design

[ancient geyser]

ES looks like the way to go for witch tbh

[alpine vigil]

quarterstaff skill

[ancient geyser]

armor only if you plan on playing with shield

[lyric palm]

oh interesting

[worthy dagger]

quarterstaff

[ancient geyser]

it'll be soon

[lyric palm]

I wonder how it works then

[worthy dagger]

oh true

[modern tangle]

poe2 flicker relies on power charges to keep going, and you can't get more of them during the flicker

[worthy dagger]

what build is this looks fun to build for poe2 if stuff is similar

[modern tangle]

lots of people are planning flicker builds for EA launch.

[ancient geyser]

no idea, think it's just some totems with flicker strike

[distant dome]

that's missing some things that the other has

[worthy dagger]

any reliable way to gain power charges?

[worthy dagger]

alr

[alpine vigil]

shock on chilled

[modern tangle]

well that's what the builds are trying to solve with our limited info 😉

[worthy dagger]

oh xD

[thorny path]

If by reliable you mean passively, nope

[alpine vigil]

power charges are looking super easy to generate compared to frenzy at least

[distant dome]

I was going to go Shield + scepter, with Energy shield to fill in the gaps XD

[worthy dagger]

is that the gem name?

[modern tangle]

you can certainly get power charges, just a matter of how fast

[alpine vigil]

it's a notable, in the monk area

[worthy dagger]

oh

[alpine vigil]

harmonic generator

[ancient geyser]

then armor + ES is the way to go, this video covers some nice info about how to approach a build like that (even if he's specfically building for CI, you can still aply the basics to your needs) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-4z6K4ovkw

[pseudo kayak]

What are the best guesses on the amount of Spirit we'll get ?

[alpine vigil]

180

[ancient geyser]

180, 30 per act

[worthy dagger]

thanks

[alpine vigil]

we've seen one sceptre gives like 196 including affix bonuses

[lofty grotto]

deadeye/ranged will spew ton of them
also you can use resonance to change endurance charges -> frenzy charges

[distant dome]

cool, I'l lwatch it in a sec :D. Thanks for continuing to be super helpful Eiene

[alpine vigil]

deadeye only yes, but that's it, endurance charges generation as far as we know is garbage especially for a frenzy user

it's on melee stun etc

[pseudo kayak]

Ooof. 180 would mean no Archmage + Cast on Shock 😦

[proven quest]

In a boss fight going back in time can be really scary haha. Trying to track where you'll end up might be hard

[alpine vigil]

there's a trailing image

[lofty grotto]

There's support gem which generates fenzy charges. But it is at 6 second cooldown 💀

[modern tangle]

There's a shield shaped cluster in the tree's str/int area with interesting notables like doubling defenses from shield. And this:

[worthy dagger]

@alpine vigil would lust of power make you gain all your power charges back with a 10 % chance?

[alpine vigil]

what is it?

oh I read grenades

yeah the combat frenzy one, it's bad

[midnight bolt]

u have literally a visual indicator in poe, so u know where you will teleprt

[alpine vigil]

but funnily enough probably the most reliable one

[alpine vigil]

yes

[worthy dagger]

thats pretty nice

[modern tangle]

Get more from amulet. Maybe runes or jewels might offer some spirit...

[lofty grotto]

I'm pretty sure Huntres is heavy on frenzy, but we'll have to wait to have her added (Huntres and Druid are first classes to be added)

[pseudo kayak]

hope so

[distant dome]

oof. I'm liking the math for bonestorm, but fire skills are just SO FRIGGEN PRETTY in PoE 2 that I might have to go them on release :p

[proven quest]

From what I saw in the release trailer it shows a shadow every so often, so you see a bunch of shadows trailing behind you. That's nice in a straight line, but when you're walking in circles it might get busy. Unless they make the shadow you teleport to look different than the others

[proven quest]

Str/ dex part of the tree looks really nice too. Makes me excited for Druid/ Templar

[worthy dagger]

how do you know which parts of stats from the passive skill tree?

[proven quest]

I meant Str/ int lol

[modern tangle]

This way of referring to them might be weird since the travel nodes now give attribute of your choice. Top is int style area, dex is bottom right, str is bottom left. The hybrids are between them.

[proven quest]

my bad

[worthy dagger]

oh interesting

[lofty grotto]

just starting positions

[modern tangle]

It's still true in the sense that defensive gear that requires pure int gives energy shield, dex gear evasion, str gear armour. Hybrids between again. 6 types of defensive gear in total.

[proven quest]

It's kind of the "thematic" stats for the starting areas

[worthy dagger]

thanks

[proven quest]

and like @modern tangle said, it's also inherited from PoE1 where the travel nodes gave static stats instead of PoE2 where you can choose

[lofty grotto]

it's flexible

[lofty grotto]

oh 👀

[distant dome]

thx, watch the video, good info

[worthy dagger]

is that broken?

[distant dome]

my worry about this node, is that I think you can get spirit on a necklace. What's that going to do for minions? :p

[velvet blade]

Minions that summon minions

[distant dome]

lol

They summon a mini-version of you? :p

[velvet blade]

Path of Fractals

[distant dome]

Fract of Pathiles

[ancient geyser]

spirit will probably do nothing on minions

the implicit will just be null on them

like mana regen

[distant dome]

yeah

it'd be nice if you kept stats they couldn't use :D

[proven quest]

If there's life regen implicit amulets like in poe1 that might be really good

[distant dome]

Early game, how strong will the "10 flat energy shield" nodes be? the ones near Sorc start

[ancient geyser]

not good imo

early game you wanna focus on dmg

then later you respec and grab the defensives

[distant dome]

yeah, and by later in the game 10 flat is probably not much

[ancient geyser]

(unless the game is very hard for some reason)

in poe1 you usually build blaster early at least

[velvet blade]

I'm very hard for some reason

[grand roost]

are xbows and bows martial weapons?

[proven quest]

10 flat is whatever, but I also don't know what life and es values will look like in PoE2. Also with the amount of increased ES on the tree, that 10es will probably be closer to 30 without really trying

[near acorn]

Big question on aegis aurora builds in poe 2 is whether stacking armor is as easy as it was in poe 1. No armor flasks and no determination revealed so far, i don't think

[hidden tartan]

How does 750% more chance to shock on Ball lightning actually works, it makes no sense to me?

[ancient geyser]

very true, we also don't have armor values in poe 2 though, they might have accounted for that

[near acorn]

Shock chance is based on damage vs the enemys ailment threshold

[alpine vigil]

shock chance is based on damage done, so you multiply this by 7.58.5

[near acorn]

If you have 750% more you multiply by 8.5

[alpine vigil]

oh it's more duh

[proven quest]

Agreed. But it looks like all the numbers are scaled down, including ES and Life. So as a ratio it might be pretty close

[hidden tartan]

Wait, just to see if I understand in poe one you had to do certain % of bosses hp to proc shock, in poe 2 it has a chance ?

[ancient geyser]

no, in poe1 you have a % chance to trigger it, in poe2 you need to deal X amount of damage to proc

[alpine vigil]

there's 2 types of ailments in poe2, for freeze, electrocute etc it's a buildup, for shock and ignite and probably poison it's a chance

[ancient geyser]

dreamcore has a video about ailments in poe2

i might be dumbing it down too much

i recommend watching it for full accuracy

[hidden tartan]

I am just really confused, if its damage based, how is it also chance based

[alpine vigil]

the chance depends on the damage done

[hidden tartan]

so higher the dmg, higher the chance it shocks?

[proven quest]

In PoE1 shock had a % chance to shock, and if you did shock, the value was correlated to the enemies ailment threshold. In PoE2 shock is always 30% (iirc) and the chance to shock is similar to the chance to ignite. Every 100% damage of enemies ailment threshold is a 25% to apply ailment

[hidden tartan]

So lets say you do 100% of enemies ailment treshold and you have 25% chance to apply, how does this 750% more come in to play there?

[proven quest]

My PoE brain says that you would multiply the base chance by the multiplier. So it would be a 515% chance to shock. But what to correlates to is needing a lot less damage to shock

I'd have to do some quick maths that might not be quick for my brain right now

[hidden tartan]

but why would you need anything over 100%, what's the point of this 750% more?

[alpine vigil]

ball lightning does very little damage per tick

[rustic radish]

Ennemies with higher thresholds probably

[proven quest]

It would mean you only need to do about 50% of the enemies ailment threshold to shock

instead of 400%

[hidden tartan]

Since lightning ball has 0% shock chance by default, does it need shock support gem in order to shock?

[atomic halo]

but regarding the chance to shock is weird yeah

i dont think any of us are very clear on how ailments, esp non damageing ones like shock are going to work

[near acorn]

I think its been explained in this discord

[proven quest]

Does the gem say it can't shock? Otherwise all lightning damage has a chance to shock

[near acorn]

Above discussion tracks with my understanding 🤷‍♂️ but its not like I've played the game

[hidden tartan]

Guess I am confused coz I am assuming its simillar to poe 1 :
A hit of damage that has a X% chance to shock is capable of inflicting shock. Critical strikes always inflict shock regardless of their chance to shock. Modifiers to chance to shock can be found on some gems, equipment, and the passive skill tree. By default, only lightning damage is able to inflict shock.

so since crits dont apply ailments by default anymore in poe 2, you have to have chance to shock don't you?

[near acorn]

I'm not clear on how the ball lightning modifier might interact with Chance to Shock support -- seems too strong if those work together

[fleet blaze]

anyone seen any cool frostie stormweaver build conncepts

[near acorn]

I believe there are two ways to shock: flat chance to shock on hit (arc, chance to shock support, lightning bolt) and lightning damage based shock (all lightning hits that dont say "cannot shock")

[proven quest]

The most recent info I've heard is that the damage of the hit is the only thing that matters for chance to apply ailments

[hidden tartan]

but then what is the point of shock chance stuff, more I think about it more confusing this gets 😦

[proven quest]

I had heard that the chance to shock on some of those gems are outdated

[near acorn]

The damage based shock compares damage to ailment threshold and gives you a chance to shock based on % of ailment threshold done

[near acorn]

That makes sense, they give guaranteed shock with pretty low investment

[fleet blaze]

when it says all dmg can shock does that mean it can proc shock or all dmg scales with shock? for instance, lightninng dmg makes your shock more effective but does that mean the same amount of cold dmg would be as effective?

[hidden tartan]

But in poe 2 , is it still the same thing as bigger the hit = bigger the shock?

[distant dome]

I'm curious about how "cast on" triggers will work when there isn't a valid target for a spell. Profane Ritual requires a corpse... what if there are none availible? Will it spend the mana? Will it skip teh energy cost? My guess it will spend the mana/energy cost, but then do nothing.

[proven quest]

This is the most recent info from GGG: #2┃general message

[near acorn]

Don't believe so. Shock is 30% base, changed by effect of shock modifiers

(Afaik of course 🙂 )

[proven quest]

Given that, the more multipliers on gems make a lot of sense but the base chances don't anymore

[proven quest]

This is also how I understand it

[lyric palm]

any speculation on if time freeze is considered a stun?

[hidden tartan]

@near acorn Would it be fair to assume for example Shocks enemies as thought dealing 400 % more damage, would be similar result as to 400% more chance to shock?

[pastel forge]

so overcharge is more or less one of the few ways to get stronger shocks?

[ancient geyser]

it isn't

it's its own effect

it's not freeze either

[near acorn]

Depends if flat shock chance exists in poe2 or not -- it shows up on some gems but those are possibly changed. If theres no flat shock chance then i think those are the same

[lyric palm]

if its not, then it would logically connect that you can build up stun threshold during time freeze to chain it into another stun.

[proven quest]

That's how I'm understanding it. If you math it out, they end up basically being the same with shock being a flat 30% and not scaling with damage

[ancient geyser]

correct, unless the skill tooltip specifically states you can't build stun and freeze during the effect, but that'd make no sense

[hidden tartan]

Yea if its like that it makes perfect sense, I was just confused with lightning storm haveing as 400% more thing and ball lightning having 750% more chance to shock

And thought those are 2 seperate things, they should probably word both of those the same

[lyric palm]

I have a feeling there might be something like "cannot increase stun threshold on enemies during effect" because time freeze with some investment into stuns with maces could end up being a common boss cheese.

[distant dome]

Will cast speed effect channeled spells?

AKA faster charge up time on Bonestorm

[ancient geyser]

very likely, we do see in the chronomancer preview that they are using comet and some freezing effects, so it might work with freeze but maybe not with stun, but who knows

[proven quest]

They probably will. I'm guessing the Lightning Storm we're seeing is from an older build. But again all of this is very speculative at this point

[lyric palm]

yeah. I'm really curious if mace chronomancer will work.

poe2 is also just so much less rigid with the fairly close start locations and choosable stat bonuses on the tree

[proven quest]

The cool thing about Path in general is that almost everything will work. It just depends on how much time you want to put into it 😆

[ancient geyser]

it will also depend a ton on what uniques we have available, they're gonna be build defining

[proven quest]

Agreed. But I'm personally ignoring uniques for now. There's probably a few that are going to be generically good, but trying to guess what a unique might do and build around the hopes of that coming to fruition sounds risky

[hidden tartan]

So overall just to sum it up, even though its speculation. You think spells base shock chance will be removed, and all lightning dmg will have base % chance to shock enemies with 30% base shock?

[proven quest]

And I think a mace chronomancer will work with 0 uniques

[hidden tartan]

that Chance to shock can further be increased either with more shock chance/as dealing more dmg

[proven quest]

Mostly. All lightning damage will have a % chance to shock based on the lightning damage they deal

And the more shock chance/ as if dealing more damage will probably be fixed to have a single wording

[hoary plover]

does barrage have any decent supports?

[hidden tartan]

Ye would make sense and last piece of puzzle I just need to make sure I understand: You still need to pass the dmg threshold in order to even have a chance to shock right?

[lyric palm]

would really like to see the rest of the ascendency, I wonder if its possible to ditch time snap for something else as ignite hammer of the gods doesn't exactly require back to back hits. OTOH it could make for 100% uptime on big ignites.

also depends on its interaction with second wind

[pseudo kayak]

@ancient geyser are you still planning on trying the blood witch Archmage, or are you looking at other builds?

[ancient geyser]

i will do lifetap archmage MoM with stormweaver, the guide/theorycraft is posted here https://discord.com/channels/174993814845521922/1313195596709892107

[proven quest]

I'm not sure about that one. I would think it's a continuous value, so dealing 50% of the ailment threshold would be a 12.5% chance to shock, 25% damage would be a 6.25% chance to shock, etc. And I mostly think that because of the more multipliers. Anything above 300% more would be useless if you needed to pass at least the first threshold

[ancient geyser]

later into the game if mana regen is fixed and the build doesn't require lifetap anymore i'll transition to CI ES regular mana stacker, but early on i think lifetap will help a lot

we discarded bloodmage for the time being because it's not gonna be easy to stack crit reliably and blood mage nodes are not that good unless we see the rest of the reveal

[distant dome]

So... Blood Mage can overflow HP right? Do we think this will work to overflow HP as well and will health costs of spells interupt the health recharge.

[proven quest]

That's what I care about the most. I haven't been keeping up with all the small nodes on the tree, those are what they are. But the ascendancy points are a big deal for me

[hidden tartan]

Yea, now everything makes more sense, thanks Mr.Tea

[proven quest]

No problem! It's a little bit of the blind leading the blind here, so I'm just trying to make sense of things and help and learn from others

[lyric palm]

if it ends up working with second wind then you may as well just go with hourglass support and make the cooldown insanely long and just rely on time snap to get usage back.

[ancient geyser]

the cost of spells shouldn't stop recharge because it's not a damage source, it's just a resource cost just like mana, but eternal youth shouldn't overflow because you need to pick up orbs for that

[hidden tartan]

Ye I understand, but that last part would make perfect sense overall to balance both high hitting and low dmg hitting abilities

[fleet blaze]

feel like every stormweaver is going to be doing this since it's basically the only well made concept that ive seen. been looking for a frost stormweaver idea but no luck

[distant dome]

k

[ancient geyser]

i think endgame you will wanna weapon swap for freeze combos, but it's hard to theorycraft around that when we don't have the full details yet

[lyric palm]

hourglass support seems like it can "recover" the lost damage link second wind causes with chronomancer

so on paper it just looks very busted

kind of funny a lot of people have already converged on hammer of the gods because numerically it looks way too strong

[terse pendant]

For those that are curious, I found a video interview that explains how this will work...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj8FxWMf4V4&t=5933s

It is effectively what we were discussing earlier. You'll lose minions if your spirit drops enough to do so. Interestingly though, it seems like you will be able to assign a completely different set of minions to the secondary weapon set, which could be quite useful under certainly situations.

[fleet blaze]

I think I'm just going to try my own thing on hardcore and when I die my char transfers to softcore and I'll just check out all the stuff that'll be out on saturday

[ancient geyser]

i think hammer of the gods might come with an ailment reduction modifier

[proven quest]

Exactly. Also depends on how the cooldown of time snap works. I think the most balanced way to do it is to have the time snap cooldown be based on the longest cooldown it reset. I'm ok with a long cooldown though, I'm planning on doing a standard monk build and then having a 2h weapon swap for huge Hammer of the God bonk 😄

[lyric palm]

as far as we're aware it doesn't have that in the game at all. Ailments don't work the same way in PoE2.

as I understand its based on the complete hit damage, not the poe1 unscaled hit nonsense.

just 25% of the hit

[ancient geyser]

yeah i know, but it'd be weird if they don't put some sort of reduction on it in on the advanced tooltip

[hidden tartan]

Do you think Arcane surge support will work on Mana tempest ?

[lyric palm]

we'll see, I guess

[pseudo kayak]

Interesting. Taking a look now. The life leech looked pretty good but I'm guessing you just really favor the double shocks?

[ancient geyser]

double shocks and potentially leaked ascendancy that says the following. the elemental storm trigger on crit looks really good as well

blood mage could be REALLY good if it has a crit chance node after gorespike

[pseudo kayak]

Oh hmm. Do we know anything about whether those leaks are from a semi legit source?

[lyric palm]

if they do then that kills most of the ignite builds people were thinking about. Maybe comet with avatar of fire is the other pathway.

[ancient geyser]

i'd say the source is legit, but you never know

[lyric palm]

is anyone datamining the game right now?

[ancient geyser]

i'm pretty sure the builds would still work, just that the total expected dmg would be lower

and no one can datamine the game right now, it's only assets and graphics

there'll be a last minute update with the actual game's content

[lyric palm]

ah

[proven quest]

It sounds like it would. I think it would only track the mana per second drained by Mana Tempest, and it would not track the mana you're spending on other skills. So it might take a while for it to proc. But that's something that'll definitely need to be tested

[hidden tartan]

But any other lightning skills makes the tempest tick more, so in theory other skills used just makes tempest tick higher numbers in theory making it really easy to proc?

[proven quest]

Yup. I do think getting to 100% of your mana spent might take some time still. It adds 30% of the mana spent on other spells to the cost, so increasing the cost of those spells would help a lot. Probably works best with archmage?

[hidden tartan]

Yea, but even without high costs, I think it ramps up insane? like one spell will cost from 40-60 mana? getting 30% of that in to t empest per one second tick?

[lyric palm]

thing is, we have the full skill description and it didn't mention a single thing about ailments...

[ancient geyser]

bold of you to assume the EA versions that have been played contained advanced tooltips

they don't necessarily have to include that sort of information

[proven quest]

Cast speed in general seems much more rare in PoE2, so idk how much cast speed we'll be able to get. The faster you can cast the faster it will ramp

[ancient geyser]

just don't be surprised if the things we've theorycrafted aren't 1:1 or can't be reliable once the actual game comes out

[raw flower]

Do you have the sauce for this?

[pseudo kayak]

Gotcha. That certainly changes things. I was originally torn between those and leech Monk, but that's pretty convincing until we find out the full info on Thurs/Fri

[hidden tartan]

Well ye I agree, but you don't need much at all is my point, tempest starts of with 1% of your mana per second, lets say you use conduit 3 times that costs 60 mana, that's gonna be 180 * 30%, now temepst trains 1%+54 mana per second? and that's just 3 spells, so using 6 would make it 1%+108, Feels like that can drain you down in less then 15-20 secs

[ancient geyser]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUXz7NkfkqA&ab_channel=Allie this video, the actual source is anonymous, so take it with a grain of salt

[alpine vigil]

I wouldn't call it legit, it's just the only source we have

The original source is a random turkish streamer

Typing the ascendancies in a notepad

[hidden tartan]

It's a good chance people are just chasing views and making up stuff as they go

[proven quest]

Definitely in less than 15-20 seconds, I agree with that. But I don't want to have to stand in a small circle for 15 seconds in a boss fight. I'd want that to trigger asap, preferably under 5 seconds

[ancient geyser]

my take on it is that you prepare for all outcomes once we have all ascendancies revealed, so it's good if you plan for all your potential choices

the lifetap build will work fine whether you are bloodmage or stormweaver so in this case it changes nothing

[alpine vigil]

https://www.twitch.tv/olivianna_ts This is the source fwiw

[proven quest]

Archmage would add 1.5% of your mana to the drain every cast, so in your example its 4%+54 mana per second. Just ramps a lot faster

[pseudo kayak]

Yeah that's the most sensible, if most work intensive, option

[proven quest]

Wait, it would be 5.5%+54

[hidden tartan]

Yea, but also standing in it you gain bunch of lightning damage so, arcane surge was just a side bonus for easy proccing probably similar uptime like putting it on other spells without actually using support slot on those spells.

[ancient geyser]

well, it's just preparing for monk and stormweaver/bloodmage (the two will basically function the same), just need to figure out a proper route that would fit your needs on monk

[hidden tartan]

And on top you get to proc Sigil easier as well, to much synergy

[proven quest]

Also agree. And it sounds like it keeps track of the mana, so if you step out of mana tempest you can recast and keep building towards surge

[raw flower]

Thanks for the answer 🙂 Yeah, the source is unreliable

[worthy dagger]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDjiotlSbQA is this a good watch?

[hidden tartan]

Didn't check it yet, but Guy played the living shit ouf of poe 1 flicker, and has really fun videos, so prolly worth it ^^

[worthy dagger]

alright ima watch rn bc flicker strike seems fun as hell

[olive tide]

magefist been making flicker strike videos since before most ppl playing this game were born

[ancient geyser]

magefist is flicker strike one trick pony

but his video doesn't have that much info for now

[worthy dagger]

yeah just waiting on the game like everyone else here

[ancient geyser]

not really his fault either, it's just hard to properly build with what we have

[proven quest]

You could probably control+f flicker strike in here and get as much or more info than that video lmao

[pseudo kayak]

Does his idea seem promising? Most flicker concepts I've seen looked jank as hell and can't generate nearly as fast as you'd want

[lyric palm]

also an idea: frostfire support for hammer of the gods ignite, with a weapon swap to a cold mace using some other skill to freeze.

[proven quest]

I'd say so. Any idea of monk+power charges+flicker strike sounds like it'll work well enough

I like the idea of cast on melee kill+profane ritual with flicker strike. If you can get 4 kills per strike you get at least 1 power charge back, and can flicker again

[knotty spruce]

So im relatively new to poe (300 ish hours) And only really ever used guides. Can someone explain to me how damage scalings work? For example if i wana for example use the ice qstaff abilities like glacial cascade does it only scale off of aoe,cold and melee dmg increases? or would it also increase based off elemental damage increases?

[proven quest]

And it has a duration*, so even if it procs mid flicker strike, the skill will probably be over by the time it would grant a power charge

[terse pendant]

How awful do you guys think it would be to try go Gemling Legionnaire as a necromancer character? I brought this up before, but am looking at the skill tree again and it seems require quite a few nodes to work your way to the other side of the tree.

[worthy dagger]

damn if your relatively new with 300h then me with 10 hours of gametime is none existent

[olive tide]

ele damage will scale the cold damage from glacial cascade and whatever other flat damage you have on the weapon. so its nice

[knotty spruce]

Relatively new in poe standards is a wide range

[knotty spruce]

other flat elemental damages right?

[pseudo kayak]

Don't you need 2 charges? (3 normally plus something I saw that let's you use one less)

[olive tide]

wed will increase any ele damage you're doing with your weapons/attacks

[pseudo kayak]

Or is there more cool tech?

[proven quest]

From what I've seen you don't need any charges to use flicker strike. The charges just increase the targets it strikes

[lyric palm]

some people have like 7k+ hours in poe1

I'm probably around the 4-5k hour mark total

[worthy dagger]

prob

[lyric palm]

been playing on and off since beta though

[misty shell]

Look at the base attack speed, using that skill sans power charge would be a meme.

[worthy dagger]

im just trying to cook a build but the wording on some of these skills just confused me

[proven quest]

Oh, I'm definitely not using it without a power charge. I'm just saying there's no minimum charge requirements to use

[ancient geyser]

the freeze combos look insane overall, i expect them to be the best bossing builds by far once people have figured out reliable synergies for them

[knotty spruce]

hmm im guessing the scaling of ele dmg or base ele dmg would be low right? with the 80% of phys into cold

[proven quest]

So you can use it with 1 charge, psuedo +1 with One with the Storm gives 7 strikes. 4 kills in those 7 strikes procs profane ritual, gives you power charge. Repeat

[lyric palm]

provided we can get good flat ele damage on maces, it shouldn't be too hard to accomplish

[proven quest]

And I'm coping you can use it with 0 charges, and you get the psuedo charge from one with the storm

[hidden tartan]

@proven quest Yo Proven just one more thing if Shock Chance support actually stays in game with its "Supported skills have 20% chance to shock" does this mean every 5 hits on average would gurantee a base shock no meter how much the dmg skill does?

[knotty spruce]

man im gona need to study this shit lmao i love the look of monks gameplay but im forced by my self to go chronomancer and want to mix em both so damn bad

[lyric palm]

oh and biting frost guarantees a crit. It all looks kind of silly.

[proven quest]

That would be my best guess. I think what's more likely is that it'll be reworded to be "Supported skills have X% more chance to shock", and then it'll fall in line with other similar stats

[misty shell]

Like no information in it.

[ancient geyser]

wasn't that part of the idea for the big nuke hammer of the gods? freeze into massive crit ignite

[lyric palm]

yes, with chronomancer so you can reset the cooldowns.

[hidden tartan]

Ye it has to be reworked or will be busted on stuff like ball lightning, coz it would easily keep it perma up

[misty shell]

Viperesque already said flat shock chance is out. Shock /ignite chance is calculated as 25% x DMG of hit/monster ailment threshold

[worthy dagger]

rip

[hidden tartan]

Awesome

[hidden tartan]

Is shock chance for 100% ailment treshold 25 % also confirmed ?

50% threshhold would be 12.5% and so on?

[misty shell]

#2┃general message

I don't know if it scales linearally

Shock is also baseline 30% always

When you shock

[hidden tartan]

ye im just talking chance

and thanks for the link

so if its 25% chance on 100% of thresholds damage, doing 50% would make sense to be 12.5% chance

[fleet blaze]

if i have cold snap on elemental invocation to cast like 10 cold snaps with this support (biting frost) will all 10 cold snaps crit if boss is frozen?

[hidden tartan]

and then everything falls in to place

[proven quest]

It's nice to have someone confirm, we were pretty sure all of that was how it worked now, but some of the old gems are adding confusion

[hidden tartan]

Ye proven I think you were right about it all, good now world makes sense again

[misty shell]

Doubtful

[proven quest]

First hit from the skill would consume the freeze, so I think the next 9 would hit a non-frozen target

[fleet blaze]

does this consume ALL charges when pressed or is it like I have 500 charges and using it onnce will consume 80

i guess it makes since it only uses it once instead of consuming all charges

sense

[tawny rivet]

this one prob has a wrong tooltip

[misty shell]

can trigger multiple times if it has enough energy.

[tawny rivet]

this triggers one spell per shock, that's not how trigger spells work

look at cast on shock for a more normal version

[rustic ocean]

Biting Frost and Frost fire can't support the same skill since they both consume freeze.

[proven quest]

This is different than the cast on skills though. You have to cast these yourself

[hidden tartan]

I think you have to press button each time

[proven quest]

And the cast on specifically say you lose all energy when it triggers

[tawny rivet]

still, it's insane to have 1 : 1 ratio for spells

[proven quest]

What do you mean?

[tawny rivet]

1 shock gets you enough energy to trigger, for example the trigger on ailment or crit are between 4/6 stacks to have enough energy

[hidden tartan]

nah I think that got reworked and isnt giving 125, but 25 instead

[proven quest]

^^

[fleet blaze]

Maybe it does trigger multiple times then. I was hoping to freeze boss and unload 10 cold snaps on em for big dmg.

[tawny rivet]

yah

[fleet blaze]

Oh well

[tawny rivet]

that still can work

you'll trigger ailments a lot of times, stacks will build fast