2┃build-planning

[pastel forge]

you pick a corpse to summon

[modern tangle]

Could be, from what we know.

[thick herald]

that would be fun

[pastel forge]

if they have a separate menu for handling storage of spectres, we do not know yet

[silent prawn]

As the specter comes back like the skeletons, I kinda doubt you will be able to have different bound to one gem.

but multiple gems are a different topic

[pastel forge]

i could see the possibility if you can indeed have multiple of the same skill gem

but i doubt that since err

uncut gem just directly upgrades the lvl of an exisiting gem that we know

unless they have a separate mechanic to produce a duplicate skill gem

one thing that could happen with spectre gem is

you can allocate the number like normal minions but since each spectre has varying spirit costs

[shut leaf]

can you share the link

[pastel forge]

maybe you can just summon until you hit the limit

[static cipher]

https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app/

[pastel forge]

ah

[neat dew]

Pog

[pastel forge]

then that would solve the spectre issue

[modern tangle]

♥️ viperesque

[pastel forge]

1 gem per spectre

[thick herald]

damm

[pastel forge]

but

you are still limited by supports

being 1 per character

so...

[silent prawn]

one mage spectre, one melee 😄

[thick herald]

stash tab designeted for different specters

[silent prawn]

still a minion

[modern tangle]

yeah, it's same as melee skelly, ranged skelly, caster skelly. Different supports. But all are spectres instead.

[shut leaf]

appreciate it thanks

[pastel forge]

max lvl 99 or 100?

[shut leaf]

100

[pastel forge]

so far so good

[daring jay]

gonna be fun to see what effects jewels can have

[knotty spruce]

Really wana try n make a quorterstaff chronomancer work lol

sounds so fun stopping time for a small amount of time and hitting a nasty combo

then reseting it and doing it again lmao

oh wait i just wana play ekko from league

[modern tangle]

I know 100% I'm playing quarterstaff but ascendancy priority list keeps shuffling.

[knotty spruce]

for me its 1000% chronomancer as thats my all time favorite powerfantasy lol

[silent prawn]

unarmed chronomancer ;D

[modern tangle]

In Last Epoch the time reversal skill is called Volatile Reversal. People get themselves killed with it every now and then because of changing position back into aoe. Often wondered if devs would bother implementing the reverse preview like Ekko has. It would be visually spammy for 1 skill though.

[neat dew]

Skill issue

[knotty spruce]

lmao never tried that on last epoch would be sick if we got a preview thing with the one were getting

nice qol thin

[shrewd socket]

does essence drain scale with spell damage?

[modern tangle]

It's a spell with damage numbers. Sure.

[alpine vigil]

in poe1 it doesn't unless specified otherwise to be fair

[modern tangle]

After going through support and notable lists I don't think "increased damage over time" exists in poe2. Dot skills have their own damage and damaging ailments derive damage from the hit that applies them (and multiplied by "effect of ignite"). In both cases they'll scale with attack or spell damage based on skill.

[olive tide]

thoughts on this support on rain of arrows? think itll break enough armor to matter or would i be better off throwing other supports on for damage

[modern tangle]

When are we going to care about armour break outside specific combo? Either at bosses or juiced rares. If they're small enough then RoA might not hit them enough. But with typical fatty bosses it'll hit a lot. Too early to ask about damage comparison vs other supports.

It's honestly a bit awkward that the support gem only breaks armor when we do high physical damage, but the target has high armour... Sources on skill gems often do flat amount.

[blazing swift]

yoooo is anyone here free to chat about a build idea ? i have 1.5k hours in poe 1 but poe 2 will be the first time im doing my own build haha

[tawny rivet]

shock makes enemies take more damage, i'm assuming this will make them take double?

[pastel forge]

do we have info on whether armour works the same as in poe1 aka good against small hits, bad vs big hits?

[cinder raven]

Chronomancer with dots look like a cool theme ngl

[olive tide]

i know its too early to know for sure.. itll be a general clearing skill for mapping. but the armor break is mostly for bosses where i can break their armor and use a snipe with exploit weakness to get a big bleed.

[modern tangle]

Very little info but tooltip description does state that trend. Expected to be basically similar to poe1.

[unreal girder]

anyone else kinda worried totems might suck if you have to spend your spirit to stack them?

I'll still try to make artillery ballistas work tho

[pastel forge]

ok, ty

now i wonder

does es come first or mana when using MoM

[unreal girder]

ES

mom is "mana before LIFE"

and ES is before life

[pastel forge]

hmm

[tawny rivet]

I hope that eldrich node will convert ES after the node buffs, because otherwise all the ES nodes will be useless, and that kinda feels not right

[unreal girder]

yup, same with Iron reflexes

[craggy hearth]

There will be no ancestral bond at EA launch? Cant find it on wiki and such, so 1 totem max?

[unreal girder]

? I saw it on multiple places it's 100 spirit per extra totem

[raw venture]

lets be friends

😄

[blazing swift]

anyone got any cooks on power charge generations? im thinking of monk start falling thunder with killing palm.. maybe late i can switch to flicker.....

[craggy hearth]

Ok all good then 😀

[blazing swift]

but with falling thunder if i can get enough shock i could cast when shock - profane ritual?

[unreal girder]

Dunno how much spirit we'll be able to realistically get

[olive tide]

last power charge chats i remember in this channel it was decided to use resonance and turn frenzy charges into them.

[blazing swift]

okay... how do i get frenzy charges haha

[craggy hearth]

Juicy i want to try a phys warrior/titan build with sunder or another melee skill for totem, ancestral bond wont be too far from the start?
Also i dont see any downside like ' you cant deal damage yourself'?

[olive tide]

combat frenzy and snipers mark(with CoC)

[cunning tide]

has anyone seen any content where supercharged slam has been used? I really would love to see the animations/visuals on the spell?

[modern tangle]

Spirit is very valuable. It's a big downside.

search for the keystone in https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app/ to see where it is

[craggy hearth]

True,in poe1 i had 7-8 totems + a few auras like grace determination, not sure how they will balance each other if i have to choose

[blazing swift]

so do i need to shock to electrocute? how can i push electrocute harder?

[leaden violet]

for a mercenary build: I wonder if these 2 nodes are worth going for in the ranger area. looks like a big damage increase, but how far are 6m? downside is, that it gives me nothing while fighting enemies within those 2-6m range

[unreal girder]

most, if not all of the shotgun skills work better if you're close

if you plan to do armour piercing and that sniper rifle stuff maybe

[modern tangle]

https://youtu.be/MKX1aPd6LjQ?t=112

[unreal girder]

it feels like it's gonna be harder to travel to the opposite side of the tree now

like that ancestral bond seems practically unreachable for duelist, and then how do you play artillery ballistas

[silent prawn]

they should add gates like in the atlas tree, that would be interesting

[modern tangle]

We know fairly little about electrocute but see the unique gloves at https://www.poe2wiki.net/wiki/Electrocute
Their text certainly suggests that just lightning type damage is not normally enough. Another way to get the same effect is Electrocuting Arrow skill I think.

[blazing swift]

thanks! im gonna start with monk.. so i think think i want arrow stuff going on haha

i think looking at frenzy charges and ways to get them, its easier to get power charges!

from a monk's POV

[alpine vigil]

100% frenzy generation is clunky

[cunning tide]

you absolute legend thanks mate!

[alpine vigil]

if there's nothing more for frenzy I don't see anyone but deadeyes using them

[blazing swift]

yeah... i agree

[alpine vigil]

once every 6.3s or having to mark to get one mark is so bad

[blazing swift]

yeah it was the 6.3s that made me think its pretty bad! unless your deadeye and have a 30% chance to get max frenzies

[maiden karma]

Wondering what's the purpose of the jade club base type

[dusky tartan]

Anyone have any concept of invoker monk

need some ideas

[alpine vigil]

no accuracy needed is interesting

[maiden karma]

If this is all the mace skills we're getting, and melee allegedly doesn't need accuracy, then what is the purpose of an int mace that never misses

[alpine vigil]

why would it not need accuracy

oh it's int lol

[modern tangle]

3 ascendancy nodes they teased are skills. Need to see tooltips to plan supports. 🙃

[maiden karma]

Because accuracy is only a problem for ranged now

[alpine vigil]

uh?

there's a debuff for accuracy at distance but that doesn't mean melee doesn't use accuracy

[dusky tartan]

I feel like i will spend few hours just to theorycraft what i am going to do

[modern tangle]

yup, some melee reaches further

[dusky tartan]

when i have all the info

[maiden karma]

Ok so you'll still use less

But this is an int mace we're talking about

[alpine vigil]

It's just a prereq tho

[maiden karma]

It's not insignificant

[blazing swift]

rue2 has a cool idea i'll try find the video

[modern tangle]

If there's a higher level version then that's for an ES mace build. If not, you could maybe use this one to apply armor break for your other weapon/minions.

[blazing swift]

https://youtu.be/288DVVByZJg?t=673

[maiden karma]

White lvl 46 jade club needs 149 int, compared to an endgame staff needing just a bit over 200

[modern tangle]

I wouldn't stare at the number too hard, jade club was seen last Spring or earlier. lvl 90 staff is recent. Might not be the same scale of attribute numbers on both.

[unreal girder]

if I add multiple projectiles to armour piercing rounds will they fire more projectiles in a barrage or fire in multiple directions?

or we dont know

[silent prawn]

as far as it was seen they fire multiple projectiles straight.

like a barrage

[olive tide]

id imagine it just adds proj to the ones that shoot in a straight line

[olive tide]

i doubt itll split into 3 lanes

[unreal girder]

ah ok

so you cant make it that much better for clear

[modern tangle]

shotguns and nades for clear

[unreal girder]

yeah I'll probably focus on shotguns more, Im not sure I like the delay on grenades plus it seems like every streamer is doing that

[modern tangle]

I agree but delay can possibly be shortened into a point blank explosion.

[olive tide]

so many ppl gonna blind themselves with flash grenades, i love it

[unreal girder]

I'm more intrigued by the lightning/cold shotgun stuff and ballistas

I hope I can make a ballista build where I use the rest of my kit to CC

[tranquil inlet]

Wait you can blind yourself with them?? 😂

[unreal girder]

not just yourself

but every other ally too

[modern tangle]

Play in a well lit room, degenerates.

[stable turtle]

For which are more people leaning towards blood mage or infernalist builds?

[pearl sluice]

as far as I've seen more people are going infernalist because it has more minion stuff and also a cool fire pet and a transformation spell.
Blood mage is what I'll be personally going for but there's kinda less known about what it can do apart from strength and life stacking lol

but I'm just a random D4 refugee so what do I know

[stable turtle]

Yeah that what was my thoughts too

[shy rune]

ok, theoretically, what would be a good secondary weapon for a grenadeer mercenary build?

[pearl sluice]

I have put together something random for blood mage so far but without tooltips and a lot of nodes missing I think especially blood mage builds right now aren't really possible to coherently theorycraft

[modern tangle]

Almost nothing is. Paint and notepad level protobuilds are about right atm.

[pearl sluice]

yeah true, I think bloodmage is one of the ascendancies that could theoretically work with almost anything, kinda like how people are saying Gemling is the most universal class, I actually think bloodmage is on par

[sterile latch]

Is double/triple herald good on paper ? trying to figure what to do with Gemling...

[silent prawn]

another crossbow 😄

[pearl sluice]

bow if ranged or you could go slams with maces

[shy rune]

They hated him because he spoke the truth.

1 crossbow for stun buildup, and another for dmg maybe

[modern tangle]

If one could change weapons to shoot another clip instead of reloading. But I don't think it'll work like that.

[silent prawn]

could try

with weapon sets

one shotgun or rapid set and one grenade

I do wonder how snapshotting will work

[shy rune]

all i know is that stun grenades go hard

and once you get a second one in the tree it becomes real nutty

[static cipher]

new bonkstun

[shy rune]

there's already a tree calculator? lol

[static cipher]

some nodes are missing

but you can make it work

if you focus

o_ o

[shy rune]

we can't live without minmaxing, huh?

[static cipher]

https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app/

https://tenor.com/view/summon-circle-game-crew-group-gif-14054278723258138571

[shy rune]

you may want to look into the grenadier node

[static cipher]

but bonk 😦

https://tenor.com/view/bonk-gif-26414884

[shy rune]

but extra grenade and extra grenade usage ):

[static cipher]

I need the dualwield 2h maces for stun buildup

[shy rune]

that gives you an extra stun grenade and a mini multiple projectile for grenades

[static cipher]

more attack speed = more stun build up again

[shy rune]

stun grenade does 400% stun buildup

[static cipher]

• stun build up passives

[unreal girder]

One for grenades one for guns feels to be the play

[static cipher]

wait what

400%? 😦

[shy rune]

yea

[static cipher]

😦

ALL THAT WORK

where is the crossbow stuff?

https://tenor.com/view/的9-gif-27299608

[unreal girder]

Or one Xbow for Ballista one for shotguns maybe

[shy rune]

one on the bottom

circle node

[static cipher]

woah

there's even minion nodes

wat lol

[silent prawn]

Balistas

[static cipher]

mercenary is god

o_ o

https://tenor.com/view/god-gives-his-strongest-soldiers-his-toughest-battles-god-gives-his-toughest-battles-to-his-strongest-soldiers-jerma-gif-16634214956535250181

[shy rune]

witch hunter all the way, brother

zealous inquisition is the best

[unreal girder]

Really curious if Iron Reflexes will work like Dreamcore says and not care about increased% evasion post conversion cos thatd make it a complete flop

[proven quest]

To expand on what @unreal girder said, I would probably only take one of them, since only one can be active at a time. The best option might be a weapon swap configuration, where your close up skills use one weapon/tree with Stand and Deliver and your more ranged skills use Death from Afar

[leaden violet]

oh yeah, totally forgot we have dual spec

[minor tree]

I've been wanting to make a "store and unleash" kind of build, in a similar vein to surge deathblade in lost ark, does anyone know which class could be the best for it in PoE2 based on what we know thus far?

[silent prawn]

pls explain more

what does it do or should it do

[minor tree]

goal is to have attacks that do meh damage but charge up a beefy finisher, ideally without being tied to an element (as it's something i'm not fond of)

[sterile latch]

i'd check combo support / skills so probably monk

[minor tree]

in lost ark surge would let you have 1 huge attack every 20-30s, at the cost of otherwise meh damage

monk(invoker) and sorceress(stormweaver) can probably go for a barrier invocation/elemental invocation route to charge up and then release a burst of spells all at once

[silent prawn]

combo skill will likely allow that.

[unreal girder]

Slams kinda can do that

[minor tree]

deadeye also has bonuses to generating and consuming frenzy charges

and can use sniper mark to gain them with any skill

[unreal girder]

Almost every class does have these combos, but most of them are element based

[minor tree]

(+ monk in general has that kind of playstyle, but idk how reasonable it'd be to go get spell stuff with it)

[unreal girder]

But really, its about what type of weapon/range/speed you want cos combos are there for every class

[minor tree]

i like being mobile for the most part, it's what made deathblade so appealing to me

since i could go around and just poke, then cash out for a bajillion damage (better not miss)

[sterile latch]

the most obvious are warrior with armour break into warcry into big slam and monk with combo/flicker strike stuff i'd say, or even hammer of god builds with 24s cd

[minor tree]

it's something i've yet to really find elsewhere

[proven quest]

That sounds like a titan might work too. Some meh attacks to reduce armour/ increase stun and then Hammer of the Gods with cries and big damage supports to smash

[minor tree]

or at least, there are combo builds and 1-2 combos (like armor break -> piercing rounds on merc, or skills that consume freeze for example), but those have a much different feel

[tranquil inlet]

Do we know how many bolts are in a crossbow magazine?

[minor tree]

since it's a debuff you stack on an enemy vs you powering up and letting it go off instantly when you want

[minor tree]

i'm super tempted to go hammer of the gods with chronomancer too x)

sorceress casting fist

[graceful stag]

I imagine warrior stun memes

[proven quest]

That might work too. The cooldown reset is sweet, but I the other ascendency nodes are still up in the air, and pathing to physical/ 2h damage might be annoying

[minor tree]

yeah that's my main worry

[minor tree]

i see that more of a combo build though 🤔

or at least, in my head powering yourself up is a lot different than debuffing the enemy for a big strike even if they're functionally similar

also invoker meditate into barrier invocation sounds hella fun

[graceful stag]

I saw stun grenade on crossbows maybe that'll work

[minor tree]

although deadeye has a chance to get max charges when gaining one, a chance to get more out of them and barrage to multiply an attack

i'm so torn x)

is there any build like that in poe1?

[minor tree]

oh and it has the advantage that you can use your stacking skills vs weak enemies and instantly blow up tougher enemies the moment they show up!

i'm looking at EI + ember fusillade in particular, since with max energy it should cast it 10x, which is the cap (gives it +40% dmg)

[proven quest]

I have a a generic text doc build for a titan debuff/ self buff build. I’m not on my pc right now but I can send it over when I have the chance if you want. Very much a work in progress

[minor tree]

absolutely!

i'm very curious about the self buff since for warrior most of it is armor breaking/stunning

Oh do attributes affect damage scaling of attacks?

[proven quest]

Tl;dr is warcry/ Rage/ Empowered damage support on a “builder” attack, and then armour break/ stun on enemy, then huge attack

[minor tree]

From what I could see it's only mana/HP/accuracy and they let you wear different gear

[proven quest]

The amount of more multipliers you can get into Hammer of the Gods is insane

[minor tree]

If so maybe a monk with just barely enough dex and a lot of int can still use quarterstaves effectively

[proven quest]

Attributes initially only have the one affect from each (str=life, int=mana, dex=accuracy), and fixing stat requirements for gear and gems. There are nodes on the tree that modify that though

But “stacking” specific stats is one way to build very strong characters in poe1, so I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s also a good late game build in 2

[minor tree]

so a warrior with 0 int does as much damage of an equally geared/leveled sorceress with 1000 int casting spark?

[unreal girder]

Depends on the skill

You can check the gems on poe2db to see

[unreal girder]

A warrior with 0 int will not be able to use spark

But int does not directly increase your dmg, it can increase it indirectly though

[minor tree]

rage suport skills are something i didn't consider, they'd probably fit right in!

[minor tree]

that's all good!
plan for now is to either go stormweaver, but ideally invoker with just enough dex and otherwise a lot of int

[static cipher]

cough https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app/

https://tenor.com/view/ifht-carbon-dealer-mtb-mountainbike-gif-20969945

[minor tree]

quarterstaff skills to shock/freeze enemies and have some mobility, eleemental invocation to cash out and nuke the world using spells

[tranquil inlet]

I'm not seeing it - Incendiary shot says 10 bolts per burst, but how many bolts are in the magazine - basically how do I know how often it'll need a reload?

[static cipher]

from what i've seen you can have up to 70

maybe more

70 confirmed

[tranquil inlet]

On all crossbow shot skills?

[static cipher]

not sure

[tranquil inlet]

Is that something that will be supported on the tree?

[static cipher]

you can check what's there, on the tree so far?

but im not sure

[tranquil inlet]

hmm ok

[static cipher]

I know there's some crossbow stuff uncovered

towards bottom of merc

I did merc melee bonk so idk

[tranquil inlet]

so we just don't really know it sounds like

[static cipher]

yea, its pretty up in the air

[minor tree]

some have 100+

forgot the name but it's the full auto one that builds up heat

[static cipher]

merc looks crazy for melee tho

[smoky sparrow]

Does anyone else plan on playing co-op mode solo on launch? Playing two characters at once sounds like next level gaming 😄

[static cipher]

supposedly you could just load him in and he'd autofollow

and you'd get better loot

but who knows

lol

keep turning on controllers

and the loot goes up

😆

[smoky sparrow]

I got dual 1h controllers

[static cipher]

spec all the robot followers with magic find stuff lol

[pastel forge]

if you want some big burst like surge, you can do staff+mace

[unreal girder]

Well loot goes up but it zakes twice as long to kill things

[static cipher]

irrelevant you're just not bonking hard enough

lol

[smoky sparrow]

solo bro ssf 😄

[static cipher]

https://tenor.com/view/bonk-piggies-piggy-pigs-rodents-gif-25600042

[minor tree]

oh shit i like this

[pastel forge]

you should be able to add in a warcry too before you hammer

[hoary plover]

please elaborate

[static cipher]

well when your friend goes afk and you continue on

he's sort of just......dragged

along

lol

but it doesnt hinder you from progressing

[static cipher]

so theoretically you can couch coop multiple toons

and just... do better with your build

and you'd get more loot

[minor tree]

if only barrage worked with mace

[static cipher]

in theory anyway

[hoary plover]

so i can just make an aurabot alt that follows me around

[smoky sparrow]

co-op mode will be unethical

[static cipher]

I dont see why you cant? XD

[hoary plover]

hilarious

[static cipher]

monsters get harder but that's literally it

and the tradeoff is more loot quantity

[hoary plover]

anyway, does anyone have a tooltip for the secondary explosion from gas skills?

[pastel forge]

but what aura tho

[static cipher]

all the auras

yes

[pastel forge]

you get...discipline

[hoary plover]

yes im sure those are gonna be the only 3 auras in the game

[static cipher]

xD

[pastel forge]

later sure

for now its what we got yea

[smoky sparrow]

scepters have aura skills that we dont know about

[pastel forge]

vitality/clarity were changed to supp gems instead as well

[static cipher]

what if making smurf npc robot couch coop friends is best way to juice maps later

[smoky sparrow]

thats my plan

[static cipher]

😮

[hoary plover]

tbh if you're gonna go that route you're prob better off just loading up on minions

[static cipher]

why not do... BOTH?

O______O

[short rover]

mana stacking cursebot to follow you around 🤔

[smoky sparrow]

blasphemy!

[unreal girder]

So it seems like unless it specifies its one clip per shot

[static cipher]

only problem is he'd prob be stuck on edge of screen all the time lol

idk aura range

xD

[unreal girder]

Some do specify 14 abd 70

[hoary plover]

just spec aoe

[unreal girder]

Others dont

[static cipher]

xD

[smoky sparrow]

not with dual 1h controllers!

[static cipher]

this sounds really broken and overlooked

[short rover]

control the aurabot with a foot pedal ez

[static cipher]

what if its actually broken

xD

[shrewd socket]

is it possible to survive archmage on bloodmage?

[pastel forge]

yes, if you lifetap ball lightning instead of casting off mana and use eternal youth to get constantly recharging hp

with MoM of course

[static cipher]

https://tenor.com/view/meonly-gif-19710542

[smoky sparrow]

dual witch minion solo bro ssf hc, log in!

[static cipher]

im doing gemling melee dualwield 2h stun bonk armoursloot

[proven quest]

I’m thinking about trying this too. I want to add combo finisher to Hammer, but I’m wondering if you can use 2 combo skills in succession, or if using one combo skill removes all combos

[static cipher]

using a combo finisher removes combo charges

yea

you cant combo finisher and then combo finisher xD

[shrewd socket]

what is eternal youth and how does lifetap ball lightning help?

[pastel forge]

eternal youth lets you recharge on hp instead of ES

base recharge rate is 12.5%

and there are recharge passives for 25%/40% faster recharge

with MoM your big manapool used to empower archmage can be used as a healthpool to protect hp

so hp will always be in a state of recharge

2k hp = 250hp recharge per second

with higher hp and some recharge passives, you can easily recharge 500+ hp per second to use to cast your spells

well, 1 spell

with lifetap

most likely ball lightning

[proven quest]

I love the idea of basically switching it so mana is your life is your resource

[short rover]

as bloodmage you will also be able to overflow your life picking up those orbs too, so thats another form of life regen. I will say though that stacking life AND mana sounds kinda annoying

[static cipher]

https://tenor.com/view/uhh-cat-meow-meowmeow-confused-gif-8057852975940592422

[pastel forge]

well its mainly gear you have to worry about

passive-wise you just grab all the mana and regen you can get

you gotta get hp and mana on your gear to scale both hp (for recharge) and mana (for archmage)

[static cipher]

thats so complicated though

when do you bonk?

[proven quest]

I don’t think that’ll be too bad, but I think trying to ALSO get crit will be hard

[pastel forge]

for now crit doesnt seem worth it

you have access to maybe 100% crit chance passives

which is nothing overall

[violet grove]

What is Monk's current easiest way of keeping power charges?

[pastel forge]

9% x2 = 18%

it aint gonna do much with gore spikes

[short rover]

shocking chilled enemies probably

[violet grove]

Is that a new support? Power charge on shocking chilled?

[short rover]

no its a passive node near the monk start

[violet grove]

Oh snap

[silent prawn]

does Flame wall accumulate ignite on every hit?

or just once?

[short rover]

and then its very near this too so if you're doing power charge stuff might as well grab this too

[violet grove]

All fire damage can apply an ignite; so as the wall continues to tick it will check to see if it can apply an ignite

(if you have chance to ignite, which would roll)

[ancient geyser]

wasn't a problem in poe1, archmage builds stack life AND mana because MoM isn't 100% unlike poe2

[violet grove]

Wtf, these notables are straight up from ascendancies... This is crazy good

[proven quest]

I’m not following this math lol. How much life are you expecting to have?

[short rover]

yeah but it seems these are more scarce in poe2 than poe1, no (or very few) life nodes on tree, higher base mana numbers indicate that might be rarer to get too etc

[pastel forge]

that's for crit

[ancient geyser]

that's even better for the build then, life will come from gear and the tree can be specialized on mana and caster stats

[blazing swift]

how do you guys think siphoning strike works with shock. like if it inflicts shocks will it proct a power charge??

[pastel forge]

you have, at most, access maybe 100% crit chance passives

which makes Gore Spikes on bloodmage kinda pointless

because you wont get any consistent crit with just 100%

[proven quest]

Ahh ok, you were talking about crit chance. Got it

[pastel forge]

so we need to see what other ascendancy is on bloodmage to see if gore spikes is even worth building for

[ancient geyser]

gore spikes might need bottled faith type shii to be properly useable

[pastel forge]

for now archmage seems better suited for stormweaver or even chrono if they have decent dmg passives

actually since crit is kinda bad, you might as well use controlled destruction on arc lol

[sterile latch]

It seems very unlikely to not have any crit% on gear end game though

[pastel forge]

well, we saw the lvl 90 staff

had like 17% crit?

or was it 20-ish

[sterile latch]

isnt crit usually on gloves on poe1 ?

[pastel forge]

we'll see i guess

im just not too optimistic about crits for now

[proven quest]

I agree, planning on being crit capped on your first character in early access Poe 2 is probably not the safest choice

[pastel forge]

since respeccing is easy now there's no reason to not change when you get appropriate gear anyway

[blazing swift]

orb of storms bolts. do they count as projectiles?

[short rover]

it doesnt have the proj tag so likely no

[pastel forge]

man

looking at poe1 tree

crits are much more plentiful lol

[blazing swift]

Ahh smart!

[pastel forge]

4 nodes total 115% crit just at witch starting area

[drifting cedar]

If you have an alternate weapon skill tree, do you HAVE to have a secondary weapon to use that tree, or can you assign both trees to your primary weapon?

I mean to say, can I have a tree dedicated to attacking / moving faster with my main weapons, and a tree dedicated to stunning and dealing damage

but not swap to another weapon set

[pastel forge]

seems mandatory

unless you can set the same weapon on both slots

[silent prawn]

you can use weaponset points as additional tree points if you won't use the swap function

but only from one set

[drifting cedar]

wait, really?

so gemling legionnaire can just get +20 skill points on his tree for 1 weapon set?

that doesn't seem right

[tranquil inlet]

The gemling will convert 20 more tree points into set points that can be swapped

So 40/122 instead of 20/122

[drifting cedar]

Isn't that how they all work? not really additional points

[silent prawn]

ah so its not additional :/

[tranquil inlet]

Yeah 20 extra points would make them the best ascendancy by far

[silent prawn]

but you get weapon set points from challenges, no?

[tranquil inlet]

Yes

Afaik

[silent prawn]

Ah then they are compared to quest reward skill points probably.

[tranquil inlet]

Exactly

[silent prawn]

like 99 from lvl and 24 from quests

or 23

[tranquil inlet]

Everyone will get ~102 regular passive points and ~20 weapon points. Then gremlins will take a node that swaps 20 more to weapon

[unreal girder]

Thats witch hunter

[tranquil inlet]

Oh right

[drifting cedar]

I had it wrong earlier and poisoned the well on that one

[distant dome]

Bonestorm with both "Cast on Critical" and "Cast while channeling" seems like fun times for Blood Mage witch

Lots of projectiles = Lots of crits

[tawny rivet]

I'm doing the cast on ailment stacks, and play for shock

[distant dome]

And you can cast all your offerings split between those two "Cast on" triggers things to keep all the tempoary minions (zombies/unearth) alive, while having power charges pouring out of your ears

[tawny rivet]

but Idk what I'll let it cast, orb or arcs

[drifting cedar]

orb is limited to 2 with support right

[tawny rivet]

not that orb

[short rover]

what do you guys think the least intrusive/annoying way to chill enemies for the power charge node would be on a Lightning focused monk

[tawny rivet]

this orb, well it's a ball

[drifting cedar]

lightning spell or attack?

[short rover]

either tbh, not sure

[silent prawn]

Frost bomb maybe?

or ice nova

or just add cold dmg supports

with some freeze buildup support

[short rover]

yeah the added cold dam will nuke the lightning damage though :/

[drifting cedar]

if going staff, can pretty easily use any of the available phys to cold convert attacks

and just alternate

I don't know of a way for monk to chill with lightning damage at present but its not like we have a complete picture yet

[tawny rivet]

does this mean that, when triggered it'll wait for the cast time of the socketed skill to actually shoot it?

[drifting cedar]

this is the situation that weapon passives are made for

[short rover]

potentially, provided there is decent ways to leech off elemental damage in poe 2, otherwise losing even more phys damage might hurt

dont think we've seen any of those yet

[worthy cliff]

Hello! I am new to poe2 and was wondering if every class can use every weapon skill how does that differentiate your starting class?

[pseudo charm]

How I see it, if Siphoning Strike shocks, you'll have to attack again to consume it, then again to apply. Rinse and repeat. Use Coursing Conduit?/Shock Proliferation then at least you can also consume shocks on nearby targets in your next attacks.

[silent prawn]

class only select the starting point on the passive skill tree and ascendencies.
weapon defines gameplay

[short rover]

Yes, and your starting class determines the spell you get in the first zone, your available ascendancies, and where you start on the tree. Everything else is pretty much fair game in PoE

[hoary plover]

starting class determines your ascendancy class choices, and your starting position on the tree. a warrior can use spells but will be further away from those passives, for example

[worthy cliff]

Oh interesting! So a warrior can't have the same ascendency as a merc I'm guessing. When you say further away from the passives can you explain? Can a warrior get the same exact passives as a sorcerer for example eventually?

[tawny rivet]

what's the difference between these two? why is one meta and the other a buff when they sorta do the same thing

[drifting cedar]

they can REACH all the same passives, but can never have the same total passive tree allocation

[pseudo charm]

Isnt there a notable just slightly south of monk start that adds 5% of dmg as cold? Maybe thats enough to ensure chills.

[drifting cedar]

you get to choose when to fire off EI and it can repeat spells

[modern tangle]

@short rover I consider this significantly uncertain but the feature "hits are freezing" might mean that all damage dealt by a skill contributes to freeze, not just cold damage. This appears on qstaff's Wave of Frost and the Comet spell.

[drifting cedar]

so you can store up a bunch of arcs or w/e and unleash them on a boss

[silent prawn]

eventually yes, just takes points to get there

[short rover]

The warrior can path up to Sorcerer nodes for sure, but its more investment to do so. Effectively this means that while a warrior can do Sorceress shit, it will never do it quite as efficiently as a Sorceress, and vice versa

[short rover]

this would be quite nice lol

infinite power charge printing monk

[hoary plover]

correct. each class has their unique ascendancy choices. a warrior can be a titan or warbringer, a mercenary can be a witchunter or gemling, etc. those sub-classes have unique passives that only that class gets.
the main passive tree is the same for every class though. so a warrior could make a lightning spell build, or a bow build, but because the warrior starts in the strength area of the tree, they would need to spend more points to reach the relevant passives for those builds.

[worthy cliff]

So a class has a fixed passive tree unique from other classes but the passive tree may have same overlaps of same passives?

[worthy cliff]

Oohhh same passive tree for all classes?

[drifting cedar]

I think (and could be mistaken) that "hits are freezing" essentially means 100% freeze chance, i.e not dependent on the amount of damage on the hit, in order to build freeze status. However, I do not know if it means that non-cold damage can also freeze. It is also likely that the damage of the hit still determines the AMOUNT of freeze buildup.

[tawny rivet]

but like there is a clear power difference between them, maybe because of the level difference of the spells but, cast on shock needs 6 shocks to trigger one 1 sec cast time ability, and the other requires 1 shock

[modern tangle]

I don't think they can give us a button that 100% fills freeze threshold without cooldown.

[drifting cedar]

its pretty likely that the tooltip on EI is wrong

[drifting cedar]

freeze builds up slowly

[hoary plover]

yeah the big tree is the same for everyone. each class just starts in a slightly different place. near the center, but on their respective "side".
the top of the tree is mostly int nodes, bottom left is strength, bottom right is dexterity. then hybrid nodes in between those areas.

[tawny rivet]

mm seems so, ty

[hearty oracle]

guys, do u think this will work on Rolling Slam (not really a travel skill?)

[worthy cliff]

Ty!

[drifting cedar]

it needs to have the travel tag

[short rover]

yes, here's an example. Say you want to get to the green circled nodes for whatever reason. The Witch/Sorceress starts on Blue, the Warrior starts on Red. Its MUCH easier to get to those nodes coming from the Witch start than the Warrior start. You absolutely CAN get those nodes on Warrior, there is nothing preventing it, it's just way more investment than on another class

[drifting cedar]

stampede yes, rolling slam no

[hearty oracle]

how bout this for Rolling Slam?

[drifting cedar]

yes that should work

assuming it goes over 2 meters per usage the end slam should get the 40%

[atomic halo]

def one of the use cases they had in mind

[hearty oracle]

2 metres is so vague

[short rover]

o damn i missed this, maybe 🤔

[supple moss]

How viable does anyone think a Titan that uses ice skills is?

[modern tangle]

Which skills?

[drifting cedar]

we haven't seen any ice skills that scream titan to me, and titan is far from cold stuff

maybe using a quarterstaff

would just be a weird monk with better warcries i reckon

[supple moss]

Ice nova, the frost armor...idk. I'm not of all of them. I just think it would be cool to have a titan that uses freezing abilities. Flavor wise of course lol.

[drifting cedar]

so ice spellcaster?

[silent prawn]

could do unarmed tho

btw i wonder if it is still no gloves for unarmed :/

[drifting cedar]

I think cold spellcaster titan is likely to be an underperforming build

[silent prawn]

or was that unburdened?

[atomic halo]

you have to justify with ascendancy choice

what are you picking there

[static plinth]

Do we know if ailment grounds still just instantly apply the ailment?

[static plinth]

Hold your breath for Glacial Hammer or Ice Crash

Or use a Quarterstaff, actually

That should be fine

[drifting cedar]

quarterstaff is dex/int and cold stuff is largely in the pure int area, no? gonna be strange

[modern tangle]

Titan has known synergies with armor stacking, life stacking, stuns (melee & phys), slams. You've named 2 skill gems that require a decent amount of int to keep using higher level versions.
I'm not seeing what connects these ideas yet. Personally I like using quarterstaff for freeze+stuns and that could certainly be a titan.

[short rover]

there's probably a staff-two handed mace swap build with Glacial Cascade on the staff to freeze and a more standard physical slam on the mace, but i def wouldnt do spellcaster titan

[static plinth]

Might be able to just build melee passives? If they're "melee damage" and not "melee physical damage" or such

[drifting cedar]

use this to buff big 2h mace slams

seems like a good use case for staff + 2h mace, and could probably be a titan. but not cold, really

[static plinth]

God maybe i should just play Monk

Combo is cool

[short rover]

Hammer of the Gods maybe?

[drifting cedar]

you dont have to go monk to combo

[short rover]

guaranteed crit hammers with 90% bonus lol

[drifting cedar]

yeah, lots of people are looking at that combo for ignite hammer

as infernalist or using avatar of fire

[short rover]

the "fuck this boss in particular" combo

[static plinth]

Would you be able to build 15 combo, then use Mantra of Destruction + Hourglass Skill?

[drifting cedar]

oh, back to back mantras?

[supple moss]

Ok maybe I'm being to specific. I just want to use freezing/frost stuff with a melee focus. I don't want to just play sorc.

[drifting cedar]

monk might be your guy

[modern tangle]

It's more likely that the Mantra gem will only count to 10. Notice the text mentions maximum combo. You wouldn't be able reach "20 combo" to store another cast.

[static plinth]

Then yeah, use a Quarterstaff, or pray for Glacial Hammer/Ice Crash to return as skills

[short rover]

there is DEFINITELY a way to do freeze focused melee yeah, esp on monk but maybe even titan. Invoker Monk specifically looks like it has a lot of cold damage interaction

[static plinth]

It doesnt mention maximum combo, and all combo gems have different required amounts of combo

[drifting cedar]

this could also be a templar thing in the future, he was the original "elemental attacker" in the first game and we have zero str/int classes in the playtest

[drifting cedar]

it says on reaching maximum combo. I wonder what determines your max combo

[static plinth]

Oh i guess it does

[drifting cedar]

does it add all your combo spenders? just use your biggest one?

[static plinth]

I think thats the largest one we've seen so maybe its 10

[modern tangle]

Quarterstaff offers inherent freeze skills, maces don't. Doesn't mean you can't build your own skill/combo but there should preferably be some reason to do it that way. Some unique items may later provide a reason.
Anyway we only get these 2 melee weapon types for EA launch so qstaff seems more suitable for what you want.

[hoary plover]

do we know if crossbows use quivers?

[tranquil inlet]

They do not

[drifting cedar]

they use grenades, right?

in the offhand

[static plinth]

Grenades arent offhands anymore

[supple moss]

Thanks guys. I'll into the monk.

[static plinth]

Just skills

[drifting cedar]

blagh

[short rover]

i interpreted combo as just "number of skills you have to use before using combo skill", so like for Mantra you have to hit with 10 separate attacks without going 5 seconds between them and then you can use it

so high attack speed stuff is better, like Tempest Flurry

[static plinth]

Do we know how combo is built? If its per hit or per skill use

[tranquil inlet]

I think skills have to be specifically tagged combo

[modern tangle]

All we really have is "Build combo by successfully striking Enemies with other skills." It could be hits.

[drifting cedar]

I would imagine its probably per skill use

would be dumb easy to build up otherwise

[short rover]

I highly doubt its hits because one good AOE pack and you have full combo lol

im guessing its skills that hit something

[static plinth]

Also wonder if you can build it with spells

[short rover]

so no pre stacking combo on nothing before going to fight the boss

is "strike" specific language in PoE?

that would be the only thing preventing it from being spells

[static plinth]

Strikes are a specific type of melee skill but thats not how its being used here

[drifting cedar]

strikes used to be much more specific

[static plinth]

Wonder if there'll be passives that interact with Combo on the tree

[drifting cedar]

they almost mean "not slams" now, but there are just a couple melee skills that are neither strikes nor slams

[pastel forge]

just stack attack speed on your main spam skill to build combo

[static plinth]

Cyclone my goat

[pastel forge]

im just curious if you can stack combo using a different weapon

like using mace skill while quaterstaff is in swap

[static plinth]

Im crying what do you mean Consecrated Path is just a support now lmfao

Also that is so unnecessarily specific

[drifting cedar]

i mean if you're using leap slam to cull/travel/maim/whatever, might as well heal you too lol

[short rover]

Wait is Conductivity not in poe 2? Or we just haven't seen it yet

[distant dome]

Bonestorm looks to do a lot of projectiles, possibly good for a blood mage trying to activate "Cast on Critical" if each projectile counts as a seperate trigger

this is like 15+ projectiles

[drifting cedar]

how much channel time per projectile?

[distant dome]

Unsure.

[drifting cedar]

also does coc have an internal cd this time around? might be weird if they all hit at once

[distant dome]

Also unsure if cast time affects the channel tiem

[distant dome]

I'm guessing it's like "Cast while channeling" and the amount energy you need to activate is every .1 Base spell cast time =10 energy

so 6 crits = 0.6 spell cast

which could be really interesting for Bonestorm

as one cast of bonestorm might be able to do that, if we can get high crit chance

I have no idea what level of crit chance to expect

in game

[drifting cedar]

yeah but in poe 1, for example, if you shot 30 projectiles and they all crit at the same moment you'd only cast on crit once becaue of the internal CD on cast on crit itself

[distant dome]

Well yeah, but PoE 1 it only takes 1 crit to cast things

vs. Building up

[drifting cedar]

fair

[distant dome]

it migth still have an internal CD

But Bonestorm will work for BOTH Cast on Critical And Cast on Channeling so...

[drifting cedar]

also very fair

[pastel forge]

i counted roughly +77% crit chance so far which is not a lot

[distant dome]

is that 1.77 x 15%, for a total of like 26.5% crit?

[pastel forge]

yea

if 15% is base

[exotic compass]

Damn first messages in poe2 server and it's scriblet yappin... Good

[distant dome]

Do you know me from D4? :p

[exotic compass]

Yeah oh I should change my name

I usually hang around Sorc/Necro/hardcore over there

[distant dome]

yeah

I might have made spirit wave in PoE 2, but I expect a ton of things not to actually work with raging spirit

it was pretty funny

[exotic compass]

I showed that infographic to my friends

One has played Poe, the other hasn't

[distant dome]

I put all my "yappin" collected here in this thread, follow my rambles: https://discord.com/channels/174993814845521922/1312364755406688256

I have a bunch of differnet ideas I'll need to test

[exotic compass]

Nice, I'm sure it'll be first of many forums to help Diablo noobs enter the new world lol

[distant dome]

and eventually I'll clean it up into a couple actual builds

Yeah, my first youtube content will be helping Noobromancers Learn to Witch

.... Noobromancer... lol

[modern tangle]

romancing noobs with witch builds

[exotic compass]

This has helped me a lot

[distant dome]

I gotta send that to Lord Saura

Kay and I just peer pressured him into buying EA

[exotic compass]

Choosing an ascendancy is more important/permanent than starting position right? If I went Merc to be gemling, but wanted to force mostly sorc/witch, do we know if that's troll or just slightly suboptimal?

[distant dome]

Yes, but also, meh

[hoary plover]

depends how "offspec" you're going and what you're gaining from it

[distant dome]

Ascendancies are the real "classes" in this game

but I feel like I have SO MUCH TO LEARN on my first character

[exotic compass]

Yeah

[distant dome]

that whatever I pick is like

quicksand

it'll change

once I have a better understanding of the game

[exotic compass]

I'm definitely one to start fresh rather than push a single char for hundreds of hours

Sadly Poe doesn't cater to that too well

[distant dome]

ESPECIALLY during Early Access, where stuff will change more often and our builds will regularly get bricked

[hoary plover]

so with the new ailment system, upfront pre-mitigation is all that matters right?
so "projectile damage" would still benefit my ignites, since the projectile that applies the ignite does more damage?
or would that only affect the ignite application since the buildup is also influenced by damage?

[modern tangle]

Both application and base damage should be based on pre-mitigation hit damage. But when the ailment's own dmg actually happens, it is affected by mitigation. So penetration or lowering resist could be important still.

[proven quest]

And to be extra specific about this, the ignite would be only based on the fire damage part of the projectile

[hoary plover]

well penetration wouldn't, but exposure would, i think

[distant dome]

Yeah... I won't know for a while which witch ascendancy I want to go. A lot of people said Fire seemed to be a good minion one, but then I looked a bonestorm synergies and suddenly Blood Mage seemed like a good minion one too

[frail jay]

penetration doesn't work

[distant dome]

Cast while Channeling + Power Offering + 30% extra power chance on power offering = ~2.1 Power charges per second while casting Bonestorm.... so every bonestorm = Power charged, excess power charges dump into power charged zombie spawning with no corpses needed

[exotic compass]

Maybe I've been going at it the wrong way. Choosing a class based on ascendancy is tough if we only know half the nodes you can take...

Choosing a class where you like BOTH ascendancy themes even if one of them doesn't quite have the "cool" nodes revealed yet

[worthy cliff]

Very interesting

[distant dome]

Yeah, do that

IMO

[exotic compass]

I would say infernalist, stormweaver, and gemling are my top 3, followed by both warrior ascendancies

[distant dome]

Infernalist looks sick to me if Ragining Spirits work for crazy synergy. Otherwise I'm going Boney Blood Mage

[exotic compass]

But blood mage and Chrono and witch hunter didn't seem as appealing, guessing if my duo goes STR I'll go INT for sure

[distant dome]

The managing flame thing with Infernalist seems tedius to me

[exotic compass]

Still trying to figure out when I would be using "minions and occult spells" if I choose to have skills from other classes

[distant dome]

In other games with similar mechanics I've found it annoying

[exotic compass]

Or ran Merc with witch spells... What am I using the crossbow for?

[frail jay]

Just build fire mitigation and ignore heat

[exotic compass]

It's like Rumble passive from league lol

[frail jay]

I'm probably starting infernalist because it looks good for a lot of different things

[exotic compass]

Overheat

[silent prawn]

when you are able to choose the ascendancy, you can preview every node

[distant dome]

I'm with you, unless I REALLY LIKE bonestorm

[exotic compass]

Well yeah

[frail jay]

Minion hit, Selfcast hit (multiple different setups), Selfcast Ailment, Minion ignite

[exotic compass]

But I'd be hours into a char before ascending?

[frail jay]

I'm expecting there will be some busted spectres

[distant dome]

same. I'm actually really interested in finding the "cheapest" specter. Like 20 spirit that has a ranged attack to combine with flame wall damage amp/bone storm damage amp

[proven quest]

I think this is an easy way to do it. Max fire res, armour and heat proofing will make this fairly negligible

[silent prawn]

if they keep the abilities like in the showcase, indeed

[hoary plover]

im trying to work out some plans for a gas explosion build. the gas arrow has a 134% damage value compared to gas grenade's 66%.
with added fire/fire conversion the gas arrow would hit, ignite, release gas, explode, ignite again but bigger.

damage/scaling-wise the arrow itself would be proj and fire (with AoF/added/etc), the gas is whatever, and the explosion i'm assuming is aoe and fire.
so fire/aoe is the "main" damage but proj damage would help me ignite more easily.

trying to cram it all in one skill because it seems to me that the gas arrow is better than grenade, but the detonation skill seems better on xbow than bow, and im not sure if committing to a weapon swap is wise/would feel good.

totally depends on how the gas explosions actually work, which i've seen no info on yet. it might not actually matter what the skill that created the gas is, in which case just the "standard" xbow grenade angle everyone else is looking at would pob be smoother.

[frail jay]

Yeah and even if you don't do that, having effectively 10% mana regen/sec after not casting for 2sec sounds really nice

base mana regen is probably still like 1.5%

[modern tangle]

4%

[frail jay]

Still a lot lower

[distant dome]

Gas Arrow from Merc or "Skeleton Archer" - oh nm

So there's two gas "arrow" skills :p

[proven quest]

Good point. If you can get minions out to do some damage for you for a few seconds, you can control your infernal flame fairly well

[frail jay]

I feel like ignite minions might end up being quite good, just play whatever is the best minion then float flame >30% with minimal selfcasting

and the minions just act like they are fire damage for ignite

[distant dome]

Fire spell effects also look sick as hell.

[hoary plover]

yeah im talking about the one literally called "gas arrow"

[proven quest]

And then self cast a spell every so often for big ignites

[distant dome]

Do you think minions causing ignite will count towards "Cast on ignite"

[frail jay]

Gas Grenade is 66% but explosive grenade is 285%

[frail jay]

No it says when you ignite

[frail jay]

The minions ignite themselves

[distant dome]

Bleh, forking

[frail jay]

TBH though I'm probably going to avoid ignite because they completely fucked ignite prolif

Enemies have to be in prolif range for 2 seconds before it spreads to them

[hoary plover]

yes but explosive grenade is not a gas explosion combo. lots of people are looking at straight grenades, i wanted to explore a different angle

[frail jay]

what's the advantage of a gas explosion combo?

[hoary plover]

i dunnno, it sounds cool

whats the advantage of [thing that doesnt do the objectively best damage]

[frail jay]

could be any number of things? Ailments/Crit/AOE/Different scaling/Combo with something else

It seemed like the only thing you pointed out was the damage though

For comparing gas arrow and gas grenade

[hoary plover]

different scaling, potentially better aoe, not cooldown limited

gas arrow has higher base damage than grenade but that might not matter depending how the explosion is handled.
arrow itself is an attack skill that can deliver its own ignite for self-detonation, grenade is just gas and needs a second thing to trigger it

again, requires info on how the secondary explosion is handled. its possible that any skill that creates gas triggers the same explosion. arrow/grenade/skeleton might make zero difference or it might matter a lot. we dont know yet

[frail jay]

TBH these tooltips don't seem complete. I don't think we know gas DoT or how much damage detonating gas actually does

[proven quest]

They do, but I think it’ll be hard to scale the ignite damage because their hits are smaller. If you have a spell with a bigger hit, then all the minion damage will increase the magnitude of a larger hit. Might scale better

[frail jay]

I don't think it works that way

[hoary plover]

yes, thats what im saying. so all i can think about right now is how it would work mechanically, and make some assumptions.
assuming base damage does matter, i opted for the skill with higher base damage.
we also know that poe2 is very heavy on skill combos, but the skill that could "self combo" also seemed appealing

[frail jay]

I feel like gas grenade can probably self combo with heat

but yeah I see the appeal of gas arrow

[proven quest]

How do you think it works?

[frail jay]

although it's probably going to be MUCH easier to detonate gas arrow with something else

[modern tangle]

They're not. Ingame tooltips can have multiple tabs but poe2db.tw doesn't support it. And even if it did, the people making videos don't show the tooltips fully.

[frail jay]

I think magnitude is probably relative to the size of hits and scales ignite additively with the igniting hit so you can't just stack magnitude with fast hitting fire damage then do a big fire hit and multiply it, but rather ignite magnitude just means when you do ignite you get the damage of the non-igniting hits before that added in.

[proven quest]

But that means that because smaller hits are less likely to ignite, your big hit will consume the magnitude. Remember that ignite is instance based, and the only damage you get is the current biggest ignite. It doesn’t stack as long as it follows the rules of poe

[frail jay]

Yes? What's your point

I'm also guessing magnitude might affect ignite chance, but we'll have to see about that

[hoary plover]

yeah the way i see it is you've got gas grenade + explosive shot with xbows, or gas arrow + detonating arrow for bows.
xbow seems to have lower base damage values, but multiple grenades would also be multiple hits (useless for ignite?)
bow's detonator skill is a channel which i dont personally like, but has much higher damage values (and might not be so bad since we can move and channel now)

[hoary plover]

i think it does, unless im misremembering/understanding

[frail jay]

I mean you can also use like incendiary shot to ignite enemies and then just shoot gas on them

or you can do flame wall or oil grenade for burning

[hoary plover]

also all valid options

back to my original point, i was looking at if it were possible/viable to not need a combo and just have the gas arrow self ignite

[proven quest]

My point is that bigger hit = bigger ignite. Small fast hits are not good for ignite, so the ignite from minions will most likely not be large

[frail jay]

I mean it probably is, but probably not in an easy way

Probably infernalist lol

[frail jay]

My point is bigger hit = bigger ignite isn't really that true with how I think ignite works

I mean kinda true but mostly for trash

[short rover]

Correct me if I’m wrong but I’m pretty sure ggg literally said bigger hit = bigger ignite

[frail jay]

Yeah but I'm talking about the actual ignite mechanics not something meaningless like that

[drifting cedar]

yeah no its fully true, its just pre-mitigation damage

[frail jay]

Because of ignite magnitude existing

[drifting cedar]

so if hit smaller because high mitigation, still big ignite

do we have any concrete proof of what ignite magnitude is? it could just be a word for damage

[frail jay]

A bunch of small hits that proc an ignite with the magnitude from all of them vs one single hit that does the samage damage as all those hits should be the same damage

[drifting cedar]

is your first example a real thing? I thought ignites didn't build up like freezes

[frail jay]

As I understand it hits that can have ignite chance but don't ignite store that damage as magnitude and it's consumed when you proc an ignite to increase the ignite damage

[modern tangle]

You can just search for "effect of ignite" in https://poe-2-skill-tree-planner.vercel.app/. Idk which one is the newer wording, that or magnitude, but it should be the same thing.

[frail jay]

Effect of ignite is ignite dot multi basically

[proven quest]

Are you assuming that magnitude is tracked for each source of damage? A bunch of small hits won’t ignite (ignite chance is based on damage), and then a big hit consuming that magnitude would be a bigger ignite

[hoary plover]

per the poe2wiki which cites viperesque
the chance to apply ignite depends on the amount of pre-mitigation damage dealt relative to 25% of the monster's ailment threshold. Critical strikes do not inherently always apply ailments, but they do indirectly affect the chance to apply ailments due to critical damage bonus affecting the damage dealt. Because the ignite chance is determined pre-mitigation, resistances and other damage reduction do not affect it.
The higher the Fire damage dealt, the higher the chance and the higher the damage of the ignite.

[frail jay]

and a bunch of small hits that don't ignite and then a bunch more small hits qual to that big hit would be the same ignite I think

Like I said I'm guessing magnitude will factor into chance

[modern tangle]

Stop guessing and provide a single source that hints that.

[short rover]

Not saying you’re wrong here but I haven’t seen this and I’m interested, where was this revealed? The storing as magnitude bit

[drifting cedar]

I might be blind but where is magnitude mentioned there?

[frail jay]

Just how the mechanic works otherwise magnitude is gonna be really silly

[proven quest]

Nope, each hit applies its own instance of ignite. So a bunch of small hits would be a bunch of small ignites

And the biggest of those small ignites would be doing damage

[hoary plover]

might have replied to the wrong comment

[frail jay]

If the hits ignite, which they don't unless they have ignite chance, and to have ignite chance they need to reach ailment threshold. But I'm guessing magnitude will factor into reaching ailment threshold to get ignite chance.

[modern tangle]

LOOK

[short rover]

I interpreted the magnitude part of the infernalist node to just mean that all damage contributes to the calculation of the ignite based on the hit, so like if your spell is doing 30% extra lightning damage, that damage is ALSO contributing to the size of the ignite

[frail jay]

If it doesn't you're gonna have people doing silly things stacking a ton of little minion on infernalist to build magnitude

[modern tangle]

There is no mystery magnitude, it's just ignite effect with new name.

[drifting cedar]

is there even a source on ignite using ailment threshholds?

[frail jay]

No magnitude is a separate thing, jonathan has mentioned it before

and it was in a video as a counter thing on an enemy

[frail jay]

someone posted it up a bit in the chat I think?

[modern tangle]

Source link please.

[frail jay]

Viper told us anyways

[modern tangle]

I just showed you what Viper told us.

[frail jay]

I'm not gonna go look for it lol

[proven quest]

I agree that magnitude will factor in. But if two hits have the same magnitude, you want the bigger hit to be the one that ignites

[frail jay]

I'm responding to multiple people, that wasn't to you

[drifting cedar]

no, I can't find it. I think if you apply an ignite that deals 1 damage per second it will apply, regardless of threshhold

[frail jay]

Oh yeah for sure, but that mostly applies to trash mobs I think, unless you're hitting hard enough to push through multiple boss ailment thresholds in 1 hit

[drifting cedar]

I thought the "fill up the ailment bar" threshholds only applied to freeze, stun, armor break

[frail jay]

It's literally in the chat a little bit up, what you said is not true except for the crossbow skill incendiary shot

and anything else with "always ignites"

[proven quest]

I have no doubt you will be able to do that. If you can’t get to 100% ignite chance, ignite won’t be good

[modern tangle]

Ignite uses ailment threshold to determine chance according to each hit's pre-mitigation damage but it doesn't do the filling bar thing like stun/freeze do.

[frail jay]

Well I'm thinking magnitude will apply to chance so that once you get over 100% magnitude every fire hit has a 25% chance to consume the magnitude and apply an ignite, but we'll have to see.

[drifting cedar]

I think the word magnitude exists specifically to decouple chance and damage when talking about ignite

[frail jay]

We don't have the full info on the mechanic, just pieces of it

[drifting cedar]

because chance = damage normally

then you can get chance without damage, and damage without increasing chance is called magnitude

[frail jay]

Magnitude is a thing that builds up when you hit with damage that can ignite and doesn't

and it gets consumed when you ignite

we've seen that before

[drifting cedar]

where

[frail jay]

it was in a video

[short rover]

Id be shocked if things like Hammer or even Flameblast cant ignite 100% of the time on bosses

[frail jay]

You'd have to deal 400% ailment threshold damage, which you certainly could I imagine

not to mention there's like searing touch with 100% increased chance so you would only need to do 200% threshold

[drifting cedar]

how would that even make sense kirvin? so when your ignite hits 10,000 magnitude it goes off? so you always deal the same ignite damage to a specific boss?

[frail jay]

probably increased chance on tree

[frail jay]

If you aren't doing hits large enough to push through multiple ailment thresholds in 1 go, and are hitting so much that you always proc an ignite before 200% magnitude, yeah basically

well it wouldn't be the same because there's different points between 100% and 200%

But it might be that you do need the larger hits to consume the magnitude

[short rover]

idk their stated goal was to simplify the application and calculation of ignite and if it works the way you're saying that is a task successfully failed, I'm a doubter personally

[drifting cedar]

I need to see this video, this is bananas

[frail jay]

We just don't know yet

I don't remember where the video was might have been LA test or tokyo game show, but you can see magnitude as a debuff with a % on the enemy before they get ignited

[proven quest]

Regardless of the cases you’re talking about, you still want the ignite to come from the biggest hit. So you want a spell that hits really hard. Then you hope that it also has high magnitude, then you get a big ignite

[frail jay]

if you can hit big enough to do like 2 ailment thresholds yeah

[proven quest]

If you can’t, ignite is very bad

[frail jay]

yeah fair

flameblast and hammer of the gods probably gonna be good for ingite

[proven quest]

I agree, so the best way to scale your ignite damage would be to self cast something while your minions are doing damage

[frail jay]

Well unless you can get a bigger hit with like a skeletal arsonist and a spectre

[sterile latch]

hopefully, i'm up for ignite flameblast

[frail jay]

or MI

[proven quest]

If you’re skeletal arsonist can hit harder than a fully channeled flameblast, then minion builds are the best in the game by far

[frail jay]

I mean it can in poe1 lol

[proven quest]

There are plenty of skills in poe1 that hit harder than a single minion

[frail jay]

Not flameblast though I don't think

Actually tbh I don't know if there is a bigger single hit skill in poe1

[pearl sluice]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2LLvLPfMhU this is a good watch if yall havent seen it yet lot of info packed i didnt know

[frail jay]

Noh I think you're wrong, I don't think any skill comes close in single hit damage

[thick pecan]

Raging spirits with minion instability and essence harvest with fireball is an infinite mana hack no?

[frail jay]

SRS might not work with essence harvest

Although I might be thinking pre-spectre nerf

Still I'd have to see

[thick pecan]

Their life would have to drain and trigger instability then for it to work.

[proven quest]

Off the top of my head, discharge is absolutely one

[thick pecan]

Or minion pact as well to drain the

[proven quest]

But trying to compare poe1 damage and poe2 damage is going to be impossible

[pearl sluice]

yeah it would work i believe, but you wouldnt be able to make it smooth until late game probably, which i assume you can get enough mana regen that it wont matter by then

i dont think theres a reliable way to trigger minion instability, on srs early game, infernal legion sure, but minion pact is nearest minion so if your running arsonist or something you could potentially be killing that and not your srs

[thick pecan]

Infernal legion sounds good

[frail jay]

In Jousis' latest video the base damage of death wish is 90000. Discharge with 10 of every charge at level 21 is 42205 damage

[thick pecan]

You can do multiple projectiles on fireball to trigger tons of RS and all will be draining from legion and exploding and giving you mana.

[proven quest]

That’s a spell, not a minion attack

[frail jay]

I mean maybe

We don't really know

[frail jay]

It's a minion explosion scaling on minion life, like sekeltal arsonists and MI

...

[pearl sluice]

just from experience in poe1 infernal legion doesnt kill your srs fast enough to feel good, need uniques too, that could be different in poe2 maybe infernal legion hits harder but i doubt theres much change to it when speaking mechanically

[proven quest]

The damage from skeletal arsonist that your talking about it something you have to cast

[frail jay]

Ok?

It's not a spell though

Also MI isn't something you have to cast

[proven quest]

But if you just sit there and let the minions do damage, you won’t get the skeletal arsonist explosion that you mentioned

[frail jay]

What's your point?

[proven quest]

And the spell you referenced has a 10% more multiplier that scales up to 13 times, MI doesn’t have that

[frail jay]

And MI you don't need to activate it

[proven quest]

My point is that the best ignite is going to come from something you have to cast yourself

Because that’s how you get the biggest hit

[frail jay]

Well you specifically said a spell, whatever

Also MI you don't have to cast yourself

[daring jay]

evasion is gonna be soo strong

you can evade spells now apparently

holy f

[proven quest]

MI won’t scale nearly as well for ignite, which is why popcorn srs in poe1 is an on hit skill not an ignite skill

[frail jay]

Popcorn SRS is not an ignite skill because SRS don't have high HP, and people don't use MI because there are better skills that exist like Death Wish and Bodyswap of Sacrifice

in PoE2 the choice is Skeletal Arsonist or MI, and putting the explosion with a bunch of damage supports on a big spectre that does a lot of damage and not having to manual cast the arsonist skill on it sounds appealing

[proven quest]

Sure, but then that’s not a lot of small hits anymore 🙂

[frail jay]

Arsonist might be more appealing due to infernal legion though

Why are you talking about small hits again?

I already said big hits are better if they're big enough

[atomic halo]

why isnt poe1 infneral legion like poe2 infneral legion

[frail jay]

[atomic halo]

poe1 sucks ass because it doesnt scale off of minion life like u would assume

[frail jay]

Can't have nice things

I'm ready for my RF minion

good base life on hellhound

Oh shit wait

[pearl sluice]

idk im not casting skeletal arsonist skill probably tbh my srs will die so fast once i have infernal legion and a unique like Tavukai Coral Amulet that it wont matter, im under the assumption popcorn srs is a build they want people playing and that there will be new uniques to compliment it

[frail jay]

@hoary plover get an infenal legion minion or the infernalist hellhound

EZ auto-detonate

You wouldn't arsonist SRS I think, more talking about spectres or something else where you have very high HP minions to blow up

[native widget]

what is srs again?

[frail jay]

summon raging spirits

it's a spirit gem in poe2, summons minions when you cast fire skills

I wonder how minion defensive power is gonna work, maybe if you have a big enough infernal legion minion you can summon multiple copies and stagger them to die and trigger CoMD as an autobomber

CoMD is only 30 spirit too might be able to run multiple copies with a few big minions

[proven quest]

Everyone that’s mentioned “defensive power” seems to think it’s related to resistances/ defenses, and people have guessed that life isn’t part of it. But I agree, depend on on how defensive power works comd sounds really strong

[frail jay]

I mean if I had to guess, I would guess it's gonna be just based on the minion itself

like arsonists have a set value

and every spectre has its own value

[gusty bone]

Where do I get the remaining 25% to fire to get 100% fire conversion?

[proven quest]

That’s interesting, if that’s the case then you wouldn’t want to get any minion defensive nodes because it would make them harder to kill

[silent prawn]

feeding frenzy increases dmg taken

[frail jay]

Yeah if you're trying to trigger CoMD you probably just get minion life and not resist if you're doing infernal legion

[proven quest]

That’s true, but a minion with feeding frenzy and 0 resistances takes more damage than a minion with feeding frenzy and 10 res haha

[frail jay]

And there's probably a balancing act with minion pact or w/e the support is that removes 100% of your life from a minion's life when you cast

[silent prawn]

40%

[proven quest]

Are we sure that each minion has its own respawn timer? I feel like I remember something in the reveal talking about there being a delay

[lunar totem]

Ruetoo was theorycrafting and seemed to think Raging Spirits would be a good choice for "50 mana on minion death" (if it works)
But making the Raging Spirits die faster seems... dubious? It seems like they last 4 seconds as a defined number, as in Feeding Frenzy would not affect them because they're not dying due to health

[frail jay]

Supported Skills remove 100% of your maximum Life from a nearby Minion on use to deal 40% more damage

[silent prawn]

7 seconds but it resets to 7 every time a skeleton dies

[frail jay]

I don't think SRS is going to be that good for it

takes too long for them to die

[lunar totem]

Yeah I think the Raging Spirits are immortal

[frail jay]

Unless there's a tavukai type thing

[lunar totem]

Maybe good for Cast on Death

[native widget]

I feel like minion pact really have 2 uses, one is with CI for the free 40% more, one is with bloodmage for cast on minion death

[silent prawn]

mhm if Raging spirits don't have health I can't play Popcorn:(

[proven quest]

There’s a couple frames in the reveal that show one raging spirit summon, and it looks like it has life below its icon*. So I don’t think they’re necessarily immortal

[silent prawn]

well they are not engaged by enemies

[distant dome]

It really depends on if despawning of Raging spirits due to duration expiration counts as "death," and if so, does "reduced skill effect duration" apply to that 4 second duration. Toss +1 limit and reduced duration, and they'll have like 1.4 secon duration

[short rover]

well in poe1 summoning new minions when at the cap, or just expiring on a time limit like Raging Spirits does, also counted as a death. If it works the same way in poe 2 (and I dont think we have a reason to assume it doesnt yet) then just printing spirits very fast or killing/despawning them will trigger all the death effects

less duration support maybe

[proven quest]

Or if your able to summon at the limit, and then the oldest is considered dying

[short rover]

o yeah scriblet beat me to it

[distant dome]

yeah that too

[sage moth]

yo im trying to plan a ignite build and im just curious if spell dmg will add dmg to ignite in poe2 since the hit from the spell will be bigger (i dont think it does in poe1 not sure tho)

[short timber]

I have a feeling

that now that real minion support exists

it won't work

[lunar totem]

Minion Pact can still work if your minions simply have a massive amount of health.
It's why I want to still take it with Infernal Legion.

Get minions to very high health
They burn for Infernal Legion damage when just standing around (5% per second)
Skeletal Arsonist blow up for 15% health
Minion Instability should still trigger(?) and do 15% health

Skeletal Arsonist ability also won't be subject to Meat Shield 35% damage reduction, as it deals the damage, not the exploded minion (If I'm reading it right)
Them dying faster may still be good

[distant dome]

if essence harvest doesn't work, but SRS has any meaningful contribution to Cast on Minion Death, it'll still be neat.

[short rover]

if im understanding the question correctly then yes it does - bigger the spell hit the bigger the ignite

[sage moth]

ok thanks

[distant dome]

Make waves of rolling magma, to summon tons of raging spirit that "explode" after a enough of them die in the form of Cast on Minion Death... That's one goal of mine. Basically my Spirit Wave build from D4 XD

[mighty basin]

any theory skills build for dark monk out there?

[short rover]

pick your poison really, the appeal of Chayula Monk is it might be just ridiculously tanky with mana stacking MoM and instant leech. Can fit a lot of skills into that profile

[sterile latch]

check ruetoo, he has a potentially really good build but it's a bit more complicated than tradi monk

[proven quest]

I like the idea of chayula monk with instant leech, darkness, grasp. Then you can do any type of damage to get 30% extra as chaos. Mom, CI, Eldrich Battery, and the only time you start reserving darkness is when you get to 0 mana

[short rover]

the big downside there is 0 spirit. No reservations

im iffy on Embrace the Darkness tbh

[tranquil inlet]

hand of chayula into hexblast seems stronk

[proven quest]

I’m iffy on it as well, but it sounds cool and if it works well it’ll be very strong

[safe karma]

Altough we dont have enough resources yet, I was considering to go for sorceress stacking mana or ES (maybe CI)

I like the idea of ES, but I am not sure about how to do damage.
Stacking shock with stormweaver sounds like a good way to scale in longer fights and bosses, but the chronomancer temporal rift sounds like the only way to regain ES besides the normal regen (which is slow)

No ES leech sounds like a pain

[short rover]

yeah, but I think Chayula might be broken even if you dont take those two nodes lol, instant mana leech is so appealing with the new MoM

[midnight wharf]

you only scale it with minion life, not minion damage though

[sterile latch]

yeah thats exactly what ruetoo is planning

[safe karma]

Do you guys think it will be viable to do cast-on-shock builds without the stormweaver ascendancy?

[midnight wharf]

as long as you stack your chance to shock you'd be fine

[lunar totem]

I mean I think the real "secret" is going to be taking Stormweaver, making all your hits contribute to shock, and not using a single Lightning Spell

[safe karma]

True. At the same time there are lightning spells with huge shockstacking boosts

[mighty basin]

that what i was thinking off. those two nodes that convert spirit to darkness can be avoided. we got few nodes still unrevealed. with mana leech we can basically go for cold/lightning elements skills. huge impact and since monk starve mana. we can fix that issue and being tanky could be better instead of of those 20% damage more.

[short rover]

is it conduit that does like 400% increased dam to shocked enemies

or some crazy ass number like that

[lunar totem]

Yeah I haven't looked over them all too religiously, it was mostly that I noticed the Stormweaver Ascendancies we've seen so far (I believe) don't mention Lightning Skills explicitly

[sage moth]

anyone know if u can use 1 weapon and trigger skills that uses the other weapon?

[short rover]

yeah thats kinda what i've been planning to start on, either this type of build or a archmage infernalist/ignite type build

[uneven hazel]

I just go big stick with big stun, me happy

[lunar totem]

Right, I'm saying there might not be buffs explicitly to "Lightning Skills" in the Ascendancy (Unless you were saying something else with that pic)
This would leave you free to use Fire and Cold spells in order to take advantage of the Ascendancy, possibly even using no explicit Lightning Skills

[iron lintel]

I'm betting the right side of very similar but for cold. (Center Right) so sort of a buff for electric skills but likely cold ailment related

I wanna see the rest of it though. Big excited for Sorc 🙂

[safe karma]

In this pic I was confirming that the ascendancy mentions that any kind of damage contribute to shock chance

[lunar totem]

I won't be doing it wholeheartedly, but I'll reiterate again that this might be busted

Just a Sorc build dedicated to creating these ailments and popping them as fast as possible

That's what I'd be playing to rush to endgame (If I didn't want to play minions so badly)

[iron lintel]

I thought about that too @lunar totem - Cold damage picking up the heatshiver node on the tree with the shock ascendancy. Lightning storm to proc it 🙂

[native widget]

OOOOR just get CI

[lunar totem]

CI far away, need take bunch of ES nodes, me no like
Also me maybe want kill healthy minion on purpose

[mighty basin]

i took this from snoobae. he is doing invoker monk.... i changed few skills (not many) since invoker cant sustain mana similar to chayula. https://poe2skills.com/share?data=N4IgdghgtgpiBcIAmEBOBrABAWQPZnRABoQAjAVwEsAbJBAbVAGd0bqEQAzaygY3RipMTAC6pKA4iCbkADrNyoRTBiFmD1I8hGqZeACzQBzOCV7VcTGHtxRSEEVN75eMMGIcwkmGJ04xeRxIAdxgIBTAfahhYdx1MFCgIEylKMDBBADdPEABdAF8iZlZqdkQmSll9fDSjYTEJU2k5BSUVeHoQKHJqEUrovUNUFJI0MMxcTh8-AKDwGHJUeNxMwQsIOhIeI30RMFqfAA8FGVQmpMooPMLitg4RGPVRTG5F1ABPKRl5RWVVTggokEmAcIgg-BUJBghweYCQXhsdlwUhWggMxiaTGq-EwslQuB4-iWfXwUmogL6YDqWNw-GuRWkJTKIAeUCeIkwpBgpS+LV+7U6aV4Z0B1h4UEoc1kPVW4isUg28O8212+ypCWgySaKr2B3UGQ8JLAUigtjcWiuBQZLDuiGCEFWEymnHxol5PzaqkVCOctA1SRGID41lIkqaRnJvEoDkopLMBO8+pghtjxpILtwAC83JhMr9ofTbjz4GAetQSN9Wn8Olai8zSOSmFUYp8K3zPR0QG5-DAG01Wa14ui0pCQPoYJQdrCfYt5bXGbaQLwKRNIrBotYme6qwKl0MTN5RBA-FI8ZMIBlMOItDoTYprEhFjHSfObcWu9FYmDdGk88ujdu-KqDA7zWJMmDBGkDyoF86ilD4BjIumZwwJmBxJBgUh5r0EB8JgGGEMhlgchkhzkCoBQFEAA

would love some inputs (these skills for chayula without taking embrace the darkness nodes.)

Ascendancy would be those points basically it depends.

[lofty grotto]

Do we have any list of spirit gems?

[lunar totem]

https://poe2db.tw/us/Spirit_Gems

[mighty basin]

https://poe2db.tw/us/Spirit_Gems

[lofty grotto]

Base is 100 spirit, right?

[lunar totem]

Not exactly

[native widget]

180

[mighty basin]

not sure but i've seen that you can increase it with stats in weapons.

[iron lintel]

Not sure what I'm gonna rock on my archmage setup

Thinking archmage / clarity / vitality and a blasphemy setup

[lunar totem]

You are going to get permanent spirit from certain activities in the campaign.
The first item gives you +30 permanent spirit.
We've been told there's "one of these" in each act.
So people are getting "180 Spirit" from two assumptions.

Each item in the 3 acts is exactly the same, giving +30 Spirit
Even the ones in the Cruel Campaign are the same (+30 Spirit)
6 * (30 Spirit) = 180 Spirit

Technically that's two assumptions that we don't have evidence for, but it's safe to say it's probably a decent number for the non-Witch classes.

[short rover]

idk if lightning exposure on Siphoning Strike makes sense if im understanding the build flow you're going for - you have lasting shocks on Tempest Flurry so if thats your first shock applicator then exposure on that would make more sense no?

but i went in a different direction - skipped siphoning strike for the charge on shocking chilled enemies notable. Didnt like the way siphoning strike looked in the video was the only reason though lol

[lofty grotto]

it was just my assumption
with 180 spirit, some auras (or their spirit replacements) are super cheap like 30 spirit

[iron lintel]

We also haven't seen many of the bigger auras so I'm assuming a lot of them will be 100

[lunar totem]

Yeah that's what made me doubt 180. Seems like a lot for certain classes. But maybe they want you to have at least one automation like "Cast on"
I also don't remember the Totem reservation if they've told us it. Might be big?

[mighty basin]

lightning exposure for harmonic generator more shock to chilled enemies hopefully generates more power charges for endless flicker strike. while lasting shock can be changed to different support its only adds shock duration on enemies.

[tranquil inlet]

I think the "one of these" in each act is an assumption as well. What they meant by "these" isn't so clear to me. There are minibosses with bonuses, yes, but I don't think we can count on them all giving spirit

I wouldn't plan on 180 being the base. 100 seems more reasonable, and if it's more that's a bonus!

[frail jay]

Ancestrol Bond being 100 per totem makes me feel like 180 makes more sense

You need 300 spirit in totems for it to be better than baseline

[tranquil inlet]

Agreed, but with weapons and the tree they might be relying on scaling rather than base for that sort of thing

I just think planning a build around ample spirit could backfire

[frail jay]

doubt it with that

I mean it's not like there's going to be totem reservation nodes on the tree or item affixes unless it's a unique

[lunar totem]

If the Spirit WERE 180 at the end of the campaign
The really good Sceptre we've seen had a "97% Increased Spirit" mod, for a total of 197 Spirit
Even then, that's 377 Spirit. Gotta get a few runes, unless there's a ton of Spirit on the tree

To get to at least 400, that is

[frail jay]

Could be that you're intended to use a sceptre yeah but if it was 100 then yeah 297 spirit doesn't even get you a third totem

[lofty grotto]

Now, when we are at assumptions topic. On endgame trailer maces have 19 unockable skills, but few seconds later Jonathan states there are 20 🤯
I'm confused.
Same goes with bow, which doesn't have tier XIII tier gems at all - but wiki states there are elemental salvo skills.

[frail jay]

Well the fextralife video had 3 skills that weren't in the LA playtest right?

for bow

[lunar totem]

I wouldn't look too much into it. Things change, skills get approved/disapproved for release at the very last second. etc

[proven quest]

I think mantra is too good to not use on any of these types of builds

[native widget]

so what are some major source of mana that we know of right now:

[frail jay]

using fire instead of mana

[lofty grotto]

didn't watched it
My knowledge is based on newest deep dive and this week influ impressoins

oh and then he states 21 bow skills

3 more than in the tree

how the heck I'm supposed to foilhat buildplan now

/s

[frail jay]

I'd check the fextralife video but idk if there's anywhere to watch it still

[short timber]

shhh

😂

[lofty grotto]

found it

[frail jay]

I'm definitely curious about elemetal discharge

[native widget]

yeah theres no info on it lmao

damn

[frail jay]

With Elemental Invocation Comet if every comet freezes then the next comet can proc a new explosion for instance (on trash where they always get frozen)