#Magic Item Attunement
rancid elm
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 03:43
Cubic Gate (legendary). Allows "Gate" and "Plane Shift" spells.
So the rule I'm hoping is true is:
If a magic item allows casting spells AND requires attunement:
- it is always the case that those spells cannot be cast without first attuneing to the item
- it is never the case that some spells can be cast from the item, but not others
rules regarding attunement from the DMG:
Without becoming attuned to an item that requires attunement, a creature gains only its nonmagical benefits, unless its description states otherwise.
That "unless" makes me :sweat: ```
DyingNoob — Today at 03:48
```With how many exceptions to the rules there are... I'm uncertain on whether that's true.```
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 03:50
```The biggest cases I can think of that are "wierd af" for this are the new spellbook-adjacent items in Tashas, e.g. Crystalline Chronicle.
Is attunement just assumed in all these descriptions?```
DyingNoob — Today at 03:53
```I think that may be the intention (Rules as Intended).
It would be nice if WoTC just explicitly stated that though.```
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 04:00
```yeah... it only takes one example to wreck that assumption. But I can't find any printed examples, so I think I'm happy to accept that as a rule until proven otherwise.```
MaxPat — Today at 05:21
```The only item that I know of that (poorly) specifies non-attunement magical benefits is the Icon of Ravenloft https://www.dndbeyond.com/magic-items/5530-icon-of-ravenloft
While within 30 feet of the icon, a creature is under the effect of a protection from evil and good spell against fiends and undead. Only a creature attuned to the icon can use its other properties.```
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 05:24
```Mmmm good find. It's close to breaking this rule but I think not close enough. Thanks!```
MaxPat — Today at 05:24
```I asked in the "Raw Arguments" channel of my oneshot server too, we'll see what they uncover :wink:```
MaxPat — Today at 05:31
```Pretty sure the spells for this item are available to be prepared, but are not cast from the item (e.g. you use your own spell slots rather than charges on the item) So I dont think attunement is necessary for that. The cantrips are a little fuzzier I think. The charges definitely need attunement to be used.```
MaxPat — Today at 05:43
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/670336046164213761/963298929498279956/unknown.png
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 05:47
```thanks i hate it```
MaxPat — Today at 05:47
```Also, we ruled out being able to prepare the spells of the Crystalline Chronicle because they are "Psychically encoded" so you should need attunement to gain access to them, you cant just read them like a normal Spellbook. So the only actual item they could point to..well doesnt cast a spell :man_shrugging:```
Calego (He/Him) — Today at 05:48
```Yeah makes sense to me. It feels like a pretty safe RAI assumption to make at least.```
Zhell — Today at 11:10
```I'm counting 57 official items that don't require attunement but do allow casting of spells or spell-like effects.```
though'd i'd condense the discussion here
buoyant shore
Appreciate you
@leaden girder yeah there's definitely no attunement but allows spellcasting.
I'm convinced now that there's no official "half way required attunement" items which allow spellcasting.
I'm not convinced that whole "half way required attunement" ruling is anything more than inconsistent copy writing
leaden girder
The only "weird attunement" items I have been able to find are berserker axe and hammer of thunderbolts. No spells on them, however.
short solstice
hammer of thunderbolts does require attument to use giants bane feature
leaden girder
Yeah, I am reading it as Giant's Bane requiring attunement, and the ranged weapon attack stuff as well, but not the +1 to attack and damage.
short solstice
yeah, the +1 stuff is just like other magic weapons, no attunement needed for it, much like a +1 longsword. passiave abiltiy.
versed otter
Does a wand of magic missile count? Doesn't require attunement, but uses charges.
short solstice
A lot of wands dont require attunement.
But there are also a lot of wands that do require it. Like the wand of fireballs.
Looking at them, looks mostly to have to do with power level of the spell. the stronger magic wands generally require attunement.
leaden girder
<@369247716225712139> yeah there's definitely no attunement but allows spellcast...
Are we watching the birth of a new module? 👀
rancid elm
I have a feeling its for the 1.6 of dnd5e
leaden girder
Didn't know attunement was being touched on. Huh.
rancid elm
its "adding items for other items" basicly, like class/subclass/features etc
versed otter
Oh my
buoyant shore
no no, don't get hopes up for 1.6
this is a module I'm in the process of, but would like to implement in the core system at some point yeah
the elevator pitch is "Magic Items" but without touching the consumption logic of core
rancid elm
ahhh ok, my bad
leaden girder
the elevator pitch is "Magic Items" but without touching the consumption logic o...
i.e., not making use of item uses?
buoyant shore
i.e., not making use of item uses?
Other way around, spells attached to items that do use core 5e's item charges. But allowing an item to be configured with some "overrides" that let you set that up before adding them to the actor.
This is obviously really rough but might give you the idea of what I'm aiming at:
the spells get added to the actor with those overrides applied
essentially pre-linking the core consumption logic rather than replacing it
leaden girder
Do the spells exist wholly on the item? Or are they just merely links to, say, a compendium until the item gets attuned?
buoyant shore
links to a compendium (or world item), which are then created as Items on the actor "same as other spells" when the "Parent Item" is added to the actor (they're hidden until attunement if attunement is required)
leaden girder
'Hidden'?
buoyant shore
I'm also making a new preparation mode "item", which lets me separate these from other things, and that lets me fully hide them from the actor's spellbook tab until I'm ready for them to be there
If something goes wrong and the parent item doesn't exist somehow or the link gets broken, the spells show up like normal spells. But barring that problem case, they're not available in the spellbook at all.
Though... I suspect spells with active effects are doing problem things now that I think about it.
... like i said, really rough 😛
rancid elm
spells with effects ?
buoyant shore
e.g. Shield
Shield's AE is almost definitely slipping past my "hide until the item is attuned" thing.
rancid elm
ohhh, you mean in core the effects will show up anyway
buoyant shore
right
leaden girder
I forgot shield had that. I remove all effects and create them on-cast with item macro lol.
But if you can hide spells, you can hide effects. Right?
buoyant shore
all things are possible, that starts encroaching on the "should" question though 😛