OneD&D Stream and Discussion

[spark flax]

👋 let the wild conjecture....BEGIN!

[prisma dove]

danke

[obtuse wedge]

Thanks HB

[prisma dove]

before I drop the notes from this video: THIS IS PLAYTEST AND ALL SUBJECT TO CHANGE

[obtuse wedge]

I think I like this, so far, I think I'm ok with a feat at 1

yeah

[prisma dove]

• they are introducing Ardlings to new PHB, that sound like aasimar but with animal faces
• also adding orcs? just the multiverse orc and putting it in the new PHB
• mixed race support
• Stonecunning gives Tremorsense when touching stone
• many races can be small like MPMM
• the new default for backgrounds is to build your own, rather than being the optional rule
• equipment packs revisited to have more equal values
• backgrounds come with a level 1 feat.
• feats are going to all have levels tied to them now. feats are being considered "class features" that do not belong to any single class, and will be leveled in the same way.
• level 1 feats dont have +1 to ability scores. some later ones do.
• returning feats have changes/new functions
• dwarf losing subraces bc they were "only cultural." tieflings gaining subraces (three) bc theyre biological? culture is now provided from background.
• the new revisions are designed to play side-by-side with Monsters of the Multiverse

feats:

• feats that have been reworked to be level 1 feats to have clear value and ALSO be more valuable to characters that would archetypically want that feat. like Healer now appeals more to life clerics who would otherwise not need it currently.
• Healer comes with a Battle Medic ability that lets you heal in combat or something
• Alert now not only gives bonus to initiative, but when rolling initiative, you and one other party member can SWAP initiative rolls.
• Musician is a new feat that lets you gain prof with 3 instruments of your choice, and also on finishing short/long rest, you can give inspiration to X people who hear you play. Inspiration like normal inspiration, not bardic.

three new spell lists (reorganizing existing spells into new lists):

• arcane

• divine

• primal

• not tied to class but rather tied to source of magic. very pathfinder.

• revised definitions of conditions

• "slowed" condition added

• Inspiration is now something you can reliably get when you roll a nat 20.

• If something gives you Insp but you already have it, you can give it to another player

• Humans, when finishing a long rest, start with Inspiration

• Crits being reworked??

• Nat 20's crit as normal

• Only a crit if you are attacking with a weapon or an unarmed strike??

• Spells critting were "rarer" than spells that use saves. So no spell crits.

• Trying to separate spells and attacks entirely. Spells do spell-y things, and hitting things does hitty things.

• ONLY PC'S CRIT???

• getting crit at level one could kill so they just uh. removed it?

• monsters already have their own "crit-like" mechanic, and it's the "recharge" mechanic

• When you roll 1 or 20 on ability check, save, or attack roll, it is an automatic fail or success. This is now NO LONGER LIMITED TO ATTACKS ONLY

[obtuse wedge]

Oh god, furries

Tieflings could be small, I never knew this

[feral sonnet]

ty alaustin

[prisma dove]

That's everything that stuck out to ME from the video but I'm sure there were some smaller things I left out

Had nothin' else to do while waiting for this meeting 😆

[modest siren]

Right, so, nothing unexpected

[obtuse wedge]

I think I'm ok with the feat thing, I've been banning eberron, guildmasters, strixhaven cause of things like it but if they are reordering and level locking them I'm ok with that

[remote sand]

it feels like they took alot from pathfinder 2

[prisma dove]

Unsurprisingly, because it's really good

But they, so far, aren't straying TOO far from 5e

[remote sand]

i mean maybe i should just play pathfinder

[modest siren]

it's literally 5.5e

[prisma dove]

You should totally try, my groups have loved it

[obtuse wedge]

They do keep referencing it as a new PHB and not SRD so thats gonna be really weird to include SRD with the new system if they don't update the SRD

[remote sand]

cant find a group

but i wanted to ask how foundry is handling this

is 5e going to morph into one dnd?

or a new system entirely

[obtuse wedge]

The whole point of MPMM was to get all the races in one book and now they are creating more races in more books, this has got to be frustrating

[spark flax]

(we have no idea right now, we have to see the core rules)

[prisma dove]

"One D&D" is a revision of the 3 core rulebooks of 5e, designed to be backwards compatible with 5e (so you can run Curse of Strahd with One D&D rules)

[remote sand]

i hope they update the srd and give a liscence to foundry

[prisma dove]

So, yeah, for all intents and purposes, seems like 5.5e

[obtuse wedge]

maybe because its a digital source maybe it will be easier on us?

[remote sand]

we3ll i think they are moving away from versioning they dont need it

[prisma dove]

Which I'm fine with, but lean more toward wanting them to make big changes. But I still would LOVE to just solidify all the dumb nonsense that we have across almost 10 years of 5e philosophy changes

[obtuse wedge]

I hope they let us submit our books for access to their new One DND instead of having to rebuy that 180 dollar MPMM package deal

[remote sand]

the one dnd thing is probabaly an attempt to move away from versioning

[obtuse wedge]

I will be absolutely pissed if I have to pay all over again...again.

[mellow otter]

I'm not seeing anything that would need Foundry to change at all. Other than maybe some new/tweaked/extended Item types in the system

[obtuse wedge]

Well I can imagine a worry about the dnd beyond importer but foundry itself is fine I'd imagine

[lunar heath]

It will happen.

[obtuse wedge]

Man that 180 bundle with them sitting on this reveal today just looks soooo bad

the way they made us buy the other two before marketting it alone later

[honest lance]

is D&D One just what D&D is now or is this still technically 5th edition?

[misty canopy]

5.5 essentially

[obtuse wedge]

Its still 5th edition but social pressures iwill make you buy the books again for a few extra modifiers to your classes and monsters

[misty canopy]

I’m looking forward to reworked conditions

[honest lance]

the Chris Perkins quote of "5th edition being so synonymous with D&D that it's just D&D" is what's throwing me off

like 5th edition is somehow the quintessential d&d edition

[misty canopy]

Well by the numbers that’s probably how they see it. Now they’re just tuning it

[thorny needle]

Never have I felt more 'too old for this 💩' than when watching this presentation. 🤣

[misty canopy]

Can’t wait to see their VTT when it comes out of beta in 2034

[thorny needle]

I am sure it will be very customisable.

[misty canopy]

And have all the edge cases built in

[thorny needle]

Definitely will not require subs or DDB accounts or both.

[prisma dove]

It damn well BETTER have the edge cases accounted for. Otherwise what's the point!

[mellow otter]

They can't even handle all MTG edge-cases in software. And MTG's rules are pretty hard-defined compared to D&D 5e

[prisma dove]

My expectations are high. My faith is low.

[modest stone]

More like a return to roots

[thorny needle]

Casual reminder that DDB has had no front-end features in 3 years, and DDB === WotC now.

[misty canopy]

Maybe all edge cases are getting the axe. And we’re back to 4E

[thorny needle]

Only clubs. No edges.

[mellow otter]

I wish, lol

[slender needle]

lmao, the dnddigital.com site is probably getting a lot more traffic now :P

[soft crypt]

If they could get software to handle all the edge cases, they wouldn't need GMs and would just release GM-less modules.

[prisma dove]

I think edge cases refers to rules that aren't as easily automated because they deviate from the norm

not judgement calls...

[crude tendon]

That's called Baldur's Gate 3

[tidal veldt]

I wouldn't be surprised if the VTT isn't just a 3D tabletop, map maker, and integration to the existing encounter builder / combat tracker and your character sheets

[dense fjord]

I honestly am going to be fascinated on how they think an Unreal 5 product will be accessibly to d&d players online. The amount of players who have issues running Roll20 alone is high

[tidal veldt]

And probably won't even touch combat automation at all

[thorny needle]

It might have fuzzy dice! /s

[mellow otter]

It looks like it's mostly a TTS competitor that comes with some fantasy assets

[dense fjord]

its going to be integrated with DnD Beyond

100%

[thorny needle]

It will no doubt require it

[misty canopy]

I thought they would just buy TaleSpire

[prisma dove]

No, actually, it's a new service! And you have to buy all your digital books again! Because there's no other way, sorry everyone!

(Joke)

(But could be real. God)

[modest stone]

I hope they don't end up pulling whatever permissions allows MrPrimate's importer

[dense fjord]

I'm going to start backing shit up now lol, MrPrimate is a lifesaver

[orchid dagger]

The question really boils down to how much automation it will provide - e.g., low automation, damage by hand, like Foundry 5E default, or high automation, like Foundry PF2E.

[thorny needle]

or how much does it force on you, and can you add/modify it yourself

[misty canopy]

My guess is auto damage but not much else, to start anyway

[thorny needle]

My guess is: you get no choice

[prisma dove]

I think there's LOTS of question 😛

[orchid dagger]

Oh, it definitely won't be Foundry-level flexible 😂

[obtuse wedge]

Its probably baldur's gate 3 but 2d, and pay for each addon

[dense fjord]

its 3d

[tidal veldt]

I do have to give them kudos for the tilt-shift camera. While I didn't think of it at first, it's obvious in hindsight. Its one of the few good things that Sim City 2013 had going for it

[orchid dagger]

I doubt it will even be as extendible as Roll20, but since it's for D&D, and D&D only, that's probably not the end of the world.

[lunar heath]

I'm more concerned with "What happens to your 'purchase' if it goes belly-up or end-of-life?"

[dense fjord]

it uses tilt shift so its going to look very nice

[obtuse wedge]

LOL what a flop

[orchid dagger]

As with all digital "purchases", it goes poof.

[misty canopy]

They REALLY should have bought TaleSpire

[dense fjord]

but Unreal is a hog on computers at time

[obtuse wedge]

they are going to kill their potential customers with a hardware requirement that halves their customers

[dense fjord]

I agree, but I think they are going after all of them

[thorny needle]

3d tokens... Who's gonna make those? lmao Betchu there will be a built-in cash shop for it

[modest siren]

This thing is going to be playable on a phone with integrated voice comms, mark my words

[dense fjord]

Heroforge, Talespire, Foundry, Roll20

[modest siren]

or if it isn't, they're leaving money on the table

[obtuse wedge]

god this looks worse and worse

Just give me an updated SRD, let the rest sink on the spelljammer ship

[dense fjord]

my guess, they will come with the books

[modest siren]

Well, probably on a tablet.

[misty canopy]

PF2E lookin real good now

[dense fjord]

I'm going to be starting to read/learn PF2e now not going to lie

the biggest thing is how they are getting rid of editions

the talk of D&D came across as a service vs product

[orchid dagger]

Heavily depends if they've got skilled game-devs on board or if they've tasked some web devs with making it - if the former, it could (but not no guarantees) work quite well even on limited hardware, if the latter, you'll probably need an RTX 4090 to get 25FPS 😂 Not an inditement on either set of developers, but the skills are just so different.

[obtuse wedge]

Their pitch meeting was probably like...Dnd, but 40k cost model

[dense fjord]

and my issue with that is I don't want someone sneaking into my digital library of books and just removing pages

[obtuse wedge]

only 2/6 of my primary table can handle unity engines

[misty canopy]

They just need to talk to tposney and they’d back out of the VTT market immediately

[modest siren]

Anyhow, recognize that by simply being the kind of people who hang out in a Discord for a highly customizable enthusiast-aimed VTT, you are NOT the target audience for whatever this new tool. The target audience are the normies who have been languishing in Roll20 jankland ever since the pandemic started.

[dense fjord]

they bought game studios, good ones

so yes they have good quality on this

the packaging and treating it like a service is going to be the make or break

[dense fjord]

the normies don't have comps for this

[obtuse wedge]

their target audience is basically Beadle and Grimm's

[modest siren]

It's gonna run on a tablet.

[orchid dagger]

Assuming they've allocated them to this project (and all sorts of other inane bureaucracy is kept away), but yeah, promising.

[thorny needle]

One edition, expansion packs only. Want typos fixed for your digital-only content? Pay up. 🙂

[modest siren]

Like c'mon this is pre alpha footage of some random unreal engine renders, it's absolutely nothing.

[modest stone]

And want to play on phones

[obtuse wedge]

So basically every patreon in foundry?

[dense fjord]

bullshit, I saw that video and if its on a tablet its going to fall flat on its ass (speaking as a game dev)

[modest siren]

That video is nothing.

[dense fjord]

by bullshit I mean I don't believe them

[thorny needle]

I can fix typos in Foundry. And ditch WotC's contractions. 😉

[modest siren]

As a gamedev you know that any renders made for media years before any actual launch is just going to be little more than concept art

[obtuse wedge]

I'm just saying that we already deal with subs here in foundry

[mellow otter]

Microsoft said that about Win10 too ... and then a few years later announced Win11 when sales slowed down a bit

[dense fjord]

if they go this road expect them to go after the wider mod/open community tbh

[modest stone]

It needs to run on tablet and phones, surely that's their market

[obtuse wedge]

windows 10 is free

they just don't advertise it

[remote sand]

guys guys i changed dnd forever because i made the lead writer of dnd change from aliugnment system from lawful to morally evil. i did that! wooo

[misty canopy]

I’m still waiting for their 4E VTT

[dense fjord]

watch the video, no way that shit is working on a phone, we got players with flip phones on roll20

[modest siren]

This is the point here, they want to provide a tool to play on devices people actually have, tablets and phones.

[obtuse wedge]

my nokia runs foundry well

[remote sand]

the conversation came up when i said theres a problem if you are lawful good and the laws of the land suck and youd still be doing evil and i suggested they move to morally good or evil.

[crude tendon]

Ugh so alignment is still a thing.

[remote sand]

and in the ua they have

[modest stone]

Streamed from a server running the engine?

[dense fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/jitterbug-deal-with-it-cell-cellphone-phone-gif-11974755

[dense fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/john-jonah-jameson-lol-laughing-hysterically-laughing-out-loud-funny-gif-17710543

[spark flax]

UE4 can run fine on mobile devices, given consideration up front.

Video based game streaming is a trap and a lie

[obtuse wedge]

So basically roll20

[modest stone]

I have had mixed experiences, but enough to see it can be possible

[modest siren]

It's gonna be optimized for mobile devices, of course it will be, why wouldn't it be? They're trying to capture the largest possible market.

[thorny needle]

They'll try.

[spark flax]

technically possible, but unsustainable

[dense fjord]

my biggest takeaway from this

https://tenor.com/view/yoda-wisdom-starwars-nod-gif-5316035

Begun again the version wars have.

[orchid dagger]

It's a reasonable thought, but honestly who knows what's going through the Product Owners mind at WotC? Is this going to be another "Don't you all have phones?" moment, but with gaming PCs instead?

[misty canopy]

At least they’re fixing feats 🤷‍♂️ (allegedly)

[thorny needle]

Just ban feats. 👌

[safe moth]

The main reason I posted this in the first place, is because at some point (according to the release video) they plan to offer a 3D VTT created with Unreal Engine.

Now, it looks like none of this will go live until 2024.

[orchid dagger]

Mm. I wonder about the feats - will that result in characters having less choice and becoming more similar?

[thorny needle]

From personal experience: No 🙂

[modest stone]

Should be more choice

[modest siren]

D&D is full of momentum right now, and if Wizards somehow botches this easy win I'll be very surprised. It's always easy to assume they are dumb and evil, but never underestimate their thirst for money.

[orchid dagger]

From the FAQ:

When will the D&D Digital Play Experience begin playtesting?

This experience is still in early development. Everything we’ve shown is pre-alpha. We expect to start showing more to players with a closed beta later in 2023.

[modest siren]

Note: If this new digital platform is successful (and why wouldn't it be? It's a Must Win Battle for them), it's going to drive droves of players onto a platform where literally the only game that can be played is D&D.

[orchid dagger]

They won't screw it up by being evil, or even dumb, necessarily. They could screw it up by being too ambitious and optimistic, and releasing a bug-ridden mess, though.

[safe moth]

I've signed up to receive the new materials they will start releasing in the next hour. I'm curious.

[misty canopy]

Well, BG3 has been in development for six? years now and that only takes you to level 12? and only PHB stuff. Hmm

[mellow otter]

Just because it's theoretically "must win" doesn't mean that WotC will break their track record of poorly implemented digital products overall

[modest siren]

That is true, and companies have failed at easier projects

[modest siren]

I mean, MTG Arena is apparently making them incredible amounts of money

It's far from poorly implemented.

[modest stone]

Level 4 is the cap still

[dense fjord]

Also, if they are getting rid of "monster" nat 20s/Crits I'm ignoring the shit out of that

[mellow otter]

It only took them how many digital MTG implementations over the last decade and a half to nail that down?

[orchid dagger]

Cap in Early Access, though I forget why

[obtuse wedge]

MTG was slapped by the EU for data mining

specifically MTG arena

go to the options in MTG arena, see that checkbox for stealing your meta browsing data? Thank the EU

[modest stone]

Cos level 5 breaks everything

[slim solstice]

As I understood it, they are adding other effects for monsters when they crit, like recharging abilities. Which I think it's fair instead of instakilling you

[modest siren]

Sure, but thinking that they won't take the experiences learned from building MTG Arena and implementing them on D&D Digital or whatever seems strange.

[orchid dagger]

Depends how you're counting them - in terms of ongoing long-term support, it's only been 2 - MTG Online and MTG Arena. The other MTG Products were all intended, AFAIK, to be limited-time products - sell the base game, a couple of expansions and done.

[dense fjord]

nah, that will be a hard pass at my tables.

[orchid dagger]

Depends what they replace them with - if they replace them with something that's fun but doesn't surprise-murder players, I'd give it some serious thought.

[dense fjord]

like the rogues sneak-attack under this new system doesn't crit

or magic anything

but its somehow backwards compatible.

[prisma dove]

Why would that be the case?

[crude tendon]

Crits are naturally biased against players because getting killed with a crit has much larger game consequences than killing a single monster with a crit as a PC (also PCs on average take way more attacks than individual enemies). so it makes sense that the mechanics would be different.

[modest siren]

Starting from the assumption that Wizards are a bunch of bumbling fools and not an extremely profitable subsidiary of a multi-billion dollar company smells like wishful thinking. Sure, it'll be hilarious if they screw this one up. But let's assume that they know what they are doing, which is much more interesting.

[slim solstice]

I don't think it is meant to be very backwards compatible. I mean, they are changing races and feats and monsters and classes spelllists enough to not be compatible

[misty canopy]

I think by that they mean you can use the old monster statblocks, but use them in a new way. That’s probably all

[dense fjord]

only attacks with a weapon not abilities

so only the weapon attack gets crits from the video description, though its an intense debate on Reddit right now

[prisma dove]

Sneak attack adds damage to your weapon attack, it would still crit just fine

Let's not put the cart before the horse

Also don't trust reddit

[misty canopy]

Sneak attack should just be auto crit

[dense fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/i-dont-trust-any-of-them-eli-the-oval-i-dont-trust-them-i-dont-believe-them-gif-24659421

[modest stone]

Luckily as DM we can mix and match version rules and even make up our own. I wonder how flexible their VTT thingy will be

[slim solstice]

I understand what you mean, but tradition

[mellow otter]

Probably not very flexible, I suspect

[spark flax]

(take the assassin subclass for that)

[orchid dagger]

Flexibility == complexity, it'll absolutely be RAW to start with

[misty canopy]

Actually maybe it finally won’t be called sneak attack anymore (because it isn’t)… wait, who am I kidding

[orchid dagger]

It'll be called Critical Strike! Just because.

[slim solstice]

Imagine WotC going that far against D&D brand

[misty canopy]

D&D beyond has always been pretty big on homebrew. Be interesting to see how flexible it will be. They do keep harping on about making the game your own

[orchid dagger]

Yeah. Again, depends on the level of automation - if it's basically just a map with shiny miniatures, and the automation being whatever you get on the D&D Beyond website (not much), then it'll be fine.

[modest stone]

Used to be backstab 🤷‍♂️

[dull crown]

"Show people this isn't a video game" WotC have you seen what D&D 5e DMs are doing in Foundry 😆?

They mentioned more diverse art. I hope they take a note from Pathfinder and move away from male gazey fantasy tropes.

[mellow otter]

It's theoretically possible, but sex sells, it's never gonna go away completely

[dull crown]

I know, but Pathfinder shows that you can still be successful without going as far as D&D does

[mellow otter]

Sure, but it shows that about the SRD too, and look at where that has gone

[prisma dove]

I feel like 5e's art has already taken a huge step in that direction in the last few books?

[dull crown]

I don't see how that's related to art

[thorny needle]

That's just not true. DDB's homebrew tools are notoriously bad.

[dull crown]

Oh it has, it's improved significantly, but there's still more progress to be made

I mean the PHB cover has a boob-butt pose right there 😆

[obtuse wedge]

I fully trust the internet to lead me in the right direction

[prisma dove]

I don't think even once in my life have I considered that on the PHB

[dull crown]

It's a bit more than giving it conscious consideration but that's outside the scope of this. I just hope to see D&D's art improve in inclusivity. If you want to know more feel free to DM me.

[dawn marten]

I am also wondering what will happen to Fantasy Grounds / FGU official books and modules now that DDB is ”official” platform.

[prisma dove]

I'm sure the contracts they have with FG and R20 (and whoever else) are probably set in stone for the duration

It would be bad for business considerably if they yoinked it from those platforms

If they wanted to, I'm sure they could though

[dull crown]

I'd expect keeping those contracts is good for business. Should their VTT fail, they've still got digital VTT marketplaces

[prisma dove]

That too!

[dawn marten]

And it is free money… literally

As other parties are creating conversions and selling them

I only have some hundreds worth of DD stuff on FG too (along DDB and physical…)

[obtuse wedge]

whats the url for the playtest material lol I lost it already

[prisma dove]

It's not up but let me grab it

[dull crown]

https://www.aonprd.com/

[prisma dove]

https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/one-dnd/character-origins

[dull crown]

https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/one-dnd <-- less snark

[obtuse wedge]

found it via their site too

Its apparently a source book

PDF not available for another 20 minutes

[prisma dove]

How do we feel about some of the mechanical changes? Inspiration being a rules-bound resource? No NPC crits? Crits outside of attacks?

Ability Score Increases being moved to Backgrounds leaving races open for more unique features

[dull crown]

I feel like inspiration being purely GM fiat was a good idea in theory but bad in execution

[prisma dove]

Personally my gut reaction to no NPC crits is "this fucking sucks" only because they explicitly said it was a reaction to PCs dying at level one all the time

Yeah, I NEVER gave it out

Because 1) it was kinda lame and 2) I forgot, because of 1

[obtuse wedge]

I liked hero points more

[dull crown]

I ended up giving everyone inspiration at the start of the session, and they enjoyed having a free advantage roll when they needed it. It added to the drama

[obtuse wedge]

I mean players are gonna die at level 1 because they keep putting intellect devourers and assassins in the first chapters of their adventure books

[dull crown]

7th Sea 2e's hero point system is my favorite though. Multiple benefits, you can spend them on yourself or others, and they open up a ton of options

[prisma dove]

Yeah, the issue is PCs are just too squishy with little to do at level 1, and instead of making changes there, they went with 5.5e and removed crits 🙃

I know it's all subject to change, but puts a bad taste in my mouth RIGHT away

PCs are already SO strong they don't need to be crit succeeding even more often and monsters cant, ever

Come on

[obtuse wedge]

I would just not allow level 1's to be massive damage killed

[crude tendon]

Gotta be backwards combatable. You can't fix that level 1 is garbage.

[prisma dove]

As soon as I heard "backwards compatible" my gut reaction was, "ah, minor changes only"

which, alright, fine. but im in camp "mix this shit up"

[crude tendon]

If they want to fix player-squishiness BS they need to fix Save Scaling.

[dull crown]

The Windows Method
Make huge change, take in all the feedback and criticism, make small changes and decent product, goto Huge Change

[slim solstice]

In my experience, it's not just level 1. Some 9th-14th level creatures deal like 8d8 extra damage on dice, and that could deal over 60 damage on a single attack in case of a crit, and they make 3 attacks per turn

[crude tendon]

My barbarian takes 200 damage per combat in my level 17 game

thats on average

[obtuse wedge]

snake creatures have entered the chat

[mellow otter]

You forgot "ignore all feedback" in the middle there

[dull crown]

I figured that's implied with every major software company

<comment-about-discord-and-reddit-here>

I'm interested in seeing where it goes

[obtuse wedge]

wait what exactly is different on crits, does that mean sneak attack doesn't crit anymore?

and smite?

[dull crown]

Maybe we'll see more narrative mechanics borrowed from other engines

[obtuse wedge]

And does dnd5e have a no npc crit setting yet?

[slim solstice]

We don't know for sure, but I think it still crits. Only spells don't, but that is a guess by my understanding

[slim solstice]

What do you mean? It's a new rule

[obtuse wedge]

Yeah but they have other variant rules in there figured maybe it was an option somewhere

[prisma dove]

The only announced changes to crits are:

• Only weapon attacks (including unarmed) crit, mostly meaning SPELLS DONT CRIT
• NPCs do not crit
• You can crit fail/succeed on ability checks and saves now

This shouldnt affect sneak attack at all

Find me the little reddit twerp and let me strangle them

[obtuse wedge]

would smite crit 0_o

[prisma dove]

Bc whoever brought it up is stupid

It wouldn't change!

Nothing changed!

[spark flax]

well there are 3 new rules im chucking immediately

[prisma dove]

People heard "you only crit with weapon attacks" and went nuts

What the rule REALLY is is "spells do not crit"

[crude tendon]

That 3rd one is a rule from older editions they ditched for some reason.

[prisma dove]

Yeah I'm not loving them either

[obtuse wedge]

ok, but if we do eventually go to this new system, using smite as a level 1 spell will need to be reimagined in midi dnd5e lol

[crude tendon]

With how saves scaled you could hit a point where it was literally impossible to make saves and it was complete BS so i'm glad they brought back auto saves on 20s again.

[spark flax]

(just linking to the top message @dull crown)

[obtuse wedge]

Can you pin the url to the playtest page?
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/one-dnd?

[dull crown]

Ah, my bad. Discord crashed when I tried pinning it

[spark flax]

team effort

[earnest sail]

Not sure if it's been posted, but Ted, from Nerd Immersion, is gonna go over the new UA in a sec: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzvu6SvsXDg

[spark flax]

Playtest Signup Page: https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/one-dnd

[prisma dove]

Don't people hate this guy

Is this the guy?

[earnest sail]

Y? He's great imo

[obtuse wedge]

People hate tons of things they don't really hate

[prisma dove]

No stake, just wondering off things I see

It also could be anyone

[obtuse wedge]

Only guys I don't like are the influencers who post RAI shenanigans that feed my players with stupid ideas

dndshorts

Extending wizard turns 1 video at a time

[frozen tangle]

It makes me have to watch his videos too so i know when to catch players trying his recommended shenanigans

[obtuse wedge]

Its fed to me cause of the algorithms

I love the DM guys, just not the player influencers

[earnest sail]

Lol, thank our Queen and Saviour Tiamat... I don't have players like that 😄

One power player, but he's fine with my rulings 😄

[obtuse wedge]

I love the influencers that are catering to the DM's I mean, not actual DM guys

[prisma dove]

https://media.dndbeyond.com/compendium-images/one-dnd/character-origins/CSWCVV0M4B6vX6E1/UA2022-CharacterOrigins.pdf?icid_source=house-ads&icid_medium=crosspromo&icid_campaign=playtest1

Lucky is a level one feat LMAO

WIZARDS HATES US!

[misty canopy]

Can now use your own slots for magic initiate spell. Didn’t see that coming 😆

[slim solstice]

Grapple now gives disadvantage on attacks against creatures other than the grappler? This is big

[prisma dove]

GRAPPLING USEFUL NOW?

Also Drow no longer get Superior Darkvision but rather just 120 feet of normal

I think that's consistent with MPMM

Unarmed strikes now can either deal damage, Grapple, or Shove

no more contested athletics

[modest stone]

Since it's UA if I build a compendium of it it could be treated like SRD and freely distributed?

[dapper briar]

No

[spark flax]

nope...nope...im out, this makes no sense apart from just trying to please everyone

[obtuse wedge]

the effects of Unarmed strike make it even bigger

GWM builds are gonna be ridiculous

[prisma dove]

@spark flax It gives a lot more value to those actions. Dex-based unarmed strikers could very well NEVER shove or grapple when it was reliant on Strength

[slim solstice]

it's weird because you could already replace only one attack with the test, but now you can attack against AC instead... why?

[prisma dove]

Now you can be a wrestler!

[dapper briar]

macho mandalf, here we come

[random valve]

I think many of these changes are just in here in order to get feedback, even if wotc knows now they'll take things in a different direction. Can't get feedback on things you don't ask for feedback on.

[slim solstice]

True I guess, but maybe they could allow a Dexterity (Athletics) check? I think that was the original idea of decoupling skills from stats

[dapper briar]

Yeah, it's playtest material

[spark flax]

that was one of the reasons to make a strength character 😦

[prisma dove]

Also valid

If more martials can do more martial things, though, I'd say benefit

[random valve]

So they may very well be pretty bad changes, but the feedback received from them may open new paths or refinements. That's my feeling, at least.

[obtuse wedge]

Monks can now sweep the leg

[prisma dove]

exactly!

[obtuse wedge]

but the question remains, can they also stunning strike on the sweep?

[orchid dagger]

I appreciate that half-elves and half-orcs aren't a distinct thing anymore and there's a specific sidebar for "Children of Different Humanoid Kinds"

[obtuse wedge]

that seems broken double dipping the control

[misty canopy]

GWM isn’t going to get through this unscathed

[obtuse wedge]

I mean it is right now, first attack, knock prone, second attack take a -5 at advantage

You only use a 2 handed weapon with both hands while attacking with it, can punch if you want to knock down

[modest stone]

If we can post and share the PDF can't we share a Compendium built of it?

[obtuse wedge]

My primary table has looked at it so far and the ones paying attention are not fans of it so I think I'm all set lol

too many lost proficiencies and that massive nerf to healer is pretty bad

[modest stone]

Yeah, that's cool. Half dwarf half elf

[misty canopy]

Makes sense if they want us to test it 🤷‍♂️

[spark flax]

no, just because WOTC gives it to you, doesnt mean you have the right to distribute it

[orchid dagger]

Though it's a bit wonky that you have to choose to be either a dwarf or an elf mechanically.

[modest stone]

I mean it got posted here

[spark flax]

as a link to the distribution source, yes

who has claim to its copyright

[vital crater]

Copyright is very nasty and easy to burn your hands on

[modest stone]

Oh I see. I'll never understand this stuff

[spark flax]

basically, if WOTC is involved, you can't share....anything you created from copyrighted sources outside the SRD. period.

[modest stone]

I mean I get that, just will never understand it

But I will make a compendium and share it with my players anyway

[spark flax]

yep, totally good for your own personal use 👍

as soon as that content goes public, you in danger

[modest stone]

(but I'm pretty sure the PDF in this thread is just upped to discord)

[obtuse wedge]

how are many artists profiting off sharing published maps

[spark flax]

they are not distributing wotc's art

they are making their own art following the fan content policy

[obtuse wedge]

ok gotcha

[spark flax]

its both, embedded for convenience with its source plainly visible 🙂

[obtuse wedge]

it is weird how they purposefully always share their errata, Sage advice, and UA's in pdf format but you can't distribute it...even though they purposely put it on our hard drives

Feels like entrapment

[modest stone]

Haha

The whole copyright thing is weird.

But at least it's not as bad as music. You can still stream yourself playing on maps of wotc art

[spark flax]

i think there is an allowance for being able to make and share content that shows their CR material, but is not in a quote "easy to use" form

i.e. you could watch a video going over a new book and type the whole thing out

....but its so impractical its a non-issue

(and im going way off thread topic, lol, sorry everyone)

so how bout them crits doe?

[exotic tide]

Npcs not critting seems fine.

[obtuse wedge]

We're not using any of it

[mellow otter]

Letting you download a file isn't "entrapment" when you choose to upload that file to somewhere else and redistribute it

[obtuse wedge]

What if your compendium already had a bit from it?

[mellow otter]

Huh?

[obtuse wedge]

What if you already had a healer feat that did that, and suddenly wizards makes it official, are you distributing their content lol?

[mellow otter]

If they release a new version of something with its own new copyright limitations, that has no impact on stuff that was created under a previous license that did allow distribution

[white plover]

Is it just me or do the grappler changes turn Strength into even more of a dump stat?

[dull crown]

Copyright law is fairly intricate and there's a reason copyright and IP lawyers can dedicate their entire careers to it and still just barely navigate it

[misty canopy]

Can play a Small human now 👍

(but only a Medium dwarf)

[prisma dove]

That is... so funny

[misty canopy]

And it looks like short rests are gone

[prisma dove]

No it's definitely still in there

[misty canopy]

It is?

[prisma dove]

It's mentioned under Interrupting Rests and the Musician Feat yeah

[obtuse wedge]

I think its meant as an errata to the SRD/phb

so if nothing changes it doesn't list everything

[prisma dove]

CTRL + F that bad boy

[misty canopy]

Ok so monks and warlocks might not need total rewrites after all

[obtuse wedge]

don't need to rewrite if its just like tashas and is all optional, I treat anything wizards does like strixhaven/MTG shenanigans. Autoban at table. (Cept Loxodons cause they are cool).

[misty canopy]

Autoban unless proven otherwise 😂

They’ve gotta fix Crossbow Expert. That feat is stupid. The only way you can use a net without disadvantage 😂

[chilly oar]

Well I think we will be staying on 5e for quite a while 😅

[obtuse wedge]

they are releasing updates each month in UA format for it

[foggy lark]

clarify rules is all I want

[chilly oar]

The background stuff is nice I like the idea of it but it'll be a loooong time until we make the leap, the vtt looks nice but you will need a heavy laptop to run it with all those models

[dull crown]

Yeah, I prefer the flexibility of Foundry. I can make it run on some very old potatoes

[foggy lark]

One thing I would love for them to revisit would the the 'rarity' of items in 5e. There are some items that are way underpowered for a 'Very Rare' item, then some uncommon items that really should be rare or very rare.

[dull crown]

Maybe. They've been pretty adamant about "these are just guidelines for play, the DM has to do all the work and heavy thinking the final decision"

Which feels like it'd contradict hard item rarity rules

[obtuse wedge]

Judging from tashas and on, they'd probably just give us all the bits of a magic item for choices to include in custom magic items lol.

[dull crown]

Sounds about right

[tiny glen]

This concerns me for several reasons.

1. Many players can't even run decent size maps on Foundry, they've no hope of a true 3d VTT.
2. I highly doubt it will be modular, like Foundry, so I expect we'll be stuck with the very basic gameplay options they give us, likely including no automation at all.
3. A 3d engine makes designing maps and preparing sessions a MUCH longer proposition.
4. Once an official VTT is out, even if it's shitty for the reasons in points 1-3, it will be the default option and what players expect to use.

[obtuse wedge]

Eh, if theres no animation, unreal could be tenable. You can run doom on a pregnancy test display.

I don't think you can run the unreal engine in a browser right? So they clearly are using an exe

[tiny glen]

Ah, another negative lol

[obtuse wedge]

Tabletop simulator runs on a potato

[foggy lark]

How about a John Deere tractor?

They can run Doom on them now.

[obtuse wedge]

Don't worry it will take 2 years for it to maybe come out and it will be too expensive compared to the already established alternatives

[tiny glen]

But it it will gradually overtake them as the detault option. Prep time and obsolescence of existing, likely better options are my main concerns.

But we'll see. The sky isn't falling yet lol

[spark flax]

Technically, but the subsystem has not been maintained over the years and is quite difficult to get running

[obtuse elk]

If some of my friends' experience is anything to go by, it barely meets the definition of "functional" on potatoes, let alone "usable".

[mellow otter]

I'm dubious about realistic prep time in 3D space ever being less than prep time with 2D assets unless you're running something very canned

[obtuse wedge]

I agree. Tools are meant to improve the tasks work and time to complete. It drives me nuts when I see tools and modules shared that literally multiply prep time lol.

[tiny glen]

That's what I said, 3d prep time will be far longer

[dull crown]

One of my players DM'd a session and someone got them started on Foundry... With 70+ modules. They spent a couple weeks figuring out how to make it all work

[foggy lark]

Yikes. I think I had 5 my zero session.

[tiny glen]

Honestly that's what I did, and I probably got up and running fully quicker than somebody who installed 2 a week lol

[obtuse wedge]

I session zero'ed again when we moved to foundry lol, and then ran sunless citadel to get used to settings, and then changed things over again for resumption of our campaign

[dull crown]

For some people it works, most I've met though get way more headaches than it's worth

It sounds like WotC wants to automate though which will help with people starting out on it, given how popular automation is amongst the dnd5e crowd on Foundry

[tiny glen]

I've not DMed on any other platform though, so I had no pre-conceived notions. I just learned how this works without fighting through my prejudices

[dull crown]

And it does make D&D more accessible, which is part of their goal

[obtuse wedge]

whoa now, careful there lol. Midi is a four letter word.

[dull crown]

Midi was what made D&D 5e bearable for me 😛

[tiny glen]

I've spent 5 months getting Foundry where I want it, and now I know my time and money invested is time limited lol

[dull crown]

Eh, there's room in the VTT space for multiple platforms

[obtuse wedge]

v10 is going to dump you in a ditch and pour gasoline on you

[tiny glen]

It's not, because I am not moving over until all the important modules go across too

[dull crown]

That's a weird way to say you'll have to update your modules to v10 and enjoy some performance improvements :p

[obtuse wedge]

lol

[tiny glen]

The only thing I see so far is I might not need Monk's Enhanced Journals or Perfect Vision. I don't think anything else will change

[dull crown]

One of the best things about Foundry is no forced updates. You want to stay on v9 or 0.8.x? You can

[obtuse wedge]

macros will likely have issues

yeah I keep my stuff version locked

[tiny glen]

I am only just getting into macros, and only have 1 that's not wrapped in a module. Let the module creators worry about those ones lol

[chilly oar]

Till Wasp deprecates a version and you want fancy new Sequencer goodies 😂

[obtuse wedge]

don't you use midi lol?

[tiny glen]

Yes, and that has a creator who will worry about making that work.

[obtuse wedge]

its macros are on us though. If you have stuff from the midi srd they likely have macros that will break

[dull crown]

Part of the reason I run module-lite is so I don't get tempted by new stuff, lol

[chilly oar]

I only have 64 modules 😅

[dull crown]

Give it time for them to be updated. Or learn some JS and help contribute to them 🙂

[chilly oar]

I like fluff though

And it helps my players visualise as we have a couple who strugfle

[tiny glen]

Module Compatibility Checker says midi is already v10 compatible

[dull crown]

Nothing wrong with that

[chilly oar]

Exactly

[obtuse wedge]

I have 72 active and 89 installed, and when I activate them all, it says 88 activated and I have never understood where my phantom module is.

[tiny glen]

I have 89 modules installed.

[chilly oar]

Id love to try the new vtt but My DM couldn't run it on his potato

[dull crown]

I play TTRPGs partially because I can't afford a gaming PC, lol

[tiny glen]

TTRPGs have replaced gaming on my gaming PC lol

[chilly oar]

I've just finished reading the UA there's some niceties

And that's why I have an Xbox 🤣

[dull crown]

I can run GoldSrc games at 60 FPS and that's about it

Same on the Xbox

[chilly oar]

Shit just works on xbox (unless it's cyberpunk)

I tried foundry on xbox

Didn't work so well but that's off topic from where we are

[tiny glen]

I find that there is the same a dichotomy in VTT users as there is in video gamers. You have console players vs the glorious PC gaming master race, and you have R20 players vs FoundyVTT players...

Other options are available, if you want to hunt lol

[chilly oar]

I hated r20, but that's for the main discussion

I'll be keeping an eye on the new uas that come out but spells not critting can gtfo

[tiny glen]

My first thought was WTF... Then I realise it's a way to buff martials as casters are far stronger

If you want spells to crit, play a Wild Mage lol

[chilly oar]

Yeah but alot of people play casters, Nat 20 sorry you don't crit

You lose that dopamine rush

[deft cradle]

Def boo on nerfing magic crits. To get rid of the disparity make martials better.

[tiny glen]

lol even without crits the caster is still doing more damage, has more utility, and is more fun (I find pure martials boring as hell)

[chilly oar]

Give them better attacks, cleave, bleeds, bonus damage to weak points et

[tiny glen]

All that stuff is what your crit is

[chilly oar]

Cleave is typically an aoe strike

[deft cradle]

Yup, give the fighters more disarm/cleave, etc options

[chilly oar]

More interesting weapons too

[deft cradle]

I do like the change to grappling though. ONly thing is if taking away the contested roll for initiating and escaping will make it too hard to maintain grapples.

[foggy lark]

I always thought that all fighters base should have some battlemaster abilities core.

[tiny glen]

Anybody played Warhammer? Boosting everybody is how you get current 40k. How about we reign in casters with a minor debuff and keep things sensible lol

[chilly oar]

Nerfing crit isn't a way to reign them in though

[crude tendon]

Minor debuffs won't reign in casters. The gulf is so wide.

[tiny glen]

Several minor debuffs like that and they will be. Easier to balance when you're doing it in small steps

[foggy lark]

Back to the d4 hp with them all! j/k

[crude tendon]

Its like giving Thor a small handicap to fight a mortal human.

[chilly oar]

Give enemies better elemental resistances, thatd reduce the damage

I know that our group. Love getting crits, it's a bug cheer all round

[tiny glen]

Great idea. That's something we all do (or should do)

[crude tendon]

That still doesn't equalize the field. The fix is boosting martials.

[chilly oar]

I do it cos I like seeing the horror on my. Pcs faces

[tiny glen]

I like throwing in a cheeky damage immunity too

But never throw in immunity to melee damage

[obtuse wedge]

I think the ultimate way to fix combat is to move to every creature using large constructs to fight in, maybe call them WechWarriors

[chilly oar]

Clever design will boost them though

Variety of attacks, and options

[tiny glen]

Minor debuffs to casters and intermediate buffs to martials and they'll meet in the middle

[chilly oar]

Anyway I need sleep

[tiny glen]

D&D is already too much of a super hero game

Let's not push it even further that way lol

[crude tendon]

D&D is currently Angel Summoner and the BMX Bandit.

[merry mango]

It is nowhere near that bad. It used to be in 3e...but in 5e it is MUCH closer.

[crude tendon]

As somebody playing a high level game now. Heavy disagree. in 3.5e you could at least play a Swordsage.

[tiny glen]

I've never played a high level campaign, but reading ahead for when my players get there, 5e looks like an absolutely cluster after about level 10

[crude tendon]

The gap between best and worst was higher but the average gap was lower because the later options were better balanced.

[tiny glen]

Almost like it was designed for 1-10 play, and 11-20 thrown in as an afterthought

[merry mango]

I've played a fighter/rogue at 20th level before in Adventurer's League. Most tables I sit down at I'm just fine and I'm super useful.

The problem isn't casters in general. It is a couple spells that when used the wrong way are super abusive. I've sat at tables with people who attempted to abused them...it was only then that I felt worthless.

[crude tendon]

Its also that saves scale lower in 5e while spells just scale. So if you have a weak save it hits the point where its 5% success chance or 0% success chance.

I'm not a 100% expert in 5e like 3.5e but my experience with a martial in 5e has been miserable and i do literally feel like the BMX bandit.

[merry mango]

The DC for a 20th level wizard is 5 for stat, 6 for prof. or 19. That's only a natural 20 for someone with an 8 in the state who also isn't proficient in it.

[tiny glen]

I find martials are stronger than casters until casters get third level spells, then they just run away

[crude tendon]

okay 10% chance then. Still too low.

[exotic tide]

Time for those introduced to the hobby by 5e to know what an edition war is.

[tiny glen]

The strongest player in my level 4 part is the archer battlemaster with crossbow expert, sharpshooter and a +1 hand crossbow

But he wont be for long lol

[crude tendon]

I'm curious how big this will be. There wasn't really a 3.0 vs 3.5 edition war.

[tiny glen]

I don't think there will be, because there is no hard reset. All our books still work

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjKrtdqjNwU lol look what just popped up in my youtube feed. They're listening...

[crude tendon]

I was also going off the Lich statblock (and my current games caster with a 21 DC save) when i originally made the number because a lich has DC 20 spells.

[exotic tide]

3e to 3.5 did not come with significant rule adjustments that caused polarization. There's already been enough talk just in here of "I'm not using that rule at my table" for things like spells not critting or saves having crit failures.

So there will likely be more division as different tables play different games.

[tiny glen]

"I'm not using that rule at my table" is legitimate discussion without a rules change though, so I don't think that's a big deal. Most DMs ignore things or change rules

I let people change weapons/shields in combat as a free action (a boost to martials), for example.

[exotic tide]

Of course. I've just seen plenty of friction caused over the years when people discuss RAW vs how their table does it. Players having to have different expectations. That sort of thing. The proposed changes seem to be polarizing is all.

On the topic I kind of like the no npc crit thing. As long as they tie some other meaningful mechanics to rolling a 20 for enemies.

[tiny glen]

NPCs don't crit either? Damn, I don't like that. I try to run my monsters as close to PCs as reasonable, to the point where I give my bosses and mini-bosses player class abilities like Action Surge and Meta-Magic

Just going through it now. Kids not long gone to bed lol

[exotic tide]

As much as wotc says that the editions will be compatable, that doesn't sell as many books.

Like 3.5 it'll probably be "compatible" with effort on the GMs part

[tiny glen]

Which if fine for me, but I don't run prewritten adventures. I think that's where most of the issues will likely be

Everything else is just a sandbox

[dull crown]

My 3.5e DM had a rule that if you rolled a 20, you had to roll another d20 and at least meet the enemy's AC to "confirm" the crit. Not sure if that was a RAW thing or something he came up with to help reduce crits

[tiny glen]

I think he was just sick of you nuking his monsters down lol

[foggy lark]

isn't that PF rules?

[dull crown]

Probably. He gave them insane initiative bonuses too if they were fleeing, like +15 to +20

[tiny glen]

Did he award XP if they fled?

[dull crown]

Nope

[crude tendon]

That's RAW and nobody ever liked it.

[tiny glen]

Hmmm... A fled enemy is defeated, and the PCs can learn from that combat. No reason not to award XP

I think any combat the PCs walk away from should award XP

[dull crown]

He considered himself one of the greatest DMs ever for his interpretation of 3.5e and prided himself on people quitting his campaign due to his personality

[tiny glen]

Ah, well that's a thing lol

[foggy lark]

My thought is any resolution of an encounter, whether kill, force a surrender or even just RP/diplomacy should reward XP.

[dull crown]

Yeah. I left with a bunch of other players after we were splitting $20/hour for each session and not enjoying any of it, on top of him being an incredibly toxic person

[tiny glen]

I don't award XP at all, but I agree lol

[dull crown]

I volunteered to DM for us after that and I'm now a forever GM

[crude tendon]

Classic

[tiny glen]

I am not against paid DMs on principle. However, I would rather DM myself than pay

[foggy lark]

My campaign is resolving a floor in DotMM, either gets a half level or level up (post dungeon level 10)

After my players finish up dungeon level 11, they should be clevel 12.

[tiny glen]

We started our current campaign on 4 March at level 1, and leveled to 2 that session. We've run every Wednesday since without fail, and levelled to 4 2 sessions ago. I much prefer slow levelling, gives more time to explore themes and you don't outlevel content overnight

[foggy lark]

With OneD&D we have a couple of years to see how things pan out. Hopefully they come up with some good ideas to cherry pick to use in existing campaigns.

[tiny glen]

There are things in this pack I like, and others I am indifferent about. Overall I think it's positive. Decoupling what your character does, and who their parents were for example, is a good change

[finite nacelle]

I noticed everyone can get Warlock spells now ... and Eldritch Blast is not on the Arcane Spell list, most likely because it is going to be a class feature

[foggy lark]

That is a problem for future DM me!

[obtuse wedge]

Vicious Mockery is useable by non bards 0_o

[foggy lark]

wait wait wait... that sounds wrong (pardon the pun)

[finite nacelle]

And a fighter could have it at first level since everyone can be a Magic Initiate

[obtuse wedge]

Wouldn't it be hilarious if eldritch blast stopped being a spell and was just a feature?

[finite nacelle]

It would be a good fix

[foggy lark]

But if it was a feature, should it scale?

[obtuse wedge]

it sure would nerf sorlocks

[finite nacelle]

It won't be great either because it cannot crit anymore 😆 🤣

[obtuse wedge]

plenty of features scale

good point spells don't crit!

[foggy lark]

I guess, but this future state seems kinda weird.

[finite nacelle]

EB not critting is such a huge nerf to warlocks I kinda expect an exception for it

[foggy lark]

Unless there is a level 1 feat that you can take to allow for that.

[obtuse wedge]

make sure that level 1 crit feature is gated behind a new book

Milk that glorious money

[foggy lark]

They really need to pool in a bunch of people to troubleshoot all of these issues.

[finite nacelle]

Sneak attack dice count as weapon dice right? Those can still crit
Any Smite or the booming blade Cantrip cannot

Quite a debuff for casters

Steel Wind Strike cannot crit now either

But Guiding Bolt and inflict Wounds hurt the most, big cleric nerf

[obtuse wedge]

Yeah they should probably create like month long trial periods of playtesting, maybe call it Excavated Magic, and release it in pdf format for their fans to pour over and experiment with.

[foggy lark]

We typically have 1 or 2 rules discussions per session, mainly because of conflicting info sources. The general advice is 'let me check Sage Advice' for a moment.

[finite nacelle]

I'm wondering if Clerics get access to all Paladin spells as well because some are quite strong

Since they get smites now

[obtuse wedge]

Clerics already had all the good ones didn't they? with Tashas?

[finite nacelle]

Basically the design concept seems to be nerfing caster damage while increasing versatility even more which is ... eh

[finite nacelle]

Almost but a few were missing like the steed spells, Circle of Power and destructive Wave

Imagine a full cleric on a flying steed, strong

[obtuse wedge]

one of the subs had destructive wave

[foggy lark]

My campaign the bard is 10 lore bard/1 life cleric and took a bard secret spell Circle of Power. He is a full on buff/debuff bard.

The only damaging spell is Viscious Mockery, lol.

[finite nacelle]

Talking bout bards, they're gonna have some weird spell list mechanic as well since only Arcane doesn't fit them at all

If they can pick from both Arcane/Divine they are going to be good

[foggy lark]

Hrm, that is interesting. Wouldn't Magical Secrets allow them to pick from all three?

Arcane/Divine/Primordial

Unless that is not a thing.

[obtuse elk]

I'm almost surprised they didn't also create an occult list for bards, warlocks, etc.

[finite nacelle]

Sure but that's not the problem. In 5e the bard spell list is a mix, they don't get all the wizard stuff but some stuff wizards don't like healing word

I like warlocks getting a bigger list and warlock spells not being exclusive anymore

[foggy lark]

My group's bard (10 lore/1 life cleric) threw even more into the mix by taking Ritual Caster feat so he could pick up some additional ritual casted spells.

Identify, Leomund's Tiny Hut, Detect Magic

[misty canopy]

It does say in the PDF classes and subclasses will have ways of gaining spells from other lists

Perhaps as bards progress they can “pick one divine spell” or “pick one primal spell” at certain levels

[obtuse wedge]

Makes sense why alot of us don't like it lol

[remote sand]

no i like whats on offer its still got 2 years to play test

the only way they will change anything is if you give feedback

[obtuse wedge]

my feedback is I have 500 dollars in books, thats enough of my blood, now give me stuff for free in the form of erratas and sage advice or more adventure modules.

[remote sand]

you seen this?

[obtuse wedge]

Preferrably not planescape and spelljammer, checks notes fuck.

[remote sand]

i liker the sumarrisation of whats called a d20 test

[dapper briar]

Yeah, pretty much how I feel. I don't like some of it, but I don't have to use any of it either. There are other discords I'm in related to dnd, and watching the people react to it is like watching a riot from the balcony

[remote sand]

which is basically ability check, save or attack roll as summarised by a d20 test

[dapper briar]

yeah, i like the attempt at more standardization of terms

[remote sand]

unfortunatley alot of geek related fan bases are reactionary i try to make freinds with people who arnt.

oh no change is happening lets riot

its silly

[dapper briar]

I get not liking it. I don't get being mad

so far, reading over the PDF, a few things I might yoink and give good feedback for are like:

[obtuse elk]

Backgrounds getting a feat is good. There are too many in the game to support having, generally, five at the most if your game happened to make it to level 20 and you ignored all your ASIs.

[dapper briar]

natural 20's giving inspiration is neato

[remote sand]

i do like the idea of crits giving inspiration which may force me to remove the max first damage die if they do that.

[obtuse elk]

Hopefully the feat progression rework is sufficient as well, without still needing to pick between it and an ASI.

[dapper briar]

and yeah! Backgrounds giving you a feat is a nice pressure release

[remote sand]

yeh backgrounds getting asi and feats just makes more logical thematic sense. because it encourages rp

[dapper briar]

same, or at least gave us some examples of what other feats could look like

[remote sand]

before that there wasnt any explanation as to why you got an asi

other than "its genetics" which is kinda racial essentialism

which isnt a good philsophy to have in a game about fantasy

[dapper briar]

it's like goku, you just clench and yell and bam, +2 STR

[obtuse elk]

Not... really. The bonuses and penalties that races got were supposed to be "relative to a generic human".

Relative to humans, dwarves are generally hardier. Plus to Con.

[remote sand]

if thats true then why have variant human or have asis on a human at all

that assumption doesnt make any sense

[obtuse elk]

I'm just providing historical context.

[remote sand]

the reason why tashas is a thing is so thaty theres less racial essentialism so that all walks of life and all sizes and races have variations.

[dapper briar]

I've never had a big issue with ability bonuses at creation tied to races, but I do like the idea that racial features are mostly features, and ability score boosts come from somewhere else

[remote sand]

fair enough still its silly

[dapper briar]

Either backgrounds or "just pick what you want" is both cool

lets you have a scholar orc bro, or a swole gnome

pretty neato

[obtuse elk]

Crits granting Inspiration is a good change, but I do disagree with removing the extra damage from NPCs, since their stated reasoning was pretty well just "it can kill a 1st level PC".

[remote sand]

yeh and the backgrounds have a custom path aswell. in this new edition so you could take a feat given by a background take that and change the asi

[obtuse wedge]

it has nothing to do with that, we have tables with years long stories going, we don't have time to uproot the way the tables play just to playtest. We're just mocking something we won't get to participate in. At best its for oneshots/DDAL clone discords to fiddle with.

[remote sand]

its fully customisaable and i think more experienced players would do that

[dapper briar]

i feel like the "NPC can't crit" will either be shaved off after UA, or moved to optional

[remote sand]

its not that difficult to shift.

[dapper briar]

it's such a minor thing that I don't think anyone really complained about

[obtuse wedge]

its a 2 week playtest lol

[remote sand]

thats a good point no mention about npcs i bet its down to creature types?

[remote sand]

i mean i could adopt the crit and inspiration elelment

simple move

the crit thing is weird tho

[dapper briar]

honestly, I've ran with a totally different crit damage thing anyways for years, this doesn't bother me at all

[obtuse wedge]

I can't do anything like that, thats stuff you do in session zero, the players would all have to agree to that stuff and my guys prefer things the way they are, no sudden changes.

[dapper briar]

i'll probably just still use mine after release, lol

but yeah, giving us a mechanical way to get inspiration is a big plus from me

[obtuse elk]

Expanding both kinds of crits to non-attacks will also generate some table discourse, I feel, because trigger happy players will declare something, roll, and get excited at a 20, no matter how outlandish.

Though I do like that it's stated that if something would be harder than a DC 30 represents, you can't roll for it.

[obtuse wedge]

We're gonna see UA's monthly for a while here, thats alot of constant shifting rules on a campaign table, thats not adviseable

[remote sand]

i understand that the impetus for the no monster crits is probably so that low level chars dont die so easily. but its so lame. also im not too happy with the 1 = fail 20 - success. have them as optional rules.

[obtuse wedge]

For oneshots/DDAL clone setup communities sure, but DM's who run long term campaigns we can't shift things on a whim.

[dapper briar]

I've done it before with my three year one, I see no problems with it.

[remote sand]

fair enough i get it im currently running descent into avernus. and i dont have time to shift that to new rules but id be happy to shift over after its finalised

[dapper briar]

Just posit it, if the players say "yeah cool", then done. I don't think it's as big a deal as you're making it out to be.

[remote sand]

thats true too

whatever makes my players happy is my answer

[dapper briar]

another thing I liked from the PDF is unarmed strikes getting grapples and shoves

i was kinda confused with aasimar being changed to ardling? I think it's called?

[remote sand]

yes that stood out for me

[obtuse elk]

See, that I actually dislike. The action economy is the same, because you're still spending an action to do it, but targeting AC makes it weird.

[dapper briar]

you get to be divine egyptian esque divine beings? that's kinda cool

[remote sand]

no they are seperate

[dapper briar]

oh okay

[obtuse elk]

Targeting AC to grapple means it's easier to grapple an ogre than a skeleton.

[remote sand]

buuuut i saw through that arrdling or whatever as a cop out to say hey any animal creatures you forgot you can now be them,

[obtuse wedge]

And a barbarian player

[remote sand]

its basically furry porn

[obtuse wedge]

which was one of the reasons for nopes

[dapper briar]

lol

[remote sand]

anyone can be a furry now

[obtuse wedge]

the other was the massive nerf to Healer feat

[remote sand]

i thought that was a buff

and i like more uses of hit die mechanics

its an under used resoource

[obtuse wedge]

original healer feat healed with just using a purchaseable resource, now it heals using hit dice

hit dice are valueable rsources in adventuring days

my players are currently min/maxing the 2-3 they get back at level 8 lol

[remote sand]

yeh but they hardly get used unless your dm is hammering you with encounters

[obtuse elk]

They are, but with the way so, so many people play, they don't often see use.

[obtuse wedge]

um...ok 😉

The Adventuring day.

[remote sand]

mkost people have like an encounter a day and rest

so they never get fully used

[obtuse wedge]

you must play in oneshots lol?

[obtuse elk]

Yes, we are all aware of 5e's concept of the adventuring day and what it's balanced around.

That doesn't mean it's what people do, though.

[remote sand]

no asctual campaigns and ive seen this from other dms than myself

[obtuse wedge]

my playres have 8-12 encounters per day during adventure arcs

[obtuse elk]

It's where most people's complaints about power and balance come from; not fully utilizing the adventuring day the way 5e wants them to.

[remote sand]

to me thats overkill

[obtuse elk]

Encounter != combat

Keep that in mind.

[obtuse wedge]

its literally The Adventuring Day

the core concept around resource draining to create a challenge

[remote sand]

how long azare your sessions 6 hours?

l;ol

[obtuse wedge]

I'm talking about ingame days man

[remote sand]

yeh but 12 encounters of combats per adventuring day thats nuts

[obtuse wedge]

you don't get your resources back every session lol? thats how ddals/oneshots work

[obtuse elk]

Nick. Encounters don't necessarily mean combat

[obtuse wedge]

one encounter a day is zzzz

[remote sand]

what else do they mean?

[obtuse wedge]

might as well play oregon trail

[obtuse elk]

Literally anything that is designed to or could potentially drain resources.

Social encounters where casters are doing things like Charm or Calm Emotions.

[obtuse wedge]

Nick I think you shouldo check out the concept of The Adventuring Day in the DMG

[obtuse elk]

Hazards like traps they need to get around or heal after.

[remote sand]

to me thats just rp and player agency tho.

[obtuse wedge]

exploration, social, and combat encounters

[remote sand]

i dont count that as an encounter

[obtuse wedge]

well the books do

[obtuse elk]

That's great, but 5e does.

Most TTRPGs, in fact.

[remote sand]

im not tracking social or events that would just happen as encounters

[obtuse wedge]

but still more than 1 combat encounter should happen in an adventure...

how do you map out your session prep lol?

[obtuse elk]

Another thing people miss about 5e IME is that you can only benefit from a long rest once per 24 hours.

[dapper briar]

ignoring the condescension, Nick, an encounter is anything that that can drain resources

[remote sand]

story points beginning middle and end and the impovise the rest depending on what the players do

[dapper briar]

so if you plan for, say, trying to get over a crevice with a bridge that's gone

that is an encounter, because someone could fall, spend slots to magic over, roll to climb up

stuff like that

[obtuse wedge]

ehh, I more count that as travel mode stuff, adventuring days are more of stuff that happens in a dungeon, or a location based adventure.

[remote sand]

ive never seen it that way i just see that as players doing whatever they want as a reaction to situations.

[dapper briar]

just think of it as a type of encounter. traps, convincing people at critical moments, protecting a convoy, transporting a heavy valuable thing

and then yeah, there are combat encounters

[remote sand]

but if encounters mean that then ok. but i dont see as a thing to announce that this is an encounter to a player. it doesnt have pragamtic sense to use that term in that way for me. so im cool with just seeing encounters as combat. and rp as rp.

[dapper briar]

well yeah, you don't announce it, haha

hell the only reason people know combat is a combat encounter is because of the near ubitquitous urge to have to pen combat with "roll for initiative"

despite initiative really just being another ability check

[obtuse wedge]

As you DM for higher and higher levels, the challenge and fun comes in the form of adventuring days, as you develop a narrative over the course of a long hard day and present them with social, exploration, and combat encounters to challenge them and make their choices have consequences that directly affect the story ahead of them.

many adventures are also structured with back to back days like dotmm

[remote sand]

one prediction i will make is that dnd will steal pathfinders cr rating system. coz it works.

[obtuse wedge]

in Dragonheist pretty much just the fourth chapter is an adventuring day

I don't think they are overhauling npc stat blocks

they would have done it already with the 2 monster books they just released

[dapper briar]

i gave up on CR a long time ago, and moved to "stats on a business card" I saw on a blog a long time ago

[remote sand]

me too but the pathfinder cr system mathmatically workws

and is predictable

[dapper briar]

oh i believe you

i just like making monsters a different way, haha

[remote sand]

i havnt tried it and i really want to but i saw a good thread explaining the system and you can predict the level of deadliness with it and it mathmatically woprks i wish dnd was that accurate

[dapper briar]

i know for some DMs, the fantasy of putting something together with a combat budget and everything is like, super cool

who knows, they might release something, probably not an overhaul, but maybe some more notes and guidance

[remote sand]

dnd has taught me to do thematic combat because the cr system is shit.

but having the accuracy of the cr system from pathfinder would be a really good tool for new dms and be less mentally taxing

[dapper briar]

I getcha, yeah

[remote sand]

the biggest problem with dnd 5e right now is theres not enough dm support

dm burnout is real

theres so much workload put onto a dm

it really needs to be addressed

[obtuse wedge]

I don't mind CR, I use it to balance all my encounters, I use the Xanathars tables to better balance things

but also when you run 4-7 combat encounters in an adventuring day they don't all need to be a challenge, you just need to bait out resources

[remote sand]

my favourite thing as a dm is to bait lucky all day long

[dapper briar]

it was kinda freeing when they were like "do whatever", but sometimes I don't wanna be told that, I want at least some sort of framework within the system that at least helps me get my brain going

[remote sand]

tee hee

[obtuse wedge]

https://media.wizards.com/2016/dnd/downloads/Encounter_Building.pdf

(The xanathars encounter tables in UA form)

[remote sand]

yeh i know but still its unbalanced

[obtuse wedge]

You stillo need to account for your party's potency, obviously it won't balance based on 5 sorlockadins. But once you know what their power level is you can judge in the table what level is their medium

[obtuse elk]

Re: PF2 creature math, yeah, it's great. I've been running Curse of Strahd using PF2 as the engine and mostly using those guidelines/rules to create encounters and monsters, and it's been fantastic.

[obtuse wedge]

but the thing about tables instead of calculators is that you can see the whole spectrum and better adjust

[remote sand]

im jealous

[obtuse elk]

I'm doing Out of the Abyss next, with the Proficiency Without Levels variant. Pretty excited for it.

[obtuse wedge]

as you host for a table they grow from level 1 to whatever and you just know their strengths as you play with them and know where to adjust up and down, and in an adventuring day you wind up pulling punches by the end of the day anyway cause it wasn't about the hard encounter, its about the death by a thousand needles.

[remote sand]

how did you adapt it just change the monster manuals to pf2e

how did you bring it into foundry?

[obtuse wedge]

pretty sure that module needs adaptation even to 5e doesn't it?

didn't it come out in 4e and then there was a reprint or something?

[obtuse elk]

Curse of Strahd? No, it's a 5e module.

One of the first.

[obtuse wedge]

out of the abyss

[obtuse elk]

Ah. That one is also a 5e module, but I'm sure it exists in other editions.

[obtuse elk]

Manually. Some monsters I simply switched with their PF2 counterpart, but in places where that didn't work (of which there were plenty) or in cases where there wasn't a good analogue, I simply used the creature building rules to make it.

[remote sand]

soiunds like alot of work

[obtuse elk]

Not particularly. I only spend a couple/few hours each week prepping, and most of that is walling my maps.

[remote sand]

i am curious about dnds vtt with unreal enginge too if the adventure books all come with premade 3d content with auto maqth from dnd beyonds roller. i might be happy with that. and then use pathfinder aand everything else in foundry

[obtuse wedge]

Yeah I do alot of creature building in dotmm, my players are 2 levels ahead of the natural progression so I'm adjusting 2-3 encounters per floor with custom versions. Page 270's in the dmg

[obtuse elk]

Oh, I did build a Player's Guide for the bespoke artisanal Out of the Abyss game that I'm honestly kind of proud of.

[misty canopy]

Presumably not too hard to automate a Nat 20 giving inspiration? Could do it now with a world script?

[cunning coral]

I'll believe it when I see it. WoTC had a ton of promises for a VTT back in 4e and that ended in a literal murder.

[remote sand]

alot has changed since then

[cunning coral]

Oh, for sure

[remote sand]

dnd has become like 4 to 500 million dollar a year industry

since then

[cunning coral]

But the constant is that large, complex projects do not mix well with the shareholders.

The first time the moving parts need expensive maintenance, whatever toy company owns WoTC is going to side with temporary profit over long-term profit and that'll be when it becomes a niche platform.

[remote sand]

an unreal based engine for a vtt is pretty powerful stuff

it does imply that it would be a downloadable client

afaik unreal engine cant be used via html

[cunning coral]

Unless it can procedurally generate a dungeon and let me tweek it, like Menyr or Dungeon Alchemist, though, the amount of prep time that full 3D environments adds to campaign prep will make it only really usable for big boss fights or running an online adventurer's league. And that's assuming it works as advertised

[remote sand]

im thinking they will have all the maps pregenerated

within the modules

[cunning coral]

Yeah. If they're smart, they'll have a very well-designed theater of the mind mode, too, so that DMs aren't afraid to let their players follow a random NPC down an un-mapped street.

As it is, the scenes without dungeon maps are the ones I end up using the most

I'm actually experimenting with 50-ft square dungeon maps that I zoom over to combat maps maps for if there's an encounter. Final Fantasy style. 😄

[lunar jay]

from what I can tell of One D&D, I have a feeling it'll be either D&D 4e 2, or it will be d&d baby mode

Just when I start to hate d&d 5e a little less, wizards of the coast manage to find a way to make me hate it again

[foggy lark]

I am approaching it with an open mind. Anything I don't like I will not use, but cherry pick what they improve on.

[obtuse wedge]

The point is to read it, maybe test it, and then answer the survey in 2 weeks

Rinse and repeat in 4 weeks with the next supposed chapter of the PHB

[foggy lark]

I am sure they had the same issues pop up when they were building out 5e, but now there is more transparency.

[prisma dove]

Was anyone around for the dndnext playtests? How much did they throw out and change from the final playtest to first release of 5e?

I expect quite a bit to change over the next two years, let alone from final playtest to first release

[obtuse wedge]

pretty sure the fact True Strike exists means the playtest was not exactly effective

[foggy lark]

lol

[exotic tide]

The whole thing really.

[prisma dove]

That's what I recall hearing

[exotic tide]

They trashed some very innovative ideas.

[obtuse wedge]

In the perkins interview he mentions that 5e was the first time they listened to what the fans wanted

[exotic tide]

Simple: Fans don't know whay they want.

[obtuse wedge]

I think if you remove that colon the statement is actually pretty true

dedicated players and DM's will apply feedback to UA surveys, simple fans won't participate in the process.

[exotic tide]

So you are saying it's the dedicated D&D players who chose for 5e to scrap all innovation?

[crude tendon]

I've been with dedicated DMs who thought Fighter was OP in 3.5e and nerfed it. I have a very low opinion of d&d fans ability to determine good class balance.

[obtuse elk]

Developing and properly balancing a game is hard. Having corpo bureaucracy on top makes it harder.

[crude tendon]

Yeah but they regressed to the same issues 3.5e had with casters vs martials.

[obtuse wedge]

I think that they are really just looking for creative ideas in the surveys, no way a creative is gonna let popularity contests decide the quality of something their name is on.

[obtuse elk]

I was just backing up your point about not trusting fans to know good balance.

[foggy lark]

Or go the Everquest route. X class is underpowered, then to fix it they nerf everything else but that class.

[crude tendon]

Its not just WOTC. There's an infamous story of a Pathfinder dev basing a characters ability to do something based on HIS ability to do it.

[mellow otter]

Because players got pissed about the classes being balanced in 4E, lol

[crude tendon]

Players hated fighters having cool options.

Tome of Battle was memed to death despite being the best 3.5e supplement.

I don't even care about balance. I just want to have cool abilities as a warrior again.

[obtuse wedge]

battlemaster is pretty dope

[foggy lark]

I toyed around with the idea of a fighter would get all of the battle master maneuvers but in a limited and permanent fashion, but only a true battle master could swap them out on a short rest.

[obtuse elk]

I'm on the "Battlemaster should have been a class feature" train.

[crude tendon]

I heard that was originally in next before it got patched out.

[mellow otter]

Yeah, the 4E powers that martial classes got were pretty great. dnd5e's Battlemaster has that sort of stuff some, but it being just stuff martial classes could do was better

[obtuse wedge]

you can do the battlemaster feat and fighting style with a different fighter sub

[exotic tide]

The dnd next playtest had battlemaster options be the default for all martial classes.

[foggy lark]

I like that idea tbh.

[crude tendon]

Yeah then it got cut because Martials can't have nice things.

[mellow otter]

They might actually be fun to play, which would make the old-school die-hard casters sad

[obtuse wedge]

If you have everything, then whats left to choose

[exotic tide]

To be fair the proposed sorcerer also kicked ass. As you used your spell slots you gained more and more dragonic traits, eventually swapping to a martial combatant when you ran out of spells.

[mellow otter]

That sounds epic

[exotic tide]

Yeah. The dnd next playtests were a very good peak into an alt reality where good choices were made.

This is not that reality.

[crude tendon]

Exalted has spoiled me on cool Warrior/martial options and its hard to go back.

Despite everyone i know just wanting to play 5e

[lunar jay]

i no longer have an open mind for these things anymore

[dull crown]

Then why go over it, review it, and keep worrying about something that you dislike?

[lunar jay]

because it will become the norm

if d&d 6e (i refuse to call it one d&d) becomes an even more sanitised version of 5e, I will laugh so much

[dull crown]

Go play a different edition then 🤷‍♀️

[lunar jay]

That's the plan

but only if i can find a compendium for 3.5e

[prisma dove]

I mean it's probably not called OneD&D, same way 5e isn't called dndnext

[dull crown]

Be the change you wish to see in the world. Set aside time to start putting stuff into Foundry or your VTT of choice bit by bit. Or play the old fashioned way. When I played 3.5e on Roll20 we didn't have anything in the VTT, we used the SRD

[obtuse elk]

One D&D is explicitly the project's code name, not the actual name.

[obtuse wedge]

Or continue to run 5e with the books you prefer, theres literally a million to 1 dm ratio, you'll always find players for your niche build.

[dull crown]

I just don't get the doom and gloom mentality of "the game I played is changing to adapt to new audiences, NOOOOO!" I hope no one's holding a gun to anyone's head and forcing them to play D&D 5e

[obtuse wedge]

I mean that is how social media is meant to be, we shit on things with opinions then go and do the opposite IRL.

When Until they start attaching real world identities to things and concequences start being attached to opinions online, you are always going to see doom and gloom cause that sells attention.

[obtuse elk]

That's a bit hyperbolic, isn't it? Even here, the most I've seen is some complaining about specific things, not just the fact that things are changing.

[dull crown]

That was specific to one user's comments

[obtuse wedge]

Were you around for the 6 months leading up to Tashas?

[crude tendon]

As somebody who hasn't played an RPG with my irl friends in years because i hate 5e and all they want to play is 5e. I would like 5e to be better......

[dull crown]

Heck go look at the 1 star reviews for the Pathfinder 2e CRB on Amazon 😆

[obtuse elk]

Not in any D&D space, no. Foundry is the first of its kind for me.

I've been around 5e since it released tho.

[obtuse wedge]

People hate change on social media.

[obtuse elk]

People in general are much more of a caricature of themselves and tend towards being hyperbolic while online, so that tracks.

[dull crown]

People hate change in general. If language was a thing when fire was discovered by humankind, I'm sure there was complaining about how things were better when you had to wait for lightning to strike and set a tree on fire

[prisma dove]

I also honestly don't get what changes Wizards could have been making lately that seemed like an improvement that AREN'T reflected in what they just released for OD&D. Everything feels like a logical step from changes they've been making for the last 3-4 major books.

[obtuse wedge]

Wait....is the next edition really ODD?

Man they really thought that marketing plan through

[prisma dove]

No

#1009872782898761828 message

[obtuse wedge]

yeah but thats like nicknames in middle school, they stick with you till you move to another zip code

[prisma dove]

you ever hear people call 5e dndnext?

[mellow otter]

Nah, "One D&D" is the current code-name. Like "D&D Next" was the name for D&D 5e when it was in development

[prisma dove]

i dont

[obtuse wedge]

yeah but dndnext didn't have funny initials that could be socially influenced by competitors

[mellow otter]

D&D Beyond Importer, I would assume

[obtuse wedge]

I find the pdf importer pretty dope

I don't really like the importers for player stuff though, you wind up spending more time fixing and editing than just if you hadmade it all yourself

[lunar jay]

Man I just wish there was some "compendium" thing for pathfinder at least

[mellow otter]

Uh ... pf1e and pf2e come with basically everything for Pathfinder 1/2 as-is

[obtuse elk]

2e does. Can't say for 1e, though all their information is also available freely per the license.

[mellow otter]

There are 10s of thousands of things in the system compendiums

[dull crown]

Yep, Paizo is pretty liberal with their community license

[lunar jay]

they do? sick

[dull crown]

I'm sure you'll be able to find pf1e players and GMs here too, Pathfinder is pretty popular it seems regardless of edition

[prisma dove]

PF2e is really sick

[mellow otter]

Enough so that they have to do some fancy stuff to avoid out-of-RAM crashes on 1GB host VMs when the world is loading and compendiums get indexed, lol

[lunar jay]

how much of it is available for free?

[mellow otter]

"Community license" == free

[lunar jay]

no i know

but out of all the content, how much of it is available?

everything?

[prisma dove]

.. a-all of it

[mellow otter]

Generally speaking, the only non-free Paizo stuff is artwork and adventures

All the stuff for Actors/Items/etc in Foundry is free (and included in the game systems)

[obtuse elk]

Aye, the rules and mechanics are freely available. There's at least one website that Paizo feeds the info to directly. They don't own the website, but they do work with the people that do.
https://aonprd.com/
https://2e.aonprd.com/

[lunar jay]

AMAZING

[mellow otter]

WotC: Pushing people towards Pathfinder, one change at a time, lol

[prisma dove]

If the thing people are frustrated with is the ""lack of content"" and ""no rules"" (usually the words I see used) then Pathfinder is more appealing by the second, yeah

[lunar jay]

Indeed

[lunar jay]

I like Pathfinder's community license

[prisma dove]

That's just huge icing on the cake after the fact, really

There's a system that fixes the problems you have, AND it's all available for free

That said, we are getting pretty off topic for the thread

[lunar jay]

I posted a website that's just a map of the Forgotten Realms, and got banned from the 5e discord lmao

[mellow otter]

Probably a website that's not respecting copyright

[lunar jay]

it's just a map though, lol

[prisma dove]

A map someone made and someone else owns and licenses

And probably not that website

[mellow otter]

Especially if it's a wiki-type website. Those are rife with people ignoring copyright entirely, to the point where they're often blacklisted just in general because it's easier than finding the few exceptional pages that actually do things properly

[lunar jay]

Lol

[prisma dove]

"Just because it's on the internet doesn't mean you get to do whatever you want with it" is always a hard pill to swallow

There's plenty that's wrong and/or annoying about copyright law as it currently exists but it still does what its intended to do

[lunar jay]

Yeah i don't care abt copyright anymore

[mellow otter]

Well, you personally might not, but many people do

[prisma dove]

Any court of law you find yourself in sure will, lol

[obtuse wedge]

Sometimes sites are absolutely amazing but because they use a map entity from a book they are banned from sharing. There is a massive interactive waterdeep map that is totally innocent and 100X better info for forgotten realms than any book but because it uses a map ripped from dragonheist its banned on most discords.

some bloke poured over hundreds of waterdeep references and map pinned every single detail imagineable to a map of waterdeep but he used an official map lol so poof to shareable work.

[mellow otter]

It's a shame they couldn't use a proper legally-used image instead and become a super useful resource

[dull crown]

I hope PF works out for you 🙂. There's a game out there for everyone

[lunar jay]

I hope so too

[misty canopy]

When I started on FVTT I installed the map I think you’re talking about from a Reddit link not knowing it was a copyrighted map. It had so many journal pins it tanked my frame rate

[obtuse wedge]

I have it bookmarked just for ideas when the players are topside

then I go and find the source of the pin if I don't recognize it

being in a good state with public library access really helps cause alot it the pins are from novels not dnd editions

Unless you are one of those crazies with a giant room dedicated to 1000 books

[mellow otter]

Sounds like a little library, lol

[misty canopy]

Ah ok I think we’re talking about different maps. The one I had only had location names and a short description for each pin. But there were hundreds

[obtuse wedge]

yeah but you can google the pins for where they are from

the only copyright violation is the underlying map it uses

If they just had someone draw a more natural looking non dragonheist map it'd be free to share I imagine

but definitely a great map to put in your favorites if you are hosting a forgotten realms world

[sharp plume]

It will be interesting to see if their plan works. When Paizo announced releasing some of their Adventure Paths for 5e they were called out by some of their PF users as cash grabbers. One of their staffers tweeted (later removed) if they didn't do the 5e stuff they were dead in the water, so they need the 5e sales to continue funding Pathfinder material.

[lunar jay]

What does dead in the water mean?

English isn’t my first language

[sterile hawk]

Just a colourful idiom about ships that are unable to move (/dead)

[sharp plume]

The company would have ceased to be as they had run out of money

[lunar jay]

Ah

[bright terrace]

probably because it was BS

the reason why they are doing it is to make cash; the art is the most expensive stuff, so if they get out 2 of the same thing, they get access to the whole 5e market with an additional 5k€ investment

most if not all 2e kickstarters also offer 5e versions for the exact same reason

[mellow otter]

No point leaving money on the table with a large consumer base just sitting there

[dull crown]

the reason why they are doing it is to make cash
Well yes, this is typically how businesses stay afloat, by providing products or services for money

[solemn echo]

Nice, another furry

We don't have enough

[tawny knoll]

ust had the email for One D&D and have downloaded the first set of playtest materials.
It is for character creation, and all I can say is it is a complete crock of shit(IMHO).

Particularly the fact that instead of each race having specific attribute modifiers, you get to pick
2 attributes and increase any one you want to increase by 2 and another by 1. Or you can chose
3 different attributes and increase them by 1 each.

That's is my major gripe so far.
I didn't like the fact humans get inspiration each time they long rest. Takes away the specialness of it being
a reward from the DM in my opinion.

What is other peoples thoughts(and why)?

[obtuse elk]

I'll repost my thoughts here as well.

I agree with you re:racial modifiers, but the changes to inspiration needed to happen. In my eight years of playing it basically never existed. I tried to hand it out about once an hour, but in the games I played in, it never came up. I think gaining it via crit is fine. Humans starting the day with it is also fine, IMO. It encourages the use of it and emphasizes that the PCs are a cut above the rest. The GM still has reason to give it out via RP.

The DMG suggested to aim for awarding inspiration to everyone at least once per session, if that helps to understand what the base game wanted. Some examples for awarding it that were presented (in addition to RP) was when PCs take action-oriented risks, like jumping off a balcony as a shortcut to something, as a reward for a sufficient achievement / victory, or for sticking to the tropes of the genre the campaign is shooting for.

I do disagree with most of their changes to crits, notably that you can crit on any d20 test, as well as spells and monsters losing the ability to crit normally beyond it still counting as an automatic hit.

[tawny knoll]

Ive just ben sent here too(lol)

[tawny knoll]

Thanks for clarifying inspiration for me 🙂

[restive tartan]

I like Inspiration and meta-currencies, I'd kinda like there to be more to it though. Nit necessarily crunchy, just more ways to spend it and earn it

[orchid dagger]

notably that you can crit on any d20 test

I dislike that as well, but it was such a common interpretation IME I guess they just threw up their hands and said "Fine! Have it your way!"

[sterile hawk]

I don't know if you saw but part of the reason humans can get inspiration on a rest, is that anybody gets it on a roll of a 20. Inspiration is being made less special and less "GM fiat".

Honestly, I thought pretty much everything in the packet is good.

[dapper briar]

Same, generally

I will definitely be using the Inspiration rule in the packet, it's super handy

[misty canopy]

The only real issue I have is that some players might want to investigate every single flagstone of the dungeon for traps until they roll enough 20s for the whole party to have inspiration. Wouldn’t be a problem at our table but it would help if the rules supported DMs a bit more in this regard (maybe they will)

[solemn echo]

I like the new rules, the only things I don't like is the 20/1 on all d20 tests, all the dm and player I met who has used this rule in the past is because they didn't know the ability checks doesn't crit. If a pg has a +12 to stealth, I don't care if he rolls an 1 or a 20, I only care for the 13 and the 32 for the dc

[dull crown]

"No, you can only make one Investigation roll." and optionally "Now roll for initiative you greedy bastards, the Beholder who runs this dungeon doesn't like people cheesing the game"

[toxic herald]

I just read through all this. Not sure how I feel

Some concepts seem cool but I already have homebrew rules that kinda account for some of those changes

Personally, probably gonna stick with regular 5e for the most part and find ways to integrate the things that jump out from 1D&D, but not till official release

[misty canopy]

It does feel like some changes are to bring things in line with how people already play. I think the feats are an improvement though (what we’ve seen so far anyway). Magic initiate is suddenly looking really good 👀

[sterile hawk]

I am certainly looking forward to more info on leveled feats and the class specific spells and changes

[toxic herald]

Same. Although I have a different rule for inspiration and my party likes that so we prolly won't try the new version

[sterile hawk]

I've been allowing inspiration to be a reroll (not just adv) and awarding it for good session recaps, and for winning the regular battle royale. Moving forward I plan to switch to the One DnD version. Looks good to me, or at least fun to try.

[toxic herald]

I do a flipping rotate. So at the start of the session everyone gets inspiration which is a free reroll before they I state the result of the original result. Once used, the way they can get it back that session is either roll a nat 1 on something, or I give them disadvantage on something, or I give advantage against them

[misty canopy]

The inspiration on Nat 1s is an interesting concept – a bit of a consolation. It seems WotC is going in the other direction, looking for player to be able to have more chance of a winning streak

[toxic herald]

I add cardic inspiration too. So once a session you can say you wanna draw a card and that auto gets added to your roll.

I like some of the ideas from OneD&D but idk if I'll be incorporating any

[misty canopy]

Inspiration on Nat 1s is what they're trying now with the latest playtest packet. You're ahead of the curve!

Here's a link to the new PDF https://media.dndbeyond.com/compendium-images/one-dnd/expert-classes/kpx0MvyfBGHe0XKk/UA2022-Expert-Classes.pdf

[sterile hawk]

I like most of it tbh.

[misty canopy]

Me too... not sure about the +1 ASI for all level 4 feats. Just decouple feats from ASIs and save a lot of space in the book

[toxic herald]

Haha, I'm too quick for WOtC

[obtuse elk]

If every feat grants a +1, it would have saved so much space to just say that at the beginning of the Feat section and then have a single line that lists what abilities you can choose from.

[finite nacelle]

WotC "Almost every feat is a half feat now ... but your top feats are crap now, too!"

[obtuse wedge]

and heres 30 more generic actions that are really just the same ones you know you can do as an ability check but we needed to fill 5 more pages of the new phb so here ya go