I recently changed over to 0,6mm nozzle after not being able to print for a few months (work + school = busy) now parts of my print or the whole thing look as if i was using fuzzy skin, i have never seen that before and am honestly dumbfounded as to what is causing it.
Printer is elegoo neptune 2 with V6 hotend conversion running on custom marlin 2.1.x with octoprint running on RP02W.
Worst part is how unpredictable this behavior is.
Sometimes its on half of the model, sometimes only on one side, sometimes its everywhere and sometimes the print comes out looking great.
#Fuzzy skin like parts of print
half cliff
sharp birchBOT
I recently changed over to 0,6mm nozzle after not being able to print for a few ...
half cliff
as for material, i am currently using PLA but issue is persistent across all materials i have (PLA, ABS, PETG, TPU) along with those come their specific temperatures, speeds etc.
hollow bison
Did you set line width appropriately for the new nozzle?
Could be it's set at less than nozzle diameter
half cliff
Here is a smaller test print from the previous piece made with exact same settings
i am making a clip for LED rails and was testing just the clip (smaller print) before making a connecting piece (larger print)
I just noticed i had Line width set to 0.5mm in cura for some magical reason (had it set to 0.6) but i am still puzzled as to why it sometimes worked and sometimes not
Set it it 0.6 and started the print, will know more in ~14 mins
hollow bison
Well straight lines would work passably but where pressure changes like at a corner it's more likely to cause issues
You can extrude thinner than the nozzle in limited scenarios but generally the results will be worse because there isn't the same level of constraint on the extrusion
half cliff
Soo in cura, nozzle set to 0.6, line width set to 0,6 octoprint nozzle set to 0,6mm and still the same issue as in previous images
hollow bison
Got a pic of a solid first layer so we can see the extrusions top down?
hollow bison
How fast are you printing here? Possible you're out running the melt capabilities since you were (presumably) printing on smaller nozzle before?
Also extrusion temp and material
Lots of under/inconsistent extrusion here
hollow bison
Can you try 215C on the same print first layer and post updated pic without changing anything else so we can compare.
hollow bison
The material does look rather wet as well but I'd think we could improve a bit more than just needing drying
Listen for any popping and look for any steam from the hotend this time
half cliff
it should be as dry as i can get it considering i let it sit at 55C for good 10 hours
and it was yesterday
just for comparison, this is what the first layer should look like according to cura
the blob in the middle is from when i hit pause instead of cancel...
hollow bison
What's layer height?
The pause and eventual cancel sure seem like there's a lot of pressure bleeding off
half cliff
0,3mm normal and 0,2 mm initial
hollow bison
Both should be okay on a 0.6 but initial could be a problem if offset isn't correct.
Do you have any coasting, wiping, or extra prime settings enabled
half cliff
and LIN_ADVANCE in marlin itself
actually lin_advance should be off taking closer look
hollow bison
The coasting I'd get rid of that is asking for gaps. The wipe of 0.1mm will be ineffective but probably not specifically causing issues
half cliff
i am gonna try to run the whole print with coasting off at 215 C to see what it does
hollow bison
Okay, I'll assume it'll be a bit. Ping me when it finishes
half cliff
sure thing
hollow bison
Would double check your esteps are correct after this as well.
half cliff
half cliff
Would double check your esteps are correct after this as well.
i would say, that it does look a tiny bit better but not by much
For comparison, this is the previous attempt from the same angles
hollow bison
Where those blobs are mid wall, is the machine pausing momentarily?
half cliff
Would double check your esteps are correct after this as well.
as for e-steps i am 95% confident they are correct, since it used to work really good with 0,4mm
half cliff
Where those blobs are mid wall, is the machine pausing momentarily?
i believe it does but i am not certain due to the speed/geometry really hard to tell micro stop from direction change especially on such a small print
hollow bison
One thing that can cause stuttering (which can in turn cause blobs) is power recovery enabled and writing to an sd/microsd card
So i would try disabling power recovery feature if it is enabled in the firmware
half cliff
M413 returns Unknown command, and i believe i didn't enable it in marlin anyway
even replaced the usb cable between printer and raspberry to be sure its not in that
hollow bison
I was about to ask that. Next I'd try printing something directly off sd card in the machine though
The straight lines look okay (not amazing but better than the curves) and the supports look okay but could be like g2/3 moves. The curved area comprised of many small facets seem to be relatively a big problem. Those would be made up of many short line segments so more gcode needed to be available in the buffer on time
half cliff
i am gonna give it a try to see what it does, just need to dig out the USB to sd card thingy, be back in few mins
If it turns out that the Octoprint/raspberry was the culprit i am most likely gonna just throw it in a drawer somewhere and order RPI4 + screen and run klipper on it 🙃
hollow bison
Well it could be something about buffer settings too or the board itself and how usb is implemented
half cliff
the thing still messing with my brain is how it used to run fine with 0,4mm nozzle few months back
hollow bison
I won't be able to offer much help in specifically fixing stuff in marlin since I use rrf primarily but can try to isolate the issue
hollow bison
the thing still messing with my brain is how it used to run fine with 0,4mm nozz...
You are asking for 50% more material to be deposited on average for a given layer height and print speed. I dunno if you were close to hotend limit before but it's a consideration
V6 should be able to do like 12-16mm³/s iirc
120mm/s exceeds that. The first layer speeds should be no problem
half cliff
Yeeah, just opened a calculator for that and aparrently i am attemping to push 21.6 mm3/s 😅 that could explain quite a bit actually
hollow bison
Assuming the v6 is all metal heat break too (generally would be) we could try higher temps still. I don't want you to push 230C or higher if its not all metal break
half cliff
its allmetal titanium heatbreak with aluminium cube
hollow bison
Yeeah, just opened a calculator for that and aparrently i am attemping to push 2...
Which I considered but doesn't completely explain first layer woes
half cliff
first layer could be partly due to Z offset being slightly off and that buildplate still being not just stock but original
hollow bison
its allmetal titanium heatbreak with aluminium cube
Yeah so you can try 225-230 C see if stuff continues to improve. 225C is still pretty safe for pla, above that you will start producing substantially more volatiles so you should make the decision if you're okay running at higher temps than that.
You can maybe squeeze 20mm³/s out of a v6 hotend with a "normal" nozzle
But that's pushing it and you'll need the higher temps
Would be better if you could exist somewhere in the 12-16mm³/s range
hollow bison
So the blobs on the curved surface are gone?
half cliff
yeah, and its printing just fine at those 120mm/s
hollow bison
yeah, and its printing just fine at those 120mm/s
I think you said it's their hyper pla so it's in the realm of possibilities for a v6 just outside of the v6' comfort zone, nozzle and material matter
half cliff
not hyper PLA, just the regular basic, 40% off sale PLA
hollow bison
I'd say drop speed or bump temp more.
I think your big issue here is something to do with buffering the incoming gcode from usb
half cliff
hollow bison
Not necessarily the pi's fault but could be a firmware config or the actual usb implementation on the board can't handle it well
We can still see some under extrusion on the supports here (will remix relevant images)
hollow bison
So i think it's still outrunning the hotend there
Higher temps or slowing down or lower layer height will alleviate that
half cliff
i would say those are just doue to the angle in cura
bot for example the middle part of that curve is supposed to be 0,8 and its spot on
hollow bison
The seam having insufficient material can also indicate insufficient melt performance.
half cliff
yeah, i believe i am pushing it was above its limits looking back at it
hollow bison
0.2 lh should still be fine on a 0.6 if you wanna keep same speeds
half cliff
corner seam has too much material from too high pressure and curve seam has too little
hollow bison
Yeah you'll want to circle back to pressure advance/linear advance once close
half cliff
i kept the speeds from the 0,4mm nozzle when i was doing 0,2mm layers which would be 9,6 mm3/s and didnt realize i would be limited by volumentric flow
hollow bison
Yeah you'll want to circle back to pressure advance/linear advance once close
Might need to revist retraction settings as well
hollow bison
i kept the speeds from the 0,4mm nozzle when i was doing 0,2mm layers which woul...
CHT could help here but also just reducing volume
I think v6 is generally comfortable around 20-25 with cht or other high flow nozzle geometry
half cliff
first, i will try a full reinstall of octoprint to see if it helps at all
and as a second thing i am likely put a volcano on it and see what it does ( i already have cube and nozzles sitting around somewhere)
hollow bison
Though i usually would prefer to run material in a range the hotend can comfortably do
hollow bison
first, i will try a full reinstall of octoprint to see if it helps at all
and as...
Volcano probably gets you closer to that 25mm³/s value with standard volcano nozzle
There's also cht like inserts to let you run normal v6/reprap nozzles on volcano and also get benefits of the high flow insert geometry
half cliff
i have seen some of them, i am just vondering if i would loose any detail when running volcano even with 0,4 or 0,2 nozzle compared to V6 with same nozzles
the classic problem with hobby home printers, engineer in us tells us to go fast and mainly print mechanical parts, family comes in with requests for detailed decorations 😅
hollow bison
i have seen some of them, i am just vondering if i would loose any detail when r...
In my experience no but your filament moisture level becomes more critical
half cliff
that is on the list of tasks as well - build a drier or buy one on sale
hollow bison
I have printed very detailed small parts on 0.2 mm nozzle with a magnum plus hotend
In pla
But it's gotta be dry
half cliff
ooh, good to know i dont need to worry about that then
currently i am using cut apart filament box placed on my heatbed as makeshift drier and it does work surprisingly well
hollow bison
Yeah with longer melt zone you can also compensate with lower temp of it is a problem
Because the back pressure from a 0.2mm nozzle is already very high on a normal hotend (eg mosquito or v6) I'd end up running pla at 245-260C (again caution about extra volatiles) but on a high flow hotend for the same part i might do 225-235C instead
Basically I'd want to lower viscosity more for a 0.2mm nozzle than on larger nozzles with less back pressure
Even though the volume id be pushing was much much lower
half cliff
The 0,2 ends up being way more strictive and having way higher pressure loss inside even at lower flow speeds
hollow bison
Ultimately i did a ton of testing and found my results for detail under 1:1 macro photography peaked at 0.3mm nozzle at 0.06mm layer height
Smaller extrusions ended up showing enough variance from filament tolerance at lower dimensions to wipe out gains in resolution
half cliff
whew i would be wondering if i could even do such a thin layer reliably on my machine 😅
i also assume you used direct drive extruder + hotend and not bowden
hollow bison
Well mostly to say maybe don't grab the 0.2mm nozzle unless the geometry actually requires it. The 0.3mm offers a surprising bump in resolution over the 0.4mm but is far less finicky as an 0.2
hollow bison
i also assume you used direct drive extruder + hotend and not bowden
Yes but could be done on Bowden but I'd expect more stringing
half cliff
also found out what a huge difference higher quality bowden actually makes, after going from the original cheap generic white one to capricorn
Anyway, thanks a lot for all your help and advice, i am going to go reinstall the octoprint just to be sure and significantly lower my flowrates
hollow bison
Anyway, thanks a lot for all your help and advice, i am going to go reinstall th...
Best of luck, glad I could getcha on the right track
sharp birchBOT
half cliff
?solved