costs money to make
#🔌│tech
old marlin
zenith sonnet
I use them
old marlin
and most people that care about a decent mouse won't care
the GP SL lost them
because few lefties
zenith sonnet
I want a respin of the G600...
Why does nobody make mice with three primary buttons any more?
old marlin
and most people that care about a decent mouse won't care
this
zenith sonnet
Why not make a decent mouse that has button options for those that want them?
zenith sonnet
The G600 was also the most comfortable mouse I ever held
Too bad the sensor was bad
I think I should get a mouse that is definitely right handed/angled
That had probably been my biggest issue when handling the G900 or GPW
Never been a fan of the Razor stuff, are there decent alternatives to the Naga?
The G600 has a terrible sensor
The G502 and G604 have that awful thumb rest garbage
young pecan
Corsair has a few options.
old marlin
nope, mmo mice have died out
young pecan
Scimitar series, for example.
zenith sonnet
What about the RAT stuff?
old marlin
young pecan
@old marlin Needs a LOT of mods.
old marlin
<@!595970503710343168> Needs a LOT of mods.
what
young pecan
I had one, was pretty good after modding it.
Printing different buttons, lubricating it because mine was a little stiff, etc.
The tech is fine, just the surface feel is awful.
old marlin
let's just say there is a reason why corsair stuff does not sell well
the software is also worse than razers
a lot worse
young pecan
Also better macros and stuff. :P
But nah, beyond the Naga there's basically just modding the Scimitar.
zenith sonnet
Maybe I'll get a G604 and see if I can make peace with the thumbshit
young pecan
Other than that MMO mice died out.
zenith sonnet
I don't need an MMO mouse
young pecan
Wait, then what purpose do you have for a 12 button mouse?
zenith sonnet
I just want one that's got a proper right handed angle
young pecan
Oh.
zenith sonnet
It was great, apart from the sensor
old marlin
the naga trinity and pro have swappable side panels
young pecan
Maybe a G Pro? If you can get around it not being right handed it's a beautiful mouse.
zenith sonnet
I was just looking for mice with a shape similar to the G600
old marlin
it is also a 6 and 2 side button mouse
zenith sonnet
Maybe a G Pro? If you can get around it not being right handed it's a beautiful ...
being not right handed
This is my exact issue with the G Pro I have
old marlin
Actually 26000 DPI because why not?
increased DPI deviation
also what makes it not right handed
is it left handed now?
zenith sonnet
ambidextrous
young pecan
^
old marlin
do you just mean symmetrical
young pecan
That's what ambidextrous means. 
Something to be used with the same effectiveness in both hands.
zenith sonnet
I want one that is not symetrical, but has a right handed shape
I seem to grab the mouse in a weird way, and ambidextrous mice rotate under my palm, and are weird to handle, and I can't properly hold them steady when clicking
old marlin
That's what ambidextrous means. <:THONK:442446969886081034>
not really
the superlight is not ambidextrous
only has side buttons on one side
the shape is symmetrical though
young pecan
Oh c'mon, it's not a big deal either way.
zenith sonnet
Fine. I want a mouse that's not symetrical, but explicitly right handed
old marlin
Oh c'mon, it's not a big deal either way.
how much internal structure does it need?
old marlin
Fine. I want a mouse that's not symetrical, but explicitly right handed
aka asymmetrical
young pecan
Shit all.
zenith sonnet
Or someone to tell me what I'm doing wrong
zenith sonnet
That I can't hold a mouse steady when clicking
young pecan
Honestly, train your bad habits out and train some good ones in. @zenith sonnet
zenith sonnet
What is the bad habit?
young pecan
@old marlin Yes, yes I kinda am. The amount of internal structure isn't the most extreme of things I've seen. A lot more 'lightweight' mice have way more for zero reason.
old marlin
what lightweight mouse has more
zenith sonnet
But it's lighter than it needs be?
Honestly, I liked the weight on the G900
old marlin
It adds very little weight.
oh yea just 10g in a single piece
the sidebutton holders are 2.3g each
young pecan
And I mean, if you have little spaghetti hands with twig fingers then yeah, I suppose you're really needing a mouse weighing nothing.
young pecan
More importantly it's the mousepad more than anything that causes difference when the mouse is as light as a G Pro.
old marlin
"people to poor for decent tires don't need weight reduction on their car"
young pecan
The G Pro is designed to be both light and extremely good.
Poor people don't buy this.
What's your point?
old marlin
it is 80g
that was pretty light when it came out
compared to like an FK
but even those are lighter in the newest iteration
young pecan
And 80 grams is light enough to not matter, tbh.
Surely you have the muscle mass to move 80 grams around?
old marlin
do you say with what experience?
old marlin
Surely you have the muscle mass to move 80 grams around?
that is exactly my point
old marlin
I own a G Pro.
ye but no mouse 20g lighter?
so what is your experience on going lighter
young pecan
Why do I want 20 grams lighter instead of utility?
I've used lighter mice, but if you lobotomize utility for little difference...
old marlin
Why do I want 20 grams lighter instead of utility?
yea so get a naga pro
young pecan
I mean it's just not that valuable.
old marlin
or you loose 1/3 of your buttons
young pecan
It's the classic hallmark of a shitty debater.
old marlin
for 1/4 of the weight
old marlin
It's the classic hallmark of a shitty debater.
I made the same argument you did
young pecan
old marlin
that was the only reason I made it
crisp granite
It's the classic hallmark of a shitty debater.
the ad hominim is strong with this one
attacking the opposition
crisp granite
young pecan
You took my words and blew them out of proportion instead of using logic?
crisp granite
he got ya there, aussieman
young pecan
That is the classic definition of a strawman.
young pecan
I said why do you want to gain a 20g reduction instead of basic utility and you immediate went to not having lighter rims on a car for weight reduction.
Bruh.
That is actually a classic strawman.
young pecan
...
crisp granite
young pecan
And the people that're left handed just don't get that at all? Even though the difference is tiny?
Roommate is left handed, dude.
young pecan
One of the hardest things for him for PC stuff is finding a decent mouse that has side buttons.
25% of shit all is still shit all. :L
old marlin
and there are about 10% of left handed people
young pecan
old marlin
that is not how mass works
young pecan
young pecan
ashen spindle
80 grams, so heavy.
your point basically is "it's useable, why would you need something better"
old marlin
yes
ashen spindle
so like, why go away from ball mice
young pecan
My point is at 80 grams why would I sacrifice utility to reduce an already good weight?
old marlin
the utility for 5%
young pecan
Sure you make the weight fantastic, but you lose utility.
old marlin
that increases weight from 62 to 80g
for 5%
AND those 5%
can still buy the old version
young pecan
Which doesn't really mean a heap, y'know? The mouse is already so light that removing weight barely does anything for you.
old marlin
???
old marlin
Which doesn't really mean a heap, y'know? The mouse is already so light that rem...
why does it not do anything
have you tried it
young pecan
Yes.
old marlin
the superlight?
young pecan
Very little difference for the money.
And yes.
I have tried and owned all versions of the G Pro-like series.
ashen spindle
I much prefer my 68g mouse over my old 84g mouse, the difference is much more than "just a bit" for me
old marlin
I much prefer my 68g mouse over my old 84g mouse, the difference is much more th...
yea but what if you suddenly turn left handed
?
young pecan
Once you have that, yeah it can be pretty decent, but it's a secondary upgrade at most.
ashen spindle
ok, so second biggest upgrade that's possible
ashen spindle
that is still a pretty big one
crisp granite
then mouse
old marlin
@young pecan what sense do you play at btw
crisp granite
then mousepad
young pecan
Varies and that's hard to answer by default.
young pecan
Custom mouse acceleration curve, I spent months working on it.
young pecan
Varies between 400 and 8000 DPI.
Here, sec.
I also use one of my side buttons in game to switch my DPI profiles so it radically changes depending.
I have one for sniping, one for basic combat, and another for more snappy movement.
Shotguns and the like.
young pecan
Or I could use better technology?
old marlin
or a lighter mouse?
young pecan
My accuracy increased by 60% after customizing accel simply due to me having the advantages of both low and high DPI.
shadow minnow
I am almost always using 4000 DPI on 4k 27” monitor
young pecan
Not something a better mouse can give you.
old marlin
with my MZ1 I can hit 6m/s flicks
hearty lake
Or I could use better technology?
cut the arm off an replace it with a mechanical-arm-replacement 
young pecan
That's great, but I don't see how that applies to me? @old marlin
young pecan
I found mouse accel to work better because it gives overall more precision with wider movement without having to fuck around mid fight.
shadow minnow
pretty useless
Pcb could be bit thinner too most likely
young pecan
young pecan
So basically what you're saying is you didn't look at the screenshot and you have no idea what you're talking about.
Cool.
young pecan
Apparently not.
old marlin
I even know the guy that made raw accel
young pecan
crisp granite
and then claiming "60%" better aim
people actually tack in game performance numbers to settings?
bruh
young pecan
Aimlab, Doge.
I wanted to be better at sniping, I decided to grind at it for a few weeks.
crisp granite
Aeon, shit works differently for different people
if you found something that works for you, great
but it won't apply to many others
young pecan
Kinda sadly.
Idk. Accel is great if you know what you're doing with the tech and actually put the time in to adjust it and relearn everything.
old marlin
Aeon, shit works differently for different people
well not exactly
young pecan
It's surprising.
old marlin
but I swap around my setup way too often to bother with accel curves
- I cba fucking around with the intercept driver
hearty lake
My accuracy increased by 60% after customizing accel simply due to me having the...
So if i understand it right, your one of those guys who tries everything possible to improve your abilities with technology instead of just grinding? 😄
But if it works for u its fine i guess...?^^
old marlin
I like hotplugging USB being a thing
young pecan
So if i understand it right, your one of those guys who tries everything possibl...
Little of A, little of B.
crisp granite
should be both for a pro tbh
young pecan
I tend to grind for my improvements, but I won't stay away from tech to advance me. Why tf would I do that?
crisp granite
you need a setup that works best for you, but also a shitload of skill to even be remotely competition-grade
young pecan
Honestly not looking forward to having to relearn everything when I get my Wooting boards.
But hey, analogue is worth.
crisp granite
personally, I am
since...well, I've never really typed very long on linears
never really liked em
cursive summit
I have not used the analog functionality on my wooting, once
I have completely forgot it can do that
hearty lake
I tend to grind for my improvements, but I won't stay away from tech to advance ...
Toa ask the "why not" i guess if u try that hard to improve that u wonna take that tech advantage, ur prob wonna play competitive for sure. So my concern about that is that A not in all games something like this is allowed plus B everytime u change ur location / setup u have to set everything up from scratch. Oh and C if ur gonna play on a LAN, there is no way ur allowed to install something like this software 🤔
cursive summit
I just love the fact Wooting is so easy to clean with all the keycaps being so easy to pull out
crisp granite
and horrible keyfeel
young pecan
Toa ask the "why not" i guess if u try that hard to improve that u wonna take th...
Nah. I don't play comp because I don't have the time for it and I want to do other things.
I just enjoy tinkering with tech, part of gaming for me is improving my setup.
:)
young pecan
More story stuff for me. Always have been a sucker for a really good story.
crisp granite
the occasional Battlefield game
young pecan
Or games like Noita. I enjoy that too much.
cursive summit
I still need to play R6 with you, Doge
cursive summit
Or to be fair, anything
shadow minnow
Lekker has nice feel… on most of the keys. Some suck which really sucks… especially ones with stabs often suck
crisp granite
Or to be fair, anything
coulda sworn we've played minecraft together at some point
cursive summit
No?
crisp granite
on the same server at least
cursive summit
Fuck are you on about
shadow minnow
Wootmc
cursive summit
Ooh
shadow minnow
shadow minnow
Pretty sure you were there, weren’t you?
cursive summit
Was actually my wife
crisp granite
o.O
cursive summit
Since I don't really play Minecraft
young pecan
Plot twist, the wife is actually the twin brother.
<alabama-flag.png>
shadow minnow
And your wife was talking with all the people like you, and was on your discord having 62 pages of messages in #archived_minecraft_server ?
cursive summit
Nobody said that my own wife is not me
cursive summit
Me, and me
timid chasm
Definitely both subs
young pecan
Mate, I swear.
If I mine this goddamn Ergo block I'm gonna be so hype.
C'MON ERGO! I BELIEVE! 2 GIGAHASH BOIIIII!
shadow minnow
Definitely both subs
True
reef tundra
They are both clones 
young pecan
...
If they’re clones does that count as incest or masturbation?
I feel like this is a question that appears a lot on 4chan and Bing.
reef tundra
Had sex doesnt matter
vagrant pagoda
Lekker has nice feel… on most of the keys. Some suck which really sucks… especia...
i replaced my two stabs with gold cherrys recently, 10/10 would recommend
also Divayth Fyr has entered chat lol
ashen spindle
cousin to David Fry?
vagrant pagoda
cousin to David Fry? <:thonk:568526682110296066>
play morrowind
one the the main story npcs is a 4000 year old wizard
who has 4 female clones
that are his wives
reef patrol
Good ole Morrowind
reef patrol
gilded oriole
shadow minnow
I love that I can relate for once
As soon as my pc is working ima be able to relate too
shadow minnow
All I want is 3080/ti xtreme waterforce wb in stock for close to MSRP
reef patrol
Best I can do is a unicorn.
shadow minnow
I will take that
When should I expect the delivery?
Just look at my Lekker order address in the mail
ashen spindle
aint happening before end of the year for the waterforce cards because those make barely any margin, getting a FE and a separate waterblock is possible much earlier
shadow minnow
Had a horse once, hopefully unicorn won’t be much harder to take care of
shadow minnow
aint happening before end of the year for the waterforce cards because those mak...
I am considering getting some GPU and another block tbh but not FE. Want at least 2 HDMI 2.1s, which around half of ampere cards have.
ashen spindle
right forgot you cant live without 4 4k144hz10bit screens
shadow minnow
I can
wheat plume
what SSD is better?
- Crucial BX500 2TB
- SanDisk Ultra 3D 2TB
- WD Blue 3D NAND 2TB
shadow minnow
right forgot you cant live without 4 4k144hz10bit screens
Have one at home
What if I buy second one to have matching monitors?
ashen spindle
then you still have 2 ports left?
since it does 4k120 at 12 bit, 10bit 144 should have less bandwith
shadow minnow
then you still have 2 ports left?
DP 1.4 can’t do it without compression, that’s why I want two HDMI 2.1s
HDMI 2.0 should work with 12bpc 12hz and 144hz 10bpc too
ashen spindle
pretty sure if you set it to 8 bit it works
shadow minnow
Even though 144 10 requires custom timings,
ashen spindle
you wont be able to see difference between 8 and 10 bit in games anyway
shadow minnow
That’s wrong imo
shadow minnow
pretty sure if you set it to 8 bit it works
That can get you to 120. Still useless compromise when you can get more by using different port
ashen spindle
ok, but what could you possibly do that needs that on more than one monitor
you aint running 2 games on 4k144hz on that card
lmao
ashen spindle
point is, there is no point in future proofing for literally everything when by that time it's cheaper and better to just swap to a next gen card
ashen spindle
its pretty much just worse than DP all around but people put money into it so they dont want it to die
shadow minnow
But also I have realized that I find laptops or big screens are better to enjoy some games than normal sized monitors. Especially for story games when having to move eyes sucks
ashen spindle
..just dont press your face into the monitor then
zenith sonnet
Why is it STILL so hard to get LED bulbs with a CRI of 90 or better?
Funny you say that
Growth lamps are pretty much all I can find
Not sure if I want a 15000 lumen bulb for a 20 m² room, though
But it sure would be an interesting experience
5, the ceiling and the 4 walls
Right now I'm trying to find something in socket r7s to replace an halogen bulb
...
Not easy
zenith sonnet
Take that.
wheat plume
its €3 more expensive, whatever TF it is
zenith sonnet
A package you can open without tools
zenith sonnet
Well, don't pay 3€ more for it, though...
It's usually a cardboard box instead of sealed in plastic
wheat plume
oh?
My Intel SSD arrived in cardboard just covered in the Anti-Static bag
I think its ok xd
pale sigil
That is sus af
wheat plume
well, the retail box
and it was inside a smaller box within that
and then in a static bag
pale sigil
Did you take a pic
wheat plume
no
Shipping box lined with bubble wrap, Retail box with the images and whatnot on it, then smaller cardboard box and antistatic bag
I hate that shit
Imma get the "Frustration-Free Packaging"
I hate that sharp plastic shit
ashen spindle
save those 3$ for a better model 
reef tundra
What you needing that performance for?
reef patrol
Hentai.
ALL the Hentai.
wheat plume
That NVME is my game library xd
wheat plume
Hentai.
ALL the Hentai.
Shh!!
wheat plume
Dont tell
reef tundra
144 refresh 
reef tundra
oled and high refresh aint the best of friends
wheat plume
Does running the 32 or 64bit version of crystal disk mark make a difference in the results?
reef tundra
Why are you still using 32bit
vagrant pagoda
oleds have sub 2ms white to black transitions
which means it can actually do a full frame 120hz flicker
wheat plume
Why are you still using 32bit
Cause when you install crystal disk mark
It has a 32 bit and 64bit version in the start menu
astral haven
which means it can actually do a full frame 120hz flicker
120hz isn't high refresh rate any more
cursive summit
Goofy's defence lawyer be like
Goofy, goofy shut the fuck up
THE DEMONS TOLD ME TO
reef tundra
Micky payed a lot of money to get you out of this. please
cursive summit
I'LL DO IT AGAIN
vagrant pagoda
120hz isn't high refresh rate any more
yes but sub 2ms white to black is
almost every 120hz+ ips cant do that
astral haven
I have a tn that is .1ms transition time
That one is from 2018
I also have a tn from 2016? That is around .5ms too
My current VA is limited to around 1 ms and cant do it on white to black transitions, but it's still 240hz and not 120
vagrant pagoda
yeah but who wants that shitty of image quality
astral haven
I've tried gaming on all 3 techs
And I can assure you that 120hz OLED is worse than 240hz va
.1ms tn blows the clarity of both out of the water too btw
It's not even in the same class of clarity
Colors are worse on the tn sure and the contrast is pain
But the motion clarity is insane
fickle ore
I don't think any TN has 0.1 ms all transitions
Best tn's are like 1-4 ms depending on the colours
Most older 240hz TN's aren't even capable of clear 240hz due to too slow transitions
astral haven
The panels themselves sure
But you can make a monitor that has transition times lower than the panel tech
fickle ore
And none of them do have faster than the reported values in the spec hehe
astral haven
?
fickle ore
like some panels say 0.5 ms in the spec but they are closer to 3-5 ms
TN just sucks overall
astral haven
I'm talking about actual mprt of .3
fickle ore
yeah right..
astral haven
And thanks to it being an lcd and some magic it carries that .3ms perfectly across every color
You ever heard of strobing?
You may not like it but it works crazily well
fickle ore
certainly no TN from 2018 or 2016
fickle ore
Which monitor
astral haven
Pg248q
Just do a bit of pixel timing adjustment and you can run it at 120hz with .5ms strobing
fickle ore
@astral haven kekw
astral haven
Ah but that's with motion blur reduction disabled
fickle ore
if you mean ULMB that doesn't change squat
astral haven
At 120hz, 7ms is sufficient for transition within the ulmb period
astral haven
if you mean ULMB that doesn't change squat
You saying that means you've never tried a blur reduced monitor that was faster than it's transition time
That's like saying OLED has a black to white transition of 8.3 Ms because it has a 120hz refresh rate
That's dumb to say too
wheat plume
🤔 Interesting collab going on here....
shadow minnow
40% sRGB but it has sub 1ms true response times
Still the colors, that’s terrible. Also what about overshoot?
astral haven
The point was that's a $300 monitor from 2016 that is faster than your $1k oled
fickle ore
Not gonna say anything since there isn't any proper benchmarks of that particular monitor, but waiting 7ms+ just to get a clear image, is already 7ms behind what could be achieved with a better panel that transitions earlier and flashes the image earlier
But it's probably a lot worse than 7ms+ for some combinations of colours
fickle ore
What's wrong with a OLED + ULMB @ 120-240hz?
fickle ore
I have VG259QM atm, 280hz, has ULMB too, but I don't like it.
astral haven
But it doesn't exist
No it doesnt
Ulmb is 85, 90, 100,120hz only
Anything outside of 120bz and under 85 is running out of sync with the transition times
astral haven
I have VG259QM atm, 280hz, has ULMB too, but I don't like it.
Oh no it doesnt
It's freesync
Which has an equivalent to lightboost
Not ulmb
astral haven
Yes but it doesn't have variable overdrive
fickle ore
might not always be 100% clear but its there
astral haven
Its using 1 overdrive setting across the entire range
Which causes a ton of visual artifacts
fickle ore
I don't want gsync/freesync variable framerate crap
astral haven
Find one which is under 2ms
vagrant pagoda
no need for the gpu to do it
astral haven
Find one which is under 2ms
At 240hz ofc
vagrant pagoda
which is why the 2ms white to black is important on oleds
astral haven
Ion
fickle ore
gsync/freesync just add delay. Nothing wrong with high hz + high fps using ULMB/ELMB/Strobing
vagrant pagoda
it can display the frame, goto black, then go to the next frame
astral haven
Get the spec sheets fam
fickle ore
Thanks Locke
vagrant pagoda
spec sheets are garbage, testing is king
fickle ore
VG259QM has that
astral haven
Ion
Find a single one that advertises 2ms mprt at 240hz
Elmb sync is nice
But it's still missing variable overdrive
astral haven
gsync/freesync just add delay. Nothing wrong with high hz + high fps using ULMB/...
Yes?
Saying it's ulmb is incorrect tho
vagrant pagoda
overdrive is a crutch to mask the monitors poor response time
fickle ore
^
shadow minnow
I mean not always
shadow minnow
Usually overdrives have no overshoots until some level
Also depends on refresh rate it’s running at
For lower refresh rates you generally want to run lower overdrive levels
vagrant pagoda
a monitor with good response time needs zero overdrive
astral haven
That's incorrect
fickle ore
Saying it's ulmb is incorrect tho
Jeebus man 😛
astral haven
Oleds use overdrive too
fickle ore
Ok ok, I was wrong ELMB is totally different from ULMB.
shadow minnow
Okay but why not to use overdrive if it causes no overshoot
astral haven
It isn't totally different
It's actually not possible to find a monitor that uses zero overdrive
astral haven
Literally every single one
It's inherent to the backplane
You don't notice it because it's not variable on oleds (so it can be perfectly calibrated at the factory with just 1 measurement too)
vagrant pagoda
what
fickle ore
@astral haven In the end, you stating a TN from 2016 has 0.3 ms color transitions is not very correct either.. 😛 Strobing modes are hardly default operating modes and there aren't even proper mprt test for that specific monitor. Some transitions are probably >120hz cycle time.
astral haven
Overdrive is sending a higher voltage into the pixel to cause it to transition faster
shadow minnow
I wish more monitors had overdrive curves. Since overshoot is different for same overdrives at different refresh rates and you would ideally want curve set if you want no overshoots and as low refresh rate you would want overdrive curve
vagrant pagoda
which means a factory calibration is never overdrive lol
also
over drive is only for lcds
and its not a constant voltage increase
astral haven
In modern panels that use TFT or ltpo or any other sample and hold backplane, you need to do that
vagrant pagoda
its a ramp up
astral haven
To charge up the capacitor behind the pixel
vagrant pagoda
and tuning the ramp up is the hard part
you drive the pixel harder than you want, then taper down to the actual voltage needed for the shade you want
you peak to high or for too long and you overshoot
and the average shade will be too high
thus bloom
astral haven
On oleds, the transition time is always the same, which is why they can just set one constant value for all of the panels
Not bloom
And the ramp up is not what gets tuned
It's literally just voltage
astral haven
The lower the voltage the longer the ramp sure
But you need to take ee101
You can't just change the ramp up of a capacitor
vagrant pagoda
yes you can
fickle ore
tl;dr TN's suck, VA's suck, IPS's suck.
vagrant pagoda
you can increase the current
vagrant pagoda
yes
and you can go from a CV to a CC ramp
which will charge the cap faster
the charge rate isnt always esr limited
astral haven
Well it is in this case because the resistance is constant
vagrant pagoda
yes
astral haven
It's the same transistor +resistor+capacitor
You can't change that
Like it's on the panel as is
Untill folks start making different OLED panels, we are stuck with this
vagrant pagoda
you can do all kinds of fun stuff with overdrive
astral haven
The only panels I'm aware of that don't really have overdrive are the microleds which have discrete drivers per led
vagrant pagoda
you should get a lcd with a open firmware and try
last time i dicked with them was back in like '12
with the old cheap korean 27 1440ps
shadow minnow
I have lcd with not that closed firmware
But didn’t really find a lot of stuff fun with overdrive. Just the fact overshoot is different with different refresh rates
astral haven
Cool
Anyways you still haven't provided the 240hz OLED with sub refresh transitions
vagrant pagoda
never said there was
fickle ore
@astral haven as if we had any proper gaming focused oled monitors yet 😄
astral haven
You said that OLED is better than lcd
vagrant pagoda
no i didnt
shadow minnow
Tbh I don’t really care about that too. The color quality of OLEDs is just great
vagrant pagoda
i said they were better than IPS
shadow minnow
Tbh I personally think lg cx is better overall
fickle ore
For motion clarity any 280/360hz strobed is best atm
shadow minnow
Better in what?
astral haven
Sure but it's not great motion clarity
shadow minnow
True
astral haven
If you have a moving image without built in motion blur (like in a game) it looks bad
shadow minnow
Sure, but overall tbh I don’t find it as important as true blacks and colors myself
astral haven
It's fantastic for movies sure
And sure if you don't care about motion clarity and just care about static image sure
shadow minnow
And also at least on my phone don’t have issues with OLED motion clarity at all
astral haven
But that's not "better"
That's "an alternative"
vagrant pagoda
i mean
astral haven
Valve index
fickle ore
Most ppl don't even play games that require over 120hz or strobing for motion clarity. There are actually not that many, even in FPS genre
shadow minnow
Again, there is no better, issue is that there are completely different categories.
For gaming? Ips may be better
In general? It’s different
fickle ore
High end Rocket-league maybe and quake, maybe tribes..
astral haven
There isn't anything even in the same clarity class as the index
shadow minnow
All I can say is that I personally don’t see difference between 60 and 120hz so far
vagrant pagoda
i mean
astral haven
All I can say is that I personally don’t see difference between 60 and 120hz so ...
Move your cursor
Lmao
vagrant pagoda
if you wanted to sacrifice brightness that much any oled could
astral haven
But doesnt
fickle ore
Yeah we haven't even accepted the parameters here what constitutes as best for clarity, so the points have no ground 😛
vagrant pagoda
do you know how low the brightness is on a index?
astral haven
And no, there's a limit to how fast you can discharge the caps in the backplane
It gets dumb bright
Well over the 250 nits that the cx does full screen
And they've been increasing the brightness with firmware updates
astral haven
Not any more
shadow minnow
Tbh, for me even though stuff like refresh rates… is noticeable, non true blacks especially when gaming story games and chilling are more noticeable
astral haven
🤷♂️ still making sacrifices much cheaper monitors don't have to make
fickle ore
Tbh, for me even though stuff like refresh rates… is noticeable, non true blacks...
Yep, but it depends on the games you play. OLED is better for 99% of the games out there
Especially due to colours and the blacks
astral haven
Not true
shadow minnow
True
vagrant pagoda
what monitor that isnt a oled has real black?
astral haven
You used a modern va
shadow minnow
I mean double layer lcd has basically true blacks
Modern VAs are still far
Unfortunately not many double layers out there
astral haven
Ph here's something that will get your panties in a twist
Did you know that VA is actually lower bloom than oleds?
Per pixel on the cx is about 1000:1 contrast
shadow minnow
Blacks themselves are still worse in my experience. On OLED I can’t see any light at all in black spots. With VA I can, same with IPS, and with zones there is halo effect
astral haven
OLED can't do better than that without adding some form of vertical walls between pixels which would severely reduce the viewing angles
fickle ore
@shadow minnow I used to play oldschool FPS-Z games. Currently atleast on Blurbuster ppl say VG259QM/VG279QM are one of the best screens for motion clarity if strobed in FPS/Rocket League...... Buuuut, these days the genre has gone to shite and they don't make that fast paced games anymore. So, frankly the monitor has been bit useless. Should've gone the OLED route since I mainly play RPG/MMORPGS anymore 😉
shadow minnow
Well all I can say is that from my personal experience I can’t see any light in dark zones of OLED, different for VA
vagrant pagoda
bleed/bloom is effected by size of the screen and the coating
ever seen a dell 30inch oled in person?
shadow minnow
<@!590931863951114260> I used to play oldschool FPS-Z games. Currently atleast o...
Yeah. Wondering what will blurbusters say at the end about eve spectrum too since they did some tuning and testing on prototypes too
astral haven
Sure but that's mitigatable just like the low refresh of OLED is
Arguing that VA is bad because of high black levels and OLED is good despite of the refresh rate is extreme chutspa
shadow minnow
Still, wish there were 27” gaming priced and focused OLEDs
astral haven
Yip
fickle ore
@shadow minnow Whatever happened to the JOLED shipping OLED gaming monitors a while ago...
astral haven
And until that exists, I'm not gonna recc oled to any PC gamer
shadow minnow
Sure but that's mitigatable just like the low refresh of OLED is
Arguing that VA...
There are 120hz OLED screens. Quite enough. And if we ever see gaming OLEDs we may see 240hz ones. Was not there like one phone that should have 240hz OLED? Idk
astral haven
<@!590931863951114260> Whatever happened to the JOLED shipping OLED gaming monit...
Asus proart 22uq?
vagrant pagoda
i think the dell was one of the very very few oled monitors
there are "monitors" that are just tvs
shadow minnow
<@!590931863951114260> Whatever happened to the JOLED shipping OLED gaming monit...
Tbf, OLED still is not perfect for RPG stuff… since burn in.
QNED however, when it comes in 5-10 years most likely…
vagrant pagoda
yeah
shadow minnow
New nano ips oxide panels have quite good colors. But still, when you put OLED next to it the blacks and the colors become not that good looking, still better than most typical IPS panels though
astral haven
Also is there someone here who knows how to install boot drivers into windows offline?
Dism isn't working
The problem is I backed up my windows install, booted to an external drive, then cloned my old drive into an AMD raid device
And well, apparently it can't just boot even tho it has drivers
astral haven
My old drive is being used as part of the raid array :/
vagrant pagoda
mirror or stripe?
vagrant pagoda
lol booting to stripe
astral haven
Fam these drives are atomic
astral haven
No caps :P
vagrant pagoda
dramless?
vagrant pagoda
905s?
astral haven
Got a crazy deal on a 4800x and a pair of 900ps
vagrant pagoda
ah
i had a pair of watercooled 900ps
well
have
dont use
wait
they are 905s
astral haven
:P
astral haven
Those are the data cables running to them on the right
Anyways yes I made the mistake of trying to use and raid
vagrant pagoda
i dont know why you would raid optane
astral haven
And no I'm not paying money to fix this
astral haven
Real world random isn't significantly reduced by raid since I'm still miles ahead of what nand can do for write latency
astral haven
Ah
astral haven
Will it support and raid?
vagrant pagoda
they just edit the bootloader
astral haven
The problem is the bcd is fine
It tries to boot into windows
But then it can't see its own drive
vagrant pagoda
safemode?
astral haven
Same error
vagrant pagoda
can you get to RE?
astral haven
Oh hunh NVM the bootloader is busted, it only sees my live windows disk's bootloader
astral haven
Yes I can get into re
vagrant pagoda
then use command line to fix it
astral haven
Problem is it won't install the drivers
reef patrol
fickle ore
@shadow minnow https://youtu.be/K_ZHEi-zh_s?t=5315 dark dungeons like these would be so awesome with OLED, I can't really wait to play it with OLED 😄
astral haven
Fucking AMD
Why can't you get your driver's whql certified and included in windows
vagrant pagoda
@fickle orethere is a really good mod for skyrim that makes it dark, like need a torch at night dark
on oled is amaizng
fickle ore
Oh damn
astral haven
It's braindead easy to do this on Intel hedt but I wanted to give AMD a shot
vagrant pagoda
i mean
i would never move a windwos install to a different drive
but i dont store anything on the boot drive
astral haven
god if i had gone x299 i wouldnt even have lost iops
the point was that before i couldnt boot from nvme raid
and now i could
so i was going to try it out
before trying to restore my backup i tried installing windows normally, and that worked fine until i installed the chipset drivers and it went into a bootloop, and once i escaped, my gpu was stuck to exactly 120w
everything was lagging because of that
no idea what caused it
but i decided i would restore my old backup that worked with my old os
buuuut no
vagrant pagoda
welcome to the world of nonstandard setups
astral haven
😭
vagrant pagoda
huh
astral haven
amd why
vagrant pagoda
i cant load steam workshop
astral haven
oh and what makes me even angrier is that if you enable nvme raid, it wipes all of your nvme drives
i have 5 nvme drives and i only wanted to raid 3 of them
but as soon as you enable nvme raid, they are all converted to raid devices
vagrant pagoda
that isnt normal
vagrant pagoda
a board issue then
astral haven
🤷 i cant find anyone with 5 nvme devices on x570 online
(who also enabled nvme raid)
to be entirely fair this board only supports 4 nvme drives
vagrant pagoda
no issues on my x570
vagrant pagoda
yes
astral haven
like im using 5 nvmes and they are all on the chipset
astral haven
ah
so you have 2 on the chipset and 3 on the cpu
i have all 5 on the chipset
3 in the x8 chipset slot, and 1 in each of the chipset m.2 slots
vagrant pagoda
there is no chipset x8 slot though
astral haven
thats why i bought the ws x570 ace
its the only one with the ability to do 3.0x8 on the chipset
vagrant pagoda
you cant have that many lanes
astral haven
yes you can
astral haven
nope
vagrant pagoda
you said one in each chipset m.2
vagrant pagoda
ew it has a x2 m.2
astral haven
i have another drive (which i havent plugged in yet because its even more jank) which is 2.0x8 and doesnt function in a 3.0x4 slot
astral haven
because its dramless, saturates a 2.0x8 link , and was $200 for 2.4tb (4tb of raw nand)
vagrant pagoda
one that dosent even follow the pcie spec
vagrant pagoda
then it should work in a x4 slot
vagrant pagoda
bridge or bifurcation?
astral haven
bifurcation
vagrant pagoda
you can get a riser to fix that then
astral haven
and when the drive detects that only 1 part is enabled, it disables both in the proprietary drivers
vagrant pagoda
if its a halfheight card it will still even fit
vagrant pagoda
they have a x8x8 to x4x4 bifercation riser
oh wait
derp
i read as dual x8
not dual x4
astral haven
oh yea theres another condition
x16 on the gpu
because otherwise i might as well have stuck with my old system
vagrant pagoda
i havent seen a x4 to x2x2
astral haven
and the problem is its on 1 pcb
vagrant pagoda
yes
vagrant pagoda
the riser i have is for dual x8 cards
makes them work in a single x8
it remroutes the pins
vagrant pagoda
yes
astral haven
without a plx chip
vagrant pagoda
to make a dual x8 work in a single x8 need a adapter that moves 5-8 lanes to the 9-12 location and has the timing repeaters to make it work
which they make
i dont know if you can do the same with x4+x4 to x2+x2
astral haven
and either way you would be sacrificing bandwidth
at that point might as well get a pile of old sas drives and run them with a nice raid controller
vagrant pagoda
yeah you need a riser with a pcie3.0 plx
vagrant pagoda
then you could run a x8 2.0 in a x4 3.0 slot
astral haven
and either way i also bought a pair of 56gb infiniband cards, which require 3.0x8 of bandwidth anyways so the point is moot
astral haven
tr5k doesnt exist yet
vagrant pagoda
you dont even have a 5000
reef tundra
They be talking in algebra or somethin
astral haven
fuck is this then?
vagrant pagoda
you said you had a 4600
astral haven
what
reef tundra
Someone get them a ti-84 graphing calculator
astral haven
also there isnt a 4600
just a 4650g
the 4600g doesnt exist in reality
fuck it windows reinstall time
also i wont complain about the bmc
being able to do anything i want on my desktop from my laptop is super nice
😛
vagrant pagoda
yeah out of band is nice
i have a x470 server with the asrack board
can you do all the out of band stuff with it?
remote mount media, directly edit bios settings, see all the sensor info?
astral haven
It just does this perpetually :/
Anyways yes reinstall time
Yes, sorta, no
I can control the bios remotely but I can't change the settings without booting into bios
vagrant pagoda
can re find the drive?
astral haven
Nop
It sees the base drives
and i cant install drivers to have it see the drives
this is all the info it gives me :/
all it lets me do is flash the bios
oooh
i can use the remote usb thing to install windows remotely
imma try that
chrome estuary
anyone know how the 5800x is? I really doubt I need a fuckin 5900x/5950x
astral haven
the 5900x is hugely better value
the 5800x isnt slow but theres no point in getting it when the 10700k exists
chrome estuary
the 5900x is literally double the price. and while I'd need a new mobo anyway, i'd be going from ryzen already to intel if i went with a 10700k or any intel.
chrome estuary
the 5800x is like 395 and the 5900x (only one I saw but I didn't really look around) is almost 700
astral haven
eur?
chrome estuary
US
astral haven
oh dang 400 us for the 5800x is almost good
chrome estuary
yeah i know and that's what I do
astral haven
chrome estuary
which is why I'd like to grab an x570 board and a 5800x or 5900x (if it wasn't double the price)
astral haven
the 10700k is too good compared to the 5800x in games
there is a very short list of games where the 5800x wins
and a good 15 minutes of messing with the memory will make the 10700k anhialate the 5800x
chrome estuary
yeah but that's the case isn't it? intel is better at games.
astral haven
yup
better at games and cheaper
5800x slaughters it in pretty much any professional workload, but you said games...
chrome estuary
what's up with the 11th series i7? is it any better? I might consider going back to intel at that rate and if the 10th and 11th gen intel aren't that much different, I'll go with the cheaper 10th gen
chrome estuary
i've got no fucking clue what avx-512 is so if i went with intel, 10th gen it is
astral haven
basically dolphin emulator and particle simms
chrome estuary
eh. I might play dolphin but I highly doubt it'll matter all that much in the whole scheme of things
astral haven
Yup
chrome estuary
I've already got good memory, ssds and everything else. I'd only need to replace mobo and CPU
astral haven
And even then, 5 minutes in ram tuning is pretty easy
Also despite the crazy power draw, both 10th and 11th gen can be air cooled
Where 5000 requires solid liquid cooling to not theottle
chrome estuary
god damn. the 2700x runs fine on air cooling at a solid 4ghz
astral haven
yup
chrome estuary
it doesn't even spin up that loud when under load...
astral haven
its around a 210mm2 die tho
around 130w over 210mm2 is ez to cool
5800x is 145w on 64mm2
thats almost 3x the density
chrome estuary
with the 3070ti coming in, i'd like to upgrade my CPU which any direction I go already requires a new mobo.
astral haven
yes
chrome estuary
I've got a 650w psu (iirc) so i should have enough power for any sensible build
astral haven
and with the annoyance this 5950x has given me id also recommend getting a cpu with an igp :/
chrome estuary
what annoyances has the 5950x given
plus i don't really see a reason going with the kf over k anyway, 10$ for no igp isn't really worth it
astral haven
just not booting mostly
alot of blank black screens
horrifically bad performance
lagging on desktop
there are so many drivers you need like wtf
and none of them are whql so they dont come through windows update
astral haven
also the power draw is dumb high just on desktop
chrome estuary
I still probably won't upgrade for a while, other than the GPU I really didn't have any issues.
astral haven
its in the 40-50 range just doing nothing
chrome estuary
damn
astral haven
and thats stock
my 9900k with a forced constant 5ghz allcore was at 25w
🤦♂️
its only power efficient at load
and even then
steam downloads saturating my internet connection uses around 90w where my 9900k was in the 60s