🔌│tech

[crisp granite]

^^

[reef patrol]

TECH meems

[wheat plume]

^^

o.o oh

[reef patrol]

Bad Lana. Don't get stuck on rslash's videos. 😄

[wheat plume]

LOL

[reef patrol]

You'll be like me - Unable to stop watching the next video again and again with 2B2T 😛

[wheat plume]

ahahah

:')

[misty pier]

im never doing tech support

[crisp granite]

mhm

[misty pier]

its like teaching apes how to handle simple equipment

[crisp granite]

I see why

humans are really fucking dumb

[misty pier]

especially when you have to sit on a damn phone to talk to them

that is infuriating

i praise people who work in a call center and can actually put up with that crap

[crisp granite]

I swear

they must be high

or mother teresa

[misty pier]

i kind of need to do call center work in this field im going into

[crisp granite]

or both

[misty pier]

so im really not looking forward to that again

like some people can be kind and gentle

then you got some karen-like people who are abrasive and complaining to you why x does not work and expect you to fix it over the phone 🗿

[crisp granite]

yeah

something tells me I'd have a bottle of vodka to get me through the day if I had to do that

[misty pier]

yeah some of the call center jobs these days can be done at home so

you can pretty much drink on the job

nobody can complain about your alcoholic breath lmao

[ashen spindle]

https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1371825497794093063

VideoCardz.com (@VideoCardz)

Sale embargo? No one ever heard of it

Twitter · Mar 16, 2021, 2:07 PM

[reef patrol]

[ashen spindle]

but its sad, they are getting scammed with the prices

[crisp granite]

lol

my buddy can finally get his 11700K and shut up about it

[ashen spindle]

yeah only costs 200 over msrp lol

[crisp granite]

not unheard of

[ashen spindle]

when zen3 is in stock at msrp now?

were are not talking about gpus lol

[crisp granite]

better than $1500 CAD for a $700 GPU

200 above MSRP is a steal nowadays

sad but true

[ashen spindle]

no for cpus thats really not a steal

thats 10 below msrp even lmao

[crisp granite]

they're out of stock in CAN

ffs

[ashen spindle]

combined thats like 30k units sold

[crisp granite]

hm...would it be cheaper to just import a 5600x from germany, over buying one here?

because they're being scalped here

somehow

[reef patrol]

Just keep RMA shipping costs in mind

[crisp granite]

right

actually

hm

canada post could ship it worldwide for like $40

actually

^^

or this

supply down south is a little less dire

[old marlin]

mindfactory doesn't sell directly outside germany anymore for private customers

[ashen spindle]

mindfactory is not the only german store either lol

[old marlin]

well yea

cheapest one though

[ashen spindle]

5600x is same price at multiple stores

oh also rocket lake announced fully, no real news, sales around end of month

[proper crystal]

That should be illegal within EU (common market stuff)

[old marlin]

why should it

if you make a shop and only sell to people that have the letter g in their name you can decide to do so

[proper crystal]

Yes, but businesses selling to consumers in a country belonging to EU can't explicitly bar purchase for citizens of EU countries other than the one they are selling to.
They can not offer shipping, for example, but explicit ban would be contentious

[old marlin]

well yea

they don't offer shipping

you can obv buy for pickup

how else would you get it though?

use the "teleport to house" option?

[ashen spindle]

but you cant buy for pickup bc local store is closed atm

[old marlin]

well yea

even if I doubt it is economically viable for an EU citizen to buy in germany and come over for pickup

[proper crystal]

There are EU countries that are pretty close to Germany.

It's not an island.

[old marlin]

yes

[proper crystal]

(I am joking)

Not being all too seripus

[ashen spindle]

the mindfactory store still isn't close to a boarder even if it were open

[old marlin]

maybe at the northern end of the netherlands

it is somewhat close to that ig

still kind of a big trip

like 100+km

would be just over the border

[halcyon moss]

3:30 😮

[zenith sonnet]

Memory bottleneck

[red oyster]

I had 4gb out of 8gb used

[zenith sonnet]

Bandwidth/latency starved?

Minecraft GC also hiccups when you give it too little or too much memory to work with

[edgy hull]

Hard to say, I went 2x8gb 3800-14-15-15 (dont remember rest of timings cuz not running them now) and still rarely seen maxed single core/GPU when on shaders

Probably a whole lot of 100% spikes that were too fast for utilization polling

[ashen spindle]

its not all parks, just general forest/farmland and quite zoomed out

[zenith sonnet]

Eww
That's long enough to make meat go bad real quick

[crisp granite]

nah

well

yes

but not if it's sub zero

I've had bread freeze in my car before 😆

[misty pier]

damn, it only takes me 20 mins on a good day to get to a grocery store

[crisp granite]

wow

laws here are funny

[old marlin]

forests do not mean there are no highways

like germany is close to 50% forests

[chrome estuary]

I know your pain Locke

[crisp granite]

you can't get pulled over and ticketed for driving under 10km per hour over the speed limit

so basically everyone drives 8 to 10 km above the limit

[old marlin]

55mph

[misty saffron]

hahahahahahhaa

[crisp granite]

it's nice barreling down a major street at 60 km per hour

[old marlin]

are you even planning to arrive at some point?

[misty saffron]

i drive 140 when the speed limit is 110

[crisp granite]

wow

the max here is like 115 in some areas

[old marlin]

at over 100km/h the tolerance is 3% here

[misty saffron]

also in russia you're allowed to drive 80km/h in cities

[old marlin]

under 100km/h it is 3km/h

80 in cities is just stupid

50 in germany

and reduced to 30 if necessary

[misty saffron]

30 is not necessary

80 is

[old marlin]

speed limits in germany are placed when required

[crisp granite]

depends on where you are, some parts of my city allow for people to go like 80 km per hour, which is 90 in practice

[old marlin]

aka actual danger

[crisp granite]

so, I can't go 150km/h through a school crossing

sadge

[misty saffron]

you can if nobody sees

[crisp granite]

just kidding, I know common sense

[old marlin]

oh yea schools are ALWAYS 30kmh

[old marlin]

radar traps

[misty saffron]

if nothing sees

[old marlin]

the only way the police can really ticket you

also they put them next to schools quite often

[misty pier]

most speed zones here let you go 110-120km legally

[misty saffron]

you people don't have radar notifications in maps?

[misty pier]

radar notifications?

[old marlin]

does not work well on mobile ones obv

[crisp granite]

not in my area

[old marlin]

if they were fixed, then yea obviously

even then

[crisp granite]

and even then, it's a safe bet for them to be at the bottom of hills and stuff like that

[old marlin]

if you go 80 in a school area you are just an asshole

[crisp granite]

well, duh

[misty saffron]

you're not an asshole you're just late to school

[misty pier]

people that don't stop when a school bus is dropping off a kid are assholes

[crisp granite]

people that try to beat the train are assholes

someone tried to do that in my city

[old marlin]

wtf

[crisp granite]

got their car crushed, themselves killed

[old marlin]

speed limit on most trains is 120

so what even is the point

[misty pier]

flashbacks to drivers ed of some video of someone running into a train

[crisp granite]

and shut down service on an LRT line for like a day and a half

it was an LRT line

it was doing like 20km

someone just tried to get through it fast, ended up getting crushed between the stop and the train

serves them right

[old marlin]

ah

that is what you mean with beating the train

[misty pier]

cops here always sat by the bottom of hills to catch people who don't slow down to match the limit

[old marlin]

do you not have gates?

?

[misty pier]

the crossing arm?

[old marlin]

ah

well are those not GFK typically by now?

[misty saffron]

don't tell me you don't have this kinda gates everywhere https://up.hw.gl/OpmAjJBkxv.png

[old marlin]

uhh

fiberglass

wtf

[misty pier]

never seen those here

[crisp granite]

the dumbass who tried to beat that LRT also trashed a pretty nice mercedes SUV

[old marlin]

pretty nice mercedes SUV

[crisp granite]

on top of killing themselves

[old marlin]

what

oxymoron

[crisp granite]

idk, I'm stupid

SUVs are more common than anything else here

[misty saffron]

pretty nice benz

hahah

[old marlin]

do you not have like metal poles coming straight up?

[misty saffron]

we have those at each railway crossing..

[old marlin]

these

[misty pier]

bollards?

[crisp granite]

those

fun

[old marlin]

idk wtf to call them

they can lift cars

[crisp granite]

we don't have any of those iirc

[misty pier]

those are bollards i think

this is a typical rail crossing in my town

[old marlin]

[crisp granite]

right

these

[misty pier]

just arms

[old marlin]

meanwhile germany

[misty pier]

y though

[old marlin]

has all of that on some footpath nobody uses

[misty saffron]

what the fuck

[misty pier]

y does a footpath need that

[crisp granite]

dude, it's the same

[old marlin]

ye

[crisp granite]

well I would, but I'd probably be shot for walking near

[misty pier]

europeans are strange

[old marlin]

a few years ago it was normal to have the gate + a fence

[crisp granite]

nah

[misty pier]

no

[crisp granite]

wait, wut

[old marlin]

and you had a yellow box you could pull a lever on to ask if they could open it

[crisp granite]

it's not

[misty pier]

[crisp granite]

just different

[old marlin]

it is not meant to prevent acces

[misty pier]

anti bike?

[old marlin]

it is meant to show if it is safe to cross

well my example

[misty saffron]

look both fucking ways

[old marlin]

that one is

maybe they removed the fence but the gate was embedded into the foundation

well

it is

modern railway crossings in germany require the gates to only cover half of the road

and the other side gets covered with a much smaller one just for the walkway

so people can't get trapped in there

wdym

like those silent truck back up noises?

wdym with silent

like in what way

ah

no

[misty pier]

no ding ding?

[old marlin]

won't be a thing here

probably

[misty pier]

interesting

doubt my town will have something like that

lmao

im not even that close to a crossing yet i still hear the horn

you'd think all the trees would absorb the sound, you're dead wrong

[ashen spindle]

there are silent crossings but there are requirements for it, there is one where they dont meet it and the train right next to town makes the entire town mad every night

[misty pier]

i think the rail line in my town isn't used anymore

so i dont even hear trains coming from town

[ashen spindle]

wrong copy paste lmao but still fits I guess?

https://twitter.com/momomo_us/status/1371855809823395840 meant to copy this

188号 (@momomo_us)

Up to 1.08X more FPS on Total War Three Kingdoms: Dynasty with a 11th Gen Intel® Core™ i9-11900K processor

Processor: 11th Gen Intel® Core™ i9-11900K processor (RKL-S) PL1=250W TDP, 8C16T
Processor: AMD Ryzen™ 9 5950X processor PL1=105W TDP, 16C32T

Twitter · Mar 16, 2021, 4:08 PM

a whole 1.08x more

[hard thicket]

for literally twice the tdp ?

what a deal

[ashen spindle]

even worse, if this is accurate they manually set the TDP for the 5950 x lower than it usually is lmao

so they needed to gimp it to barely beat it with much more power

[crimson wigeon]

Worth it

Gotta have them frames whatever the costs

[ashen spindle]

definitely need it in my RTS game!

[crisp granite]

yikes

so basically utter shit

[ashen spindle]

feel like intel made the mistake elsewhere though

they kinda needed to make rocket lake, or comet lake was ending up as a new socket with just a single cpu generation

imo they should've made comet lake still on the older variants, make the new socket for rocket lake so alder laker can use the same

[crisp granite]

yeah

but new mobo sales are also good

[ashen spindle]

the way it currently is it only makes sense to grab mid/low tier intel cpus as budget option

[crisp granite]

if they can sell a whole new mobo with every 2 gens, they will

[ashen spindle]

but they dont sell boards and dont care what vendors make

[crisp granite]

they sell the chipsets used in the boards

[ashen spindle]

sure but that wouldn't have changed if they restructure what socket gets which cpu

[crisp granite]

idk why intel changes sockets as often as they do

but it makes sense from a chipset point of view

[reef tundra]

Because they are intel and that is what the cool kids do

[ashen spindle]

because otherwise you end up in situations like AMD where the backwards compatibility is a nightmare

[crisp granite]

yeah

both sides of the coin are shit

[ashen spindle]

the bigger issue with intel was that you absolutely needed a high end board for overclocking etc.

despite the lower boards having capable hardware

like im using a b550 board because it has all I need for like 2-300 less than an equivalent x570 board would cost

[reef tundra]

It is intel being greedy and shafting the consumer

[timid chasm]

Buy the Dark Hero just for the usb ports though

that has a normal amount of usb ports though

P-Prime has the same # as the XE except the XE has 2 USB-C...

ditto

[ashen spindle]

I’ll stick to my aorus pro for USB ports :p

[timid chasm]

See that's a nice for the price

I've always skimped on motherboards cause fuck $200 for one

[ashen spindle]

well I got it for 130

[timid chasm]

yeah that's even nicer

[ashen spindle]

msrp 180 but was on sale

tbh would've gotten it even without sale bc sub200 no other boards has as many usb ports

[timid chasm]

Maybe I'll buy a fancier board if I can get my hands on a P-ATX V2

[old marlin]

you love to see it

ah GN vid btw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgFlB0HG_84

[ashen spindle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSyJLSWtBAI ah darn missed the start

[ashen spindle]

aorus pro

the one I mentioned lol

[fickle ore]

tldr nerds?

Will I have to retire my 5800x?

[reef tundra]

Computer is binairy

[ashen spindle]

yes, mandatory to sell it to me for 10€

[crisp granite]

I'll pay 20€

minus shipping, of course

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean it isn't a bad option if you want to upgrade later.

[crisp granite]

true that

[vagrant pagoda]

Or you want 3 NVMe and a capture card

[crisp granite]

I know someone who bought a pretty pricy mobo and a Ryzen APU

and they are just waiting for stock of ryzen 5000 to be decent and GPUs to be available

because neither are rn

[vagrant pagoda]

I was almost there lol

But I got lucky

[crisp granite]

same

I was prepared to buy a 3400U

but

[vagrant pagoda]

I got a 5900x for msrp

[crisp granite]

that email about an RTX 3070 came

and I pounced on it

I bought it an hour later

[vagrant pagoda]

5900x

[crisp granite]

to higher up chips

in this case, a 5950x

but supply of those is shit here

and price even more so

[vagrant pagoda]

5900/5950 will drop used prices faster than a 5600x

Because when ddr5 comes out people will want cheap ddr4 used rigs

[crisp granite]

at this point, I really don't know why

[vagrant pagoda]

Huh?

[crisp granite]

unless you absolutely need the PCI-E lanes and extra cores

a 5950X is enough

[vagrant pagoda]

Price will stabilize before zen 4

Amd can actually deliver silicon to real consumers vs nvidia

[crisp granite]

well, supply for their stuff atm is pretty shit

[vagrant pagoda]

Ryzen issues right now are just Eypc doing so well

I mean they keep stocking

Constantly

[crisp granite]

fair enough

but for now

[vagrant pagoda]

And once Eypc tapers off

Ryzen will have fine stock

Amd dosent make artificial chip shortages

[crisp granite]

yeah

[vagrant pagoda]

Eh

[crisp granite]

it's just an issue with supply

[vagrant pagoda]

Intel dose 100% they cut off previous gen production before next gen is out

[crisp granite]

NVidia selling their GPUs and them being so good at mining that the miners buy them all up instantly isn't an artificial chip shortage

it's just one group buying up supply

[vagrant pagoda]

Mean while amd is still making new 2xxx ryzens

[crisp granite]

I've only ever seen that happen with cyberpunk

but, it kinda makes sense when you think about it

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah it's dumb

[proud nacelle]

It is generally agreed that turning disks on and off causes them to "die", or so to speak... But there's no valid research papers on this AFAIK.

If anyone knows of such research papers, please do tell. I'm actually curious if this is true or not.

[zenith sonnet]

Damn 5850U looks preddy gud

[vagrant pagoda]

Inrush current to the motor can cause the driver board to fail

Which is a repairable failure, but still takes the disk offline

This is how most drives fail

Either a motor/driver issue or a head flex cable failure

[astral haven]

motors have known failure modes

[ashen spindle]

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/03/google-undercuts-apple-with-new-15-revenue-share-for-certain-play-apps/ progress yay

[proud nacelle]

Right... So turning them on is what generally kills them. Isn't there an inrush current limiter though for these types of things? Either an external piece of hardware for it or even in the software? I mean I doubt it for software.

I mean logically a slow starting hard drive also sounds counter intuitive for like 99% of the population... Back in the day they were slower to start, but they still started up pretty quick.

[astral haven]

mage the problem is the torque

to acheive the required spinup times that they advertise they need to torque them pretty hard

[proud nacelle]

yeah. that's why i said "a slow starting hard drive also sounds counter intuitive for like 99% of the population"

even if they did reduce torque, there's a limit to how slow slow is. there should be a balance between torque and lifespan, but this is out of my hand.

like increasing a drive by 1rpm per second is ridiculous... even older drives <1990s spun up faster

then again if the drive is never powered down... who cares I guess

[astral haven]

problem is number of cycles

[proud nacelle]

so short of never turning off the drive, or killing them quickly, there's no option. well, i guess that settles that.

i suppose there isn't a way to reduce the power draw while the drive isn't in use (without turning it off/putting it to sleep)?

[astral haven]

nope

90% of the power of the hard drive is the main motor even while seeking

[proud nacelle]

damn. 2.5" have lower power draw but at the expense of ridiculously lowered data storage

[astral haven]

i mean

5tb isnt that small

pretty sure 5tb 2.5s are the most dense hdd storage option in terms of volume

[proud nacelle]

Are they SMR or CMR?

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ pretty sure they predate smr

yea well

cant go helium

and they cant increase production costs because ssds exist

all of the over 10tbs now are helium

[proud nacelle]

:/

[astral haven]

and so to hit 6tb in a 2.5 with current tech probably requires helium

[vagrant pagoda]

Eh there isn't a lot of demand for high capacity spinners anymore

In 2.5

[astral haven]

thats a very important qualification

[vagrant pagoda]

A single 3.5 14tb will be less power than 2 7tb 2.5s though

[astral haven]

tape isnt that high power

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah

[astral haven]

no ion

[vagrant pagoda]

At the same rpm

[astral haven]

since the 3.5 is helium its gonna be alot lower friction

my 12tb 7200 rpm with 6 platters (i believe) is lower load power than my 2tb 2 platter 7200 rpm drive(s)

[vagrant pagoda]

A 3.5 helium drive is around 10w with random write

[astral haven]

ok but if you are loading it you gotta have the same speed loading

[proud nacelle]

^

or if you are trying to use it for a project

battery powered

[vagrant pagoda]

Then you'd have ssds anyway

[astral haven]

and my heliums are 10w total from the wall in an enclosure

well actually ssds arent nescessarily more efficient

if you are needing a ton of capacity it can be very high power to write to them

[vagrant pagoda]

For speed focused drives yes

[astral haven]

in general

[vagrant pagoda]

For storage focused no

The controllers are the power hungry part

[astral haven]

no ion

the nand is very very high power to write

its well over half

unless you are looking at pcie ssds in which case 🤷‍♂️

but for storage ssds. alot of the power is in the nand

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean

[astral haven]

also the annoying bit is how you cant buy the larger ssds

[vagrant pagoda]

My 660p in my pinebokk pro

[astral haven]

qlc for data storage is a baaaaaaaad idea

[vagrant pagoda]

Is 20mw idle

[astral haven]

idle sure

[vagrant pagoda]

And 4w max

[astral haven]

no

[vagrant pagoda]

For 2 tb

Yes it is

The highest power profile on it is 4w

The pinebokn won't run anything higher power

[astral haven]

oh wow thats not bad

but thats qlc

and qlc is useless for long term storage

2tb of qlc is the equivalent of 1tb of tlc effectively

[vagrant pagoda]

Apples to apples

4 2tb qlc in raid 5 is going to last longer than a 6tb spinner

[astral haven]

so lets go with for example 20tb of tlc

no

[vagrant pagoda]

In the same size

[astral haven]

qlc lasts 1-3 years when unpowered

hdds last 10-50

[vagrant pagoda]

Why would you ever think if archiving on a ssd/hdd?

That's dumb as hell

[astral haven]

because hdds last 10 years still 🤷‍♂️

thats long enough for most regulations

[vagrant pagoda]

Not reliably

[astral haven]

yes

10 years of reliable storage is nearly guaranteed

and you can buy drives which do guarantee it

hippa is 6 years

[proud nacelle]

@astral haven https://i.redd.it/wmspmlgnzii51.jpg 24 years

[astral haven]

thats not qlc

[vagrant pagoda]

Who dose?

[proud nacelle]

nope, just decided to pluck this in bcs of the 10 year thing

hdds can last a hell of a long time

[astral haven]

is that file corrupted?

oh

no thats how old the drive is

[proud nacelle]

correct

[vagrant pagoda]

Who sells a 6 year warrantied drive?

[astral haven]

so that drive specifically can last at least 20 years

[proud nacelle]

no one. they'd lose money if they did

[vagrant pagoda]

Or better yet 10

[proud nacelle]

not to mention it would take them too long to test the bloody things

[vagrant pagoda]

So no one rates a drive for 10 years of cold stoage

You know who dose rate drives that long?

Gold backed silver cd/dvd and tape

Which is what actually stores data that long

High quality LTO tape is rated for 10-15+ years

[astral haven]

yea but it actually physically lasts alot longer than that if its not abused

[vagrant pagoda]

Gold sealed cdr and dvdr are rated for 100+ years

They are the best permanent storage

[astral haven]

horrific density tho

[vagrant pagoda]

Because even now they can easily be read without having an acutal drive

By what medium?

[astral haven]

cds and dvds

[proud nacelle]

archival discs can hold 100GB per disk afaik

[vagrant pagoda]

A stack of dvd with layer protectors the height of a dvd drive

[proud nacelle]

but that's still horrible, compared to a hard drive or lto tape of that size

[vagrant pagoda]

Isn't terrible

But the fact in 100 years

With no dvd drive

Someone could still read it

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ that aint the problem

[proud nacelle]

that is impressive though

[vagrant pagoda]

With just optical magnification

Is important

To lots of archival systems

[astral haven]

also i do have in my computer a drive that can theoretically at least hold data for ~200 years in the dod required archival thermal cycling spec

[vagrant pagoda]

So a single dvd can replace a ROOM full of paper records

So density is good

[proud nacelle]

what about microfilm?

[vagrant pagoda]

Poor life

[astral haven]

film doesnt last that long relatively speaking

its like a dvd but alot thinner and less dense

[vagrant pagoda]

The light used to read it damages it every time

[proud nacelle]

[astral haven]

oh thats not a problem at all

[proud nacelle]

sounds like a problem with the material or something then

[astral haven]

and thats true for every medium

[vagrant pagoda]

Yes

[astral haven]

film is like consumer dvds and cds

in terms of durability

[vagrant pagoda]

But also density is lower

[astral haven]

yup

well

[vagrant pagoda]

Lto is king

[astral haven]

nah

hyperscalars are moving away from tape

tape is only being used for legacy systems now

anyways you arent curious about my 200 year drive

ill give you a hint
its solid state 😛

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean google is still the largest user of tape

[proud nacelle]

🤔 you say 200 years but under what conditions?

[astral haven]

dod spec apparently 🤷‍♂️

[proud nacelle]

right let me ask this then: how often must it be powered on or something? what about room temperature, humidity, as well as bitrot/bitflips?

[astral haven]

the data storage mechanism is permanent

and is inherently bistable under like 150c

[vagrant pagoda]

Also lto isn't for anything like hyperscalers

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️

[vagrant pagoda]

Tape is for records and archived backups

Large corps and governments who never delete anything

And store emails and reports indefinitely

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ thats not as common nowdays

[vagrant pagoda]

Huh?

Yes it is

Every company keeps all thier transactional history for ever

They keep all internal email for ever

All call recodings

[astral haven]

alot of people are moving towards throwing everything in redundant data pools and replacing the drives when their warranty runs out

and thats not true at all

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean why would they when the density is poor

And life is lower

[astral haven]

convenience and scalability

tape isnt that much more dense than hdds

the amount of space required for a tape arm is immense

the nsa exabyte project was hdds only

at least as far as we know

[vagrant pagoda]

It's yottabyte

Not exa

[astral haven]

lolno

[vagrant pagoda]

And that's because it's all hot data they use to train ai algorithms

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ everyone is using everything to train algorithms nowdays

[vagrant pagoda]

Also tape arms are tiny

Literally the same thickness as a tape

[astral haven]

they require a ton of volume

[vagrant pagoda]

And the have tape back to back

So it's only a 30% loss

Per volume

[astral haven]

remember the entire area needs to be climate controlled

[vagrant pagoda]

Same with hard drives

[astral haven]

nope

the idea is throw the hard drives away when they fail and have the data be statistically safe

using all sorts of fancy nonsense

[vagrant pagoda]

You can also get 30PB per rack with tape

[astral haven]

you can get 1pb with tape lel

[vagrant pagoda]

Thats a library controller setup

The 30 slots is the master

[astral haven]

oh geez

then yikes tape is ultra dead

[vagrant pagoda]

120 is a active addon

And 640 is the parking rack

You can add 20 or 30 of them

But even with 2 racks

30+640

Is 1200pb

Most systems support off the shelf 1000+ tape setups

Normally closer to 10k

[astral haven]

how much storage is it per u

[vagrant pagoda]

2 racks

1200pb

The sl8500 supports 2048 tape drives and 300,000 tapes

[astral haven]

uh thats not 19 inch racks

yea nothing here is 19 inches lel

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah they aren't really installed along with racks

They are standlone units

[astral haven]

entire system is 733 inches across for 1200pb

and is ~53 units high

38 racks across and 52 units high

1976 equivalent units

hdds are 477tb per unit

thats 900pb vs 1200

and the 900pb is nearly a million times faster?

[vagrant pagoda]

Cost and life

[astral haven]

dude it doesnt matter they dont care about that

[vagrant pagoda]

Lto8 tape is ~50 a pop in volume

And is rated for 15 years

[astral haven]

these tape libraries are a few million dollars

lel

and the installations require maintanance subscriptions

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah also

They generally have automated access points to off-site old tape as it's filled

Cold storage tape has even better density

And the cost of tape makes that an easy option

[astral haven]

find one

its just people dont use them any more 🤷‍♂️

old installations get maintained

but noone deploys new tape

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean 19 And 2020 were records years for tape

[astral haven]

doesnt make this not true

people are only expanding their current libraries

[vagrant pagoda]

Lol

Dragging those goalposts must get tiring

[astral haven]

thing is everyone is waiting for crystal

and in the meanwhile is deploying hdds to the nth degree

[vagrant pagoda]

Tape is literally at it's all time high

[astral haven]

ok but so is intel

[vagrant pagoda]

Due to cyber threats and ransomware

[astral haven]

cool but ssd storage is growing faster than tape

and hdd storage is growing faster than ssd storage

[vagrant pagoda]

Yes because the amount of hot data for web has exploded exponentially

That isnt the kind of data that is stored on tape

[astral haven]

the point is not that tape doesnt exist

the point is that less data is being stored on tape relative to hdds and ssds

sure more data is being stored on tape

but its not growing anywhere near as fast as hdds or ssds

and the fact of the matter is people are avoiding deploying new tape

its just not as manageable 🤷‍♂️

[vagrant pagoda]

Lol how is it less manageable?

It's just used for archiving and cold storage

Which is what we were talking about

No one is cold storaging hard drives

[astral haven]

again my point is that cold storage is going away

[vagrant pagoda]

No it isnt

You always keep atleast one cold storage

[astral haven]

why?

[vagrant pagoda]

Or you're one software bug/hacker from no data

Off-site, offline, and off limits

Is the basics of archiving data

[astral haven]

all can be done with servers in storage

but thing is

[vagrant pagoda]

No one

Is cold storaging hard drices

Who do you even know what dose that?

[astral haven]

amazon?

trucks full of hdds in warehouses

[vagrant pagoda]

Proof?

[astral haven]

i forget the name of the service

its an aws service

[vagrant pagoda]

They use them to send data

Not store

[astral haven]

you have to give them a weeks notice to get your data out

[vagrant pagoda]

They send to your site to take data or to recive data from them

And it dosent take that long

[astral haven]

oh yea theres that too

[vagrant pagoda]

I've seen it happen

[astral haven]

but no thats just how you get data in

[vagrant pagoda]

Or out

[astral haven]

i forget the name of the service

[vagrant pagoda]

Snowmobile

It ain't cheao

And it's end to end encrypted physically

You send someone to amazon with the hardware key

To unlock it before it's transferred into ebs

It's about 200gb/s

But that could of been upgraded

Thus was 2018

[astral haven]

snowball

thats what my friend used to import it

[vagrant pagoda]

Snowball is handheld

Snowmobile is a semi truck with a 40ft container

[astral haven]

yea

well define handheld

[vagrant pagoda]

They are big lunchbox sized

Again

That isnt cold storage

[astral haven]

it was a tier of aws glacier

[vagrant pagoda]

Last time I checked glacier wasn't spinning disks

[astral haven]

yea s3 glacier is hdds
and deep archive is tape

(s3 glacier deep archive)

[vagrant pagoda]

I don't think it's tape

Thought it was optical

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ amazon doesnt buy a whole lot of optical (at least enough to make a dent on the market)

[vagrant pagoda]

I mean lto is only like 0.5c per gb in volume

DG is 0.1c

[astral haven]

per month

wait no

what?

[vagrant pagoda]

Yes

Optical is 0.004c

[astral haven]

per what

[vagrant pagoda]

Gb

Which is inline with DG

[astral haven]

yea but for how long

[vagrant pagoda]

Per disk

[astral haven]

deep glacier charges you every month

[vagrant pagoda]

Lto8 cost 0.5c a gb

[astral haven]

so amazon has to keep you a customer for 5 months to make profit?

doesnt seem that long

[vagrant pagoda]

No way they are charging 0.1 for that with storage

Optical would make sense

Normal glacial is probably tape

[astral haven]

its too fast for tape

[vagrant pagoda]

Not really

[astral haven]

oh wow google doesnt offer any tape on google cloud

dang 1.2c a month with sub second access time

"AWS’s GDA costs $0.0099 per GB per month whereas Google’s Cloud archive is more expensive at $0.0012/GiB per month.

Google’s Cloud Archive retrieves data in less than a second, the same as Google’s Nearline and Coldline storage."

minimum storage time is 1 year

i mean im currently paying them .005c/gb but shh

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah aws is def tape

150mb/s is the priority retrieval speed with time 1-5 minutes

[astral haven]

tape is alot faster than that per tape tho

thats just gigabit limited

[vagrant pagoda]

Yeah

But that in par for tape

[astral haven]

wut

[vagrant pagoda]

With seek time

And retrieval of the tape

[astral haven]

hmm should i buy this

lel

exact opposite of what we have been talking about here lol

couple ns power off data retention if i dont have a backup battery

[vagrant pagoda]

Google has a minium retention if a year though

[astral haven]

🤷‍♂️ aws is 5 months

also not on my storage plan

[vagrant pagoda]

No glacier is 90 days

[astral haven]

oh neat

still not the point of either of these

[vagrant pagoda]

I'd be more worried about food and water at that point than data

[fickle ore]

Ok Amazon is literally a scummy company

Ordered a memory kit in December, cancelled it via support but it was sent anyway. When it arrived, contacted support who told me to keep it for free as a one-off situation. Was retrocharged yesterday for the whole amount 123,99€ and upon contacting support they deny everything and prior chat logs where I was promised and assured it would be free.

[ashen spindle]

lol

[fickle ore]

Also the item I was dead on arrival 3 times in a row, so I had to send it back 3 times - I lost about 40€ for shipping costs until I got a working one.

Was told by CS that I should choose priority shipping for the 4th order so I get it fast and they'd reimburse shipping cost for that as a good will gesture

Now they say they cant reimburse me cuz it was shipped on time LOL

[ashen spindle]

you need to pay for sending stuff back for amazon??

[fickle ore]

YEp

[ashen spindle]

wtf

not here

isn't that an EU thing you dont have to pay that in case of return bc broken?

@reef patrol

[fickle ore]

Anyways 2 promises broken - bad bad customer

amazon reimburses up to 8€ per order but each shipping cost me 20€

[old marlin]

[fickle ore]

Guess they don't really care about their reputation

[old marlin]

afaik you only need to pay for it if you just don't want it

at least that is the case for me

if the product is faulty I never had to pay shipping

[fickle ore]

Try to live in finland, I told them each and every time it was broken item and still had to pay

[old marlin]

rip

[fickle ore]

They won't do an RMA either so you're fucked

[reef patrol]

If your RMA is accepted, the seller has to cover shipping within reasonable limits, yes.

So if they shipped it to you with CAREFUL, you have to do the same...and they have to recoup that.

This doesn't cover "US to EU" shipping though.

[ashen spindle]

well I assume it was from some EU amazon to finnland not from .com?

[fickle ore]

Amazon.de -> me

[reef patrol]

Within EU - It's covered.

[fickle ore]

Amazon doesn't RMA 3rd party sellers. So only option was to send it back as "faulty" which they compensated with 8€ each time - So each shipping back was -12€ for me

[fair gull]

the only time i had to pay shipping back was third party sellers on amazon

[fickle ore]

Never again, shit company

[fair gull]

tbf why did u even tell em that u still received it despite cancelled order

[fickle ore]

Thoughts on chargeback?

[shadow minnow]

Intel just leaked a new MacBook

[ivory geyser]

Well is it... white?

I guess

Also boring

[shadow minnow]

Not the color, look at the bezels too. Not boring, especially with M1X it will most likely got.

[ivory geyser]

Well tbh, it looks like one of those 2002 "futuristic designs" - kinda ugly imho

Not a huge fan

[ashen spindle]

I'll be honest that just looks like any other macbook to me

[crisp granite]

mhm

the macbook design hasn't changed much in the past ten years

for all I know, that could be from 2012

[shadow minnow]

But the bezels are crazy small

Compared to most of other laptops too

[crisp granite]

could just be a macbook pro

those have fairly thin bezels

[ashen spindle]

it is

[ivory geyser]

Yea, they are. Good way how to crack the screen when transporting it.

[shadow minnow]

Last gen

[crisp granite]

thanks for pointing that out

[fair gull]

idk how amazon not paying u the shipping to a third party seller is scummy

but ok

[crisp granite]

I mean

most of the time, amazon is the middleman

it makes sense that they can't facilitate everything

[fair gull]

na for a lot u actually buy from amazon and send back to amazon

while yes not everything

[crisp granite]

I know, all the prime shipping is direct from them

and amazon warehouses

but, a lot of other stuff is third party

[fair gull]

but this is like saying ebay is scummy cause ebayseller#10374 didnt pay the return shipping and now u expect ebay to pay it

[crisp granite]

I mean

sure, the local amazon warehouse for me may have had a stupid number of covid cases

[ashen spindle]

a big resistance made on lies will crumble way faster than a tiny one build on a solid foundation

[fair gull]

welcome back confucius

[crisp granite]

shit captain, it's almost like you have some functional brain matter

[reef tundra]

Sorry the piss bottles are a part of the job

[ashen spindle]

negative

[crisp granite]

[crisp granite]

so, it's not just me who pisses into bottles?

ngl

worst thing you can do is mix up the ginger ale bottle and the pee bottle

[reef tundra]

Also fuck amazon

greedy capitalists pigs

brainwashing the masses that unions are bad with their fake news

[crisp granite]

I, as the end user, see none of that

I just see a great service, that delivers products fast and hassle free

none of the behind the scenes stuff

[misty pier]

man i seriously don't want to wait a month to order stuff from another retailer

that's why i go amazon

although i'm aware they're doing shit like this behind the scenes

[crisp granite]

I don't want to walk 20 minutes to my local best buy to get the same thing

when 3 clicks is all it takes to get it to my door tomorrow

[misty pier]

you do you mate

i'm spoiled by it

[crisp granite]

if it was really bad, there would have been formal complaints, and they would have been resolved by now

[reef tundra]

Amazon can afford to keep delivering the same service and give their practically slaves somewhat of human treatment. But that is going to lower the shareholders money who work so hard by owning the company

[crisp granite]

well, I'm one of them, with a pretty small slice

I want the stock price to increase in value, and I really don't care how they go about it

wait

one was there in the first place?

look, I want amazon workers to be compensated fairly for their work

but not to the detriment of amazon's bottom line

not really, I'm fine with whatever they do as long as earnings are up

if they dump some extra earnings into their workers pockets, that's great

fair enough

[urban lynx]

the bottom line of amazon?

[crisp granite]

the earnings

[urban lynx]

do you know how fucking much the guy owning amazon has in savings?

that bitch wouldnt need to earn one single cent more and could still afford a super sports car every month until his death

[crisp granite]

unimportant to amazon's stock price

but yes

insane figure

[reef tundra]

Fuck consumerism, fuck the exploitation of the working class, child labour, slave labour. ree. Id rather pay more so the people producing stuff can have decent lives. and fuck shareholders contributing nothing and demanding money for owing shit

[urban lynx]

you know stock market is just a way of rich people getting richer`?

[crisp granite]

good points, and so would I, but shareholders are a necessary part of our world

I'm glad that it's becoming more open to all

[reef tundra]

The shareholders should be the workers

[crisp granite]

stock options as part of payment

anyway

I'm gonna bail since I've clearly pissed people off

[urban lynx]

sure.
i gladly miss out on the payrise that'd allow me to get a place to live on my own instead of with my parents, just so my boss and his buddies who got shares in the company so they can buy a second pickup truck they dont need, because they just use their private planes everywhere anyway to go fishing, showing up once in a while at work, only to retrieve their camping or fishing gear, while we are already drowning in work.

sure.

"shareholders are important"

yeah.

to people wanting money from selling their company

who profits from sold shareholders i ask you?

the person that sells them.

who is that, i ask you?

[crisp granite]

they're too deeply ingrained, and for people who help fund startups typically get compensated with shares, in leau of actual cash down the line

[urban lynx]

how come there are so many, countless companies that can exist without being at the stock market then?

[crisp granite]

they choose not to

[urban lynx]

that dont sell shares

[crisp granite]

it's not mandatory

[urban lynx]

so... how is it necessary then?

[crisp granite]

so

lego, is a private company

they still have shares

but not publicly traded ones

a person might have given money to lego in exchange for a certain amount of stock, equity stuff like that

it's literally a slice of a company, hold enough and you can dictate what happens

[crisp granite]

and on top of that, not every company is big enough to be publicly listed

if that was the case, we'd have millions of "lemonade stand" stocks

that no-one would buy

it's also a lot of paperwork

[urban lynx]

and where in this equation does it explain that people in the lowest ranks must barely earn enough to live, not even comfortably, to make meets end for a good reason?

[crisp granite]

I wish I knew, saki

I wish there was a way all people could just live in peace and be happy, but human behaviour ruins that, like it ruins everything

[urban lynx]

didnt you say to prevent too much rise, so the shareholders can stay save and sound by just owning these papers?

[crisp granite]

idk what you mean by that

prevent too much rise?

[crisp granite]

ah, yes, I want amazon to report higher earnings

because that helps drive up the stock price

[urban lynx]

so you dont want good pay for everyone.

you want to give the bare minimum to people.

[crisp granite]

no, I want fair pay, but not if that means amazon reporting less in earnings, and the company leadership is the same way

[urban lynx]

in my eyes, share holders could do with a ton less of "winnings" just by owning these papers.

i dont see why a worker that does the most heavy lifting in the company, get barely enough to pay a place for living, and food. less able to do so with kids or being sick.
while some higher up, that doesnt even show up to work because "he doesnt have to" earn so much money, they could buy a new car each month, and still go to a restaurant every day and eat like a king.

[crisp granite]

that's just someone being an ass

[urban lynx]

that's the world.
and that's how the profit from shares happen almost 80%

welcome to the fucking world.

[crisp granite]

thanks, I hate it

[urban lynx]

if you arent born rich enough, you will suffer. by people exploiting you and your force, until you're all used up. so they can earn a dollar more from having the privilege of having you do their work.

aint that a dream

honestly i still dont get how i keep struggling and fighting against myself to live and experience more of this world. it's a bloody nightmare

[crisp granite]

there has to be some good in it for you to push on

same with everyone really

otherwise, I would have killed myself by now

[urban lynx]

a naive dream that things will change. that things will get better.

[crisp granite]

things will get better

[urban lynx]

so i've been told

without actual evidence

it's been 2 decades of this BS already

"it'll get better"

"only when you get older you'll understand"

"you'll mature and see things in a different light"

yeah. i come to understand that we kept cheating the generation after us. thanks.

[crisp granite]

well then

it's our turn to take up the mantle

[urban lynx]

and cheat those after us? sure.

[crisp granite]

or do we all suffer and break the cycle?

[urban lynx]

how about i just murder someone, and end up in state care for the rest of my life, being paid those stupid enough to keep working and paying taxes?
while i sit inside, get my own TV and dont have anything to do?

gotta love german prison

[crisp granite]

how about no, you don't go out and murder someone

[urban lynx]

dw, it'd only be my mom

[crisp granite]

ffs

[urban lynx]

she deserves it, trust me on that

[crisp granite]

coming from you, that makes sense

but it won't make things better

[urban lynx]

doesnt have to

actually

it would make things better

[crisp granite]

life when you leave prison is gonna be worse

[urban lynx]

i'd have to stop worrying about stuff for a while

[crisp granite]

and when reality snaps back, it'll snap back hard

[urban lynx]

well, is it my fault if i grew dependant on prison life?

[crisp granite]

saki

stop this line of thinking

you aren't going to, it's worse for you if you do, it won't solve anything

[urban lynx]

what do i want in this world?
where people get punished for shit, but a nazi party can go on threaten to murder and mutilate you, just because you are running a campaign for a "non nazi" party in an election? and police are just like "oh, hm. probably just a joke"

[crisp granite]

I sincerely hope that was either sarcasm or a really shit joke

[urban lynx]

neither.
that's real life.

[crisp granite]

if you really feel that way, I will happily block you

[urban lynx]

it's nothing i'm feeling.

it's something i've experienced

[crisp granite]

I...need to think

[ivory geyser]

You were in prison? 👀

[crisp granite]

do you really want this in the world, or is this what you hate?

because cutting contact to neonazis is no skin off my back

[urban lynx]

maybe read this as "what do i want in a world, where people..."
obviously i dont want this.

[crisp granite]

good

[urban lynx]

i hope you never try to make me seem like a nazi.

[crisp granite]

I at no point ever thought you were

[crisp granite]

the wording of this rubbed me the wrong way

that's it

[urban lynx]

good.
because it's a shitty world we live in, where you cant even try to put up a proper, progressive party, without being threatened by some new nazi organisation 2.0

[umbral knot]

My old neighbor was a neonazi and he hung a nazi flag on his porch one day and got shot

[urban lynx]

good riddance

[crisp granite]

he earned it

I wish I was there to blast his head open

maybe spit on his corpse

[misty pier]

jesus fucking christ

[urban lynx]

my parents voted for our barely legal right wing party. because they feel those are the only ones actually trying.

[umbral knot]

It was quite traumatizing for me because I was like 8-9 and heard him begging for his life

so um that might explain how I am today

[crisp granite]

(:

[umbral knot]

short a few braincells

[crisp granite]

that would have put a smile on my face

[urban lynx]

probalby USA

[umbral knot]

America where else

[crisp granite]

would have brightened up my day

[urban lynx]

what question is that fleimi

[umbral knot]

I guess a third world country might also explain it

[urban lynx]

USA is in top ten of homocide by gun per 100,000 citizens.

[crisp granite]

and all the others in the top 10 are wartorn countries or just dealing with gang violence

poggers

[urban lynx]

among the likes of brazil, colombia, venezuela

[umbral knot]

It's scary to think that probably about 70% of those are in three cities

Chicago, Detroit, and New York

[urban lynx]

to be fair, these places also have one of the highest densities.

if you cant even make 100,000 people on the countryside...

[crisp granite]

to be fair, gang violence is a major issue in those 3 large cities

[urban lynx]

i mean, true

[crisp granite]

'merica, fuck yeah

[urban lynx]

japan is btw the lowest of the listet

[crisp granite]

well duh

[urban lynx]

with .02

germany is at 1.04

[crisp granite]

getting a gun there is harder than getting a commercial pilot's licence

[urban lynx]

USA is at 12.21

Venezuela is first place, with 49.73

[crisp granite]

or .0003%? of the US dies to gun violence, every year

[urban lynx]

russia is not listed.

[crisp granite]

I may have lost it there, my bad

❤️

[umbral knot]

Venezuela is just not good

in any aspect especially economy

[reef tundra]

Nazi's bad, neonazi's bad, facism bad. Incoherent ideology and always ends up with suffering

[crisp granite]

yes, thanks for explaining the obvious

[umbral knot]

438% inflation in 2017 for the venezuelan bolivar

[urban lynx]

https://c.tenor.com/uIE25ozp1cMAAAAM/birds-bird.gif

[umbral knot]

🐦

[urban lynx]

the only true religion you need

[crisp granite]

anyway

I'm gonna eat some lunch

[misty pier]

just move on 🗿

[urban lynx]

i still havent started sorting stuff out and all.

i got too much stuff

[shadow minnow]

Like, really? Sure, these people deserve life sentence, but tbh I do not see anyone being just killed necessary and definitely not reason to make someone’s day better. Like, I just do not see point of killing someone if you can imprison them or a they are in prison and posses no further threat, so you have no reason really. And when the person is begging to life, no matter who it is, even terrorist or anyone, killing them, when it does not improve anything, as you can just send them to life in prison is imo kinda pointless.

[crisp granite]

that was spur of the moment animalistic bloodlust

ok?

[reef tundra]

Blood for the blood gods

[urban lynx]

sorry but i understand that.
someone in prison can still make contacts. can still get stuff in motion.
and when they get out? what then?

[crisp granite]

[shadow minnow]

Well, that’s why life sentence in well guarded prison is imo what should the person get. Sure, if it’s some important politician, that would still make lot of contacts in prison, then you may have to look for other measures. But if it’s just regular person, well enough guarded prison where person is alone in cell should not be such a issue.
I am sorry if I am going too far with disagreeing, but I just really hate killing in general, and especially when it brings nearly no use. Also the fact how people being killed feel atm, idk, I am just the kinda person that hates seeing anyone killed, and wishes that at the end everyone would go, if it existed heaven, no matter what they did before, as it would have no impact on others.

[urban lynx]

i dont really like when people die either.

https://tenor.com/view/dog-turn-table-gif-15526139

also just a word for the death sentence, especially in the US || i fucking HATE how easily it can be given, and that it often turns out, to affect the wrong people, who, posthumanly get declared innocent. and it's disgusting. and ultimately the argument why i dont support the death sentence, despite understanding the idea and idealogy behind it ||

[shadow minnow]

Yeah. There are quite a lot of people that were sentenced to death even though they were then proven innocent, and there was not even enough evidence at the first place

[umbral knot]

also I don't know about you but I'd much rather get a quick release rather than rot in a prison for 80 years

[crisp granite]

ye

same with me