how they make the notification UI make use of the punchout area
#🔌│tech
ashen spindle
misty saffron
rather than ostracising from it
vivid vine
I just want the Watch Ultra, wonder when Xfinity will have it in stock
ashen spindle
have the animations go in/out from it, have it be the center for small icons or just be part of the background for bigger text boxes
misty saffron
closest thing i've seen to what they'd done is samsung's dick useless front camera animation
pale sigil
I just want the Watch Ultra, wonder when Xfinity will have it in stock
Mountain climber and diver I see
ashen spindle
you can still dislike the punchout, but what they did with it was pretty cool
vivid vine
Not even, I just want a tougher watch @pale sigil all the other models I have got, all have small dings on the edges because the way the frame meets the screen. The way they did the Ultra is what we have been waiting for
misty saffron
also titanium
vivid vine
Think I have the 5 or 6 and its already dinged up from just everyday life
wheat plume
The satellite location only works for 2 years on esim????
vivid vine
ashen spindle
yes then it permanently bricks the entire phone after 2 years
.. seriously did you watch it even
vivid vine
Look at that thing @pale sigil why the Ultra interest me
wheat plume
astral haven
They just have to mention it for the bingo
shadow minnow
But it shouldn’t be crossed out
Oh
Well that was such an obvious one ofcourse they mentioned it
astral haven
I'm surprised they didn't mention astrophotography
wheat plume
How do you download an eSIM without any way to access internet because the only way you can access internet is through your phone plan which is part of the sim you can't install onto your new simtray-less iphone?
shadow minnow
I think you have to scan sth
crimson wigeon
Your phoon can still connect to networks and such even without any plans or SIMs
Just activate it on website on another computor tho
vivid vine
If you are buying a thousand dollar phone in a country that doesn't have wifi networks in abundance so you can activate eSIM.. think you need to readjust some priorities.. just a little tippy tip
astral haven
How do you download an eSIM without any way to access internet because the only ...
You don't it's super messed up
Verizon makes us connect to wifi now to set up all the phones for our clients
wheat plume
.... Bruh
astral haven
If you are buying a thousand dollar phone in a country that doesn't have wifi ne...
Guess how long it takes
wheat plume
If you are buying a thousand dollar phone in a country that doesn't have wifi ne...
At my house
My phone is the only source of wifi
Cause it's too expensive to get a router here
astral haven
Tippy tip Verizon doesn't provide a qr code to activate it either (at least for their business customers)
fair gull
lana... we established plenty times how ur house does wifi isnt the regular case
vivid vine
@wheat plume but the thousand dollar phone was do able?
crimson wigeon
But even then you could just keep using your old phoon to activate your new one?
vivid vine
wheat plume
I don't have a 1000 phone and never will cause fuck paying that much for a phone
fair gull
<@361968952592826378> but the thousand dollar phone was do able?
dont question it
wheat plume
The most I've paid for a phone is 300 euro
astral haven
The iphone SE is free for us lel
wheat plume
Wat
astral haven
Business customers get benefits
wheat plume
Oh bill pay
astral haven
Nope
The plan is $50 a month and that's all we pay per user at all (unlimited everything)
Doesn't matter which phone they get
The iphone 12 is like 700 or whatever and the 23 SE is 99c with a 99c coupon alot of the time
fair gull
here i sit 30bucks altho i cant complain i dont need unlimited data
astral haven
Yea this is for business use
We have to provide them unlimited tethering for liability purposes
ashen spindle
didnt they also show how they are working with all the major carriers that you can enable esim without an internet connection?
astral haven
Yea well it doesn't work yet
ashen spindle
well yeah the phone also isnt out yet
vivid vine
I just pay by the Gig.. never go over and pay like $15 a month
astral haven
And it hasn't been working for at least 6 months
vivid vine
Xfinity mobile is pretty dope compared to what I use to pay the big companies
astral haven
I just pay by the Gig.. never go over and pay like $15 a month
How much would probably like 40gb a month on average cost?
wheat plume
vivid vine
Idk if you go over 3gb they just charge you the $45 unlimited line price
ashen spindle
oh also they said its only the US models where all only have esim, so EU models likely still have sim tray option
astral haven
Wait no tray at all??? 🤢
ashen spindle
maybe, as usualy they weren't super clear
fair gull
ngl i barely use data on the go
vivid vine
You guys use mobile connections like I use my home connection sheshh
fair gull
usually just to fetch customer deeds and then i have wifi at the place anyway for testing etc
so /shrug
astral haven
I'm sitting in an office with half gig/s wifi and I don't use it because of the web filter disabling YouTube comments and that's all that I noticed
It also slows discord loading
fair gull
glad i control the filters at the place i work lol
astral haven
I have no fkn clue how my boss managed to disable YouTube comments and nothing else
It's not a feature of our webfilter even...
ashen spindle
hahahah
that should be default settings, turn of so mankind has more time for other things
astral haven
Well now that dislikes are gone it's the only way to judge sentiment on a vid...
I watch alot of highly niche videos and often there are very useful insights in the comments
Also hype
Monoscopic 3d camera poggers
shadow minnow
<@361968952592826378> but the thousand dollar phone was do able?
Ever heard of rural areas?
vivid vine
@shadow minnow that was the entire point, move to a more developed location instead of buying expensive electronics 🤣
shadow minnow
Apart from moving being expensive
I wouldn’t want to live in a city ngl
Nature > good internet speed
vivid vine
Like me moving out to the mountains here in Colorado, but then complaining I have no good internet options, you can't have your cake and eat it too
Not the way the world works
shadow minnow
Yes that’s the point
Some people may get a good phone yet live on mountains with bad wifi
vivid vine
Yea but why?
If nature is so good why do they need the good phone?
Lol makes zero sense imo to be a tech head and live out in the sticks
astral haven
If nature is so good why do they need the good phone?
What if you already have a job and home...
shadow minnow
If nature is so good why do they need the good phone?
Photos of nature if you are too lazy to carry camera
shadow minnow
Lol makes zero sense imo to be a tech head and live out in the sticks
You can be a tech head yet enjoy nature as well
vivid vine
@shadow minnow never said you can't enjoy nature but there is a difference between living off grid and enjoying nature
shadow minnow
Well living off grid and having bad wifi isn’t the same
I live in a place with no wired connection yet it’s far from off grid
vivid vine
@astral haven most people in the US living that far out don't have good jobs.. why they live out in bfe
They live off the land
astral haven
Yea
Like uh literally all but one of my colleagues
vivid vine
@astral haven but how close in the next neighbor so I can get a rough idea how far out you are talking ?
ashen spindle
live far off in a decent house doing remote work as senior dev, be rich and live in your house in the woods with good connection, not unheard of
astral haven
<@126850798666645504> but how close in the next neighbor so I can get a rough id...
30 feet 🤣
astral haven
It's an embarrassment that our network options are so atrocious
vivid vine
That sounds more like terrible city officials that signed the wrong deal with the wrong provider
astral haven
That's not how it's supposed to work
The providers are supposed to compete...
There's supposed to be more than 1
wheat plume
Im so confused.... why does youtube have a different search bar in Chrome vs Firefox???
vivid vine
Well telecom fucked us in the US a long time ago, when cities, counties and states didn't want to fork over the money to lay the networks telecom came knocking
astral haven
Im so confused.... why does youtube have a different search bar in Chrome vs Fir...
Html and css has some interpretation
wheat plume
and the voice search is missing on firefox
crimson wigeon
To push you into using a chromium based browser
crimson wigeon
Or: A/B tests
cursive summit
fair gull
my guy its a website
cursive summit
I have never noticed that button existing, but it's there
fair gull
fuck the clutter
cursive summit
Same
frozen ingot
apple keeps on price gouging their customers
and people are dumb enough to keep buying it in the millions
pale sigil
You guys have icons on your taskbar?
ashen spindle
what is apple doing now?
wouldnt call it gouging if the prices are same like last year
frozen ingot
still using the awfully uncomfortable iphone 4 design I see
crisp granite
huh
was literally about to buy Airpods Pro
and now the second gen is out for the same price
funny
astral haven
Y tho
crisp granite
Y tho
works
works well
audio and noise cancelling is good enough for me
plenty portable
astral haven
Oof
frozen ingot
tbh I wouldn't buy anything audio from apple
astral haven
^
frozen ingot
like yeah its convenient, but audio quality is atrocious for the amount of money you shell out
astral haven
All the major brands bought audio brands to improve their devices, and the one apple chose was beats
Samsung bought akg and by extension harman
Kinda telling...
frozen ingot
I wouldn't buy those brands either, even if they consulted akg or whatnot
I'd rather buy actual akg then
astral haven
The n400 is alright but gets wrecked by the buds pros
And it's rather metallic
The buds all don't have any noticeable flaws audibly besides the buds + which gained a bit of that akg metallic edge
The n400 are amazing because they are $50
Not because they are good
The buds pro 2 are apparently absolutely knocking it out of the park
final flame
r/headphones moment
astral haven
^
Akg changed their sound to be more pleasant and less pandery and people complain
They drop their prices significantly to keep up with the competition and people complain
Sucks but if you don't have the best sound you've gotta go for the midrange
And akg has never been the best at anything
The midrange if audio has gotten so very very competitive that it's fantastic
tropic nacelle
Good example of competition eventually being good for the consumer haha
cursive summit
Akgee is amazing
Top end sucks dick
But low end offerings are amazing
I kinda want test out the K872
Maybe it's not total trash
fair gull
so anyone ever checked if 8khz polling even works out with windows having a timer limit of .5ms
fair gull
yes they checked or yes it works out
ashen spindle
it works
wheat plume
OMFH
Xdd
wheat plume
I liked Steve Jobs
He actually did innovating things
Apple these days just removes useful features so that they can upsell their other products to you
ashen spindle
ok that doesnt have anything to do with his daughter, they just use her name to use his name to get clicks
wheat plume
That's true
ashen spindle
and sure its nota lot more new stuff, but if you give someone the option to chose a 13 or a 14 why would anyone go with a 13
assuming same price etc.
wheat plume
Yes
But if you already have a 13 then no reason to upgrade really
ashen spindle
thats been true for years on any brand
reef patrol
Linus did a quick overview - Sounded to me like all of the "major" improvements were camera and selfie related. Oh and the weird ass dynamic notch bar
ashen spindle
yeah and it has some emergency stuff that could come in handy, and slightly better battery
reef patrol
Oh and no sim slot. That's hopefully going to spread like wildfire as a result.
ashen spindle
thats only the US model, eu should have it still or at least some iirc
but yes that should spread fast I hope
reef patrol
SIM had its use back when phones didn't have gigabytes of storage. No so much any longer 😄
ashen spindle
yes and thats why it fits so well in this case
people get what is meant but its not entirely true
aka they arent actually the same phone
cursive summit
Linus did a quick overview - Sounded to me like all of the "major" improvements ...
That "weird dynamic notch" bar is what we call innovation, duck
Now buy the new phone
It'll be like the first thing they mention in their marketing material
"Screen notch of proportions you have never seen before!"
"Everyone wants to get rid of the notch? Well we made it bigger!"
reef patrol
cursive summit
The same way the cunts got rid of the 3.5mm jack
Instead of putting a better DAC to it to improve the native audio quality
Just remove it, it's what we call innovation, friends
"Waterproof phones can't happen without removing all the jacks"
Meanwhile Sony 
empty wren
no
cursive summit
That's a shit title
empty wren
Yep
cursive summit
Even if it's ironic
empty wren
When Linus tries to be an edgy 12 year old
reef patrol
cursive summit
How tf did Apple just make everyone want a notch
It's the apple effect, literally
Apple: "No headphone jack"
Masses: We don't need a headphone jack
It was literally last year that we were looking for ways to make the front of the phone without a notch
Even use active pixels on top of the camera to camouflage it
Apple goes: notch goes massive
wheat plume
Ok wtf is a dynamic island
cursive summit
That's their new notch
Apple really is a shit influence on the industry
All the worst things in life they popularize
reef patrol
Ok wtf is a dynamic island
A notch that changes size and shape and includes information based on the app.
cursive summit
They should have included a "make it disappear" feature
This is literally from their own website https://www.apple.com/iphone-14-pro/
TF IS THAT NOTCH
It takes up so much damn space
wheat plume
Uuuhh...so two hole punch notches can can join together to make one really awkwardly long one?
cursive summit
I love how you could just fill up all the damn black space with pixels
And just add like a dynamic indicator in the middle for your "dynamic island"
So it will be at least damn acceptable
WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE MASSIVE
cursive summit
Yeah?
wheat plume
.-.
cursive summit
What Lana, are you against InNoVaTiOn?
wheat plume
Thought it would be two hole punch notches that fill in the blank area between them when needed
cursive summit
How dare you not like InNoVaTiOn
Apple gives you InNoVaTiVe features and you dislike them
wheat plume
Xd
cursive summit
I like how all of this could have been done in the OS by making the top navbar just have a dynamic thing to it
But they decided to ruin the thing via hardware by MAKING THE NOTCH MASSIVE
wheat plume
Yep .-.
cursive summit
Literally, just cover the camera up with pixels
So the front of the device is just screen
Add a software feature where middle of top bar is programmable
To do the things that this "island" does
wheat plume
It least it's not this....
cursive summit
And you have an actually innovative design
This though, this is a step 5 years back
reef patrol
It least it's not this....
I strongly prefer a notch that isn't a floating black pill thing on my screen. At least on the Android it goes from the edge inwards 😄
halcyon moss
they need that notch for the face unlock
cursive summit
People really use faceid?
halcyon moss
yes
wheat plume
Can't wait to be forced to change my carrier plan to an eSIM when I buy a new phone in a few years time once Android starts to also remove the SIM tray
eSIM doesn't really exist here
cursive summit
I would never use faceid, finger print sensor ftw
halcyon moss
but that said, i really prefer the punch hole on mine
wheat plume
I would never use faceid, finger print sensor ftw
You have to on iphone .-.
No fingerprint scanner
cursive summit
Hold on
ashen spindle
or just use a password/code
wheat plume
No
cursive summit
What
wheat plume
Not since the iphone 10
halcyon moss
not anymore since the notch
cursive summit
How tf will I log into the banking with biometrics?
halcyon moss
face id
wheat plume
Face id
reef patrol
Face ID - Ironically less secure than fingerprints 😄
cursive summit
Yeah I would just rather fingerprint
wheat plume
No shit
ashen spindle
Can't wait to be forced to change my carrier plan to an eSIM when I buy a new ph...
also surely you realise by them time new phones have no sim tray, carriers also have more esim options?
reef patrol
I use 2FA instead of either - Thank god 😄
wheat plume
My bank app doesn't have any biometric login
It works by registering your phone so only your phone can login
cursive summit
Mine does, Swedbank
Just hold my finger for 0.5s on the reader and I'm in the banking account
reef patrol
Glorious Denmark uses state issued 2FA for everything. Banks, State, Municipal. Even some odd things like Bus passes.
wheat plume
Even if you factory reset the phone
You need to go bank into the back and get them to register the phone again
cursive summit
We do use SmartID as well
Basically password thing for authorizing everything, logins/payments
But fingerprint reader bypasses that for convenience, except for payments
Payments are always via smartID, just the login is with fingerprint
And it's good that way, pretty comfy
reef patrol
Wheeee - First test batch is in the work before mass production. Can't wait to get my hilariously silly Amiga mouse with wireless and USB 😄
ashen spindle
beyond [the power limits of your psu]
so now we have a countdown for intel to release arc or its becomes truly irrelevant
cursive summit
I wonder what the pricing will be on these
So Radeon now also has a countdown
AMD did promise to launch them by end of year, they still have ample time
Launching first is a big boon for early sales though
ashen spindle
not really
they will both sell through the entire stock at the start just like every launch
wheat plume
wheat plume
so appealing
cursive summit
Then buy either the best option is or whatever their prefered brand is
ashen spindle
yeah but in the same vein some will wait for nvidia and others grab amd first if that comes first
cursive summit
Yeah
ashen spindle
in the end they both sell it all so they make the same sales
cursive summit
So launching first is still something that you would want
cursive summit
in the end they both sell it all so they make the same sales
Same sales? Ehh, depends
ashen spindle
you can't have more sales if you sell the entire stock either way lmfao
wheat plume
(PRODUCT)^red
ashen spindle
what
cursive summit
I mean if Nvidia has enough time to restock multiple times until Radeon even launches their stuff
ashen spindle
thats now how it works
cursive summit
It's still getting more sales from people that are hungry for an upgrade
ashen spindle
you dont get chip to card done in a week
cursive summit
You sure don't
ashen spindle
lets say nvidia has 10 units airfreight and 100 on ship planned for the rest of this year
if they sell all 110 then thats it
they dont have more till next year
they cant restock that
cursive summit
Bit small numbers but yeah, fair
I guess there won't be enough stock for both nvidiots and just people that want a new card
So at that point Radeon even can profit by tuning their cards to more closely match Nvidia if needed
What are the typical perf boost numbers you can get by a software upgrade when it comes to GPUs?
Let's say Nvidia launches their stuff, 4080 is like 1299$ and 140 FPS at 4K Ultra
AMDs 7900XT is like 1299$ as well but only does 120FPS, but it hasn't launched yet
PCBs are made, being sent to AIBs
How much can you pull off from boosting the GPU clock, memory clock, undervolt, etc
wheat plume
oh, this is how it works
ashen spindle
what software upgrade
wheat plume
there is no space between the two notches
ashen spindle
do you mean drivers or do you mean hardware changes
cursive summit
Yeah push out new drivers
ashen spindle
somewhere between 0-100%
cursive summit
I dunno if anything above 20% is feasible with just tuning clocks
cursive summit
So if Radeon rn is behind NV, and has their PCBs already in AIB hands
What's the likely thing for them to do to match RTX 40 perf if they are behind
halcyon moss
lower the price
ashen spindle
I dont see how it matters if aibs have the chips by or not
cursive summit
Well you can't recall them to the factory for hardware swap for faster memory, etc
ashen spindle
the settings on the chip can be set however by the bios
you cant swap memory in the last months lmao
that takes ages to validate
cursive summit
Exactly
So without hardware swapping for faster stuff, what would Radeon do to get extra perf against 40 series
halcyon moss
nothing?
ashen spindle
more power draw on stock, better drivers
idk you're asking what can be done in the last moments on stuff in the makings for years
depends on what can be done, what the timeframe is, what the target is
cursive summit
Basically yeah, what can be done in like 1 months time before launch
Let's say NV launches in October
AMD in like mid November
And they are like 20% behind in most tests
halcyon moss
its always a combination of price and performance (and powerdraw == price)
ashen spindle
about the same nvidia can do if they are behind
cursive summit
I'm mostly interested in what can be changed to inch out the perf gap
Not the price, but the perf
ashen spindle
idk you're speculating so hard its just that, pure speculation
how much they can do depends on what the difference is and what the limits are and what they want to sacrifice for it
wheat plume
Why
I hate this
The large awkward gap too to the left of the settings icons...gosh damn
stuck solar
but centered it will look weird
wheat plume
even if they were left aligned it would look better
marginally
oh wait, only the most expensive iPhone has the hole punch notch
the rest have the real large chin notch
ashen spindle
yes
halcyon moss
lana, where is the chin
at the bottom of the face correct?
where is the notch?
at the top
how can it be a chin notch
TELL ME
ashen spindle
Australian face
halcyon moss
im so tired of that joke :p
wheat plume
Oo
wheat plume
Yeh!
crimson wigeon
And when you really don't want to use a third party service for such things
halcyon moss
most of which generally suck
wheat plume
This used to be dots, right?
It's one solid line now
Or am I forgetting since it's been a while ?
LAME
reef patrol
Don't touch that system. You're going to break Windows store in seconds flat.
fair gull
that could be cool for long distance relationship stuff
but we have discord where its free
reef patrol
That and the Xbox gamepass system are just a minefield. Even if you force access to it, you will so easily permanently break it to the point of needing a reinstall.
fair gull
its in my Games Drive and this is the only inaccessible folder on here
its so u dont fuck it up
wheat plume
That and the Xbox gamepass system are just a minefield. Even if you force access...
reinstall the entire OS??????
reef patrol
If you fuck up this subsystem, which is very easy. Then yes - It can be impossible to just reinstall it without a reinstall of the entire OS.
wheat plume
o.o
fair gull
well depends. its fixable i borked it once and fixed it
its a ton of reg edit and tracing stuff tho
reef patrol
Sometimes it is, other times it's just not worth hours on hours of trying to poke it back into function.
I remember giving up after a week of trying to fix the store when Sea of Thieves was free.
fair gull
well me as someone who hates reinstalls its worth it
i lived for 4 yrs with a win install that basically crashed randomly after the 2hr mark
all the debugging i did didnt tell me whats wrong but i lived with it cause i dreaded a reinstall more than the occasional reboot
misty saffron
lana is the kinda person to just try and nuke everything by deleting important folders and then say how shit windows is
wheat plume
Nah xd
I don't nuke things unless I know it's safe to do so
reef patrol
wheat plume
Xd
shadow minnow
Hmm so aparently no other phone front camera has autofocus, that’s where the advertising came from @wheat plume
reef patrol
Might finally make the front facing cameras ... relevant?
Literally never used them. They suck so hard compared to the regular one for... anything.
shadow minnow
Well yeah but lot of gen Z uses them a lot
reef patrol
(No I don't take selfies - Even if I did, I'd still want something as basic as fucking focus change 😄 )
cursive summit
Selfies 
Imagine being a diva
Everyone normal uses the proper camera to photograph cats and stuff
shadow minnow
Regardless front cameras get used a lot, so it’s nice to not have fixed focus
halcyon moss
samsung has a focuing can on the s22 line
astral haven
And 21
astral haven
It's been very useful for reading sns and checking wiring on the back of computers
ashen spindle
urgh, nvidia might change the branding of geforce
astral haven
Don't worry about it yet
ashen spindle
oh I wont worry, I know it doesnt matter what it will be, if it's changing it will be chaos
cursive summit
I do love iPhone 14s marketing
It's just so badly worded that I am flabbergasted that such advertising is even legal
astral haven
Anything that is only fined is legal if you are rich enough
ashen spindle
innovative doesn't mean its worlds first
cursive summit
It ain't innovative either
astral haven
It might be innovative sensor if they use a 6 year old one lmao
cursive summit
I think I read that Samsung is moving even beyond 108MP camera
astral haven
Yes
They have already released a 200mp sensor
shadow minnow
More mp ≠ better
astral haven
More mp ≠ better
Except tbh it kinda is thanks to computational photography
cursive summit
The more data you feed to the AI, the better the post-processed image will be
shadow minnow
Well depends, you want bigger pixels too
astral haven
Actually you dont
shadow minnow
You do for low light
astral haven
The smaller the pixels the more options you have for combining pixels
wheat plume
Windows getting inspiration from Plasma desktop
cursive summit
Windows getting inspiration from Plasma desktop
?
astral haven
You do for low light
The best low light camera uses a 48 megapixel sensor binned to 12 megapixels...
wheat plume
wut
cursive summit
Or not, I forget tf is the shortcut for volume control
ashen spindle
I bet its about a round corner or something not the feature
wheat plume
the volume slider used to be in the top left
cursive summit
Ah
wheat plume
now its above the taskbar at the bottom
cursive summit
So them relocating it is "copying plasma"
astral haven
Depends how you pull it up
wheat plume
Animated up from the bottom
astral haven
Clicking sound button has always brought it up at the bottom of the screen
wheat plume
a bar appears at the top of the screen when you move a window around and if you move the window over it, it expands to this
ashen spindle
are you watching a video about the new win11 features or
wheat plume
no, installed Insider build...
cursive summit
It perplexes me that lana cares about this kind of stuff
Just use the OS
Nobody normal cares about this stuff
wheat plume
I am using it, thats how I found this feature
I moved the file explore to my other screen and saw something come down from the top of the screen
and then was like wtf is this
idk wtf is new on this build other than File Explorer tabs before installing it
astral haven
Obviously they need something to compete directly with dlss
Fsr2 wasn't, so they are working on it
cursive summit
Oh boy the ghosting is massively improved
isn't ghosting still DLSS's weakest part?
cursive summit
Wew
AMD's doing god's work for consumers
Who knew injecting a dying, nearly bankrupt yet pretty innovative company with Ryzen cash will make them a major competitor in the scene
astral haven
Except
Before Ryzen, AMD actually had flagship products faster than nvidias...
astral haven
No
cursive summit
Even after ATI got acquired
astral haven
Ux
cursive summit
I despise that word
But yeah sure
I guess AMD invested more cash into the drivers and radeon software to make it more workable
astral haven
Most important part of a product
It wasn't just drivers tho
Hardware compatibility
Firmware bugs
And holy shit freesync
Freesync was so buggy until Nvidia started certifying monitors lel
Gsync is still smoother generally but it's minor difference compared to the old days
With early freesync, you would be running a smooth and consistent 120fps on the GPU and your output would be as choppy as 48 fps on a gsync monitor....
cursive summit
Oh yeah I love how freesync now completely dominates the market
Is gsync even a thing anymore?
reef patrol
Yes?
astral haven
Yep
cursive summit
This whole get your shit certified by nvidia thing really killed gsync
astral haven
?
ashen spindle
????
reef patrol
You kind of don't.
cursive summit
Freesync was always a downloadable thing you just drop into the display drivers and it just worked
astral haven
Lel
ashen spindle
Huh
reef patrol
Uh...not quite.,
cursive summit
Gsync was this whole thing where you had to get a specific Nvidia controller to just be eligible for Gsync
astral haven
You are thinking of Radeon smooth sync
reef patrol
You need to pass certain hardware requirements.
Same with Gsync.
A lot more Freesync monitors happen to also pass Gsync requirements.
astral haven
We are talking about the hardware refresh rate syncing
cursive summit
I clearly recall literally any display back then being able to get freesync just cause it was so much easier to install back then, that's why even 150$ monitors had it
astral haven
You need to pass certain hardware requirements.
Same with Gsync.
A lot more Fre...
No
No freesync monitors pass the gsync requirements
Some monitors are compatible with gsync, but the requirements are alot more strict for the monitors Nvidia designs
cursive summit
Gsync wouldn't start until like 300$ due to special hardware requirements
astral haven
Both require special hardware
But Nvidia required a special certification process before you could use the logo
reef patrol
No
No freesync monitors pass the gsync requirements
Some monitors are compatibl...
"they don't pass requirements"
"THEY WORK"
cursive summit
Carmonben, are you talking about Freesync premium?
astral haven
Gsync is not the same as gsync compatible
reef patrol
Gsync is not the same as gsync compatible
Does it or does it not work?
astral haven
Freesync premium is a thing and made to comete with gsync compatible
cursive summit
Cause the normal freesync has, to my knowledge, been downloadable for nearly all monitors
astral haven
Does it or does it not work?
Define work
astral haven
Cause the normal freesync has, to my knowledge, been downloadable for nearly all...
Very much not
There's a short list of compatible display driver ics
cursive summit
"Since this technology uses the Adaptive Sync standard built into the DisplayPort 1.2a standard, any monitor equipped with this input can be compatible with FreeSync technology. With that in mind, FreeSync is not compatible with legacy connections such as VGA and DVI.
The “free” in FreeSync comes from the standard being open, meaning other manufacturers are able to incorporate it into their equipment without paying royalties to AMD. This means many FreeSync devices on the market cost less than similar G-Sync-equipped devices."
From ViewSonic
So you just have to have either a specific HDMI or DP connector, and you are eligible for freesync
That's how I recall it being
reef patrol
TLDR; You don't need a Gsync branded chip in your monitor to use variable refresh rates any longer.
astral haven
Well that's always been true
But if you want it to be smooth, you've still gotta get the Nvidia chio
reef patrol
Nope.
astral haven
I lived it
Vesa async displays were released less than a year after gsync was announced
reef patrol
You don't need Gsync to get smooth variable refresh rates.
You needed a Gsync monitor to have a monitor with smooth variable refresh rates until everyone else caught up in general (on higher end monitors) without the Gsync addin hardware.
reef patrol
Yes - You're starting to sound every so slightly shilly my dude 😄
ashen spindle
there are reasons why the gsync module is still used in high end screens like in my alienware, it still is producing better results than other options
now sure it also has limitations, think its the reason the monitor doesnt have hdmi2.0 but dont need that so that doesnt bother me
astral haven
The main feature of gsync, introduced as part of the original module that you could purchase as an upgrade for your existing monitor, was variable overdrive
And the year that people started even having the option on freesync was last year, and instead of having a full range lut, they use a small number of discrete levels
Now the effect is very very similar, but when you add that to being 7 years late it's just kinda disappointing
reef patrol
More like 2015...
astral haven
Hmm?
reef patrol
Gsync came out in 2015 and was heralded for it's superior syncing as made incredibly tiresome by the pendulum effect. Freesync was not long after...
ashen spindle
freesync being out is not the same as freesync having the same quality
reef patrol
It caught up fast to what Gsync was marketed for.
astral haven
Here is the proportion of freesync monitors that have variable overdrive now
Where it's a requirement for gsync
reef patrol
Variable Overdrive was never the selling point of Gsync on release.
astral haven
The selling point was the image quality of native refresh rate at lower fps
Without variable od you don't have that
reef patrol
Oh no! Tearing at lower refresh rates!
Enables Freesync
Oh... well there goes the need to increase our monitor prices by 30% due to proprietary add-in boards and certification
astral haven
Have you ever used a gsync monitor right next to a freesync one and compared them?
reef patrol
We've been over this. Yes. You're trying so hard to make the difference worth the markup.
cursive summit
I can't even find the part online where you can't just download freesync onto your monitor product
I found something about certification, they don't explain anything about what it's about
But anyways, keep on
astral haven
Nvidia is now certifying some freesync monitors
I'm rather unhappy that they aren't requiring variable od, and they also aren't requiring async down to 0
I can understand not requiring async down to 0 but I have a suspicion if they add that to freesync it will improve quite significantly
ashen spindle
yeah entry and budget screens would be so much better if they could get better requirements that dont even add much to the costs
astral haven
It's def speculation, but it just seems to me that offloading that task to the monitor would be smoother
astral haven
yeah entry and budget screens would be so much better if they could get better r...
Oh both of those features are very costly
ashen spindle
oh not those but in general
astral haven
Yea
And the freesync dev has improved laptop sync a huge amount
I really hate that Nvidia never announced they were using freesync on laptop panels until 3 years later
That was really screwed up
vivid vine
Pat is the best thing to happen to Intel in over a decade
ashen spindle
ehhhh
vivid vine
Still hate Intel but they are finally smelling the bullshit
ashen spindle
that's hard to say yet, so far lots of stuff is still done under previous ceos and till now lots bs still happend
deep wind
i used to like intel but compared to amd .. why would you waste so much money
misty saffron
nowhere close to being the blessing lisa su was for amd
ashen spindle
I mean, plenty of cases where intel is still the go to and they have lot more products than just cpu
cursive summit
For example, Lisa Su is now touted as amazing
frozen ingot
I don't care what brand it says on the tin, I just buy what's most reliable/best value
cursive summit
But Zen was in development before she took over AMD
So I dunno if Lisa is even that good to begin with rn
misty saffron
no shit zen was in development
cursive summit
If anything Lisa might be just doing nothing and the brains of the operation is Papermaster
vivid vine
I mean Swan did the grunt work for Intel before Pat took back over, they needed both of them tho imo
misty saffron
even the most incompetent idiot would understand bulldozer is not the way to go
cursive summit
I'm just saying, Lisa is called as amazing CEO and stuff
misty saffron
under lisa su intel received actual competition, however
frozen ingot
intel tend to be less picky with stuff around it like ram etc, even if its not the fastest it might still be a better pick for some
cursive summit
Most of what makes Lisa good right now is probably not her doing tbf
deep wind
well like most of the times its the people you never hear from who are the master minds
cursive summit
Sad that Jim Keller left AMD
thick elk
I don't think it's any one particular person responsible.
deep wind
ceo is more like the press guy kinda lol
misty saffron
amd’s ceo has a phd in electrical engineering
why do you expect her to just be a spokesperson kinda ceo
ashen spindle
she was ceo like 3 years before zen release, so its not like she just joined when it was going up
misty saffron
a bit too overqualified, if you think of it like that
ashen spindle
pat was a top ranking engineer at intel before he left some years ago and made products that are still used
cursive summit
If you take a look at who was the CEO before Su, they are actually also partly responsible for AMD's reinvigoration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rory_Read
This is towards the end of bulldozer's arch
So might have been Rory who gave the start to a new actually good arch
And Su finished it up and released it
ashen spindle
its still 3 years between zen1 release and her becoming ceo
sure she didnt start the first idea but its not like it was even close to done when she took over
cursive summit
Apparently Jim Keller was tasked to create Zen
And that was in 2012
Damn I wish Keller could still be doing good work in either Intel, from where he quickly left, or AMD
ashen spindle
he joined them in 2012 so it took a while to start working on it and its still going to take a lot of changes and redesign over the time
and from what we know he mostly did basically management and not the design itself
for all we know it might be better he's not working on it anymore, not like we will ever actually know what his work was
cursive summit
Ngl knowing that Keller was heavily pushing for this thing to come out
I wonder if this thing would have been any good
Never did, Zen came out instead
stark bobcat
I see arm and my mouth does the pog thing
cursive summit
Imagine, AMD invented M1 4 years before before Apple
It could have been really good for the market to be fair, to release both K12 and Zen
ashen spindle
no
cursive summit
Since ARM-based CPUs, afaik, are a very small minority of desktop market
Chromium and other snapdragon shit
If AMD pushed with a competitive design to optimize x64 for ARM, could have been interesting
stark bobcat
Arm cpu is desktop is doa tbh at least in a windows ecosystem
ashen spindle
to compete with their own x86 product? why shoot yourself in the foot that much
cursive summit
Weren't there like 0 Zen 1 laptop CPUs?
Release ARM CPU for laptops and Zen 1 for desktop
stark bobcat
The reason it works for apple is because they can force devs to develop for it
ashen spindle
that doesnt even make sense
cursive summit
I don't recall at all Zen 1 having a laptop variant
ashen spindle
again, arm is not some black magic that would have suddenly made it a laptop viable product
stark bobcat
The problem is application support
stark bobcat
That makes much more sense
stark bobcat
They would've been crushed in non chromebook segments
ashen spindle
what laptop maker would in their right mind say they dont use zen1 because no trust, not special enough etc. etc. and then go with k12 from the same company, when that means even more work because its not x86
stark bobcat
If Microsoft doesn't support windows on arm it just won't work
ashen spindle
if you dont make zen1 laptops you sure as hell wouldn't want to try make amd arm laptops lol
cursive summit
I mean, it's not like Zen 1 had any laptop variants
And I can't find any Zen 1+ either
ashen spindle
yeah and k12 would be trying to have negative laptop varaints
cursive summit
It's only with Ryzen 3000 they released laptops
stark bobcat
There were plenty zen+ laptops
They just sucked
And people would rather not remember
cursive summit
Well it's difficult to say how good something could have been since it never released
But Keller made it, so I trust it was good
ashen spindle
or maybe it never got release BECAUSE its not good
stark bobcat
The product in a vacuum might be good
cursive summit
or maybe it never got release BECAUSE its not good
Or, idk, not enough fab space? Shifting priorities? Too expensive?
AMD from what I remember was in massive debt up until like 2020
stark bobcat
But if no one can use it for anything because no one develops for the architecture it will be bad
ashen spindle
or maybe it would have had to be at least 50% than zen on release to be even considered to be used since it would have been so much extra work to implement it?
and you would have to divert your limited engineers even more
stark bobcat
Arm on laptops would have been incredibly niche anyway
cursive summit
I think honestly the reason they didn't go with it was not because it wasn't good
But because they couldn't support it, like Quin said
AMD wasn't that financially stable back then
stark bobcat
Have you seen Microsofts attempts at the surface pro x?
cursive summit
Not good
stark bobcat
Laughable
cursive summit
That's why AMD prolly just decided that it was a far fetched attempt
Not cause it was a bad product by any means
But because the platform wasn't meant for it
ashen spindle
also compare it to apple, their third chip on N5 is losing out to amd's first chip made on N5 and its not even a laptop only design
cursive summit
They couldn't fix their damn GPU drivers until like recently ffs
ashen spindle
so maby arm just literally doesnt matter
shadow minnow
also compare it to apple, their third chip on N5 is losing out to amd's first ch...
Which exactly?
ashen spindle
no I dont care to argue with the apple fanboy now
ashen spindle
Isn't RISC arch simply better at some things than x64?
based on kellers own words it literally doesnt matter
cursive summit
Hmm
shadow minnow
no I dont care to argue with the apple fanboy now
No I am genuinely asking
Do you mean m2 or m1 max?
And compared to which amd cpu
cursive summit
Tbf I don't know what CPU AMD even have rn on N5 
Zen 4 isn't released yet
So we don't even know that well how it does
ashen spindle
early ES/QS samples are out and we know from the presentation how the chips are going to perform for the most part
cursive summit
So, you are saying the only reason Apple had the performance lead is cause they always went for the lower N number
So basically buying into a better node a year or so earlier before others would
ashen spindle
I'm saying that they had a huge advantage because they spend billions to be the first on new tsmc node and they made a purpose build chip only for the laptop, nothing scalable for servers to phones etc.
ashen spindle
and because if you make it brand new you can take all the low hanging fruit and take the easy wins since no legacy support etc.
cursive summit
Is Apple on N5 or N5+?
ashen spindle
yes
ashen spindle
all the big customers use a customised version with DTCO anyway so they basically never get the same nodes unless you are really small customer
cursive summit
Oh apple does use N5P
A15 Bionic
Now they are on N16 so that has to use it too
And this, apparently
ashen spindle
doesn't really matter if you call it n5p, n5+ n4 or whatever, very similar and customized anyway
cursive summit
M1's on N5
shadow minnow
They said A16 is on 4nm or n4 or sth like that
cursive summit
I mean TSMC does say N5P is like faster, denser version of N5
ashen spindle
N4 is N5
stark bobcat
this
ashen spindle
basically the same since it's customized either way
cursive summit
ashen spindle
the base is very similar
cursive summit
"Kuo states that the "significantly better N3 & N4P won't start mass production until 2023" and that "N5P & N4 are the latest technologies Apple can use" for their products in the second half of 2022, finishing off the first tweet with "N4 has no advantages vs. N5P"."
ashen spindle
N3 is not better and thats been known for over a year
n3 is literally getting canned so n3e will be the first lower node in mass production
cursive summit
ashen spindle
cursive summit
Oh that is really recent
ashen spindle
it was always going to get canned, some few stuff will be on it but as I said, not mass production and thats the only thing that matters
cursive summit
So N3 did not get canned
ashen spindle
it effectively did
cursive summit
It's still up to being produced
ashen spindle
you wont get a N3 product
cursive summit
Up it'll still be made
N3E is just far better and that's what they'll offer to customers
ashen spindle
you will get as much N3 as you got original intel 10nm
cursive summit
Cause they literally do say "N3 on track for volume production this half of the year"
So it'll be used for... something
ashen spindle
yes, for nothing relevant
cursive summit
Maybe it'll be like a more energy efficient alternative for some companies who want to go N5
Just take the N3
ashen spindle
no because its literally worse for most parts
shadow minnow
And probably more expensive
ashen spindle
also you obviously wont ever get an officaly report from tsmc that will tell you N3 is canned.. no publicly traded company is going to do that
cursive summit
That title though
"U.S ban on Nvidia, AMD chips"
I was like, they banned their own products?
wheat plume
why are the US banning GPU companies?
cursive summit
Read
Exports to China
To prevent them from obtaining U.S tech I suppose, stop feeding the Chinese
China famously was relying on AMD a lot for processors
But recently (years back) they started their own CPUs, which were shit, idk how they are now
And now GPUs, which are... weirdly okay
ashen spindle
pls you dont even had to open the article, the embed says its banning exports..
wheat plume
cause it has no overhead cause by unremovable telemetry
and it only takes like 5GB on clean install VS like 35GB for windows
so its got a lot less to do in the background
cursive summit
Okay now do a gaming comparison
Windows 11/10 vs a native linux port and one running on proton
wheat plume
I know Elden Ring runs better in Proton
wheat plume
Proton = WINE but specifically for gaming
ashen spindle
ah yes, the telemetry overhead that checks notes basically doesnt change the performance at all
and os file size also doesnt instantly mean it does anything but take that much more space
ashen spindle
thats odd but I dont think the relevant components were different
ashen spindle
sure but different network isnt changing the AI upscaler working 150% faster
at least I think thats what that is
cursive summit
So, why exactly would Linux work faster than Windows?
ashen spindle
becasue sometimes its not faster, because you have tradeoffs if you do thing differently
ashen spindle
the >10% differences are likely not from linux itself but rather the tool being compilled less efficently for windows or so
slow garnet
Might have something to do with cache sizes
slow garnet
I might be wrong, and I haven't read the article, but I'm guessing less cache misses with Linux executables
fair gull
they dont specify where the perf difference comes from
its just a we made tests and this is what we got
slow garnet
There's a reason why Phoronix is banned from certain places.
ashen spindle
I might be wrong, and I haven't read the article, but I'm guessing less cache mi...
wouldn't that be something the result of a compiler working better/worse and not the OS if thats the reason?
slow garnet
Well yeah, but as far as I can tell the question was "Why is Linux so much faster". The ELF binaries just might be smaller because A: they aren't asinine Windows shit, and B: yes, the compiler is likely more optimized.
It's the same reason why certain programs run better when Os is specified instead of O2
Less cache misses.
IMO benchmarks nowadays are shit anyway
Be it for any OS.
There's so many god damn factors that it's probably near impossible to replicate a result from one person to another.
ashen spindle
and that is fine so long as they are consistent compared to each other form the review and not miles off from others
if 3 reviews get +10% fps in the game but have different numbers since different spots or different ram I can still know what I would get in the game for the most part
slow garnet
I guess?
I'd still be wary though.
Sometimes for whatever reasons 99% might have close averages and then potentially one might have absolutely different results, for whatever reason.
Like things that come up to mind are random Windows scans and updates.
ashen spindle
sure but for the most part you have a rough estimate and if you need something ultra precise for work you test yourself
and any decent review does more than one test pass to makes sure something like scans arent going on
slow garnet
I'd hope.
ashen spindle
think GN does 3 passes usually
slow garnet
But last time I checked, a lot of reviewers seem to miss that part.
And good on them for doing so.
ashen spindle
yeah but thats why you look at more than one review always, very unlikely same issue at the same moment for different people
slow garnet
Of course, but if we're being honest, most people will only look at maybe one or two reviews. They aren't as special as we are 
||kinda like the fortnite kids that think that this keyboard will make them 1000% better at the game||
cursive summit
Huh
He doesn't like anything about them
Well DankPods did they Meze Empyrean are "good"
And they are, well, not very good
I do wonder what he'd say about the Galaxy Buds 2 Pro
If that does not crush Apple then fuck off
shadow minnow
Even Linus uses AirPods Pro
Tbf they weren’t refreshed in a while
Most earphones can probably beat them in some or most categories by now
cursive summit
"Even Linus uses" doesn't mean anything
shadow minnow
AirPods Pro gen 2 may be a more interesting comparison
Only thing probably no other earbuds can match to that extend is spatial audio with head tracking
cursive summit
OH GOD
Fucking crypto
Queen coins.. that are up 600%
If that's not a cash grab then wtf is
ashen spindle
liquidity 1-3k... that might just be one person joking around
cursive summit
Joking, or pump n dumpin'
ashen spindle
pumping what
thats not even 10k in the image
and while I would like to get that for free, not like 10k is much for crypto numbers
tropic nacelle
10k is indeed nothing for crypto
ashen spindle
https://game.intel.com/story/intel-arc-graphics-qa-hardware-specs/ they really try to get it out before next gen is there
"its going to be soon guys"
tropic nacelle
It's like game of thrones "the dragons are coming"
I really want Intel to succeed in the GPU market just so that hopefully there is "real" competition rather than the current duopoly which is almost price fixing right now.
The current state of it though is abysmal, I really don't see them being close just from a driver perspective for at least a year and at best a mid range setup now
ashen spindle
which is nothing new, first generation was always expected to suck
tropic nacelle
Of course, I know others had way too much expectations of them hitting the ground running which is honestly impossible unless you are already established.
The rumours of Intel pulling out due to the state of the launch are everywhere though which still seems odd to me as Intel can afford to "waste" money on this and it has a huge end game for them.
mild dome
They have to justify the expenditure to shareholders, that "eventually the money will start rolling in".
Could also be that management decides they don't want the hastle of trying to make a gpu, and cancel the project to focus on other things
thin saffron
Getting closer 🤣
astral haven
Even Linus uses AirPods Pro
Linus specifically said they weren't great for audio quality, he only uses them because he can sleep with them
final flame
^
stark bobcat
Linus also thought the drop panda were the second coming
And "cherry mx is the gold standard" idk about all that
astral haven
The panda are very solid once dsp'd
crisp granite
Linus also thought the drop panda were the second coming
crisp granite
And "cherry mx is the gold standard" idk about all that
they are the industry gold standard, everyone follows the standards they set or tries to exceed
and tbh, everyone's suffered with em, so they make an effective benchmark over...say... original holy pandas
stark bobcat
well yeah they do set the standard but linus is saying that as in "cherry mx is the best"
deft marlin
Getting closer 🤣
Why the weight reduction in the first place
And if it’s because it’s a tad too heavy, you’re going a tad too light tbh
thin saffron
Why the weight reduction in the first place
The lighter the better
deft marlin
The lighter the better
Not always, and not for every shape and person
thin saffron
Today I did this front parts
deft marlin
besides at some point you’ll end up having to deform for a very light mouse
mild dome
It's likely the mouse structure is over engineered to prevent any issues, but a lot of struts are meant to improve rigidity.
It's interesting to see how far these structural elements can be pushed though. Hopefully you can renove enough materials without the structure being compromised
deft marlin
It's likely the mouse structure is over engineered to prevent any issues, but a ...
I agree that this is a worthwhile experiment, but it’s his mouse so… if he’s thinking everything he does will still keep it functional then that’s a green light
if it has sentimental value to him that’s a thing to consider
mild dome
Sentimental value? Perhaps a second mouse could've been bought for experimentation before this one was altered as to prevent destruction of something important?
deft marlin
Sentimental value? Perhaps a second mouse could've been bought for experimentati...
Well that’s the thing
Does he have a second mouse? Onboard settings which are valuable?
customised otherwise?
thin saffron
It's likely the mouse structure is over engineered to prevent any issues, but a ...
There is a lot of plastic that is used as reinforcement for holding the components in place that really do not need as much, I only remove the unnecessary after much thought, the mouse remains as strong as out of the box and 100% funcional
thin saffron
I agree that this is a worthwhile experiment, but it’s his mouse so… if he’s thi...
Yup
wheat plume
O.o
wheat plume
ashen spindle
that makes no sense
you think an apple exec cares about roaming costs enough to change sim when he goes to vietnam
ashen spindle
good, that would force all carriers to support esim then
wheat plume
Judging by how long it took for them to jump on the removal of the headphone jack after relentlessly mocking it to hell and back
ashen spindle
yeah but there isn't really a downside here
unless you go to burner phones using prepaid sims to not be tracked while on a chase or something silly
wheat plume
What happens when your phone is broken beyond repair or lost?
You'd have to somehow prove you own that phone number and get a new eSIM on a new phone
ashen spindle
you know if you have a contract with a provider that means they have info about you and if you tell them your account number or something they know its you
like the same can happen with a regular sim lol
wheat plume
Can you have two eSIMs at once?
ashen spindle
yes
empty wren
You'd have to somehow prove you own that phone number and get a new eSIM on a ne...
Just find the qr code
ashen spindle
https://videocardz.com/newz/intel-confirms-core-i5-13600-cpu-and-below-are-based-on-alder-lake-die ahaha I knew it
cursive summit
Lol what
crimson wigeon
Bruh
cursive summit
Why
ashen spindle
thats why zen4 starting at 300 doesnt matter
intel isn't releasing anything new for entry either
shadow minnow
They don’t need to
ashen spindle
yes they do lol
shadow minnow
They don’t if amd doesn’t release anything there either
ashen spindle
below 300 since zen4 starts at 300 for now
so now zen3 just reigns supreme there since intel isnt coming out with something that can flat out beat zen3 be it on cost or performance
cursive summit
There was no 5500X last gen
shadow minnow
I definitely wouldn’t call 200-300 entry tbf, getting to midrange territory
cursive summit
3500X wasn't bad
shadow minnow
so now zen3 just reigns supreme there since intel isnt coming out with something...
Isn’t 12600k way cheaper than amd 6 core alternative is gonna be though?
stark bobcat
And slower
ashen spindle
no? 12600k is like 320€ lol
shadow minnow
What about 12400?
ashen spindle
also the intel platform costs 50-100 more and you kinda need ddr5 whereas a zen3 system can use the cheaper boards and ddr4
ashen spindle
you sorta do
stark bobcat
When does b650 release?
ashen spindle
october
shadow minnow
Is 12400 or 5600x faster?
ashen spindle
depends
but as I said, they dont outright win but have the more expensive platform
if 13 gen had new parts that would be better, they would be the clear recommendation in the entry levels
stark bobcat
I mean the 5600 is 150€ sometimes
ashen spindle
now amd basically has zen3 for free as entry products and intel isn't adding competition in the segment lol
stark bobcat
Yesterday it was 155
ashen spindle
yeah but thats cutting it close to 300 for zen4 so might as well do that jump then
stark bobcat
Not needed for most people
ashen spindle
thats why a 5600 level is the better comparison
