Osto-Ayak (Doom of Mokhaiotl)

[shell kraken]

i would argue that doing that every 4-5 levels, is better than resetting and running 1-2(or 3/4) again getting no rolls for uniques

[worldly nexus]

credit ladlor

the difference between say an average delve depth of 15 and 18 is very small

[shell kraken]

hard to comment on that graph without knowing how its calced

[worldly nexus]

so any real time loss to get it really is hard to justify

[shell kraken]

but i agree that the deeper you go the less impact a level deeper makes on the whole run

[worldly nexus]

type in from:ladlor in:doom and go to the oldest posts, you can check the convo there if you wish

but thats a key basis as to why i dont think doing much to "push" is worth

like i just take a couple of brews and mostly hard food

because its not really worth going too deep

[shell kraken]

W 1-2 : 40 seconds
W3-6 - 1 - 1:30 seconds
max
W7+ - 1:15 seconds avg

That doesnt sound too accurate, especially with max w7+ should be faster than that I think

but yeah i agree on the whole concept of going too deep is not always best

the banking time (and early waves that dont roll for what you're hunting) doesnt matter enough at some point

[worldly nexus]

i also put some amount of value on the base loot too

50k cballs, so far is a nice benefit

[shell kraken]

Yeah me too, however i just go how far i can

sometimes the acid rng is just so bad that i reset early

i just keep going as long as it is realistic to complete a level

[worldly nexus]

i dont really ever reset due to acid

[shell kraken]

and i just clean whenever i get the opportunity to do so

[worldly nexus]

i just stand in it from time to time

[shell kraken]

yeah i think our experiences with acid are different

[worldly nexus]

just drains supplies ab it faster

[shell kraken]

scobo produces so much more acid

[worldly nexus]

thats a fair point

[shell kraken]

also bping carphase probably also produces acid

where you are probably just tbowing it

[worldly nexus]

tbow can legit 2 hit him into shield phase

i sneak in 1 BP hit per car phase

[shell kraken]

yeah im bping like 90% of carphase

[worldly nexus]

usually its a spec but always send 1 because its free

[shell kraken]

ah well its a fun boss

[worldly nexus]

wait bp in carphase produces acid?

[shell kraken]

and deeper levels are most fun to do imo

[shell kraken]

im not sure

[worldly nexus]

i dont think thats how it works

[shell kraken]

hope so

[worldly nexus]

shield + car phase = no acid

once car ends, acid begins

always goes same direct as it sprays at the start of the fight

so you can be dynamic in where you lure him

[shell kraken]

thats interesting

[worldly nexus]

to ensure the acid isnt going in a bad place

very occasioanlly if im noodling in car phase

and rocks are shit

ill lure him to narnia and miss 1 tbow shot

and just accept ill get an orb phase

to ensure he isnt in a bad spot for acid

[shell kraken]

crazy that this is a thought tbow havers can have

[worldly nexus]

its very rare but it does come up

as in, orb phase is coming no matter what

so just missing a tbow shot for better acid placement

i also take venator ring

most ppl dont but imo its better then lb

[shell kraken]

i wouldnt do this if you dont care for delving that deep tbh

[worldly nexus]

another trick is to attack on the same tick you start pray flicking the bolders

[shell kraken]

thats nice with 3t chally insta punish, you get to shoot before the first boulder explodes

[worldly nexus]

as in for non-melee bunch ones

gives you a free hit

[shell kraken]

but ill play around with car placement however i dont think ill ever really do that

since because of scobo i basically get orbs 80% of the levels so i get to clean a lot anyways

think its more relevant for tbow

[worldly nexus]

found a death screenshot that shows a typically acid amount

[shell kraken]

Not at home for 2 days so cant dig in mine

[worldly nexus]

this has 1 acid on melee punish

and 1 tick for car phase

so maby like 10 acid dmg per kill and its on the higher side i guess because its at the end of the run

here is a 16 with basically no acid

[shell kraken]

thats like what my level 9 looks like lmao

[worldly nexus]

you can actually see where i lure him at the end of car phase

you can tell i havnt done cleaning as no straight lines of clear tiles

and obviously little to no acid in rock A/B spot or melee punish spot (thats a bit rng tho)

anyway, maby its just bow diff

but i defs like that rock layout + thralls

wouldnt suprise me if thralls make the different between orbs or not like 5% of the time

[shell kraken]

keep in mind theres a difference between killing in car phase, and skipping orb

you often have a couple hits post car phase

i really think you can drop thralls and it wouldnt really make a noticeable difference

[night zephyr]

It can't be stated enough how much less acid tbow makes compared to scobo.

Every single factor.

1. Slower attack speed
2. Less accuracy (more zeros, no acid on zero)
3. Higher max hit

[worldly nexus]

fair points, so likely just tbow diff on having problems with acid

[paper patrol]

Gf

scobo + chally only

[tulip spade]

it's really just #3, amount of acid generated per floor is a function of how many non-zero hits you need for a kill

a slower weapon would generate more acid per floor than a fast one if it had a lower max hit

and a 100% accurate weapon would still generate less acid per floor than scobo if it had a higher max

[shell kraken]

Sounds correct

[civic surge]

I'm still hunting. Just haven't been posting as much since I didn't play this weekend. 700-ish deep delves

[weary garden]

We got some work to do then. At this rate I’m aiming for most dry iron in this discord lmao

[civic surge]

What else were you really dry on?

This is the most dry I've been but I've been slightly dry on everything. Lol

[weary garden]

1351 at CG, 1400 for fang at arax, 2k for bandos hilt, 1500 for prims
A couple others that I can’t remember off the top of my head

I’ve been pretty spooned as well though. I finished oathplate in 400 Yama kc, mostly solo some duo
Also mega spooned my voidwaker lol

[civic surge]

Those are some rough counts

[weary garden]

Yeah, I feel like it’s mostly been balanced by being spooned though. Idk if I can really complain

[dense ginkgo]

Going dry for specifically Prims isn't as bad now that treads exist

Relevant number is how dry you are on 3/3

[heady flicker]

Prims over dboots was never a big upgrade, it wasn’t ever "bad" to go dry on because it didn’t really matter

Cosmetic upgrade

[weary garden]

Well wouldn’t that be the same number tho in cases where you’re dry for prims? Lol

[dense ginkgo]

different ratio

[weary garden]

Eye #4

[steady heart]

I appreciate how dev was able to keep DPS gap between tbow and scobo reasonable, but at same time give megarare a few extra advantages in the fight outside of raw dps

[weary garden]

idk how much more of this i can take. is there any downside to skipping cloth entirely if im about to grind for shadow?

[patent stirrup]

Cloth is pretty massive

[main briar]

I mean it's bis forever

so completely skipping it sounds very bad

[verbal edge]

Just take a break

Come back when you’re less burnt at the content

[weary garden]

nah i cant play the game like that lol

[verbal edge]

Wdym

[weary garden]

im not a fan of moving on to other content if i havent finished my current grind

in my experience, thats how grinds never get finished

[civic surge]

I am thinking of just taking the week to do skilling stuff to chill out

Maybe a bunch of farming contracts to rebuild my potion stacks.

The thought that I might run out of prayer pots before finishing stresses me out

so I could rebuild all that

[keen rapids]

solid plan

[weary garden]

Im gonna have to spend a few hours in the tower of life to replenish my restores soon lmao

[vapid lintel]

holy fucking rip and i thought mine was bad

[proven owl]

could have been worse, at least no dupe cloth so you actually get all the dupe gp

[acoustic oak]

elite void is like playing slots i stg

3ting my bow as much as possible and pre switching for melee punish and i still sometimes get orb phases

i had like a 1:14 w4 52ish w2

[weary garden]

There’s someone in here that’s dryer than me lol

I’m getting close to him, but I think he’s over 1k

[civic surge]

Alas, poor Kaz

[weary garden]

Yeah, Kaz lol

I think I’m aiming for 1k kc by this weekend. Just need another 140ish

[main briar]

#fuckvoid

[shell kraken]

with tbow+zcb you defo want to use masori for speed

[desert thorn]

everything is gambling if you set your mind to it

I have run some calcs and in full void venny ring gives me +3 max hits

but bp specs for car phase kinda important no?

mmmm

[main briar]

if you need the bp specs to survive, that's probably not worth it

[desert thorn]

I usually get to wave 15-17 bp specs kinda helps getting there

[main briar]

doing a pipe spec saves you ~2t, think i'd rather have the lb

[weary garden]

Pipe specs save me a lot of supplies tbh. Especially when acid gets a bit worse and I have to step in a few to move car around

[spare sinew]

Going back a ways but do you have a vid/tiles for this?

[shell kraken]

I do not but I think widega and jackoo both do this method

So can check their vods

[weary garden]

Pretty happy with a delve 21 pb. I remember when I was mad early on about the tbow/zcbers having it easy at this boss

[whole bronze]

I'm not sure how to compare drop rates, and I know that deep delves are always better for getting uniques, but how much worse off would I be if I did 1-8 resets (can use hard food and prayer pots instead of brews and restores) vs 1-10/11 (inconsistent, skill issue so more stressful)?

Just curious to see if I'd be trolling doing the former

[keen rapids]

here's the expected drop rate of items by floors completed

looking at about 1/50 for an item from a w8 vs about 1/28 from a w11

[whole bronze]

Just hunting the ayaya so 1/140 vs 1/80 hmm damn

I'll keep pushing then 😔 tyty!

[keen rapids]

would also have to factor in that a w11 takes longer, id say roughly 1 minute per floor

148 w8 delves ~ 1184 minutes = 19.73 hours
81 w11 delves ~ 891 minutes = 14.85 hours

yea still kinda cooked

[whole bronze]

Seeing the numbers laid out like that makes sense, although 8 minutes per w8 delve seems very fast, at least I take significantly longer (scobow/chally/bp)

The large gap between the two plugging in my delve times seems right though lol

[keen rapids]

yea not the best estimate but at least enough to give an idea

[civic surge]

x4 -.-

[mossy burrow]

sm1 has a good dumbed down explanation how the pathfinder works in orb phase?

like if the trees are 1 tile north or south, will it begin by moving up or down to make a straight line, or will it move up or down the very last tile before it reaches its destination

[main briar]

Diagonal then straight, same as all npcs

Or basically the opposite of player pathfinding

[mossy burrow]

kay so it will basically fix a line first and then straight

[tulip spade]

correct

[keen rapids]

Always hard for me to remember but if I'm trying to mop I will try to remember that the first tree you shoot will be the straight part of the path, then the second tree will be the diagonal part (and also where it starts)

So if you want to clear a big line, make sure the first tree is on that line

[mossy burrow]

can i make doom get stuck on the x next to the 2 if its the first rock?

i kinda threw this run because was so much acid and he did melee punish

[keen rapids]

Idk how diagonal rocks work but I'm guessing no since north and east rocks work and that one's northwest

[mossy burrow]

maybe

the play was probably to just run through the acid and get the punish off here

[mossy burrow]

when u get hit by a boulder at wave 8 does that stop u from changing prayers?

like when it hits and your character jumps out from the boulders square

[mossy burrow]

that would have made me so upset

imagine that happened to a hardcore at later waves haha

[rich compass]

That's happened to me 4 times in the span of 2 hours so I'm assuming it's something I'm doing

Like diagonal orb path or something making it not move horizontally for 1 tick

[night zephyr]

That's avoidable entirely. You shouldn't set an orb path within melee range. And if you do, you should at least have 1 tile that isn't in melee range. Looks like the other hit is from secondary debris.

You had a tree east that would have given you a straight line and also not have been in melee range.

[rich compass]

Yeah my path is bad because I am bad and just started doom today, but my question is why did the orb stall for 2 ticks

[main briar]

or just do this

[rich compass]

I was in the orb ctrl click walking speed and then walked in front of it

[main briar]

it's slower on the early waves init?

[night zephyr]

It is slower early waves, but regardless it stalling wasn't your source of damage

You got meleed which can and will happen instantly when coming out of orb phase if you are within range.

[rich compass]

I didn't get melee'd

But I know the path is bad bcz its in melee

orb being slower explains it, should probably be on the wiki in the shockwave section

[night zephyr]

You had orb protection? Sometimes the melee doesn't do an animation.

Maybe I'm not seeing correctly cause of how slowed down your video is

[keen rapids]

wait really? i thought the orb was just always walking speed

huh

[shell kraken]

Its slower early yeah

[keen rapids]

yeah its half walk speed in that clip

[shell kraken]

Not sure when it goes 1 tile per tick

[night zephyr]

It might just be the first wave or second. It's slower than walking

Scoboers feel it a lot.

Prob get like 5% of my wave 1s that go to orb.

[mossy burrow]

how do u guys deal with double boulders and orb at the same time at wave 8?

does the pathfinder block falling rocks or?

[night zephyr]

Check out pecanbread vid. He shows the 4 different ways you may have to flick it with a nice graph

I believe they made an update that the main debris from a rock is blocked by the Pathfinder, but secondary debris can still hit you. I wouldn't worry about dodging that at first. That's like the last thing you add

[mossy burrow]

ic

[mossy burrow]

wave 10

[mossy burrow]

do you guys reckon not bringing chally as a learner is better

sometimes i lose a couple of ticks trying to get the spec off instead of just clicking weapon and boss

and if i do, maybe the sara spec is better

[keen rapids]

I like chally for a couple reasons

1. it's a halberd, nice for hitting melee punish and difficult melee grubs sometimes
2. vs nox hally: it has a dps spec for early waves
3. and it's lower death cost

i use bp for spec late waves, but if i play well enough prayer becomes my limiting factor, so ive been considering trying sgs for a few runs

[mossy burrow]

yeah

but im kinda struggling rn even with wave 8

[civic surge]

I also do not chally spec later waves. BP for healing. Chally spec for me is mostly for triggering heal on melee punish. Once that stops wave 9+ I consider it a waste of spec.

[mossy burrow]

and i do have a nox hally

[civic surge]

BP becomes "mitigate missed grubs for free"

Wave 8 I wouldn't worry about chally spec if it's causing you trouble. Just swap and click.

[mossy burrow]

yea well that stuff is not relevant for me yet

yeah

i just wanna get to like delve 10 consistently

[civic surge]

Imo you should focus on getting wave 8+ boulders clean and making sure you're comfortable with sidewalk.

After that you can add on more efficiency, but those are the most important things

[mossy burrow]

ye i noticed that, cant really always make the pathfinder go straight

[keen rapids]

Chally spec can be actively detrimental on 6 and 7 if you're trying to place two boulders

But other than that

If I'm on 8+ and full spec I'll just send spec

Dc on the grub phase

[main briar]

can you get a bow in after the chally now if the chally procs?

[keen rapids]

yeah but I think it just does shield damage

no good for killing before second shield

[main briar]

yeah that's the biggest thing I like about scy, the crazy deep procs

[keen rapids]

Big fan of scy punish

Harder to not step in acid tho

[keen rapids]

yea this, the big thing is you just want something to stop the blast, preferably something with halberd reach

fwiw i use the spec orb, maybe that might make things slightly easier

[tulip spade]

orb makes it harder imo

more mouse movement

may depend on what sort of window you play in though, orb may be ok on fixed or very small windows

[tawny kelp]

the number of times I've misclicked the orb and ran to narnia ;;

[tulip spade]

yeah that too worse consequences for misclick

[night zephyr]

I love the accidentally scobo speccing the tree instead of blowpipe speccing. Cant do anything but accept your impending doom. Well you can tele of course.

[keen rapids]

i actually play on stretched mode lol just used to it i guess

click orb click boss

[night zephyr]

Might be a unique way of doing it, but I never learned Ctrl walking for orb + doubler boulders. I prefer just doing 2 actions on 1 tick a couple of times if needed.

[keen rapids]

I could see it being helpful but I do more of a bp walk kind of thing

Attack, run, attack, run

Even tho im bowing

(sometimes hitting grubs instead of boss)

[night zephyr]

Yeah pretty much same here.

[tulip spade]

sometimes i swear the dead zones between prayers are magnetic to my mouse

enjoy

[mossy burrow]

you guys reckon full masori with zaryte vambraces etc would lead to more consistent kills before orb phase on wave 8? or is it just strictly worse than void

[night zephyr]

Void will generally give you more kills before orb spawns than masori

Max hit higher and accuracy doesn't matter during car.

[mossy burrow]

ye, i was thinking maybe masori would make up for it before car phase but

it seems void is just better

probably the only thing that would help me is a zcb during car phase

[weary garden]

Since the phase changes at 75%, you spend more time in car phase than you do outside of it

[night zephyr]

Also since it's a strict 75%. Getting to 75% quicker doesn't change anything in regards to skipping orb.

[mossy burrow]

maybe dragon knives in car phase is worth using over tbow camp

[night zephyr]

If anything void still helps more pre 75 because you still have a higher max hit and a better chance of a deeper proc as a result (albeit very small)

You should be able to upkeep DPS with tbow quite easily to skip orb a lot

I skip orb a lot with just blowpipe amethyst darts.

[mossy burrow]

yea ive skipped it the last 3 times

[night zephyr]

Maybe not on 8 directly but on 8+

[mossy burrow]

but sometimes tbow just doesnt hit

[night zephyr]

It literally always hits though

[mossy burrow]

like it hits low numbers

and i cant finish it before orb

[night zephyr]

Lol I know what you mean just giving you shit

[mossy burrow]

ah ic

xd

cos its 100% accuracy

[night zephyr]

Ultimately it's a skill issue though and you should recognize that. You want to get good at flicking boulders during orb.

And you'll get better at it over time

[mossy burrow]

ya its just rough atm

im just not a god gamer, if there is an easy way to do something i do that xd

but with the orb u just have to git gud

[weary garden]

It’ll click for you eventually and it’ll be easy. It took me a while to learn orb

[mossy burrow]

i hope so

rn im kinda just sending 1-8 or 1-9

maybe thralls would be worth it at wave 8+ since im only going wave 9 ish anyway

probably not

[weary garden]

I still use thralls in my runs, and a good run gets me to 20-21.

I only thrall on car phase though

[mossy burrow]

oh really

and yeah

[main briar]

Think the answer is almost definitely "save the 2 invent spaces and do another wave"

[weary garden]

It’s probably not worth it, but I’m comfortable enough with orbs to clean acid and not worry

[mossy burrow]

thralls probably hits 0's during car phase?

liking the thralls

good for a newbie

what i meant was like, does the thralls hit 0-3's during car phase

like it can still hit 0's

[tulip spade]

it can

thralls hitting 0s is not a miss it's just a 0 damage roll

[mossy burrow]

ye

thats what im thinking

[keen rapids]

bit silly come to think of it since they specifically got rid of 0 dmg hits for players

remove 0 dmg hits from thralls it's time, they're underpowered anyway, why would you want a summon that only maxes 3

[night zephyr]

0.625 > 0.73 DPS increase

If it's done the same way player 0 hits were implemented.

[keen rapids]

The ginger numeral!! Another reason to do it, easy to remember

[night zephyr]

Imagine it removes the 0 all together instead.

[night zephyr]

It was 0.729166 but I rounded up for the memes. Please don't hate me.

[keen rapids]

Close enough

[mossy burrow]

im getting consistent wave 9 clears now

the aether runes from this is so nice

risk or not to risk

[main briar]

https://i.imgur.com/opv4H9A.png

[mossy burrow]

i would risk if it wasnt for the aether runes

i need those

[north axle]

Thralls make it much harder to get the cleaner

[civic surge]

I would consider that list of loot to be "nothing"

[mossy burrow]

wave 13 pb now

i thought that was a task?

[main briar]

16

[mossy burrow]

thats doable

[mossy burrow]

thats literally me rn

cant believe it

[mossy burrow]

u guys reckon switching to scorching bow when its low is better?

[main briar]

if it's <50 hp when trees spawn, scobow has higher success odds

but it's minor

[mossy burrow]

and success probably marginally increases if its lower than 50

[main briar]

yeah (this is just 20t of damage, 4tbow or 5scobow) https://images-ext-1.discordapp.net/external/zLv-fXpWZKrBGAEYyYEqBKEAg4EKIb1wyF0jx-zQ7cA/https/i.imgur.com/g645fGb.png?format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1262&height=1307

[mossy burrow]

holy fuck

i spooned

thank god cos i suck at this lol

[civic surge]

Pretty much everybody in my clan except me has greenlogged without ever having done a single deep delve. You at least have delved deep! So grats!

[mossy burrow]

thanks, i cant believe its real

but deep delving has to be so much faster than 1-7

[night zephyr]

It's like 30+ hours quicker depending on how deep you delve.

It just seems like the 1-7ers all spoon. The ones who don't probably are too ashamed to share their logs

[mossy burrow]

definetly worth it then

i can only imagine eye of ayak and new bracelet being good on obelisk in toa

i hope so

[night zephyr]

i think its decent but bofa is better

eye shines on p3/p4 and akkha though. You need to bring a lot of mage switches and bin some ranged switches. so it might end up being better to eye obelisk if you go down that route.

Lots of discussion about it in tombs of amascut chat over the last month I believe

[mossy burrow]

ya it probably really shook up the meta there

gonna calc later if its better on akkhas shadows than masori bp, hope so

[night zephyr]

Not as much as you'd think and it's depndent on you having good enough mage gear for it

if you have tbow, even less so.

idk how it compares to tbow p3/p4 but id imagine its a lot different than bofa.

[mossy burrow]

well i do bring tbow for my 400s and on the obelisk i bgs 2x and vw 2x usually and then blowpipe

im hoping that now i can instead send 4 voidwakers and camp ayak for obelisk, no rng involved

[tulip spade]

just got my eye

what's fun to go do with it

well i do wanna use it to grind rigour but maybe i try to get cloth first

[meager cradle]

nothing until cloth

[tulip spade]

[dense ginkgo]

Barrows/PNM aren't bad but cloth still helps at both

[weary garden]

[elfin drum]

Are the wiki tiles generally accepted as the best ones?

[main briar]

They look like the ones from this vid, which are fine

[elfin drum]

Yeah they are

For learning should I be bringing chally over nox? Started yesterday and can get through 6 consistently

[heady flicker]

I bring chally and I consistently get to 9-10 at this point. I’d probably switch once I consistently get to 11-12+

[elfin drum]

Is the nox benefit just less acid

[heady flicker]

Chally speeds up 1-8 a lot and you’ll spend some time there.

8 is significantly harder than 7 imo

[heady flicker]

1 hit splat (less poison), shorter attack cool down, and it poisons

[weary garden]

I like bringing chally over nox. I just don’t chally spec at 6+
Feels nice to zoom through 1-5 with lucky melee punishes

[stuck cape]

I would use the ones from petcord,

Nox keeps you out of melee range

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gy6IzyBYcLo

This method relies on two tiles that can never get acid on them if you follow the method

And it puts the car in a spot that constantly cleans the area you need for grub phase

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1279067769559711826/1420772144861810698/image.png?ex=68d69cac&is=68d54b2c&hm=476cc5da4a21d97540847f3821c6fd0fdfa77ea6f6ec20725b59a86a98837634&

After wave 18 I still have little acid near my rock tiles, northwest corner

And grub side of boss is still completely clear

Can do this method to 50+ if you bring enough divines and antivenoms

[tulip spade]

that's a nice looking strat

[tulip spade]

i got curious about the math on chally vs nox punish so i did some quick math based on my setup. trying to look at the average damage dealt per non-zero hit, because that's what actually matters for acid purposes

the average damage per non-zero scobo hit with dragon arrows is 27 (26.5 for amethyst)
a chally punish produces one hit for a guaranteed 26, and another hit with an average of 20 damage, or 22 if specing
and a nox punish gives a guaranteed 31 plus an average 27.5

so, a nox punish is slightly superior to a scobo shot in terms of acid generation, while a chally punish is slightly worse, with chally spec doing two of these slightly worse hits. unsurprisingly, both lose badly to a tbow shot which can average 42 or so

not sure where i'm going with this but it feels good to put some numbers to the concept

in the end it seems like chally is about 15-20% worse for acid generation per hit than nox

if you're deep delving with tbow i'd bring nox for sure

with scobow it's less clear to me, maybe it's worth making a little more acid to lessen your odds of hitting second shield phase and losing a lot of time

[night zephyr]

Id probably opt for both if I had a nox hally

[tulip spade]

although, that only applies if the chally spec allows you to push deeper past the shield phase hp threshold, or if you get a melee punish post-car phase (not super common)

specing at full boss hp is probably no good in all cases when deep delving

[night zephyr]

Nox hally also allows you to push deep in a way. Nefusss you can do another scobo hit on the actual boss HP instead of the shield

With chally spec your attack CD is 1 tick tock slow

[tulip spade]

good point

[night zephyr]

Overall chally is probably still more consistent deeper procs but worth mentioning

[tulip spade]

bringing both isn't a crazy idea either, if you are still working on your deep delve consistency

oh, all of the above is assuming piety btw, if you don't piety then your non-guaranteed hally hits get a lot worse

[night zephyr]

I've found myself favoring not losing ticks instead of getting piety on on earlier waves

But usually plenty of time to get it on when setting up rocks

[tulip spade]

on the other hand, no piety means you're less likely to land that shitty non-guaranteed hit in the first place

complicated stuff lol

[night zephyr]

Is the first hitsplat of chally the only one that is guaranteed? I thought both were tbh

[tulip spade]

each hit gives one normal attack roll plus one guaranteed splat

[night zephyr]

But they are both guaranteed to hit

The normal attack rolls

[tulip spade]

huh, are they

i thought you could hit 0

[stuck cape]

If you ever don’t have spec chally is really bad tho

And it’s much better to use spec on sustain then dps

Blowpipe , ancient Godsword, even sgs

[whole bronze]

Where can I actually get the tiles? Neither link in the video description work for me, and googling petcord doom tiles doesn't come up with them either

[heavy canopy]

https://discord.gg/petcord

#1402630890563047424 message
https://pastebin.com/raw/zDR66VQ9

[whole bronze]

Thanks!

[whole bronze]

How much better is this method than muffyn's sidewalk tiles? I'm back to getting clobbered before I get used to this new way so I'm wondering if it's worth

[weary garden]

Weekly check-in. hows the mental doing boys?

also made it to rank 94 on the iron hiscores. thats cool ig lmao

[wise spire]

I gave up at around 1300

haven't played the game in weeks

[whole bronze]

Mental's not great, ever since I started pushing to 13/14 I thought I'd be seeing more items, but it's been like 700 delves since the last

but good god your log is rough

[desert thorn]

here you can have some cloth

[stuck cape]

Much better, it goes on forever

[keen rapids]

Terrible thanks today or tomorrow is going to be my last attempt at the boots before I go back to potting the shidder hc

[night zephyr]

My motivation to get boots has dropped. I've been gearing for doom and then logging and playing other games.

I just wanna send tob. But want boots for it.

[weary garden]

That’s about where I am. I want to be at ToA for my shadow but I gotta finish the cloth. I’m close to just taking a break and playing league for a couple months lmao

I think I’m gonna try and learn new tech and do the other method. I’ve been making it to 21 semi consistently so I can probably push further

[keen rapids]

Widega tech has been good for a little bit of extra motivation

Love learning new things

[weary garden]

That’s what I’m thinking. We’ll see lmao

[keen rapids]

does the method just not work on w6-7? the 2nd slam (corner rock) isn't getting nulled even though im placing it correctly

[tulip spade]

yeah corner rockblock tends not to work on 6/7

[keen rapids]

i hate this boss

[night zephyr]

Yeah learning tech is a good shout. I'll try and throw in a new rock block method. Is widega blowpipe friendly with adjustments? Or do I need to go for something else?

[heady flicker]

I was using kirbys tiles (widega based) and you can’t afk shoot on his marked tiles with bp without being dragged

[timber sandal]

This game really fucks with your mental. Makes U think U can't do other content with out x item, then makes U 5x dry at that item. Best of luck to all my non spooned brothers in the chat

[whole bronze]

That’s good to know, I kept getting tilted thinking I was doing something wrong

[keen rapids]

TIL that holy water restores 25% spec

[dense ginkgo]

Bro didn't read the patch notes...

[night zephyr]

It's nice. If I am close to maybe not finishing with chally I spec I just send the chally spec for the prayer restore.

Trading -5% spec energy for +25 prayer is nice

[keen rapids]

been wondering why ive been ending with spec % ending in 5 despite not missing a death charge proc

[dense ginkgo]

Bro's not precasting death charge after teleporting back...

[weary garden]

my god.. just got my 5th eye. im gonna lose it

[vocal girder]

does any1 have a good vid on how to deal w 2-3 autos into double boulder for deep delves?

for some reason those two feel way tougher than 0-1 auto into double

[stuck cape]

Do you mean tree phase?

Pecans video explains it best towards the end

[vocal girder]

oh yeah, thank you

[tulip spade]

2 = pop tree on your free tick during orb flick
3 = pop a bit before flicking, flick while walking

[weary garden]

I don’t think this is accurate right?
1 is pop tree during free tick
2 is pop before flicking

[tulip spade]

yeah u rite

i was thinking the other way cause idk why 3 into boulder would be a problem

[vocal girder]

yeah this is my major roadblock i can go delve 11-12 using 2-3* brews but get completely screwed if i get either 2-3 autos into boulder during tree phase.

for some reason it doesnt click lol

always dying with many brews on invy

[tulip spade]

2 is tricky, but 3 should be fairly easy as you should be walking in a straight line by the time you have to flick

[weary garden]

2 autos still kills me sometimes depending on if my orb is gonna go diagonal first

3 is a lot easier though you have time to pop the orb, ctrl click, and then flick

[vocal girder]

do you begin ctrl walk the tick after popping?

[weary garden]

With 3 you have time to wait until orb spawns to ctrl click

Don’t have to anticipate when it’ll spawn and start walking

[tulip spade]

this bit from the pecanbread vid is instructive on ctrl walking

as soon as you're on yellow you can ctrl click once and be good for the rest of the orb

[vocal girder]

im trying to find a 20+ scobo vid because every1 with tbow just skips that mechanic.

[tulip spade]

tbow still has to do it a decent amount of the time

but they have an easier time going deep since tbow makes a lot less acid

[brazen token]

Treads on 602! Just when I was starting to get comfy with Doom

[tulip spade]

the next 2 delves after this were pet and treads lol

[weary garden]

2 eyes and a pair of boots today. no cloth still lmfao

[weary garden]

• another eye just now :/

[whole bronze]

Free after a 900 delve dry streak! The wait for one last glowy hole was worth it

I never did end up getting any uniques past wave 8 for some reason, deep delves scam confirmed?

[vocal girder]

actually same, 7 uniques all before wave 8

[wispy knot]

Ok how the fuck

do i deal wiht the fucking endless larva

[civic surge]

Kill them next to the boss.

[tulip spade]

in what context

outside of shield phase you just kill them when it's convenient, don't worry much about popping them on the boss especially on later levels

in shield phase you sit next to the boss and pop them as they come in, you won't take damage from the explosion if you are next to the boss

when the phase is about to end you may want to pop the extra grubs that are further away before popping the one that will end the phase, that way you don't have to deal with them during car phase

if you have one or two really far away at the end of shield phase, you can often ignore them as car phase will take the boss far away enough that they time out and despawn

@wispy knot does any of that answer your question

[wispy knot]

sorta, its i cant click them when they get behind doom's model

or my character spams eye shots at a fuckign melee overlaying it

I'd rather it be where larva clicks override doom

so if a larva gets close i have time to click it

[civic surge]

For me, that would cause deaths due to failing to tag Doom to reset his shield timer.

You could set Doom to shift click = walk here and set larva to shift click = attack

or vice versa

[keen rapids]

nah larva prioritizing over doom is the play

[civic surge]

You can set custom menu swaps like

This will set the clicking priority in order

so you can at least be aware of which one will be clicked on top

[weary garden]

This is the answer^

[weary garden]

Is there any point where its worth for me to just farm wave 2 for the cloth? after 11 uniques im tired of not seeing the cloth

[winter garden]

No

[main briar]

no of course not

[winter garden]

Maybe if u lose the ability to use ur hands but even then

[weary garden]

lmao im desperate rn

im also down to 1300 darrows left from 15k
this boss is gonna get way more annoying if I dont get the cloth soon

[main briar]

doing 2500 wave 2s on average sounds... not good lol

[weary garden]

yeah that sounds awful lmao

[main briar]

vs doing 50 x15s

[weary garden]

my account is just cursed lmao

[wispy knot]

Nah, just push the highest wave you can. I've been spooned though given like 700 delves for eye and boots so far; boots were wave 4 so 1/1350 roll for it

I think doom's taking pity of me not cracking wave 7

[wise spire]

I'm in full conspiracy mode that drops are fucked past wave 8 or something

[weary garden]

same

2 of my 11 uniques were past 8

[stuck cape]

What ratio of ur waves were past 8 though, 20%?

[timber sandal]

Don't give up king

[weary garden]

I’m 1300 deep delves with 4200 total

[timber sandal]

Next glowing hole is cloth

[wise spire]

careful with that, you might doom them to another 1500 delves before glowing hole

[unborn girder]

@civic surge did you green log yet my friend?

[civic surge]

No I came too close to running out of supplies. I'm farming and skilling for a month before I go back. 😄

[unborn girder]

geez man, what deep delves you at now?

[civic surge]

Hopefully blode will consume all the bad luck while I'm on this break!

I think I'm close to 800 deep delves or 3500 total.

I won't complain again until Blode gets his drop though! 😄

[weary garden]

Hopefully you can complain again soon brother

[civic surge]

Yes you are too cursed. I really hope you get it

All I get are cloths and pets now

[wise spire]

as someone running low on d arrows too, is the new fletching activity a decent method of farming them?

[weary garden]

I’ve heard it’s less than ideal

I’m just gonna send amethyst tbh

[mossy burrow]

our of curiosity, why does avernic treads add 2 max hits on doom? is it like a special thing only on doom? cos its only 2 ranged strength

you would think maybe it adds 1 maxhit or something

[tulip spade]

demonbane fuckery

demonbane weapons have wacky str breakpoints

[mossy burrow]

oh yeah, the extra strength

[tulip spade]

because they add a multiplier or something

[mossy burrow]

i wanna remember it added 2 on the tbow aswell not sure tho

[arctic niche]

sometimes u just hit right thersholds with minimal strength bonus on crazy scaling weapons

i was doing some calcs on some dhcb setups i might run and avernic threads gave me 3 max hits on dhcb

but bucker only gave me 2 despite having 5x more str bonus

[mossy burrow]

wtf?

that makes me think that its not a simple every x ranged strength =get 1 max hit equation

[arctic niche]

another example i think is when zary vambs came out it gave like 3 max hits on task(tbow) but adding masori body/legs only added an additonal 2 or something

its just wierd ye

[mossy burrow]

thats so weird

[arctic niche]

theres a pretty good live example if u have avernic threads maxed ur max hit with amethyst scobo goes from 55-57 (rigour scobo doom)

with 1 extra strength bonus

[mossy burrow]

maybe its something like, every 4 ranged str, get 1 max hit, and then at random treshholds gain 2

like 50, 100, 150 or something

[arctic niche]

ye no clue how it works honestly luckily calcs/commuity can figure out how insane upgrades will be

[mossy burrow]

i assume with these new boots ppl can hit 100's with tbow on olm now

[night zephyr]

+++

[tulip spade]

when you have a bane weapon adding a multiplier on top of that formula, yeah it's not that simple anymore

it's a thing where your "regular" max hit goes from 25 to 26 but then demonbane multiplies your max hit by 2 so your actual max goes from 50 to 52 (not the actual math just for demonstration)

[mossy burrow]

hmm

[tulip spade]

on another note, are there any good videos on deep delve acid cleaning out there

i feel like i'm still pretty bad at it

the process i'm trying to use at the moment is stand near the middle > find and shoot a tree that's on a row i want to clean and isn't too close to the center > find a decent tree on the opposite side > run to it and pop it at the appropriate time

[steady heart]

Dragon arrows add 5 max hits over amethyst in tbow at doom

[night zephyr]

I died trying to get the screenshot, but I think I have the world record for the deepest 75% shield phase proc. DPS was so bad, I got orb phase at 76%. started hitting like a truck during orb phase into a melee punish.

(this is pre 1st car hp lmao)

[keen rapids]

i've had that happen a few times, dunno if i got its hp that low though

[weary garden]

lets gooooooooooooooooooooooooo got my 8th eye!!!!!!!!!!!

[timber sandal]

Did I say last yellow? I meant the second yellow. You won't get 16 straight no cloths without a cloth on the 17

[civic surge]

Noooo! I literally saw you just scream "let's goooooo" and was like YES HE GOT IT then read the rest

At least your total deep delve count is 1337

[wise spire]

bruh, reading this chat is making me consider deironing

[weary garden]

Lmao idk if I have the mental for iron anymore either

On a positive note, I’m rank 48 on the Ironman hiscores for doom now lmfao

[wise spire]

I've just gotten to the point where everything is "hope I don't go mega dry" simulator

only I go mega dry

[night zephyr]

You close to around 3 expected uniques?

[wise spire]

4 if you include pet

[night zephyr]

Pet is meme to include.

[wise spire]

I don't even know what the glow hole sprite looks like

[main briar]

Include pet, but cry if you get it

[night zephyr]

I'm doing decent

2 uniques expected 4.5, but at least didn't get a dupe

[tulip spade]

man i was regressing hard for a bit but just cleared delve 15 for the first time so i'm feeling better

[plucky turret]

its because how the game calculates and rounds stuff. the game basically always rounds down even during intermediate steps in the damage formula so when using scaling weapons or % based weapons it may reach a breakpoint earlier and then that just cascades

+1 str 3 lance maxes on task is one of my favourite examples

[mossy burrow]

lol

[worldly nexus]

please send help

[weary garden]

Damn you still got me beat

[worldly nexus]

at least you can do something with your dupes :p

[weary garden]

Haha fair, pretty sure I’ve funded a scythe split for my main by now

[worldly nexus]

nice all i have funded is depression

[weary garden]

Lmao I feel that. I paused my ToA shadow grind for doom thinking it’ll be a quick month of grinding

[night zephyr]

With the drop rates you'd think lol.

[civic surge]

@weary garden https://www.reddit.com/r/ironscape/s/fmsJl2tTyY

I know you will find this thread as offensive as I do. 😄

[weary garden]

Yeah no respect for 275 deep delves LMAO

7% deep delve ratio

If you try and tell these Reddit people to deep delve too they get mad and downvote you. It’s infuriating

[civic surge]

True! Most of the time I suggest anyone do something the response is always "That is impossible! Literally no human could ever do that!" Oh well.

[night zephyr]

I probably did like 500 worth of 1-7s coping before drop rates came out, but even with that my ratio is still 15%. 7% is rough. Poor guy is still at over 7 expected uniques without a single one though. That's terrible for the mental, especially at doom

[paper escarp]

Lol don’t think that’s how the maths works there bro

[weary garden]

Is it not?

[paper escarp]

No mate

The total delves is counting each floor

Deep delves are always 1 regardless of floors

[weary garden]

275 of 3595 delves were deep delves
275/3595
7.65% of total delves were deep delves

[paper escarp]

Yeah I know your maths

But the logic is wrong

Because 3595 delves are all floors ever completed

So it could be 3595 floor 1s or 3595 all in one delve

[weary garden]

No? Every 8+ is counted as a deep delve.
Going to floor 15 adds 8 deep delves.
8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15

His KC shows he did 3320 floors of 1-7

[paper escarp]

Ohh okay

I didn’t know it worked like that

That’s cool

I thought regardless of wherever he got to it’s ‘1 deep delve’

[weary garden]

Oh god if that was the case my log would be nutty. 1350 deep delves lmfao

[paper escarp]

Hahaha yeah it would be

Thanks for correcting me!

[keen rapids]

In theory you can have a deep delve ratio of over 97%

If you can consistently do wr tier depths

[vocal girder]

sry for reviving old chat but just wanted to thank the people here. Finally managed to learn 2-3 autos into boulder in tree phase and deep delves became 1000% more consistent for me.

[night zephyr]

how do I have 4 pets and 2 unique rolls

[weary garden]

nice! thats awesome, it feels good when the boss finally clicks

[tulip spade]

jk i'm back to barely being able to clear 8

why am i like this

i love misclicking a volatile earth and instantly knowing my run is over

putting NPC highlight on those fuckers

[night zephyr]

I have mine NPC highlighted and still fall victim to this every now and then.

[tulip spade]

jk i'm a god

[tulip spade]

i would like to get more bp specs on volatile earth but it's... hard to do on deep delves without getting owned

[weary garden]

i like sending bp specs on car mohka more than the earths tbh

[night zephyr]

I base it on my HP. If I'm like below half HP I'll wait for the earths. But if above and full spec. I'll send on doom

[weary garden]

510 dragon arrows left. when I run out I should just send it with amethyst right? -3 max hits hurts

[main briar]

of course

[timber sandal]

Yes. And then when U run out of amethyst, send with rune. Don't give up king

[tulip spade]

wait how the heck did acid get on the center rock-block tile here

didn't matter cause that's not the strat i was using, but

[weary garden]

We’ve got a problem if I run out of 95k amethyst

[tulip spade]

i don't think i ever put the boss in a weird spot to put acid there

does where you attack from affect how far the acid flies or something? i've seen acid fly weirdly far a couple of times, thinking about it

like i had one land here at the start of a level

[elfin drum]

I feel like once I learn a boss and it clicks I don't have issues after that. That is not the case with this boss lol

[weary garden]

IMO it’s because Jagex loves to throw one shot mechanics in content and call it hard. Miss a flick and you’re not full health? 60 to the face.

I’ve got the same gripes with ToA lol

[tulip spade]

you have 99 max hp
mechanic deals up to 60 damage
"one shot mechanic"
???

[timber sandal]

Not to be devils advocate but making punishes in pvm does make it harder..

[tulip spade]

i mean yeah having mechanics one-shot is objectively a form of difficulty, just isn't a very fun one when overused
but i don't think that criticism applies to doom, shield is the only one-shot mechanic and you have to make multiple mistakes in a row to get hit by it

it is pretty easy for a mistake to cascade into you getting 100-0ed but that's fine

[elfin drum]

I wish they would let your shot through if you get it off before he goes into shield phase

Having to do another with like 10 hp blows

[tulip spade]

they do though? maybe it's timing sensitive but i've had plenty of kills where it dies as shield phase starts

[elfin drum]

Maybe if it hits him as it starts

Not when your shot is in the air

[tulip spade]

yeah i think it has to be on the same tick as shield goes up or maybe 1 tick after

it's kind of annoying but it usually means i get to death charge and drop a pipe spec so eh

[weary garden]

Oof, time to lay off the Reddit buddy

[night zephyr]

I mean by definition it's not a 1 shot mechanic. It just happens to be if you make 1 mistake it's likely you are making another.

[weary garden]

Yeah, that’s my point. Maybe I should have been more specific, but buddy couldn’t control himself trying to correct 99>60

[tulip spade]

there's reddit and then there's words meaning things

[vocal girder]

holy fk im free

[weary garden]

Gzzzzzz!

[wanton skiff]

Is there a sidewalk guide with blowpipe spots? Been kind of winging it but the convienence of being out of the dash path with scobow is nice

[plucky turret]

check 📌

[weary garden]

Eye number 9????

can i please stop getting eyes ffs

[fleet cargo]

[heady flicker]

neyen

[weary garden]

im so close to just deironing this account lmfao

its just cursed

[shell kraken]

atleast ull have the demon tears for the cloth when you get it!

[weary garden]

lmfao i have 125k in the bank and 47k in my eye that ive been charging since I got it. Ive almost charged an entire eye just from doing doom

[shell kraken]

:D

ull get it soon brother

[weary garden]

I really hope so. the mental is taking a huge hit

[fleet cargo]

Have you tried camping delve 2 at this point

It's insane that you have gotten so much of everything but the cloth, like actually

[weary garden]

i actually considered it, but people here said it was really dumb

[fleet cargo]

It is probably dumb but it would be so mindlessly easy

[weary garden]

it would be nice to guarantee my next unique is a cloth

[night zephyr]

It would not be nice doing 2500+ delve 1 and 2s though

55 hours of farming 1-2 if you average 40 seconds for each one

[weary garden]

honestly doesnt sound bad compared to what ive done already

[main briar]

that's because you're comparing average rng to much worse than average

now imagine you go 4x dry on the w2s

[weary garden]

yeah thats true. i just need some copium lmao

[weary garden]

New PB. Gonna have to start flicking to go any further than this. CBA tho lmao

[weary garden]

am I going crazy or does the boss push you out from under him when doing the orb / slam attack?

I just set up a ctrl click walk and got pushed out from under the boss while he was slamming

wtf causes that?

[fleet cargo]

You're going crazy

[tulip spade]

i don't think i've ever walked under the boss during slam

[night zephyr]

I'm guessing it's similar to if you are under boss during transition to car?

That's gotten me killed a couple times when trying to greed a last minute melee grub

[fleet cargo]

Training yourself to not get baited by grubs is the real difficulty curve

[weary garden]

im gonna record it and see if i can catch it again

its like im getting hit by a rock but im under the orb so i dont understand

[weary garden]

boss ends in the middle for me so sometimes i need to clean the middle

[night zephyr]

I'm guessing it only happen at end of orb phase? When transitioning out of orb into the couple reg autos before shield?

[weary garden]

it was during orb phase. 3 autos into orb, so i set up a ctrl click thru boss to follow orb. after the 2nd boulder blew up (while I was walking in orb) i got pushed out from under the boss

[glad osprey]

my buddy also reported being pushed out

[night zephyr]

Guess I gotta start bringing more restores and less brews

[weary garden]

fuckkk it just happened again and i wasnt recording. i got knocked back right after the 2nd boulder popped which was right when mokha started his slam

gotta be some kind of bug?

[tulip spade]

ok i watched this happen while boss was in the starting position. how

"this" being acid on the B tile

it didn't matter for my strategy but there's clearly something i don't understand about this mechanic because i thought this couldn't happen

but sometimes it just yeets acid clear across the room

[wise spire]

bruh, gnomonkey has a better deepest delve and deep ratio than me on his goddamn hardcore

[night zephyr]

I mean fair. But it helps a ton when you learn the boss on a different account and have a tbow.

[verbal edge]

if you don't properly dodge the falling rock from the first boulder, then you'll get knocked back right as the second one explodes

so maybe your timing is just off

[weary garden]

that may be it, but i swear im already walking w/ the orb when that happens so that feels impossible. i gotta try and record it to know for sure

[night zephyr]

I also could've sworn there was an update that the pushing boulder wouldn't spawn in orb safe zone

[weary garden]

There was, it’s on the wiki
Which is why I’m very confused lol

[night zephyr]

Maybe underneath the boss is nulled for that effect?

[weary garden]

I got it

Maybe when the boss starts slams during the orb phase he pushes you out?

[timber sandal]

I keep coming Back here to see when U get cloth

[weary garden]

lmao thats amazing
I got to 1500 / front page on ironman hiscores and kinda started slacking off a bit

[timber sandal]

50 total delves a day u got this

[weary garden]

idk lol, 50 is a lot depending on when I get home. if I dont get this damn drop in the next couple of weeks, im probably just gonna quit until sailing comes out and i 99 it

[north axle]

this is weird

never saw this once

[weary garden]

right???

[north axle]

maybe it's some projectile delay bullshit

[weary garden]

I am right in assuming that I should be safe from the boulder since im in the orb right?

also im walking, so the boulder shouldn't land on me regardless

[north axle]

no idea on the former

but yeah i always thought that if you never stop moving you never got hit

[night zephyr]

I've had some weird stuff I wish I got recorded. Got smacked a random 40 stomp when I know I was definitely covered by orb protection yesterday.

[timber sandal]

One run a day how about

[tulip spade]

there is some obscure weird shit with this boss for sure

[tulip spade]

still looking for an answer on this one

[night zephyr]

Yeah. Id also like to know why sometimes he throws down the entire floor beneath him with acid sometimes and sometimes doesn't throw any down.

[elfin drum]

Do you not get meleed during orb phase?

Or is it just cause you're under

[weary garden]

If he's slamming he isnt going to melee

[dusty roost]

so slowly getting the hang of delve, when do you guys reckon I should claim for tears

(pretty average player)

or do I worry about this whenever I get a drop

[heady flicker]

Never imo

If you get eye early you get them passive, if not just claim when out

If you need tears after 3/3 just do the 20 min afk

[dusty roost]

but how do you get them passive if you never claim

[heady flicker]

Put 10 charges in eye, it gets them passively

I got 7k from eye so far. (On rate for 3 uniques), got eye bit before 1 unique rate

[dusty roost]

so I have to bring it inside I guess

[heady flicker]

Yeah, use it for mage grubs

I’m at 10k+7k so far

Claim vs passive

[dusty roost]

ok cool

hopefully I dont get eye last haha

idk if I would even stay for eye if it was

[heady flicker]

And I’ve claimed more than I should for sure. (Key AND elite I claim, and some claims when kid woke up)

[dusty roost]

ok cool

[dusty roost]

I guess that answers that

[heady flicker]

Gz

[spice nest]

Descend

[dusty roost]

no I'm a pussy

5th lvl 8 clear

[spice nest]

[weary garden]

Yeah bring eye and once you get really comfortable you’ll start claiming when you run out of supplies. I have about 200k tears and never actively tried collecting them

[fleet cargo]

Imagine claiming

[civic surge]

Loot kinda sucks overall. I'd just claim when I'm out of supplies.

[fleet cargo]

Doom giving shark lures is such a joke

[weary garden]

Anyone here uses cure me / sbs to death charge?
I tried it once but hated the delay sbs has

Im running low on antivenom :/

[shell kraken]

I'm bringing venom sacks

And have been focussing on dodging the venom more, when I was bringing anti venoms i didnt really care about my pathing that much in some scenarios

[weary garden]

Yeah this is for sure what happens with me lol. Especially delve 15-25 im running through tons of acid

[shell kraken]

Yeah it gets rough when deeper without anti venoms

I guess you could just use sbs

Its probably annoying at first but I'd imagine its quite fast to getting used to

[fleet cargo]

its for super deep delving records, not for getting to 20 over and over imo, just make more antivenoms

the delay is problematic in the short term and unless youre very skilled can get you killed easily

thats been my experience atleast trying it out

[shell kraken]

Youd only sbs at the end of each level

[weary garden]

I’m making more antivenoms, but I’m trying to prep for worst case scenario lol.
I’ve got about 170 antivenom+ (need to farm araxyte sacks) and I’m just assuming I’ll run out before I finish the grind

[main briar]

Araxyte sacks are pretty quick overall

especially if missing heart

[weary garden]

I’ve got heart, but I’m just cannoning the small ones today. I’ll be able to grab the ~700 I need.

Just thinking ahead just in case I keep going dry and run out again

[desert thorn]

Im probably coping. Im at like 1.1k deep delves and 3k total delves, only missing eye, have everything else. I usually get to wave 22-26. Would be worth it to do speedys 1-7? If I only care abt eye 1-7 maybe have better chances?

[shell kraken]

Doing 1-7 resets when you can delve deep comfortably sounds like a horrible idea

Idk what the numbers say, but besides whats most efficient 1-7 are imo by far the worst part about delve

[main briar]

Unless you can do 1-7s twice as fast as 1-10s they're worse than those

and actual deeper runs are better still

[desert thorn]

i see

[main briar]

and a 1-16 is 4x as good as a 1-7

[desert thorn]

ait gonna keep deep delving then

it would be cool to get eye before top iron page tho

[shell kraken]

top iron page is much cooler than owning an eye

[desert thorn]

top page is 1529kc and im at 1020 so uuh im kinda of close

i wouldnt say its cool tho

[heady flicker]

You belong on the frontpage, being an expert and all

[weary garden]

This is what I thought, but then made it to top page :)

[desert thorn]

[fleet cargo]

How do you guys feel about the claim system?

Also, I feel like delve 9 having the same unique rate as delve 20 or something is kinda stupid, I'm not saying it should have some way higher rate but idk

Maybe a scaling system to where it continues to scale up until a unique is rolled as you delve past 8?

[spice nest]

It’s da same fight over and over past 8 so it should be

[shell kraken]

the average rate per level gets better the further you go for that run

[fleet cargo]

Somewhat, d20 for example has way worse acid than d9

[shell kraken]

which is imo enough, shits already common enough

[fleet cargo]

And more grub damage, assuming you've made mistakes and grubs have gotten to him

[spice nest]

With good strat for car phase it should be less relevant

[fleet cargo]

So, actually I'd disagree that it's the same boss past 8, fundamentally it does become worse

[spice nest]

All about good planning and consistency

[heady flicker]

I think common loot could have scaled more aggressively but also don’t care a lot

[shell kraken]

common loot is fine with how common uniques are

[fleet cargo]

Common loot should scale more and be top heavier agree

[shell kraken]

if uniques were way more rare i would have wanted to see common loot be a bit better

[heady flicker]

I think that’s a good take toe, think that’s what I feel too

Bad loot but doesn’t matter

[fleet cargo]

Yeah uniques are so common haha

[tulip spade]

deep delves are already insanely rewarding they don't need to be made better

and while acid does get worse after 8 it caps out at a certain point where you are just maintaining the space you need with orb cleaning

[night zephyr]

It's actually pretty awesome that if you are a giga gamer with max gear you can do a super sweaty/difficult method to get a unique in 5 hours.

And if you are decent you can still get them much quicker on average than the noobs doing 1-7

[arctic niche]

i dont know if this has a impact but i always saw it being very valueable because ud have to do less waves 1-7 with worse rates

[tulip spade]

no yeah that is a massive impact

like clearing 1-8 gives a 1/50 chance of unique, while 9-16 is about 1/22

[night zephyr]

9-16 itself or 1-16?

[tulip spade]

9-16 itself

[night zephyr]

Hmm so about 1/15 for 1-16. Which is where I bow out on an average run. Takes me about 30 minutes all things considered for a conservative estimate well say 2 an hour. 7-7.5 hours for me to go on rate for a unique like that.

Assuming I never die on the way to 16 that is. Id guess it's closer to 9-10 hours factoring planks and when I am motivated to push closer to 20.

[shell kraken]

30 minutes is really conservative for 1-16 though

[weary garden]

This math makes me really sad lmao

[night zephyr]

For a scoboer it's not that far off.

I prepot a divine and bring 1. I'm usually running out of divine around 15.

So count banking and it's close enough.

I think it's hard to compare the math to what actually happens for me though because I most definitely don't make it to 16 every run.

[fleet cargo]

Okay but do we like the claim system or not

Because I don't think I do, I'd rather receive drops every KC I think

Even if they were worse

[shell kraken]

You can receive drop every KC, just claim every KC

The whole idea of the boss is that you're either picking your loot, or risking it for better/more loot

[fleet cargo]

Yea it's just frustrating when you die and spent 30 mins for zero account gain, I know 'get good' will be the argument though

[shell kraken]

get good

jk

just dont value the regular drops (because theyre quite bad anyways)

[fleet cargo]

You'd think after 600 deeps I'd stop dying but this boss has a way of making you do dumb shit

[shell kraken]

Just care for unique rolls, which you're constantly getting

[fleet cargo]

I only have 65 claims so, I don't claim often

[shell kraken]

Those numbers dont mean much

[fleet cargo]

Wdym

[shell kraken]

For some people 600 deeps and 65 claims means 100% claim rate

For others it might mean a 1% claim rate

[fleet cargo]

No one here is doing 100+ deeps in a session

I'd guess the average person in this channel does anywhere from 15-20

[shell kraken]

65 claims for 600 deeps is averaging like 16-17

[fleet cargo]

Tbh if you can get past 20 without a tbow you're pretty damn good imo

Can't break 19 atm

[night zephyr]

I haven't adjusted my set up yet, but I'm at 19 pb with scobo too when I ran out of prayer. Just gonna try to flick more for now for my prayer to last me longer.

[fleet cargo]

If I had drag arrows still but that supply ran dry 400 deeps ago

[night zephyr]

Dragon with scobo seems like a waste to me. I've only ever used amethyst.

[shell kraken]

Imagine mining amethyst lmao

Rune arrows ftw

[night zephyr]

WFH gang

[fleet cargo]

I don't have access to amethyst, mining is only 82

[weary garden]

I used all my d arrows and now I’m on amethyst :/

[fleet cargo]

But if I did, I'd prob make a nice stack for doom. Honestly rune arrows work just fine

[shell kraken]

Can i send u my creds

[fleet cargo]

I BP doom mostly anyway during car phase so it wouldn't help that much probably

Thank God he drops drag darts

[night zephyr]

Exactly. So you'd just be using dragon arrows on 1-5 more often

[weary garden]

D arrow switch in quiver for 8+ is the play for sure

[night zephyr]

If I got treads first I would've switched to dragon darts for the +2 max hits, but it's only 1 max hit without treads

[weary garden]

Speaking of, just remembered I can bring a blessing now lmao

[fleet cargo]

I guess, not too many other places I'm using drag darts atm

That spec healing is beautiful

[weary garden]

You for sure profit a fuck ton of ddarts either way

[night zephyr]

I seem to only get a unique when I am double the rate for a unique at this boss, and I am about to hit 6 expected with my 3 uniques. So I'll see my next unique in 2 missed rolls.

[fleet cargo]

I also now have like 20k cballs out of nowhere that was nice

For mole killing

[weary garden]

The spirit seeds are also nice to turn into seed packs lmao

I opened like 70 seeds packs a couple weeks ago

[fleet cargo]

Yeah I've had zero issue keeping supplies for the grind because of those, except ranged pots

[night zephyr]

I've ran out of crystal shards. Got tons of supplies to make more of everything but when I use up my next 90 divine ranged pots I'll be relegated to thieving. Hoping I get treads before then

[weary garden]

I just ran out of splinters in my quiver :/
Good thing without max treads and d arrows blessed quiver isn’t a max hit

[fleet cargo]

7k rune arrows left and I have to actually find a source of rune arrows

It's grim

[night zephyr]

How spooned were you at CG jeeze?

I thought everyone got infinite rune arrows for their account from CG

Or at least until you get to grinding out cox.

[fleet cargo]

535 KC CG, I only had 5k drag arrows

I did have a lot of rune arrows, I went through over 25-30k at doom

[tulip spade]

rune arrows are rough pre-treads. 3 less max hits than amethyst with scobo 99 ranged anguish etc

treads closes that gap a lot

i've been using rune for 1-5 then switching to dragon

but also working on my mining on the side, once i unlock amethyst i'll probably use that exclusively

or not. it's only 1 max hit over rune with treads

[night zephyr]

Hmm I have like 45k and only did 320 CG. Honestly no clue where I got the rest of mine. Maybe 150 cox gave a ton.

There's always LMS I suppose if you do actually run out.

[fleet cargo]

its all good, just greenlogged doom, got my shoes today

[weary garden]

Gzzz

[weary garden]

lol past couple of days I can barely make it past 8/9. im so burnt on this boss

[timber sandal]

One run a day keeps the burn out away

[fleet cargo]

On days like that, it's better to walk away and come back with the energy to go 20+

I had a good few like that

[dusty roost]

do people still use the sidewalk thing from the pinned message?

I've seen some other vids but so far it's been working fine

[civic surge]

Sidewalk rules

[whole bronze]

I think people either do the sidewalk or the widega tiles, I did sidewalk for all of my kc but I think widega is supposed to be better

I tried switching over but muscle memory too strong

[weary garden]

LETS FUCKING GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[spice nest]

[civic surge]

Congrats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[granite turret]

Bro gets to play the game

[weary garden]

Just in time for gridmaster tbh

[shell kraken]

Kinda lucky ngl

Gz beast!

[weary garden]

Gridmaster, ranger boot grind, then back to ToA

[whole bronze]

I've been occasionally checking in this thread hoping to see this, gzzzzzz freedom!

[glad osprey]

huge gratz man! I had a feeling I'd see this today LMAO

[weary garden]

I love all the people who were keeping up with the dry streak

[stuck cape]

You should use the Petcord method, which I believe is similir or the same as widegas method

But Petcord has the best resources explaining it all

[timber sandal]

I fuckin called it!!!! Huge gz

[weary garden]

You actually did "next yellow after this one", I went look it up lmao

[dense ginkgo]

could get rangers before gridmaster

still have 4.5 days

gzzz

[weary garden]

true true, I'm doing a bunch of prep from the big writeup you gave me. I saved it from all that time ago lol

[night zephyr]

One day jagex will let us play our account on the main game and leagues worlds at the same time.

Inflate those players counts to a million

[dense ginkgo]

not with one subscription

they said they want to move to what RS3 did with its League

[night zephyr]

Engine limitations?

What did Rs3 do?

[dense ginkgo]

you can "nominate" another account on your jagex account to get the rewards for playing

[night zephyr]

Ok that would be cool. But then you have to have a jagex account.

[weary garden]

this is why ive never touched a league

[dense ginkgo]

that way you can be logged in and do the League on one account while also staying on the main game on the other account

[weary garden]

only doing this event since im maxed

[night zephyr]

Yeah I'll use it as my doom burn content instead of fps games.

I guess that's the best we will get though. That's a fine solution. Main drawback is the forced jagex account/double membership though

[dense ginkgo]

double membership is a problem they probably don't want to solve lol

[night zephyr]

But I'm probably done with leagues after like 2 bonds so that's not bad

Yeah lol that's why they probably set it up like that I doubt they change that

[dense ginkgo]

they also had a membership bundle for just playing the league

[night zephyr]

Oh right they usually do that

[timber sandal]

Prep for rangers??? Pass that writeup over hahaha

[timber sandal]

I always play my alt while afking on main, 100% worth

[weary garden]

Yep! It's super informative and it so far its made the one clue I did really nice lmao

Here is where Gray Nine wrote it all up

[fleet cargo]

Big gz blode

[dense ginkgo]

(Dayoh wrote it, I just forwarded it)

[weary garden]

Oh true, but you still wrote the rest about the clue plugin and stuff below

[dense ginkgo]

yeah

[elfin drum]

how is the EHB for doom 20 kills an hour? 3 minute 1-8?

[night zephyr]

It's considering going deeper than 8

Idk the exact average depth they chose though

[elfin drum]

oh ok. so each floor past 8 counts as a kc then for the ehb

that makes more sense

[toxic thunder]

anything i can do about the boulder break sound cutting out when far away from boss?

[night zephyr]

Go off the animation instead

And you'll build up muscle memory for it over time

Honestly don't know what sound you are referring to, but I don't use any sound timing for boulders at this stage

[fleet cargo]

My sound never cut out even when far, maybe there's a plugin issue?

[toxic thunder]

yeah might check plugins then

[civic surge]

In my head, kills before floor 8 don't even count.

[tulip spade]

had to claim because of venom for the first time, guess it's time to start bringing a second AV

[fleet cargo]

Tell that to the dude I duo'd Yama with the other day, 2300 delves, zero deeps, full greenlog

Chad behavior truly

Not a single delve 8 clear, I was so impressed

[heady flicker]

What was his Yama strat? Mage only from narnia with phoenix neck and triple eats camping 1 pray?

[civic surge]

Guy in my clan is the same way. lol

I guess if you're as lucky as that, you don't need skill!

[fleet cargo]

We just maged, it was hella chill, double mage is actually quite good if you both have ayak specs/accursed scep

You literally never bank

[fleet cargo]

The thing is, that's actually not 'lucky'. Doing 2300 total floors, assuming one did 328 of each delve 1-7, gives you 1.5x of treads, 1.6x of wand, and 1.8x of cloth

Not to mention you get to claim on 7 every single time

If we assume pretty average times, you're talking about a 40-45 hour grind that gives you on rate all uniques and every single piece of normal drop loot, unless I'm missing something with zero need to learn delve 8 content. Pretty sick

You also can stay there and not bank for a long ass time and instantly hop right back into delve, which cuts on downtime

You end up with 40k cballs, 75 ranarr seeds, 50 spirit seeds and 115k demon tears, 6k drag darts and a pretty fat alch stack, idk man it seems fairly legit

[night zephyr]

Expect going those rates for uniques isn't even on rate yet for 3/3

You can't look at as you are over 1.0x that means you deserve the item

[fleet cargo]

is that not on rate or am I reading this calc wrong, because thats definitely on rate, no?

[night zephyr]

3 uniques means you need to roll 5.5x uniques to hit expected rate for all 3

They are all on the same table so you can't look at it like that

If your goal is to get all 3 that is

[fleet cargo]

im confused, in my example, does this calc not mean you'd see this expected number of all these items?

[night zephyr]

It means you'd expect that number of them yeah. But in terms of the amount of unique rolls to hit actual expected completion of 3 uniques. You need 5.5 rolls on the table to hit the expected 3/3

This is a bit less than 5 unique rolls

[shell kraken]

Also imo the comparison you make for how good it is, is like saying doing toa 200s to greenlog is amazing because its only twice as long of a grind, but so many more seeds

[fleet cargo]

its great if you dont want to engage with the content

and im not convinced its twice as long of a grind if you dont do d8

assuming youve never engaged with the content, especially

[night zephyr]

It's definitely a lot better than 200 toas, but you are probably subjecting yourself to an extra 10-20 hours of doom vs. deep delving

[shell kraken]

Even while learning and dying on 8 and later, you still get the rolls early. Learning 8+ is barely a time loss for a big gain

[fleet cargo]

dying and banking and running back to multiple d8 deaths is a considerable timeloss vs claiming and jumping right back in at d7

[shell kraken]

Sure you die a bunch of times, but its literally only the wave you die on thats the time loss

[fleet cargo]

all im saying is this is very legitimate method

[shell kraken]

Its a method, but imo as good as doing underinvo'd toas

[fleet cargo]

of course not

[night zephyr]

Anything is legitimate. You just accept it taking you longer to do the grind because you didn't want to improve your skills at the game.

Id rather get better at the game and finish a grind quicker at the same time

[fleet cargo]

its really not even much longer when you factor in the learning process

[night zephyr]

Learning process is a moot point when comparing to claiming vs. 7. You already put in all the time to get to 8.

[shell kraken]

Im confident that even with being an average pvmer its still a huge time save to delve deep

[night zephyr]

You are gonna die instantly to double boulders until you get it down lol

[shell kraken]

Considering the learning time

[shell kraken]

This. Its really not that much time to learn

[fleet cargo]

i just want people to know, they dont have to actually learn delve 8

[shell kraken]

Also if you just die on 8 a couple times, but are good at 1-7, you can do a lot of runs per inventory

[fleet cargo]

obv they should, but they realy do not have to at all

people who have gotten great at the content dont want to hear that but its clear that you can, with good odds, receive all 3 uniques in under 40 hours and never do a single 8