Osto-Ayak (Doom of Mokhaiotl)

[burnt lichen]

so this is start of every phase?

[austere matrix]

Maybe something in mes arrows set to withdraw x and you changed your x amount at some point so not withdrawing full amount? Done that plenty of times and ended up somewhere with 14 arrows

[hollow ermine]

oh

the plant thingy gotta be planned?

or make it go really far always?

so for tagging the grubs or whatever

[proven owl]

ye the 75% shield

[vagrant trout]

so does this mean it waits until his next attack <75% HP to phase to grub?

[proven owl]

maybe it works after nascar too i dunno

[hollow ermine]

am i missing the plugin that can make me tag npc differently?

ah nvm its better npc highlight prob

[vagrant trout]

also i figured out the "fake" melee punish last night, when he starts melee punish immediately after grub phase ends, the grub phase punish damage hits him for 24 or whatever and cancels melee punish idk if that just started happening after this week's update

[hollow ermine]

yey

new pb

[proven owl]

hmm anyone else deep delving that has any opinion on clearing acid

i feel like i can get w15-20 pretty reliably without using any earth orb tech or waiting for boulders

but then almost all boulders get eaten by acid

im curious if its best to lose time to clearing acid and prob risking death since its the most dangerous section or just claim w15-20

im leaning towards claiming but im not sure if anyone has any good tech that doesnt lose much time

[night zephyr]

I wouldn't feel bad about claiming around 15-20. Ladlors charts showed pretty diminishing returns on expected time for items after staying past that point.

[proven owl]

ye that's why im leaning towards that

[night zephyr]

Widega often spent much longer on waves purposely to clear acid

[proven owl]

it also lets me use scythe and some melee swaps

so my early waves dont take 10 years

[night zephyr]

Yeah and at least you still get to see regular loot from claiming

[burnt lichen]

u dont need to spend extra long to clear acid

just look to see if boss is low at end of car phase, and go for a KO shot on the right tick

[wary oriole]

i started using a modified widega strat for placing boulders and its helped a ton

need to wait for scond boulders but thats fine, makes car phase super easy

but i think i'm getting to the point where i might need to force some orbs too

[proven owl]

i should really go mark widega tiles, im kinda doing a similar thing but only for first 2 smashes

[acoustic oak]

I’m gonna try the sidewalk video tonight

[wary oriole]

i was just nulling first smash and baiting into corner but in deep delves all the other rocks were in narnia so i was losing a lot of dps or getting slammed trying to hide from 3rd

[proven owl]

do you actually get a lot of acid clears with this, i just ended up hitting 0s or not getting the low hp car most of the time

[wary oriole]

tried placing my own boulders and got pretty comfy with it after like 2 runs

[proven owl]

i didnt stop dps on car if i got it low early tho

[burnt lichen]

yea it's p common

maybe got like 5 clears in my lvl 30 run or something idk

[wary oriole]

i'm skipping orb phase like 90% of the time now with blowpipe

in 0+

9+

[night zephyr]

Did you switch to dragon darts?

[wary oriole]

ive always been using ddarts

[night zephyr]

How much do you find yourself using for an average run and how far for that run? I'm curious if I'll have enough, but I think I'm gonna switch to them

[wary oriole]

negligible amounr

i'm sure im profiting ddarts here

[night zephyr]

Alright I'm loading up the dragon darts.

Do you get to 33 if you have base treads? Would be nice to spoon those first if so

[wary oriole]

i have 33 without treads

[night zephyr]

Venator?

I'm only showing I'll get 32

[wary oriole]

yes

[night zephyr]

Ah makes sense

[proven owl]

man i try banking my scythe and melee switches again and instantly get 2 min wave 2

its insane how shit these waves are with hally

[arctic niche]

guys think binning thralls is worth? if trying to push deeper

[proven owl]

ye im fully on board the fuck thralls train

[arctic niche]

i dont really like summoing them past w2 anyway

[night zephyr]

I think I'm just gonna bin. Unless I find myself consistently missing the skip by like 1-10 HP, the thrall wouldn't have helped anyway.

[coral basalt]

Binning thralls worth even for poverty void-scobo-nozcb builds?

[worldly jungle]

The acid from thralls 3-6 didn't feel like much of a problem and I'm still pretty bad

[night zephyr]

Even then. 2 extra brews or 1 brew 1 restore is enough to push an extra couple of delves that is more valuable than 1-6 being 0.625 DPS quicker.

[hollow ermine]

on the orb walkey thing, do yall delay spawning the orb usually?

some arbitrary amount? is it consistent?

[night zephyr]

There's a sound/animation queue when you need to start it. It's also 20 ticks from when trees spawn consistently.

[hollow ermine]

oh ok thats cool

imma need to learn that then

thats about 4-5 scobo hits then

[night zephyr]

For me I found that animation sometimes gets overridden, so I'd get used to sound or timing based on your attacks

Can also turn your visual metronome to 20 ticks

[slender monolith]

I see ralos not being recomended in a lot of guides, but dps calc it seems pretty good to me without zcb. anything I'm missing?

especially with void

[main briar]

Past wave 4 I'd rather have more bp specs

Bringing an item just to speed up 1-4 is a waste once you start going reasonably deep

[slender monolith]

bp spec for dps, or healing? I'm not having supply issues but skill capped at 7 rn

[keen rapids]

for healing - i think i read on car phase bp and tbow are about the same dps

and tbow is much easier to manage

[main briar]

Both

Spec is minor dps increase but it doesn't hurt

[slender monolith]

so if I don't need healing where would you use spec?

[north axle]

dps calc doesnt reflect the dps loss of using ralos

[slender monolith]

I also have venator ring which gives max hits in my setup. So I could camp that and probably net just enough specs for melee punishes

[north axle]

the fight just isnt very long

[keen rapids]

chally spec good if you don't have scythe

oh yea if you're lost on what to spec with definitely don't take lb

[slender monolith]

this makes the most sense to me. I feel like I still come out ahead bc it's 8 second time save, but maybe just not worth the trouble at that point

[keen rapids]

8 second time save is a lot for mocha what the

[north axle]

ignores how much of the fight is 0 def

[keen rapids]

fair

[north axle]

• not just double bp speccing

[slender monolith]

I guess this would be a more fair comparison since I would camp venator ring in the non ralos setup, and now we're probably closer in the range where lost dps from ralos hit makes up for the difference

[main briar]

7 second timesave, probably really more like 5 once you consider the spec itself taking time and doing not a lot of damage

if you never miss

[slender monolith]

basically half the average hit of one of your tbow shots (+ 1 extra tick). the math is possible, but I'm too stupid, so just gonna switch to venator ring and move on with my life.

[wary oriole]

because the boss is 0 def like 60-75% of the fight past wafe 5

[hollow ermine]

does anyone have a rule to remember what order to hit plant in

[keen rapids]

shoot one that's far then one that's close

[hollow ermine]

farmer -> far near

im gonna try that one

[keen rapids]

the first one is the endpoint, the second one is the start (it's counterintuitive)

sometimes i shoot a close one then run far away to another one and shoot that one

[wary oriole]

anyone have a pneumonic device to help me remember two short words

help

[hollow ermine]

is pneumonic device the actual term for it?

was wracking my brain trying to remember it

or i never knew tbf

[main briar]

Mnemonic

[hollow ermine]

only "huskeregel" in nowegian

[main briar]

close neough

[keen rapids]

pneumonia is when your lungs are fucked

[hollow ermine]

ok i learnt this attack was not the indicator for the bomb attack

or however you refer to the plant one

[unborn girder]

Is there a way to get the true tile of the orb from the tree special?

[unborn girder]

might have it

[main briar]

^

[unborn girder]

ty

[hollow ermine]

lol

i just realized the admins look like the case hardened pattern (:

[night zephyr]

No way admins got the blue gem

[nova solstice]

bro acgs would make this so tolerable

getting to 20+ with just bp is cancer

[main briar]

i mean at the end of the day if you're getting to 15 or 20 it's not gonna make that big of a diff longterm right?

[nova solstice]

does it not? i havent looked at drop rates tbh the way im playing it is just trying to pb

this boss is kinda like gambling

[wise spire]

iirc the expected time to completion levels out around 15 or 20

it's like 18 hours per item or something

[nova solstice]

i see

[wary oriole]

bp heals a lot on the trees

[wise spire]

first 8 clear

aaaand immediately dead on 9

[nova solstice]

getting to trees doesnt rly happen XD

but yes its nice when u do

[night zephyr]

You still get a guaranteed spec on the boss itself at least

[wary oriole]

that's in your control

[placid vortex]

does the orb stop if it hits a rock?

i swear mine just disappears sometimes

[wary oriole]

it stops if he stops stomping

or if he dies

[nova solstice]

fuckkk

im greeding treest o clean acid too much ive noticed

need to stop doing that

couldnt hit 9hp

[wanton skiff]

Can you make mokha red when he turns to melee punish mode? My default is blue.

[stone dawn]

No, its the same npc

[main briar]

yes

[wanton skiff]

Im conflicted now

NPC id changes for that like the other shield or is it the same?

[north axle]

melee punish is the same id as normal

demonbane is different id

[mild orchid]

finally did it after always insta dying to the double boulder

[nova solstice]

goodshit king

[wise spire]

Bruh how do people get sub 10 minute 8 runs

[nova solstice]

tbow+zcb

[weary garden]

mostly zcb/tbow. but its possible with scobow/bp

[wise spire]

The time to completion estimates were using like 75 second kills at 9+

[nova solstice]

my pb is like 8:34

[weary garden]

my pb is around 9:45 with scobow/bp

[nova solstice]

hard to say the average i havent rly trackeed

[weary garden]

using ddarts and darrows is the key imo

[nova solstice]

i think 9:3x is avg?

[wise spire]

Even with dragon ammo it still takes me like 2:00 to do 6+

[weary garden]

probably missing a lot of attack ticks focusing on mechanics

youll speed up over time

[nova solstice]

what u using?

[wise spire]

Scobo and bp

[nova solstice]

speed doesnt rly matter tbh as long as ur getting deep

survival more important

[wise spire]

It helps a lot though with not seeing multiple shields and orbs

[nova solstice]

yea true

i have no idea about scobo bp kills

[wise spire]

If he hits second car I usually end up getting fucked

[nova solstice]

1-8 are slow that i sometimes can get 2nd shield aswell

with tbow zcb

[weary garden]

yeah we're definitely fighing a different boss than most people

[nova solstice]

but past 9 it happens so rarely

[wise spire]

Man I don't wanna go back to tbow grinding

[nova solstice]

i bet even just zcb will help a shitton

but i find myself using it less and less lately

and rather bping or sgsins for hp

[wise spire]

Zcb even worse to get tbh

Fuck nex

[nova solstice]

real

altho i wonder how nex is now with all the powerspikes

[wise spire]

Waiting for phosani nex removed 4th phase and buffed loot treatment

[nova solstice]

still cant believe wtf they did with oathplate

makes nex so m uch more irrelevant now

[wise spire]

Honestly based

Just release a better zcb and upgraded hybrid barrows gloves to circumvent nex entirely

[nova solstice]

merge nex and pnm and give a roll at each tables per kill

[wise spire]

[nova solstice]

phosanis nexmare

[wise spire]

Then cry when you roll inquis

[mighty rain]

add torva shards to nex like yama has

[nova solstice]

that would be kinda dope tbh

[mighty rain]

and the people who have already done a ton of nex can go cry about it

[wise spire]

Wouldn't even matter for someone like me

700 yama solos and 391 shards

Actually better idea, we add mega rare shards to all raids and then everyone can cry about it

[nova solstice]

baami would love that

188 purples no mal

[verbal edge]

sure but you have to fight them both at the same time

[wise spire]

How about fighting neither of them and the loot just appears in your bank?

[wary oriole]

scythe helps a ton

[nova solstice]

ok inventory setups are kinda goated

i had no idea they worked with pot storage

[acoustic oak]

I think people that are good at the boss don’t rly use zcb

But bow is a good weapon (hot take I know) so getting one isn’t needed but it’s like stoning 2 birds

[nova solstice]

yeah i just use zcb to speedd up 1-8 rn

u benefit just alot more from healing later on

sometimes ill send one if im super chilling on supps and hp

[verbal edge]

is zcb actually bad on deep delves

i get that healing gets you better PBs but once you're already sending 15+, sending deeper delves is pretty marginal gains in hours/item isnt it

so zcb speeding up all your waves seems kinda good

[acoustic oak]

No clue

But a lot of people I’ve seen don’t bring it, or do and barely use it

But it bleeds hp, and other specs profit hp

And if ur solid u don’t rly need to skip orb phase

[nova solstice]

yea

the only thing is, that

thee longer the boss is alive for

[verbal edge]

skipping orb phase lets you finish the level like 30 seconds faster though

[nova solstice]

the more acid it spreads

[acoustic oak]

I don’t think it’s bad, I just don’t think it’s op

It’s prolly preference/ situational

[verbal edge]

its hard to imagine delaying every wave that long is good for getting items quickly

[nova solstice]

its good on 1-8, situational after like 12 id say

cus grubs start hurting

[acoustic oak]

I don’t think it’s the same narrative as it was a week ago

[nova solstice]

and a bunch of other shit

[acoustic oak]

Where people just said the boss is lifechanging w zcb, that was prolly more the case when you crutched dps check

[nova solstice]

u can defo skip most orb phases

with tbow only

past 8 anyways

ik widega still brings zcb

havent watched how he uses it tho

[acoustic oak]

I watched the 63 run live, most of it, I noticed him use it once

Granted I tuned in like wave 15 onwards

[verbal edge]

i think its kind of important to differentiate ppl going for high PBs vs going for items

what widega does kind of irelevant for ppl here trying to just get the items

[acoustic oak]

It’s prolly still comfy for sub20

I can’t imagine like 13-17 is worse loot/hr

[nova solstice]

the only ppl i havent seen bring zcb are the irons without one

[verbal edge]

yeah i've seen people earlier today say that once you get decently deep, like 15ish, increasing your depth beyond that isnt massively helping your hours/item

which is why i think zcb is still extremely good for everyone going for items, since brews are plenty healing to reach that depth

[acoustic oak]

You prolly also need to bring 3 reg range and a Div

Cuz Everytime u brew u need to repot and idk I take like chip damage and zcb damage so

Idk if I wanna start waves 75-80 hp

[nova solstice]

thats what ive just accepted at this point

u cant just brew to 99 every wave

massive wastee

and ull most likely die anyway even at 99

if u fuck up

[verbal edge]

its an almost 0 damage boss so its not a big deal to start a wave a little down on hp

[nova solstice]

ye

[verbal edge]

i just brew every couple waves on avg

[acoustic oak]

Maybe for youn

You

Most people are gonna take a debris or maybe an offpray

If they hover 8-11

[nova solstice]

i bring sgs + bp

aswell

[acoustic oak]

I take debris chip or let a leech go somewhat often?

[nova solstice]

incase that happens

[acoustic oak]

So that’s like 1 dose of brew, zcb spec is another 9 hp

Or whatever

Ya I don’t have any other spec outside zcb so it does add up

Like I don’t bring one

[nova solstice]

not even bp/

u shud defo bring bp imo

lets you 3t tbow if u can be bothered and nice healing on trees

[verbal edge]

bp spec on trees costs you zcb on next wave though

[nova solstice]

there is alot of overcharge

mainly if ur doing park tech

u get grubs

thats 30 spec

and ur regennin

the whole time

ull easily get another zcb

back in time for car

[verbal edge]

ime even with double dc theres only about enough spec for a zcb per wave

maybe a little extra but not enough for a 50 spec

[nova solstice]

are u speccing during car only?

zcb i mean

[acoustic oak]

Ya I only spec to proc Shield or start of car

I can drop a pot or hard food for pipe see if I can make it work

I wasn’t paying much attention to spec overcap, so I can be mindful to see where id use it

[nova solstice]

bro the fuck?

insta melees are still a thing

swear they said the patched it

[weary garden]

Well, thats a huge improvement on my PB

Think that might be my limit with scobow
I got lucky with acid but it was getting unmanageable

[nova solstice]

i just had to res a 13

cause my acid was unmanageable aswell

by wave 7, on the south side i had to already step under for melees lol

and then it just kept fucking even under it

[weary garden]

Crazy lol

[nova solstice]

10 tile melee weapon when?

SUPERCHALLY

[vagrant trout]

i got a lobster

[dense ginkgo]

Would

[vagrant trout]

[hollow ermine]

made it to wave 5 babyy

the car phase was chill

[lone carbon]

[hollow ermine]

is mark of darkness required to oneshot the grubs?

oh fuck sake

i been using undead grasp, not dark demonbane lol

do yall prefer to call it car phase or roomba phase

either way it ate the rock i was gonna hide behind

[burnt lichen]

oven mitts acquired

[hollow ermine]

gg

[stuck cape]

Use the low tier demonbane spell

Does the same thing but you can cast it after brew sips more often

[hollow ermine]

oh good shout

i been worried about that often, and fucked by it once already

[nova solstice]

Whats the reason noone puts rocks west or south? Is it just not possible?

[nova solstice]

Jesus christ gz

[dusk hedge]

Has there been a consensus on most efficient delves level to farm loot? I can usually do 6-7 easy, can sometime push to 8 and on perfect runs reached 9. Need wand to be done wondering when I should reset

[keen rapids]

as deep as you can go

resetting was always cope

[main briar]

If you have any pots left, resetting seems to just always be bad

[dusk hedge]

I see thanks for the heads up

[main escarp]

karambwan 12s

[celest robin]

Yep, his collision doesn't work very well north/east, probably related to SW tile shenanigans

[night zephyr]

What change did they make that is letting me get such deep procs past 75 hp?

And that he is staying up for quite a bit longer after car phase?

This feels huge for consistently skipping 2nd shield

[main briar]

Not sure. I've also gotten a melee punish after car a couple times and never remember getting it before a couple days ago

After trees I mean

[celest robin]

They changed it so that shield phase procs based on his attacks, not based on him being damaged

and they added a several attack grace period post-orbs so you don't instantly get a 2nd phase

[night zephyr]

Massive

thats why skipping so much more consistent now lol

for the non tbowers/zcbers

I need new sidewalk luring tiles that dont get me dragged when using blowpipe

tried using these tiles in the pack and got me killed

[acoustic oak]

I feel like this is so low on number of item, unless ur not claiming

[nimble crest]

i have a similarish log

[acoustic oak]

Idk what’s expected number and wave distribution so

[main briar]

it's roughly 200 1-10s for greenlog, which is 2k total and 600 deep

[main briar]

or 150 1-12s which is 1825 total, 760 deep

[acoustic oak]

Ya but 4 items seems low, even at greenlog, I think I’m expected 4 items with like half the deep delves

Or 4.5

[north axle]

giga pb

getting the hang of this now

[burnt lichen]

u prolly want to bin scythe in favor of nox halberd to spawn less poison

if ur going deep

[dense ginkgo]

Asgore phase

[north axle]

it's just to speed up early waves

tbh

I don't use it past 6

any deeper and I'd have a second divine but the floor was such a mess anyway at this point

[night zephyr]

fellow scoboers. Do I just say unlucky gg go next when doom targets my west side 3 times in a row 6-8?

died wave 10 cause had no room from acid

[hollow ermine]

whats the nally for in wizzys setup :o

[burnt lichen]

for hitting melee shield on 6+

1. halberd range so you can attack over acid, and potentially attack over acid for melee grubs
2. only 1 hitsplats so it spawns less acid, important for not making a mess out of the room when pushing

[north axle]

this is going really well

once i get more consistent i might bin scy/thrall

[burnt lichen]

and i would use aether runes

[night zephyr]

I binned thrall for the +2 slots

[burnt lichen]

o yea if no thrall for 1-5 then can save ur aether runes

thats what i did

[north axle]

Good idea

[weary garden]

What’s your log look like?

[weary garden]

This is what I’ve kinda been doing. Some runs I try and force it if the loot is extra dogshit

[proven owl]

does anyone have widegas tiles that they can share?

[night zephyr]

I think im on rate for 1 unique?

[weary garden]

Oh damn, I thought you had more delves than that nvm

[night zephyr]

trying to make my own tiles for doing sidewalk tech with blowpipe. His luring tiles are out of range.

I havent been able to seriously delve in like 1.5 weeks. Think I had 550 after first week, then been moving

[main briar]

The deeper procs with scy are kinda cute for skips, but going past 15 or so becomes a bit of a brick wall

[weary garden]

Honestly going past 15 with just scobow feels like a brick wall tbh

[night zephyr]

the extra hitsplats from scythe are like our reg scobo hits equivalent

[wise spire]

Does this mean you can't sit and chill to force a second boulder proc in 6/7?

[main briar]

Well +2 hitsplats per wave is a lot less than the number of extra scobow shots you're gonna do

[weary garden]

You can

[night zephyr]

you just have to sit above 75% hp waiting

[wise spire]

Oh, so it's a set number of attacks after 75?

[weary garden]

That is in reference to after orb phase. He’ll do a certain number of attacks after orbs before going back into shield phase

[night zephyr]

it seems inconsistent to me after 6. sometimes he does extra attacks sometimes he phases right under 75

but early waves im always getting the extra attacks

[wise spire]

Interesting

[night zephyr]

but ive only been messing around for an hour today

[weary garden]

I’ve seen it a lot in 8/8+. I think in all my 8+ runs because of that I’ve consistently gotten 1 car every time

[autumn fulcrum]

So guys I just finished my summer courses and have a couple of weeks to learn and farm this new boss. I hope to learn to consistently get to wave 15 and claim. I know there are a lot of different approaches to this boss and im wondering if theres any consensus here on what the best strats are for consistent wave 15. I am a tbow zcb haver so i guess my plan right now was just zcb at start until car phase wave then zcb at beginning of car phase and do the sidewalk thing. Nox hally for melee punish. Is there anything else to consider or does that sound good and now its just a matter of implementation?

[night zephyr]

If you time your tbow shot correctly when going into tree phase you can proc the trees and kill boss at same time and then get a free stress free acid clear path

check Dayohs messages in here has a clip linked. Or watch Widega vod

But prob not needed for a tbower/zcber just wanting to claim at 15

[autumn fulcrum]

i noticed widega did that in vod last night and saw gregs clip as well. ill keep that in mind. is it relevant for only wave 15 though? seems like acid might not be super relevant unless pushing 20+

[night zephyr]

yeah prob not relevant but can be nice to keep in mind if your tiles get ragged that you want to use

[autumn fulcrum]

i figure claim at wave 15 cuz from math ive seen it looks like diving deeper past 15 has significantly diminished returns and claiming is nice for the mental, get a lil loot, even if it is buns

[autumn fulcrum]

cool willl keep this in mind ty (:

[night zephyr]

as a scoboer if he picks the side i wanna use 3 times in a row im just screwed

Guess I need to learn to use the mirrored tiles/set them up for blowpipe range as well

[burnt lichen]

i found u can just kinda wait a tick after car phase ends and then tbow

there is more lenience than I first thought

like 2-3 ticks that u can ko boss on for the trees to stay

if its still kinda high hp tho then the bp->tbow would be valuable

to improve your odds at killing it successfully

say like 60 hp for example

[dense ginkgo]

I've only been using bp specs during car phase, but is that even good? Now that I think about it it's a higher net ttk reduction if I use them when I'm normally scoboing right?

or is it just because of the healing and chance to miss outside of car phase?

[nimble crest]

healing and better dps than a tbow is good

[dense ginkgo]

yeah I was just saying that it would be better dps to use the specs after car phase, but again just did the math and it's *not even better dps

oh wait I doubled and halved hold on

[nimble crest]

ah the context is bp speccing outside of car vs during

[autumn fulcrum]

prims or pegs pre treads?

or arena?

[night zephyr]

aranea if you pass the /5 check with them

[autumn fulcrum]

what is the /5 check

[night zephyr]

your extra bonus damage is based on your melee strength /5

[dense ginkgo]

21.0 -> 34.4 expected hit of scobo -> 2x bp spec (+13.4)
~32 -> ~48 expected hit of 2x bp -> 2x bp spec (+16)
car phase is actually +2.6 damage per two specs, +1.3 damage per spec
yeah more dps to just use it during car phase even

[night zephyr]

so if aranea get you to the same /5 threshold as prims do. just use aranea

[autumn fulcrum]

oki cool

ty

[night zephyr]

which they will if you are using void/chally

[autumn fulcrum]

i was planning to use void nox for punish

i think i wouldnt have enough spec to chally and then also zcb every wave

[night zephyr]

ah ok idk the nox thresholds youll have to check

[autumn fulcrum]

oh yea i already checked ty! arena boots good with void nox

[burnt lichen]

https://www.twitch.tv/widega_?twitch5=0

lol widega is just continuing with avernic treads in there

wave 65 rn

[autumn fulcrum]

thoughts?

[wary oriole]

jesus he still has so many supplies

and his room is so clean

[burnt lichen]

do u have acgs

[wary oriole]

i've had worse looking rooms on wave 10

[autumn fulcrum]

i do not :/

oh i could probably bin buckler? most of the time i zcb on 100% accuracy yea?

[signal cipher]

first lv 4

[mighty rain]

deserved

[wary oriole]

always the zoobs

[autumn fulcrum]

lets go juke!!

[signal cipher]

zoobs be eating

[burnt lichen]

@autumn fulcrum if ur actually planning on playing well and going deep, i would:

1. bin pendant and just do max cape -> colosseum on jewelry box -> bird
2. i wouldn't bother with buckler + juggling
3. take blowpipe to speed lower levels up + have heals from specs
4. take fewer brews, more restores, 2 extended antivenom potentially, 3x divines 1x reg ranging

[burnt lichen]

tigersuit wins again

[idle fog]

The king's chariot stops for no deer.

[burnt lichen]

actually u might be hurting for hp more without acgs, idk how effective exclusively bp speccing for healing will be

[wary oriole]

it's really good if you use it on trees

like 24 hp or something

[autumn fulcrum]

heard ty for advice. I think i plan to bin a few brews eventually but i also imagine ill be taking a lot of avoidable damage at the beginning as im learning. my goal is to get to consistently delve 15 and then just claim and reset but once i start getting to delve 15 ill see how i feel, i might want to learn to go deeper 😄

[burnt lichen]

why claim at 15

[autumn fulcrum]

i saw stuff that showed you dont save much time to greenlog going past 15

[wary oriole]

when you have to claim because u run out of supplies, see what gated u and add more of that

[burnt lichen]

erm wut

you save a ton of time going past 15 wym

[autumn fulcrum]

this is what i saw

maybe its innacurate

[wary oriole]

i started off with 1 divine 2 reg 7 restore and like 13 brew and i'm currently at 2 div 2 reg 9 restore 9 brew

[burnt lichen]

who posted that chart? how was the time assessed

[night zephyr]

Ladlor

[wary oriole]

there's no reason to claim unless you're out of supplies

[night zephyr]

make sure its the tbow/zcb chart

he quoted times here awhile ago on update day

[wary oriole]

or you think the acid/grubs are getting too bad

don't just say "ill go to 15" and claim with 6 brews

[autumn fulcrum]

saw @thin meteor post this in log hunters server

[wary oriole]

the reg loot sucks anyway

[autumn fulcrum]

is the normal loot really so buns that its not worth claiming?

[main briar]

Darts are nice, otherwise it's pretty meh

[autumn fulcrum]

i feel like aether is really good loot to claim at the least

[wary oriole]

i get a little sad when i lose ddarts but the rest of the loot is really medicore

[autumn fulcrum]

especially since i spooned sire and green logged levi pre update

[main briar]

Only thing in here i care about at all is the darts and ranarr seeds/spirit seeds https://i.imgur.com/9hd9uvh.png

[autumn fulcrum]

alright well ima get in there and get to wave 15 first, then ill reassess 😄

[night zephyr]

yeah i wouldnt go into mindset of resetting 15, but if acid is unmanageable and supplies low at that point I take it as not extremely unefficient to claim at 15

[wary oriole]

doing 1-7 again is depressing

especilly now that i binned scythe

i miss him...

[main briar]

ok maybe i should switch to chally/nox at this point, cba dealing with this even on w12 https://i.imgur.com/zBkpLgi.png

Then i look at widega and the whole room is quarked

[acoustic oak]

Aura farming

[sleek pivot]

is there any manip to getting punish phases? sometimes i get 3 min kills with no punishes (my spec wep is chally which is why this matters so much for me)

[main briar]

Homie's been out of bastions for like 5 waves

[arctic niche]

if u drop a pot at mokha does it carry over for rest of rooms?

or do u have to keep juggling it?

[proven owl]

think it carries over some waves

not sure which ones

but ye u just have to juggle them that's why i bank my off hand when not using a waystone lol

the brew that i inevitably forget on the floor is worth more than 1% accuracy on my zcb

[honest kayak]

do i sell or coffer dupe treads?

[signal cipher]

no universal answer

[main briar]

Do you need coffer or alt gp?

[mild orchid]

do u need alt money or coffer money

[main briar]

🤝

[hollow ermine]

https://pastecord.com/loqilaroqo.yaml

[signal cipher]

[honest kayak]

not sure tbh dont play any other accounts

might as well sell for bonds and give some cash to mates

[hollow ermine]

change line 43

[signal cipher]

if u dont play it and dont need split money for group content id coffer it

but coffer is usually easy to maintain if you pvm

and treads going to crash

its rly the same bucket tho

if you ever drop dupes to main theres no difference between 200m in your coffer vs 200m to alt

unless youre abusing ge/coffer differential

[burnt lichen]

yea I think the wave times are a little off, but im not sure that it would change the answer much

[hollow ermine]

probably not

[main briar]

Which tiles can you use for the initial lure for the park? didn't realize it was way more than the row of 5

[north axle]

anything behind those 5 also works I believe

[night zephyr]

There's a chart somewhere in the sidewalk tech vid

Might be worth a pin

[main briar]

Didn't realize that those would also put it at the same distance back

or can it just not go further back towards the wall

[proven owl]

ye it just doesnt go further back i think

so any tiles behind the line should work

[keen rapids]

he did it

[proven owl]

im starting to reconsider bringing bp

you basically only get to use it early waves unless ur stalling for a cleaning orb

widega seems to just use it to heal up when he's afking for the orb

seems like a brew would just be better if ur claiming 15-20 which personally i think seems to be bis if the chart is right

[keen rapids]

has anyone tried sgs for the trees?

also you can always bp spec the car

[proven owl]

its pretty rare for me to have spec at car tbh i usually zcb if i have didnt need to heal with acgs

[arctic niche]

okay got to wave 10 with scobo no zcb think ima just aim for 10s

chart says 9-10 is like 95% as good?

[proven owl]

you have very little acid there so u can prob clear to 15 at least fairly consistently

but i dont think doing 10s for a bit is a terrible idea

[wary oriole]

Whats ur loadout? I use blowpipe a fuckton

[hollow ermine]

oh i just noticed his loot is worth 242mil wow

[wary oriole]

I would bring it unless u have tbow +acgs

[placid vortex]

is it worth goofing around with bp if im not clearing 8 yet? using a 1 way chally atm

debating between archers/suffering/lb

[keen rapids]

cause he got treads

he was risking it for like

over 20 floors

idk when he rolled it

[hollow ermine]

oh it scrolls further down

i see

[proven owl]

this is what i run atm but i feel like i only ever use my bp early waves to 3t tbow

sometimes very rarely ill get 1-2 3t tbows late waves too

[placid vortex]

spider shoes>pegs?

[proven owl]

i dunno if spider shoes are better for me with hally but they do cost less on death so meh

[wary oriole]

tmog hide void bottons is kinda tech but i dont think i could do it lmao

[proven owl]

i am still tempted to use scythe tho every time i have to redo slow ass w1-5

[wary oriole]

too hideous

[proven owl]

wdym nothing wrong with a man wearing some nice shorts

[north axle]

that inv could absolutely go further

[stuck cape]

I just do entity hide self + player outline

[night zephyr]

I gotta learn to use both sides of the setup with scobo

feel like im dying 10 a lot cause of acid but if I switched sides id prob be fine

[arctic niche]

ye i started using other sides of rock block and its helped alot with my consistensy

[arctic niche]

i definitely got lucky on acid i just dont know if i can be consistent past this point

wtf lol

[night zephyr]

Hope he remembered to relog

Lmao I typed that as he died 6

[proven owl]

honestly that setup with a couple prayer enhances might actually be what the final setup looks like

[stuck cape]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1090692910355316758/1403817622104965191/image.png?ex=6898ee8a&is=68979d0a&hm=b855ebb3386e90c4ebda6288f4f70f59db7a438da14807c28fa741f2dce2554e&

That’s the real invy

Eldritch seems really good, flick but don’t stress about losing 2-3 points per wave, and every so often just spec a tree and get back 26

[dense ginkgo]

I like BP with dragon darts + Ultor

Ultor + Prims helped a lot with 8 and sped up the early floors personally

Also if you're not clearing wave 8 and you're dying with supplies in inventory there's zero cost to bringing the BP

[dense ginkgo]

What are they SBSing for?

(besides death charge)

[night zephyr]

To be on lunars for cure me

Only SBS for DC

[dense ginkgo]

Ah that makes more sense, I thought the NHally was how they were curing the venom lol

[keen rapids]

pb

[hollow ermine]

gz what a gamer

[keen rapids]

ok yeah we claim these holy

boss actually drops loot

[night zephyr]

Glad I don't get loot like that so I can keep sending without regret

Though I've started just left click descending without even checking till 7 cleared

[keen rapids]

kinda based tbh

i was already pretty sure i was gonna claim that before 8

then ranarr seeds sealed the deal

[verbal edge]

i dont check anymore till w15

probably should though but i just like the flow of insta-descending

dont want to tempt myself to claim early

[north axle]

Brain off shiftclick the hole

If you don't want to descend, it'll stop you

[dense ginkgo]

key half is an instant claim

[proven owl]

ye only real reason i check before 15 now is just key half

i claim key half any wave

[dense ginkgo]

elites are huge too

[proven owl]

im not quite dug deep enough into the clogger hole to claim early wave elites yet

but i do like them and i do use more supplies to play safer with them

[weary garden]

I’ve seen so many key halves lmao

[proven owl]

ive gotten 11 so far but mask is 1/500 so really can't have too many

I doubt ill ever get all of the other halves to finish the keys but maybe down the road they release a good afk for it or i get really bored

[stuck cape]

Isn’t there a fishing spot that never moves

[nova solstice]

this is quite a pickle im in isnt it

[stuck cape]

I think now you can still loot and descend

But before last update you had to tele

[brazen token]

This is wave 10. I must be doing something very wrong to have this much acid, no? No thralls

[proven owl]

there is but the rates are a bit unreasonable and i doubt the pet is very likely from there

something like redwood trees that i want to cut anyway for the wcing pet is what im looking for

[proven owl]

it's a decent amount but still playable for sure

looks kinda like my w12-13 maybe?

chally punish adds a bit more acid and no tbow

so i doubt ur doing anything wrong in particular

[brazen token]

Oh mb it was actually w11, just finished it. Maybe nally then? Maybe it's just no tbow yeah

Sometimes let 3 melee grubs in right before car phase... unsure how to avoid that when there's so much acid

[proven owl]

you can run through acid as it changes into nascar form

i just kill any close grubs before i run off

it takes some practice to know which ones u have time to kill tho

[night zephyr]

Seems average for a scoboer

[proven owl]

if its 3 melee grubs then id run off to kill them before i kill the one underneath that will proc nascar

[stuck cape]

Fair, yeah all the afk stuff is like 1 every 3-4 hours, pretty bad

[wary oriole]

looks normal enough to me tbh, it's a lot of rng based on what side the boss spits the acid

looks like he spit in all 4 directions in 5 waves which is a bit unlucky

[proven owl]

where do you usually lure him during nascar

i guess you could be making him spit acid in a bad spot if you're not luring him properly

[night zephyr]

I can see the acid from where he lures. Looks like it's a long the south wall

[brazen token]

I lure east then usually SE. I'm trying to master a method that involves building 2 rocks during single orb phase, which does E -> SE -> S

[proven owl]

anywhere in the SW direction is usually fine

so south should work

[worldly jungle]

Would y’all be against Mokha not nulling damage when going into shield phase or turning on melee punish.

I get annoyed when I hit a 60 and the boss just decides to ignore it.

There probably some unintended prephase shenanigans I’m not considering

[night zephyr]

I think damage on any bosses should never be nulled during transitions

It never feels good

[main briar]

Just hit a 65 on 65hp into 2nd shields that doesn't count... support the change

[nova solstice]

i wonder if u can do anything to make some hits count

i know on the first shield u just need to be 1tick away

but its not consitent, think it only works if he boulders

[keen rapids]

yea thought they learned this from nex

on a slightly related note i had a deep delve where i stalled the shield phase for more rocks and i got the tree special, because the tree special was going on it delayed the shield special til he was less than half health, was kinda cash money

[night zephyr]

Couldn't you get two tree phases doing this and delaying enough? New 200 delve WR incoming

[night zephyr]

Did they patch the cleaning acid post trees?

i just got to do it and it didnt spawn a shield

[nova solstice]

Did u wait too long?

Theres a time limit

Worked fine for me 2hrs ago

[wary oriole]

no

[night zephyr]

Oh I must have waited too long

[unborn girder]

Do you guys think they'll nerf the uniques or how the deep delves work? I mean It's not that hard to grind 8+ delves with either skill or good gear and the time to droprate for these uniques seem fast compared to raid purps. I can see the unique items being devalued steadily as good players bring them into game in droves. Talking about very impactful items too. Could be looking at it wrong idk

[green pagoda]

With these drop rates i don't think they expected them to be super rare. And people will stop grinding as they crash.

[unborn girder]

Fair enough. I mean the boots are crazy upgrade. The mage weapon is 2nd bis. The torm upgrade is bis. The boss is kind of addicting and can see people actively grinding just to see how far they can dig

[night zephyr]

They nerfed Yama pretty quickly. I doubt they'd nerf rates after 2+ weeks of data.

[unborn girder]

true.. must be okay with it then

[grizzled comet]

how many unique drop rate nerfs have there been over the course of osrs? right now i can only think of nex, yama, and toa

[night zephyr]

They've been increasing rates if anything with the recent changes

[unborn girder]

do you guys recommend the blowpipe method gnomemonkey showcased yesterday?

for scobo users

[night zephyr]

idk what gnomonkey showcased but I would recommend blowpiping as much as possible during car as a scoboer

I personally use sidewalk tech

[unborn girder]

yah thats what he showcased

[night zephyr]

With some modified luring tiles for blowpipe range

[unborn girder]

but Ladlor chart has blowpipe after all 3 delve unqiues

I got treads luckily... I think i will go back to zulrah for blowpipe then come back

getting tree phase on W5+ pretty often without blowpipe is annoying

[night zephyr]

the math is kind of difficult to do/not an exact science since blowpipe enables you to skip more often, but I was trying to get Ladlor to math it out.

he mathed out 5 hour timesave from having eye for zulrah

theres a chance blowpipe speeds up delve by more than 5 hours, but not sure

[unborn girder]

Thats hard to guage anyways because someone might not getting consistent kills pushing higher delves without blowpipe vs with

that tree phase sucks XD

[night zephyr]

well you'd have to make some kind of assumption, like dying at wave 12 on average or something

[unborn girder]

yeah

zulrah grind is only 16 hours anyways with bowfa ya?

500/30

[night zephyr]

Yeah im not sure how he mathed out 5 hour timesave from eye but I could see it

but that sounds about right for bofa zulrah

[unborn girder]

i think id rather have it even if it cost me hours just for how much less stressful itll make doom grind

[night zephyr]

It's really nice

helps with QOL cleaning up your mistakes on lower waves with healing you up too

[unborn girder]

ofc the solution to my dilemma would be too just get good. But man its easy to mess up with earthen orb on later delves with the prayer flicking

[wary oriole]

They should but they wont at this point

[night zephyr]

In 2 years when the gaunts and eye are 10m they'll make it so that the boots are higher weighted at deeper delves.

[verbal edge]

Drops being easy to get is just the standard now

Nex and cox rates are a thing of the past

[wary oriole]

dt2 rates are good for bis

at least the rings

[main briar]

It was always the standard for non-raids other than a very short stretch of time tbh

[nova solstice]

what teh fuck just happened

i skipped 75% shield phase

got no trees either

it just went straight into car?

🍝

its the 2nd time its happened and i have no idea what causes it

[nova solstice]

what the fuck is 2m in heree?

[tribal igloo]

The bones are 8k/ea which is 1.4m

[nova solstice]

[hollow ermine]

new pb!

[arctic niche]

take back what i said 11-12 seems possible for me now with scobo (wave 12 pb)

[glad arch]

it's honestly humbling how bad I am at this boss

I just cannot get past wave 8 lol

[arctic niche]

was struggling to get past wave 3 when boss came out just keep trying

[hollow ermine]

practice and muscle mem really help lol

im trying to do a lot of attempts but also with a lot of breathign room

[keen rapids]

Meanwhile I've been grinding since release and still only have cloth

not to mention araxxor huey and yama

[north axle]

https://wiseoldman.net/competitions/101485

[buoyant rose]

from 0 wave 8s to now pb'ing a 12

should have stopped coping ages ago

send till die supremacy

[night zephyr]

I'm just glad I stopped making as many silly mistakes and started using blowpipe to heal throughout early waves.

Now if I plank 8 or above it's basically like I did a wave 7 reset and used 1 ppot/brew max to get there.

[burnt lichen]

lmfaoo

so those are tracking actual bots? what's the criteria?

[north axle]

Some guy hopped around looking at delvers

And note that this is only deep delves

[buoyant sand]

I never see Ward of Arceuus mentioned, does it not work or can it be worth it for bringing +nats? I scobo to ~w13 and am never really supply limited (either skill or acid limited, and I just claim if I feel 'meh' about the next wave lol)

[night zephyr]

as you said its usually either acid limited or skill limited that you die to a bunch of damage. 10% reduced damage will still probably kill you if you take 2 hits off prayer.

[nova solstice]

I would rather an invy spot

Even if it works shit is so fucking deadly

[nova solstice]

Bp gud

Esp cus its so common to get trees on 5 or 6 or 7

So u can heal up for 8 if u were goofing on early

[buoyant sand]

W8 max hit is 60, 2 max hits would kill a 115hp player but ward would save you!!! /s

[burnt lichen]

its higher than 60

[buoyant sand]

Yeah I specifically tailored my cheeky example to w8 which is 60, w8+ is 65 at which point Ward wouldn't save you haha

[burnt lichen]

oh it's a 8 vs 9 thing

didnt know

[hollow ermine]

one thing that gets me hit relatively often is the shards falling

i tend to dodge by running into another

[proven owl]

easiest way to dodge regular w8 boulders is to go to a tile where the first boulder's shards fell

for the melee punish you either do the widega tech where u just get hit by boulder 2 with bad rng i think or u have to dodge carefully

[hollow ermine]

ehm tbh im not sure what i shouldve done here

of course pray correctly lol but

all my rocks got smoked

any feedback?

[plucky turret]

use the rock block setup

[haughty panther]

I think the "intended" solve is place the car far enough away that it doesn't touch your rocks

[plucky turret]

unless theres new tech im not aware off i saw some other stuff i think but not sure if it was car phase related

then probably use that

[haughty panther]

sidewalk/rock block is bis though yea

[proven owl]

its gonna be hard to do when ur not 100% used to the boss yet but u had a lot of time to realise u needed to run to the south rocks

if u run straight away u can make it across the entire room pretty much with that little acid in the way

as the others said tho rock block is still really good

even with rock block u still get situations like this sometimes tho for higher waves where all ur rocks are eaten by acid

[iron mortar]

Why the fuck does AGS spec heal sometimes reset blue shield, And other times it just doesnt?

Feels random af when it resets or doesnt

[proven owl]

although its mostly a w15-30 issue or so tbh cuz around 30+ ud just wait for boulders every time and drop all of the boulders u need on specific tiles for every smash

[shadow lion]

At 1:15 in the vid, you shoulda already realized you’ll have to run across the room, as soon as second shockwave goes off, start running there baiting boss back middle/diagonally

[keen rapids]

where loot

[iron mortar]

https://gyazo.com/e195859a00645d4a9bad0228ff8dd558 wheres mine 🙁

[signal cipher]

is there something weird about importing ground markers here

ive tried it a few times and nothing is showing up

even when it says successfuly imported

oh the floors are different?

[plucky turret]

is it for the correct floor

ya

[signal cipher]

i see okay

[plucky turret]

theres 1 and 2-5 i think and then 6+

[signal cipher]

thanks

[dense ginkgo]

It's very funny how they kept saying it goes up to 8 then it's 8 over and over again but 8 and "8+" have all these differences lol

[verbal edge]

reducing the boss hp for 8+ was certainly a weird choice

[winged minnow]

ooc is there a link to the tile markers for doing the new rock block car thing

took a like 10 day break from doom due to being on holiday with crappy internet

seen those tiles people ahve but cant find the import anywhere

[shadow lion]

do confliction gauntlets work on barrage spells?

[limber finch]

What I’ve heard is that it works on the primary target only, but idk where that info originally came from

[worldly jungle]

In the description https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCnp9qSyjAA

[winged minnow]

merci

[buoyant rose]

anyone got the combined waves calculator for loot

im curious

i tried googling for it 0 luck

[fast latch]

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Calculator:Doom_of_Mokhaiotl_Completions_Calculator

[hollow ermine]

do u lose ur delve if u log?

[night zephyr]

Yes

[worldly jungle]

I tried low detail but is there a better way to get rid of shadows on the floor. I keep running into stuff on the ground because I can't make it out

[mild orchid]

using blindfold and skybox plugin?

[main briar]

ok too many green kevins

[worldly jungle]

Blindfold requires I whitelist a bunch of things yeah? I’ll try skybox next run

[wary oriole]

blindfold lets u turn off 6 different things that you can configure

terrain is one of them which is just the floor

[worldly jungle]

Oh perfect, i misunderstood that plugin from tob vods

[fast latch]

that's ground object hider

[signal cipher]

one kevin in one kevin out policy time

[dense ginkgo]

Legendary Kevin

[arctic niche]

not related directly but bring chally imo its super worth with ur gear

[dense ginkgo]

could've booked it south as soon as the second slam happened

as soon as you see the dust you can move

[unborn girder]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCnp9qSyjAA Have you watched this vid? You get your first rock placement on the rock block tile. Then try to get a second on the tile this guy/girl shows. Then go to the tiles 1, 2 and 3. If you proc shield phase to quickly then you wont be able to get a rock down on the second spot thats used for the second "boom"

[tulip spade]

alright, do we have any primer guides on this boss that don't suck

[night zephyr]

Pecan guide

[hollow ermine]

thanks will check this out

[unborn girder]

Basically you stand on the "rock" tile (black arrow pointing to it) at start of 6+ until boss does the overhead boulder attack, right before its about to break you run out so that a rock will spawn on that tile. Then you try to do the same thing on any of the tiles I have circled orange to spawn a rock there. If you proc shield phase too quickly, you wont get a second rock down.

Once shield phase is over you run nearby the rock tile. Boss will car over to it and when he does the "boom" you wont get hit. Dont have to stand behind any rocks for that one. At this point you should be standing on "2". Itll make him zoom to the southeast part of the photo but wont actually run you over. Keep up DPS. Do your prayer switches and run behind the 2nd rock (from the placement in the orange circle i mention earlier). Then he does second boom and your safe. Then immediately after the 2nd boom you go to tile 3 on the south of hte photo. Again he will car torwards you but not run you over. Keep up DPS and do prayer flicks while running to whatever available rocks you can find, typically something on western side of photo.

Sorry I know that's alot but just got to see it in action a few times then it will click

@hollow ermine

[hollow ermine]

sweet

shouldnt take the time to put it into practice atm so ill check it out tomorrow

[unborn girder]

On wave 8+ you get 2 boulders so first one you place in the rock tile and second one you place in the tiles in the orange circle. Got to be quick and keep up prayer flicks as you do this while potentially also needing to meele punish

[hollow ermine]

the flicks on wave 6 have been a bit difficult

been losing dps to stay alive

but practice makes perfect

i think learning the strats u just showed will free up more of my mental stack for correct pray

[unborn girder]

Flicking while moving with the unearthen orb is difficult stuff. Esp if the overhead boulder is breaking just as you proc the 2nd tree and orb spawns and its not in a straight line with the destination XD

[unborn girder]

yes exactly, get it down to procedure and it becomes consistent rather than a freestyle everytime type approach

[hollow ermine]

its a nicely designed boss tbh

good pacing in increase in difficulty, and is also not a giant time thief on those easier parts

[tulip spade]

ty

[main briar]

With no zcb, thoughts on chal vs nox?

Nox is less acid, but early waves suck and you get less deep procs into car phase?
Chally gives deeper procs but less pipe heals

Although I think you can nox into bow and still have it count before shield?

[night zephyr]

I like chally. I don't mind keeping 1 pipe spec in the tank unless I really need it. I'll send 2 pipe specs and later do a chally whack if I have to, but even then with double DC + lb I'm usually back to a chally by the time I need it

[unborn girder]

my brother jsut got 4th doom pet LOL

why did they make it so common

[hollow ermine]

how so?

spec on melee punish?

[unborn girder]

yep

[hollow ermine]

oh ok cool

i heard some hitsplat multiply thing

but i been also hitting 4 with emberlight only

[proven owl]

the hitsplat thing doesnt rly matter unless ur doing over w15 or so maybe

u can bring nox hally and bp tho

that's prob the budget setup id bring

just heal up with bp and punish with hally

[proven owl]

when learning chally is prob better since u will usually die without running out of supplies

[hollow ermine]

ok i havent got a nally

[unborn girder]

Chally is good

[dense ginkgo]

also downtime on floor 8 onwards until you get comfortable enough with double boulder to re-click the boss during it

[main briar]

https://i.imgur.com/wxVm6ok.png

[nimble crest]

down bad for ddarts

[arctic niche]

i think chally is good feel like fishing for bp specs makes me lose punishes and also is just annoying and speeds up early waves alot

ive even went back to using ultor ring

also helps kill during melee punish for holy water

[keen rapids]

ive been taking chally with the general idea of chally spec early waves, bp spec late waves

[dense ginkgo]

ye ultor + prims are nice for this, sometimes I even turn on piety for the extra damage on the actual hitsplats if he's low

[arctic niche]

just skill issue on my part but i find bp really hard to use even pulling it out seems tricky

[dense ginkgo]

radius marker car phase

(first one is for chally)

[main briar]

completely free to dump it on the 2nd rock

if you do the sidewalk tech

[arctic niche]

think my problem is i dont like letting my hp get low and risk planking to benefit from bp specs

[dense ginkgo]

even if it's like 70 you can benefit

and car phase is right after grub phase, which is super safe

if your hp is low enough that a mistake during grub phase can kill you (besides not hitting the boss often enough) then it's low enough that you can heal and still benefit from double bp specs

[arctic niche]

ye i might try out lb/bp again i definitely feel alot more confident now

[main briar]

the thing for me is that if i'm gonna brew i end up just brewing to full lol

[arctic niche]

ye same

[hollow ermine]

Excited to give all of this a go tomorrow

[worldly jungle]

Pluginscape delivers again

I was having a hard time with the mage boulders, swapped them with toa is much nicer

[nova solstice]

is sidewalk tech placing 3 rocks east so u dont need to move at all?

[keen rapids]

sidewalk is taking advantage of the los for car pathing such that the car drives straight but you never get hit by it cause you're a tile to the side

[nova solstice]

oh

[buoyant rose]

i sent like 6h straight today its 100x more fun when you get used to the fight

[night zephyr]

With blowpipe range you have to modify the sidewalk luring tiles though.

[north axle]

Nox and scythe early if you only do 1x divine

[nova solstice]

we need mtx to skip wave 1-7

[acoustic oak]

they wanted to add a tp token to skip early waves and people were hella against it

[night zephyr]

Still wouldnt want it

It would be too rare and only mains would get a tangible benefit

[nova solstice]

if they were to do it they shud make it available if u get deeper than 25 or something

and ofc dont give it the wave 8 rates when u start and all that bs

[signal cipher]

if its not better loot and it has a high unlock req whats the point

just for people doing challenge runs?

[night zephyr]

And if you skip waves the challenge run is devalued

So there would be zero point of that version of it

[nova solstice]

i have no idea how you would balance it to the point where its better loot but not the point where ppl start complaining

maybe scale it to wave 8 rates after 4 waves

or some shit like that

(if u skip early)

kinda like rs3 with the enrage i guess which this kinda is the osrs version of it

[signal cipher]

just seems like deep runs are already so good its hard to imagine specifically easier to do

[wary oriole]

i think just like a 1/40 at 9+ for a token that lets you skip back to 8, untradeable

not a big increase in ttc

[wispy knot]

still gonna keep going after banking to try and crack wave 8.

[verbal edge]

if you keep going without banking then you'll have extra incentive not to die

[night zephyr]

Why's the sparkly brown hole sometimes look cool and sometimes look terrible

[autumn fulcrum]

cleared wave 8 my first attempt there, planked 9 tho ):

we gaming, this boss is fun

clean up a few things and we should be gettin deep 😄

[night zephyr]

It's tradition for me to insta plank the next wave after a PB

just did it on 11 after my first 10 clear

[dense ginkgo]

animated, apparently

[obsidian turret]

man just started trying to learn doom

maybe 4 hours of attempts ive seen 8 like 5 times but i always end up dying to double boulders either to the flick or not melee punishing

just need reps but damn this boss destroys you if you make a mistake

[wispy knot]

the volatile earth spec is a killer

Should i be trying to get the boss to the center at the end of racecar so you can actually get some space for the spec?

[dense ginkgo]

some methods put it at the side, some methods put it in the middle

definitely do not put it in a corner for the third dash

[weary garden]

im starting to turn into a 1-7 truther. ever since I learned 8+ and consistently can do deep delves I havent seen a single drop lmao

[main briar]

Same other than pets lol https://i.imgur.com/twAeaEB.png

[weary garden]

Do yall know how to estimate expected drop rates? I wanna know how close I am to cloth droprate, i think im about half way maybe?

[dense ginkgo]

[dense ginkgo]

add up completions of each floor divided by rate for that floor

[weary garden]

easier than I thought, ty

If my math is right, im 87% of the way to droprate for cloth

[tribal igloo]

88% yep https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Calculator:Doom_of_Mokhaiotl_Completions_Calculator

[main briar]

So prob around half that to completion kc

[weary garden]

well im a spoon, so cloth = completion for me lmao

[main briar]

yeah just saying that looking at how you compare to one item rate is a bit of a silly way to look at things

[weary garden]

Hmm, is it? That’s usually how I complain about drop rates when lmao

[main briar]

when more than 1 item exists, that's very silly

[dense ginkgo]

me when I haven't green logged Medium clues in exactly 566 caskets

[main briar]

havent greenlogged barrows in 350 kc

[dense ginkgo]

it's especially silly when the rates are this similar

complaining about Hydra Claw when Leather exists is pretty different

[main briar]

If there's 3-4 drops with the same rate, multiply the expected kc by 2ish

[weary garden]

I guess that’s true, but regardless on average you’ll see a cloth in x kills
Unless you’re just saying I should be looking at unique drop rate since they’re all the same?

I see

[main briar]

you should expect to have all 3 drops on average in 2x that kc

[dense ginkgo]

if they're all exactly the same rate I think it's 5.5 uniques to get 3/3

these aren't but it's pretty close

[nova solstice]

u cant coffeer cloth can u?

[weary garden]

Probably not yet

[dense ginkgo]

if you have a spare zenyte you can try seeing if noted confliction gauntlets can be coffered

that oversight worked on Araxxor, but not Yama

(and the cloth itself can't be noted)

[nova solstice]

wait ur telling me i can note my nox hally pieces dupes and coffer?

[dense ginkgo]

not the pieces, only fully assembled nhallies

(I'm also not sure if they fixed this, or if they just straight up let unnoted nhallies go into the coffer by now)

but at launch that was the only way to coffer nhallies

[nova solstice]

oh i see

sad

[buoyant rose]

monkey paw, 3000 delves for cloth

im so glad i got boots first considering the other uniques are more common

also +2 max hits with rune arrows fuck amethyst

[wispy knot]

Yea, rune arrows are fine. A little weaker than dragon/amethyst but still works.

I had 6k dragon arrows from cg

[buoyant rose]

i use dragon arrow switch on wave 8+

personally

i use like 20 arrows a run seems like a good use

[weary garden]

Yep, the boots first curse lmao

[buoyant rose]

i got boots at 200 now im at 1100 nothing else to show for it yet

i dont regret anything

boots are goated

[night zephyr]

If you max boots and use charged quiver your max hit goes from 55 to 57 with scobo amethyst

[wispy knot]

honestly im deciding to take a break and go unlock amethyst before coming back. Got staff and cloth, can hunt boots later

[weary garden]

I want max boots so bad, but I don’t wanna do the medium clue grind until I finish doom

[hot oar]

Spare RNG ma'am?

https://tenor.com/view/squidward-spare-change-spare-some-change-begging-poor-gif-18999842

[night zephyr]

Dupe cloths are so troll. To drop trade you lose a lot. If you plan on using demon tears you have, you are basically dumping 7.5m ironman gp, farming another zenyte for 5 hours, to be able to drop trade a dupe or coffer it.

[hot oar]

It's so frustrating because you can't death coffers them

if i could throw the dupes in for 75m death coffers

i wouldn't be 'as' annoyned about the dupes

its that combined with the fact that I literally just got the 3rd cloth

& am still due 2.6 more drops

[lone carbon]

how do I beat this doom mechanic?

[weary garden]

Move right next to a datacenter

[main escarp]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-jeez-thats-terrible-cable-company-worker-south-park-informative-murder-porn-season17ep02-gif-19529878

[civic surge]

What's the best way to avoid having rock debris fall on you in wave 8+? Can debris from the second rock just not fall where debris from the first rock fell?

So do you just wait for the first rock debris to fall, then walk on it then prayer flick immediately? Is there time for that?

[keen rapids]

That is correct

You can incorporate a motion to drop the second boulder in a favorable spot but I think you have to go pretty far to guarantee not getting hit by a boulder, if that's a guarantee at all - the sidewalk tech video talked a bit about this but i don't really remember what it said

[dense ginkgo]

has anyone thought about purposely putting the car in a corner on 6+7

it's easy enough that you can make do with bad tree positions, and putting the post-car acid in the corner on the "easy" waves sounds nice for 8+

[keen rapids]

Sometimes I wait til second boulder to proc shield phase, usually I just yolo it

[hollow ermine]

damn

the guy camouflaged his attack

fuck i need to know the terminology of his phases already fuck

he did the long one where he is charging up

and then without skipping a beat, into the charge and nuke ur face one

[dense ginkgo]

grub phase

[hollow ermine]

ah thanks

[dense ginkgo]

normal phase randomly has melee punishes when he throws out a boulder, which I think happens after a set number of autos (haven't counted, feels like it)

if you take 60 seconds to kill him on floors 1-2 or 60 seconds to reach 75% on floors 3+, you get trees

on 3-4 at some point after reaching 75% you'll get grub phase, then return to normal phase, then if you take 60 seconds you get trees

on floors 5+ at some point after reaching 75% you get grubs, then when the grubs end you get car phase, then after car phase you get trees, then shortly after trees you go back to grub phase and repeat

might be off on how trees on 3/4 work but that's the general idea

[keen rapids]

trees are the earth spawns that make a levi enrage shield orb

[arctic niche]

wait what?

is that only with maxed threads

i was getting 55 max hit with scobo with base threads

and 58 with darrows

assuming rigour to

[signal cipher]

did you have v ring?

[arctic niche]

no

i have quiver as well

though

if its with vring i can see it but +1 str giving 2maxes seems interesting so just making sure

wouldint mind using amethyst arrows if im only losing 1max hit

[signal cipher]

very easy to check

[night zephyr]

It's only maxed threads, amethyst and charged quiver. If you are only base threads it's still 55.

Or if quiver isn't charged you still get 55. Need the full +4 ranged strength to go from 55 to 57 with amethyst

No vring

Scobo has scaling like emberlight so that's why I'm guessing it doesn't jump up even +1 maxes.

[arctic niche]

ye fair enough i see ty

i cba grinding rangers but maybe i will

think if i finish my duke grind grind i should hopefully have enough darrows for the grind

[night zephyr]

Yeah I don't have boots yet but it tempts me to go and grind rangers if I get treads before I get eye.

D arrows don't seem worth to me for scobo users. But I've gotten used to using blowpipe as much as possible during car phase

[opal lark]

I wish I knew this 10k dragon arrows ago

[mild orchid]

are there other tiles for bp sidewalk?

[viral cedar]

Is it a known bug (or intentional design) that freshly-placed rocks stall your character?

[hollow ermine]

dam didnt try any of the recommended stuff today, was too much other stuff going on

[night zephyr]

You need to modify luring tiles a bit to use blowpipe

I can try and send a screenshot or what I put together. I didn't get tiles that dodge the car completely but are easy to blowpipe from and run to the next tile without having to react to the car moving

[mild orchid]

yea sounds good

[dense ginkgo]

intentional

pretty sure anything that moves your character does

think how you need to re-click after a teleport at Sepulchre

or getting bounced by Verzik

[weary garden]

I’ve been using D arrows and darts and I feel like my runs have gotten way more consistent. Getting orb skip more than half of my delves

[keen rapids]

only the one that targets your initial location - the rest just damage you

it's a punishment for standing still

[minor tartan]

Just completed the log and not one of these came from a deep delve. What are the odds of that? Uniques we’re on floor 5 and 6.

[viral cedar]

To clarify, I don't mean in the case where you don't move and you get displaced. I mean where you move 1 tile adjacent to where the rock fell and your character stalls when needing to walk around during orb walk, if that makes sense.

[keen rapids]

oh, not sure