manga-serious

[empty trellis]

the one imu used is highly likely uranus.

[limpid grail]

we know poseidon is a person, pluton is a ship, but we dont have details on what uranus is. It probably isnt a ship.

[empty trellis]

the one that imu used is kinda like a spaceship shooting gigantic laser beams downward, it's far from being like any normal ship anybody would use.

[deep haven]

It might actually be some gigantic creature

But that being powered by a bit of motherflame is a little strange

[empty trellis]

and considering uranus is related to the sky, i guess spaceship would fit the criteria somehow.

[deep haven]

Yknow, it might be a flying whole island

[limpid grail]

ancient ships could fly around likely.

space ships are still ships on one piece world

the thing about Pluton is its suppossed to be a massive ship whos key ability is destroy an island with one activation. That sounds so much like what destroys lulusia is why I pause is it pluton or Uranus there.

[empty trellis]

i can only think of thriller bark's gigantic creatures

idk when will they come to play once again in the story

[fallen maple]

Has to be Uranus. We know where Pluto is and the whole plans thing wouldn’t have any meaning if the WG had alternate plans all along. What if Uranus also has both the original somewhere and backup plans? Enel would have stolen the plans from Birka and used them to make Maxim Arc. And the WG has the original weapon. This would make Skypea very similar to ennies lobby except they arrived when the villain had already recreated the ancient weapon.

[simple ocean]

It would have meaning because someone can counter their weapon with the made up pluton

The thing is that the weapon Imu has basicly does the same thing as pluton only pluton is supposed to be stronger unless oda has to retcon that, based on what crocadile said

[limpid grail]

the water 7/enies lobby was all about pluton. That includes visiting a giant hole in the ocean. Quite possible this was also done by Pluton. Also, there might be some overlap between Birka and Elbaf, and if the Galleila giants built pluton, its possible Birka would have information on that. We also know elbaf have access to some technology to make their ships fly. It wouldnt be too surprising if Galleila could incorporate this into Pluton.

We also dont know for sure if Pluton is in Wano, nobody has seen it. We do know during the void century Wano had walls built to prevent a flood, and that before that happened suppossedly Pluton was buried there. So was pluton buried there during the void century and the walls went up?

Was pluton not used during the void century and the great flood?

Something just doesnt fit

or was this a lie spread by former ruler of Wano....Saint Ethanbaron Nusuro

[simple ocean]

Form what I remember the way it sounds is joy boy hid it in wano, wano at the end of the void century closes its walls off and it begins to flood, there is evidence of this that I remember from a past conversation about pluton so I can't say how accurate it is but I believe that was the pipeline?

Also kinda crazy that Jack didn't find Pluton

[limpid grail]

that would suggest the world wasnt flooding during the void century, but came afterwards?

you see what I mean, not saying the standard theory cant work, but there are gaps here I find puzzling

now, one can say that the stories we have heard are only partially true. Rumor and myth has bent stories. Sort of like Jarul saying Ratatoskr and Ragnir were separate beings that merged at some point. We can take this as cannon, or that its a myth with some elements of truth.

[high sinew]

The actual king of the world was davy d jons until he was burned and cursed by the devil and the only person who is said to have devils power is imu so most likely imu stole the position to attain power . ( i could be wrong)

[limpid grail]

oda depicts once Wano is full, the ocean level is now above the old wano.

I think its an interesting concept, because it helps fill in the gaps. Some things dont make sense with timing right now with the information we have.

[limpid grail]

The Etymology of Uranus (Ouranos) is 'rain maker' or 'lord of the rain'

[simple ocean]

And that I'll admit feels like it could be zaza or the thing that Imu used to obliterate illusia

[thorny dirge]

The addition of Zaza makes Poseidon confusing now

I think most people assumed that Poseidon or maybe Uranus was what caused the sea level to rise

Until Zaza

But now with the addition of Zaza it’s up in the air if Poseidon and Zaza are the same thing or different

I still like to think that the tub current is a contributor to the sea level rise. A gigantic whirlpool with the rotation and displacement causing the surrounding oceans to rise

[glass acorn]

uranus (assuming lulusia weapon) definitely causes the ocean to rise

maybe other things also cause the ocean to rise but theres no doubt uranus does

vegapunk measued it and it just makes physical sense

theres a cylinder in the ocean where water can no longer go, therefore the water that used to occupy that space needs to be in the rest of the ocean, causing it to rise

[limpid grail]

while I think Uranus can cause some water increase, I dont think that is what was used to raise the ocean 200 meters.

[limpid grail]

I also wonder if their are people in the 2nd age who tried to become 1st world gods, and not all through devil fruits. The sea god and the rain god may actually be seperate people.

like poseidon is a 'weapon', but clearly its also named and connected to a sea god.

What destroyed lulusia, if say is Uranus the sky god, but its also the rain/sea god to raise the sea, and its also the underworld god since it burrows deep into the earth????

[glass acorn]

I think all the ancient weapons contributed to the sea level rise

[limpid grail]

how does poseidons powers contribute to that?

[glass acorn]

unclear at this time

maybe posideon can make the sea kings somehow or transform fish into sea kings

which would cause sea level rise

[limpid grail]

you mean just add like 100 milllion sea kings and their volume displaces water?

thats actually funny thinking about it

[glass acorn]

i always thought the name sea king was suspicious and them being ancient telepathic beings who seem to know these important prophecies is also suspicious

I was wondering if you might have like a sugar situation where kings of the old world were transformed into sea kings

[limpid grail]

i do wonder if the giant animals, like the owl and zunesha were once human

[thorny dirge]

maybe its similar to imus powers

where he can divy out his own poer to others

[limpid grail]

I mean the fact in old world mythology the great flood was caused by rainfall seems highly relevant

[thorny dirge]

like all the sea kings are part of 1 being or hte collective memoires of 1 being but it was split up to protect the memories

[simple ocean]

What of the seakings are equivalent to the gorsei, they look like sea monster version of them

Fishman packed with posidon

[limpid grail]

and the animals with Loki and Luffy at times

[fallen maple]

I think a lot of people miss the fact that water is constantly falling in there, it has to be falling to some underground sea. Upwards stream and reverse mountain might be water flowing from the underground to the surface. Those holes somehow might end up breaking the balance and making more water flowing up. It’s completely impossible for the water to be falling down constantly if there isn’t some sort of inmese cave below the sea floor. The sea level would lower if water keep falling down the hole and never came back up. These two things should be basic deductions from the holes.

[glass acorn]

I think it's just falling to the bottom of the hole

[fallen maple]

The hole would fill

[limpid grail]

I think its a gravity void.

[frozen osprey]

my headcanon says it's pumped out by water 7

[fallen maple]

What would that mean?

[glass acorn]

It doesn't fill cause magic whatever. There's obviously some kinda magic going on or the hole would fill regardless. Ennies lobby been this way hundreds of years

[limpid grail]

this would still lower sea levels though.

[glass acorn]

No? Why?

[fallen maple]

I don’t think that makes sense. Underground continent makes way more sense. It’s a very recurring trope in old adventure books. Including Jules Verne from whom oda has taken inspiration from.

[glass acorn]

No water is being lost but volume water previously occupied is being lost

Water can't be being lost cause that would lower sea level and whatever speculation or uncertainty one thing is clear, sea level rises

[limpid grail]

its not a ton of volume displaces, and water that flows downwords would also have some value running along the edges depending how deep it is.

[glass acorn]

The water going along the edges is necessarily smaller than the water that could be stored in the cylinder. It's like the shell of the cylinder

[limpid grail]

yeah, but given how large the planet is, I would be shocked if sea levels rose by more than a few millimeters. But again this is a comic book.

[limpid grail]

basically water cannot fill the void because their is a force permanently created within it.

but instead of a giant object blocking the water, its some type of gravitational force

[fallen maple]

But we saw people fall to the hole in ennies lobby and experience normal gravity and then climb up. Not to mention there are landmasses above the hole in ennies lobby and no abnormal gravity was observed

[limpid grail]

so of those landmasses dont make sense they can float, and it might be impacting different objects differently

we know one piece is a world where water does not interact well with other things

[fallen maple]

Subterranean fiction is a whole genre of fiction that was popular in the past, one of the few oda hasn’t touched. An underground continent/sea is very likely to be on odas plans and is a more direct and obvious answer to this never filling hole. Also, Vegapunk mentioned subterranean waters when talking about the sea level rise.

[limpid grail]

there is also what was this thing originally built for. The thing that destroyed capone's ship for example had a weird gravity effect. If the weapon was made for mining originally, it makese sense it could create giant holes in the ocean to stop the water, but allow miners to go down.

[fallen maple]

Seriously, how can you be trying to justify antigravity that affects different materials differently and not even acknowledge that a hole and an underground ocean is a much more simple, logical and probable explanation.

[glass acorn]

How does an underground ocean lead to sea level rise? Wouldn't it lead to sea level fall

[wise arrow]

if it's something as gravitational as the moon, it's possible

pulls up the tidea around the destroyed area

so that the adjacent islands meet a rise in sea level that goes down the further away from the hole you are

are blimps allower to go higher than clouds in one piece?

there's no way they would want to show whatever it was that wiped out lulusia

but it could be as strong as the moon when it comes to gravitational pull

[fallen maple]

There are currents that flow up (like reverse mountain) those holes would somehow alter the flows and currents and end up sending more water up the upwards streams. I know it’s a bit weird but it’s still more mundane than an antigravity well that shapes a cilinder hole in the ocean but water still falls and doesn’t affect land or people in the hole.

[glass acorn]

but if its just a hole why doesnt it fill

it demands some kind of weird magic or gravity

[fallen maple]

Have you seen the hollow earth maps?

[glass acorn]

no but it doesnt matter whats underdeath the empty cylinder at surface/ocean level needs to be justified

if its just normal gravity that hole fills in a few seconds, a few minutes at most

it doesnt matter whats underneath

[fallen maple]

https://share.google/OM51dnoYoJq13MMXl

[glass acorn]

i get the rough idea of a hollow earth but i dont get what would keep a tunnel to the hollow earth from immediately flooding if we're relying on mundane answers and normal phsyics

[fallen maple]

Have you seen the small corner where a ship sails and how gravity would work?

It’s like a sinkhole. But the upwards currents act as a pump pumping water back up.

[glass acorn]

can you pick one of the pictures in that share yorue talking about or draw a picture

[fallen maple]

https://share.google/vPC1lgt98eQMWuhI9

Imagine I have a pump sending the water that goes through this hole back up

But the pump works faster the more holes you make. And it’s not proportional, every new hole accelerates the pump to pump back up more water than the hole sends down.

[glass acorn]

i think that has some threshold and water only flows in when the water level is greater than the drain threshold

thats like a tube/drain, not a column of water

i mean im willing to accept some weird gravity/magic im just saying this doesnt free us from that it also requires it

[fallen maple]

I have a theory on how it’s a hollow earth in OP world. All of those crosses with something on the center symbolism would be the poles, reverse mountain, Mary Geoise and the center of the earth

But yes, in the end it would need gravity to work differently. But we already have seen water that flows upwards in one piece.

[glass acorn]

could be for thats one way to hide laugh tale

[fallen maple]

Imagine Oda ends the series without ever elaborating on this mystery. 😆

[glass acorn]

I do think some things should remain mysteries but maybe not this

[fallen maple]

That’s what I think. Laughtale doesn’t seem to be just further in grand line. Would be easily found. Specially with so many users that can fly from island to island.

[glass acorn]

i think the answer we're being presented right now is that the world is huge. marco claims there are millions of islands. So you cant realyl search taht

[fallen maple]

Oda weirdly marked the poles in the initial sketches of the world maps and there have been multiple easily forgettable references to the artic, poles and lands of ice over the series

[glass acorn]

also it may not be obvious

[fallen maple]

I think it’s either in the North Pole or inside the earth with an entrance in the North Pole.

[fallen maple]

Just curious what kind of stuff would you accept to remain in mystery

[glass acorn]

uh a lot of the time people talk about aspects of people's pasts as necessary that must be included in some flashback that i dont necessarily agree. Like roger's motivation for traveling the world for example. The weird weather along the grand line i dont necessarily need a scientific explanation im happy to take it as-is as just being weird. The origin of devil fruits im on the fence i could just accept vegapunks words as all we ever get. And while im sure we'll get some details of the void war i dont need every single detail.

[fallen maple]

I agree mostly. But I really dislike vegapunks explanation on dfs tbh, it’s a non explanation.

[glass acorn]

it is a non explanation but i think thats fine that like.. this is as close as we can get and its not very close

[fallen maple]

My main problem with it is that the fruits have always been present as a limited number of available ones, they are on a book etc, there should be new ones popping up every once in a while if they were just human aspirations.

I would rather not have Vegapunks explanation and never be clarified on fruits than have just vegapunks explanation with no extra info.

[glass acorn]

i think we will get a little bit more info in the void centruy flashback

[fallen maple]

Hope so, Oda has been constantly raising two new questions for every one he answers for too long xd

[glass acorn]

but i think i would dislike it if some void century scientist gave like a chapter long monologue explianing it

i would just want a tiny morsel of extra info

[fallen maple]

Yes, too detailed and fleshed out explanations for long standing mysteries often end up being disappointing, seen it happen to many series.

Tbh I have yet to see a series of books that was constantly creating mysteries as they solved them with a satisfying ending, I hope Oda shows me the first one.

[uncut smelt]

I can't relate, I only ever see stories not explain enough to "keep mystique" and then it just feels unresolved

[glass acorn]

sometimes the uncertain thing that lives in your head is better than the answe the author gives on page

[fickle vortex]

So fellas what are your current theories on Imu?

[grizzled lantern]

I think we with this flashback, we will spend a few chapters introducing key players, then resolve the rest in the present.

[limpid grail]

a lot of smaller flashbacks are usually around the 5-6 chapter mark.

[limpid grail]

https://discord.com/channels/164970986284777473/1472027136146538547

also the symbol of shangara, Shamrock...ect

[fickle vortex]

So the kingdoms/countries Joyboy was allied with are probably
Alabasta, Skypea/Shandora, Water 7, Amazon Lily, Fishman Island, Zou, Wano, Elbaph, Esperia

[limpid grail]

Mary Geoise too

[clever wharf]

Hmm does the bink's sake song originate from Esperia?
Maybe they held a few songs hinting at the history of the world

[limpid grail]

It may have originated with the musician on Joyboys crew

[fickle vortex]

Remember, the ladies on amazon lily are called the Kuja tribe. 9 snakes

Calling it now, Esperia was allied with Joyboy.

[limpid grail]

the main symbols we still have to figure out

[fickle vortex]

Remember the Kuja flag

[limpid grail]

I wonder if Amazon lilly was founded after the war

[fickle vortex]

I still think lily founded the place

[limpid grail]

yes, I agree with that.

[fickle vortex]

It's also would be the last place you'll expect somebody to hide

I assumed that the world government didn't know about Amazon lily's location for centuries

[sour vortex]

It's interesting that the entire Elbaf arc seems to contain West Blue references from start to end, I don't think the other Blues has this much attention in any other arc

1. Bringing back Ohara incident with Robin and Saul
2. God Valley incident and Rocks Pirates becoming Thriller Bark zombies
3. Shanks and Davy clan hometown in West Blue
4. Kozuki Moria cover story randomly in Elbaf arc
5. And now bringing back Brook back story, in West Blue

I wonder if it will lead somewhere

[fickle vortex]

The one piece is in the west blue or something?

[clever wharf]

Each island wiped out by the wg had some knowledge about history, I think Esperia had music with hints on the true history

[slim tree]

Do you guys think celestial dragons are actually happy

Most of the time they look angry

[white vine]

They do it for fun every 3 years. Tho since it’s flashback important probably

[night pulsar]

I think imu is currently building solider but for what? He even considered Luffy as if he wasn't your nemesis lol

[thorny dirge]

oda will do all this except talk about high west

[wind storm]

we learnt a bit about north blue during whole cake since that's where germa is from

[cunning burrow]

Im wondering if Brooks talk about "3 personalities" will have any connection or implications to plot threads like Cavendish and blackbeard

[thorny dirge]

I h ave never understood where the 3 personality thing for blackbeard came from

people just made it up so it would fit the narrative

and now is just a widespread idea

[limpid grail]

there is a lot of clues for it

[thorny dirge]

I know there are alot of things related to 3 with black beard but i dont understand the personalities thing. The entire multiple personalities things stemmed from a concept art of his sisters that never made it into the full story and people say he did somethign to eat them or consume their soul or they are like parasitic twins or or something insdie him. nonsensicle stuff like that.

and even in th story i dont understand how its justified

[limpid grail]

I think it was also the dialogue at mocktown when the strawhats were calling BB 'them'

[thorny dirge]

he doesnt shift pesonalities like hakuba

hes friendly when hes not facing an enemy but that could be said with anyone

[thorny dirge]

yea

people think its his non existent sister

[limpid grail]

also Marco saying his body was different.

I think its all these strange things. Plus the 3 skulls icons are unusual

[thorny dirge]

so where does the mutliple personalities thing come in though?

[limpid grail]

well, his teeth switch places at times..ect. I dont think he exactly has three personalities, but something is going on with him

Either because he is a buccanneer or something

[thorny dirge]

I think the teeth thing is similar to luffy drinking milk and getting his teeth back and its jsut oda drawing it differnet every time

[limpid grail]

thats what I lean to as well

[thorny dirge]

i think the 3 things arent coincidental and he has the possibility to get a 3rd fruit but I jsut dont get the personality theory

[limpid grail]

the one thing that strikes me is we are in the '3rd world' There appear to have been three nika. Possible three nidhoggrs..ect.

The thing about the dark dark fruit is it absorbs everything....including potentially souls.

I wonder if you combine a buccaneer with a soul eating fruit....

[thorny dirge]

i wouldnt like that becuase it invalidates big moms fruit

big moms fruit is literally the soul soul fruit

so if the dark dark fruit can just do that as well it kinda ruins her fruits uniqueness

[limpid grail]

yeah, but she reperposes souls. I think dark dark fruit just absorbs it, without choice.

(just the users soul)

[thorny dirge]

yea i made a diagram fori t before

he kills people. prevents the devil fruit sould from getting away to a new fruint then forcefully implants it into the fruit of his choosing

[limpid grail]

oh, I dont know if its even that powerful, but it could be. I just wonder if the users of the fruit has his soul trapped, especially if they are a buccanneer/davy.

Because the whole stealing other peoples devil fruits appears to be an ability his entire crew has now

[thorny dirge]

I was under the assumption that his crew carried around giant bags of varried fruit so it has a high chance to appear in their when thye kill people but black beard can just 100% it

[limpid grail]

thing is their are so many populated areas, millions of fruit trees on islands...ect. And the bags they carry seem like they could hold maybe a dozen or two fruit? There has to be something else going on in my mind.

[thorny dirge]

I wrote about it here a few years ago #manga-theories message

iut probably wont be that but i like to think its that

[limpid grail]

especially now that we see people with metal hearts popping up

[thorny dirge]

i think oda will jsut say "yea he can just do that"

[thorny dirge]

whatever it is im sure oda is going to fool us

we al lthink its one thing and then its going to be something completely different

its probably some method black beard learned from void century history.

[limpid grail]

I think he shows us a little, and then waits 10 years to address it. But wants to make sure we get some clues as well so its not completely random.

[thorny dirge]

becasue he enjoys history as his hobby

[thorny dirge]

Oda loves dropping some mysterious thing and then waits for the readers to write shit for him lol

hes got 10 years worth of theories ot mix together

more like 18 actually

I think marineford happened in like 2008-2009

[limpid grail]

Removing a piece of a person heart and sticking an apple in there to turn into a DF doesnt seem completely out of the realm of possiblity.

[thorny dirge]

feel thats a bit dark for odas taste

oda writes some messed up stuff sometimes but thats pushing it

[limpid grail]

I mean Whitebeard was fighting with only 80% of his head left at marineford

[thorny dirge]

https://tenor.com/view/kalima-gif-19064001

[limpid grail]

and he had two holes in his chest. Enough to basically do open heart surgery without need to cut anything.

[thorny dirge]

i dont want to belive oda would make cannibalism a way to gain power in one piece but theres also burgess in dressrosa with a knife

[full frigate]

that just meant that he wasn’t alone

[thorny dirge]

why would burgess needa knife to kill someone

he was going ot kill luffy and steal his fruit but im sure if he plannd on fighting luffy he would try to physically fight with punches and wrestling moves

so he would have needed the knife for something else

[limpid grail]

https://tenor.com/view/whos-to-say-who-know-no-idea-who-knows-not-sure-gif-16426797

[limpid grail]

yeah, jumping at luffy with a knife seems weird unless its for a very specific reason, totally agree. The dude is a brawler

knife might even be seastone

[thorny dirge]

side note: oda scaling at work here

knife is 2x bigger than luffy

[limpid grail]

wondering if Gunko has a special contract with Imu, but seems strange since we knew the three kinds of contracts. But Gunko is not aging. But what if either Reuven or Candelle have the opi opi No mi

it would be the perfect time to reveal a previous user of such a fruit

GV showed us a lot of fruits that came back in circulation later on

[thorny dirge]

I saw a theory on twitter earlier in the week saying that candelle is a holy knight who was infilitrating the esperia kingdom to scout for a place for the next human hunt tournament and similar to garling had a child/children with the native islanders.

because she is dressed similar to how garling and shamrock were

[limpid grail]

its possible. esperia could be a member nation as well.

Its hard because her style is just generic enough to fit the styles and charactes from other places as well. Even Brooks outfit looks like what Shanks wore in the holy land, and we have people like captain John

[thorny dirge]

yea but captain johns is jsut from his coat

[limpid grail]

yeah, but her vest has the stylings of the times for anybody with some money

The only thing that seems strange is Garling ended up in GV, but kept a low profile. candelle we are told is incredibly popular, she is a star (maybe not Hancock level, but we are getting that hype again.)

[thorny dirge]

well garling wasnt trying to infiltrate the island I think he jsut kinda came there did the business and then left for 9 months

then came back for his kids before the tournament started

[limpid grail]

yeah, but the knights are always a low profile group. People have heard of CP9, CP0...ect. But gods knights are a mystery to all but a few.

[thorny dirge]

yea so candelle being popular wouldnt raise many eyebrows right

[limpid grail]

So candelle being a celebrity known to a chunk of the world would seem to be an ackward mission to hide.

[thorny dirge]

people dont know about the gods knights

[limpid grail]

But garling wasnt even scouting GV for human hunt tournament

[thorny dirge]

was it ever explained how the wg found out about the davy clan on god valley

didnt rocks say he only told herald about it

[limpid grail]

no. It seems Garling stayed there for a bit, and gauged interest if they wanted to join WG. They basically were not interested, but his wife or somebody started talking about Davy/D to him on the island.

Basically if your an island rich in rescources and you are not interested in joining WG, you are a target for the next hunt.

having Davy...ect clan makes you for sure a main target

[thorny dirge]

besides the pirates I wonder why the wg didnt choose hachinosu for one

it used to be under the control of th wg i believe when it was prison colony

[glass acorn]

its deep in the new world isnt it? it seems logisitcally difficult

[limpid grail]

pirates are too wild and violent to human hunt. They will resist.

[thorny dirge]

well before that

[limpid grail]

Normal farmers and merchants are not going to be as combative.

[thorny dirge]

it wasnt alwys a pirate island

the origin was it was a prison colony wasnt it?

[glass acorn]

dunno

[thorny dirge]

and then he prisoners took it over

[thorny dirge]

yea im looking back into it and it was a former penal colony but then the prisoners found a ton of gold under the island and they took it over

[limpid grail]

seems like it was a somewhat baren island where they expected people to die

so the WG thought the Island was a piece of crap, and it turned out after many years gold was discovered.

probably a Shandian mine, since we know a poneglyph was discovered there

[thorny dirge]

was there?

i dont remember that part

[limpid grail]

yea, in SBS for rocky port incident, Oda said there was one there

[thorny dirge]

that doesnt sound like it was discovered there

[limpid grail]

we have little info, but tie that in with the Gold discovered, makes me VERY intrigued

[thorny dirge]

it was ruled by ochoku for decades after god valley so i dont doubt he coudl procure one

jimbe was able to get one

[limpid grail]

why would he want one though? Why draw conflict with the WG? dude is a business man.

[thorny dirge]

he was on rocks crew he knows they are valueable

[limpid grail]

Rocks honestly seems somewhat ignorant of them

Not sure he mentioned them once

I think the Davy had their own verbal history

Joyboy had the poneglyphs, and Davy clan had 'the history where we are rulers of all' stories passed down. Just my thought on it.

[thorny dirge]

well yea but i seriously doubt that the rocks pirates had no idea about poneglyphs

big mom had 3 of them alone

other than the road poneglyph what would be the point of having the other ones if she didnt know their value

[limpid grail]

it was after Rogers death they became really important to them

When big mom realized she need to steal them

[thorny dirge]

yea so what was stopping ochoku from getting them?
\

[limpid grail]

I think he was a small man with small ambitions. I think once he got hatchinosu, he just rested and didnt do anything.

[glass acorn]

yeah i agree he just sort of coasted on his small victory

[limpid grail]

just my thought. He wasnt interested in Shaki, ore more money, or GV or....ect.

[glass acorn]

if you just wanna have a wealthy comfortable life you dont need to go after the one piece, its a bad idea =

[thorny dirge]

I think ochoku was similar to buggy

coasting off his rocks fame

he was called hte pirate cultist for ar eason

[limpid grail]

yeah, I think he was basically like an accountant that got an island, and could have a comfortable life just keeping the lights on.

assuming Caribou is his son, he seems pretty low intelligence and low motivated as well. However he is the luckiest pirate as well because all of his failings has him 20 feet away from somebody talking about ancient weapons.

[fickle vortex]

So Australia

[wind storm]

Yeah poneglyph knowledge was probably way more obscure pre roger's execution

Roger had to put together a bunch of pieces during his journey and then do a second lap with Oden

[molten anchor]

They likely believe they only need the Giants and the power of davy jones

[fickle vortex]

I do think lodestar will be more of a flashback arc

[fluid venture]

yall think mihawk has a connection to imu

maybe he shouldve become a holy knight but decided to be a warlord instead cuz he didnt want imus mark cuz mihawk seems morally okay kinda makes no sense why he worked for the government

[vapid shadow]

Since volume 115 ends on Imu's devil form reveal, I wonder if we'll get the official colors by having him on the cover

[grizzled lantern]

Thoughts on Candell being a garling and gunko being a shamrock

[clever wharf]

Candelle gives young Garling vibes though it's more about the looks and arrogant kinda full of herself vibe she gives rather than killing her partner in cold blood

[neat ingot]

Mihawk is a Nerona

[clever wharf]

Tbf I don't wanna see a repetition of past cd flashback like just a cd wanting to take a wife by force, eventhough it's in character for cds but I hope we get something more diverse

Candelle pulling some spying job like Garling would be better if we have to repeat a previous theme

[slim tree]

Is the queen really a celestial dragon

[clever wharf]

Idk if she is one or will become a wife of a cd, only her look gives a hk vibe

[wind storm]

It might just be a royal look tbf

[frigid wagon]

I'm being convinced candelle is a god knight by the fact that gunko is specifically mentioned as a member of the manmeyer family, so she must have direct lineage to a celestial dragon of that family and the king clearly isn't

[vapid shadow]

If Douzan is a giant named after Rikidozan, it'd be thematic if they aren't an Elbaph giant.

Rikidozan popularized professional wrestling in Japan despite the trials he faced as a Korean born under the Japanese colony.

We've got a theme going with Hajrudin, Ida, and Saul as non Elbaph giants who play significant roles in changing Elbaph. So perhaps Douzan was important to the direction Elbaph took.

[wind storm]

Actually thats pretty plausible

Would be similar to Garling marrying into god valley

[slim tree]

guys what if Blackbeard got Sanjuan Wolf on his crew as a sort of replacement for Harald/Loki

because maybe he knew Loki wouldn't join his crew

so he just got Sanjuan Wolf instead

[wind storm]

The fruit presumably would stop him from nidhogging

[slim tree]

what

[wind storm]

Rocks wanted harald because of how powerful he'd be as nidhogg

And sanjuan already got given a fruit

[slim tree]

yeah to make up for the loss of the Niddhog fruit

Rocks his plan probably involved having a really big crew member, and because Niddhog was already taken he settled for Sanjuan Wolf and his huge huge fruit

[wind storm]

Tbf though if blackbeard uses his steal fruit + double fruit trick again it could work

Maybe sanjuan + giant fruit + nidhogg would be comparable to ancient giant + nidhogg

[slim tree]

Sanjuan Wolf probably can't get a 2nd devil fruit though

Blackbeard has that special lineage

[wind storm]

Maybe but we dont actually know what trick blackbeard used still

[slim tree]

he's pregnant with Rocks

so he has the yami yami no mi and Rocks has the tremor fruit

that's why his belly is so big

[molten anchor]

If oda follows through with the squid theory then he altered his own RNA

[wind storm]

The what now

[limpid grail]

I think it makes sense Douzan was the void century nidhoggr

And Ragnir wants revenge for his death

[molten anchor]

Blackbeard is believed to eaten a krakken fruit (or imo just have squid dna himself) because his flag has 3 skulls and 8 bones which could be 3 hearts 8 legs/arms. his bounty being 3996= san ko ko ro aka 3 hearts.

They can also sleep for 40 seconds i believe, and can edit their RNA if they wanted to,for adapting into different environments

[limpid grail]

potentially pluton. The galleila may have been the makers of pluton, and Davy may have had a strong connection through that.

[molten anchor]

Facts

[limpid grail]

this might sound crazy, but given all the unique powers we have seen, I wonder if all living creatures at the end of the void century had their memory wiped of the void century.

[molten anchor]

I could see it happening to prevent anyone from finding about the past

[limpid grail]

and only tales from poneglyphs, books, stories was preserved. World was flooded too to hide it. Why government wants everything written to be destroyed.

it is hard for me to believe the elbaf giants are basically ignorant of the void century. Like Jaruls family was living through it. I am curious how Oda is going to get around this.

[chrome rock]

i wonder why Oda fit in the brook flashback in right now

is this the first time we have had multiple flashbacks in one arc?

[limpid grail]

no

the flashback may shed some light on something currently happening or about to happen though

perhaps how Esperia got destroyed...ect.

Also, I notice the King of Esperia appears taller than Brook. More like blackbeard or a little taller.

[chrome rock]

i think it will just free Gunko in the best case scenario. Its likely that Gunko is actually remembering this flashback but brook is the one telling it. I think Candelle probably Eperia succumbed to the world government but i dont think it was destroyed because we know a lot of the Rumbar pirates are on this island so they have moved out. Yes its possible they coudl of been destroyed but you would think during Brooks adventure and his age he would of seen notice about it.

though it is true that when Lulusia was destroyed, no one but Sabo has heard about the news yet so...who knows

[limpid grail]

Brook seems a little inconsistent on his memories, and we dont know if he witnessed this, because it sounds like it happened in Esperia (the murder.)

My current 'out there' theories for this flashback:
• One of Shuri’s parents have the Opi Opi No Mi
• Shuri gives herself to the WG in the end to protect Brook
• Brook either was told misinformation, or his memory was distorted about Shuri being the one to kill
• It is possible that Brook became a gods blade

I don't think Shuri has a pact different then the other gods knights, I think the difference is she has the eternal youth surgery.

[fickle vortex]

I doubt that Brook was a god's blade since if that was the case, Brook would've seen Gunko up on marie geoise

[limpid grail]

he was a gods blade before Shuri sacrificed herself is what I was getting at

[fickle vortex]

We just have to see

i doubt it still though

[limpid grail]

yeah, these are my less than 25% likely takes

like with harald, I think we are going to get a twist on the story beyond just mind control, at least when ti comes to shuri

[chrome rock]

this is just a wack theory but its possible that women of blue hair and probably some bloodline are very important to Imu

[molten anchor]

Yes

[chrome rock]

its completely possible that Gunko could of been a vessel for imu until she realized she couldn't be and has to just keep her nearby

Gunko is the only holy knight who stays with imu all the time in the garden, this has to be a special case. This also ties into why vivi and previously lilli were important.

[molten anchor]

Maybe blue hair (or just nefertari women) = uranus

[limpid grail]

blue hair might trace back to the water god. White hair Nika...ect.

revolutionaries seem to have the black dragon as their symbol. Shanks the Red dragon....

pink/pink hair associated with blood of the gods

[limpid grail]

the other thing is Shuri and Vivi are both rulers of their kingdoms when Imu wants them.

[limpid grail]

the popular theory on the internet the last couple of days is that Queen Candle is a holy knight that infultrated the kingdom. That might be true too.

although I find it strange the gangsters would be after her

[fickle vortex]

okay i just noticed that the Viz translated used contact instead of saw when brook is remembering the last time he saw Gunko

[limpid grail]

yeah, and brooks says she was not a CD last time he had contact with her

[fickle vortex]

As I stated before, it seems that Brook never been to Marie geoise before

[limpid grail]

agreed, unless his memories were altered.

if with a covenant with Imu, that is certainly possible

[limpid grail]

[hardy elm]

I think Gunko could go one of two ways:

1. Her family were trying to become CDs. Gunko was branded as part of the deal to be Imu's handmaiden for some reason, and she was then used to kill the father in front of Brook. Fairly unlikely as I don't see Imu reneging on deals.

2. CDs will arrive who want the queen for her musical talents. This niftily sets up beef between Brook and the CDs directly rolling into the final arcs. I'm less sure of how Gunko ends up killing the king in this scenario. Perhaps the queen dies defending herself and her daughter, then Gunko is similarly branded and used to kill the king.

[wheat sparrow]

wonder if Saul will end up being the "man with the burn scars" after all and the ship stuff is just a red herring

he does have extensive scarring in Elbaf

only thing that's weird is the road poneglyph went missing a long time ago. would've had to happened almost in the same year as Ohara was destroyed

the all-black ship could be a ship that was charred in Ohara but survived

[glass acorn]

I think it can work if we handwave the whirlpools into some sovereignty esque giant technique

But giving 3 clues and having one be a red herring would be bs

[mental berry]

@dense rose or @ripe mist can i report something to one of you

[dense rose]

Sure what’s up, feel free to DM

[wheat sparrow]

Whirlpools could be assistance Saul got from someone in the fishman isles in secret

im expecting the road poneglyph reveal in elbaf arc

[glass acorn]

I'd accept pretty much any answer I'd just be bummed if the answer was something like "oh that's just a rumor"

[wheat sparrow]

oh yeah def

but lafitte also suspected it's a devil fruit power cos what else could it be but like

there's no knowledge if it's something hinokizu himself is capable of doing

if we consider the chance that he didn't act alone, it could very well be saul

timeline is possible, scars match, knowledge of history matches, he has a clear motive to secure that poneglyph

[sacred trellis]

Hes also a government man, formerly

[chrome rock]

i honestly enjoyed the episode more than the chapter itself. the paneling on the chapter was a bit off for me and it kind of took out the emotion of meeting saul again. However, the episodes pacing is great and the way they cut between both timelines really did it for me.