also-manga

[long basin]

fair, BUT would this entertain us enough?

[pulsar path]

Tbh shanks tricking Loki probably really ticked him off when he's like the god of trickery

[final trench]

Yes

Not #1 but 2

[leaden rivet]

The coward comment I feel makes it clear that Loki wasn’t defeated purely by shanks being superior in strength

[strong wadi]

I mean, it's more like Loki and Shanks are just extremely strong

[long basin]

I mean he could certainly be luffy lvl

[jade rain]

Yea and Loki below both

[long basin]

if they were roughly equal I wouldn't expect shanks to beat him and cuff him to the tree.

I'm sure shanks either lied to him or ... poisoned him

[strong wadi]

I mean, if he's beaten, he's beaten 😭 Putting him in elbaf is the safest place until the time is ready for war

[jade rain]

I feel the cowardly comment is for shanks still not doing anything or attacking the WG despite him being that strong

[pulsar path]

So I don't think rat has a devil fruit I think it's just a mythical creature who decided to inhabit the hammer that was special or some shit

[long basin]

I mean a lot is possible but my gut is against it. can't do much about that

[muted hedge]

people really say anything to attempt to make Shanks look worse, lol

i don't think that Oda is physically able to make Shanks look bad

Oda is the biggest Shanks fan out there

[strong wadi]

Well you see, as someone who has a PhD in studying Oda, he will do whatever wanks Shanks the most. In this case, it's 1v1ing Loki fair and square.

[pulsar path]

Also I think nidhog was one of imus past crew mates/ associates infact I think all the dragons were under there power and Imu will also end up being some sort of dragon related creature

[pulsar path]

What's the wanking order? Shanks than Mihawk than bb? Lol

Poor Luffy

[strong wadi]

No, Shanks > Zoro > everyone else

[long basin]

I would love to see an equal fight of prime shanks, ngl.

[crisp python]

More importantly, do you guys think Shanks believe Mihawk is stronger than him since you know Mihawk is the stronger swordsman? 🤣

[pulsar path]

Oh shit your right Zoro

[muted hedge]

Shanks probably doesn't give a shit

[jade rain]

This is my problem with shanks character smh, despite liking them, shanks and rocks are just showcased like gary stu

[muted hedge]

i'll be totally honest, Shanks couldn't care less if Mihawk beat him or not

[leaden rivet]

I don’t think any top tier thinks any top tier is stronger than them

[pulsar path]

Zoro just been farming that aura for years than using it as power

[long basin]

let's try this differently, how would YOU cuff Loki to the tree

[leaden rivet]

I don’t think Big mom thought she was weaker than Kaido nor Shanks thought he was weaker than Big mom or Kaido

[torn stirrup]

yea maybe something alluding to how Satan is sometimes referred to as a 'Great Red Dragon' or similar draconic imagery

[pulsar path]

I think he does I really do I think it's very much like Roger and Garp but they just are less immature than them

[muted hedge]

i disagree, at least Shanks has two of his biggest weaknesses outright shown
firstly we have his scar on his face then we have his missing limb

[cold steppe]

Bait him with lola

[pulsar path]

Yes yes yes

[muted hedge]

if he was a Gary Stu as you propose, i think he wouldn't have any sort of flaw

[long basin]

I see, the forbidden trick

[pulsar path]

I really think at the very least his final form will be dragon like

[leaden rivet]

I think he cares, but there’s more things on going right now that he needs to take care of

He is still a Mary sue ye

[pulsar path]

Tbh Mihawk is the one who won't fight lol

Shanks seems down

[muted hedge]

Shanks doesn't seem down if you ask me, he accepts it whatever the outcome has been

accepting the loss or victory and proceeding to stay as friends

[pulsar path]

The only time he turned it down is cus he was hung over

[leaden rivet]

Shanks was hella down to fight Mihawk when Mihawk came to his island

Mihawk just didn’t want to fight

[muted hedge]

the thing which drags Shanks down the most i'd say is his loss that his destiny foretold that he couldn't be with Buggy as he wanted to

[pulsar path]

But than Mihawk said I'm not interested

[grand flower]

Rocks completely and utterly failed

[leaden rivet]

Because beating your rival who lost an arm is a hollow victory

[pulsar path]

Also luffys bounty

Mihawk wanted to celebrate the kid he heard shanks tell him will be the " future"

[muted hedge]

i think that Shanks was this down to fight as it's unprecedented that a single man would enter the territory of him without wanting to draw blades for glory. but i may be interpreting it wrong

[pulsar path]

I think shanks likes to fight like Garp and Roger

And Luffy

But it's hard when you at the top

[grand flower]

Too much at stake

[pulsar path]

That too

[muted hedge]

to me he doesn't seem to share the same drive as they do, it's more so he stays strong to protect those who he wants to protect.

like Roger, Garp and Luffy are battleholics

[pulsar path]

Tbh shanks has more responsibility than Roger

Roger literally was a party pirate

[muted hedge]

Roger is the most piratey pirate if you ask me

[graceful grove]

He can catch BB hands any day he likes. Just have to show up at his house but we know he wont

[grand flower]

Born to dilly dally, forced to lock in

[pulsar path]

Yup pretty much and Roger was out there chasing women half his piracy

Or I should say one women

[leaden rivet]

I think shanks has more self control also

Shanks would love to fuck around with Buggy if he could

[pulsar path]

Idk rocks might own that title

[leaden rivet]

But he has things he needs to take care of

[pulsar path]

And bb too

Roger bb and rocks might be tied

[muted hedge]

they're certainly runner ups but Roger has the top spot

Roger is the definition of what a pirate is.

[pulsar path]

I mean not really

He's too nice

[leaden rivet]

Roger is way too soft.

[pulsar path]

He kidna isn't lol

[cold steppe]

You gotta admire Roger's confidence thinking the chosen ones has to be his son and a child from his crew

[pulsar path]

Rocks is

And bb

[leaden rivet]

I feel like Blackbeard emphasizes it the most

[pulsar path]

Roger is more of peace main

[leaden rivet]

Roger doesn’t have enough senseless greed

[pulsar path]

Probably not like Luffy

Luffy does lmao

[muted hedge]

we saw in the flashback that Roger wasn't always soft either, he had a temper and he let it be known, like when he cut down the entire row of people outside of Shakky's bar, or when he came in and started to insult Rocks by calling him a porcupine

[pulsar path]

Yeah rocks stabs kids lmao

BB kills his buddy's

[muted hedge]

well, not all pirates were cruel

[pulsar path]

Yes they were

[muted hedge]

it's different to being soft and being needlessly cruel

[pulsar path]

Real pirates

[muted hedge]

no, all of them weren't lol

[pulsar path]

Than. They wouldnt be pirates bro

[trim lily]

most real pirates were only cruel when they needed to be

their main priority was staying alive and making money

[muted hedge]

yes

[pulsar path]

Which was when ever they met any one else. ....

[muted hedge]

even the likes of Blackbeard ruled prominently with fear, not being needlessly cruel

[trim lily]

in most cases they preferred to have a peaceful takeover or transfer of wealth

[pulsar path]

Yeah by hold up lol

[trim lily]

that’s why people like blackbeard put so much into intimidation

[pulsar path]

I mean yeah who wants to die

[muted hedge]

yeah, as it was a risk to board another ship they prefered to be as quick as they could

[pulsar path]

Y'all acting like that's not savage

If someone robs you for your shit at gunpoint but doesn't shoot

That's still bad lmao

[muted hedge]

sounds a lot like Roger, though he holds a sword to your throat instead

[trim lily]

well it’s the difference of needlessly cruel vs it having a point

[cold steppe]

Like Zeff

[pulsar path]

We have never seen Roger take treasure form other pirates

[muted hedge]

we've heard Garp go on about how ravaged an entire military army just for them having insulted his friends

[pulsar path]

Zeff we have

[leaden rivet]

If a pirate ship attacked you and you resisted they would be VERY cruel

[trim lily]

yeah

[muted hedge]

come on, do we really need to see that? it's a natural thing for pirates to do

even Luffy has done it, multiple times

[pulsar path]

So than how the fuck wernt pirates crule

[trim lily]

they would go the extra mile to kill you if you resisted too hard

[maiden charm]

https://tenor.com/view/7zqs-ltg-low-tier-god-mods-matey-gif-6770248085174496043

[pulsar path]

Luffy has never been in a ship to ship fight lmao

Other than Garp

[muted hedge]

he has still stolen from other pirates, lol

[long basin]

once! vs fullbody in front of the baratie!

[fringe escarp]

Blackbeard genuinely a bum

[muted hedge]

also, we know that Roger killed all of Squards' crew

that's pretty damn cruel

[fringe escarp]

Zero aura since pre ts

Blackbeard is the Usopp of the yonko

Fittingly 😭

[pulsar path]

Not really when they probably started it

Same with the military

[muted hedge]

so it's not cruel as long as there's a reason?

[pulsar path]

Cruel would be like capturing someone and keeping them as your prisoner

BB

[trim lily]

is it better to just kill them and be done with it

[pulsar path]

Yes

It's way cruler to capture someone

[muted hedge]

i'd say the most cruel part about it is that Roger left Squard alive to experience the loss first hand

[pulsar path]

Well tbh thats really depends per person

We seen what lil piece of shit he is tho

He literally won the war for the Marines

He probably wa a piece of shit before that than

[muted hedge]

you're just going off of assumptions now

[trim lily]

well he isn’t really a bad guy

he’s just a bit gullible/desperate

[pulsar path]

He stabbed white beared wtf

Yeah idk

[trim lily]

i forget what the reason akainu gave was but it was along the lines of “whitebeard is throwing away all of your lives for one pirate”

[pulsar path]

Luffy or Roger would have confronted white beard rather than sneak attack them

[muted hedge]

it was for Squard to spare himself and the rest of the Whitebeard pirates as long as Whitebeard died

[pulsar path]

Regardless if we were to look at the grab scheme of pirates (,vikings Mongolians than the carabeian piracy ) I think majority of pirates were cruel over not being cruel just off of viking and Mongolians

[muted hedge]

Sakazuki really is a manipulator

[trim lily]

rather rude of him

[strong wadi]

Hey, i'd manipulate like that too if i was akainu

[muted hedge]

Sakazuki is such a great villain, man
Marineford really put him up there

[latent hamlet]

altho in fairness
kinda dum for squard to fall for that so easily

[trim lily]

though it’s very funny for him to disguise himself as part of a rebel faction when he was the most excited for this chance lol

[upper rose]

foreshadowing for wakainu turning against the wg and becoming forest god wakainu

[muted hedge]

probably hard to say no to someone who is made of magma, lol

[latent hamlet]

"WB gonna sell u out"
"U LIE"
"i mean....does he REAAAALLLY care about u?"
".....um"

[warm sierra]

Akainu in sword

[muted hedge]

i know it won't happen but imagine if Sakazuki comes to Elbaph and takes the visage of Surtr

it would be so cool

[trim lily]

akainu not going to wano cause he feared the samurai but being a ok with the war land of giants

[dense rapids]

I think the Gods are just named after their kingdoms

You have Neptune the Sea God of Fishman island and the war god of warland

The other gods might be connected to certain places with those names

Forest
Sun
Earth

[muted hedge]

i think it'd be more of a case of him deciding to go there to put a stop to it as he is tired to sitting around, letting everyone else attempt to do it for him. after all Sakazuki wants to be in the middle of the battle, not really in the seat underneath the high and mighty

sort of like a volcano erupting

also, imagine if he came and picked up the giant sword

i think that he was a swordsman in the past, though i could be wrong

maybe it was toei filler

[formal wagon]

wano was filler

the whole yonko saga was filler

this is a story about pirates and warlords

[rose rune]

let's sing the neep tune together

[lofty fern]

My first hope for Loki. So many other cool things he could have been than another dragon

I also really don't like the name "Nidhogg", sounds like a weird pig

[muted hedge]

i like it

[lofty fern]

Oh well, lets see what oda does with it

[muted hedge]

Nidhoggr sounds so raw

[lofty fern]

If you say so

[muted hedge]

though i also think that Nidhoggr is actually Uranus

[digital juniper]

rr

[lofty fern]

It sounds as if nit and hog clashed together, I think I would have liked any of the other dragons better, but perhaps there's a connection that will be made later

[lofty fern]

I don't think we've had a devil fruit be an ancient weapon

[muted hedge]

right, so let this be the first one

[lofty fern]

That would limit the fruits' creation to only as old as the ancient kingdom though

[muted hedge]

hmm

right

[grand flower]

Forest could be Zou

[muted hedge]

or the Boin Archipelago

[dense pike]

Be ready for his arrival

[muted hedge]

hell yes

forest god Heracles

[dense pike]

Forest God Louis "Heracles" Arnote

[muted hedge]

forest god Louis "Heracles" D. Arnote

[shadow python]

Mask theory suggests that next time we see Heracles un he will be unmasked

[dense pike]

he will come to Elbaph at the end of the arc, and the giants will recognize him as Louis Arnote when he takes off the mask

[digital spear]

And then they bow down. Top 10 respect moments

[shadow python]

I considered the idea of him being in elbaf since he's usopps mentor and this shoupd be Usopps biggest focus. But theres a bit of a difference between the greek hero Heracles and the norse legends

[digital spear]

https://tenor.com/view/rio-ferdinand-manchester-united-real-madrid-football-soccer-gif-10493961563865561088

[dense pike]

"Louis Arnote is safe" 🥹

[digital spear]

[dense pike]

well hes not really based on Heracles hes mostly just based on the Hercules Beetle
also a lot of the giant names are not norse-sounding, so i dont think names alone would be enough to hinder it

[shadow python]

It would be such a shame for the live action to not include Jaya

They referenced the Noland story so i don't think they will and i also don't think it makes much sense to do Jaya and not Skypiea

[muted hedge]

https://x.com/JLjarx/status/2028174770127159548/photo/1
cool colors

JARX🖌 (@JLjarx)

ONE PIECE 1175 Loki Nidhogg
•Like RT follow me to support me [ credit me❤️] #ONEPIECE #ワンピース #zoro #ワンピース #ワノ国 #人魚姫 #イヌアラシ #ナミ #vegapunk #ONEPIECE1175 #LUFFY #Loki

X · Mar 1, 2026, 6:25 PM

[shadow python]

Boo i wanted it to be rainbow

[muted hedge]

it's confirmed to be an obsidian-dragon

so probably black with shades of purple

[quiet ice]

No shade but I don’t really vibe when people try to make it look like the anime

[ruby moat]

the bird in its mouth looks like the jaya bird kinda

[quiet ice]

More people gotta try to copy color spread colors

[muted hedge]

https://x.com/KentaroPJJ/status/2028178529620210121/photo/1

James Valle (@KentaroPJJ)

#ONEPIECE1175 #ONEPIECE   
#今週のワンピ
#ワンピース

X · Mar 1, 2026, 6:40 PM

[trim lily]

he’s so silly

[ruby moat]

Sommers thorn dragons > kaido fish dragon > loki cow dragon

[long basin]

he will help Usopp ... with a power up

[shadow python]

Oh yeah we should really talk about that

Summers is a master with his ability he can create sentient life that shoots thorn bullets. Its somewhat similar to Doffys string clone and shows that devil fruit powers can be way more powerful than you would first think

[pine ridge]

monkey d dragon dragon>>>>

[shadow python]

Summers' power isn't really much different from Miss doublefingers but his use of it is leagues beyond what she could do. This is a much better example of fruit reworking than Machvise and Miss Valentine wherein he had the stronger fruit but didn't do anything more creative with it than she did

[distant vine]

Its so funny how half this fandom is "ODA STOP SPENDING ALL THE TIME WITH SIDE CHARACTERS" and the other half is "ODA NOBODY CARES ABOUT THESE BUM STRAW HATS"

Very stable!

[muted hedge]

definitely the most unreliable fanbase

[fluid cedar]

Monkey monkey model weather dragon

[shadow python]

Lokis flashback was the longest flashback in the series. It was also too short and skipped a lot of useful information that probably should have been covered

[frigid gulch]

Wocks

[lofty fern]

So many artists giving Loki a way better design than Oda ever could

[dense haven]

no rainbow dragon tho

[fringe escarp]

The design is the exact same here bro 😭

[formal wagon]

whats wrong with loki's design?

i like the fairytale dragon look

[fluid cedar]

The flashback was showing events related to haralds death and everything related to it was shown
how come is it short

[strong wadi]

It really only skipped lola and the shanks encounter. The latter is probably being saved for later, whether it's shown or what went down is just verbally stated by a character.

[dense haven]

loki > kaido

[formal wagon]

yeah

[shadow python]

Lola was how we knew about Loki in the first place. And for Big mom to think that she could have access to the giants via Loki as presented is very curious given he was effectively expunged from the kingdom for killing Harald.

[dense haven]

oda retconned the lola thing

[ashen perch]

no he did not, nothing about Loki after Harald's death was covered and its very clearly on purpose lol

we'll get back to it, when the time is right

[dense haven]

bro really wants the entire arc to be flashback

[ashen perch]

2 possibilities

• Loki sticks around for the next arc and thats where the flashback happens if the arc really has to end soon (I doubt this)
• the arc is not ending anytime soon, and we get that flashback in the latter half of the arc

[shadow python]

Lokis flashback is already the longest in the series and Big Mom is dead. I didn't think we'd get another chance for this

[ashen perch]

I believe the "Loki" flashback was really mainly a Harald flashback, and that a real Loki flashback is yet to come

[ashen perch]

we absolutely will get another chance for this

[dense haven]

dont mind arsal hes still waiting for the egghead skip flashback

[ashen perch]

remember what this all started with between Loki and Luffy, its all centred around Shanks

[shadow python]

Im just worried its going to be covered in an sbs and not in the main story

[ashen perch]

naturally, we're going to cover all the events that led to his capture by Shanks and the event of the capture itself

[shadow python]

I don't think we'll cover the Shanks stuff here

[ashen perch]

0% chance of this

[formal wagon]

we are going back to egghead

theres unfinished buisiness

oh its march

[ashen perch]

Luffy promised to free Loki because he was going to tell him all about Shanks that he knows

[shadow python]

And if Loki wanted to talk about Shanks capturing him he had the chance to do so

[ashen perch]

its not the time for it

they had 3 minutes

[shadow python]

But a number of the details concerning Shanks were intentionally odd like him joining the gods his shift in attitude the loki interaction.

Shanks will probably have his own flashback in a different arc

[ashen perch]

no doubt, but its not gonna have anything to do with Loki

we will get that right here

[shadow python]

Capturing Loki is what put Shanks to the emperors it can be covered with other Shanks things. I believe Loki flashback is done

[ashen perch]

I mean that'd just be very silly, I doubt the Shanks flashback is coming any time soon

So to hold it off for so long, when it has little relevance by then

I doubt it

[wraith mantle]

whats the issue here tho

like people are individuals they dont have to fit into a mold

[ashen perch]

It matters now, Luffy wants it now, Luffy wants the info now, he'll get it now

[wraith mantle]

some peeps dont like focus on side characters some peeps want more focus on side characters

[ashen perch]

Some peeps are very stupid

[wraith mantle]

and some peeps are very smart

[distant vine]

Its just funny to me. Its only One Piece that really goes through this in my experience since the cast is so fleshed out even outside the main protags

It's not really a problem what people prefer, I just think its a funny dilemma

[ashen perch]

Yeah, and its certainly not the peeps that genuinely dislike the main core of the story

[wraith mantle]

dont think its up for you to decide lol

[dense rapids]

Insane

[ashen perch]

Well I am deciding

[wraith mantle]

people enjoy fiction in their own ways

[distant vine]

I'll agree with Arsal

[dense rapids]

Loki could’ve already told Luffy about shanks

[ashen perch]

Overestimating the radius a bit I feel, height is accurate-ish. But I imagine we'll get an idea next chapter for sure

[dense rapids]

There’s a time jump between them arriving in the sun world

[distant vine]

Its ok to prefer side characters. I mean I like Law more than every SH barring Zoro. But if you hate the main crew, I mean I'll just say youre wrong

[wraith mantle]

i am lowkey in the middle

i enjoy all peak oda gives me

[vital heart]

The main curiosity I have now is that I want to see how big Elbaf compares with other islands. We obviously can tell Elbaf is larger than 99% of islands, but by what factor?

@dense rapids @ashen perch

[ashen perch]

Yeah I don't take issue with liking a side character more, its dislike for the main cast that's wild go me

[wraith mantle]

even the foxy arc was fun in its own way

[ashen perch]

A lot

[dense rapids]

Lulusia is no where near the size of it that’s for sure

[ashen perch]

I think Loki should be able to destroy like an Amazon Lily with that

[dense rapids]

That whole branch should be destroyed next chapter

[vital heart]

You missed my point

[dense rapids]

We didn’t see the full attack

[vital heart]

None of that matters

You both missed my point

I want to see Elbaf side by side with another island, for reference

That will likely never happen

But it would be interesting

[dense rapids]

I wonder if Oda is gonna actually have Loki destroy Elbaph at the cost of saving everyone

[ashen perch]

No I know your point meek, i was thinking of how much damage it could probably do

[wraith mantle]

what makes you think this is a possibility

is there a tidbit of foreshadowing for this?

[dense rapids]

Elbaph weakness is fire and lightning

[wraith mantle]

oh

[dense rapids]

And he just hit it with a raigo

[formal wagon]

elbaf arrives in april

[glacial bear]

Yes

[formal wagon]

yes...

[dense rapids]

I think the only actual comparisons for Elbaph we will see if is Loki flies over a regular island compared to the size of him to the Adam tree or if Thriller Bark goes there

[formal wagon]

wait fuck appears works better

[frigid gulch]

Mailbit box

[formal wagon]

\

[dark nymph]

i'm ngl im not the biggest fan of this dragon design but it is what it is

[fossil nimbus]

casual ancient weapon attack

[dark nymph]

also did Summers fucking die lol

[raven wing]

rat mixed with lizard 😭

[restive sierra]

rat? is that shanks!!???

[dark nymph]

that looks way cooler than wht it looks like in op

[restive sierra]

no, imu will kill him since imu loves to kill his own people

[raven wing]

no that's loki before oda redraw

[restive sierra]

i thought it was shanks rat version…

[raven wing]

probably his sword

[restive sierra]

shanks has rat rat no mi

[formal wagon]

he's probably fine

[raven wing]

how come he can swim?

[formal wagon]

luffy can't beat holy knights yet

[restive sierra]

because he is cheating

[dense rapids]

What do u guys think Imu does next chapter

[restive sierra]

i want him to fight gunkoimu

[raven wing]

get erected by imu afterwards or imu himself killed him

[formal wagon]

once we see zoro finishing the job we can be sure sommers is out of the picture for good

[restive sierra]

tries to fight with gunko over her body

[raven wing]

probably cry abot it, the fact he can't do shit

[dense rapids]

Brook got off screened

[raven wing]

brook tag in using his fruit

[restive sierra]

i expected this

[dark nymph]

not next chapter cause Loki still has to show out, but I think he'll eventually domi reversi Loki.

he'll want that power for himself

[grand flower]

Reversi Loki and dips

[digital spear]

lol this was clear. Dragon didnt randomly attack Mariejois = "its not looking good for Dragon 😭 "

[grand flower]

Interesting that Loki isn’t awakened

And he doesn’t have flame clouds

[digital spear]

yet

[raven wing]

he can't be offscreen if they show it to the world the gov name will soar through kingdom

[digital spear]

maybe Loki awakens when they free from the Domi Reversi or something

but Lucci showed there is an "awakening form" for zoans

[raven wing]

i mean we already know since the beginning there's an awakening of every fruit it just depends if they can unlock it or not

[formal wagon]

elbaf appears in april

[restive sierra]

dragon wont be there no matter what

[formal wagon]

good

[digital spear]

oh it straight up said "awakened form" lol

[digital spear]

this CANT be it Mailbox...

[ruby moat]

oh wait judge jr is gone..

[unkempt sable]

Yo

[digital spear]

new month new bit

[formal wagon]

its midterm week so i just took the first good suggestion i got

[ruby moat]

febuary is a short month tho so judge jr should get two months

[formal wagon]

judge jr will be back

[digital spear]

aura

[ruby moat]

thank god

[digital spear]

Judge Jr. 2: The Revenge

Judge Jr. 3: Now its personal

Judge Jr. 4: The Reckoning

Judge Jr. 5: The last Vinsmoke

Judge Jr. 6: A new Generation

[scarlet nacelle]

people slandering zoro by saying he was struggling with "base lucci" were so fucking stupid

lucci was AWAKENED

this was literally lucci at his strongest

the opposite of base lucci

[raven wing]

wtf is this shit

[digital spear]

the truth

[restive sierra]

we all know its you kaku

[tall wharf]

idk next chapter and might feel have bad feeling

[dark nymph]

and for breathing too hard

[digital spear]

wheres the horse one

[snow locust]

It’s bc Zoro fanboys set unrealistic expectations by saying Zoro was gonna beat Lucci with ease

[scarlet nacelle]

i enjoy poking fun at zoro and his fans as much as the next guy

but it feels like some people were actually believing it was a hard ass fight for him

[snow locust]

It was mid-diff I think. Not easy, but he didn’t have to go all out either

[digital spear]

he needed like a TRILLION chapters to "beat" Lucci and then DADBEI had to save him and change his diapers!

[dark nymph]

just put the boxes in the bag

[digital spear]

Thanks

[dark nymph]

I hope Jinbei shows out in Elbaf, I have a feeling he won't be getting much from now on lol

[formal wagon]

INTERMISSION

[scarlet nacelle]

roger has a guy on his crew named "marx" and this would've been the perfect opportunity to bring him up

[digital spear]

horse

[torn kite]

Who do you guys think is the second weakest straw hat I wanna say Nami but it could also be chopper

Or maybe Robin

[formal wagon]

WHAT

[pseudo gulch]

Chopper can tank better than Nami but Nami's offensive power is crazy so I say Chopper

[formal wagon]

wdym? i dont get it

[pseudo gulch]

Yo mailbox

How are you doing

Been a while

[formal wagon]

doing alright how about you

[scarlet nacelle]

the video kept bringing up people with titles of "man marked by [thing]" and marx could have been "man marked by marx" or smth

[torn kite]

See I wanna say that, but when was the last time we saw chopper go all out in a fight I legitimately don’t know how strong post time skip chopper is

[formal wagon]

still thinking about whether or not you can screenshot the caterpillar

[pseudo gulch]

Doing fine thank you

Now long until I can finally have an answer for that

It's such a hard pic please let me take a screenshot

[formal wagon]

OHHH i get it. took me a long time though 😭

[pseudo gulch]

I guess vs Queen in Wano? Not sure tho he hasn't really been involved in a serious fight the entire post ts

[formal wagon]

that would have been a good addition

[torn kite]

Exactly which is why I’m curious

[celest mauve]

what's with luffy glazing zoro so hard for doing the bare minimum this chapter, it actually reads really weirdly now that I look at it

[pseudo gulch]

I been saying that

That "That's Zoro! And he's very strong!!!" dialogue was so weird

It feels fanwritten

Marvel ass dialogue

[celest mauve]

he happened to be in the right place and cut some thorns, and then luffy treats it like he saw shanks in action lmao

[blazing depot]

tcb or viz?

[celest mauve]

yeah, I know luffy has praised his crewmates before but those times felt natural and this feels forced

[blazing depot]

stephenslop or meekslop

[lofty fern]

I do wonder about this, was there ever an attack in the first place? I've questioned that since Imu said it

[celest mauve]

I read the viz translation just now

"way to go zoro, I always believed in you" and it's just cutting some thorns

[dense rapids]

I think enies lobby was the home of the moon people when they first came

Then whatever happened in the first world caused them to split up to where they are now

[lofty fern]

Either way, it sounds a bit like silly praise

[pseudo gulch]

tcb, I haven't read Viz yet

[dense rapids]

Skypeians - Emperor Cloud

Shandians - Jaya

Birkans - birka

[pseudo gulch]

Usually he does it when people say bad things about the straw hats

[hot cairn]

I found it odd too, that was so random

[torn kite]

I don’t know maybe he wants other people to know how cool his crew is or something or maybe he’s just glazing

[lofty fern]

To be fair, I don't think meek did this chapter. I liked some of his early translations better though

[blazing depot]

oh i know I just wanted to make fun of him

[celest mauve]

if it was usopp for instance needing encouragement after a low point, I'd get it

[blazing depot]

https://tenor.com/view/kizaru-borsalino-admiral-marines-shades-gif-10682292755083267442

[hot cairn]

it’s like if Zoro was struggling this arc and he just did something right for the first time

[celest mauve]

lmao yeah

[hot cairn]

yeah exactly

[lofty fern]

Almost condescending if it was anyone but Luffy

[vital heart]

Bitch I didnt work on this chapter even a little bit

Shut yo bitch ass uP!

[lofty fern]

I could see Killy doing that to Sommers. "Oh you finally did something right! Good job Summers! 👏 "

[pseudo gulch]

Standing on business

[small ember]

Sommers getting absolutely broken in pieces

Love it

[coral vapor]

is there any moments in the manga yall cried to

[small ember]

And nice Loki nuke we got

[formal wagon]

yes

[coral vapor]

which moments

[lofty fern]

Sure, many of the flashbacks have choked me up. The ASL flashback, parts of the wano flashback, Parts of Sanji's second flashback, etc.

[blazing depot]

The only piece of media that made me cry was an episode of The Clone Wars

If you watched the show… you’d know

[dense rapids]

This is mirroring the slaves having to go get the mother flame and being saved by the sun god

Even has the serpent behind them

As well as the svarr ships

So I wonder if the sun god appeared from the hole like how Luffy appeared from the underworld

[dense marsh]

Why the holy knight so squishy
Can't they work on their durability

[trim lily]

you can only spec into regen or durability

unless youre warcury in which case you get both

[glacial bear]

That’s why the goat is TOP 🔝 MAN 💪

https://tenor.com/view/one-piece-saint-topman-warcury-intro-title-card-saint-topman-warcury-topman-warcury-st-warcury-gif-5414042910152365497

STRIKE THAT POSE

[spice python]

There were a lot of episodes

[lofty fern]

Their "squishiness" is actually an illusion. GLR had a nice review of the idea, but the reason that the HKs look so non-durable is because Oda has to show off the regen and how it works by having them be destroyed in ways no one else gets destroyed. However this has the unintended affect of making them seem "weak" when they really aren't. Oda just has no other way to be able to show off regeneration.
Also, he can now show off the true power of our characters strength because he's no longer has to hold back or censor things. He can now totally have fun. What Luffy did to Summers is what he would do to anyone, but Oda can't have blood and guts go everywhere because this is a shounen. Someone like Summers allows him to have his cake and eat it too.

[trim lily]

the knights are absolutely going to suddenly be much more durable when the regen is eventually countered

[snow locust]

It feels like he’s overkilling it tbh. Like I got the picture the first time I saw Saturn get splattered into a million pieces

I don’t need it to happen to every single one of them

[leaden rivet]

I’m curious if there’s any this is Usopp’s arc believers still out there

[hot cairn]

yeah def

Oda is just using Egghead and Elbaph to showcase regen

[red lagoon]

Ye he’s getting ragnir

[trim lily]

any chapter now he'll have his big moment

[hot cairn]

but people are already thinking their bums

[trim lily]

i mean oda hasnt done much to help that

[hot cairn]

there are

[trim lily]

he showed them getting dogwalked in god valley, they looked pretty cool in the first half of elbaf but now the monster quartet is here unfortunately

[hot cairn]

but I don’t personally buy on “if he doesn’t do anything this arc, it’s over” mentality

One Piece won’t end this arc

[trim lily]

unless..

[hot cairn]

[grand flower]

Oh brother

[leaden rivet]

Does anyone’s discord like refresh/reset whenever they open the announcements channel

[leaden rivet]

Shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up

[hot cairn]

lmaooo

[hot cairn]

what happened

[leaden rivet]

I’m still dying on the hill that the straw hat most deserving of conquerors after Luffy and Zoro is Usopp

But even I have given up on that dream

[dense pike]

fair

[scarlet nacelle]

i swear it feels like after ts a lot of the strawhats just got thrown to the wayside

[leaden rivet]

Monster trio and friends

[scarlet nacelle]

oda just spams all these new side characters who are interesting by themselves but take time away from the actual SHs

[small ember]

I see the logic but he’s gotta worry about Observation first lol

[leaden rivet]

+Jinbei’s bum ass

[scarlet nacelle]

like i don't fucking CARE about the colloseum nobodies

[small ember]

Love Kyros tho

[scarlet nacelle]

or the one MILLION different characters in wano

[small ember]

Wano suffered big time from this yeah

[leaden rivet]

He can get both

[grand flower]

Oda did this for nothing IG

[small ember]

I just hope he does develop it more, we got teased in Dressrosa

[scarlet nacelle]

im shoving so many new characters in every arc it means the shs get less time to shine

[leaden rivet]

Conquerors is like the perfect ending to his dream

[scarlet nacelle]

usopp is a sniper

what has he made any meaningful sniping feats?

[leaden rivet]

It fits so much that I’m surprised he’ll never get it

[small ember]

Conq…bullets

[grand flower]

Usopp hasnt dialed into Haki in anyway probably because he can’t remain calm

[ionic palm]

meanwhile, Im over here still wanting Usopp to have access to a DF

[drowsy flame]

Dressrosa

[grand flower]

His Kabuto may eat ome

[scarlet nacelle]

well i mean of course there is that but when else?

[grand flower]

It may become the new host for Ratatoskr

[drowsy flame]

Not shit lol

[grand flower]

I’m hoping he gets Arrow Arrow tho

[leaden rivet]

What is Gunko really doing against an acoc laced green star?

[unkempt sable]

What if Loki dies and ussops weapon eats the fruit

[dense pike]

ooo thatd be cool
Fixed trajectories and shit

[leaden rivet]

JON

They gave you your embed back? No way

I’m so hurt

[unkempt sable]

https://tenor.com/view/one-piece-one-piece-opening-26-opening-26-assu-egghead-gif-17678643079776378610

[leaden rivet]

Just made my day that much worse

[unkempt sable]

lol

[leaden rivet]

[scarlet nacelle]

i'd be content with that but that requires oda actually killing a character

[grand flower]

9 people died in Wano and Saturn died in Egghead

We don’t have to rewrite One Piece lol

[hot cairn]

you’re correct

[small ember]

Oda been more on the character deaths lately true

Shaka…

[dense pike]

And Harald, Rocks, Marlon, Estrid, Ida and Shanks' mom died in Elbaph

[leaden rivet]

When have I ever been incorrect?

Flashback deaths don’t count

[red lagoon]

Don’t hate on the fax

[dense pike]

darn

[grand flower]

I can see something where Auger teleports to a spot and an arrow is there waiting for him

A shot Usopp fired earlier in the fight and Auger thought he dodged comes down the Arrow and hits him

Usopp used future sight to aim where he saw Auger will be

And used the arrow to guide the projectile there

[dense pike]

!cook

[tropic nova]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1211111343852228638/1217510693411229746/cook.png?ex=66044a31&is=65f1d531&hm=fda7fc91afb3dda1c7a90192efda3372e268931d0bcc5db2b97d635b65b260ae&

[grand flower]

Auger arrogantly thinks usopp missed

[hot cairn]

that has been the post time skip overall but it’s because the crew is a better unit rn than they were pre ts

[leaden rivet]

[hot cairn]

cook

[grand flower]

For some reason people don’t include flashbacks even though it’s the same story

[small ember]

”The world.”

[grand flower]

I entertain the argument to show how even if you take that

It still isn’t even true

Oda drops people in the modern day all the time

Absalom died too

[scarlet nacelle]

in egghead alone oda faked 7 different deaths

[red lagoon]

I stake it all on ussop getting ragnir the I told you so list grows

[formal wagon]

*goda

[hot cairn]

[small ember]

Pound should certainly be dead

[scarlet nacelle]

he's a sniper

[grand flower]

Foolish to doubt usopp this arc

[red lagoon]

Yes

[scarlet nacelle]

why would he ever use a hammer
more over, him getting ragnir makes the rest of his kit invalid

[leaden rivet]

I was wondering where I was at then realized you’re using my real name lol

[grand flower]

No he shouldn’t be

[red lagoon]

He’s used hammers before ?!?

[ruby moat]

Have you forgotten the many times he’s used a hammer

[grand flower]

Usopp HAS used hammers

Lmaooo cmon man

[red lagoon]

We deadass

[leaden rivet]

They jumping him

[red lagoon]

Ussop has ussed hammers in canon and even in the movies

[leaden rivet]

Fight back ballistic

[small ember]

I’m not upset that he’s back but his death scene would have been a good place to leave off if that makes sense

[scarlet nacelle]

ok you got that point
but still i feel him using ragnir would lead to him never actually using kabuto
why use that when he has one of the strongest weapons in the series

[ruby moat]

It’s just a rly dumb reason for him to not use ragnir.. he’s used massive hammers on multiple different occasions

[hot cairn]

I want to be optimistic but so far we haven’t gotten nothing : (

[red lagoon]

He can wield ragnir he doesn’t have to keep it

[hot cairn]

but Ill trust Oda

[red lagoon]

I don’t think ussop will keep ragnir at all

But he will 100% use it imo

[leaden rivet]

I don’t see a good reason why he should get Ragnir

[grand flower]

I think him getting rewarded for being a good parent to complete the contrast with Big Mom being a bad parent is worth it

[scarlet nacelle]

...you really could've elaborated on that earlier, that makes much more sense

[leaden rivet]

Wield it for 2 minutes then go back to being fodder huh

[grand flower]

I’d reread

[small ember]

That’s actually a pretty good idea, plus look at how it ended for BM

[grand flower]

Yeah exactly

[small ember]

As far as death scenes go, Yasuie had one of the best ngl

[grand flower]

It’s why pound is revealed alive in a Bege cover story

[leaden rivet]

Wano did so many things right

[dense pike]

yeah idk, colloseum-goers want blood ig
theyre just Sommers's irl

[grand flower]

Bege and Pound are the good parents

[leaden rivet]

But its length and Gear 5 throw people off

[grand flower]

They contrast judge and BM

[red lagoon]

I love g5 I dont Get the discourse

[small ember]

That scene plus the Ebisu reveal while the ppl mourn are such a crazy combo

Wano’s highs are so damn high

[unkempt sable]

But also so many things wrong

[red lagoon]

Did I use that word right

[leaden rivet]

I love Gear 5 I just don’t like Nika

[red lagoon]

Can y elaborate a lil

[leaden rivet]

Wano felt like a movie like every chapter

[leaden rivet]

It’s Oda’s best work

To me

[hot cairn]

I mean in Elbaph

[small ember]

That’s one I’d go back to read one day

[dense pike]

speakin of, just realized Sanji and Franky during Egghead were literally the son of Queen and the son of Judge trying to save the man both their fathers hate

[hot cairn]

Wano is so peak

[grand flower]

Yeah id reread Elbaph

[hot cairn]

Gear 5 is peak

[grand flower]

Like lets be fr for a second

[heady lava]

i am ready to read all th arcs

[leaden rivet]

Gear 5 is great, it makes Luffy’s fights more entertaining and dynamic.

Nika is not, it feels like it’s replacing who Luffy is as a person, it’s removing his identity to make him almost some sort of shitty reincarnation. It’s no longer just Straw hat Luffy saving the day it’s now every time Nika.

[heady lava]

from now on

[grand flower]

Elbaph has Luffy criticizing Usopp’s performance in a fight

Luffy has NEVER done that

Oda is an intentional writer

[leaden rivet]

Not only that but it feels incredibly hamfisted into the plot

[grand flower]

Doubting usopp this arc is actually literally foolish

[hexed ridge]

I think people were expecting a serious angry form, when that's not what G5 is supposed to be about

[leaden rivet]

Nika gets next to no mention’s 99% of the story and now every plot beat is related to it

[hot cairn]

COOK

[unkempt sable]

Ussop will do SOMETHING this arc

[leaden rivet]

I love Gear 5 but I can do without Nika

[heady lava]

def

[hot cairn]

I remember that

[red lagoon]

I feel like it doesn’t remove his identity simply because of who Luffy is every time people call him joyboy or nika or whatever he always makes them knows he’s Luffy

[heady lava]

elbaph is usopp's fav island

[glacial bear]

Cook

COOK

HOLY COOK

[heady lava]

he mentions it in every arc

[grand flower]

This ain’t the kind of details thr fandom appreciates anymore

[red lagoon]

Even when Luffy learns about nika and joyboy I can see him rejecting all that and doing what he sees best and only cause he wants it

[heady lava]

" i wanna go to elbaph"

[glacial bear]

https://tenor.com/view/one-piece-onepiece-op-shipwright-franky-gif-11600843988162806494

[heady lava]

by usopp

[leaden rivet]

He initially acts confused (he still doesn’t know about it?) but people around him still treat him as Nika despite it all

[grand flower]

Patience is always validated with OP more than cynicism

[latent hamlet]

"he's the messiah" meme

[heady lava]

ofc

[leaden rivet]

It’s so cringe

And unnecessary

[hot cairn]

a serious angry form is okay but Gear 5 is peak

[latent hamlet]

meanwhile luffy

"THE FUCK'S A NEE KAH? IM LUFFY"

[leaden rivet]

This is also why Blackbeard is vastly superior to Imu btw

[red lagoon]

I love gear 5

[grand flower]

It also makes perfect sense people woukd look at Luffy and call him Nika when he’s doint what he’s doing

[unkempt sable]

[latent hamlet]

GEAR DEATH

[leaden rivet]

Blackbeard feels like an enemy for Luffy. While Imu feels like an enemy for Nika.

[latent hamlet]

GEAR GOD

[grand flower]

The entire premise of Luffy awakening the fruit is that he embodies what Nika is

[dense pike]

so glue

[hexed ridge]

OH NO USOPP GOT A BOO BOO, TIME TO GO RAGE MODE AND LOSE ALL MY MORALS

[grand flower]

Calling Luffy “Nika” is just shorthand for “our super cool savior guy”

[unkempt sable]

You sort of can’t do gear 5 as it is now without Nika

[hot cairn]

that’s true, fine. I’ll be hopeful

[red lagoon]

Everytime I see gear 5 fighting on screen I actually smile irl I love gear 5 so much

[leaden rivet]

Yeah and it’s a shame

[red lagoon]

They can never make me hate g5

[leaden rivet]

Luffy is a lot less interesting to me as a character with all the Nika stuff

But I love gear 5 nonetheless

[dense pike]

this should be
!noonedies

[hexed ridge]

Also, damn, Sommer is showing his celestial dragon side way too much.

[unkempt sable]

long as they don’t make him a one to one reincarnation I’ll be fine with it like they can be similar, but don’t have them to be the exact same people

[red lagoon]

I don’t think it will ever be a reincarnation thing

Luffy is too adamant on he is himself

[unkempt sable]

You say that till it is

[leaden rivet]

So basically you’re saying you’re against Luffy being black?

🤨

[red lagoon]

But op all inherited wills over reincarnation

[hexed ridge]

I think Nika was real, but the fruit was either created of manifested to embody his powers, not his soul.

[dense pike]

@hexed ridge

[grand flower]

Whenever people like morj talk about Oda “cheating” them out of the emotional pay off of a death scene I think of Sommers now

Like nigga you know you got more emotions right? 💀

[leaden rivet]

The time for inherited wills is oooooover. It’s all bloodline connections

[unkempt sable]

To be fair, it wouldn’t be a problem if there weren’t like a five fake out deaths a arc now

[grand flower]

Yeah whatever bruh

[ruby moat]

except for Koby 💪 😤

[clever idol]

[dense pike]

"I NEED THEM TO SUFFER!!
SUFFER LIKE I HAVE!!"
-Toby, age 17

[hexed ridge]

I just mean that Sommers is drooling over aponzing cruelty and it's like "woah, dial it back buddy boy"

[tidal onyx]

Don’t doubt usopp

[grand flower]

I go whoopie when the characters I like survive with miracles

[red lagoon]

Even the boar oden “killed” got a fakeout death

[leaden rivet]

Koby is the child of some rocks pirate, idk who yet and neither does Oda

[grand flower]

Idgaf about none of that fake out discourse stuff no more

[red lagoon]

Tf reason did that boar need to live

[ruby moat]

NO

[unkempt sable]

Someone had to have had laws fruit because no way

[glacial bear]

My favorite YouTuber, Sommers!

[dense pike]

Not talkin bout that
im squintin at you for somethin completely different

[clever idol]

I just call those complainers blood thirsty so this fits

[unkempt sable]

https://tenor.com/view/koby-coby-one-piece-gif-12417753141580632326

[grand flower]

LMAOOOOO “ey bruh I didn’t come to this fairy tale to feel happy, kill these mfers”

[hexed ridge]

wut?

[dense pike]

[ruby moat]

💪 😤

[hexed ridge]

Cmon what did I do?

tell me

[grand flower]

They sound exactly like Sommers and it’s so funny

“This is the real stuff! This is emotion!”

[clever idol]

Crazy thing is oda is u can both be sad about the death and then relieved they did survive. Have your cake and eat it too

[dense pike]

My theory, remember?
remember when you mansplained my own theory back to me?

[grand flower]

Sommers is ome of my favorite antagonists just because of how relentless of a mockery he is

[hexed ridge]

which theory?

[ruby moat]

thats the nice part about weekly chapters, u get a whole week where u think they may actually be dead

[hexed ridge]

I don't remember

[grand flower]

The people who can’t see the forest for the trees and see there’s more emotion going on

[ruby moat]

sometimes multiple weeks!

[dense pike]

Devil Encyclopedia

[grand flower]

Exactly bruh

[leaden rivet]

This is silly

[grand flower]

It’s almost like the dread makes the happiness of them surviving stronger

[hexed ridge]

Oh yeah that, what did I say again about it|?

[grand flower]

I wanna turn Sommers’ name into an insult for these folk

[clever idol]

Dont understand how sad i was when i thought bon chan died and then how happy i was when i found out they survived

[lofty fern]

Has anyone seen this man? If you have any information on his whereabouts, please call 555-555-5555

[leaden rivet]

There is payoff in death and sacrifice. If whitebeard didn’t actually die but got healed up by law afterwards would his final battle hit as hard?

[lofty fern]

https://tenor.com/view/franky-one-piece-franky-one-piece-franky-fade-one-piece-meme-gif-7941568265652526516

[leaden rivet]

No because their exists payoffs in death

[dense pike]

what i said in it, but phrased differently
#manga-theories message

[grand flower]

That small panel of Kinemon and O-Tsuru sitting together was worth more than any Kin’emon desth scene

[leaden rivet]

If ace tanked akainu’s blow and ran away with Luffy would it hit as hard?

[grand flower]

That shit tugged on my heart it was so cute

[clever idol]

Not every death serves the same purpose

[ruby moat]

well u gotta wait a lil while to reveal theyre alive

[leaden rivet]

I don’t know why some people act as if there’s no narrative benefit in death

[grand flower]

Huh?

[leaden rivet]

I agree

[grand flower]

We don’t talk about story structure here

A character has a death scene they gotta die

That’s the storytelling rules

Good story is follow the rules

[leaden rivet]

Not every death does serve a purpose, but it feels like you’re arguing that death is pointless narrative wise. When there are strong payoffs in death.

Not everyone needs to die

Not everyone needs to live

Kaido should be dead

[clever idol]

Yea i was always routing for kinney and all the scabbards getting a happy ending. Theyve suffered enough

[hexed ridge]

OOOOh, the DEVIL enclyopedia I see

[grand flower]

Side note Jesus is the biggest fake out ever

[leaden rivet]

For example

[grand flower]

I don’t hear complaints about that

[ruby moat]

they even foreshadowed it with lazarus' "death"

[dense pike]

True, death got retconned after only 3 days
Brian Griffin stayed dead for longer 😭 🙏

[grand flower]

LMFAOOOO

[leaden rivet]

I’ve noticed often the response to one piece criticisms is just like the most insane straw mans ever and it’s quite nauseous to talk about.

[grand flower]

got revived by a deus ex machina btw

Bestseller, beloved classic

[clever idol]

Yea thats not my argument at all

[leaden rivet]

Being upset about fake out deaths does not equal that you think everyone should die

[grand flower]

But Oda does it!

[leaden rivet]

Good.

[dense pike]

Yes!!

[clever idol]

Im specifically talking about the instances im which oda does his fakeouts here

[hot cairn]

https://tenor.com/view/meme-gif-14770887436103544323

[grand flower]

Reading Greek myth and going wtf is this shit when people just walk in and out of Hades

Sick of these fake outs

[signal fiber]

I'm so Oda pilled I'm immune to fake death negative effects

[leaden rivet]

Especially when in general, you built up such a beautiful scene and ending to a character just to be like actually he’s still alive

I want to talk shit about some other series right now

But it’s not worth the warn

[dense pike]

true, same

[signal fiber]

Dw the LA will kill Pell for real

[trim lily]

common LA w

make it the main canon of one piece from now on

[ruby moat]

they should restart the manga to follow the live action and have boichi do the illustrations

[signal fiber]

I just rewatched in prep for season 2. What a delightful show

[hot cairn]

me too, but I get not liking fake out deaths. Tho I don’t really mind, I like OP too much lol

[leaden rivet]

Would be kinda crazy to start the one piece manga with Garp sending yonko level assassins against East blue Luffy

You mean Luffy didn’t beat Mihawk?! And now he’s dead?!

[leaden rivet]

You’re a pretty good balance between the one piece dickriders here and the cynics

[signal fiber]

Jokes aside I'm not effected by fake death, but it has a weird secondary effect. When Ashura and Izo were actually dead i was like "wtf really? Oh idgaf"

[grand flower]

Ey you know what actually

[formal wagon]

unironically

[grand flower]

Fake out death discourse is tired

[clever idol]

Yea this is certainly one way to look at it. However I am saying an alternative perspective which I think aligns with his intention more is he is tryinf to both capture the spirit of sacrifice and the spirit of survival here. Which is where a lot of the romanticization comes from. For me personally the fakouts never really bothered me cuz a lot of one piece is just sitting in the tragedy and joy of surviving the tragedy. I also just tend to want things to turn out well for characters too

[trim lily]

jesus is the perfect midpoint in the gradient

[formal wagon]

nvm mackenyu's acting just flashed into my brain i take that back

[grand flower]

The same poorly thought criticisms get boring to read

[leaden rivet]

I can see the future. He’ll be a prominent member of pirate folk one day.

[signal fiber]

He knew Mihawk would like his hat

[grand flower]

Let’s talk about fake out victories

You know I’m sure all the people saying

[ruby moat]

They got a bunch of one piece merch at the store I work at but it’s all based on the live action characters it’s like sorta uncanny valley

[grand flower]

“Well Oda is cheating you out of your emotions!”

They’re gonna say the same here rihht?

[dense pike]

Even if a character gets confirmed dead by the narrator, we know even the narrator is in on the propaganda campaign 🤫
The Teller Men tell all

[hot cairn]

the Garp plotline is the worst part of the live action for me, I wasnt a fan of the added Garp/Koby/Helmeppo added scenes. I think they cut a lot of character work from Usopp and Sanji’s arcs to make space for that

[grand flower]

How am I supposed to believe in a victory if Oda is just gonna have the bad guy get up?

Isn’t that kinda cheap?

Writing so the characters are celebrating

Big dramatic impact from the move

Making ME believe it’s over

[clever idol]

Oh this is a good one

[grand flower]

Ans then it’s not???

What bullshit

[signal fiber]

While I agree, Helmeppos actor is just wonderful

[leaden rivet]

He’s trying to have his cake and eat it too

[grand flower]

Stories aren’t allowed to lie to me

[leaden rivet]

Is essentially what you’re saying

[clever idol]

Exactly

[leaden rivet]

Look I killed this guy everyone be sad! Just kidding he’ll be back after the break

[clever idol]

But also hes trying to let us have our cake and eat it too

[hot cairn]

I try to hear everyone out, critcism aint bad at all. I LOVE One Piece, but I know it isn’t perfect. Even if I talk about it like it is

[ruby moat]

U don’t tell them that

[leaden rivet]

I don’t want to eat the cake Albair

[hot cairn]

LMAO

[leaden rivet]

I hate cake

[clever idol]

We dont talk enough about how emotionally manipulative he is lmaoo

[leaden rivet]

Especially chocolate cake

Disgusting piece of shit

[grand flower]

How am I supposed to believe Bajrang gun took down Kaido if Lucci is just gonna get up from a gigant pistol?

“I’m losing consciousness” my ass

[hot cairn]

ngl those “wait 10 minutes for Luffy to get back up” at the end of Dressrosa was crazy

[grand flower]

Let’s talk about fake out allegiances

[leaden rivet]

You hear people out so that’s good enough for me

[clever idol]

I know exactlg which epiaode this is from

[grand flower]

I’m supposed to believe Crocodile is on Mihawk’s side?

[signal fiber]

What. Bajrang Gun is like getting hit by Manhatten

[grand flower]

Not when Oda faked me out with pudding!

[leaden rivet]

All jokes aside Albair

[grand flower]

Ans Kanjuro!

I can’t believe in ANY friendships when I’ve seen betrayals!

[hot cairn]

oh yeah that guy knocked it out of the park

[leaden rivet]

For you, it’s fine because you want to see the characters happy no matter what, but can you also understand why people don’t want to see such a beautifully set up death scene wasted because they’re not actually dead?

[clever idol]

I dont think its a waste at all

[grand flower]

It’s not a waste

[clever idol]

Its about the sentiment

[leaden rivet]

Ok

[grand flower]

The drama of the desth scene reminds you why you want them to live

So when you get what you want

It’s cathartic

[leaden rivet]

Do you think death serves a narrative purpose Albair

[clever idol]

Of course

[grand flower]

That’s how story structure works

[wraith mantle]

Even molten lava chocolate cake?

[grand flower]

The desth scenes are still used for something

[leaden rivet]

Do you think the sentiment about one’s death isn’t at all effected by them actually dying

[grand flower]

In tjis case, it’s used to make the survival harder hitting

[leaden rivet]

This unironically made my stomach turn

[wraith mantle]

Damn

[grand flower]

I’ve yet to see anyone explain why Oda isn’t allowed to do this

[glacial bear]

Emotion!

[heady lava]

?rank

[grand flower]

Or why this can’t work

[leaden rivet]

People who eat chocolate cake can’t be trusted

[grand flower]

It’s how EVERY fake out works

[wraith mantle]

Was your name brach before?

[grand flower]

Dofy getting up is dramatic because Oda wrote it as though Law won

[glacial bear]

Brach?

What does that mean

[wraith mantle]

There was a regular here whose name started with brach or bach

[grand flower]

You’re not sitting there going “but you just wrote law winning you can’t take it back!” Because of this

[leaden rivet]

Brachydiosu

[glacial bear]

Oh. Nah that’s not me

[coral vapor]

have any of yall reread the series multiple times or nah

[grand flower]

Death is the only thing people do this for

[leaden rivet]

@glass plume

[wraith mantle]

That’s the one

[heady lava]

i want blackbeard to not to be there

in op

[grand flower]

To the point that they don’t realize they accept fake outs for everything else

Stories fake out the audience ALL the time

Desth is not exempt

[hot cairn]

yessir, it’s better to hear out people. I would love to be treated with the same respect.

[ruby moat]

Like not in the story at all?

[clever idol]

No because the character themselves were willing to put their life on the line. That sentiment in my opinion is celebrated and rewarded in them getting to survive. I think the crux of the issue here isnt actually the fakeouts themselves but the frequency of how often theyre used. For long time readers its difficult being fully immersed in the scene when the track record is what it is. Which is 100% fair imo

[grand flower]

I’ve yet to see a single argument to why Oda can’t turn the dread of watching a character die into the relief in seeing a miracle

There’s NO good reason he can’t lol

“But then you don’t believe desth”

They gunned Yasui down like a dog

I bet your ass believed that

[clever idol]

Yea but doffy did that like 5 times in dressrosa

To law

[heady lava]

blackbeard is nothing but a pain

[clever idol]

God oda put law through the ringer

[hot cairn]

LMAOO, I just saw this. Yeah I think those deaths were like uncermonious for Oda’s usual writing. I don’t if it was a me thing but I didn’t got the feeling that they died.

[leaden rivet]

Wouldn’t you say the impact of a sacrifice is heightened should they actually die from it? Being willing to put your life on the line is one thin, actually dying makes the tragedy several times stronger.

Like for me, Ace willing to die for Luffy causes great emotion on its own, but him actually dying is truly what makes the scene

And it’s for nearly every major one piece death

[buoyant walrus]

fax the ep 1000 kinemon fake death was too much

and then he fake dies to kaido later again like bruh

[grand flower]

That’s the flaw here

[buoyant walrus]

maybe its the way the anime showed it for me but yeah

[grand flower]

It’s not meant to be a tragedy

The writing behind the tragedy is being used for something else

[leaden rivet]

For me I don’t care about the frequency of fake our deaths moreso the issue is if they put a strong amount of emotion behind them actually dying just for them not to die

[grand flower]

Why doesn’t this make them surviving more impactful??

[ruby moat]

I’m not sure if this one was meant to be a death at all. His second one where he got stabbed def is a fake out death but I think he just got rly fucked up on this one

[leaden rivet]

Like If you set up a scene where everyone’s crying and someone gets their last words off before blowing them selves up

[grand flower]

If you’re sitting there feeling sad theyre dying how does that not make it MORE relieving that they don’t?

[leaden rivet]

And then they walk out just fine

It’s so

[grand flower]

Is it not sad because you want them to not die?

[leaden rivet]

I don’t know what to call it

[grand flower]

This makes no sense man

It’s sad, meaning you want them to live

But it’s ruined cause they live?

[clever idol]

Sure I can agree with that But here's the thing that more often than not that is how these moments play out. It's just predominantly in backstories. Where the despair typically lives. The present in the story I see it as oda trying to let joy be more prominent. At least thats the trend ive noticed.

[buoyant walrus]

wdym not meant to be a death

[grand flower]

If you didn’t want them to live then how was the desth scene valuable in the first place

[buoyant walrus]

his last words heavily imply hes gonna die and that luffy must carry on his duty for hum

although it might js be how the anime did it, idj

[ruby moat]

Well he couldn’t fight anymore so luffy would be carrying out the duty of fighting kaido for him

[grand flower]

The chapter where Kinemon’s attacked by Kaido

If you revisit it, it’s not meant for us to think Kinemon is dead

[buoyant walrus]

ive watched that scene around 5 times but i havent read it so i cant say for sure

[ruby moat]

It’s the one right before red roc right?

[grand flower]

The theme for that chapter is the samurai won’t give in to the beast pirates attempts to fill them with despair

That’s why the dialogue throughout the chapter is about Luffy losing

[buoyant walrus]

yea the one w red roc

[grand flower]

The point of the Kinemon scene is for Momo

Momo sees Kiku get stabbed and Kinemon get bludgeoned

[buoyant walrus]

ill go back and read it some time but from the animes pov it def felt like it

[grand flower]

Instead of giving into tje despair that made him feel he made the announcement

[ruby moat]

Yea right before red roc, luffy tells law to tp all the scabbards downstairs bc they were out of the fight and heavily injured but not dead yet

[grand flower]

Yeah go back to that chap

Kinemon getting bludgeoned is for Momo

Momo declaring they will win despite his grief is what’s for us

That’s why the complaints that Kinemon’s survival undermines the scene is invalid

[hot cairn]

wasnt enough

[grand flower]

Even if WE knew rihht then ans there he didn’t die

[leaden rivet]

I feel as if such a dichotomy is unnecessary. It’s perfectly fine for Oda to prioritize joy and happiness in the current day and trauma in backstories,…but it doesn’t mean that joy shouldn’t exist in backstories and the opposite. I understand what you’re saying, you’re explaining the point of what Oda is doing. And I don’t disagree that this is what he’s doing. I just don’t like the way he does it

[grand flower]

All that mattered is that Momo didn’t know he survived

Becausw it makes it more powerful that Momo declares they will win

[clever idol]

Was thinking about this the other day. That scene is actually just kaido mocking samurai more than its about kinemon dying. Kaido mentions how he likes the samurai because theyre willing to die for what they believe. Kaido is more interested in this idyllic version of the samurai in his head. So when hes actually faced with a samurai that doesnt look like the cool version in his head hes disgusted and then goes on to mock him. Almost as if to say "your role is done. You lost now just die"

[grand flower]

we do get joy in backstories and tragedy in the present

[trim lily]

i dont know if this point was brought up already, but in that case then what benefit is there to making him survive it

[grand flower]

What I’m about to say to Albair

[grand flower]

Yeah another reason kinemons survival was impoetant is because it proved Kaido wrong

Kaido is going on tje entire raid about futility

[hot cairn]

ep 1015 just made it feel like if he died. I noticed many reactors thought he did

[clever idol]

Yea thats fair. Especially on the joy piece being potentially more prominent in backstories.

[grand flower]

It’s essentially Kaido going “there is no reason to hope” vs Luffy going “there is always reason to hope”

Kaido leaves that scene sayin a warrior should embrace death when it’s inevitable

[ruby moat]

Ah okay

[clever idol]

Kaido is weakest where it matters most tbh

[grand flower]

Saying that the samurai continuing to fight is wrong becausw there is no reason to hope

That’s why it’s that same chatter that Sanji tells chopper to stop crying

“How many miracles have you seen since you joined this crew?”

[clever idol]

Honestly the more I think about him the more I realize theres more there than I previously think.

[grand flower]

The fact that kinemon survives becausw of something that’s complete happenstance proves Kaido wrong

There is ALWAYS reason to hope

[grand flower]

It’s not a trick

It’s not something he planned

It’s the pure blind luck of

Law never fixed Kinemon

[hot cairn]

Wano is sososo good man

[grand flower]

Oda let us forget about that for 300 chapters to sell thus exact message

Niggas don’t have to like it tbh

But you canr call it bad writing

You truly wouldn’t know what you’re talking about to do so

[clever idol]

We don't talk enough about how yamato's imitation of oden lived is a direct reflect of kaido imitating how oden (wb and roger too) died

[leaden rivet]

I think you can strike an appropriate balance of it. Death hits harder than most things in fiction because the finality of it. It’s different from any other narrative piece in fiction because of that. A lot of the times when Oda actually kills people he does it very well, because Oda already has you tugging at your heart strings prior and the true death is the perfect finisher. But when he sets that all up just for everyone to live….thays why people constantly complain of it.

[grand flower]

It’s not just that

It’s an inverse of Momo becoming a dragon like Kaido

Yamato, Momo, Kaido and Oden have a LITANY of parallels between them

Like people who say Kaidos backstory is back are hacks

[clever idol]

Both r trying to capture the spirit of oden's last moments but only one of them understands it

[grand flower]

They never talk about how oden ans Kaido were both unruly and powerful since childhood

And their leaders both got rid of them when they felt like they were out of control

[trim lily]

to me it sort of feels like hes cheating in trying to get both an emotional finale/farewell while also keeping the character for later

[grand flower]

Or how both of their sons were born on pirate ships then came to Wano

[grand flower]

It’s not cheating when he’s using it for a different emotional pay off

It’s the same principle as walking into the store ans buying something you need without issue

[leaden rivet]

That’s exactly what it is. He’s trying to have his cake and eat it too.

[grand flower]

V/S getting if after rushing to the store because one was left in stock

[leaden rivet]

Oh no guys Vegapunk is dead everyone cry, just kidding he’s actually still alive in all these prepared satellites

[grand flower]

Tension builds relief

[leaden rivet]

Not that anyone gave a shit about vegapunk anyway

But it’s still annoying to say the least

[grand flower]

The way people talk about is completely wrong

Relief doesnr undermine tension

They build on each other

[trim lily]

its kind of what annoyed me with the satellites/punks in egghead, where yes it would make sense for vegapunk to have backups but the tone of everything made it seem like this was the end of him and every sacrifice mattered

[leaden rivet]

Yep

[grand flower]

That’s why I brought up the Dofy scenes from before

[hot cairn]

isn’t Stella dead?