also-manga

[glass plume]

y'all know the name of Robin Hoods neighbor?

[stone terrace]

Oh yeah oden shouldve seen that too

You mean not one person on wano could do that?

[ashen perch]

he was the strongest so if he wasnt doing it, nobody was

[stone terrace]

Hyo...

[ashen perch]

I mean you can make contact with internal destruction too, we also saw that in act 2

did Hyo clash with anyone who also had it? thats the new thing to Oden

[distant vine]

Idk how to expound upon this critique but my gut feeling is Oda is half assing something

And it makes action more confusing and bland than it needs to be

[golden valley]

I assumed luffy did pure contact on Kaido because

1.) red roc requires direct contact to ignite on fire (the opponent)
2.) luffy was G4 and to not waste Haki projecting it from a distance, more contact makes sense plus Im pretty sure internal + direct contact = “more damage” like to the exterior layer at least assuming you can hurt them

[glass plume]

half assing what?

[distant vine]

I gotta think on it more

[ashen perch]

contact v no contact, both still internal destruction

[small ember]

Both still hurt if I could guess

[ashen perch]

oh right, the neck collar too, also required contact

[small ember]

Man imagine just getting a high speed Luffy punch and he ruptures your organs on top of it

[ashen perch]

Rayleigh blew it up from the inside after grabbing it, Luffy too, and Luffy also broke Yamato's cuffs with that too

[golden valley]

Thats why its wild op characters just take internal attacks

Even in pre timeskip

Usopp took an internal attack from that dial

[pine scaffold]

https://fxtwitter.com/bisphonate/status/1987786965698404819

約款 (@bisphonate)

血統

**💬 5 🔁 911 ❤️ 6.4K 👁️ 63.5K **

FxTwitter · Nov 10, 2025, 7:38 AM

[proud pivot]

Sick

[small ember]

Yeah I love it. Like oh yeah my small intestine is liquified but you’re not ready for my next attack

[golden valley]

Oh and BM got shredded INTERNALLY by puncture wille and still was talking shit and flexing Haki

[ashen perch]

I disagree, his only issue is that he likes to keep things moving without explaining how powers work, but thats a weird philosophy he has and not equivalent to him not trying lol

[ashen perch]

and it was her brain too

she's just built different tho, so theres that

Kaido and her both

[small ember]

Doctors in op must hate this

[ashen perch]

a good example is Doflamingo v Kaido in how they took Gamma Knife

that was maybe 5% of the damage that Kaido took throughout that whole fight

while Doffy was dying if he hadnt stitched his organs up

[small ember]

God knows how much internal damage WB took

[ashen perch]

Kaido didnt even think about his heart being Gamma Knife'd after that one, which was insane

[tranquil blade]

Idk most of WB's damage was external

Except the magma

[small ember]

Yeah that’s what I was thinking of

Magma in your thoracic cavity

Ow

[ashen perch]

yeah the magma was the big one that really must have hurt

and he is no Kaido and BM too

well he might be a Buccaneer idk but thats not necessarily giving him the same type of durability as them at that age

[golden valley]

Well, the admiral attacks were pretty easily piercing WB, so unless his organs are really small and they were just missing, his internals would’ve been rlly cooked. I think the fact he still fought with half a brain shows that internal injuries isn’t immediately putting him down tho

[glass plume]

Whitebeard is such a champ

what's your favorite Whitebeard moment?

[golden valley]

It still just baffles me WB disrespect came out of GV

[carmine frigate]

when Whitebeard hugged squard after his betrayal

[glass plume]

this is my favorite moment

[glass plume]

you and me both 🤝

[golden valley]

I think WB’s introduction to MF is my fav tbh and the hype leading up to it

[native seal]

has to be his final speech for me

[golden valley]

https://scans-hot.planeptune.us/manga/One-Piece-Digital-Colored-Comics/0551-015.png

https://scans-hot.planeptune.us/manga/One-Piece-Digital-Colored-Comics/0551-016.png

[glass plume]

i feel like Whitebeard has unlimited good moments

it's hard for a character to have that, but Oda really nailed it with Whitebeard

[golden valley]

The double pages in MF was just peak and had a large presence

[glass plume]

i can't think of a single moment which i dislike with Whitebeard

[prisma yacht]

Peak

[grand flower]

Oda based WB on an old man he knew

He’s never gonna make WB look bad

[blazing mantle]

Whitebeard still my favorite yonko

[glass plume]

damn i didn't know that...

[cyan meadow]

You all are forgetting something

[blazing mantle]

He died I think

[grand flower]

Yeah guy passed some time ago

[glass plume]

rest in peace 🙏

[grand flower]

WB might be like a tribute to him

[cyan meadow]

how WB js left after seeing demon rocks loll

[grand flower]

lol well he did ask rocks if he was just an impediment

From his POV, Rocks said yeah

IK rocks transformed but at the same time, Zoro didnt tell anyone about Ashura

[wide star]

lol i wonder if oda did that intentionally to show how it circled back around with Rocks son just leaving WB

[cyan meadow]

and? he was with rocks over 10 years
is he stupid to not see rocks growing 3x size, with demon eyes and teeth and fangs?

[grand flower]

Tbf

Zoro developed a move where he grows two heads and 7 arms

[blazing mantle]

Both hands on god valley collapsed

[cyan meadow]

I don’t know, but it just didn’t feel like something WB would do

[grand flower]

And didn’t tell anybody

Chopper was like literally freaking out

[golden valley]

Just pure peak shots throughout the entire arc https://scans-hot.planeptune.us/manga/One-Piece-Digital-Colored-Comics/0557-008.png

[lofty fern]

Why do people keep thinking that just cause you're with someone for years it means that you're close/or that you know them inside and out?

[cyan meadow]

so what's your point? he should have said "oh what happened to you rocks" and not "oh rocks you betrayed me after being with me for over 10 years paying all my bills and shi"

[grand flower]

My point is tjis is a world where sometimes your crew mate will just turn into a demon and them’s the breaks

They didn’t assume rocks was corrupted csuse

That’s the world

[golden valley]

I kinda assumed Roger eventually told WB

[blazing mantle]

This arc had so many spreads

Oda was locked in

[wide star]

if roger & garp could tell he was corrupted that had to as well imo

[grand flower]

If Zoro can just pop up with two heads one day, why should they be suspicious of rock’s suddenly being able to do that

[urban lodge]

It's still a little weird when they saw him get stabbed by an immortal demon

[cyan meadow]

yesh js say he's not loyal or anything
rocks used to pay for every bottle WB used to drink
who even does this? your enemy? loll

[lofty fern]

I doubt Roger even figured it out fully. it's also not really something they'd talk about again

[cyan meadow]

THERE was no need for this betrayal theme in first place tbh

[grand flower]

Again, from the POV of the SHs Zoro spontaneously grew two heads and 7 arms one day

[wide star]

2 people who are your “enemies” could tell you were corrupted but your own crew who been with you for years couldn’t ?

[tranquil blade]

I kinda like how the second Kaido and Big Mom get sent flying they immediately stop talking about Rocks and go back to beefing

[grand flower]

Well that’s what Rocks gets for assembling a crew by strong arming people via Davy back fights against their will

[glass plume]

does Zoro really look lke that tho? isn't that just his "aura" taking that form

[craggy vapor]

believe me y’all, Rocks will get a proper smiling face send-off

[cyan meadow]

I can understand it for crydo and big meme but WB nah

[golden valley]

Unless it was in bad taste where they don’t like talking about the events of GV, I don’t see why they wouldn’t mention Rocks and I don’t think Roger figured it out fully too, but he knew something was clearly up at least

[glass plume]

while being erased?

[lofty fern]

I mean, if the person has a tab who know? Let's ask this same question about the other crew mates. They were around Wang Zhi for the same amount of years and STILL never figured out that he was behind Shakky's kidnapping. A whole year went by and they never figured it out.

[wide star]

yeah it’s a illusion basically

[grand flower]

They don’t care about him

[amber lark]

Guys, how do you survive a weekend without a new manga chapter??? 😢
I need emotional support

[golden valley]

But they heard Rocks cries no?

[craggy vapor]

yes

[wide star]

roger & garp didn’t either , that don’t mean they can’t have enough common sense to tel he is corrupted since physically he DRASTICALLY changed

[craggy vapor]

knowing that my son will finish the job

[wide star]

it don’t take a rocket scientist to realize that

[golden valley]

I think it’s manifested Haki or whatever that’s physical

The whole point of Asura is more swords

[grand flower]

Yeah but Roger and Garp are committed to stopping him

The others have no reason to

[golden valley]

And Zoro can clash at any angle with them

[wide star]

yeah but we see Roger & Garp talk about the way Rocks is acting isn’t adding up cause he isn’t acting like himself .. if those 2 can see that , then your own crew mates should be able to as well

[wraith mantle]

https://fixupx.com/Wenma13_/status/1989435067156873723

Wenma13 (@Wenma13_)

Agenda Piece be funny as hell till you realize niggas is NOT joking

**💬 51 🔁 486 ❤️ 8.0K 👁️ 94.2K **

FixupX · Nov 14, 2025, 8:47 PM

[golden valley]

Yeah but they see that through his crying

[cyan meadow]

WB was with him for over 10 years. Even ussop easily got the difference between demon giants and actual after being with em for literally just a single day. AND WB thinking that rocks betraying him makes absolutely no sense let's be honest here.

[grand flower]

They should have assumed Zoro was cursed ig

[grand flower]

They stuck around long enough to see it

[wide star]

Big Mom also says Rocks got way bigger and we see the big wings and fangs and glowing eyes . common sense should’ve allowed any of them to realize that he wasn’t himself

[grand flower]

Kaido and Big Mom got knocked aside quickly then dipped

Which, yeah, why would they stick around for Rocks

Garp and Roger notice because they keep interacting with Rocks

[golden valley]

Yeah and they still thought it was Rocks

[lofty fern]

The bigger question is why would they? They're both mostly people that live in the now without regrets etc

[grand flower]

You pointed it out yourself, Garp says it because he was observing his actions, expressions, and behavior

[wide star]

right which is why i said they’re dumb for that

[golden valley]

Its not that WB didn’t notice the visual changes

Its that WB didn’t know what was going on

[grand flower]

Kaido, WB, and BM just didn't interact with Rocks long enough to come to the same conclusion

lol

[wide star]

but we already knew kaido and big mom were dumb anyway so it’s not inconsistent at least

[grand flower]

Neither of them are dumb, what

[wide star]

WB though .. smh

[cyan meadow]

IT'S JUST because ROCKS is a RETROACTIVE ADDITION

[lofty fern]

That happened over time. They saw him raging and yet crying and yet saying other things all at the same time. His crew didn't stay for all that

[cyan meadow]

big meme and crydo have total IQ of GARP

so i can understand it for em

[grand flower]

dawg lol why you ignoring that WB interacted with Rocks for a single moment unlike Garp and Roger?

[golden valley]

I think it could always just randomly come up in a conversation, like them recalling their clashes at GV and then it leading into a conversation about Rocks

[lofty fern]

WB is a good person, but he's not a genius. He's actually pretty simple

[grand flower]

[wide star]

even before that his crew pointed out how he looked differently and he was acting different .. that right there would be enough for almost any other crew to realize their captain isn’t being themselves

[cyan meadow]

"genius" 😭

[leaden rivet]

He just assumed rocks betrayed him

[leaden rivet]

And then just abandoned him to die

[wide star]

zoro isn’t attacking them or acting differently .. he just did a attack that looked weird to them

[lofty fern]

Maybe, though at that point they had several other clashes they could probably talk over, Rocks was probably a sad point for Roger and what he had to do so why bring it up? And none of the Rocks pirates seem to bring up Rocks ever again

[golden valley]

https://scans-hot.planeptune.us/manga/One-Piece/1164-002.png

WB doesn’t know whats wrong with Rocks, immediately after, Rocks attacks

[lofty fern]

He could have had a DF he was hiding or some power up for all they know. A person suddenly changing and then attacking their allies is actually not shocking.

[cyan meadow]

you don’t have to be a genius to understand the difference between your captain, who was fighting with you a minute ago, and someone who just got stabbed a minute ago and suddenly grew three times in size with demon eyes and teeth lmao

[golden valley]

They’re left in the dark right then and there

[golden valley]

The automatic assumption isn’t gonna be mind control lol

[wide star]

if Luffy or any other yonko or roger grew wings and grew in size and had glowing eyes and was acting weird and not like themselves , every crew member would.know something happened to them to where they aren’t being themselves and not just assume they crashed out for no reason

[golden valley]

From a reader perspective, we would automatically assume that

Not the characters

[prisma yacht]

The crew wasn't close enough to care that much

[tough igloo]

tbf the rocks pirates aren’t that smart lol

we know big mom got mental issues

[lofty fern]

Imagine this. Hody Jones was hiding his steroid pills and then suddenly takes them and hulks out to the surprise of his crew. He's so out of his mind he starts attacking them. Why would they suddenly suspect he'd been taken over or something?

[cyan meadow]

Ussop got the difference between actual giants and DR giants so your point is completely invalid

ok bro comparing someone like hody jones to rocks

nevermind

[golden valley]

Not only that, but DR Rocks is able to comprehend and respond, which gives even less reason to assume control https://scans-hot.planeptune.us/manga/One-Piece/1164-008.png

[lofty fern]

He's only really hoping from what he already knows about their characters, but even Usopp has no proof of anything

[urban lodge]

Yesss

[tough igloo]

that yes isn’t normal

that’s a possessed yes lol

[lofty fern]

Is there a difference? Not in the person but in the hypothetical situation?

[golden valley]

Because he knows the giants btw

[cyan meadow]

AND? he didn't started saying yo giants betrayed me and blah blah
his first reaction was what happened to you all

[glass plume]

what's a possessed yes?

[cyan meadow]

for 1 day TEARS

[golden valley]

He knows that stands against what they believe in

[golden valley]

He knows theyre like dorry and brogy lol

[tough igloo]

in movies and shows , when someone is possessed or when demons/devils involved they drag out their words like that

[cyan meadow]

WHAT??

[tranquil blade]

See in their position I'd probably understand that it isn't normal, but I may just be smarter than those 3 pirates

[golden valley]

They were not thinkin like this man

[glass plume]

yeah, but i don't know how Whitebeard was supposed to tell

[golden valley]

Whats confusing? Dorry and Brogy crew are warriors

[glass plume]

Whitebeard just heard his captain say yes to him that they only are impedents

[golden valley]

What they stand for

Is against DR

Usopp knows this

[tough igloo]

i’m not saying they were , i already said they should’ve realized from his appearance alone but i never thought the rocks pirates were smart anyway so im not surprised by it

[golden valley]

Usopp knows thats out of character

[lofty fern]

Usopp is much closer to the giants and considers them friends, so of course his mind goes to the first coping mechanism explanation he can find. The Rocks Pirates aren't that. They are used to and defined by greed and betrayal. So yes, their first response is: you betrayed me.

[cyan meadow]

bro saying anything lmao

[golden valley]

Huh

[tough igloo]

specifically big mom and kaido

[glass plume]

the Rocks pirates weren't built on trust to start with, so i don't think they thought two steps ahead with Xebec being able to betray them

[golden valley]

Genuinely what are u talking about

Usopp knows what they stand for because of their interactions all the way from little garden to now

[lofty fern]

Even that can be explained by "oh, you have some special power you never told us about". That's not unusual and despite being together for years they still hide things from each other and don't tell each other everything.

[cyan meadow]

brain-dead take literally

WB : “Damn Rocks… I should’ve known this was how you’ve always felt about us all these years, all it took was for you to launch yourself into a selfless battle to save your family something I find extremely noble considering my own dream, battle and get stabbed by what I can only assume is the Devil Himself on top of that spider creature, then have a literal spell put on you before my very eyes in order for you to finally reveal how you truly seen us 🤓”

[wet condor]

The thing is Rocks was just attacking some weird black entity

He's stabbed by it, undergoes a transformation, stops attacking it, and then begins attacking them

They're actually confused by the situation

[cyan meadow]

confusing for someone with no brain ok

[hot cairn]

@digital spear can you send me the list of the things that are left to be shown in the flashback?

[cyan meadow]

or someone who's blind

[lofty fern]

You do know WB has no idea Rocks even had a family, right?

[ruby moat]

Why is this guy so hostile

[tough igloo]

it can’t though cause rocks already told them the power he was trying to get and they been with him for years since then and know he didn’t get it yet.. just like everybody in elbaf immediately knew something was up with the domi reversi people cause the weren’t acting or look like themselves , then if not Big Mom & Kaido , then at least WB should’ve realized the same thing

[wet condor]

You can say they eventually rationalize it as they figured he betrayed them, but I also think it's just a rationalization born out of them not caring

[cyan meadow]

make sense WB gotta be blind
no wonder he couldn't find difference between rocks and his child

[ornate tartan]

no one knows rocks has a family except harald lol

[lofty fern]

Again, because Rocks HID stuff from his crew

[wet condor]

Like they suppose it's "betrayal" but they also don't care that much either

[golden valley]

This is not a good argument. Xebec still wasn’t truthful with his crew

[tough igloo]

Rocks didn’t hide the DF stuff from his crew so he would have no reason to hide the fact he ate it

that don’t even make sense

ima tell y’all what i’m trying to get but don’t tell you when i get it

[golden valley]

again, rocks is not truthful with his crew

[cyan meadow]

Rocks: gets stabbed, grows like 3 times larger, gets fangs and a fucking pair of wings then powers up and starts attacking his crew

Whitebeard: "I cant believe he betrayed me 🥺"

[golden valley]

Your argument doesn’t really make sense because people can be dishonest

[ornate tartan]

WB never said that

where’s the panel of him saying that

[lofty fern]

Yeah, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have other powers. Or he could have been lying to them and already had a power and was playing them. This is new to all of them. Even with Elbaph they already knew the HKs were at work. Here everything is coming out of the blue.

[cyan meadow]

this is bad, real bad.. all your saying is just cope

[tough igloo]

i’m specifically talking about the DF stuff , he was truthful with his crew about that .. Rocksnot telling them about his family is completely separate from him telling them about something they already talked about

[golden valley]

Also, it doesn’t even need to boil down to Rocks having a secret power, the assumption could also be that Rocks struck a deal FOR power

[cyan meadow]

this is the type of shit that makes you questioning if one piece will be disappointing in the end

[lofty fern]

We know he didn't trust his crew. He only told them something, he never told them everything

[golden valley]

Your basis hinges on the idea they’d assume Rocks would inherently be truthful

[ornate tartan]

bro what r u talking about😂

[golden valley]

That

[wet condor]

I think they just didn't care that much either

[golden valley]

Is not based on anything

[wet condor]

They aren't close

[tough igloo]

he didn’t trust them with his FAMILY and that’s it lol hats literally the only thing he told harald that he hid from his crew .. not trusting pirates with your family is completely normal and different than telling them about a goal that y’all already agreed on

[cyan meadow]

we getting similar reaction when OP will be revealed 💔✌️

[leaden rivet]

Big mom unironically is probably the smartest pirate there

[golden valley]

“Rocks told them he wanted two specific DF’s, so therefore he wouldn’t lie about having a secret power” — IS NOT what they are thinking as far as we know

[ornate tartan]

no matter what it is people gonna complain

dk what u mean by this

[lofty fern]

how do THEY know that? We know that as the audience, buy why would a hardened pirate believe he's being told everything? Especially when we know for a fact that Rocks kept secrets just like all of them did?

[leaden rivet]

It seemed like they were close when Whitebeard stood with him at the end

And Whitebeard actually seems kinda hurt by rocks betrayal

“Was that all we were to you?” At least felt like that

[wet condor]

Whitebeard is the only guy there who I think felt any sort of obligation to Rocks. I still don't think they were that close though

[lofty fern]

We know that, but how do THEY know that? They all don't trust each other to tell the whole truth as it is. Why should this be any different?

[cyan meadow]

YES obviously no amount of tresure can justify 30 years of wait
WE getting slandered to oblivion by other anime fandom

[rose rune]

Making Oden's betrayal sting even more... 😔

[tough igloo]

because we know rocks already shared his goal about the DFs with them and they all agreed to the goal and know what he’s trying to do ..they would have ZERO reason to believe he would hide that and he wouldn’t need to hide that since they already know about it

[leaden rivet]

I feel like they were close enough to the point where Whitebeard shouldn’t have left rocks to die

[wet condor]

Not even obligation... just some level of companionship I guess

[sage temple]

https://tenor.com/view/akira-leave-me-alone-leave-me-alone-meme-gif-6420351794930725971

[rose rune]

"In the end. Everyone will betray you..." whitebeard 2025

[wet condor]

Mmm, if that's the case he wouldn't've left.

[cyan meadow]

WB gotta be dumbfuck to think something like that bfr

[golden valley]

The premise is that it changes after seeing Rocks change

You’re talking about two different timeframes

[tranquil blade]

Well most of the time I'd probably agree, though she has her dumb moments

[golden valley]

The whole point is after, not before

[leaden rivet]

It’s not just the look, it’s a compilation of everything that should’ve made them realize rocks was clearly not in control

He just randomly switched up on them after getting stabbed by an evil demon and then turned into an evil demon

[wet condor]

yeah, he just stops attacking it

then attacks them

his pupils are gone

[ornate tartan]

Yall are overestimating the extent these guys were loyal to rocks

[leaden rivet]

He completely contradicts his entire behavior the entire time

[wet condor]

he's grown several feet

Like he just does a complete 180 on the way he was acting beforehand

[ornate tartan]

what was the first thing WB said when they landed on God valley?😂😂 how yall forget so fast

[wet condor]

And they're actually confused by it

[leaden rivet]

Like a single moment after he got stabbed. You can be Luffy level dumb and realize something was done to him

[lofty fern]

And how do they now know he isn't holding back anything else or even that he isn't just lying through his teeth? You're trying to impress your trust of Rocky's words on to them. You say they have 0 reason believe he's hiding something, when I would say they also have ZERO reason not to fully believe him either. These are shifty suspicious pirates. They're never going to give someone the benefit of the doubt. That's how you get a knife between your ribs.

[wet condor]

"Ouch Rocks what are you doing?!"

[leaden rivet]

I saw that as just banter. In the end he still stood by rocks against Imu when he had no reason to do so.

[wet condor]

"Are you attacking your own people?!"

[tough igloo]

no cause it’s as simple as they would have no reason to think Rocka was hiding that DF power when he already shared that goal with them and they been with him for years since then and now he finally decided to show it .. like if we being fr that shit don’t make no sense for them to think that .. it’s as simple as they saw rocks change and start attacking different and said fuck it he betrayed us and left .. trying to say they thought he hid a DF is just cope to excuse them for thinking that

[golden valley]

“Control” isn’t the automatic assumption. They could have just assumed that Rocks made a deal with that black goo

[tranquil blade]

I mean Whitebeard was willing to fight with Rocks over a simple tab with no actual reward for him, it's not like Whitebeard was just waiting for the chance to betray Rocks or anything

[ornate tartan]

Yeah he has a good character, but I don’t think Kaido and Linlin are as loyal as WB was

[tranquil blade]

The idea that he just didnt give a shit at all just seems untrue

[ornate tartan]

Linlin only came to attack Kaido

and Kaido was just testing his new powers

[tranquil blade]

Big Mom didn't care about Rocks and Kaido was young and naive so I understand why they would react that way even if I find it dumb

[leaden rivet]

Control is the best assumption to make of why he suddenly and randomly switched up on his crew, and randomly grew several demonic parts and became bigger.

[lofty fern]

it was fine then, but when it seemed like Rocks took advantage of that, he left.

[leaden rivet]

Im mostly bothered by Whitebeard leaving rocks to die.

He’s just kinda like oh well we got betrayed time to move on

[golden valley]

Stop conflating the timeframes, what Rocks told them is irrelevant to the now because the argument is “Oh, so you had a secret power all along”, the whole point is that it’s a betrayal, their perceived notion of Rocks no longer applies. I don’t necessarily even believe they thought he had a secret unrevealed power, but I’m steelmanning and just saying your argument doesn’t disprove that notion

[tranquil blade]

I don't really see any justification for Whitebeard not sensing something is up unless he is just not that smart of a guy

[tough igloo]

exactly that’s the same thing i said , them reacting like that is consistent with the type of characters they are cause they ain’t that smart

WB is the only one that’s surprising to me

[ornate tartan]

WB not sensing something is wrong was weirder then the other 2

[tough igloo]

exactly lmao

[tranquil blade]

"He could have a devil fruit that he was hiding?" Okay?

[tough igloo]

but mf’s wanna defend that

[urban lodge]

Is stabbed by the immortal demon he was attacking 2 minutes prior, becomes an immortal demon himself

[lofty fern]

I think people are expecting a lot of WB when they probably shouldn't. 1) he's not yet the man we later see at Marineford 2) he was never loyal to rocks, though he's not going to leave a guy in the lurch, on the other hand, he's not going to stick around for the guy either

[golden valley]

Idk about that, because you can just make the argument “Who’s abilities are capable of controlling someone like Rocks?” Given Haki, this wouldn’t be their automatic assumption

[lofty fern]

if he betrayed him

[leaden rivet]

The gigantic demon that just face tanked all their attacks perhaps?

[ornate tartan]

I guess this was just the easiest way to remove them from the fight

[lofty fern]

They don't know what it was, just some weird monster

[wet condor]

You don't think the weird black demon could possibly have a role into why Rocks is acting completely different form before?

[golden valley]

They didn’t know whether their attacks worked or not

[wet condor]

That ain't cross they minds?

At all?

[leaden rivet]

The distinction doesn’t matter.

[golden valley]

Thats why Roger questions it

[prisma yacht]

Even roger and garp weren't able to figure out what was going wrong
If it wasn't for the voat

[tranquil blade]

Gets picked up and poked by this giant demon monster, gets dropped to the ground, gets up and starts talking about "purging names from history" and attacking everyone standing in front of him, all I'm gonna is in Whitebeard's position I wouldn't have just written that off as Rocks randomly switching sides for no reason

[wide star]

yeah i just gotta accept the fact that WB was just as dumb as Kaido & Big Mom on the day of god valley .. he got smarter as he got older later on lol

[ornate tartan]

Rocks asks Roger and Garp to kill him with VOAT before he attacks them

[lofty fern]

Actually did they even realize it hasn't been destroyed? Roger and Garp eventually do but Kaido and BM are just arguing the whole time

[leaden rivet]

That was more incredulous than a question

[wet condor]

These strange entity, whose powers we're not familiar with, might not be the source?

[golden valley]

Tbf, if WB did hear allat, he is a dumbass

[leaden rivet]

Roger was incredulous that their attacks did completely nothing

[golden valley]

But my assumption is that he didn’t

[leaden rivet]

Big mom iq upscale

[wet condor]

Ohhhh

"What did it do to you"

Hmmmm

[leaden rivet]

Only one that’s not a fucking moron

[wet condor]

I ain't even see that lol

[leaden rivet]

Her leaving makes sense cause she doesn’t care

Whitebeard is just a moron

[wide star]

• Rocks tells Kaido & WB they’re fighting the world

• Rocks is perfectly fine before going up to fight Imu

• they see rocks is up there with Imu alone

• Rocks comes back down and is completely different

WB, Kaido & Big Mom : rocks what are your doing !! you betrayed us 🤦🏾‍♂️🙂‍↔️

[golden valley]

Eh, hes still being suspicious of whether the attack had an effect, even if it leans both ways, they still don’t know what Imu is

[prisma yacht]

His actions and his facial expression weren't matching

And this was on top of voat

Which was a completely different scenario when wb bm kaido were attacked

[lofty fern]

I think it took even him about halfway through Imu and Davy's talk to realize they hadn't destroyed the thing

[urban lodge]

This is why I think this was never the original plan

It's so dumb

[lofty fern]

The "world" is a pretty weird word choice, what are they supposed to get from that. And we don't know howhow much they actually saw. Imu and Rocks are like halfway into conversation before they even realize they didn't kill the thing

[cyan meadow]

cope

[prisma yacht]

Wdym cope

😭

[lofty fern]

Pay no attention to the new guy, it's all he can say

[prisma yacht]

If u think it was dumb for wb to not notice

[wide star]

at the very least they know they’re fighting something so powerful that Rocks called it the world and they could all feel its haki

[prisma yacht]

The whole top 6 guys were dumb too

[wide star]

they didn’t have enough common sense to think that monster who’s haki the entire island felt , that rocks is up there fighting alone could’ve did something to Rocks 🤔🤦🏾‍♂️😂

[leaden rivet]

This panel actually pmo. Obviously demonic looking rocks who just got stabbed by demonic looking being randomly betrays his crew and Whitebeard says this dumb shit

[urban lodge]

Wholesome chungus Rocks wasn't the original plan, so Oda needed to come up with an excuse

[cyan meadow]

"world is pretty weird word choice" lmao

[leaden rivet]

Im only really annoyed by WB here since he seems to care

[lofty fern]

Eh, the "world" is meaningless as a power term. We know what he's talking about but they have no idea. I doubt Kaido was even paying attention and WB has already been shown to not be that observant

[prisma yacht]

It is vague bro wtf

[cyan meadow]

Funny part is that Domi Reversi Xebec wouldn't even need to be necessary to justify the end of the Rocks Pirates

[ornate tartan]

why’s that

[golden valley]

I think the issue is yall are inputting your perspective based on pre-existing knowledge of what we as the reader can see and applying it to the characters 😭

Control is just not going to be the automatic assumption, especially of Rocks caliber.

[cyan meadow]

All xebec was needed to do was die

[wide star]

it isn’t meaningless when the thing that Rocks called the world is letting the entire island know with its haki that nobody can fuck with it ..: maybe the monster that Rocks called the world who has insane haki did something to rocks .. but i guess the future yonkos ain’t smart enough to think that deep lol

[lofty fern]

Care only goes so far

[cyan meadow]

We have already seen in MF of how captain is only one who sticks the whole crew .As long as he dies in the story, the end of the Rocks Pirates is sealed

[stone terrace]

I dont think there was an orignal plan

[leaden rivet]

Cares enough to risk his life

That’s a pretty far care

[stone terrace]

Oda just wrote god valley as a concept

[wide star]

Rocks infront of Imu with WB & Kaido “ hey king of the rats so you came to kill me !! “ma i guess they didn’t think about that either when they thought Rocks betrayed them

[lofty fern]

That obviously didn't do it for them

[stone terrace]

And then adlibbed when he got here

[wet condor]

I wish it would've been prelude to the OP

That's what I thought it was going to be

[golden valley]

GV def got changed

And i refuse to believe shakky was the original concept

[wet condor]

Oda may've just started freestyling like Icon was saying

[cyan meadow]

WE saw in MF when akainu punched WB that he was alive without his half head

FORESHADOWING of WB not having an actual brain

[tranquil blade]

GV got changed quite a lot even from what it looked to be in Kuma's flashback

[tough igloo]

facts he was literally with WB & Kaido when he said to Imu “ if it isn’t the king of the rats , so you came to kill me “ to the big monster wit crazy haki lmao they just dumb

[wet condor]

He had an idea, then when we got around closer to it, he started making up the plot details.

But that also feels a little weird to me. It's an event involving all of the greatest pirates that we've ever known. Oda not having a clear idea of what that was going to look like on its introduction, at the outset...

Feels strange to me

[cyan meadow]

Even if the theme of betrayal was so important , there were so many ways to do that

[lofty fern]

Pirates do that all the time. No skin of his nose. But if Rocks attacks him, what's he supposed to do? He's not going to stick around where's he's not wanted. And remember the only reason Roger and Garp stick around ISN'T to help Rocks. That comes later. They're there to protect their crews from being killed. WB doesn't have that worry.

[urban lodge]

It is strange but I think it's very evident that it's the case

[leaden rivet]

Whitebeard very clearly isn’t like other pirates

[tough igloo]

Wang Zhi betrayal already covered that theme so this shit with WB kaido and big mom thinking that wasn’t even needed lol

[lofty fern]

At this time he is

[leaden rivet]

No he doesn’t seem to be that way at all even at this point

[lofty fern]

He has no sons to protect, no friends he holds dear, none of that

[cyan meadow]

even after that there are so many ways to do that and prove kaido's message

[wet condor]

Even here he seems different. Maybe more similar to the others at this point, but still diff

[leaden rivet]

Rocks could’ve actually just betrayed them lol

[wet condor]

Yeah

[lofty fern]

He's nicer, but is he nice enough to stay?

[leaden rivet]

It could even work if Imu has his family

[golden valley]

Oda was kinda afraid of pure evil rocks

[cyan meadow]

YOU ALL dumb take is just trying to hand wave some bad plot "oh the characters dont talk so it makes sense" 😭

No in story it doesnt, they talk, they fucked with Rocks enough to fight an immortal phallus for him and the excuse for why in present day they dont talk fondly of him is "eh they never liked him so it makes sense"

[leaden rivet]

It wouldn’t make rocks look any worse, since he’s still doing it all for his family

[wet condor]

True

[urban lodge]

Coward

[lofty fern]

And again, WB has no idea about the whole family aspect

[tough igloo]

yeah the way kaido came to this conclusion was just dumb as hell and felt rushed … some many other ways could’ve had him do that

[golden valley]

It would’ve honestly been cooler if Rocks was so selfish he just ended up switching up like an unhinged maniac

[urban lodge]

Didn't even need to be pure evil

[deep chasm]

tbh the story made out the rocvks pirates to be mmore disloyal than they actually work

[royal orchid]

wait is sandman posting the truth?

https://fixupx.com/sandman_AP/status/1989282532941263218?t=cB9HNkhQmqEZ2dIjajLD4A&s=19

sandman (@sandman_AP)

Do you think Oda had already planned Haki concept from the start? In 2002, Blackbeard implied Luffy’s Haki was way too strong for a 30 million bounty, but Viz official translation misread and skipped the word Haki.😭 This chapter is the first time Haki ever shows up in the series

**💬 193 🔁 458 ❤️ 7.6K 👁️ 1.81M **

FixupX · Nov 14, 2025, 10:41 AM

[urban lodge]

But his presentation is so weird

[golden valley]

This is old information

[lofty fern]

Why are we still looking at Sandman?

[deep chasm]

even with kaido stealing from big mom thats just kaido trying to be selfish in competition

[royal orchid]

I didn't know about it tbh

[wet condor]

Yeah, we were talking about this a while back

[tough igloo]

back to back blackbeard posts from Oda wife lol first him taking imu power now this 😂

[lofty fern]

Mr. I somehow know everything that's happening in Oda's house

[pine scaffold]

''BB doesnt know haki''

[wet condor]

Like the way Sengoku was talking about them, I thought every other panel we were going tosee them killing and betraying each other

[golden valley]

Viz fucked up the translation yeah

Haki is mentioned in Jaya

[ashen perch]

I mean most of the crew didnt even fight with Xebec at all lol

[pine scaffold]

BB is gonna be a monster in terms of haki

[tough igloo]

Viz fucked up both blackbeard translations damn lol

[deep chasm]

doesnt this say the opposite of what blackbeard is saying. Hes saying here that luffy didnt even seem worth 30 mil

[wet condor]

Like characters could be talking in panels and in the background you can see some dude getting shanked

[cyan meadow]

literally
kaido is never actually going to talk about it, we're never getting anything from kaido - we will just have to live in subtext

[pine scaffold]

YO WTF WHY DOESNT IT SAY ''typing'' anymore

[wet condor]

For stepping on another fellas shoes or something

[leaden rivet]

Wait where did Stussy go again

[tranquil blade]

When we first hear about the Rocks pirates they're described like they were constantly trying to kill each other every 5 seconds and were trying to undermine Xebec completely

[pine scaffold]

WTF

[ashen perch]

and we saw that

[cyan meadow]

same same

[pine scaffold]

Nah bruh I miss the ''is typing'' thing

[royal orchid]

everyone blocked you bro

[deep chasm]

exactly. The only real sign of betrayal was the stuff with wang zhi and then the shiki thing

[ashen perch]

Shiki tried to kill Kyo

[leaden rivet]

Memory is a bit blurry, she was on Whitebeard’s shoulder and then where did she go after

[tranquil blade]

Yeah Shiki did I guess

[pine scaffold]

dawg I dont like this

[wet condor]

She asked where WB went

[pine scaffold]

restarting discord rq

[wet condor]

I forget who she was talking t o

[deep chasm]

that is a good question

[tranquil blade]

but like that's one guy

[ashen perch]

no Sb its the update

its been gone

[tough igloo]

i think we saw her last chapter with ganzui and gil bastar

[pine scaffold]

NAH WTF IS THIS

dude this is the worst update

[leaden rivet]

I think rocks and the future yonko were a bit closer than him and the rest of the crew

[deep chasm]

yea I think there should have been more betrayal considering how the rocks pirates were described

[ashen perch]

and Wang Zhi did literally kill Don Marlon

[pine scaffold]

great so now I cant tell who the fuck is speaking anymore

isnt that amazing

[ashen perch]

and BM was betrayed by Kaido too

[tranquil blade]

until Shakky's kidnapping God Valley comes around they somehow manage to be pretty well held together

[royal orchid]

I mean if it's true it's true, viz is known to translate things their Own™ way

[golden valley]

As I said, I felt like the Rocks Pirates were lacking substance, they deserved more

[clear hollow]

Wang Zhi always looked like he was upto no good

[royal orchid]

sandman is BBposting a lot though

[lofty fern]

Ganzui

[tranquil blade]

Still not as extreme as it was portrayed to be

[pine scaffold]

deadass anyone can pull up to this chat now

and we wont know if they are typing

[ashen perch]

I dont know, what more betrayal really? most of them didnt even help Xebec at all

[deep chasm]

kaidos crew had more betraying than rocks pirates

[leaden rivet]

I don’t know if that counts as a betrayal. And it was more big mom betraying Kaido than the opposite.

[clear hollow]

big W for chat lurkers

[urban lodge]

Oh so that's not a bug? They got rid of the typing thing?

[pine scaffold]

this is such an L

[pine scaffold]

they removed it

[urban lodge]

Wtf is wrong with discord

[tough igloo]

right sengoku said they were always killing each other lol

[pine scaffold]

ngl I may quit now

[royal orchid]

I don't see it either yeah

[lofty fern]

Wang was there since the beginning, they worked with him for years and yet they never firgured out it was him that did it

[pine scaffold]

cuz this is a huge change

[ashen perch]

like that was the whole thing, they werent able to fight together

[pine scaffold]

Goodbye.

[royal orchid]

discord's worst decision is the next one

[golden valley]

What typing thing?

[cyan meadow]

it's a glitch probably

[ashen perch]

x is typing

that

its gone

[golden valley]

Oh

Wtfff

[royal orchid]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/738580480437387264/935176618677268490/cunk2.gif

[fallen meteor]

What no way

[urban lodge]

Dumbest decision ever

[tranquil blade]

What was the point

[ashen perch]

you dont see it anymore, I noticed it earlier

[clear hollow]

Because of the typing thing gone, messages seem so quick for some reason

[deep chasm]

not helping him when there was other stuff going on rlly doesnt correlate to betrayal. The point is the crew was hyped up to be all about disloyalty. Just couldve been shown off more

[tranquil blade]

What does that achieve

[fallen meteor]

But how can i know YC is cooking??

[royal orchid]

I can't time messages to gifs now 🌝

[ashen perch]

yo true, the messages seem too quick now

[royal orchid]

just gotta feel the typing aura

[leaden rivet]

I didn’t even notice that lol

[ashen perch]

when you saw "X is typing" it was like seeing the process play out

but its just message after message now

[pine scaffold]

@ashen perch its down

this isnt an update

[leaden rivet]

Tbf could just be discounted as propaganda

[royal orchid]

SB was actually concerned lmao

[fallen meteor]

Hopefully its back later

[gloomy tree]

someone hacked Discord

[deep chasm]

I think that'd be ass if the idea is its just propaganda

[pine scaffold]

I was about to quit discord

[sage temple]

My bad guys

[gloomy tree]

fuck

[tranquil blade]

I think the moral of the story we should get from all this though is that Sengoku sucks

[gloomy tree]

so close

[deep chasm]

I mean regardless I dont think the idea is that its propaganda lol

sengoku had no reason to lie about that

[ashen perch]

eh, other stuff was just them selfishly seeking out treasure, they did not give a fuck about what was happening to Xebec

[pine scaffold]

I would genuinely quit if the typing thing was an update

[wet condor]

I was expecting to see a panels of some people trying to kill Rocks. Or Rocks was chilling at the bar and someone comes in to inform him some members on the crew just got into a fight over some shit and 10 crew members got killed, and him being like "we still gotta replace the guys who got killed in a squabble from the previous week"

[deep chasm]

that doesnt compare to how they were talked about

[urban lodge]

Thank god, as fucking stupid as discord updates can be that would be insane even for their standards

[tranquil blade]

Why is it that big of a deal

[fallen meteor]

Bro you all are just conjuring paragraphs out of thin air

[ashen perch]

it does though

[tranquil blade]

I mean it's not good but

[deep chasm]

yes its cool many of them werent crying or desperately trying to help Rocks

[royal orchid]

I rarely see Chrissy here and every other time it's to antagonize SuperBaiting lmao

[deep chasm]

but that just means theyre not super caring of him

[gloomy tree]

because Sb is a dramaqueen

[fallen meteor]

Typing it on the notes app then pasting it here

[deep chasm]

sengoku talked about rocks as if they were consistently betraying and killing each other

[leaden rivet]

Sengoku wasn’t there

[pine scaffold]

it looks like everyone is spamming and I like to know who's currently in chat

[leaden rivet]

He just knows what others told

[gloomy tree]

tbh when im here its mostly in this channel, i just dont always type because sometimes i have nothing worth adding

[tranquil blade]

Maybe the claw guy got killed on the ship or smth

[gloomy tree]

but Sb always baits me in

[pine scaffold]

every message looks like spam

they just appear out of thin air

[fallen meteor]

Ah i cant see who you are anymore

[deep chasm]

1. Rocks pirates existed for more than just one day
2. The idea pretty clearly isnt that this is meant to be sengoku propaganda

if oda comes out and implies yea bro so sengoku was trying to lie or just didnt know anything about them

sure

[clear hollow]

Some guy put prime sengoku in the same as prime roger and garp😭😭

[deep chasm]

but thats a stretch

oda just couldve shown off the betrayal aspect more

not a hard conclusion to reach

[leaden rivet]

What does that mean

[tranquil blade]

Surprised none of them tried to kill Rocks himself

[frigid gulch]

The “killing one another” bit didn’t really happen

[fallen meteor]

Black role black mode

[leaden rivet]

Ah

[frigid gulch]

Besides Marlon

[ashen perch]

Wang Zhi killed Marlon, Shiki tried to kill Kyo, WB and Kaido, Kyo was fighting with Shiki constantly, Gloriosa constantly argued with Stussy, Ganzui tried to kill John, Shiki tried to kill Ganzui, BM betrayed Kaido and Kaido betrayed BM, then Rocks himself seemingly betrayed Kaido, BM and WB

[frigid gulch]

But that’s different

[steel stirrup]

Black name black background probably

[tranquil blade]

Maybe he's just that strong

[ashen perch]

what more did you guys want lol

[steel stirrup]

Yes

[tranquil blade]

MORE

[steel stirrup]

Its not enough

[ashen perch]

its enough

[royal orchid]

we need them killing each other

[frigid gulch]

Ye I thought the in fighting was showcased fine

[tranquil blade]

Guys the gif search is not working

[lofty fern]

It doesn't even make sense as propaganda since the story Sengoku told itself was covered up The point of propaganda is to be out there to influence people.

[ashen perch]

wait I just noticed LOL

[deep chasm]

yea lol

[ashen perch]

the gif button is gone

[fallen meteor]

Omg

[steel stirrup]

Few solid villains left but its not enough

[wet condor]

Mines still here

I'm on pc rn though

[steel stirrup]

They not loading for me

At all

[fallen meteor]

I have hust 3 saved gifs

[royal orchid]

I can only use my favorites

[wet condor]

Oh it's not loading

[lofty fern]

I still have the gif button

[steel stirrup]

I csn pull it up

Yea only my favorites are loading

[royal orchid]

I have like a million saved gifs lmao

[frigid gulch]

Oh Discord is shitting itself huh

[steel stirrup]

Seems so

[frigid gulch]

No wonder

[ashen perch]

incredible

[tranquil blade]

This broke ass app

[fallen meteor]

No like only 3 of mine load

[lofty fern]

Oh, but yeah I don't get anything

[royal orchid]

billion dollar company

[fallen meteor]

Oh I have one for you meeks

[clear hollow]

"oh no my captain grew big in size and has demonic features now and is attacking us, let's retreat, surely it's just a normal betrayal"

[ashen perch]

but yea, uh there was a lot of betrayal

[steel stirrup]

Only my favorites are loading and even then not all of em are

[fallen meteor]

Sent you on dms

[prisma yacht]

I thought my wifi was acting up

[ashen perch]

I think the demonic features on Xebec are irrelevant to the idea of them thinking its a betrayal

[steel stirrup]

Shit me too

[ashen perch]

they can think:
A. He Joined Imu

B. He had a DF

but that 2nd one is unlikely

[fallen meteor]

Its so fucking dumb

[royal orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/boshka-baki-gif-17020917195779675007

[ashen perch]

I think they just assumed that he joined Imu because he saw no way of winning

[urban lodge]

He joined the thing he was attacking 30 seconds earlier?

[steel stirrup]

Big Mom not understanding is fine she's not the sharpest tool in the shed but Kaido and WB not noticing is wild work

[urban lodge]

Ehhhh

[deep chasm]

Arguing does not count for anything. There was a quick series of people betraying each other which sums up half of what youre referring to. BM didnt betray kaido. Kaido stole the fruit from her in what he felt was friendly competition and then she attacked him cuz she was angry. And we know rocks did not actually betray them, and garp would be aware that he was not his true self.

Its okay to sometimes say something couldve been done a little better

[ashen perch]

remember the words of Kaido

[clear hollow]

They literally saw that Imu arrow pierce rocks's chest

[lofty fern]

Not sure how you join something they don't even know what it is. You joined the "black spider blob"?

[ashen perch]

"Pirates will betray you when they see no way of winning"

[fallen meteor]

They see him grow wings after getting stabbed and after imu goes "domi reversi" and they think hes betraying???

[ashen perch]

I think that was Kaido's assumption atleast

[royal orchid]

so when do they start killing each other for the crown of hachinosu

[steel stirrup]

Damn you think after all this time he still thinks Rocks did it of his own volition

[ashen perch]

that he joined up with Imu

[stone terrace]

Kaido 12 iq moment

[steel stirrup]

Bruh

If thats the case Kaido and Big Mom both stupid

Tried to give BM a pass because she her mind is still childish sometimes here and there

[lofty fern]

It's funny since Kaido didn't even seem that upset. He just goes right back to arguing with Big Mom

[ashen perch]

I dont think its stupid per se, they didnt really fw Xebec like that

[steel stirrup]

They shrugged that shit off

[clear hollow]

It's so ironic that roger who didn't know rocks better than his crew, actually figured out that something was wrong with rocks but not his dumbahh crew

[lofty fern]

He doesn't even know if Imu is "joinable"

[steel stirrup]

He went up normal and then came down three times bigger with fangs and wings

How tf did they not notice

[ashen perch]

yea thats not important if they just think he joined Imu

[leaden rivet]

This is all so completely inane

[clear hollow]

they just dumb like that

[deep chasm]

yea kaido and big mom thing really is not what Id call a betrayal. Kaido did something selfish in what he seems to think was just competition. It turned into more later sure, but this is more like your younger brother makes you mad

[leaden rivet]

What a joke

[fallen meteor]

Im going to be real with you guys
If we are on a fight and the opponent wraps me in void tentacles and says domi reversi and you all think i decided to betray you all im going to be very mad

[steel stirrup]

Thats the meme answer

I need a real answer because wtf

[ashen perch]

also Laww I disagree, I think the betrayal aspect was well portrayed for a flashback that barely showed much properly

[urban lodge]

Retconned valley

[lofty fern]

To be fair, I don't think they heard most of that

[ashen perch]

like that was actually one of the better portrayed aspects of the incident lol

[royal orchid]

Whitebeard didn't notice Rocks becoming 150% his size, getting fangs and white eyes but usopp did with Brogy

[steel stirrup]

On my immortal everlasting soul

Bruh

[royal orchid]

like this is unprecedented

[ashen perch]

I dont think they didnt notice

[steel stirrup]

Like what is going on

[ashen perch]

why do you guys keep saying that

[clear hollow]

idk i have been thinking about this since i caught up a week ago, and the answer is ||poor writing||

[steel stirrup]

I wish they had if said something like "whats with the wings?" slap

But no

[royal orchid]

WB reacted as if it was just a normal rocks running to him

[steel stirrup]

Just slap

[fallen meteor]

Holy shit welcome to your first break week

[royal orchid]

didn't say a word of "why do you look like this" or something

[deep chasm]

you think everything was well portrayed though. Im saying this crew was made out to be known for the betrayal and consistent killing of each other. But from what we saw it rlly was just one day whre things went to shit and a few people attacked each other. Kaido and big moms shit really turned out to be more of a sibling rivalry moment. People could clearly see something changed with rocks, and I dotn think the point of sengokus words is for him to have just been misinformed.

For most of the flashback the rocks pirates seem like a rlly argumentative family rather than people all waiting to kill each other

[ashen perch]

thats not true though

[tranquil blade]

Well Big Mom says "Is it just me or are you bigger?"

[steel stirrup]

It definitely appears that way

If Oda had them at least comment on the wings we wouldn't be having this convo

He was also three times bigger

[ashen perch]

yeah was gonna say

[steel stirrup]

She sees that but not the wings😭

[lofty fern]

Maybe Oda talks about it later, but the fact is all of the Rocks Pirates DID do exactly as Sengoku said and left Rocks. That's the fact of the situation. We can keep asking why but all we can do is just assume based on what was said and what happened.

[ashen perch]

BM both asks him what that "thing" did to him, and that he seems to be bigger now

[fallen meteor]

Bm smartest pirate alive

[leaden rivet]

Big mom really isn’t an issue

Whitebeard is

[ashen perch]

and then they see him follow the orders of that thing

[clear hollow]

I caught up in 2022, then got busy with life so didn't read weekly and then this year, i forgot literally everything about OP so i just read it from the beginning, got caught up, didn't read weekly again, and now i caught up for the 2nd time this year

[prisma yacht]

We see him giving normal responses until the voat and him tearing up
It was as if he got a new power up and he switched up

[steel stirrup]

All I got is a "Are we in your way Rocks?"

[fallen meteor]

Glad you could caught up all those times tho
Welcome

[vale heath]

Bet y’all wouldn’t notice I grew fangs, wings, and 25% taller

[lofty fern]

Even if something was wrong, what would you expect him to do?

[leaden rivet]

Find out what happened, fight with Garp and Roger

[clear hollow]

But tbh, this break week has been the longest for me since rocks after his appearance has been my top 3 character so i have been hoping he gets a honorable death just like WB at Marineford or even better but I don't expect much from Oda anyway now

[fallen meteor]

25% taller fanged and winged Mimzee: Hello
Me: Mimzee

[thick mango]

He is in the middle of a honorable death I think

[steel stirrup]

He got beat by two top tiers and they had to expend all their haki to beat him

Imo its pretty good

[lofty fern]

Why? The only reason Garp and Roger hung around was to protect their own crews. Even they weren't trying to "find out what happened"

[thick mango]

He's there to save his family, that was successful, and he's resisting reverse me than anyone we ever seen

[deep chasm]

well not rlly their crews were ready to go

they stuck around to kill rocks like he asked

[steel stirrup]

Only person I've seen resist it but tbf we haven't seen everyone and their momma be DR yet

[wet condor]

Imu talks about how tough he is

So it's not something that they normally see

[lofty fern]

That was later. They even said Roger will stay there until he knows all of his crew as safe. They even say they're not going to let Rocks hurt their crews. It's only after that that Rocks is crying and speaks to them

[steel stirrup]

If Imu hadn't of brought up Harald i wonder if it still would've worked

Seemed to be working regardless, the rage bait just sped up the process

[lofty fern]

There was a bit of time after Rocks's turn and when they finally challenge him

[prisma yacht]

I don't think gv was bad writing at all

[steel stirrup]

In my headcanon my goat could've fought it off but realistically he was probably cooked regardless

[leaden rivet]

They don’t have to have the same reason to fight rocks lol

[steel stirrup]

Only issue i have off the top of my head is Gloriosa crying her eyes out for Shakky and then not doing a damn thing to help save her

[lofty fern]

Imu says he was stalling, which makes sense considering Imu starts it off by threatening Rocks' family

[lofty fern]

The Roger hots took hold

[leaden rivet]

You can’t make the same argument for Whitebeard for everyone else because Whitebeard clearly cared for rocks

[thick mango]

Is gloriosa even a fighter? Does she have a bow? A fruit?

[steel stirrup]

I wish she could've kicked a nigga or two to help clear the way for Rayleigh

But she did fuck all

[leaden rivet]

All the Kuja are fighters

[prisma yacht]

Had that jealousy deep down 😂

[urban lodge]

She's the empress of amazon lily, of course she's a fighter

[leaden rivet]

They’re a warrior tribe

[thick mango]

Rocks tried to kill wb it's just too dangerous to be unravel this mystery time

[deep chasm]

well at some point they wre on the ship and roger keeps fighting

[prisma yacht]

Jk

[tranquil blade]

I think she just fights like Boa but without the fruit

[steel stirrup]

LMAOO

[thick mango]

I'm just saying I can't remember a panel of her fighting

[steel stirrup]

Lmaoo does the woman from the warrior tribe know how to fight?

[leaden rivet]

3 edits

[tranquil blade]

Well that's cause Oda's a hack but

[lofty fern]

Yes, but in the midst of seeing Rocks throttle him and then go on a rampage killing most people on the island for seemingly no reason. He has no reason to really stick around.

[steel stirrup]

I don't think so

[urban lodge]

That's their whole thing, strength is beauty and beauty is strength and the empress is the strongest among them

[thick mango]

Is there one? Shiki an ganzui and all did stuff. Does she get a panel being highlighted?

[steel stirrup]

Not that I can remember

[tranquil blade]

No

[leaden rivet]

He does because his friend randomly switched up on them lol

[tranquil blade]

Neither does Stussy

[steel stirrup]

We saw her shoot at some niggas

[lofty fern]

He's not Roger

[thick mango]

Well then it's not too unreasonable to wonder

[leaden rivet]

You can just use the context of their existence. She doesn’t need to have fighting scenes for her to be a fighter.

[clear hollow]

Do yall think 1066 begins with the conclusion of rocks and afterwards we'll see everyone escaping or would it be the other way around and oda will give the last 2 panels to the conclusion of the fight?

[tranquil blade]

I kinda doubt that a Rocks pirate would be a non-fighter

[leaden rivet]

Streusen

[lofty fern]

He's not his friend

[leaden rivet]

He is his friend

[lofty fern]

They are not friends. None of the Rocks are

[leaden rivet]

They absolutely are friends

[steel stirrup]

Then why didn't Whitebeard just leave

[leaden rivet]

At least Whitebeard and rocks are

[tranquil blade]

I mean Streusen can fight tho he's just not that crazy

[lofty fern]

Associates, not friends

[steel stirrup]

Good enough terms for WB to stay and help with zero obligation

[leaden rivet]

I can’t see how you can see this panel and think they aren’t friends

[lofty fern]

he doesn't like leaving a guy in the lurch. doesn't mean they werre friends.

[leaden rivet]

That’s just silly

[lofty fern]

Even Rocks pretty much agrees he only has one friend

[deep chasm]

yea no this is friends

[leaden rivet]

Whitebeard risked his life for literally no reason to help rocks for no reward

[deep chasm]

youre doing more work to say theyre not friends

[tranquil blade]

They're at least relatively chill with each other, enough so that he'll help him even when there's not much gain in it

[leaden rivet]

And they’re just assosciates?

[steel stirrup]

I just doubt he would stick around and help in this situation unless he has a little bit of love in his heart for the nigga

[ashen perch]

idk what to tell you Laww, I dont think everything was well portrayed and thats such a silly assumption youre making based off nothing I have said. People at Hachinosu mentioned that the Rocks Pirates likely lost because they could never stand each other to team up, which was clearly true. We have seen the group fight "together" twice, once against the charity sanctuary where Shiki tries to blow up Kyo, Kaido and WB and WB tries to sink the whole island in response along with the whole crew. The 2nd time was God Valley and we saw how that played out too, which was always the main incident that was described to us and we saw how the crew acted in it. WB, Rocks and Kaido was the closest they got to teaming up, but that was blown up too when Rocks attacked WB and Kaido.

[clear hollow]

it's not that fleshed out as many fans wanted it to be + it has some inconsistencies with the version of GV in Kuma's flashback

[fossil nimbus]

All Kuja are fighters

[ashen perch]

they arent

[deep chasm]

friends doesnt have to mean theyre best friends froever

but theyre friends

[leaden rivet]

They are

You’re only denying their friends to make sense of Whitebeard leaving him to die

[steel stirrup]

There must be at least a modicum of love in Whitebeards heart for Rocks

[lofty fern]

Friend in one piece is much closer meaning that we would take it

[ashen perch]

but thats the thing Illya

[royal orchid]

125% of 4ft is 5ft

[lofty fern]

A friend means I'm with you no matter what. And WB was obviously not that

[ashen perch]

why should I ignore WB leaving him to die? that makes no sense

[leaden rivet]

Yeah kinda like someone who’s willing to die for no reason other than to help someone

[prisma yacht]

Are u talking about roger calling out xebec "wait rocks" ?

[leaden rivet]

I never said you should

[ashen perch]

the added context that we get later is important

[lofty fern]

Did he or did he not leave him to die?

[ashen perch]

it allows us to analyze this line better too

[tranquil blade]

What % of 6ft is- nvm

[leaden rivet]

It doesn’t Arsal

[royal orchid]

what's half of 13.4ft avery

[leaden rivet]

Because him leaving him to die is because he believes rocks turned on him

[ashen perch]

WB is an honorable man who felt he owed it to Xebec to help him out, that went out the window when Xebec tried to kill him

[steel stirrup]

An immortal came to kill Rocks and everyone else here, how is that not a "no matter what" situation?

[leaden rivet]

Whitebeard decided to help out his friend face a demon for no gain to himself

[lofty fern]

if you were actual OP friends, you'd never believe that, even if the person did betray you

[deep chasm]

Im actually basing it on everything you have said. Because you always think whatever the topic is was done well without any flaws youre willing to point out.

And yea they had quite the betraying going on. Idk why sengoku and others hyped it up so much when theres less betraying than in kaido's crew though

[tranquil blade]

Bro messed it up

[leaden rivet]

And then he felt betrayed because rocks attacked him

[ashen perch]

thats not friendship per se, thats WB following his code as a human being

[royal orchid]

check again

[lofty fern]

Did he or did he not leave him?

[leaden rivet]

I don’t see any way that they’re not friends

[ashen perch]

I literally dont even like that we got GV here man but ok

[steel stirrup]

After his friend tried to kill him yea he left

[leaden rivet]

[lofty fern]

Even WB himself said he's not attached to Rocks, They're associates

[tranquil blade]

Whitebeard left him after getting sent through a mountain by a demonic version of the guy

[fossil nimbus]

Isn't there a whole spread explaining that none of the rocks pirates are friends, and they all have their own goals

[deep chasm]

you can be friends and not be attached

[leaden rivet]

That’s like the most obvious banter ever

[deep chasm]

why are we acting like friends = cannot be separated or have different goals

[ashen perch]

I just think unreasonable criticism is unreasonable

and this is unreasonable

[lofty fern]

Would Luffy leave Sanji even after he tried to kill him?

[deep chasm]

you think lots of criticism is unreasonable apparently lol

[leaden rivet]

It’s not unreasonable at all, you just support oda no matter what Arsal

That’s just what it is

[ashen perch]

Its okay if you want to believe it Illya, thats fine

[steel stirrup]

Did he turn into a demon and blast him into the side of mountain?

[leaden rivet]

Yes I am believing the truth

[tranquil blade]

Not all friendships are equal, just because Whitebeard wasn't gonna kill himself over Rocks doesn't mean they can't be friends

[wet condor]

That panel is an interaction that, irl, I can only see happening between two guys who're friends. I agree

But...

[lofty fern]

Even if he did, would he?

[wet condor]

I will say this is OP

[wraith mantle]

arsal is oda's strongest soldier

he rates every chapter 10/10

[leaden rivet]

Arsal is the anti-piratefolk

[steel stirrup]

Probably

[sage temple]

Anti comedy

[steel stirrup]

You tryna bring up whataboutisms now

[ashen perch]

the idea that WB's actions were inconsistent there is just silly, youre the one who is trying to approach this with the idea that they were friends in the first place

[wet condor]

I will just chalk it up to WB being an overall good guy and the two of them being on decent terms. I will put them at "friendly acquaintances"

[wet condor]

at most

[ashen perch]

it comes down to WB being honorable and good, not necessarily loyalty to Rocks

well

friendship, to Rocks

[steel stirrup]

Not saying he would die for bro but he definitely had some love for him

[wet condor]

But even that doesn't seem like completely apt description of what they are lol. They've spent more time around each other than the word acquaintance would imply. Idk lol

[barren token]

Wb dipping was kinda unexpected for me i can't lie lol

[ashen perch]

thats the key word, friends

they werent friends

[sage temple]

If break week is long enough mfs will argue about which side of WB's mustache is longer

[lofty fern]

Hey if you guys want to think about them as friends, that's fine. But it just makes it all the more tragic for you I guess. I never considered them that, which is why I have no problem with WB leaving Rocks

[ashen perch]

even BM thought Xebec was a scumbag

[barren token]

Everyone else i get but wb seemed like the kind of guy who would stay

[deep chasm]

I have no problem with wb leaving rocks too

but they were friends

[ashen perch]

I am sure WB was no different

[royal orchid]

they were drank together friends but they weren't dap up friends

[ashen perch]

they werent friends

[hasty sable]

They were definitely friends

[steel stirrup]

Ratio

[tranquil blade]

I think he realized the island was about to be destroyed and that he just got sent through a mountain so he said "fuck this" and left

[leaden rivet]

They drank together and Whitebeard was willing to die for him for no gain to himself but they’re just acquaintances

[ashen perch]

Xebec assembled his crew through pure strength via the Davy Back Fights

[lofty fern]

They were associates that had no problems with each other and got along.

[fossil nimbus]

isn't there are panel of the rocks pirates saying none of them liked each other and wouldn't care if ROCKS died

[steel stirrup]

[royal orchid]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/738580480437387264/1412073551854440448/Animation9.gif

[tranquil blade]

Shiki said that

[digital spear]

Whitebeard stuck with Rocks for 18 years

[royal orchid]

man I never thought I'd be constricted to favorited gifs

[barren token]

Also this being said about arsal is so funny

[tranquil blade]

but Shiki is also a known jackass who was always like that

[ashen perch]

Shiki said that but it applies to the whole crew

[royal orchid]

billion dollar company and they can't keep their API up

[lofty fern]

So did Wang Zhi and I don't see any loyalty there

[prisma yacht]

For personal gains

[tranquil blade]

I can't even access my favorite gifs

[steel stirrup]

But they were only associates

Apparently

[barren token]

The guy why won't shut up about egghead 2 years later

[wet condor]

In real life you wouldn't expect this but let's be real, OP relations aren't an entirely accurate reflection of relationships irl

[leaden rivet]

What Shiki said does not apply to Whitebeard lol

[digital spear]

Because he was a schemer

Like BB

[ashen perch]

Cunk thats the thing

[fossil nimbus]

So did Shiki, also isn't that just because of the davy fight rules

[lofty fern]

Most of the rocks pirates are

[hasty sable]

There’s no convincing argument you can make

[digital spear]

But not Whitebeard

[deep chasm]

theyll say this is just him being nice

[ashen perch]

honor

[royal orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/tai-lung-tai-lung-chains-ty-lung-ty-lung-chains-kung-fu-panda-gif-1336214153079306842

[fossil nimbus]

Shiki also stuck with rocks for 18 years, those are just rules of the davy fight

[steel stirrup]

This convo is sending me

[hasty sable]

This definitely sells the idea that at the end of the day, despite their disagreements, WB saw him as a comrade

[wet condor]

i put most of it on Wb being a decent guy, yeah

[lofty fern]

If I help out a coworker out of my own time, am I friends with them?

[royal orchid]

drinking buddies

[barren token]

Fignt imu just isn't that scary because he's weak, fighting rocks is a lot harder

[digital spear]

Is something wrong with Discord?

[deep chasm]

ackshually he just was trying to pay him back for a couple beers 🤓

[tranquil blade]

Yes

[ashen perch]

and Wano too lol

yeah YC

[steel stirrup]

Whitebeard had zero reason to help him at that point but okay

[hasty sable]

Rocks discourse is actually stupid

[prisma yacht]

Xebec's reaction is enough to understand that they weren't close

[clear hollow]

Yeah but WB was the only crewmember we saw have an actual emotional connection with Rocks so it was kind of disappointed to see WB just think that Rocks "betrayed him" even when there were obvious signs of the opposite happening

[lofty fern]

We seem to be holding WB to some high standard when he was just after profits just like the rest of them

[barren token]

If you fight for your co-worker against the king of the world for no benefit yeah I'd say your probably friends

[hasty sable]

Read between the lines a little

[steel stirrup]

LMAOOO

[wet condor]

Because WB does come off as just generally more decent and honorable than the rest of them

[steel stirrup]

They said the same shit about Harald and Rocks

[digital spear]

^

[fossil nimbus]

I'm not arguing for whether wb was loyal or not, I was just responding to how your point doesn't actually tell usif he was loyal. Because Shiki was on the rocks pirates for the same amount of time as WB but hated rocks

[deep chasm]

time and death are kinda different. Its one thing to give them some time out of your day, its another to put your life on the line for them

[ashen perch]

I didnt say he was trying to pay him back, I said it just comes down to him being an honorable and good man

[leaden rivet]

Which directly is a reference to how Whitebeard treats his family

[hasty sable]

Whitebeard is more decent. He also liked Rocks enough to fight the devil with him.

[wet condor]

Irl that's one of your best pals lol

[tranquil blade]

Why do we have to assume that you need to literally be willing to die for your friend to be considered friends? Like Whitebeard doesn't have to have strawhat level loyalty to be friends with people

[digital spear]

Higher standard than what the other Rocks pirates implied to be doing for sure

[lofty fern]

he has no idea that it's the king of the world, and "sharing a fight even to the death" is everyday dealings for WB. Still not friends. Because if WB was actually a OP level friend. he'd never leave him.

[steel stirrup]

Shiki was staying for the score and as soon as he could he dipped

WB was there with Rocks the whole way until he got DR

[fossil nimbus]

Imagine a Yonko crew casually eating at your restaurant

[clear hollow]

I dont even expect WB to fight against DR Rocks but at least try to figure out what's wrong with Rocks and not just think he betrayed you and just leave

[lofty fern]

Rocks has gone to "family" now lol

[leaden rivet]

Don’t be obtuse

[steel stirrup]

Here we go

[fossil nimbus]

Genuine question, but don't the pirates who are won by a davy fight have to stay with the crew? Or am I misremembering

[leaden rivet]

It’s clearly a reference

[wet condor]

I dunno. I don't try to contextualize OP relationships like they're real life ones

Sometimes. But some of them aren't really

[ionic palm]

they do, thats how the game works

[steel stirrup]

They said you'll be cursed by Davy Jones whatever that means

[wet condor]

Like how Big Mom and Kaido are lol

[fossil nimbus]

Ye so it's not like any of the pirates in rocks crew had the "choice" of leaving

[wet condor]

Or Roger entrusting Garp, a man who he's seemingly had near deathmathces with and who works for people who want to end his bloodline, to take care of his son

[ashen perch]

I just think its clearly not a friendship if you put it in the context of WB choosing to leave, and his dialogue there

[lofty fern]

i think so, unless they are won or released or just decide to leave despite the consequences. They can leave though. We see that Foxy lost almost all of his crew

[ornate tartan]

Kaido and BM probably weren’t recruited by Davy Back

[hasty sable]

This too

[ornate tartan]

Kaido wasn’t at the very least

[steel stirrup]

Then why didn't they all come help

[digital spear]

Its funny how Rocks just says YESSS...

[steel stirrup]

Friendship ended

[leaden rivet]

I mean if a friend tries to kill you, it makes sense that you don’t want to be friends anymore

[hasty sable]

Yessss

[wet condor]

I laughed at that too

[leaden rivet]

It doesn’t mean you were never friends

[deep chasm]

this is what Im saying

[steel stirrup]

Sounds like steam escaping

[hasty sable]

Unsubscribed

[digital spear]

Its like if he just said Yurrr

[steel stirrup]

Thank you

[leaden rivet]

Whitebeard and rocks friendship doesn’t need to be strawhat deep where they’re lifting the planet for each other

[steel stirrup]

LMAOOOO

SKEEE YEEE

[leaden rivet]

YC your color is throwing me off, make it stop

[fossil nimbus]

They were all at different places, plus at least WB was more "honourable" than the other rocks pirates who showed that they couldn't care less what happened to rocks

[frigid gulch]

WB did try to help him

[ashen perch]

He thought Rocks would really betray them, because it makes sense, the entire crew knows of him as a total scumbag whose death wouldnt even make them flinch. WB wasnt quite the same as them, but it still would apply to him

[digital spear]

take less drugs

[lofty fern]

In OP world it doesn't.

[leaden rivet]

2 weeks sober

[steel stirrup]

I dont think WB would try to help a guy he doesn't care for at least a little bit why is that so hard to believe

[leaden rivet]

I’m trying but it’s hard

[digital spear]

dang

stay strong

[steel stirrup]

Damn so it aint just me

[ashen perch]

Kaido wasnt yea

[digital spear]

almost as hard as avoiding spoilers

[ashen perch]

but BM was implied to be a DBF recruit

[leaden rivet]

Avoiding spoilers is harder

[lofty fern]

I think Rocks only saw one person as his actual friend. That's why he only trusted that one person with his secret.

[wet condor]

Yeah. It's very nuanced. WB clearly feels a bit of fondness towards Rocks

[leaden rivet]

I’ve never been 2 weeks off reading spoilers since Wano lol

[wet condor]

You might be right, yeah

[wet condor]

I don't think Rocks viewed WB the same way

[sacred flume]

Wb and honorable in the same sentence sprintbeard sprinted away at the sight of danger

[digital spear]

every week since Wano im addicted to the next chapter

[ashen perch]

also come on lol

[wet condor]

Strange dynamics overall

[ashen perch]

we saw how WB reacted to betrayal from his family

[barren token]

"Yeah then rocks just grew 10 feet and bat wings and fangs and was a dick to me i hate that guy"

[steel stirrup]

He seemed surprised

[clear hollow]

Is there a pattern of oda taking a break after 2 consecutive chapters?

[barren token]

Is wb an idiot?

[wet condor]

Yeah

"You sure?"

[clear hollow]

yes

[wet condor]

"There ain't nothing to gain here"

[lofty fern]

You never see Rocks act the same way with WB as he does with Harald

[fossil nimbus]

WB, BM and Kaido might all be

[clear hollow]

Or that's just poor writing

[leaden rivet]

Arsal, I’m saying that Whitebeard’s reaction to rocks is stupid, that’s my complaint here

[wet condor]

He was on my list of smarter OP people

I may have to knock him down a few places

[leaden rivet]

I have friends I talk to every few months and friends I talk to everyday. Not all friends are at the same intensity.

[steel stirrup]

But that explains his surprise

He didn't think they would be down to go this far

[tranquil blade]

Yeah

[ashen perch]

its not if you do not consider them to be friends like you keep on insisting that they are

[clear hollow]

We already knew BM n Kaido were dumb asses but not my goat WB💔

[frigid gulch]

WB’s dialogue when Rocks attacks them gives off disappointed vibes

[leaden rivet]

Okay. I don’t think we’re going anywhere with this my darling.

[lofty fern]

In the real world yes. In one piece, a person you actually call "friend" is not the same

[fossil nimbus]

WB was in Rocks crew for decades, he was part of the rocks pirates b4 they became the rocks pirates yet didn't notice rocks growing by 10 feet, gaining wings and fangs

[wet condor]

Right. I'm not disagreeing

[steel stirrup]

"Why you ain't have your haki on?"

[leaden rivet]

You’re labeling every friend in op as strawhat deep Irene, and that’s where our disconnect is

[ashen perch]

Xebec is hated by his own crew, they know not to trust him already, I think that made it easier to believe that he was really turning on them

[clear hollow]

Even roger noticed that, that's the irony

[prisma yacht]

All those arguments lead us back to the start

Smh

[steel stirrup]

Oh all friends have to die for one another? 😬

[leaden rivet]

I will defend big mom, she’s not stupid. It’s only Whitebeard.

She realized what was going on first. But she doesn’t care about xebec so her leaving is fine.

[ashen perch]

I think they all did lol

[leaden rivet]

That’s enough big mom defending for this year

Moving on

[steel stirrup]

Did what

[wet condor]

Rocks didn't expect them to have his back like that. That indicates to me that he didn't view his relationship with WB as being close enough for him to stick his neck out for them

[ashen perch]

Oda just didnt have the space to show it, but I think BM's reaction is kinda meant to apply to all of them

[wet condor]

WB viewed their relationship I guess in a different light than Xebec saw it

[lofty fern]

Because that's how OP talks about friendship. A real friend is someone you are super close to, You can have fake friends of course and Oda even plays with that. But other than that. you have work friends and associates, but they are different

[wet condor]

And namely because WB is just an overall decent guy

[frigid gulch]

Ye it def wasn’t Harald level

But Harald is also his best friend basically

[wet condor]

That's how Rocks sees him