manga-theories

[plush pike]

1. To solidify her past with Kaido.
2. To somehow discover that she ate Mother Carmel.

[forest rampart]

To push her to Elbaf perhaps, similar answer to what I've said above to other question

[primal goblet]

We gotta remember that Oda literally uses word play in japanese to foreshadow stuff, us as english readers can't be 1000% sure in what we get translated for us so thats why I'm leaning towards the giant war being in Elbaf while the final war is after one piece being found

[plush pike]

Also to have Kaido and Big Mom clash and team up on the rooftop, because that shit was awesome as all hell.

3. To discover more about Big Mom's motivations and why she does things

[forest rampart]

I assume it might be "kyoudai" war, which means a big war but idk, can't confirm

[lucid igloo]

I know it's hype and cool, but it has to make sense plot wise. So far in this arc we have had no mention of Elbaf as far as I can recall. Maybe it'll be touched upon later

[lucid igloo]

No 3. is the whole purpose of the Whole Cake Island arc

[plush pike]

There's no reason for it to be mentioned yet, it'll be a like a big reveal moment (for Big Mom) when she finds out. I'm personally a fan of ghosts from the past, including Oden, Ace and Mother Carmel showing up.

[plush pike]

Yet we haven't seen how she interacts with random villagers that are kind to her. We got that this arc. This can setup how she finally ends up at the end of the series, after finding out about everything and dealing with it.

[lucid igloo]

True. There must a point of Oda showing that in the story.

[plush pike]

Perhaps O-lin is more like how she was when she was little, and her evil side is more like how she become when swallowing Mother Carmel, taking on some of her evil characteristics.

[forest rampart]

Probably just to hype up about the returns of Rocks Pirates - those legendary pirates that people thought is someone that might appear later near the end of Wano

[plush pike]

Based on ancient folklore that said consuming human flesh would add their soul to yours. Fitting for the soul-soul fruit user.

[lucid igloo]

We already saw how she was before she ate Carmel and the kids though

[plush pike]

I don't think we ever saw her evil, she had hunger pangs, but she meant no harm to anyone.

[forest rampart]

Didn't her parents abandoned her? It might has smth to do with her hunger pang and/or personality

[plush pike]

From what I remember, didn't the parents abandon her specifically because she had violent tendencies?

[forest rampart]

Maybe. I don't remember

[plush pike]

Anyway, the parents could technically still be alive, but I don't think they will be very relevant to Big Mom's story arc

Kinda just had to explain why she's at an orphanage with an evil nun.

[lucid igloo]

According to the wiki she was exiled due to her uncontrollable behaviour causing much destruction. So she was inherently violent

[forest rampart]

Wiki.. Sometimes it contains made up facts/explanation

[lucid igloo]

Watched the scene again. It was because of the destruction she caused in her homeland

[scarlet urchin]

I just saw that page again, now reminiscent of the Kaido & Doflamingo relation

[lucid igloo]

But that would imply doflamingo was controlling Kaido! The string controls the dragon. It's a nice find though

[forest rampart]

Yeah, you're right

[fallow knot]

Oda should show Roger's era.

[weary cliff]

Ain't got time for that. Maybe a oneshot after the series ends

[pure raven]

He wasn’t controlling him fully, but he was heavily influential in kaidos descicion making

[charred coral]

Guys, im calling now, jinbe is gonna die because they didn't do the toast

[fallow knot]

What if Marines come to wano in time and fujitora stops onigashima from falling to flower capital???

[supple ivy]

if anyones dying it will be sabo but doubt it, but i also doubt it will be one of the straw hats but now i think about it jimbei may die because jimbei is the only who dosent have an end goal in the straw hats

[supple ivy]

what happened to wano being lawless - not under the world government

[dusky acorn]

Marines would have a very short window of time to make it here. The departures to capture the Warlords were only 6 days ago. If marines came to Wano this very night, it'd probably have to be people who weren't dispatched there

And that's like, barely anyone

[supple ivy]

one thing i dont get is why they are capturing all the pirates which they were allied with

[weary cliff]

At the reverie, they outlawed the Shichibukai system. So now those pirates are suddenly wanted criminals

[supple ivy]

yh but why werent previous ones hunted down such as jinbei, Trafalgar law and blackbeard

[weary cliff]

They escaped marines. In this instance, the marines had a chance to blindside the old warlords

[supple ivy]

but im sure that it was written in the newspaper

[weary cliff]

It took time for word to spread. We clearly see by the time they're reacting to the news, that they've already been surrounded by marines

[supple ivy]

oh yh that is true

[bitter kraken]

Anyone think this the flying six will be be back in the fight before the war ends? Them being awakened Zoans they recovery extremely fast, we saw that in impel down with the guards but what I don’t know is how long it takes them to heal and be in fighting shape

[plucky kiln]

please not lol. this would mean that a lot chapters would focuss on their fights

Im more interested in King and Queen right now

[modest skiff]

The flying 6 never interested me to begin with. If they come back again, I hope they are all thrown in the ocean

[pseudo citrus]

saw an interesting speculation that ulti and page one could join kid, since they were both done in by big mom

[acoustic helm]

Fujitora Shogun

[plucky kiln]

I really want a Fujitora Wano connection, but I dont think that the Marine has the time and the reasons to go to wano.

[modest skiff]

Overall I really like the recruiting potential Kid has here. Kid saving WW from CP0 would be a good way to go about that

[rocky galleon]

ok i know this might sound stupid but pls hear me out- what if adult momo saves wano from onigashima falling. i feel like that would be cool

[plucky kiln]

I think thats what everyone thought about lol

I agree. it would be cool

[modest skiff]

I think it is heavily implied that adult momo is going to try to prevent onigashima from falling and i agree it is likely

[plucky kiln]

zunisha could also just appear and destroy onigashima with a single hit

[modest skiff]

or just toss it on its back

Would enjoy Onigashima just being another resident of Zunesha lol

[light onyx]

Imagine

Buggy was just acting weak

And was used to help luffy

Big brain mentality ong

[merry mango]

@light onyx its cannon and confirmed by Oda when he told me in my dream

[arctic patrol]

After this recent chapter, I'm reminded of these lines from the Baratie arc -

[queen arrow]

why

[fading thorn]

is marco intangible?

[queen arrow]

no

[bitter kraken]

What if onigashima is actually god valley and kaido brought it to wano the same way he’s moving it now

[queen arrow]

that island was in Wano before Kaido got there

[bitter kraken]

Lol ooops

[queen arrow]

Marco recognized it, and the Whitebeard pirates have only been to Wano once

[bitter kraken]

That dosnt prove it was already there tho

[queen arrow]

it does

[fading thorn]

i mean marco did say "so thats what they call it now" when referring to onigashima

but idk how it looks like a valley tho

[bitter kraken]

Hmmm do we know if Marco was also on rocks ship?

Or did WB pick him up after leaving

[queen arrow]

Marco was new to the WB pirates at the time of the Oden flashback

[bitter kraken]

Gotcha

[queen arrow]

so no he wasn't in Rocks, it's unlikely any of WB's family was

[fading thorn]

could the poneglyphs be made out of the material the red line is made of?

[queen arrow]

rock?

[light onyx]

I KNEW IT

[ancient vault]

@final stone

[chilly dragon]

So since the Noah got wrecked, and Fishman Island is such a cool location that would seem like a letdown to just abandon, what are the odds the whole of Fishman Island gets pulled to the surface by sea kings in the end?

[olive quail]

Low since sharley predicted luffy destroying it

And the noah exists for a reason

It got wrecked but not irreversibly

[modest skiff]

Bold to assume Franky and his homies won't fix it up

[olive quail]

Yo crackpot theory real quick: Kings race can generate flame. One of the most common unexplained abilities in One Piece is fire generation. Some people can just generate flame for no reason. The general consensus by the community is friction but sometimes that doesnt make sense. Post-timeskip Sanji literally lights on fire from anger. Heat from Kids crew can breath fire. So does Black Marias Spider head. What if some or most of Kings race came down and were bred out and the ability of some people to generate heat and flame is due to being distant descendants of them.

[waxen dust]

Okay, so I read this and the further explanations afterwards;

Whales
I definitely agree with your notions about the animals of the world being a significant part of the story; There’s a connection between the whales, Zunesha, the Onis, the Sea Kings; and any other important animals I missed. To me it seems all these creatures have been around long enough to witness numerous changes within the One Piece world and know that some unnatural events have occurred (one of them being the Red Line).

Vivre Cards
I like your deductions about this because we have yet to know the origins of this. All we know is IIRC Wano is where everyone goes to learn the method, but we don’t how Wano themself actually invented or if it was passed down through ancient times. I don’t think these will have a overall impact on the One Piece, but it’s definitely vital for tracking people and their health. Think that will be important for upcoming arcs.

Bottom
I know there’s a lot of interest in Yuderon’s theory about Enies Lobby and it’s bottom; although it’s a possibility I personally don’t think this is an important factor. If anything the left eye of Jaya is more important. I definitely think there’s significance to its geography and it is most likely the Ancient Kingdom. I also do believe the emphasis of the “left side” ties into the thematic of 2 sides of the same coin. More so in the sense of Will of D, Sun & Moon, etc.

Music
I believe this will begin to play a major role into the story as we reach the end. For music and dancing to be emphasized to people having parties and people coming together, it’s an absolute that music plays a vital role for those connections. I even think music has been inspired since the days of AK because Bink’s Sake seems to be originated from there. If you read the lyrics to that song instead of singing it then it reads as a telling of the past and possibly a instruction to do something specific.

The One Piece Treasure
For us to know what this is exactly, we have to understand what’s awaiting for us in Laugh Tale. We know what’s there are Joyboy’s treasure & The Real Poneglyph (All the poneglyphs are connected here). We also know the road to reach Laugh Tale also heavily relies on reading the ancient texts, so language is another big factor. Another important thing to note is Joyboy himself because it’s his treasure, so Joyboy is based on being a person who likes to bring joy to the world through singing and dancing. Also the Ancient Kingdom is based on Jayabaya and the Javanese kingdom (google if you don’t know)
So if we deduce those points we can probably figure it out;

Joyboy + Ancient Language + Laugh TALE + Music + Javanese Kingdom = ???

So what I came up to as a conclusion is: The One Piece is a Picture Book and the lyrics of Binks Sake are missing pieces of the story.

Because think about Roger’s reaction, he was laughing and said he wished he was in Joyboy’s time, Also Roger named the island Laugh TALE indicating there is something funny to be told. BUT we can also look as them laughing as a red herring. In Sabaody, Rayleigh said that the SHs may reach a different conclusion when they reach the One Piece. So with that in mind whatever the treasure is means it’s up to interpretation similar to certain stories with no actual ending, you can think of a happy ending or a sad ending; I think what determines the interpretation is based on if you can actually do anything afterwards like all the Ancient Weapons being accessible to use; Or if you’re ready to head to Mariejoas and fight Imu. All the pieces set in place is what will based a person’s interpretation of the story. For it to be a story book plus have all the information in the Poneglyphs tells me that knowing it all and being able to do something afterwards is what will “shake up the world” just like Whitebeard states in Marineford.

Sorry if this is a bit long to read, wanted to give you an actual feedback

[modest skiff]

Ah good, glad you also replied, BrotherE. Did you see my reply to him as well? Mine was ultra long lol, I used my entire nitro character limit on it

@waxen dust " In Sabaody, Rayleigh said that the SHs may reach a different conclusion when they reach the One Piece"

My take on this is that Roger and his crew felt like they either lacked the time or the capability or will to take action based on the tale. I think Rayleigh sees it as "Roger knew he was about to die, but you're not about to die, so maybe instead of shrugging and not worrying about (blank), you'll go do something about it" and it may also have to do with it not being the right time. My original thought is that all of the planets need to align before (thing) can happen (which ends up meaning things like Poseidon being born etc) and so it is cyclic and only happens every (blank) years.

[patent sail]

I really like the idea that King’s race (which we now know can create fire) is tied with the sun god Nika. If you look at a picture of Nika you’ll see what looks like a flame on top of its head. Maybe in the past King’s race might’ve been a Nika worshipper and got wiped out by the WG during the Great War event that happened during the void century.
Credits belongs to Sawyer7mage

[modest skiff]

Yeah I was saying earlier I think/hope King's race is from the sun 😄 a bit more out there but 😄

I think part of Zoro's fight with King will be enduring being engulfed in flames

[patent sail]

Yeah, he even said that since they lived on top of the Red Line and he probably knows why it’s indestructible he might incorporate that factor into his fight in some way. All for Zoro to figure out how to cut something that is thought to be indestructible.

[modest skiff]

Is the Red Line said to be indestructible?

[patent sail]

Iirc it was explained during the time Laboon rammed his head against the Red Line.

[olive quail]

I think the idea was more that a single whale isnt capable of destroying part of a continent via headbutts

[vale ocean]

That new ch was soo good

I hope queen gets like a backstory or something

[modest skiff]

#manga and #also-manga are intended for general discussion whereas this thread is more for "serious" theory discussion just fyi

[vale ocean]

Oh shit my bad guys , I’m new to discord my bad

[modest skiff]

No worries, but I do agree with your thoughts on the new chapter 🙂

[vale ocean]

Thank you bro 🤝

[stable heath]

I was thinking if Momo ages because of the mature fruit that maybe Bonny could reverse it afterwards? Since after Wano Luffy will probably hear about Sabo and they'll meet the revolutionary army. I'm not sure if Bonny can effect the age of other people but if she can...

[supple anchor]

Yeah bonny can affect other people. We don't know the extent of it but she did it on saboady iirc

[stable heath]

That would be work no? I just dont know if its Oda's style to do this. Make such a big decision just to delete the consequences afterwards.

[modest skiff]

What do you mean by “be work”?

[cedar sinew]

there's no real reason to reverse it afterwards

I never actually thought that Oda would go that path with Shinobu's fruit but since he is, Momo stays old like a proper shogun

I guess that'd clear up some people's complains about Momo being "too young" to rule as well

[modest skiff]

Yeah momo being old proves his resolve and also helps with the sociological issues of having a child shogun

Especially since I think he will be mega chad

[pure raven]

ahhh I love the way you think , and I agree with your deduction. It would explain why roger said they were too early because of what all the pictures led up to. I just read up on the Jayabaya Kingdom story on google and how much it ties with prophecy.
So since it's influenced by things like prophecy , I assume that other things are needed in order to complete the treasure in it's entirety like the Ancient Weapons for example, and since the mermaid princess wasn't born in Rogers timeline I think this would support this.

Treasure - for the treasure itself I think your idea of a picture book might of been what roger obtained, but couldn't act on. We know that this treasure is supposed to be something that impacts the entire world; so I came to the conclusion that the treasure is something that's inductive to the entire world. So perhaps a large signal or symbol, whether that in quantity or in a single entity I'm not sure.

Few points to support this idea are

• cherry blossoms | treasure of drum kingdom
• Rain | treasure of Albasta
• sound of the golden bell | treasure of Skypiea
• memory & identity | treasure of dressrosa

All of these things have connected the past and future like the story oda said he wanted to write.
So from raw deduction, the theory here is that the One Piece is a treasure that symbolizes freedom. the conclusion I came to was something that transmits a voice it could be something like a supernatural horn, because it doesn't have a language barrier and it would be something any race that can connect to like whales. Sounding freedom to the entire world. One Piece being freedom theme as it is and that Jayabaya story.

This still doesn't explain it being called "One Piece" but perhaps it is because it's needed to break something to symbolize "One PIece" not sure on that one, big reach 😅

[cedar sinew]

it'd only change him physically I believe but he was always good enough mentally to be a shogun

[pure raven]

I've seen a few references to the bible in One Piece at times so maybe Oda may take inspiration from the story of Jericho in where they used music to break the walls. And in our case that would be the redline

[modest skiff]

@pure raven one of my theories of the One Piece is that it can be used by someone with extremely strong CoC to transmit their CoC (Mihawk alludes to the idea that people with strong CoC are naturally followed by a lot of people and that it is why everyone naturally rallies behind Luffy, some kind of passive CoC effect) and that it has an effect similar to Belo Betty's power (Pump-Pump Fruit). So that would mean that people would actually be willing to rise against the CDs rather than being scared. If the entire world rallied against the CDs, they would win. But the CDs rule through fear. So if the entire world revolted, they would easily win. I think it is possible that someone with sufficiently high CoC can use a device (maybe a horn like you said) to transmit and enhance their CoC such that they are extremely powerful and inspire the world

[pure raven]

Perhaps it is Nika who sparked the riots with music

[supple anchor]

There's the theory that Nika and joyboy are the same person, just different names

[stable heath]

If momo actually becomes older I think people would feel its a waste of his life to just cut out 10years or more of development, so that's why I thought they'd use Bonny since she oh so conveniently has an ability to make people younger

[pure raven]

yeah I like that idea, I've never thought CoC can be used like that it may be possible to be used in reverse to create allies and a horn would be perfect for that if it rallies people together to rebel since it would transmute a large signal.

but knowing how Oda is I think he may take a different direction, it may not be with a horn but something else that transmute voices that's really ancient, a horn was just something I came up with at the top of my head haha😅

[pure raven]

isn't nika JoyBoy?

[modest skiff]

Seems heavily implied but we don't know for sure

[waxen dust]

Another idea I have had is similar to your Horn theory. I like that theory as well because that does symbolize a “call for fighting”. My other idea as to what the One Piece was is Joyboy’s Drum

Since the irl Joyboy used a drum to play with for the heart’s content of his people, I could also see Oda implementing the drums as an item Luffy could use to play with. Especially with his Gomu Gomu fruit Luffy can beat the drum in 72 different ways (Sun WuKong) which ties into the importance of the Gomu Gomu fruit. Joyboy’s drum can be used as a weapon and like mentioned similar to Belo Betty’s ability to call for battle.

hi

[pure raven]

What dragon is Monkey D. Dragon based off of???

[waxen dust]

this one

[modest skiff]

I like the drum idea because it could require gomu awakening. If the drum is not naturally flexible, gomu making it bouncy would allow it to function as a drum

[pure raven]

No really- you think his powers could be hinting to what kind of dragon is a weather deity of?

[modest skiff]

My theory is Dragon has a mythical storm drake fruit

[pure raven]

Yeah!!

[waxen dust]

https://tenor.com/view/feel-me-think-about-it-meme-gif-7715402

[pure raven]

As in a rebound?

Imagine Luffy turning himself into a drum playing "Bink's Sake"

[runic dawn]

After chapter 1022's revelations, I think Marco knows where is the last red poneglyph. After arriving in Onigashima he is been revealing one after another secret/information like Onigashima was formerly known as Dragon Island(He didn't specifically say this but Oda revealed it in an SBS). Now he revealed some information regarding King's race. With this information King's race had something to do with the Celestial Dragon. A genocide of King's race. The lost red poneglyph was in Fish-man island and after Roger's death Whitebeard took control of Fish-man island. Maybe Roger told him about the importance of the red ponyglyph so he moved it somewhere safe. If Marco knows about the last red ponyglyph so does BlackBeard. Some people speculated that Luffy and BlackBeard's fight would took place at Laugh Tale. I think there path will collide where the last road ponyglyph is. So BlackBeard will be deafeted before Luffy reaches Laugh Tale. I think Marco will accompany them for a while and fight alongside with Luffy against BlackBeard Pirates. Will Marco join the Strawhats Pirates maybe not but he will accompany Luffy in the fight against BlackBeards Pirate and play a rule in BB's defeat that way he will accomplish what Ace and Whitebeard couldn't.

[modest skiff]

@waxen dust what exactly did you mean by "Especially with his Gomu Gomu fruit Luffy can beat the drum in 72 different ways (Sun WuKong) which ties into the importance of the Gomu Gomu fruit", how would the gomu enable 72 different ways?

I'm familiar with the Sun Wukong stuff but don't see how the gomu relates unless you mean the same thing i was saying about awakening

[pure raven]

Because SunWukong is famous for displaying 72 unique powers during the Journey to the West

Or am I wrong in that?

[waxen dust]

Luffy’s awakening and ability allows him to shape his body in various shapes and sizes throughout the series, so if he does obtain the drum he can activate it with using all his various Gomu moves and each move should resonate a different beat of the drum since physics and vibrations.

[pure raven]

What are these SBS

[modest skiff]

@waxen dust makes sense, i honestly feel pretty good about that. My only problem with it is it doesn't explain why Luffy has been allowed to keep it all this time. If someone quite powerful knows about the drum and the gomu's interaction, it feels like they would prioritize immediately getting it back

[primal pivot]

it was transported by CP-9 so it was probably high importance for some unknown reason

[modest skiff]

yeah but once it was stolen, if they knew what it did (I will venture to guess they don't), you would think they'd go get it back rather than watch him cruise through the food chain

[primal pivot]

yea ig they woulda sent the big guys sooner

[pure raven]

I think it could have been a black market bought fruit for a higher up

Someone tracked it down and that tiger man got cucked by Shanks for it. But why did Shanks even have the fruit to begin with?

[modest skiff]

I think its possible Shanks knows why the gomu is so important but the CDs don't precisely know. I think Shanks has some reason for thinking whoever gets the gomu at some certain point of time ends up being either joyboy or someone very important

[waxen dust]

Maybe they don’t know what exactly is the One Piece, but rather the ramifications if it were uncovered. Either the Story Book or a Musical Item (Drum, Horn) make the sense to me at the moment.

[pure raven]

He had to have had a thought to use it for himself or his crew if not hand it off to someone else.

The hat honestly is more reflective on who inherited Joy Boy's will

[vestal orbit]

might just be stating the obvious but

zoro has haoshoku haki

iirc crews with a lot of coc users fall apart due to infighting, with the notable exception being xebec's crew

sanji and zoro constantly fight, bicker, squabble, etc and often refuse to listen to each other

99% sure this means sanji has coc

[vast echo]

If he had conquerors haki, there should be more evidence...
or at least some foreshadowing

thats just reaching

[scenic thicket]

blackbeard will kidnap robin to read the road ponegylphs

[tribal belfry]

I honestly dont think Sanji needs COC

[vast echo]

agree

[scenic thicket]

he gives up his dream too easily for tht

[tribal belfry]

although future sight he should have (not sure if he has it yet or not, but I believe he does)

[vestal orbit]

huh, didn't realize sanji having coc was an unpopular opinion

[tribal belfry]

no reason for him to have it

[vestal orbit]

well not opinion

[scenic thicket]

he gave up on his dream in dressrosa

[tribal belfry]

main reason ppl want sanji to have it is cuz Zoro has it

[vestal orbit]

eh, alr

just seems a bit strange

their rivalry sprang up from literally nowhere iirc

[tribal belfry]

I also feel like Zoro is closer to strength with luffy rather than Sanji

[vestal orbit]

and he has royal blood, insane willpower, etc

[primal pivot]

sanji literally rejects his royal blood

[tribal belfry]

that's not true either. They both have clashing beliefs and ideals. Sanji refuses to hit woman, while Zoro respects the power of woman after Kuina. In additiona Sanji had given up on his dream during the Baratie as he saw Zoro still hold on to his dream even when beaten by a small knife

[vestal orbit]

doflamingo was banished from the celestial dragons, doesn't mean he lost coc

[scenic thicket]

idk i feel when he gave up on the crew and the all blue for violet it showed he doesnt have the complete requirements

[vast echo]

Sanji <= Zoro <= Luffy

[primal pivot]

doflamingo was craving the royal power and status tho, sanji hates it and prefers serving people (food) i dont think coc fits at all with his personality

[tribal belfry]

I agree except no equals anywhere imo

Sanji has never been seen as a leader, which is a big req for COC. Zoro takes charge when Luffy is incapacitated or elsewhere like in Thriller Bark or Alabasta

[scenic thicket]

its not a bad thing he doesnt have it, if anything it shows conquerors can be competed with

[tribal belfry]

^

[primal pivot]

keeping the list short makes it that much more special

[vast echo]

to be fair that doesnt work with the hole zou incident

[vestal orbit]

eh, mostly fair enough

really not in the mood to get into a massive argument so

and yea ^

[tribal belfry]

wdym

[vast echo]

but i agree that he doesnt need conquerors

[vast echo]

He led the team being chased by the big mom pirates arrived at zou, and the hole we are the mugiwaras and we have come to save you sort of deal

my point is he was shown being a leader

[scenic thicket]

a lot of the members lack in certain areas but fill in for others which is more in line with a show w/ collectivist themes

[tribal belfry]

idk if I can agree with him being shown as a leader at Zou. Might have to reread Zou

[primal pivot]

theres a ton of characters who shown leadership

[tribal belfry]

Sanji 100% needs future sight if he doesnt have it tho

[scenic thicket]

it was called the twirly hat crew tho

[vast echo]

my boi ussop needs some basic armament / observation haki

[scenic thicket]

he has it tho

[tribal belfry]

honestly I feel like there's a higher chance of Usopp getting COC than armament

[primal pivot]

god usopp

[tribal belfry]

he gonn be leading a huge army after all

[scenic thicket]

nah but him not having it and being a leader shows that just being a leader isnt what gives people CoC

[tribal belfry]

true. tho him getting it would be hella funny

I dont see why he needs armament tho cuz he a sniper

[primal pivot]

maybe a new branch of observation haki shown by his father

[vast echo]

to imbue his "bullets"

[tribal belfry]

hmm ig

[scenic thicket]

like the amazon women with the arrows

[tribal belfry]

although Oda did say Usopp will always be the weakest strawhat. Usopp is def a wildcard tho I could see anything happen with him lol

I hope his buff is that his slingshot eats a devil fruit and can talk or smtn

[primal pivot]

yea but i feel like he's extra weak compared to others in current time

[tribal belfry]

I mean he is as strong as pre time skip Zoro

[vast echo]

thats cap

[tribal belfry]

I thought Oda said that somehwere

[primal pivot]

like even nami and chopper look pretty wild compared to usopp

[tribal belfry]

idk abt Chopper

Usopp is the only member of the strawhats who has haki yet isn't one of the main stream fighters

[primal pivot]

yea thats true, also he plays plays key roles in desperate situations i guess

[tribal belfry]

although I do think Usopp should and will get a buff

but I also hope Chopper gets a buff as well

[primal pivot]

his doctor side was hella buffed but fighting wise he hasnt upgraded much ye

[tribal belfry]

his monster point should be stronger for all the risk put in it. Wish it could be like pre time skip Chopper. Sometimes I feel like chopper is even weaker than Usopp (especially when he couldn't do shit to Queen even after buffing it)

[tribal belfry]

true, tho I wish the "mink medicene for Zoro" had been invented by Chopper

idk how much Chopper has done in Wano or WCI tbh

[primal pivot]

wci with the mirror thing he was pretty bright and during onigashima he's carrying the healing

[tribal belfry]

oh true actually forgot abt his counter to queen

CHopper should make potions or smtn to weaken ppl, it'd be cool

[primal pivot]

yea maybe that new "good virus" thing can lead to some new offensive stuff

[forest rampart]

Imagine if the one piece was the gomu fruit. That would mean Luffy already got the treasure.

[primal pivot]

1.5k episodes for nothing

[near cave]

Lol

[pure raven]

here’s a theory I saw awhile ago lol
Eustass is 23 years old, they searched all the blues for pregnant woman and killed any they found suspecting they were Rogers spouse carrying his child? (Correct me if I’m wrong on this part) so this might mean that Eustass’s mom might have been killed? (Motherless behavior lol)

[fading thorn]

did ace have future sight?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-F-hk0L_eo&t=62s here

or is it similar to what usopp had in dressrosa

[supple anchor]

probably not future sight but with Ace being the 2nd commander of the WB pirates its hard to imagine he didnt have some skill with CoA and CoO

[solid badger]

Why would u use anime as a reference

None of that happened in the manga

[amber oar]

• Filler episode
• Even if it wasn't filler, that just looks like standard obs at best

[junior cape]

We know from the SBS of volume 43 that Eneru would be around a 500 million bounty. How do you guys think he would shape up in the New World?

He would inevitably get smashed by an Emperor, but I think he could take out some officers before being brought down. Dude has future sight and a crazy powerful fruit.

[modest skiff]

Enel's range and power make him an extremely valuable member to any crew, up to an including emperors. He would have had an enormous impact on the Wano raid, for example.

[junior cape]

No I mean if he just went in alone, on his own conquest.

[supple anchor]

he would get smacked by an emperor or one of their higher ups probably. Enel was strong but he only showed CoO and not even future sight

[modest skiff]

Oh gotcha, yeah that's different. He doesn't have enough speed to compete in the new world. But if he used proper strategy, he could likely defeat some pretty big names just from the range of his attacks

Luffy being capable of punching Enel even once means he would be a glass canon and that just doesn't fly because people in the new world are smart. But he would be an incredible asset for a crew/team that can defend him reliably

[sand sail]

That's not why he wouldn't do well in the New World, though. You really don't have to have haki, and for a logia it's even less of a concern than for most in the end. Especially one that can use observation reliably at all, which Enel can do just fine

[junior cape]

And Enel did have ridiculous CoO

Aided further by his powers, he could sense for miles

[modest skiff]

He had ridiculous CoO but he still got punched. So long as he still gets punched, he's a glass canon. He would need to have much better speed for that CoO to be useful

[sand sail]

Enel's not a glass cannon by any means, though. Just because he can be punched doesn't mean he can be beaten every time, and his speed with observation was actually just fine. Not too many people can outspeed electricity, and with being able to see the future all he'd have to do is move his body away from the place he's getting hit

After fighting with Luffy, I imagine that'll be something he figured he should start doing instead of taking every hit

[modest skiff]

From my perspective, if Luffy was ever able to land a punch in skypea, he is apparently not able to dodge that quickly. So even though he had CoO and everything, and even thought lightning is clearly fast, it just seems like he didn't react fast enough. Or am I not remembering the fight correctly? I feel like Luffy's speed in Skypea is like crazy crazy slow compared to what is happening in the new world. But skypea was a LONG time ago so I may not be remembering right

[sand sail]

Luffy was able to land a punch because of Enel's ego, not his own speed. Enel was able to dodge Luffy plenty of times, but he kept getting cocky and rushing face first in, so he'd end up getting hit

And after being hit once, he'd be dazed enough that Luffy could follow up

But even still, Enel was physically about as strong as Luffy in general. He was very far from a glass cannon, and didn't even spend the end of the arc unconscious

[modest skiff]

This is the level of detail I forgot. Makes sense and I now agree with you. Thanks for the explanation!

[sand sail]

The punch at the end of the arc he calls too fast, presumably too fast to avoid, but that was with something very heavy helping propel Luffy forward, not his normal speed

But I agree that at this point being as fast/faster than lightning should be a general standard. I believe Ulti somewhat proved herself to be when she dodges Zeus at the least, but it seems to still be difficult to avoid for most people

Even up on the rooftop, they couldn't avoid Big Mom's Tenjin

[junior cape]

Also, for all his electric speed, Enel is only human, and can only react and move his body so fast in response.

[sand sail]

But still having said that, Enel's problem isn't that people can hit him, it's that most people won't actually be able to stay conscious against him. If the man can flood someone with electricity, just being strong isn't gonna help all that much

"Human" in One Piece includes people who can see the future and react to things moving the speed of light, Enel's physical limitations should not be part of this conversation.

[modest skiff]

Yeah this is why I think Enel is INCREDIBLY strong as a support. Like imagine if Enel was being protected by the straw hats and he was able to just unload on Kaido's folks

[supple anchor]

i think he would do fine in the New World but that the higher tier fighters in the Yonko crew would still be above him. I agree that he would do fine but against top tier fighters those few disadvantages can make the difference

[sand sail]

Yeah, Enel should be perfectly capable of being at least as powerful as Zeus or Hera, at a minimum.

[modest skiff]

Agreed

I need to re-read Zeus vs Ulti, could have sworn Zeus was able to defend Nami by being faster than Ulti

[sand sail]

Nah, Ulti avoids the first blow but gets stuck mid-air while Zeus swings back around

She can jump, but she can't fly lol

[modest skiff]

Gotcha, makes sense. God I love Zeus so much. Def one of my favorite characters lol

I am always impressed by the level of detail you remember, bean. Am I a speed reader?? I hope not, I don't think I am lol

[sand sail]

Lmao, I've just argued on this server a loooot

[modest skiff]

Yeah I suppose its kind of like building calluses LOL. Either way, its impressive

[junior cape]

Chapter 427 may just be one of the best in the series

It marks a turning point for Luffy as a character, where he realizes that he gets the power to surpass limits not only from himself, but from his friends as well.

Also it's one of the chapters they translated into anime really well. Usopp's afterlife speech is fantastic to watch.

But it's also super cathartic, because it's the end of Rob Lucci.

Honestly one of my most rewatched youtube clips

[silk rain]

doesnt electricity move at different speeds depending on the medium?

[junior cape]

They did that scene spectacularly

[junior cape]

Yes... I think.

Enels medium would be cocksure attitude

[silk rain]

[junior cape]

So very slow

[light onyx]

I wonder who they all are

A fish man A skypian I think dual wielding guy

Two swordsmen with fashionable glasses

[copper frost]

they're all named

you can check the sbs for volume 97 iirc

volume 96 my bad

[tacit veldt]

That guy has demon wings, i never noticed that

[copper frost]

https://thelibraryofohara.com/2020/04/05/volume-96-sbs-question-corner/

all of them have been revealed here and named

[torpid mist]

I like white hat black mustache

[light onyx]

Thanks

I feel like we will see gabban

[mossy dock]

Gimme some good theories to read

[sturdy hound]

have you checked the pinned theories?

[thick sky]

Good ones are pinned

and subreddit's top are also good

[sturdy hound]

or i can link you to a 50k word monet theory if you want

[thick sky]

Mip used to have that monet pfp for so long

[sturdy hound]

i will bring it back soon

[limpid sequoia]

we should unpin the one about zoro not having CoC

[pure raven]

I found some more credibility for the otoko is a kurozumi (my apologies if this is already known) In the SBS for volume 99 oda says that Yasuie found otoko and theyre not related by blood. Perhaps he realized that this child was a kurozumi and decided to save her from persecution

and maybe we will get a flashback at some point of yasuie finding otoko

[limpid sequoia]

otama and otoko are different people homie

[pure raven]

you really sent that after i even edited it

[limpid sequoia]

okay but the theory is that otama is a kurozumi, otoko has nothing to do with that theory

[pure raven]

ah nuts

[limpid sequoia]

Randy Troy has the video on it iirc

[tired osprey]

how would he realise that? and whats up with all these theories of orochi having multiple spawns across the country when its never even been implied in the manga
people really want orochi to have some abandoned babies

[tired osprey]

why cant there be multiple theories? this pastas own theory has nothing to do with tama or randy lol

[limpid sequoia]

otama being a kurozumi has some leverage, but it just depends on where Oda wants to take the story, whether he wants the kurozumi's to stay evil and be ended or forgiven through tama.

[mossy dock]

Thats what im looking for😂

[limpid sequoia]

monet isn't dead

[sturdy hound]

The theory exists btw, I’m not even kidding

[tired osprey]

doesn't have any leverage at all tbh, its all fan fiction that some people think makes sense, there is definitely no leverage that warrant it being as popular it is

[mossy dock]

Oh wut, gotta pass then

But gonna chexk the pins

[limpid sequoia]

she has purple hair and is a perfect foil to Momo's character, I wouldn't be mad if it happens but I agree that it is very subtle.

[teal bay]

momo gonna be adult

[tired osprey]

p1 has purple hair too, and orochis hair is more pinkish purple, magneta

[limpid sequoia]

if you want the evidence or thoughts behind the theory watch the randy troy video, I'm just saying that I could see Oda doing something like this, not that I 100% die hard think it's going to happen

[tired osprey]

ive watched it, and i like the stuff randy dug up, but there is still no clear evidence or foreshadowing of that happening, thats why it bother me when people take it for granted itll happen, its byakko all over again

[rancid kiln]

Is the katakuri vs Blackbeard pirates theory true?

[thick sky]

It's still theory because we don't know if its true or false

[zinc iris]

Dropping the revenge motive is a recurring theme

[fallow knot]

What if uranus is on elbaf. And the giant war in elbaf based on Ragnarok. As shanks character based on norse mythology

[acoustic helm]

Momo fruit is a SMILE ,
Tama kibi dango works on SMILE...
If momo eats kibi dango 🌋🌋🌋

[tired osprey]

Momos fruit is not a smile

[mossy dock]

What is it then?

Just the vegapunk version of that

[runic osprey]

There is no confirmation yet

[fallow knot]

I think bb will go for ancient weapons.Tht will be more reasonable for him to rule the world

[pure raven]

is crocodile a woman

[white hinge]

@empty plover

ffs it looked better in my mind

[empty plover]

makes sense

[white hinge]

y e s

[warm plank]

Vivi is in wano, let me explain this

[white hinge]

ok

[white hinge]

isnt rebeca the new vivi tho

[warm plank]

CP0 tried to assassinate Vivi cause she holds the power to control Pluton

Sabo and the 4 commanders stopped CP0, and two admirals came in

Bonney saw this as a chance and “reverted” Kuma’s time and went back to his human form

Cause Her devil fruit ability isn’t about ageing or some sort.

[white hinge]

tf

[warm plank]

Its playing with the time of the soul.

So she reverted Kuma’s time and his body is back to the human form (not robotic) and he would have his devil fruit powers back

Bonney explains to him whats going on and Kuma sees the situation and understands what Bonney’s power is, so he sent ALL of them to Wano cause Kuma already knows that ONLY Luffy can protect Vivi at that moment.

Kuma would only know about this cause of Bonney

And this is where I start to think that Yamato and Vivi will join the straw hats by the end of this arc.

Carrot can join the straw hats, but it seems unlikely cause I also think the scabbards will die and Carrot+Wanda will become the new kings of the mink tribe.

[hidden tinsel]

Mornin my fellow nakamas

[white hinge]

mornin

[white hinge]

bro i think ur doing too deep

[visual merlin]

inu and neko dying could be a reason for carrot to stay back, but carrot definitely would not be a ruler

[warm plank]

But this also leaves you to think about this, why would everyone leave an “ancient weapon” in Wano?

[visual merlin]

She's 15 and is super immature, any of the other 200 musketeers are a better choice than her for leader

[white hinge]

who do u think has the last road ponigliff?

[white hinge]

yeah

[warm plank]

Not really, you also have Wanda to help her out.

But moving on

Momonosuke being Uranus is something I like to think of, and hence why I think he might join the straw hats for a short period of time.

[visual merlin]

Why would they have wanda to help her out, and not just have a competent ruler there

[white hinge]

I am actually against the theory but, None of the musketeers want to go with luffy

[visual merlin]

Im saying if the minks had to choose a new leader after Inu and neko die

carrot's like the last person they should be picking

they can pick Wanda and Shishilian, or any other 2 adult minks

[warm plank]

So the strawhats would have 13 members in total:
Luffy,Zoro,Nami,Usopp,Sanji,Chopper,Robin,Franky,Brook,Jimbei,Vivi,Yamato,Momonosuke. Two of being the ancient weapons or holds that power.

[warm plank]

This is where I like to think that Wano is setting up the Dragon and Luffy meetup.(next arc)

Dragon and Luffy meet up, Dragon explains everything to Luffy and he’ll make Luffy decide what to do, side with Dragon or just be on his own?

I feel like in that very arc, BlackBeard will show up cause that Island might have the last road poneglyph and BB would know that Luffy already has 3 road poneglyphs.

So he could sweep up all 4 of em at once is his thinking, but incorrect thats where the war will begin of BB and the SH.

Thoughts?

[tired osprey]

Both compliment eachother well, Wanda for diplomacy and Sicillian for war

[tacit veldt]

Didnt the minks only have one Duke prior to Inu and Neko? The ram dude

It seems the ruler of the day/ruler of the night situation isnt tradition, It Just comes from Inu and Neko not wanting to even meet each other

[thick sky]

Yeah

[obtuse shore]

In an SBS (v42-p14X) Oda says that he didn't know that Rob Lucci's name can be read as thief of light, do ya'll think he's trolling or was it really a coincidence

[pine delta]

didnt the reverie happen a while ago

whats the timeline?I guess it is 3 days and 3 nights of flying and it would be sick for newcomers to crash onto the scene but the only threats unaccounted for on onigashima are the slowly spreading fire, big mom pirates (lol) and cp0

[ancient vault]

not that one

[stable heath]

Yes I believe it was stated that the reason it's like this is because of their beef.

[ancient vault]

I think its a coincidence cause he usually admits when someone finds sth out

[silk rain]

Not that its important but kuma still has his df just fyi

[forest rampart]

I think that Sanji could have another cool moment after he defeats Queen. Smth like Mr Prince and EL moment
It could be smth like helping Momo to stop Onigashima Island from falling to the Flower Capital

[heady parrot]

wish good theories got pinned more often than once a year. really hard to find anything good in this channel unless you’re checking all the new messages every day.

[dusky acorn]

The frequency 's dependant on the amount of well thought out, huge write-ups people do in here, I can't really help it. Things won't be pinned just for the sake of it, if it means reducing the baseline of effort and quality people should expect to put into their theories to be featured there

[copper frost]

Not a lot of good theories as detailed as those come across to be honest

[dusky acorn]

I'd like something like that, it'd make up for the fact that Zoro had more time to shine earlier with the fight against Kaido

Since Zoro is the one running on borrowed time with this medicine, Sanji can potentially last longer in the war and go on to do something else after his own Calamity

[ancient vault]

true. its exhausting to write them out tho

[copper frost]

Sanji is going to last longer and therefore, he's going to be of some more importance I'm sure

[pure raven]

Listen

My Theory

I think I see through Oda's plan. He got Sabo arrested meanwhile Luffy becomes Yonkou level by beating Kaido , right after Wano he finds out about Sabo and Marineford 2.0 begins

Thoughts ?

[copper frost]

So it's going to be the same situation as Marineford, Sabo's execution and all?

[ancient pelican]

I think Burgess is stronger than shilliew

[pure raven]

Yes which I find quote boring tbh

[pure raven]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA are you drunk ?

I hate Shiryu but he low diffs Burgess

[ancient pelican]

man, he's first commander, im sure

[ancient swallow]

yeah i think he is drunk

[copper frost]

He's not siem

[pure raven]

Lmao Shiryu is Blackbeard's right Hand burgess is maybe 3rd Place

[copper frost]

All the captains have the same rank in the crew

All ten Titanic ship captains have the same rank, similar to the WB pirates

[ancient pelican]

Guys, Marco was the first fleet commander and you can see hes level

[pure raven]

U do realize Shiryu is on par with Magellan right ? And let's face it Burgess is not on their Level

[ancient pelican]

Marco = Burgess

[copper frost]

Whitebeard pirate commanders had the same rank as well regardless of strength

[pure raven]

So u think Sabo would low diff Marco like Burgess

Burgess is on Oven/ Daifuku level

[ancient swallow]

Don't mind him he came for the brago serveur

[pure raven]

Lol

[ancient swallow]

The ZKK came from the brago serveur

[ancient pelican]

1 - Burgess can beat Magellan NOW

2 - Marco < Sabo

3 - WB pirates had the same ranks but the 1st fleet commander was stronger

4- ZKK is still alive

[dusky acorn]

1. Burgess hasn't even gotten his devil fruit yet. That, along with him losing to Sabo is basically a point made that he still needs to get stronger and wouldn't be quite up yet.

2. Would you agree that Oden was the strongest crew member of Whitebeard back when he was sailing with them? Granted we don't know who held the 1st division commander rank back then, but if you do, then that proves the first division rank isn't supposed to be the strongest

!wbcommanders

[lone hedge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/486983010025996299/741108250400784405/a6530302b04fc196c69920748e0c9c06.png

[dusky acorn]

4. Zoro is fighting King and is running on medication. We can probably consider him lucky if the medicine even gets him through this whole fight with the Calamity. Really don't see him lasting way until the very end of the raid, even after Luffy defeats Kaido

[ancient pelican]

1 - Sabo gots Kuma's level so it's normal that he defeats Burgess

2 - Oden was not the strongest because Vista was stronger than him and was probably the 1st fleet commander at this time.

(Oda told about pirates ranks but he also told that Shanks was yonko at 27 but he's yonko at 33 in a Vivre Card so Oda could change that)

3 - Zoro did resist to the most powerful attack in One Piece and he's the superior to Oden so he can easely defeat King and defeat Kaido since Luffy beat BM with Law and Kid

[dusky acorn]

1. Okay, I can agree with that statement. Sabo being indisputably considered the no. 2 Revo really help his case. Unless someone wants to argue Kuma held that notoriety back when he was a Revo before Sabo, but that takes some hoops.

2. I feel like it's likelier that Vista was just promoted to 5th Division up front rather than switching around commanders spots, but to each their own

If Luffy plays a part in Big Mom, I don't think it could be in Wano. His fight with Kaido is already going to completely wear him out it seems like

If him being KO'd a couple times is already something to judge by, and he's frequently completely out of it (for literal days, sometimes) after his main villain fight

[fallow knot]

I think Zoro will get his last sword from King. King is based on crow tengu. So he is a sword master.

[copper frost]

1. Sabo being Kuma's level I can take.

2. Vista was never mentioned to be the first commander ever, I don't know where you got that information from, nor can it be verified. And nor was it ever stated that he was placed at 17 stronger than Oden who was able to clash with Kaido and was called a monster by his captain himself.

3. Zoro being out of the fight after fighting King is set in stone at this moment. Him coming back was to reinforce him and Sanji defeating Kaido's most important and powerful subordinates as the wings of Luffy. Also, Luffy immediately coming down from the rooftop where Yamato is awaiting his return and is stalling the fight for him and Zoro suddenly going up after I'm assuming you think he beats King? I don't know how that works either but there's a huge possibility of the medicine running out while the fight is on with King and Queen which would mean extra difficulty for him to deal with Kaido. Zoro stalling Hakai for just a second broke most bones in his body and required a special Mink medicine to bring him back into the fight with adverse affects to fight King.

[ancient pelican]

1. Oden was called a monster but at this period, Mihawk was not a fighter and i think Mihawk is better than Oden. Knowing that, we all saw that chapter when Vista was equal to Mihwak (The best swrodsman)

(I told Vista was 1st fleet based on my personal opinion)

Luffy can't beat Kaido because the only way to kill him is with the a Sword, reminding him the trauma let by Oden. Kaido seems immortal but, the only way to hurt him is with a sword. (Yes, Luffy hurt Kaido but not so much than Zoro)

Zoro can easely take down king and queen with the help of Sanji and he's raid suit in my opinion. The invisibility gives a clear advantage

[copper frost]

Who said you need a sword only to hurt him? Where is that stated and how does that relate to his trauma of what Oden did to him. Its never made obvious that a sword would only do such damage to him because Luffy with CoCting can easily damage him.
The damage accumulated by Luffy's attacks on the roof easily surpassed Zoro, because there's a concept called damage accumulation. Kaido was excited to fight Luffy and dismissed Zoro after scarring him, immediately hitting him and Law with a CoC enhanced Thunder Bagua. Also, Kaido is remotely not immortal, he can be hurt, he can be damaged. Zoro is not taking the help of Sanji to beat King and Queen, he's fighting alongside King and Queen with Sanji.

His strongest technique, as he mentioned before he invoked Ashura to attack Kaido and scarred him

Kaido immediately in response to getting scarred and attacking both Law and Kid with a Thunder Bagua

Another instance, Zoro placing immense faith in Luffy to beat Kaido, even not believing that Kaido defeated Luffy as announced by Bao Huang

Another important point, Zoro is fighting alongside Sanji to defeat King and Queen, whether or not it remains a 2v2 or goes into a separate 1v1 is another matter. But he is going to be at his physical limit at the end of this fight as well and would still accumulate double the pain that he did while on the rooftop

These contributing factors mean that this individual or combined win against the two strongest calamities is going to put Zoro more on the map as well.

[fallow knot]

As japanese folk tales a soul of wicked person cursed to become oni. And they were defeated by momotaro and monkey King. Maybe kaidos immortality is related to joyboy. He also knows about joyboy bcoz of his race. Maybe luffy as next joyboy can defeat him

[surreal oriole]

idk where this immortal talk is coming from, i thought kaido was just extremely durable

[copper frost]

He's not immortal at all

[surreal oriole]

okay good, just making sure i didnt miss something lol

I like all this Zoro love but im pretty sure Luffy will be the one to take out the big bad this arc

[copper frost]

I mean, love what he did on the roof but he needs a solid matchup to solidify him as a major threat within the alliance and establish him as one of the wings of Luffy who's gonna help him achieve his dreams

[surreal oriole]

I thought that person was king

for this arc at least, eventually mihawk

[copper frost]

it's honestly progression that makes sense, here we have a dude whose strongest technique can give Kaido a new scar and also, would beat Kaido's right hand men alongside Sanji

Eventually, he'll go for greater heights, beat Mihawk

[surreal oriole]

yah, I have this headcannon where when the straw hats meet the the red hair pirates that luffy steps aside and lets zoro fight shanks. But in reality i think we will get a parallel of roger and whitebeard clashing,with luffy and shanks instead

[copper frost]

Consider the context of how he scarred Kaido, he scarred Kaido with Ashura with a will to protect his captain, to avoid Kaido to go for Luffy and kill him further

[silk rain]

I disagree with almost all of this.

1. Burgess > magellan
   Magellan could solo people like pre-ts luffy, and entire pre-ts bb crew, along with ivankov and inazuma, crocodile, jinbei, and could imprison shiryu (Jinbei and shiryu didn't have that drastic of a power change through the timeskip as oppose to luffy and bb, because they were both well-known for strength beforehand). Meanwhile the only feat Burgess has post-ts is failing to get to luffy and getting wiped out by sabo.

2. Marco < sabo
   This is a lot more believable because sabo could hold off one admiral and fought against two with other commanders in the RA, but marco could also hold off one admiral (kizaru, and akainu) they are at least comparable, its hard to say. So stop comparing marco to burgess, we havent seen anything from him in comparison.

3. WB commanders had the same strength
   Its just not true, Marco not equal to jozu, oden, ace, thatch, izou, vista, etc. Their ranks are the same, but the levels of power are clearly different. The reason is probably because whitebeard wont say which son is his favourite,

4. ZKK stil alive
   Like what @dusky acorn said, Zoro killing kaido seems off of the table at this point in the game. Zoro's fighting king, and his strongest attack at his peak strength didn't even bring kaido down, just leaving a scar. Zoro's strength fighting king could very well be less than when he fought kaido
   Zoro resisting the most powerful attack in OP doesnt mean he can defeat king and defeat kaido. He almost died from it and was taken out of the fight, except chopper brought him back and now he can fight king. Zoro is basically on drugs and although he will beat king I don't think he will go for Kaido right after. At this point Zoro will be the new captain if he has to be the one to fight Kaido.

Swords are DEFINITELY not the only way to kill Kaido, I don't know where you've been the past 20 chapters. Zoro's strongest attack hurt kaido and would leave a scar, but kaido didn't even seem bothered by it after the attack happened. Kaido only sees luffy as the main threat to him at this point

5. Sabo's same level as kuma so Sabo > burgess
   First of all, sabo is two ranks higher than kuma in the RA. He surpasses him in bounty, rank, and strength. Sabo could hold off fujitora, but kuma isn't at that level now. The only person that seems to be admiral level in the seven warlords is mihawk, whose strength we can't measure right now. Does this also mean that Kuma could beat magellan and marco, since you're saying Kuma = sabo?

6. Vista > Oden
   So Vista is close to Kaido's level?? Not only that but you think vista could CERTAINLY beat Kaido's commanders like King?? Vista fighting with Mihawk doesn't show that he is comparable to him. Thats like saying since Zoro fought Mihawk on baratie he must be as strong as him. theres a reason why Vista isn't known as the world's greatest swordsman

[sand sail]

I'm gonna ask you and @ancient pelican to take the discussion further in #also-manga instead if you choose, and anyone else who felt like continuing instead, just because the conversation is no longer about a theory. Having said that, the logic here has a lot of holes in it lol

[copper frost]

Are you referring to SiEM or spicy bean

[sand sail]

That addresses both of them, and just anyone else who felt like chatting about it still in general

[silk rain]

yeah he was arguing with the other guys here so I decided to send a message in this channel too
ill keep it in mind next time

[drowsy marsh]

No way someone said that Vista>Oden 😭

[polar bison]

Vista being stronger than Oden wouldn’t mean he’s anywhere close to current kaidou

Oden fought a kaidou of 20 years ago and lost. Kaidou’s gotten 20 years stronger in the interim and become a yonkou as proof of it

[drowsy marsh]

Kaido should have swapped Oden with Vista when talking about Luffy's potential

[polar bison]

vista had 20 years to get stronger that oden didn’t

he might not have been as strong while both were alive, and he might well have peaked lower than Oden would’ve had he continued living, but

that’s still 20 years of training and experience over the guy lol

[sand sail]

@polar bison @drowsy marsh Guys come on, I just asked everyone to move it to #also-manga

[pine delta]

oooo this gives me a fun idea. imagine the final red pongelyph was fed an animal devil fruit and it runs away from everybody

[ancient vault]

That is a fun idea indeed

[waxen dust]

Something 4Kids One Piece would do

[pure raven]

lol

that could be interesting

[woven bramble]

nice

Who do you think is In sama? Any theories?

[pure raven]

I disagree, I think kuma with his consciousness is defiantly Admiral level. He can move relative to the speed of light and can deflect any attack. Super intelligent too and has good haki. I would even wager that he was dragons right hand man before Sabo.
Since he's like the equivalent of what vergo was to doflamingo.
We even saw him training sabo when he was strong and has been with dragon since the beginning. and between ivankov and kuma. Kuma is clearly stronger he's done the most important work of the revolution thus far

Kuma can probably beat Magellan since he stomps Magellan in speed and his df is a direct counter to Magellans. He would walk all over him

[dusky acorn]

As Bean said, since at this point this is just dragging into flat out powerscaling and not theoreticals anymore, we're dropping the discussion. @pure raven Reason being, we don't want this channel to just be a #manga3. Since enough warnings have been given, I won't hesitate to mute if anyone continues to reply to that specific discussion from beyond this point

[dusky acorn]

We can branch off discussion from here instead

I like that idea that Imu personally knew Joyboy, possibly the one to put an end to his life even. Which may go along with the idea that the gigantic hat was his

[pure raven]

i think that he or she is someone from the void century... dont know further lol

[pure raven]

agreed

[pure raven]

sometimes i think about his or her relationship to Vivi, her photo was the only one not damaged on that scene

and the fact that the nerfetari is the only founder family that doesnt live in mary Geoise

[pure raven]

Due to the fact he sits on the empty throne, something all the kings and other celestia dragons are excluded from.
I think he has some trait or power that puts him above all other beings because of how much high regard he's shown towards the Gorosei. What would the trait or power be?
Well we know enel and 5 priest are like a parallel to them. and Enel was omniscient pretty much, so would im-sama be omnipotent? Not in the literal since ofc but because of the power he holds it is like he is omnipotent and is considered omnipotent. Him being an ancient being who hasn't died and the power he holds, we also know devil fruits didn't start appearing until 800 years ago, so could he be some type of progenitor to this power?

I mean devil fruits in general are counter traveling the seas so....in exchange for this power df were used in a way to stop more people from traveling as to not discover laugh tale? perhaps even acting as a balance at one time in history. Since that's what the WG are all about

Big head cannon

[woven bramble]

I like this theory that he/she can see the future or something like that, and then tells the Gorosei which people are dangerous for the government stability

[pure raven]

• king
• omnipotent
• ancient
• liar
• balance

Hypothesis = king of thieves?? | unironically the king of pirates

[pure raven]

that would be crazy

like the madam shyarly thing

[bitter kraken]

I find it interesting that Imu keeps his/her existence a secret from the world, I like to think Imu is scared of someone or something and stays in the shadows as sorta protection

[sand sail]

That's always a possibility. Maybe that's what Xebec's great crime was and why he had to be silenced and erased from history, he actually found out who Im was and tried to take them hostage

[ancient vault]

I think he was trying to bait Imu out with God Valley. Either he was just trying to get attention by destroying the CD's fav island as well as kill the CD's or there was sth special on the island.
At best (or worst) Imu themselves was on the Island hidden somewhere but Xebecs knew they would be there.

[sand sail]

Yeh, that's what I figured. Either God Valley was a specifically important place for the Celestial Dragons, or it was the first Mariejois

But then, aren't we told they moved to Mariejois 800 years back?

[ancient vault]

Idk if I posted my theory here before but it was part of the Tama theory. God Valley used to be the home of real dragons and the birth place of the Celestial Dragons. They were "crowned" Gods on that island and transported up top to Mary Joa on the back of (a) dragon(s). Thats how their obsession with dragons started.

[warm plank]

Oh I know this, hence why I crafted this theory

[drowsy marsh]

Only downside is that Yamato doesn't fit the number theory.

[scenic thicket]

tbh i think the five elders are immortal alongside Imu and helped him during the void century

which is why they wanted the ope ope fruit back under their control. they used jewelry bonneys powers as a substitute

[bitter kraken]

Immortal how tho? Cause the elders have scars or atelast one of them does right? If it was something like high speed regeneration wouldn’t it heal, or do you mean immortal like they simply stop aging

[scenic thicket]

stop aging. at the very least Imu has recieved the immortality surgery. i had this thought when rewatching dressrosa abt how doffy only cared abt his family from way back

also the swordsman of the group is gonna be the real best swordsman not mihawk

[ionic plinth]

Yeah, he’s gonna have at least one of the highest grade swords of not several

If not the highest itself

[unreal viper]

Why are u guys making theories when u can just read the light novel smh 🙄

[gentle knot]

i think ik who ima sans

imu sama

he’s joyboy rival and defeated him and is the ring leader of the world goverment to cover up the void century and had the age surgery op op done on him

[weak flicker]

No offense, but did you just read ||Return to Reverie||? If not, I’d highly recommend it. Awesome OP theories.

[gentle knot]

huh

no i came@up with it

[weak flicker]

Well there’s a very similar theory with Imu turning out to be ||Xebec and had the op-op surgery||.

[gentle knot]

why is it covered

OMG I SAID THAT LIKE 3 days ago

ITS THE ONLY POSSIBLE THING that’s why god valley incident was cleared snd@imu sama has complete control cause he’s strongest and can’t die

[pure raven]

What about imu being uranus?

[gentle knot]

no nami is uranus

[pure raven]

[gentle knot]

it’s all connected shebweather god and there’s huge foreshadowing

in fishman shirarsohi said to her i think i remeber yku from before

[pure raven]

Is there a theory ?
If so do share the link

[gentle knot]

no

[pure raven]

[gentle knot]

yh actually and shiraroshi said

yeah ik that’s true 100% that’s why god valley incident clear and even garp said there’s a possibly of them coming back and he’s the strongest

even kaido and big mom will obey him they know his power

[weary cliff]

This channel is supposed to be a meme-free zone

[weak flicker]

So, I’ve always speculated… What would have happened if Luffy never set sail?

[mortal moth]

Crocodile would be king of alabasta

[gentle knot]

shiraroshi would be dead

[weak flicker]

• Koby is stuck on Alvida’s ship for the rest of his life, however long that may be
• Zoro is killed by Helmeppo
• Nami escapes from the Buggy Pirates with the gold but Orange Town is destroyed
• Usopp and his entire village are killed off, with Captain Kuro destroying the remains of his crew and running off with a fortune
• Nami is tricked by Arlong, the entire town bands together to stop the Fishman Pirates and are killed by them, and Nami is either forced to be a navigator for the rest of her life or tries to escape and is killed for it.
• Sanji and Zeff defeats Gin and Krieg but Sanji is found out by his siblings and forced to marry off in WCI

• Laboon is captured and Crocus is supposedly killed or thrown overboard
• Vivi and Igaram are killed by Mr. 5 and Ms. Valentine
• Chopper barely manages to defeat Wapol but remains on the island
• Baroque Works’ plan goes off without a hitch, and Alabasta is conquered by Crocodile
• Robin and Cobra are killed off by Crocodile

[gentle knot]

shanks lost a hat

[white hinge]

keeps a hat xD

[gentle knot]

what you on about

set sail not meet shanks

[white hinge]

oh ok

[weak flicker]

• Bellamy still wrecks havoc on Jaya
• Cricket never gains solace in his ancestor’s adventure
• Enel wins and a huge chunk of the Skypeians/Shandorians are killed off

[gentle knot]

ace would be alive

[weary cobalt]

Doubtful.

[gentle knot]

whitebeard was gonna save him anyway 100%

[weary cobalt]

His stubborness would get him killed someday

[gentle knot]

luffy was just a annoying that arc for them

[weary cobalt]

Ace would not be the same person if Luffy hadn't entered his life

[gentle knot]

bro are you dumb

it said set sail dummy even if luffy didn’t set sail he would of met ace

[weary cobalt]

He would be more resentful and bitter than he is when we meet him in the storyline

There is no telling how that could affect his life expectancy, I don't see him living long with those the personality traits mashed together

[weak flicker]

• Foxy does nothing

• CP9 win, and the Ancient Weapon is built, with Franky killed after having all the information they can get from him extracted.

[gentle knot]

no lol robin would survive she would be with crocodile

[weak flicker]

• Ace is captured by Blackbeard and taken to the WG for his new Warlord status.

[weak flicker]

No, she planned on betraying Crocodile. She expected her death. I just had a brain fart for the Arnie’s Lobby one.

[weary cobalt]

It's more productive to just remove Luffy's existence in general. These are boring

Especially with Ace

[weak flicker]

• Nothing happens at Sabaody except for Rayleigh’s escape

• Nothing happens at Amazon Lily, except for Boa losing her status as a Warlord for refusing to take part in Marineford

• Literally nothing goes down at Impel Down

• Marineford goes exactly as it used to except Ace is killed on the spot instead of by Akainu

[gentle knot]

no

whitebeard would of saved him

[weak flicker]

If it weren’t for Mr. 3 Ace would’ve been dead on the spot

[slim moat]

Well. Technically there would be no one piece show if none of it happens

[pseudo citrus]

maybe Kid would be the main character then

[silk rain]

One of the main theories about joyboy's will is that its not a set person who is joyboy from birth, but that people inherit the title overtime through their willpower, because luffy seemed to be very similar to kid in a way, it makes a lot of sense that he would inherit the will of joyboy in this case if luffy wasn't born or something happened to him (out of all the people we've seen so far)

• Desire for Freedom
• Willpower
• Charisma??
  Except Kid seems like an inbetween of luffy and bb, considering that he literally crucified a crew pleading to go back to paradise 😂

[weary cliff]

This idea is the last bastion for people who don't want Luffy to be the fated hero (which is most of us), but unfortunately it's copium. Luffy is the set person. If it was going to be Kid or anyone else, you'd have to rewrite the story to make it so

[slim moat]

Shanks gave the hat in first chapter itself. Remember it's 1997. It was not big cliche when it started.

[sleek hare]

What if Shanks is Xebec's son? Shanks is 39 years old and the "God Valley Incident" happened 38 years ago from the TS, meaning that he was an infant when it happened, what if Roger took in Shanks after defeating Xebec when he was a year old, and that's how everything from then on happened? It seems far-fetched at first but imo, it really all adds up.

or maybe it was Buggy 🗿

[lone hedge]

isledelphino#9226 was warned!

[wild veldt]

Don't post terrible memes here

[stuck slate]

what if kuina is mihawk

[waxen light]

read the comment above yours

[shut copper]

did spoilers for chap 1023 release

[shut copper]

you deserve the one piece

[modest skiff]

Wrong channel. This is for serious theory discussion. Go to #manga

[stuck slate]

thanks it took me a while to think abt

[true lily]

What if shanks is a tenryubito?

[ancient vault]

thats a popular theory too. That roger took him from the CD on god valley

If whos who doesnt die this arc I could see him join Blackbeard or Kid

[modest skiff]

I’d enjoy watching Kid punch cp0 into the ground and then ask WW if he wants to help kill Shanks

[covert hazel]

I'd like to see him at least interact with luffy

[ancient vault]

Yeah the 3 of them have all a hate towards shanks

[modest skiff]

Yeah but Kid needs more crew more than BB

[ancient vault]

its just gonna be like this

[ancient vault]

Yeah thats why he could get ulti and p1 if they see how kid defeats Big Mom they could possibly join him. Whos who I think cause of his history knowledge should go to BB

[slate torrent]

Ulti and p1 will probably go off into the new world by themselves

But I don’t mind them getting up and fighting bm with kid next chapter

[proven lion]

See the problem with this theory imo is that even in the beginning of the series shit even before every episode of the anime, "inherited will" is talked about quite often, it is a very common and prevalent theme and always has been in one piece.

With that being said I dont think it's right to say luffy isnt joyboy, or that he doesnt hold some kind of inherited will within him. He most certainly has to according to what we know thus far in the story. And I dont think it's just because a "promise" he made to shanks that he has gone to such lengths, it has to go further then that, that kind of will power and preservence is inherited not really taught.

[silk rain]

Im not saying luffy isnt joyboy i was responding to somebody else

[lucid oar]

What y'all think of this theory about devil fruits?

Summary:
Devil fruits are in a dormant state of powers and the closest version to the full potential of any devil fruit is an logia fruit or awakened logia fruit.

By this is meant that eventually all devil fruits are able to unlock logia powers like: intangibly, regeneration, transformation, influencing environment.

Referencing to the fight between Luffy and doffy where Luffy says "everything's turning into string!! It's like he's no longer a paramecia anymore"

Sidenote: these dormant powers are not only unlockable or achievable by experience/training. Vegapunk, Judge & Caesar had ways to recreate devil fruits and devil fruit powers by working with the lineage factor.

[proven lion]

Understood. In other news I said this ages ago and its starting to look like this after the who's who incident ( havent talked in here for months) but shanks isnt a "good character" I dont think, he is either neutral or bad.

[proven lion]

Yes I agree and it's not out of the question to think luffy will be able to produce rubber when he has awakened his fruit. Also when you consider katakuri is also an awoken paramecia it's even more apparent

I believe gear 5 will involve this

[tacit veldt]

Ulti and P1 are 100% cover story material

[agile tangle]

I'm curious, a lot of people don't want this to happen, why not?

[lucid oar]

This makes me almost also believe that logia is already the final stage of devil fruits meaning its sort of already awakened but you can get stronger with it. With the result that you can do large scale devilfruit power output. Like aokiji vs akainu

You can go even as far as saying the classes given to devil fruits are wrong. And only given because the one piece world doesn't really understand the devil fruit.

Ofcourse you would have to explain a Zoan awakening, but I think that Enel is a good example of transforming just like how alot of Zoan types could transform in different shapes.

[proven lion]

Because it would make luffy "too special" and not just some kid who worked hard for everything which is a farce

[weary cliff]

It at leasts runs counter to some of the themes sef up back in the early days

[agile tangle]

So they think that Luffy being the chosen one means that his hard work wasn't because of his own dream but something predetermined?

[proven lion]

But there is also odd ball fruits specifically the 2 that blackbeard currently has

[agile tangle]

Could you elaborate please?

[weary cliff]

One Piece has been chiefly about dreams and freedom. If Luffy was destined to fulfill whatever predetermined path, was he free?

[proven lion]

Basically but it goes a bit further like he had a golden line up of family members and coincidentals, he grew up with Roger's son, is the son of the most wanted person in the world, the grandson of the most notorious marine ever, and trained under Roger's best friend.

[agile tangle]

Ah I see

Thanks

[proven lion]

I personally dont see it as him being the "chosen one" because well he has almost died countless times and only survived because others. And he fully admits that he needs friends to succeed.

[weary cliff]

His ability to bring others to his cause are part of what makes him special

[proven lion]

He is likely joyboy but I dont think joyboy is what we think... I think personally joyboy is someone who can bring people together.

[stuck tulip]

Luffy kills kaido im callin it

[proven lion]

Yes

[stuck tulip]

Luffy somehow gets enma and decapitates kaido. this theory is shit but aint no way oda isnt gunna draw a dragon getting his head cut off

[weary cliff]

And so he was chosen to be able to bring people together. Be destined doesn't mean you have to be the ultimate life form capable of anything

[proven lion]

I think based off what we are seeing it will be a momo and luffy who take him down

[stuck tulip]

But momo is fucking dogshit

[proven lion]

Well... not after what's about to happen.

[stuck tulip]

If he becomes an adult i still got usopp beating his ass lmao

How tf he even touchin kaido

[proven lion]

He is about to be made an adult and will be his dad basically... nah momo is one of the few people who have the voice of all things in the series he is genuinely important dont count him out.

[runic osprey]

Depends on what is his df gonna become

[stuck tulip]

If momo somehow gets strong then thats some dbz bullshit

It dont matter if he a dragon. He aint got that lvl of haki

[runic osprey]

He said that if he turns to an adult his dragon form will become bigger

[stuck tulip]

Momo as an adult is basically the dragon from punk hazard

[proven lion]

He wont have a devil fruit he will wield Ame no habakiri

[stuck tulip]

Doesnt mean he can do anything against kaido lol

[stuck tulip]

Still not doin shit tbh

[proven lion]

Dont count him out that's all I'm going to say.

[lucid oar]

This actually explains it even more, because teach acts like a baboon but he knows way way more then he shows. And also that he is an archaeologist according to sbs from oda. Meaning he has historical knowledge and traveled the one piece world on whitebeards ship.

Concluding that the one piece world doesn't know the truth about the devil fruits. And that there is a whole other side of devil fruits that will be released.

I think that the release of this other side, includes the so called existent classes are wrong or either incomplete.

And finding one piece has something to do with this truth of devil fruits.

[stuck tulip]

If kaido basically low diffed zoro then aint no way momo is fighting kaido. Im not counting him out, im not even gonna acknowledge him as a chance, hes a vehicle for luffy and thats it

[runic osprey]

Most likely

[proven lion]

One piece in my opinion is what we always said it was it's the world whole again every ocean free to be sailed.. the grand line and red line are man made and so is the calm belt

[stuck tulip]

Most likely what? I said multiple things

[runic osprey]

That momo wont be that important in case of fighting kaido

[stuck tulip]

Oh W then

[runic osprey]

Maybe a support for luffy everytime he gets knocked off

[stuck tulip]

Hes finna be the pegasus to luffys hercules😂

[proven lion]

Nah he will... just trust me lmao he is not just important but crucial for them to win once he is an adult.

[stuck tulip]

Im ngl that sounds so ass. I dont think even DBZ does bullshit like that

What will he even do

[proven lion]

Well for 1 he is a dragon, his fathers son, and how things are lining up will wield the ame no habakiri.

I'm not saying he will solo kaido

But he is going to help finish what his father could not

[lucid oar]

But how do the devil fruits fit in this. Do you think devil fruits have always existed or does it have something to do with the void century and the D. Clan.

Because i think they do. Devil fruit owners where from the D. Clan and celestials were afraid of devil fruit powers. And after the void, the devil fruits became available to everyone.

[lucid oar]

And finding one piece will also reveil this

[proven lion]

Well no personally I think those are also man made.. vega punk in my opinion isnt far ahead of his time he is actually just using ancient knowledge, devil fruits are also man made just like smiles they are un natural in every way.

These are just theories really but to me it would make perfect sense as to why we dont know much about them. And vega punk seemingly knows all there is to know about them.

[lucid oar]

I totally agree that it is manmade, because Judge also gave his sons devil fruit like powers by changing their DNA (lineage factor)

[stuck tulip]

Kaido invulnerable skin. No haki. No skill, a huge pussy, zoro who was prolly the 2nd strongest nigga on the roof got low diffed, Momo legit cant do shit with anything he gets as an adult

[proven lion]

It will be a critical reveal twords the end you are absolutely right on that it's one of one pieces biggest mysteries but when u line up what the government is all about it is pretty clear.

[proven lion]

Idk you are right on all ends of that but wano is not done oda will make it interesting dont you worry he said wano will make marineford look like childs play and it is delivering thus far. I'm not saying your not wrong in any way but just think about what we know about momo.

What's most interesting to me still is what who's who revealed

[lucid oar]

About the gomu gomu fruit?

[supple ivy]

gear 5 > gear 6 > awakening > advanced awakening 🤡🤡🤡

[proven lion]

Yes and the fact shanks stole it off the ship

[lucid oar]

Yeah they knew they were going to steal the gomu gomu fruit

[proven lion]

[supple ivy]

best gomu gomu theory yall have heard

[lucid oar]

But I've a thought about that and it makes it pretty simple actually and that the gomu gomu fruit isn't that special compared to law's fruit which gives immortality.

[proven lion]

That's the thing.. why did they have such an important person guarding it and why was he sentenced after failing to retrieve it... I think it does hold significane I just cant think of a reason why.

[lucid oar]

This thought also make skypia 1 of the more importants arcs although it felt like a filler arc to me😅

[supple ivy]

the theory i’ve heard is it’s awakening will be a property of rubber which will be erasure which is able to erase people’s memory and remove memory’s of the void century

[proven lion]

Hmm that doesnt make that much sense but who knows lmao

[supple ivy]

skyp was so boring

[supple ivy]

basically being able to erase people’s memory’s but it dosent really add up

or the rubber fruit gives you immortality

[proven lion]

But how is skypeia boring.. had the first op villain, was the only island that had the ancient writing just out and about, the first time luffy caught a glimpse of Roger's path besides his deathbed, and was also the strangest location thus far.

Oh and not to mention one of the coolest flash backs

I dont understand the hate for skypeia idk

[supple ivy]

now like people tying everything back to skyp it is now an important arc

[copper frost]

better stick to theories here rather than arc discussions

[proven lion]

To me it was always interesting even beside the whole nika thing now

[supple ivy]

i think the thing we have to realise is oda wanted to start and finish one piece in 5 years meaning there should be a lot of clues in the early chapters

[proven lion]

Your right slight tangent sorry

[lucid oar]

Because as we all know and believe, I certainly do: it's about the strongest devil fruit in existence, god enels fruit. Capable of almost everything and even reviving your own heartbeat.

In the void century the most feared power was the goro goro fruit power, and the only fruit that can defeat the goro goro is the gomu gomu.

And the WG has always been on the cautious and prevention stance. So this was a fruit to have the insurance to fight against the goro goro, because they couldn't find the goro goro fruit (by now it's on the moon so they still won't find it😅)

So it's pretty simple, and it's not about awakening the gomu gomu. Because why would they gaurd a fruit with such basic powers when eaten for the first time. They ain't guarding it for it's awakened powers, because that takes a long time to master. Just like what makes law's fruit special, it can give Immortality from the getgo. Not after awakening it.

[supple ivy]

yu sat there and typed all that i Respect it

[lucid oar]

Yeah🤣🥳

[proven lion]

Well either way the goro goro is made useless post time skip aka haki is now relevant.

And I dont think haki was discovered recently I think it has been around always.

[lucid oar]

Yeah true but still haki is somewhat special. Because when Luffy unlocked Q-haki, everyone was shooked at marine war.

And it goes both ways, what if gorogoro also had Q-haki.

World king😰

[supple ivy]

luffy is smart when it comes to using anything to fight the person in front of him. his battle iq is definitely decent and the next thing he’ll be able to do with his df will definitely be very op after all the haki and shit he’s learned

[proven lion]

Maybe it seems interesting to a degree but has some plot holes

[proven lion]

Jon Jones of one piece

[supple ivy]

correct me if i’m wrong kaido passively coats himself in conquerors haki and armament

[proven lion]

Yes he does and so does big mom

[lucid oar]

Well I didn't think to hard of how special gomu gomu is, because I was looking only at the base powers. And came to the conclusion, the only special thing is the anti-thesis to the strongest devil fruit😅

[supple ivy]

what if luffy finds a way to mix the two types of haki and make a new one … bit of an overkill but ig he could right ….

[lucid oar]

Because in the end haki wins from everything: Roger & garp vs xebec & crew (all with devil fruits)

[proven lion]

Well there is advanced conquerors haki that was shown in the roger flash back... I think that will play a big role soon

[supple ivy]

we see haki all being used separately but what if there’s more to it

[lucid oar]

That's why I don't take haki in the sum of devil fruit powers.

[proven lion]

Yeah I think maybe what makes the fruit special is when u combine haki and the gomu gomu

[supple ivy]

yh

[lucid oar]

But u would still need a stronger Haki then your opponent. Because let's say for example Luffy haki vs garp Haki.

In the future Luffy for sure will have a stronger haki then garp. But now I still believe garp would hurt Luffy. Just like Luffy was a kid when he got hit by him😅

[supple ivy]

advanced haki - the mix of all 3 haki

yh 100% haki is something you have to train if it’s weak then a stronger haki user will body u

[proven lion]

Yeah it was said that shanks has the strongest haki currently though which goes back to why I think shanks stole it... he wanted to eat that fruit himself

[lucid oar]

And Haki outrules devil fruit powers, so I find it hard to find the connection with gomu+Haki

Because someone with stronger haki would still clap Gomu or any otherbfruit+weaker haki right?

[lucid oar]

Yeah I've read this theory too.

[supple ivy]

the only fruit that ik that can’t be outruled is barrier fruit

i’m pretty sure gomu helps increase the strength of luffys punch or kick

[proven lion]

I haven't heard the theory anywhere else lol but it just seems likely that what makes the gomu gomu powerful is the combination of that fruit + a powerful haki maybe the world goverment didnt actually want it for themselves rather they wanted to keep it away from someone who could actually reak havoc with it

[supple ivy]

cause we do know gear 2 helps increase speed abs strength i think

so gomu could amplify haki

[lucid oar]

Yea could be considering they want to prevent anything and everything

[supple ivy]

we see that best used in gear 4

[proven lion]

Yeah but those moves were made by luffys intuition.. I think it goes deeper in the fact that yes it has an amplifying effect so if u combine it with someone who has the ability to awaken it it could potentially be a very very dangerous fruit.

[lucid oar]

And how the black haki lines shape on Luffy giving him the title "wisdom king" alsmost looking like wukong mythology.

So yea I can agree how the Haki influences his gomu 4th Gear, looking like the final boss 🤣

[proven lion]

Yeah and my opinion snake man was utterly op

[supple ivy]

how many gear does a gear box normally have 5 or 6

[proven lion]

5 to 6

Depending on the car but usually 5

[supple ivy]

yup he’ll definitely make a gear 5 by the end of wano

[proven lion]

The gears thing is just luffys doing tho imo I dont think anyone else would use that fruit that way

[supple ivy]

maybe gear 5 is the mixture of conq haki. Yes that is very true i also do believe that joy boy had this fruit aswell

[stuck ore]

Nvm

[supple ivy]

lmaooo

[stuck ore]

Read that "nobody uses their fruit that way"

[proven lion]

Interesting take.. I find it funny how there is hints all over for the fruit being important like in the ASL arc

[stuck ore]

It is important it is a direct counter to so many things

[proven lion]

He was constantly ragged on for the fruit being buns but we all know now that it's more then just useful.. but that doesnt explain why its THAT important I just think it's a funny little foreshadow

[stuck ore]

Yeah why WG needed that fruit specifically is what I want to know

[proven lion]

Yeah like i said earlier I believe it was a preventive action

I dont believe they wanted it for themselves rather to keep it away from people who might have the capability to unlock its power, the combination of powerful haki and the fruit itself is what makes it powerful which is why I think shanks wanted to eat it himself.

[supple ivy]

If it was THAT important i think imu would have taken it and kept it with him

[proven lion]

Which is what he might have been planning on doing

Who's who was incarcerated for many years because he failed

Who really is imu by the way.. that is another thing that kind of puzzles me because I dont believe he is the final villain and the fact that shanks willy nilly was having conversations with him is kind of wowing

[supple ivy]

i feel like it has to do with 1. a mix with conq and arm haki with the df will make the fruit do something because it’s probably the most compatible or the awakening of the fruit is a property of rubber

imu i’ll see if i can find anything on him

[proven lion]

I mean we know who he is more or less he is the head of the government as we know it but why was shanks able to talk to him...

[lucid oar]

What counters is more then? I've got goro goro fruit. The devil fruit of god enel 1st on my list of counters then

[supple ivy]

what is he capable of that’s the question

[proven lion]

He is capable of anything the government is capable considering he is the government

[supple ivy]

lemme rephrase that. was does he plan on doing. what is his main objective. and if he’s that powerful why didn’t he take care of roger secretly. as rogers crew was a threat to the wg due to them knowing the secrets of the world. and did roger find out who imu was

[proven lion]

That itself is jarring I really dont know he is genuinely mysterious and nefarious to me.

[ancient vault]

shanks never talked to imu

[proven lion]

Maybe he is "joyboys" brother

[proven lion]

Your right he talked to the gorosei I was confusing panels

[stuck ore]

Canons and pistols

Can be used to float in air

[lucid oar]

But I'm more specifically talking about base powers, not trained, created or developed powers

And floating or walking in the air is also trained by by rokushiki powers by the Navy

[stuck ore]

Omce you eat rubber fruit your body becomes rubber so where training part?

You just need to fill in air inside your body

[hollow dust]

but it isnt just air that he uses to fight spacify

[lucid oar]

Then you become bounce man🤣

[supple ivy]

like that a lot aha just like one for all and all for one

[lucid oar]

But I think that's more of the creative fightingstyle of Luffy instead of an inherent gomu power

[stuck ore]

Maybe you are right

[lucid oar]

Which is why the base gomu powers aren't anything special.. so I believe the wg is precautionary of the gomu because of its awakened abilities or it's inherent counter ability to the strongest devil fruit in existence.. god enels devil fruit

[stuck ore]

Yeah

[lucid oar]

Because there are only a few fruits where the WG was precautionary for. Law's fruit and maybe bonnet fruit, which all have something to do with aging.. so gomu gomu maybe could also have to do something with aging

[stuck ore]

But if shanks stole the fruit then that eliminates enel from scene

[lucid oar]

Well. It's not about enel, I think because of enels personality the strongest fruit was weak. It's more about the fruit itself. And where enel supposedly found the goro goro fruit. (The acient kingdom & Jaya theory)

[hollow dust]

What do you guys think about caribou and how mysterious he is, being able to store humans in his body, etc etc popping up at opportune times, he heard Poseidon’s identity, was at the prison and now disappeared even though he begged to join luffy

[lucid oar]

I think caribou is a character like Bartholomeo will go on and off the story when needed

[hollow dust]

I’m still super interested in all the Blackbeard being 3 people theory, there’s a ton supporting it, even when they were on the island war when Blackbeard pirates fought whitebeard pirates buggy and shanks were talking and buggy states that “they say he didn’t sleep the entire time” makes sense because he can swap out parts of his body, as supported in him being able to have two devil fruit powers… and the whole shanks scar thing, he can swap his hand instantly from being just his hand to maybe using that claw he used from when he was a younger pirate

And Marco supporting the whole “odd body thing etc “

[lucid oar]

It sounds familiar with other theory's that in a sort of way claim the same. And that Zoros lineage goes back to Ryuma. To think that Zoro would be a decadent of ryuma would be pretty awesome.

[hollow dust]

It also supports why he can eat as much as luffy and why he ordered so many pies

[lucid oar]

Everyone finds shanks the most mysterieus one in one piece. But for me it's Blackbeard. He knows too much, he is able to do too much, and is just too OP in rvery way towards the truth of one piece

[hollow dust]

Well think about it, luffy states that it’s “them” rather than him, and the fact that he kept ordering so many pies, no regular person can eat as much as luffy

[lucid oar]

He is also a 'D' but according to whitebeard he didn't inherit their 'will'

So.. so many mysteries shrouded around Blackbeard. And he definitely knows the key about devil fruit powers

[hollow dust]

Well I feel as though, even though Blackbeard has 2 Powers now, maybe already has a 3rd we don’t know about which is why he maybe “absorbed” his twins or, it’s a similar thing to caribou where pirates we know now could be Blackbeard’s 3rd twin or something

It’s why Blackbeard body is able to swap out to other hands, heads etc

Or Blackbeard is a chimaera like orochi is a hydra

Hence the 3 heads on the flag

[lucid oar]

Well until now we haven't yet seen a different personality if he would be like the movie split

[hollow dust]

No, because teach is timid at times and others super aggressive

[lucid oar]

If that would be revealed, then the only question is, who is or are the others😨

Could be xebec

[stuck ore]

It is posted

Luffy did say people in snow countries dont sleep

[hollow dust]

I do think Blackbeard has too much knowledge of course for his time especially because if I recall someone said in the manga that he has had “TWICE” as long

[quasi roost]

My bad, Ill delete it, as its spam

[stuck ore]

No prob

It will just disappear once spoilers come out

[lucid oar]

When do they come out

[hollow dust]

I mean Blackbeard also was the first person to scar shanks too

[stuck ore]

A few days

[lucid oar]

Blackbeard is like the 🃏 of one piece story. Able to do everything & anything out of the blue lol

[hollow dust]

I feel like he is a chimaera of people a mixture of 3 and i don’t know why but I feel like caribou is involved because of how mysterious and his abilities and what he has done/does

Since he can “collect” people inside him infinitely , caribou is going around collecting people and information

[light onyx]

3 in one ?

[teal bay]

wrong channel

[hollow dust]

Yea. There’s a ton of theories supporting it, Blackbeard’s flag, the 3 pistols, Marco stating his weird body, he doesn’t sleep during the war, eats as much if not more than luffy, knows too much, has lived twice as long as most people , luffy with his observation Haki states “they”

[stuck ore]

Lol

[light onyx]

The pattern of luffys clothes look like his devil fruit

[teal bay]

yeah

[light onyx]

I think momo will deal the finishing blow to kaido

[teal bay]

that is gonna be luffy

[light onyx]

Luffy killing kaido ?

[hollow dust]

Yea, unless momo is somehow secretly stronger than luffy with his ryou

[fallow knot]

What if there is sea devil who defeated previous gods of one piece with the help of 20 nations and trapped thier soul into fruits? From Gods I mean different races with powerful ability.

[hollow dust]

Maybe zoro will be the final hit on kaido since this is the wano arc and he is using odens sword

[fallow knot]

How much u want from zoro.

Don't underestimate king. He will be a good match up for him.

[pure raven]

luffy with his observation haki
This was in jaya

[pure raven]

still no clues?

[pseudo citrus]

biggest "clue" is that the anime showed that Toki is most certainly dead... the hairstyle looks like Toki's, and the Scabbards (maybe just Kinemon?) seemed to think it was someone they knew, but it can't be her if she's dead.

most people just assume that it's Hiyori (or meme pick Enel, with that being an earlobe instead of a hair lock)

[waxen dust]

It can still be Toki; At this point I wouldn’t be surprised if it actually is her. I hope it’s Hiyori, but given the significance of Toki’s character and her devil fruit I am betting to believe she’s somehow the one peering over the Scabbards.

[pseudo citrus]

yeah that's fair, I guess I should say, if it's Toki you need a bit of extra spice to make it work, like something that lets her travel back in time (devil fruit awakening?) or it's somehow her spirit/ghost/shadow manifested

[waxen dust]

Whoever this person is I definitely believe they’ll play a significant role very shortly and it’s gonna tie back to Momonosuke. Whenever this person is revealed Momo will likely be there as well.

[amber oar]

People keep ignoring this panel

[pine delta]

how could it not be hiyori

like, barring enel it could literally be no one else. it being toki would be so out of character, she faked her own death? She's the one who married oden

would also give us a chance for hiyori drop kicking orochi

[pure raven]

Any idea about Shanks move?

[forest rampart]

sipping tea

[pure raven]

will it be in Wano or elsewhere ? I

[forest rampart]

move in elbaf

[pure raven]

there is like less than 15 chapters left

[crisp bridge]

Quick question: could this be Merry Lamb telling luffy to look down for the One Piece since there‘s that Theory with the OP being under Enies Lobby

[ancient vault]

no (this has been asked like 500 times now)
Its so obvious why merry told them to look down. Tf u think merry was? Up in the sky?

[pure raven]

No the ohara theory has been debunked

[crisp bridge]

Aight ty

[bitter kraken]

I think it’s the lurking legend so it’s gonna be someone from the past, prolly toki deff not hyori

[worldly anvil]

wait have Momo met Hiyori yet?

[ancient vault]

Lurking legend was also already revealed. Its the Kaido BM alliance known as "The return of rocks". The legend that was lurking was the Rcks pirates and the lurking legend being the SHs biggest enemy ever is just the 2 yonko alliance.

This person is most likely hiyori

[ancient vault]

nope

[worldly anvil]

damn

[bitter kraken]

Oh lol I forgot that it was gonna be a state hat enemy, but I still think the silhouette is not hyori to me the fish reaction was sorta like brushing it off because to him toki is deff dead 💀

[ancient vault]

he escaped with hiyori. He didnt see her die but he knows from others she died. So saying I saw someone that looked like lady haki is basically implying he saw hiyori whos a copy of toki lol

[modest skiff]

Not gonna pretend it is likely, but Enel looking up lots of history regarding the moon makes it totally conceivable that he would end up being a Wano enthusiast. We’re getting lots of hints that Wano is central to a lot of things and maybe Enel ends up realizing Wano needs to open for some kinda moon thing to happen. I think Enel is such a meme that people aren’t recognizing the legitimately possible connection

[pure raven]

it will be greater than Marineford, so its not surprising that Enel is there

[modest skiff]

I legitimately don’t think this looks like Hiyori. Maybe I just haven’t seen panels that make Hiyori look like this. But if we ignore all the stupid culture around Enel, I think it’s more likely Enel then Hiyori. Still feels like a third option is still possible but if you held a gun to my head and told me to guess Enel or Hiyori, I would definitely not guess Hiyori

[somber sphinx]

Guys Marco mentioned the race of people who can burst into flames that live on top of the grand line - Luffy's RED HAWK!!??? is luffy of that race?

[primal pivot]

Plz no

[modest skiff]

Luffy creates fire the same as Sanji, friction interacting with air causing an electric potential that creates plasma

I thought that was already explained or at least people say that’s in an SBS or something

[somber sphinx]

was there? i dont recall anything official

[modest skiff]

Or they called it friction or something. Either way, strictly speaking, there is a speed at which an object traveling through a gas will ionize the gas. It’s just that the One Piece universe seems to have basic constants that allow gas to ionize at lower energies. This could actually be somewhat justified if the intrinsic magnetic field of the planet is much higher.

[modest skiff]

People cite “friction” every time like it comes from something canon. Don’t have the reference myself, just assumed it’s true since I never see anyone get corrected over it

[bitter kraken]

From what we know momo and hyori mean to the Sabs, the fish would have panicked if he thought even for a second hyori was there in that island where a full blown war was going on, but he didn’t panic he just was like nah it can’t be pretty much lol because to him and everyone else toki is dead and seeing her would be like whot

[surreal oriole]

I knew the diable jamba was friction, I always thought the red hawk or when sanji ignited his body on Fishman island was something different

[forest rampart]

I missed my chance to post my opinion on who's the person before but now I'm ready to post it. It's a bit long.

[ancient vault]

Those "long" hair things fit hiyori.
The nose fits hiyori more or less
The person crying which only makes sense for hiyori with the knowledge we know

• hiyori is missing

[forest rampart]

Chp 955
"I'll admit, I'm worried out of my mind for poor Otoko. But for now, Kawamatsu, I will refrain from meeting the others. Sentiment is forbidden before a battle." "Please join your strength with the others, and find a way to protect Wano!!" - Hiyori

Then, Chp 1007 we have..

it sounds like Kawamatsu was talking about someone dead here: Oden or Toki, but it could also be Hiyori since she said that she'll refrain herself from meeting the others. imo Hiyori came after she gave Toko to Hitetsu's care, or that Hitetsu offered himself to look after Toko. So it's possible that she knew about Hitetsu's identity (aka Sukiyaki).

I think that Hiyori decided to come to Onigashima after she left Otoko to Hitetsu's care. She's a clingy person but she does have self-refrain. Between Momo and Hiyori, imo Hiyori has a stronger feeling of wanting to meet Momo. At Onigashima, she decided to keep in hiding because she told Kamawatsu that she'll refrain herself from meeting others, but still helped to heal the scabbards, and she probably left because she didn't want to be seen by others, and because of the announcement about Momo (Beast Pirates were searching for him). Unlike Momo, Hiyori didn't go to the future (present timeline) which could easily turn her feeling of wanting to meet Momo becomes a longingness (foreshadowed by Black Maria's song). She was a crybaby, and i think that she's still a bit like that even now. The reason why she came is because it's not like that she didn't trust the scabbards, but it's more like she's afraid of losing another and the only family member that she has now.

Momo will take Luffy to the rooftop. After Luffy ||(and Zoro)|| wins, and Kaido is defeated, Hiyori will appear on the rooftop, and she'll reunite with Momo "beneath the light of the moon".

But then, how much longer it is until the Sun will rise? Also, when tomorrow comes, what would happen to the 1% person? I would like to think that he'll definitely survive. Oda hyped his reader about that 1% person but there're already many deaths happening in the battle rn: samurai, Orochix2, Ashura, Kiku, Kanjuro, Kinemon.. Oda has done the same in the past, he hyped up about Luffy's "death": Hawkins said that no matter what, Luffy's chances of dying were never at 0%.

Imo before Hiyori meets Momo on the rooftop, perhaps she'll meet Denjiro and Orochi (alive). Or that she'll meet Orochi after Kaido dies. And she will decide to forgive Orochi despite her hatred towards him. Her decision will be the right choice and will drive the citizens of Wano to also forgive Orochi and admit their fault to the Kurozumi clan. I think that forgiveness is the key to create a better future for Wano.

[modest skiff]

Sounds like I haven’t internalized a panel that you have then. My brain tells me the nose and hair are not a good fit. I’m not 100% sure those are tears

[forest rampart]

done

[ancient vault]

u make me wanna drop the caribou theory for a moment and start the hiyori theory cookie

[forest rampart]

What theory?

[ancient vault]

My hiyori theory which I wanted to write about half a year ago

I got all these notes but im to fcking lazy to write it out

[forest rampart]

Oh haha 😂

[modest skiff]

Me and you both swrml

I’ve got like 3 days of writing I’m putting off and it just keeps growing

[forest rampart]

I do have a bunch of other theories too but I'm so lazy to make a proper theory out of them. I think that Laugh Tale theory will be the first and last proper theory I'll ever make.

[ancient vault]

yeah I also had found out that the song was a foreshadowing for the two meeting.
But I think youre a bit wrong on her characterization. I also think she will meet momo before kaido is defeated.
Also doubt shes forgiving orochi

[forest rampart]

No, i think that she'll meet Momo after Kaido is defeated.

Orochi already died two times. if he's still alive, maybe he'll stay alive to the very end this time. He's never a real threat to Wano unlike Kaido is.

The scabbards said that they don't want to waste their time on Orochi before they immediately killed him after he transformed to his snakes form.

What's your idea about Hiyori's character then, swrml?

[ancient vault]

I wanna keep that for the theory nd I still have to think about it

Honestly Im not 100% sure that shes gonna kill him simply cause its Oda

[ancient vault]

Because the scabbards are needed elsewhere. Hiyori isnt

[forest rampart]

This is my early thought. But my opinion has changed now since I dont think that Hiyori will kill Orochi even she did said that she wished to kill him herself.

[west saffron]

i haete you

[pure raven]

I need to think wtf

[surreal oriole]

It would be a bit of a let down for me if its hiyori at this point, Its gotta be someone we all thought was dead for sure. Could is possibly be Oden's dad? Can't remember how his death was handled off the top of my head.

[pure raven]

toki couldve went an jumped in the oil pot and went forward in time since they didnt have sea prism shakles nor did anyone know of her powers

[sand sail]

They shot her and she died in front of a crowd

[weary cliff]

If Sukiyaki is alive, he's Tenguyama and he's at the fire festival. Sounds like you let yourself get overhyped

[surreal oriole]

Eh idk the shaded figure looks very male to me. And the tenguyama idea is a unconfirmed theory so we don't know that's him yet

[weary cliff]

My point is it's ridiculous to think Sukiyaki is alive but not that he's Hitetsu. It not "uncomfirmed" more like "all but confirmed"

[modest skiff]

At this point I feel like I need evidence hitetsu isnt Oden’s dad lol

[surreal oriole]

It very well might be true but to pretend that it is without Oda confirming is the definition of headcannon

[modest skiff]

I would call it something more forgiving than that. I think there are plenty of relatively probable inferences we can make prior to it being explicitly shown

[weary cliff]

Just saying you're challenging one of the most well established fan theories with "I think that silhouette is manly"

[surreal oriole]

Idc how established a "theory" is, that still doesn't make it fact

[modest skiff]

If we’re talking about the silhouette of whoever saved the scabbards I still don’t think it’s Hiyori

[weary cliff]

Idk who else it could be. If it were Fukerokujo (sp?) I'd expect him to have revealed himself as sympathizer instead of fighting Raizo. And who else is there to consider?

[surreal oriole]

Now that's a good question, and idk. Let's speculate, who else could it be beside hiyori or toki? Oden's dad possibly? Oden himself?"which I hope not"
Enel?!?!?

[modest skiff]

I don’t think we need a good theory in place of a bad theory. I just don’t think it looks like Hiyori. Not sure who it does look like, but not her

I think it’s a higher chance of being Enel than Hiyori purely because I look at the picture and think “that’s definitely not Hiyori”

[weary cliff]

So I guess Hiyori is still the only plausible one in the list so far

[modest skiff]

Here’s what I said earlier

[weary cliff]

Well I'm not sold on her either, but man after earlobes doubled down as a villain, there really is no one coming to mind. A new character would be extremely left field, too

[modest skiff]

Enel can have purely selfish motives and still want Wano to open IMO

[weary cliff]

Kawamatsu is all we have to go off of, and he sort of kills the Enel meme

[ancient vault]

why lol
Just your subjective hype thing?

I get the male look argument. I just dont get why it has to be someone that has died lol

[surreal oriole]

No I'm just not a hiyori fan lol but like all your theorys yes I'm being subjective LOL

Not terribly hyped for the reveal that is who ever it is. I'm sure its gonna be big tho whoever it is

[waxen dust]

It’s definitely think Toki is possible still, I don’t see her dying just so easily because that means her DF will eventually have to play a role in the story, since someone else likely posses it with seems far fetched, since it’s OP.

[ancient vault]

Noone has to posses it. DF powers go missing for centuries. I dont think thats anything unusual. It was mentioned and commented many times how people saw her die. Unless u find good proof of her still being alive she's dead

[wispy sun]

I think luffy will awaken df fighting kaido again

[pure raven]

nah there is still some more importants fights

[surreal oriole]

Agreed, but would give more weight to kawamatsu being shocked as to who he thought it was right?

Going off of kawamatsu's line is what makes me think it is someone we thought dead

[pure raven]

But not impossible. Ryuo + Conqueror Haki + Awakening can beat Kaido

maybe Gear 5

[waxen dust]

I do think that fruit needs to play a role in the present day, as far as people seeing Toki dead it wouldn’t be the first time Oda pulls the rug from under us and let’s a “dead” person be alive. I could definitely see her still being alive . As far as a spiritual reincarnation, we haven’t had much indication of that yet in the story so it seems possible but not as likely. I think Toki shouldn’t be counted out as a possibility, Hiyori seems too easy of an answer and doesn’t necessarily need to be silhouetted for that scene.

[ancient vault]

but when was the last time someone who was seen die reappear?

[dusky acorn]

I guess you could count Kanjuro, when Kiku struck him down the first time

[surreal oriole]

Birdman, Lola's dad, that curly haired dude on alabasta

The old man at skypiea

[waxen dust]

I actually prefer Hiyori because that’s most logical one and gives her something important to do in this fight.

But Toki seems vital to overarching story. Her being the one is okay too just will be crazy knowing Oda didn’t kill her off and she still has that DF. It would still be interesting nonetheless

If it’s Enel...I’ll shit myself and jump out my window.

[surreal oriole]

The thing that makes me think Oda wouldn't bring toki back is because she knows to much. Isn't she from the void century or before?

[surreal oriole]

Agreed, I would lose my mind if its Enel lol

[weary cliff]

Toki feels like she had secrets to spill. Too bad she definitely died. Maybe we'll get exposition from her through the journal

[surreal oriole]

Yeah I would like that. Would be surprised if she isn't brought up in the story down the line because of where she's from

Traveled through time in wano cloths while never being to wano, I need answers for that shit

[weary cliff]

We know a little since she's an amatsuki. Still a lot of mystery surrounding why she's not in Wano when we meet her. She has to be in the journal or a VC flashback

[waxen dust]

There was very little to no exploration of her character during Oden’s flashback. So I am really wondering if we’ll get more in-depth look later on whether through flashback or somehow being alive.

[void trout]

Kuina = kurozumi + shimotsuki
Zoro. = Shimotsuki true bloodline

I think the heir of shimotsuki ushimaru is Zoro who was helped by his people to transfer to a distant place while Ringo fell...and to save the true heir kuina was used as a decoy ...kuina was actually killed by someone from wano who thought she was true shimotsuki....it's like saving Zoro by creating a alias.

[weak plaza]

What if chopper awakening devil fruit become like this handsome little cutie boy ?

Do you think chopper awakening would be like this hybrid half human ?

Just my curiosity theory

[waxen dust]

https://tenor.com/view/cant-unsee-eyes-homer-simpson-gif-5686646

[modest skiff]

I honestly don't see why Enel is so completely beyond the realm of possibility. What am I missing?

[waxen dust]

I think it’s a timing thing and essentially we’d need a good enough explanation to why he’s come to Wano and more importantly why weep over the Scabbards (which seems totally out of character for Enel).

[modest skiff]

I think the idea that Wano is linked to the moon in some non-zero way is easy to accept. The whole "8" thing and lots of other stuff do a good job at showing there is very likely at minimum a vague connection. I think a big connection. If Enel is really into the moon and looking for power, I think its entirely conceivable that Wano would end up in his priority list. There may be a reason that he would selfishly benefit from Wano opening. I'm also not convinced that is a tear.

[sand sail]

Enel couldn't know about Wano's border stuff happening from the moon

But it's not impossible, it's just that the thought of Enel coming down is a pretty hard reach. Wano has something to do with the moon distantly, but it's not like it's Skypeia where there seems to be some direct descent

[modest skiff]

I think both Hiyori and Toki are shaky enough that other things are totally within the realm of possibility. If we have all these prophetic things going on, I think its totally possible that Enel was on the moon, put 2 and 2 together and was like "Wait hold up...LOL that's THIS year, I need to get my ass to this supposed 'Wano' place"

I am not so much saying "here is the evidence to look at", I am saying we have enough vague allusions that I could see Enel finding/reading ADDITIONAL things on the moon

[sand sail]

Toki is next to impossible, Hiyori is the most likely candidate just going by everything we have at play here, she's really not that shaky at all. Her most pressing thing is just how she got to Onigashima and when, but that's about it

But knowing about Wano shouldn't be a thing, Wano would've been made long after anything on the moon

Unless there have been return trips, he shouldn't have any information remotely about it up there

[modest skiff]

I suppose my problem with the Hiyori thinking is that it feels like people are accepting it because it feels like the only option. There are always other options. We shouldn't assume Hiyori while knowing it seems shaky just because it feels like our only other option

[modest skiff]

I am kinda shoving in a presupposition that all this prophecy stuff may be reflected on the moon where they are like "Yo hit up Wano in 800 years"

[sand sail]

But unless Wano and the moon were in contact, that shouldn't be the case. That's why Enel is so much worse as far as a possibility goes, you'd basically have to define Wano's whole history to justify it, and we just don't have that so much

[modest skiff]

And just to be clear, I am not saying "And I am certain of this", I am just saying that with the Hiyori and Toki evidence feeling very shaky, I am willing to entertain a lot of other possibilities

[fervent halo]

Trust me bro sanji is not the son judge, he belongs from the same clan as of king

[sand sail]

With Hiyori, she's not really shaky. Her only problem is how did she get to the island in secret, but even that's easy if we consider her going with Tama (who would have told her goons not to say anything about her), or she just seduced people with the same promise along the way

[pseudo citrus]

that would be something... but unfortunately it doesn't explain the figure looking familiar to them

[modest skiff]

This is true/fair and I think I am willing to extrapolate a lot here because of how shaky all the other theories feel, if that makes sense. In my eyes, everything else sucks too

[sand sail]

Likewise, even Oden didn't actually know anything until getting to Laugh Tale. Enel shouldn't be able to pin down Wano from up there, just from what we've seen that he has to work with

[ancient vault]

All clans start with moon of XY. Its directly tied to the moon. But yeah Enel randomly appearing in the middle of the arc is indeed weird

[modest skiff]

Roosta, when I look at that silhouette, I don't even slightly see toki/hiyori. Maybe my eyes suck. But I just don't see it

[sand sail]

Sure, but starting with the term is a far cry from being from the actual moon.

[ancient vault]

Thats true lmao

[sand sail]

This, as opposed to the people in Skypeia who have a solid physical resemblance we can go on lol

[ancient vault]

Okay yh ure right

[waxen dust]

Enel doesn’t seem likely at all, Skypiea and Wano aren’t gonna bridge this soon into the story.

Hiyori is who I am rooting to see be the reveal, but I am definitely not disregarding the idea of Toki somehow also being there as well.

[modest skiff]

I know this shouldn't count as evidence, but: Am I the only one who thinks it would be extremely weird to silhouette Hiyori? Why do that for someone who is on Wano and we know is alive and feels pretty straight forward? Sure, she's not supposed to be on Onigashima right now, but that's not enough of a stretch to justify a silhouette

I generally strongly dislike using arguments like that, but it feels like its beating me over the head

[split stone]

Shank's full name is Rocks D. Shanks

[waxen dust]

that’s one reason why I think it could be Toki, the only reason to silhouette Hiyori is to suggest she also snuck into Onigashima like Tama. Hiyori seems to easy of an answer to be the reveal. But I would most certainly prefer her as she SHOULD have a role to play in this raid, most preferably defeat Orochi with Denjiro.

I’m 70% Hiyori and 30% Toki (same ratio for her death)

[modest skiff]

My ranking is Enel, Toki, (?) and I reject Hiyori as a possibility

[sand sail]

Enel is more likely than Toki, but objectively less likely than Hiyori here

Toki is just near impossible

[modest skiff]

The big thing for me is that I look at the silhouette and I'm not even convinced they are female lol. But I am not going to pretend I feel super confident in any direction. I am simply stating my "best shitty theory I got"

[sand sail]

Well, the other thing is, Enel can't possibly be the silhouette if that's really the topic

[tight stump]

Would Enel #care about people enough to heal someone tho

[sand sail]

Setting all possibilities on the table, that just wouldn't make sense from any way we could look at it unfortunately. He could like go down to Wano, that's always a thing, but him being the one we saw in the chapter just isn't really something that can happen

[modest skiff]

If you mean because of the tear, I am not convinced it is a tear

[sand sail]

No, because he's healing people from nowhere

[modest skiff]

Well one thing I realized as I was driving home today was that Enel's power could be used to fuse wounds closed

[sand sail]

Nothing on the moon would possibly tell him anything about that, and I suppose he could use his observation after getting to the island, but then Wano would notice Enel come down too

Yeh, but they weren't super cauterized or anything, just bandaged up

[tight stump]

He would probably want to fight more than heal people right? Or at least after healing, make a big entrance!

[modest skiff]

True, I dunno, I really feel like our information is so limited its hard to have a proper discussion

[waxen dust]

It really seems like everyone has completely opposing ideas on who could be the silhouette. I don’t remember last time the ideas have been so divided

[surreal oriole]

I like the thought of it being enel but I don't think it is either just as much as I don't think its hiyori. But I see the Ohara theory get alot of shit on here and I didnt agree with much of it but it did convince me shandora and wano are connected in some way

[modest skiff]

Yeah its gonna be pretty amazing when we finally see who it is lol

[waxen dust]

watch it end up being Fukurokju

Double spy Fuku

[surreal oriole]

Anyone else convinced by that video that The one piece, shandora and possibly another city was on jaya? Or has that been thoroughly debunked?

[mossy rune]

There are some cool parts but overall I don't believe in that theory

[waxen dust]

No I’m for the idea of Jaya for a long time; Ohara nor Yuderon were the ones who actually came up with the theory. It’s all ties into Indonesia culture

[surreal oriole]

I didnt either, some of it I did find compelling. Not the "d"one piece shit like that

[modest skiff]

One thing is for sure, Oda seems to like Indonesia for some reason

...Not to say there is anything wrong with Indonesia

[tight stump]

I mean the parrallels are really cool between the chestnut guy and roger

[waxen dust]

[modest skiff]

I seem to be missing the reference BrotherE lmao

[surreal oriole]

I know it ties with Indonesian culture but that doesn't rule out that they used to all be on jaya. Er I thought it was Aztec. I like the part of Bellamy making fun of all three, on the island all 3 used to be on. Plus the noland/ roger inversions. What about the dates we get from noland and how they translate to kanji, do you guys think there is weight to that? "The one piece roars with the sound of the great belfry" something like that

[mossy rune]

The dates thing was cool, but some of the other things seem too of a stretch to me

[surreal oriole]

Agreed, I could pick a few things I really like from that video but alot of it is a stretch. The thing that seemed like a stretch that I liked was the left eye closed business. I and people want to shit on jalas art but in reality its odas art so it might mean something. it felt like a stretch to me but I still think there is something to it

I know this theory has already been heavily discussed in here, I just wasnt in here then lol so sorry if I'm beating a old drum

[scenic thicket]

am i crazy or was chopper able to fly in drum island. what happened to that

[modest skiff]

Which theory would you say this relates to

[tardy dune]

I think you're crazy?

Maybe you're remembering his jump boost form?

[scenic thicket]

he definitely pulled a sled in the sky

[modest skiff]

that was Rudolph

[tardy dune]

If you can find me a panel of him doing that I'll believe you

[modest skiff]

@past river spam above

[scenic thicket]

nvm they took out the rope he was standing on

[modest skiff]

They didn't remove the rope, they emphasized the perspective of the people below because the rope wasn't apparent. Or at least that's how I remember the anime

[proud tree]

guys I have a theory: Pluton is hidden inside Laboon

Laboon is a very weird wale with iron doors in his outer skin

A former member of the Pirate Kings crew guard laboon from the inside: The crews medic Crocus

Barook works was founded by Crocodile, who wants to find Pluton ... and some of their henchman attack Laboon

[velvet perch]

crocodile did not seem to care much about laboon, it was more for the food for the village

also looking at the timeline, it looks unlikely considering we saw a flashback to when laboon was little

[proud tree]

Crocodiles henchmen never knew about Crocodiles true intetions

[velvet perch]

also it was stated that the iron was reinforcement so that laboon wouldnt die from hitting his head

if crocodile knew it had pluton, youd think he would put more priority on it

and not send people who are relatively farther down on the ranking

[proud tree]

agree solid counter argument, for the theory to be true Crocus must be the one who decided to hide Pluton inside Laboon

[proud tree]

It was just one of many unlikely Options to search for Pluton ... more of an expedition mission unlikely to yield any valuable results