#manga-theories

1 messages · Page 105 of 1

covert scroll
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oh ok mb

oak mural
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yes so far

pure raven
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Roger and Rouge is some Alabama shit.

teal bay
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How???

light pond
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Well if u count law's sister we have 2

lofty socket
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Don't you think that "D" means "Dawn"? Straw hat looks like "D" without a base. And straw hat may has a reference to the sun that rises from the horizon. Like sunrise 🌅.

hoary quest
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that would be cool

random stump
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D may not stand for anything and be just a symbol for the dawn and sunrise. Just like the kozuki have the moon symbol

split hornet
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There's so much connected to the D,
destiny(like luffy surviving many things where he should've be dead, mihawk attacking him and after that saying his famous quote),
dreams (like they follow their dreams and make them true(Roger mentioned dreams, Blackbeard, luffys dream to be PK etc)
Smiling/laughing in absurd situations
"The D will raise another storm"
" People used to scare their children that the people of the d will eat them"
Extraordinary will
Checkered fate
Checkered life
Strongest characters
Etc etc

ripe yacht
pure raven
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Rosinante mentioned it when he was talking to Law

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I'm pretty sure that's when Law reveals his true name includes D. Water

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"something something a D will gobble you up if you aren't well behaved"

slow sandal
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theres no spoilers yet

cobalt grove
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Yeaaa. Wheres the spoilerss

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My weak heart cant afford it any longerrr tsk

split hornet
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Usually around an hour or two

raven holly
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you guys think hachi would rescue luffy? i mean what are the odds?

heady cairn
slow sandal
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what happen regarding to namii

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im hypeddd asf

heady cairn
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I don't think it makes sence, because from where did he come, just the marine and the people in wano know about this war in wano, he is a normal fishman, so its dificult he know this information

raven holly
heady cairn
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👍

heady cairn
split hornet
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Didn't linlin also "drowned" but got out
Wondered if conqueror's haki has to do something with it

heady cairn
coarse jewel
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i think when king fought against her

cyan berry
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she just washed up on a shore somewhere

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she had no control over anything when that happened

coarse jewel
heady cairn
pure raven
glacial dawn
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ive been kicked

warm hollow
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Bro why are you people spoiling here

pure raven
vestal rampart
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anyone see mr morj's elaboration on the red line one piece theory? it was amazing.

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btw its a 20 min video for anyone interested

weary cliff
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Destroying the red line to create all blue is a safe bet. I don't see that itself being the one piece

glacial dawn
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tell me your theories

heady cairn
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I don't have any theories in my mind

pure raven
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if destroying the Red Line gets you all Blue, shouldn't Sanji be the one to do it.

grizzled fog
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Don’t think there’s a singular person capable of destroying the whole ass redline

pure raven
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Ever heard of this guy named Blackbeard, the dude can create earthquakes and blackholes.

rotund locust
cyan berry
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if it was that simple then why couldn't roger do it?

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He knew a man who could create earthquakes, and potentially knew the locations of the other Ancient Weapons aside from Poseidon

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Why wait 20 years for someone else to do it?

heady cairn
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Don't know if it's real

rotund locust
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Well people think Poseidon and their ability to control sea kings is apart of it in terms of removing the calm belts

split hornet
snow cloak
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What if?instead of red scabbards oden came to the future 16 years ago during mg and joined WB with his battle and they both arrived at wano for demolishing kaido

pure raven
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oda always do foreshawdowing like this one he blackshade whos gonna die

Screenshot_20210602-000927_YouTube_Vanced.jpg
last void
pure raven
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maybe idk

last void
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I really hope not

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But might be a Possibility

pure raven
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you can't kill the doggo

nimble hinge
weary cliff
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Inu is a prime candidate for a sappy death

pure raven
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Inu was the person who killed the first joy boy

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idk how but i'm calling it

sudden plaza
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when kaido said "what was it? gum gum....?" you think he is talking about red roc or a new move?

visual hawk
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I think it was a new move that required conquerors

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He might try it again next time

weary cliff
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I think so, too. But I hope it was just Kaido clowning on his stretchy powers in general

sudden plaza
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thatd be so disrespectful lmao

visual hawk
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It would XD, I just think it’s a new move since they offscreened it

sudden plaza
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true, sad it didnt do anything or he missed or just couldnt pull it off

visual hawk
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My headcanon is that he attempted to use CoC but he didn’t have any left so Kaido wacked him off Onigashima

sudden plaza
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thatd make sense

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either that or kaido just speed blitzed him lmao

visual hawk
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I think a mix of both would be great too lol

coarse jewel
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yall think gear 5 gonna happen this arc?

pure raven
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honestly no

coarse jewel
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some ppl say awakening and some ppl say gear 5 gonna happen

pure raven
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just because the mechanism of his gear systems basically get enhanced a shit ton with the use of conqueror's

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and we haven't seen Gear 4 + CoC

coarse jewel
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but i think luffy gonna get much better haki then get gear 5 in the next arc maybe?

pure raven
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In Elbaf?

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I also don't think so but that's cause the giants lowkey kinda don't... pose that much of a powerhouse threat??? Idk I don't see the giants as worth while compared to the elite power houses in the one piece world

coarse jewel
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well

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i meant against someone like maybe WG / akainu or BB or Shanks

pure raven
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I don't really think Akainu got a power up during this point in time if I'm being honest

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the only real power up he could get is being awakened but like... idk logia awakening just feels weird since they effectively already basically do the awakening aspects like the paramecia types do

cedar sinew
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they could always have a different awakening as a logia

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zoans and paramecias have different awakenings

sand sail
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^ It's more likely for this to be the case

sand sail
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Elbaf is the most powerful country in the world because the giants are the most powerful race

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They pose a massive threat

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More so than the samurai of Wano do, and we've seen the kind of people they can produce

cedar sinew
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the giants are inherently the most powerful race on land but we haven't seen any standout individuals. Hoping going to Elbaf enables us to see more than the Giant pirate crew or the giants present at BM's flashback

sand sail
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Yeah, once we get a good little dive into the local culture and heroes, attitudes about the giants will probably turn around a bit.

pure raven
# sand sail This is also very mistaken thinking

massive threat in standing with typical societies but against the other truly powerful they fall below.

Average Giant > Average human
Power houses like Akainu, Luffy, Rayleigh, etc... > Giants

cedar sinew
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all the giants we've seen at the flashback stems from those two groups though, so idk what's happening. Dorry and Brogy were the captains and the giants at EL were related with them. The giants at BM's flashback in Elbaf were also under that crew iirc, and then Carmel mentions selling the first giant to be a marine so that entire line of business was established from there. Harjudin and co also come from the same place

left pecan
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Bruh

sand sail
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Power houses like Akainu, Luffy, Rayleigh, etc, are the 1% of the 1% of the entire planet. That's not how you measure any kind of threat standing

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Funny you mention Mai, not just from the same place, it's basically the exact same group of giants we've followed since Little Garden.

left pecan
cedar sinew
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well Kaeore we'll probably see some massive powerhouses. Though if Oda were to rewrite One Piece he could've made Brogy and Dorry way stronger I guess

pure raven
sand sail
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They'll be shown as stupid powerful someday LUL Just the ultimate retcon

cedar sinew
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yeah I know Harjudin and a lot of the others were but wasn't sure if everyone on that village was from the same pirate group

pure raven
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BM as a Child killed one of them so I'm gonna need to see more showing from them before I buy into it

sand sail
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Unbeatable is how they've been framed, they're powerful enough to remain independent from the government entirely

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And that's still a really, really poor mindset. As a country, presumably, they'd bowl everyone else over

cedar sinew
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ok look at is this way. Fishman are still "weak". None of them will measure up against the admiral or w/e

sand sail
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Falling from where they are, power drops exponentially. It's not like there's a steady line of people numbering in the thousands who can do the things that Luffy can do to a giant

cedar sinew
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despite having two full dedicated arcs towards that race.
What I want though is a Jinbe or Hody like figure in the giants world

pure raven
sand sail
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So I guess in hindsight, we've seen only one little clique from Elbaf

amber oar
cedar sinew
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also races that have way less population are bound to have a weaker top 1% of fighters I guess

sand sail
cedar sinew
modest skiff
# pure raven In Elbaf?

Gear5 in Elbalf could basically be gear4 but his entire body is a giant, like that one time the giant girl went inside luffy

pure raven
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Let's reel it back so we can put it into perspective.
Where would Smoker for example fit into this dealing of power scaling

sand sail
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What if that does end up being it? LUL Elbaf was really just that one village, and Caramel was just giving it a good reputation 'cause she secretly loved the giants and didn't want anyone hurting them

sand sail
cedar sinew
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dude idk lmao. The thing is that actually matches up with every single thing that has been referenced about the giants. Even the terrorizing aspect because they're pirates after all

pure raven
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Cause I think Smoker is an "Average" to the idea of Vice Admirals in power

sand sail
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Based on?

pure raven
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would you prefer Coby or Helmeppo?

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Honestly the main VA we know is Garp but Garp's been offered the position of Admiral various times making him an outlier in the Vice Admiral chain of power

cedar sinew
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I actually think Smoker is on the upper spectrum of VAs

pure raven
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and presumably we have more VA's than we do Admirals

sand sail
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Not really a presumptuous statement lol, but what I'm getting at is you're trying to measure a 1:1

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It doesn't matter that one person can beat one giant if 1000 giants can wipe out most groups of 1000 people

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To put it in perspective, Big Mom felt that if she'd had the forces of Elbaf behind her, she'd have been a powerful enough Emperor to wipe out every single other one

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Including Whitebeard

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That is the kind of strength potential the giants have, adding them on can skewer the entire balance of the world. Can't really say that for most other groups of folks, even the samurai are just barely making it so the Strawhats are able to keep up with a crew directly

sudden plaza
pure raven
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That feels more like a divide and conqueror plan rather than "These guys are over powered". Whitebeard and presumably Shanks have others territories to defend meaning their forces get dwindled to deal with it while BM just has to attack straight on

modest skiff
sand sail
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It wasn't a divide and conquer plan, she seemed to imply she was going to wage open war. "These guys are overpowered" is exactly the message we were supposed to be getting fed

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Big Mom doesn't mention any kind of vital strategy, she just wanted their power

cedar sinew
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this is in reference to Luffy's haki training right?
The giants can serve a similar purpose as the wild animal island they trained on next to Amazon Lily. If some of the giants can use haki (which is plausble at this point in the story), even better. @pure raven

pure raven
inland jolt
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Luffy is Joyboys reincarnation 😤😤😤

modest skiff
cedar sinew
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I don't think many giants can use conq haki lol

sand sail
modest skiff
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Maybe not "many", but I feel like there is some special reason elbalf is considered extremely strong other than a bunch of giants. There is something we don't know about giants yet IMO

cedar sinew
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even more skeptical since we've seen only one group of pirates in Elbaf throughout. Maybe the leader could tho and he could spar with him

pure raven
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if the giants turn out to have uranus i will shit myself

cedar sinew
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no I think what we know so far is very convincing evidence

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fishmen are referred to the exact same way

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"10x stronger than humans. They're monsters!"

modest skiff
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I suppose it depends on if there is really even an incentive to take over Elbalf. maybe they don't really need to and it isn't worth the trouble.

cedar sinew
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now giants are like 1000x stronger than humans, in fact it's probably been stated somewhere in EL. So an entire army of them which we've never seen other than the couple that were present in MF would be devastating

sand sail
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^

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Taking over Elbaf is actually a huge incentive, that's why Caramel's business was going so well

modest skiff
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What's the incentive to take over elbaf?

sand sail
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Going back to the Big Mom bit, if she believes the giants were a power enough to completely shatter the balance of the world if they fought on her side, then they're easily the most powerful nation out there so far

cedar sinew
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I think because of the fact that giants whenever present in the story serves as punching bags and not a direct threat to the SHs that they are underestimated a lot.
If BM was a giant or something it would boost the race's reputation but she had to be human smh

sand sail
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The incentive is more power. Elbaf would have one of the strongest armies in the world just by existing

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I wish at least Kaido were a giant 😐 Give a little more depth to their relationship, too

pure raven
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so comparing giants to giants

modest skiff
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Yeah right now my impression is giants are the strongest nation, then wano under them maybe

pure raven
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how would Haj compare to the marine giants?

cedar sinew
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well the SHs aren't going to take over Elbaf, if that was what you were referring to

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they'll definitely visit it though

modest skiff
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I think they will ally with giants, not take over

cedar sinew
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they that's possible

pure raven
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I think the allying makes sense especially with Haj being on Luffy's side and the fact they know their two famed leaders

cedar sinew
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Haj? Harjudin?

sand sail
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Definitely gonna ally

pure raven
sand sail
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Absolutely. Which will give Luffy an Emperor powered crew at that point. Really, no one could ever argue he isn't one LUL

cedar sinew
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it might be Harjrudin. But idk, he's sorta young and inexperienced as a giant so I'm inclined to say a bit weaker

modest skiff
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Giants + wano + minks + existing alliance + portion of navy + revolutionary army vs world government

pure raven
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I'm actually quite curious to see how the giants fit into the lore of the prophecy so to speak

cedar sinew
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I don't think they're all fighting the WG

modest skiff
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I think eventually, that's the team

pure raven
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because the prophecy itself really does seem to speak about fishmen and the humans so like I imagine it must impact the giants in the same way

modest skiff
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oh yeah and fishmen

pure raven
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and seeing as how they're norse based, could be something akin to ragnarok as a loos inspiration

vital pilot
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WG are too pirates.

pure raven
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wait

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how old are the giants?

modest skiff
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Hajrudin is 81

pure raven
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oh nvm

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I thought Dorry and Brogy might have been around for the void century or have some connection to Joyboy but probably not

modest skiff
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Dory is 160

sand sail
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The giants would have a connection to it

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They're only one or two generations removed

pure raven
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I hear speculation about Luffy meeting shanks in elbaf and I'm like hmmm

modest skiff
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True lol. "Yeah, my great grand father fought in that war"

cedar sinew
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well we don't really know when giants have kids but it'd still be way more than 1 or 2 generations. 3 human generations is like 100 years. If we say giants live 4x as longer, we'd still need 6 generations to reach VC

sand sail
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The Void Century was only 800 years back, and the oldest giants on Elbaf were 400 years old already, if their parents had lived to a similar time then they'd have been born just as the Void Century was being created, with the grandparents being directly involved

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I worded that strangely with the birth, but I think I got the meaning across lmao, not that they had kids at 400 years old

cedar sinew
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yeah but they don't have kids when they're about to die

sand sail
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So up to maybe 4 generations seems good to have like mature giants participating that weren't too far down from the current ones lol

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So, their great-grandparents would've participated in the events directly if Elbaf had any large part to play at the least

amber oar
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IIRC Oda said giants age 3x slower than humans (either that or he answered yes to someone asking), so they'd become parents around the 80-100 year old mark

sand sail
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Yeh, he said their average span is about 300 years, so that sounds about right. Hajrudin was considered a young adult, I think?

amber oar
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yup and he's 81

queen arrow
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Hajrudin was an infant at 18

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it's a cool thing to think about

sand sail
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I notice, and one thing I love, she doesn't mention Blackbeard at all

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Do the new Emperors recognize him?

pure raven
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They probably see him as an upstart

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though to be honest it is quite funny to see since Oda establishes that there's no honor to be expected in a pirate fight

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and the least honorable and probably respectable pirate is blackbeard

past river
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what chapter is that bean

amber oar
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well, all of that happened before the summit war. She even mentions Whitebeard instead

Basically, she probably thinks BB wouldn't have even got to be an emperor if she could have carried on the marriage

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The failed marriage was when, 4 years before present?

sand sail
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Are we given a timeframe for the marriage?

pure raven
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we know it was probably before lola dipped from WCI

sand sail
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I figured it was maybe because of the whole it happened back then, it's just funny that she reached all the way back to Whitebeard with it but talking about how she'd be King now

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I feel like maybe she and the others don't want to look at Blackbeard as worth the seat yet, since he's only had it for around a year

amber oar
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didn't find any, I must have imagined it. Still was before the summit war because Lola was already on the run

sand sail
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Yeh, did she mention how long she was stuck in Thriller Bark?

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That'd give us a small estimate at least

amber oar
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Pudding was a little child

nqAXpOJ7AoU5ZHP40Os4c0nly9f5tc5PAMeGsjA1u2ISMcIb4OXxjRuyhHM81Zas8ZXFEeKZn8iMtOmZ3GNQ2dvNPSi94zcE1WIY.png
amber oar
pure raven
queen arrow
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a bit related, are the Sea Kings Dorry and Brogy killed the biggest ones we've seen in the series?

sand sail
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I think most of them were about that size if they were from the Calm Belt

amber oar
sand sail
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Do you have pics for reference?

queen arrow
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i'm gonna get it one sec

sand sail
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Dang, so 3 years there

modest skiff
# sand sail

The interesting thing about this is that I wonder if that means giants could conquer people today if they wanted and just choose not to

queen arrow
pure raven
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but that's putting the big weapons into play

queen arrow
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i don't remember if Little Garden was actually an really small island, but we can't even see the giants in relation to them

sand sail
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One country isn't going to topple every other, but if that country gets added onto an army, then yeh it's going down

modest skiff
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Yeah but I wonder if Elbaf could just fill some boats and go take over WCI if they wanted

sand sail
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Big Mom would've ruled the whole world lol

queen arrow
pure raven
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I don't think there's enough wood

modest skiff
sand sail
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Jeeeeeeeez, they just might be mate, fuck man. I forgot those were that big

modest skiff
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So then I wonder what bm plan was

queen arrow
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i want to check the other really big sea kings

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i know the one we see in the calm belt, and then the ones we see in FMI

sand sail
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There's the goldfish they kill at the end of the chapter too

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Wasn't it supposedly the size of an island?

queen arrow
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eh i think they say it eats islands little by little?

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ah there it is

0129-005.png
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still you can tell by looking at it that it isn't nearly as big as the sea kings

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okay so here's the perspective shot i wanted, we can tell a bit of their size in relation to Merry

0128-017.png
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this is how these sea kings compare to Merry

0101-008.png
modest skiff
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I am assuming each of those also have powers

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In my head I've always assumed the extra unique ones have special abilities

queen arrow
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weird assumption, nothing really indicates that

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they're just big sea creatures

sand sail
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They'll probably have species specific things at the best yeh

pure raven
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...

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I just realized... We see all those Sea Kings in respect to Roger and Oden alongside them talking about Shirahoshi and they all are just there for the straw hats???

cedar sinew
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they live there

queen arrow
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so either those 2 sea kings are the biggest one we've seen or they're really close

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unrelated but Dorry is scary here

0117-017.png
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also he just lifts the skeleton and puts it on top of Luffy

shut flume
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Are the spoilers hype this week??

sand sail
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Don't ask here please

onyx marten
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Man Elbalf is gonna be great

coarse jewel
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who do yall think sogeking is??????

sand sail
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We don't allow any talk of them, even opinions about them, outside of the spoiler channel

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@shut flume

rotund locust
sand sail
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This is a no-meme zone guys

rotund locust
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My Bad

coarse jewel
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oh okay my bad

shut flume
lyric dust
queen arrow
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she's not an asshole, she's actually an genius

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with one sentence she ended one of the greatest pirate crews ever

weak arrow
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Hey, this isn't really a new theory or anything, I've just laid it down more cohesively, with more additions.

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Sabo and Boa Hancock have been captured by the Marines/WG and have been sent to Impel Down. This has made the worlds news and eventually Luffy would find out and would feel a need to go rescue them as he did with Ace. However this time, it won't be necessary.

The revolutionary army this time will invade Impel Down. They have the means and the motive to do so.

  1. Morley had already escaped Impel Down before Luffy's break out. This shows there was a way to escape even without everything that went down during the Impel Down arc.
  2. Morley and Ivankov are both very familiar with Impel Down. Morley being the creator of 5.5 also shows that if he can get inside, he can easily infiltrate and practically grab any prisoner they want to save.
  3. They have the means to escape Impel Down either through Karasu's devil fruit and possibly Dragon's alongside it, but Karasu should be enough.

The revolutionary army will primarily go there for Sabo and I don't think I need to mention why, but there are plenty of other people they can grab.

Boa Hancock. I think it's safe to say that Boa Hancock and Sabo will both be level 6 prisoners. They can each develop a friendship over their bond with Luffy. Sorta similar to Vivi/Rebecca/Shirahoshi and Rebecca/Koby. Naturally Boa Hancock will be broken out of jail alongside Sabo because of this. She will then proceed to join the revolutionary army. As we all know, Boa Hanock's backstory involves her and her sisters being enslaved to the celestial dragons. It would certainly not be a stretch for her to have a desire to take them down which is the revolutionary army's goal. Don't think it's feasible that she herself searches out the revolutionaries, and the revolutionaries wouldn't know her past to seek them out themselves.

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Bon Clay. Bon Clay was revealed to be alive and the ruler of 5.5 as the chapter 666 cover story. Ivankov will want to recruit Mr 2 just because he's Mr 2 and how he's the reason Ivankov and Luffy were even able to fully escape Impel Down. This sacrifice shows huge character and would honestly be something any army or crew authority would want. His fruit is perfect for espionage and possible distractions. He has Cobra, Vivi, and Luffy who could all potentially be useful in the future and could also just disguise himself as Dragon for a much needed distraction.

Doflamimgo. Doflamingo is probably a controversial choice, but some would have said the same for Crocodile. Doflamingo has useful information regarding the celestial dragons, and I doubt Oda will let him rot away with that information. Vergo will also be joining him because it will parallel Crocodile and Daz Bones.

Vivi/Cobra? Vivi/Cobra may have been thrown in Impel Down for whatever they wanted to cook up. Regardless, they'll rescue ViviCobra because they're a leader of the people. Also could have a nice moment with Mr 2 apologizing to Vivi. Vivi/Cobra would be placed in Impel Down because they hid the poneglyph and information on it from the World Government. This is the news that Morgans refused to cover-up. This allows for Blackbeard to head to Alabasta to try to acquire Pluton. Shimon has also told me that there's an anime only scene that involves the people of Alabasta reacting, so there's that i guess.

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Some may argue that Luffy needs to do the break out, but I disagree. Luffy does not have time to go Impel Down. It is on the other side of the Red Line. He would need meet up with the revolutionary army and fly there with Karasu's crows. He would not be able to ride the Sunny there as he would need to go through the calm belt, and go through Reverse Mountain (Thus completing Brook's dream super early?) and then go all the way to Impel Down. It would simply take way too long. I also don't see why the revolutionary army would seek Luffy out when they could make the escape themselves.

The other common argument I've seen is that Sabo and Boa hancock would be held at Marejois. Hancock would be given to the celestial dragons as a slave, and Sabo would just be held over there too cause it's near New Marineford and just be executed there. First, I would say that I don't like the idea of rehashing marineford. Luffy and his forces certainly aren't equal to Whitebeard's and even with the help of the revolutionary army, it still would not be enough. It's not time to fight the Marines/WG yet. We have not learned of the Void Century. If Luffy learned of Boa's capture and that she was being held as a slave in Marejois, he would go. Some may argue that Boa escapes, but I don't see Boa Hancock abandoning her people. Her and her people being captured and sent to Impel Down is the perfect segue for them to serve the revolutionary army and keep their relevance in this story.

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"Luffy may not learn of Sabo being captured/dead". Wano still gets newspapers, they just don't land in the hands of the general citizens. Yamato knows who all the strawhats are. We had the scene of Doflamingo's defeat with Kaido and his men. We also have Drake there who could also relay this information. Luffy will head straight to where Sabo is. At the end of the arc, I think he'll learn both of Sabo's capture and his escape. You may be thinking there isn't enough time for this to happen as Boa Hancock would need to both be sent to Impel Down and be freed. However, after major battles, it's very typical for Luffy to sleep for days. He could easily sleep for an entire week after the events of this arc allowing time for the escape. This way, the story won't be sidetracked by Impel Down 2.0/Marineford 2.0.

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@gloomy canyon you said you'd make this but you took too long.

gloomy canyon
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LOL

#

well, I'll take it, you probably wrote it up better than me anyway

raven stratus
#

just wondering but what cover stories have been shown within the main story again (like, buggy has been shown, but enel has not been again)

gloomy canyon
#

Yeah, I've been a supporter of this theory for a while, Luffy is really the only thing that discredits it. Also I guess some fans might be like "So Sabo was captured AND broken out while we were still in Wano, so the Sabo thing didn't lead to much" and might be disappointed

#

But I disagree given that this is a clear indication that the Revos are making their move and the forces are gathering

#

and causing another mass breakout of Impel Down is huge

cedar sinew
#

wonder how the wg knew about vivi/cobra and pluton poneglyph

gloomy canyon
#

Something Im related

pure raven
#

It would be nice to see dragon in action and I’m all for Doffy running lose 😎

gloomy canyon
#

And Cobra's insistence on talking to them

#

Doffy wouldn't run loose

#

He'd be under the strict wing of the Revos

#

such a valuable asset for taking down the WG

pure raven
#

It’s doffy have some faith in him

cedar sinew
#

why would be cooperate though

gloomy canyon
#

former CD and knows about a secret treasure of Marie Jois that has a "short shelf life"

#

He would want to watch the CDs burn as well

weak arrow
pure raven
#

He also prolly wants to see the word burn

cedar sinew
#

cooperate's not the right word, more like why would be place himself as a subordinate of the revo army

gloomy canyon
#

He wouldn't really. He wouldn't be given a choice

cedar sinew
#

he has a grudge but he's not the type to work under someone else

pure raven
#

He would have no choice, he’s in sea stone cuffs now I think those would stay

gloomy canyon
#

They need him for his information, that's really it

weak arrow
#

Just have to have the right circumstances. Crocodile assisting Luffy is very similar.

cedar sinew
pure raven
#

They can always torture him too, like water board him and since he’s a df it could be more effective

cedar sinew
#

Crocodile assisting Luffy is a short term goal to escape impel down. Doffy physically taking part in overthrowing the WG is different. Though I can see him giving up the info

#

iirc he says something along the lines of the info needing to be made public

weak arrow
gloomy canyon
#

it's going to be used in the near future

#

and Oda brings back villains, one as major as doffy will be no exception

cedar sinew
#

yeah that's the panel Evan

pure raven
#

Doffy laughs in the face of death 💀

gloomy canyon
#

I guess it's easier to control the narrative during the Reverie

#

I don't really know

cedar sinew
#

also, Crocodile doesn't seem the type to give in under torture. And the people torturing him wouldn't have any reason to press him on further if the didn't have any lead ins. The fact that he wanted to take over a country is a good enough motive for his actions.
I'm leaning towards Im and potentially Uranus

weak arrow
#

Well there's really only 3 good incidents that could have happened and it could be any combination.

Attack/death/arrest of Vivi
Attack/death/arrest of Cobra
Pluton being revealed on Alabasta

Vivi was the image taken by Imu.

#

BB's dialogue definitely hints towards pluton being revealed on alabasta imho

cedar sinew
#

yeah I agree with that

weak arrow
#

Well if you can agree with that statement, that means either Cobra/Vivi revealed it or someone else knew the info thus tried taking out Cobra/Vivi (Which would be the WG), thus the question of how they would know is not very important to the theory since either way, they'd know in the end either way

cedar sinew
#

Shirahoshi was there too so it's relating to the ancient weapons.

#

it wasn't a criticism of the theory, the only narrative importance of Cobra and Vivi in the current story is pluton, hard to doubt that. It was just a question I had open to speculation

weak arrow
#

Well the only way to know is:

Nefertari line
However Crocodile found out
Poneglyph locating the poneglyph that had pluton's location (Not mutually exclusive from the above statement)

cedar sinew
#
  1. Im
weak arrow
#

4's not a good option cause they could have done that years ago

gloomy canyon
#

Are you questioning why the WG would try to kill/imprison Cobra and Vivi?

unknown.png
cedar sinew
#

Well we don't know how it works exactly. Could be a periodic thing.
But yeah amongst the more grounded options locational poneglyphs make the most sense ig

#

No I'm questioning how they found out

#

that they have secret knowledge on pluton

queen arrow
#

they have to means to escape Impel Down through Morley's devil fruit like he did before*

unknown.png
gloomy canyon
#

I think he means like make a swift exit

weak arrow
#

I mean we dont know if morley escaped with 0 help

gloomy canyon
#

by flying away

weak arrow
#

i assume morley could go under the sea floor but that might take a while

#

morley's is better for infiltrating it OrochiScheme

gloomy canyon
#

wait am I misunderstanding or couldn't they have just found out that Cobra knows about Pluton and the poneglyph after they had a meeting with him?

weak arrow
#

That's assuming Cobra had a death wish

gloomy canyon
#

like Cobra just told them about it because that's what he wanted to talk about

cedar sinew
#

so Cobra told them voluntarily?

gloomy canyon
#

wait lemme find the panel

weak arrow
#

you mean the one you just posted?

gloomy canyon
#

nah

sand sail
#

The one where Cobra talks about wanting to bring up a subject at Reverie?

gloomy canyon
#

Chaka even brings up the poneglyph

#

So I'm sure Cobra brought it up

#

I think he underestimated how ruthless the WG would be and expected answers he never would have gotten

cedar sinew
#

what chapter is this

gloomy canyon
#

823

weak arrow
#

i think it's like right after zou

gloomy canyon
#

yeah end of Zou

#

I think Cobra was curious and naive enough to bring that up in front of them

#

Didn't really know what he was getting himself into

cedar sinew
sand sail
#

Not naive, evan

#

Desperate and at the end of his patience

gloomy canyon
#

well I don't think he expected to be killed or imprisoned

cedar sinew
#

uhh. I guess he's referring to the void century. So yeah he might've brought it up or referred to it

sand sail
#

What he'd be doing there, because he knows full well exactly what would happen to him, is trying to force their hand so he can know exactly why his kingdom was targeted and essentially shamed from the inside out because of that one weapon

#

I'm sure he expected to be killed or imprisoned yeh

gloomy canyon
#

I kind of took this as he did in fact bring up the poneglyph and pluton. That's pretty linked to the Nefertari in general

unknown.png
sand sail
#

He's asking a question whose consequence is legally one or both of those things

gloomy canyon
#

Well if he expected to be killed or captured, he should have known that Vivi wouldn't be safe either and he'd be putting her in danger as well

sand sail
#

Not necessarily, knowing they'd take him isn't the same as thinking they'd wipe out his entire family

#

But it is a fair thought too, that may be something that he'd considered

#

And just thought Vivi may be strong enough to handle herself now?

gloomy canyon
#

Potentially, but my main point is I think Cobra definitely brought up Pluton and the alabasta poneglyph up during their meeting

#

and that's how they found out

#

about their knowledge in all this

gloomy canyon
# sand sail And just thought Vivi may be strong enough to handle herself now?

Yeah he could have told Vivi right before his meeting that something bad might happen and that she should escape or be careful. Maybe even had an escape plan for her (I know a lot of people think Vivi might have been saved by Kuma or something). But then it would be pretty risky to bring her to the Reverie in the first place. Idk

inner sphinx
#

@gloomy canyon I’d forgotten about this; thanks for posting them here.

gloomy canyon
#

the panels?

inner sphinx
#

Yeah

queen arrow
sand sail
#

But then yeah he still brings Vivi and everythin

gloomy canyon
#

Yeah I don't really subscribe to the Kuma thing myself, but he should have known that bringing up these topics to the Gorosei wouldn't end well and would put him in immediate danger, and by extension... Vivi

#

I'm sure we'll get this all cleared up after Wano

unkempt drum
vast atlas
#

Jinbei saves luffy

#

I haven't seen him in Wano yet, I really think he'll show up to rescue him

cedar sinew
vast atlas
#

oh yeah-

#

Then probably not him

#

Oh, here's one, Momo has Conqueror's Haki

pure raven
#

No he is a whole bitch, they don’t get coc

#

Ussop won’t get it either

queen arrow
#

how did you not see Jinbe

vast atlas
#

I don't read the manga often

queen arrow
#

then why even bother reading

gloomy canyon
vast atlas
#

To read ahead

queen arrow
#

you're literally missing crucial pieces of the story

vast atlas
#

Ight

queen arrow
#

there was a whole ass introduction scene to Jinbe showing up, and he's been on multiple chapters

vast atlas
#

MarineAhoy ahoy

novel thistle
#

Okay maybe I might be the only one but I just started rewatch one piece (first time rewatching, been caught up since whole cake island started) I forgot about don criegs right hand man gene or whatever. He ends up saying see you on the grand line. I WANT A REMATCH OF SANJI AND GENE. that fight was sooo good! Why is not hyped up as much as some of sanji other stuff. Seriously!!! Might be spelling names wrong. Pls @ me if you respond. I wanna talk about this

queen arrow
#

Don Krieg and Gin

cedar sinew
#

the best chance Gin has to show up now is as part of Shank's crew

#

or as a cameo. But that'd serve no purpose

errant nova
#

Some folks think Gin succumbed to Krieg’s poison but I guess that’s not very typical of oda lol

novel thistle
#

The shanks crew sounds like an awesome theory! I’d be so down if that happened. I just want that to go full circle! Since we’ve seen most of the east blue villains in the Grand line. It would be cool to see him again!

severe chasm
#

Call me crazy. But I don’t think Luffy will Kill Blackbeard. I think he will convince Blackbeard not to continue his evil path.

#

Looking back at when they met at Skypiea it was clear BB was pretty twisted although had very redeeming qualities.

cedar sinew
#

there is no such thing as evil path. Just different methods of achieving one's dreams

#

Luffy and BB both represent that ideal through different means. There's no need for Luffy to convince him and no reason for BB to accept that

lilac mirage
#

Luffy has a reason to be mad at BB, right?

cedar sinew
#

yes

last void
severe chasm
#

I agree. No matter what evil things he does I just can’t hate Blackbeard

last void
#

Perhaps.But Sometimes It's Annoying when Luffy doesn't kill off people.Even tho they Ultimately Take his side

vagrant imp
#

Lol wonder where the story will go from here

#

I really thought Luffy would pump Kaido pepehands

last void
severe chasm
#

Yea I think he should’ve killed quite a few people. @last void

#

For sure Wapol

last void
#

And Charlos

severe chasm
#

Is Luffy even going to kill Blackbeard?

vagrant imp
#

So what theories did I miss here? Any theories about the current state of Onigashima?

severe chasm
#

Bet he leaves him alive

last void
severe chasm
#

I don’t want Blackbeard to die. He’s weirdly relatable af.

#

Mans a true devil. Almost lured Luffy to follow his ideology when they met in Skypiea.

cedar sinew
#

they literally have the same core ideology

#

there's no luring

maiden terrace
#

Do you guys think Sanji will be the same power as EOS Zoro. Zoro cut Kaido, and it’s clearly implied that Zoro would eventually be able to do more damage to a Kaido level threat as the show goes on, and it’s common knowledge that Sanji and Zoro are at somewhat the same power level throughout the series (I’m not sure about now)

split hornet
#

Blackbeard should suffer real bad, like from his own DF or something
Luffy gum gum awakening, make him tremor inside

acoustic helm
#

Hmm

#

Thanks

coarse jewel
split hornet
#

I think zoro stays slight ahead of sanji
But Oda keeps messing with them

severe chasm
severe chasm
west saffron
#

Am I right that we dont know how Odens logbook survived the fire?

oak salmon
west saffron
#

okay forgot about that, but is it possible that kaido has read the logbook and has been 'playing' us, looking for who could be joyboy? i know it sounds crazy but it would make this massive ark that oda has been planning for us to have a wayyyy better villain, and be an awesome twist

last void
#

Is it Possible that Momo has the Colour of the Supreme King?

west saffron
#

honestly probably

last void
#

Now,There Being Many Coc users after it being Stated that it is rare is indeed Annoying

#

But would be cool if Momo did have it...just like his Father

fast olive
#

Wouldn't that pretty useless who has a weaker will than momo

#

He couldn't knock out anyone

wild latch
#

Theory "ONIGASHIMA DRAGON"

Starting with the basic information we have to make this theory as easy to undestand as we can

1.ryuma slew a dragon that flew over the flower Capital, and that was one of his major feats that led people to praise him as the warrior that he was

  1. Onigashima is an Island located in wano, we dont know if it was always in wano, but we know that it was previously called "DRAGON ISLAND"
    3.there is a giant skull of what seems to be a giant oni like oars but even much bigger.

I think that that the dragon that ryuma slew and the oni skull thats in onigashima are one and the same. Beacuse there wouldnt be any reason to call it dragon Island if it had nothing to do with a dragon, also it could Just be that kaido put that name and later changed it, but seems unlikely beacuse, marco knew of this name change, but marco WAS NEVER IN WANO FOR THE TIME THAT KAIDO HAD BEEN THERE, THAT MEANS IT MUST HAVE BEEN CALLED DRAGON ISLAND EVEN BEFORE KAIDO ARRIVED IN WANO.

The next question is how can the giant oni and the dragon be one and the same? Thats simple, the giant oni had the SAME FRUIT THAT KAIDO HAS NOW, the giant oni must have been one of those people that wanted to take over wano like onimaru mentioned, but ryuma killed it while it was in dragon form, but the head went back to oni form as soon as it died.

WE have to think about the fact that kaido is currently flying and planning to crush the Island back to the flower Capital, like bringing the dragon terror back to the City that it once terrorized. Maybe some people will actually recognize it.

pastel summit
#

I don't think it had a name prior to onigashima. or it was unnamed. Don't think we know what it was called prior.

patent summit
modest skiff
#

I do think there is something fucky about onigashima. I don't think they'd make an island in the shape of a head.

patent summit
#

The gap between zoro and sanji aint that big

modest skiff
patent summit
#

Nah the gap between luffy and zoro is way bigger than that

#

You cant compare zoro's haki to luffys

split hornet
last void
#

Sanji Against Women- -2000

patent summit
#

Luffy is way ahead of zoro. With the all the gears and advanced armamant and Coc

modest skiff
teal nymph
#

jimbae around 93 in between zoro & sanji ?

patent summit
#

I think sanji is stronger than jinbei

last void
#

Jimbei and Sanji are Almost in the Same level

split hornet
#

Jinbei has experience and wisdom though, all things the others kinda lack

modest skiff
#

If I was drafting a pirate crew, I would recruit Jinbe before Sanji

teal nymph
#

chopper around 85 ?

#

he 1v1 queen so ...

pure raven
last void
#

Chopper is Indeed Underrated.But he ain't as Strong as Queen tho

dusky tundra
#

I doubt he's even 3rd commander level

pure raven
split hornet
#

Someone like jack he means probs

dusky tundra
last void
pastel summit
#

yeah I think he's about mid high low top average vice admiral yonko commander tier.

split hornet
#

Don't think all strawhats should be powerful, look at Roger they literally had babies and children

pure raven
dusky tundra
#

He doesn't have haki tho

dusk willow
split hornet
dusk willow
pastel summit
#

we don't know anything about most of roger crew, but yeah. not all of luffy or roger's crew needs to be super strong. and they probably won't be.

noble fractal
#

I personally think Otama is a Kurozumi, she has the same hair color as Orochi, and that's my only thing supporting this theory. Plus, she's an orphan

fast olive
#

I knew she was evil

vast atlas
cedar sinew
#

There’s no inherent connection between voat and coc

vast atlas
#

Not yet at least. But don't you think it's a bit too convenient that a couple major people, who all have coc, can hear it?

#

Even Oden could hear it, and the concept of Haki wasn't fully known during his time

cedar sinew
#

yes it was

#

narratively, the concept of haki was fully known during the oden flashback

#

chronological order doesn't matter lmfao

vast atlas
#

Sorry, I meant not fully known in Wano

cedar sinew
#

why does that matter?

#

not sure how that proves momo has coc

rancid vine
#

....crocomom?

sonic lantern
#

momonosuke will use his fruit properly with enough control and a goal to complete, he will be as big as kaido and will fight him head on with luffy

reef moth
#

Luffy is going to lose to Kaido for the third time. It would be impactful, showing that no matter how hard Luffy tries, he can't catch up to decades of building power and experience in only 2 years and a few months. It would also show him he can't shoulder the burden of defeating the main enemy alone this time, and that he'll need the help of everyone to effectively take Kaido down. I'd really like this to be the case instead of Luffy somehow getting strong enough to fold Kaido in hybrid form.

pastel summit
#

Why does he need to lose another time, instead of just teaming up with everybody this time around?

#

that first message was already established when Luffy lost just now. He doesn't need to try again then lose again. that's just pointless extension of the conflict.

fathom kettle
fathom kettle
fathom kettle
heady cairn
#

I would love to see luffy in a 1 v 1 with Kaido, but I would love to see all the mugiwaras vs Kaido. So, I don't know what I want

#

What do you think is more probably to happen? About this fight against Kaido

pastel summit
#

probably neither will happen.

heady cairn
#

Ah

pastel summit
#

but SHs vs Kaido is more likely than Luffy going solo with Kaido yet again

heady cairn
#

What is SHs?

pastel summit
#

straw hats

heady cairn
#

Yeah, I agree

#

But other problem is big mom, who will fight her?

pastel summit
#

I think BM is probably gonna leave the island

heady cairn
#

I don't know, it would be anoying, I like big mom, but she is anoying sometimes

#

Maybe Oda make Big mom leave the island, to give time to luffy learn more and get stronger, so he can defeat her alone, because I think she is more less in the same level of power as Kaido. So luffy will get an power up, to in the future he fight with black beard, akainu and maybe Shanks

pastel summit
#

I don't think Luffy will beat BM, but BB will. BM leaves Wano, but she takes the poneglyph, and then BB goes after her because she'll have 2.

heady cairn
pastel summit
#

Kaido will be a group effort, but then Luffy beats either Shanks or BB on his own. depends which one he meets first.

icy sapphire
#

Wait guys

#

From the 9 Samurai, who’s the green one? What’s his name

chilly veldt
undone marten
#

What do you guys think about the Theorie that the D Clan are able to eat more devilfruits and BB knows About it

icy sapphire
#

Ok but how did he eat white beards fruit

heady cairn
#

Hmm, it's interesting, but it will make the D so much powerful

icy sapphire
#

If it wasn’t present in a physical form , I think it had to do with his fruit not will of D

undone marten
#

Hmm true

onyx ember
icy sapphire
#

Yes him

heady cairn
icy sapphire
cloud trail
onyx ember
#

We don’t know if big mom got her fruit from caramel

modest skiff
#

We have no proof of what happens when someone eats 2 devil fruits right? We know you die if you try it but do we KNOW that?

onyx ember
#

For all we know, she got it while part of Rocks

cloud trail
onyx ember
#

Big Mom

cloud trail
#

the fruit was with Mother Carmel

onyx ember
#

You’re right. I missed that 😂

cloud trail
onyx ember
#

No idea

cloud trail
#

lol

vital pilot
#

Soo Luffy is Joy boy. Momo can’t be joy boy. The prediction was made he will be born and meet shirahoshi.

weary cliff
#

Luffy is probably Joyboy. He did make that promise with Shirahoshi. It could all be a misdirection though

vital pilot
#

How the big daughter got so lost that she ate all her friends. Was she drugged?

heady cairn
#

you are saying luffy as joy boy, like a reincarnation of him or like a title?

heady cairn
#

abstinence of food

weary cliff
heady cairn
#

And the title is given according to his actions

#

My point of view

weary cliff
#

Either way it was predetermined. How you frame that in relation to freedom is up to you, but the fact can't be avoided that all of this was known to be coming hundreds of years ago

heady cairn
# weary cliff Either way it was predetermined. How you frame that in relation to freedom is up...

I think there's maybe prophecy, that other person that will recieve the title of joy boy will come, but it didn't need to be necessarily luffy, but probably is him, because he is the protagonist and this prophecy is probably the same as the one that says someone will bring another era, thats probably luffy. Other thing is that in the lost century, someone with the name of joy boy had developed an important funccion and in this new era, the other person that will recieve this name is luffy

cloud trail
#

to be JoyBoy

heady cairn
#

It's true

cloud trail
#

but I can't see anyone else

heady cairn
#

Maybe momo?

weary cliff
#

See, that's where you lose me. Because if some kind of prognosticator knows that someone will come around and finish Joyboy's business, but they don't necessarily name him as Monkey D Luffy, we still know after the fact that they were talking about Luffy and it was his destiny the whole time. Never mind the fact that Sharley has called out Luffy specifically as the one who will destroy FMI. So when that comes to pass, we can argue again was that his freewill or was that destiny. That kind of philosophical quandary is one people face in the real world, and probably bigger than what can be solved in a manga theory channel lol its up to the reader how they interpret it

cloud trail
#

MMMMM, Momo is a source of inspiration, but we all know that he is not the leader Luffy is.

heady cairn
#

He is much more mature

weary cliff
#

We dont really know if Joyboy will be a leader or specifically what function they will perform. But Momo doesnt fit the prophecy as for having already been born when we presume the sea kings were talking about their upcoming birth in a distant sea. Some people speculate Vivi since she's met Shirahoshi and Imu took particular attention to her. I think she's been a bit too absent from the story to come back and play that pivotal of a role, but we'll see. Its probably Luffy after all

cloud trail
#

Didn't they say they must open the borders FOR JOYBOY

weary cliff
#

I think its interesting to note that Oden, who knows more about Joyboy than almost anyone else said it was important to get Wano ready for their arrival. But Luffy had no problem arriving and will be the one to open the country

weary cliff
cloud trail
#

Yea, in a way Luffy must be opening it for him, not Joyboy himself will be the one opening it

heady cairn
cloud trail
#

JoyBoy is a character we don't know about, the simplest way to put it

#

as in not introduced yet

grizzled fog
#

No

pure raven
#

I mean like we don't even know who exactly JoyBoy was and how are we supposed to even relate a character with him

cloud trail
#

If everything turned out ok with the Revolutionaries, they might be tracking the weapons back to Wano, but they already declared war on the World Government and it wouldn't make sense to just divert away from that. only in a situation of changing his plans.

pure raven
#

Saying that momo/luffy will be the JoyBoy without knowing who JoyBoy is, it just doesn't make sense to me

cloud trail
storm cave
#

hmm

weary cliff
cloud trail
pure raven
#

Making a headcanon based on a headcanon

cloud trail
weary cliff
#

Since we don't know the source of Kaido's info, we can't be sure if his take on anything is reliable

modest skiff
oak mural
#

its a title or a nickname for people who possess the same will (D) or even same characteristics i guess

pure raven
#

We know exactly who Roger was and we can figure out many candidates who can be the next Roger

oak mural
#

joy might be the king of the ancient kingdom which was erased by wg ?

pure raven
#

Kaido was with rocks and prolly knows a lot more than we think

weary cliff
pure raven
#

JoyBoy can be a dwarf as well ShanksTroll

storm cave
#

i doubt it lol

weary cliff
#

I think people are conflating the ideas that the return of Joyboy will have anything to do with the pirate king. Just because the info from Joyboy mostly came from LT

modest skiff
#

I think all pirates prioritize overthrowing the navy above most other things and I honestly think Kaido wants to work with Joyboy

#

I still predict Kaido ends up as a Tsundere for Luffy. Not a direct "ally", but a tsundere

pure raven
modest skiff
#

Well I think Luffy defeats him first, which is why he becomes a tsundere

#

I think Kaido basically has a defeat fantasy

pure raven
#

After that he can ig

modest skiff
#

ig?

pure raven
#

I guess

modest skiff
#

I just think whatever happens with Luffy's crew/alliance is going to be totally nuts. Everyone is wondering if Yamato joins Luffy's crew, and it would make a ton of sense. But man I would laugh my ass off if Kaido joined the crew, not the fleet, the crew ViviChuckle

worldly anvil
#

they can't fit Kaido on Sunny tho

#

he's too fat

pure raven
#

He can fly the entire time

worldly anvil
#

Honestly I think Kaido is going to die in Wano, he want to die

keen portal
#

Where's the obligatory "But what will he bring to the crew? What job?"

worldly anvil
#

in a cool way ofc

modest skiff
pure raven
#

I don’t think it’s true but people are saying that luffy is gonna awaken his devil fruit this arc because of this part in the opening, something about changing the elasticity of water idk though I just think it’s some food for though

gleaming lintel
weary cliff
#

I hope not

amber oar
#

Sounds like a terrible idea, a DF affecting water would break one of the basic laws of OP universe

weak arrow
#

Yeah Luffy isn’t gonna be able to do anything in the water. People theorizing that are just click baiting

west saffron
#

maybe thats how you awaken your devil fruit? through a conqueres haki technique? have we seen anybody who has awakened their devil fruit not have conqueres?

#

not with the whole changing the elasticity of water thats broken and dumb

weary cliff
#

Jailer beasts had no inclination of being conquerors

west saffron
#

those might be forced awakenings like choppers

#

am i wrong?

#

choppers is through rumble ball right?

weary cliff
#

Maybe, but we have no reason to think that either. They didn't behave at all like how chopper does, and we can assume he's an expert on forced zoan awakening

#

By that I mean the jailer beasts seem to be perfectly able to stay awakened, but Chopper who is an expert, just got to the point of keeping it for 30 minutes. So the simplest solution is that they are truly awakened

modest skiff
#

The jailer beasts don't really make sense to me tbh. Seems inconsistent

grizzled fog
#

How so

modest skiff
#

Maybe inconsistent is the wrong word. Maybe I am misunderstanding something. If I recall correctly, they kinda didn't really have control of themselves and were somewhat brute'ish

#

Why would someone want to awaken a power that makes you mindless? Am I forgetting something?

grizzled fog
#

They had plenty of control over themselves

#

They didn’t speak, but that’s kind of it. But they were obedient snd knew what they were doing, it’s not like they were out of control berserkers.

modest skiff
#

For some reason I remember them behaving more like a bull after a matador than a strategist

grizzled fog
#

Also Sadie might be to blame for them acting like vegetables lol

modest skiff
#

I should really re-read or re-watch. I was on a lot of pain killers during that arc, lol

weary cliff
#

Gotta be careful using re-watching as a refresher. I just got caught up on the Wano anime because I had binged acts 1 and 2. Since it was all kind of foggy, I was totally convinced all the little filler scenes, like Zoro at the gambling house, were canon. I still dont know what else was added content even now

west saffron
#

The filler scenes ended up being semi-canon though lmao they pointed to zoro having conqueres Haki and GUESS WHAT hahahahaha I’m fuckin with yall

#

But, seriously, is there any way that kaido could have read oden’s logbook?

queen arrow
#

no

west saffron
#

How?

queen arrow
#

Yamato says that none of them know it even exists because she kept it hidden

pure raven
weary cliff
#

That's a relief. The whole thing was totally in his character

pure raven
#

Yeah some of the things that seem anime canon will probably be canon to the manga too or else Wano would be 300 Chapters

coarse jewel
#

who do yall think will save luffy

#

I hope someone like katakuri maybe but i know thats unlikely

#

thats the most logical answer tbh but i kinda want someone else to save him

#

someone unexpected to save him

west saffron
#

i doubt it highly

weak flicker
cedar sinew
#

they're different titles but to be fair joyboy and pk are just heavily implied to be connected and the same person. Both due to the prophecies and the parallels but also because to be the pk you mutually have the qualifications to be the next joyboy

rigid wadi
#

they're different titles but to be fair joyboy and pk are just heavily implied to be connected and the same person. Both due to the prophecies and the parallels but also because to be the pk you mutually have the qualifications to be the next joyboy
@cedar sinew Roger said he wanted to meet Joy Boy, is not the same

cedar sinew
#

in the context of the current story and what kaido was referring to, they're the same.
Opening the borders of Wano, bringing about the dawn, finding One Piece, learning about the VC, very interconnected

#

(hint: luffy)

#

Roger and the original joyboy are different people yes. That's not my point

rigid wadi
#

I don't see using Joy Boy as a title

vestal isle
cedar sinew
#

if you're wondering why Kaido specifically said joyboy instead of PK to Luffy as he fell it's because joyboy is directed related to Toki's prophecy and she's heavily implied to be searching for the next joyboy since the void century, Oden wanting to jump 20 years forward until the next joyboy arrives, wanting to prepare Wano to greet the next joyboy, and even Hitetsu potentially referring to the same line of thinking

vestal isle
#

i would say it has more to do with luffy in particular than the general position of pirate king

cedar sinew
#

joyboy shown as a title

#

kaido just confirms it even more

rigid wadi
#

if you're wondering why Kaido specifically said joyboy instead of PK to Luffy as he fell it's because joyboy is directed related to Toki's prophecy and her heavily implied to be searching for the next joyboy since the void century, Oden wanting to jump 20 years forward until the next joyboy arrives, wanting to prepare Wano to greet the next joyboy, and even Hitetsu potentially referring to the same line of thinking
@cedar sinew well k u convinced me nice argument

vestal isle
#

there's obviously some type of destiny at work that probably has more to do with luffy than anyone who could take the position

#

like theoretically if kaido became PK i dont think he would be joyboy

cedar sinew
#

Yeah I agree with that to a certain extent. But that's not really relevant in the context of the current story and what Kaido said

#

because we're referring to luffy here, narratively

#

but yeah becoming PK doesn't mean you automatiaclly become the new joyboy

vestal isle
#

you're right, i'm just saying that your point about the PK and Joyboy being the same thing probably only applies to luffy

#

which i do agree with in his case

cedar sinew
marsh cloud
#

What if Law is undercover?

cedar sinew
#

more supporting images, some are more implicit than others

#

this is another point I thought about. Two sovereigns with one referring to Shirahoshi and the other referring to Luffy. Why is it Luffy if he's not a sovereign? Well being the PK is technically being a king isn't it?
Another point to mention, whales + seakings will be happy at their reunion because they're part of the whole Noah, FMI liberation plotline, being under Poseidon's command. Luffy carries on Joyboy's will and completes his promise; it fits on that aspect as well.

#

rogers comments here also imply that it's Luffy aka the next joyboy, who'll also find One Piece, and circumvent the world. More connections between the two titles

amber oar
# marsh cloud What if Law is undercover?

Nah. The way he behaves when he's alone doesn't suggest any of that.

We already have clear Law's game - Originally intended to use Luffy, but Luffy has grown on him and now he genuinely cares

weak arrow
# cedar sinew

Just wanted to point that it’s the whales that would be happy with their reunion, not the seakings. And that the whales were extremely happy when the strawhats surfaced after FMI (thus after the reunion.)

#

So yes I basically agree

vale harbor
#

what does PK mean

cedar sinew
#

pirate king

#

and ye Adam idk why I said sea kings. Though it's kinda weird whales were specifically chosen.
But the seakings still show signs up being happy/looking forward to the reunion so still fits ye

hollow grotto
cedar sinew
#

tyty uwu

hollow grotto
#

I do want to ask, since I've seen you in the chat a couple times, what do you think Oda plans to do with BM?

#

I've got my own thoughts on it but the peeps I talk to think she's going to die in Wano

weak arrow
#

I'm not Mai, but as of the latest chapter, I'm on the train that she'll leave Wano, possibly with Kaido's poneglyph. However, I don't think she will be in Elbaf, but she will be defeated by Blackbeard off-screen after recently obtaining Pluton. This will then give Blackbeard 1-2 poneglyphs when to our knowledge, he has 0 or at best 1 (The one with the unknown location)

hollow grotto
#

just collecting thoughts from others as I have a theory in the works, am curious to see what others think though

cerulean coyote
#

Pluton blueprint was destroyed. He cannot obtain it.

weak arrow
hollow grotto
#

I like the idea, there's definitely set-up for BM to head out with Kaido's poneglyph, potentially ditch or just escape after it's all over.

cedar sinew
#

Honestly my opinion on that is entirely connected to Kaido's potential defeat in Wano. I'll explain why in a sec.
I actually thought there's a chance that Kaido won't go down in this arc, and he'll retreat (or some other measure) but as time passes it seems that that's an unlikely option. So Kaido going down to the alliance, so would BM because

  1. Pave way for the new (worst) generation. Maybe Kid takes the empty yonko spot, though I'm still unsure of how the defeat will happen or if it's even possible.
  2. She's already had an entire arc focused to her, and gotten a fair amount of screentime in Wano. So makes sense for her to go down for good as an antagonist.
    I'm still open to other ideas like her leaving potentially to defend WCI. But I'm definitely leaning towards BM never appearing again as a major antagonist after Wano.
hollow grotto
#

I've got my own thoughts that BM will go down 'as an antagonist' in this arc, but it won't be the end of her character importance.

cedar sinew
#

only asking because that's what you bet on

hollow grotto
#

Something about the way that Punk Hazard played out, introducing monstrously-giant children obsessed with candy that were saved by Chopper in the end got me suspecting potential parallels to another monstrously-giant, child-minded mentally-ill adult with an obsession with candy, coincidentally funding the same organization. There's nothing concrete set up in the theory yet, but I do find it odd.

cerulean coyote
#

If bm goes down, cp0 will eliminate her.

hollow grotto
#

wonder if Oda has been planning something with BM regarding something of a similar nature to that for a while now

#

just feels too closely-resembled to be a coincidence but there's not much to build off from there

cedar sinew
#

well tbh the kids on punk hazard and BM are just fundamentally different. But I do agree that the kids being addicted to drugs is physically resemblant of BM's hunger pangs

hollow grotto
#

yeah of course, it's all in the end just room for thought

cedar sinew
#

it's also not coincidental btw. BM had a good reason to fund the research

weak arrow
cedar sinew
#

I guess the drug affects were just one of the means to which Oda chose to demonstrate the addiction 🤔

weak arrow
#

im more into this theory after luffy got knocked off onigashima

hollow grotto
#

yeah I'm aware there was reason for the funding, but the conditions themselves are similar to Big Mom's situation

#

and her own Hunger Pangs - curious if there's a connection, if not, algood

#

putting Chopper with Big Mom when she had amnesia and showed her childish nature free of any ill-intent might allow Chopper to see the good in her and try to save her, having overcome that initial fear he felt when he saw her on the coast and realize there is some good to her

#

The narrative could easily sway a different way though, just thought it'd be more interesting and align well with the story rather than just 'killing her' since Oda really doesn't seem that confident in doing that to his characters

cedar sinew
#

tbh I think she's beyond saving. If BM were portrayed as a nice person with sporadic hunger pangs which make her go insane I'd be more inclined to agree but she's pretty villainous and ambitious in her own right. Even willing to kill off her own children.

#

The fact that she has a utilitarian end goal, though, does provide more room for potential development

#

but even having said that, she's an old woman and probably won't change her ways in her 60s

weak arrow
#

There's a fair chance of a permanent Olin storyline, but that wouldn't begin unless she's defeated this arc, and just means Luffy has a super strong ally in BM that can help in the final war.

cedar sinew
#

what is the permanent Olin storyline? That she her permanent amnesia?

#

what will happen to her crew and WCI then

modest skiff
#

I think the last glyph is in Elbaf and that’s why world government isn’t really worried about it. If giants don’t have the others and no one will ever have the giant one, it’s game over. Or so they think..!

cedar sinew
#

idk if Oda will go that way. Feels like a major copout. The only way I can see BM or ANY character really joining the SHs cause is out of their own volition and free will

hollow grotto
#

Amnesiac Olin? nono

cedar sinew
#

but the only people that we've seen have that knowledge are the minks and Roger's crew

hollow grotto
#

I think the amnesia plotline could move into a route that allows Big Mom to finally come to terms and deal with her childhood trauma in some way. How that happens is not clear but there's obviously some anarchy to be said about her that could be touched upon and twist what we think about her.

modest skiff
hollow grotto
#

possibility is really just being thrown out there since I discuss a potential mentally-healed BM plotline rather than amnesia Olin or purely 'evil' Big Mom

#

with my friends in private

cedar sinew
#

I just think that BM's inherent evil and ambitious nature that's clouded under her "unity persona" is too big and too much of an integral part of her character to overturn.
We still don't really know how BM became that way. She ate everyone at the party (didn't know what happened, though she might have a clue now?), and we flashforward to her joining Rocks crew.
I'm going to make an educated guess that BM turned out that way due to Streusen's evil influence, so yeah. I think there's much more to BM's antagonistic nature than what happened at the party during the flashback. From a child she was always extremely selfish, but her utilitarian goals kinda clouded it to making it seem like she was a good person. In the end she'll do whatever she wants regardless of other people's feelings, and while other children learn at a young age that that's not how society works, BM never had that check on her entire life due to her monster strength.

#

So this is something built up for over 60+ years. I don't know how Oda could change that and develop her character in a believable way.

#

Other than the amnesia plotline

#

which personally I think is shit

#

and no, I don't think the WG has knowledge of a potential road poneglyph on elbaf @modest skiff

weak arrow
hollow grotto
#

Streusen's influence was definitely for self-gain. He used her monstrous strength and took advantage of her gentle and kind heart, but by her amnesia sneaking into the story talking with Chopper, he was able to learn that she had a selfless side to her that we had no clue was there prior. It's obvious that the amnesia storyline to a lot of people was a dumb choice on Oda's part, but if he uses this as a means of allowing Big Mom to see the truth/come out with some sort of inner peace at the end of it all, it will make everything that the amnesia plotline made people went through, imo at least, worth it. It would provide greater narrative purpose than to just be a plot device from point A to point B and develop BM, and if it aligns with what I think, Chopper's dream more-so too.
Because that plotline now exists is the reason that I believe this change could happen, where if you'd asked me before Wano, I'd have to disagree. BM's antagonistic nature feels much more like it's puppeted by the people that raised her to be the way she is, and by showing no other influences other than her loss of Mother Caramel and Streusen's influence over her, it infers that those were the two things that turned her into the person she is now. I couldn't tell ya all the answers and explain what Chopper would do to help, but there's a lot of set-up for something like this to happen.

#

though I do agree, BM is meant to be an antagonistic force as a Yonkou and all and has done horrible things in the past, but I still can see the possibility if it means giving her some sort of closure. A happy ending for a tragic character, no matter how dark they were, sounds fitting for BM of all people. She's made fun of for being incapable and incompetent as a Yonkou from the community and perhaps that's why Oda allowed her to be messed with so easily by people like Robin. could just be poking my head in the sand and this means nothing but it's been on my mind for a bit

cedar sinew
#

I'll comment on a couple things here.

she had a selfless side to her that we had no clue was there prior
We DID know BM had a selfless side to her. Her entire flashback demonstrates that. That she has good intentions but has selfish approaches, and fails to understand everyone's differences. She has a 3 year old mentality and still has the same mentality, which as I explained is the byproduct of having monstrous strength.
BM's antagonistic nature feels much more like it's puppeted by the people that raised her to be the way she is
This is true but it also doesn't dismiss anything. Humans by inherent nature are shaped by their environment. Ofc, there are extreme exceptions if you're mentally a psychopath or a saint from birth, but for the majority, a character is shaped by their upbringing and environment. Couple examples: Hody and his hatred for the human race, perfect example of this. Doffy/Law and their hatred for the world. Law was still able to be saved from a young age due to Corazon's influence, but that's not the case for BM unfortunately. So I think you're downplaying the factor one's environment plays into their characterization- the large majority. In other words, the fact that BM isn't inherently evil from birth has little to do with the fact that she's capable of changing.

#

I think thinking about how this could connect with Chopper is interesting, though I'll point out that this is much more psychological and doesn't necessarily align with his dream.
Oda using the amnesia plotline for Udon liberation (and just some fun before the storm) is fine in my books, but I can also see how that's a potential leverage, though I'm still against the idea. I do think there's a good chance of her getting a concluding character arc moment, but to me is still beyond the point of redemption.

#

@hollow grotto

celest seal
#

Man I can´t wait for Moria to get his revenge on Kaido in act 4

junior cape
#

If big mom goes down this arc, she will absolutely show up later

#

And I say this from the perspective of "The BM Pirates value their face value above all else". They know that without BM around to slap her name on things and wreck havoc, they will never be taken seriously again, even if their members are hilariously powerful.

#

They would in a heartbeat drop everything to get a critically damaged BM out of danger

#

No questions asked

#

Because if they don't, they're finished. They lose all authority. Totto Land bites the dust, and they go back to being a ragtag group of pirates who just so happen to be related

#

In that sense, BM's presence is an immensely sharp double-edged sword. The BM pirates need her to stay relevant and """safe""" in their power, meanwhile having her around is like having a nuke in your back pocket that could go off at literally the drop of a hat.

#

And almost nobody can stop her

#

None of her kids can. Luffy might be able to. Some of Kaido's men might be able to. Maybe a couple Naval admirals together could. But beyond that, BM is an unstoppable monster once she goes off.

junior cape
#

However, Kaido has to die for this raid to succeed

#

no running him out of Wano, no making him promise to not return, he has to go

#

There will never be peace in Wano unless his head rolls

#

Luffy doesn't have to kill him, but Kaido has to die

rigid wadi
#

He will loose to Luffy(with or without help) and someone will kill him. I got my bets on Blackbeard and the theory of him getting the strongest Zoan too

junior cape
#

IDK about that one dawg

#

We have no indication that BB is on the move. If I had to guess, either Yamato, one of the surviving samurai, Kidd/Killer/Law, or the ocean will kill Kaido (Like, Luffy knocks him into the sea)

#

Even Kaido the dragon cannot swim

sand sail
#

In fact, he did actually point out he was making a move

snow cloak
junior cape
#

BB or Kaido?

junior cape
#

It was about the Reverie, NOT Wano

sand sail
#

Yep, he's not going to Wano

pure raven
#

BB would have balls jumping into this fight

noble fractal
#

After Wano, maybe Luffy gets news about what's happening to Sabo, and instead of there being an island after Wano for an arc, he has to go save Sabo? This seems like a rather stupid theory, but honestly, I can see it happening, it took two arcs to save Ace. We'd get more lore, and after that we get to go to Elbaf?

junior cape
#

As for post-Wano, we're finally gonna be introduced to the final Naval Admiral, who we were teased with back in the Reverie.

#

IDK man he's managed to break the pre-established power system in the world into literal pieces by acquiring multiple DFs, as well as the ability to steal them.

noble fractal
junior cape
#

Also valid

#

He may have grabbed more when he was on his rampage

pure raven
#

i think BB can hold only two but he can give fruits to his crew

dark perch
#

Im excited to see Luffy's and BB next interaction

icy sapphire
junior cape
#

I think the next interaction between Luffy and BB will start with Luffy just immediately going in for a punch

last void
#

The Next Time they meet,He might get hit with a Red hawk

dark perch
#

If BB wants to be villian of the year, he'll go off on how he fucked up Ace, similar to what Doffy said to Law about Corazon

split hornet
#

I keep thinking about luffys eyes when he's unconscious, wonder what it means
Like Kaido mentioned he keeps staring at me ¿?‽ Even being unconscious

cloud trail
#

probably as in his will did not break

scarlet summit
#

who do you think gonna save luffy guys gimme ur ideas

teal nymph
#

the possible options zou , octopus , momo (?), law crew , BMP , shanks ???

small pasture
#

btw i really think that the warship island filler is a rough sketch of the final arc of the series

#

dragons + lost civ + lost island + ancesctor history

amber oar
#

ah yeah a 373kb game, what year is this 1987?

snow cloak
#

Guys I think luffy will use coc haki with gear 4 he won't use normal gear 4 or coc alone he will use both to boost up and law will save him

hearty igloo
snow cloak
twin void
#

and vice versa

weary cliff
#

That's all it is

hearty igloo
#

Wow thank you for the answer all

undone marten
#

I am pretty sure sanji will die , i Dont know when it will happen but yeah

last void
#

A Question: Do you think Luffy will die at the End?

cloud trail
#

No, he will never be forgotten

last void
amber oar
#

no, that has never been OP's tone

warm hollow
pure raven
#

Chopper should die, then they can replace him with Marco the crew gets to keep a doctor but a serious power up

snow cloak
#

I think if they defeat kaido someone need to stay behind in wano to protect the country.Momosuke not strong enough(if only mommueuke got a crazy power up or he can communicate with a creature that protects the wano or all smiles began to work)

Yamato probably joins straw hats

Hancock maybe got captured.
Mohawk destroys the entire fleet.
Weveil got captured
Luffy need to have a talk with his dad so they can act accordingly

Theories:
Shanks is a celestial dragon
Blackbeard and rocks are related
Void century is just a war between two groups with different beliefs

vast atlas
thick sky
#

chopper is a better doctor than Marco

vast atlas
#

Plus hes cuter

thick sky
#

why should chopper die and why should he be replaced

vast atlas
#

His presence has already been well established in the crew, and the backlash of his death would be gargantuan

thick sky
vast atlas
#

Not to mention, theres not much of a bond between the crew and Marco

pure raven
#

We don’t know that chopper is a better doctor than Marco, also chopped is weak 💀 Marco is a free agent and not only will they keep a doctor but the crew will gain another powerful member which they will need in the fights to come

thick sky
#

Marco just finds Straw Hats - cool and awesome

vast atlas
#

It would be lazy writing, because he'd most likely join just because Luffy is Ace's brother

thick sky
#

yeah. Marco is probably better winding up remaining wb pirates hotshots for the final war or smth

pure raven
#

But think about it if you were captain of that crew, wouldn’t you ditch that pet for a stronger member lol I sure would

vast atlas
#

I see marco joining the fleet instead of the crew

thick sky
vast atlas
thick sky
pure raven
#

I’m not luffy, I’m just saying what I would do and I think it would be more beneficial for the crew

vast atlas
#

He'd never abandon a loyal crewmate just because theres a stronger alternative

thick sky
#

yea

pure raven
#

Also if chopper dies it’s not like luffy can do anything about that except move on

vast atlas
#

But the backlash would be so big

pure raven
#

What backlash

vast atlas
#

Fron the fans

pure raven
#

Lol wtf

vast atlas
#

Not to mention, it's absolutely not in Luffy's character to abandon a crewmate

#

Much less let one die

pure raven
#

It’s not abandon if that crew mate is dead, and luffy is dead in the water not like he can save anyone right now

vast atlas
#

If not Luffy, then someone else

dapper mica
#

The one piece is really ironically named and that’s what made Roger laugh, and why no one has been able to guess what it is (Oda said no one has guessed it yet)

cedar sinew
#

not the right channel for that 🙂 @last void

last void
#

oh

torn pine
vast atlas
#

I know right

red hamlet
#

shanks is definitely the son of a celestial dragon and blackbeard is xebec’s son. also, yamato joins straw hats

junior cape
#

Uh no

#

Nuh uh

little kelp
#

does the weapons that Kaido said the government made that are powerful enough to end the Pirate Era have a name yet?

weary cliff
#

Nope

snow cloak
#

Sanji fights queen
Luffy saved by laws crew
Yamato confronts kaido
Kid destroys bm
Zues soul in nami's barton
Akainu is in wano

misty timber
#

Do you think jimbei will shine in wano?

snow cloak
misty timber
#

It feels weird he doesn't fight against big mom or kaido

weary cliff
snow cloak
shadow jewel
#

Hitetsu is Sukiyaki and waiting for Joyboy

split hornet
#

I definitely think cp0 will make a move at the end when they're tired and weakend

cedar sinew
#

@grand cloud only serious messages here please 🙂

grand cloud
#

ah shoot my b, anyways i believe luffy will just wash up on shore like the starting of wano and train and possibly wait until onigashima is above or destroyed the flower capital

#

he could gear 4th early too

warm gust
#

Test

light pond
#

I like the fact that in the recent sbs it is stated that vegapunk was trying to duplicate dfs that are not zoans, i think he hasnt succeeded yet considering he hasnt duplicated kuma's powers yet but he was having a progress since he manage to recreate kizaru's lazers

I wanna know about vegapunk soon hopefully next arc

carmine plover
#

Vegapunk saves Luffy from the ocean FujiWoke

queen arrow
#

i thought it said that he managed to replicate a mythical zoan, unlike Caesar who couldn't

light pond
light pond
queen arrow
#

yeah, i thought it was clearly refering to Momo's fruit

light pond
#

Considering he was researching about kizaru's fruit i think he was still trying

queen arrow
#

fuck that theory btw

#

Pacifista's lasers aren't just logia cloning

light pond
#

IMO Judge does it better since he manage to give superpowers to his children without the weakaness to water

light pond
hollow rapids
queen arrow
#

Drake didn't say he made artificial devil fruits to shoot laser beams, just that he replicated "kizaru's laser", which is probably the only existence of laser beams that someone had even seen before

light pond
#

Drake says vegapunk was researching kizaru's fruit and btw dont be rude i never once throw explixite words at u

queen arrow
#

this is less of a jab to you and more of a jab to Artur btw

light pond
queen arrow
#

Artur thinks that pacifistas literally have artificial devil fruits in them

light pond
queen arrow
#

i'm sorry

#

but yeah, i don't think it makes sense for the laser beam technology to be bloodline elements devil fruit stuff

light pond
queen arrow
#

related to this point, i don't remember it exactly but did any of the Vinsmokes show powers without their tech and raid suits?

light pond
#

Poison, heat, lightning, grappling, invisibility that are some legit superpowers without the water limitations

cedar sinew
#

they showed super stregnth and durability

#

but none of the elemental powers

cedar sinew
queen arrow
#

yeah, that's clearly less of a big deal than cloning devil fruits them

light pond
hollow rapids
light pond
cedar sinew
#

heres's the panel

hollow rapids
cedar sinew
#

so he definitely knows more than laser creation

light pond
#

Niji without raid suit using dengeki blue

unknown.jpeg
light pond
#

Unlike vegapunk who needs a copy of the linage factor from the df user itself judge didnt need those he experimented with the linage factor and manage to give superpowers to his kids abliet some side effects

queen arrow
#

the fact that he needed to do this to them when they where in the womb is a big deal though

light pond
queen arrow
#

?

#

i'm pretty sure it's confirmed Reiju is just like her brothers, even with the born emotions thing

light pond
queen arrow
#

it's confirmed on the vivre cards that she didn't have emotions when she was born, and instead was taught how to feel by her mother

unknown.png
grizzled fog
#

......huh that’s weird

I don’t like that

queen arrow
#

why not?

grizzled fog
#

Taught her emotions? Her brain is wired differently, so she’s not really “feeling” them?

#

Idk it almost feels fake that way

light pond
#

It really contradicts this panel here

unknown.jpeg
queen arrow
#

it doesn't, it's a nature vs nurture thing, and it shows that even the Vinsmokes are capable of being redeemed

#

because she was raised in a different way, her emotionless nature was able to give way to feelings

strong chasm
#

Vivre Cards have been inaccurate in the past

grizzled fog
#

Tbf, that does work actually, it lets me kind of believe that in wci the vinsmokes other than Reiju did begin to show some genuine emotions, and weren’t just trying to repay their debt for being saved

queen arrow
#

it also explains why she was so nonchallant about letting herself and all of them die

olive quail
#

Wait i thought she was only physically augmented

#

Post birth

light pond
#

Anyways back to the topic i wonder if judge collects those linage factors from original df users or he manage to find someways to create superpowers himself hmmm

light pond
#

I also thought reiju was post birth

olive quail
#

Well the brothers also had their dna altered

light pond
#

Everyone of them have their dna altered just sanji who was saved from it

olive quail
#

Yeah sorry i misunderstood ur message

light pond
#

If emotions can be taught wouldnt that make sora's sacrifice to sanji like totally useless cause he could just teach him post birth and let him have superpowers too?

#

It is just weird to have reiju taught "emotions"

#

Sora should have just taught the kids "emotions" rather than take the drugs that caused her death

honest spade
#

Genetic altering couldve been different from what everyone else got compared to Reiju. Plus Sora wasn’t sick and still alive

olive quail
cedar sinew
olive quail
#

Vegapunk has the whole puzzle and knows how to recreate dfs

cedar sinew
#

sora only had time for reiju @light pond

light pond
light pond
cedar sinew
#

maybe she didn't feel confident that she could devote the time to change all 5 of her kids behind Judge's back.

#

and she had no idea Reiju could turn out that way

honest spade
light pond
#

The drug that make sanji "human" and have "emotions" is what killed sora and it is useless if she could just teach emotions

light pond
cedar sinew
#

you realize that reiju is still a cold blooded assassin

#

she just has the ability to feel some emotions

#

she's still a killer robot

#

sora didnt' want any of that

#

reiju even says this herself

#

"I can feel emotions but I'm still a killer and I'm willing to die myself along with my entire family"

grizzled fog
#

Yeh she’s not exactly normal lol

cedar sinew
#

no regular human would say that.

olive quail
#

Here's how we answer this conundrum

cedar sinew
#

also, Sora's not a goddess who can see the future. You only think this retroactively as an omniscent reader

#

at the time, that was the only choice she had

olive quail
#

Do reiju's eyebrows swirl the same way as sanji or her brothers

#

Thats our answer

cedar sinew
#

don't shitpost in the middle of a discussion.

light pond
queen arrow
#

Sanji being a regular human is what makes his unable to let go of his feelings, Reiju was totally willing to let her entire family die and Sanji who is the one that suffered the most wasn't able to handle taht

cedar sinew
#

what side effect? The goal was to stop the genetic changes, which she failed to do so except for sanji

modest skiff
#

Reiju is awesome

pure raven
#

question cause I just sort of realized but what's the power scaling of Sannji vs his siblings without the raid suits cause the whole cake island arc made it seem like they're utterly useless without their raid suits

olive quail
cedar sinew
#

in what way

light pond
queen arrow
#

Sanji kicks their asses if they don't have the suits tbh

cedar sinew
#

she sacrificed herself for her kids and failed, that's the point

light pond
queen arrow
#

they only managed to do anything because he was in a hostage situation

pure raven
olive quail
# cedar sinew in what way

Well sanji's eyebrows swirl opposite his brothers to signify how he's different. If reiju's eyebrows swirl like sanji then she's more like him than her brothers

grizzled fog
#

Most definitely not lol , he whoops their asses without the suit. And he couldn’t fight back in the actual situation

light pond
grizzled fog
olive quail
#

Oh i missed that

cedar sinew
#

it swirls like her brothers. But that's not even the point

#

we know Reijju is different

queen arrow
pure raven
light pond
#

The eyebrow swirl has no connection at all QueenKEKW QueenKEKW

hollow rapids
light pond
#

I just posted the two translation up there

#

Vegapunk is not researching linage factor just for the purpose of cloning

errant nova
cedar sinew
#

anyone have the sbs question?

hollow rapids
light pond
olive quail
#

I have library of ohara's translation of the question

16227780324316520788927239374001.png
#

@cedar sinew

cedar sinew
#

🤔

modest skiff
cedar sinew
#

Oda could just mean that he wasn't thinking about anything writing that scene.
Rayleigh's comment could've just been a vague "back in the days" comment ig

light pond
olive quail
cedar sinew
#

they're old so they're bound to have spent some time with kids. Doesn't have to be prominent.
But it is kinda weird

modest skiff
pastel summit
#

why does that mean they're bound to have spent time with kids? They may be old, but they're still a pirate crew, and have been part of one for majority of their life.

olive quail
#

I mean there's no point in including the line unless it meant something. Especially in a grouo of pirates

light pond
cedar sinew
#

they visit different villages and meet different people

olive quail
#

The clearest explanation would be them referring to Shanks and/or Buggy

cedar sinew
#

being a pirate doesn't mean sailing and fighting 24/7

modest skiff
hollow rapids
light pond
olive quail
pastel summit
#

ye but being pirates doesn't typically involve babysitting.

modest skiff
light pond