manga-theories

[peak cape]

Isn't being a swordsmen and using swords as a weapon 2 different things in the OP universe? Like Rogers used a sword but he's never been hyped up as a swordsmen.

[wild veldt]

It's not a different thing

[grizzled fog]

Until we are given a definition that separates them, it’s not a different thing

[sacred hawk]

A ZKK compromise:

What if Luffy and Zoro land the final hit on Kaido together?

[weary cliff]

Surely there's a line somewhere. Luffy punching folks with niidai kitetsu probably doesn't qualify him as a swordsman. However people like Roger and Shanks who actually swing their blades might as well fall under the swordsman umbrella. Oda will sort out the inconsistency somehow

[grizzled fog]

I see a combo attack from all the rooftop fighters at once as one of the most likely options, but I guess that’s plausible, tho not as good as some other options in my eyes

[sacred hawk]

I'd still call Luffy a swordsman, just not a very skilled or effective one.

[visual merlin]

What about this then

[sacred hawk]

A swordsman is someone who can fight with a sword. This is no different

Take Lebron James. He's a basketball player.

[visual merlin]

yea but then

[sacred hawk]

If he one day tries to play hockey with a few kids, then he's a hockey player

[visual merlin]

everyone is a swordsman

[sacred hawk]

He might not be very good at it, but he's still playing the game

[peak cape]

Like a Swordsmen in OP treats using swords as a way of life in my eyes. Meanwhile like Luffy using a sword is just a tool or messing about to him. If he's serious he'll use his DF.

[visual merlin]

I don't think anyone else thinks this way

I could play tennis with my friends one day in my entire life, I wouldn't say Im a tennis player

[sacred hawk]

But when you don't have experience, you're not gonna be very effective at it

[weak arrow]

I'd say it's pretty obvious who you'd deem as a swordsman. The only exception really is Big Mom.

Kizaru: Not a swordsman
Aokiji: Not a swordsman
Fujitori: Is a swordsman

It really boils down to, "Do you think X character would call themselves a swordsman"

[sacred hawk]

I guess I'm not explaining it quite well. What I mean is that it's not a permanent classification. If you're swinging your fists at someone, then you are fighting as a brawler. If you swing a sword at someone, you're fighting as a swordsman. Whether or not you're skilled is an entirely different matter

You're a tennis player as long as you're on the field with your friends

[visual merlin]

But no one classifies like this. For one this would only apply to a specific moment, and even in that moment you wouldn't really call yourself that. Im playing tennis so Im a "tennis player" but if some dude asks me if I play tennis I will say no as Im not actually a tennis player

[weak arrow]

Basically, would you classify yourself as a tennis player if you just casually play tennis? No, most people would not

Parents casually playing soccer with their kids don't go around calling themselves soccer players

[sacred hawk]

But let's say that when casually playing, you somehow show better performance than the world's greatest tennis player. You'd be considered a better tennis player than that guy, right?

You wouldn't get discounted just because "this guy's a casual!"

[unique flare]

I think you'd be classified as a swordsman if you have been using a sword as your main weapon for atleast a year

[weak arrow]

I wouldn’t call myself that therefore I would not call myself the best tennis player. I wouldn’t be able to start doing that unless I started building up my fame by specifically fighting other good tennis players and beating them at their own game.

[sacred hawk]

If someone who casually picked up a sword was to best Mihawk publicly, they'd gain the title of WSS

[visual merlin]

Even if I am a better "tennis player" than the worst person who considers themselves a tennis player, Im not gonna call myself one

[sacred hawk]

It would be up to the tennis community who's the best tennis player, not whether you want to call yourself that

[unique flare]

Nah because they're not a swordsman

[weak arrow]

If that person doesn’t classify themselves as a swordsman, they won’t get the title. That’d be like someone that isn’t a pirate being claimed to be a Yonko

If dragon beats up big mom and takes her territory, he isn’t suddenly a yonko

[dusky acorn]

I don't think even a set time matters. Instead, what's most important is what the person think of them as. When Zoro or Kuina first picked up their swords, I'm sure they already thought of themselves as swordsmen much earlier on than spending a whole year with it. They could be classified as swordsmen almost instantly if it was what then considered themselves as.

[weak arrow]

For simplicity sake, it really is just as easy as saying “would this character call themselves a swordsman”

And no, Luffy would not

[sacred hawk]

The way I see it, swordsmanship isn't a title you declare, it's a skill. Anyone who can fight with a sword can be called a swordsmen, even if it's not their primary style. People can have multiple job classes, with varying degree of expertise in each.

[unique flare]

They were little kids, classifying yourself as a swordsman and being a swordsman are two different things

[sacred hawk]

I don't think that matters. If you beat the best swordsman in swordsmanship, you're not going to be disqualified over a technicality like "he didn't call himself a swordsman".

[dusky acorn]

There's no one crowning you the title of the swordsmen, it's what you feel about swordsmanship going into it. Why would their age even matter, Kuina went in striving to be the strongest in the category of swords, is that not defined enough

[weak arrow]

Except anyone fight with a sword just like anyone can kick a soccer ball. That doesn’t make them swordsman or a soccer player. And if you want to say swordsman is a class sort of like how soccer is just one type of sport, just playing soccer doesn’t make you an athlete.

[sacred hawk]

It's like beating the world swimming record as a casual swimmer and getting disqualified because "He's not a swimmer"

[weak arrow]

Theoretically, if kaku did not dual wield his swords, he would be a nitoryu swordsman, just by using his feet. He classified himself as that, but people observing him would not because he’s not using any swords.

[jolly coral]

I think Advanced Conquerors Haki let’s you control the weather and thats how Dragon made the lighting go in Loguetown and wind. Roger also used it to escape when he was surrounded by Shiki. just a theory😂

[weak arrow]

He is not conventionally a swordsman, but if he beats Mihawk using just his feet, I guess he wouldn’t be the worlds Greatest swordsman because he didn’t use any swords because it’s more important what everyone thinks of you

[unique flare]

She was at most the student of a swordsman.
I mean think of it like being a chef, yeah anyone can do what a chef does but the people who are actually good at it are called chef

[sacred hawk]

Just because you're not a pro doesn't mean you can't say you play soccer. Even if you have no skill

[jolly coral]

Did you guys notice that Kuinas hometown is named after Ryumas last name

[weak arrow]

Yeah, but just playing soccer does not make me a soccer player

[unique flare]

Seems plausible

[weak arrow]

Wielding a sword once in your life does not classify you as a swordsman forever

[jolly coral]

best swordsman = nobody can pick up a sword and beat you, not even kaido

[weak arrow]

Usopp picks up a random sword, slashes a fodder guy, and then drops it, guess he’s a swordsman

[dusky acorn]

This is almost ridiculous. it's like disallowing Oden to be called a swordsman or samurai when he was a kid because he was Sukiyaki's son, so he could only be the known as the "son of the Shogun".
I don't know why you're bringing in capability into the argument as if that's something Kuina didn't have, she was the strongest in the dojo apart from Koushiro

And you can still be a bad swordsman but still be known as a swordsman anyways

[unique flare]

Idk if Shanks got buggy's df mihawk would lose

[sacred hawk]

I'm not saying you're marked as a swordsman forever if you use a sword once. I'm saying that the ability to use one at all allows you to act as a swordsman. What I'm trying to argue is that the ability to act as a swordsman, for all intents and purposes, qualifies you as a swordsman

[jolly coral]

how do yall think big mom gonna get saved in 1010

[weak arrow]

Except anyone can act a swordsman, which is why this argument is ridiculous

[lapis prairie]

They're not over water anymore

[sacred hawk]

They'll suck at it tremendously, but they're still swordsmen.

[main sigil]

She might land on land in Wano or ig like some people have been saying land on the Mama Chanter? Idk

[sacred hawk]

They'll just be swordsmen with terrible swordsmanship

[main sigil]

I think we can cross off Kaido saving her though because that would make like the whole last chapter pointless for the roof

[jolly coral]

i think Katakuri is getting stepped on by BB rn

[weak arrow]

I guess when Luffy holds a sword in one hand and beats Zoro EoS by using the other hand, he’ll be the WGS

It’s pretty obvious what the series means by swordsman

Despite anyone’s personal beliefs on the matter

[dusky acorn]

It's people who pour they heart into the blade, have ambition to improve their swordplay, perhaps explicitly go out to beat other swordsmen, etc. Luffy was literally just doing it for fun

[weak arrow]

Kaido would not be one of these people. He obviously puts his time into learning techniques with his mace. Call him a maceman for all I care, idk if there’s a better term

But if he picks up a sword and swings, and obviously he is a very powerful person, he will do some real damage

But he is not a swordsman

[sacred hawk]

It's just means he's less effective as a fighter when using a sword as opposed to the club

[unique flare]

I haven't seen the stuff about oden so imma just skip over
Sure kuina is a swordsman

[weak arrow]

This is true. But also not a swordsman.

[unique flare]

I'm saying you need to have a certain level of experience to be classified as a swordsman.

[weak arrow]

It’d be like calling Zoro a broom man when he fights with 3 brooms. Idr if that was filler or canon.

[pastel summit]

believe that was filler

[weak arrow]

But that’s essentially the argument

[sacred hawk]

Okay, I have a good benchmark for swordsmanship

[weak arrow]

The only person I really question is big mom.

[sacred hawk]

All we need to do is tweak the plot Baratie a little bit, and replace Mihawk with character X.

Character X can be anyone. It can be Shanks, King, Fujitora, or even no-sword style Zoro

If character X can be substituted into the plot of Baratie in place of Mihawk ass the WSS and not make you go "How the fuck does count as swordsmanship", then it's swordsmanship

[dusky acorn]

HYPOTHETICAL: If Luffy never got the devil fruit, and instead chose to pour his heart into swordsmanship to follow in Shanks' stead, while still being dead set on improving his swordplay, no matter how clumsy he was, then I would consider Luffy a swordsman.
Yes, he'd be bad, but if kid Luffy wants to actively improve his swordplay to be just like Shanks and cross swords with him in the future, then he is one because that's what he thinks

Luffy was terribly clumsy with his gum gum fruit when he first got it, but he was still dead set on improving his ability with it

Being terrible with it didn't make him any less of a fruit user

[unique flare]

There's a difference between holding a sword and being a swordsman

Yeah it might be his main form of attack but if he had just started using sword like a week ago hes not a swordsman

He might be trying hard to become one but he doesn't have enough experience

I mean yeah eating a devil fruit might make you a df user but having a sword doesn't make you a swordsman

[dusky acorn]

This all inevitably trails back to the root being there's no one crowning you the title of swordsman, this is you predisposing some ambiguous bar you have to reach onto people over what they see themselves as and think

[sacred hawk]

It's not a protected profession or anything. Swordsmanship is the art of trying to kill the other person with a sword. If you fight by doing that, you're a swordsman

[unique flare]

So luffys a swordsman?

[sacred hawk]

A very bad swordsman, but yes

[dusky acorn]

If we were to go by my hypothetical, yes he'd be one as soon as he goes into the fighting style with that specific passion poured into it

[sacred hawk]

In the same way that Michel Jordan is a bad baseball player

[dusky acorn]

But not the Luffy in Wano who used Nidai, there's a distinction

[unique flare]

Nah not by your hypothetical

Isn't that contradicting what you said before though

He thought of himself as one

[dusky acorn]

Contradicting what? This exactly fits in line with that I said about Luffy merely doing it for fun

He said "It's Wano, so it wouldn't be right if I don't use a sword"

He's not striving to improve his technique with it, he's fitting in with the trend of the country

[unique flare]

Manga?

I don't remember him saying that in the anime

And we should stop debating this in manga theories

[dusky acorn]

Not exactly my paraphrased quote, but same difference

He was using it to look like a samurai, not become one

Even without reading dialogue though, yoo can clearly tell by Luffy's actions he did not care about actually using the sword in battle lol

[unique flare]

I mean he cared enough to deny zoro use of it

Might be remembering wrong haven't watched in like 3 monthes

[dusky acorn]

This is such semantics, we all know the reason he denied Zoro, he thought having it made things more fun

I guess we can leave things here then

[unique flare]

Yep agree to disagree

[carmine comet]

Monkey D. Dragon ate the western mythical dragon with wings fruit thoughts ???

[unique flare]

I was thinking thunderbird mythical zoan

[high portal]

ok so Momonosuke's artificial fruit was made from splicing Kaidou's Lineage factor, has anyone's thought that Blackbeard knew about the lineage factor and rushed the splicing procedure to get Whitebeard's DF?

[rapid nexus]

what if laughtale isnt actually on the grand line but in one of the seas. (like the East Blue). Thats why Roger was laughing, since everyone was looking in the wrong place. That also explains why no one ever found it yet on the Grand Line, since it was never there in the first place. I also beleive that IM (the mysterious dark tall freak) was the right hand of Joy Boy, and was the reason for his fall, as he exposed him to the Marines, which led to Joyboys fall.

[errant nova]

Man I’ve been thinking. Has luffy ever really killed one of his main opponents? I feel like Kaido has always been the exception in the way the mission’s framed. Luffy saying “I’m going to take kaido’s head!” But like it’s hard to imagine the first explicit kill of luffy’s being the invincible kaido. If anything luffy creating an opportunity for zoro/law would maybe seem more plausible. Or maybe admirals show up and capture Kaido after he’s knocked out? That kind of feels like a cop out though.

If luffy uses ryou and a new form to penetrate kaido’s heart, that’d be hype

[vagrant imp]

Two tets, @unique flare there can only be one

[hallow sequoia]

Throughout One Piece, there are a couple of straw hats with percieved personal problems that cannot be helped by others, as if they have lost faith Luffy; Sanji, Nami, Robbin, and Ussop. At some point, his friends care so deeply for him that they dont want their own problems to intervene Luffy's grand goal (obtain The One Piece), and the only way to resolve conflict is by leaving (pretend to betray Luffy). However, Luffy always fought hard with insane willpower to regain all their faiths. One touching phrase from Luffy is "I can't become the pirate king without you, Sanji" just further consolidate the bond of trust between them. This seems to be a re-occurring pattern that I'm looking for the rest of the main straw hats who haven't lose faith in Luffy; Brook, Choppa, Franky, and most importantly, Zoro.

[rapid nexus]

I feel that was a thing of pre timeskip. Because before that, he was actually pretty weak. Now, most of them even risks their lives just to say that Luffy WILL become Pirate King. in a story sense, I dont think it will really make sense anymore, unless one of them is like a spy or something which i highly doubt.

[hallow sequoia]

thats not true cuz sanji left at whole cake

time and place can change people dude

[rapid nexus]

Ig. but i feel like its a bit too late in the story now to have events like that to occur

[hallow sequoia]

nah

what about the 5 nobbles and the other emperors

no but if oda can pull it off at this late stage just gives insane character development

[rapid nexus]

Ig. Tbh i dunno how Oda can create a satisfying ending

like especailly if it was that long of a manga, it will be realy hard to pull off. Theres also so much hype around Im, Shanks, the One Piece, the last fight, how Luffy will end his sotry, I just hope he can satisfy us all

[hallow sequoia]

no dude i think if he does something with zoro

it would be insane because hes the most loyal one to luffy

[nimble hinge]

Except half of those people don't pretend to betray him because "they care too much for him"

Usopp specifically. Zoro already had his moment of that nature. It was at the very start when he told luffy that his goals come first

And since then, that resolve has shifted. There doesn't need to be a part two

[lean jungle]

God usopp

[supple nimbus]

Thank you, for your fruitful contributions.

[hallow sequoia]

when did i say they pretend to lose faith what

they pretend to petray him because they lost faith in his ability to solve their own problems

[nimble hinge]

Pretend to betray *

Usopp doesn't pretend to betray. He feels betrayed and leaves. Nami doesn't pretend to betray. She never had any faith in them. She was just using them.

Really the only one pretends to betray is Robin. Sanji let's them know he's leaving. And once he realizes it's not a situation he can just fix, he wants them to leave him behind. His case arguable. But just barely. Even so, 2 out of 9 is hardly a pattern

[hallow sequoia]

pretty sure sanji pretended too

[pure raven]

Sanju pretented to betray because he wants to increase his bounty so that he can bully zoro

[quick jackal]

Could Rocks D. Xebec actually be Blackbeard?
Bear with me, because I just had this thought talking to a friend.
The description of Blackbeard’s power, the Yami No Mi, goes as such “Darkness is gravity! It swallows everything around it... even light itself can't escape!... Its power is infinite!” He says himself, when he absorbs the power at Marineford, that he can “reduce anything to nothingness”.
And this is where I haven’t developed my thoughts too much, as not much about Xebec, nor his fight against Garp and Rogers, have been displayed. What if right before his death he used the darkness to absorb his own soul? Somehow put himself into another persons body...-> Blackbeard as a baby. The rocks pirate was said to be around “40 years ago” mentioned post timeskip. Blackbeard is 40 years old. Shanks and Buggy said he’s a monster and doesn’t sleep. Luffy and Zoro described him as a “they”. So what if Blackbeard have two souls, the other one being Xebec, the one who guided him to find the fruit again.

I’m spurring this out, but would like to see if this has already been discussed on forums before thinking about it more

[stone veldt]

👍

[dusky acorn]

The main reason I can't see Rocks having Blackbeard's fruit is a similar reason why Roger didn't have Luffy's power. Someone in the series should have commented on it already, and there's plenty of candidates of which would know about Rocks' power. Whitebeard, Garp, Sengoku, Gorosei, none of them so much as batted an eye to talk about the history of Blackbeard's devil fruit or its previous user, especially considering this hypothetical of it having been such a legendary figure.
The absorbing his own soul into the dark pocket dimension is a cool idea I suppose, but that doesn't explain how he would go about merging it into another person's body as a result afterwards.

So what if Blackbeard have two souls, the other one being Xebec, the one who guided him to find the fruit again.
As for your conclusion on Rocks' soul guiding Blackbeard to the fruit, we know that isn't true. Blackbeard merely looked at the Devil Fruit encyclopedia, memorised all the shapes and powers, and noticed the Dark fruit being said to be the most dangerous in the history of devil fruits in the process, so he just had to have it. It was pure coincidence by Blackbeard just based on what he stumbled into whilst reading the book. If any other fruit in there instead had the "most dangerous" dubbing attached to it, then he would no doubt have gone for whatever other power that may have been.

[broken leaf]

I definitely think there's a more direct connection between Xebec and Blackbeard than merely inherited will
but thing is at this point we dont know enough about Xebec to really make a solid argument

[quick jackal]

I like the response about it not ever being mentioned. That is true. I had the same thought regarding what if Roger had Luffy’s fruit and came to the same conclusion. Nobody’s brought it any attention.

The part of transferring the soul is tricky. A thought would be that while he absorbs his soul it’s suspended in the darkness void, where it can be repelled back out, say in Blackbeard who’s a baby at the time, and part of the D clan. There’s way to much here that’s left for pure guessing. Also poses to many new questions.

And with Xebec “guiding” him, I meant more so as maybe as a sort of “whisper” in his ear that he’s not fully conscious of. Leading Blackbeard down a path he’s not fully choosing himself, more his other conscious.

The first part about it never being mentioned though is kinda hard to go against. Would be kinda oblivious of all the characters in the series to not say a single word about it

[quick jackal]

True true

[dusky acorn]

And with Xebec “guiding” him, I meant more so as maybe as a sort of “whisper” in his ear that he’s not fully conscious of. Leading Blackbeard down a path he’s not fully choosing himself, more his other conscious.
Ah, if it's something Blackbeard would be unaware about, and rather something that's inadvertently shifting his fate to have gravitated towards the specific fruit, then that's a perspective of the idea I can appreciate more.

For this theory in general, I would prefer it if Blackbeard was just tragically unaware of why he's so different. Would add to his backstory of being unable to sleep and what not.

But instead, he seems to have a good grasp of what's up with his body in the present at least, considering him being confident in whatever his body is allowing him to get another devil fruit

[broken leaf]

however I think regarding "soul transfer" or something, theres definitely a better candidate than the darkness fruit

[quick jackal]

Yes, I’d like that as well. It would make make Blackbeard a much more likable character who you can emphasize with. In that theory both could be possible. Being possessed as an infant by one of the most evil pirates in existence would be very sad. As he never was given a choice for himself, or has always been led by a different will than his own. As of knowing the extent of his powers, he could have came to a realization growing up about why he is the way he is. Oda did state that one of Teach’s hobbies is studying history. Rocks was erased from history, we’re told as readers, but maybe he was able to learn about it somehow. He’s definitely inspired by him, which is a sign he does know who he is. His ship is also named Saber D. Xebec.

[quick jackal]

Love the feedback. Thank you. It’s far out, I know haha. None of my friends are One Piece nerds, let alone Manga. So sad...for them.

[dusky acorn]

As of knowing the extent of his powers, he could have came to a realization growing up about why he is the way he is. Oda did state that one of Teach’s hobbies is studying history. Rocks was erased from history, we’re told as readers, but maybe he was able to learn about it somehow.
Yeah, Oda could try going for the best of both, and we know how much he likes his tragic backstories. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to consider Rocks had some sort of fail-safe should he "die". At the time, he outright knew he was going on what would potentially be his utmost greatest mission. So yeah, potentially early on in Blackbeard's life he was ignorant to the reasoning behind his abnormality, and ostracised into isolation with nowhere to go until he joined Whitebeard, who he looked up to before growing old. As you say, his realization of the fact may have been related, or the result for Blackbeard to then go on to study history as his hobby afterwards, to learn even more about Rocks. I suppose this also goes along with Blackbeard having ridiculous innate power, despite always laying low and not letting himself known, which is great. It's definitely out of left field, but making these kind of big reaches are sort of what's needed to figure Blackbeard out.
And no problem! I always love seeing long and thought out theories in here.

[broken leaf]

His ship is also named Saber D. Xebec.
Saber of Xebec, also if you still want to roll with the soul idea it would probably make more sense if it was the Ope Ope no Mi. Might also explain the huge price of the fruit

[quick jackal]

Thanks. Necessary correction there. I’m tired 😂😂 Also, good point.

[fathom matrix]

I do kinda like the idea that Blackbeard has a zoan fruit

and since Zoan can effect the base form of the user, like Kaido's scale's, Orochi's ability to survive behing beheaded, and Marco's flames. Maybe that's why he has a weird body

I can imagine BB is trying to get or already has 1 of every devil fruit catagory

and each of the fruits are the strongest of each class. I mean, a fruit devil nullifying, gravity pulling, dark absorbing Logia, an earthquake creating, world shattering, tidalwave inducing Paramecia, and he probably has or might get ba zoan to surpass Kaido's, or hell, maybe he might go after Kaido's

[slim hull]

I have a super amazing theory that will make everyone shake in their pants

Big mom falls off onigashima

Big mom hits her head

Big mom gets amnesia and becimes O-lin again

[worthy hedge]

personally i dont like this theory

[worthy hedge]

i prefer if big mom gets saved from her children and thne se betrays kaido

[slim hull]

More of a troll theory

[worthy hedge]

its a bad plot point for the fight

the amnesia was more of a way to show hwo powerfull was king and a way to save luffy from the prison

there is no reason for her to get it again to help them it is beter if she changes her mind on kaido

[slim hull]

Yeah ik, nobody likes o-lin. That's why i made that "theory"

[pure raven]

This channel is for serious theories only

As I’ve said before does this mean nothing to some of you people?

[acoustic helm]

We do know big mom can just make another homie

[vestal furnace]

Shanks is Xebec's son

[kind gate]

I believe you saw the previous messages by buri

[hollow grotto]

I doubt they introduced an amnesia plot line just to drop it because 'power' and 'plot convenience', could be wrong but as much as people dislike it, it is likely to be brought up again

[tame tendon]

Why? I thought he was a tenryubito son

[slim hull]

@pure raven i mean, i kind of think that will happen

[tame tendon]

Anyone have the best moon theory so far?

[tulip lagoon]

But what IF Xebec is not related to Blackbeard at all?

there isn`t really prove they are related even for now

[pure raven]

do u mean like family or do you mean by the will of D

[amber oar]

The closest link is that BB's ship is named after Xebec. And the D obviously

[tulip lagoon]

family and maybe the will. It is possible I mean

I mean who knows IF Xebec's will was trasnferred to someone else not to Teach

[old needle]

hey guys! when do u think one piece will end? since there are so many unrevealed mystries in it

Shanks is the son of xebec or someone in goverment?

[acoustic helm]

Is shanks was son of xebec then WG would definately wanna extinguish that bloodline.

[amber oar]

shanks doesn't need to be son of anyone

he's got a mentor and paternal figure in Roger

[limpid marsh]

[formal quest]

Since Luffy was hit with a very heavy attack....when he comes back up its gonna be something veryyyyy big!!!

[cyan berry]

He's rubber, not Urouge. Just because he got hit by something big does not guarantee he'll come back with something bigger

Unless I misunderstood what you meant by veryyyy big

[opal roost]

[pure raven]

whatchu guys thinking about gear 5

[worthy hedge]

i hope it is not gear 5 but an awakening to defeat kaido

[pure raven]

imagine if luffy manifests the spirit of haki

[pure raven]

yea

but wahts the awakening

[silent valley]

g5 saved for bb

[worthy hedge]

we have flamingo and katakuri one after the other major antagonists use awakening

Gear 5 is going for the BIG war that is coming

[silent valley]

BB

not the war.... itd make 0 sense

[worthy hedge]

we dont know in what order it is going to be

what ever big thing is next

[pure raven]

right now we are jus going thru roger flashbacks

wait

sorry i dont keep updated, but what was luffy doing before roger flashbacks

[worthy hedge]

htey where getting ready for the invasion

[opal roost]

w h a t

[worthy hedge]

?

[opal roost]

wasn't luffy fighting kaido and big mom

[worthy hedge]

before the flashback

[opal roost]

oh

[uncut musk]

do you think guys that kaido will save BM or her kids will!!!

[heady kindle]

her kids

i dont think the 5 supernova would let kaido save her

[frozen gust]

Kids

[uncut musk]

what do you think if he let the island fall in the sea for her!! @heady kindle

[frozen gust]

That's too bizarre

[heady kindle]

I wouldnt like it bc it would be out of character for kaido

[frozen gust]

She might wash on the shore after dropping down

[uncut musk]

well ODA are doing things more than that lmao

[heady kindle]

i dont think he really cares about her that much

im betting she gets amnesia again and her kids take her back to wci

[frozen gust]

If this happened that's one yonko down maybe then just MAYBE they have some chance defeating kaido

[uncut musk]

yeah i agree

[frozen gust]

Although I think the raid will fail

[heady kindle]

i think the raid failing will depend on whether or not luffy has a new form

[uncut musk]

but if her kids appear right now i can say the 5 supernova don't have a chance against all of them ( without a help from a 3rd part, i mean another pirates)

[frozen gust]

Even with his new form I don't see him anywhere near kaidos level

[uncut musk]

i wish that lmao

[heady kindle]

like if he pulls out a gear 5 or awakening then the raid will succeed imo he needs something new to set himself at the yonko level

yeah but like a awekend luffy plus zoro, kidd, killer, and law

i think that beats kaido

[frozen gust]

I'm expecting some kind of timeskip rn

[heady kindle]

plus maybe yamato

[frozen gust]

Do you guyz think xebec is alive ?

[uncut musk]

it will be a big help to them

[heady kindle]

toki could come back and send big mom like a week in the future that would seperate them

idk if xebec is alive

[frozen gust]

I think he is and will arrive in wano

[heady kindle]

maybe hes in blackbeard but i dont think hes just out somewhere chillin

[frozen gust]

I have some leeds on xebec but i don't have pic perms

[heady kindle]

what do you think would happen if xebec comes to wano

[frozen gust]

He will side with kaido and the biggest war that will make the summit war look like a joke

[heady kindle]

how would that be a big war tho

kaido and xebec would probably stomp on everybody in wano

[frozen gust]

Idk that's why I think xebec is alive

Obv xebec won't be as strong he was in his prime

[heady kindle]

but still

[frozen gust]

Yeah and there will be more parties arriving in wano too

[heady kindle]

even if hes like whitebeard

[frozen gust]

The warlords are on loose too

[heady kindle]

like the grand fleet and marines?

[frozen gust]

Yeah and even more pirates

I have source for this but I don't have pic perms

[heady kindle]

link?

[frozen gust]

It's a pic

[heady kindle]

dm? im interested now lol

[frozen gust]

Sure

It's an old ss have to find it

[heady kindle]

word

[split ledge]

Are you guys talking about fist of love and yami yami no mi

In wano🙄🙄

[frozen gust]

Found it !!

[split ledge]

🙄🙄🙄

[frozen gust]

Huh

[split ledge]

I got some leaks but am not sure🥺🥺

[obtuse void]

Man what is One Piece that caused everyone to laugh even Roger who is close to dying it needs be something mindblowing like One Piece is just a simulation like SAO or smtg thats super crazy

[glacial kindle]

if everyone laughed at the one piece, it might be something that readers are already familiar with

and perhaps the treasure they find might be priceless to pirates, but maybe worthless to common folk

[amber oar]

did you have to bring up that utter worse than shit anime

[pure raven]

It’s laughtale that’s funny, not the one piece itself

[glacial kindle]

?? nah bro they named the island laugh tale because they laughed seeing the one piece

[pure raven]

No

Roger read the story that joy boy left and that is related to the one piece and most likely the forgotten century

The one piece itself is only mentioned when roger say that joy boy left an awesome treasure

But it’s not funny by itself

[keen portal]

read the story that joy boy left

This is what Roger found a funny story lmao

and thus named the island Laugh Tale after it

[pure raven]

I know, it’s irrelevant though

[keen portal]

so by your assumption that story and one piece are unrelated?

or the story is irrelevant to one piece?

[pure raven]

Laughtale is the name of the island. And roger called it that cuz the story about the one piece is laughable

Like I said it’s related. But not in regard of the funny part

If one think the one piece is what made Roger laugh, one is mistaken

[keen portal]

wouldnt the story about one piece be a part of one piece itself tho?

[pure raven]

Nope

[keen portal]

or are you considering it a separate thing from the treasure part

[pure raven]

The story isn’t part of the one piece. The treasure mentioned in it is the one piece.

The story is funny. The one piece isn’t per say

[amber oar]

Roger straight up refers to the story as the treasure, or at least part of it.

I do believe there's real wealth in Laugh Tale, but the central point of the treasure is clearly the story.

(and the sole reason I believe there's real wealth there, is that otherwise Nami would be quite pissed )

[dapper mica]

It’s called laugh tale because the tale makes you laugh. The name is for the story left behind, and has nothing to do with the One Piece

[amber oar]

what kind of bullshit is that and where did you headcanon it from

[dapper mica]

What do you mean

[amber oar]

the One Piece is the treasure. And the treasure is the tale.

Of course the One Piece is related to the story

[night jewel]

also oda did say that luffy deserves a real reward, so whatever one piece is, it must be something rewarding for luffy as well

or atleast some part of it

[dapper mica]

Yes the one piece is related to the story, i said the one piece isn’t related to the name of the island

[amber oar]

but the island's name comes from the story, it's all connected

[dapper mica]

The name is for the story though, and has no indication of what’s on the island

It’s not like it’s called treasure island or gold island

[night jewel]

the tale is most likely associated with the real history they learned from the real poneglyphs, but there is some other treasure besides that

[dapper mica]

The one piece is only related to the name of the island through the story, and isn’t directly relevant

[cyan berry]

!pics

[lone hedge]

Get a role (pirate/revo/marine/civilian) in #old-role-info to be able to post pictures!

[dapper mica]

Nvm realised it was a duff theory anyway as I realised Oda doesn’t often do family resemblance

[sleek seal]

hello

[errant oxide]

Goodbye

[sleek seal]

did kuma become a slave just because he helped the straw hats?

wasn't he a cyborg at thriller bark?

[errant oxide]

Was likely punished after not defeating the straw hats

Vegapunk had turned him into a cyborg before. Then they used him to make the pacifista. After failing to defeat the straw hats, Kizaru and the one dude in charge of the pacifista I forgot his name probably had him punished to become px-0 so he’s a mindless slave robot. Though he asked vegapunk to give him one last mission to protect the sunny

Not sure why Vegapunk accepted though

[weary cliff]

Vegapunk is quite enigmatic. While he is the technological driving force behind the WG, his interactions paint him as perhaps ambivalent towards the marines. At the very least, he's not 100% bound to their philosophy.

[opaque willow]

so the one piece is the tale lmao

[amber oar]

The tale plus other things, likely there's actual wealth there. But the tale is the central point and the rest is supplementary

[gloomy latch]

Found this theory https://twitter.com/KaizokuWave56/status/1379055507240013826?s=19

Captain & Navigator (@KaizokuWave56)

I think we will find out more about Nami’s true origins the closer we get to Laugh Tale.

Nami was born the same year Toki made her prophecy about the moon 🌙 being unaware of the dawn.

Coincidence? I don’t think so.

She’s as integral to Luffy‘s destiny as Toki was to Oden’s. https://t.co/CD9H6Br1TE

Twitter · Apr 5, 2021, 12:57 PM

[random yacht]

coincidence? I think so

[smoky shore]

I haven't seen anyone discussing this, but I don't check in here that often so lmk if this has been discussed already..

Chapter 1,009 spoilers:
||I should start by saying I believe in the theory that Nami will get Zeus back somehow. In 1009, Zeus was separated from Big Mom, again, and I just have a hard time believing that they're gonna be able to take away a yonko's "weapon" another time after this. Based on these things, I believe Nami will be retrieving Zeus from the box he's trapped in currently. I see two options for how this could happen. Either she'll retrieve him after the fighting is done OR she'll retrieve him on the roof during the battle. I find the latter to be far more interesting/probable, but I don't believe Nami would show up to fight alongside all those powerhouses alone. If she goes to the roof, so will the rest of the crew. All this to say, Nami's getting Zeus back and we'll get a full page spread of the entire crew facing off against Kaido and I'm here for it.||

Some assumptions based on assumptions in there, but I don't think the theory is too out there to be realistically possible. Thoughts?

Feel free to ping me, I have notifications off so I'll probably forget I posted this here and never come back lol

[dusky acorn]

Yeah, earlier on Nami commented on needing a stronger lightning after shocking Ulti down, and presumably Tama's group is steadily going to be climbing higher to round up the Gifters on the upper floors that have been converted, like Poker.

[pure raven]

Don't have anything to add to the theory itself, but you don't need to use tags here btw

[halcyon terrace]

Theory: Break next week. Please let me be wrong for the love of Go D. A

[dusky acorn]

Well, I can't remember the last time there's been 4 chapters in a row so it's most certainly a break after this.

[halcyon terrace]

shit..

[halcyon terrace]

I'd rather see the rest of the strawhats trying to stop big mom while the supernovas + Yamato try to beat Kaido.

[dusky acorn]

Obviously not going to happen. Don't just meme in here dude.

[acoustic helm]

Zeus has Bm soul don't get hopes high...

[karmic oyster]

pretty sure shanks might appear in wano soon, i feel like wano is the finale of the four emperors saga and it wouldnt make much sense for shanks to barely have any screentime

[dusky acorn]

Yeah, Wano does mark the end of the saga, I'm pretty sure that was confirmed recently

[karmic oyster]

i wouldnt think so

i think he might have an important appearance in wano and then dip for the war thats been foreshadowed and spoken about after the current saga

but then what would the next saga be? shanks saga?

something like that is really important i would think there needs to be some plot built around it

[wild veldt]

The next saga is the end. We in the yonko saga now, so shanks can just be the next arc

[karmic oyster]

yeah but wano will be the last arc of the yonko saga, cant have the yonko saga with only 3 yonkos making their appearances. also it would make sense for blackbeard to appear at the end and since shanks is curious about bb it would make sense for him to appear as well

[karmic oyster]

(not including reverie btw shanks got 1 panel to himself)

50 bucks?

[dusky acorn]

Yeah, even if he isn't in Wano right now, it's pretty strange for him to not have even one scene to himself like Blackbeard did during an interlude in this arc. He should just show up in a future one though, for post credits, instead of extending that to such an extreme of him coming to Wano itself

What motive would Shanks even have for coming to Wano anyway?

Isn't he more interested in Bb

[karmic oyster]

i agree with you that would also increase the build up and hype which oda does a lot

[dusky acorn]

Well yes, Roger is very clearly a dead man, keep it to serious talk in here

[karmic oyster]

yeah and people are theorizing that bb will come to wano, the catarina = oden theory was denied but it may be a possibility

[dusky acorn]

Slab, that was a metaphor, he wasn't going to die in spirit, his will carried on to start the great pirate age but he literally died for everyone to see in Logue Town.

[karmic oyster]

yeah we see multiple flashbacks because he's dead

they confirmed it many times over in loguetown

well no one had the ope before law iirc

[dusky acorn]

There was actually a famous doctor who had it before Law that etched their mark in history, but that's besides the point. If you're somehow convinced Roger is alive then nothing is changing your mind. Agree to disagree

[karmic oyster]

ah you're right my bad

this is a theory channel, discussion channel is #manga

luffy doesnt want to take down the world government

even when ace died he didnt all of a sudden become a vengeance character, its not like he hates all of the world government too, he just wants to become the pirate king

you're forgetting that roger himself left the treasure open to grabs

not to take down the world government. also although they fought, roger had good relations with garp

taking down the world government doesnt mean taking down the five elders or Im-sama. i dont think they'll declare war or something on the marines for no reason

doesnt mean they have to fight for it

[misty timber]

Are there theories for Zoro s past reveal ? Will it play a minor or big role in Wano ? And when ?

[pure raven]

Everyone hoping for another Zoro flashback will be disappointed I think

[dusky acorn]

Dunno, it doesn't seem to have any place in this arc, it's not like anyone on Wano itself would know about Zoro's past before he came to Shimotsuki's dojo

So, not really anything to trigger it

[pure raven]

I can only imagine a "sunacchi" flashback

[misty timber]

Yeah.. Enma could have been a way but even with that i dont see it coming too , i was wondering what was the point if it s only going to be explain at the end of the arc

[rapid nexus]

I have a theory on what happened at the Reviere.
Sabo and Vivi met up at some point, and ended up "kidnapping" Kuma. As they were running away, Charlos (that piece of sht Luffy punched), ordered the admirals to go after them, and kill vivis father. Green Bull was responsible for sabo and Vivi getting away, and the WG is just trying to hide that fact.

[reef moth]

I just had an idea bruh. Instead of Kaido's Ragnerok knocking Luffy out, Luffy might just straight up cancel out the force of Kaido's attack with Emission Haki, like the admirals did to Whitebeard. It would be a good way to show how much Luffy's grown since that point and also remind the reader that Haki gets stronger the more you fight a powerful opponent. Then again Luffy might be fucked up and I'm just dead wrong.

[pure island]

do you think that big mother is actually dead!

[sonic plaza]

no

[uneven zephyr]

she'll be gone for a little but no way she dies like that

[sonic plaza]

luffy, law, and kid did what they wanted to do

[pure island]

true, it seemed like an underwhelming way for her to go

[kind gate]

thats not a theory
#manga
#also-manga
very good for normal discussion

[errant oxide]

I doubt she would die from a fall to the ground, even if it’s that high up

[uneven zephyr]

shes falling into the ocean

[sonic plaza]

i think bb is gonna show up and kill her or smth

[errant oxide]

How do you know there’s ocean below

[sonic plaza]

she is not dead btw, no way

[dusky acorn]

Folarin, people asking speculative questions is fine for this channel, it still prompts others to respond with their theories on the topic

[kind gate]

ah I see
my bad guys

[dusky acorn]

Sounds like a cool idea, but even with haki it's tough to see how Luffy could tank it, the attack seems even stronger than Bagua being two-handed and all

[kind gate]

do you mean in the last attack?

[reef moth]

Because Onigashima is floating lol. Pretty sure she'd be able to see the fact that there's water below her unless she's blind

[pure island]

true, she's either landing in the ocean or on the rocks where onigashima was i guess, but zeus is trapped in law's box currently

[uneven zephyr]

only reason i think its possible is because i feel like Oda knows that even the readers are doubting luffy

[sonic plaza]

do you guys think nami will keep zeus after wano

[reef moth]

She's not gonna die though lol it isn't Oda's style. This seems like a perfect way to reintroduce her kids because they fell off the watefall earlier

[pure island]

i guess not

[uneven zephyr]

going into wano I actually had no idea how luffy was gonna even touch kaido

[kind gate]

I think cobra was killed
but not because of charles
I think maybe because of Im but

[uneven zephyr]

but Luffy keeps being luffy

[dusky acorn]

I suppose we never did see Luffy's actual torso when being hit with the Ragnarok, at the very least it's likely he braced himself with regular haki coating like he did prior to the swing before

[fathom matrix]

Yaknow what I kinda smile at? I think Kaido's kinda starting to like Luffy. Not in the sense of "Let's be best brawling buddies" but like "I beat the crap out of you, you lost, you pulled all this off, got stronger, learned a new form of haki, you're managing to almost rival me and tank my attacks....I respect you kid"

[pure island]

i think thats pretty likely

i dont think we'll find out next chapter if shes dead however, itll probably cut away to another scene

[sonic plaza]

like katakuri

[fathom matrix]

Kinda yeah

[uneven zephyr]

oh yeah 100% Kaido's demeanor from when Luffy first landed in wano to now is so different

[lyric dust]

he seems to have a bit more of respect

[dusky acorn]

Yeah, Kaido seems to have evolved from first being annoyed at Luffy giving all that big talk to actually enjoying the battle and how Luffy's proving himself with his determination, like in the cliffhanger of 1008

[sonic plaza]

at first, he just hated him for beating doffy

[pure island]

true, i do like the tension between luffy and kaido

[fathom matrix]

But I think Katakuri had more sympathetic respect, cause Luffy didn't once laugh at him, but he realised he's been patronising luffy, so he should show him the same respect in return

[sonic plaza]

anyway, when do you guys think act 3 will end

[fathom matrix]

soon yeah

[dusky acorn]

Hopefully when the war itself is over, I wouldn't enjoy getting an abrupt cut away from the tension of the current climax

[fathom matrix]

Also.....Orochi's still not dead. Let's be honest, it might be like the Hydra, where you need to destroy the body.

[pure island]

like this panel, but yeah.

[visual merlin]

best friends

[kind gate]

not all his heads were cut from what we can see

[sonic plaza]

now that the supernovas achieved their goal (separating the yonkos), you can tell the battle is gonna start ramping up

[fathom matrix]

I think he might grow them back at some point

[uneven zephyr]

honestly i can see act 3 coming to an end in the next few chapters

[kind gate]

Next chapter predictions?

[dusky acorn]

They have more wiggle room to really bombard on Kaido without Big Mom there now, if only Luffy and Zoro weren't so damaged

[uneven zephyr]

i dont think zoro can even move at this point

[sonic plaza]

i feel like luffy and zoro will beat kaido at the end of wano and these will be the bounties
luffy - 3.2b
zoro - 1.6b

[kind gate]

I think he could grow them back in theory but not in a day or so
the only reason I think he might be able to grow them back is because fuku said that he's already met his demise today

And I don't think he would specify that much unless it meant something

[fathom matrix]

I think Prometheus, Zues and Napoleon will escape, jump off Onigeshima, go after big mom and shout "YOU'LL REGRET THIS ZOANOA, TRAFALGA, KIDD AND KILLER!"

[sonic plaza]

we will see

[dusky acorn]

I can see Napoleon and Zeus playing a role as allies for Kid and Nami respectively, don't know how anyone would be able to make use of Prometheus though, seems like an extra nuisance

[fathom matrix]

I don't see Napoleon but I can see Zues going back to nami

[dusky acorn]

Well, I just see Kid adding it to his scrap pile or something

[fathom matrix]

Oh for def

[kind gate]

franky adds prometheus to raid suit or sunny

[errant oxide]

Sanji should use Prometheus as a flame for the kitchen stove🔥

[dusky acorn]

Would be cool if all 3 could act as permanent powerups or just like, trophies for certain characters to have after the war is done, instead of only Zeus being made to use by Nami

[kind gate]

Would be cool to see a Prometheus Usopp dynamic

[grizzled fog]

Kid utilizing Napoleon as a weapon here on out would be sick

[nimble hinge]

Based on how the attack is framed and the Zoro panel just before it, Luffy either blocked Ragnarok with Advanced CoA, or he got very seriously injured (to the point of having to take a back seat for a little while)

[grizzled fog]

Probably be a rockier relationship than nami and Zeus

[nimble hinge]

It's going to be one of the two extremes.

[sand sail]

Luffy couldn't have actually blocked that, even with his advanced armament unfortunately, so he just got whacked pretty hard

[nimble hinge]

With the shield variation? That's quite similar to Barto's barrier, no?
He just needs to have the Haki for it

[craggy bloom]

you think he saw it coming with future sight?

[grizzled fog]

He did, we saw the visual indicators

[sand sail]

He didn't have to see it coming with future sight, he watched Kaido jump up to do the move

So probably not

Like, he doesn't notice it until he sees Kaido jumping, so maybe he saw it at the last second? I dunno

[grizzled fog]

I do think luffy blocked it with ryuo, and that’s gonna keep him from getting absolutely crippled

[sand sail]

Nah, thing is, haki is haki

[sonic plaza]

here are the bounty predictions i have for after wano btw (tell me what you guys think)
luffy - 3.2b (beating kaido w/ someone else)
zoro - 1.6b (fighting kaido)
sanji - 1.4b (taking out king or queen)
jinbe - 800m (taking out lots of ppl)
nami - 200m (if she gets zeus + taking out page 1 and ulti w/ usopp)
usopp - 600m (doing most of the work for getting page 1 and ulti
chopper - 1k (oda trolls) or 300m (monster point)
brook - 250m (getting Black Maria)
Robin - 300m or 1b (depending on whether the Navy learns that she has 3 road poneglyphs read)
Franky - 400m (needs an increase)
blackbeard - no change or 4b (if he does something crazy)
law + kid - around 2b (fighting big mom or smth

[uneven zephyr]

im think Bartos fruit is stronger than any type of haki right?

[sand sail]

And strong enough force can break through it without much issue. Luffy's haki couldn't even block Kaido casually swinging on him, he gets hurt trying. So there's no way he's blocking something that's spilling out haki that Kaido is leaping into the air to use

[uneven zephyr]

its suppose to be basically invincible

[sand sail]

He can use the second form all he wants, but ironically, he's the one who first shows us that it doesn't mean shit if you're not strong enough lol

[nimble hinge]

So I'm confused then. If it's the exact same as regular CoA, what's the point of using it in single combat? Like we saw the Boa sisters, and Sentomaru use?

[sand sail]

No, I meant in that you can still pierce it with enough force

[visual merlin]

Seems to be a wall you form outside of your own body, but it's still limited to how strong your haki is

[sand sail]

It's still a projection, and it's more powerful than you'd normally use

Because the way to use it is by focusing all of your ambient haki to one area, not just a general coating

But, if your haki's just not strong enough in general, it's not going to help, like with the Boa sisters specifically

And Luffy in Udon, actually, if I'm not mistaken

[nimble hinge]

Yeah, but why use that wall then? If it's just as strong as regular hardening. Cause from what I'm gathering, you're saying that him using the shield variation doesn't mean anything, because he couldn't stop Kaido's attack with regular hardening. So what is the point of the shield variation in 1v1 scenarios if it doesn't allow you to defend to against attacks regular hardening wouldn't?

And if you believe that the shield variation does provide more defence, then I don't think it's fair to say it won't work, because regular hardening didn't.

[visual merlin]

Could be that it covers more than your normal arms, or that it's just helpful for it to not actually be touching you. It also could be stronger than normal, but in any case there's definitely a limit on it, we even see it pre timeskip with Luffy and marigold

[mild kite]

Sanji will be between 770-997 million at the end of Wano if Luffy is at 3 bil.

[reef moth]

I was hoping we'd see a conquerors clash between luffy and kaido lmao

We still might but idk

[visual merlin]

Yea, it could work if it's naturally stronger, but it's still unlikely since that'd be a huge jump from your arms bulging after a normal swing, to blocking ragnarok

unlikely that he would block well with that, that is

[nimble hinge]

I'm assuming it has to provide more defense than basic CoA, cause Marigold used it to block a regular punch. Normal CoA would have sufficed for that. But she went above and beyond. Especially for that first one she blocked.

[sand sail]

I'm not saying it's the same strength, I'm saying it's still just a limited resource

[reef moth]

I don't think zoro is killing kaido lmao. He might pull out a three thousand worlds before he passes out and that'll be his big thing before the island drops onto wano

[sand sail]

For perspective, this literal same situation already happened with another Emperor, and Luffy failed even harder

[nimble hinge]

Sure. But then that doesn't mean it won't stop Kaido's attack. We don't know if Luffy's Haki pool is big enough to stop that attack using shield CoA

[sand sail]

What I'm mostly saying is just even with the second stage being stronger than the first, Luffy himself just isn't strong enough for that gap to go from not being able to block Kaido one time to being able to block a much stronger blow seconds later

[nimble hinge]

I mean, that depends on just how much stronger the second stage is. And we really only have one reference to work off of. Which doesn't really help us

[sand sail]

If Luffy were actually able to just no sell that because he can use advanced armament, then the gap between them isn't large at all

[nimble hinge]

Either way, I don't think there's enough evidence to rule out him blocking it. The possibility exists, and I'm confident it will end up being one of the two extremes. A surprising block, or a very serious blow leaving him to spend time recovering.

[sand sail]

I genuinely don't think there's any chance that he blocked that attack successfully, it'd somehow be the first attack he'd have been able to block the entire fight so far from Kaido, why wouldn't he do it to the Thunder Bagua he gets beat with at first?

[nimble hinge]

Those were more blitz attacks. This was Kaido knocking Luffy down and then "charging" up an attack with a leap into the air and then a slam. Dodging TB might make more sense given how fast it hits. Especially since we know Luffy barely dodged it despite having advanced CoO.

If just dodging it is that difficult, I can understand why channeling your Haki into a shield in front of you is a bigger risk.

In this situation, he might have felt that Advanced CoA is the better option. He's been knocked into the ground and is on his back vs his feet. Makes sense to defend against this kind of hit. And it's really the only attack besides TB that Luffy has been attacked with that seems notable and worth defending in any way. The rest have been regular swings or ranged attacks.

It's this reaction that is fueling my belief that it's one of the extremes. Every panel is intentional and I think that's why that one is there.

[sand sail]

Oh, I'm not questioning that he tried to do it, I just have no doubt that all it did was save his life and not much more. It definitely didn't protect from the actual hit, it would've just softened it enough to not put Luffy out of the fight for good

[nimble hinge]

Mhm, that's fair. I think that just comes down to how effective and how much of an upgrade you think Advanced CoA provides defensively, and whether Luffy has the fuel for it.

[mortal wigeon]

Hey guys just a little one, someone on Reddit asked what are poneglyps made of and this is just a little idea I had because someone asked if they're unbreakable, how did the koizuki carve them?

What do you think about the material isn't necassarily important - it could be some granite or whatever, not so important just a stone - but then worked, carved, and then imbued in some way using ninjitsu or haki in the same way a black blade can be imbued with haki

I haven't thought super deep on this specific idea but I have wondered about how they were made and what of for a while

[nimble hinge]

I do think we'll cover the wills of objects, and imbuing wills into objects at some point. Black Blades and Vegapunk being key moments of exposition

Especially the latter, as that is going to cover a lot of what branches off the big theory of One Piece.

[hallow sequoia]

choppa prolly get to 200 berri and franky is 100m

[uneven zephyr]

i feel like somewhere along the line i heard they were made of sea prism stone

[hallow sequoia]

luffy bounty will triple.

[uneven zephyr]

but at this point thats impossible

[nimble hinge]

Luffy's bounty will be 4.5 billion after Wano? LMAO

[mild kite]

4.5 bil?? Damn, then what do you think Luffy's EOS bounty will be?

[uneven zephyr]

i disagree

i dont think bounties will ever go away because pirates will never go away

[mild kite]

There are still going to be pirates, so there has to be some type bounty system

[mortal wigeon]

For sure I was just wondering if people thought the stones were always "indestructible" like seastone but wano can carve them, or do you guys think like I said it's possible they were normal objects but imbued to protect them?

[mortal wigeon]

Aren't they COMPARED to sea prism stone in that they're indestructible? Robin can touch them for example and it doesn't seem to bother her, haven't we even seen her with an extra hand while touching a poneglyph?

[uneven zephyr]

yeah probably, your theory is honestly the closest thing i can think of

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah it's total speculation I jw iif anyone had any insights in their own head. Ty anyway for the reply :)

[nimble hinge]

The material they're made from is relatively unknown. It's a unique material, and I believe native to Wano, but not entirely sure.

[hallow sequoia]

Ok If luffy takes down kaido 1v1 surely but if not then surely at least double

[mortal wigeon]

Ya I'm jw if you had to guess, would you guess it's naturally as hard as it's always been, or is it hardened you think? Or you don't really have an opinion?

[nimble hinge]

You realize 4.5 billion is the second highest active bounty we know about right? Number 2 in the whole world.

[mortal wigeon]

What's Luffy now roughly 2.8?

Or is he 3.4?

[uneven zephyr]

1.5

[visual merlin]

Would be the highest if Kaido dies

[nimble hinge]

I would wager they have will imbued into them.

[visual merlin]

His current bounty? 1.5 billion

[mortal wigeon]

Woah rly? Who was 2.8 in a somewhat recent bounty drop? Or is my mind just messed?

[hallow sequoia]

blackbeard

[visual merlin]

yea there's no 2.8

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah it seems pretty likely doesn't it. Thanks for your input!

[visual merlin]

Closest is Blackbeard with 2.2 bil

[nimble hinge]

Which is also how Roger is able to hear and get the gist of what the glyphs say. Because he's hearing the will that's been imbued.

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah I think I was confusing a few numbers in me head. Well if it's 1.5 I think 2.5-3 is the realistic, top end his bounty could swell to

[mortal wigeon]

Yes I did think of this a little bit!! Especially how the voices got much louder when Roger touched the stone right?

I mentioned ninpo/ninjitsu earlier - with the Tanuki Teapot Tama has, another theory I had earlier is, do you think most of not all ninpo items are probably items that ate fruits? Like Raizos scroll is a scroll that somehow ate an absorption type fruit?

It seems that maybe the people of Wano or some knew how to do it w/o Vega - it seems odd the Tanuki Teapot would just be sitting in a little random teahouse if he made it

Also the dude with the red mask said he made the Tanuki right?

[nimble hinge]

I don't think we'll ever get a strong explanation for ninjutsu, or things like Kinemon being able to cut and produce fire. Personally I'd attribute it to being related to manipulating and manifesting the will of objects. But I don't think we'll ever get a confirmation or reason to disprove that idea.

[uneven zephyr]

itd be kinda weird for raizo to have so many devil fruits though

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah I'm not saying it'll get covered necassarily other than the fact that there are items like the teapot in wano in general

[uneven zephyr]

they are hard to come by and wano is an isolated place

[mortal wigeon]

Well my idea would be these items accumulated over centuries as in theory a scroll wouldn't die unless it burnt or rotted or whatever

[uneven zephyr]

ahhhh

[mortal wigeon]

So Raizou could have item fruits from ninjas centuries ago yknow?

[uneven zephyr]

i could see that but it seems like a very big stretch

when he was introduced wasnt he making shadow clones with just his fingers

[mortal wigeon]

When I say this, I'm not saying it to moan, because if it was never addressed I wouldn't mind at all

But ninjitsu just being a thing seems a bit ass pull for Oda - because he likes his world to be so tight, and for this to be dropped in basically 900/950 chaps in, and he didn't try to call it some kinda haki like Ryouu

[uneven zephyr]

yeah i get that 100%

but if he really doesnt explain any of it, fine by me, hes already explained everything else in this world

[nimble hinge]

Well in Raizo's case. A lot of that stuff can be brushed away as being part of his fruit intrinsically. Not from any extra sort of Wano ability.

His Devil Fruit is just one of those fruits that can do funky shit

[uneven zephyr]

i forgot he had a DF

[mortal wigeon]

Knowing Oda what will happen is he will answer all of our obscure questions after we've accepted they'll never be answered in the prologue, then we'll love it. Lol

[uneven zephyr]

who else have we seen use Ninjutsu

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah I think you're right there but he also deffo has a few magic items

[nimble hinge]

Raizo, Shinobu, and one of Orochi's retainers.

[mortal wigeon]

Doesn't Shinobu claim to know some ninjits

[nimble hinge]

None have done anything that is crazy though. Pretty easy to explain outside of the one shadow clone thing Raizo does. But that felt like a gag.

[mortal wigeon]

When did she show it? When she was spying in the roof?

[nimble hinge]

A couple times. Her kite, the attack against Hanzo (?). Pretty sure she calls all of those ninjutsu

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah I was thinking the kite wasn't sure - I think that kind of ties into what I said tho - as wano is kind of superstitions and isolated from the world, for someone to think their lucky item like her kite is a special item like Raizos scroll is some kind of magic because they don't totally understand their origins either if you see what I mean

Like - if I say I have a lucky sock, it doesn't mean a magic wand can't exist

[nimble hinge]

Well the scroll is just his devil fruit. Maki Maki no Mi is the Scroll Scroll Fruit. And they call it magic and don't understand, because they don't know about DFs.

[amber oar]

it's not confirmed to be a df (though probably is)

[nimble hinge]

Unconfirmed, yeah, but the translation didn't really much room to assume it isn't.

Don't think he repeats the name of any of his other jutsus the way he does for Maki

[polar bison]

???? there’s random ass powers introduced in OP all the time

raizo doesn’t even have a confirmed devil fruit, his ninjutsu is absolutely a real power system clearly shared by the rest of the oniwabanshu

[mortal wigeon]

Yes but they usually get tied in or explained. Like I said it was not a complaint it was just oda USUALLY tries to create a consistent world where it all ties in, and there's an underlying system of physics and science. But it's also just a comic and a great one

[polar bison]

define usually

I think there’s like enough things and powers and instances that aren’t explained to where this shouldn’t be a surprising thing or considered a rule of his writing

[sacred hawk]

Okay, so we know that Drake destroyed Amigasa Village. But as an undercover marine, I don't see him attacking innocents for no reason

However, if Tama really does turn out to be a Kurozumi, then maybe the villagers tried to attack Tama, but Drake intervened.

[pure raven]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[mortal wigeon]

I mean it wasn't a super deep comment but the first thing that comes to mind is stuff like Mantra, Haki and Ryouu, or how the ability to decode the poneglyphs is thru the voice of all things the same power that allows communication with the sea kings.

I think another part of it is because it's wano and wano is soooo important to the void century and the ancient history, so to me, it kind of makes sense this isolationist country would have things they consider magic the wider world has looked into.

Like I said I didn't think super deeply into the comment but to me personally it just feels like every time I go back and re-read OP, I find little links between things that didn't have to be linked at all but are just part of Odas world building which I think he enjoys a lot

I just said ass pull because I couldn't think of a better phrase I just meant out of nowhere, like I said in the same comment, it was not meant to be a complaint or a criticism at all about oda or Wano or anything, just it didn't feel to me like something oda would leave disconnected and then a Reddit post sparked this little theory in my head about how maybe some of the ninpo is items that ate fruits, as the red mask guy Tama with said it used to be his fave teapot so I don't think it has anything to do with Vegapunk, or the WG leaving it just strolling around a tea shop.

So idk I just tied it all together into my head into a little theory but I didn't pour immense thought into the details just wondered what others opinions were

[polar bison]

madame sharley is the biggest, most obvious example, but far from the only one

also ninjutsu isn’t inherently magic. sure, the scroll is fucked up and maybe probably a devil fruit, but Raizou’s other tricks are just supposed to be as vaguely mythical as the irl ninja legend. it’s not even any different from him somehow being able to sneak around all manner of places with no difficulty despite being a 10 foot tall man with a massive face

[crystal onyx]

what is the egg on rogers ship

[pure raven]

Uranus

[crystal onyx]

uncalled for but ok

[mortal wigeon]

Yeah I did actually say to someone else in here that if there is some actual "ninpo" (be they fruit objects like I said, or actual magic), wano being so closed off, it's not impossible that there being real ninpo making them superstitious about other every day or lucky objects

[pure raven]

Haha, just a "theory" about the "ancient animals"

[median flicker]

surprise egg

[mortal wigeon]

If you would have asked Sunday, I would say Jesus. It's after Easter so I'll be serious, it's Jesus Burgees

[dusky acorn]

Remember to treat this room proper by keeping all discussion genuine. If someone asks a speculative question, give them a real answer or don't respond.

[dusky acorn]

And I don't have a theory of my own, but there's conjecture on it being some sort of dragonic egg due to the sheer size. Perhaps some sort of spoil Roger obtained from God Valley

[ionic peak]

i just notice that there is not a single fishman on the marines

[mortal wigeon]

Well the marines historically didn't think much of them as a race, same as the CDs. I guess it's kind of a "gays in the military" kind of situation.

[muted ember]

whos they

also doesn't "the promised time" kind of hint at the fact that Joyboy might come to the world of One Piece?

[mortal wigeon]

I think "they" is the SH, but they're talking about "the promised ones" - the "different era" thing is about how I think either Joyboy tried and failed to do what Luffy is now doing, or maybe this has happened even longer agi

[dusky acorn]

Definitely wouldn't say Joyboy is literally coming to the present, it's more like Joyboy's will is being carried on through someone, which is probably unknowingly by the person currently. Many speculate this to be Luffy.
As for who they are that could help fix the Noah, well the immediate guess is shipwrights of some kind. Straw Hats in general as the group they're referencing is also possible yes, considering they have Franky of course.

[zinc iris]

Even with the assumption that Luffy is the worthy successor of Joyboy, it's very suspicious that everyone was able decades ago to pinpoint this specific year as the one in which it will happen

[muted ember]

yeah but "Noah promised Shirahoshi and the Fishmen to bring them up to the land with Noah"

[muted ember]

I don't think its that simple though, because they highlight the word "their"

meaning its something important . Also how would Sea Kings even go abouts to talk to shipwrights.

[hollow badger]

Wow I was gonna come in here Bc I randomly had a theory that luffy might be joyboy when “he” appears again but apparently y’all already talking about it 😂

[tame tendon]

Is there any theory about Gin will be coming back to the main story? My friend just sent me a pic about Greg (@onicmusha) said that Gin will be back.

[muted ember]

I believe, that Joyboy is this christ like identity, who will descend the planet of One Piece at a "Promised time"

maybe to end the final war, just like Shanks did?

[dusky acorn]

Yeah it's definitely interesting. Fairly certain there's a specific poneglyph(s) that somehow give the info about the year, which is how Oden knew about it or some other ancient text on Laugh Tale, but the root of the knowledge seems to extend from a different point than just there too, since the sea kings knew about it

Also Pikku, sea kings knowing about shipwrights isn't much of a stretch, considering they're capable of such intelligence to begin with lol. They're talking about fixing the ship, what other object or thing besides a shipwright would be able to do that? "Their" is what I take as people, not an object

[flint berry]

Aight, i felt dragon has the thunderbird fruit.
That "bird" is a legendary creature in the history and culture of certain indigenous peoples of North America.
On that mithology, this creature controlls the weather(we saw many references about wind-rain with dragon).
Also, the "scar" on his face can be very related to that mithology. What u guys think?

Its also considered supernatural in therms of strength and power

Anyone else thinking this is real?

[muted mortar]

It will be cool if its real👍

[regal ibex]

Do we have database of op theories

[queen ice]

How did roger ship travel from roadstar back to skypeia? When we can only travel one way?

Maybe weather egg?? Like the egg on their ship?

Because if you say they travel to calm belt. It's not possible because it's super calm... Unless there is a way they can send their ship woopin' in the sky by some kind of weather manipulation.

[dusky acorn]

We do personally have a collection of theories up in the pins of this channel, yes.

[queen ice]

So therefore, for me the egg onboard rogers ship is a weather egg.. Also evident in Edd War.

[weary cliff]

Roger probably went up reverse mountain and back down to do the grand line all over again

[hollow grotto]

Check the pins :)

[vivid cargo]

My theory of the One piece and the ending (not completely original, I've pieced this with a few theories ive seen +original parts aswell)
I think laugh tale is actually a city made by joyboy for the fishmen to move into as I believe luffy will destroy the red line in which he'll also have to destroy fishman island which also fulfills madame Shirley's prophecy and then he'll use the Noah to transport the fishmen to laugh tale,
I also believe shanks will be the last antagonist, not as a villain to beat luffy but as someone who maintains peace in the world along side the gorosei etc so as luffy does destroy the red line shanks will intervene to stop him to maintain the peace and as luffy beats him and destroys the red line he'll have also had created the all blue which accomplishes sanjis dream aswell

[kind gate]

Hmmm most of this is popular but I haven’t heard of the one piece fish man habitat before
Interesting

[muted ember]

yea I hate the idea of "destroying the red line"

Luffy, cares about the people

destroying the red line, will create a deadly tsunami, which will kill people, Luffy aint about that style.

[onyx fjord]

It’s kind of hard to justify the All Blue’s existence in any other way based on its descriptions

[muted ember]

I know, but Zeff's said he's fished in all of the seas

[kind gate]

I love looking at spoilers but that chat is backed up right now

[nimble hinge]

That depends on how it's destroyed. Very possible to destroy it and not leave a wave behind

[fringe tide]

Doesnt an “all blue” technically exists near the reverse mountain where the four seas meet

[nimble hinge]

No. It would need a 6th path. It only has the 4 blues, and the grand line from one side of the red line.

[lament cave]

didnt sanji say something abt fishman island being kinda like the all blue since it had such a large variety of fish from different seas

[queen arrow]

no that was a joke

he called Fishman Island "his all blue" because of the Mermaids, Fishman Island also doesn't have all the types of sea-life from all the seas

[amber oar]

that was Sanji just being horny lol

[pure raven]

Simpji

[sonic plaza]

tbh, i dont think one piece is going to end in 2025 unless Oda reduces the number of breaks

• Wano prob has like 40-60 more chapters
• then we have Elbaf which might be like 50
• raftel/final war should be like at least 80
• and not to mention that there are prob more arcs like Lodestar or smth
  and if Oda keeps taking break every 3 weeks, then we will only get 35 chapters per year, so one piece will prob finish in like 2027

[echo crane]

Regardless of when one piece ends, I just hope it never gets rushed. I don’t want anything to be forced due to a time constraint on Oda

[digital timber]

we already know how shanks is gonna die

yall know how ppl compare shanks to tyr

Tyr is known for having one arm, Tyr's role is upholding law and justice (would explain shanks actions), and Tyr has red hair

and he dies by the guardian of hel's gate, garmr on Ragnorak,. whos the guardian of hel's gate in greek mythology? Cereberus. If the theories r right on how Bb has 3 souls, then we gonna see a ragnarok on Elbaf 😈

[pure raven]

quick question... you guys think Kureha did a stint in the New World?
She looks like she's seen some stuff

[exotic echo]

Wouldn't doubt it

[grizzled fog]

She knows about the will of D, knows Roger’s real name. Wouldn’t be surprised at all

[exotic echo]

Also, I never heard of that Capn, that's an interesting idea

[grizzled fog]

Rocks pirate Doctor?

[pure raven]

I totally thought about that, but I figured her stint was MUCH earlier

[onyx fjord]

when is this mentioned?

[pure raven]

ok i found a pic and it’s not specifically in 1000’s

[grizzled fog]

I’ll get it one sec

[ancient vault]

she also looks very similar to captain John

[pure raven]

she’s like 106

[grizzled fog]

~140 actually

[pure raven]

o

[mild kite]

she was 139 in pre-timeskip

So she should be 141

[pure raven]

141

she would have been 103 during God Valley

[ancient vault]

@pure raven https://twitter.com/KrinkyGrape/status/1349813359919640580

Kinky Grape 🍇 (@KrinkyGrape)

Who I think Mihawk's Parents are:

Twitter · Jan 14, 2021, 8:19 PM

Read this thread if youre interested in the theory

[mild kite]

Great read. I dont want this to be the case but I cannot deny the possibility.

[nimble hinge]

Not just that. That theory also reference Shanks role in ending the War. And Tyr is known as a God of War, and to uphold treaties and such.

[ancient vault]

Tyr also got his arm eaten by a monster

[nimble hinge]

Opposite arm though if I'm remember right

[onyx fjord]

wow i completely forgot about this seemingly crucial detail

[ancient vault]

Nah also his left one

[nimble hinge]

@ancient vault

Both Shank and Tyr willingly sacrificed their arms though

[ancient vault]

🤔 Then I wrote it wrong in my old theory

[echo glen]

is elbaf confirmed to be the next arc?

[onyx fjord]

no

[nimble hinge]

Fenrir only agrees to the play that capture game if Tyr places his right arm in Fenrir's mouth. Tyr does, and when Fenrir can't escape for the first time, he bites of Tyr's arm. Don't think I'm missing anything else./

[ancient vault]

@nimble hinge Linke means left

[onyx fjord]

It is just a strong likelihood that Elbaf would be the next arc (after maybe a post wano type deal)

[nimble hinge]

And Elbaf won't be the next arc.

[onyx fjord]

Why do you suspect that

[nimble hinge]

I looked at several other sources as well swrml. All either said right arm, or just arm. But all in English

[ancient vault]

I see. Well in my theory i looked up the german article. But it doesnt really matter because the parallel is still very clear

[nimble hinge]

Because that's usually how Oda does his narratives. Big arcs, with little ones sprinkled in.

[onyx fjord]

yeah thats why i mentioned after a post wano type deal
It seems fairly certain elbaf would be the next big arc (at this point)

[nimble hinge]

Mhm. It's a very old theory. People have loved linking Shanks to Norse myth ever since we saw his viking ship.

[echo glen]

when chopper joined which was in like drum island

[nimble hinge]

I remember when he showed up and said he's stopping the war in Marineford, people immediately jumped to pointing out how God of War like it is.

[echo glen]

who? shanks?

[onyx fjord]

Yes

[nimble hinge]

Mhm. And for next arc I think we might actually get two little ones. One being vegapunk focused. Getting that one for sure. But maybe one smaller extra one with Weevil.

[onyx fjord]

do you believe the effects of wano would be covered in a separate arc with its own narrative rather than a post-enies lobby type thing, such as one of the two you mentioned in your above message

[nimble hinge]

No. We'll see those events sprinkled in with the next one. That's why a WG focused arc like Vegapunk makes sense.

[pure raven]

what do you think is Perospero's hair color?
I wanna say pink like his mother, because that polka dot crown looks unnatural

[nimble hinge]

Plus we simply need a Vegapunk arc for the exposition dump. SSG, new pacifistas, relationship with the new admirals, DF's, awakenings, lineage factor, and finally giants. And that will lead into Elbaf.

[onyx fjord]

what is ssg?

[pure raven]

Secret Science Group. It's designed to compensate for the dissolving of the Warlords

[pulsar geyser]

Hi, I found this in my gallery. Not my own theory but it looks good.

[onyx fjord]

Interesting read. I feel like this is just sorta fanfictiony though. there is no evidence involved, just sorta spitballing random things based on what we know

[nimble hinge]

Look into the Inherited Wills, Bink's Sake and Luffy's Dream theories. You'll enjoy those if you like that one. It's the OG and even more detailed version

First one you can find on Arlong Park I think. Bink's Sake might be here and on Reddit. And Luffy's Dream theory is pretty recent and likely here and on Reddit as well

[ancient vault]

I got one about Luffys dream if youre interested I can link it here

[vestal isle]

yes please

[ancient vault]

https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/forum/threads/luffys-ultimate-dream-the-man-who-brings-joy-to-the-world-chapter-1000.9652/

I should update it a bit lol
And I couldve elaborated a bit more as to why I think Luffys dream is something that affects not only him but the people around him and maybe the entire world

[nimble hinge]

The original version elaborates even further than that, and says Luffy's dream is to deliver Bink's Sake like in the song.

[ancient vault]

Wdym "original"

[nimble hinge]

The one posted a year or so ago? Fair to say that's the original since it came before yours. There have been others as well, but not specifically about Bink's Sake and the joy to the world like that one, and yours are.

Fun fact : The last lyric in Bink's Sake also means funny story, or laugh tale.

[ancient vault]

It ends with "laugh tale", yeah

Also this doesnt sound like a personal dream. More like it affects the world

[lyric dust]

yo swrml you're back

that was a good theory as well might become a believer

[nimble hinge]

Yeah, delivering Bink's Sake and a party for the world go hand in hand. I think that's what they focused on

That he intends to throw one big party. And that's why the others laugh at how silly it is

[vestal isle]

yeah it's pretty solid

I think you're pretty much right for the most part in terms of reasoning and stuff like that

I think it'll be a massive party too

a party for the whole world, which is why it's so unbelievable to everyone who hears it

[peak cape]

It would also line up with pretty much every arc ending with parties.

[nimble hinge]

Mhm, it's been one of longest running joke theories. Really got serious after the oden flashback. And then variations of the theory flooded social media after chapter 1000

Everyone always used to joke that the end would be one big party in true one piece fashion. But I think once we learned that the name was actually laugh tale, the binks sake stuff really tied that final knot

[onyx fjord]

So I was wondering about the laugh tale name. Wasnt the previously thought name—Raftel—debated to be a mistranslation by some. Wasnt the Japanese part kept purposely vague so that it could be either or?

[nimble hinge]

Well originally people didn't dissect translations as much. And in terms of naming the island Raftel fit better than laughtale, after it gets romanized. The idea was originally that the last island was like a raft, constantly moving and that's why no log pose directed you to it and why it was impossible to find

It was a reasonable assumption, and no one questioned it, because the literal translation wasn't offered.

It wasn't until some shit on twitter 2 to 4 years ago that people started looking into it further. And then we got some stuff from an editor, and then the actual romanized version in the manga itself

[ancient vault]

Basically it was a translation mistake

it was revealed in stampede

[nimble hinge]

I think it was before then actually. Some editor mentioned.

Roughly the same time though

[ancient vault]

🤝

[ancient vault]

Yes, but I'll probably be gone soon again for a while

[vestal isle]

im kinda new to the theory side of op

[ancient vault]

You can check out some pinned theories if you wanna read some

[vestal isle]

if anyone has any recommendations for really good ones id be down

[ancient vault]

The pinned ones are well thought out and written out in an essay type of way

[vestal isle]

mint i'll check them out, thanks

[ancient vault]

Youre welcome

[hollow grotto]

except mine

it was a mess lol

[ancient vault]

it was a nice idea ^^ I enjoyed it and I think its possible

[hollow grotto]

I'm glad you think so! I'm just hoping more comes out to support it.

You've made a lot of good ones and I enjoy reading them

[ancient vault]

Yeah there are similarities but real hardcore evidence that speaks for it theres noone out yet imo
What do you think would be a massive hint for it?

[ancient vault]

Thanks a lot! Glad you enjoy them :)

[hollow grotto]

Actually, I was thinking about adding new evidence to my theory with the most recent color spread, but as you know they aren't typically canon. I just found it a little interesting and gives room for thought. I can elaborate if you give me a min to find some images lol

[ancient vault]

ohhh because of the statues?

Wait they look like fuku 😮

[hollow grotto]

yep - though they're associated with Buddhism and the likes, introducing an direct equivalent isn't what I think Oda had in mind

Especially coincidentally when they're introduced in the same arc as Fukurokuju and come from the likes of Asian history just like Wano

It looks like they're in Ringo based on the snowy landscape. The color spread itself may not be canon, but the contents in it do seem to be

[ancient vault]

Wait so the longhead tribe could be from ringo?

[hollow grotto]

The Longhead Tribe could have originated from Wano honestly - there's historical context here to prove its origin, and I don't think it was just some direct reference to real-world Buddhism

seems too much of a coincidence that Oda introduced Fuku in Wano, then had a color spread in what we can assume to be Wano with statues that look just like him

[lyric dust]

[ancient vault]

I see I see

I feel like Wano got so much more to offer. I want the clans to be picked up again and be addressed tbh

[hollow grotto]

yeah, there's a lot to explore, but we're in the middle of the final battle

then again isn't Wano the longest arc now?

[lyric dust]

its like one off dressrosa or something

[hollow grotto]

oh god

yeah I'd love to explore more of its history but it might get addressed when the Void Century is talked about, that'd be good

[ancient vault]

Thats true :(

[hollow grotto]

hope

[nimble hinge]

Wano was connected with the entire world in the past

[ancient vault]

"land of gold"

[hollow grotto]

It's really iffy talking about color spreads because they aren't canon

[ancient vault]

It used to be famous for its wealth I believe (not literal gold)

Moon of Rabbit is so random

[hollow grotto]

where's that from?

[nimble hinge]

It's the clans

What does Orochis translate to?

[ancient vault]

I dont know I only saved this pic

[sand sail]

Moon of Manure

[ancient vault]

Kurozumi literally means "black charcoal" in Japanese

[nimble hinge]

Fugetsu doesn't literally translate to Moon of Wind, does it? There's a gap filled by Ukizuki somehow, I think

Which fits the naming scheme for the rest. So Kurozumi might have something similar?

Guess how it's written in Japanese is what really matters. So much you can do with the Japanese characters.

Just look at all the layered meanings in Hakai

[amber oar]

Oda loves that thing of wordplays with multiple meanings

he manages to do that even with the bounties

[versed hamlet]

where did u get those translations from

[ancient vault]

no idea i saved them some day

[versed hamlet]

ok but im using the one piece wiki and the kanji they give for uzuki is 雨月 and that would be rain not rabbit

[ancient vault]

twitter maybe? Maybe from someone ehre

[versed hamlet]

wiki could be wrong tho

[vital nest]

ok im not sure and i could be late and this isnt in the manga i dont think even tho it could be manga spoilers cause anime onlys dont know kanjuro is a traitor yet but when i was watching epiisode 967 i found a picture that looks like one of kanjuros birds watching rogers ship while coming down from skypia

[hollow grotto]

I noticed that too, though didn't want to make the assumption because you know the ridicule one makes when they apply occam's razor to any seemingly-outlandish theory

[nimble hinge]

People really don't what Occam's Razor is and how it works LMAO

[hollow grotto]

ahh, was under the assumption that, in a situation pertaining to two or more ideas presented with all facts, the most simple explanation was often correct. sorry if I'm wrong about that <3 very tired

[nimble hinge]

It's essentially a "rule" that says complexity shouldn't be added in for no reason. In this case, there is no reason for those birds to be Kanjuro's. There has been no hint or idea to suggest he would follow Oden's adventures. Or that he and Orochi have any interest in the One Piece (which they don't)

So to add in the complexity but not give a reason, lets people abuse Occam's Razor. Which in a way is fair. Because a baseless theory should be questioned.

[hollow grotto]

Hmm.. so, what I've taken from it is just a more dumbed-down view? It seems a lot more simple than what you're suggesting, so thanks for clarifying that for me. Yeah, the whole 'bird is a painting of Kanjuro' idea is completely baseless and any theory would rely extensively on headcanon, which would it make it, well - a headcanon. The birds themselves from an earlier point of information though, were they ever actually confirmed to be sending information to Orochi by Kanjuro, or was that an assumption we made once it was revealed he was a traitor?

[nimble hinge]

The literal definition is : Occam's Razor is the problem-solving principle that "entities should not be multiplied without necessity"

A simple way of thinking about it is like you've said, the simplest answer is correct. But that does lose a little bit of the nuance of the actual definition

[hollow grotto]

Ahh right, awesome. That helps a lot, thank you

[vital nest]

well i only said that because it looks like the general style of art that kanjuros paintings have, and since hes a traitor and was a kurozomi the entire time it makes sense that he would be spying on oden wouldnt it?

[nimble hinge]

Except neither him or Orochi care. Their vengeance is solely based around Wano and their clans. Not about Oden is doing and his adventures. Or what he might discover.

[vital nest]

i guess

[nimble hinge]

Vegapunk and Impel Down arcs to follow Wano. And lead into Elbaf.

Impel down being a possibility and Vegapunk arc being the one I'm confident in.

[weak arrow]

Who do you think would participate in an impel down arc

[weak arrow]

Cause the strawhats being involved would be near impossible

[nimble hinge]

Buggy, Boa, BonClay, Members of the Fleet. I can see that being the event the fleet is known for.

[weak arrow]

Fleet isn’t really possible either

[pastel summit]

yeah but do you think we'll get a full arc that doesn't feature the SHs? Or are you suggesting the whole SH crew is breaking into Impel Down?

[weak arrow]

Unless they find a way to traverse the redline

[nimble hinge]

A full arc? No. A smaller one? Yeah. I can see that being used as a way to reintroduce characters, and establish unknown ones like the Revolutionaries. Should have listed them and Sabo amongst those above

[weak arrow]

Yeah the revolutionaries are really the only feasible ones that could

[mild kite]

Here's a theory: After the events of Wano, Mihawk is riding on his boat reading the newspaper headline about the straw hats alliance's victory against Kaido and Big Mom. Surprised about their victory against 2 emperors, he says to himself "Looks like we'll be meeting soon....Zoro". This is a direct parallel to Shank's reaction to the newspaper headline about Luffy's actions in Totto Land. The panel zooms out showing a full frontal view of Mihawk's boat, with all Navy battleships destroyed in the background. Thus, I reflexively N U T.

[weak arrow]

To get to impel down though, they’d have to traverse basically the entire world again or figure out a way to climb the red line.

This goes for the strawhats and the fleet

[nimble hinge]

They climbed up the red line from the Impel Down side, just recently, no?

[weak arrow]

Only people we’ve seen climb the red line are the germa snails and the people who used the elevator on the new world side at New Marineford.

And fisher tiger bare handed I guess

I would assume there’s an elevator on the other side too though.

[nimble hinge]

It was on the new world side. I forgot stelly got their via the calm belt

[weak arrow]

I do sorta agree though

Because I see doflamingo escaping and causing some mayhem in the end of the series

[mild kite]

No one cares about my theory

[kind gate]

lovely

[mild kite]

Thank you

[lone nova]

I think Toki is still alive but she will end up dying somehow in the Wano arc which will revert the devil fruit effects of everyone who have traveled into the future (Kinemon, Raizo, Momo, Kanjuro) by making them look their actual age (20 years older). I can’t see any other way how Momo could be helpful in this arc unless he was older and stronger (unless he uses the same power he used on Zou).

[obsidian phoenix]

given the foreshadowing of momos fruit being apparently an inferior version of kaidos own im fairly sure itll have the same properties
sooo i think momo will have his epic moment when he stops onigashima from falling, even for a minute
that way he can be helpful without having to get older for it and itd be a great coming of age achievement

also i sincerely hope we're done with resurrecting dead characters after the whole oden debacle

[ancient vault]

I read a theory that mihawk fought vs Kizaru

So im not sure if mihawk can just casually defeat them

[mild kite]

Hopefully not. I liked Kizaru as a character. I don't want him gone

[ancient vault]

[mild kite]

Little does the Navy know Mihawk has plot armor until his fight with one of the main characters

[pastel summit]

mihawk losing is going to be one of the most satisfying moments of the series, seeing all the people who put so much faith in him being an invincible god, then losing to greenbull's frog zoan.

[mild kite]

You take that back sir. Godhawk slander will not be tolerated

I already have to deal with not having "Mihawk pirates" as a crew option. I will not take further discrimination

[onyx fjord]

why would greenbull have a frog zoan

great response forsty

[hollow grotto]

yes

thank you I am very creative

[pastel summit]

certain kinds of frogs can apparently go a long time without eating. same with crocodiles.

frog zoan would just be cooler

[peak cape]

Greenbull is a bull zoan.

[onyx fjord]

green bull is not a bull zoan no way

[hollow grotto]

Bullfrog Zoan?

[dusky acorn]

Sounds cool since it fits Ryukugyu's monicker, but my main thing is it would probably be the most underhwleming devil fruit an admiral has ever had

[onyx fjord]

it would be uselessly weak too lmao

unless theres some japanese ancient myth oda references about a 8 story tall bull, i dont see it

[hollow grotto]

I really hope it's a Zoan so we have one of every type of DF among the Admirals

[pastel summit]

underwhelming fruit user in a high position only adds to the hype shimon

[onyx fjord]

only scenario where i would be okay with this is mythical zoan

[peak cape]

Nah you see it'll be revealed. Everyone laughs and then he one shots a mofo. Cut to shocked faces.

[dusky acorn]

I suppose so. The idea reminds me of that idea people had of a SMILE user potentially being a tobi roppo, sort of speaks greater for the individual if they make a high rank with a worse fruit in comparison

[peak cape]

Fine. Minotaur. My final offer.

[pastel summit]

I want to see more unique martial arts styles, so a regular zoan would facilitate that. as opposed to someone just using the OP mythical abilities.

[dusky acorn]

I do agree with the idea of Greenbull generally having a Zoan fruit though, for sure

[onyx fjord]

i mean if Buddha classifies as a zoan this isnt that big a stretch lmao

[hollow grotto]

Yokozuna is secretly Greenbull's cousin

[dusky acorn]

Also we can have fun with more outlandish theories but let's not go too far, still keep a layer of seriousness in here

[weak arrow]

Greenbull be using that torpor, not to be confused with hibernation

[peak cape]

He's actually just that dude Kyros fought on Dressrosa in a mask.

[hollow grotto]

In all seriousness, my hc is that he has some sort of Ent Mythical Zoan

[weak arrow]

I do prefer the Ent theory, or dryad or something

[hollow grotto]

Yeah something like that would suffice, since we haven't seen much grass-like abilities

[onyx fjord]

question for clarification. does fujitora correlate with his devil fruit like the other admirals
cause i dont see how gravity is purple

[mild kite]

P. H. O. T. O. S. Y. N. T. H. E. S. I. S

[dusky acorn]

By nature of Fujitora not being a logia like Kizaru/Aokiji/Akainu were, nah his colour really doesn't mean anything in regards to his fruit, moreso just clothing

[weak arrow]

Apparently purple is a common color to represent gravity in the anime/manga medium

[grizzled fog]

I mean his gravity is often visualized as purple ig

[hollow grotto]

not sure why but one of the common associations I saw with gravity was purple

[onyx fjord]

odd

[grizzled fog]

Yea gravity seems like a purple color

[weak arrow]

yeah tvtrope cites like 10 anime/manga examples of it

[hollow grotto]

like, this is a really quick google search so don't take it as proof but the first result was this on TV trope

[dusky acorn]

Oh really, didn't know that was a thing

[hollow grotto]

yeah honestly just checked myself, was surprised to find that out lol

[weak arrow]

smh shimon go look at the list and tell me you arent a speedreader

[peak cape]

Gravity feels purple to me or black.

[onyx fjord]

green bull -> green = nature -> nature-related -> animal -> zoan

[grizzled fog]

GreenBullFrog

This theory is still going strong 💪 🐸

[onyx fjord]

if his name does correlate which it might not
a minotaur is possible...

[hollow grotto]

[dusky acorn]

I'd still say the naming trend of Greenbull's moniker is being taken a bit too literal but I won't get on that much, I'm guilty of doing the same with my theories

[grizzled fog]

🧐

[hollow grotto]

It's probably a bit on the nose but we don't have much else to work with

[weak arrow]

Well, people just prefer the Paramecia Logia Zoan trio now, so people will naturally go try to find Zoans that can fit the not-eaten-in-2-years idea

[grizzled fog]

Look. GreenBullFrog is a genuinely sick idea

[mild kite]

Greenbull is a venus fly trap

[onyx fjord]

I just pray to almighty that if Green Bull gets a zoan, it is a mythical
i really do not enjoy most other zoans with exceptions lol

[peak cape]

Honestly I'm getting frog vibes from Greenbull even if he has less page time than Shanks.

[hollow grotto]

am I allowed to post images from subreddits other than OP?

[onyx fjord]

the strongest zoans we see tend to be mythical as well though, so it would make sense
to get him to admiral level

[weak arrow]

if it shows spoilers from another series, no

[tame trench]

episode 973 :(

[mild kite]

I mean Oda giving it to everyone now. Even Orochi got one. I think it's likely an admiral got one too

[hollow grotto]

alright, it's good then, I was just looking on reddit and found this on a random subreddit

poor dude trying to explain what he means without giving away the anime name lol

[onyx fjord]

honestly good lmao

he was super conservative with it before so i dont mind him going all out with the last few
this is the new world after all

[pure raven]

And will never die

[peak cape]

Dude is a snake zoan

[onyx fjord]

what mythological creatures dont eat
thats a good starting point
definitely not a minotaur then thats for sure

[dusky acorn]

I researched some animals that can go a long time without eating just now, didn't know Crocodiles could go 3 years without food, still don't think that's strong enough of a fruit for Greenbull though

[keen portal]

Don't think a lot of them need to eat lol

They just eat because they feel like it

[dusky acorn]

Tardigrade is also a cool choice, they're extremely durable organisms iirc

[peak cape]

I assumed all mythical creatures don't really eat..

[weak arrow]

I feel like tardigrade is a bit outside of one piece's scope

[onyx fjord]

isnt the whole point of the minotaur story that he needs to be fed a sacrifice every year to satiate him in the maze

[peak cape]

Mythical ant zoan.

[ancient vault]

And frogs are ugly thats why no women wants to eat with him. My theory is confirmed

[dusky acorn]

Yeah it's pretty microscopic isn't it? Seems a bit hyper specific to be made as a fruit in story, but who knows. That's the one real life animal I would see as fitting strength wise for an Admiral* though. If not, then he'd most likely be a mythical/ancient

[weak arrow]

I mean, any type of insect would be good if it scales

[onyx fjord]

Axolotl zoan where the user regenerates

[weak arrow]

Well we already know for a fact that isnt his fruit

[onyx fjord]

wait thats already a thing

[grizzled fog]

I think it’s plenty strong. Crocodiles are fucking monsters. Especially salt water crocodiles, even modern ones are insane. Strongest bite force of any animal, fast on land and in water, tough skin. Now just imagine an ancient version of that, that’s much bigger than a real one. And give that to green. An ancient powerful zoan + crazy haki + insane physical abilities is plenty strong for an admiral imo. After Bullfrog that’s my second choice personally

Also, anyone else think Greenbull is gonna have coc? I don’t really have any backing for it, but I have a good feeling that he’s gonna be the second confirmed coc user in the marines

[ancient vault]

I think akainu is gonna have CoC

[mild kite]

We shouldn't assume greenbull's hunger limit is three years. He said he would eat if a lady offered it to him. That seems to me that he cannot eat indefinitely

[dusky acorn]

Oh nice just checked too, there is prehistoric crocodiles that existed, so I'm more down for the idea then

[ancient vault]

Nah its cause hes ugly and im 100% sold on that

[mild kite]

Guaranteed he has it

[ancient vault]

Cant have 2 new characters withojt one looking goofy in one piecw

[peak cape]

Greenbull doesn't have a DF. He's actually just Akainus nephew.

[ancient vault]

Pls no insect fruit

[pastel summit]

prehistoric crocodiles are just crocodiles.

[peak cape]

It's great. Greenbull can be whatever you want him to be.

[keen portal]

Ancient praying mantis zoan

[pastel summit]

there's no real difference between modern ones and ancient ones.

[grizzled fog]

But bigger and cooler. Shit up

[ancient vault]

Which ones look cooler choc

[pastel summit]

they all look the same

[ancient vault]

[peak cape]

Sloth Zoan GreenBull.

[dusky acorn]

Wait, really. Thanks for the insight, but I'm sure it's still something Oda would pull just to give it that ancient zoan typing, even if he doesn't have to, just like what he did with Maria lol

[grizzled fog]

They are bigger tho

[onyx fjord]

It would be kinda cool to see an admiral without a devil fruit

[grizzled fog]

Ancient crocodiles can be a lot bigger, there’s even a kind that can reach 9 tons

Also, Maria’s zoan is “just a spider” but it’s ancient choc. Oda can make it plenty original

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcosuchus

[dusky acorn]

Every Admiral so far has had such hype fruits, it's hard to see Greenbull without one of the 2 rarer zoan types

[pastel summit]

yeah, but it's not actually that animal. It's oda attaching the "ancient" moniker because people think it makes it more interesting.

but the actual spider itself is not that interesting.

[mellow silo]

What if Greenbull has some nature related fruit? Could also give somewhat of an explanation for him not eating? Although he does say it’s because he’s lazy, but could that mean he already absorbs enough energy?

Idk I just thought of this cuz of the green

[peak cape]

Ancient germ zoan GreenBull.

One of these will be right.

But for real yeah he's probably got plant powers.

Oh also the admirals seem to have a theme of using a natural force as a weapon. Akainu has lava, Kizaru has light, Fujitora has gravity, Aokiji has ice. So earth powers could fit if that's a conscious theme Oda wants for the admirals.

[pastel summit]

well, 3 of those are because that's what logias are lol.

so it's more of a theme of logias than a theme of the admirals.

[peak cape]

Yeah true.

[worthy hedge]

plants are not fasting lol

[worthy hedge]

i heard a theory that i liked that greenbull is something like a kraken like markos devil fruit

and probably he is brooks first captain that left the crew because of his illness

[ionic peak]

golden lion shiki ?

[worthy hedge]

could be

[tame tendon]

I prefer Toki, cz the hand is too small for Shiki

[ionic peak]

but a girl doesnt sit like that lmao

[pure raven]

Avatar Kaido?

I picture Kaido as an earth bender with his devil fruit giving him the other bending disciplines

[tame tendon]

It symbolize freedom, everyone could sit at will lol

[grizzled fog]

Toki? Gotta say I haven’t heard that one before for that cover page

Toki is green haired anyway

[ionic peak]

lmao

ahh yesss, so must be shiki then ?

[tame tendon]

Maybe some kind of japanese samurai wigs to pretend herself unknown. like the one that used by yamato

I hope shiki is join the canon too, but I still can't figure its him

[tawdry hound]

any other crew member than Oden in Roger Pirates from Wano?

[ionic peak]

ahh make sense

[pure raven]

Do you guys think law might sacrifice his life to save luffy on the brink of death during the wano arc?

[dim herald]

No but he will to save zoro, cuz zoro killing Kaido, duh

[supple nimbus]

I mean Sengoku had a mythical zoan, but yeah ig he was only fleet admiral

[tame tendon]

Anyone read the theory about the connection about moon and races in One Piece?

[keen portal]

yes its a very common one

[tame tendon]

https://twitter.com/Jabulkheir/status/1285648731442905090

Have u read this one? What u're opinion about this?

[keen portal]

thats a very very long stretch saying every one piece race came from some moon in the one piece solar system (if it even exists.)

[pastel summit]

I've thought about that idea tbh, but yeah. It's a big stretch.

[keen portal]

the only plausible one is whats been set up with the 3 sky races and the one moon we know

[tame tendon]

Of course, 3 sky races came from the moon where enel stay is very make sense. but IMO even though the rest of moon isn't existed the reference Oda took was very genius if it was real

I wonder what is references for the last 3 races?

[keen portal]

the giants example he made is also false. The Titans and the Giants in Greek mythology are totally different entities and groups

[dry lynx]

Wano could stretch till chapter 1056

[worthy hedge]

hey i just saw that in Japanese lore there are 4 mythical beasts

1 is dragon
2 is the white tiger wich may be Yamato
3 is marchos phoenix
4 is some short of a tortle

[dry lynx]

Yamato is a turtle

[worthy hedge]

we saw Yamato have fanges

[worthy hedge]

dont remember what chapter that was

and also the white tiger is the biggest enemy of the dragon who is kaido

[tame tendon]

But firstly he mention "mimas" that literally the other term of Giants

[worthy hedge]

maybe greenbull has the giant turtle

the 4 mythical creatures

[wintry cipher]

who has the Tiger tho

[wintry cipher]

.

[worthy hedge]

probably Yamato we saw her with fangs at one point and the white tiger is the bigest enemy of the dragon

[wintry cipher]

oh right

poggers

[worthy hedge]

and GREENbull could be the turtle

[wintry cipher]

maybe dragon got the giant turle tho

its so big, it could cause wind

[worthy hedge]

greenbull sed that he doesnt eat because he is lazy

[wintry cipher]

ye

[worthy hedge]

dragon i thinks has something like the storm storm fruit

[wintry cipher]

like weather weather or sum

[worthy hedge]

yea

we saw at the death of roger it started raining and when luffy almost got executed was raining both time dragon was there

[worthy hedge]

greenbull could be brooks last captain

[wintry cipher]

he died tho

[worthy hedge]

we dont know

[worthy hedge]

i think that we only know that he got away from the ship for his illness

[pure raven]

buggy d clown shows up and single handedly defeats whitebeard with one hand and is signing t-shirts with the other hand