dev-general

[old wyvern]

Source code of life

[quiet depot]

elara is a dead language face it

[old wyvern]

Did you know that DNA was compiled from Elara?

[prisma wave]

Nah not dead

Just under renovation

[old wyvern]

False propaganda

[cinder flare]

I gotta say, going through a recently converted kotlin file and just doing all the things intellij wants you to do is quite enjoyable

[old wyvern]

^

[quiet depot]

2 months no commit

[static zealot]

btw I bought elara-lang.org elaralang.org elaralang.com elara-lang.com and some others. I'll sell any of them for $2000

[old wyvern]

Yea redesigning stuff piggy

Plus both of us have lots of work to finish

[gusty glen]

u can keep them, I would not accept them even if you told me it was free

[static zealot]

lmao

[cinder flare]

I wish I could make it auto unconcatenate

cause this shit is annoying

[prisma wave]

what

[quiet depot]

wott

[gusty glen]

what

[old wyvern]

what

watt

[cinder flare]

concatenation -> inline #{} boi

[quiet depot]

wattage

[gusty glen]

concatenation is gold

[prisma wave]

what

[old wyvern]

watter

[quiet depot]

water

is

[cinder flare]

in kotlin

[old wyvern]

Woter

[quiet depot]

wet?¿

[cinder flare]

you do inline variable replacement

[old wyvern]

Wohter

Wohtah

[prisma wave]

Oh string interpolation

[quiet depot]

utah

[cinder flare]

yeah sorry forgot what it was called

[quiet depot]

murica

[old wyvern]

uta

[prisma wave]

lol

[cinder flare]

i love that shit

[prisma wave]

What do you want to do?

[old wyvern]

eez mericans innit

[cinder flare]

I converted a java to kotlin

[prisma wave]

alt + enter can convert concatenation into it

Iirc

[cinder flare]

woah okay okay'

[quiet depot]

obviously he’s planning a trip to utah, ‘murica, with lots of water

[cinder flare]

YOOOO

[prisma wave]

wotahh

[cinder flare]

you're so smart i luv u

[prisma wave]

cheers

[old wyvern]

Speaking of which

Wheres the senpai guy

Did he leave?

n3work or something

[cinder flare]

speaking of guys

remember Titanic?

[old wyvern]

Speaking of speaking

[prisma wave]

Still here

[gusty glen]

speaking of speaking of speaking

[old wyvern]

Speaking of speaking of speaking of speaking

[prisma wave]

Literally yesterday lmao

[cinder flare]

well yeah

but is he still here?

[gusty glen]

fannycube-senpai, have you tested my stuff?

[old wyvern]

Remember remembering

[old wyvern]

Probably not

[cinder flare]

nice

[old wyvern]

nvm

[prisma wave]

soz I completely forgot

[old wyvern]

what stuff 👀

[cinder flare]

oh shit did the kotlin conversion un-lombok my code

i hope so

[gusty glen]

m a g i c - c o d e

[old wyvern]

magi code

[gusty glen]

no wait

(((magic(code))))

[old wyvern]

no no

[cinder flare]

IT DIDNT

damnit

[old wyvern]

lets cons it

[prisma wave]

cons 🤤

[old wyvern]

'm' : 'a' : 'g' : 'i' : 'c' : ' ' : 'c' : 'o' : 'd' : 'e' : []

[prisma wave]

jesus

[old wyvern]

Desugared haskell

😌

[prisma wave]

🤩

[cinder flare]

how do I make the kotlin conversion delete lombok from existence

[obtuse gale]

By not using lombok in the first place

Get yourself a DeLorean and kill your past self before you use lombok

[cinder flare]

it wasn't me tho!

[obtuse gale]

suuuuuuuuuure

[ornate quarry]

[20:37:17 ERROR]: Could not load 'plugins\BasicGUIShop.jar' in folder 'plugins' why

[obtuse gale]

idk

[errant geyser]

Look at the rest of the error message and you might know.

[obtuse gale]

it probably tells you the reason somewhere in there

[ocean quartz]

Stick to one channel my dude

[obtuse gale]

@ocean quartz any idea on how I would "split" a component by Component.newline()? Trying to send multi-line messages in console without it being like

[blah blah logging stuff]: line 1
line 2
line 3

and more like

[blah blah logging stuff]: line 1
[blah blah logging stuff]: line 2
[blah blah logging stuff]: line 3

conserving style?
I was thinking of (your favorite) recursion and re-building the "top-most" component as I iterate, when I find a Component.newline() I send the component (and skip the newline ofc) but like it can get super tricky if there's like inherited style from parent components and text before too

Either that or I just stick to nothing more than 1 children deep 😛

[ocean quartz]

I'm not sure of any actual way, I'm not too experienced with modifying components only creating them
But you could maybe loop through the children and create a component per line?

Let me try something just a sec

A bit harder than i thought 😅

[forest pecan]

Ok this is weird. Are apps on Mac have some sort of unique identifier for each mac?

I have this app called VLC.app on mac. I zipped it up to a zip file and published the binaries onto github

then i downloaded that same zip file back into my application folder

then when i unzipped it

and try opening it

it said that there was an error

[sweet cipher]

Your virus is breaking it

[forest pecan]

lmao

Exception Type:        EXC_CRASH (SIGABRT)
Exception Codes:       0x0000000000000000, 0x0000000000000000
Exception Note:        EXC_CORPSE_NOTIFY

Termination Reason:    DYLD, [0x1] Library missing

Application Specific Information:
dyld: launch, loading dependent libraries

Dyld Error Message:
  dyld: Using shared cache: A33707D1-FC47-30FB-A239-A6AFA68DA7C0
Library not loaded: @rpath/libvlc.dylib
  Referenced from: /Applications/VLC.app/Contents/MacOS/VLC
  Reason: no suitable image found.  Did find:
    /Applications/VLC.app/Contents/MacOS/lib/libvlc.dylib: file too short

the last line, but im not sure

hm

[obtuse gale]

Indeed

[forest pecan]

So looks like i found the issue

MacOS is very very weird

When you Zip a file on MacOS, it also puts a folder in the archive called "__MACOSX"

if you unzip normally on MacOS, this file will not appear because its a hidden file on mac

However, because windows and other zips don't have this hidden file, the reason to how i found this is from running from tests and extracting the zip file.

I keep seeing the hidden folder

the hidden folder also has a copy of the same file with the same name of the app, which makes me think it has something to do with the data

Conclusion? MACOS SUCKS

Schools should start handing out more linux pc's

🌚

[ocean quartz]

Basically

[oblique heath]

my old high school already uses linux pcs

aka chromebooks 🥲

[sweet cipher]

@ocean quartz Sorry for the ping, but is it possible to manually set the server version with mfgui?
It says the version is Unknown when I am trying to set the ItemBuilder to Unbreakable.

I am using spigot 1.16.5

[ocean quartz]

Yeah that's an issue with the latest version on maven central, I've fixed that on my repo
I'll send in a second

[sweet cipher]

Okay thanks!

[cinder flare]

I honestly prefer mac to windows most of the time

At least it's POSIX-compliant and has bash

[obtuse gale]

You can hexdump /dev/random so 👍

[ocean quartz]

https://repo.mattstudios.me/artifactory/public/ and implementation("me.mattstudios:triumph-gui:3.0.5-SNAPSHOT")
There were some small tweaks
But mostly there were some package changes, so you'll have to reimport a few things

[sweet cipher]

Okay thank you

[sweet cipher]

Do you have the maven dependency?

[obtuse gale]

me.mattstudios:triumph-gui:3.0.5-SNAPSHOT

separate by :

groupId:artifactId:version

[sweet cipher]

Oh okay thank you

[cinder flare]

ew why maven

[sweet cipher]

Is it

<groupId>me.mattstudios</groupId>
<artifactId>triumph-gui</artifactId>
<version>3.0.5-SNAPSHOT</version>
```?

[ocean quartz]

Yeah

[obtuse gale]

you 2 days ago: ew why gradle
you now: ew why maven

[cinder flare]

seems to be

[ocean quartz]

Character growth

[cinder flare]

okay the gradle kts is kinda got me flustered, ngl

[obtuse gale]

lmao

[cinder flare]

once i figured out how to backport from maven and all the weird shit it did, it's so concise

[ocean quartz]

Why?

[cinder flare]

hundreds of lines of code less

it just looks prettier to read

it performs like, 100x better

[sweet cipher]

Whats the repo id?

[cinder flare]

it compiles my whole project in < 10 seconds, maven took a whole 45 seconds before

[cinder flare]

and that was after I disabled creating a javadoc jar?

also intellij is having a hard time analyzing my file in kotlin :(

[sweet cipher]

Oh figured it out its just mattstudios lol

[obtuse gale]

oh the id

isn't that totally irrelevant?

[sweet cipher]

Well it wouldn't work without the repo idk

[obtuse gale]

maven 🌝

[ocean quartz]

The id doesn't really matter, i think it's actually public or central

[sweet cipher]

Oh

Yeah I tried putting the letter a as the groupid and it worked lol

[ocean quartz]

Not the group id, the repository id

[sweet cipher]

Seems unnecessary that there has to be one then

Thats what I meant

[cinder flare]

maven lmao

[sweet cipher]

Is there a button in intelliJ to fix all imports?

[half harness]

ctrl + alt + o

i think

[cinder flare]

god i love intellij

[obtuse gale]

https://tenor.com/view/i-love-refrigerators-appliance-fridge-gif-16332262

"I love IntelliJ"

[sweet cipher]

I think that only works in one class at a time

[obtuse gale]

wat

that just refreshes maven dependencies

[half harness]

thats ctrl + shift + o

i think

[obtuse gale]

aa

[sweet cipher]

I have two schematics as options, and I keep accidentally clicking the one thats like 500x500

[ocean quartz]

Crtl + shift + o?
Weak

[static zealot]

Nothing wrong here https://i.imgur.com/FZXANrP.png

[pale shell]

But how

[sweet cipher]

I have that but it doesn't change ones that don't work

[cinder flare]

👀

[obtuse gale]

Ever used the debugger while the plugin is loading/enabling?

[sweet cipher]

Thats 10 times as long as mine just took lol

[static zealot]

nah its server ran on PC lmao. Its not a plugin

[obtuse gale]

lmao

[static zealot]

I had MC opened as well

while starting it

xD

[cinder flare]

his 2GB of ram were stretched tight lmao

[half harness]

mine sometimes takes 200+ seconds

for 50+ plugins

[cinder flare]

damn du de

[static zealot]

I mean I did have browser and discord opened as well

[cinder flare]

i get mildly annoyed waiting for the libraries to load at the very beginning lol

[static zealot]

the thing is it doesn't get stuck at plugin loading. it gets stuck at library loading. Like the first action it does

when it starts

that is what happens when you ain't got 4-5$ for a test server lmao

[cinder flare]

oh okay glad im not the only one

but imagine how much more work it is to push to the git repo, wait for it to compile, then spin up the server

probably takes the same amount of time overall

[static zealot]

ugh why do all that? I just build locally and would just add it using ftp

lmao

[cinder flare]

ah okay so just a test server, not a whole CI integration lol

[obtuse gale]

👌

[static zealot]

yeah

ok I closed browser and I'll retry lmao

lets see

brb xD

[obtuse gale]

If I remove all plugins it's like 1 or 2 seconds lol

[static zealot]

I mean if I'd close minecraft it would probably be like 10 seconds for me as well

[obtuse gale]

eeeeee

[cinder flare]

fefo wtf

you have a super computer??

[half harness]

i still get like 7-10 secs with 0 plugins

[obtuse gale]

lmao

[cinder flare]

it takes me literally 15 seconds to load libraries and I have a pretty slammin pc

[half harness]

😑

anyways ima go

byeeeeeeeeeeee

[obtuse gale]

Matt I think I have an idea......

For the components thing

[static zealot]

closing the browser and now its: https://i.imgur.com/drjkkpe.png

[half harness]

lol

i get like 40secs on my dev 1.16 server

|| and like 15 secs on my 1.8 dev server ||

ok im actually going to go now

[obtuse gale]

let's see how long it takes to start up paper 1.8.8

[sweet cipher]

Done (8.177s)! 1.16.5

I have barely any plugins though

[ocean quartz]

Oh? What is the idea?

[static zealot]

oh I've just realised that 37.6 was not with browser fully closed

just yt music

was stopped

lmao

[obtuse gale]

lmao

[obtuse gale]

:kekw:

[cinder flare]

wtf sub 1 second

[obtuse gale]

1.8.8 tho

[cinder flare]

what are your computer specs

[obtuse gale]

0 plugins

Nothing too fancy, i7 7770 and ddr4... i don't remember the freq lol

[static zealot]

nothing fancy

fuck off

[cinder flare]

ddr4 lmao

what graphics card bro

[static zealot]

I'm crying here with an old gen i5 some 8 gb ddr3 very low freq

[obtuse gale]

lmao

I mean yeah

[static zealot]

the cooler barely running

[cinder flare]

this guys got 100hz ram

[static zealot]

my laptop would literally burn if I had no external cooling

[cinder flare]

not Mhz

[cinder flare]

gpu?

[obtuse gale]

R9 390

dead internet 🥲

[static zealot]

I got a 940MX or whatever. Also I can't even change the termal paste because a screw is destroyed and I can't open it anymore

[cinder flare]

i've never heard of that card

[obtuse gale]

lmao rip

[cinder flare]

but it's amd so yikes

oooh 2015

[obtuse gale]

ye

[cinder flare]

you've got quite the disparity my friend

[obtuse gale]

I mean I play like the same 4 games over and over (and I barely play them) and it does way more than well for my use case

[cinder flare]

lol

obviously it's got those server load times down

[obtuse gale]

lol

[static zealot]

ok 7 plugins. No browser or MC opened

[obtuse gale]

I just play like GTA Online once every... 7 months lol; now I'm hitting Doom Eternal, every now and then I play Mirror's Edge & Mirror's Edge: Catalyst and one day I will finish Tomb Raider and Shadow of the Tomb Raider

[static zealot]

https://i.imgur.com/POyVmn8.png

[obtuse gale]

let me implement it and I'll show you :p

[ocean quartz]

9 Plugins, Mc, Ij, browser, open

[ocean quartz]

Alrighty ;p

[cinder flare]

What does this idea concern?

[static zealot]

why do you guys like to bully me?

[ocean quartz]

We like to bully everyone

[oblique heath]

hehe, this is 1.16 with Plan, LP, FAWE, ViaVersion, and a few other small plugins

[cinder flare]

Plan?

[oblique heath]

stats plugin

[surreal quarry]

Premium Leaded Augmented Neuron

[oblique heath]

Player Analytics

[cinder flare]

ah yea yea

[surreal quarry]

damn this has a web view

thats hot

[oblique heath]

plan? ye

[obtuse gale]

I think this is the first time ever I have used local classes hold on

[obtuse gale]

@ocean quartz kill me

I think this works but I don't have enough of a complex styled component tree to test with...

It works on a basic level at least, (1 children layer deep) again I have nothing complex to test it against
https://paste.helpch.at/mamiparexi.java

[surreal quarry]

i usually have 2 layers of children in my basement

any solutions for that

[obtuse gale]

add more, then the top layers will muffle the screams of the bottom ones

[surreal quarry]

okay thanks

[tranquil crane]

waitaminute

[lunar cypress]

i broke jmh

[jovial warren]

Lol

Imagine knowing how to use JMH

I should use JMH for some of the whack in Krypton lol

Micro optimisations are the best optimisations

Oh also, btw, thinking about the Kotlin DSL, if there is one thing I like about it, it's the fact that IntelliJ can recognise it properly and doesn't have any really strange issues

[distant sun]

n = x;
while (n > x - 9999) {
n--;
}

[jovial warren]

Would that even work?

[distant sun]

there 🤣

[jovial warren]

Actually that would be an almost infinite loop

Until you get an integer underflow and it stops

Just thinking about how annoying ticking in Krypton is gonna be

[old wyvern]

No

That should run 9999 times

xD

[jovial warren]

since ticking is kinda by definition meant to be done sync, since it’s a repeating task

ah yes, it’ll run 9999 times now

but before, it was n > n - 9999

[old wyvern]

ah

[jovial warren]

which would loop until it underflowed and that condition was no longer true

oh btw, you guys should try running LuckPerms on Krypton now lol

go to my fork, build it from source and drop the JAR into the plugins dir

ez

the command /lp on its own doesn’t seem to work atm due to Brigadier weirdness, but it works if you give it arguments

and /luckperms always works

[plain void]

e

[hot hull]

a

[quiet depot]

@old wyvern wot u forking docdex for

[subtle lynx]

ngl, #816184749752188958 should have a rule where you can't add a bunch of filler space

it seems like a way to keep people from seeing other people's offers

[stuck harbor]

good idea

ill just use a bunch of spaces

to block people

[subtle lynx]

just realized this is the wrong channel for this

lol

[stuck harbor]

meh

staying on topic is for dweebs

[old wyvern]

wink wink

[subtle lynx]

it doesn't really add anything to a message

[quiet depot]

wink wink bruh

[subtle lynx]

it's more like "hmm today I will be annoying and make the channel harder to scan through"

[stuck harbor]

we all fork dockdex

ill do it

and rewrite it in quercus

[old wyvern]

First of all gotta pr that message deletion things

[stuck harbor]

bet

[old wyvern]

Then some stream stuff I just saw while looking for where to make the change

[stuck harbor]

@quiet depot would u object to me contributing clojure code to docdex?

[quiet depot]

yes

only java

[stuck harbor]

sadge

[quiet depot]

wym yugi, stream stuff?

[stuck harbor]

streeeaaaams

[old wyvern]

Oh nothing major

anyMatch(possibleMatch -> {
    final boolean matches = rawMessage.startsWith(prefix + possibleMatch);
    if (matches) {
        match.set(possibleMatch);
    }
    return matches;
})

like this

[quiet depot]

is that my code?

[old wyvern]

could probably just have the match check and then peek

Yes piggy

[quiet depot]

lol

[old wyvern]

Loving the use of streams btw

[stuck harbor]

shouldn't that be

if (!matches) return matches;
match.set(possibleMatch);
return matches;

less arrow-y

[quiet depot]

i use streams a lot

[old wyvern]

Lovely

[stuck harbor]

anyway thats ew its too modern

modern java is too modern for me

[quiet depot]

that’s not even modern

like 7 years old

[old wyvern]

Would you rather die in imperitiveness?

[stuck harbor]

yes

[old wyvern]

😮

Impure soul

[stuck harbor]

whenever i have to write java, i usually just end up writing java 8

even if im in like java 16

[quiet depot]

streams r java 8?¿

[old wyvern]

lol

[stuck harbor]

shut

java 7 then

😉

[quiet depot]

iwanio do u like meat pie

[old wyvern]

I have mostly only used 8 as well

11 sometimes

[stuck harbor]

i should probably relearn java

[old wyvern]

And 15 only on a linux vm

xD

[stuck harbor]

not really

[quiet depot]

bruh

[stuck harbor]

well pork pies are nice 🙂

[quiet depot]

docdex is j11 only because of dcevm

what

[old wyvern]

ah

[stuck harbor]

dcevm is the hotswapping shit, right?

i can never get hotswapping working

[quiet depot]

yes

lol

[old wyvern]

Why dont I see var abuse 😫

[stuck harbor]

maybe its cause i use emacs and a remote server sadge

C-c C-c c

[quiet depot]

because I like verbosity and I forget that feature exists

[old wyvern]

lol

[stuck harbor]

that sounds violent

var abuse

[quiet depot]

iwanio

[old wyvern]

very

[quiet depot]

pork pie looks like dog food in pastry

[stuck harbor]

shut have u ever had melton mowbray?

[quiet depot]

who’s that

no

[stuck harbor]

uncultured swine

[quiet depot]

don’t think so

meat pies are different down under

@old wyvern combine the running and development wiki pages to get ur shit setup

[stuck harbor]

down undaaaa

piggy is a kiwi confirmed

[quiet depot]

what

i aint no sheep fucker boy

[stuck harbor]

as a welsh person

that is funny

[old wyvern]

Alrighty

[jovial warren]

imagine not having a school iPad you can just hotspot

[stuck harbor]

mmm what brand is that?

i want a new smartwatch tbh

my old one is like 5 years old

its served me well

but its getting a bit old

fun

[jovial warren]

Apple bad

Apple hates literally everyone

[half harness]

aaaaaaaaaaaaa who ghost pinged me

[stuck harbor]

ur mum

hehe

spurt time

u must 'exercise'

[jovial warren]

Lol

[stuck harbor]

what model is it?

[cinder flare]

Apple watch gang and proud 😎

[jovial warren]

Oh btw, is there actually a way to do async ticking for Minecraft?

Or would it all get out of sync

And then cause issues

[hot hull]

probs issues

[jovial warren]

I mean, I guess I could probably find a way to tick async by section in a world

[old wyvern]

Why would you do async ticking

[jovial warren]

Because a lot needs to be done in ticking

[quiet depot]

with a will there's a way

[old wyvern]

Yea you could group parts together

Thats similar to what aether engine does

[jovial warren]

And I don't want Krypton to end up like another vanilla

[hot hull]

My will is powerful, thus I'll die easily is what you're saying yea

[cinder flare]

Damn that's kinda crazy to think about though, separating the game loop

[prisma wave]

1 thread per chunk

ez

[quiet depot]

1 thread per block

[stuck harbor]

1 goroutine per chunk

[jovial warren]

Maybe I could use the region grouping

[old wyvern]

Synchronous ticking usually exists in many games

[hot hull]

1 thread per pixel

yeet

[prisma wave]

That could actually work tho

[quiet depot]

1 thread per operation

[stuck harbor]

yes

[cinder flare]

1 thread per long

[prisma wave]

1 thread per new Thread()

[old wyvern]

Sequential flow is not the culprit for most performance issues

[jovial warren]

Yeah but most games just make their servers to work

[stuck harbor]

1 thread per CompleteableFuture.runAsync()

[old wyvern]

We are not running on 90s hardware rn

[quiet depot]

you're right, the main culprit is people not using a new thread for each operation

[jovial warren]

And nobody generally cares how well they work because it's the only option available

[old wyvern]

definitely

Screw it, time to async my processor

Separate every single operation

brb gonna rewire* this shit

[quiet depot]

smort

[jovial warren]

Krypton has vanilla to compete with

[cinder flare]

Bardy boutta hit us with a server that has like 700% improvement performance

[stuck harbor]

'vanilla'

bof

[jovial warren]

😏

[old wyvern]

Epilepsy warning?

[quiet depot]

bardy have you started with the hard stuff?

[jovial warren]

Like?

[winter iron]

do i just run buildtools for nms right?

[quiet depot]

well there's only one hard part to making a server

[half harness]

and mavenLocal() in build.gradle

[hot hull]

I know something that's hard 😏

[half harness]

idk about maven

[quiet depot]

and if you think anything you've done so far is hard then you're wrong

[old wyvern]

Again bard, trying to make everything non-continuous is not the way to go

[quiet depot]

because comparatively this one component is way harder than everything else

and that thing is

drumroll

world generation

[old wyvern]

After a point asynchronous flow will be slower

[quiet depot]

have fun lol

[jovial warren]

World generation is currently being left to Frosty, but I'm not sure if I trust him to finish it this side of Christmas lol

[hot hull]

will defo be done till christmas

Just not sure which one

[jovial warren]

And I kinda wanna learn these things myself anyway

[quiet depot]

frosty do you have any clue how much effort that'll be?

[hot hull]

A lot yes

[quiet depot]

vanilla world generation isn't documented anywhere (afaik)

it's literally new territory

[old wyvern]

Perlin

[quiet depot]

you have to do it yourself

[hot hull]

I'm aware Piggy

it'll be fun

[jovial warren]

I mean, we have the parameters and we know what it uses

[stuck harbor]

bardy u should implement a wavefunction collapse algorythm

[quiet depot]

yes lol

[stuck harbor]

its a bit slow on non-quantum computers

[quiet depot]

I was literally just thinking abou tthat

[half harness]

make sure to support seeds 🙂

[stuck harbor]

but meh

[quiet depot]

iwanio no joke was just thinking about that

[stuck harbor]

haha

thats funny

[old wyvern]

Ah yes

Quantum minecraft

[cinder flare]

Nah only generate one world. Saves effort

[quiet depot]

yeah then just download that petabyte world when the server starts for the first time

[old wyvern]

I mean technically a minecraft world would follow the "observation" rule I guess

If a player is not near, it aint workin

[quiet depot]

how big is a fully generated mc world?

[stuck harbor]

big

[cinder flare]

Presumably quite large

[half harness]

googles 2b2t world size

[hot hull]

considering it's infinite large

[old wyvern]

Not defined?

Actually

[jovial warren]

I think rendering and textures is probably more difficult than world gen

[quiet depot]

dkim I'd assume thousands of tb

[stuck harbor]

mmm petabytes

i love petabytes

[half harness]

In order to store a fully generated Minecraft world, you'll need more than 4 of the current largest data array in the world (15 PB). This Minecraft world will take more than half of the upcoming largest data array in the world (IBM, 120PB).

[old wyvern]

4 * (Double.MAX_VALUE)^2?

[stuck harbor]

whats the equivalent of mebibytes in peta?

[quiet depot]

bardy I've never made a server, but I'm going to make an educated guess and say that would be tedious, not necessarily hard

[jovial warren]

World generation is also very tedious and requires a lot of time learning

[quiet depot]

yeah tbh most things that are "hard" can become only "tedious" if broken into small enough steps

[jovial warren]

But I read Wikipedia articles for fun lol

[quiet depot]

weird flex but ok

[jovial warren]

Lol

Nah I'm just saying, that's what I like to do to get information

[quiet depot]

@half harness 400pb

well

409

not 15

[half harness]

?

uh

what is pb

[hot hull]

peta byte

[quiet depot]

oh wait

[half harness]

ohhh

[quiet depot]

you said 60pb not 15pb

well

still much higher than 60

[hot hull]

How big of a world would that even be?

[half harness]

lol

[oblique heath]

pretty big

bigger than average

[quiet depot]

how big would a 409PB world be?

[hot hull]

Yes

[quiet depot]

max

fully generated

60 mil x 60 mil

x 256

[jovial warren]

Generation is likely just a matter of reading Wikipedia and documentation, then applying it

[quiet depot]

bardy that's only half of the task

[jovial warren]

Also, with Anvil, it ends up bigger than that

[half harness]

how do i get like the \u1234 code?

[hot hull]

Bardy, indeed it is, what I firstly need to build is a testing environment

[quiet depot]

dkim

try press alt then 1234

[half harness]

i meant

how do i convert a to that thing

[quiet depot]

paste it into intellij

[half harness]

oh

what about without intellij?

[quiet depot]

google the unicode

[half harness]

ok

[quiet depot]

@old wyvern what do u like about them

[unkempt tangle]

piggy

can ya disassmble ?;c

[quiet depot]

disassemble what?

[unkempt tangle]

😭

#dev-general message

[stuck harbor]

hehe

sucks to suck to suck

[jovial warren]

Thinking about it, using semantic versioning for Krypton’s API is gonna get really confusing

since if a new minor just requires a few patches, those will be released as patches

or if a new major just requires a few backwards compatible changes, only a new minor for the API will get released

[forest pecan]

Holy shit

i did it

[old wyvern]

Ah yes wonderful

[forest pecan]

i installed an app from a dmg file in java

[old wyvern]

I wasted my time ona NP hard problem

🙂

fuck

@forest pecan

You do competitive coding right?

[forest pecan]

Yes

i do

[old wyvern]

Can you send a me somewhat of a hard question?

[forest pecan]

ok

[old wyvern]

🥲

[forest pecan]

well

how hard

lmao

[old wyvern]

Medium ish hard?

[forest pecan]

i will send you my hw ig

[sweet cipher]

What is competitive coding?

[old wyvern]

Its not for me to do actually xD

I have to submit questions for a competition

[forest pecan]

http://www.usaco.org/index.php?page=viewproblem2&cpid=1091

here you go

[old wyvern]

Im sick on comping up with questions

[forest pecan]

wait thats kinda hard lol

oh

[cinder flare]

bro I hate problems like that

those never happen in the real world lol

[forest pecan]

they do

many job interviews ask these questions

[old wyvern]

i came up with 2, 1 was too complex, 2nd was just impossible to solve in a considerable time

[cinder flare]

i know but im saying they shouldn't

[forest pecan]

??

[cinder flare]

when you're actually coding a project, farmer john's cows are not going to be dancing in a line

[oblique heath]

i saw some really small, unique questions on youtube recently

[forest pecan]

thats only an idea

[sweet cipher]

How can you be so sure?

[cinder flare]

you won't be given problems like this that are so mathematically pure

[forest pecan]

nothign to do with the problem

lol

[old wyvern]

Longest Path in a cyclic graph in a simple way

[cinder flare]

alright whatever man

[oblique heath]

one was 'print hello world without using semicolons' in java

[cinder flare]

just saying, practical coding is more important than stupid problems like these

[sweet cipher]

I'd say learning about dancing cows is pretty practical

[lunar cypress]

"compute the longest path in a cyclic graph" is a wonderful task PepeLaugh

[forest pecan]

well, this is why i am always so big on optimizations

lmao

[old wyvern]

That wasnt the question tho intially xD

[cinder flare]

I would rather hire someone that can do Pig's Challenges than solve that puzzle

[old wyvern]

I had to attempt it to make test cases

Then I realised it simplifies to that

xD

[forest pecan]

cause pig's challanges don't require any logic really

lol

maybe use of data structures but not much after

[old wyvern]

I have been trying to write a solution for like 5 hours now

[lunar cypress]

I thought you were joking

[old wyvern]

🥲

[cinder flare]

but if I hire a plugin dev, will he be making plugins like Pig's challenges or solving riddles?

[old wyvern]

Oh I wasnt

I actually wasted time on this

[forest pecan]

these aint riddles

its a competition

[cinder flare]

okay, sorry, stupid mathematical puzzles

[forest pecan]

you say they are stupid cause you cant solve them

lol

[sweet cipher]

It gets you to think

[forest pecan]

^^

[cinder flare]

point of the story being: experience with how things are done is more important than theoretical ability to solve puzzles

[lunar cypress]

not everything you solve has to be industry approved TM

[sweet cipher]

It's the concept behind it

[oblique heath]

if you have a large project you're bound to run into situations where it may be possible to optimize with some critical thinking

[cinder flare]

gonna tell me to invert a binary tree now?>

[old wyvern]

I mean the question is a bit more than longest path I guess

[forest pecan]

??

[old wyvern]

=paste

[compact perch]

HelpChat Paste

Please use a paste service to share configs, errors, code and long logs.
• HelpChat Paste

[cinder flare]

those are also used at job interviews

and are rarely used in the real world

[forest pecan]

invert a binary tree? lol

[cinder flare]

yes?

[lunar cypress]

there is no longest path in a cyclic graph though

[old wyvern]

This was the initial idea if any of you wanna try

https://paste.helpch.at/kucusecene.coffeescript

[cinder flare]

im impressed you've never heard of it

you seem very familiar with redundant tasks to test someone's job ability

[old wyvern]

Yea its a bit different

[forest pecan]

its used quite often in google's algorithms...

[cinder flare]

no, it's really not

[forest pecan]

and many of these techniques are quite used to optimize algorithms

[cinder flare]

they just use it to interview people

[forest pecan]

then how does google search?

be so fast?

[cinder flare]

dunno, proprietary

[oblique heath]

linear algebra

[sweet cipher]

Circular algebra

[forest pecan]

https://tenor.com/view/facepalm-really-stressed-mad-angry-gif-16109475

ok yugi we can make our cult

lmao

[cinder flare]

maybe if you're working for a top company doing brand new stuff, it's good to know stuff

[old wyvern]

Theres possibly some solution, but I assume the question is pretty much not usable with the given time constrainsts

[cinder flare]

but if you're just a normal dev, experience with the tools and workflow you'll be using are significantly more important than inverting a binary tree or solving stupid theoreticals like that

[old wyvern]

Wait what? xD

[forest pecan]

im sorry but im pretty sure everyone knows that

its not that hard to learn

[jovial warren]

over 20 years of some of the best developers in the business and many micro optimisations

[cinder flare]

alright man

it's not worth arguing lmao

[old wyvern]

Im sorry, you say you cant invert a binary tree?? You're fired mister!

[forest pecan]

lmao

[jovial warren]

binary tree?

[lunar cypress]

I'd take a shot at it but I gotta study 🥲

[cinder flare]

a tree where each node can only have two children

then you can traverse it using binary search which is pretty zoomin

[old wyvern]

good luck lol

[forest pecan]

right node is always higher than left

[sweet cipher]

Can you invert it twice though?

[jovial warren]

ah right

[oblique heath]

you just described college

[old wyvern]

Ok, you want more nodes? invert a TERNARY TREE\

[forest pecan]

isn't that not possible?

lmao

cause like 3 children

[old wyvern]

idc, invert it

[cinder flare]

it wouldn't be very useful

[forest pecan]

well middle would stay the same

just the sides would switch

lmfao

[old wyvern]

Lets make a ternary avl tree

[jovial warren]

man, try looking at the Brigadier command tree

[old wyvern]

Self balancing nonsence

[jovial warren]

get on that level

[cinder flare]

not always lol

[old wyvern]

Thats just a tree

[forest pecan]

now invert a non-directed weighted graph BITCH

[forest pecan]

nope always

[cinder flare]

nope lol

[forest pecan]

thats always the case for binary trees

[old wyvern]

🥲

[forest pecan]

always

[cinder flare]

please provide a source

[forest pecan]

http://max.cs.kzoo.edu/AP/ABMaterials/Trees/BSTLab.html

[cinder flare]

ah a binary search tree that is the case

not just a plain binary tree

[forest pecan]

Yeah

[cinder flare]

???

lmao

[lunar cypress]

see but there's a difference between critisising the practice of asking irrelevant algorithm questions in job interviews and going at individuals who just enjoy solving stuff like this

[old wyvern]

Ditch binary trees, switch to avl trees, k tnx bye

[cinder flare]

im not going at any individuals

I just said I hated when companies ask those stupid questions

I enjoy problem solving myself too lmao

[old wyvern]

I mean they cant just give the jobs out to anyone

[forest pecan]

^^

they need the best

[old wyvern]

Its mostly just a filtration process

[cinder flare]

lmao

good old capitalism

[old wyvern]

Some of the algorithmns they ask do come to use at some point

[cinder flare]

are you also a fan of standardized testing?

[lunar cypress]

yeah but there are better ways to see if someone is qualified or not for sure

[forest pecan]

i am, in fact

[cinder flare]

lmao

[old wyvern]

How do you mean?

[forest pecan]

because they don't test your ability on the material

but rather

your test taking ability

[old wyvern]

Especially when selecting between thousands

[forest pecan]

im sry but google and high tech companies aint gonna choose from 1000 people that all know how to use ci

lol

[cinder flare]

and you think that's a good thing?

[forest pecan]

Yes?

[cinder flare]

what the fuck

[forest pecan]

You think that's bad?

[cinder flare]

yes!

you should be tested on your knowledge

[forest pecan]

Say that to colleges

and all your exams

[lunar cypress]

something more practical that represents what you're gonna be doing. You can be the best in your algorithms class and still suck at coding or using the tools you need

[old wyvern]

standardized testing, as in?

[forest pecan]

in the future

lmao

[cinder flare]

ACT, SAT

[cinder flare]

I'm in college lmao

I took the ACT

I happen to be a good test taker, but do I remember anything that was on the ACT now?

no lmao

[old wyvern]

True, but ussually the questions asked for these cases arent overly complicated

[forest pecan]

isnt this hyprocritic tho lol. I said before that test taking is the important thing and not knowledge. and you forgot the knowledge?

lol

[old wyvern]

You'd see the really hard questions in random competitions going on

[cinder flare]

Im saying that the system shouldn't be how it is

[old wyvern]

Which well, was the persons choice to attend ig

[cinder flare]

Just because it happened to benefit me doesn't mean it's a good thing

[lunar cypress]

Sure, I think theoretical problem solving questions are totally fine, if that's not the only thing they're gonna ask you. What I personally wouldn't approve of is asking for specific algorithms you're supposed to memorise and stuff like that

[forest pecan]

It's not usually specific. Usually its variants. And tbh there is a pattern to memorising them

it isnt hard memorizng formulas

[cinder flare]

If you want the best students, you should be comparing learning ability, and standardized tests definitely skew less towards economically privileged people since they can't prepare as well

[forest pecan]

then its bad for them?

[cinder flare]

I'm honestly appalled that you think test taking is a better measure than learning ability

[oblique heath]

how do you fairly compare learning ability

[cinder flare]

I'm not sure

But test taking isn't it

[oblique heath]

well what's better

[cinder flare]

Again, I don't know

[forest pecan]

I doubt any

[oblique heath]

whats the alternative

[old wyvern]

Id agree with that as well. Even though using this as a filter is fine, selecting solely based on this is just stupidity

[cinder flare]

I don't have to have an alternative to think something's not good lmao

[oblique heath]

then it's the best

[cinder flare]

???

wtf

[oblique heath]

?

[cinder flare]

there are much smarter people than me that probably have solutions

[forest pecan]

well, then study?

lol

[cinder flare]

wtf is this chat

[lunar cypress]

4Head

[forest pecan]

lmao

[cinder flare]

I can't have a discussion with anyone except johnny lmao

[oblique heath]

would you say that a solution to this requires unique critical thinking

as if to a problem you dont normally encounter

[cinder flare]

not the kind you're tested for at a programming interview lmao

[forest pecan]

well it is how it is

you can go argue with the interviewer, if you want to

but i'm not going to

[sweet cipher]

Doing real-world things might be better than test taking. Like programming, instead of a test just program something idk lol.

[cinder flare]

jesus fucking christ are youg uys dumb

[cinder flare]

im not saying that i will lmao

[forest pecan]

no you are just being pissed off from the truth

lol

[cinder flare]

do you not envision change ever?

do you think everything should always be how it is forever

[old wyvern]

What change are you asking for star?

[cinder flare]

"well it works now, must be the best way"

[forest pecan]

Well, if we did envision your change

would we get anything out of it?

[cinder flare]

More practical programming interviews than theoretical exercises

Yes?

wtf

[forest pecan]

thats opinionated

and plus

too many people know about ci

and shit

[cinder flare]

everything in this world is opinionated

[lunar cypress]

yo what

[cinder flare]

too many people know how to invert a binary tree because they look it up because its "required knowledge"

[old wyvern]

Can you be a bit more specific

[forest pecan]

so you are going to hire someone just cause they know how to not name their plugin class Main?

lol

[sweet cipher]

I think there are better options than things like timed tests to determine skill. Some people could just memorize the exact things they need to know, but not understand it.

[old wyvern]

You do realize thats mostly just a meme right?

There are many different types of questions being asked

[cinder flare]

you can google how to invert a binary tree, you can't google how to create good plugins

[forest pecan]

???

LuckPerms

WorldEdit

they are all open source

perfect examples

[sweet cipher]

That plugin by Conclure

[lunar cypress]

this is really not a good argument

[cinder flare]

https://www.educative.io/edpresso/how-to-invert-a-binary-tree

10 seconds

it would take days to analyze the code of good plugins and learn patterns and replicate it yourself

[old wyvern]

Ok wait

Star

[lunar cypress]

you can't just look at a few texts written in a foreign language and then you know it

[ocean quartz]

That's not a good example, you can look at those plugins for a while and it won't make you much better, practice will

[cinder flare]

❤️

[sweet cipher]

Tests just encourage memorization

Not learning

[oblique heath]

bold of you to assume examiners don't have a phone book sized collection of questions to ask

[forest pecan]

that's how algorithms work too

[ocean quartz]

I'd say depends on the test

[sweet cipher]

True

[cinder flare]

algorithms are very simple concepts, usually self contained lmao

[old wyvern]

Thats the same with comp. coding tho

[cinder flare]

a plugin is a huge connected interweaving of many things

[forest pecan]

uhhh wot?

[cinder flare]

i can google quick sort and understand it in minutes

[forest pecan]

then let me give you a problem, and see if you can google

[cinder flare]

i can't understand everything about luckperms in minutes

[sweet cipher]

If its more of an open-ended test with options for the test taker to add their own "spin" then it doesn't really use just memorization, but things with exact answers give an advantage to people with better memories.

[old wyvern]

While I understand that solely testing a person on algorithmns isnt the way to go. Some form of initial filter is required or it just wouldnt be practical to find the best individuals

[forest pecan]

"the problem"

[ocean quartz]

Many of my Math and programming tests we were allowed to check our notes during test because what mattered was the actual problem solving

[cinder flare]

exactly

we're allowed open internet

[forest pecan]

Standarized testing is different from exams

[cinder flare]

because you should be testing ability to make programs rather than ability to memorize generic algorithms

[forest pecan]

algorithms aren't "memorization"

[sweet cipher]

They can be

[cinder flare]

they definitely can be

[forest pecan]

Well yes, but its not efficient

to learn it that way

[sweet cipher]

Its not, but its what tests grade for

[old wyvern]

Most questions arent just "take an existing algorithmn and implement it"

[forest pecan]

^^^^

[old wyvern]

You have to improvise

[forest pecan]

and mix and match

many algorithms together

[cinder flare]

you'd be impressed at how my school does tests lmao

[old wyvern]

Knowning a few algorithmns help

But you could also solve it without that method

[forest pecan]

its not your ability to just know them, but also your ability to change it up to match test cases

[cinder flare]

yes I agree!

[old wyvern]

Its just a standard solution to somegiven problem which yo ucan break down your problem to

SImilar to mathematical identities

[forest pecan]

that's why many problems must be planned out

step by step

[old wyvern]

💀

[forest pecan]

cause you cant code it directly lol

[cinder flare]

yes and we should test for that!

[old wyvern]

Test for what?

[cinder flare]

im against memorization tests

[forest pecan]

?

[sweet cipher]

I am terrible at planning things

I just do things, then redo everything a day later

[cinder flare]

ability to morph algorithms and come up with unique solutions

[forest pecan]

ok i agree i hate memorization tests lmao

[old wyvern]

^

[cinder flare]

we're on the same side I think lmao

[forest pecan]

but test taking strategies

thats a different day

[cinder flare]

huh?

[sweet cipher]

I don't like tests where you don't have access to notes/outside things, where in a real job you would.

[cinder flare]

exactly

"solve this without a calculator" but Ill have a calculator in the real world

[forest pecan]

i have a science exam and its closed book and its about volcanoes shit today

💀

[cinder flare]

you think im manually converting huge hex numbers into binary?

[sweet cipher]

Volcanoes go to the bathroom?

[forest pecan]

lmao

[lunar cypress]

I mean, maybe a bad example, but that's not hard at all lol

[ocean quartz]

You never know, you could be solving a problem on a deserted island with no access to the internet, then you'd need to have memorized it!

[sweet cipher]

Thats true!

I didn't think of that

Test makers are so smart

[cinder flare]

bro I forgot how to do long division manually, we only had a pen and paper to convert numbers in the millions

[sweet cipher]

Lol

[cinder flare]

dividing by 16 over and over again is hell

[sweet cipher]

We had to do long division this year in high school

[lunar cypress]

you don't need that though

[old wyvern]

💀

We had to work like that til 12th

[lunar cypress]

Every 2 hex digits are 4 binary digits

[old wyvern]

But log hacks all the way bois

xD

[cinder flare]

you're right, I can google hex calculator

[forest pecan]

don't forget derivitives! They are useful for when you are burried alive by a tsunami!

[lunar cypress]

and you can just convert them directly

[cinder flare]

it was from hex -> decimal

then decimal -> binary

[oblique heath]

i think this is actually a scary mentality for someone to have

[ocean quartz]

Well I'll disagree with that, learning to solve things without a calculator is actually very beneficial

[forest pecan]

its slow if you use calculator for some things

[cinder flare]

Simple things, sure

[oblique heath]

like for obviously easy stuff sure

[cinder flare]

oh my god okay maybe I should never speak in this channel lmao

[oblique heath]

but then "why do i need to know how to invert a BST, i'll never use it:

[ocean quartz]

I mean hex to binary is simple xD

[sweet cipher]

Well we are talking about understanding things, so I agree you should be able to do things without a calculator. But once you prove you can do it, I don't think there is an issue with using calculators.

[forest pecan]

^

i agree with that

[cinder flare]

yeah that's what im saying lmao

[old wyvern]

star, while in the real world yes, youl always have calculators to convert the bases, the point is to make sure you actually know how bases work

[cinder flare]

and I do, we spent a lot of time on th at

im saying making you do it over and over again is tedious and wasteful

[old wyvern]

Yes, but there must be a way to grade your understanding, correct?

[oblique heath]

lmao

[cinder flare]

ask questions relating to how they work ring a bell?

[sweet cipher]

Or. Just an idea. Make something that reads their mind. Then you don't even need to test them!

[cinder flare]

lmao

[old wyvern]

What such questions would you suggest for base changing?

Any examples?

[cinder flare]

Jesus christ dude

How many times have I said I don't know the answers to things, I can just see that they need to be better?

Converting numbers manually from hex to decimal in the millions sucks

[forest pecan]

you are proposing things that arent possible lol

[sweet cipher]

You can ask me. I know the answer to everything.

[cinder flare]

How can we better test knowledge? dunno

[old wyvern]

^

[cinder flare]

oh my god okay guys

ill never complain again

we can just suffer how we are forever

[oblique heath]

i mean the reality is pointing things out with no solution just isn't all that helpful

[forest pecan]

you don't understand that other people have their opinions too? lmao. you didn't have to complain about the problem i sent to yugi the first place

[sweet cipher]

Honestly even things like making everything open notes would help.

That should be^

[cinder flare]

but there might be a solution

[sweet cipher]

Like school is to prepare for actual life right? Why make school tests unrealistic?

[cinder flare]

that I don't personally happen to know

maybe other colleges do it better

[oblique heath]

sure, there might be

until someone comes up with it what's the point arguing over it

[sweet cipher]

We will come up with it

By arguing

[oblique heath]

ah yes

[cinder flare]

that's how discussions work lmao

usually you broaden your understanding and find other opinions