classic-doom

[median cloud]

1 hr 17 is why I skipped this map

[crystal hill]

Oh good lord

Unless I'm really really into this wad, I think I'll skip that map. Like I skipped map 32 of Speed of Doom

[karmic cliff]

I want to try Eviternity now. Looks supreme.
Though can't imagine forcing myself through this with pistol start. Lol

[sharp veldt]

It's cool, lots of amazing scenery and fun gameplay

[woven swallow]

Pistolstart is not that bad

[sharp veldt]

wonder if we'll get Eviternity 3 on Doom's 35th anniversary haha

[woven swallow]

Eviternity 2 was peak, wonder how they are gonna go beyond it

[karmic cliff]

In that beginning segment, would have to use in-fighting like the guy did.

[woven swallow]

Yeah it's fine

[median cloud]

it's a necessarry skill for most doom wads

[karmic cliff]

I use the skill way more often in Doom 2 than Doom 1.
Especially with Revy.

[languid quarry]

I never should have started with Myhouse.wad

[woven swallow]

How did it go for you?

[languid quarry]

I went in blind and it all went downhill from the mirror

I had to start a new run and attempted to noclip

And that certainly went well

||I got the sale ending after the house fire||

[woven swallow]

Was this your first mod or....

[languid quarry]

2nd

Brutal Doom was the first

[woven swallow]

1st is brutal doom?

[woven swallow]

I FAWKIN CALLED IT

[languid quarry]

Lol

I looked up "Best doom mods" Because I wanted to find some good ones to start with and all I saw was Brutal Doom and Myhouse.wad

[woven swallow]

They are good, yes, but they are NOT the best for beginners to start on ☠️

[languid quarry]

Most likely

[sharp veldt]

MyHouse.wad is basically just invisible teleporter shenanigans

[languid quarry]

Myhouse is insanity in Doom Wad form

[woven swallow]

I could give you a better list of mods to start with

[languid quarry]

I'm putting together a list as I go right now, what are some good ones? I'm mainly looking for some TCs or Gameplay mods

[karmic cliff]

Pink Valley?/s

[languid quarry]

Lol I just saw one of the server admin's original comments on the Myhouse.wad post

Clueless

[woven swallow]

I sent you a dm

[languid quarry]

Thanks!

[woven swallow]

Note: that is barely half of the mods I have...

[languid quarry]

🙃 I've only played around 3 lol

[woven swallow]

Some mapsets I listed are incredibly hard as hell, and extremely grindy or it takes extremely long to beat. So I recommend looking them up before blindly jumping in 👍

[woven swallow]

Do you want a better list too?

[karmic cliff]

Eventually, I'll let you know

[woven swallow]

Okay, Dms are always open

[languid quarry]

I'll check some of these out later, thanks for the recommendations!

[karmic cliff]

Atm focused into Evil Within and possibly Expedition 33 afterwards.

[cosmic pagoda]

technically impressive but gameplay sucks, its more of a tech demo really

[crystal hill]

From what I've seen it's going all in on atmosphere/story, with gameplay as an afterthought

Thats not strictly a bad thing. I really enjoy mappers like Lainos who do basically that same thing, but with less GZDoom trickery

[languid quarry]

The gameplay of MyHouse isn't great, but it's not a "tech demo"

Because the gameplay isn't the point

Myhouse is chaos

[thorny nest]

There’s also the ARG parts outside of the mod itself that add to the chaos

[languid quarry]

The way it throws something completely new and random out of nowhere is masterful

You open a door? Nope that's an airport now not a closet.

Myhouse is all about brain damaging impossible spaces and eerie storytelling.

the Horror is the focus, rather than the combat.

[crystal hill]

exactly

I prefer wads/maps that focus on gameplay, but I respect one that goes all in on atmosphere and horror instead

[languid quarry]

Also just how well done all the transitions are is insane

[languid quarry]

Same here

I'm still a doom modding noob but I really like gameplay mods in general

Myhouse.wad is honestly one of the most well made mods I've ever played

[crystal hill]

I have a bone to pick with it for very petty reasons - that being that the general public seems only to know Myhouse, and it's kind

rather than playing stuff that plays and feels like vanilla Doom. Gives them a false impression of what Doom (for the most part) is

[languid quarry]

Doom is still it's own game, and to anyone who played the original game before Myhouse, it's clear it's a mod

[crystal hill]

thats the thing, many people do just play stuff like Myhouse instead of the PWADs

[languid quarry]

I mean that's what I sort of want to do, but only because I'm looking for something NEW instead of the Doom campaign I've already played

I think it's just because the Doom campaign is so old at this point

[sonic nexus]

doom aint getting old for me

[crystal hill]

you don't get my point. To a lot of people, stuff like Brutal Doom or Myhouse are synonymous with the Doom experience

even though they vastly change it

[languid quarry]

True

I think for me it's just that when I hear "Doom" I think of D2016 rather than the classic doom 1/2

But Doom 1 is by no standards a bad or boring game

[cinder sapphire]

this is why I dislike when they make games with the same exact titles >_<

I made a post here a while back listing my mod recommendations 🤔

as for classic doom campaign getting old, there are so many ways to play it. I've been doing about 4 different versions so far. quite overboard, I suppose 😅

[median cloud]

Is AV limit removing?

[crystal hill]

its vanilla

I wonder if limit removing ports were even a thing back in 2001

[median cloud]

I do remember some sprites dissappearing on av 25 and 27

[median cloud]

Boom was 1998 so I think yes

[crystal hill]

Boom was, but people back then may not have wanted to explicitly remove limits from vanilla doom while keeping it vanilla

if you wanted limits removed, you may have been told to go to Boom or ZDoom

[median cloud]

TNT Horizon is a top 3 doom song

[halcyon willow]

I mean, Zdoom and Prboom were both a thing in 1998

Technically Zdoom predates boom, which I find amusing

[crystal hill]

Disjunction is becoming kind of Sunlust esque near the end

Might be a plus for some, but its a little disappointing for me

[median cloud]

@crystal hill just finished ancient aliens map 15 and I think in terms of combat its perfect for me at the moment

its difficult but not so difficult that I need to grind it

Eviternity is imo very similar so if you like the difficulty in AA u'll like Eviternity probably

[crystal hill]

Map 15 is a good natured slaughter fest

One of many maps I think of fondly in that wad

[crystal hill]

I think AA was a smidge to easy overall, but this is my 2nd full (I guess first fully truly complete) playthrough, which reduces the difficulty significantly, imo. Eviternity will probably be managable as well, minus that hour long secret map

[median cloud]

I think AA has some tough maps and skillsaw often puts me in situations where I have to get zapped by an arch

Tbh I hope it doesn’t get a lot more difficult lol

[crystal hill]

it for sure has tough maps, but they are few and far between, and the overall average difficulty is fairly low

[crystal hill]

Map 28 gets tough in particular. You'll need to figure out a good route through it

[median cloud]

Yeah I did beat 12,13,14,15 today and breezed through them

But 10 for example was kinda tough imo

[crystal hill]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/730896302526955574/1468369045681082379/image.png?ex=6983c4bd&is=6982733d&hm=af27af6915930a5eb6bb087c53ddfb7b081bebdc610a5bc30c074f8286f3979d& look at the sector art on this map

[median cloud]

Dang u can post images here

[crystal hill]

I've seen other people doing it, so I figured its possible

[crystal hill]

like I said, the early episode 2 and 3 maps are very managable

[median cloud]

Secret maps up next

[crystal hill]

I died on the last fight of the last map of Disjunction, but I'm not too too upset

It looks a lot more doable than map 10 at least

[native anchor]

Who uses Chocolate Doom as their main sourceport?

[halcyon willow]

People who like Chocolate Doom

Closest port to the original engine afaik

[ruby jay]

I use dsda and uzdoom. Dsda for everything cept stuff that only runs on uzdoom

[native anchor]

I tend to do that too.

DSDA and UZ are the 2 best source ports most of the time.

[modern peak]

what exactly makes dsda so good

[woven swallow]

1 , good for playing the original doom and it emulates well. also has many QoL settings
2, it's good speedrunning and tasing
3, can run mods from vanilla to mbf21 (and supports UMAPINFO, DEHECKED and DEHEXTRA)
4, it's extremely optimized and can run the biggest of maps with no lag

[median cloud]

I use it for vanilla maps but I think i might migrate to crispy doom

I find secret hunting really frustrating and chocolate doom forces me to look on the wiki lol

Coloured lines in automap + "a secret found" messages are just too nice

[cosmic pagoda]

only map 30-32 of evi 1 to go

im probably gonna skip 30, I didint like that boss

[woven swallow]

migrate to woof

[crystal hill]

thats not very vanilla

[woven swallow]

how?

[crystal hill]

it plays a lot more than just vanilla wads

[woven swallow]

it has vanilla compatibility

[crystal hill]

he seems to be aiming for a vanilla only source port

[crystal hill]

so does UZDoom

[woven swallow]

unlike uzdoom, it actually as strict compatibility

[crystal hill]

does it? why do people use stuff like chocolate or crispy then?

[woven swallow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1376790283274162206/1428369117240492114/ScreenRecording_10-02-2025_01-24-29_1.mov?ex=6983eda7&is=69829c27&hm=57878ec0c3c011c7899cb77119a1fbd9b10828d9769a162cb04f9fbc1ab72cba& so stuff like this doesn't happen

[median cloud]

Nah Woof isnt as vanilla as I want. I just use dsda doom then

[woven swallow]

i recommended woof because it's kinda similar to crispy doom

[woven swallow]

i guess they only just want complevel 0 to 4....

[crystal hill]

stuff like crispy and chocolate seem to me like niche source ports, only for people who want the true authentic vanilla experience without opening up dosbox

[median cloud]

I find it more similar to dsda doom

[median cloud]

Pretty much

I used chocolate doom because I wanted the authentic 90's doom experience and see if I could keep up

But stuff like no secrets found message or a shitty automap are just annoying

that's why I wanna go crispy doom

[crystal hill]

its not something I'm interested in myself, but I respect people who want that

[woven swallow]

i guess migrate to Russian doom, literally crispy but has few features QoL settings, supports only complevels 0 to 4 and is limit removing (just like crispy doom)

[median cloud]

So what's the difference between russian doom and crispy?

[woven swallow]

a custom difficulty: Ultra nightmare
a level selection menu is available (unlike others i've seen, it allows you to customize before warping)
you can change the audio settings to Pc speaker (if that's what you want)

[median cloud]

what's ultra nightmare? And it sounds less vanilla than Crispy :p

[woven swallow]

makes fast monsters even faster, that's literally it

[storm tapir]

Nightmare is clearly too easy /s

[bitter shoal]

wait do source ports typically not have PC speaker setting even faked?

[woven swallow]

no, i only seen it like 4 sourceport....

[bitter shoal]

huh.. I don't know why I thought it was a more common thing

[woven swallow]

and i have like 40+ sourceport so....

[crystal hill]

why?

[woven swallow]

1 i like collecting them
2 preservation, in like 30 years all of them are gonna be lost media or something
3 i want to help people and recommend what sourceports to use

[crystal hill]

I assume you mean preservation

Unless they're super niche source ports I presume they'll last long term. And if not, its likely because no one wanted to use them

[bitter shoal]

Preservation is a very "you have to take the bad with the good" kind of efforts

[crystal hill]

I think that's valid for games, source ports less so

[crystal hill]

but even then, not everyone's going to preserve everything

they'll focus on what they value most, and bad/lesser known games will more likely fade into history

[bitter shoal]

I think some people like to trace the lineage of DOOM software (or software in general) and it isn't really harming anything to archive the software so I mainly see it as a positive

[cosmic pagoda]

dsda is nice

I use it as my main sourceport

[crystal hill]

I think it's a waste of time and effort, but to each their own

[cosmic pagoda]

sometimes crispy

[crystal hill]

hell, isn't the source code for all of these publicy available?

[woven swallow]

it's not vanilla enough he says....

[crystal hill]

unless github dies then the code wont be lost

[hoary folio]

I think i tried dsda once

pretty solid port overall

[median cloud]

Same but I like playing some of the 90s wads under a purely vanilla setting like chocolate doom. But chocolate doom's hiccups are becoming too grating

Like doom zero is something I'd play under choco doom but I cba maxing those maps without some form of feedback

[hoary folio]

i think for classic doom other than the kex port i used prboom-plus

was the only port i ever remembered for the classic doom experience prior to the release of the kex port

[median cloud]

I see dsdadoom as a continuation of prboom

[crystal hill]

having all these ports available is a little confusing

[woven swallow]

do you play it for only just for the pixelated dos aesthetic orrr

[hoary folio]

prboom actually is why i have my field of view at 105 in most shooters

i think prboom capped it at 105 or something

i forget the default field of view for doom, i think it’s either 65 or 90

[woven swallow]

90

[bitter shoal]

yeah, I was gonna say OG DOOM probably didn't have any consideration for FOV and just thought of everything in 45 degree angles so 90. That and using multi monitor turned the view in 90 increments to the direct sides so that was further proof

[median cloud]

Kinda

low res and 35 fps

[hoary folio]

i actually don’t like the pixelated graphics i’ve never liked it since i started playing doom

[crystal hill]

what do you mean by pixellated?

[bitter shoal]

closest thing DOOM had to anisotrophic filtering was running a blurry CRT, so it is fair tno tlike the 320x200 look since it isn't really the full representation of running it old school anyway.

[woven swallow]

then just use dsda, cap the frames at 35 and lower the resulation to 320x200. not to mention it too supports strict vanilla compatibility (unlike zdoom ports)

[hoary folio]

gzdoom does iirc cause i turned it on as recently as yesterday

idk about the zdoom port, though, it’s been years since i’ve used specifically ZDoom

[crystal hill]

vanilla comp on GZDoom isn't strict compatibility

[median cloud]

Yeah but then I need to change those settings every time I want to change aesthetic

[hoary folio]

there is a doom (strict) compat also

[woven swallow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1167762378197311528/1456176114677321932/nugg0000.png?ex=69843c30&is=6982eab0&hm=95f4ee55895041978d7ff3c708ad0b57d1eabe797dac7de9e788e47cd70ee208 maybe this

[median cloud]

It's just easier for me to have another port for this specifically

[bitter shoal]

yeah, a CRT would have softened that up a bit. Not entirely but a little

[hoary folio]

not that, but the term i used was wrong my bad

i’ve never played doom on a res that low

[bitter shoal]

you know what the best part is

you can lower the screensize to get an even lower resolution

ROTT telling you "get a 386"

[hoary folio]

isn’t that done on the other console ports of doom

to up the performance

[bitter shoal]

it is an option in every PC version of the game. Only 3DO doom has screen size changing as far as consoles go

[woven swallow]

wha?

[median cloud]

I like some wads in 35 fps low res and some wads in 1080p uncapped fps

If I play ancient aliens, eviternity etc I want the latter

if I play fava beans or whatever I want the former

[crystal hill]

odd

[hoary folio]

i don’t cap my fps unless i’m on my handheld pc

[median cloud]

I would have to change my settings all the time it's just easier to have an oldschool port and a newschool port

[median cloud]

It's just to experience it how people back in the day experienced it

by the time eviternity was released the more dsda doom look was the norm

in the 90s 35 fps low res was the norm

[crystal hill]

personally, I like everything looking as clean and crisp as possible, regardless of how it looked back then

[woven swallow]

crispy doom for vanilla mods
and Limit removing, boom, mbf and mbf21 for dsda
problem solved

[median cloud]

A big appeal to Doom is the retroness it brings, for me

[crystal hill]

(that and I dont like most 90s wads)

[median cloud]

Yeah that's what I'm going with :p

[hoary folio]

doom itself is retro whether ur playing on a crt or a 4K monitor but to each their own if you enjoy it who’s to stop you

[median cloud]

Basically can use crispy doom for anything that runs in complevel 2 and dsda doom for complevel 9 or 21

tho I will def play augur zenith in dsda doom lol

[twin mortar]

Xbox 360 lets you do it too for... some... reason

Genuinely no idea why anyone would use it

[crystal hill]

I like having a unified port for everything I play

playing lillith in ZDoom was a weird experience in and of itself, minus the intentionally fucky wad

[hoary folio]

i use kex port for classic doom and gzdoom for modded shenanigans and if i were to go back to a genuine pc id probably use dsda

[median cloud]

I think dsda doom is best for regular wad playthroughs and uzdoom for everything modded

[crystal hill]

I'm planning on playing the official wads in Kex for the novelty and the achievements next time I play them

[median cloud]

rest is just personal preference

[hoary folio]

uzdoom is pretty good, i’m sad that it’s broken on macos right now

[median cloud]

People talk a lot about Woof but I find it meh, iirc you can't even change the complevel in woof

[hoary folio]

audio just does not work for some reason

[woven swallow]

yes you can

[crystal hill]

really? thats a shame

it works fine on linux, minus the icon being a generic gear thing so it looks bad

[median cloud]

I couldn't find the setting at all, I had to change all the comp flags manually instead of just selecting the complevel I wanted

[hoary folio]

yeah audio doesn’t work at all and the devs have acknowledged it pretty sure they’re trying to fix it

otherwise it runs well, and it’s the only reason why i’m still using gzdoom right now

[crystal hill]

very fair

its pretty much the same as GZ right now, so there's no massive incentive to switch

[hoary folio]

i think once zscript gets updated again there will be

because i already know a few mods that’ll force those updates 😭

[crystal hill]

yeah eventually it'll be different

[woven swallow]

just launch it througha cmd lin, .bat file or even a launcher

[hoary folio]

ahem project brutality

[woven swallow]

you can even change the complevel using the cheat code TNTCOMP

[median cloud]

Then I'd just rather use dsdadoom that has it as a setting icl

[crystal hill]

you shouldnt need to learn coding to change a setting like that

that just sounds like a real pain in the ass

[median cloud]

I do remember Woof having a better, more responsive mouse than dsda doom

but I think I somewhat fixed that by going exclusive fullscreen

[hoary folio]

changing what, complevel?

[crystal hill]

in that way, yes

[hoary folio]

complevel could be changed using ZDL

[median cloud]

How? I use ZDL

[hoary folio]

-complevel xyz

[median cloud]

by adding it as additional parameter?

[hoary folio]

yes

[crystal hill]

I'd forget about that immediately

I once put in a -nomo parameter and played a wad for 15 minutes without realising that was still in there

[hoary folio]

you can also use it for stuff like dsda and prboom-plus

ZDL is a goated launcher i used it even for gzdoom stuff

although on my mac i use justlaunchdoom and i think it also supports command line parameters

[crystal hill]

I keep all my favourite wads on ZDL at all times, just crossed out, for easy access

its getting a bit cluttered but oh well

[median cloud]

Maybe just typing it in ZDL is easier than manually changing it in the options menu

[hoary folio]

JustLaunchDoom is pretty solid, I prob might use it when i go back to windows

[crystal hill]

Never heard of that

I've used ZDL for years and have had next to no issues with it

[hoary folio]

i heard of it while looking for a mac doom launcher

works well

[woven swallow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1167762378197311528/1468541866709352539/woof0000.png?ex=698465b1&is=69831431&hm=2abcbad347e0b8c9fb35ea2ef92105f47eb1ecc51c6cb45f44873952f6dd37d8& https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1167762378197311528/1468541601331810438/woof0002.png?ex=69846571&is=698313f1&hm=5b5d3827665218d02961855e703ef1b4340ef08c90f94a0c51dbfcccd8a2a2c0&

[median cloud]

I swear I downloaded Woof like a week ago and deleted it because it didn't have that setting

Maybe it was another setting that it was missing that I misremembered

Either way there was something missing from Woof that made me dislike it

[hoary folio]

I know when I had a shitty laptop

[woven swallow]

and that is?

[hoary folio]

I used beta builds of a gzdoom fork

[median cloud]

Can't remember, thought it was that compatibility setting. Maybe it got removed in later versions?

Could've also been widescreen support?

[hoary folio]

qzdoom is such a good gz fork im sad its never been updated for a long while now

[crystal hill]

were they less intensive?

[median cloud]

Or maybe woof doesn't let you change resolution

it was something like this

[hoary folio]

qzdoom was much less intensive than gzdoom

i still feel gzdoom has optimization issues, but that might just be bc i had shitty hardware

[crystal hill]

well, you need a lot of time and motivation to keep up source ports

[crystal hill]

it absolutely does

I have a pretty good PC, should be more than enough to play Doom. I get major frame rate drops when playing Nuts. But when I open up pr boom plus, it runs flawlessly

[hoary folio]

I think that’s just like code differences tbh

[crystal hill]

?

[hoary folio]

i think people have said before that you shouldn’t play nuts in ports like gzdoom cause it just is super bad performance wise

[crystal hill]

yeah, the code differences makes GZ far less optimised

[median cloud]

I think Woof doesn't let you change resolution or force a widescreen

[woven swallow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1167762378197311528/1468542799820357805/woof0001.png?ex=6984668f&is=6983150f&hm=5496d1c8996ba2d2f07c308172ff21cb72d9872dafb621a9d8a25d5ef7ac27c5
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1167762378197311528/1468543073847083008/woof0002.png?ex=698466d1&is=69831551&hm=c99323e08eb60591566014ece6a20f910a32c931db81e8cc59986f63baf2faac

[crystal hill]

you seem hell bent on converting him to woof

[hoary folio]

why does it have resolution scale?

[median cloud]

yeah that was it! It was the resolution

[hoary folio]

i’ve never understood the reasoning behind resolution scale for doom

[median cloud]

Doesn't let me set an actual res but uses some weird res scale

and ig no stretched status bar

[hoary folio]

odamex is another port i remember using

mainly for multiplayer i think…

[woven swallow]

stretched as in widescreen?

[crystal hill]

yeah, odamex is a multiplayer source port

[woven swallow]

if yes then it does have that, i turned it off to match 4:3

[hoary folio]

for modded doom it was skulltag and zandronum and odamex for classic doom

[median cloud]

Odamex was... okay

I was more into playing CTF and stuff and odamex' netcode used to be horrible

[cosmic pagoda]

playing vanilla stuff in 4:3 aspect ratio changes the experience far more than the specific resolution does btw

it feels quite different, more than it logically should

[median cloud]

There's added difficulty to playing at a low res with 35 fps cap

You see things in the distance less easily and the lower frames makes it harder to react to stuff

but I gotta say it does feel good to play in that setup I always find my aim pretty crisp on choco doom

[cosmic pagoda]

I absolutely love the way arch viles can induce sheer panic in maps

[desert tinsel]

Odamex is getting new netcode right now actually. The team just got a new patch last week and more is coming

And it has dsdhacked now so it can run eviternity II and legacy of rust servers

[crystal hill]

If you like puzzle wads, The Given is really cool on that front. It also looks beautiful and has some cool lore to it

[native anchor]

No there isn’t.

[crystal hill]

yes there is

being less able to tell what is ahead of you will make you less able to react to it

[median cloud]

? Ofcourse there is

[native anchor]

Not for me.

[median cloud]

In every game ever a lower framerate is a disadvantage

[crystal hill]

good for you

[median cloud]

This isn't about you though

[native anchor]

I still can sightread in Chocolate Doom despite the 200p resolution.

[crystal hill]

its like saying that if I forced you to put on blurry glasses, you would play exactly as well as you would without them

[median cloud]

Yes so can I man. I beat Hell Revealed and Alien Vendetta on Choco Doom pistol start

but it's still harder than current source ports

[crystal hill]

exactly

harder =/= impossible

[woven venture]

Oh shitttt, Official ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIA-NAI-QBU

[crystal hill]

what even is this?

[little oar]

Unless this is an official rerelease of RPG what purpose does this serve that can't be fixed by buying DOOM on...well, anything else

Portability isn't a plus because DOOM is on switch and phone
Sure as hell won't have any benefit of being a console since oh hey, DOOM is on those too

[crystal hill]

also on steam deck and it's clones

[little oar]

Quick research into what an 'evercade' is and it's a console that still uses cartridges
Alright I guess. More ways for DOOM to be ported isn't awful but there's that ig

[crystal hill]

I wonder what the price will be

[zenith berry]

The Duke Nukem Evercade collection consists of not only the first two 2D titles but also has the PS1 version of 3D and its other exclusive titles.

I have a feeling that not only we’ll get classic Doom but also its console port variants.

[twin mortar]

A port of a Rayman GBC game to a similiar system costed 50 dollars, so I don't think this will be pretty

[little oar]

If this is how we get a ps1 doom port then I'm gonna be kind of bummed

[crystal hill]

Amen

[little oar]

You lock it to some UK-based console instead of something way more accessible

[crystal hill]

I want to play it officially for the new levels it offers

[little oar]

At least with Duke Nukem you can still buy 1 and 2 on PC so it's not as much of a crime in that case

[zenith berry]

Maybe GBA? Though aside from cosmetic and optimization differences the content is mostly the same as the DOS version

[crystal hill]

(shame its only on Zoom because Randy is an ass)

[crystal hill]

there'd be little point to porting the GBA version

[zenith berry]

Yeah true

[little oar]

Can't imagine people would be going out of their way to buy DOOM gba ngl

[zenith berry]

I bet it’s going to be either the PSX version or RPGs, or maybe just Doom + Doom II.

The fire thing in the video is giving me the PSX/Saturn title screen tho.

[little oar]

Hooray...

I guess one upside to this is that it shows they still have access to the ps1 ports code and are willing/able to rerelease it if they please

[crystal hill]

hopefully they can release it as DLC or something for the kex port

[little oar]

May be weird to have two different engines but combining it would be nice

Unless they remake it in kex ig

[crystal hill]

@median cloud I havent felt as frustrated playing Map 11 of Disjunction as I have in a year or more playing Doom. I've tried to push myself to beat it for a whole day, but it's not worth it

the final fight takes so much to get to and needs to go perfectly for you to stand a chance. It's not great

I think the map itself is fine, I'm just bad and frustrated, but I feel the need to quit for the sake of my blood pressure

[median cloud]

Havent checked that wad out yet but it does sound tough

[crystal hill]

its only map 10 that seems like absolute BS on UV

I could have grinded out map 9 and 11's endings eventually

[woven venture]

Sadly, Doom + Doom II not include legacy console port

[cosmic pagoda]

that evi1 map32 fight with archviles tho

I dont remember it being that hard

the one where you hit a switch in a room full of caged archies

[modern peak]

i mean why would you want to play the unity version anyway

[crystal hill]

Doom 1 + 2 on PC does include the Unity port

PC gaming in general is far more customisable than consoles

[twin mortar]

For the original music at a hearable level

[cosmic pagoda]

wdym hearable level

you can change volumes in options on all source ports

[twin mortar]

D+D2's Bobby Prince OST is like, super turbo quiet for some reason

I'm on console

[cosmic pagoda]

oh console

weird

[crystal hill]

can you not adjust it?

[twin mortar]

I have it set to max

[cosmic pagoda]

otherwise, afaik unity is not demo compatible due to the sr50 by default thing, not that it matters on console

[modern peak]

the humble steam machine

unfortunate that only god knows when it will even release

if it even will

[crystal hill]

why wouldn't it?

[modern peak]

something something economy

[crystal hill]

you know what could help with that?>

selling a product to earn money

[woven venture]

Nightdive studios port better Unity port

But never add legacy home console and handheld console version

[pastel wedge]

which is better DOOM + DOOM II or Doom Classic Complete?

[crystal hill]

the former. It has a lot more content

Doom + Doom II has No Rest for the Living and Legacy of Rust (plus Sigil 1 and 2 which are freely available elsewhere)

also it has the mod browser, especially good on consoles

[thorny nest]

I thought Doom Classic Complete was delisted?

[crystal hill]

it is. I don't know why the question is being asked

[twin mortar]

There's a physical copy of the Steam bundle but that gives you D+D2 anyway

They might own the game on PS3 and are just asking because they wanna know which one to play next. DCC also has NRFTL

[crystal hill]

does it? Doomwiki says otherwise

[twin mortar]

The PSN release also includes No Rest for the Living, which is absent in the Steam release.

From the same page

[crystal hill]

ahhh, its a bit hidden

the classic bundle lists NRFTL as one of the games, classic complete mentions it later

[pastel wedge]

I can still buy a steam key

[twin mortar]

That'll give you D+D2

[crystal hill]

Yeah

I'd suggest you buy it directly on Steam or GOG

[twin mortar]

DOOM Classic Complete, as in, the actual seperate game of that name, was a PS3 exclusive

If you can get your hands on a sealed physical copy with the key intact then that has more content technically. But they're pretty rare and expensive iirc so no shot (talking about the Steam version here btw!)

[thorny nest]

Yeah, the Xbox alternative I think was Doom and Doom 2 on XBLA

[twin mortar]

Indeed. DCC had really ugly menus and bland trophies but it did have more content

[pastel wedge]

And all day I can't decide which version is better to buy.

[crystal hill]

couldnt you look it up?

[twin mortar]

They are basically the same release except you'll also get the delisted DOS versions of Final DOOM and Master Levels (what's the use case here though?) and Unity DOOM II with DCC

[thorny nest]

I’d say Doom + Doom II hands down for legacy of rust alone

[twin mortar]

If you care for those niche delisted games then yeah sure whatever go for DCC. If you don't then just buy D+D2. If you want everything and don't care about it being on Steam then just get it on GOG. You'll be getting D+D2 in every single one of these options anyway

[crystal hill]

what're the delisted games?

[twin mortar]

^, so the original seperate releases of Final DOOM, Master Levels, and DOOM II

[crystal hill]

You can just take those wads and play them through a source port of your choosing

I imagine you could use some tech wizardy to play them on Dosbox as well, if you so desire

[twin mortar]

They run on DOSBox out of the box

They're cool for novelty, if you like collecting delisted media, but that's genuinely the only reason to get your hands on these, aside from Unity

[crystal hill]

see, if you're so hyper specific about your Doom releases, you would already have the delisted DOS versions

or would know front to back all of this stuff we're discussing

[crystal hill]

you can play the Unity port on Doom 1 + 2

[twin mortar]

Not of DOOM II

[pastel wedge]

is there no final doom in the 2024 edition?

[crystal hill]

there is

[crystal hill]

weird

Ignoring wads, I guess it would be more important to have Doom 1's unity port than Doom 2's

[twin mortar]

Not sure why they didn't just make DOOM + DOOM II a seperate library entry like they did with Heretic + Hexen and with DOOM + DOOM II on like, every single other platform

[crystal hill]

overcrowding?

before the 2024 release, they consolidated Doom series games a bit

[twin mortar]

Ehh idk if overcrowding is the reason, especially since H+H arguably overcrowds harder

Well, not arguably, it's straight up fact

D+D2 serves to replace two games while H+H serves to replace three

[thorny nest]

Something interesting I found about the different releases is the medkit textures. The original disc release of each game had a Red Cross on the medkit, the bfg edition and I think the unity ports changed it to a pill icon, then the 2024 release changed it to a green cross

[crystal hill]

D+D2 replaces more than two games

[twin mortar]

Green cross is since Unity; Eternal uses pills, because it uses the BFG Edition ports as a base

[thorny nest]

I see, that makes sense

[crystal hill]

Doom 1 and 2, Master Levels (which is gone from my library now) and Final Doom

[twin mortar]

I mean games as in Steam library entries. Post the 2022 consolidation, it was just DOOM (1993) and DOOM II

I have heard about Master Levels being gone. I heard something about that obscure physical DCC release being the only way to keep them

[twin mortar]

I get that they were going for the whole 90s computer vibe but they should have used the sickass Xbox 360 menus for this port. They are AWESOME and deserve to be featured in more than one release

[crystal hill]

not the case

D1 + D2 has the one big master levels wad, but they've also got all the individual master levels too

and the original text files

[twin mortar]

No I meant the library entry

Like, the seperate release of the Master Levels

[crystal hill]

Would you really care about that?

[twin mortar]

About what?

[crystal hill]

having a seperate Master Levels exe on Steam

[twin mortar]

No not really

[crystal hill]

plus, you can use dosbox on those wads manually

[twin mortar]

I wasn't advocating for anyone to go out of their way to buy DCC because of it, I was just saying what I know on the subject :p

[median cloud]

@crystal hill Ancient Aliens map 16 is pretty amazing

[crystal hill]

ohh yes

it's the peak of AA's "adventure" spirit

feels like you're going on an interplanetary road trip, not playing a Doom map

god I love that wad

I slept on it so hard in the past

[drowsy beacon]

Was able to get 100% secrets on D2 map27 after several hundred failed teleporter linedef skips. feels good man.

[median cloud]

@crystal hill gave up on maxxing map 18 tho

i cba to max an icon of sin map

[crystal hill]

I didn't either, lol

[median cloud]

crazy how decino maxxed it like first try

[crystal hill]

you can certainly maxx icon of sin maps, but I never do so

[median cloud]

just cba to figure out which monsters are real

[median cloud]

k I was stubborn and maxed it anyway hahaha

its rng tho

[crystal hill]

I'm sure I could also manage it, but I follow the MtPain rule of not bothering to UV Max Icon maps

[median cloud]

I understand that

[crystal hill]

Gotta save the blood pressure, lol

right now, what's fuelling me is the anticipation of playing Golden Souls 2 again

[median cloud]

I played that a bit but never finished it

Possibly my pc couldnt handle it at that time lol

But iirc that was golden souls 1

[crystal hill]

I'm going through possible withdrawals on that game

Since I first played Golden Souls 1 and 2, I've replayed them once a year. But since I started the cacoward list thing, I've decided not to play anything ahead of schedule to not bias myself

Which means I had to hold off on replaying Golden Souls 1 for a year, even longer for the second one. This is a slight problem because they're some of my favourite Doom wads. The second IS my favourite, period, if you count it as Doom

[crystal hill]

weeeeeell, GS2 is only going to be more intensive

GS1 has smaller, shorter levels. GS2 ones can get real damn long

[median cloud]

Im happy Im having so much fun with classic doom

[crystal hill]

As am I. This year long marathon has unearthed a lot of gems I didn't know about, gotten some creators into my headspace permanently

[grave bane]

Idk if this is the right channel but does purchasing delta touch give you a license automatically or do you have to provide for your own WAD? I have the master collection on steam so i can port it whenever but i want to make sure first

[halcyon willow]

Why would delta touch give you a license for doom

It's a port

[pastel wedge]

or BFG edition?

[covert swan]

Delta Touch doesn't come with WADs.

[covert swan]

Doom + Doom II, because it contains doom, doom II, plutonia, tnt, master levels, no rest for the living, sigil, sigil 2 and new Legacy of Rust expansions, also has cross platform multiplayer and some QoL improvements. Whereas Doom Classic Complete comes with only doom, doom II, TNT, plutonia, Master Levels and no rest for the living doesn't have cross platform multiplayer (if it has multiplayer at all).
BFG Edition has awful sound pitching feature, also doom and doom2 wads are modified (pill instead of red cross on stimpacks and medkits and etc.).

Haven't seen anybody playing BFG Edition in multiplayer, as well.

Even if you don't like Doom + Doom II port itself, you could grab wads from there and play them with the help of source-ports.

And finally, Doom Classic Complete got delisted on Steam, unless you're playing on playstation (I dunno whether it got delisted there as well or no).

[karmic cliff]

Did Doom 1 + 2 fuck with the classic Doom games in some way?

[covert swan]

Rerelease version yes. But since it contains OG dos versions as well, it's not a big deal.

You could just grab OG versions and use them with source-ports.

[woven swallow]

No

[halcyon willow]

No. The wad files are the same. It's functionally a source port

[covert swan]

I wasn't really happy about green crosses on medkits

So yeah

Doom source-ports usually distinguish in their launchers whether it's doom2.wad or Doom2.wad (KEX edition)

I've seen that in Odamex and UZDoom

[karmic cliff]

That and I think the secret wolfenstein level was censored.
Aside from censorship, its probably my favorite port of Doom 1 & 2.
Especially since Andrew Hulshult's ost. His remixes might've replaced the original versions for me.

[covert swan]

Yeah, I just remembered. It got censored, you're right.

I play doom both with fan made source-ports and with Doom + Doom II. I don't mind, honestly.

It just was a lil bit frustrating to see censorship.

Despite those issues, Doom + Doom II is still a decent port. (I wish netcode was improved too)

[karmic cliff]

Yeah, I don't agree with censorship at all.
If you ever played Cod Zombies, the WaW maps with nazi imagery was censored in their BlOps 3 counterparts. Completely ruins the setting and fact these maps take place in WW2 or had involvement with Nazi Germany.

[covert swan]

I like the approach of new Wolfenstein games. If I recall correctly, they didn't use swastika, but created new design for them (since it's about alternative future).

Not like censorship in Doom + Doom II is critical for me, but yeah, as I said, a bit frustrating.

[karmic cliff]

Just searched it up as a refresher.
It's like a triangle. Like if you took the lines of the swastika and made it invert on itself. As if it was strangling whatever it has in its hold.

Though I never see it in my version of Wolfenstein when I play them. Always get the normal swastika. Thought I remembered it being doubled. Like an interior and exterior swastika.

[covert swan]

It has been a while when I played New Order, Old Blood and New Colossus, but either I am blind or my memory is bad. I don't really recall the real swastika, but those triangles, instead.

[karmic cliff]

My memory is shit, so I get that. Probably thanks to personal life abuse and trauma. Lol
Think there might've been a censor option, if I recall.

[covert swan]

I am sorry to hear that.

Keep strong.

The life road might be full of obstacles, but the result is very rewarding

Remember, someone out there cares about you.

Thank God, Doom helps to get distracted from that. Especially when you had a bad day, good to RIP and TEAR those demons to chill.

[karmic cliff]

My life has been better since the worst years of my life. And I hope those stay the worst years of my life.
I still live with my mother and brother, they're always there for me as I am for them. Hate being alone, my mental health would be too much if I was truly alone. So I stay with them.

[vivid parcel]

Aww man lol i thought it was not you that's why i deleted my first text but I hope you get all the happiness you deserve and I really hope you're fine now? Take care buddy

And your never alone I can be here anytime you can ping me whatever

[crystal hill]

I think I have a chronic allergy to Ribbicks' work

I've started playing Stardate 20X7, and even on HMP (as recommended) its kicking my ass. I'm sure I can beat it eventually, but I kind of don't want to. It'll be like overcoming a rake I'm stepping on just to step on another rake down the line

[median cloud]

His stuff is just ridiculously hard

His maps are grand, amazingly made and have crazy depth to the combat. They're also basically later Sunlust levels of hard

[crystal hill]

I can probably count on my one hand the levels of his I've enjoyed

[median cloud]

I'm not sure I'm gonna play his stuff either

[crystal hill]

All of them do look beautiful, though. I'll give him that

[median cloud]

I'm quite happy with beating the old guard of hard wads first

[crystal hill]

Even his supposedly easier mapset, Crumpets, was a pain to play near the end, so I gave up

Unfortunately, he is very prolific in the community. He gets a wad into the cacowards pretty much every year now

I wonder what blood ritual I'd need to do to make Cyriak map that frequently

[median cloud]

His wads are good though

Just above my skill level

These days Sunlust is seen as a top 3 wad of all time but f me if that stuff isn't hard

[crystal hill]

I guess I can't call them bad

Especially not with my bias

[crystal hill]

I wonder if the people are masochists, or if they have enough sense to play on easier skill levels

Give me Going Down any day of the week

[median cloud]

I think a bit of both. A lot of people also just play with saves and don't care about uv pistol start

[crystal hill]

Ahhh, true

[median cloud]

the ones that do have probably improved so much to the point they can beat sunlust

[crystal hill]

With saves, even Swim with the Whales was quite easy

[median cloud]

I've played Sunder map 1 - 14 and 31 but I did it with saves inbetween fights and I found it a fun experience

Same for sunlust map 30

I don't "save scum" but I did just save after every main fight

[crystal hill]

Even saving like that would remove a lot of the challenge imo

Very fair if you want to play that way, but I hate myself a little too much to do that

[median cloud]

Yeah but I just cba to play an hour long or two hour long marathon of a map where I'm not even certain I have one fight beaten

Especially as a first experience to the map

Sunder is the type of wad you don't just first try pistol start

[crystal hill]

Well, neither can I. But thats the beauty of doom, I dont have to

There are dozens of wads I know I like that I could play instead. I'm spoilt for choice

[median cloud]

But you do miss on a lot of grand wads and mappacks by just avoiding them imo

[crystal hill]

True enough. I give everything a chance

But I do not hold myself to finishing any of them. Even stuff I really honestly like (Disjunction)

I'll come back to that eventually and likely love it, when I've cooled down and have prior experience

Maybe I can do that with Sunlust. I got further this playthrough than on prior ones

And if I do miss out on something great, oh well. I have so many other excellent wads on my list

[modern peak]

not entirely sure if i like AA, though ive only played the first 3 maps

somethings just off idk

to me it feels too different

might have to look into some other like more vanilla oriented wads

[median cloud]

It's a really good mappack imo but it does feel more advanced than pure vanilla

[crystal hill]

Ancient Aliens feeling off? I dont get how

I think its boom compatibile, but many wads are

[median cloud]

Yeah it's cl9

Ancient aliens never appealed to me either tbh I just played it out of reputation

Except that one map in the clouds

But it's been really good

[crystal hill]

Until doing my cacowards odyssey, I've never loved Skillsaw and his maps

With the exception of Vanguard, which was one of my earliest played wads, alongside stuff like Plut 2 and Golden Souls, so it coasted by on nostalgia (mostly)

But now I've grown much fonder of every wad of his Ive played, AA especially

Except for Vanguard, actually. Unlike Plut 2, I think nostalgia is the main reason I still like it to the degree Ido

[wintry copper]

I don't think I'd ever be able to beat Sunlust without spending a disproportionate amount of time on it lmao

yea Vanguard from what I've played is pretty good

[crystal hill]

Vanguard is probably best suited as an introduction to Skillsaw

[median cloud]

Not ancient aliens?

[modern peak]

yeah it is but it just has such a unique vibe compared to the original games and whatnot that it just doesnt entirely sit right with me

[crystal hill]

Nope

Vanguard is shorter and easier. Its also aesthetically and atmospherically more basic

I'm of the belief that you should never start a series with the best entry, since you'll just be disappointed every other time

[crystal hill]

Odd, but to each their own

[median cloud]

Just played fava beans

[crystal hill]

what do you think?

[pastel wedge]

original doom 1 removed from steam?

[crystal hill]

have you looked this up yourself?

[median cloud]

Just okay basically an E1 remake

Not bad tbh

[pastel wedge]

doom is not available in my steam region

[crystal hill]

see, I hate E1 remakes now because of how bloody many I've had to play by now

[twin mortar]

No, it was just turned into D+D2. You can revert it back by right clicking the game, pressing properties, going to betas, and swapping out your version for the Unity release

[crystal hill]

However, Fava Beans was one of the first ones, so it's not the one to blame for it

[median cloud]

Yep 1994 haha

[crystal hill]

on its own, and for it's age, it's quite solid

even in 1995, this may be top of the pile

I liked H2H Xmas more in my playthrough of them because it was wackier and looked more unique

but objectively and fairly speaking, Fava is likely a superior product

well, Nostromo's Run was also decent

[pastel wedge]

that is, if I buy the steam key Doom Classic Complete bundle, will I get the first doom only as a reissue of DOOM + DOOM II?

[twin mortar]

If you buy the bundle you will only get D+D2 because DOOM 1 became D+D2, yes

[crystal hill]

if you insist on playing the original for some reason, you can do so via D+D2

[raven pawn]

So you remember lan multiplayer?

[median cloud]

Why does my ZDL sometimes reset config?

[crystal hill]

what config?

[median cloud]

my zdl just sometimes becomes blank while my source ports etc are gone

[crystal hill]

really?

never had that issue in my years of using it on linux

[calm lichen]

That actually happened to me a few months ago

[woven swallow]

Same here...

[crystal hill]

which version do you have installed?

[livid light]

found a github issue about the same problem on lcferrum’s repo and someone said they had to delete their qzdl.ini file and replace it with their own
i dont use zdl tho so idk much about it

[summer creek]

Where is doom 64?

[crystal hill]

this is the channel to talk about it

[halcyon willow]

I agree Vanguard is the best starting point for Skillsaw's work, but I also think it's his best

[crystal hill]

really?

It feels the most bland and standard of the lot. Even Lunatic has more going for it

[halcyon willow]

I fucking love Vanguard

Easily the best combat design of his work

Valiant drags after episode 4, Ancient Aliens is kinda all over the place for me

Slaughter maps are my favourite combat style and Vanguard is the one that leans most heavily into that (Superstructure )

[crystal hill]

Ehhh

Superstructure blows its load early and doesn't really recover after that

[halcyon willow]

I haven't played Heartland so I can't make a comment on that

[crystal hill]

I dont see the need to have it on an engine no one uses

[halcyon willow]

It's a 15 minute map? The whole thing is early lol

[crystal hill]

I meant in the opening room

[halcyon willow]

Eternity has features no other port does

Mappers choose ports for a reason

[crystal hill]

but more than one port supports, say, boom features

[halcyon willow]

And?

[crystal hill]

or mbf 21 features

[halcyon willow]

That's irrelvant

[crystal hill]

it would be convenient for more people to play it

[halcyon willow]

It takes 3 seconds to download a source port

[crystal hill]

and then get it working, and configuring it

[halcyon willow]

And shining a light on a less used port is an objectively good thing

[crystal hill]

what if its less used for a reason?

[halcyon willow]

"Get it working" which is clicking the exe

So difficult!

[crystal hill]

whatever, man

[halcyon willow]

Go whine at Skillsaw if you think he's made a bad decision

Eternity's portal suite allow for geometry pretty much impossible to create in any other port (not counting models in UZDoom et al). Skillsaw wanted to make use of that, and did so extensively

[median cloud]

Is this needed for heartland?

[halcyon willow]

?

Is what needed for Heartland

If you mean Eternity, yes that's the port it runs in

[median cloud]

yeah I meant that

I didnt know it needed a seperate port

[twin mortar]

Mod discourse has me glad I really don't care enough to go deep into DOOM modding

[hoary folio]

only exists due to differing opinions on whats good and bad

[cinder sapphire]

not sure you'd cross that out. it's a pretty accurate take.

[dawn stream]

From where can I download Final Doom? I have both Doom games from 90s but I want to play Plutonia and TnT. Is there a way to get these games seperatly anymore?

[little oar]

The doom 1 + 2 game on steam gives you the wad files you need for both Final DOOM expansions

It also has both expansions as part of it, too

[modest summit]

Ijust downloaded doom II from GOG. Isn't there a keyboard/mouse setups screen?

[median cloud]

man I fucking hate cyberdemons at the end of a map

[median cloud]

alright beat ancient aliens map 23

map 24 will be for tomorrow, amazing map

[crystal hill]

you're making good progress

[median cloud]

Yeah I died at the end of 23 got on my nerves a bit

[crystal hill]

Map 23 is a map I didn't bother finishing after dying halfway through. I didn't care enough

I've beaten harder maps before, so I had nothing to prove

[median cloud]

Yeah I understand that wasnt a fun one but I knew that if I quit now I would be looking against it

[median cloud]

Yeah its not a hard map per se, very long and open

[crystal hill]

I guess I can try and finish it next playthrough

[median cloud]

not very fun tbf

Hyped for 24 tho

[crystal hill]

I gave up on the last two levels of Ancient Aliens on my first playthrough because I was so sick and tired of it after all I went through

I had a VERY bad time during said playthrough. Map 13 was the absolute bane of my existence

[crystal hill]

it rivals auger zenith in terms of beauty and wow factor

[median cloud]

Its dangerous

If 25 is a shit map or an annoying one I could be at risk of dropping AA after

[crystal hill]

it is anything but

thats a weird statement to make, though. Is Ancient Aliens not to your liking so far?

[median cloud]

It is but 24 is the one I was looking mist forward to

So im just at risk of burnout after

[crystal hill]

I don't see why

the rest of the maps are quite good, and you're approaching the end

Burnout it something you tend to experience near the middle of something, not the end

[median cloud]

Not for me

All wads I drop are near the end

[crystal hill]

thats weird

[median cloud]

Av at 25, speed of doom at 23, eviternity 2 at 27, pl2 at 29, hr at 26

After completing a grand or tough map I just lack the willpower to start a new tough map often

[crystal hill]

I recommend playing two wads at once and alternating

If you beat a tough hard map in one, switch to the other for a shorter map or two to cool off

AA only has map 28 as a significant challenge before the end now

[median cloud]

I did beat fava beans today lolol

Maybe I just gott start augur zenith

[crystal hill]

theres one or two tough maps there, but on the whole its quite easy

(something that hampers my enjoyment a little, even)

meanwhile, I've got down to the last 5 wads of 2017, so I could be done by the end of this weekend

[median cloud]

Ya mtpain had it as a C+ or smth

I wonder what ancient aliens map I like the least

[crystal hill]

Water Spirit from Manbou was nicely detailed with some good fights (two of the hardest ones being very cheesable with invuls for some reason)

[median cloud]

Probably map 31

That one was bad

[crystal hill]

Waterlab GZD is a pretty standard map, I think primarily made to show off water effects. Even still, the fights and pace are really snappy, I got through it much faster than I expected. In particularly I like the secret visual language of the wad - every time you see a static-y monitor, you know its a secret/theres a secret nearby

I hesitate to call that one bad, but it does not fit in with what Ancient Aliens is trying to do

AA is about exploring the world, whether its some American desert + ruins, space stations/planets there, the Alien homeworld or a mix of them all

Grey Dwarf has you secret hunting in a massive spaceship that looks bland in comparison to everything else

[median cloud]

Yeah I just didnt like it much

Its like a C for me

I like how dsda doom keeps level stats

[crystal hill]

and how does it do that?

[median cloud]

Just through a txt file it saves

Very bare bones and can be manually edited

[crystal hill]

ahh, saving your stats permanently?

I dont care after I leave the level, lol

[median cloud]

Yeah like you have a table to see all the maps you completed and the stats

[crystal hill]

I keep track of what maps I finish in a private discord server, just for the hell of it. And to see how "productive" I'm being

[median cloud]

Ahh too late

Maybe I shouldve done smth similar

Or rate every map I play

[crystal hill]

I don't rate em myself

I feel like that would actually generate burnout

Having to rate every map, let alone every wad, would feel like a chore more than anything

[median cloud]

Yeah true

[torpid yacht]

Im playing doom when I get my glasses back 👓

[robust timber]

Is there any wad that adds maps from Doom eternal or 2016?

[cinder sapphire]

not that I know of, but there is a mapset from Doom 3 and also a mod that makes the gameplay feel closer to Doom 2016.

[robust timber]

D4T?

[zenith berry]

Plenty of them, Embers of Armageddon is another example.

We also have Doom 4 Vanilla if you want to go retro.

[cinder sapphire]

Not sure I know what D4T is 🤔 but I was talkin about Doom 4 Vanilla, as Mondy said. and the Doom 3 mapset is called Proper DOOM 3 Demake. @robust timber

[smoky radish]

Anybody on PlayStation wanna play some classic doom wads?

[robust timber]

Oh okay

[robust timber]

Yeah amazing mod

[oak adder]

bouta start playing plutonia on uv

wish me luck

[smoky radish]

Anyone know if it's possible to play the blood mod on doom 1 + 2

[edgy creek]

damn sigl 2 is a bitvh

[oak adder]

okay im 6 maps in and uh...

yeesh it's brutal alright

[smoky radish]

Not that anyone cares but I figured I should tell people to spread it around I just started streaming doom on twitch I usually play wads and more if you give me a request

My twitch is nekro_nah

[torpid yacht]

You got this man

[oak adder]

thanks
btw "well of souls" has that one bridge section im like bruh

good thing im not pistol starting

I might enjoy plutonia more than evilution

mainly because the maps are more simple just excruciatingly different

[torpid yacht]

Evilution is annoying and draaags

Plutonia is a fresh air

Compared to tnt

[oak adder]

ghost town was...

interesting

yep a bunch of chaingunners, big spider, revenants, etc

and four arch-viles

I had the lure them out the room to kill them

[edgy creek]

Indeed, ive never been so bored

[sharp veldt]

https://youtu.be/-_gZriKG7h8?si=QeHSaoEvJ7dgDfrg

Nameless was a pretty cool map

[woven swallow]

if you mean Bloom then no, doom+doom2 is not a zdoom port it can't load mods like that

[smoky radish]

No I'm pretty sure it's called blood

[woven swallow]

can you post a link?

[smoky radish]

A link of what exactly

I remember the cover looked like this

[woven swallow]

the mod

[smoky radish]

It had a black background with doom font that said blood and then a hand

[modern peak]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/3884520/Blood_Refreshed_Supply/

Steam

Blood: Refreshed Supply™

Blood: Refreshed Supply follows Caleb, an undead gunslinger on a quest for revenge against his former demonic master, Tchernobog. Despite his once powerful position as a fearsome Cabal commander and one of Tchernobog’s “Chosen” few, Caleb and his fellow Chosen are betrayed by the dark god and slain for reasons unknown. Seeking answers and…

Price

$29.99

Recommendations

566

[smoky radish]

Yes this mod

[woven swallow]

ohhhh blood (1997)

[smoky radish]

Yes

[woven swallow]

that's not a mod, it's a standalone game

[smoky radish]

Sorry I should have clarified lol

Well I've seen someone play it but in doom?

[woven swallow]

that's bloom

[smoky radish]

Ohhh dang

[woven swallow]

https://www.moddb.com/mods/bloom-doomblood-crossover

[smoky radish]

Okay okay makes sense now

Thanks

And I did find a mod for this on doom 1 + 2

[woven swallow]

really?

[smoky radish]

Yes

[modern peak]

i doubt it actually works

[woven swallow]

....even then i don't think it would work

or even if it did load it's not gonna be the same

[smoky radish]

Yeah

[modern peak]

kex engine isnt based on zdoom

[smoky radish]

Its not the best

[woven swallow]

do you play on PC?

[smoky radish]

No

I play on ps5

The mod isn't the best but it gets the point across

It's just called BLOOD DOOM TC

It has a red hand on it and just says blood

I'm my opinion it's not the best but there are worse mods to come across on here

[cinder sapphire]

this one?

oh nvm. can't link.. :S

found a page for the one called BloodTC

if you search doomwiki you can find it

[median cloud]

@crystal hill do you have a favorite Doom soundtrack? Custom included

[crystal hill]

if we're going off of official wads, TNT. If we're including unofficial, it's very tough. Going Down has pretty much nothing but bangers, but reuses music a lot. Still probably my pick, with stuff like Ancient Aliens, Plut 2 and the Golden Souls games coming in close runners up

[median cloud]

I was more looking for an actual favorite song

Should've said song instead of soundtrack

[crystal hill]

oh, I see. Probably Sanctified from Plutonia 2

With chimpnology/whatever it's called in Going Down a close second

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RquIC8kPOyA

[median cloud]

That's from the snow map right?

Black Ice?

[crystal hill]

being attached to maybe my favourite level in Plut 2 helps. Black Ice, yeah

[median cloud]

That might be my fav plut 2 map

Also pretty tough iirc

[crystal hill]

kinda tough, but if you know to cheese the ending two cybers, its ok

[median cloud]

I've been listening to the Mucus Flow soundtrack on repeat now

[crystal hill]

kind of starves you for ammo, but I'm into that, so its all good

[median cloud]

yeah I remember that

[crystal hill]

I suppose this reminds me of something I could ask -

Do you have any songs and maps you have inextricably linked with each other? To the point where, even if you see them in other maps, you can't help but imagine "its the song from that map"?

[median cloud]

PL2 has a really good soundtrack. Map 10, 20, 24, 29

[median cloud]

Actually the song from the Mucus Flow I associate way more with sunder map 31. Imo it fits that map sooooooo incredibly well

Duke Nukem's plasma is also always associated with Alien Vendetta map 10 for me

[crystal hill]

Some of mine are Sanctified with Black Ice, of course, but also Happy Gardens with Map 1 of Golden Souls, Organic Gods with Jade Earth, Snatcher's Main Theme in Map 1 of Auger Zenith and Sadistic from TNT Map 1 (I remember a lot of map 1s)

[crystal hill]

heresy, absolute heresy. The Mucus Flow and that track may as well be married to each other. I've played a few maps that use it since, and ehhh

[crystal hill]

very good choice, considering its a pretty commonly used one

[median cloud]

Yeah that's true yet sunder map 31 fits it perfectly as well

It's the hardest map I've beaten to date (even with saves) but I loved playing it

[crystal hill]

I have a sliiiiight bias against Sunder

[median cloud]

I think it's fantastic just above my skill level

I won't uv pistol start those maps but they're an experience and the experience is often positive

They all look so grand and amazing as well

[crystal hill]

I tried playing Sunder one time. I instantly disliked it

that kind of mass slaughter really really isnt my thing. Even Sunlust lets you start off easy

[median cloud]

Yeah it's pure slaughter if you dislike that you cannot really like sunder

[crystal hill]

I don't like it, no. Will play it again soon, but I don't have high hopes

[median cloud]

@crystal hill also small correction it was a cybruiser not an afrit in eviternity map 19

[crystal hill]

Thats less painful. I also dont remember that conversation by now

[median cloud]

hahaha it was a while ago

[crystal hill]

Eviternity is on the horizon for me, though

I have a handful more wads from 2017 to play, then the 25 missed cacowards, then Doom 1's first three episodes, then I'll be onto 2018

[median cloud]

"25"

[crystal hill]

well, it was initially 25

then 5 years later it was 30something, then they decided to do another 5 every year

I cant wait for the 2020s where there's 4000 cacowards a year

[median cloud]

To be fair I think the overall quality also kept increasing over the years

I went through the old cacowads and they had some very meh mappacks

[crystal hill]

I don't disagree, from Alien Vendetta to Action Doom, there's a full on drought of good mapsets

IC2005 is the only truly great one in there

at least in the 90s, the mapsets were all quite short

[crystal hill]

one problem with my system is if I play two wads that are hard/I'm frustrated with

[median cloud]

Just add a third one

[crystal hill]

Because my short term memory is shot, I'd have some trouble remembering which order to play em in

I just skipped the levels I couldnt be arsed with. Neither of these wads are good enough for me to power through them

[crystal hill]

man, Return to Hadron Ep 2 is disappointing

Episode 1 is the first Doom 1 wad on my list (minus Sigil, thats technically on there but not really), I was super impressed by it. Ep 2 seems content to spam cyberdemons everywhere and call it a day

[median cloud]

My ZDL just keeps emptying on restart man

[crystal hill]

thats bizarre

what version are you using?

[median cloud]

3.1.1

[crystal hill]

Thats my exact version too. I don't know what the issue could be-

Right, does the ZDL keep emptying between you turning on your computer and turning it off?

[median cloud]

When I booted up my pc today the zdl was empty again despite me filling it up yesterday

I made an .ini now just in case

[crystal hill]

that's happened to me. Here's what you do - fill it up, manually close it down, then open it up again

[median cloud]

That keeps the files

[crystal hill]

weird little quirk I discovered a while into using it

[median cloud]

Maybe I accidentally press some key combination that clears it

[crystal hill]

It says Control + N clears all fields

I'd test it out myself, but I have 40ish wads on there now, I dont want to manually readd them

[median cloud]

damn this bug would be awful for you

[crystal hill]

I think it's either that control + N thing or just not closing the application manually before turning off your PC

Ive never had my full ZDL wiped in the years I've used it

[median cloud]

to do that or to avoid doing that?

[crystal hill]

avoid the first, do the second

[median cloud]

hmmm that could be it yeah

Also beat map 24 by now culture shock

died once to the archvile trap and some other times to snipers

amazing map though legit art

Playing SP doom really is like experiencing an art form more than just playing a game

[crystal hill]

sometimes

AA blends the gameplay and the worldbuilding really well

[median cloud]

I mean theres also bad art

but I see most doom wads as some artform expression by the author

[crystal hill]

Sure, but the way thats expressed is as a game

level design and music choice and all that is an artform

but its to facilitate a game at the end of the day

[median cloud]

okay nvm now its completely bugged

just closing the app removes it all

the hell

[crystal hill]

I don't get it

oh, maybe I do

go to general settings

at the bottom left, is the remember external file list option ticked?

[median cloud]

yeah its ticked

I unticked it and reticked it

so strange

it seems to save stuff now but tbh I dont know where it saves

[crystal hill]

I have no idea whats going on then

You'd think it wouldnt work properly on Linux instead

I've been fighting a constant cold war with this PC, but maybe it isn't so bad after all, if it keeps what's most important working well

[sacred dagger]

i beat ultimate doom yay my first playthrough on ultra violence i will admit i used alot of save points and sometimes tutorials if i was lost but it was fun. How different is Doom 2 apparently its not as good

[oak adder]

okay plutonia playthrough making progress

on stage 14 - "genesis"

man hunted gave me a bad time

[median cloud]

Did you beat e4 as well?

[sacred dagger]

yup

just started 2 and i love this new shotgun

[median cloud]

Nice! Doom 2 is fine the combat deepens a lot with the new cast

[twin mortar]

Wow, first Jesse plays RAGE, now Huell plays DOOM. This show has a lot of id representation. Bravo Vince

[sacred dagger]

So my playthrough plan is Doom-Doom2-Doom64-Doom3-Doom2016-Doometernal- then dark ages

Forgot final doom

Jesse actually does seem like the kinda guy to have played doom

[median cloud]

Ah just experiencing all of Doom

[twin mortar]

He played RAGE which is from the same dev team

We need Walt on Hexen next

[median cloud]

Classic Doom has a very big custom mappack community so if you love it be sure to ask for more

[sacred dagger]

Well ive come from a generation with modern games but i have quite enjoyed playing the original doom and i might do modded one day but i just wanna play them all first

[median cloud]

Thats fair I always liked retro so

[sacred dagger]

I just genuinely think the original doom still holds up like i actually got scared at some times lol

I played Doom 3 in vr for a bit too but fell over

[oak adder]

good luck with that

[oak adder]

the "hunted" level is pain

[south phoenix]

How can I download mods?

I'm playing the steam version

[smoky radish]

Y'all check out my stream on twitch my acc is nekro_nah

[uneven tangle]

Does anybody here know any bible quotes that parallel the events of DOOM 64? It'd be very helpful for my writing.

[mellow matrix]

The final level of Resurgence almost entirely nuked my enjoyment of the whole third episode. The indoor section is way too long, I felt aggravatingly underequipped, and the Archvile + Chaingunner meme combo was well past jumping the shark. I could barely make any sense of the outdoor half, ate the megaspheres like skittles, and only technically "won" through about 45 minutes of save scumming until the dice rolled in my favor.
I loved the stretch of maps from 20-29 (except for The Library, 26) and Joshy shit all over them right at the end :\

[bitter shoal]

I'm enjoying how a lot of Scythe 2 encounters feel like puzzles to solve

it really gives me the impression that a lot of thought was put into the level design

[smoky radish]

Anyone down for some death match in doom one + two

[mighty walrus]

Tempting. Doing some work but ping me next week sometime

[smoky radish]

Bet

[mighty walrus]

🤝

[karmic cliff]

Yeah, The enemy AI intelligence and cooperation based on a given combat situation, exploration and backtracking, and flow of gameplay holds up incredibly well.
One of the counterpoints for why I say Doom is better than Halo with my Halo friends is the AI.

[smoky radish]

How long did it take y'all to beat e2m7 brink on legacy of rust, for me it took almost 7 tries

[torpid yacht]

1 try

But the last level like 20 tries

[median cloud]

Took me one try but e2m6 a lot more

[median cloud]

I think my newfound love for TNT Evilution comes from the fact that it is the most atmospheric official doom wad by a long shot

[bitter shoal]

It does have good use of lighting, otherwise I never could get into how the use of textures to sell a really clean Sci-Fi look was.

[crystal hill]

honestly, I think there were more problem levels than just 30

I wanted to like it, because I'm a big fan of Speed of Doom, but Resurgence had a tendancy to fucking infuriate me, especially in the second half

[crystal hill]

newfound? lol

[median cloud]

And midis

[median cloud]

Well compared to 2 years ago ahaha

[crystal hill]

I will grant that it is the most atmospheric official Doom wad, with help from the excellent music

I'll let you know what I think in more detail when I do a replay

[smoky radish]

Could it maybe be cause I was on ultra-violence?

[smoky radish]

Tbh the whole game took a long time for me to beat lol

[median cloud]

I think you will absolutely hate some maps

But if you remember the layout you’ll prob like some others more than before

[median cloud]

Dont sweat it legacy of rust is pretty hard especially on UV

[merry grove]

I just spent around an hour playing one single map of the mod just for it to say "I know I should send you home, but those demon bastards kidnapped my rabbit!"

[torpid yacht]

Was also on UV
Nothing less

[native anchor]

Is there a WAD that combines all the Master Levels in one?

[crystal hill]

it exists as part of Doom 1 + 2

[native anchor]

Well, that, but I'm talking one for any other sourceport like Crispy Doom.

[crystal hill]

You can go into the files and take that wad out

It'll probably work with DSDA doom and similar

[modern peak]

the full compiled wad is included with the kex rerelease

[median cloud]

u play Crispy Doom?

[smoky radish]

Gee wizz your just good huh lol

[native anchor]

So what? It's one of my favorite sourceports.

It's Chocolate Doom but with more sauce.

But my most favorited, outside of UZDoom, is DSDA.

And I'm playing Doom 2 through Woof right now. Heard good things about Woof.

[median cloud]

That wasnt a dig I play crispy as well

I used chocolate doom in the past but disliked not being able to see stats and secrets found so switched to crispy

[median cloud]

Same but I dont see it

I mostly play dsda doom and crispy for vanilla

[native anchor]

It has some features like auto saves, which DSDA has.

[mortal silo]

I stan wolf. It has the best controller support.

[native anchor]

Maybe I can use Woof for Steam Deck then. Even though I use Steam Input anyway.

Steam Input is more customizable, and allows for gyro aiming.

[mortal silo]

I love woof. It has the best controller support. And is an up to date boom / id24 source port.

[torpid yacht]

Nah i got Lucky, the revenant wave had me scared the whole fight

[crystal hill]

@median cloud Honestly, I think I slightly misjudged Sunder. It's starting off quite gentle, though I still don't love it on account of some of the fights and how I need to "solve" them

hopefully this relative gentle nature continues for the rest of the original 14 maps

[sacred dagger]

any way of getting red card doom 2 map 2 episode 1 without running into window

cant make the jump on doom vr

[crystal hill]

???

that's not a hard jump to make at all. Run off the ledge quickly

if you're using a mod that alters your hitbox, then I cant help you with that

[median cloud]

Its very puzzle combat but the first two maps are pretty

03 and onwards becomes way harder

[crystal hill]

now Map 3 is making me want to quit, yeah

It seems like a Hell Revealed situation

[median cloud]

Maybe try it with saves? Just save per fight

[crystal hill]

that would make it far too easy

[mellow matrix]

You could always try Sunder for People Who Don't Have Time to Play Sunder if normal Sunder gets too grindy

[crystal hill]

I admire the lack of secrets. Gazebo knows what he wants out of his levels

[crystal hill]

What's that?

[modern peak]

its sunder for people who dont have time to play sunder

[crystal hill]

very funny

[modern peak]

thanks

[storm tapir]

if it is like dos doom 2 you need to run if the default walk speed is walking (no autorun on)

no jumping

[median cloud]

Nah not really

Dont save during fights only before or after

Plenty of fights will take you multiple tries

[crystal hill]

yeah, but being able to restart from the beginning of the first rather than the beginning of the level will make the level a lot easier

that kind of approach neutered swim with the whales

[mellow matrix]

https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/144252-boom-sunder-for-people-who-dont-have-time-to-play-sunder/
Technically a joke wad but the maps still have effort put into them and should be taken at face value: It's Sunder but you can beat maps in ~20 minutes or less

[median cloud]

I mean sure but the other option you have is quit out of frustration

[crystal hill]

doesnt sound so bad. I've got other things to play

if I don't enjoy something, I'd rather just stop than crippling it's difficulty

[crystal hill]

that looks neat, I might play it in the distant future

[storm tapir]

Use saves but restart if you die 3 times (Across all saves not just last save)? 😛

[modern peak]

doom eternal extra life mode

[median cloud]

Crippling it is just streching it idk