classic-doom

[azure nimbus]

y sheering heals the soul

[hexed escarp]

you can just turn it off

[fathom atlas]

finally beat suburbs guys

why is map 17 worse

[median cloud]

It is?

The ledge area is a bit tough but that should be it

Look out for secrets there are plenty

[median cloud]

Alright, finished all of NRFTL uv max pistol start

Latter two maps are stinkers

01, 03-06 and the secret map are fantastic though

[lunar rune]

NRFTL might be the only megawad where the first map is better than the rest

Especially with Decino's Homesick

[median cloud]

Hmmmm I can see that 01 is great

I do really like the secret map as well

And the first canyon map

But 01 is really really good

[ebon forum]

I just started playing NRFTL lol

Literally just closed out of it in fact

God I'm starting to hate it X3

[fathom atlas]

Yeah the two chaingunners, cacos, and entire row of imps that spawn

[red harbor]

yeah i still dont get why it's an option

[hexed escarp]

i think its like really easy to implement

so they just figured they might as well because maybe someone will want it

[median cloud]

What map u on?

[ebon forum]

I think my last save is on map04?

I swear to God though, the sheer number of Barons I've had to fight with a goddamn shotgun...

[median cloud]

dont have a ssg yet?

[ebon forum]

Nope, not found one yet. Only have shotgun, chaingun, and RPG

[median cloud]

damn no way u shouldve definitely found a ssg by now

[finite crag]

It's in level 1 iirc

[twin mortar]

Yes but getting to it is long

[median cloud]

Every map has a ssg

01, 02, 03 and 04

[opaque rose]

What’s that acronym?

[red harbor]

No Rest for the Living

[opaque rose]

Ah, yeah that’s a good one imo

[red harbor]

guys am i weird for liking the standard hud instead of custom "alternate ones"

[twin mortar]

No, you're based

[finite crag]

I like the classic hud and seeing the blocky doomguy

[red harbor]

yes this is exactly why it's better

it's weird not seeing doomguy's face

[coral arch]

i tried tetanus earlier but the difficulty is all over the place

why is the first map so difficult compared to the second map

[twin mortar]

You can ask the map maker if you want to, Egg Boy is in the server

[coral arch]

i like it overall. the map design is great and the music is a banger but the difficulty just feels kinda unfair

[split smelt]

I dont remember how i got good

[median cloud]

by playing

[split smelt]

Silly me

I think i got good with sunlust dont play it if youre starting out on playing wads i suffered

[azure nimbus]

sunlust is a good wad for people relatively early in their doom career. I mean play something first but still

While the latter levels are hard, they're within reason and more importantly the opening levels are pretty chill

[coral arch]

i dont really feel an enclosed room with like chaingunners and 2 achviles and opher stuff at once with very little cover is within reason

zone300 so far seems to be way more within reason

[split smelt]

Zone300 my first wad

The first wad i ever played

[lunar rune]

I could play without seeing my HP, just Doomguy's face is all I need

That's why I like using standard HUD

[hexed escarp]

The first wad that I played all the way through was eviternity

Actually I haven't played a whole lot of wads all the way thru

Heck I never actually finished doom 2

I started getting annoyed/bored in the last 3rd and quit mid way thru 27

[celest coyote]

You don’t even stop to see the penultimate challenges in wads? 29 is usually the beef challenge in a megawad

[hexed escarp]

i mean i do if i get to that point in the wad

one wad i am almost done with is scythe 2

i am in the middle of 29 with that one

its not really too much of a penultimate challenge

its more just super frustrating and pace killing

27 was insane brutal difficulty

28 was super bfg slaughter

30 is super mega insanity slaughter

but 29 in the middle is this slow meticulous slough with way too many afrits and damaging floors

[celest coyote]

Well to be fair 27-30 in scythe 2 weren’t made in the same bulk of time as the other maps in the set

So it makes sense those maps might feel out of place

[hexed escarp]

well 28, 29, and 30 were all made at the same as each other

id say 23-30 all feel like they flow together with good pacing

all except for 29

29 does not match at all with the maps on either side of it

the only other major break in pacing in the wad is the jump from 22 to 23

[celest coyote]

I think 29 is fine as a calm before the storm that is 30

[hexed escarp]

more like irritation before the storm

[celest coyote]

Adds a nice sense of anxiety and preparation for me

But I agree the lack of consistency in damaging floor is annoying, can’t argue that

[hexed escarp]

yeah it just doesnt match the gameplay style of the whole rest of the wad

[celest coyote]

Sometimes that’s ok, sometimes not

Map 28 of Scythe 1 is another example. And I dislike that one

[finite crag]

Are the Scythe wads good

How do they play out, kinda interested

[celest coyote]

Easy the first third
Medium the second third
Hard the third…third

That’s the general guide to each scythe

[hexed escarp]

scythe 1 is decent, scythe 2 is my 2nd favorite wad of all time

[finite crag]

What's your favorite

[hexed escarp]

eviternity

[celest coyote]

Hard to say a favorite..depends on what I’m looking for

[hexed escarp]

but yeah the difficulty of the scythes is very all over the place

[celest coyote]

Visual wise, there’s a gzdoom map called Lullaby.pk3 that knocks visuals out of the park

[finite crag]

Time to do it on Nightmare blind

Cause I absolutely hate myself

[hexed escarp]

in scythe, episode 1 is easier than doom 1 episode 1, episode 2 is probably a little easier than plutonia, and episode 3 is harder than most wads out there

[vale gyro]

The pain will be real

[celest coyote]

If you really hate yourself, try Sunder on Nightmare blind

[hexed escarp]

or really just Sunder on Ultra Violence blind

[finite crag]

Isn't Sunlust another hard one

[hexed escarp]

yeah

Sunlust is probably the hardest 30 map out there

[celest coyote]

Long = Hard

Sunlust is good tho

Sunder not so much

[hexed escarp]

slander

[finite crag]

Time to do every single official doom expansion on Nightmare back to back

[hexed escarp]

i like sunder, im not quite good enough to be able to properly play it tho

[finite crag]

Pistol start

[hexed escarp]

i have played the first 3 and a half maps of sunder with saves on UV

they are good so far

and ive looked at the later maps a ton

they are insanely beautiful

[finite crag]

TNT shouldn't be super hard on nightmare, I mean it's TNT...

[celest coyote]

Pistol started all of Sunder on UV myself, still waiting on map 21…for 4 years lol

[hexed escarp]

the thing with nightmare is that most maps were not designed to be possible with nightmare

so a lot of them will just be completely ridiculous

especially ones with backtracking

[finite crag]

E1M3...

[celest coyote]

Never beat TNT tho

Can’t force myself to lol

Too uggy

[finite crag]

Tiktok N' Torment

[hexed escarp]

but yeah scythe 2 is excellent

it gets really really hard starting with map23

but everything else before that is pretty manageable

[finite crag]

I love things that are hard

[hexed escarp]

it has excellent atmosphere

[twin mortar]

I think a better word is 'difficult'

[finite crag]

That's what I meant

[hexed escarp]

like what level of difficulty are we talking

[twin mortar]

I know, but it's not what it can be taken as

[hexed escarp]

what what are some of the more difficult things you have played

[finite crag]

Idk

Just things that require me to be good at the game

idk how to explain it

[hexed escarp]

but theres like different levels of good

whats an example of a wad that you have played that you would consider difficult

[finite crag]

I haven't really played a lot of custom wads

[hexed escarp]

have you played plutonia?

[finite crag]

Yeah

[hexed escarp]

the later levels of scythe 2 are a couple orders of magnitude above that

[finite crag]

I haven't played much of it but I would say it's challenging, mainly cause of how stuff can screw you over

[hexed escarp]

but like 2nd quarter of scythe 2 is probably on par with plutonia

[finite crag]

I did try Go 2 It...

[vale gyro]

Yeah, gave up 4 maps later lol

[hexed escarp]

pretty much every map of scythe 2 map23 and later is like go 2 it but worse

like way worse

[finite crag]

I don't remember much of Go 2 It but all I know is that it was... hard...

[hexed escarp]

scythe 2 is probably a good way to improve actually because it starts very approachable and then ramps up throughout

not on nightmare tho lol

but uv

[finite crag]

Plutonia's Map01 wasn't that bad honestly

[hexed escarp]

yeah that map is easy compared to most stuff

[finite crag]

I know that's kinda obvious, it was the first level, but it didn't feel as hard as I was expecting

[hexed escarp]

yeah plutonia isnt as absolutely insane as people say it is

it definitely has a lot of traps

and it was definitely hard for the time

but in today's age, its very reasonable

[celest coyote]

You can always try out Italo.wad if you want sum hard

[hexed escarp]

or sunder

[finite crag]

Cause everyone's had quite a while to gi gud, though

[hexed escarp]

yeah

[azure nimbus]

Flotsam might be the set with the highest median difficulty I've played that didn't achieve this by having hour long maps

[celest coyote]

Everyone’s skill is their own journey tho

So pace yourself through wads

[azure nimbus]

Or maybe I think that just because map01 of flotsam is ridiculous

[hexed escarp]

although I started playing doom just a couple of years ago and i already would consider plutonia not too bad

so you dont have to have been playing for ages to get good

[celest coyote]

Really just takes a year, maybe two to awaken your hidden potential

[vale gyro]

Unless your me lmao

[celest coyote]

But if you’ve been playing doom since you were 4…it’s a little unfair to play anything these days

[hexed escarp]

but yeah if you want a good custom wad to play, i can definitely recommend eviternity

[finite crag]

No

[vale gyro]

Been playing this game since 2020 and suffer with pretty much everything on HMP

[finite crag]

I want the most absurd level of difficulty that would turn any self-respecting doomer to leave

[vale gyro]

I can agree with this as well despite my lower playtime on it

[vale gyro]

Nuts.wad 100% kills

[finite crag]

I want something so challenging it makes the Nuts wads look sad

[vale gyro]

There you go

Have fun for uhh- a whole month!

[finite crag]

That's not that bad even

I mean ZeroMaster did it

[vale gyro]

Yeah, and that single run alone took him a month to record

[finite crag]

Technically

He didn't play most of that month

[vale gyro]

I mean literally

Because it was running at like 0.5 a frame per minute or something like that

[finite crag]

yeah

I just like challenges I guess

[vale gyro]

I hate them

[finite crag]

Absurd ones but still challenges nonetheless

[vale gyro]

I’m fine with being challenged

But I like it to be fair

[finite crag]

I don't care if it's fair or not, I want something that makes me hate myself

[vale gyro]

Unlike fucking Scythe 2 Episode 5 and onwards

[split smelt]

Cant agree more

Scythe jungle episode is fair

[vale gyro]

Eviternity’s been like this honestly

[split smelt]

But very difficult

[vale gyro]

If your referring to E5 it was anything but fair

[finite crag]

E5?

[split smelt]

You’re*

[split smelt]

The jungle episode of scythe 2

[vale gyro]

I’d call E4 mostly fair

E5 is what the CIA uses for its torture program

Along with C++

[finite crag]

dang

I want a wad that's like a slaughter map up to 10

[split smelt]

What do you mean by up to 10?

[finite crag]

Like to the max

[split smelt]

Cosmogenesis

[finite crag]

Maximum pain and suffering

[split smelt]

74k monsters

[vale gyro]

[finite crag]

It makes you feel regret just looking at it on the page

[vale gyro]

Okuplok single segment also brings pain

[split smelt]

Okuplok means pain in doomer language

[finite crag]

what is that

[split smelt]

Doomer language is nothing really just some vocabulary that doom players use

[finite crag]

No I mean Okuplok

[vale gyro]

Uhh

Do I roll the clip?

[finite crag]

I want pain to the power of 11

[vale gyro]

Mind you only one person to my knowledge has done this

And it had to be done on ITYTD

[red harbor]

Java? Fucking Objective-C?

[finite crag]

Then make me the first to do it on Nightmare!

[vale gyro]

We don’t talk about Java or Objective-C

They’re another brand of bullshit

[finite crag]

I'll do it, no matter how much of my lifespan I lose

[red harbor]

If we wanna just send them to hell make them do shit in Malbolge

[vale gyro]

[finite crag]

Also what does single segment mean again, like in one sitting? pistol start? or what

[vale gyro]

One sitting

No saves

[finite crag]

Bet

[vale gyro]

Pistol start

[finite crag]

[vale gyro]

Mind you the map’s like 4 hours long

[finite crag]

I can do it.

[vale gyro]

5, actually

[finite crag]

Not even that bad

[vale gyro]

The map has 23k enemies

[red harbor]

"Nah, I'd win." sounding

[finite crag]

I would win

[vale gyro]

Nah, I’d lose

[red harbor]

real

[finite crag]

23k enemies isn't even that bad

How much does Nuts have?

[vale gyro]

I forgor

[finite crag]

Apparently it has 10000

[twin mortar]

More like 2 second levels

[azure nimbus]

better question -- why does it have that text background black

[finite crag]

Kex port I think

I thought they bought ID

That's unrelated to bethesda

Something's wrong with red crosses I think idk

[azure nimbus]

I think you have a weird setting. Cuz I played a bit of KEX and never saw this. Least remember I don't

[red harbor]

thats to comply with the geneva convention, nothing to do with ID or Bethesda

pretty sure you can turn off high contrast text in the accessibility options

[red harbor]

idk

[vale gyro]

The fireblu in the wall?

Nah, that’s just to indicate a secret

[finite crag]

FIREBLU is secrets

[red harbor]

i havent played sigil 2

[austere tangle]

I wonder what the worst DOOM 2 map is to most people

[finite crag]

yes

[finite crag]

I haven't played it either still on Sigil 1

[austere tangle]

Downtown is a pretty stinky map with how crudely designed it looks

[finite crag]

I like it

I like the city levels designs

There... there are?

Have you not played Doom 2?

The last third is in hell

MAP21-30 is in Hell

I guess you can also count MAP31 + 32 cause that's in Nazi germany, which is equally hell

I think it even says you go into hell

But tbf it is called "DOOM II: Hell on Earth"

Dead Simple?

That's fair, it is a fun map

[vale gyro]

it's fun

also the THORR OST is great if you buy Sigil 2

[finite crag]

6.66 euros

[red harbor]

usd too

same with the buckethead soundtrack

[finite crag]

Oh fr?

[vale gyro]

or even more expensive if you buy a physical copy like me

[finite crag]

Real

[vale gyro]

physical copies are really cool, though

just the USB alone is awesome

[austere tangle]

I think one of my favorite maps is The Spirit World

Everything about it screams "near the end" to me, with the tense music and the placements of tough enemies, and all the secret items you can find, it's a true delight to me whenever I play through DOOM II

[high beacon]

Update: decided to start working again

Very weird since it basically stopped working for 2 days and decided to straighten itself out

[high beacon]

Nvm it broke again lol

[azure nimbus]

It's hard to overstate how influential the last few levels of doom2 are in terms of guiding how custom wads look. map27 is exploration heavy, map28 is weird, map29 is the last gauntlet, and map30 is a quick punchy challenge. Obviously it isn't a rule, but it's a rough template that is followed quite often and I believe that it comes from the vanilla maps

[celest coyote]

Dimensions map02 was cool save for the vile fight at the end, but map03 had me stuck on the first fight for 2 hours lol. Fuck revenants and fuck being tired while playing something that challenging 😂

[median cloud]

27 is the best Doom 2 map

[split smelt]

My dad would absolutely approve of this message

[austere tangle]

I think Monster Condo is also up there for me, kinda feels like a breath of fresh air after dealing with so many annoying maps in a row

[coral arch]

is monster condo broken? theres no way out of the room with 4 mancubuses

[austere tangle]

You need to shoot some walls

[finite crag]

Quake ass feature

[coral arch]

i shot every wall in that room

and hitting the button dosnt do anything

[austere tangle]

Try shooting the goat skull wall in the back

There's a switch behind that wall

[azure nimbus]

Press the walls or the mid area might be a TP?def no shootable though

[austere tangle]

I actually pistol started the map and beat it to find out if I was right

[coral arch]

yeah som ething bugged out because i did shoot it earlier and it for some reason didnt register it worked now though

[austere tangle]

Yeah turns out you gotta shoot the goat wall in the first Mancubus room

[coral arch]

i had to shoot it in the second room

[austere tangle]

Why do you exit Map 18 through a toilet

[coral arch]

is there some way to get that selecxtion preview at the top on gzdoom like its in the doom + doom 2
[16:58]
also does gz doom have a thing where i can se how many enemies are left without opening the minimap?

[austere tangle]

I'm worried this might be a hot take but I don't like Barrels o' (Not) Fun

[surreal portal]

it really isnt

a lot of doom 2's middle maps are middling to bleh

that's honestly a quite cold take

[austere tangle]

After the Catacombs, I feel like all the maps up until Monster Condo are just crap

Bloodfalls is a generic feeling map with hurting floors from the start, which is a dick move

The Abandoned Mines is ok but keeps blocking you with Cacodemons

And do I even need to mention the map that comes after Barrels o' Fun???

[lunar rune]

Garbage map

The Chasm is one of the best looking maps imo

[remote cedar]

It's been a bit since IDKFA's full version dropped so I decided to rank all the DOOM + DOOM II tracks based on how much I prefer IDKFA to the original https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/126733860674338816/1288917456190046316/image.png?ex=66f6ed6c&is=66f59bec&hm=a4aa2c81de11b99d6f9128e4ee43918d769c20789de74d37da3dd7f04d10f579&

darn you really can't see anything with the embed

[celest coyote]

Ok

[silver sage]

Anyone else getting errors on moddb?

[red harbor]

nah it embedded for me

[vale gyro]

Probably not without making a fork of GZDoom or a custom-made launcher.
For the second question, more than likely, but I don’t use GZ so I got no clue where it is.

The closest I’ve seen to it was with the RT fork of GZDoom, however it was only UDoom and Doom 2 and it was kinda buggy, not to mention the fork doesn’t really support mods from what I can tell.

[red harbor]

for the second one yeah it's the alternate hud

[vale gyro]

Or, maybe some mod that interacts with a Wadsmoosh?

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[coral arch]

why does gz doom permanently capture my cursor untill i ctrl alt delete

a lot of the time

[twin mortar]

Because GZDoom sucks

[vale gyro]

As a source port, most definitely

[twin mortar]

Which is what it should be good at...

[red harbor]

these days it's more like a game engine that just so happens to run doom

[vale gyro]

Yeah

[red harbor]

just dont expect it to be vanilla at all lol

[silver sage]

Is it not still best way to play doom 1 and 2? And best modding support

[twin mortar]

Best modding support is a fact, first part is very heavily subjective

[little oar]

Best modding support? Yes
Best way to play? God no

[twin mortar]

And if you are talking about just sticking to the original's gameplay, it absolutely sucks

[red harbor]

seriously though if you want a nice feeling yet vanilla (for the most part) source port just use PrBoom+, Crispy Doom, or any of their forks (most notably DSDA Doom which is what I use to record vanilla compatible demos)

[twin mortar]

Even when setting everything as strictly vanilla as you can there's differences

[red harbor]

ehhhhhh depends on what you want out of a source port

[silver sage]

Every version of doom including the new port and gzdoom...plays the same to me

[vale gyro]

It never was the best way

[little oar]

GZDoom is something you only use when you absolutely have to for a mod, but if given a choice you pick anything else over it

[vale gyro]

Nothing ever was the best way to play Doom

[twin mortar]

You don't notice them usually but they're apparent if you read on them

[red harbor]

no, no they do not

[vale gyro]

Source ports exist for a reason, because people want different things

I’m agreeing with Anome and Nuze here

[red harbor]

i dont really pay attention but i can feel the difference between DSDA-Doom and GZDoom's movement

[vale gyro]

The physics in GZDoom alone make it sort of a pain to play

[coral arch]

im super confused tabbing into gzdoom is causing all my 3 screens to go black

what is happening

[vale gyro]

More recent versions of GZ had this issue for me at one point

[little oar]

That's just gzdoom being an unoptimized mess like usual

[red harbor]

i personally prefer GZDoom's feel (yeah you guys can crucify me for that) but DSDA-Doom is my go-to for demos

[coral arch]

i dont really notice a difference between vanilla and gzdoom exept gzdoom feeling more responsive

[silver sage]

So whats the best way to play doom 1 and 2...the new one?

[red harbor]

insert joke about them blaming the mods that aren't installed here

[vale gyro]

I’ve had this pointed out to me but GZ isn’t as unoptimized as people say it is

[twin mortar]

You know how 80 and 90s movies have those "NO GIRLS ALLOWED" signs on treehouses and stuff? Let's get our own one but for GZDoom

[vale gyro]

Like I said, there is none

[twin mortar]

There is no best, but it is certainly not GZ :p

[vale gyro]

Use what you like

[coral arch]

its been working for the past few days

[vale gyro]

I personally would say it’s Woof

[coral arch]

it just started doing it for no reaso right now did i hit some keybind or something?

[vale gyro]

Dunno

[red harbor]

again, it heavily depends on what you want. there's no objective perfect way to play Doom

[little oar]

The kex engine is good but not perfect, but stuff like woof! (or any boom fork) is probably your best bet
Dsda doom is also really good supposedly, but I don't have experience with that one so

[vale gyro]

Woof is an MBF fork

[twin mortar]

Crispy DOOM would be my pick, for Heretic at least, not sure for D or D2

[red harbor]

It's a PrBoom+ fork so that's already a good sign

[little oar]

Tf I thought it was boom then my bad

[vale gyro]

Specifically a WinMBF port

[red harbor]

technically. PrBoom+ is a fork of PrBoom, which is a fork of Boom. you aren't wrong

[little oar]

No I meant for woof

[red harbor]

oh im silly

[vale gyro]

Get Vega’d

[little oar]

Go away vega no one likes you

[red harbor]

cant even say a long oh in detroit

[vale gyro]

When will Vega get Vega’d

[little oar]

Because of woke

[vale gyro]

You’re 100 correct btw

[red harbor]

god that would be hilarious

[vale gyro]

Also, technically Woof is a Boom port at its core as MBF is forked from Boom iirc

[coral arch]

what is causing this issue

[red harbor]

dude every source port is forked from Linux Doom

[vale gyro]

Yeah, I know lol

[red harbor]

this is why Linux is the best OS (as i type this from my windows 11 PC)

[vale gyro]

I also have a stance there is no best OS

There is a worst OS, though

That goes to ChromeOS

[red harbor]

thought you were gonna say macos lol, then you reminded me of THAT abomination

[vale gyro]

Nah MacOS is fine

Same with Windows and Linux

[red harbor]

the joke is that you can't really game for shit on there

[vale gyro]

Well, less so Windows now adays because of the bloat

Well, MacOS is a work OS

Its main goal is far from gaming

[red harbor]

yeah no that's what's been making me consider swapping to Linux fully, but given software compatibility i wanna hold out until Microsoft inevitably releases Windows 12 to see how bad they fuck it up

[tropic timber]

MacOS is better for everything that’s not gaming in my experience

[vale gyro]

You don’t get a Mac for gaming, you get it for its workflow

[red harbor]

meanwhile apple trying to market it's gaming capabilities:

[tropic timber]

Mac on the streets, Windows in the sheets

[vale gyro]

Yeah, I laugh at that all the time

[red harbor]

like if apple didnt try to market that you'd have a fair point

here's to proton for Mac saving them

[tropic timber]

Mac is good for Mac stuff

Like digital art

Or all the stuff that isn’t videogames

[coral arch]

ok so its happening in fullscreen

[vale gyro]

Mac’s also really nice if your already in their ecosystem like I am (no, I do not buy a new phone every year, that’s stupid)

[tropic timber]

Yes

[vale gyro]

Try borderless if GZ has that ig

[tropic timber]

You can play Gmod on Mac but it requires you use the 86-64bit beta and a piece of third party software

But it runs pretty well once you set it up

[twin mortar]

Rayman 3 is on Mac, good enough for me

[vale gyro]

Doom 1 is on Mac, good enough for me

[tropic timber]

Marathon (aka doom but better) is on Mac

Good enough for me

It is objectively better due to two features

Dual wielding and multistory maps

You can stack floors. In vanilla

[vale gyro]

Counter argument: I don’t have 11 copies of Marathon

[tropic timber]

Counterpoint: you only need one copy of marathon and it’s free on steam

[vale gyro]

Counterpoint: shit, you’re right

[tropic timber]

The version on steam is an official source port approved by bungee

[vale gyro]

I need to actually try Marathon

[tropic timber]

It’s really good

[vale gyro]

Too busy admiring my copies of Doom, though

[tropic timber]

M2 has the best single player and MI has the best multiplayer so make sure to get those too

[vale gyro]

Ok so only get Marathon 2

Got it

[coral arch]

not sure why but it seems turning off instant replay fixed it somehow

[finite crag]

dude it's pretty good!
it's a little stiffer than doom

but im personally am completely hooked, im trying to finish the first game on Total Carnage difficulty

[tropic timber]

multiplayer is good

[tropic timber]

its sooo good

and a lot closer to modern fps than doom is

it came out a year after doom and it shows

its definately less of a run in guns blazing game

[tropic timber]

bluddy theyre all free, you can get them all

not to mention the comunity made scenarios which are practicaly all for marathon infinity

[tropic timber]

also @vale gyro MI stands for Marathon: Infinity, the third game

[bitter minnow]

Is there any way I can send mods for doom + doom II? Lol

[finite crag]

dude have you seen Apotheosis X?

[tropic timber]

no

[finite crag]

everything in that mod looks SO GOOD

[tropic timber]

ive heard of it thpugh

[finite crag]

huh... server doesn't allow me to send the link... is it ok if i send it to you in dms?

[tropic timber]

go ahead

[finite crag]

it's really good

hopefully VKdoom will take over soon

TOTAL. VULKAN. DOMINATION.

man i wish i was like really rich, filthy rich, saudi-arabian sheik rich... just so i could donate lot's of money to all those open-source port projects

"yeah here's a gorillion dollars, do your best"

[red harbor]

Who's gonna tell him that GZ already had Vulkan?

[finite crag]

it does?

i gotta update, the version im using must be jurassic

[red harbor]

If you want something more vanilla, may I recommend DSDA-Doom (or what it was based on, PrBoom+)?

[red harbor]

Yeah current version is 4.12.2

What version are you on?

[finite crag]

don't know, already replaced the .EXE

oh wow, it's fancy now

it has a little screenshot on the launcher window

das good

man i honestly just drag-n-drop, im ooga booga like that.

it would be a cool feature, let's keep fingers crossed and hope it comes in the near future

like, i've got so many wads so disorganized on my gzdoom folder that there's stuff i don't even remember what it uses to run

probably stuff in the code

im no expert but i think the addition of more enemies and weapons kinda makes it very hard to be retrocompatible... or not, i may be wrong.

but that's where i put my two cents

coding is black magick

[boreal gate]

why the FUCK can arch viles redirect their attack from a monster theyre infighting to you when it dies

[silver sage]

Anyone getting error 520 on moddb?

[azure nimbus]

this has nothing to do with it dying. This goes for all monster attacks: if their target dies while they are performing their attack, they will carry on attacking a dead target. If they switch targets mid-attack it's because they got hit

Even if you shoot a monster while it's attacking a dead enemy, it'll only swap targets if it's stepcount is 0. Unfortunately, viles will always switch targets upon getting shot

[coral arch]

Wish there was some way to actually know archviles have shot of their fire attack

[vale gyro]

The fire that’s in front of you

[azure nimbus]

it is a bit weird. The fire is only in front of the thing targeted at the start of the attack. If it swaps targets mid-attack, they don't get a fire sprite. I think there's also a glitch where the fire doesn't spawn properly if line of sight is broken on frame 1.

Still, there is a sprite frame on the vile where he does the damage part of the attack. if it's after that, he did the move

[vale gyro]

ah

[halcyon willow]

doom 1 has an episode structure, doom 2 does not

and as you said, different base asset set

that's not an episodic structure, not from a code perspective

that's just "uhhhhhhhh we changes the skies"

anyway, look in the wad's readme to see what iwad they use

it's not hard

[vale gyro]

I'd say everything launch by its self would cause issues

as evident with the KEX mod browser

that'd cause conflicts for WADs that need TNT or Plutonia as IWADs

as they fit the same format as Doom 2

[halcyon willow]

Make it yourself if it's so easy

Otherwise shut up about it

Or go whine on reddit

The people who made doom didn't make the source port dumb ass

[vale gyro]

you're the only one who wants it

[halcyon willow]

last warning

move on

do something meaningful with your life

lol i'm making my own game

nice try

[vale gyro]

I will mention you're saying this to a game dev

[halcyon willow]

scared to tell me yourself?

what was that?

huh

must've been the wind

[finite crag]

Damn

[halcyon willow]

for everyone's information, there is no data in a custom pwad that points towards a specific iwad. you could load eviternity with hexen and the source port wouldn't be able to tell what's going on until it found missing assets

[bronze hound]

🍿

[halcyon willow]

c:

[vale gyro]

yeah, exactly

[finite crag]

🫳

[vale gyro]

though, that gives me an idea, actually

[bronze hound]

i have no idea what y’all talkin—

[bronze hound]

Hey!

[vale gyro]

couldn't you make a lump similar to GAMEINFO that tells the port what IWAD it needs?

[halcyon willow]

you'd have to make a launcher that read that lump

[vale gyro]

well, it'd require adoption of the lump in ports, though

[halcyon willow]

it's probably quite doable

[lapis wolf]

I think I might be suffering a Doom burnout or fatigue as of lately.

I tried playing some stuff like Valiant today and I didn't want to play much lol.

[vale gyro]

Guess what, I already made a launcher!

[halcyon willow]

it's just that it's not an issue most people have, because they can read 👅

[vale gyro]

if I wanted to I could actually add that functionality to it

[bronze hound]

i seriously have no idea what y’all yapping about. I’m here for the entertainment

[halcyon willow]

99% of custom wads use doom 2 anyway

[vale gyro]

yeah

so it'd be useless to actually add detection for that lump anyways

[lapis wolf]

First time I played Classic DOOM in like 2 weeks, and I just got tired fast.

I tried Eternal too, and it was just bleugh.

Probably burnt out lol

Also I played Valiant before and really liked it, just wasn't feeling like playing it today or lately, in case someone suggests that Valiant isn't for me

[finite crag]

I keep reading valorant ;-;

[vale gyro]

lmao

[finite crag]

I need help

[vale gyro]

with what?

[bronze hound]

wsp

[vale gyro]

AND REPLY FAIL #2 FROM ME TODAY

[bronze hound]

dang

[vale gyro]

should I do this, though?

it'd take me like a couple months to figure it out or so

[finite crag]

Life

[vale gyro]

oh

[lapis wolf]

I think I am mostly just worried the port is going to fuck up, bug, or saves for mods/WADs will get corrupted like always.

Which messes up my motivation to want to play Classic DOOM.

That might be why actually

So less burnout and more-so, it's probably not worth it until more patches roll out

[azure nimbus]

On some level, I commisserate with the issue. But on the other hand, I can't imagine not knowing if I was supposed to use doom2 or doom1. It's never been ambiguous

[red harbor]

Dude you're the one who started bitching over a feature nobody really needs or even cares about

[lapis wolf]

I didn't even know there was a fight going on until now

[red harbor]

Yeah I didn't know either but only because I was offline lol

[vale gyro]

yeah, never had an issue with it

it was a mere idea that I came up with on the spot

the chance of me actually adding it to Minty Launcher is slim

[red harbor]

That's what we have the READMEs for (at least on the idgames archive)

[vale gyro]

yeah

it's more annoying to figure it out when coming from here or ModDB unless they specify it

[azure nimbus]

Why go the time to download something if you don't even know what it's for?

[finite crag]

idk

[ebon forum]

I'm playing No Rest For The Living and I'm stuck on map05

[finite crag]

I hate that one room in Phobos Lab that has the flashing lights right at the end

[wanton gust]

Same I always go for the light goggles on the left everytime

[ebon forum]

I actually love it , particularly in Brutal DOOM, because it feels almost like DOOM 3

But yeah, I usually go for the goggles. That one barrel there always nearly gets me though

[finite crag]

It's fine if I wasn't playing an old version (don't ask me which one)

[ebon forum]

1.1?

I actually don't know what version is different with that map

[boreal gate]

i swear i didnt hit them i was running around in a slaughter map. is it because its gzdoom or something? i swear its buggy sometimes

[coral arch]

The fire goes away as soon as i get behind cover

And if i reemerge too soon i get hit by it but i cant see if he fired of the attack since i cant see the archevile

[halcyon willow]

Archvile have a unique behavior that means they instantly retarget if any damage is done to them at any time. Standard behavior (iirc) is a chance to retarget on damage based on their pain chance

[boreal gate]

https://tenor.com/view/angry-thiago-mad-angry-fist-emoji-gif-17761307

evil

[vale gyro]

That’s why you gotta get used to the timings

[coral arch]

Really feel like they should have had some sort of sound when they fire it

[vale gyro]

Yeah, that’d help a bit

I’ve personally never had an issue with it but I get what you mean

What I can tell you is to attempt to get comfortable with hiding away for just long enough

[red harbor]

I usually right until a moment AFTER I hear the sound of their attack end

[coral arch]

Yeah i wouldnt mind that if they didnt try to reanimate the entire room i just cleared

Their sound stops the moment i hide for me

So once the flame goes away as i hide no more sound

[red harbor]

That's why they're ALWAYS highest priority and you hit them with your strongest weapons

[red harbor]

Huh must be a GZDoom thing then

[coral arch]

I do target them first unless theres like a chain gunner

But the thing is maps like to introduce an archvile at the end of combat

[red harbor]

That's just evil

[coral arch]

Had a map that had an invulnerability sphere and when you went to get it it dropped you into a small room with like 30 imps

So basicly guaranteed death

[red harbor]

But you have invuln, just use rockets?

[coral arch]

Not invulnerability mega spheres

[red harbor]

Ohhhhhh

[coral arch]

You didnt get to the sphere

You get dropped into the room as you approach it

[red harbor]

Still not too bad if you have a plasma gun

[coral arch]

You dont

[red harbor]

Damn

Not even SSG?

[coral arch]

No

Well you might have a plasma gun but not enough ammo

[red harbor]

Did Satan make that level?

[coral arch]

The trap is early in the level

[red harbor]

Eh I'd say that's a decent time to use it

[coral arch]

So you dont lose that much process

[red harbor]

Seriously I love using the Plasma Gun on hordes like these

[coral arch]

The room is so cramped tour completely surpunded so 4 or 5 imps will be meleeing you at once

As soon as you drop down

[red harbor]

I mean how much cell ammo do you even have?

[coral arch]

Actually im not sure if you even have a plasma gun at that point

Il have to check when im at my pc

I can tag you with the name of the wad

[vale gyro]

I’ll check it out later

[coral arch]

The balance on hurt me plenty seems really good atleast

[red harbor]

Sure, I'll take a look on the Doom Wiki since I'm not on my PC right now

[coral arch]

It is part of a megawas though

[red harbor]

Yeah I'll have to check on DSDA when I get the chance

[vale gyro]

-warp exists for a reason

[coral arch]

Its the first or second level

So no need

I did manage to solve the weird black screen issue

Some how having instant replay on was causing ir

[vale gyro]

Watch that somehow cause another issue lol

[coral arch]

No idea how or why turning instant replay on caused all screens to go black when fullscreen in gzdoom but eh

[vale gyro]

Yeah

It’s little stuff like that which gives me another reason not to use GZ

[red harbor]

Classic unoptimized GZ

[vale gyro]

Using GZDoom’s like using Linux but unfun

[red harbor]

Nah I'd say it's like using Modern Windows. You need it for a lot of shit, but you're going to need to DEAL with a ton of shit.

[coral arch]

I mean it could also be something with shadowplay itself

[vale gyro]

Fair

[coral arch]

Since turning shadowplay on caused that issue

Other then that gzdoom has been working great for me

[vale gyro]

GZDoom has personally never worked that great for me

[coral arch]

Exept that i had to edit the txt file to make jumping and freelook pff by default

[vale gyro]

The engine changes too much for me to like using it

[coral arch]

I dont really notice a difference exept the game feels snappier to play like looking around is more smooth

[vale gyro]

The physics are effed in GZ

Also the hardware renderers screws up a good amount of levels that depend on software rendering

[coral arch]

You can put it on the software renderer though

Thats an option you can change to use the default one

[vale gyro]

Then you gotta switch back to hardware as soon as you need to play almost anything else

As most stuff for GZDoom requires freelook

[coral arch]

Thats a map issue though. Not really gzdoom issue

[vale gyro]

Which becomes dead useless in software

[red harbor]

I kid you not I suggested for them to disable Texture Filtering by default since nobody uses it and it requires changing ONE value in the default config. They said something like "It's so easy for people to disable so we don't see a reason to change it ourselves."

Took a while to type since I tried to get an exact quote lol

[coral arch]

What does that do again?

[red harbor]

Makes the game look blurry as hell

[vale gyro]

Smear Vaseline all over the textures and sprites

[coral arch]

Guess its off by default in the new version maybe? Atleast when I downloaded it its looking sharp

[red harbor]

I'd be surprised if anybody used it that actually knows they can turn it off

[red harbor]

It uses the config you already made

[coral arch]

Although in like 1.5 hours think any of you can help me with tinkering with the options a bit?

[vale gyro]

I personally can’t

Because I still gotta spend an hour screwing with the config any time I boot up GZ

As I always notice a new issue with it

And from what I can tell you can’t even disable one of my major gripes

[red harbor]

Which is?

[vale gyro]

Enemy drops jump into the air when you kill an enemy

And also have a noticeable delay when they actually spawn

[red harbor]

Huh so that's why the E1M1 shotgunners behind those pillars sometimes drop their shotguns up there

[vale gyro]

I guess

But yeah

There’s so many little things that I dislike about GZ that I’d rather not use it

I only use it for mods that aren’t really Doom-like and are their own thing at this point

[red harbor]

Speaking of I finally got around to playing The Thing You Can't Defeat. Not too bad

[vale gyro]

I might try it out but I consider it Doom-like

[red harbor]

True

Especially the start

[vale gyro]

I basically consider anything that’s trying to be its own game not Doom-like

[red harbor]

The ending is a bit confusing but given what the mod is about it makes sense

[vale gyro]

So Selaco, VietDoom surprisingly, among other mods

Well, Selaco is its own game

But whatever, it’s still running on GZDoom

[azure nimbus]

sounds like it was the "backed in cover within a frame so the fire spawns weirdly". Listen for the sound

[red harbor]

anyways does anybody know how to get the plasma gun in MAP01 of the ID Deathmatch Pack?

[azure nimbus]

I agree with the GZ doom devs here. Why not have one of the unique GZ features on by default for people installing GZ on purpose?

[red harbor]

it's not even unique

[vocal summit]

they're not going to change it

gzdoom default settings are graf's personal preference

[red harbor]

i know, it's an easy to change feature

they hate changing those

[vocal summit]

honestly if i constantly had to say i'm not going to change something and people continue telling me to i'd be annoyed as well

[coral arch]

the wad was called dimensions of time

[lapis wolf]

Are you fucking kidding me.

They still haven't fixed the loading saves issue in the KEX port?

Sighs

[hexed escarp]

have they fixed the boom/mbf21 compatibility issues?

[lapis wolf]

First time I saved in Valiant today and couldn't quick load the save. :/

[lapis wolf]

From my experience. I don't think so.... and secret exit in Eviternity Map 15 is still impossible.

As well as glitching through the floor on a lot of levels in these WADs.

[hexed escarp]

weird

[lapis wolf]

No I remember why I don't want to play Classic DOOM lately. Sighs

[finite crag]

what are the issues?

[lapis wolf]

Basically every mod ever doesn't let you load a save due to "not having the correct mods installed" when you clearly do and you were literally just playing them.

This is a pretty recent issue too. Maybe 2 weeks ago or a bit more

But the issue keeps getting worse and worse and no idea why

[azure nimbus]

is it possile that you've found a duplicate upload of the mod?

I guess pistol startin kinda helps

[hexed escarp]

you can play a source port if you want

or are you on console

[red harbor]

I mean, if he's on Xbox I guess he has Masters of Boom???? Basically bad source port using Freedoom lol

[lapis wolf]

Console unfortunately

[lapis wolf]

Lmfao. I played that. Beyond abhorrent

[red harbor]

Yeah I've heard of it, haven't had the chance to suffer through it yet

Mainly because I don't use console that much lol

[hexed escarp]

rip

yeah hopefully the kex port will become usable eventually lmao

[lapis wolf]

Yeah. I also liked Valiant based on what I played too.

RIP

[lapis wolf]

I think I talked about it here a few weeks ago. Might be from me lol

[hexed escarp]

yeah valiant is pretty great

ive only played the first 8 and a half maps

but its already awesome

[vast hull]

Thoughts on anomaly report?

[red harbor]

Nah it was from a random YouTube vid

[vast hull]

Hmm?

[lapis wolf]

The water world episode was awesome I thought

[unique wyvern]

Now that I look at it the skull crusher from dark ages look like calamity blade from lor

[red harbor]

i really need to give kex another chance

i feel that im just comparing it to source-port only features (for me mainly freelook)

when i should be comparing how the features differ between kex and source ports

when it comes to that i think kex does quite well, with it's main shortcoming being THE FUCKING NON-EXISTANT DEMO SUPPORT

BETHESDA WHY WON'T YOU LET ME PLAY DEMOS THAT I MADE IN YOUR OWN GODDAMN RE-RERELEASE

anyways rant over

[opaque rose]

I find it very funny how e3m8’s song is one of the most adrenaline pumping songs in the game (imo anyways) then you only end up hearing it for 20 seconds

[red harbor]

bold of you to assume the level lasts 20 seconds with a couple well placed bfg shots

[opaque rose]

God damn you’re fast

[red harbor]

yeah i just did a quick run and got 19 seconds lol

did snipe bfg blasts from afar though since it's a death sentence to go in

i cant type for shit

[opaque rose]

That’s what I do, up close is just too dangerous

[red harbor]

just did a mix and got 15.31 secs

[opaque rose]

God damn

[red harbor]

could be faster with a soulsphere

[lapis wolf]

I would wait until updates.

So many technical issues, it's absurd

[coral arch]

what issue?

[red harbor]

cant load games with mods for some reason

[coral arch]

i can load games with mdos with no issue

[twin mortar]

Not everyone can

[coral arch]

is it a mod thats compatible

because you can upload incompatible mods to the browser

[red harbor]

i dont see why an incompatible mod would play but be unable to load

[vast hull]

How's the troopers playground?

[lapis wolf]

If it wasn't compatible then I wouldn't be playing it and saving on it in the first place

[lapis wolf]

It's loading save files from mods that's the issue, not loading the mod itself

[halcyon willow]

time to practise your 2 shots bruv

[red harbor]

also a quirk i've noticed with the KEX port is that it seems to be a lot easier to 2-shot Pinkies with the standard shotgun

[red harbor]

Idk if that's just a GZDoom quirk or I'm lucky but it's way more consistent in the KEX port

[azure nimbus]

I've heard a bunch of people say RNG is more favorable which...is certainly possible but I'm going to hold off on believing it until seeing some real statistics

[red harbor]

yeah it might be

no concrete proof besides the pinkies from me though

[halcyon willow]

consistency makes things feel more "favourable" even if the average damage is the same

a good example of this is the Supercharge mod, that removes all damage RNG

which means that a berserk punch always one shots pinkies. it does the same "average" damage as doom, but because the average damage point is a one shot on a pinkie, it means it feels more powerful

[red harbor]

@opaque rose just got 12.31

[torn beacon]

does anyone wanna playtest my doom wad

because

why not

[vale gyro]

yeah, what IWAD, engine, and complevel?

[torn beacon]

doom 2 vanilla and doom 2

i dont remember the specific comp level

but just the doom 2 one

[vale gyro]

I know what it is seeing it's vanilla, dw

[torn beacon]

ok

[warm elm]

anyone wanna play doom 1 or 2 coop campaign or brutal doom lfg

[finite crag]

So if (according to civvie) pistol starting UV on Plutonia means you get a girl

What happens if I do that but on Nightmare! and it's every expansion

[twin mortar]

I'm pretty confident one of the Plutonia levels is next to impossible on NM when pistol starting

[finite crag]

Can't be that bad

[azure nimbus]

try it

[coral arch]

He said he hoped that happens

Anyone can recommend a good wad that is not too difficult

Why are so many of the was so extremely difficult

Wads*

[twin mortar]

When you have 30 years of modding history, after a while the mods get stale

They're usually hard as shit now to give players a kick, a challenge, so they don't breeze through them like a regular WAD

[coral arch]

i dont want to breeze through them but im tired of the fight just feeling unfair where its like mancubuses from all directions with revenants and chaingunners

or just tiny room tons of monsters

i tried tetanus but its way to difficult

[coral arch]

do you know where gzdoom stores savefiles because i got some i need to delete but they cant be deleted ingamer

[twin mortar]

I don't know anything about GZDoom :p

[azure nimbus]

yes they can. click the "del" key

[coral arch]

ive done that

but they come backthus the point of not being able to delete them ingame

as soon as i start the game again they reapear in the list

is there a 3rd part of back to saturn or is it unfinished?

[lunar rune]

Just go to your GZDoom folder, it should be there

If not then just go to your appdata and local/roaming check if it's there

[coral arch]

i downloaded a beta build where it should be fixed instead

also what happends if you load a doom 1 wad in doom 2?

[lunar rune]

It kind of just bugs out and maps/music don't work

[surreal portal]

TVR aint really hard at all

and contains quite some examples of early doomcute

you also have Doom and Doom 2 The Way ID Did It

but yeah its less that later wads are hard and more that the stock levels are really easy

[coral arch]

i think its more that people have had like 20 years to get extremely good at the game

[surreal portal]

nah they are mainly easy
tons of ammo everywhere, especially keeping a shotgun stocked
Parts of E3 of Doom 1 and E4 were where the difficulty actually went up

E4 was legit designed for people already familiar with Doom

I'd call Quake's levels as a whole quite harder than base Doom's

[coral arch]

i did beat e4 on uv

[surreal portal]

its also stock doom 2 not really using its new monsters well at times

[coral arch]

i would find a lot of wads way better if revenants didnt have way to himing misile

[surreal portal]

stock doom 2 becomes a lot easier once you get monster quirks like the fact revenants will NEVER shoot a missile (unless flinched) at a certain close range

[coral arch]

its really stupid that it can do a 360

[surreal portal]

abuse it, make it hit
The thing has a quite relatively slow arc and you can run faster than it

[finite crag]

they're kinda nerfed in 64

[surreal portal]

If you think revvie missles are bad, just wait till you see Quake's Vores

[finite crag]

Are those the flying enemies?

Idk the names of any of the enemies in Quake I'll be honest

[surreal portal]

fuckin embed restrictions

[finite crag]

Idk if I've seen those guys yet

[surreal portal]

I cant even link a damn wiki page

[finite crag]

I saw, don't worry

And yeah I have no idea if I've seen them

[surreal portal]

they first appear in the finale of E2

but yeah, revenant missiles can be easily manipulated, and they're also relatively fragile

[finite crag]

Ah yeah I'm only on Episode one xd

[surreal portal]

2 incomplete SSG blasts will take down a revvie

or 5 normal shotgun blasts

abusing revenant missiles in an open area is a prime way to trigger infights

or form up a bunch to straight up kill something if you got the time and space

[finite crag]

cough Nuts cough

[coral arch]

ohh found a better smooth weapons mod the gun s now have shell casings

[red harbor]

Smooth Doom?

Not bad at all, but it isn't universally compatible

[coral arch]

nope

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?t=78199&start=15

it should work on any map as long as they dont have customw eapons

it works for both doom and doom 2 as well

[lapis wolf]

What do y'all think of the Marble Hill WAD?

DBP 67 specifically

It has an Ancient Aliens song lol

[lapis wolf]

Personally I like it, but doesn't entirely click with me for whatever reason

[red harbor]

I will never understand why the fullscreen HUD in the KEX port doesn't let you see all your ammo

[velvet scaffold]

i wanna get doom on the ps1, is it a good port?

[surreal portal]

its moody, but the Ultimate Doom levels are still the ancientass Jaguar levels

We never had an actual accurate doom console port until the embedded version on the Xbox version of Doom 3

and only a widely avaliable good one on the Xbox 360 XBLA

[lapis wolf]

Though I'd be surprised if there's anyone here who's played it or knows what that is lmao

[velvet scaffold]

i remember getting doom 2 on that

and doom

[surreal portal]

the included doom 2 levels in psx doom are notably actually somewhat close to the PC ones

because there was no jaguar base

[velvet scaffold]

didn't they plan on releasing it on jaguar

[surreal portal]

doom literally came out on jaguar

but nobody ever made a version of doom 2 for consoles until it being part of PSX Doom

due to no base and a stronger console, the Doom 2 levels are notably closer to their PC counterparts

[velvet scaffold]

i know doom 1 did but i thought they planned for doom 2 unless im just not paying attention

[surreal portal]

no idea on that

altho even on psx doom 2 levels sacrifices had to be made

like you'll notice the Crusher room on... The Crusher has been very much vertically squashed

[junior egret]

Classic doom was goated it was the first doom game i played and beat

[lone sail]

Hey uh, does anyone of you guys have brutal doom v22 test 3?

[azure nimbus]

idk why people make such a big deal about it when people make that sort of thing about every game

[vale gyro]

Don’t get it either

Anyways how do I force myself to play Plutonia?

I’m doing Arceon slowly at the moment

Mainly because I don’t wanna do Plutonia

[twin mortar]

Last classic WAD left, you got this

[vale gyro]

Except all the Master Level WADs

[twin mortar]

Uhh

Penultimate classic WAD...? It's less motivating but... yeah

[vale gyro]

Plutonia was kicking me into the dirt for what I played

[red harbor]

Pretend hitscanners are using hacks

[vale gyro]

That’s just gonna piss me off lol

[red harbor]

Then idk pretend they just have dumb luck

Or maybe go down the Wolfenstein route and say they're all THOSE Germans from the 1930s/1940s

[coral arch]

wouldnt that level with like 10k monsters or whatever it was also be a classsic wad

[twin mortar]

I don't think it's humanly possible to do every 'classic WAD'

I meant official ones

[coral arch]

do we count sigil 2 as well

[twin mortar]

Coder has beaten SIGIL II already so

[coral arch]

what map did you get too?

[twin mortar]

Nevermind, Coder has NOT finished SIGIL II

[coral arch]

i belive it dosnt get to 100% plutonia untill like map 4

[twin mortar]

Well, it's in the gray area. It's officially endorsed but unofficial. Kinda like Black Mesa

[coral arch]

i mkean id say sigil 2 is more official since it is made by romero himself

kinda like if gabe made black mesa

[twin mortar]

Black Mesa is more official than SIGIL II

Whether SIGIL II is official or not is a whole debate and I don't wanna delve into it, as I said, it's in the gray area

[vale gyro]

I did lmao

I did MONTHS ago

[twin mortar]

Nevermind then

[coral arch]

id still say its more official as its made by the person who worked on the original game

[twin mortar]

That doesn't have to mean shit though

[vale gyro]

Would me having a physical copy count as proof?

[twin mortar]

Like, you have Greg McConcrete who worked on X game. If he makes a fangame after leaving the company, it's still fanmade

That was the most random name I could come up with

[coral arch]

then hunt down the freeman is just as official as black mesa

both are licensed by valve

[twin mortar]

What I am saying is, Romero isn't affiliated with id or Bethesda in any way NOWADAYS

[twin mortar]

No, you don't even know why I said it's more official though lol. I said it's more official because it was included in the Half-Life franchise sales a few years back, under the franchise catalogue

[vale gyro]

3 or 4?

I can’t remember, honestly

[coral arch]

i link the game to the people who made it not the company

[vale gyro]

It’s been a bit

[twin mortar]

Well then link it to John Romero, the guy who works at Romero Games, not id or Bethesda

[finite crag]

Genuinely forgot how good In Sandy's City is

[red harbor]

And Sigil 2 would've been in Doom + Doom II but it came out too soon to it's release date

[hardy pebble]

Yo I just got doom+doom II and I'm trying to make it as close to gz doom as I can any specific mods to download im on ps5 BTW

[azure nimbus]

Not really. Aesthetic stuff is out there to an extent or could be but you're not going to be able to have vertical freelook nor monster-over-monsters

[coral arch]

What is monster over monster

[azure nimbus]

when a monster occupies the same x,y coordinates but is at a different height. LIterally one is over the other

This isn't allowed in doom so gives the effect of infinite height for certain collissions

[red harbor]

does anybody know why i suddenly have a larger cursor under my main one in the kex port?

[coral arch]

https://youtu.be/KmnTXqYnoCo?si=SFXnrbokonPRlO7W

[red harbor]

...and yet i always find myself here

no matter how hard i try

[junior egret]

Real

[red harbor]

gzdoom always seems to bring me back

and that sucks because kex is great

[red harbor]

hey just wondering since the kex port has both the original and unity wads, which is better? i've been using the unity ones since they're more recent and all that but i want to see your opinions

[vale gyro]

originals imo

I'd see no reason to use the Unity over the Originals

[twin mortar]

Do the originals keep the NIN logo?

[vale gyro]

I think?

I can’t honestly remember

[coral arch]

The originals dosnt seem to have the improved controlls or graphics though

But each to their own

[vale gyro]

WADs have nothing to do with the controls???

[coral arch]

I tought he meant the the kex port vs the dos option in the launcher

[vale gyro]

Nope

He specified the WADs in particular

[coral arch]

Whats the difference in those?

[vale gyro]

Unity has some censorship and also makes the health crosses green instead of red due to the Red Cross and the Geneva Convention

Originals have none of that

[coral arch]

What censorship?

[little oar]

Can confirm, the originals on steam (through the dosbox) does retain the NIN logo in e4m1

Same for stuff like the red crosses

[vale gyro]

I think the NIN logo in E4M1 and maybe map31 and map32’s textures

I’m not as sure about the latter

[little oar]

NIN logo, red crosses to green, textures in the wolfenstein levels changed (as well as a few sound clips from the dead n*zis)

The swastika in one of the early E1 missions was also removed

[vale gyro]

This was removed in UDoom as well

Actually, maybe in later Doom 1 versions as well

[little oar]

Yeah, but if we're talking differences between the steam releases and the originals then I'd still count it tbh

[vale gyro]

Well, the “originals” in this case are pretty much not available anymore

I would exclude that change seeing it’s in UDoom as well

[little oar]

Fair

[coral arch]

well that sucks. accidently picked up a medkit on 97% health

[zenith berry]

Ouch moment

[coral arch]

died with 163 kills out of 165 froma ccidently blowing myself up with the rocket

[zenith berry]

Ah, the classic facerocket.

[coral arch]

i intended to switch to chaingun but i already was on the chaingun

[coral arch]

my aim was off so i entierly missed the enemy but there just happened to gbe a barrel to where i accidently shot so i still killed him

im so good i hit even when i miss

ok why does doom the way id did have several inescapable pits

they said they eumlated romeros style but they broke 1 of the first comandments of his making. no inescapable pits

[zenith berry]

Thou shall not make inescapable pits

[coral arch]

nboth of them are placed very close to the exit as well

and these maps are large

exept for those this does actually feel like official maps

for the most part

[twin mortar]

So does the X360 version, another point for it

[red harbor]

IIRC it was removed in v1.4

[azure nimbus]

that's right

[red harbor]

god it's so weird seeing red health packs after so long, cant believe the unity wad is literally just censorship (and removing "The Ultimate" from the title screen)

[twin mortar]

Valid censorship though

[red harbor]

yeah except the wolfenstein levels imho

i get the other ones being over the geneva convention and trademarks though

[twin mortar]

It was done to save time, they'd need to make two seperate versions of the game otherwise

[red harbor]

didnt germany allow that kind of stuff if the n*zis are painted in a negative light recently though? or was i misinformed

[twin mortar]

Key word being recently

But there's already a Germany-only version of DOOM II Unity, so, do with that info what you will

Check on SteamDB

[red harbor]

huh i thought it was last year

[twin mortar]

What do you mean by 'it' specifically

[red harbor]

germany allowing n*zi imagery as long as they're painted in a bad light with it

mb if i wasnt clear

[twin mortar]

Yeah okay but the Unity WADs are from 2019 so it's no difference

[red harbor]

true

sad they couldn't spruce those up for the rerelease

[coral arch]

ok doom 2 the way id did started good but then slowly became worse and now it just feels like slaughtermap

map 15

[rough cairn]

Hello all

I was wondering if I could get some help on Doom II, the Master Levelxs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ybq7OYtm2hE&t=2s

I am trying to do a playthrough of the level, obtain 100% of everything

but I seem to have missed an items and I can't get 100%

I know why the kills is not 100% (this is because I killed the Icon of Sin but he had fired a projectile to spawn a demon already)

that's not so important

but the Items thing is driving me insane (despite watching numerous walthroughs, including Big Mac Davis)

[azure nimbus]

There are some spectres stuck in the wall in this level https://youtu.be/2wuS_gBhq7Q?si=pmkV4L5tW7cAOVAo&t=695

Items idk. I suggest opening the map in an editor and counting the items

[rough cairn]

Thanks so much!

There are so many glitches

I don't think I will be playing this map again anytime soon

It is, by far, my least favourite map from Ultimate Doom, Doom II and Final Doom

[azure nimbus]

The master levels are not Udoom, Doom2, or Final doom

Udoom is specifically the original 3 episodes and thy flesh consumed. Doom2 is those 32 maps, final doom is Plutonia and TNT. The MLs are a separate thing

it's part of why the quality is...dubious

[rough cairn]

Yeah I see what you mean

I just called it part of Doom II because I play the game on Steam and it's classed as part of Doom II

but you're right because some of the D2 Master Levels are part of the Master Levels for the PS1 version of Final Doom

[azure nimbus]

They are all part of the master levels

They were released seperately on CD in 1995 by a group of guys contracted by but not part of id Software

Still, the fact that various combinations of original levels were released in the same package on various ports does muddy some of the history.