classic-doom

[finite crag]

Doom roguelike arsenal

With monster pack

[vocal sand]

ahh yeah i was trying that one out the other day, pretty fun

[finite crag]

Ok

Version 1.5

[vocal sand]

i played thru doom 2 with Final Doomer the other day, that's a fun mod if you haven't played it

[finite crag]

I found out that doom 2 mods work on ultimate doom

[vocal sand]

makes sense

[finite crag]

When can we play

I use delta touch

Bc I'm on android

It got a update recently that it can play doom 3

[vocal sand]

man i haven't played doom 3 in so long lol

[finite crag]

I never played it

Lol

[vocal sand]

i did when it first came out

[finite crag]

So when could we play

I'm in Europe so the time if different

[vocal sand]

i probably can't, i typicaly only play doom at work

just making my way thru wads

[finite crag]

What's your favorite

Wad

Just asking so we can play it

[vocal sand]

probably TNT Revilution

Valiant is pretty fun so far, i'm only on map 10 tho

[sleek mirage]

i finally finished thy flesh consumed

[vocal sand]

now you understand Perfect Hatred

[sleek mirage]

i absolutely hated e4m2 and it demotivated me from playing it

[sleek mirage]

lol

[vocal sand]

i used to hate it but now i love it

[sleek mirage]

yeah

the rest of it was fun

now back to hell on earth map19

[vocal sand]

hell yeah, one of the worst maps in Doom 2

[finite crag]

Any doom wads that expands on the lore? (If that makes sense)

[vocal sand]

i heard Doom Zero does a bit

most wads are story lite tho

[azure nimbus]

I know some people here like the classic beta content: Fabian released the latest version of woof today which implements classic lost souls, classic bfg, as well as removing auto aim for projectiles and using some older sprites from the -beta param

[finite crag]

Hi

I'm back

[bitter raft]

Welcome back, I'm Blytz.

[finite crag]

Ok

Can you play doom 1 Co op with me

[bitter raft]

Sorry, but it is getting late for me.

[finite crag]

Ok tomorrow?

[bitter raft]

I'll be busy with work.

[finite crag]

K when then

[bitter raft]

Also timezones can be a problem since I live in Australia.

[finite crag]

I'm in Europe

Germany

[bitter raft]

I assume vanilla Ultimate Doom?

[finite crag]

Ok why no mods tho

[bitter raft]

Just curious.

[finite crag]

Ok

But I find it kinda boring with only 7 weapons

[bitter raft]

Also, what difficulty? I'm good with Ultra-Violence.

[finite crag]

Hurt me plenty

Or ultra violence

I choose ultra violence

Could I add the mega weapons pack mod

[bitter raft]

I do alot of Ultra Violence on Doom.

[bitter raft]

I mean I assume it's more fun having the SSG in Doom 2.

[bitter raft]

sure

[finite crag]

Ok

When could we play

[bitter raft]

Oh right.

[finite crag]

Lets make a day where it's cacodemon day

[bitter raft]

Eh... would 23rd be alright?

[bitter raft]

don't know when's that.

[finite crag]

For cacodemon day?

It's on 23rd July

[bitter raft]

inb4 we play this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecJVdNuPk5w

[finite crag]

Ok

Sounds a bit funny

[bitter raft]

Have to be honest, I barely play Doom online.

Like from here for example. https://youtu.be/EvwLaqNiaLo?t=3938

[vocal sand]

a lot of people like to play with no mods for the vanilla experience

[bitter raft]

true

[finite crag]

Ok

[vocal sand]

@finite crag have you tried asking people on the doomworld forums for coop? might be easier to find people in your timezone

[bitter raft]

Sometimes, we like to experience the vanilla game to remind us how the game is link before it's modded.

[bitter raft]

Oh yeah right, since I am busy with my job and I do prefer singleplayer anyways since I don't really experience much multiplayer other than playnig alot of Brawlhalla.

Thank you Dave.

[vocal sand]

np

[dapper flint]

Choose the difficulty you enjoy

[finite crag]

Hurt me plenty

[tacit remnant]

Ultra-Violence is the default for the official releases and most WADs but play the difficulty you’re most comfortable playing. Worth noting though that most people will find the 2 easiest difficulty settings to be incredibly boring due to the very low monster population

[vast reef]

i play on UV in the official releases for the sole reason that there's more demons to kill

[vocal sand]

uv in custom wads can be mega hard, sometimes it helps to run thru on a lower difficulty first to learn a level

[vast reef]

yep

i only play UV by default in official releases or in wads i know i can handle

[vocal sand]

the last few levels of scythe 1 are pretty insane on uv

same with alien vendetta

[vast reef]

mhm

[vocal sand]

valiant has been pretty tough so far, had to take a break after attempting map 11 for a while earlier lol

[dapper flint]

Uv is usually the map makers intended difficulty. Usually pistol start. You are generally missing out on the map when it's lower than that

[vocal sand]

i don't think either of those are true, otherwise why would map makers bother to fill out the other difficulties?

pistol starters are also just a small niche of the doom community

[tacit remnant]

It’s definitely the intent but most mappers offer lower difficulties as a sort of compromise. Playtesting is almost always from pistol start so while it should play fine continuous, it’s definitely balanced around pistol start intentionally or not

I played Scythe 1 on UV recently and just stopped upon hitting Run From It as that map is simultaneously really hard and really stupid. Fear is one of my favorite Doom levels though as it introduced me to slaughter maps, which is why I’m currently trying to play through Rush (Rush is very hard and I’ve only beaten the first map

[vocal sand]

Fear is great

Run From It stinks, i just skip it

i think the map being balanced around pistol start and the intent being that you pistol start a map are two different things, i think most designers want the game to be flexible around the player's preferred method

that's a major part of Doom's lasting appeal after all, the custom experience

[dapper flint]

Actually it is true

Maps are tested on uv with pistol start in mind

Mostly for balance

Not so you're forced to play it that way

[vocal sand]

that doesn't mean you're supposed to play it that way, the designer just wants it to be in the realm of possibility

[dapper flint]

That's what I literally just said

[vocal sand]

doesn't mean you're missing out by playing on a lower difficulty

[vocal sand]

this statement isn't true

[dapper flint]

You are missing out in added monsters and intended encounters are nerfed

But it's up to the player

[vocal sand]

lol ok dude

[dapper flint]

It is

Literally

Map makers test their maps on uv and pistol start for balance

It's a fact

[tacit remnant]

I don’t pistol start because I find rebuilding my arsenal every map pretty annoying. “Intended experience” and “forced experience” are different. The intended experience is what the designer thinks will be best but it’s not a hill to die on in most cases

[dapper flint]

That makes sense. Alot of people do

It's about fun end of the day

[vocal sand]

the map maker intends fun and a flexible experience, unless they only designed for 1 difficulty setting, which is specified in the readme that comes with most wads

[tacit remnant]

You’re allowed to deviate from the intended experience because most mappers would rather you play the nerfed version than pass up outright

[dapper flint]

Sure but maps are usually tested pistol start and uv just to test its balance

[vocal sand]

that's not the same as an intended way to play

[tacit remnant]

They’d still probably prefer you to play on UV though since it best reflects their design vision

[vocal sand]

it takes a lot of work to balance difficulty settings, i doubt they'd do it just as a compromise

[tacit remnant]

Intended means “the designer thinks it’s best” not “they want you to play this way and only this way”

[dapper flint]

For the most part uv is the intended difficulty the map makers would like the player to experience the map. But nothing stops you from playing what you're comfortable with

@halcyon willow

Not being an elitist. Play what difficulty you want. But in most cases a map maker designs their map for a UV playthrough. That's the full experience intended

[azure nimbus]

Unless you're Ribbiks or Sandy Peterson

[dapper flint]

Exactly

There's lots of exceptions

[azure nimbus]

I think Skillsaw also takes care to balance HMP but I'm not sure

[vocal sand]

i think the designer would want people to play through their maps regardless of difficulty settings

i suppose you'd have to ask map makers though

i'm sure they're split on the issue

[dapper flint]

Yeah but from all the maps I've played of his uv is where it's at

[tacit remnant]

Yes, but they usually have a difficulty in mind as the best version

[dapper flint]

I can actually

Let me see

[azure nimbus]

I remember watching a Nirvana video and he was saying that he liked seeing people play HMP. He balances that and likes when people try it

[vocal sand]

i think to say, you're supposed to play UV, turns people off from trying new maps when they hit a difficulty wall

[tacit remnant]

I’m not saying that you’re supposed to so much as it’s ideal if you’re up to it

[dapper flint]

Yeah it's nothing to do with supposed to

[azure nimbus]

Oh Erik Alm too, I think he said something about "if scythe1 gets really hard here(e3), consider HMP"

[dapper flint]

I've heard that before though. Not always true

[azure nimbus]

Doomkid definitely balances HMP. Most people do default to UV but definitely a lot of mappers are perfectly fine with you playing HMP.

[dapper flint]

Like sigil and Romero recommending hurt me

[azure nimbus]

Romero is gonna add a PE secret to sigil2

[dapper flint]

The best are where enemies aren't exactly taken out but a different encounter all together with hurt me

[tacit remnant]

Like Sunlust

Which is still an absolute beast on HMP

[vocal sand]

developer intent /= what you're supposed to do?

[azure nimbus]

Yeah map24's redkey fight is stupid on UV with SIX sniper viles(no bfg). Some are replaced with revs on lower difficulties

[tacit remnant]

Developer intent is the design focus. It usually isn’t the only accepted version of the experience

[azure nimbus]

I'm less concerned with what the devs wanted and what makes the level good

[vocal sand]

that's pretty muddy imo

i think the only developer intent you can imply is that they want you to finish the map

[azure nimbus]

Well, you are the one playing so get to choose how to play it

[tacit remnant]

Cognition is muddy, so any description of cognitive processes are also muddy

[azure nimbus]

check out the newest version of woof btw. it has beta stuff that I remember you liking

[tacit remnant]

Woof?

[dapper flint]

It's a sourceport

[azure nimbus]

https://www.doomworld.com/forum/post/2521530

kinda like DSDA with controller support and very slightly more features. It was originally just meant to be a windows mbf port. -beta param makes beta souls and bfg

[tacit remnant]

Oh okay thanks

[vocal sand]

the only reason i argue against uv being the intended experience is because i've bounced off of some maps just because i insisted on frustrating myself, i'm sure that's not an experience unique to me

and there is a sentiment in the community that uv is the ideal

[dapper flint]

When you re good enough sure. And ready for it

No use getting destroyed and having a bad time

[azure nimbus]

I honestly don't know how much "elitism" there really is. People who are good at the game aren't often toxic about it and I don't know if people who don't play and assume that that's the best way to play really count as elitists if they're not experienced. Most classic doomers are pretty chill

[dapper flint]

You have to play uv is stupid for sure

[azure nimbus]

Some maps are designed for coop, to be done uvspeed, to be done uvmax, to be played casually, done with or without saves(holy hell revealed is not meant to be uvmaxed for example) -- but yaknow, you're playing the game. Unless you're submitting a speedrun, whatever

[dapper flint]

I've played some wads where I feel it would be boring without solo net

[azure nimbus]

though I will be sad if you play gz with rocket trails. it ugly

[tacit remnant]

I turn off rocket trails to preserve framerate. I can barely tell visually

[dapper flint]

I had fun in gz but it's not for me anymore

[vocal sand]

i play on gz, set to strict

cuz i jumped on classic Doom after watching MtPain videos lol

classic case of what i'm talking about, in his last video he hated SWTW map 3 for being absurd when he could have turned the difficulty down and had a better time

[halcyon willow]

Unless stated by the mapper there is no such thing as an intended difficulty setting

Eg sunlust where ribbiks says hmp is what most people should play

The intended difficulty is the one you enjoy playing

[azure nimbus]

-nomonsters

[vocal sand]

nightmare -nomonsters

[tacit remnant]

Mt Pain keeps the difficulty fixed because he’s writing reviews and he needs to keep things consistent somehow

[halcyon willow]

That will be the opposite of consistent lol. Bastion of chaos on UV will feel nothing like jenesis on uv

Abandon vs btsx

You'd get a more comparable exper9nce adjusting difficulty based on who made the maps

But

That would take a fair amount of research

[tacit remnant]

Consistent in the sense that the wads are being held to an objective standard. If you’re changing the settings for each wad that means they can’t really be held to a matching standard

[halcyon willow]

Consistent standard of what?

[azure nimbus]

if he played nerf, he's play nightmare. there is a line where he'd change the settings to fit better

[halcyon willow]

There is no objective standard of anything in classic doom wads

[tacit remnant]

Consistent standard of assuming a particular baseline. Objectivity requires a fixed point of reference, and good reviews need to be partly objective

[halcyon willow]

Italodoom has the hardest difficulty hntr

There is no objectivity

[azure nimbus]

smax does the same

[halcyon willow]

Pretending there is is an exercise in self delusion

[azure nimbus]

he changed it up for d64. mtpain played continuously then

[halcyon willow]

You can have your own internal yard stick or whatever, but pretending it's anything other than subjective is just incorrect

Because it's your internal yardstick

[vocal sand]

yeah i have to agree with Bridgeburner here, you can't have objectivity when everybody is playing doom a different way

[halcyon willow]

There's absolutely nothing wrong with subjectivity

[vocal sand]

you could argue objectivity isn't there in MtPain's videos because he's playing on GZDoom for example

[halcyon willow]

In fact I'd say its better

I'd rather have someone's personal opinion than them pretend to give a cold "objective" review. People like different stuff for different reasons. I wanna hear why

[vocal sand]

right on

[azure nimbus]

doom is when you play the 1.666 version of the executable on dos uv pistol start and only the first 3 episodes. anything else is basically quake

[vocal sand]

lmao

[halcyon willow]

I'm sorry only doom shareware is valid

Episode 1 or gtfo

[vocal sand]

only e1m1 with no weapons is valid

pacifist

[azure nimbus]

even if I had a floppy disk with doom and dos somehow, I'd have no clue how to get it running

[vocal sand]

it's ok, you can play the psx port

[hexed escarp]

are the names of sprites hardcoded into the engine?

[low ore]

I will play bastion of chaos with gold complex

never made it past half of bastion of chaos on uv normally before cheating so, god complex is not a good idea but imma do it

[dapper flint]

Psx port is hot

[halcyon willow]

What are you trying to do

[hexed escarp]

im not trying to do something specific atm but if i were to make something with dehextra, would i just have to name all of the sprites sp01 sp02 ect or can i change what sprite name corresponds to what sprite number

[halcyon willow]

If you're using mbf21 you can name them w/e but gor standard dehacked they have to use existing codepointers

[hexed escarp]

but how do you know which sprite number is which

[jade solstice]

A stupid question maybe (from me)

What’s doom vs ultimate doom - like what’s the difference
I briefly looked before and I thought they were the same game IIRC what I read

[hexed escarp]

doom 1 only had the first 3 chapters

ultimate doom released 2 years later with an added forth chapter called Thy Flesh Consumed

[hexed escarp]

approximately how many wads have been releasaed that use otex?

[jade solstice]

Thank you

[azure nimbus]

ultdoom was also the first time doom1 was sold in stores rather than online. And lost souls bounce in ultdoom whereas the original release (and vanilla doom2), they do not

[jade solstice]

Bounce?

[spice radish]

They bounce?

[azure nimbus]

https://youtu.be/XFZFNE0a82w?t=705 bouncing on the floor.

[jade solstice]

Interesting

Unity port is Ultimate doom I assume then

I never knew the bounce thing tbh

[halcyon willow]

Approximately a metric fuckton

[hexed escarp]

oh ok lol

[finite crag]

Otex?

[hexed escarp]

its a texture pack

the one used in Eviternity, and i think heartland

[finite crag]

That seems cool

[hexed escarp]

yeah, i looked at it

[finite crag]

So like freedoom for textures?

[hexed escarp]

it is insanely meticulous

[hexed escarp]

i mean it could be, but it has mostly just been used alongside doom 2 textures

[finite crag]

i remember a friend of mine doing something like that but using source textures from discs

nothing beats the good ol' cobble_stone

[hexed escarp]

wait is cobble_stone not already in doom? thats surprising

[finite crag]

nope

we might be talking about different cobble_stones though

[hexed escarp]

im talking about the one in mario64 and like tons of other games

[finite crag]

oh yeah nope that one isn't in doom

[half adder]

https://twitter.com/goldenaxedoom/status/1549187017862414336?s=21&t=DAPuQdta0S2Uls1D9YjcvQ

Connoisseur_of_Toilet_Wine💛💙 (@GoldenAxeDoom)

NEW MOD

I present

"CacoFrendo"

does ur heart ache every time u squeeze the trigger on one of the lovable tomato boyz?

well now with the power of "Cacofrendo" you dont have to!

simply pat the Caco on his lovely little head and watch the blossoming friendship take hold!
#doom

Likes

174

▶ Play video

Twitter · Jul 19, 2022, 12:19 AM

😮

If this is in the wrong channel lmk

[dapper flint]

Cacoaward incoming

[noble pecan]

Where is red key E3M7?

Nvm found it. Stupid lava maze

[noble pecan]

This game is stupid

[hexed escarp]

Is it possible to have 5 ammo types in mbf21? Or am I stuck with 4

[noble pecan]

So I heard Doom I “base game” is basically the first three episodes? So I can consider the spider mastermind the final boss and move on to Doom II?

[hexed escarp]

That’s what I did

It doesn’t really matter

The early doom games don’t have much of a story so you can play them in whatever order you want

Thy flesh is actually harder than doom2 in some cases so it could make sense to play doom 2 first but you can do whatever you want

[dapper flint]

Even though thy flesh came after 2 I'd still do it first

[noble pecan]

I’m not committed to playing every level, just whatever is considered “base game”

[dapper flint]

Thy flesh is in the base game included with unity

But it is difficult for new players. If you're just trying to get through the original episodes that's fine. But you'll be skipping an episode

It's an official 4th episode

[noble pecan]

What’s unity? All the extras and addons make it very confusing

Also how can you add an episode after the next game already came out?

[dapper flint]

Unity is the new re release that you're playing. Unity engine. I believe it's limit removing. Alot of the add ons are fan made maps and not official releases other than thy flesh, plutonia and tnt. Sigil is a unofficial 5th episode. When ultimate doom was released it included thy flesh. But thy flesh was released after doom 2

[dapper flint]

Alot of people still played both. It's not like today when the new game replaces the last

Oh and I think master levels are included

[noble pecan]

Well I’m not doing master levels. Playing the game from start to finish of the main campaign is all I need. Is that just through episode 4?

[dapper flint]

Yeah. 4 is actually my favorite

I wouldn't worry about masterlevels. They're trash

[cloud talon]

It will get cacoawards for five years straight. Its so good it gets them after a year

Just like how mario 2 has been winning game of the year for the past 40 years straight

[honest granite]

https://youtu.be/c6hnQ1RKhbo

[low ore]

the nemesis macrocosm is HARD

https://i.imgur.com/8CQlENv.jpg

now I will die a lot

yep, this is death

[vast reef]

i'd play gz vanilla for graphical mods if it didn't lag on my PC

the stuff that doesn't work on strict compatibility usually shouldn't affect me

[sleek mirage]

is that the unmakyr

[sleek mirage]

if you want to feel anger play they flesh consumed

thy*

[vast reef]

more like depression

for me at least

[sleek mirage]

i felt hatred

[vast reef]

lmao

[sleek mirage]

i felt like breaking my screen

[low ore]

after 30 minutes... I completed phase 1 of the fight

[low ore]

no it's nemesis

I guess it's kinda like the unmakyr, it shoots magenta lazers that consume your health

this is the coolest fucking thing I have seen in my whole entire damn life

everyone needs to experience this once it's that fucking amazing, it's so amazing that I have to swear to emphasize how amazing this is

[hexed escarp]

does anybody know how this mod works? i installed it because it seemed funny but i cant figure out how to actually pet the caco

[vast reef]

check out keybinds maybe?

or check out the fist and see if alt fire or something makes it pet the caco

could be weapon zoom or reload since modders like binding random stuff to those keys fsr

[zenith berry]

Yoo, John Romero is currently making an unnamed FPS game using Unreal Engine 5!

(And he has opened job applications in his site for those who want to participate)

[hexed escarp]

hmm its not alt fire, reload, zoom, or interact with either fist or pistol

and in the video they used pistol

[vast reef]

oh

[hexed escarp]

is the mod not loading properly for some reason?

im dragging the pk3 onto the gzdoom exe

[vast reef]

i assume you're on the latest version

let me check the twitter post

nothing

[hexed escarp]

yeah idk

[noble pecan]

I already feel anger toward the game because I don’t know what the heck is going on. Like sometimes rockets lock on and other times go straight, and I couldn’t tell if my BFG shots were hitting the spider, and mostly I can’t figure out where I’m supposed to go next. The game doesn’t communicate with you, and that makes me mad.

[tacit remnant]

Aim assist is definitely inconsistent. The BFG is programmed weird where when the ball hits something you (not the ball) send out a cone of hitscan tracers in the direction you were facing when you fired.

Level navigation takes some getting used to admittedly

If you shoot the BFG while running right at the spider and are pretty close to it when the ball connects, you can oneshot her

[vast reef]

play gzdoom and use smart autoaim i guess

but i'm not sure if that fully fixes everything

[vast reef]

yep, best to think of it as an energy shotgun

the ball does damage on its own

[noble pecan]

As I’m sure you’ve heard me say before, I want games to be playable on the first run. This game is supposed to be killing demons, not solving puzzles. All these 1-2 minute levels are taking me 30+minutes to complete

[vast reef]

but after the ball hits something it sends out a second attack

[vast reef]

ouch

i looked at walkthroughs a crap ton during my first playthrough of doom

[tacit remnant]

The puzzles are kinda just how games in that era were designed. The more of them you do, the easier they get

[noble pecan]

I was shooting the BFG and immediately jumping behind a corner. And I wasn’t sure I was hitting it because I was firing from far enough away that the ball was hitting the legs not the brain.

[tacit remnant]

The legs count fine. The hitscan cone is where most of the damage comes from though

[noble pecan]

Well which game do I play to get gratuitous continuous violence? I don’t want exploration from this game.

[tacit remnant]

90s game hitboxes tend to be very simple, so anywhere is generally fine

[noble pecan]

So I was missing out on that by ducking behind corners?

[tacit remnant]

Right

Plutonia Experient is difficult but is definitely the most combat focused part of classic Doom.

[noble pecan]

Is that an addon?

[tacit remnant]

Yes

It’s near the bottom of the list

[azure nimbus]

newer fanmade maps are usually easier to navigate, or at the very least you get accostomed to traversing envirnments

[noble pecan]

Part of me wants to play it all just to get a feel for where it came from. But I mostly hate the outdated limitations of the older games that make them less fun. I’d never intentionally play this game for fun I don’t think.

[tacit remnant]

Yeah the clunky stuff is mostly from earlier Doom content. Later campaigns smooth most of that out

[noble pecan]

Starting with what, 3?

[tacit remnant]

I mean with mods. The modded campaigns for Doom 1-2 have gotten more linear and less puzzly with time

Most have a little bit of puzzle stuff but it’s rarely a major component of modern Doom map design

[noble pecan]

When do the official campaigns become linear? Not til 2016?

[tacit remnant]

Doom 3 is pretty linear

[azure nimbus]

I was getting lost even in 2016.

I was LOST in d3

[tacit remnant]

Doom 3 has the problem that everything looks kinda the same, but the actual pathways are simple enough

[noble pecan]

I don’t remember getting too lost in more than a couple parts of 2016. Certainly nothing as bad as E3M7s lava maze. With single-use rad suits

[tacit remnant]

For more combat focused classic Doom, I recommend trying No End In Sight, Plutonia, Deathless, and Earthless

[noble pecan]

So I assume 2 isn’t going to be much different style than 1, meaning maybe I’ll just play 3 next?

Except I don’t understand how you guys are pulling lore from this game; it tells you almost nothing

[tacit remnant]

2 is much more open than 1 and is easier to navigate mostly.

The main exception is the city levels near the middle that everyone hates

[noble pecan]

Open means not linear though right?

[tacit remnant]

Open meaning bigger spaces and more room to move. It’s more linear sometimes but it really depends on the level

[noble pecan]

Hmm. I hate trying to keep distance with demons because I can’t quickswap to kill them quickly enough

[hexed escarp]

does A_Chase just make a monster move forward in the direction its facing?

[tacit remnant]

Circle of Death and Dead Simple are extremely linear (they’re basically each one big arena fight) but the Chasm isn’t at all. The rule is to fight decently close but to switch weapons between enemies

Switching weapons isn’t something you’re expected to do while firing on an enemy, it’s what you do while seeking your target.

[noble pecan]

I just wanted to play through the series but with mods and everything there’s way too much content for that approach

I’ll probably muddle through E4 and hope Doom 2 is fun

[tacit remnant]

I recommend trying some mods but not sticking to them if you aren’t having fun. The different campaigns often have different design goals so you probably won’t like them all, not even all of the good ones. Don’t bother with E4; it’s basically an expansion and significantly more difficult than most of the OG content

[noble pecan]

I think mods etc are something I’ll come back for. I want to follow Doomguy’s journey through the games, because of how fixated Eternal is on his origins.

[tacit remnant]

That’s fair

My rule with mod campaigns is to play the first level and then decide whether to keep going. The first level usually isn’t a highlight but will give you a general idea of what that campaign is going for

[noble pecan]

I understand why Doom was so appealing in the 90s though. Kids have all kinds of time to kill, so exploring the levels would be fun.

[noble pecan]

I’m a bit of a purist. I see mods as fan fiction, not really worth my time when getting through a game.

[tacit remnant]

That’s fair. I see them like unofficial D&D modules myself

[noble pecan]

Unfortunately I don’t really have a social life so I never got to play D&D. My creativity is limited to asking the creators what they want me to do next in the game.

[tacit remnant]

Lots of them are honestly better than the base games. Plutonia is fairly challenging but is way better designed than Doom 2 proper (also Plutonia and Evilution are technically official Doom 2 expansions)

[noble pecan]

I don’t like choosing my own adventures once I decide to pursue a certain game; I hand my will over to the creators.

[noble pecan]

Maybe I’ll treat them like master levels. Where once I’m done with vanilla, I’ll try out mods. But I’m still playing DE everyday so classic doom isn’t a huge priority; I just want to get it done for completion’s sake.

[tacit remnant]

Yeah that’s fair. As an aside please skip on the Doom 2 master levels (the Eternal ML namesake); they’re honestly garbage.

[noble pecan]

They named some after DE? How does that work?

[tacit remnant]

No the Doom Eternal Master Levels are named after that Doom 2 pack

For some reason

[noble pecan]

So only 2 and Eternal have MLs?

[tacit remnant]

Under that name yes. Almost every Doom has something of that nature though

[sleek mirage]

yep

i agree with all that

rockets have a mind of their own

sometimes they go LEFT of where i'm aiming

LEFT

[noble pecan]

Is Doom 2 even worth playing? I’m eager to see modern style gameplay

[tacit remnant]

My assessment of official classic Doom expansions is:
TFC: has 2 extremely hard levels randomly included for no apparent reason. It’s otherwise fine I guess
TNT Evilution: it’s not terrible but is the maziest official Doom content so anyone who isn’t into that won’t have fun
Plutonia is amazing. Most of it is small contained gauntlets of monsters and traps. Straightforward to navigate but not dying is hard

Doom 2 is a very mixed bag. It has some amazing levels and also some kinda terrible ones

[noble pecan]

Is there much lore?

[tacit remnant]

Not really. John Carmack at the time had the philosophy of “story in video games is like story in a porno. You expect it to be there, but it’s not that important”

Those are his exact words btw

The staff was like 6 people when they made the first 2 Doom games, and Carmack was the main programmer

[noble pecan]

Is any old Doom game going to supplement ancient Eternal lore?

[azure nimbus]

the lore is that doom2 guy is doom1 guy

[tacit remnant]

Not much. 64 a little bit

[azure nimbus]

is also Thy Guy Consumed

[noble pecan]

Knee Deep in the Guy?

[azure nimbus]

There is some weapon swap tech but it's very limited. Like say you have the pistol out and are approaching a shotgun. You can begin the "drop pistol" animation before hitting the shotgun by pressing the 1 key so that you drop your pistol and pick up the shotgun before the raise fist animation begins

[tacit remnant]

Doom 2 did introduce many of Doom’s most iconic monsters (though Plutonia used them better)

[azure nimbus]

Or if you are approaching a shotgun but want the chaingun, so you press the 4 key as you are picking up the shotgun. Or you save your last bfg shot until you have an extra in the chamber so you don't have to swap weapons

[dapper flint]

Thy flesh is great. Haters

[azure nimbus]

some of it is pretty indefensible like m4 and m7

[tacit remnant]

TFC isn’t bad but it is a significant difficulty hike in seemingly random places and isn’t part of the original Doom experience. I think Doom 1 first timers should pass on it or play it on a lower difficulty

[dapper flint]

I don't think it should be passed on at all

Lower it is a better idea

[azure nimbus]

idk e4m6 is a lot harder than anything in doom2

[hexed escarp]

i think that people should experience doom however they want to experience doom

its not our place to tell them what order they have to play the games in

[dapper flint]

No one is saying have to. It's my personal opinion skipping thy flesh would be a mistake

Just like how I don't think plutonia should be skipped

Tnt on the other hand..

[tacit remnant]

I personally wish Doom 2 played more like Plutonia. Doom 2 is still good imo but it feels like it could have been so much better if it had a bit more dev time and took the gloves off a bit more. Maybe even the city levels would have been good with more revisions and feedback

[floral gale]

I just finished knee deep in the dead on doom 1993 : D

[floral gale]

On mobile

[tacit remnant]

That’s impressive if my assumptions about mobile controls aren’t way off

[vale gyro]

They suck tbh

If you turn on auto sprint

You can’t sprint at all

The interaction buttons are in weird places

The older controls were better in my opinion

[tacit remnant]

That’s impressively bad

[vocal summit]

delta touch says hi...

[finite crag]

I have delta touch

I have a server

Who wants to play with me

It's doom 1

[hexed escarp]

im trying to get this soulsphere in eviternity and ive been sitting here trying to figure it out for a solid 10 minutes

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/988209746756661338/999030274740457623/unknown.png

can someone give me a hint without straight up telling me how to get it?

[finite crag]

what about no rest for the living

[dapper flint]

Outside arena opens up on the left side

[tacit remnant]

@finite crag Forgot that was official. I haven’t played it enough to have a detailed opinion, but from what I have played it feels like a more intense Knee Deep in the Dead. I don’t like Knee Deep nearly as much as the Classic Doom playerbase as a whole seems to but it felt okay nonetheless. I always favored Classic Doom’s Hell levels over all of the Earth/Techbase levels. I think techbases are kinda boring tbh. No Rest is more interesting than most techbases though

[dapper flint]

https://youtu.be/qQ4MWpGv4f8

At 7 06

@hexed escarp

[hexed escarp]

yeah i looked it up in the level editor lmao

i also loaded it up to see how that 3d beam thing worked

that was galaxy brain

[crisp tiger]

I need some people to play multiplayer

Please 😔

[ornate vortex]

After like 8 attempts, I beat the first level of Sunder (This WAD too hard)

https://imgur.com/a/5JQPats

[slim willow]

it gets worse :)

[sturdy laurel]

Or Sewers and Betray, from the OG-Xbox version?

[slim willow]

e1m10 and map33 are very bad

[finite crag]

i haven't played those honestly

[azure nimbus]

good

[hexed escarp]

Holy crap there are a total of 162 official classic doom maps

[azure nimbus]

maximum doom

[finite crag]

including doom 64?

[azure nimbus]

I'm not sure where he got 162 from. 4*9 from d1, 32 from d2, 64 from final doom, 21 from the MLs, and if you like, add in the 32 + 7(includes the lost levels but not map33: Title) from d64. Then max doom...buuuut who cares

[cloud talon]

Cinematic resolution

[hexed escarp]

3440x1440

[cloud talon]

Why is the soul sphere lighter

[hexed escarp]

color palette of that wad

[cloud talon]

Why do certain wads change the color blue?

[hexed escarp]

they dont just change the color blue

they change a bunch of the colors to make the specific textures they are using look better

[slim willow]

maximum doom is bad

they literally just downloaded stuff off the internet and shipped it

[narrow condor]

Maximum Doom is great if you want to have a sense of how shovelware wads of '90s were like. It can help you appreciate modern wads better.

And modern wads that parody such rubbish, such as Down the Drain, which is a dark twist on the idea of finding a floppy full of amateurish wads.

[dapper flint]

Hahaha nice

[cloud talon]

😡 😡 😡

how dare you

Maximum doom is the greatest bonus of all time

two whole working doom maps

and thousands of others

I wonder if anyone has actually completed every possible map in maximum doom

[vast reef]

why does his face feel wide

[hexed escarp]

prboom plus doesnt adjust for the aspect ratio on the hud for some reason

[vast reef]

huh, weird

but prboom+'s graphics options always felt a little confusing to me

[slim willow]

you can change that you know

[narrow condor]

I got so used to the wideface that when I 'fixed' it, it felt so wrong that I went back. :-)

[vast reef]

lmao

lemme check if the emoji on this server has it wide

nope, thank god

[dapper flint]

Yeah not a fan if the wide guy either

[cloud talon]

id software was really good at spelling gauntlet

[narrow condor]

American English seems to prefer the spelling 'gantlet' when it's used to mean the punishment method rather than the article of clothing.

[cloud talon]

no doomguy wears gantlets in doom and id really wanted people to know

[narrow condor]

Ah, fair point.

[hexed escarp]

I hate that doom has rectangular pixels

[vast reef]

not a problem for me when i make sprites since i can just make the pixels 1:1.2 in aseprite

but it's very confusing at times and it's really annoying

[hexed escarp]

No I just hate it conceptually

But for wall textures should I scale all of them to look correct

Or does it not apply to those

[vast reef]

yeah it would have been better off with normal pixels

[vast reef]

find out yourself i guess

try making a wall texture and seeing if it looks weird in-game

on a vanilla port (or even DOS) just to be extra sure

[woeful creek]

My 6-year old younger sister just beat E1M1 of DOOM (1993) in 4 minutes, 17 seconds, 16 milliseconds (with a little help from me, the big bro)

on my Xbox One with a controller

[vast reef]

be proud of your sister

[dapper flint]

Well done. My 3 year old neice also. It was a great day! Congrats

[woeful creek]

I certainly am :)

[hexed escarp]

I wish my younger brother was interested in doom

All he wants to play is Roblox

[sturdy laurel]

Since you folks mentioned Maximum Doom, there's an absolute madlad from Doomworld, who put all of the maps into easily-digestible PK3's. There's an E1-styled hubmap for Doom 1, and three archival-style hubmaps for Doom 2, sorted alphabetically, with very long conveyor belts to make navigation less tedious.

https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/129732-v3-final-maximum-doom-in-one/

[hexed escarp]

What is the difference between maximum doom and the master levels

[sturdy laurel]

Maximum Doom was the shovelware pack-in that shipped with Master Levels.

[hexed escarp]

What does that mean lmao?

[sturdy laurel]

It was id Software's answer to unofficial, "shovelware" map collections like D!Zone.

[azure nimbus]

the MLs are 21 maps made by people paid by ID. Max doom is some collection of thousands of rando maps from the 90s

[narrow condor]

I'm astonished someone would go out of their way to do this.

[dapper flint]

I'd love to see an interview with those that worked on maximum some day

[narrow condor]

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if many of them had no idea their wads were distributed like that.

[vast reef]

my sister plays ultrakill most of the time

she plays doom whenever i leave it open on my PC

[jade solstice]

You ever like, go down the wrong hallway, finding out you should’ve went down it second

Could’ve easily saved half my health if I had the rocket launcher

[dapper flint]

The map is your friend

[jade solstice]

Yeah I use it but definitely not enough

[jade solstice]

Bro I’m boilin

Playing plutonia experiment and there’s an invisible bridge

[azure nimbus]

I think it's a la self referencing sectors

[dapper flint]

You can stop the trap from screwing you over if you back out fast and reopen

Or just rush forward

[jade solstice]

I don’t remember what trap you’re referring to tbh 😂
But, a question for the more experienced folk (I.e., anyone aside from me) - does the chaingun stun all enemies, with constant damage? Minus the cyber demon
Archville?

I mean it has some sort of effect right - I’m not crazy 😅

[narrow condor]

The chaingun simply has a high rate of fire and pain chance is recalculated for every single hit.

[cinder ibex]

the plasma also does the same thing

[narrow condor]

SSG is usually a better choice for low pain chance enemies (like archviles and cyberdemons) because it shoots 20 pellets in one shot.

[eager hill]

What's your favorite doom/doom 2 mod?

[narrow condor]

But it has a slow loading time so I prefer the regular shotgun when I need to, say, stall an arachnotron, because its pain chance is high enough for the shotgun alone to work most of the time and the quick reload means it can't start blasting plasma in between shots.

[cinder ibex]

akshually the BFG fires 40 tracers so it is way better for low pain chance enemies!!!

[narrow condor]

Hahah

But the reload time!

[cinder ibex]

reload time doesn't matter if they're already dead

:clueless:

[narrow condor]

True!

[azure nimbus]

the way pain state works is for every instance of damage, a dice roll happens and the monster gets stunned if it loses the dice roll. So once per bullet, once per pellet(7 shotgun, 20 for ssg, 41 for bfg(ball+40 tracers)) or 2 for the RL(1 direct + 1 splash)). Chaingun is good for continuous stuns, plasma is better, and ssg is best for stuns. Though a full bfg guarentees a stun on a cyber. How much damage is irrelevant. And each monster has different pain chance. ssg is better for viles and cybers in terms of pain chance, but chaingun and plasma is extremely likely to chain stun arachnos and mancs. Revs usually as well

[dapper flint]

Nothing

[narrow condor]

If we count pwads as mods, it's probably Scythe for me.

[jade solstice]

There’s a lot of math to this game 🤣

[cinder ibex]

I've always though that eviternity was pretty cool

[dapper flint]

Yesh that's a good wad

[cinder ibex]

clearly you need to binge some decino videos

[dapper flint]

Very fun wad

[cinder ibex]

:lo:

[jade solstice]

I’ve watched a few for my brain to hurt

I think I watched one where he literally said “it doesn’t make sense, but …” 😂

[azure nimbus]

says the dehydration hater

[narrow condor]

You don't need to memorise the numbers — you get an intuitive sense like 'two SSG shots can take down a revenant' as you play.

[dapper flint]

I'll give it a go. I think I just was really sleepy man

Burned out

[jade solstice]

Ye ye, I know most (I think) of the basics, but it’s just always impressive to look deep into mechanics for the game

[narrow condor]

There are some things that are very difficult to figure out without being told about them though. It wasn't until last month that I learnt about the revenant 'pain chance retaliation debt' thing by watching a video, for example.

[jade solstice]

Is it random chance if a revenant’s shots lock on

[narrow condor]

In practice, yes. You can tell the homing missiles apart from the others by their smoke tracers.

[jade solstice]

Ahhhh interesting. Never noticed a difference

[narrow condor]

IIRC it's something like '2/3 chance of shooting a homing missile on even numbered tics, 1/3 chance on odd tics'. I forgot the specifics.

[azure nimbus]

kiiinda. Basically, every rev has a 50 % chance of favoring (3/4 vs 1/4 split) a particular type of missile. But, that chance might get flipped whenever they are pain chanced. So...effectively a 50 50. It's basically unpredictable. But, it is technically based on what frame it's on rather than an RNG call

[narrow condor]

Ah, so it was 3/4 and 1/4.

[jade solstice]

My brain is turning smooth

[azure nimbus]

As far as a non-TASer is concerned, it may as well be random

[cinder ibex]

basically just
50/50 chance and call it a day

[dapper flint]

Just need to play the game the basics will come to you. Knowing the numbers is neat though

[jade solstice]

I’ve played through every doom game ~ but I’ve been trying to get back into the WADs on the unity port
I’ve got 5 left to do a first run of :L
And I always see something else neat each one

[azure nimbus]

Yeah that's probably the best way to go about it. There are particular ways every monster acts, ways different oriented geometry act, A lot of in depth stuff. But if you're new, the main thing is just dodging projectiles and getting good at movement and feeling out which guns are good at which range. The only real in depth thing I'd insist a newbie learns is that the bfg is more of a shotgun than an explosive

[cinder ibex]

oh speaking of revenants this video is pretty cool if you struggle with them specifically
https://youtu.be/a2DJHSErSdA

[narrow condor]

Yeah, that's where I learnt of the retaliation debt.

I'm working on a document that collects mechanics like these, based on what I've read, watched and experienced. I made it for myself originally but I think newbies may find it useful as well.

[azure nimbus]

There is the doom movement bible which you might like for that

[narrow condor]

rip

Turns out I can't post a link to the document.

[narrow condor]

Oh, I had no idea about this. Looks like a great source.

[azure nimbus]

The Doom Bible has some crazy stuff there, but for most people who aren't speedrunning, sr40 and sr50 is more than enough

[narrow condor]

Well, it's mostly focused on things newbies may not figure out at first like 'you can stop a pain elemental from spawning by hugging it' or 'rad suits can leak on 20% damaging floor' or 'first two chaingun bullets are always as accurate as pistol'

[azure nimbus]

pistol has the same innacuracy thing as chaingun where only first shot is guarenteed accurate

[narrow condor]

Oh right, I should write that down too.

[dapper flint]

1000 lines 3 100 percent accuracy rifle is so sweet

[azure nimbus]

lots of pwads include a 100 % accuracy weapon 2

[cyan fjord]

Wanna know the most effective way to use the bfg

[dapper flint]

This one's different. Feels fantastic. Extremely well balanced

[tacit remnant]

Tapping the chaingun lets you fire 2 perfectly accurate bullets. The chaingun is basically this game’s assault rifle type weapon, but bigger and more over the top

[dapper flint]

Actually I believe it replaced the chaingun

[cyan fjord]

I really don't use the chaingun only the super shotgun but I do agree

[dapper flint]

You definitely should. It's stun is very very useful

My go 2 for pains

When I don't have plasma obv

[tacit remnant]

The best levels push you to use everything at least some. The chaingun is great for crowd control and for stunlocking cacos

[dapper flint]

Revs also

[tacit remnant]

And Revs

[cyan fjord]

Ya i use chain gun when in big hordes super shot gun for mancubus and revs

[azure nimbus]

The ssg is definitely the highest dps of your regular guns(shotgun, ssg, cg), but having the lowest firerate with the worst range means each shot is more committal and it's the worst at continuous stuns so it's balanced pretty well

[jade solstice]

Rad suits can leak!?

I thought this was a bug man- I got damaged randomly sometimes and I was like wtf man

[narrow condor]

Yes but only on 20% damaging floor.

[cyan fjord]

Ya in lava

[jade solstice]

Sheesh

TIL

[dapper flint]

Not always lava

Poop water water or other poop liquids

[cyan fjord]

Really I thought only lava

[narrow condor]

The texture doesn't really matter.

You can make lava non-damaging or bricks damaging.

[tacit remnant]

Only on 20% floors. The texture can be whatever

In official Doom it’s lava

[azure nimbus]

e2m2's electric blue area is 20 damage too

[tacit remnant]

Oh there’s that

Well it’s usually lava anyway

[jade solstice]

Electric blue floor makes me grumpy 😠

You don’t even know till it happens REEE

[cyan fjord]

It kinda sucks in doom 2 the bfg edition that the wolfenstien levels are censored

[azure nimbus]

if you can pull the regular version from steam, you can play the uncensored versions

[dapper flint]

Or if you have a hard copy and a disc drive ;)

[cyan fjord]

I'm on Xbox so I cant

I don't have a pc

[dapper flint]

Yikes. Stuck with unity hey

[cyan fjord]

Does doom deathmatch still work on Xbox or no

[azure nimbus]

split screen only

[cyan fjord]

that's sucks

[azure nimbus]

I remember seeing the full wolfenstein maps on xbox1. maybe I"m misremembering

[cyan fjord]

dude I literally played them a 2 days ago they were censored

[dapper flint]

Where are you from

[azure nimbus]

is it removed SS guys or is it just changing the textures to the keen walls?

I remember they changed the swastika to a keen symbol but kept the ss dudes

[cyan fjord]

They did keep the ss dudes but the swastikas were changed

Mmjp08 do you play on xbox

[azure nimbus]

I have it on xbox1 and did the achievements and stuff, but I use the WOOF port on my laptop now using the steam versions iwad file as a base

[cyan fjord]

Can you mod doom on,Xbox 1

[azure nimbus]

no but it comes with some addons like plutonia, btsxe1, btsxe2, sigil, deathless. If you like the type of stuff you're seeing, consider the pc version. Lot more modding capability

[cyan fjord]

Cause I've always wanted to play brutal doom

[azure nimbus]

You'll need the pc version to pull the IWAD from. And downloading gzdoom(I am not sure if BD works with Zdoom or only GZdoom). I do recommend playing more vanilla style stuff first but play what you like

[cyan fjord]

Ok

[dapper flint]

Pretty sure only gz

[cyan fjord]

I think no likes archviles tbh

[vivid vine]

MetaDoom

[halcyon willow]

You would think wrong

[cyan fjord]

...

[halcyon willow]

Archviles are the greatest enemy ever created for fps

[azure nimbus]

Someone forgot about the head of John Romero

[halcyon willow]

(Classic doom ones just to be clear)

Lol

I stand corrected

[cyan fjord]

Hmmmm

What would be the worst enemy

[azure nimbus]

wolfss, they're missing sprites and their working sprites are the most jank of any monster

[cyan fjord]

I didnt notice when played the ws levels

also the reason I was gone was cause I was playing doom 64

[azure nimbus]

Wolfenstein 3D doesn't have infighting so any time the wolfss is firing, he's shooting at you so you see him from the one angle. But wolfss infight normally in doom2 but lack sprites for firing in other directions. They also have a few magenta pixels between their legs

[cyan fjord]

Is John Romero in this server

I probably didn't notice cause I was killing them from afar

[slim willow]

Hell yeah. Fast, deadly attack, resurrects enemies to make them a priority to take out. So damn good.

[halcyon willow]

Yup

An entirely unique enemy concept

Adds so much for the player to think about in an encounter

[slim willow]

Yeah man. Mind races all over the place when you have other nasties to deal with as well. I especially like when a mapper puts them in multiple locations at once. Good stuff.

[dapper flint]

Auger zenith mall parking lot archies. Final fight

[slim willow]

mmmm so good

hope the next doom goes back to the drawing board with modernizing it. too stationary. should be zooming all over

[azure nimbus]

DE literally putting them behing an impenetrable wall in taras nabad ML to make them scary. D2 viles are definitely the best incarnation of them. They're so gross, their sounds and jaggedty fast movement

[dapper flint]

And they say why when they die lol

[azure nimbus]

wub wub wub

[low ore]

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, after ONE HOUR, I have reached PHASE THREE

https://i.imgur.com/hprqV0f.png

that's right, phase 3

[dapper flint]

They recorded why and then altered it

[azure nimbus]

from a young girl supposedly. At least that's what I hear bobby did from I think a decino video

[dapper flint]

So much shit on that hud God damn

[low ore]

you have ammo, health, important enemies, runes, timer and the completion numbers

it's not thaaaat much

[dapper flint]

What's that yellow thing in the bottom right

[low ore]

legendary ammo sphere

gives infinite ammo for most weapons

[azure nimbus]

I still don't get how voodoos work. So ok, when they die but you don't, weird stuff happens. When you die but they don't, weird stuff happens. But how are your healths not synced? Do you not share a healthpool and both lose or gain health if the other does?

[low ore]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XKIB8mkYMs

[azure nimbus]

I've rewatched that dozens of times, still don't get it

[slim willow]

Even 3 which seems to base itself closer to the original games in places still manages to mess up the Archie. I feel like a really important aspect to the demon that keeps being ignored is the fact its intelligent. The thing is a fire mage and can reanimate the dead. It laughs at you and lets out whats literally a sped up voice clip upon death. Aside from the wakeup roar it makes sounds that implies it at least has some level of sentience and the newer incarnations miss that.

[low ore]

well as the video says voodoo dolls have 2 health values

[azure nimbus]

I imagine the vile being quick to infight because he knows that they can be revived

[slim willow]

Yes

[low ore]

like, if you pick up a megasphere, it only affects YOU but not the voodoo dolls

[slim willow]

i love voodoo dolls

the ol teleport into a voodoo doll death trap trick

[dapper flint]

I played around with that in eviternity. End up dead in the portal stuck. Pretty cool

[azure nimbus]

voodoos can telefrag stuff too. That's used in MSCPmap15 to kill a cyber sniper

can voodoos end a level if they're on an "end level" sector?

[slim willow]

i wonder

[narrow condor]

Isn't that how lift endings work?

You get on a lift and the map ends whilst you're still ascending/descending — the linedef that triggers the lift also releases a voodoo doll onto the exit sector.

(So you can jump off the lift and the map would still end in just as much time.)

[halcyon willow]

Not the end level sector, it's an exit line that the voodoo doll is pushed over

[narrow condor]

Ah right, my mistake.

[halcyon willow]

I'm not sure if the voodoo doll can trigger the end level sector special

[finite crag]

Question: is there a PrBoom-compatible Doom / Doom II mod out there that completely converts the soundtrack, sprites, and all graphics to be identical to the PSX version, but without the level design changes and cuts? (i.e., only cosmetic)

[narrow condor]

As in it contains the levels of DOS Doom and Doom II?

[vivid vine]

Really like some of the changes especially replacements for boss levels

[finite crag]

As in it changes nothing about the actual levels of Doom and Doom II (unlike the actual PSX versions). Solely cosmetic changes.

[vivid vine]

And all the Doom 2 monsters thrown in

[hexed escarp]

is woof multiplayer any good?

[narrow condor]

There are TC iwads for GZDoom and outright source ports that directly replicate PSX Doom but no vanilla pwads, to my knowledge.

[hexed escarp]

like using hamachi or smthn?

[finite crag]

Nothing that'll run on PrBoom? That's a shame.

Well, if I'm alright with using GzDoom, are there any that only change the game graphically to resemble the PSX version without the level design changes?

[narrow condor]

You could theoretically gut out the iwad into a pwad without the maps and pray everything falls into place with a vanilla iwad.

[dapper flint]

There is yes

[finite crag]

Sounds too complex for my peabrain.

Any links?

[narrow condor]

Ooh, I'd like to see it too. I've only seen TCs.

[dapper flint]

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=75439

[narrow condor]

That sure changes more than cosmetics, but it's nice to see they modularised it and tested it with vanilla wads.

Very cool.

[dapper flint]

https://www.moddb.com/mods/doom-ce/downloads/psx-doom-ce-205-full-version

For anyone interested

[cyan fjord]

Actually when I get a laptop I can get doom 1 for free since I have xbox game pass ultamine

[slim willow]

https://github.com/BodbDearg/PsyDoom/releases

the CE mod looks epic too. im going to have to play it

[vast reef]

zmovement

maybe demonsteele or complex doom

oh wait QC:DE

[narrow condor]

Actually, glancing at my $DOOMWADDIR, I think ALT may be a good contender for my favourite.

It's an unforgettable experience.

[low ore]

phase 3 is hard

[strange nexus]

Hey, I'm having trouble joining zandronum servers. Anyone know what i could be doing wrong?

[pearl osprey]

What kind of error does it give you?

[strange nexus]

Mainly just giving me the options to leave servers n such before i even joine one, and when i try to, i never seem to have the right mods

Although idk if those are errors, since i mainly use gzdoom

[strange nexus]

Revenants don't let me forget

[vast reef]

wadseeker might be broken on your PC (for me it's eternally broken because i screwed up my visual c++ distribution, presumably by having nearly 10 installations of it on my computer for no good reason)

do you rename your mods/wads?

i used to do that but i heavily advise not to since it's so hard to join zandronum servers

even if you have the correct mod, you can't join if it's named incorrectly

[strange nexus]

Oh, nah
I'm just running it off of DOOM2.wad

[vast reef]

what error do you get specifically btw

[strange nexus]

I'll try to boot up a server, hold on

Yeah it says there's a "network error", but my ethernet is working perfectly for everything else

[vast reef]

weird

have you tried asking on the zandronum forum or server about this?

i use zandronum a lot but i don't have much knowledge on how it works

[strange nexus]

It just
Does

Yeah, that's not normal
Megaman 8BDM seems to be the only thing to fail

[vast reef]

maybe your versions are different

i remember a lot of MM8BDM servers on zandronum having outdated versions when i scrolled through doomseeker

[strange nexus]

Idk,
Man, zandronum is confusing

But i am using comhotel, it has a cool name so i guess it's popular

[pearl osprey]

You are using doomseker to connect to servers right?

[strange nexus]

Yeah, every server i try to join tho just
Doesn't

[vast reef]

doomseeker just finds the servers

oh wait

[pearl osprey]

also downloads the mods automatically

[vast reef]

yeah

[pearl osprey]

I never encountered that issue so idk what's wrong

[strange nexus]

8BDM is a big mod though, might simply be the size of it
But at the same time i use brutal doom platinum on gzdoom

Download is 69%

It.. worked this time?

Why work when i start complaining?

[strange nexus]

Just thought about it, someone should make a doom mod with realistic gun volume

[dapper flint]

I love waking up in the morning to sinners

[hexed escarp]

does woof's multiplayer work decently?

ive heard prboom-plus multiplayer is trash but im wondering if woofs would work any better

[molten iron]

Woof's multiplayer is the same as Choco/Crispy multiplayer. You can use Woof while your friends use Crispy

And yeah, prboom's multiplayer sucks

[hexed escarp]

oh interesting

im assuming that only works on complevel 2-4 tho

[molten iron]

Probably

Its mainly used for speedrunning and other coop demos

[hexed escarp]

good to know that there is a boom/mbf compat port that retains demo compat and has good multiplayer

[molten iron]

For the best casual experience, multiplayer focused ports should be better

[hexed escarp]

yeah

[slim willow]

wtf dante from devil cry (real)

[hexed escarp]

but i am sorta a purist, so i like things that are demo compatible even if im not recording a demo so that sounds perfect

[molten iron]

same ahah

[hexed escarp]

i wish there was an online multiplayer port that was boom derived instead of zdoom derived

[dapper flint]

https://imgur.com/a/v22vsmN

[molten iron]

Oh I remember Decino playing that map

I will never forget the slaughter of the baby cacos

[dapper flint]

I actually got it because I saw that decino video. Really great map so far. The fights are really easy though for some reason. I feel with so much space things should be a bit more spice

[azure nimbus]

https://youtu.be/hiVkfYenMYU gamebing moment

[vocal summit]

Deafguy

[strange nexus]

The chaingun

[halcyon willow]

that's an issue no matter what program you use to find servers. and it's caused by people not changing the name of the wad when they upload a new version to TSPG.
doomexplorer is the best i've found. doomseeker isn't bad either

[open prawn]

There is an entire recreation of Doom in VR Chat that I played earlier. It's quite impressive, but also quite buggy.

[gentle compass]

Hundred percent back Doom Explorer as a great utility for both multiplayer and singleplayer. Used it for well over a decade, maybe two at this point when it was still just known as IDE

Being able to set up custom ports and save presets for SP is sweet too

[hexed escarp]

how do i add a deh/bex lump in slade?

also quick question do the states need to be in order in the dehacked file?

[finite crag]

Hey, so I checked this out and it seems that this doesn't allow a cosmetic-only option.

It's always the PSX levels, can't find an option to just use the PSX graphics but with the PC levels.

I also have another question.

The PrBoom raytracing fork has a CRT render mode that renders it all as if you're playing on an old TV. I like this. Is there a way to do that but with normal PrBoom (software rendering)?

[dapper flint]

I know of a wad that looks like psx.. that's as close as I can find ..

[finite crag]

Eh, it's ok. Thanks anyway.

[dapper flint]

Sorry about that man. Even took me a while to find it

[finite crag]

It's alright. Now I'm just curious about the CRT thing.

[vocal summit]

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?t=74412 try this, it's gzdoom only but it's what you're looking for

also, you're definetly gonna need a flashlight mod for that

it's pitch black in some areas

[narrow condor]

For the past few weeks I've been playing the Community Chests. I know the first two have QA problems and filler maps, and the latter two suffer from magnum opus fatigue (as Demon of the Well put it), so I came up with a silly idea: Playing the wads with the map slots interlaced. For example: CC MAP01, CC2 MAP01, CC3 MAP01, CC4 MAP01, CC MAP02 and so on.

So far I got to MAP14 on all four and I must say it's working quite well, not to mention the added variety.