the-dark-ages

[placid saffron]

Ah, now it makes sense when rereading!

[graceful lion]

yeah, you dont

[earnest swift]

Honestly the Chainsaw’s dash seems like a decent substitute as far as speed goes.

[graceful lion]

multiplayer is not easy to make

[plucky plinth]

Not easy is an understatement

[graceful lion]

its practically like making the game again

[raw relic]

well actually fans made a mod for eternal so it cant be that hard

[plucky plinth]

As it’s not even just relating to programming, it relates to several fields

[graceful lion]

in some cases

[plucky plinth]

That’s because it had multiplayer systems already in place

[graceful lion]

and how much time did it take?

[raw relic]

idk

[graceful lion]

meanwhile for subnuatica it took years of work to make modded multiplayer

and so far it has taken over 2 years and they still have not updated it to the latest version of the game

[ebon shale]

The subnautica mod is still shit though lmao

[raw relic]

it took us 2 billion years to invent a toaster

[graceful lion]

its getting an update in some time

[raw relic]

and 100 billion peopple working on it

[graceful lion]

which is gonna fix a majority of the issues, and update it to living large

they are remaking the mod entirely

[earnest swift]

And you expect that to be a comparison that has literally any merit?

Because it doesn’t.

[raw relic]

yes it does

[graceful lion]

making a toaster is easier than making multiplayer

[raw relic]

because the example makes as little sense

[graceful lion]

https://imgur.com/a/uUu7nEF

[ebon shale]

I thought the devs of that mod got hired to work officially on 2. Or I'm confusing that with the elden ring thingy

[graceful lion]

probably confusing it with ER

but they are remaking the mod entirely to make it incredibly stable

and remove a vast majority of the bugs, major or minor, as far as i can tell

[plucky plinth]

Oh yeah, not to mention you or somebody on your team has to know networking and several other fields just to get basic p2p connections working

[graceful lion]

its around 90% of the way there or so

[graceful lion]

yeah its not as simple as your ISP adding wifi to your house

[plucky plinth]

server based is a whole other ballpark in general

[graceful lion]

you are trying to make rocks communicate from thousands of fucking miles away

think of all the little things

making sure cutscenes play for both, making sure the damage is correct for both, making sure enemies dont act weirdly, making sure both players know where each of them are

i think it would be a good idea for deleted user to maybe ask someone on the coop mod team if the mod was hard to make

wiat nvm im dumb eternal already had mp code

and also, as hugo said, they had to sacrifice multiplayer for the cool dragon and the mech, along with making the game be the best they can

especially since multiplayer has not really been doom's strongsuit, its all about making an insane campaign

[winter idol]

I heard dark ages is longer too

[graceful lion]

lets fucking go

[plucky plinth]

Would make sense, they focused their team on just the single player

[prime sentinel]

They called it the biggest doom game yet

[winter idol]

which is exactly what i wanted

[plucky plinth]

Instead partially on the multiplayer as well

[graceful lion]

multiplayer can definitely take years for a project like this

[prime sentinel]

I think it was very smart to focus on the singleplayer, hope we get a horde mode post launch like eternal though

[winter idol]

eternal was disappointing in length IMO, especially with sentinel prime and the nekravol levels

[graceful lion]

it takes alot of time and effort

[graceful lion]

im not sure we will, but someone will add it, a team

[prime sentinel]

Really? I thought it was a great length for a linear singleplayer shooter

[graceful lion]

well, might

[plucky plinth]

I’m actually fine with shorter games and usually prefer them

[graceful lion]

making multiplayer on a game not built for multiplayer is gonna be a bitch to do

[plucky plinth]

As long as the price isn’t absolutely absurd for the length

[prime sentinel]

My first play through must have taken like 15-20 hours

[winter idol]

I think i kind of set my expectations too high for eternal and ended up very disappointed with many aspects of it

[prime sentinel]

That’s lengthy for a game like doom eternal imo

[plucky plinth]

Which is sorta how I felt with Trepang2

[graceful lion]

it will most likely take more than a couple years

[plucky plinth]

As I beat that whole game in like 5 hours

[prime sentinel]

And personally if dark ages is over 30 hours it will be a bit exhausting

[winter idol]

I finished doom eternal in 1 sitting with no breaks in 15 hours

[prime sentinel]

That’s long for a singleplayer shooter like that though

[graceful lion]

and even subnautica 2's early access will take 2-3 years, and i feel a big component is multiplayer alone

[prime sentinel]

Like titanfall 2 is 6 hours

[plucky plinth]

The only thing that saved it was the gameplay tbh

[plucky plinth]

Wasn’t it mainly focused on the multiplayer, though?

[prime sentinel]

Eh it has a really good ass singleplayer

[plucky plinth]

I loved Titanfall 2’s single player, don’t get me wrong

[prime sentinel]

It’s kinda rare to get a linear shooter with only singleplayer

[plucky plinth]

I actually dislike the MP bar the PvE mode

[prime sentinel]

And plus eternal also had multiplayer so it is a fair comparison imo

[plucky plinth]

To me it really isn’t. Eternal is more campaign focused while Titanfall 2 was more focused on the multiplayer.

[prime sentinel]

They put a lot of work and advertising into battle mode

[winter idol]

eternal multiplayer is a gimmick at best, I think we all knew it wouldnt last long

[prime sentinel]

It’s not like titanfall 2 launched with a million maps

[plucky plinth]

Fair

But at the same time that is also true for some COD titles

[prime sentinel]

Imo 15 hours is a good length for the type of game eternal is

Especially since you are expected to play it multiple times

[plucky plinth]

Fair

[winter idol]

I dont think i was disappointed with the overall length of the game in the end, but the lenght of some levels and their replayability

like nearly every level in 2016 is super replayable

[prime sentinel]

Hmm idk, some of the levels in the middle of the game are forgettable to me tbh

[graceful lion]

how many?

[prime sentinel]

Eternal’s levels all stick out to me even if some are better than others

[winter idol]

Nekravol annoyed me

[prime sentinel]

9 total

[winter idol]

a section in both levels that was just a minute of waiting on an elevator

[prime sentinel]

Including all modes

According to google

I like nekravol a lot

My favorite level is prolly super gore nest or mars core in base game

UAC Atlantica for DLC

[prime sentinel]

Multiple maps in 2016 require you to stand in a room and listen to exposition

[winter idol]

yea that sucked too

hope they fixed that in dark ages, im guessing they did

[plain iron]

I like nekravol cuz giant Olivia statue

[prime sentinel]

I just like classic hell

[prime sentinel]

Gonna assume it’ll all be in cutscenes now and people who aren’t interested can skip

[plain iron]

I like Olivia :D

[prime sentinel]

Was kinda weird that eternal kinda fixed it but then did it anyway

[graceful lion]

we kill her twice

the doom series is one of the only series where you have to kill the same woman twice

[plain iron]

I just like women

Still kill her

But I might let her kill me first

[earnest swift]

Hmm. Not the biggest fan of that from a UN perspective.

[slender night]

I don't mind it personally, seeing as I don't do UN, but being longer has some minuses. Wayyy less replayable, and considering DOOM 3 felt like it was going on forever for some people (even though it was only 5 hours long), I'm not sure how the attention span of a DOOM player will stomach this

[plain iron]

Speak for yourself I have a attention span of a god and I will just lock in when it comes to shit

[slender night]

I am speaking of myself, it took me 2 years to beat DOOM 3 because it felt wayyy longer than it actually is. I know some others have had that experience too :p

[split sparrow]

hey this might be a question for the crowd, but has anyone who pre-ordered got their steam codes yet, or will we get those closer to release? /genq

[plain iron]

I have the same issue, but im just slow

[split sparrow]

to clarify pre-ordered a physical edition via the bethesda store

[plain iron]

I've played doom 3 a few times and each time was like.

At least 2 days

[slender night]

I was slow with Classic DOOM, now I can call wraps on both of the original games in like a bit over an hour total

[graceful lion]

ok, so let me tell you about this really cool system

[plain iron]

I can finish pokemon moon in like. 3 days

[slender night]

I had 3 playthroughs, 1 on BFG PC, 1 on BFG Xbox then 1 on 2019. Pretty sure I did one of these almost in one sitting, as I only had Mars City and one more level cleared

[graceful lion]

som developers let you pre-install games a few days before release, so you dont have to wait for download time

[gilded lake]

i spent like three weeks on doom 3 iirc

[split sparrow]

do we know if doom tda will support pre-install?

iirc doom eternal didn't

[graceful lion]

probably

[plain iron]

I still haven't finished doom 3 on my playstation :D last time I played doom 3 besides that was like. When I was 12 😭

[graceful lion]

afaik god of war ragnarok and black myth wukong did it

[slender night]

But in all fairness it took me a while to beat Sonic 1 too, even with savestates and rewinding. I'm getting more used to longer experiences lately

[graceful lion]

so idk if its a new system or not

[placid saffron]

you can play the game 3 days early if you pay their premium price so probably

[plain iron]

I do prefer long games though

[slender night]

Took me like 3 days to clear out half of SM3 a year or so back, I cleared the other half in like 5 hours a few days ago

[graceful lion]

same

[split sparrow]

ah, i got the physical collectors edition and haven't been able to check my email a while, so was curious if we know when we'll get codes, thanks for the help :3

[plain iron]

I procrastinated finishing TAG 2 cuz i didn't want to finish doom :[

[slender night]

I'm indifferent. Longer games offer longer experiences but shorter games are far more replayable

I had 12 playthroughs of Sonic 1 done this year by the middle of February or something because it's just so dang short

[placid saffron]

aslong as the early game isn't a slog like eternal it's still replayable enough

[plain iron]

I do the same w fallout 4

[slender night]

I never said it's not replayable, just to the majority not AS much

[plain iron]

Man I don't even need to put a marker for diamond city anymore

I want to be able to play fallout 4 again w out it being spoiled

[slender night]

Just wait a few years before replaying

You'll remember the general premise but you'll forget enough to make the experience still fairly enlightening

[plain iron]

Nawh it's too much of a big thing for me

I've memorised several interactions 😭

[earnest swift]

Is that an attention span problem or is it a pacing problem? If "Dark Ages" has great pacing like "Eternal" does replayability shouldn’t really be an issue. "Eternal" is much longer than games that are designed to be replayed, mind (games that are usually, at most, 1-2 hours long), provided you aren’t doing speedrun shenanigans.

[slender night]

I think it's an attention span problem. No matter how much you like a game a longer one will inherently be harder to replay

I adore DOOM 2016 but it'd take me a lot to get through it in one sitting, let alone even within a day, you'll get burnt out eventually

[earnest swift]

Tbf it’s, what, a four hour campaign if you’re playing decently optimal?

Lot of people can’t squeeze in that amount of play time into a single day.

[slender night]

Yeah, it's four hours long, and if TDA is only gonna be longer that'll amplify the issue

I don't mind longer games but it's a double edged sword. Richer experiences at the cost of not coming back to them as often

At least to the average person

[summer obsidian]

A 4 hour campaign is way too short. The fact that AAA games release with <10 hour campaigns is wild

[earnest swift]

I never said it takes 4 hours to beat 2016 for the first time.

Repeat playthroughs always are quicker than the first.

[slender night]

A 4 hour campaign is decent considering the game goes for 20 bucks nowadays and often goes down to 5 dollars

[summer obsidian]

Tda better be at least 15 hours

If not 20

[slender night]

Gosh I hope not

[summer obsidian]

Why

[slender night]

I love replaying games but I don't wanna spend an eternity on them

[summer obsidian]

I want a long good story

[earnest swift]

And frankly I prefer a game that’s too short than a game that’s too long. (cough the pirate "Like a Dragon" game cough)

[slender night]

I agree. I don't mind a game being short or a game being long but if I had to pick between too short and too long, I'm taking too short

Shorter games, at least in my experience, are also wayyy more fun to speedrun, because even the first time through you don't need to put insane effort into beating it in one sitting, it's more of like trial and error until you're able to get it a decent amount of time down

[placid saffron]

15 hours is not even long for a single player game

that's just the medium ammount

[slender night]

I play older games mostly so 15 hours is crazy for me

[placid saffron]

actually i'm factoring in soft replays with that nvm but still it's definitely not long

[slender night]

I'm capable of going through a game like that but it'll be over a longer amount of time, like days, weeks, unlike a shorter game where if I'm feeling like it I can go through it in one sitting or in extreme cases over like 3 days

[placid saffron]

and for a game that is 90 euro it better be fucking worth your money qua time

[slender night]

And I'm a completionist so 15 hours just to beat the game would be too much

[plain iron]

I play a lot of games that aren't a fps based campaign so 15 hours is very short

[slender night]

Taking the price into account yeah it should be long but I also think that price is absurd, I'll be waiting for a sale where I know my money will be worth it

[plain iron]

Ie the main game of hollow knight is for me, over 200 hours

[placid saffron]

oh the price definitely is absurd but it's just downright tragically sad if MS thinks that is worth it

[plain iron]

Ehh it's the same price any AAA game is these days

[slender night]

For that much money I'm expecting a demon to crawl out of the screen for me to beat up myself

[placid saffron]

yeah, those are overpriced too

[plain iron]

I don't agree with that price, but it is expected

[placid saffron]

...i also didn't say it was a surprise or unexpected

[slender night]

Playing older games is a gem for this reason

[plain iron]

I struggle to see why folk get angry over game prices

[slender night]

Most of them will go down in price and you'll be able to snag so much gameplay time for so little

[plain iron]

I just get kinda sad

[placid saffron]

it's just price gouging

[plain iron]

I justify games by a dollar per hour

[slender night]

Not everyone is able to afford so much for a game, and those who need to wait for some paychecks to justify getting the game will likely be spoiled

[placid saffron]

the industry is growing, microsoft is a literal trillion dollar company, digital distribution made physical printing a thing of the past...

[placid saffron]

ok cool, that's kind of irrelevant to the discussion honestly

[slender night]

It's either gonna be some fucker on Twitter or one of those youtube videos that are like "ALL BOSSES" with every single boss in the thumbnail uploaded the same day the game comes out

[plain iron]

I'd say it's more the hiring part that makes it expensive

[placid saffron]

AAA studios don't really care for "price per hour"

unless they know they can't sell their game full price if it's like 3 hours cough cough sennua hellblade

[plain iron]

That's not what I am saying, I'm saying I personally justify a price that way

[shut whale]

66 days left. I wish we could get a game keyboard, mouse, controller for dark ages. Also a cover for console.

[placid saffron]

yeah but i'm saying that that sentiment... isn't really relevant

[slender night]

Make another shitty keyboard overlay like they did with DOOM 3

[plain iron]

People forget that they are making models from scratch, along w the design of said things, people need to get paid, and with the cost of living going up, so will games, so that the studios can actually pay their employees

The price isn't just the physical manufacturing process

[slender night]

Oh they'll make their money back if they sell the game like 10 bucks cheaper trust me

[placid saffron]

it's a shame the industry isn't growing every year so that they get paid more regardless of those fact- oh wait

[slender night]

Any price and they'll make their money back, the cheaper the more people can get the game

[plain iron]

You definitely don't know how little artists get paid.

[placid saffron]

making distribution practically infinite helps

[placid saffron]

making the product more expensive won't lead to them getting better paid unless they have a strong union lol

[plain iron]

That's the idea.

[placid saffron]

no it's not??

[slender night]

I'm not exactly surprised that they're still doing physical stuff tbh, there was one DOOM game that was physical-only in the era of digital gaming, at least on one platform

[plain iron]

The hope is for a decent pay for artists, I hope that most AAA studios pay that.

[placid saffron]

i don't know much about the bethesda union but i haven't heard ID studios has gone a ton better for them

[placid saffron]

making a product more expensive has always lead to more corporate profits

and most AAA studio working conditions are terrible

[plain iron]

I think the price is totally reasonable.

Prices of things are gonna go up

It's a shame that the minimum wage doesn't

[placid saffron]

maybe things shouldn't go up in price that much then

[plain iron]

It's not really that much

[placid saffron]

a 33% increase is quite a lot

[plain iron]

Eh not really, most folk here pay that in taxes

[placid saffron]

...so even more is somehow good???

for a product that absolutely does not need the price hike?

[plain iron]

Folk forget that games are not essential things, they do not need to be cheap, as they are a luxury

[placid saffron]

genuinely: so?

that's still not really a justification for it, and especially not something that lessens the critique

[plain iron]

The price of basic necessities are going up, so will luxuries, the price is annoying but it is justified

[placid saffron]

so will luxuries
but they don't have to

[gilded lake]

yakuza games do be like that tbh

[earnest swift]

Honestly, no. It’s the first one that actively felt like it had mechanically overstayed its welcome. And not by a little imo.

[placid saffron]

there's no magic rule that makes them go up if there is still a lot of money to go around and the industry is growing

using inflation to obscure price gouging still makes it price gouging

[obsidian shard]

DOOM; The Dark Ages is Literally standard AAA Price now, Cause it's More AAA, Bigger and Better and the Best DOOM game yet They say.

[slender night]

Best DOOM game yet is entirely subjective, and that's the issue, an overly long game, if it sucks, is gonna be a nightmare

[obsidian shard]

IF it Sucks, Y'all know what Game studio we are talking about right? I Understand Some Form of Worry it will suck is there, since it's bigger In every way but 3 Things I always remember

1. It's id Software
2. All Multiplayer Resources went into the Campaign
3. Everything we've seen so far is Several Months old

[slender night]

id has a game under their belt the general public dislikes, I wouldn't glaze them, literally any studio has a chance to fuck up at some point

Especially with the stuff id is making being heavy departures from eachother, a group of people will dislike it

[obsidian shard]

You mean DOOM3 I'm Guessing?

[slender night]

No, RAGE

[obsidian shard]

Hmm

Alr

True but Then they spent 6 Years making 2016 and 4 on eternal and the Reboot of DOOM is Critically Acclaimed

[slender night]

Irrelevant, especially because this game is going back to the roots in terms of gameplay

Like I said, these all play so differently there is gonna be a group of people disliking it

[obsidian shard]

Back to the og DOOM which is loved, A group of people dislike it, yes, But most don't and are Really looking forward

[placid saffron]

tbh if anything more time spent on a still linear game just means there has been more trouble

[slender night]

This game isn't even out yet my guy people currently liking it won't mean it'll be seen so well on release

[obsidian shard]

It's called optimism

[slender night]

I'm cautiously optimistic, I'm not saying you can't be excited but I wouldn't see id working on it as a guarantee of quality

I know, I engaged in a discussion like this once, issue is the things you brought up don't guarantee it'll be as good as the price tag points to

[placid saffron]

i'm also optimistic: but i'm also not going to pretend something we haven't seen unfiltered, actual gameplay of yet will be better then eternal

especially not for a 33% price hike lol

[obsidian shard]

No DOOM game is better Directly, They are all different for a reason,
If you wanted a game like 2016 play 2016
If you wanted a game like Eternal play Eternal

The price Tag I understand it's a big hefty in price

[placid saffron]

i was not referring to being just more of eternal

[slender night]

That's a bit of a silly point, you can only play the same game so much, looking for something new is valid

[obsidian shard]

Look, I'm excited for the game and it looks good so far, Everything we've seen has been In-Game and several months old (Quakecon old)
Therefore I'm Optimistic
I understand your point and worries as they are valid and yes more issues could acure, but the least you could do is understand mine

[slender night]

I'm definitely not trying to shoot down your optimism, I think you're reading me wrong. I was just trying to clarify on a point you made why you think the game is gonna be good

[obsidian shard]

My apologies then

[placid saffron]

I'm excited for the game and it looks good so far
yeah, and again that's specifically cherrypicked footage by marketing meant to look the best it could possible be. I don't trust marketing at all for giving a honest representation of a product

[obsidian shard]

Fair

[lucid saffron]

even if the game is that slow im gonna punt up that game speed to max

no way im dodging snail-paced mancu-balls

[graceful lion]

again. the trailers are alywas slower than the game play

[lucid saffron]

yes

but

[graceful lion]

they will defintely bump up the projectile speed and speed of everything a notch

[lucid saffron]

if not im going ludicrouse speeds

[wheat sigil]

there is no option to change only projectile speed💔

[graceful lion]

eh you will find a point where its like "holy fucking shit thats too much"

[graceful lion]

now, is that the final game menu?

[lucid saffron]

if i can play doom eternal, i can play TDA

[wheat sigil]

oh wait nvm, i'm misremembering

[graceful lion]

it might get a change for it

[graceful lion]

u forgro

[wheat sigil]

there is no option to change only enemy speed

[graceful lion]

even people who cant play eternal will be able to play tda, well, as much as skill ceiling goes

[lucid saffron]

https://tenor.com/view/spaceballs-ludicrous-speed-warp-drive-gif-12402192132620925944

[graceful lion]

TDA making hardware as much as it is makes sense tbh

or like, making these the requirements

they are parts from 4 years ago, and that feels reasonable for an upgrade timeframe, an upgrade every few years or so

[earnest swift]

https://tenor.com/view/you-have-excellent-taste-emma-samanda-ninja-kamui-your-taste-is-impeccable-adult-swim-gif-16756502149963867934

[obsidian shard]

Enemy aggression

[wheat sigil]

that's something different though

enemy aggression is probably how much they like harass you

[obsidian shard]

Darn

[wooden acorn]

Day 46 of 112

[placid saffron]

tbh flatly boosting game speed will probably not feel that great to play with

[placid saffron]

wher's that from?

[slender night]

Ninja Kamui

[raven pilot]

So, I've been in a bit of a tight situation with money so I kind of turned my gaze away from any big spendings. This means I have no idea of what the situation with the TDA Collector's edition situation

Do you guys think that if I pre-order it close to the release date I'm still gonna get it¿ I still have to decide whether I want it and can afford it

[placid saffron]

i mean, if you are in a tight situation money wise you should most definitely not overspend on a bit of doom collector edition...

but aslong as you get it before it's delisted you should get it

if not: you get even more money back :)

[placid saffron]

hell you should most definitely wait for a sale a year/half a year later to even get the game to begin with

[dark peak]

i hope the game gonna be as troll and unfair as doom

[grim cloud]

doom will have both difficulties modes and sliders. It can be as hard or diff as you want

but i do wish it would have a monster count slider. Maybe we get master levels later, or something

[dark peak]

yeah but doom had fake exits that was troll af

[delicate grotto]

I do miss the random monster closets and jumpscares classic Doom, especially Plutonia, loved to do.

[frail bloom]

I wanna see a hugo interview

About more relative things than, "can you beat dda with melee only"

I find the info uneeded, the agaddon hunter info was helpful tho

Or maybe they pick and choose so they don't spoil

[grim cloud]

will be getting a PC gamer invertiew shortly. Maybe by the end of this week that will have that, or at least until someone gets us the magazine scans

[frail bloom]

Hopefully it's info that's actually important

[grim cloud]

i need to see more gameplay, they need to pick a level or two and play it in depth like before

[frail bloom]

I don't really need to see more, cuz we saw enough. I just need explanations for things that people are uncertain about

Cuz no sane person is worried about the purple circles lol

[prime sentinel]

we will?

a 10 minute straight just gameplay clip would be really awesome

or at least give the press/content creators a demo they can record b roll of or whatever

[grim cloud]

yes that, i needs it, we needs it

[frail bloom]

Yeah I need to see if it runs well

[grim cloud]

Next PC gamer will have a Doom Dark Ages cover story

[prime sentinel]

I doubt we're gonna get a full level playthrough

but like, 10-30 minutes sounds reasonable as a preview

[prime sentinel]

cover story? cool

[grim cloud]

waht we got for Doom Eternal will be enough. B-roll good, press playthroughs probably closer to release

"Speaking to Doom: The Dark Ages game director Hugo Martin and producer Marty Stratton for our Doom cover story in the upcoming issue 408 (396 in the US) of PC Gamer's print magazine, "

New mag comes around 20th of each month

[prime sentinel]

cool, hopefully that's when we start getting some gameplay footage

[grim cloud]

we will also get Trailer #2 at some point, maybe this month

then a Launch Trailer about a week before releasae

[prime sentinel]

yeah I'd like to see more soon

I can wait till may, its not too long, but it'd be nice to see more

[grim cloud]

the week of doom releasing will be hell though, i wont be able to play till wed even if i have early access

[ebon shale]

The only things I still want to see before launch is the level design, in regards to how open it is and the transition from flying to ground combat.

[prime sentinel]

I kinda doubt you can fly whenever you want, its probably specific areas

perhaps you use the dragon to travel between "islands"

[grim cloud]

i am too also confused about level design. i heard sand box like, but that could mean an umber of things. Do you go back to levels after getting upgrades?

[prime sentinel]

I believe it has been confirmed that progression is linear, you play level to level

[grim cloud]

there are aslo entire levels dedicated to "atlan" mode. Not sure how i feel about taht. I dont need some mech armor to kill demons imo

[prime sentinel]

the levels themselves are open

like you play each level one after the other, but each level has side areas and explorable optional sections

its a sandbox in the way mario 64 is a sandbox

[grim cloud]

see i also heard that and also heard that we can go back to levels after opening up other things and getting special upgrades.

[prime sentinel]

that was an early theory but it has been debunked I believe

its not open world, levels themselves are just more open ended

perhaps you use the dragon to travel between optional areas, in RE4 remake there's an area where you get this boat and you can do lots of different things in different areas that are optional, picking up goodies, weapons, etc and its pretty open ended but there is a goal that you eventually have to do

speculating here

[ebon shale]

If that is going to be the case I would love it. But also depends what the goodies are that you can get off the beaten path

[prime sentinel]

prolly weapon upgrade points/extra challenges

more gameplay is its own reward if the game is good enough, eh?

it would be cool if you could get guns early like in Doom 2016 (or literally every game besides Doom Eternal lol)

I think Eternal was so focused on its own pacing that it didn't really leave room to let the player find stuff like that in secret areas, but the 11 minute preview made it sound like there are secrets with actual goodies that the player will find useful

[frail bloom]

Yeah it was a little too linear

[prime sentinel]

the secrets were all upgrade points and bonuses, and don't get me wrong, I like that stuff

but this game won't have a hub iirc so I have a feeling secrets won't work the same way as in Eternal

[frail bloom]

Me too, just I want more bang for my buck

[prime sentinel]

I wouldn't say Eternal was "too linear" but it was definitely focused on doing a few very particular things

[frail bloom]

More exploration

[wheat sigil]

a deep combat system is the most bang for your buck possible

[prime sentinel]

people look for different things in games

[frail bloom]

True

But I want to spend as much time as possible

[wheat sigil]

it will always triumph over secrets and stuff, in regard to how much you can play the game, unless you're just not interested in learning the combat

[prime sentinel]

to me time = quality

[frail bloom]

Well I also think combat's important but I want more

It adds replayability

[prime sentinel]

I have more hours in counter strike than most games I actually like :p

[frail bloom]

Deep combat with expansive maps

Seems fun

[wheat sigil]

i'm hoping for as linear level design as possible xd

[prime sentinel]

lol you're gonna be disappointed

[frail bloom]

It's probably linear if he ignores the secrets

[prime sentinel]

unless you already go in knowing that is the opposite of what they're going for

[prime sentinel]

in the 11 minute preview it was said you have multiple objectives and can tackle them in any order

before returning for a final confrontation

[frail bloom]

I wonder what they would be

[gilded lake]

😔

[frail bloom]

Vega acting up

[prime sentinel]

my guess is maps are pretty big and have tons of different paths to go in

with optional encounters, secrets, and even "dungeons" (I believe they said this in the 11 minute preview)

[gilded lake]

anyways it's been confirmed via an interview w pcgamer that dark ages won't end with doomguy in the sarcophagus

[frail bloom]

Well whatever it is, larger maps mean more encounters

[prime sentinel]

there are probably more linear sections, but there was a focus on exploration in the preview

I wouldn't expect doom eternal style levels but bigger.

also demon patrols were called out, lots of demons just kinda hanging around till you show up

[wheat sigil]

not disappointed, i'm expecting having to go out looking for upgrades, but i'd prefer just collecting stuff

[prime sentinel]

kinda like classic doom

I'm sure there will be arena style encounters but that's not all there will be

[wheat sigil]

i have a hard time getting into a lot of game just because of the early stages where you don't have your stuff, and i don't like exploring, but i'm definitely a minority there

[frail bloom]

Didn't both modern doom games have that tho

[slender night]

We also got UN confirmed (yay) and ELM confirmed (kinda random but yay)

[prime sentinel]

I think here the difference is things won't be so clean cut

[frail bloom]

For sure

[prime sentinel]

between encounters and breather in between areas

I think encounters won't just be monsters teleporting in for a few minutes

we see clips of the slayer breaking into a village already populated with an encounter's worth of demons

Doom Eternal's pacing was very deliberate, set piece, platforming, breather, its all clean cut

in this game you choose your own pace, that's what hugo and marty said

[frail bloom]

Good then

Me personally, imma look in every inch

[slender night]

I'm hoping for TDA they bring back the hellish fake walls, would make a funny secret

[prime sentinel]

of course this is simply how I've interpretted the game

that we've seen so far

I think some people are thinking about it too much in terms of Eternal when its clear they are deliberately trying to make this game very different

[frail bloom]

Wouldn't that break immersion tho, monster closets can work

Oh a secret

[prime sentinel]

hm yeah this game is going for something slightly less goofy than Eternal

[frail bloom]

Me dumb

[slender night]

You had a big realistic cartoony green fish in Eternal

[frail bloom]

Yeah my bad

[prime sentinel]

yeah but Eternal is a video game ass video game, this one is going for a darker cinematic style

[frail bloom]

He meant funny secrets

[prime sentinel]

Eternal is like, saturday morning cartoon, its fun

[slender night]

TNO is a dark game and it has that Wolfenstein 3D secret level easter egg

I think they can sneak in a secret fake wall, the game won't need to always have a serious tone

[prime sentinel]

it'd be cool if classic levels returned

like 2016

I bet it'd work better with this gameplay style too

[frail bloom]

Well that would make sense this time

Yes exactly

[slender night]

I think they'd be best off if they touched up the levels to fit the game's artstyle

[prime sentinel]

sounds like a lot of work haha

I would rather just get more levels than them remaking classic levels in the game's style lol

[slender night]

I mean, eh, not really

[sleek ermine]

Well, with lore, can we confirm around what time in the future Eternal is

[prime sentinel]

not really 💀

[slender night]

With the campaign being the longest one according to them, they're bound to have a lot of assets done, I wouldn't mind if they reuse some of them to just build like a modern E1M1

Yes, not really

[prime sentinel]

levels usually have lots of assets made specifically for them

[frail bloom]

I mean you could just play some eternal modded levels

[sleek ermine]

This (probably worded poorly)

[prime sentinel]

maybe for 1 level it would be fine

oh you know what would be awesome? A completely secret level like in classic Doom

that would probably be a bigger waste of resources though haha

[slender night]

Yeah, when I said "to just build like a modern E1M1" I meant that specifically E1M1 and no other level is necessary, I think with the amount of assets they'd have built and the level's short length they can pull that off

[frail bloom]

But the geometry is weird tho

[prime sentinel]

well that's why you remake it :p

[frail bloom]

I don't know how you would pretty it up

Without losing it's recognizability

[prime sentinel]

you could make it recognizable and still have it fit an artstyle

rooms don't have to be the exact shape

[frail bloom]

I mean whether or not they do it won't harm my experience

[prime sentinel]

well regardless, if they add mod support it'll get E1M1 either way

[slender night]

Only gonna have to wait 4 years!

[frail bloom]

Yeah like eternal

[slender night]

I want another SnapMap tbh but the fact they won't be doing multiplayer is enough to tell me they won't bother with a SnapMap 2

[frail bloom]

That would be hard to code

I'm pretty sure doom 2016 was built with snapmap in mind

Given it's more simplistic enviroment and the way it works

They would have to build dedicated large maps for you to fill in

I just don't see it

[prime sentinel]

prolly not happening yeah

but I have to wonder if we'll get any other modes besides singleplayer on launch

[ebon shale]

I doubt it

[frail bloom]

Well they care about the community

[prime sentinel]

well, I worded that wrong, what I mean is any other modes besides story mode

[frail bloom]

So they need to have something for that dedicated fanbase

[slender night]

I'm not saying I want them to add it in the future, I was just thinking about the possibility of it happening

[prime sentinel]

so a horde mode or rogue like mode for example

[frail bloom]

Yes

[prime sentinel]

rogue like in particular is popular with games that the dark ages seems slightly inspired by

[wheat sigil]

the dedicated players on pc will inevitably get too good for the base content

[prime sentinel]

while I don't doubt its a meaty game, just story seems a little bare for a release like this

[wheat sigil]

although maybe not with the sliders

[frail bloom]

Well that's why we need a mode

[wheat sigil]

or probably still, but it will take longer

[prime sentinel]

I could see a challenge mode of sorts as well

[frail bloom]

After we git gud at this one

[prime sentinel]

I suspect like Eternal there will be post launch support

we know there will be at least one DLC

[frail bloom]

Yeah exactly

[wheat sigil]

what mode you thinking?

[frail bloom]

Hmm

Master levels and another horde mode lol

Not too sure where they'll take it

But they care, that's whats important

[prime sentinel]

arcade mode could return

[frail bloom]

Or some original mode

Too early to tell

[prime sentinel]

too early, we're 2 months out from this game coming out and we still know this little haha

[frail bloom]

True

They've been kinda quiet relative to eternal

[prime sentinel]

at this rate we won't "know for sure" until we have the game in our hands

[frail bloom]

They just want to blow us away

[prime sentinel]

I don't interpret their quiet-ness in a positive or negative way, could go either way

[wheat sigil]

that'll probably get too easy, mods are really the only way to entertain the playerbase for a longer while

or, keep challenging the playerbase at least

[frail bloom]

Well like eternal, you'll probably have to wait

[wheat sigil]

maybe the sliders can get stupidly difficult though

[prime sentinel]

modders will probably be on it real quick

[frail bloom]

Yes try those

[prime sentinel]

like, I bet within the first month there will be something

[wheat sigil]

didn't really take that long for Eternal

once the master levels that weren't arc complex or cultist base released, therr were already players good enough to UN them

[upper mauve]

will my 3060 ti be able to run this at 1440p

[frail bloom]

I mean it isn't their fault if you master the game in the week unless it's too easy

Try ultra nightmare or something

They did say extra life mode is more challenging this time

You can hold them up to it

[prime sentinel]

when did they confirm there were lives?

[frail bloom]

The edge magazine

I don't know what vid but it's fairly recent on the horde mode gaming channel

It's a snippet of the magazine so I know it ain't fake

[wheat sigil]

yup, and i'm not blaming the devs, the playerbase for eternal improved extremely quickly, and i'd expect something similar for tda

[frail bloom]

Well I don't think it'll be super quick

[wheat sigil]

mods are the only way to reasonably challenge the playerbase after a while, unless of course the sliders are busted

[frail bloom]

The whole point of it being diff is so you can't cheese through it knowing all the optimal strats

[prime sentinel]

which video?

[frail bloom]

Lemme check

[wheat sigil]

the issue with making the sliders busted though is that it isn't really that fun, unless implemented very well

[prime sentinel]

wait I think I found it

are lives in the base game or is extra life mode just a different mode?

[frail bloom]

Hold on

[wheat sigil]

i often play on custom difficulties in eternal, and if you go overboard with the extra damage/enemy speed, it becomes boring even if you play easier stuff to compensate

[prime sentinel]

I imagine the system is flexible enough where you can just decide to make it really grindy if you want :p

like you can just make it not fun if you feel like it

[grizzled spoke]

Maybe, ID is pretty good at optimization

Worried about Ray tracing being forced though

[wheat sigil]

yup, but i don't think that's a good way to challenge the playerbase

"yeah it can get really hard, but it won't be fun lolol"

[prime sentinel]

right I don't think that's what its there for necessarily though

like for example it needs to let you adjust the speed and how much damage enemies take

so if you are a weirdo you can decrease the speed to the slowest and increase enemy health to the max

but that's not really the devs' fault, that's just the inherent flexibility of the accessibility options

[grizzled spoke]

I always wanted to do that in most games. Sometimes the best difficulty feels too easy and other times it’s just annoying.

[wheat sigil]

yup, not arguing with you here

[prime sentinel]

right okay just making sure we're on the same page there

[frail bloom]

Man I can't find the video

[prime sentinel]

in terms of challenge there isn't really much to say, its totally true many will master this game in a week's time, or at least all that's in the base game haha

[frail bloom]

They really gotta cut up the segments

[prime sentinel]

I found it

[frail bloom]

Oh cool

[prime sentinel]

its the latest upload

[frail bloom]

Of course it is

Me dum dum

Unrelated

If I were to do a main menu theme

I'd choose message for the archvile

It's super sinister

Like how mick chose opening to hell

Andrew Hulshults Idkfa is a good example

[grim cloud]

empowered demons were a cool concept, but they didnt feel as dynamic and as immerssive as they could of. i think now they are just scripted

[frail bloom]

Yeah probably, no way people keep dying to that dreadknight in atlantica

[grim cloud]

yah i think it was the begninning stages of invasions but they didn't finish it because of covid and left as is

if time and money wasn't a factor, i would of made it so if a demon kills a slayer, it levels up with a unique skin, and continues to get stronger the more slayers it kills. Eventually snowballing into a unstoppible killing machine

[prime sentinel]

vestige of an abandoned mechanic

[prime sentinel]

kinda almost sounds like the nemesis system from Shadow of Mordor

[grim cloud]

a level 10 empowered demon would be larger and stronger and your fucked if you see it

[prime sentinel]

which is patented by WB games lmao

[prime sentinel]

this would ruin UN runs haha

would probably have to be disabled for UN

[grim cloud]

you can turn them of

[grim cloud]

not sure what that is, but you can do a lot of unique things with code to make it different

[prime sentinel]

basically in Shadow of Mordor there is a really neat mechanic where certain enemy AI can return later after you beat them, with scars and leveled up, they basically get stronger and remember your character, its pretty cool

[grim cloud]

but that shit would be sick as fuck, adds some random encounters and random diffiucultie spikes. Killing a high level empowered demon could reward skins or something. I dunno if only i where a developer

[wheat sigil]

eternal still isn't mastered😢

[wheat sigil]

totally agree here

[grim cloud]

pretty sure you can do that in other games without getting sued

[prime sentinel]

some of these nemesis will track you down too

[prime sentinel]

I forget how it works but certain elements of it are patented, unfortunately, and WB just shut down the studio that came up with the damn thing

I'm not saying Id would get sued, I'm just saying your idea reminded me of the mechanic

[grim cloud]

they can try, but im no lawyer but u cant patent a concept, just how its built

[prime sentinel]

I think it kinda works better in an open world setting where you revist areas and can just come across them on patrols and stuff

this isn't about that aaaaahhhhh

I was just saying they patented it

I don't think Id would get sued for your idea necessarily

[grim cloud]

WB would be going up against MS and angry raging nerds

[prime sentinel]

anyway it is patented though

and it doesn't expire till 2036

not exactly sure how you infringe on this particular patent

I just know that WB games was allowed it

[grim cloud]

looking at it now, my first thought is how in the hell cant that be patentable. We get a lot of that shit in RPG's already

so it much be something very specific in their, more code reletated, which can just be made differently by smarter people that me

[prime sentinel]

I think because its a dynamic system

like it can be any enemy

they get names, titles, ranks

its actually super cool

[grim cloud]

well pretty sure leveling up emp demons with the more slayers they kill woudn't even be a issue here. But now i am angry at WB

[prime sentinel]

like I said, I don't think Id would get sued, I just thought it kinda reminded me of it

[dark peak]

yeah, enter a room and get your ass wrecked by some chaingunners behind you that would be great

[delicate grotto]

Well no… obviously hitscan sucks. Other than the occasional Chaingunner barrage, classic Doom’s surprises were fun and challenging. I’m glad TDA is moving away from locking the player in an arena that is clearly about to spawn in a horde. Still love the games, but this is a nice change of pace.

[grim cloud]

No chaingunners that we know of in TDA. Maybe there is a minion variant

or whatever the new zombie soldier characters are called, do we even know?

[feral cargo]

I just hope the core game is dope as eternal

[dark peak]

also make certain items trigger things, like doom

[sonic turret]

So apparently TDAs storyline will be open-ended, not connecting directly to 2016, to allow for more potential DLC content.

[prime sentinel]

sequels as well

I think basically they want to make room for more stories they can tell

[grim cloud]

yes that is true, it starts shortly (as in a few years maybe?) after the slayers arrival.

One DLC is confirmed, a second DLC was leaked from the MS/FCC Doom Year Zero leak

[atomic moss]

im unable to get this game off my mind, its so good and its not even out yet

[vapid lodge]

I really don't know how much they can milk DOOM, don't get me wrong I am extremely happy of any DOOM content, no matter if its a game or lore or whatever. Im buying it.

I know its been said after Eternal that I can't imagine what would be the next gameplay loop, and then TDA came out...

But after TDA, what else can they do?

[prime sentinel]

eh that's a ways off

we're in for a year or two of post launch content for TDA

[vapid lodge]

I hate myself that I remember how hyped I was when Eternal was launched, first gameplay. Its gonna happen again with TDA. Can't wait but that feeling is gonna fade away again

[grim cloud]

there is always room for more doom

[prime sentinel]

no need for the onwee, the game ain't even out yet haha

[vapid lodge]

yeah, it was just so much hype....

[sonic turret]

I hope there won't be more sequels between TDA and 2016, I'd rather they bridge that gap between the main campaign and DLC, otherwise it'll just feel incomplete and with narrative gaps, but then it depends on how successful TDA is compared to previous releases, if it's more successful, then it may be deserving of more sequels from the DA story arc.

However, I'd like to move back to the aftermath of Doom Eternal and the higher primeval threats.

[prime sentinel]

I think TDA will have a satisfying ending, it just won't lead into 2016

[grim cloud]

Doom: The second dark age

[delicate grotto]

Makes sense.
No where to really take the Slayer’s story post Ancient Gods. Unless something entirely new and disconnected occurs

[vapid lodge]

Doom the industrial age

Or this is 2016?

[prime sentinel]

because 2016 starts so far into the future compared to when TDA takes place it would make no sense for it to end with the coffin, even in DLC

[sonic turret]

And learn about those beings that supercede Davoth, moving up the chain of command.

[grim cloud]

there are centuries, if not eons of slayer story telling

[prime sentinel]

exactly

there is so much room between TDA and 2016

anything could happen there

[grizzled spoke]

Looter shooter

[prime sentinel]

I actually think post Eternal would be more limiting because uh, where do you go once you get into that ethereal god space

[grim cloud]

cthulu hell according to hugo

[prime sentinel]

like, Davoth is the god of the doom universe, and I guess there's stuff above him? but that's so abstract and weird

like how do you even do that in a game?

[grim cloud]

primeval beings, whatever those are

[prime sentinel]

I think going into the past was probably the best choice

[grim cloud]

basically the start of Quake 6

[prime sentinel]

and I can see them doing many slayer adventures in the past

[grim cloud]

staring doomgirl

[prime sentinel]

idk about that...

[grim cloud]

just making shit up

[prime sentinel]

as much as I love quake lol

a lot of stuff that used to be quake is now in doom

but who knows

I just don't get how you could get crazier than Eternal

Dark Ages is more fantastical but also more grounded and gritty

which is kind of an oxymoron, but Eternal is batshit insane

[hard thistle]

After dtda, what will Bethesda make in the doom universe? They ended the slayer off in the ancient gods dlc's. And they are making a prequel to doom 2016. So that got me thinking, what else can they make? Doom 1993 modern doom remaster? A whole nother reboot?

[prime sentinel]

doubt they'll remaster classic doom

its just kinda pointless since 2016 and doom 3 both are kind of alternate retellings of that game (yes I know 1993 is canon to 2016, but it still follows classic doom a lot)

[hard thistle]

Hmm wonder what Bethesda will do to the doom universe after dtda comes out.

[prime sentinel]

Id Software will likely just find somewhere else in the timeline to set a new game

there's a lot of gaps

particularly between 2016 and Eternal and TDA and 2016, and post Eternal is possible as well

[hard thistle]

Speaking of timeline gaps how can doom go from the dark ages with futureistic technology to just some Mars base futureistic technology? (If you know what I mean)

[prime sentinel]

different civilizations

the bases from 2016 are human built

the tech base we've seen in TDA appears to be Sentinel in origin

[hard thistle]

Ohhhh makes sense

[prime sentinel]

yeah, it looks like long before humans had that tech, or even existed maybe? in that universe the sentinels had comparable or maybe even better tech

[grim cloud]

argenta tech appears supperior, but who knows. I guess we need a UAC versus Argenta deathmatch game now

[prime sentinel]

lol

[plain iron]

As in the hebeth lab?

I presume that's the classic games' UAC

[prime sentinel]

there's sentinel writing in it

its where you get the accellerator, which also has sentinel writing on it

[plain iron]

The UAC is known to steal other mfs technology 😭

[prime sentinel]

no I mean on the walls and stuff

[plain iron]

I'd say the sentinels found it after the events of classic doom

[prime sentinel]

like the signs are in Sentinel

like all the tech has sentinel stuff on it lol

[plain iron]

The architecture is too close to UAC for it to not be them

[prime sentinel]

it actually resembles sentinel architecture a bit too with the domes and the ribbed ceiling detail

I theorize the UAC stole from the sentinels

because this is clearly sentinel writing on the wall, I thought it was the UAC at first too but if you look at the concept art especially it is sentinel

we also know that Hebeth was a Sentinel outpost or whatever

the concept art also shows what appears to be a spiritually locked door or something haha

[obsidian shard]

And Maykr Tech

I'm gonna Enjoy The Physics Side of glory Kills ALOT, Freaking Love Physics Based Shit

[hard thistle]

@hard thistle Bethesda is not makiong doom only publishing. ID SOFTWARE makes doom.

[hard thistle]

I did not know that tysm

no problem just dont want ya praising bethesda when they didnt make the game.

[lunar surge]

I Just Preordered The Collector’s Edition With DoomSlayers Helmet

[vapid lodge]

Same, almost $400

can't wait

[lunar surge]

I’m Hyped

[plain iron]

I ordered it and now I'm struggling to find money so I can still have nitro 💀

Oh the woes of a teenager

[vapid lodge]

yeah well I understand it :/ life is life

Even as an "adult" its still a little expensive

[plain iron]

Worth it though

It would be much more expensive after TDA releases

[vapid lodge]

For DOOM yes? I would not buy this much merch if it wasnt DOOM

[plain iron]

Same.

I've spent $1.2kaud on physical doom merch

[vapid lodge]

Im also working on the TDA cosplay, should be done next month if im not lazy

[plain iron]

That's mainly that big cuz of the collectors edition and the helmet

[vapid lodge]

dayum, yeah I havent measured how much I did too but thats a lot

[plain iron]

A decent amount of it is shipping 💀

[vapid lodge]

Yep, Im gonna have 2 TDA helmets lol

one made by me and the collectors one

[plain iron]

Hrr that's so cooool ima make one too but like. Small because I'm 5'2

It's gonna be funny as hell walking around PAX as the slayer w a cane cuz the legs no work

[vapid lodge]

I dont think Ill ever cosplay in the US, travelling is way too much for me, and airport security will take my stuff, been known to happen

I really wish I could somehow attend Quake con

[plain iron]

Nawh I ain't gonna do the American PAX I think I'd get deported somehow, ima stick w Australia's PAX

[vapid lodge]

You got to meet Mick?

[plain iron]

Nawh, couldn't go that year

[vapid lodge]

aw man

[plain iron]

I do like mick, I ain't gonna try and get out of the hospital for that mf

[vapid lodge]

ouch, sorry 😦

I dont know the wounds, but if I was dying I would have ran anyway

[plain iron]

It would have been ouchy for the rest of the folk, It was the mental hospital 💀

[vapid lodge]

sorry, hope you are ok

[plain iron]

It was 2 years ago it's fine

[latent bronze]

Qq is the official helmet worth it

[plain iron]

Yes imo

It has lights :D

[latent bronze]

But why are the shipping options super expensive?

[latent bronze]

Wait really?!

Which part

[plain iron]

It's really really heavy

[plain iron]

I haven't a clue, but it requires batteries iirc

[latent bronze]

I wished that the helmet was the collector's edition merch instead of standalone

Like the statue is cool but the helmet looks cooler imo

[plain iron]

It's typical of what's in the collectors edition tbf

[latent bronze]

Do you think the game is over hyped or under

[plain iron]

A bit of both

I do believe that TDA will be a good game

[latent bronze]

Me too

[plain iron]

I've never really seen id software make a bad doom game imo, but people are going to disappoint themselves when it releases

[plucky plinth]

VFR slowly enters the chat

[plain iron]

I love vfr.

But I think the main issue that people will have w TDA is that "Oh but it doesn't feel like eternal so it's a bad game"

[plucky plinth]

Yeah, that’s how Eternal from 2016 sorta was

I’m weirdly the opposite, though. I’m in the category of “Oh but it doesn’t feel like Eternal so it’s a good game”

[plain iron]

Yup, eternal is lowkey a shit doom game

It's a good game, but just a shit doom game

[plucky plinth]

I wouldn’t call it a bad Doom game due to the 50/50 split of NuDoom and Original Trio

[latent bronze]

Imo eternal is better

[plucky plinth]

I am honestly not a fan of Eternal

[latent bronze]

I think the arcady electric feel is better

[plain iron]

Ehh it's worse than doom 3 imo [I am a doom 3 lover]

[plucky plinth]

Doom 3 is closer to a “Doom game” than even 2016, Thomas

[latent bronze]

How

[plain iron]

Yes I don't like 2016 that much either 😭

[plucky plinth]

Judging by the Doom Bible and such, Doom 3’s atmosphere and gameplay is what was initially intended with the original games

[latent bronze]

I like the new gens alot

[plucky plinth]

But id Tech 1 did limit that vision

[latent bronze]

Do you think doom tda will have a collect mania or something to remember the old games

[plain iron]

I played and watched doom 3 for the majority of my childhood so I gravitate towards it more

[plucky plinth]

I gravitate towards the older titles much more

I find 2016 my personal favorite NuDoom game, but far from my favorite Doom game

[latent bronze]

Then what is your favorite

[plain iron]

I deadass only play nudoom cuz of a lore fixation

[plucky plinth]

Doom 1 without a doubt

[latent bronze]

The dlc story imo broke the game

[plain iron]

Nawh the dlcs didn't do much

[prime sentinel]

I think this a really poor criticism. I hate when it’s used for doom 3 and I don’t like it here either

[latent bronze]

The whole samur makyr and Vega and the endgame thing

[plain iron]

That's been there since possibly 2016 and eternal

[prime sentinel]

What elements exactly are important to make a “good doom game” it’s highly subjective so this sort of thing just doesn’t make any sense to anyone else

[plucky plinth]

Yeah, pretty much this ^

[latent bronze]

May be it's just a bit lamer than a man that is this kind of selfless instead of a person who is full of himself

[plain iron]

Vega's core is deadass just a maykr's head, along w his entry in 2016

[prime sentinel]

personally I think Doom Eternal is a great Doom game BECAUSE its a great game

with legacy franchises you have to expect the games to change heavily

mario, zelda, stuff like that makes big swings game to game

[plain iron]

And Samuel w the crucible, and when that one cutscene in urdak where it goes "welcome, seraphim"

[latent bronze]

And the sentinal army imo was just done for no reason out if nowhere

[latent bronze]

When

[plain iron]

The sentinel army was needed

[prime sentinel]

certain elements remain, and this is the case with Doom as well, there are elements that are always there, but the developers will mix and match and bend it to make new stuff with new ideas

[latent bronze]

I don't remember a reason they were able to go there

[plain iron]

One of the first few cutscenes in urdak, just before the slayer stabbing that heart

[latent bronze]

Idk why I don't remember it I may forgot it

[plucky plinth]

I’ve personally left the boat of saying “X is a bad Doom game” other than to more-so ironically say it (well, I guess that does exclude what I said earlier, but eh).
Though, I will mention that a game being great can, up to a point, be subjective.

[latent bronze]

3rdly imo it would be cooler as if that the doom slayer literally took hell out by himself and just had the davoth be angry about his destroyed city

[placid saffron]

Doesn't help that the lore contradicts itself within 10 minutes

"The gate of divum is the only way into immora"
Ok so how the fuck did those sentinels get here then???

[latent bronze]

That's my point

[plain iron]

no

[latent bronze]

It could have been a one man army moment

Of doom guy

[placid saffron]

Eh definitely would fit more with how the games have laid it out

[latent bronze]

Getting his revenge by himself

[placid saffron]

Unless they actually build up the storybeat more

[plain iron]

I genuinely hate the idea of doomguy being this one man army character

Because he isn't

[latent bronze]

Imo doom guy is perfect for a mount Olympus in hell moment

[placid saffron]

I don't hate it but the game definitely should've showed it a lot more if they didn't want to either

[latent bronze]

Like in god of war

[plucky plinth]

Well, he basically was from Doom 1 all the way up to 2016. He basically never got outside help up until then.

Which I don’t personally like to be quite honest

[plain iron]

Eh how much of it was him just surviving

[plucky plinth]

True

[plain iron]

He was just lucky imo

[placid saffron]

Or the help was always in an assistance roll

[latent bronze]

Nah bro just got a stackable buff then grinded

In hell

[plain iron]

[placid saffron]

In the OG games definitely, but nudoom made him a chosen one... ew

[plain iron]

Regardless one man couldn't have done what was done in immora

[placid saffron]

Yeah but doom doesn't really bring that message

[plain iron]

There's was motherfucking dragons dawg

[plucky plinth]

Yeah…

[placid saffron]

It's literally "against all odds"

[plucky plinth]

Honestly, I did like when he was more of a survivor

[plain iron]

I want him to not be assumed as some big heroic badass

He is in my eyes, a traumatised, damaged man who has emotional disregulation

[latent bronze]

Well they made him a god that was worshipped

[plain iron]

He's hardly a god and I hate the idea that he is

[latent bronze]

Don't hate the game hate the devolpers

[placid saffron]

glances at the divinity machine

[plain iron]

I do.

[placid saffron]

Like i'm sorry but your opinions are simply 9 years too late

[plain iron]

He mimics the idea of a god

[prime sentinel]

this is such a goofy conversation

[placid saffron]

The franchise you want is not the franchise that currently exists

[prime sentinel]

those darn developers are at it again

[plain iron]

I want him to be perceived as what he is

[latent bronze]

They made everything more metal

[prime sentinel]

ruining everything I decided I wanted later

[placid saffron]

A guy with a shard of god imbued in him?

[latent bronze]

That is your opinion

[plain iron]

[latent bronze]

That killed him

[latent bronze]

[plain iron]

I want him to not be perceived as he is currently

[placid saffron]

A guy who slaid hell for "eons" according to the codex entries? Who terrified an entire conquest realm?

[plain iron]

He is not a god, he is not special and he was just a tool.

[latent bronze]

Imo cultist base is top 5 best tracks

[placid saffron]

Eh davoth was powerless so it's not really a feat

[latent bronze]

Wait really?

I thought he regained them

[placid saffron]

He is not capital God but be is imbued with whatever vague power God had
He is special according to doom's heaven prophecy, he is the destroyer
A tool that managed to break free of his chains and go on an inhuman massacre

[prime sentinel]

I mean like it or not the slayer has been characterized this way since 2016

you can't just decide that to you he is this thing and that the developers should follow that simply because that's how you want others to see this fictional character

[placid saffron]

No he just regained physical form, his powers are still locked away

[latent bronze]

I feel that doom 2016 is a harder collect mania

[prime sentinel]

huh?

[latent bronze]

Now let's see doom guy beat Vega/the father

[plain iron]

He is special because davoth wanted him to be special. Everything that happened, davoth did

[prime sentinel]

2016 has entire lore entries that just exist to suck the slayer off

[plain iron]

He never broke out of his chains

[latent bronze]

Like the runes and toys are harder to find

[plain iron]

He was a tool from the start

[prime sentinel]

what does that have to do with the way the doom slayer is characterized?

[latent bronze]

Idk just wanted to say my opinion

[prime sentinel]

lol you responded to my message though

[placid saffron]

Yeah, it's fine to not like the current direction; i don't like it either. But completely mischaracterizing him and saying everyone else is wrong is BS

[latent bronze]

I felt doom eternal was easier to collect stuff in

[placid saffron]

Yes, and?

[placid saffron]

Killing davoth himself was never his plan sooo

[latent bronze]

[plain iron]

He isn't what everyone makes him to be and I just don't like it

[prime sentinel]

you can feel that the slayer is a traumatized character that is just super emotional and stuff but that is never really how he's been characterized in game, at least from my perspective

[placid saffron]

Well he sure as fuck is not what you claim what he is either anymore

[plain iron]

I'm tired of the constant misinformation and mischaractisation that seems to run rampant

[prime sentinel]

in both modern games he is never characterized as anything but super badass and in control and super epic

[placid saffron]

Traunatized he has been shown. Super emotional? Ehhjh

[plain iron]

Emotional disregulation isn't just sadness

It is rage

Im not saying he's some sad sob story, he is a very angry man

[placid saffron]

Going in the other direction from cannon then powerscalers do doesn't make you right either

[prime sentinel]

I mean yeah he is filled with rage

but the game never asks you to question it or even to think its not good

its the "man too angry to die" meme

in 2016 when he breaks samuel's stuff you're supposed to be thinking "hell yeah! fuck that guy!"

not "this is a broken man..."

[latent bronze]

Real

[prime sentinel]

I think the best characterization you get in 2016 is that he clearly cares about humans, you only really get it in the beginning when he looks at the corpse when samuel says "this is for the betterment of mankind"

[latent bronze]

I am waiting for dtda

Let's see if fat makyr dies

[lucid saffron]

he will

yay for more Maykr but sadge for buddah Maykr

[hard thistle]

To be fair he is still very much killable. The whole conversation of "god" in this series is silly to begin with because of shit like this.

In Doom even a whole "God" can still be killed with guns and really hard punches. That is Doom's universe. It's trying to be sort of grounded with that. The Slayer, you can call him a "god" if you want but it's just a meaningless term in Doom's universe.

[proud vine]

Is the doomslayer being a god even backed up by anything? Other then the divinity machine

[hard thistle]

People like Elena Richardson call him this, but it's a relative thing and mainly just because they revere him. The Slayer is a human with the power of a Primeval.

Whether that counts as a "god" or not is up to you. But he's definitely killable, fallible, and can succumb to things like asphyxiation.

[proud vine]

Tbh every god in the doom universe can die by said things i think

[hard thistle]

It's arguable if we've even seen any of them. Davoth is a Primeval and it seems there's a higher being that made him, so if he's a God or not is kind of up in the air.

The Father helped make reality but was otherwise just a really cool machine. Is that a God? Who knows.

[proud vine]

Wasn't davoth the creator of everything?

[hard thistle]

Not really directly.

[prime sentinel]

Davoth definitely has god-like powers

right?

like he can just create worlds (intentional or not)

[hard thistle]

It's never actually confirmed that he made Jekkad, for example. All we know for sure is he built the Father and the Maykrs. They don't really show off any examples of how he could've made reality, for example - I believe the Father still made the Earthly Realms.

[proud vine]

He did make peoples in his "city" immortal in tag 2

[hard thistle]

I don't believe Davoth had the power to create worlds. Everything can be traced back to him but it's non-direct, like having a son who makes the cure for cancer.

[hard thistle]

They already were, thanks to Argent Energy, supposedly.

[prime sentinel]

didn't hell form itself around him?

like passively creating hell?

[proud vine]

After the father betrayed him tho

[prime sentinel]

I'm not a lorehead, genuinely trying to understand

[hard thistle]

Hell is just the corrupted form of Jekkad, which could have pre-dated Davoth. The realm has grown exponentially but it doesn't do this by itself, it does this by taking worlds from other realms and sucking them into Hell.

It's possible a vast majority of Hell itself isn't even "native" Hell / Jekkad, but transformed land from conquered planets.

[proud vine]

Hell is basically a big terraformed landscape

[hard thistle]

This specific stuff is a bit up to interpretation. You can argue Davoth waved his hands and magically created Earth and shit, but I personally do not believe this and I think it contradicts Davoth's character. I find it more likely this is one of the things the Book of Seraphs wasn't lying about - the Father created the Earthly Realms after locking Davoth off in Hell.

[plain zodiac]

do you guys think the dark ages gonna pass the 120Gb
bc they added much new things and ofc better graphics
even doom eternal , 2016 was 80gb

[prime sentinel]

It’s possible

Especially since it’s supposedly the biggest doom yet

granted that doesn't mean it will necessarily be a larger file size, but if I were a betting man I'd bet it will be

actually

no it won't pass 120 gigs, the system requiremements says 100 gigs free space

maybe with DLC it will be

[lucid saffron]

Elden ring + Doom?

LET ME INNNNNNNN

[plain iron]

Weirdly enough though he can have his biceps exposed to space 😭

[hard thistle]

Well I've done that before, that's no big deal.

[plain iron]

No biggie

[plain zodiac]

i belive that id software is the best studio with zipping files but it's look huge that's why

[prime sentinel]

oh whoops

well the doom twitter just tweeted

its not on bsky yet

but it is hugo discussing a piece of concept art

we now know the dragon is named Serrat

[simple mist]

This is what underthemayo is gonna say.

/J

[grim cloud]

New nuggets released, we even see a better shot of lizard lord and a new caster like demon

looks like a mindflayer kinda

Serrat

[obsidian shard]

The Goat

[obsidian shard]

Better look at quite a few

[prime sentinel]

Serrat is the mount

oh wait you mean the other concept art in the background my b

[grim cloud]

looks like we see some demon mech forces as well. A tank and a flying something. Are they piloted?

[hard thistle]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1249847635364413471/1349028253901525172/IMG_0517.png?ex=67d19bf7&is=67d04a77&hm=c4294c5e0a60d089972a4d8de082b7eafc8e770867ac6b4ca3e9d10f6e6ad16a&

Who put skyrim into my doom

[grim cloud]

maybe that is the acolyte

[obsidian shard]

Im DOOMING IT IM DOOMING IT IM DOOMING IT IM DOOMING IT

[fleet spruce]

straight up quake'ing it

[hard thistle]

Bruh they put davy jones in my doom

[neon perch]

What is that? Where'd you get it from?

[hard thistle]

I didn't realize that's a emoji. XD

[faint marten]

No ur omning it

I can’t wait for doom guy to say “prepare to meet your doom”

“Doom the dark ages”

[slender night]

"I'm your ultra-nightmare!"
Quote from a cinematic disaster

[lucid saffron]

"Its like hell on earth here"
roll credits

[hard thistle]

https://tenor.com/view/cringe-meme-cringe-shrek-gif-6551256872915503916

[woven jolt]

oh cool, the dragon

name is Serrat

[wooden acorn]

Day uhhh 47 of 112

[cobalt fog]

https://tenor.com/view/stick-bug-stick-bugged-bug-dancing-bug-dancing-gif-18059923

[waxen valley]

https://tenor.com/view/why-are-you-gae-pepe-julien-gif-13687553676606303412

[frail bloom]

Where can I see this?

[wooden acorn]

Is that the new dragon

Stickbug

Or whatever it’s name is

[real rose]

every time i hear news about this game i get more and more excited

im so ready for this new expeience

im especially excited for the new music, even what little we already have is amazing imo

[frail bloom]

I'm hoping for a legacy of rust track

I'd understand if it's not there tho

[real rose]

i havent played the older titles so forgive my ignorance, would that be a callback sorta thing?

[frail bloom]

Legacy of rust was an expanison they released last summer

[plucky plinth]

Was about to say that

[frail bloom]

It has really cool midi songs and 5 new demons

[plucky plinth]

A real callback would be like Doom 1, 2, or TNT

Specifically TNT has Plutonia has no original tracks

[real rose]

oh i think i remember hearing about that

[frail bloom]

Hear me out, message for the archvile as the main menu theme

[plucky plinth]

Maybe

[frail bloom]

If you hear hulshults version, it sounds foreboding

[real rose]

is there anything specific in the game you're looking forward to?

[plucky plinth]

The more “return to form” that it goes for

[grim cloud]

return to form needs pinky hordes. we havn't seen that yet

[plucky plinth]

Fair lol

Or endless chain gunners

[grim cloud]

main bosses as main enemies is also something i like

[frail bloom]

1. Doom 1 and 2 callbacks
2. More coherence in storytelling
3. Larger levels
4. Larger enemy variety
5. All doom 2 monsters
6. Satisfying gameplay loop
   Just more doom basically

[real rose]

thats a pretty solid answer

[grim cloud]

def need every doom 2 monster, not sure if those are cacodemons and pinky beasts?... but still missing Pain Elemental, Spider Mastermind, Baron (semi confirmed), Flameboy, chaingunner minion variant

[real rose]

how do you feel about the pace?
personally im not fussed cuz i'll definitely be tweaking it in the settings

[plucky plinth]

I might even slow it down a bit

[frail bloom]

To build off of that, they need classic variations for the cadodemons, barons, and archviles, the rest idc

[grim cloud]

i cant tell till i see more gameplay

[grim cloud]

imo, if a demon existed in doom game, i want it to exist it TDA. I know that would be implausable, but damn give me all of them

[real rose]

imagine a Banshee and an Archvile in the same encounter

[grim cloud]

id also welcome back the summoner

[frail bloom]

Yes! They need legacy of rust monsters!

[grim cloud]

but fuck the spirit

[real rose]

wait am i getting mixed up- what was the one in 2016 that replaced the archvile?

[hard thistle]

Summoner.

[real rose]

right, that one

where'd i get banshee from?

[frail bloom]

The banshee comes from legacy of rust

[grim cloud]

Baalgars and Spider Masterminds, we need to fight those in TDA, and not just as bosses

[frail bloom]

It's the red ogilee bogilee cloud

[real rose]

hm.. i've never even seen that

[frail bloom]

I think the strogg looking thing replaces the mastermind as a superheavy

Just speculation

[real rose]

BUT i think im most excited for the environments? thats something i really enjoyed about Eternal

[frail bloom]

Yeah that green area they showed looked awesome

[grim cloud]

also the tda arachnotraons are called mindreavers since they have chainguns

[frail bloom]

How do you know that?

[real rose]

but also getting better looks at the new demons is something im really excited for, im a real spec bio nerd

[frail bloom]

Or is that speculation

[frail bloom]

Yeah maybe their viewer doesn't look like crap this time

[real rose]

it did its job well enough, but yea, i'd like some more interactive data logs

[hushed geode]

What’s popping?

[frail bloom]

Data logs were fun to read yeah

[frail bloom]

Super shotgun

[real rose]

i want it like a god damn pokedex, i want info and a movable model

[frail bloom]

We had those the last two

[real rose]

well yea but

better

[frail bloom]

Oh yeah for sure

[real rose]

i hope the art book is good, too. i really wanna get that when it comes out

[frail bloom]

I mean they're selling it so it better be good

[real rose]

and remind me what versions there are?
theres the standard, premium, and collector's right?

[frail bloom]

Yeah those 3

[real rose]

so the collector's edition comes with the statue, right?
what comes with the premium?