streamchat

[river cargo]

They supported Ross

And refused to hear thor out

Josh was in the chat with charlie

[indigo wadi]

supporting ross != dogpiling thor

[fluid dome]

Supporting Ross =/= Dogpiling Thor

[steep surge]

I knoooow but like... slander or those videos* are one thing but what some of those forums do...those are actual crimes

[river cargo]

They're responsible for all this hate

[indigo wadi]

no

you're being ridic

Supporting Ross also is not a reason to sue them

that's also ridic

[fluid dome]

https://tenor.com/view/fistbttf-marty-mcfly-biff-biff-back-to-the-future-gif-25954062

[summer night]

guys the internet is the internet. i've been in to many cod lobbies to care what the internet says

[thick ledge]

let vx underground post cats chat

let it happen

i left a post saying i like thor and even i can appreciate a good cat

[river cargo]

Thor doesn't become the bad guy without those people piling on him is the issue

[opaque raven]

I wish...

[indigo wadi]

My dude

ppl were alrady dogpiling thor BEFORE SKG was a thing

[steep surge]

saying stuff is one thing, but those people are sadly doing more than "internet says a thing"

[indigo wadi]

also can you post Screenshots of Hbomberguy outright saying he won't listen to thor?

[tribal canyon]

VX is the souce of my 300GB cat memes folder

[indigo wadi]

You can support the intiative just fine

like, am i just being baited?

[fluid dome]

The most hbomberguy will do is most likely make a 3 hour documentary on the whole ordeal and meme about both sides

[indigo wadi]

true

[river cargo]

But there comes a time where the hate has gone too far

[indigo wadi]

and like maybe include Thor and Ross

[indigo wadi]

They aren't to blame? Hello??

[river cargo]

Nah screw Ross thor should not ever talk to Ross or these guys ever again

[lunar moth]

... wut?
From top to bottom:

1. People are allowed to have opinions, this includes disagreeing with people you agree with.
2. Josh actually defended Thor in the sense of him voicing his opinions and concerns, all whilst disagreeing with him.
3. Hbomberguy makes one video a year. He's not capable of siding with anyone without making a 4 hour long video - and I doubt that SKG will be his next video, that seems unlikely.
4. Defamation is really difficult to prove in regards to online speech, because ya' know... stuff is public - online defamation is in almost all cases crystal clear or impossible to prove.
5. Calm down.
6. I wanted to make a sixth point.

[indigo wadi]

okay

he's just trolling

moving on

[fluid dome]

Also Harry is like, one of the best people to cover this I feel, because he actually does his research.

[lunar moth]

Probably.

[indigo wadi]

Poor Somerton...

[minor nymph]

What the hell are you talking about?

[tribal canyon]

cat meme times

[indigo wadi]

nothing relevant, being trolly

[summer night]

his trolling he must be

[river cargo]

Supported Ross and skg

[thick ledge]

they want everyone talking about you to get in legal trouble for defamation or smth

[fluid dome]

Also next video will probably be about The SSSniperwolf shit if I'm being honest

[indigo wadi]

Josh did a level headed vide today that BARELY included Thor. HBomberguy did a simple tweet about supporting the initiative. That's it

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/wtf-confused-look-gif-24835232

[minor nymph]

And?
They have a different opinion.
Let them have it, lol.

[opaque raven]

Maybe it's just a misconception, and it's always good to talk about it 💙

[indigo wadi]

oh god, please do

[lunar moth]

Wouldn't that just be an extension of his Plagiarism video if he made that?

[indigo wadi]

that's a gold mine

[lunar moth]

Or am I forgetting something about SSSniperwolf?

[indigo wadi]

Part 2

[lunar moth]

Haha xD

[thick ledge]

theyre just mad thor wont do react content

[indigo wadi]

truth

[fluid dome]

SSSniperwolf got mad that JJJacksfilms called her out on her lazy react content and doxxed him

[opaque raven]

Btw, side note, Sniperwolf sounds like such a cool name

[steep surge]

to be fair
He's reacting to chat all day
Isnt that already react content then

[river cargo]

React content is the biggest plague on social media and influencer content

[summer night]

never a truer word spoken

[river cargo]

A waste of ad space

[thick ledge]

take a screenshot of me talking about react content so 5 years from now when im a react streamer you can post it in a take down post

[steep surge]

I dunno there are a few good ones

I like experts reacting to stuff and they add context and their knowledge
Thats always fun

[lunar moth]

Sure, but HBomberguy does big projects - the notion of "lazy react content" doesn't seem ... that important to him.
A documentary about doxxing and internet security could be neat though, so that might be a thing?

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/theodoros-gif-18371963

[fluid dome]

Idk I just really like Harry's content

[lunar moth]

Same

[fluid dome]

His roblox video was what got me subscribed

[summer night]

@thick ledge how are you anyway dude? all good?

[indigo wadi]

Didn't he cover react content in his plagerism video?

[green plank]

i kind of dont like content elitism personally

[thick ledge]

tired, i just wanna shitpost and ive been forced to be REAL too much this week

[fluid dome]

That was mostly Somerton

[indigo wadi]

Oh did you hear Somerton apparently faked his death?

[lunar moth]

I... think so? But that's why I thought that's why it wouldn't be relevant now

[steep surge]

mood honestly

[fluid dome]

LMAO?

[thick ledge]

meanwhile im delivering crates of famitsu magazine

[indigo wadi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SL-UgTBb6Vc&pp=ygUIc29tZXJ0b24%3D not sure how true it is

[fluid dome]

He also covered Internet Historian

[indigo wadi]

Same video

he covered like 3-4

illuminaughti

all as a lead up to somerton

[summer night]

ewwww

[indigo wadi]

it was a work of art

[summer night]

i feel sorry for you

[fluid dome]

Honestly Harry's takes are one of the few that are genuinely good faith

[indigo wadi]

100%

[lunar moth]

I remember, the thing about him is that he's even more deeply weird than what was covered by Harry - which is a shame since he has some ol classic videos IIRC

[steep surge]

Is there anything worse than feeling real and like you are an actual person with a corporeal form?

[thick ledge]

no

[indigo wadi]

@fluid dome I came across Harry with his Pathologic video

[indigo wadi]

I feel like im an alien on this earth

[fluid dome]

How do you think I feel during Pride month? I'm FORCED to be perceived by the common man. I hate it.

[thick ledge]

i need chat ot know every time i in this ravine i have to look at this gd, ber

bear

[indigo wadi]

WHY IS MICKEY THERE

[summer night]

yes what you said and remembering its monday tomorrow

[steep surge]

oh my god please someone put Thor's face on it

[opaque raven]

How the frick you all know so much about so many content creators? I can barely follow one or two

[thick ledge]

put thors face but make sure its faded like the bear is on the rocks

[steep surge]

yeees

[indigo wadi]

terminally online on youtube

[steep surge]

where's Nelas when you need them

[indigo wadi]

for 10+ years

[opaque raven]

Ew

[indigo wadi]

like..probably 20 by now

[summer night]

i hate grass and the sun scares me

[indigo wadi]

Yt is one of my main forms of entertainment

[opaque raven]

You mean the giant galactic fireball in the sky? It truly is scary

[steep surge]

same honestly

[fluid dome]

Check out his videos on Deus Ex Human Revolution and Fear and Hunger

[steep surge]

that too
It's always scary

[thick ledge]

me fighting package thiefs with tasers to recover snes game carts

[steep surge]

I don't want to be perceived at all, alright

[thick ledge]

death stranding is wild

[steep surge]

I mean....they got a point tho

[indigo wadi]

Still waiting for his VTM video

[thick ledge]

48kgs of videogames

[summer night]

its why i have this for thor's stream ONLY 4 till 300

[steep surge]

geez lmao
How many catridges would that even be

[thick ledge]

do the math

the silver containers are game carts

[steep surge]

noooo I'm an artist

I cant do math

[indigo wadi]

I hate you

[steep surge]

numbers are yucky

[opaque raven]

Oh ye, I saw some peeps on stream chat talking about how they sadly lost their streak recently. Not sure if it was a Twitch problem or what happened

[steep surge]

They dont like me and I dont like them

[fluid dome]

I remember when Black Ops 3 removed the campaign (I think anyway)

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/pirates-of-the-caribbean-peasants-gif-12617726

LOL

[indigo wadi]

I cast upon you, interrupted internet at Thor's next stream

[thick ledge]

imagine 2 companies have shitty practices so you wanna disassemble entire game genres

couldnt be me

[steep surge]

sounds like a twitter take

[indigo wadi]

hrm

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/leonardo-dicaprio-laughing-reverse-reverse-card-reverse-uno-gif-3758578067338957449

[indigo wadi]

my son is getting fussy. I'm guessing he wants food or something

[thick ledge]

time to do a death stranding with ur son

[indigo wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/meme-uno-uno-reverse-card-uno-cards-uno-reverse-card-meme-gif-12483429616104088768

[steep surge]

oh yeah you have a son
I just remembered

[indigo wadi]

I do

[steep surge]

hope he's doing okay!

[indigo wadi]

I sometimes remember too

[thick ledge]

you rn

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/yugioh-trap-card-trap-triggered-gif-12909225702038116

[indigo wadi]

kidding

[indigo wadi]

legitimately

[opaque raven]

Toddler?

[steep surge]

yea you better be kidding!

[indigo wadi]

8.5 months

[thick ledge]

so more of a death strand 2 situation

[summer night]

thats creepy

[thick ledge]

https://tenor.com/view/death-stranding-2-sam-baby-hideo-kojima-gif-11053849587515972551

[opaque raven]

Not yet on the feral goblin years I suppose

[indigo wadi]

kinda

[steep surge]

aww thats sweet tho

[indigo wadi]

nah, he's still in cute critter goblin mode

Can I say, they did an amazing job on toddler Lou?\

like holy hell

[fluid dome]

https://tenor.com/view/classic-blunders-gif-24186536

[thick ledge]

lou is not born yet for most of death stranding 1, so shes like 8 months old by the start of the second game?

i mean shes awake and aware

[fickle bluff]

Can you shake za baby in DS2 like an oversized soda bottle?

[thick ledge]

but in a pod and not born

so

you can in one

[indigo wadi]

I think lou's older. 8 months old isn't walking yet

[thick ledge]

if you rock her too fast

[indigo wadi]

walking i smore 1-2 years i think

[thick ledge]

she gets stressed out

and is less reactive to bts

[steep surge]

well tell us when you find out

lmao

[indigo wadi]

oh my son will go from crawl to RUN

like me LOL

[thick ledge]

does lou walk in death stranding 2?

[indigo wadi]

Yes

[thick ledge]

pretty sure shes crawling but could be wrong

[steep surge]

haha, better buy one of those toddler leashes then

[fluid dome]

@minor nymph idk if u have or not but if you haven't I wanna recommend Space balls and The Princess Bride, both are fantastic comedies.

[indigo wadi]

She has a wlaking toy in the first scene at Norman's base

[opaque raven]

Ok, I'm voluntarily asking for spoilers here (and ofc pls put the || )
Why does the guy need to carry a baby on a jar all the time on DS1?

[thick ledge]

could also be some supernatural shit at play seeing as how she was developing memories while not being born

[indigo wadi]

I've joked with my other half about that

[tribal canyon]

||they let you see the ghosts that attack you||

[indigo wadi]

BB helps detect invisible monters

[steep surge]

that can happen with children in rl too tho
not like...recall-able memories but it does happen

[tight bramble]

For flavor lol jkjkjkjkjk

[thick ledge]

so the pod baby is an unborn child from a brain dead mom

its connected to the beach, or the afterlife

[opaque raven]

Any babies or that specific one?

[thick ledge]

BTs or Beach Things, are people who have died but are still connected

[opaque raven]

Oooohhh, very specific baby

[thick ledge]

if a BT touches a live human a nuke goes off

or eats them or smth

[tribal canyon]

BT's are antimatter

[thick ledge]

so plugging into a BB or beach baby lets you see an outline of BTs

[indigo wadi]

and the capsule keeps BB alive

[thick ledge]

ye

[steep surge]

they are like radars?

[indigo wadi]

kinda

[thick ledge]

no they hook to a scanner that pings nearby

[indigo wadi]

oh ya

that

[thick ledge]

your like, sharing thier perception with equipment

[indigo wadi]

im rusty on DS1 story

[thick ledge]

it reportedly makes you feel very nasty to be hooked up to one

sick and lathergic

[summer night]

you know i see twitter and i see all the negative stuff and somehow @lime canopy always makes me smile thank you Zultralord

[opaque raven]

Oh so that's the radar thing that moves around like crazy, ok cool

[thick ledge]

this doesnt appear to effect sam (reedus' character) tho

yeah the flashy thing will point at the nearest BT and flash faster the closer it is

[opaque raven]

And I'm assuming the BT are the basic bosses of the game

[steep surge]

like the one from alien isolation

[thick ledge]

BTs are an enemy type

if you get touched by one it summons a bigger BT you have to either fight or run from

its quite difficult to fight BTs without alot of prep

its far smarter to try to stealth around them

they cant see, only hear

[opaque raven]

I think the game makes sense now for me
So it's a very dangerous world to walk around, people live in places that are somewhat safe but hardly connected to each other
Mailman with baby can connect people with messages, items, etc

Am I close?

[thick ledge]

ye

[opaque raven]

Feels like Metro (I'm reading the book, not sure about the game)

[thick ledge]

if a BT gets into contact with a living person and successfully consumes them, it makes an explosion the size of a small city

instantly

[steep surge]

ohhh I love the metro books!

so good

[thick ledge]

thats called a Voidout

anyone who dies, will turn into a BT if not cremated within a day or so

[opaque raven]

I'm in the middle of the first one, loving it!!
Also got Roadside Picnic to start after Metro

[steep surge]

so it's like their souls or something that creates the BTs?

[thick ledge]

theres more nuance to the whys and hows but

yeah its thier soul

theres like, alot of lore about the mechanisms behind it but spoilers

[steep surge]

oh yeah! I read that when I was a teenager and some scenes still haunt my memories
so good that book

[thick ledge]

its very good and people should play it

its got action moments and very contemplative moments

alot of planning on how to deal with terrain and enemies

[opaque raven]

Hmmmm so...can you just nuke a city or village if you throw a dead person in there? Like weaponize a corpse

[thick ledge]

this is a thing thats happened in lore

[steep surge]

There's two types of people...

[thick ledge]

theres a massive chain of craters between like, louisiana and canada

you can thank that for it

[dire burrow]

Death Stranding 1

[opaque raven]

Arthas would be proud of those weaponized corpses 🔥

So I'm assuming people don't use weapons anymore, since it's absurdly dangerous to kill someone

[indigo wadi]

there are weapons

[opaque raven]

Or just use a LOT of flamethrowers

[thick ledge]

yes

[indigo wadi]

tasers and such

[thick ledge]

weapons are almost exclusively non lethal

killing someone would be tantamount to suicide

i have a bola gun

the death stranding is still within living memory tho so real guns are floating around out there

[opaque raven]

Spoiler question
Is it due to aliens, experiments or diff dimension?

[thick ledge]

-shrug-

i aint got those answers

im not done the game :P)

[opaque raven]

So you already start with the world in this state? Ok ok

[indigo wadi]

Yeah

[thick ledge]

was busy reading chat and fell of a cliff and died

[indigo wadi]

if you wanna watch a playthrough, jackscepticeye does one. "Norman Reedus and his amazing Fetus"

[opaque raven]

Is it only with human deaths or animal death could also cause the explosion?

[thick ledge]

uh BTs are interested in animals

but cannot cause a void out with them

theres also timerain which usually precedes BTs

its regular rain that rapidly ages anything it touches

[opaque raven]

Like Twitter

[steep surge]

that would be funny
imagine stepping on a BT cricket and an explosion goes off

[opaque raven]

Imagine bacteria

[thick ledge]

humans typically cant touch a BT

but a BT can touch them

[steep surge]

constant explosions, everywhere

[thick ledge]

theres not alot of defense for the average person against a BT other than, dont get caught by one

[opaque raven]

Is there anything that makes the cities safe? Like since it can't rain on certain spots let's make a city here of sorts

[thick ledge]

they get rid of any of thier dead bodies

BTs dont tend to like, wander

afaik

[indigo wadi]

Cities don't seem to be affected by BTs

they're mainly out in the wilderness

[dire burrow]

they don't wander, but they can kinda appear anywhere

in lore, atleast

[opaque raven]

Why "Beach" tho, are they coming from the ocean?

[thick ledge]

the beach is like

the edge of life and death

[dire burrow]

the beach is purgatory, kinda

[thick ledge]

its metaphorical and also a physical place

[tribal canyon]

the Beach is the boarder between Life and Death

[dire burrow]

and its usually unique to a single person/region

[opaque raven]

Ooohhh

[tribal canyon]

this is Kojima, sometimes you have to accept you wont understand it

[indigo wadi]

Ya

[thick ledge]

its possible to understand it, its just gonna be, hard to grasp

[indigo wadi]

Kojima has...ideas

[thick ledge]

thats intentional

if its mysterious to the characters, its supposed to elude you somewhat too

its part of what keeps you engaged with kojimas writing imo

[proud coral]

have a wiwiwi

[opaque raven]

I honestly like when we don't really know everything, it's perfectly fine especially when you are following the story of a character (not omniscient at all)

[indigo wadi]

There's definitely an exploration to Deaths Stranding

it's quite the experience

[thick ledge]

its so good

wholly unique as a video game

imo

[dire burrow]

Its good in a way

You can't describe

Its undescribable goodness.

[tight bramble]

https://youtu.be/SWkMYO9V_-k?si=uEikSZKf8OyBvBLv

[thick ledge]

are these real kojima

[indigo wadi]

it's also got an interesting connectivity with other players

[thick ledge]

i feel like i can buy these

kojima is this a product placement

[opaque raven]

Is it the type that it's best played with full focus? Not sharing attention, just you and the game

[thick ledge]

yeah

if you can

[indigo wadi]

yeah

[dire burrow]

oh zaf

[thick ledge]

you can get REALLY sunk into moments and be really immersed

[dire burrow]

you might love/hate this

[indigo wadi]

Even then

[dire burrow]

You can play music in DS2

WHILE PLAYING

[thick ledge]

peak

[dire burrow]

Not just in your room or menu

[indigo wadi]

Oh

just be aware

it's called walking simulator for a reason

SO

MUCH

WALK

[dire burrow]

Yeah

But

[indigo wadi]

in a good way

[dire burrow]

The walking is mixed with stealth/action/puzzles/cinematic

[thick ledge]

the walking itself is a puzzle

you have to look ahead and prep the best way to approach it

without loading yourself down with too much equipment

[opaque raven]

Someone told me to play a very short game like this, full attention, enjoying the unique experience. I don't remember the name, 1 second

Outer Wilds

[thick ledge]

death stranding is not short

lol

[opaque raven]

I mean, on full focus mode

Bcs I'm usually listening to a presentation or corpo meetings or studying so I share my attention a lot

[thick ledge]

itll suck in your attention really well

[opaque raven]

And someone told me to play Outer Wilds on full focus for the best experience

[thick ledge]

theres moments where you crest a hill and a track starts and its peak

[opaque raven]

And now Death Stranding also deserves attention

[thick ledge]

Its on discount rn on steam

👀

[opaque raven]

Hmmm I already have a huge backlog, like 6 games iirc, can't add more

• Shadows of War/Mordor
• Witcher 3 (read the books but never played the games)
• FF 16
• Tales of Graces
• Metaphor

[hasty grail]

Witcher 3

or FF16

[indigo wadi]

Can't add more?

[opaque raven]

It's already a lot, overwhelming

[indigo wadi]

ah

[opaque raven]

Things that I got as a gift or brought but I never played. Feels weird to have them sitting there

[pseudo grove]

stopped buying on steam, only buying on GOG

[thick ledge]

ok

[steep surge]

I dunno if I trust that anymore

[pseudo grove]

At least we can get the installer files

[tight bramble]

Radio running through the backlog as we speak lol

[thick ledge]

https://tenor.com/view/kid-baby-child-girl-tired-gif-4871328261097149781

[steep surge]

that feels like a site one of those channel reward heartbound keys would end up on

[indigo wadi]

Me patiently waiting for Bloor Bowl 2 and Heroes of Conquest to go on sale on Xbox

[steep surge]

ahhh what is that gif

[thick ledge]

GoG is fine

it does old games that need special work to run again

[tight bramble]

Ghost in the Shell. Great cyberpunk movie

[indigo wadi]

doesn't work for all games sadly

[thick ledge]

"having the installer files" is not a reason i would want to use it though

[indigo wadi]

Chaos Overloads is a VERY old game that GoG hasn't been able to get working

okay this might be why

[steep surge]

how do they have steam games that are cheaper there than on steam tho?
Isnt that against steam policy?
Or is that only for the devs of the game

[thick ledge]

dunno

[indigo wadi]

base game price is probably the same, sale prices are probably different

[steep surge]

hmmm

[opaque raven]

6 good games to play waiting for me
Meanwhile here I am playing League...

[indigo wadi]

this game is great though

[fluid dome]

Arguably the best summary of ff7 rebirth I've ever seen

[indigo wadi]

LOL

[opaque raven]

I'm also getting Patrick's Parabox by recommendation

[tight bramble]

Just like gwent and the witcher 3

[opaque raven]

I really really wanted to get into the FF7 new story but...the ghosts...nah, I'm out

[fluid dome]

There's a review I watched of Rebirth that basically covers everything better than I could

[hazy storm]

Triple triad is the best FF card game and i will fight for that opinion

[opaque raven]

Come to FF14 and start your TT journey

[thick ledge]

you guys ready for my hot take

i hate card games

[opaque raven]

It's ok to be wrong

[steep surge]

digital ones or physical ones too?

[indigo wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/eric-andre-controversial-yet-so-brave-controversial-brave-gif-12046682

[fluid dome]

https://youtu.be/HH0LqSu1LB8?si=o5xTEQVQqCwEDEmc

Found it.

[thick ledge]

i hate digital ones, im just disinterested in physical ones

[steep surge]

I agree with that

[thick ledge]

digital card games are almost always a mechanical cop out

instead of dreaming up something unique its CARDS

[opaque raven]

I would gladly buy all the FF7 remake games if it helps bringing Dirge of Cerberus back

[steep surge]

the fun thing about cards is them being physical for me
I wanna handle them, you know

[fluid dome]

Balatro and Slay the Spire:

[thick ledge]

balatro has a reason to be cards

its poker

slay the spire gets a pass for being the first one

all 5 million other card games? perish

[tight bramble]

Wasn't one of the kingdom hearts games a card game of some sort? I remember that correctly?

[thick ledge]

yes its the worst one

[fallow token]

Every game is really some form of card game though

[opaque raven]

This is a very old jrpg with a card system that I love with a passion. I highly recommend to take a look

[steep surge]

how is CoD for example a card game

[fallow token]

You can buy baten kaitos 1+2 on steam btw

[opaque raven]

Yup

[tribal canyon]

yeas but that takes 2 weeks

[tight bramble]

-hits blunt-
Duuuude......like, imagine poker....but like, with POKER, ya know?

[steep surge]

poker squared

[indigo wadi]

jfc, just saw that there's a live action movie of how to train your dragon.

Can we stop with the live action remakes already?

[tight bramble]

Poker²

[indigo wadi]

No. Not every game is a form of a card game.

RDR2 is definitely not a form of a card game

[fallow token]

So, let's look at CoD. It's like a card game where you technically have infinite lives in most cases, but you win by destroying as many of your opponent's as you can. Sometimes the rng generates you teammates or cards that are more or less a detriment, but if you're smart enough and fast enough you can still turn it into a win. It's all about strategy on what gun card you pick, what angle card you use... It's a real time card game.

[steep surge]

thank you

[opaque raven]

Every card is a form of game

[thick ledge]

of gdi

[indigo wadi]

Um, no. This makes absolutely no sense.

[thick ledge]

something surprised me in DS

lmao

[steep surge]

it would make sense if you said variable instead of card but like that it doesn't make a whole lot of sense

[opaque raven]

Define "card" first

Thn define "game"

[tight bramble]

Game is a card of form

[steep surge]

I mean, everything is just probability and variables
and not only games either

[fallow token]

A card is just a representation of a tool you have at your disposal

[worthy ivy]

I suppose you can break down the strategic and mechanical logic into tokens you could call cards? but you can tokenize almost anything

therefore, not just games, but /all things/ are card games

[fallow token]

Merely a UI choice

[opaque raven]

Could be something like...
"A contained space with visual information"

[indigo wadi]

then everything is just a token game

[worthy ivy]

something something traversing graphs something something universal computation 🙂

this I believe, the universe can be represented as a tokenized hypergraph of sufficient resolution

[indigo wadi]

certainly card games could share mechanics found in video games, but that doesn't make video games = card games

[opaque raven]

I mean, if you go really REALLY deep into statistics you reach a point where there is no probability (and if you add physics you reach no possibilities even)

[steep surge]

how so? Aren't statistics just probability?

[nova bough]

the card games/board games based on video games usually change mechanics to suit a physical medium better. slay the spire is an excellent example

[thick ledge]

theres a terraria board game and its a shining example of all the things wrong with people who are obsessed with physical adaptations of videogames

[indigo wadi]

I'd say that's more an almalgimation

[opaque raven]

Probability falls into the lack of information, the more you know the more accurate you get. Econometrics (my og field) studies those gaps and add information to it. Assume that you add all the information in existence you end up having statistics but not probability since it becomes deterministic

[worthy ivy]

"Everything adds up to nothing, that's the point"

[opaque raven]

If you wanna take a deeper look at this concept I would strongly recommend taking a look at Laplace's Demon

[nova bough]

slay the spire is actually a good board game. i have it

[opaque raven]

And a good shelve it seems

[steep surge]

ah I understand what you mean
so if all "cases" are discovered there's technically only statistics?

[nova bough]

its got a lot of stuff in it

[opaque raven]

Ye, that's the demon, a highly omniscient figure that knows all the variables. The end game is that everything is settled forever, there is not probability on the universe but only this demon knows it

A "demon" in the academic field is a creature of high knowledge btw, nothing to to with religion or hell or anything, not evil, just peak omniscience

[steep surge]

ah so like a "determined fate" kinda thing

[opaque raven]

There are 3 known demons for academics

• Laplace's Demon (no probabilities)
• Maxwell's Demon (perfect entropy)
• Descartes' Demon (shadow plane)

And btw on the dnd campaign I'm DMing my groups is fighting the 3 demons to free the universe from its deterministic nature

[worthy ivy]

depends on how sensitive to initial conditions the present state of the universe is

if it's sensitive to intial conditions, then likely "randomness" is actually just a case of not knowing the initial conditions in enough detail

but if it's not, then there's a chance that some "randomness" is actually random (like in an emergent way because of the rules themselves)

disclaimer, not a physics-surgeon

[steep surge]

uhh I like that
rebel against the determined state of the universe!

[steep surge]

I hate how much sense that makes
the thought of a pre-determined fate in like "no matter what you do, you'll end up there" is making me feel unwell

[worthy ivy]

well we don't know - could go either way, no need to panic 🙂
HHGTG rules... DON'T PANIC!

[nova bough]

yeah that ties into the theory of "we dont actually have free will" ...which is wild

[steep surge]

[nova bough]

and makes sense at the same time

[worthy ivy]

we may or may not have free will, best just not think about it

[steep surge]

me no likeyyy

[nova bough]

i just prefer not to think about it, lest i hit an existential crisis

[opaque raven]

Yup, they are themselves but got isekaied to another world identical to ours but since they are from the outside they are the exact randomness that got added to this universe, they are free, volatile and the "demons of determination" don't like it. That's my story

[nova bough]

https://tenor.com/view/just-keep-swimming-nemo-dory-just-continue-swimming-just-keep-going-gif-12134638072472740446

[worthy ivy]

ngl The Demons of Determination were one of my favourite break-out Jazz/Ska outfits of the 90s

[steep surge]

yea lets argue about stoopid stuff on twitter again to distract from the existential dread haha ...

[nova bough]

lol thats a first

someone asking for the drama

[worthy ivy]

Laplace's guy on the bass, Maxwell's on the drums and Descartes Demon on the ivorys

top trio

[steep surge]

uhh I like it! Stick it to those demon gods or whatever haha

[steep surge]

Anything to escape having to think about the pre-determined fate of our existence
like...the universe already knows how I'll die and I don't like that thought

[worthy ivy]

and that tour they did with The Horsemen...

[opaque raven]

One of my players actually very recently sided with the demons since he saw the future and thought it to be good, instead of adding randomness and freedom and the possibility of ending on a bad future

[lunar moth]

Existentialism is fun though... I like it as a philosophical field of discussion!

Albeit I wasn't particularly happy about the choice litterature when I was studying it

[nova bough]

hades 2 touches on it too. but the game will eventually let you do something. (its EA, so ...all the story isn't out yet )

[lunar moth]

I had just lost my mum and the first book of the first chapter talked about their dead mum... hit a bit too close so I didn't finish that course, but I still like existentalist philsophy!

[nova bough]

i cant wait for hades 2 to get to v1.0. im a nerd for greek mythology

[steep surge]

brb
a huge bug just came into my apartment

[nova bough]

https://tenor.com/view/stranger-things-fire-flame-gif-14920648

[hazy storm]

Don't kill it

[lunar moth]

I never played Hades but I honestly should, but at that point I think I'd honestly rather just read up on Hellenic stories and culture

[nova bough]

hades 1 is finished and freaking amazing too

[steep surge]

uh oh
it can fly and now its gone

[lunar moth]

Yes, but I has a capstone project to finish... I can't be getting more games ^^'

[hazy storm]

It will come back

With friends

[nova bough]

oh yeah. finish school

then vidya games

[lunar moth]

I want to get into a Master's program this fall for History of Ideas

[nova bough]

neat

[lunar moth]

(I'm well aware that my degree wouldn't be a "useful" degree, but I love philosophy, history, and sociology - so... me still want to do a master's!)

[nova bough]

ptsd from fleas

[hazy storm]

Ptsd from bed bugs

[nova bough]

yeah bed bugs beat fleas. but i havent personally dealt with bed bugs. i have fleas.

[worthy ivy]

would love to have /a/ bug

we got a wasps nest by the front door and bees nesting in the asbestos-laced workshop - plus I'm sure there's a wild honeybee hive at the bottom of the garden

I go outside it's like being surrounded by a million tiny buzzsaws

zzzzzzzzzzz.... bzzzz-t-zzziiiiiiip....zzzzzzz....bzzzz,z,zzbzzzzzzz

[nova bough]

the fleas are all dead now. and my cats are perma on flea prevention

[steep surge]

I mean, being a philosopher survived so far in human history

[worthy ivy]

do like the noise the bees make when they're happy tho

[hazy storm]

Wasps hunt bees right?

[wet storm]

You could do a kickass bug thunderdome

[steep surge]

ahhh nooo

[worthy ivy]

yeah, the wasps only moved in a week ago so I'm expecting war at some point

[steep surge]

that actually would be entertaining to watch from veeery far away

[worthy ivy]

it's no worries, the wasps'll move on (these ones don't reuse the nest) and the bees are welcome to stay

[lunar moth]

I know, and I think it is good knowledge, and I like Academia and research, and I'm combining it with Media literacy studies, so it is a field that is immensely useful; but just not in getting a job... ^^'

[worthy ivy]

I like bees

[nova bough]

bees are bros

[lunar moth]

https://tenor.com/view/dancing-bee-bee-dancing-vibing-gif-24578716

[opaque raven]

There is a concept that I like to think about that even if things are settled, it doesn't really matter for the food I'm eating or the joys I'm having.
I am an experience

[steep surge]

yeaaa that's always the problem
I hope at some point you can find a job that is in that area that also pays the bills!

[steep surge]

oh, I like that one actually

[tight bramble]

Ptsd from ants

[worthy ivy]

last house I lived in there was a bush full of these tiny little flowers the bees loved and a bench right up against it - could chill out with a smoke and a brew, surrounded by a hundred happy bees all "ziiiiiiiip"ing away in the flowers

[steep surge]

I guess, even if everything is pre-determined you can still enjoy it

[lunar moth]

Honestly I still just want to find an IT-support help desk job

Because the funny thing is that I still want to work with IT

[worthy ivy]

we are the universe experiencing itself

[steep surge]

Recently we get a lot of bees that just sit on the ground
I always gently grab them and put them on a nearby flower

[worthy ivy]

was that Wheeler? can't remember

[steep surge]

but it's been scary how many there are recently

[hazy storm]

Mind bender: what if things only become pre determined when you actively wonder if its pre determined? Like fate is a quantum state that only locks in once you question it

[steep surge]

heh like Schrödinger's cat
Schrödinger's pre-determined outcome

[worthy ivy]

they use EM to navigate IIRC, so as we put up more phone masts and high speed wireless connections and microwaves transmitters it effs them up

[opaque raven]

That's how I see things at least, even after studying a lot of econometrics and statistics and the physiological sides of it, I don't feel locked in a prison like some academics fall into (which is very VERY common in this area)

[steep surge]

oh, what interest you in IT then?

[worthy ivy]

pretty sure that's why we don't see ghosts these days - radio killed them

[hazy storm]

Schrodingers Destiny

[steep surge]

oh thats a good name

[worthy ivy]

there's a movie in there somewhere

[fluid dome]

Baba booey

[opaque raven]

On an universal scale
You are very new
and
You are very very old
Enjoy the ride 💙

[hazy storm]

Its called Groundhog Day

[worthy ivy]

goooooood movie

[steep surge]

oh, I wonder why lmao
I suppose it really depends on how you see your own outcome
If you're optimistic or pessimistic of your own fate

[worthy ivy]

brb - have to do a Bill Murray round now - drink or smoke whenever he comes up in conversation or on the tellybox

[steep surge]

tellybox

[hazy storm]

Boob tube

[lunar moth]

Honestly, I want to learn how people use technology and more the people-tech relations side of things.
The long and short of it is that I have repeatedly been recommended by people to look into the sociological side of IT and multiple people have said to look into hacking.

Which is a weird thing since I don't really know much programming, yet folks keep recommending it so... why not look at the entry level stuff?
Not a particularly strong "I want to do X because I want Y and then I will take over the world via Z!" but, eh, it is something to look towards and try.

[steep surge]

I like that! There's a lot of ethical questions regarding IT and it's use
especially with AI now in the picture

[hazy storm]

Note that IT isn't necessarily the same as programming

IT in a business concept has to do with infrastructure and operational systems

Pardon me if you know this already

[lunar moth]

Yeah, what I have learned is that there's some interesting philosophical questions regarding AI and I really quite liked reading Nick Boström's Superintelligence on the topic, as well as an interview with him and people discussing what we actually know about LLM systems and the like

[steep surge]

that is true
There's hardware things too and taking care of server infrastructure
(although I dunno how much programming there is for like...SysAdmins)

[lunar moth]

No worries!
I learned something interesting about programming over a decade ago; it is the same principle as learning a language, because fundamentally that's all there is to it - mathematics is nice but it is more so about understanding the lingustic code-based structure of how things connect and how they change up the "language" to what it aims to do

My description of that is pretty poor but you get what I mean

[steep surge]

I mean, yeah, that's a huge discussion

[steep surge]

but it also boils down to
"Why code not work sadge"
or "why code work?? confusion"

[opaque raven]

Oh no no please don't discourage yourself from studying what you want due to job market.
It's ofc important to think about a career but remember that jobs can be temporary, the market changes a lot on time and geography, you can always start a career any time of your life. Taking your time to learn what you love might delay your career ~2 years but that's the thing you are planning to do for the next 30, the time """"lost"""" becomes meaningless on the long run.

Also, the way I see, Job and Career are two different things. You get jobs to pay your bills, help your family, invest in your hobbies, Job is mostly about working for money. A career is your passion, your experience, what you love, this you should always invest into looking for. Many times they can even end up being the same when you find a job that fits your career, but they don't need to be the same.

[steep surge]

I suppose that's also similiar with "actual" languages
sometimes you break every rule of grammar and writing but it still works

[lunar moth]

I liked Thor's description of it!
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/G7L6mQxlfVU

[opaque raven]

Oh, huge text, sorry 🙊

[steep surge]

now
would you say there's a point when you get into the "time lost" territory?
Because if you study things you like for 2 years, and then for another 2 years, and then another... those 30 years shrink down

[hazy storm]

Just to add to this jobs are like skills in a tech tree. Just because you go down one career path doesn't lock you in to that career path forever. There's always an opportunity to respec and reskill.

That actually makes you n MORE desirable as a candidate because you bring so much more to the table

I used to be in Customer Success but i respecced to marketing and that gave me an advantage working for software companies because i understood customers and programmers a lot better

[steep surge]

what's Customer Success?

[hazy storm]

A different kind of customer support that's more on long term relationships with a specific customer

[lunar moth]

Here's the thing in my case; I'm 30 years old, gonna turn 31 this year - I'm massively "behind" in life, but it is due to loads of stuff happening that was outside of my control.
I have Aspergers, Dyslexia, the symptoms of ADHD (not the diagnosis, so I'm mentioning the symptoms just to give an idea of some issues I have with finishing my stuff).
Then I have a neurological condition that meant I couldn't walk for like ... 1.5-2.5 years, then came Covid interrupting my rehabilitation, then my current program stopped existing, and a bunch of other stuff.

So... I have learned to go with the punches. Because honestly... screw life. Living life is better.
(Oh and most of this stuff happened before I had even turned 25 so... it has been a few years! xD)

((Also no feeling sad for me, I'm quite happy - just mostly stressed because it is difficult to get myself to finish the capstone project.))

[steep surge]

yeaaah it is an art form lmao

[lunar moth]

So... eh, live life and be happy - stuff happens, and get one's degree if one want one when one can get it!

^^

[split tulip]

I've heard of software companies that have hired English or journalism majors and just taught them programming in house. You already have most of the skills required, like being able analyze large amounts of text

[steep surge]

ahh like client stuff

[opaque raven]

Oh for sure, there is a thing called "perpetual students" that is a sort of trap that you can fall sometimes. You are building skills and building and building and...building...but not really using them. There is a balance you need to find but the way I see studying and preparing yourself doesn't stop you from working and applying. You can do both

Another opposite trap is the one where you work YEARS somewhere and stopped learning a long time ago. Stopped developing, they are both dangerous imo

[steep surge]

ahhh I'm in a similiar boat actually

[nova bough]

there is some. server maint gets tedious, so it gets automated.

[lunar moth]

God, I'd absolutely love that!

I have a minor portion of my current degree in Journalism and hilariously, the most fun I had in it was archival work as well as creating a database to extrapolate interesting news stories from the information we could gather!

[nova bough]

and other tasks, like reporting and whatever else can be thought up.

[lunar moth]

Yay for same-boat-buddies! xD

^^

[steep surge]

Personally I haven't made peace with that yet

[lunar moth]

Oh, sorry

Hope I didn't say something wrong there

[steep surge]

I'm still in the "whoever pre-determined my fate will catch these hands!" phase

[opaque raven]

Well...I very recently hired a woman who worked with jewelry most of her life due to her absurd aggression with correct details and precision.
Her job now: training to be head of QA, and she is loving it

[steep surge]

nah it's alright! I guess it's nice to know that other people experience similar things or are in a similar spot as me

[hazy storm]

And keep in mind immigrants have to go through this shift all the time

My uncle was a bank vp back home and had to become a bank teller when he moved to Canada

[opaque raven]

I don't wanna give a half thought opinion so let me think about this first

(Also, ofc, disclaimer, it's not about life advises, I'm just giving my very honest opinion and thoughts based on the very short conversation we are all having)

[lunar moth]

Eh, fate is something I don't think exists - we make our own fates, because it is something that we just made up; we exist, and we find our enjoyment in our existence!

I put it to myself like this; either I will be stuck in a wheelchair and unable to do anything for the rest of my life, no work, no degree, barely the energy to think, etc., or I'm not - and then I pursue that.
Just needed to get some help from a doctor willing to do some casual brain surgery and I'm better, not fixed, can't be fully fixed, I still have some interesting muscle spasms, and I have also had Covid that lasted for about 2-3 weeks, so I'll just have to see later on in life if that affects me.

But I'm here, I'm talking with ya'll, and ya'll are wonderful people.

Also if you want to ever poke me about this stuff feel free to do so, no idea if I can do anything, but if I have a similar experience or a similar spot - I'm always open to talking if ya' wanna'!

[lunar moth]

Fire away! Also no problem, take yer' time!

[thick ledge]

A

[steep surge]

"casual brain surgery" lmao oh man....
I feel ya though
I guess, personally, I'm just sick of sitting around and not being able to do something, you know?
I finally wanna go out and *do * something like an actual career

And then there's the tangible fears of like...retirement

[charred wolf]

I hope the best for ya, man

[minor nymph]

Why is AI like this?

[hazy storm]

AI palindrome

[charred wolf]

Not huge on tech but it might have a false positive bias

[steep surge]

lmao
Every time I see something like that I always remember the Youtube AI summarizing that one stream of yours

[minor nymph]

AI apparently cannot do palindromes?

[jolly sky]

Lmao ask it what it thinks of racecar

[steep surge]

"humoursly associated with the vegetable" what? lmao

[charred wolf]

Have you ever asked an LLM to make ascii art?

[steep surge]

oh yes, that famous beet joke "stets"

[charred wolf]

The results are stupid.

[minor nymph]

Oh god, why

It just gets worse each time

[patent flame]

I think you destroyed their AI and made it go quite mad.

[charred wolf]

It might be confusing the sentence itself for a palindrome rather than the individual word

These sentences can be reversed just fine

[steep surge]

this is great

peak humour

[jolly sky]

Dear lord, and people trust this to do their coding and schoolwork for them!?

[minor nymph]

"A rabbit, a big, big rabbit" is absolutely not a palindrome

[lunar moth]

A guildmate of mine can't get a job due to medical issues, so... she started making plushies, and custom made postcards.
Is that a career? Not really, but when I have felt like I needed to really just do something I picked up a new hobby - so I'm sewing and repairing clothes, and I am going to start making stuff as I have a goal to make a Florent flat cap for myself, as well as a custom self-made IKEA shark, and maybe some time in the future a waistcoat or Carlton Coat.

But step one will just to start sewing, and that's how I'm going about it.
Is that a career? Nope, but careers are... as far as I understand it, something people stumble across and then decide to make into careers?

Due to my medical stuff, I haven't been able to do a job until now essentially - done volunteering jobs, but that's how I view it.

It is probably not relevant to ya' but I'm just saying what I have done since I haven't had anything even remotely close to it.

[steep surge]

maybe the AI is so smart, we, mesely peasants, don't understand what it means

[charred wolf]

The ai is probably using the logic of "things that can be arranged backwards and read the same" to a word-sentence level rather than what the word palindrome means, which is on a letter-word level

[jolly sky]

"AI" trying to understand what a Palindrome is;

[lunar moth]

Maybe it is an AI-palindrome? Maybe that'll become a new word added to the dictionaries in the future! ^^'

[minor nymph]

The phrases themselves are also not palindromes so neither match.

Also, a palindrome can be a word OR a phrase.

[charred wolf]

Hold on, let me reread some of these

[minor nymph]

"rabbit rabbit rabbit" is not a palindome.

At all

In any way

[tribal canyon]

the irony of palindrome not in face being a palindrome

[steep surge]

I get that, I'm doing that with my art too but it's difficult for me to feel like I "am" someone doing "only" art
So I'm looking for anything I will be able to do but I dunno
this is a longer topic for me lol

[hazy storm]

AI cannot remember what it just defined so its probably spitting out a random phrase. It can't double check what a palindrome example looks like because it doesn't know what a rhyme is

[minor nymph]

It even knows it's wrong LOL

[steep surge]

Thor doesn't know "rabbit rabbit rabbit" can be read the same backwards and forwards? smh

[jolly sky]

"AI" just, generally summarised

[minor nymph]

I hate this shit like you couldn't believe

[patent flame]

https://tenor.com/view/milhouse-simpsons-explode-gif-13394367268399724417

[steep surge]

atleast that gives us a little hope for the future and job market

[lunar moth]

Eminently understandable - also no worries, me no wanna make ya' feel like ya' need to talk about it; I had all of Covid and some time before that to basically just sit and process this stuff - I didn't do any of the "be at home"-stuff, I mostly just dealt with these things, but it helped me discover philosophy and I love that

[jolly sky]

And there isn't a hat of discipline big enough to smash the "AI" with

[steep surge]

its not smart enough just yet to atleast do palindromes

[charred wolf]

I mean in the sense that it's picking the word individually and shifting them in reverse order instead of flipping them by the letter. This is the only method I can feel that would explain this madness

[main ruin]

You can't explain AI it is stupid

[lunar moth]

Thank you btw, but at this point I'm mostly good, as good as I will ever be I mean! ^^'

[opaque raven]

It's going to be a somewhat long text, let me format it a little bit

[silk scarab]

unrelated note did you know that you can subscribe to this huge ublock origin ai blocklist and have a lot of annoying ai things just disappear from the internet?
https://github.com/laylavish/uBlockOrigin-HUGE-AI-Blocklist
how convenient!

[hazy storm]

AI cannot reason. Its basically building a paragraph where every word is RNG

[outer gust]

just let the ai do all the thinking for you. it gives you more time for subway surfers

[patent flame]

So if I don't pay for Google's AI, then it being wrong isn't a problem : D : <

[charred wolf]

It really is

[jolly sky]

Ublock Origin absolutely chadding it up as always

[opaque raven]

inertia
That's my take
On physics making an object exit the stationary state is extremely expensive energy wise, but keeping a moving object moving is comparatively way less expensive. You've been forced to stop or slow down several times due to several reasons, the slower you got the more expensive and more energy you need to move out of it.

You need to start, and you don't need to start correctly or on a very well planned target, you just need to start. Get momentum, speed, and if you shift your ideas and goals later it's perfectly fine, reasonable, and even less work thn exiting inertia, you can change directions. The important thing is that You are already moving

Choose anything as your starting point, if it's something that motivates you, even better! You get energy out of it, and you need it. Motivation is hard to find but never let it go after you find it! Time becomes relative when you gain speed.

Start moving, stop the inertia

[silk scarab]

common ublock w

[charred wolf]

Then again, it hit me with "stets" for beets so

[steep surge]

I love stets for beets

[charred wolf]

It's bleak

[steep surge]

atleast we can laugh about it

[silk scarab]

me and the lads on our way to beat up john ai

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/987123333659250688/1377363151951101982/Tumblr_l_41830781445968.gif

[steep surge]

I'll join in! Just to create some chaos

[jolly sky]

Further Ublock King behaviour;

[charred wolf]

I don't even wanna know how they work

It feels like Frankenstein's work

[lunar moth]

Thank you! And I know what you mean; my dad puts it in a very succinct fashion:
"Decide to do something... and just do it."

Doesn't really matter what it is, just ... do it.

If one decide to start cycling, go wild and start cycling.
If one decide to make a hat, make a hat.
Same thing with finish my capstone project.

So... yes, thank you - and whilst I know this stuff, it is still really good advice!

[outer gust]

mmm I am full of fried chicken...

[silk scarab]

the world's most informed AI expert wouldn't be able to tell you

we as a species literally do not understand how they work

[steep surge]

oh my god so many mods in one place

[charred wolf]

You mean to tell me

[silk scarab]

we're faced with the terrifying concept of something we know how to make but do not understand once made

[charred wolf]

That we are capable of putting something we cannot understand

Together

[silk scarab]

yes

[lunar moth]

Yep

[charred wolf]

In such intricate fashion?

[silk scarab]

there are full PhDs and research projects trying to understand small parts of how LLMs work

[outer gust]

man knew how to create fire before it understood the chemical reaction

[steep surge]

oh fun! More existential eldritch horror things to think about

[silk scarab]

it's the same as studying the brain

[outer gust]

and fires burn uncontrollably

[patent flame]

So I guess I won't have to worry about AI making games just yet.

[silk scarab]

clever people can figure out how small parts function and their general purpose with lots of research

but the system as a whole?

nowhere close

[lunar moth]

Question: do ya'll feel worried about that?
Because I find myself curiously... excited about that prospect - to be able to use and to study something that we made but still have no idea what made it "click" to function as 'well' (hallucianations or not be damned) as it does

[charred wolf]

How the hell did we even get here?

[outer gust]

Query:

Please produce more cat pictures, catpgt.

[lunar moth]

That's the trick: we don't know

[nova bough]

shhh dont think about it

[charred wolf]

Are they just putting different things together to see what comes of it?

[jolly sky]

Publically accessible "AI" tools should never ever have been made available to the public

[silk scarab]

Yeah. I find it fascinatingly horrifying

[outer gust]

cat is this real

[nova bough]

ok!

[steep surge]

I also hab cat picurs

[outer gust]

[charred wolf]

I think this is a cat

[lunar moth]

Nick Boström has talked about this - he's an AI philosopher and IT researcher - and he's talked about it extensively since 2014, and he's this state of "I'm not worried per say, I'm concerned, but also excited for the potential future." He's also more prone towards an AI-related utopia as opposed to a dystopia, which is if nothing else a nice prospect that a researcher in the field is more excited than worried.

Either way, I'm not going to create more dread - have fun with the cat pictures, I'm going to enjoy my hot chocolate! ^^

[tribal canyon]

300GB of VX's finiest cat pics comming in clutch

[nova bough]

hopefully these cat pics suffice

[steep surge]

He‘s a goober

[opaque raven]

I suppose a number of those who are afraid of AI are mostly worried about their jobs and future

[hazy storm]

Its not an unreasonable fear

[steep surge]

if not because AI becomes "that good/smart", then because companies will still trade good workers with stoopid Ai models

[hazy storm]

I know marketing writers AND customer service people who have been replaced by AI

[lunar moth]

My cat-related contribution (old picture of one of my family's cats)

[steep surge]

yeaaaa its grim

[outer gust]

so cute, absolutely

[steep surge]

awww the headbutts

[nova bough]

they think im going to give them wet food. (their auto feeder goes off in like 10 mins)

[opaque raven]

Some time ago when I was choosing my hyper energetic retriever ☀️

[lunar moth]

Eh, have another one as well!

[steep surge]

I guess the only hope as an artist that I have is the AI has filters
I do not
I WILL DRAW WHAT I WANT
I CAN DRAW WHAT I WANT

[opaque raven]

"Yes sir, that one that is trying to eat his brothers"

[nova bough]

look at them

[wet storm]

AI? AI is dope

[steep surge]

fear me

[lunar moth]

Do it!
Go for it!

[steep surge]

oh I already am haha

[lunar moth]

Awesome! ^^

[opaque raven]

We need more dogs here to balance the cats

[wet storm]

The part nobody understands how the heck it chooses certain responses instead of others

How the heck it can go and hey I can translate ancient Latin

And that's cool as hell to me

[steep surge]

isnt that just probability? and interation?

[wet storm]

It's prediction based on weights

"This is probably the next thing I should say"

Like a souped up autocorrect

[steep surge]

yeaa
For me it gets scary when it starts to understand context that I didn't expect it to

[opaque raven]

"its amazing how chatgpt knows everything about subjects I know nothing about, but is wrong like 40% of the time about things im an expert on.
Not going to think about this any further"

[empty lily]

where is that from

or is it just a joke lol

[steep surge]

doesn't that mean it doesn't know everything but only about 60% of the other things too?
Is that the joke

[jolly sky]

https://tenor.com/view/adventure-time-demon-cat-i-have-approximate-knowledge-of-many-things-wise-wisdom-gif-4593239

[opaque raven]

Greetings Frank, the human boy

[tribal canyon]

mums dog being a very attentive girl

[nova bough]

weird cat

[steep surge]

aww more pets!

[tribal canyon]

Oh she acts like one thou

[opaque raven]

Yup, a funny exercise is asking "are you sure" and you can see how it melts away. The sheer amount of "you are right, I got that part wrong" is surreal, but it only gets that if you confront if first

[steep surge]

yeah like a yes-man lol

[jolly sky]

The incredible danger of it is how willing it is to assume you are right, and it assumes that it is also right

Like, that is incredibly dangerous

[steep surge]

yeah like letting it think 1 + 1 is 3 and so on
to be fair that is quite funny tho

[nova bough]

but its totally going to replace my job. totally.

/s

[opaque raven]

Imagine the sheer amount of patients coming to a doctor's office carrying ChatGPT knowledge

[steep surge]

now, it doesn't need to be smarter or more capable than you
its just about whether your employers think it would be

[nova bough]

then when stuff breaks or AI cant do my job, i get contractor rates

[jolly sky]

Dude there are already people trying to enter workplaces based on ChatGPT "knowledge" and are then being let go because they're talking absolute bollocks lmao

[nova bough]

i have a nest egg. i can wait.

[steep surge]

the modern version of people selling magic potions

[steep surge]

or snake oil and all that

[jolly sky]

And here's a scarier part, there are some kids going through University now to be DOCTORS and are letting ChatGPT and a-likes doing their work for them, and they're not getting caught

[steep surge]

oh, I'm aware

a lot of school kids write their essays like that

[nova bough]

time to go back to paper and scantrons

[jolly sky]

Like imagine being in bed in a hospital, and you somehow know that your Doctor passed their exams because of ChatGPT

That is terrifying

[steep surge]

imagine how many won't be able to apply critical thinking or write stuff or do maths and everything

[knotty marsh]

[nova bough]

im legit somewhere between concerned and terrified for the next gen

there will be 0 critical thinking

[opaque raven]

I can only imagine how it was when Google and the internet itself became more accessible, even mobile
"He googles everything, doesn't read, his work came from Wikipedia"

It's on a different scale ofc, dangerous even, but there are funny similarities

[nova bough]

tiktok rot and chatgpt rot

[knotty marsh]

critical thinking as already something I felt my school system was failling to promote, most school systems are imo, now it will be even worst

[steep surge]

I mean
to be fair
Even now it's scary to know you can either get a good doctor or a bad one and you're in the hands of fate

[nova bough]

schools are just passing kids. even if they cant read.

[opaque raven]

I mean, it has been like this for...a thousand years?

[hazy storm]

They made a study about that already. 3 groups asked to write an essay. 1 using chatgpt 1 using Google 1 by hand

Group 1 was the fastest but when asked to edit their essay group1 did the worst

[nova bough]

its somehow worse

[hazy storm]

Then in the final round group 1 was asked to write by hand and the by hand group was asked to write using chatgpt

The group 3 did much better at using chat gpt than the original group1

[empty lily]

you in school rn?

[nova bough]

at least when i was in primary school, school admins would side with their teachers and fail kids

[nova bough]

no. but i know people who teach.

[knotty marsh]

AI is a tool, it will only be so good depending on the user
anyone one not using it as a tool is a fool

[empty lily]

thisss

[steep surge]

hey
You know how people say "hey, chat" here to adress the crowd
Now think about people using "hey, chat" but not knowing twitch chat or adressing anyone, but using it for chatgpt
Or people thinking "hey, chat" comes from chatgpt

[knotty marsh]

if you are using it and not treating it as a tool you are cooked

[nova bough]

thanks, i hate it

[jolly sky]

I think the argument that "it's a tool" has depreciated quicker than it could be made up.

There is no other tool that exists that will just "do things for you"

You have to learn how to use a tool to make things, "AI" skips that entirely

[opaque raven]

The funniest of funny things is that the kids on my family (ages 4, 7 and 9) are learning how to ride horses with us and plant carrots, which in some eyes is very far away from AI

[empty lily]

same and i haven't heard of kids who cant read passing

in fact most of them can

[steep surge]

are people who use it to code stuff for them not also using it as a "tool"?

[knotty marsh]

sorry I didn't express myself correctly I meant if you use AI it should be used as a tool not as soemthing that does everything for you

[hazy storm]

Theyre not if they aren't learning how to fix what it makes

[nova bough]

i have heard of it. like maybe not completely cant read (ie, illiterate), but they are very behind for their age.

[opaque raven]

On a way yes but ideally a tool doesn't make tools, so they are starting to become something else

[hazy storm]

My daughter is the top performer in her class. I love her to bits but she's not that smart. She just reads for pleasure and likes doing things by hand. Which puts her above her classmates who rely on gpt

[nova bough]

well, at least she loves to read

and thinks for herself

[knotty marsh]

for example it has been used by scientists to do a bunch of manual lavor that would normally take ages, aka reduce the number of stuff you have to check from 1 M to maybe 1000, that you can than check and run tests on

[jolly sky]

Medical and scientific uses? I am all for that honestly.

I just don't think that publically accessible "AI" should ever have been a thing

[opaque raven]

Which field?

[empty lily]

ive used it to write HTML for me to write a backend for and its a lot easier that way

[vital berry]

I bought a machete for $6 : D

[knotty marsh]

there are good and bad uses for what we call AI sadly rn it is mostly the latter

[empty lily]

interesting, why so

[knotty marsh]

biological/medical

[steep surge]

but wouldn't it be worse if AI made mistakes in medical and scientific uses?

[jolly sky]

Because, well, look around you

[vital berry]

R there rules for this channel specifically

I wanna show the machete I bought

[jolly sky]

#rules

[vital berry]

K

[brisk sparrow]

same as elsewhere in the server

[empty lily]

a bunch of people in a discord server all agreeing that LLMs suck?

[opaque raven]

Really? Hm
Do you have the link for it, I would love to take a look

[nova bough]

sometimes people also say AI very broadly. like everything automation is AI. but...not everything is an llm

[kindred holly]

Wasn't machine learning used to find an early stage cancer last year?

[jolly sky]

Because the "AI" used in those fields is hyper, ultra specific and focused, and only trains with information it is given from those fields, and at all times has experts checking the data.

Publically accessible "AI" has none of those things.

[steep surge]

now, off-topic but I gotta ask
why weather stuff?

[vital berry]

Ok so I read it and only if it’s a REPEATED issue then it would be a problem. So if I post the same image like 4 or 5 times is when it’s an issue

[brisk sparrow]

interested in it since i was young

[jolly sky]

Maybe you should also read the rest of the rules

[brisk sparrow]

which tbf isnt that long but still

[empty lily]

why are you putting AI in quotes

[opaque raven]

From what I see and experience on academic fields no one is actually using AI for anything on a high level research
Not bcs no one wants to, I would LOVE to use it all the time, but it's just not good enough yet

[vital berry]

I read the page you sent me @jolly sky

[jolly sky]

Because it is in no way Intelligence. Just Artificial

[vital berry]

Half of it was just don’t advertise and don’t call people weenies

Which I won’t

[opaque raven]

If there is someone openly using it on high end research, aside from marketing campaigns, I would love to see it

[steep surge]

ah, I guess the "experts checking the data" is the important part here because if it puts in misinformation into medical stuff that would seem like a bigger problem

[jolly sky]

It's not the only important part, but it sure is a lot of it

[brisk sparrow]

Same as why humans will never be fully replaced in Meteorology.

[steep surge]

but like why? Just like how it works?

[knotty marsh]

I don't really have one of the top of my head but I am sure you can find it.
there have been a lot of small breakthroughs because a lot of the menial work can now be done with AI, instead of you researching 1M possible iterations you can squim it down to 1000 and save a lot of work that would have resulted in dead ends

[vital berry]

@jolly sky to quote: “spamming tons of junk is uncool.” Tons refers to plural

[knotty marsh]

actually you probably won't be able to find cause a lot of google research is just a bunch of AI slop too

[jolly sky]

Well, put it this way. If you feel like you have to ask to post something, it's probably not wise to post it.

[vital berry]

That doesn’t answer my question tho.

It’s called testing the grounds

[brisk sparrow]

Somewhat, now its more the small intricacies. Like the butterfly effect in full view. or how one system can evolve over short periods or longer.

[opaque raven]

It's just that....this sounds like a wild guess instead of a real thing that is actually happening...

[steep surge]

oh I have a feeling this will be funny

[opaque raven]

With all due respect, I don't buy it

[steep surge]

ohhh, I can see that! That sounds cool

[vital berry]

@opaque raven speaking of buying, I bought a machete 🙂

[brisk sparrow]

also glad you know what meteorology is. Have had a few people ask me unironically if it was the study of meteors.

[vital berry]

It was cheaply made and doesn’t work lol

[jolly sky]

Nah we've had people in this channel who worked with Medical AI testing as their job, it's a real thing

[knotty marsh]

dude I have such a big bone to pick with this, it bothers me so much that the term AI is being used to loosely to describe something that is not actuall inteligent

[brisk sparrow]

which like, so close but so far

[empty lily]

"the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills." (Oxford Languages)
(2a.) "the ability to apply knowledge to manipulate one's environment or to think abstractly as measured by objective criteria (such as tests)" (Merriam-Webster)
is using essentially statistics and predicting the most likely result not applying knowledge (training data, such as the next predicted word or expected action) basically the same thing?

[vital berry]

I found a cool Pokémon card also

[steep surge]

haha bless their hearts
I mean it says in your bio but yea I thankfully know what it means

to be fair
the studying of meteors would also be dope

[jolly sky]

It doesn't do 2a. It also cannot apply knowledge. It just throws words at people through its prediction of what that person wants from it.

[steep surge]

who doesn't like space rock

[brisk sparrow]

astronomy moment

[nova bough]

because LLM isnt a buzzword

its...all marketing

[knotty marsh]

I wish I could llink you some studies using it but I don't have them saved and finfinf them is a pain
AKA: there was one that was used to fully scan a brain to check for something I cant recall rn and if I try and look it up, top stuff is how "AI CAN READ YOUR BRAIN"

[steep surge]

yeaaaah
If there only wasn't so many physics and numbers involved

[knotty marsh]

internet is so cooked

[steep surge]

oh the internet is well-done already

[nova bough]

@grok is this true

[steep surge]

bothering on burnt

[brisk sparrow]

math jumpscare (granted most of this EQ is set by the radar hardware)

[empty lily]

which would be the ability to aquire and apply knowledge (previous data) and skills (eg. actions in a DQN)

[knotty marsh]

oh yeah there have been some uses in astronomy aswell but I am not educated enough on that side of sciences

[steep surge]

https://tenor.com/view/fade-away-oooooooooooo-aga-emoji-crumble-gif-20008708

[steep surge]

Every fiber in my body hates this picture

[jolly sky]

It also cannot apply knowledge. It just recorrects and throw another result at you.

Being able to just recount things and say them to someone does not equal intelligence

[brisk sparrow]

I was looking for a high quality version of that

[steep surge]

noooo don't please I'm begging you

once is enough

[knotty marsh]

sadly yeah
just slap AI onto your product so you can get investements

not like AI actually emans anything

[empty lily]

i havent listened all the way though this one yet but https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7640807/

[nova bough]

like AI has some really, really good uses. but it shouldnt be everywhere

[jolly sky]

It sure as shit shouldn't be in the general publics hands for sure

[knotty marsh]

see some of those described there are good some are not, diagnosing patients is a massive red flag
drug discovery and development is the good use, as those will be tested anyway

basically you can reduce the ammount of drugs you will have to test instead of 1k maybe you only need to test 100

that is massive

[empty lily]

yeah that sounds awesome

im a developer not a medicine guy but that sounds cool

[knotty marsh]

yoh grook my brain is hurting what do I have
Grook: brain cancer

[empty lily]

that being said idk i could see diagnosing patients (with regulation and oversight by a real doctor) could help speed things up especially in countries where healthcare is like backed up could be cool

[knotty marsh]

aight jokes aside they will give you a more nuanced response but still, they can't actual properlly diagnose someone

[spare trellis]

i looked at this and then my brain exploded

[empty lily]

oh yeah i'll die before that ever happens

[hazy storm]

Even human doctors regularly misdiagnose patients

[brisk sparrow]

I cant find my notes for it anymore but we spent like 4 lectures just getting to this point for that equation

[green plank]

you could make an argument that the ai could be kept up to code on medical research, where as some doctors dont do there continued education and go off what they learend in med school (which gets outdated)

[brisk sparrow]

Hardest math class ive taken is easily Differential Equations

so many derivatives

[empty lily]

yeah exactly maybe a second opinion (even a statistically likely one) could be helpful

[frosty spear]

https://youtube.com/shorts/KJ9vOc2ypok?si=-OgT7WJu-Um0YxGk "You make me an enemy because once you start hating you can stop thinking."

[empty lily]

rip im gonna have to take that for EE/CS

[knotty marsh]

exactly, AI would basically be that doctor that you get to is office he looks at you and diagnoses you without actually checking your body

[frosty spear]

Very applicable to the internet

[worthy ivy]

"doctor, why did this patient die?"
"ah... see, we had the 2024 lora loaded, so..."

[nova bough]

yeah. ive heard that too. it was an elective for me...and i elected to take something else

[knotty marsh]

twitter rn

a bunch of SJW

[hazy storm]

There was a case of a lawyer who used AI to build his argument. He was ripped apart by the judge because the argument referenced court rulings that didn't actually exist

[knotty marsh]

they just find a reason to hate someone and refuse to use their head to think

[nova bough]

the dishwasher should not be rhis fascinating

[opaque raven]

Ok peeps, good talk but....it is time...I'm going in🔥

Wish me luck

[knotty marsh]

rip

[empty lily]

im kinda excited though math is interesting to me 😦

[worthy ivy]

they're trying to spot whatever it is that makes the noise inside it when the door is closed and the lights are flashing - reckon they think there's a creature living in there they can hunt or something?

[knotty marsh]

that last part I hate how true it is
I had a doctor that I went to, as someone that as a degree on human biology I could clearly tell his education was not updated, so I didn't go again, come to find out months later he is appointed as the head of the medical university nearby me

[nova bough]

oh yeah, if you like it ya like it. math for me was more... "i have to do this for the other fun classes"

[green plank]

yea and like to be clear, i think doctors generally are great! (im not anti-medicine lol)

[opaque raven]

AI usage is one thing and it's perfectly reasonable but used on base high end research is a whole other thing. I don't doubt one but very much the other, that's all

[nova bough]

not sure. im thinking its mostly just because its closed most of the time and now its open as i empty it

[green plank]

its just that is a flaw in the system

doctors are just guys and girls that study stuff

and can have flaws

[worthy ivy]

getting a good scoping in while they can

check for danger and that

[green plank]

and really good doctors tend to stay up to date on stuff

[nova bough]

there is danger in every closed closet and cupboard, according to them

[opaque raven]

I have something for you!!! 1 second

[steep surge]

Monster under the bed ❌
Monster in the cupboard ✅

[opaque raven]

@vital berry 🐟

[knotty marsh]

it all comes down on how it is used sadly, even in scientific research some times it is not used properlly
AI is a tool and nothing but a tool anyone that uses it as more than a simple tool is basically gambling
A hammer is great for nailing nails but it still needs to be guided, it won't nail a nail by itself if it just falls on it, not properly anyway, same goes for AI

[opaque raven]

Also, stream question, have anyone found a way to "fix" the wings of the copters on Dune? The way they show it weirdly on stream

[steep surge]

I think it‘s tied to the bitrate

[worthy ivy]

think that's 144fps wings on 60fps video capture?

[steep surge]

So changing the bitrate might make it look better but I dunno
I‘m not a stream person, I just iterate what I have heard other people on stream say

[nova bough]

hydration break

[opaque raven]

I honestly also don't know, I saw it with Thor and I thought that maaaaybe it was just on how he streams. Thn today I saw it again with Khronos, and looked for others also streaming, most if not all had a similar issue

[steep surge]

Uh what is that? Coffee?

[nova bough]

root beer float!

[opaque raven]

Also, Khronos' cat is amazing

[steep surge]

Yeah its bitrate stuff

[steep surge]

Bailey is great! So cute

[opaque raven]

Those cables on the floor look so dangerous, I would trip on all of them every single day

[worthy ivy]

I know youtube's video encoding effs with my visualisers - they look sooo much better at my end before I upload and youtube compresses and processes the absolute bejeezus out of it... 😦

[nova bough]

they go under a rug, dont trip on them pretty much ever

[steep surge]

Ohhh that‘s nice!
I wanted to make a cola float the other day with low-calorie ice cream but it didn‘t work very well

[opaque raven]

Like this?

[steep surge]

It melted in 0.1 seconds and then it was just one mass

[opaque raven]

(I just used the remix edit of discord! Reeeeally cool, never knew about it)

[steep surge]

Yeah that‘s what I heard
That the wings look fine ingame but awful on stream and in videos

[crimson coral]

root beer

https://tenor.com/view/getcampedonnerd-gif-26208571

[nova bough]

pretty close

[opaque raven]

That tape tunnel or something looks brilliant btw

[steep surge]

You look tall

[opaque raven]

Cable management my beloved

[nova bough]

the black thing or the stuff against the wall in white

[nova bough]

i think i took that pic at .6x, but im just below 6ft

[steep surge]

Yeee u tall

So many darn tall people in this discord server

[fickle bluff]

Shorty

[opaque raven]

Black thing
Looks like it doesn't even get in the way of cleaning

[nova bough]

out of the things that people call me, that is usually not one of them, especially since im a woman

[steep surge]

nah I'm your target
I'm 5'2

[nova bough]

oh yea it doesnt get in the way. esp on tile.

[fickle bluff]

I am glad to have provided new experience

[fickle bluff]

Naaaah, anyone below 6ft is classified as shortstack.

[steep surge]

you better guard your ankles

you'll make a lot of short enemies

[fickle bluff]

I am set to receive the ankle pain dlc any day now. You'd be doing me a favor.

[idle hill]

Preparing for the future, I see

[opaque raven]

Very quick question about twitch
What's the stance on the world "kill"?
Bcs I've seen some using "unalive" on chat and titles and even when speaking and I'm not sure if it's bcs they are used to instagram/tiktok or if it gets less trouble on the platform

[fickle bluff]

https://tenor.com/view/indeed-tealc-stargate-gif-4496552

[fluid dome]

Misinformation, you're a cat. I shall now proceed to hate you for no reason /j

[nova bough]

i mean true

[fluid dome]

How are you doing today tho?

[nova bough]

me?im fine. just a boring sunday with my 2 kitties. you?

[fluid dome]

Just relaxing at 2am

[fickle bluff]

https://tenor.com/view/silly-seal-tounge-cute-s-gif-11171139685842627140

Mandatory con-seal-cration

Business may be conducted on these grounds

[vital berry]

A SPLENDID GIFT

[round bolt]

Mr president, more drama has hit the timeline

[gloomy forge]

What happened this time?

[round bolt]

Short version is somebody made a post on the PC gaming subreddit talking about having made a criticism of the "always online DRM present in his single player game"

[gloomy forge]

Meh reddit.

[round bolt]

They are claiming they got banned from this game's steam community hub