streamchat

[agile walrus]

Which was...well

https://tenor.com/view/you-have-earned-one-singular-yike-gif-23625776

Besides the Ex. Gal was lovely to talk to. Sorted out a few things and now Stormi lives with me now. ^~^'

Now I gotta navigate the Medicaid system to find a therapist and a primary care doc to get the paperwork I need to keep him in the apartment. ^~^'

A little about Stormi, He is round abouts a year/year and a half old. Is a attention seeking brat, and his personality is starting to surface day by day. ^~^

Things I gotta worry about now is making sure I get him to a vet to have him checked out and neutered. @~@ but I think I might be able to get help there through the humane society in my area.

[indigo wadi]

various reasons

[jolly sky]

It wouldn't surprise me, but last I heard from Thor is it's from the WoW nonsense

I mean its still ongoing really

Ah, well yes it seems that reviews as of today are people simply buttfrustrated about the SKG debacle

Sad people bringing up anything they can rather than the game itself

[indigo wadi]

no reason to. wasted energy

[jolly sky]

Don't bother man, find better things to do it ain't worth it

I'd rather sleep that engage with arguments on that lmao

Infact I'd rather spend that time on the toilet

[indigo wadi]

those ppl alrready have their minds made up

so all the misinformed nonsense

[teal zodiac]

Thanks! I ended up reading everything and took a while to understand it, felt like i was missing something all the time

but nope, its just plain childish

[woeful lantern]

yea no, it's just dumb

it's just dumb

it's very much the kind of thing that some people think "God, it's so simple, just don't turn off the servers!"

"Or give us the ability to run our own!"

neither of which are nearly that simple

[wet storm]

At the risk of getting dogpilled because I did like the SKG initiative.

That's not really what was being proposed
So you're right to say they're both dumb because that's not the goal

The idea is that future, not retroactive games, be left in a state like, say, StarCraft 2

If SC2 dies tomorrow (Blizzard if you're reading this it is NOT a suggestion) you can still play arcade, LAN, the campaign, etc.

CS-GO you can play with bots and in LAN.

It's more about leaving live service games in a state where the game doesn't become unplayable.

Idk what was said about MMOs tho they'd be borked

I guess what I'm trying to say is pull out your ethernet plug or turn off your PCs WiFi; if your game refuses to load when you should have a way to play it offline that's the type of game that would be in violation. I think LoL doesn't work offline while Dota 2 does.

And the obvious bounce back from companies would be "Yeah that sure but not MMOs" or w/e but I guess we'll never know.

If there are minutia of "Actually Ricky article 7 of the proposition subsection 23 on the fine print kills every game ever" I didn't read on that level of detail, but I'm willing to bet like 5 people on the planet did

(when SC2 dies I will miss co-op tho I'm finally starting to enjoy Mengsk P3)

[exotic locust]

he said that while servers might not need an obligation, companies tend to do what makes the most money and that microtransactions, dlcs, stc may still be a viable source of revenue for a game that is in it's end of life phase. Basically saying there's enough of a financial incentive as there would be a huge demand for MMOs.
Source:
https://youtu.be/sEVBiN5SKuA?si=PCAHXVUj2ArwRvDz&t=1866

[wet storm]

Thank you! Glad to hear there's at least something being said. Because that particularly doesn't make anything anything since we can't possibly predict that

I'll have to actually read now so I know what's being said about MMOs in the proposition

[jolly sky]

Developers are not just going to willingly hand over their server source code, (which is tied into how the games work) and forcing them to by law is an absolute brainless idea

[wet storm]

I don't think that's in the proposition either

Ok I'm gonna read that cos I got the curious itch

If there's a mention of server binaries I'm gonna flip

[exotic locust]

handing over source code isn't part of what the proposal is. It's asking for an end of life plan.

[wet storm]

"The game is LAN capable" is from what Interpreted, sufficient

[indigo wadi]

Nope. It was dead in the water from the get-go

[void blaze]

Guy makes an hour+ long video saying SKG is dead

Spends half the video blaming Thor for it

[jolly sky]

Which is impossible for something like an MMO to do, and have it be playable, without giving out their code

[void blaze]

That's kind of pathetic

[indigo wadi]

and yet, thor didn't say anything for 10 months

[void blaze]

If the opinion of one man said months ago is enough to kill a movement I don't think that movement was all that strong to begin with and would have sputtered out on its own

[indigo wadi]

Cannot blame someone who hasn't said anything over an extended period of time.

Clearly the issue lies with how SGK was presented and worded, much like what Thor mentioned.

and it shows because of the fact that people tried to egg Thor on to keep talking about it because that was the only way it was gaining any traction

[jolly sky]

The things that the Initiative wanted would have been impossible for certain games to implement.

If it was just a "make an offline mode for single player games that require a sign in" There would be have very little problems with it

[wet storm]

This is SO FRAGMENTED

No wonder nobody's reading it

[indigo wadi]

Plus you really think the Government wants to do the work of that kind of oversight?

[wet storm]

Oh I know the answer to that one

Yes

At least in Europe

[exotic locust]

the initiative talks about this and says that games that were build previously would be grandfathered in and not require an EOL plan. The idea is that games going forward would be made with knowing they may make an EOL plan at some point.

[indigo wadi]

no, the government does not want to do that kind of work.

[wet storm]

It generates jobs and justifies tax increase

[exotic locust]

Ross himself says it's unreasonable to make this work retroactively

[indigo wadi]

I'm very cynical that this would have that effect.

[jolly sky]

No. The EU is already behind on several very important digital laws, and that would just be another one to add to the pile

[wet storm]

Are you from Europe?

Or lived there?

[jolly sky]

And we're talking behind by like, 5-10+ years

[indigo wadi]

Nope, but I am an observer of Gorvernments and what their willingness to do

and this ain't it

Governments do not care about keeping games from dying.

[jolly sky]

Which would still be impossible to do for certain types of games 'cause that would make them not function whatsoever

[jolly sky]

i.e. games that require connecting to a server that the Devs have for events etc

[wet storm]

Yeah no SKG doesn't elaborate on MMOs

So for all intents and purposes if an MMO reaches end of life the developer is borked

Well, would be borked, this aint passin'

[indigo wadi]

You know what other games are effectively dead?

Atari

Nes

[wet storm]

Those are retroactive

[frosty spear]

you can still play those

[wet storm]

Plus, if you have the cartridge, you can play them

[frosty spear]

you would need a console and the game but you can play them

[indigo wadi]

legally? good luck finding console and cartridges

[jolly sky]

SKG is a poorly worded, poorly implemented, mess of an initiative and relied on several scummy ways to get it pushed through into being made a law

Of course it failed

[indigo wadi]

thats why i said effectively

[jolly sky]

And yet "Thor is the problem"

[wet storm]

The opus of the proposition is exactly "leaving games in a playable state"

Cartridge games are left in a playable state.

The problem here I feel is MMOs

[indigo wadi]

Not if they no longer exist.

[wet storm]

cos the thing elaborates on whether it's single player and multiplayer

[wet storm]

Yes but that's not to do with SKG

[exotic locust]

thats not what skg is trying to do. SKG isn't trying to say you should be able to play any game in history. Games on console still work if you have the console and cartridge

[wet storm]

The game was left in a playable state

[frosty spear]

I mean I'm of the opinion that abandonwere should be entered in the public domain

[indigo wadi]

100%

[wet storm]

Oh for sure

[frosty spear]

But the point is if you find a console and the cartridge you can still play those games

[wet storm]

I was assmad beyond belief when EA relaunched old Ultima games

[exotic locust]

I think the thor dogpiling comments in Ross's video are dumb and really hateful. Ross himself kept the arguements about what was said and not what about thor is or was as a person at all.

[indigo wadi]

we've seen mmos get ressurected before. It's not otu of the realm of possibility but it is difficult to do

[frosty spear]

less so with something like loadout or what that game with the customizeable guns is named

[exotic locust]

i gotta head out. Studying for sec+

later folks

[wet storm]

What puts me in a sour mood is seeing "Ross is dumb" rather than "The proposition is dumb and here's why" then giving a reason that's actually about the proposition and not some made up assumption that is disproven in the FAQ.

[indigo wadi]

didn't ross spend half the video blaming thor for it dying?

[wet storm]

The citizen's initiative itself is very, very vague

[wet storm]

He blamed Thor, but not as a person, rather the content that was published. If he went "yeah thor bad grrr look at that guy he sucks grrr" I'd be very, very dissapointed at Ross

[exotic locust]

oh wow, I am right to leave when I did.

[wet storm]

And contrariwise Thor did the same thing, he attacked SKG, not Ross

[indigo wadi]

excpet Ross blamed the wrong thing

[wet storm]

He does open by talking about general apathy

And I agree 100%

[indigo wadi]

because he doesn't want to take responsibility that he effd up

[wet storm]

Btw I'm not here to bash on Thor

You can like two content creators that disagree with each other

[indigo wadi]

this was his baby and it failed and he can't bring himself to say he's at fault

[indigo wadi]

what

[wet storm]

But Ross did say he was not the right guy for it

And I agree

[indigo wadi]

then he shouldn't have lead it in the first place.

but if you're here to bash on thor, you can sod right off

[jolly sky]

If you're here to bash on Thor, you may want to leave, or stop.

[wet storm]

I meant not bash

oops

Sorry

[frosty spear]

You know I was neutral to the whole but just saw in the Thor news announcement him saying that it would kill live service games and now I might be all for it \possibly joking

[earnest cove]

the main news for me is that the initiative died in the first place. i thought it was going somewhere because of europe

[frosty spear]

I mean even in the eu legislation stuff moves slowly

[earnest cove]

moving slowly doesn't mean it's dead. In this case it seemed to be abandonned?

or rejected?

[frosty spear]

and there are a lot of old people there that couldn't really give two shits about video games

[indigo wadi]

its dead because it didn't meet the required signatures

[wet storm]

From what I understood it dies in July 31st unless they can magically conjure up like 600k signatures

[earnest cove]

Aaah so that's why

[indigo wadi]

it doesn't help that ross's community also attacked thor

[jolly sky]

There are so many laws out of date even upon their implementation. Even GDPR is woefully out of date

[frosty spear]

Also the opportunity cost because working on legislation for the skg would mean they would have to deprioritize some other legislation while they prepare everything for the bureaucratic machine

[jolly sky]

Not quite unfit for purpose but its missing a LOT of things it needs

[earnest cove]

I really thought they met the requirement to push it through european legislation because people were celebrating that it was considered at all

[indigo wadi]

they did not

[brisk sparrow]

Government of any kind cannot move fast enough for the modern era.

That’s just the truth

[indigo wadi]

a lot of em were on hopium

[frosty spear]

Hey it's still better than what a lot of other places have gotten

also helped me get rid of some very aggressive telemarketers

[jolly sky]

True and don't get me wrong, I'm glad it exists in general

[woeful lantern]

Also, for the record, if Starcraft 2's servers shut down

no, you would not be able to play the game

[earnest cove]

Aaah i see i see so i had heard falsified hopium news

[woeful lantern]

it still requires connection to Blizzard's servers

[jolly sky]

Only if Blizzard shut down entirely

[wet storm]

Are you sure? I played it offline without internet

[frosty spear]

I mean from my understanding one of the points of skq would have been to ban unneeded connections to company servers

[wet storm]

There's some excellent arcade maps you can play solo

[woeful lantern]

So have I... when I was previously already connected.

[wet storm]

Oooooooh

I see what you mean

[indigo wadi]

have you installed it then played it offline?

[wet storm]

Hmm dang I did NOT think of that

[wet storm]

i.e.: content distribution

[woeful lantern]

Okay, I sit corrected for at least base game SC2

[wet storm]

Nah nah you raised a good point

I didn't consider content distribution

[woeful lantern]

though Arcade wouldn't work, unless it's pre-downloaded maps.

[wet storm]

Correct yea

[wet storm]

So if it were to be retroactive, which it wasn't, Diablo's 3 and 4 not being on that list is where they'd be in some sort of violation

[woeful lantern]

given D3 and D4 are currently running games

they WOULD be required to comply

[wet storm]

Iwas there, in the trenches, when I bought the disk for Diablo 3 and it required an internet connection

[woeful lantern]

if they weren't currently supported

then it'd be different

[wet storm]

I don't know a country that would pass a law like that

[indigo wadi]

roflmao, true

[wet storm]

Typically the law is passed going forwards, and you can't be trialed for something you did that breached it in the past

[woeful lantern]

You're kidding right? The EU has passed I dunno how many laws that caused required changes to dozens of hardware, work requirements, etc, things in the past.

software is no different

they'd be given leeway probably

[wet storm]

Is there a software law I could take a look at? I'm legit curious

[woeful lantern]

but still required to actually change to comply

it's like how

if a privacy law updates in California

you'll see EULA across the board

update

to take that new law into account

Like, I'm not a lawyer, I don't have the resources to supply you a specific instance of software laws causing active changes

but software isn't any different than anything else that might be governed by law

if a law passes and your stuff violates that law, unless it explicitly grandfathers you in

you are not given a pass

[wet storm]

I THINK, but I could be wrong 'cos I'm also not a lawyer (light the beacons that summon Khronos), but I think privacy laws change ongoing data storage, not data already stored prior to that

[woeful lantern]

they govern everything to DO with that data

[wet storm]

So your practice, not what you already did

[woeful lantern]

including what you're permitted to do with it

[wet storm]

Yes, but after the law is passed, not what you did before

[woeful lantern]

no

look, if a law passed that said "you can no longer sell user data"

good luck, but say the fantasy world where that happened came to be

you couldn't then sell data anyway just because you already had it

at least, not legally

You couldn't be tried for previously selling it

no

but you couldn't then do it again

[indigo wadi]

@slow veldt come look again 😛

[wet storm]

I mean more like GDPR. If you had held data prior to the law being passed, and moving forwards you still used that data without consent forms (I'm assuming like the EULA you mentioned), you'd be in breach. But you wouldn't be, like, liable for past usage of said data before the law was signed.

And this is like, privacy law. Idk how to explain it, but it feels different than an online service

Then again lawmaking is whatever people in charge wanna do

[woeful lantern]

you wouldn't be liable for previous things no, but an ongoing live service is not a previous thing

it's an ongoing thing

[wet storm]

If the law is passed like "This also applies to games released prior to this law that are an ongoing service" than that's that. But it would go against what SKG proposed

Massive backfire it would be

We won't know to see it. It's dead

[woeful lantern]

it was also so vague it didn't not say that

which was, iirc, part of Thor's issues with it

[wet storm]

It does.

[woeful lantern]

was that it was so vague that it risked really dumb interpretations

[indigo wadi]

Moot's point coming up 😂

[woeful lantern]

That actually doesn't say what you think it does

[wet storm]

It still risks dumb interpretations anyways 'cos yeah, lawmakers can go "nah"

[robust galleon]

That was part of the faq not the actual proposal

[woeful lantern]

it doesn't exclude currently active live service games

[indigo wadi]

This just doesn't make any sense

[woeful lantern]

it says "No, this won't kill live service games."

[wet storm]

Is that not in the proposal?

[frigid crown]

I keep seeing the vague part brought up but it's not a law plus with word count limit you can't really go into every single detail

[woeful lantern]

Then narrow your scope

[robust galleon]

Nope, I read the proposal 10 months ago

[woeful lantern]

so you can be more specific

[wet storm]

Honestly I think Ross' effort was commendable, Thor's response merited a more serious debate. Idk why that debate happened. Even offline, but not async, it could've strengthened the proposal rather than just Ross' audience attacking Thor and what I'm seeing here of "Ross dumb what a dumbass dumb proposal" like, that doesn't help anyone

It's a bummer what happened happened the way it happened

[woeful lantern]

and besides that, because you're right and it's not the law that would be signed. Just asking them to MAKE a law. Given it's not actually the law being put forward, being specific about what you want is important.

[indigo wadi]

Read Thor's tweet about it. He answers it there

[wet storm]

Yeah that's what I meant with lawmakers doing whatever they want

(I will say I also happen to be in a rather privileged position where, besides the occasional WoW sprint, I don't have a live service game I play on the regular...but I understand the intent of not liking your favourite game's plug being pulled)

[frigid crown]

Not an EU citizen so I'm not sure if I understand it correctly but it's not the job of proposal writers to cover every single thing because it's meant for people to at least get the discussion rolling. I really just wish they had a discussion early on, I enjoy watching thors videos but the complete shutdown just left a bad taste in my mouth was all

[woeful lantern]

It's not their job to cover EVERY use-case no, but being specific about what you have in mind is still a good thing. And Thor did a complete shutdown because the community based around SKG at least MOSTLY decided to do dumb things trying to get him to talk about it MORE.

And it's not Thor's job to have that discussion anyway

[indigo wadi]

nah it'll go on for the next month easy

[ocean agate]

iirc the same thing can happen with any digital product, from video games, movies, music, anything. amazon can take a movie out of your library if they no longer support it. they dont refund you they just say oh, well we dont want it on our server anymore

[woeful lantern]

doubly so if people aren't discussing in good faith

[wet storm]

ngl I'm tired of drama

Like exhausted

[woeful lantern]

most people are

[indigo wadi]

not thor's fault ppl are unhinged and can't grow up

[frozen sonnet]

Imagine how Thor feels poor dude

[woeful lantern]

at least 2 people during stream told him to do things that violate twitch TOS

and I'll leave it at that

[indigo wadi]

a person cannot kill the momentum of something if they haven't talked about it for 10 months

[woeful lantern]

the claim is he killed it 10 months ago

[indigo wadi]

but when thor talked about it, it got a lot of sigs

so which is it?

[woeful lantern]

shrug I'm not saying they're right

[indigo wadi]

i know, just pointing out the 2 claims and how ridic the entire thing is

i am bemused that ppl claim thor doesn't take accountability but then won't hold Ross accountable for the movement failing

[frigid crown]

I didn't mean to imply I think it's his job to or anything, just that I'd rather have seen an honest discussion rather than just have videos from either side. And as for the hate I dunno man some people just suck but I really don't think ross actively tries to curate that kind of community. I think it was just a hot topic that spiraled really badly.

[wet storm]

I don't think it's Thor's fault for it failing. I might've been hypothetically the cause for it not succeeding so hard if people weren't apathetic.

More active gamers in a parallel universe would've signed it and more voices in the industry would voiced harder on the details.

[robust galleon]

The thing that always confused me about the skg proposal is Ross is also an American. And it's an eu proposal that he can't take part in, also a repeat of one he did in the US that failed too.

[woeful lantern]

also that yea

[late bane]

So what's happening

[wet storm]

There's names on the citizen's initiative that sound like names from Europe. I think someone else there took the torch to have the proposition started there.

[indigo wadi]

Yeah I found that odd too

[wet storm]

I keep saying initiative when I mean petition, sorry

[woeful lantern]

nah, it's an initiative legally

[jolly sky]

I wonder why Thor stopped talking about it when all he did was express was some concern about its proposal, and was met with death threats

oh golly oh gee I wonder

[woeful lantern]

it's... CEI CUI, something like that

Citizen something Initiative

[indigo wadi]

he was being used as signature bait

[woeful lantern]

He was open to a discussion as of the first video iirc

[frigid crown]

Well that's cause it's been dead in the water in America since the start and in his own words this was what he saw as potentially the only chance for something he cared about

[woeful lantern]

in between vid 1 and vid 2 he was used as sig bait despite his reservations and people were scheming up ways to get him to talk about it even negatively

[exotic locust]

He lives in Poland

[woeful lantern]

and so he put out vid 2 and shut up

[jolly sky]

Well that quickly stopped when the unhinged rolled into his various chats, obviously

[woeful lantern]

mm

[robust galleon]

Is that now? He was listed as an American citizen 10 months ago.

[indigo wadi]

dual citizen maybe?

[remote locust]

I think the issue is being caught between two camps here - wanting games to be preserved somewhere, and understanding the practical problems that legislation would cause

[sturdy badger]

Ross has dual citizenship, pretty sure he posted a video about it years ago

[jolly sky]

And also, getting the government involved in game development is one sure fire way for said development to stop

[tight bramble]

Dude this crap again.....like the 2 or 3 most recent vids that Thor uploaded have the comments FLOODED with garbage. I mean, he still gets comments on the WoW stuff. The hater-ade must be extra tasty.

[indigo wadi]

yup and the sky is blue

water feels wet

[remote locust]

I mean that's just not true, because there already IS involvement and there always has been lol

[indigo wadi]

and i am hungry

[indigo wadi]

that level of involvement would cause it to stop

[dry osprey]

Na water makes you feel moist

[jolly sky]

Outside of age regulation laws, no not really

[indigo wadi]

nah that's...nope, not gonna say it 😂

[dry osprey]

almost got you

[remote locust]

Yeah................. I feel like having nuanced conversations is a dying art form

[wet storm]

Ⓜoist

[indigo wadi]

i mean, i do choose what to type 😛

[exotic locust]

admittedly, this is an old video (11 years ago sheesh) but this is what I remember.
Source:
https://youtu.be/2Rtqm8U7CC8?si=g18c0JNL7fFNG37n&t=311

[robust galleon]

Ok

[wet storm]

It is very, very hard rn

[exotic locust]

basically he lived in poland at the time but this could have changed since then

[wet storm]

to do that

Being responded with "That doesn't make any sense" or "Yeah but this is ridiculous" or "Are you serious?" is very vexxing when one's trying to be civil

[indigo wadi]

it's been a lost art form for years now

[dry osprey]

Tbf people still dont stop talking about thor and wow. I knew the moment he wrote that he will join that guild it will end up with stuff like this.

I feel so bad for thor, mods and the rest that works with him. To deal with such people and meaningless toxicity OVER A GAME

[indigo wadi]

i know he's great friends with winky, but all this extra drama just wasn't worth onlyfangs

[remote locust]

data privacy, age guidance, Copyright, cybersecurity requirements, monopoly laws, visas for gaming, first sale doctrine, the list goes on and on and on dude

[dry osprey]

But you know what sells to something else. Drama.

[remote locust]

Saying government involvement would kill all development is just being blind to the amount of legislation around gaming and videogames and development, and companies, that exists already

[robust galleon]

When that WOW drama happened it was so bad on yt that I turned live chat on my tv and just hung out here for a couple of streams.

[tight bramble]

"Stop doing ad hominem"

"Maldavius figtree lawl"

"No focus on the issues and topics"

"Nepo baby kek"

It's just exhausting.....

[jolly sky]

Again, none of that actually changes how the game is actually made, whereas SKG would have. There would have to be some fundamental differences in how its actually developed to worm that in, if that were to have been implemented

All of those other laws just means that the game itself has to put in various TOS wording

[foggy moat]

what's confusing about that?

[remote locust]

Except the GDPR fundamentally changes how data is collected, stored, and processed.

Which DOES change development, and has for years.

[wet storm]

That really depends on the game

And the country, and how they apply the law

You said "government being involved". Government gets involved all the time

There was (idk if it's still the case) a truckload of banned games in Australia

[indigo wadi]

this would be like, direct government oversight

[wet storm]

for being too violent

And historically, even older than that, Wolfenstein being banned in Germany

[jolly sky]

Which is a nanny state problem

[dry osprey]

They should ban hello kitty xD That stuff is to violent

[jolly sky]

And a bad one at that

[wet storm]

Germany still outputs enough development for there to have been a friggin germanyfest on Steam

[indigo wadi]

germany isn't as stingy as the usa, lbr

[wet storm]

There's an ocean of difference between "it's a problem" and "game development will stop completely"

It certainly is a problem due to the precedent that it narrows what can be released

Then again, there's a gagillion countries in the world

[shadow dawn]

Also, you seem to forget why that game is banned here

[wet storm]

You mean wolfenstein?

[shadow dawn]

Yep

[indigo wadi]

and how many actually develop games on a big scale? Not many

[jolly sky]

Alright then, I'll re-jiggle my words. Governments getting too hands on into game development can easily hinder game development

[wet storm]

The root of the reason spreads onto the point that Germany cannot release any games related to World War 2

No CoD clone can spawn from there

I think

[lime vine]

https://youtu.be/YmU5gcttf1c?si=OkVTXitq4phTkDAd Oh just not Muta...

[wet storm]

Idk I'm conjecturing a bit

[remote locust]

No, its a specific ban on Nazi imagery

[shadow dawn]

Nope, symbolism associated with WW2 is prohibited by law

[indigo wadi]

oh god, not muta

[remote locust]

Has nothing to do with WW2

[remote locust]

The drama train must continue

[wet storm]

Thanks for clarifying, yeah that's that

[indigo wadi]

i can't stand muta, comes off incredibly preachy

[shadow dawn]

Yeah man, thats a bit of a problem

[wet storm]

No Company of Heroes clone 'cos theres a giant nazi flag on the headquarters

[lime vine]

I dont even want to watch this. Youtube recommended it to me. But most likely its just blaming Thor. I can guess.

[remote locust]

Its probably that, because again......... there IS something to be said for videogame preservation

But the specific implementation needs to be very very very carefully considered

[indigo wadi]

he is like a lot of the time

[lime vine]

I love it when the world goes to shit under 1 day. Hytale and now this.

[indigo wadi]

ah

Muta supports Ross

is the jist of the comments

and of course, yt comments dumping on Thor yawn

calling Thor a fraud now roflmao

[shadow dawn]

Im starting to think the comments are made by people who dont understand like, 60% of the words they write, they just heard them somewhere and must now use them too

See: fraud, accountability etc.

[indigo wadi]

who knows at this point

all of the claims against Thor are disproven for those that want to actually pay attention

senpai noticed me 😂

[shadow dawn]

which the ppl on the other side dont want to do most of the time

[indigo wadi]

correct, because they'd rather engage in hate because "it's the cool thing to do"

it's sickening. Go touch grass and live lives. My 8 month old is more mature.

[late bane]

Yeesh

[indigo wadi]

Hasn't said a thing in 10 months, yet Thor's the one to blame?

that's not even logic

[tight bramble]

Focusing on issues to work toward solutions makes waaaaaayyyyyyy too much sense.

[teal zodiac]

where the idea of "they blame Thor" came from? is there a reddit post, video response or anything on that?

[sturdy badger]

I don't see how you could blame Thor for it... I do wish Thor and Ross had a discussion over it though, might have been interesting and I feel like there might have been misunderstandings in both directions

[shadow dawn]

You dont ask a random dude on the street to perform surgery though

[indigo wadi]

Because thor spoke out against it, he's the reason it died

that's the "logic" from those blaming Thor

[tight bramble]

Almost messed up there lol

[indigo wadi]

People want an easy blame and thor is that fo rthem

[indigo wadi]

huh?

[shadow dawn]

Wait till somebody explains correlation vs. causation to these peeps, heads will go boom

[sturdy badger]

Oh yeah, I get that... but at the same time the math doesn't math.

[indigo wadi]

sadly those ppl won't get it

[indigo wadi]

for us that know better, absolutely. For those that don't or don't want to, they don't care

[tight bramble]

Oh just saying that you gave the answer then immediately added the context, like panic adding a /s

[sturdy badger]

Someone else told them how to do the math and there was an ulterior motive

[wet storm]

Ayo summer sale on?

[tight bramble]

Oh is that going on?

[wet storm]

Woooop

[tight bramble]

STEAM SUMMER SALE!!!!!11!!

[wet storm]

Yeah june 26th

Are you ready for a miracle?

[tight bramble]

Stuff my money into a spud gun and aim it at my monitor.

[wet storm]

Anyone here alive to have seen gaben.tv?

No no, gaben.tv

It was a website that played this whenever it was steam sale

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUo1PgKksgw

The early 2010s were dope

[indigo wadi]

oh god my wallet

[tight bramble]

I wasn't a pc gamer at that time. I was older consoles and focused on army stuff.

[sand crown]

Vod got deleted

[indigo wadi]

To be expected

[blissful imp]

i went to bed at 9AM cst. woke up at 6PM cst.

HOLY FCKING SHIT!

[indigo wadi]

howdy

[outer gust]

go to bed

[vital ore]

Is there a reason the vod dissapeared from 23/06?

[blissful imp]

i wonder why

[woeful lantern]

Probably just him not wanting to feed morons more.

[blissful imp]

The saddest part is Hytale's development is cancelled...

[woeful lantern]

which also came up a LOT

[blissful imp]

oh well, At least the hypixel team can get back to work on the hypixel server. most of that team stopped working on the server when the hytale release happened.

[woeful lantern]

I think hypixel is also going away

[indigo wadi]

trolls from SGKs nonsense

[blissful imp]

Which left the server with very few devs

[blissful imp]

And lsf as you'd guess.

[indigo wadi]

no idea, i dont visit there

[blissful imp]

here's what i'd guess is the 1st post. not going to link the post because Duh.

there's also this crosspost.

honestly the upvotes and so on aren't the biggest and craziest. the mong0 stuff has way more.

for today that is.

[indigo wadi]

oh well

par for the course at this rate

[earnest spire]

great now the vod is down

[brisk sparrow]

i mean was bound to happen

even r/videos was a cesspool on the post i saw about it

[indigo wadi]

Course it is when you have trolls coming in about SKG

[earnest spire]

https://tenor.com/view/elmo-sigh-gif-5895699729383201961

[sand crown]

I wouldn’t be surprised for the next few days that the VODs don’t stay up

[minor nymph]

People flooded all of our socials with hate posts.
Banned a ton, took the twitter post down, going to get back to work.

[winter sierra]

:<

[tight bramble]

Oh captain, my captain!

[blissful imp]

Did GabeN win???? https://www.theverge.com/news/690967/microsoft-xbox-app-windows-steam-games-aggregated-library-support-beta

[indigo wadi]

It's a shame that you can't even provide your point of view on the matter because people are heckin' derp

[minor nymph]

Can't talk about shit without a wall of hate posts anymore.

Heartbound is getting review bombed by them now.

[indigo wadi]

JFC

[lunar moth]

Saw that, and it is honestly just sad that folks behave like this - like hell, even when folks disagree one can do so in a reasonable fashion, not randomly start harassing folks

[indigo wadi]

That's the new way apparently.

Can't have nuanced discussions online anymore. At least on most social platforms.

Seen it with facebook initially years ago

like, 2012

[exotic tinsel]

not to mention some of the positive reviews got the jester award

[minor nymph]

They've been doing that for months

Any time I release content for the game it has that

[indigo wadi]

They must live the shallowest of lives

[minor nymph]

Same with the new song on YouTube

[exotic tinsel]

Months!?

What for?

[indigo wadi]

cause they can

[minor nymph]

WoW Classic is when it started

[indigo wadi]

they still can't get over it.

I've never seen such unhinged behaviour.

[exotic tinsel]

This is crazy, is all I can say

[lunar moth]

I have, but... you have to basically go back to 2012-2014 with Gamergate (which I'm not sure if one can talk about here)

[indigo wadi]

You don't need to say anymore. We're acquainted with that situation.

[lunar moth]

Gotcha

But yeah, this is absolutely crazy to the extent folks are still going on about this stuff

[exotic tinsel]

call me ignorant, but damn, I'll just pretend none of this happened and indulge in the games I actually enjoy

[raw condor]

Just chiming in here. @minor nymph im really sorry about all this nonsense being directed at you. It really feels like hateful pricks want to dogpile on you because its the popular thing to do

For what its worth you said something on stream once that really, really helped me out in my personal life and i just wanted to thank you personally

[upper zephyr]

I watched that skg video “update” he did and it’s a mess of a video, even without all the anti pirate software bs in there, Ross admits that it was his fault and he is already done with skg. When he started to blame Thor I just couldn’t believe that he would be so petty. Shows he got in way over his head, cause even if they get the votes, this process will take even more years to finish. The whole process of government is to slow people down. Thor definitely doesn’t deserve one bit of hate over their failures.

[indigo wadi]

Oh so he does take accountability, yet still blames Thor 🙄

[upper zephyr]

Yup

Some

[smoky crypt]

Yeah it's a shitty mess. I made a post on the post before it got taken down, gotten two replies that were equally unhinged and a DM death threat. Lovely people.

[untold seal]

It is like, I can understand why some people might be cheesed off the way Thor responded to the entire thing. Sure . But to blame the failure entirely on him? That is low. If your entire idea/movement is "derailed" by one person, it was never that robust to be begin with.

[indigo wadi]

It wasn't that robust to begin with, even if Thor hadn't commented

10 months later

[blissful imp]

The crazy thing(that isn't that crazy) is that the SKG thing started because of an Ubisoft game and Thor has said he's going to stream the Division 2 because of the new DLC releasing. The Division 2 is an Ubisoft game.

Oh boy the SKG losers are going to be out when that stream happens.

Which is going to suck.

[indigo wadi]

won't be any different. Mods will do their thing. Thor will pwn at Division 2. It'll be a good day.

[blissful imp]

yes, but... seeing tons of people say stupid shit is very distracting. this happened during the classic wow drama. i literally couldn't stop looking at the chat.

and yes i know i can just hide the chat, but chatting is a whole part of watching live streams imo.

[strange owl]

I truly don't understand having so much energy to throw at something so pointless.

Idk if it's an outlet for these people and that they're trying to impact something else cause they can't impact the things that matter or whatever the reason.

[indigo wadi]

Stream chat sometimes goes fast enough that you can't even catch it. Alternately, just close Twitch Chat.

[indigo wadi]

It takes very little energy to be nasty online.

[strange owl]

The energy required is mainly mental.

What kind of person feels the need to do so?

[indigo wadi]

One that doesn't care about the words they say online.

[strange owl]

Idk how to bring it up without springing something on someone, but something truly awful happened a few hours ago, due to the same thing.

[indigo wadi]

Who else?

[strange owl]

I can send a PM, it's not my place to bring it up publicly.

[indigo wadi]

sure

Things like that just make me want to unplug from the internet and return to a pre-internet time.

"People just don't give a toss, it's about making others feel bad in exchange for internet dopamine."

@strange owl this is probably your answer.

"Because there are no longer any consequences for being a shitty person. If anything, it's quite the opposite: we get incentives to consume and instigate. Those on the receiving end, who don't know how to deal with it, tragically end it early. Bullying, by default, isolates its victims."

And this.

[strange owl]

Yeah, I just don't get it. Such a toxic world we live in.

[indigo wadi]

The eff youtube?!

[vague palm]

Youtube recommending "news" to people who don't ever watch them is nothing, uh, new. Assuming that's what you're refering to

[indigo wadi]

Nope, 4th video

[brisk sparrow]

oh thats just he algorithm deciding to boost a random video

[vague palm]

Oh. Well. Having no idea what the content of the video is, but... whether it's positive or negative I can see this gaining enough traction for it to just be a random rec.

[brisk sparrow]

happens from time to time

[indigo wadi]

given what we were just talking about, that's incredibly creepy

[blissful imp]

ehh, i'd personally ignore the late night talk show videos. just not my thing. ESPECIALLY when its about politics.

[indigo wadi]

oh I love Colbert. Long time watcher 😂

[vague palm]

Just a manifestation of the frequency illusion.

[indigo wadi]

I NEED humour in todays climate

Im just not subbed to him because I'm only interested in the monologues

[vague palm]

You're lucky if you're still able to laugh at anything, I'd say, cause I haven't had that ability for years now.

[indigo wadi]

well, I am a fan of dark humour

[opal bronze]

Man those guys need to talk it out with asmon as the mediator I'm sure that would fix all of it

[indigo wadi]

I also find A LOT of things funny, so ya, laughing is a must on a daily basis

[blissful imp]

humour on serious topics like politics isn't funny or entertaining imo. i'd rather be entertained by other types of videos on youtube.

not politics btw.

but again that's my opinion.

[indigo wadi]

If politics cannot be criticized via humour, then I dunno what to tell ya.

George Carlin said it best. Everything can be laughed at. It's all in how you construct the joke.

IE: Wars are nothing but dick waving contests.

granted, I understand what I find funny, others might not, and that's okay.

[rare crane]

I love Carlin

[rough maple]

My two cents 'fore I have to leave, in regards of Thor's statements I know about so far.

I kind of understand Thor's concerns, but I also believe he could've handled it better (so, a case of "nobody's perfect and I expect nobody to be").

Like... I might be a little out of the loop 'cuz I don't like drama and haven't read Twitter posts and stuff, at all, but I think Thor said explicitly in his video that he's fine with the movement, but not in this state.

Still, addressing people's concerns would've been ideal 'cuz I think it would've helped clarifying everything.
That's pretty much the only criticism I have so far.

But, as I said, no one's perfect and I just don't want to "take sides", 'cuz me being terminally online taught me it's never a good idea in general to blindly follow the masses and believe that the world is either black or white. 🙃

[oblique palm]

Guys

Human eared cat

[thick ledge]

I think it's stupid that people can attack a dude for having an opinion they disagree with and when he doesn't do a streamer customer service response they get even angrier

Fake internet pleasing is annoyijg

And I will never do it

[brisk sparrow]

it is, and its why i mostly lurk everywhere. idrc about being known

[thick ledge]

People online being cringe no way

[brisk sparrow]

this is one of the few communities im actually active in

[subtle gate]

[thick ledge]

I talked about it in gen chat, but imagine your favorite resteraunt closing so you hunt the owners down and demand the keys

Lmao

[brisk sparrow]

the other 2 being a mod, and a separate modpack, both for minecraft

[thick ledge]

"I spent money here!!"

Cringe behavior

[kindred holly]

I haven't been up to date about this and quite frankly I'm not really sure if I want to. I remember when it initially started, I was pretty conflicted because, quite frankly, I followed both Thor and Ross. Ross is kinda a part of my childhood because of Freeman's Mind.

I thought Thor initially was pretty agressive at first and while I didn't agree with his stance on live-service games (I generally don't really like them to begin with), I thought he made a good point about the work maintaining the servers and government involvement. What rubbed me the wrong way was the way Ross initially talked about how "easy" it would be for the EU to implement.

My guy, that is super naive.

[thick ledge]

If you don't like service based games you know will close, then don't... buy them?

[kindred holly]

I personally don't

[thick ledge]

Perfect

[rough maple]

I think I'm just gonna sit down and watch what will happen in the future.

If there's fire and someone's gonna burn their hand, let them. Reality eventually knocks at the door.

But let me just say that you don't want the government to make laws that decide what stuff to enjoy for you.
Sometimes, you better vote with your wallet. Period.

[thick ledge]

You'll never get "scammed" then

[brisk sparrow]

lmao if something is easy for a government to implement the either the implementation is flawed or the government is (or both)

[thick ledge]

I for one, enjoy experiencing live games and the unique experiences like live one time events that come with them

[kindred holly]

That's totally fair. It's not my cup of tea and I don't really care for the business model.

[indigo wadi]

I know WoW will shut down one day and I'm perfectly okay with that.

[kindred holly]

Tbf, I play a lot of single-palyer games

[thick ledge]

Example, in everquest years ago an immortal dragon awoke and rampaged before escaping, that happens once and never again

You have to come in with your not buying a physical product, you are buying access to a venue

Like going to a concert

With live service games

Eventually, the venue will close

"Hey I paid to be in there let me back in, I'll play my own music"

How unhinged does that sound

[kindred holly]

Yep, it's literally by design. Trying to maintain it being open with local and wide-spread servers will be a nightmare too. It's not the same as just running a huge minecraft server.

[thick ledge]

Im paying for access to an experience for as long as it's theee

Not permanent access, and I know that upfront when I'm buying it

I'd totally be behind a legally required disclaimer of such

But other than that, jf the devs wanna give it over to the community they can

But it's whatever

[kindred holly]

It kinda runs in the dilemma that lost media preservation has: everything will fade away at some point. At what point is it worth trying to prevent the inevitable?

[thick ledge]

It's like demanding a live band never stops playing

Because you paid to listen to them

[brittle jacinth]

The problem is that the players should not need an active connection to the official servers to play the base game (LAN and dedicated should be ok) but from both side they are telling it in a weird way and nobody understands the other sides

maybe its just my pov from an outsider

[indigo wadi]

How would that work with a game like WoW?

[opal bronze]

I wanna play little big planet servers again, people set up a community server for it I think but I haven't looked into how to access it

[kindred holly]

Iirc, this started because of that online game with the huge drive-thru map of the US, right? I forgot the name of it, but iirc, someone pointed out that had a hidden singleplayer mode that people datamined, but I don't know how true it is.

[brittle jacinth]

the same way as minecraft i guess

[subtle gate]

I'm one of those that hates playing multiplayer cause "there's always a bigger fish" so I have no statement in this matter except that there is a definitive ignorance in politicians toward games along with anything that isn't in their own little world so that one message we send should be very specific

[brittle jacinth]

it does work but yeah it needs to be implemented before launc

[thick ledge]

thats stupid

no

lmao

[indigo wadi]

Minecraft does not require a server to be able to play. Even WoWs base game requires a server, so the minecraft way wouldn't work

[kindred holly]

I mean, maybe it's somewhat better in the EU, but I would never trust a US politician with this. They barely know how the hell tiktok or the internet works as a whole.

[thick ledge]

literally saying mmos shouldnt exist because they dont allow you to play indefinitely

[strange owl]

I can somewhat agree with letting the tech go "free" when the game is sunset, that way you can make some type of private server. It does bring up some copyright/IP issues, but I can see it in some form.

Simply releasing the software or keeping it up indefinitely on the other hand is just plain wishful thinking.

[thick ledge]

thats dumb

[thick ledge]

also a dumb idea IMO, again its like demanding the keys to a resteraunt because its closed

people just need to come to the reality that things dont last forever and thats fine

[strange owl]

Yeah, but I can at least see it be feasible

[thick ledge]

and some devs do that

because they want to

forcing them to is stupid

[strange owl]

Yepp

[thick ledge]

STG is so incredibly entitled it baffles me

you knew that game was a live service when you bought it

that means it will one day close

you KNEW that

and yet you still throw a fit

just -dont buy them-

not you specifically but you in the general sense

[round bolt]

It should just have nothing to do with live service games

[thick ledge]

the consumer

[round bolt]

Would have nipped a lot of this in the bud

Or even advocate that live service games are more egregiously advertised as such... I'd be fine with that

[thick ledge]

^ put a disclaimer on it

that it will close one day

done

id support that

[jolly sky]

You also just can't make single player offline versions of some games, like the game is fundamentally broken if that is even attempted

[thick ledge]

force the developers to never close it? no

lmao

[kindred holly]

You know, I should've be surprised about Muta in general. I remember when he used to do creepypasta overviews and deep web dives. And now he's just a toxic drama tuber. Whatever.

[round bolt]

I will say I do support the rest of the spirit of it.

[thick ledge]

i get the spirit

i dont agree

but i get it

[round bolt]

Like for example, just cause 3.

[thick ledge]

a bad implimentation of a sentiment im already not a fan of

[brittle jacinth]

the point is that you dont buy it you rent and you don't know for how long it will last so thats why if you "buy" something you should always be able to use it

[kindred holly]

I think at best, it's incredibly naive

[round bolt]

If you can't kiss their dumb little server, the game doesn't load past the main menu.

[thick ledge]

you are buying access

rather than a game

like buying a concert ticket

[indigo wadi]

anyone that buys into a live service games KNOWS it's temporary.

Video games are about the experience, the journey.

[thick ledge]

experiencing something fleeting is normal

people do it all the time

idk why games should be an exception

[round bolt]

I personally always gravitated away from those things.

Never really liked game pass, or paying for Netflix

[thick ledge]

there are still singleplayer games

[round bolt]

Etc

[thick ledge]

its more indie by the day

but there always will be

[jolly sky]

If SKG was about putting forward making sure that majoritively single player games with online authorisation logins can still have an offline option after that authorisation server goes away, it would have been a slam dunk in terms of support

[thick ledge]

^

i 100% agree, DRM online checks can be done away with

[strange owl]

It does have a bit of an "old man yells at clouds" stink about it.

[thick ledge]

demanding all service based games be permanent is stupid

[brittle jacinth]

cause yes it's but a tempoary moment in our life but i do go back on old game just to get these memory back and experience it again

[thick ledge]

and you can do that, with games designed that way

but i dont demand to be able to re-experience anything else i buy access to

[brittle jacinth]

cause yeah you cannot keep a server alive

its impossible

[thick ledge]

why would i be able to do that with a game

[indigo wadi]

game pass is an excellent way to try out games before buying them outright. And if you beat it, then you've paid a cheaper price than the full price.

[thick ledge]

like anything live, its temporary

[wispy plover]

It always kinda cracks me up in a "this is sad" way any time people ride Thor's ass about his takes and it almost always comes down to the same things. A lack of being able to read, or a lack of any legal understanding. Then they get mad because they have no counter to sound logic arguments, and fall back on "Well he's smug." and other stuff. And then, when they get mad because they want to be mad anyways, they wanna start LSF style shit storms over nothing.

I watched Thor's videos again, and it still is a sound argument. He never said like it was all bad, he said that this wasn't the way to go about it. And he's right. Also, people wanna hold on to stuff forever for no reason like it's their comfort blanket. Games die. It happens. Dune will die eventually. So will Blockgame. So will WoW.

People sling shit everywhere like it's gonna bring their dad back with the milk. It isn't. He's never coming back.

[thick ledge]

are you gonna argue buying a house is the same as a concert ticket?

because if so, i have nothing to say to you lmao

[indigo wadi]

You cannot have the same experience. You can only experience something the first time.

Sure you can play through a game again, but it's not the same experience.

[thick ledge]

living somewhere is an experience lmao

what a numbskull way of thinking

[jolly sky]

Some thing like DRG is like, one of the only live service games that I can think of that I could feasibly see the Devs working out an offline single player version if it was going away

[brittle jacinth]

yeah true but its more the nostagia that people want

[thick ledge]

living in a house, same thing as buying a ticket to a live preformance, check mate

[golden latch]

The season retention was an amazing idea

[jolly sky]

Oh yea that was a great move, you just select an old season and unlock the old stuff

[golden latch]

Like playing cod black ops now a days compared to 2010s

Naturally its different

[round bolt]

If I wanted to try out a game I would usually pirate it if I really wasn't sure if I'd like it.

[indigo wadi]

I'm nostalgic for the 80s and 90s, but it's impossible to experience them again.

I've 100% RDR1 5 times because I enjoy the game, but each one was a lesser experience than the previous. I can certainly be nostalgic for the 1st time experience I had, but it'll never be obtained

[round bolt]

That's what I did with hat in time. I liked it a lot so I bought it.

[indigo wadi]

On pc sure, but can't exactly do that on xbox 😛

[round bolt]

One of the many reasons I didn't really do much on console.

[jolly sky]

Main part for me is that the PC has the undisputed largest backwards compatibility vs any console

[golden latch]

And sidewards compatibility

[indigo wadi]

SIDEWARDS

[brittle jacinth]

Whats sidewards?

Affraid to ask

[indigo wadi]

im poking fun at the misspelling

[golden latch]

(Emulating) such as vms

[golden latch]

Thats the correct spelling

[indigo wadi]

oh that's an actual term?

[brittle jacinth]

Thought it was just emulating the real term

[golden latch]

Yes its just rare to use as -wards is a suffix

[indigo wadi]

gotcha

[golden latch]

It is, but its also technically “compatibility” mostly just a pun

[proper phoenix]

Ghost pinged

Someone pulling a tomfoolery

[kindred holly]

I think it might've been from that post from Thor's twitter reply about SKG . Looks like he deleted it.

[proper phoenix]

Heh ?

[rare crane]

Yep he did see #streamchat message

[proper phoenix]

dont know whata going on but alr

Smh ghost pinged me

[brittle jacinth]

Weird drama of both side atacking each other cause both parties a a minor different point of view

The classic of the internet

[kindred holly]

It's petty. Not as petty as Onlyfangs, but petty nonetheless

[brittle jacinth]

Drama from misunterstanding is always the same

[serene valley]

I don't think it purely stems from a misunderstanding

[proper phoenix]

ic

[serene valley]

From what Thor's said, people were specifically devising ways to get him to talk about it, even negatively, to use as signature bait

[brittle jacinth]

Yes an no but Thor has good point and the other side a good points too

[proper phoenix]

I like stop killing game
Even signed the thing

Sadly it come to this

[brittle jacinth]

But both are similar

[thick ledge]

youve always been welcome to disagree with john stremer

just dont be an ass about it lol

[serene valley]

John?!?

[proper phoenix]

so theres now drama now ?

[rough maple]

This.

[thick ledge]

accursed farms put out like an hour long video and 33 minutes of it is bitching about thor

because he wouldnt debate bro him i guess

[golden latch]

I dont know the streamers name so he is john so he doesnt scare me

[serene valley]

Damn

[brittle jacinth]

Cause yes SKG is vague and cannot be put only online game after release right now but games need to have a offline mode or at least say that its a one time payement subscription

[golden latch]

https://tenor.com/view/steve-over-the-hedge-lets-call-it-gif-15299473

[serene valley]

https://tenor.com/view/minecraft-movie-minecraft-a-minecraft-movie-jack-black-i-am-steve-gif-13691645871022200802

[golden latch]

[proper phoenix]

I mean as far as i rmb didnt thor say thst he wouldnt talk to the streamer that was behind the stop killing gsme thing

[proper phoenix]

Why is this so high resolution

[thick ledge]

yes, thats the debate bro thing i was saying

[proper phoenix]

[thick ledge]

he wanted to debate the merits on stream

thor didnt want to

[brittle jacinth]

Merits???

What merits?

[thick ledge]

lol

[brittle jacinth]

Maybe bad understanding of the word from my part?

[serene valley]

iirc at first Thor wanted to talk, but then AF did some inflammatory statements about Thor when Thor didn't immediately get on board

And then Thor just went nope

[thick ledge]

basically he wanted to argue about it, but he shit talked thor publically before hand and thor said no

[muted robin]

Ngl as someone who has been the subject of discourse in my own small subject matter online niche I understand it perfectly. Some ppl are a waste of time to talk to or like. You just don't care honestly

Normalize letting people say "i don't like this" and then moving on instead of turning it into a months long drama farm or trying to bait streamers into saying something clippable (not accusing anyone here more just my general perception of internet culture)

[proper phoenix]

Isnt the reason thor dont wsnt to talk with him is bc he made some cynicals joke ab some politicians

[serene valley]

Maybe I have my timeline screwed, now that you say that, that was Def something too yea

[proper phoenix]

And idr the streamer sending thor hate and it was just some rando online

[serene valley]

Anyway that's why I lead with iirc

[brittle jacinth]

Views and fame is more important than anything in some people eyes. So yes they try

[thick ledge]

oh yeah he said that european politicians would be easy to trick into doing what they wanted or smth

[brittle jacinth]

Yeah and its a stupid take

[thick ledge]

thor said that was bad faith

and then the guy insulted him

that was the timeline

i think

[proper phoenix]

[brittle jacinth]

Its true for some politicien but it doesn't work like that for most

[serene valley]

Do you mean doesn't?

[brittle jacinth]

Yes sorry

Thx for the mispelled point out

[muted robin]

"People are too stupid to argue against this legislation so we can pass it" is such a bad argument anyways

Maybe not bad enough to nullify the whole idea but it just made the case for stop killing games look worse

[serene valley]

If all legislation was passed in that way I think we'd have some very weird laws

[proper phoenix]

Wait till u see murica

[muted robin]

I'm pretty sure there's lots of legislation passed that way and the results are generally not good which is what thor's general concerns boiled down to

[serene valley]

💀

[dusky grove]

This just reminds me of tom scott going "We flew a kite in a public place"

[proper phoenix]

Im not even american and i keep seeing yall on my doomscrooling on reddit

😭

[serene valley]

Banger song

[serene valley]

Neither am I and same

[dusky grove]

Truly the best of his content

[muted robin]

I'm not a subject matter expert in games but I felt that Thor's basic principle about the whole thing was "legislative action that isn't thoroughly thought out beforehand could have negative consequences and you can't just brush that aside and jump into making decisions" and that's something I like about him

He seems cautious/measured as a rule which I think is rare in a time/culture that demands instant action and rewards knee jerk reactions that start drama

And the appearance of doing something more than the actual effectiveness of a thing

[rough maple]

Bit off topic, BTW, but it seems the attitude from this "side" is vastly different.

Like, from what I gathered, the "defense" towards SKG is mostly insults, jabs and "x is right/wrong", without addressing any concerns.

Here, while peeps mostly agree with Thor, they're also fairly voicing their concerns without being offensive, which I honestly respect wholeheartedly.

[thick ledge]

i could be more offensive if youd like?

as a treat

[rough maple]

No, no it's fine. Please, keep the good attitude, I need more. lol

[serene valley]

Zaf is ready to bat

[brittle jacinth]

Yes and thats is mostly why he againts but SKG got a point of "if you buy it you can play it whenever you want"

[serene valley]

https://tenor.com/view/baseball-anime-mm-emu-emu-mio-isurugi-gif-7962784

[thick ledge]

im ready to KILL

[muted robin]

https://tenor.com/view/phineasandferb-phineas-ferb-notyet-notyetferb-gif-17986942

[rare crane]

Unrelated but I'm excited for the CITY anime

[thick ledge]

im RABID

[jolly sky]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-pillow-bite-angry-angry-cat-gif-25541136

[serene valley]

https://tenor.com/view/giant-fatass-bnuuy-bunny-bnuuy-rabbit-rabbit-whatever-gif-15720990188084548831

[brittle jacinth]

I've still never understood why people never fact check or see the others pov before going rabbid but i guess its the internet so its normal

[proper phoenix]

Its the internet u think ppl actually read there or something

[opal star]

gamers cant look up, redditors cant read

[rare crane]

I'm trans and there are a lot of people I don't listen to their thoughts because they don't want me to have rights or to even exist. Not the case here but.

[dusky grove]

Whats that mike tyson quote? Something something getting hit in the face?

[proper phoenix]

My capabilities to read is unheared of its almost invisible

[brittle jacinth]

I do and its hard for what i know and experience

[proper phoenix]

[serene valley]

I just choose the things I don't read

[thick ledge]

to be fair i dont want me to exist, thanos snap me rn

[serene valley]

Like install instructions for xampp

[thick ledge]

im not trans tho

[serene valley]

It specifically says to not put it in program files

Guess what I did

[thick ledge]

ur thanos mileage may vary

[brittle jacinth]

Hope at least it didnt break something

[rare crane]

For example any group that goes by LGB and not LGBT I immediately dismiss

[brittle jacinth]

Wait... Theres group for specific letter??

[thick ledge]

the dreaded terfs...

[rare crane]

Yep I have the displeasure of knowing a local one that doesn't file its 501c3 990 forms and got called a troll and groomer by them. All because I support allowing trans children to exist

[proper phoenix]

Ppl are always quick to take side without any due diligence
Many conflicts can maybe be solved if both side just start learning ab the other side pov and and come to a mutual understanding
But atlas its the internet

[rough maple]

People nowadays only care about being right, period.
Everything is either black or white, good or evil, as if life is a Saturday morning cartoon.

It's maddening.
And trying to chat on a train with bad connectivity is hell. Don't recommend

[thick ledge]

i also only care about being right, and by being right i mean winning, at mario kart

[rare crane]

Hell this group has called trans people Nazis

[brittle jacinth]

Im too out of these thing to know that but wtf i know its "different" but is it not the same thing about just being different. Sorry if it sounds bad

[opal bronze]

read that as tetris like thats what the T meant

[opal bronze]

easy way to get banned from the community

[rare crane]

This group being the transphobic group I've had the displeasure of interacting with IRL

[opal bronze]

irl like at a convention?

[rare crane]

At MIT

[opal bronze]

that sucks, cant curate irl stuff but where it can be curated it is to weed out people like that

[rare crane]

Fun fact that was on a trip advisor review and has since been removed

[opal bronze]

what was

the hate?

[rare crane]

The person calling trans people Nazis

[opal bronze]

oh right

yeah i dont see that staying up for long lol

people be saying shit just to have an effect on another person, i keep that in mind personally, helps me not react back to heinous shit its what they want/need yknow

saved me hours of potential arguments on twitter for sure

[rare crane]

Oh I need to stops rage bating myself by looking at the comments under any local news video

Or NPR video

[opal bronze]

lol definitely

self rage baiting is so easy to do and hard to break out of sometimes depending

[rare crane]

What's funny is when I comment on NPR videos on how they have a neutral tone when reporting and someone comes in saying their reporting isn't neutral. Like ok I didn't say the reporting was neutral I said the delivery was neutral

[opal bronze]

seems about par for the course

but when people usually talk about neutral in reference to reporting its about that so i can see the mistake

[rare crane]

If you've ever listened to NPR you'll know they never really get emotional when doing their news updates

[opal bronze]

i cant say i have sorry

but i think that should be the standard for news reporting

i know there are news people that dont and thats part of why people watch

but yeah, now that you mention it, it is something you notice

[rare crane]

Korva Coleman is the voice of NPR for their hourly updates during the day and she's able to keep the same tone

[golden mirage]

NPR also tries to report objective facts and interviews subject experts for subjective analysis and opinions. It's not completely unbiased but they do try not to put a personal spin on things.

[opal bronze]

i like TLDR for the same reasons but i dont watch them as much now

[rare crane]

Now only if YouTube would actually get around to getting rid of the spam targeting them. I've seen the same comment by the same person on every one of their videos

[golden mirage]

YouTube I'd bad about that in general. I rarely bother reading comments anymore.

[rare crane]

Well time to fall asleep to this https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjrG6gN9y1FNu7-7KN4JkS7S8YQx5ruXD&si=pq9QYbt32z2XnkgB

Good night

[opal bronze]

night

[summer night]

morning all have things calmed down from last night? see thor deleted a tweet

[brave sapphire]

what happened last night?

[gritty tartan]

«Stop Killing Games» died.

[summer night]

SKG organiser posted a video blaming thor for it dying

and everyone started dog piling

[brave sapphire]

Oh, another drama pile blaming Thor for his dissenting opinion. What fun (heavy sarcasm). Was hoping to turn the stream on before I went to bed but wouldn't be surprised if Thor takes the day. Thanks for the updates guys

[summer night]

ahhh the VOD is also deleted

[brave sapphire]

Gnight

[blissful imp]

Khronos is streaming rn https://www.twitch.tv/khronosvii

just started 12 minutes ago

[summer night]

night mate

[coarse niche]

What happened last stream that was drama worthy enough for a VOD deletion?

[summer night]

LSF got its hands on it soooo yeah

[frank geyser]

Stop killing games died, and blams Thor, thats why the VOD are gone

[blissful imp]

Stop killing games. Ross blamed Thor for it failing and the internet did what the internet does.

[summer night]

https://tenor.com/view/loud-noises-anchorman-yelling-yell-gif-5294834

[blissful imp]

Also. Twitch updated its buttons. They're rounded now!

[winter sierra]

and ugly

[frosty socket]

anyone else suspect Thor is oversleeping rn?

[blissful imp]

i disagree. i think it looks good. Small, but good

[gritty tartan]

ah yes, another useless UI update from a big company.

[coarse niche]

Have they reverted their mobile app changes yet?

[gritty tartan]

I have no idea

[summer night]

hahahha your funny thinking they would change it

[blissful imp]

btw. khronos has music playing on his stream. like actual music if you get what i'm saying.

[summer night]

its a nice vibe

[frank geyser]

Music on channel 2, that the vods and clips can't access so he have a "mute" stream

[winter sierra]

i wish it was a liiitle less rounded

[blissful imp]

ok so. the ugly part of the ui change was the font being changed. you can notice the change looking at the hype train ui.

maybe i'm just crazy, but i swear the font was changed

[frosty socket]

same font, different font size and lacking Bold

[winter sierra]

no bold D :

[chrome mantle]

Well, there's no announcement that Thor isn't streaming, so I'll keep waiting for his stream to go live o3o it's only Tuesday, after all.

[winter sierra]

he needs sleep

tbh

[chrome mantle]

He prolly got his sleep. and even if he didn't, I'll wait till he goes live

Or until a Mod comes on saying that he's not going live

[frosty socket]

ah, Thor probably slug from dealing with SKG idiots, okay

[winter sierra]

didnt he say he wanted to go to the doctor? am i remembering wrong lol

[frosty socket]

well, SKG and LSF

[river cargo]

damn he deleted his response on twitter 😦

that was a good response to shut down the haters

[carmine stump]

Mirror asked him please go doc and he said he would

[summer night]

i didnt see it

was it a good response?

[river cargo]

basically called out ross scott for his obsessiveness and then signed off with stay frosty

[winter sierra]

i feel bad for thor. i know i wouldn't be able to handle this amount of hate

[proud depot]

All the comments on initiative death video are almost funny. I feel like they hate thor cause he's an industry insider

[chrome mantle]

People are dumb =T Hating on someone because someone essentially pointed a finger and said "IT'S HIS FAULT" with no actual evidence =T

[fringe fractal]

why is channel points higher up than bits

[chrome mantle]

Cuz you have no bits?

[fringe fractal]

I've seen the same for people with bits

[gritty tartan]

of hell no... please... not this shit.

this is pure pain

[chrome mantle]

I have no bits. So it makes sense that I have more Channel points XD those go up whether you pay for them or not

[sacred junco]

oh the text line

[summer night]

i mean you watch the stream so it goes up?

[carmine stump]

It's like that pixel on the calculator app all over again

[fringe fractal]

Courtesy of Khronos for mentioning this

[summer night]

oh the font

[chrome mantle]

OH!

[summer night]

DAQ

[chrome mantle]

That's weird

[winter sierra]

OH GOD

ITS HORRIBLE

[sacred junco]

someone did not check the alignment before pushing

[winter sierra]

WHO DID THAT

[chrome mantle]

N?

[frosty socket]

the pictures are also not aligned

[gritty tartan]

I went to a channel that never watched and look

[wanton elm]

They aren’t aligned?!

[chrome mantle]

Sir/Ma'am what the hell is N?! HOW MANY POINTS DO YOU HAVE?!

[proud depot]

Is that nonillion?

[foggy moat]

other language for thousand

[proud depot]

Ah, ok

[foggy moat]

probably idk

[summer night]

i mean

i watch alot

[chrome mantle]

OH! I see

[summer night]

i hate grass

and the sun

[chrome mantle]

I thought the K was just standard Romanization via Roman Numerals, and that everyone did it....shows how ignorant of the world I am XD

[proud depot]

Looking up what languages use that A, it might be Vietnamese

[foggy moat]

maybe, again, idk, but it seems plausible

also, k isnt roman numerals afaik

[proud depot]

well k comes from kilo, which means 1.000

[sacred junco]

I mean we used the K as well, but twitch gives us extra care and decided to localize the thousand part lol

[proud depot]

What language?

[sacred junco]

You guessed it above

it's vietnamese

[proud depot]

My weird obsessions win out!

[foggy moat]

kilo is derived from greek, maybe the other prefixes too

mega, giga etc

[sacred junco]

kilo= a thousand, translate thousand to vietnamese and you understand why tis N for thousand for vietnamese

[proud depot]

Some are latin, some are greek

[sacred junco]

What would N be a number abbreviation for in english tho?

[frosty socket]

Nonillion

[proud depot]

Typically nonillion

but thats a very big number

[frosty socket]

1 Nonillion = 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000

[sacred junco]

BRUH

[frosty socket]

30 Zeros

[proud depot]

Also its used to mean an unknown number sometimes like a variable (EG: n number of watermelons)

[sacred junco]

yea, but I don't think unknown number is a big number, so I was left confused

[wanton elm]

where n = zero Thor streams happening at this exact moment in time 😭

[tight bramble]

How about the poincare recurrence number? That one's a doozy....

[proud depot]

the what now? never heard that phrase before

is it a weird math thing?

[tight bramble]

It is a theory:

How long would it take for the universe to repeat itself. Down the the very last particle.

[wanton elm]

Is poincare the name of the mathematician that devised it?

[tight bramble]

Yesh

[proud depot]

Oh yay, physics

[chrome mantle]

Not possible to get Nonillion points XD

[tight bramble]

I dont know how to type exponents on my phone, so bear with me...

[frosty socket]

press and hold the number

[chrome mantle]

XD

[proud depot]

https://tenor.com/view/huh-cat-huh-m4rtin-huh-huh-meme-what-cat-gif-5834484041415217257

[wanton elm]

@chrome mantle that’s… that’s a lot of years

[chrome mantle]

It certainly is XD Lol

[proud depot]

but did you take into account a level 3 subscription? and winning bets?

[tight bramble]

That only works for the first layer lol

[wanton elm]

“10^24” is the best I can think of

[chrome mantle]

So, for those who are curious, that's 1 septillion years

🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣

[tight bramble]

Poincare recurrence is: (10 to 10 to 10 to 2.08)

[weak spindle]

This is too much math

[wanton elm]

Exponents to exponents? Isn’t there a rule that you can just multiply down the exponents? Or is that a log rule?

[blissful imp]

pinned message font...

[winter sierra]

EWW

[light locust]

how can there be that much time left in N, if the Planck length is 1.616 × 10^-35 meters? im just trollin idk wtf ur going on about

[proud depot]

I HATE that font

its too thin and lanky

[marsh forge]

Why does twitch have to be like this?

[wanton elm]

Just think about channel points as being in mid jump

[tight bramble]

Honestly, once you get past a certain point. The number becomes meaningless. Like the time frame for poincare recurrence isn't specified. Years? Millenia? Epoch? It doesnt matter. Because numbers this huge break logic.

[blissful imp]

Are there browser extensions that can change fonts on websites to make them look better?

[wanton elm]

Sometimes I think we may have been emotionally and socially better off as hunter gatherers lol

[proud depot]

I like to think of it in numbers of cookies, then it all starts making sense

[light locust]

Dyson proposed we Digitally dilate the perceived rate of time and live forever

[tight bramble]

Lol. Then we can also look into the Minecraft Universal constant. It makes poincare recurrence look like 1+1.

[chrome mantle]

1 nonillion is a number so insanely massive that it only starts to make any practical sense when you’re dealing with counts at the atomic or subatomic scale, or maybe the total number of possible chess games or DNA base pair combinations on the planet.

The Universe is Estimated to be about 13.8 Billion years old, and there's estimated to be several hundred Sextillion stars in the universe.

[spice vault]

Thor is awake!

[chrome mantle]

and the earth is 6.6 Sextillion tons.

[coarse niche]

Community wise, I would agree, though I would also argue that there have been times in (remotely) recent history where tight nit communities where everybody knew each other in their nearby vicinity and were kind of close

How would the weight of the earth be calculated? Cause on the one hand you have just all the mass it has, on the other, it is in space and its frame of reference is the sun isn't it?

[chrome mantle]

I was wrong, it's 5.97 Sextillion Tons

[coarse niche]

Oh, Thor is in stream chat

[tight bramble]

Oh wait....my number was way, WAY off. I read a number from a different source. The true poincare recurrence time is as follows:

[light locust]

thats a lot of stars but its something like only 0.4 galaxies in a 10 by 10 light year cube of space

[tight bramble]

(10 to 10 to 10 to 10 to 10 to 1.1)

[marsh forge]

i missed the end of the last stream - can somebody tell me what kinda drama got the vod nuked?

[tight bramble]

And that is described in quote: "plank times, millenia, whatever"

[terse pelican]

The ''Stop Killing Games'' Drama.

[marsh forge]

Thx

[tight bramble]

My head hurts now......

[proud depot]

Thor has commented his 7's. sttream is starting an hour late

not hating of course

[golden mirage]

No hate, just use it to convince him to stream for 24 hours to make up for it.

[frank geyser]

This will get curesed right?

[summer night]

indeed

[proud depot]

Chat is one point too big. Though you can change it in bttv settings

set it at 13 and its back to normal

[tribal nest]

-# Hehe, he said sex

[proud depot]

thats a very sexy weight

https://tenor.com/view/licking-lips-shaq-flirty-shaquille-oneal-seductive-gif-23776129

[covert lake]

morning chat o/

[earnest mirage]

the font never changed. they changed the size from 1.4rems to 1.3rems.
if you want to keep the smaller font, get better ttv (browser extension) and then you can click on the gear on twitch chat and select a font-size (set it to 13 if you want the old style). You could also change the font type if you don't like standard Inter.

however, this applies to chat only, not the bits and channel points.

and thanks to whoever has pointed out the wrong alignment of the channel points. Now this upsets me every time i see it -.-

[covert lake]

https://tenor.com/view/argll-gif-23177908

i cant un see that now

[earnest mirage]

ah i see what's causing the issue.
The bits and channel points are part of a flex box which items are aligned on the center line. Bits and the bit logo are separate items but the channel points and their logo is in another flex box and they forgot to align the items of this flexbox to the center-line.

[earnest mirage]

if you want to fix it manually. The class fHdBNk is missing align-items: center;

[spice dome]

Someone please fire the person in charge of changing the font and/or its size

[terse pelican]

You can change it yourself to a certain extent

[gritty tartan]

This Hunk skin doesn't make sense, btw. I guess know why they did it like that, but Hunk never worked in R.P.D. I'm annoyingly nerdy about Resident Evil.

[tepid elm]

Made a new Bezos for the Division for Thor

[wet storm]

This is so damn good hahah

[woeful lantern]

You could argue he could be under cover, as Umbrella isn't exactly supposed to be deploying their squads the way they do.

cause iirc, he works for their like, Asset retrieval teams right?

[tight bramble]

I really wish I could join his group. I understand I'm just a random, but I think he would enjoy my build and play style.

[stone nacelle]

curious if we could share builds somehow

[tight bramble]

Maybe he'll set up a div2 discord

[stone nacelle]

twin size mattress by the front bottoms? random

tts recently

[gritty tartan]

yep, but he looked like generic black ops and his team went straight to the Umbrella lab

[blissful imp]

Can i be honest. i expected the twitch chat to be worse today.

its been somewhat okay

decently normal

[indigo wadi]

wtf is even happening