#Dirk is not a good starter ship

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

smoky canopy
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The old default shrike had 2 gimballed CIWS repeaters and a railgun. Which easily shows how stuff works and both provide actual damage.

Dirk cannot upgrade the railgun and the lasers are a prob a weird thing for new players. (Completely ignoring my distaste for hitscan weapons 😉 )

It's not even possible to buy the real shrike anymore. Which was the only ship, I actually liked to play. (I would prefer the stiletto, but not locked to the default railgun)

plucky brook
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I sorta agree with this. I personally prefer lasers on the shrike cause CIWS tends to drain ammo like no tomorrow, but I do agree with the railgun being locked being an annoyance.

topaz marlin
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all shrikes need able to change weapon in nose section

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and maybe some special stuff, like high caliber cannon or shotgun, or huge laser(for dirk, or what version have most powerful reactor)

smoky canopy
topaz marlin
smoky canopy
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still bad. lasers are hitscan. meaning there's no dodging incoming fire. if you point it onto my ship, you WILL hit.

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that's cool, albeit boring, in single player games. but it sucks massively in multi player games

topaz marlin
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what about plasma cutter? like just plasma cutter but huge and with magnetic lenses, like close combat weapon that emits beam of superheated plasma

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or too sci-fi?

plucky brook
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Lasers still have their downsides in this. They're hitscan, but very slow damage over time. A well placed railgun strike completely outclasses lasers any day of the week

plucky brook
smoky canopy
# plucky brook Lasers still have their downsides in this. They're hitscan, but very slow damage...

the problem is still that 2 ships lasing you at the same time will quickly kill your weapons. and there's no dodging.
And you can't rotate away, because the railgun is at your front. It will be damaged or destroyed. There's also accumulated damage over time. at larger distances, thelaser has a higher DPS than railgun. Especially in the current build, where your own thrust seems not be used by the pip

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just IMO a meh mechanic, that takes a way far more than it adds to the game

olive oxide
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It's not every day, but today I flew one session of Open Space in which I got multiple kills with the Dirk's railgun, and 3 of them were one shots: a Pegasus, and two Hyperions! Just saying... 😉
Normally, I don't do that well. 🤷‍♂️

topaz marlin
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nice

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i think i had no not-oneshots
but my targets were only light fighters

smoky canopy
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old version required 3-4 shots of the S2

topaz marlin
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depends on luck

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you can oneshot hyperion, or hit shrike 5 times without any serious damage

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but now damage works better i think

smoky canopy
novel lichen
glass tartan
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My only thing about this is that for whatever reason, gimballed cannons are just not hitting for me, or even hitting me, basically ever, regardless of range. The aiming pip just seems completely wrong constantly, I can only consistently land shots with the railgun within about 1.5km because the aiming pip beyond that is too inaccurate, and i can't hit with the gimballed CIWS ever. Granted, because CIWS guns suck so bad, i can just get within range to one-tap with the railgun because i'm probably only going to take a few hits from the autocannons as long as i dont fly in a straight line. But outside of that, the most reliable damage dealers have been the lasers, because, well, lasers can't miss.

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And then just missiles.

smoky canopy
# glass tartan My only thing about this is that for whatever reason, gimballed cannons are just...

CIWS guns have less than 1 km/s projectile speed. which is important. otherwise there would be no fun in the game.
There seems to be an issue atm that the pip doesn’t calculate your own acceleration. When I can let go of my left stick for a second while shooting the railgun, I can hit things far away.
but in a tighter fight, with both upwards and horizontal maxed out, then even the railgun pip will be way off.

Also, you can see them hit stuff. It’s just that CIWS needs a bunch of hits at the same spot to destroy it.

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it’s possible that the pip issue also affects CIWS and the AI, because they rarely hit at all.
lasers do hit, so the general aim is there, it’s just the prediction based on relative motion that’s the issue.

with less than 1km/s, you will always be able to dodge them at certain distances. But not as much as you’re used to from other games, because acceleration is only a fraction here

glass tartan
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I mean, yeah, my point being that gimballed CIWS in general is so inaccurate as to be effectively useless, and the aiming pip on the railgun is off enough that beyond 2km, the pip will not lead to hits. But within 2km, it's good enough, and it's generally a one-tap, so why would I ever bother with the CIWS guns?

Ultimately the point here is that, actually, I think the only flaw on the Dirk for this current build is that it has a fixed auto cannon when just slapping missile tubes on that hardpoint is just better.

I've yet to get a single kill from an autocannon, gimballed or otherwise. Railguns make up the majority of my kills, naturally, with missiles and lasers making up the rest.

novel lichen
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I got a 12-13KM kill on a Shrike with the basic railgun so I'm not sure that saying the aiming box is faulty is entirely accurate. It would be nice if the box better reflected center mass, especially on tiny ships, but it's still doing most of the work for you.

smoky canopy
plucky brook
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Thank goodness. So I'm not the only one who feels like the lead sight is off

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In the old version, I was able to consistently nail a reus or any larger targets from 5 km out. Beyond 5km, shrikes were the only thing that posed a significant challenge to aim at. Something definitely feels off

novel lichen
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I think the sight may be slightly off but there's also just a lack of reliable hit indicators even when I see a ricochet or hear the critical trill from the DSS

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So it's hard to differentiate the two

plucky brook
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I agree with that a lot. It would be really nice to know when shots are actually landing on target. Especially if I'm using something like GSUs which have crazy spread. So some hit indicators would be a very welcome addition

glass tartan
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I think the longest confirmed railgun hit i've gotten is about 5KM against a pegasus, because it's just a huge ship. beyond that, i have no idea if im actually hitting or not, especially because i've definitely seen reus' tank like 8 railgun shots because every round is just deflecting. So maybe I am hitting targets at distance, but it's just deflecting or being tanked. The lack of feedback makes it hard to tell.

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Aiming pips just in general seem very, very off, though. It gets more forgiving as ships increase in size, but that's just obvious. Against a shrike or kolibri though, forget hitting from outside about 1.5km with pretty much anything except lasers and missiles.

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So right now, actually, the shrike is easily the best ship in the game in my estimation, because it's miniscule so it's difficult to hit, its fast and maneuverable, the Dirk has twin gimballed lasers which are reliable, and the railgun has the capacity to quickly kill anything.

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And because its so small and so fast, the fact that you have to close to short range to hit with the railgun is doable, because the only threats you have to be concerned with are lasers and other railguns, and the AI doesn't seem to actually use their railguns.

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The Reus on the other hand, without a railgun of its own, it has to rely on the lasers and missiles, and missiles are too easy to shoot down to be reliable. And it's big enough and slow enough to actually be hit at close-to-medium range.

smoky canopy
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I did much further out, even at a shrike that was coming straight at me. at 9km. But not on video...

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those were all case where I let go of any thrust input tho. the moment you have thrust, you will skew the pip in the demo

glass tartan
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It feels like you have to have a perfect storm

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where neither you nor your opponent are maneuvering defensively

smoky canopy
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yeah, that feels sketchy every time 😄

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I think there's more to it tho. I think there's areal problem with how the reticle is projected.

glass tartan
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part of the issue is that i lack so much confidence in the aiming pip that i don't even attempt to shoot unless i'm within like 2-4 km

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railgun ammo is so limited why would i try to shoot at distances where compounding aiming pip calculation errors are going to make a miss likely

olive oxide
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We're working on much improved feedback to indicate hits (and hopefully differentiate between low and high damage hits). The railgun is very challenging, especially when the target is flanking. I used to be a terrible shot, but I've gotten better with practice. I think I mentioned this already, but nowadays I frequently get at least one or two long-range kills per match. I just flew an Open Space match using the Dirk and nailed a Shrike over 10km away. Just knowing I can do that is incredibly satisfying.

sullen socket
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I can get at least 1 kill at 10+ km per belt match and have killed a few ships at 15+, only thing that annoys me is seeing the slug bounce on a target.

olive oxide
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Indeed, but imagine being on the receiving end and having your bell rung like that! We're working on more dramatic sound and visual effects.

plucky brook
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Like if you die to a 15+ km kill, the game just starts roasting you

smoky canopy
wind quiver
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Also, not to be such a Geth, but wouldn't windows be a structural weakness?

olive oxide
# wind quiver Also, not to be such a Geth, but wouldn't windows be a structural weakness?

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Aluminium oxynitride

Aluminium oxynitride (marketed under the name ALON by Surmet Corporation) is a transparent ceramic composed of aluminium, oxygen and nitrogen. Aluminium oxynitride is optically transparent (≥80% for 2 mm thickness) in the near-ultraviolet, visible, and mid-wave-infrared regions of the electromagnetic spectrum. It is four times as hard as fused...

smoky canopy