Always overflicking despite trying many things

[shell crystal]

Example video at the end. I have always had an issue with overflicking. I've improved my precision, smoothness, reactivity, tried different types of flicking styles and speeds, and yet the issue is the exact same now as day 1. Any help is appreciated, thank you.
Example: https://youtu.be/PufYJFE69cw

[marble granite]

You are flicking too fast, since you are missing most of the shots i guess that you simply arent good enough to hit those flicks or you are using a very high sens

[civic silo]

As Vesc mentioned - you are flicking too fast, and it doesn't look like you allow yourself to micro adjust either.

The bots spawn pretty slowly, so you should allow yourself to take advantage of that time to micro correct.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0Y1KSYxuo4&t

Here is a good video for static improvement

[shell crystal]

I get that flicking fast and microadjusting slowly yet accurately is a great way to get high scores, and I've trained plenty of that for a while. That's never been the issue. My microadjustments have gotten a lot better and I'm happy about that, but my initial flick has always been an overflick by the exact same amount. How do I train to get my initial flick to be more accurate properly rather than training myself to rely on a micro-adjust? Please let me know if I'm missing something here

[civic silo]

I don't really have any tips I am afraid, but most people tend to mention that you could try putting extra active thought in trying to underflick.

But I think you kinda have the wrong idea about flicking - even high level aimers can't always get their initial flick on target 100% of the time and still have to rely on micro corrections, this counts for both training and gaming, the difference is mainly that you just learn how to transition from flick to micro correction much faster eventually

So you should definitely not neglect the micro correction aspect of it all

[shell crystal]

Alright, I understand. Thanks for the help 🙏

[civic silo]

Goodluck!

[dull hawk]

Sorry, I am very passionate about flicks, but I have to strongly disagree with some of the opinions you were given simply because they are limited views on flicks based on a singular way of flicking (no offense to either of them, they simply aren't informed of these other methods, or it slipped their mind to mention them), but here is a presentation of a few ways you can improve these types of flicks:

Under and over flicking is expected when getting used to flicking, especially if you aren't that used to your current sensitivity or mouse well enough to get used to it or to have steady enough control. There is no such thing as flicking too fast, there is only using improper technique when flicking or flicking beyond your current ability to control the flick you are attempting. The first of three methods I will describe is "flicking past" the target. In flicking past the target (which is the easiest of these methods in my opinion) you simply need to flick quickly past the target and time your click with the moment that you "feel" the crosshair pass the head; yes, you don't actually feel it, you see it, but it comes across as a feeling through repetition and understanding. The second of these is "curving toward" the target. In curving toward the target you will be moving arbitrarily toward the target not directly but in a curve that lands on the target's head. This may be easier or harder for you based on how you are used to using your mouse, but it's exactly as it sounds and should be as quick as possible to make up for lost time that is spent following trajectory over moving directly but never faster than you are able to control with this one as it is easier to make bad habits with than good ones if you repeat it in an incorrect way due to your focus being on speed, however, if your focus is not on speed but you are simply repeating it incorrectly on accident then it is either not for you due to the way you use your mouse or it is not creating bad habits...

...not creating bad habits and you simply need to practice with it. The third and final of these is to "flick directly to" the target. In flicking directly to the target you are making one straight flick and leaving no room for error, just as you were attempting before in the clip, and believe me, I looked, back then, like how you do now when I was practicing those types of flicks on my normal sens about a decade ago, so I know how it feels xD but keep with it and train well, you can use a regimen of trying to flick with precision but slower and then trying to flick to the same place quicker/faster while not caring as much about precision and you can alternate between the two based on how comfortable you feel (or don't feel) with what you are trying at the moment, be it precision or speed. Tell me if any of this helps, and whether you need any further help, as I said I'm passionate about flicks so I'd be more than happy to provide insight on them, though I have never aim trained more than a handful of hours in my life, so others will be able to help with aim trainer questions like Aim Lab or KovaaK's better.

For examples within your own video, the flick at 13 seconds was pretty close to what a "flick to" would be, and the flick at 37 seconds would be a good example of what a "flick past" would look like, and the flick at 22 seconds would be a very good example of what a "precision" "flick to" the target would be like.

[dull hawk]

I do find it interesting that in all of the gameplay clips he showed he only used a micro correction flick once, but I definitely see that the micro-correction type of flick is very useful when doing those specific types of scenarios where you need to click as many very tiny dots as possible before the time limit is reached, though, it would be nice to see more micro correction flicks in the video unless his goal was to show how using micro-correction in aim training helps improve overall mouse control?

[civic silo]

I think he applies the micro correction flicks all the time, but he has become so proficient at it that he 1) gets extremely close with his initial flick, and 2) his flicks very smoothly transition into a micro correction. Which makes it look like he isn't micro correcting at all.

I cannot argue any of your points cause you know much more about flicking than I do for sure, I do however wonder what the usefulness for these types of flicks are? To me personally (opinion), ones like the "flicking past" where you learn how you time your click seems to me much harder to consistently implement, while the bardpill method trains the user how to correct for the initial over- or underflick, and get much faster with it over time.

But again, this is my very narrow and limited opinion on the subject matter at hand.

[dull hawk]

I don't mean to diminish what you know, if you read what I typed then you pretty much know what I know, but I personally don't agree that he was micro correcting because he makes one straight flick and lands on the head in the valorant clips from bardOZ in the video you linked for the majority of his flicks but there was one good example where you can see he micro corrected after flicking for sure, and if he doesn't micro correct then he would by definition be "flicking to" the target right? Whether one of the flick types you use is hard or easier may be subjective, to me it's always felt the easiest, but for you maybe it doesn't line up with the way you flick so it may be harder, but just for an example, here is how I implement that kind of "flick past" the target: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VO88wS9ZoMY

[civic silo]

I didn't take it as diminishing 🙂 just soaking all the info in myself.

[dull hawk]

Oh ok, I'm glad then, didn't want to be negative in any way :=)

[civic silo]

Absolutely not negative at all. Your last paragraph makes sense to me, about some flicking techniques likely feeling easier than others for different people. You gave me a new perspective on the position at least with things I didnt know about.

[dull hawk]

Here is "flicking to" the target (on the first kill only): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Xl2EkGUGpM

[civic silo]

I personally just felt like that the Bardpill-way of flicking can be more easily replicable, if that makes sense?

You are indeed right that some of his clips dont seem to support what he is advocating for, but I think it just comes down to his skill level 😅

[dull hawk]

Yeah, he's definitely very skilled at flicking, I liked the flicks that were shown in the video, as "flicks to" the target, they were very very clean and you can tell he has good stopping power/control over his mouse.

The way that guy laughed in the clip will always make me smile cause he literally never talks in voice chat normally xD

[shell crystal]

I love the way you two are conversing. It's so pleasant to see two people discussing ideas, informing eachother, all in the goal of understanding more, and all civilized and compassionately

[shell crystal]

I am so extremely thankful to you for writing this. I'm a very sensitive person so writing in public, especially for help, is something I struggle with greatly. And the first guy's response hit very uncomfortably and the second was pleasant albeit stuff that I've heard many times (probably because of how well it works for others).

I'm so happily surprised that you started with #1 because that's exactly how my reactive flicking has been for as long as I can remember. I hit so many shots where my crosshair is so far beyond the target but I shoot exactly on the targets head. I've felt like it's a bad habit that I learned ever since I've been trying to get the #3 style, flicking to, but the way you worded it, it makes it feel like mine simply an uncommon flicking style, which feels very relieving. It also makes sense to me now why learning the 'flicking to' style is so difficult for me to learn, because I've got it deep in my muscle memory to use the 'flicking past' style.

It also feels very relieving that you went through exactly what I am going through, haha.

I'm a bit confused about the difference between 'flicking directly to' #3, and 'precision flick to' flick is. Are they the same or do they differ?

I personally want to go from my 'flicking past' style to the 'flicking on' style. Especially because if my timing is off, I flick past target again and then it's and endless loop of me flicking past the standing-still target haha. I'd love if you could share how I go about training that.

[civic silo]

Hopefully my tone wasn't too bad. Don't want to signal off bad vibes 🙂

[shell crystal]

Nope you were completely fine. I appreciate you! Gave off nothing but helping and good vibes. Nothing landed wrong, I just felt frustrated that I had heard the suggestions from others as well.

[dull hawk]

Lol I actually forgot about the “repeated flicking over” thing because I totally used to do that as well especially when using shotguns in-game. To answer your question, flicking directly to and precision flicking to would be the same terminology, sorry for confusing you with them 😅 but yeah, I meant the same thing but I was using the term “precision flick” in that instance to refer to the difference between the “flick to” focusing on precision vs the “flick to” focusing on speed instead. In a speed “flick to” it might feel more like you are flicking with your accuracy being more of a feeling and you flick with your focus being on making your flick fast with a short quick stop. In a precision “flick to” you might slow your speed down a bit and focus on reaching the head accurately and smoothly.

[shell crystal]

Awesome, yeah. That makes sense, thanks for clarifying. How would I go about training myself to go from flicking past to flicking on? I can do the training in any game or trainer probably cuz flicking is everywhere, I can even do it on my desktop screen. So any tips? Anything you struggled with that might help me?

[dull hawk]

I personally focus train with osu! using click for taps, though that’s a whole new skill and game to learn, but honestly I didn’t learn to “flick to” the target for a long time, I just used “flick past” and eventually when I became very good at that, I just started to try to get myself to stop on the target and click since I was already proficient with stopping power and flick speed and clicking as I see the head pass my crosshair and the only difference being that I would click as my crosshair landed on the head instead of passing it. Though, I will say that I struggled with flicking just past the head or just before the head and so I would just consciously change the amount of flick to be just before the head since there was a slight bit of bounce back after a flick from my muscles at the time, which DOES get ironed out eventually but it was a problem at the time and to overcome that, basically I just tried to consciously train it for a little bit like 3-5 minutes at a time during matches and when I got frustrated and exhausted from flicking over and over and having it go seemingly randomly before and after the head while trying to correct it consciously the whole time, then I would stop trying and just start playing the game and testing it out and trying to hit the shots in the heat of the moment and then I would repeat the process at random or when I felt like I wanted to practice it again in the middle of the match I would just pick a point in the game, pretend it was a head, and then try to “flick to” the target again over and over for 3-5 minutes.

Precision “flicking to” the target can be good for accuracy but you definitely don’t want to feel limited by it and give up on speed, so try to keep a healthy balance between the two and keep your main focus on whichever you would like more, better speed or better accuracy, I went with better speed, but I still have very good accuracy with it, though if you focus more on accuracy you could end up being one of the most consistent flicks the west has to offer lol but it’s up to you how you want to train.

[sage sphinx]

u go so fast that u cant microadjust

[shell crystal]

Thanks, I'll keep everything you've said in mind. I'm actively trying to notice how I aim now and amd trying to hit shots accurately with my flicking style in mind. Sounds like it's a long process but definitely one with a finish. I'm trying to flick the same way I flick normally, the flick past style, using the same muscles. But instead of flicking past, flicking on. I think that's what you said too. Thank you very much for your time and effort 🙏 You were great to talk with and learn from!