ptb-discussion

[calm wagon]

basekit soul guard is next

[uncut veldt]

yeah and its useless, u waste 4 minutes standing next to a downed survivor. its only useful when ppl r denying ur pickup w flashlights or pallet saves

[humble kindle]

basekit made for this + were gonna live forever

[true apex]

Pretty soon we'll see basekit flashlights and toolboxes

[calm wagon]

basekit flashlights so more people bring toolboxes and medkits

[tame lagoon]

I feel like Lightborn hurts you more than it helps as if you know it's a super alturistic team you're just making them touch those filthy gens instead of wasting their time trying to prevent hook stages. While not running it those players just linger often offer free injures giving the killer a lot of pressure and have like nobody on gens.

Only time I really see a lot of value is if it's a smarter team that doesn't waste all match trying to save and instead tries to save when it matters later in the match and applies gen progress earlier on.

[calm wagon]

lightborn is a perk slot waste but it's also AMAZING ragebait

[tame lagoon]

But almost every game I get a 4k on is because there's always that 1 or 2 dumb player who you know is always lurking with a flashlight.

[humble kindle]

basekit decisive, basekit smash hit, basekit power struggle, basekit

[true apex]

It's intended as basic counterplay/training wheels for new killers. It's fine as it is.

[calm wagon]

this isn't enough for me

[tame lagoon]

I'm not saying it needs to be changed was just saying from my experience I find it hurts you more than it helps you.

[humble kindle]

only run lightborn on killers like pyramid head, xenomorph, demogorgon, wesker

like they have no eyes/wearing sunglasses

why you shining beamer?

[true apex]

Survivors just hate it because it gets in the way of their fun

[solid perch]

I dont understand the new killer

[humble kindle]

spirit and plague had a baby

[tame lagoon]

I'm still angry they nerfed my favorite perk a while back... I used to love Shadowborn and now it's probably the worst perk in the game.

[solid perch]

Ok

[modest tree]

I run it for the pallet flashlight bs that they always do

[solid perch]

The shape rework is better then i thought

[calm wagon]

zoning distance denying demon

[modest tree]

I dont mind it honestly had alot of fun doing scratched mirror memorial flowers and getting jump scares

[true apex]

It's a decent perk for when you're starting to learn how to play the game, and has niche uses after that against very specific squads.

Perks are supposed to be like that, specialized options that make it so you're stronger in some areas.

The devs forgot this and constantly try to make universally good ones.

[humble kindle]

all will be fixed in DbD2

[ripe bison]

That is all its good for though. That lunge is pointless and terrible.

[calm wagon]

i will say her add ons are all pretty mediocre outside of the purple one that applies 4% hindered and the iri one that makes them start with leech 1

[ripe bison]

Theres also a purple one tbat applies blindness.

[humble kindle]

i think her basekit power is strong on its own

[calm wagon]

that's the same one funnily enough

[ripe bison]

Oh yeah lol

[calm wagon]

leech 1 applies blindness leech 2 4% hindered

[true apex]

We've had like a dozen DbD 2s by now, they all die

[ripe bison]

So all the survuvors can immedietly start the trial blinded yeah

[calm wagon]

strong but clunky so people are calling her weak

[humble kindle]

nurse is weak too

[calm wagon]

the weakest killer in the game in fact

[true apex]

I do think this is why the devs feel like it does not matter if they mess up.

There's no real competition against it

[humble kindle]

There is a perk called Hubris

[ripe bison]

If you hate stuns so much you can just run Hubris yeah

[humble kindle]

or play nurse

[ripe bison]

Or Billy with that one addon

[restive summit]

i hate pallets build (hubris, enduring, brutal, spirit fury)

[ripe bison]

Theres also the funny anti-pallet legion build

Pallet stun me out of frenzy? Naaaaah

[restive summit]

ah yeah the addon very spicy

[ripe bison]

Both of them are togather coupled with perks

[restive summit]

out of all killers i tried blight the hardest not even close

i respect all blight players

🤝

[ripe bison]

His irri addons make him so much easier.

[restive summit]

yea i was prob using dog water ones

[ripe bison]

Reminds me of a Blight I encountered once. The dude had an alternate color scheme cosmetic and kept missing their rushes. I looped the dude for a bit and then they DCed after like a minute or two into the game

[true apex]

Blight has one of the highest skill floors of the game, Along with nurse... But when it clicks, it CLICKS.

[restive summit]

i found nurse to be way more simple at least for me

[ripe bison]

Nurse isnt tooo bad to get decent at.

[restive summit]

not brainless but deffo very chill once u get some muscle memory

[ripe bison]

Assuming youre already experienced at the game

[gray shard]

Public test build, is it public enough?

[true apex]

On PC is easier though, and yes if you're already competent at the game it is simpler to get into.

This is what I like about killers though. Different styles will get different results from players.

I just can't hillbilly for example, I'm terrible at it.

Dredge, Demogorgon? I am very good with them.

Cenobite I love to play it despite not being too good at the aiming part. And still make it work

[modest tree]

I agree nurse and blight i can't do but ghoul yeah I definitely can

[restive summit]

i want to try billy more need to use q and e for turning cause using mouse feels like ass, have yet to try dredge and demo, and well ceno rip for me im newer so never can buy

i tried ghoul out and dont see how people say he brainless

[modest tree]

Dredge is really fun

[restive summit]

dam will try him out soon then

[true apex]

It's probably my favorite killer of all the roster

[jagged gull]

I am being dead honest when I say, I haven't escaped more times in a row since this update, it's not even a challenge any more, the whole fun of this game is that it was a bit of a challenge to escape, and it was fun to play killer. Now it's a walk in the park to escape, and feels like pulling teeth tryna play killer. Bhvr, fix ts immediately 🙏

[modest tree]

I can see that he's really fun to play with love his ability, for me it's probably the executioner or knight

[modest tree]

Yup im a shitty survivor, and even i made it out a few times

[true apex]

Knight is great too... I suck at it but it's very fun

[true apex]

Yeap, basically this

[unkempt elm]

Oof that bad huh?

[gusty violet]

hey guys I didn't play the ptb I'm on ps4, I wanted to see what do yall think about everything?

[jagged gull]

Yes it's horrible 😭

[gusty violet]

actually that bad?? damn

[true apex]

I had to go back to normal game after a couple hours on PTB just to remind myself what I like about the game

[true apex]

It's horrible, thanks for asking

[gusty violet]

do you think the one making it horrible is the tunnelling or the slugging update? or both?

[gray night]

Really not much difference in play

Tunneling straight off the hook is gone on survivor

On killer you still dominate if you have a brain

[jagged gull]

Dog shit, horrendous, needs to be reverted, the killer change to Myers is ok, hes actually a good killer now and has potential to be more fun, but another sloppy unoriginal instadown easy killer isn't needed, the krasue is fun, good if you learn her, can't do shit with her until these anti-tunnel system is reverted

[gusty violet]

so the anti tunnel are the shit ones, I see. watching some myers videos he didn't seem too op so I guessed he might be better now

[modest tree]

Only thing I don't like about the new killer is her detached forms m1 locks you in place

[gusty violet]

can't you lunge? pretty sure you can

[true apex]

The basic attack, it keeps you stationary

[ripe bison]

Every killer is easier on pc tbf

[gusty violet]

oh I see, pretty sure it's not intended

[ripe bison]

Her head form attack always lunges forward. Part of why its clunky.

[gusty violet]

so overall the update is like a 6/10 cuz of the tunnel thing?

[modest tree]

Hopefully its not, if you can hit your shots with her regurg you'll be ok

[jagged gull]

Yeah usually unless they have a shitty sens like hillbilly, but even then mastering hillbilly on keyboard and mouse will make you better then a master on console

[gray night]

The lunge has a small turn radius

Intended as it would be unfair if it was stronger

[modest tree]

Me personally would say a 4/10 they nerfed alot of killer perks and buffed survivor perks

[modest tree]

The detached m1 doesn't even have that unless it's extremely small on hers

[granite patio]

Agree tbh

[gray night]

That’s exactly what it does

[gusty violet]

oh yeaahhhh I forgot they changed perks I should check these out too, do you know where I could find the changes?

[modest tree]

Check reddit that's were i saw them

[honest hamlet]

basekit tenacity needs to be nerfed and the passive recovery should happen only when not moving

[gusty violet]

thx :3

[granite patio]

God I really hope the tunneling thing does not hit live, dont wanna be dramatic but that would just put dbd on the same path the TCM game took, and we all know how that ended

[honest hamlet]

the protection is fine but the punishment is too heavy and too triggernhappy

[gray night]

Across 50+ survivor matches a single person

One guy

Because the killer lost his slug

Got his basekit unbreakable

And it happened because you have to straight ignore the survivor on both sides

90s is a long ass time

[true apex]

I do believe the slug changes are the least troublesome

[native aspen]

this was my experience on both survivor and killer side as well

[granite patio]

Exactly.

For example, I already got all survivors on 2 hook, I dared kill one and I lost the ability to kick any gen, like why???

[native aspen]

it's extremely rare in a normal game

[true apex]

Now the hook thing is atrocious

[scenic nimbus]

do i have to download every time i switch between ptb and live version?

[ripe bison]

Yeah there are killers that more significantly suffer from using a controller. Every killer does though as at the very least it is way easier for a survivor to successfully spin you.

[native aspen]

I even had 4 survivors slugged in one of my killer games and they were only getting picked up because someone was abusing PTB conviction

[jagged gull]

Yeah, the slug change is fine imo, I just hate hate hate the tunnel part

[native aspen]

Yes.

[ripe bison]

Come to think of it, I wonder what is causing the immense lag spike when approaching the exit gates

[restive summit]

tunnel penalties need to be removed at 3 gens remaining

[dense geyser]

Just make it 4 hooks and gen speed buff for 2 hooks in a row to death instead of blocking all gens and its fixed

[gray night]

Tunnel part is actually my favorite part

What I agree needs looked at

Is the 6 hook stipulation

[native aspen]

What's the issues y'all are having with the anti-tunneling?

[fathom bane]

Mori offerings are bugged on the PTB currently and reveal themself to survivors. lmao

[scenic nimbus]

damn

[true apex]

The gates are heavy 🤡

[granite patio]

The slugging changes can go through, they are a good idea.

But the hook ones are a literal killing blow to killer, it forces you to play the same way regardless of what character you pick and is even more handholding for survivors.
If this can go through then maybe next update if survivors complete a gen in 30 seconds they should all get a hook state and be exposed all match right?

[ripe bison]

No. Reward the killer for not tunneling dont punish them.

[granite patio]

Exactly

[native aspen]

Punishment is a stronger behavioral tool than reinforcement.

[true apex]

This so much this. Make it an incentive to hook different players, not a punishment for hooking the same one

[ripe bison]

Rewards do a far more effective job at incentivizing without disruption of the gameplay than punishment.

[restive summit]

its not a reward versus punishment problem its a game design flaw at a fundamental level

[jagged gull]

Fr

[gray night]

I think the 6 hook thing looked at and tuning on unique hook haste buff killer specific and it will be golden

[granite patio]

Then punish sabo squads, punish genrushing, punish that one Kate perk with the horse -I forgor the name- squads.

Actually punish hiding or going to the edge of the map where there are no hooks

Or are those valid strategies?

[true apex]

Sadly, it also means that the play pattern feels forced and takes out agency from you, meaning that even in the case you need to "break the rule" because it's the only option, you throw the match

[native aspen]

I disagree, this is good for long term game health. Is the balance perfect right this second? No - that'll come with time, but they can't make changes to fit it if the system is never in place.

[ripe bison]

This only applies to killer who can effectively chase down and tunnel. You arent tunneling as say, trapper, without the very high likelihood of doing nothing but wasting your time chasing around a person like an idiot.

[unkempt elm]

Or ya know, don't stop gen regression but if they are hard tunneling giving a slight repair buff is fair, have fun balancing your kicks

[true apex]

Are they survivor strategies? Then yes 😂

[ripe bison]

A slight repair buff wouldnt be so bad as it might make up for the instant loss of a player that harms survivors so much.

[granite patio]

I got a situation today where
I was down to 2 hooks.
Got a survivor down on second hook stage, literally hook her and kill her.

What do I do?

Do I, hook her, getting a kill but losing the entire game, slug them and try to find simeone else letting her go and risking getting no kills

[native aspen]

If this patch results in kill rates getting halved then there'd be a problem, but that just isn't going to be the case. It's not that drastic. People need time to adjust their strategies, and I imagine these changes are fitting what their goal was.

[native aspen]

Sorry, what do you mean "down to 2 hooks"?

[spice tulip]

This PTB has officially ruined the game for me

[granite patio]

Already hooked twice

[native aspen]

Had you hooked other survivors?

[granite patio]

After the ""unique"" hooks ofc

[restive summit]

i think it applies to most lower tier killers it makes the game more artificially difficult and will reduce kill rate by no other mechanism other than an arbitrary system that is fundamentally and deeply flawed in its intentions, yes some of the behavours are not pleasant but such is life in a pvp game, by reducing suffering on the survivor side you are making killer gameplay more stressful stress is being offloaded to killers with no regard for their enjoyment of the game

[gray night]

So far on SM on ptb

All wins will do another full day of it but I don’t seem to be having any issues

Wasn’t someone who leaned on tunnel/slug so that’s probably why (not attempting to shade)

[true apex]

And makes it so new killer players have to contend with "picking the wrong killer to learn"

[granite patio]

So why is it ok to punish killers for being efective? Because the people that only play survivor, overuse Windows and run into walls 99% of the time refuse to improve on the game?

[native aspen]

I think it's worth considering that low tier killers would struggle against a good team regardless of these changes. It's just a different path to victory now.

[granite patio]

But there is no victory now tho

God forvid you kill someone with condemned

[gray night]

I think the people mostly effected have been the people that go straight to the unhook notification

[restive summit]

correct and also less people will want to try the role at all, its fairly obvious that killer role is less appealing due to performacnce anxiety etc

[true apex]

The only path to victory in many cases is getting one kill and throwing the match

[granite patio]

Oh how dare you use your abilities efficiently

[native aspen]

You have to consider that they weren't going to completely rework every killer that could be remotely affected by this large system change, until it was confirmed to be implemented.

[gray night]

Which I am glad they are moving away from

[restive hornet]

Trash update

[native aspen]

Yes, there are niche killer-specific scenarios that would need to be looked at.

[spice tulip]

Survivors shoundlt get rewarded for playing shit

[calm wagon]

sadako might need an entire rework lol

[granite patio]

Then dont implement it, simple as that.

If the playing ground is not fair for everyone then dont add it.

[native aspen]

But they want to test it and see if it meets their goals first before addressing them.

[granite patio]

Well clearly it does not since most of the community is begging them not to add it

[spice tulip]

i think there is alot of tweaking needed do cause rn this isint looking good

[true apex]

Notice how almost everyone does not complain about hiding the unhook except for the deactivation of killer instinct Wich affects specific killers.

It's the overall penalties that feel overtuned

[gusty violet]

ye killer perk changes are ass honestly. I don't even play killer that much but this is horrible

[native aspen]

I don't agree with that philosophy. Getting stuck in old ways prevents progress.

[calm wagon]

it's hard to do that in this kind of game especially with the fact that not all killers are made equally in strength, I think adding compensations based on how weak/strong a killer is was a good move

[modest tree]

While I agree, it's impossible to make both sides happy. But favoring one side over the other is a bad take.

[frigid briar]

Who are they making the game for? Themselves, or the people who actually play it?

[tame rapids]

they could also you know
punish only people who play like that with already strong killers

[calm wagon]

well rn it's only stronger killers getting less changes

[gray night]

Agreed it’s the 6 hook thing that needs looked at

Everything else by and large is fine

[prisma latch]

Hey ya'll. Where do we properly give feedback on the PTB?

[granite patio]

"Old ways" Dude it literally punishes you for being good as killer

[radiant root]

I've tried a lot of builds for the Krasue and here's the most powerful one I found !

• Perk : Coulrophobia / No Quarter / Distressing / A Nurse's Calling

• Add on : Chicken Head / Pig's eye

I'm not sure for the pig eye but yeah the perks works so well with her enjoy !

[native aspen]

I disagree, I really enjoyed the changes. Number tweaks, sure, but the core system has a lot of good behind it.

[granite patio]

Thats what I wanna know

[spice tulip]

i Think the 6 hook needs to be changed to 4 and some tweaking done to the slugging and tunneling benefits and then i think its amazing health update for the game

[granite patio]

Make the punishment not permanent

[restive summit]

i respectfully disagree, i expect pick rates on lower tier will drop if this goes live destroying and more so creating a more monotonous lobbies with more s tier killers

[native aspen]

I'd argue that focusing the same survivor because they're the "easiest target" does not qualify you as a good killer. Effective, maybe, but if you're only able to catch one of them then do you deserve to win off of that?

[true apex]

Six hooks and the gen regression block. It comes up in a lot more potential situations than what one would think of in paper, and in paper already sounded horrible

[ripe marlin]

Disagree, definitely going to be playing a lot of new Myers myself

[native aspen]

I think 5 would be fine too, that allows you to unique hook everyone and kill one without punishment.

[spice tulip]

yeah 5 or 4 could work but i still think survivors get massive buff for 1 fuck up from killer side

[granite patio]

Do you know how many times survivors act stupid and fly over the same survivor before you can even hook them so you get 4 downs? Is that skillful on their part? Should they be rewarded for their stupidity?

[true apex]

I believe 4 is ideal, but 5 would be a decent compromise

[calm wagon]

I think every unique hook should come with a forever entwined effect where the hook is faster

[modest tree]

My idea for the anti tunneling is

Change it to 4 hooks
Keep the 25%
Have the ability to gen regress but at a lower rate
Change base kit pop to pain res
Itll punish the tunneling

[gray night]

It’s another one of those paper versus gameplay

Didn’t have it really ever come up ok gameplay but I can see it’s issues

I would like a system that does t automatically make 3v1 an instant loss condition like live is though

[native aspen]

Sorry, "fly over"?

[frigid briar]

It's not about "catching", it's about punishing the Killer for the mistakes of Survivors, if they run into me consecutively - that's a misplay and I should have full right to take advantage of it, but instead - the Survivors get rewarded for getting killed?

[naive nimbus]

I agree

[worldly pewter]

How are the survivors rewarded for dying exactly?

[maiden mango]

new changes are so abusable nobody can deny this fr

[native aspen]

Most scenarios currently isn't survivors running into the killer. Many killers purposefully seek that survivor out. That is what this system is working on addressing.

[frigid briar]

I don't know, +20% repair speed and permanently unregressable gens?

[calm wagon]

that's what I think the problem with a bit of these changes are. They aren't neccesarily bad but they punish killers for survivors mistakes and also encourage bad plays from survivors like healing under hook but I think these changes are still a step in the right direction

[gray night]

☝️

[ripe marlin]

This is all obviously to make the new player experience better. The veterans are so resistant to change.

[cinder shoal]

Can anyone tell me if people actually wanted DMS and Pain Res nerfed

[fathom bane]

You've gotta remember, its worded VERY badly currently
Its not
"You need 6 hooks THEN you can kill someone"
Its "You need five hooks, and the 6th state can be killing someone"
A lot of people are misinterpreting it as "6 hooks then i can kill"

[calm wagon]

a lot of these changes need some toning down, but overall I think a lot of them are a good step

[native aspen]

🤚 I did

[true apex]

This, basically, if you find yourself in a game state where you have to either slug the survivor and pray that someone picks them up because you can't hook that particular survivor, it's a problem.

It also makes it so there's always one survivor that's untouchable by you. Because if you hook them you lose instantly

[native aspen]

It's been meta for years, it needed changes to shake things up imo

[calm wagon]

it makes solo queue feel a lot easier too lol

[gleaming drum]

I was just playing some rounds and feels like hook camping still not controlled enough. I was on a hook for at least 45 secs while Krasue circled me and no one could save me yet the bar moved up so slow?

[tame rapids]

they needed a nerf because with this update they would be even more popular

[restive summit]

the ux of tracking the new ruleset is not good

[maiden mango]

but then again you can run into killer making yourself a target and then killer gets punished for it

[fathom bane]

If there are survivors nearby the hook it slows down drastically

[frigid briar]

And yet, this system incentivizes running into the Killer in hopes they take the bait and activate these absolutely busted effects.

[gleaming drum]

she had us all injured so no one could really get me without going down rip

[native aspen]

That's something I'm still not clear on myself; I had someone die as the 6th hook and got the gen speed

[calm wagon]

with no collision this isn't possible unless the person is trying to make it a 3v1 at 2 gens

[worldly pewter]

Being in a 3v1 for 20% gen progress doesn't seem fair to you? also how do you hook the same survivor twice in a row with 1. info on hook and 2 they can't body block you

[gray night]

It’s a bug I guess I posted screens of it as well

[native aspen]

Intentionally dying is not the strategy people are saying it is. Being down a survivor is still worse than having all 4.

[calm wagon]

which has been effective actually so nvm

[fathom bane]

huh. meanwhile i didn't when killing on my 5th hook...
it was a mini-mori kill though so maybe it was just bugged?

[maiden mango]

as an artist main i dont like her future basekit pop is basically useless for her

[true apex]

The new survivor experience, new killers get to experience the joys of being pushed into unwinnable states

[maiden mango]

now only perk i can use on artist is ruin

[restive summit]

making the player check the far left of the screen for now fairly crucical info is bad design it should be integrated into the game for example hook state being applied as an aura on a visible survivor (no aura 0 hooks blue 1 hook red 2 hooks etc ) require no reason to check hud on left

[cinder shoal]

I get that it's annoying, but they just HAD to nerf them pretty hard along with Eruption and PGTW. They'll nerf DMS and Pain Res because people complained, but I see people complain about Lithe, Windows, and Finesse constantly, and I don't see any nerfs (Not that I think they NEED nerfed, just an example)

[ocean karma]

How is Myers in ptb? Any good

[fathom bane]

Very Good Rework

[maiden mango]

DMS had to be nerfed BUT PAIN RES DIDNT

[native aspen]

If a survivor is intentionally running into you and trying to die then 90s of slug is plenty for you to hit them then find someone else, if you feel you still need the regression.

[frigid briar]

Spoken like a true surv main

[maiden mango]

slug is ok besides basekit TENACITY HAS TO BE GONE

[spice tulip]

this

[worldly pewter]

I've been playing killer all day and literally ran into gen blocks 1 time and the game was over when it happened

[gray night]

I think they just need to tweak the numbers a bit and we are in a pretty decent spot

Unique hook state buff separate for each killer is something the devs talked about in the live stream as well

So people like trapper or SM don’t feel left behind

Even though I don’t on SM personally

[honest hinge]

No like seriously who thought that was a good idea

[maiden mango]

remove basekit tenacity and slug changes will be ok

[worldly pewter]

also good answer that's what i like to read

[calm wagon]

fan agree this is abuseable

[cinder shoal]

Yeah, it's too much, especially with basekit unbreakable

[frigid briar]

I mean idk go play killer for a few games and read what you said again

[tough mirage]

at the very least i feel like the basekit tenacity should only be implemented past a certain recover %

[honest hinge]

Whats the point of unbreakable as a perk now anyway now that its basically basekit

[tame rapids]

the crawling speed you get is almost comical, that's no slug that's a turbo snail

[worldly pewter]

I've been playing killer all day and literally ran into gen blocks 1 time and the game was over when it happened

[cinder shoal]

AND THEN THEY TAKE TENACITY OUT BACK AND SHOOT IT WHEN ITS ALREADY OBSOLETE

[restive summit]

what is your winrate today se?

[worldly pewter]

again idk how you run into these situations you make in your mind

[maiden mango]

and for the antitunnel rules drag punishment to 4 hook stages because and %15 gen repairing speed

[native aspen]

Waiting 90s is not going to be as common as you think it is

[tame rapids]

you can pick yourself more times thanks to the extra recovery speed if you fill the slug bar

[native aspen]

UB still lets you get up first down in a reasonable time

[tame rapids]

plus it's still a free self pickup before the 90s

[spice tulip]

A. Unhook Protections

Shorten duration—make the buff window more tactical, not an extended safe zone.

Restore some visibility—beyond a brief cooldown, allow killers to see unhook status again.

Eliminate aura reveal or scale it—too powerful with no counterplay.

B. Self‑Recovery Tuning

Introduce proximity-based delay—if a teammate is nearby, the self-pickup timer pauses (like anti‑camping zones).

Disable movement during recovery—require survivors to stay stationary to recover.

Reset the Resolve timer after each down—prevent infinite pickups once the bar is filled.

C. Rework Tunnel Penalties

Remove hard generator lockdown—instead, provide temporary regression boosts to all survivors if early kills occur.

Maintain gen-speed bonus for survivors only if their team isn’t too close to winning—e.g., 2/5 gens aren't broken yet.

Implement “favor” balance system—weaker killers get stronger hook bonuses (generator kick, haste, aura reveal), while stronger killers get more modest perks

[granite patio]

Oh goly I love having to forcefully play one way and not being allowed to try fun shit

[native aspen]

is that chatgpt

[frigid briar]

Interesting, people you play against don't take advantage of an easily abusable system, wonder what that says about your mmr

[bronze perch]

Why survivors complaining about getting tunneled in the ptb as if that's not the biggest change to test in the ptb? 😭

[tough mirage]

b-but now u cant have ur aura read while in the dying state!!! (they reworked deerstalker and removed dying state aura from nurses calling.....)

[granite patio]

This is a legit good idea

[maiden mango]

getting a kill at 6 stages is definitly not tunneling people are malding

[true apex]

I do believe there's possibility to salvage things, but not if they don't remove the kill penalty.

They can rework the buffs so they're more decent (and stop nerfing all killer perks thank you very much).

Homogenizing the play pattern just makes it so the already strong killers will be insufferable

[worldly pewter]

probably 70%

[ripe bison]

Havent seen anyone mention how they nerfed Nurse's Calling

[gray night]

It 100 is

[worldly pewter]

theres mmr in ptb?

[honest hinge]

It got nerfed? (Hello fredditor)

[frigid briar]

Sure feels like it tbh

[true apex]

I can totally get behind these, feels more fair

[granite patio]

Except, god forvid, actually getting a kill, oh no, no, we can't have that

[tame rapids]

you can still tunnel if you find it funny and you like making people upset, you'll lose if you do tho

[native aspen]

I'm curious how you think it makes strong killers more insufferable

[restive summit]

if using new killer thats good

[spice tulip]

Summary Table
Issue Suggested Fix
Overlong unhook buffs - Shorten, restore some killer info
Free self-pickups, no risk - Add movement restriction, reset timer
Tunnel/slug punishment - Softened penalties, dynamic gen pressure
Imbalanced killer strength - Favor-based, tailored hook bonuses

[worldly pewter]

No i didn't play her i played pig/freddy

[granite patio]

Again, tunneling is a necesary evil in certain cases like, 2 gens left

[native aspen]

ok yeah thats chatgpt

[potent spruce]

I think in krasue's head form if you pick up a survivor you can't block a flashsave by looking up or down is that true?

[ripe bison]

In the ptb it no longer shows the aura of survivors being healed while downed on the ground. Only injured or deep wounded survivors.

[spice tulip]

i have sheet and yeet it into that ( + Dont say u never used it )

[honest hinge]

Oh wth

[frigid briar]

By forcing killer mains to play Ghoul by Nurseblight, as these changes are just too much for anyone that isn't A-tier or higher

[prisma latch]

As a 70/30 Survivor/Killer here is my impressions after playing a lot of rounds yesterday, as well as watching some of the popular streamers play as well.

Anti-Slugging

• This didn't seem to be an issue for myself or anybody else that I noticed. I don't know if Killers are just avoiding long-term slugging altogether on the PTB because of the change, or what, but I think this change is probably mostly okay as is without hurting the game.

The Shape

• I don't play The Shape, personally, so I don't have a dog in this fight. My friend, however does, and he said it was very weird to try to play it the new way, but he might be able to adapt to it. I can't give much more insight than that here.

Anti-Tunneling

• And this is the big one everyone is raging about. It definitely needs some tweaks.
• For Killer, keep the new feature of showing the hook states of all survivors as well as the indicator for who you hooked last. This will help people who don't want to accidentally tunnel someone out of the game, but let's be honest, someone set on hard-tunneling someone out is already doing this without these QoL additions to the HUD.
• IF you must incentivize/punish actions, then you need to remove the punishment effects when there are only 2 gens left in the game. At that point the game is more than half over and hooking the same person twice in a row becomes more necessary to actually try to win, and let's be honest, that far into the game, it is no longer hard/intentional tunneling.
• The tunneling that we should be addressing is when someone is taken out of the match with 5 (maybe 4) gens left; after that, it should be treated as a normal game.

[native aspen]

looking down i couldnt but i could looking up

[potent spruce]

oh I see

[simple stone]

bamboozle any good with krasue?

[true apex]

As many have said before, the bonuses the system gives are easy to capitalize on already strong killers (nurse blight etc) and almost negligible for weaker ones.

So killer players will obviously go for the "best" option even more

[gray night]

Think the nerfing of perks is more meta shake up

I’ll agree eruption doesn’t and didn’t need a nerf and I think PR was also fair in its spot

I believe they just wanted to shake up the meta along with the 20% kick it seemed (on paper) to be too much regress

But in actual play I think it would be fine to keep their live regress values

[tame rapids]

the anti tunnel should just get disabled once survivors are down to 2 gens left with 0 kills

[spice tulip]

@native aspen So making google doc of what i experienced put the summaray into Chat gpt to make it easier is not good feedback for u ?

[maiden mango]

so like im gonna write my thoughts about ptb and i think most people agree about them

1- Remove Basekit Tenacity
2- bring punishment rule to 4 stages and %15 gen speed
3- remove blocking and cant regressing gen part because it can be abuseable vs stealth players (if you want something add limited gen kicks)
4- give myers a better pallet breaking animaton it seeemed chunky
5- krasue needs some better addons and qol life changes for her head form because you can hit obstacles very easily

[ripe bison]

Nerfing Monitor and Abuse is so obnoxious and pointless tho

[native aspen]

Respectfully, nothing's stopped people from playing the "best" option for the past 9 years either. This won't change that fact

[calm wagon]

the problem is that even in solo queue people are aware of these changes and purposefully playing a lot more altruisticly to delay the hook as much as they can or allow their teamate to go under a palette while still recovering. I think a lot of the issues people have with this system is the fact that it's making survivors be more bold and willing to go down

[gray night]

No idea why they did that either

[maiden mango]

nerfing pain res was also funny

dms had to be nerfed but not pain res

[spice tulip]

was needed do coming from killer main

[frigid briar]

Except now they'll have to.

[native aspen]

ChatGPT is not your own work; I'd prefer to hear it from you and not filtered through AI. I see enough AI at work

[native aspen]

No, nothing is forcing them to.

[stable ivy]

Just messaging to say please please please keep the unhook notif etc in the game. 💔💔 please keep it. please

[tough mirage]

definitely unneeded, the only killers it "buffs" is large tr killers and they aint using m&a anyway

[true apex]

Meta will always be meta, but with the changes, there's so many killers that get nothing in return for having perks nerfed or making their play pattern objectively worse

[calm wagon]

which honestly is fine by me if my solo queue teammates are better but the thing I realized was I can force the killer into unwinnable situations even more now without needing swf help

[spice tulip]

Welcome to the future drimmalor its how the world works but hey if u want summary fully done by myself il give it to u with pleasure

[maiden mango]

do you guys agree those?

[restive summit]

i play variety killer and if this goes live i will go hard sweat on nurse lol

[calm wagon]

yes very

[maiden mango]

bamboozle is a must on her

and she has some pallets she needs to break which is nice

[frigid briar]

If I may, what killers do you even play?

[ripe bison]

Instead of flat -8/+8 to the terror radius it now works off of a percentage in the PTB. -25% while not in chase and some higher percentage I dont remember while in chase. This hurts the killers who actually particularly benefited a lot from it like Hag.

[native aspen]

I said it earlier, but these changes aren't going to change relative performance of killers. Why shouldn't they implement these changes, then later buff killers in a way that fits the new ecosystem?

[maiden mango]

krasue is bad at double pallets, short tiles with obstacles

[gray night]

Copy and pasting Ai responses is not how the world works

You don’t get hired FOR sure if you send in that crap with a resume

And you get put on academic prob if you do it in any educational space

[native aspen]

I play a lot of variety. Mained Onryo, Artist, and others for a while

[calm wagon]

they've shown that they have this killer specific rewards system in place so I'd be fine with them doing this

[maiden mango]

you think these wont change killer perfomance 🤣

[native aspen]

But I jump around and play different killers all the time

[naive nimbus]

Myers is great for me

[native aspen]

Relative performance.

[spice tulip]

My man i own company and my site and some of my stuff is run by AI and i am doing pretty good but hey like i said i am writing it myself rn

[maiden mango]

these changes are totally ripping artist to a b tier killer trust me only perk now she has is ruin

[native aspen]

i.e. a "low tier" killer will still be low tier

[frigid briar]

And you, potentially having played Onryo in the PTB, are gonna tell me all of this is fine for lower tier killers? This is either bait or REALLY poor judgement.

[true apex]

We can agree that the buffs to speed and making the gens unbreakable is overturned at least?

[prisma latch]

As I said, I have no dog in that particular fight. 😅

[maiden mango]

as a artist with 1k+ hour i can say artist is getting ripped a lot in this patch

[simple stone]

does it affect pallet vaults too

[calm wagon]

no

[native aspen]

You're not reading what I'm saying.

[frigid briar]

Did you play the PTB?

As Killer*

[native aspen]

Not as Onryo, no. But I played PTB all day yesterday as survivor and killer.

[gray night]

Is it still up for another day?

[frigid briar]

Did it go well? Or was it a 1k?

[calm wagon]

I will say, sadako feels like the biggest victim of these changes (sadako main here)

[native aspen]

I don't know how long PTB is up

[true apex]

As Onryo it was miserable

[maiden mango]

this patch couldve been good if they nerfed decisive and shoulder the burden

[native aspen]

I 3/4k'd every game

[ruby dove]

oh right

[fathom bane]

Time for some post-rework sidegrade iri vault speed myers

[ripe bison]

Not the Krasue ones. It does effect Legion's vault speed over pallets though I believe?

[gray night]

Same on SM

[maiden mango]

shes still too fast tho

[spice tulip]

@native aspen TB 9.2.0 – Positive & Negative Feedback Overview
Aspect Positive Feedback Negative Feedback
Survivor Buffs Effective on paper for countering tunneling Overwhelms and removes strategic Killer gameplay
Self-Recovery Mechanics Player-friendly and smooth experience Undermines risk, disables teamwork, and encourages selfish play
Tunnel/Slug Reduction Promotes fair, non-toxic gameplay Feels restrictive and reduces core gameplay tension
Perk Changes Adds consistency and synergy to perk interactions Nerfs many popular or essential Killer perks
Queue & PTB Access Simplified setup with preloaded perks and unlocked characters Limited player base leads to long queue times, especially for Killers
UI & System Changes Streamlined PTB experience through auto-unlock and pre-equipped loadouts Confusing changes to shards, menus, and character access
Emotional Response Some players are hopeful for a more balanced future Others feel alienated, ignored, and fear for the long-term health of Killer gameplay

[simple stone]

im talking about krasue though 😭

[gray night]

Will do another day of it today I think

[misty yew]

Probably due to the increase in pallets to reduce dead Zones. Chases aren't exactly Onyrōs strong suit

[maiden mango]

krasue is mix of old chucky old billy unknown and plague

[spice tulip]

@native aspen There u go fully writen by myself of what i experienced in the ptb

[true apex]

Like, literally miserable, feels like you're fighting the game, the survivors and have to actively try not to trigger your own ability

[native aspen]

i'm sorry but copy pasting a table into discord just does not work, it's hard to parse what the columns are

[fathom bane]

Hm...... i wonder what offering the killer took

[ripe bison]

Krasue's "vault" is like Chucky crawling under pallets. Its not actually a vault.

[spice tulip]

Discord doesnt allow me to do that so yeah idk 🤷

[calm wagon]

it feels like you can't even play hit and run which is the only way sadako is really effective

[maiden mango]

@simple stone its still the strongest thing in her kit imo

[restive summit]

just codemn spam eat the penalities and enjoy life

[frigid briar]

Definitely not as Doctor, or Pig, or Onryo, or literally anyone that isn't Nurse, Blight, Ghoul, Dracula and Singularity

[maiden mango]

you have to play fifties around it

[heady orchid]

dont eat the penalties thats a lot of calories you might get fat

[restive summit]

LOL

[cinder shoal]

Making it to where the killer has no way of stopping gen repairs, AND giving a huge repair bonus is certainly a terrible way to go about it. They don't need to punish killers for tunneling, or reward them for not, they just need to make targeted tunneling harder, but make it to where a survivor that intentionally keeps putting themselves in harm's way still gets punished

[true apex]

Didn't even want to try doctor, I know it'll be horrible

[frigid briar]

Don't see any Trappers getting 3/4ks

[restive summit]

we love the calories and sadako kinda small she needs the gains

[misty yew]

Give Sadako some love. Or at least a good add-on overhaul.

[spice tulip]

got 5 yesterday by myself

[heady orchid]

anti tunnel should disable itself if a survivor performs a conspicuous action, they added that whole system in and it barely does anything rn

[frigid briar]

Did ai tell you that as well

[spice tulip]

Nope ( Yeet it into ai detector if ur unsure i aint gonna argue about this )

[native aspen]

See, you're approaching the conversation making assumptions about what killers are strong. This patch doesn't change the fact that those killers are on the weaker side, and against a sweaty actually good team, they'd struggle. That's not what I'm arguing here.

[maiden mango]

so like im gonna write my thoughts about ptb and i think most people agree about them

1- Remove Basekit Tenacity
2- bring punishment rule to 4 stages and %15 gen speed
3- remove blocking and cant regressing gen part because it can be abuseable vs stealth players
4- give myers a better pallet breaking animaton it seeemed chunky
5- krasue needs some better addons and qol life changes for her head form because you can hit obstacles very easily

[heady orchid]

what killer wouldnt struggle against a good sweaty swf though

[frigid briar]

Yeah, you're arguing that "these changes are good actually because the game is changing" or something.

[native aspen]

I'm saying that these systematic changes can be put into place and underperformers can be buffed around this system in the future.

[maiden mango]

this patch is still problematic because they didnt nerf DECISIVE and SHOULDER exchange of new changes

if all antitunnel perks were gone this patch would be ok

[native aspen]

Because if a killer is underperforming in the gameplay that BHVR wants for the game, then they deserve buffs.

[true apex]

It's horrible, that's my point. You get trapped in unwinnable states where you have to slug someone and eat the tenacity if no one picks them up, or kill the "wrong" survivor and lose the match

[restive summit]

by the time the buffs come round survs will get 2x the buffs disingenuous in my opinion

[heady orchid]

decisive is fine as is

[spice tulip]

i woundlt say remove them all but tweak most of it

[frigid briar]

Underperformers? Buffed? Whenever was the last time you played Slinger - he hasn't changed since then, go figure

[ruby dove]

anti tunnel for the anti tunnel.

[maiden mango]

have you ever run into 4 decisive and 3 shoulder the burden lobbies?

[native aspen]

I played slinger a few weeks ago

[spice tulip]

Slinger got shadow nerf since DBD keep adding invisible shit ass walls ( THis is coming from p100 Slinger )

[calm wagon]

these are extreme cases

[maiden mango]

like im saying current antitunnel is already enough miserable

[worldly pewter]

Isn't this the first time they added nerfs to specific killers?

[heady orchid]

no because its very rare and youre probably not going to do very well against a coordinated swf regardless of perks

[calm wagon]

right now with the current meta most people won't bat an eye to anti tunnel perks

[native aspen]

I have a personal vendetta against him, though. He needs to fix his jaw

[ruby dove]

They shouldnt be cases at all

[maiden mango]

not in my lobbies

[native aspen]

Yes, this is the first time killer-specific balance to base mechanics has been made.

[spice tulip]

When is the est Time the PTB Will switch to live ?

[true apex]

Not to mention the fun little moment where you'll find a 2 or heaven forbid 4 people squad with the same character skin and you'll be utterly effed

[worldly pewter]

Exactly so they can buff "weaker" killers in the future they literally stated this in the sneak peak

[native aspen]

The chapter is scheduled for release on September 23rd.

[heady orchid]

the hud tells you who youre chasing

[west pier]

Hopefully never lol

[frigid briar]

Surely if I ask you "How did it go?" you wouldn't lie and say 3/4k again to further support your point of view

[heady orchid]

do people seriously believe slinger is bad

[native aspen]

I mean I'm pretty sure I streamed those slinger games

[spice tulip]

Okay i hope they take the Community feedback Since dbd is known for just Not giving a f about there community opinion might just be me

[native aspen]

I'm not saying I 3/4K every game, but I also don't blame the game for my failings.

[ruby dove]

oh the same way nerfing sloppy butcher “opened design space for other perks”. Where is it

wheres the other perks

I dont see them

[spice tulip]

they will still push it and idk if dbd will lisen to its community

[heady orchid]

maybe you havent been paying attention there are loads of good killer perks especially recently

[west pier]

itsss cool if ttthey dont listen. ill quit and i gottt my moniess worth over the years

[spice tulip]

facts

[heady orchid]

why do you type like that

[frigid briar]

Yeah, because the random invisible wall where your harpoon should've easily gone through is not the game's fault. It's almost like you're just trying to avoid badspeak about the developers or the state of the game.

[native aspen]

You have to also remember that the people being vocal about these changes are mostly the ones unhappy with it. People happy with it don't feel the need to voice their happiness compared to those that are unhappy. That's just psychology.

[true apex]

There's no-chase moments and simply split second decisions you have to make on the spot, 2 players with the same character will make it so you miss the HUD on a critical moment. This change punishes that and I can guarantee survivors will exploit that

[spice tulip]

Most of the changes was needed like the perk nerfs and stuff but some of this Tunneling and Slugging stuff needs to be Tweaked like basekit tenacity and Hook state being downed from 6

[carmine bobcat]

real ones run dms, grim, no holds barred and oppression on singularity and hold the game hostage 🔥

[native aspen]

Arguing killer-specific interactions is not what I'm here to do, sorry.

[tame lagoon]

Behavior is usually pretty dense so they won't till it affects their income then make changes going backwards towards where it came from saying "There was no way they could have known as it was a minor oversight."

[native aspen]

Yeah, I'm all for tweaks. I just think it's healthy for the game in some form to add in.

[west pier]

grim, no holds, pain res, corrupt. Nurse and a dream

[true apex]

There's so much that needs to be tweaked before it goes live

[frigid briar]

"Psychology" being that people who like (thing) are fine with it and people who don't like (thing) want it gone. That's not psychology, that's basic human behavior. Trying to weave in smart words for absolutely no reason now

[restive summit]

🤝 🍷

[spice tulip]

yeah but rn its feels heavily towards killer's and punishing em for not playing specific way

[native aspen]

Human behavior is psychology my guy

[carmine bobcat]

Singularity is way more fucked to deal with

[frigid briar]

Then what ARE you here for? This entire game is killer-specific interactions, is it not?

[spice tulip]

Perfect example XD

[calm wagon]

not to be neutral andy but I don't think either of you are using the correct metric to address how these changes effect weaker killers. it's how much effort/how close these games are that i think should be taken into account as a lot of these 3-4ks are entirely reliant on survivors making one HUGE mistake. but in these changes I can see the room for error to go unpunished in survivor play has grown a lot meaning games are either gonna be a lot closer, unwinnable, or obviously you'll have those games where they all slip up anyways. what I'm saying is how dependant a lot of weaker killers are on survivor mistakes to make up for what their kits lack will struggle to find these 3-4ks

[tame lagoon]

I mean Singularity is one of the 3 annoying killers (Skull Merchant, Knight, and Singularity) that I've seen hold games hostage for multiple hours.

[native aspen]

"Deathslinger can't shoot around this specific tile" is not an argument against "every killer shouldn't be able to tunnel without punishment"

[spice tulip]

Buff trapper please 😢

[gray night]

the game doesnt even allow you to play matches for "multiple hours"

[frigid briar]

Slinger literally has nothing to do with the PTB discussion, I used him as an example of Bhvr not buffing underperformers as you implied they would if the changes go live.

[carmine bobcat]

Singularity with dms has to be the goofiest shit ever yoy tag em w the cam and if they stick the gen u tp but most of the time they run and it get dms’d 😭

[tame lagoon]

It used to be able to last for a couple of hours.

[ruby dove]

”Why is every game nurse now”

[heady orchid]

and they released back to back to back 🙂 not a fun time to be a survivor main

[spice tulip]

cause is the best killer in the game that Yeet's all the game mechanics out of the window

[ruby dove]

Survivors a month after this goes live

[native aspen]

This PTB specifically has added a way for them to buff specific killers basekit.

[heady orchid]

i just think a lot of killers are too shit at the game to switch to nurse full time because she is both macro and micro intensive

[spice tulip]

Also i would say if they Buff alot of low tier killer's i think the update could stay as it is but rn alot of killer's ar suffering from these changes

[desert crown]

People don't understand that killers do the things they do in response to whatever is happening in the given situation at hand. Most people don't load up a game predetermined to do some "toxic" playstyle - they do it out of strategic necessity.

[frigid briar]

And you think these buffs are proportional to what survivors get?

[tame lagoon]

Funnily trapper is my least favorite killer to verses. No matter how underpowered he is I just suck against him as I look behind me more than I do in front so I step in the dumbest traps (Yes I don't like him because of my skill issue)

[heady orchid]

i would rather take shitty nurses every game than boring w holding tunnellers

[calm wagon]

that's what I think a lot of killers problem with these changes are which is how lenient the game is being with survivor mistakes, coming from a survivor main or whatever people say to make their points come across as more substantial

[native aspen]

They won't know what killers need it until after they can get it to live and get good data, either.

[spice tulip]

No worries

[native aspen]

Try playing a killer besides Myers or Krasue on PTB and most survivors just DC

[spice tulip]

fair enough but hopefully it wont take them ages cause it will hurt the playerbase if this goes live as it is rn

[tame lagoon]

Yeah it was brutal I ended up quitting for a while and only came back last season because I had old console friends that got back into it and since now days has Crossplay I could play with them again.

[frigid briar]

No, they don't need it to go live to find out. This is what the PTB is for.

[calm wagon]

as i said I mostly play survivor but my recent killer main was sadako and how reliant her snowball is on survivors messing up is insane

[true apex]

This, killer is a highly dinamic role that needs to adapt strategies to whatever the other 4 players are doing.

Killers kits dictate the rules of the match, but survivor behavior around those rules dictates what the killer has to do to win.

[heady orchid]

literally all you need to do to fix this update is remove the hook secrecy thing and make the anti tunnel not count hook states where survivors performed conspicuous actions its that simple

[desert crown]

It's the same as someone playing Oni and complaining that survs are predropping and holding w all game when this is the most optimal counter to Oni. You can't morally judge a player for adapting

[native aspen]

PTB does not gather large amounts of data across the board.

[calm wagon]

guys did i actually say something right for once

[native aspen]

It's about general feel + bug identification.

[tough mirage]

the issue i have with some of these changes is theyll most likely affect killers that go into the match with no intention to tunnel or 4k slug,, its not often but theres been times where ive ended up hooking the last hooked survivor without realising quick enough or ive just not been able to find anyone else and i feel like these penalties would be too much for those situations

[carmine bobcat]

Can we give singularity 200
Biopods thanks

[frigid briar]

And everyone playing nothing but the top 5 killers if all of this goes live unchanged definitely will, got it.

[native aspen]

That's just not going to happen, but you are welcome to believe that.

[heady orchid]

also why do the gen piston things glow yellow whats up with that

[calm wagon]

yes this is what I said kind of, but a lot of the weaker killers rely less on their kits and more on survivor mistakes

[desert crown]

Yeah I'm a killer main and I never start out with tunneling or slugging - I only start doing it when there's like 2 gens left and 4 people alive, as the situation turns dire. With these changes doing this will only punish me further into a loss

[carmine bobcat]

Truthfully these changes do nothing to the top 5 killers but gut the others which isn’t healthy

[tough mirage]

for compensation, im gonna need a sadako tv spawned on every loop in the map, thank you

[frigid briar]

It baffles me how wrong and blind to being wrong you are.

[heady orchid]

man people still play skull merchant and trapper in big 2025 theyre not suddenly going to switch to blight

[ruby dove]

ah how history repeats itself

[native aspen]

My theory is it makes it easier to see gen progress from further away, and helps identify the basekit pop and such

[heady orchid]

it looks strange i dont really like it. but that makes sense

[carmine bobcat]

ill still continue to run 4 gen block perks as singularity and purely gen camp for an hour till the match auto ends and i win

[spice tulip]

u see it also if there repairing

[true apex]

All killers rely on survivor errors, some easily capitalize on them, some have to work for it.

It's ingrained in the design. That's why this update feels wrong, it punishes killers for doing their job

[tough mirage]

everytime i end up tunnelling a survivor i feel terrible but it's usually just because a loss is inevitable without it or i just didnt realise before getting into a chase

[heady orchid]

i dont think survivors should be able to see the glow it kinda kills a bit of the immersion. but for killer its fine

[native aspen]

I've told you my opinions and you've done nothing but tell me that I'm objectively wrong and bring up irrelevant points; so forgive me if I'm not interested in entertaining further conversation with you on this topic.

[calm wagon]

I finally said something right I feel amazing

[frigid briar]

Feel bad for these folks but good for them I guess, survivors are gonna be able to take a break from versing Nurse 10 times in a row and bully them.

[maiden mango]

meta stacking is more problematic than tunneling am I right?

[heady orchid]

this is how i feel all the time knowing im right about everything

[jade radish]

right

[tame lagoon]

I mean realistically getting tunneled sucked and all... But unless you where really bad and in a bad solo-queue lobby it normally hurt the killer more than the survivors as they could do gens without worrying about pressure being applied.

Instead when gens are being done too fast it was used as the main tool to balance the field by eliminating the weakest link on the team who keeps running into the killer without any situational awareness.

So while doing something about it isn't a bad idea, they went full dramatic about it and missed the shot so far you question if they're even aware of how their own game works 😂

[carmine bobcat]

who even chases in the big 25 as killer 💔

[heady orchid]

this is just not going to happen man idk what to tell you.

[jade radish]

just shoot surv and reel it up

[frigid briar]

This implying I have any interest in speaking to you further, you're clearly not allowed our amount of badspeak for fear of losing your role.

[ruby dove]

Yall survivors got like a bajillion good perks for anti tunnel. Use them.

[white prawn]

if anything people will be playing nurse more because there's only like 12 good killers now

[heady orchid]

true i lowkey just play ghostface and if i get destroyed early game i switch to being friendly and pretend that i was just playin the whole time

[carmine bobcat]

I dont even do allat i camp gens as singularity with 4 genblock perks

[calm wagon]

nah i find anti tunnel boring I like juicing with a healing/body block build because it boosts my ego

[tame lagoon]

Oh no, but that requires me to not run genrushing perks blastphemy!

[carmine bobcat]

The longer i can waste their time the better

[red pebble]

just seen a ridiculous survivor build that if a full 4man swf can pop 2 gens within the first 30-40 seconds of a match if the killer does not find them in that time

[desert crown]

These changes remind me of the difference between low-rank and high-rank in every other game - low rank everyone is clueless and doesn't know how to spot and punish opponent's mistakes, therefore it's pure rng who wins. High rank people pay attention to the mistakes of the enemy and try to capitalize on them, while they themselves try to play optimally to minimize mistakes on their part. This is the most bread and butter dynamic in any PVP game.

[native aspen]

BHVR does not censor our opinions; we just have a standard for our Crew about voicing opinions in a respectful manner. These are my legitimate opinions. I can tell you some of my opinions that are against BHVR's design intents, if you'd like.

[jade radish]

oh, thats odd... but understandable

[carmine bobcat]

Corrupt intervention:

[desert crown]

These changes cater to the low-rank mindset

[ruby dove]

Basically what im hearing tbh

[tame lagoon]

I'm a survivor main, but I get salty as hell when I play killer 😂 because I queue for like 30 minutes to get genrushed by a SWF and like "F playing killer this is too stressful."

[spice tulip]

They should have QP and ranked ranked has these changes and QP is just live server's rn this would be 10 times better

[calm wagon]

I used to think the game was killer sided until I finally played killer and realized I simply was not built for that

[red pebble]

thats a semi counter they can just find a different gen tbh and it does not even in culde weaving spiders to take 10% off the gen aslo

[earnest summit]

hey atleast the queue times are gonna be less so you can get genrushed more often :)

[maiden mango]

you guys are saying 4 decisive lobbies arent that much but what about 4 medkit or strong toolboxes lobbies, are those also rare for yall?

[calm wagon]

I can still 3k-4k a decent amount but it takes a lot more out of me

[true apex]

Killer is certainly a mood and a half 🤣

[carmine bobcat]

i dont think i can even be gen rushed with how i play 😭

[tame lagoon]

Yeah I used to many years ago, but then I tried playing Killer and its the most stressful thing ever. Every second matters unlike survivor where I can do whatever I want and not be punished.

[maiden mango]

@native aspen do you also think new map designs with new god pallets should also make it to live servers?

[calm wagon]

unfortunately for these takes we will be called killer mains in disguise

[hoary bramble]

they need to remove the anti tunnel when you are near other survivors since its crazy i get followed around by stage 2 ppl i just hooked bodyblocking and sabotaging KNOWING i can neither slug or hook them

[red pebble]

really also depends on the killer and how well they can pressure gens

[true apex]

Which is ironic since killer mains are supposed to be the source of stress

[maiden mango]

can anybody explain why crotus prenn got BUFFED?

[carmine bobcat]

Singularity i main with 4 slowdown gen perks

[lost berry]

Just met a survivor that said they liked these changes and told me to "cry and get better" 😭

[spice tulip]

Playing killer rn feels like i got timebomb around my body and if i dont do what the games want i blow up

[hoary bramble]

like anti tunnel is meant to be DEFENSIVE yet every survivor i face has been using it OFFENSIVELY

[calm wagon]

I audibly laugh everytime I look at the ui and see I'm playing against skull merchant

[earnest summit]

it got buffed?! xd

[maiden mango]

new map designs should never MAKE it

[native aspen]

I like that pallet spread has been evened out; I've always hated that maps just have entire inexplicable deadzones. I'm not sure what new "god pallets" you're specifically referring to, though. Some maps definitely swung too far and I think these pallet changes are the actual strongest thing this update that nobody is even mentioning.

[vital zealot]

Even without this - the game shouldnt feel like a linear experience. Playing killer with these changes feels like riding its a small word at disneyland. LET ME GET OUT OF THE CART LET ME PLAY THE GAME

[lean cave]

Sadako is cooked with the anti tunneling changes-

[red pebble]

thats good for you but ppl who like to play killers such as myers, trapper etc the slower killer we just get royally screwed by this

[calm wagon]

haddonfield is good that map is pretty killer favored

[carmine bobcat]

I know it’s stupid because now people r forced to high tier killers to win and cant enjoy themselves on simple weaker ones

[native aspen]

I have a gross example from Pale Rose for one, gimme a minute to find it

[red pebble]

was not meaning it in a nasty way btw the anwser

[hoary bramble]

i love how the game was fine with most killers being slightly weak with 50ish kill rates but BHVR take a steamy dump over everyting and tells us to eat it up

[tough mirage]

some of the maps needed more resources (like haddonfield) but i feel like some were unneeded

[carmine bobcat]

Ye dw bro

[spice tulip]

Old haddonfield was better

[native aspen]

Kill rates were higher than 50

[maiden mango]

macmillian has new god pallets, they removed god rocks but like some pallets seem exteremely safe

[carmine bobcat]

These changes royally fuck slow and low tier killers but the top tier ones stay basically the same

[red pebble]

why can't we just buff things till everything is balanced instead of nuking everything for one and not the other

[tame lagoon]

I'm a survivor main through and through because I could never get behind the insanely long queue times with how stressful being a killer was. But like even when I'm tunneled and stuff I enjoy my time because when a killer starts tunneling me I make the most out of it and try to make them flustered ect. by being toxic myself with t-bagging, getting greedy till they stop respecting then prethrow to waste as much time as humanly possible whatever to make them get too emotional to leave me.

Or like when I face a good Nurse or Huntress I normally enjoy it because what they can do is insane skill as I've tried and it's not nearly as easy as it looks its a lot of predictions.

[carmine bobcat]

but the issue is 80% of killers are in that low tier 💀

[lost berry]

Can anyone tell me why I Just met a survivor that said they liked these changes and told me to "cry and get better" 😭

[true apex]

THIS

[hoary bramble]

and and BHVR wanted them to be 60% iirc for a balanced game

[carmine bobcat]

Because this is behaviour were talking about and logic doesnt seem to exist for them

[calm wagon]

usually getting tunneled is a good thing if you are confident enough in chase

[spice tulip]

Average entitled survivor main just click next and go

[lost berry]

It's insane that people like that actually exist

[red pebble]

i'm only ever toxic if someone is toxic towards me ingame

[west pier]

And i get heavily trash talked for being good at nurse lol

[spice tulip]

what the game has become

[heady orchid]

not really, you dont get a chance to breathe and without being healed youre always one hit and a lot of perks dont activate

[spice tulip]

and this is fair ?

[maiden mango]

crotus prenn also have double pallets lmao

[tame lagoon]

Yep, and in most cases players who need to tunnel are very emotional so you can piss them off enough to make them tunnel visioned to throw the game to ensure your death.

[lost berry]

These changed better not go through in ANY way I dont care bro

[native aspen]

Like I said, some maps went too far.

[gray night]

"Rip Killer Update"

Meanwhile pt 7

[spice tulip]

ow i already said if this shit goes live i am quitting dbd and not returning behavior already made so many fuck ups this is just the final drop

[native aspen]

I like that deadzones have been addressed but some maps have too many. That's what people should be focusing on this PTB imo

[calm wagon]

as long as my team is on gens then it's either a 3 out or I'm also getting out. not to mention before I ran healing builds I'd crutch resi a lot so I wouldn't heal that much anyways

[native aspen]

People are just so blinded by the tunneling changes to notice

[hoary bramble]

51k bp, wonder how long that game lasted

[lost berry]

Whatever drugs they were on when making these changes are INSANE AND NEED TO BE KEPT OFF THE STREETS

[spice tulip]

XD

[worldly pewter]

Doesnt bp glitch when it's a bot?

[red pebble]

yep no logic of look tunnelling is a issue lets just nerf all gen regression and add a small bit to basekit to compensate and make new tools for survivors to use that make the game 100% faster as for the casual playerbase this is a loss who jst want to have fun and enjoy the game

[gray night]

have a vod can check was a long match

[tame lagoon]

I always give props to a good nurse and huntress... Because the games end fast and all as I was brutally murdered but when there's skill you can't deny it.

Like I remember playing Nurse with meta perks on the Stranger Things map and there was one catwalk where no matter where I aimed I could not blink onto so the survivors found that out and bullied the hell out of me as I was slower than them ect.

[lost berry]

Lock up the dealer dog

[calm wagon]

it does feel unfun to get hard tunneled though I agree since I'm not always the best in chase ever

[spice tulip]

Might aswell just play Main game and tunnel the fuck outta people for the last few days until this update

[true apex]

Because they're horrible and make for a bad play experience for one side completely.

As we have been talking the rest can get tweaked and fixed somehow but the tunneling changes actively wrecks the game

[red pebble]

can't wait for the rework for her tbh

[lost berry]

If survivors wanna kuck killers ill kuck them back

[gray night]

12:25

[calm wagon]

nah how much skill nurse takes is usually overstated she's pretty easy just boring blight is more respectable

[spice tulip]

facts

[tough mirage]

no matter how long that may take......

[lost berry]

Gonna play ghoul endgame only LOL have fun

[vital zealot]

This is not problematic in my eyes. If they just gave survivors more resources like this and weren't dead set on removing killer autonomy the game could feel good on both sides imho

[hoary bramble]

thast suprinsgly short for 51k bp, i thought it was at least going to be 20

[spice tulip]

playing hostage singu u 2 XD ❤️

[west pier]

You don't play high end nurse

[tame lagoon]

I'm 50/50 when it comes to chases I either last 30 seconds or I last like 3-5 gens. It really depends on how early I get put into the chase and if I've identified windows and pallets yet.

[calm wagon]

I play high nurse

[carmine bobcat]

Playing survivor u can have music on and be jerking it w one hand and win but as killer god forbid ur not dialed in u loose

[hoary bramble]

yeah i got that for legion too, lost that game hard aswell since i never played legion

[lost berry]

Lol

[west pier]

Obviously you don't if you're saying shhe doesn't tttake a lot of skill

[native aspen]

What specifically is making it a bad experience?

[lost berry]

"Wahhh I didn't win wahhh"

[red pebble]

yeah she might be my only hope tbh she can atleast hold mean 3 gens if played right but have to be locked in

[red pebble]

right

[lost berry]

Because even for people who dont tunnel are people who are punished aswell this is ridiculous

[tame lagoon]

Nah man, you clearly haven't played Nurse.... She's a lot harder than it looks. Obviously she's still S tier so you can do bad and often do decent because there's a weak link you identify early but if you don't find that early its 5-10 minutes of being bullied.

[carmine bobcat]

Hostage singularity is so clapped for survivors to face especially if ur smart and use extra range addons so u can place 2 biopods on the same gen and they cant emp both same time so they waste 2 emps 💔

[native aspen]

Can you elaborate?

[tough mirage]

i love sm but she just kinda sucks to play rn so i hope they dont just keep pushing back her rework with at least no buffs or changes until then

[hoary bramble]

the fact that surviviors can literally bodyblock you with 2 stages and you cant do anyting to them?

[ruby dove]

People off hook immediately genning in your face or just hover over for flashlight saves. They act untoucheable after coming off the hook

[native aspen]

I don't tunnel and I didn't run into any unplayable scenarios on the PTB.

[vital zealot]

I think the worst part about the killer changes are. Some people are going to respect them and be miserable for a whole patch - then there's going to be people tunneling anyway and working around the new changes doing toxic endgame builds etc etc. So the reality is the problem isn't solved and the people who inspired these changes arent going to be affected by them at all.

[gray night]

☝️ same

[calm wagon]

I made a joke that I play nurse while high but let me rephrase what I said, nurse is easier than most people make her out to be. Compared to Billy, blight, wesker, even huntress she is much easier to learn and get a grasp of

[tame lagoon]

Only killer I would say that has a higher skill ceiling is Huntress as a top-tier huntress is the most horrifying thing you'll ever run into as a survivor.

[lost berry]

Say you hook someone you get your haste get in a chase knock and hook that guy and JUST SO HAPPEN to run into the guy u hooked its 30 seconds of basically being a god

[calm wagon]

nurse has a high skill ceiling, but her skill floor is not as high as some people say it is

[red pebble]

especially if she keeps getting fire cosmetics like she has been she need at least a couple buffs before the rework

[gray night]

you can tell if they are yourt recent hook

[worldly pewter]

It's a unique hook how are you punished

[gleaming lantern]

So i have a question this "immunity" that the survivor gets when they get unhooked until they do a conspicuous action (unhooking, doing gens, sabo, and cleansing totems, healing ect.) With if you run into a "bully squad"? Stuns/blinds do not count as "conspicuous" so you could literally have one person whose been hooked not doing anything of those things just running around stunning the killer without being touched? Surv main here.

[native aspen]

90s of slug is a lot of pressure; and you could just kill them. A dead survivor is more value than any anti-tunneling compensation.

[lost berry]

It's not my fault if the recently hooked runs back into my face like what??

[native aspen]

That's where I'm lost as well.

[tough mirage]

"theyll forget all about how bad she is once they see this new cute skin"

[calm wagon]

again, not saying nurse is braindead easy but I'm saying she's not as hard as people make her out to be and there's way harder killers

[tame lagoon]

Nurse is hard to get into, but even when you're a bad nurse you can easily exploit the survivors weak links its all about identifying them early on. Benefits of being a S tier killer. As you have a strong ability to rely on.

[red pebble]

i can't get the timing properly down on her blinks and blink attacks i'm a smooth brain my brain no longer has adhd and does not move at lightning speed anymore

[urban stone]

dredge feels a little better with the haste and bbq basekit but yeah i get face genned bc of the off the hook bonuses and keeping up is really hard with all their haste

[worldly pewter]

You just said you hooked one then got haste chased ANOTHER one and hooked them then the first one came back

[tough mirage]

i cannot play nurse or blight to save my life so :[

[red pebble]

yep

[lost berry]

I miss worded say you hook survivor 1 chase survivor 2 hook survivor 2 and by that time survivor 1 is fully healed and STILL has the buffs even after you chased and hooked survivor 2

[native aspen]

I just genuinely don't think a survivor giving you a free down is as problematic as people are making it out to be.

[urban stone]

also anyone get a pole on swamp that blocked one of the new pallets?

[ruby dove]

The point is why is the other team getting a reward at all. Sure I can slug, but im supposed to just not hook someone for standing in front of me like a fish out of water?

[worldly pewter]

I don't believe he can have the buffs after being healed

[calm wagon]

there's sort of a feeling you get it's less of putting your direct thought into trying to approximate the distance. like tracer from ow which I main so maybe that made learning nurse a bit easier for me if there's any correlation there

[red pebble]

console players have it hard also so many good killers are beytond difficult to play on a controller like oni is borderline impossible

[carmine bobcat]

singularity tickles my brain in the right way with my health issues

[red pebble]

it's more so the timing of when i blink how long i got left to either blink again or swing or get exausted effect

[tame lagoon]

I find Blight to be the easiest S tier killer. I used to main Billy back when the game came out on PS when I played a lot of killer but when I quit and came back he was nerfed so hard I didn't play him again till recently when I returned once again this time on PC and his chainsaw within the 1st second I struggle because I turn like a 480 in .5 seconds as its hyperspeed turning so its so hard to control.

[vital zealot]

So just slug and "tunnel" anyway?

[tough mirage]

issue is im on pc i just suck LOLLL

[maiden mango]

Why are we REMOVING TUNNEL without REMOVING META STACKING?

[true apex]

1. Killers get actively punished if the game comes to a state where they have to take out a specific player for any reason.
2. punishes low tier killers since it reduces the strategies they can use (if genrushing and sabo squads are a thing that players have to put up with, so would tunneling and slugging)
3. The nerfing of perks in exchange for bad base kit replacements reduces the build variety, homogenizes play patterns and reduces player choice.

I could go on but those are the 3 main pain points

[proven cradle]

but having gen kicking and gen perks be rendered completely useless along with gen speeds being made faster by 25%
I don't even see HOW its worth it anymore

having 1 less person is good, but wasn't the whole point to apply pressure since they always had 1 less person doing gens
now they've basically got 6 people doing gens because each person might as well count as two

[maiden mango]

?

[native aspen]

It's going to take adjustment, but currently tunneling as a prominent strategy draws games out and makes it unwinnable for the survivors if it's early enough. That's what this system is addressing.

[native aspen]

Sure, why not?

[lost berry]

If killers get penalized for killing where's the punishment for survivors for doing gens

[calm wagon]

damn, blight is the s tier killer i struggle the most with along with Billy

[maiden mango]

shoulder the burden and 4 decisive strike lobby: hello there

[proven cradle]

there is none and there will be none

[lost berry]

To fix tunneling and such just make gens take longer then you WONT NEED to tunnel someone out so early

It's that simple

[maiden mango]

Why are we REMOVING TUNNEL without REMOVING META STACKING?

[worldly pewter]

i agree make gens take 180 seconds

[maiden mango]

meta stacking has to be gone

[proven cradle]

also, if BHVR "listens to the majority"
wouldn't they be listening to killers?

because don't they often end up with the BP bonus
basically any time I play, survivors are being played less

[lost berry]

Literally we dont need all this junk just make gens take longer its that simple

[calm wagon]

it's just not tunneling as a strategy it's tunneling as a means to actually be toxic which happens to overlap with the strategy

[tame lagoon]

Billy for me, then Nurse. I find Blight to be easy to control and a lot of players aren't ready for him so he catches them out of place a lot then the one or two good players on the team it takes you like two seconds to relocate to the other side of the map to someone out of place.

[calm wagon]

I just find bump logic confusing and turning

[lost berry]

You cant control a toxic bunch dont let some bad apples ruin it for literally everyone

[calm wagon]

gens should be longer though I agree

[proven cradle]

I guess killers having Blight was their justification for doing all this

[tame lagoon]

If I ever tried to Killer main (If the queues got better) I'd for sure want to go Huntress her skill ceiling is insane and horrifying. But basekit she's hard to get into.

[native aspen]

my hot take is blight shouldnt be able to break pallets in power

[restive summit]

majority of players are survivors im am sure

[maiden mango]

shes gonna die after the perk nerfs dont even bother to

[calm wagon]

my chosen killer main after just playing a bunch of them is sadako

[worldly pewter]

would you say the changes are fair if they make the anti tunnel punishments turn off after 2 or 3 gens

[red pebble]

yes longer gens but still let them have options to do em slightly faster not this new 30 sec gen bs

[tame lagoon]

How so?

[proven cradle]

for every gen that is completed
the others take more charges to complete

now we're both punished for doing the objective :D

[maiden mango]

artist and huntress is legit dead now thanks

[calm wagon]

sort of like 2v8

[maiden mango]

perk nerfs are gonna hit her hard

she used to be a good dms pain res user and now thats gone

[dusty edge]

@unkempt sapphire 🚫➡️ Your message content contains flagged text

[proven cradle]

I play the twins...

[spice tulip]

now this seems fair tbh\

[wise tide]

I have noticed that it's some some gens that haven't been touched either. I think it's a visual the more gens completed then the fire spits. I'm still trying to work it out can't lie 🤣

[dusty edge]

✅➡️ [NO DM] Banned 344_8 with reason compromised account
(1 ban(s) on record | 5 total logs)

[tame lagoon]

I dunno about that. You see a lot of high end huntresses not even worrying about slowdowns its nothing but intel so you can keep the survivors scared.

[lost berry]

The punishments are to harsh thinking dog training reward good behavior dont punish bad reinforce "good behavior" with rewards dont punish because it simply creates rebellion

[maiden mango]

i mean you can still put pressure there its just you wont get 4 slugs at 1 time

[calm wagon]

twins is not as dead as people are saying they are

[proven cradle]

but it won't happen
because BHVR favors survivors
and this would make their time playing "less enjoyable"

[maiden mango]

bcs ppl dont force locker grabs

[carmine bobcat]

can mental issues affect how i play singularity i feel like some of my conditions help me dial in

[spice tulip]

DBD will and always will stay survivor sided game

[lost berry]

Autism lock in

[maiden mango]

but there are cases you cant force locker

[spark valve]

the ghoul:

[vital zealot]

Because that's stupid? 90s is enough time to finish a chase if you aren't an idiot, sure. But not abiding by the survivor rulebook now results in what is practically an instant loss. All this update has done is enabled survivors to be more toxic, it does not feel like balance it feels like "lets see how killers like it for a change "

[spice tulip]

ur point ?

[lost berry]

Ok survivor player

[tame lagoon]

This patch is clearly designed around those Survivor lobbies where you run the killer around for 4+ minutes to see the huds of the other 3 survivors doing nothing, except maybe opening a chest and cleansing dull totems.

[proven cradle]

Twins IS and HAS been dead
they're played LESS than a killer that was purposefully nerfed into the dirt because they couldn't kill switch a killer for 2 years

[naive abyss]

With the anti tunneling updates coming up, should I still get DS?

[spice tulip]

no its useless

[spark valve]

they go whichever side gets em more money at the time. usually its survivor but when it's killer it's horrible. (ghoul prime example)

[native aspen]

"Survivor rulebook" is and always has been a strawman. Address it as game mechanics or not at all.

[spice tulip]

Survivor rulebook is laughing stock

[spark valve]

do you only play killer?

[lost berry]

Simple fixes and not all this

1. Just make gens take longer so you don't NEED to tunnel

2. Don't punish bad behavior reward good behavior

[proven cradle]

Survivor rulebook is just "let ME have fun, and your fun has to entirely revolve around that"

[lofty glen]

i think we all know what survivor rulebook is, dont tunnel, dont slug, dont camp or theyll cry youre toxic

[proven cradle]

ah yes, the killer that got nerfed because survivors complained about it

[red pebble]

it exists and its ruining the game everything has to go how survivors want if anything slightly makes things harder or irritating etc it goes or gets nerfed into the ground thats it

[spark valve]

got nerfed *because it was extremely unhealthy for the game and overpowered

even killer mains knew he was OP

[lost berry]

U definitely only play survivor

[dusty edge]

@lean pecan 🚫➡️ Your message content contains flagged text

[spice tulip]

XD ur a good comedian

[spark valve]

u 2 def only play killer

[spice tulip]

yeah ?

[ruby dove]

The ironic thing is that the stuff in the “rulebook” is exactly whats being addressed

[lofty glen]

bro really does look like he mains a certain role

[gray night]

"Rip Killer Update

Meanwhile pt 8

[lost berry]

Indeed trust

[spice tulip]

i can see ur a avg survivor entitlted prick that abuses the game how it is

[lost berry]

Preach

[spark valve]

if u played even one survivor game against release ghoul you would know how unhealthy it was

[quasi thistle]

Killers get nerfed the moment survivors have to use 5% of the brain or make an effort

[proven cradle]

fuck the survivor rulebook
can we get a killer rulebook

[tame lagoon]

I mean hot take, did you know slugging would be less popular if... Okay hear me out, instead of running toxic perks players ran perks based around the issues they ran into... Like for example Unbreakable.

It's odd... It's almost like the issues have counter play that people don't want to do because they don't want to run situational perks only meta perks.

[red pebble]

i play both and as for the feeling if the game its definatley survivor sided game so much easier as survivor than killer fr

[calm wagon]

this is a hard conversation for me to really engage in as I play mostly survivor but my general take is that the game favors survivor atleast in the greater macro of the game. but I think the game is more nuanced than the entire sided argument and boiling it down to this doesnt get us anywhere

[spice tulip]

Nice opinion however ( NUH UH )

[native aspen]

I've played this game since 2017. Tunneling and slugging has always been a pain point that leads to unfun scenarios. Why shouldn't it be addressed?

[spark valve]

i agree but some ppl here think there have never been issues with killers being OP

[calm wagon]

survivor sided has always come down to the fact that the killers can't afford to waste as much time as survivors can if that makes sense

[spice tulip]

i never play ghoul anyways i am p100 Pyramid/DeathSlinger/Wesker/Nemisis

[gray night]

it doesnt

[lost berry]

Because survivors are OP dude

We get punished for killing?????

[lofty glen]

cuz killers rely on it, bad game design i guess but otherwise survivors become stronger

[red pebble]

i agree he needed a nerf but not to this extent the essentially nearly gave him the skull merchant treatment u now get punished for using your enraged mode and or power, break pallet no power, vault over pallet no power, hook someone no power i see a pattern here

[spark valve]

i agree newest PTB is extremely horrible and that should never be a thing

[spark valve]

agreed, he needed nerf but not that hard

[ripe marlin]

Do killers genuinely enjoy the tunnel/slug tactics? So much uproar over something I consider boring gameplay.

[spice tulip]

so why did u start arguing against it not being

[calm wagon]

there's more obviously but what I'm saying is that the game being a 4v1 quite literally makes the game naturally lean towards survivor due to how much you can be rewarded by just having one good chase or the killer failing one mind game

[lost berry]

I've literally never did it

[spark valve]

i never argued the PTB is good.

[ruby dove]

Because the issue is complicated, tunneling doesnt even happen on purpose either. Yes sometimes it will, because thats kinda just hunan nature, but the game is not designed for killers to play fair.

To quote here: “I aint got time for that”. Every second counts

[hoary bramble]

self report

[proven cradle]

will BHVR ever address Gen-Rushing or Bully Squads?
they're not fun to go against either 🤔

[gray night]

its the opposite actually.

[spark valve]

i argued against you saying game has always been and will only be survivor sided

[native aspen]

A lot of people have decided that it's necessary to win. They don't want to adapt because they've been doing it for years.

[tame lagoon]

Literally 90% of the reason some people complain Killers are OP is due to the fact that the survivors are too lazy to bring situational perks to counter common killer strategies as they could get constant value from genrushing or chase perks.

So of course Behavior wants to nurture this behavior and punish the killers due to the survivors not wanting to run situational perks.

[calm wagon]

I wanna know what you mean

[ripe marlin]

What is 'bully squad' please define

[gray night]

☝️

[spice tulip]

This

[restive summit]

it not even debatable that tunneling is the most optimal strategy

[hoary bramble]

then they bring 3 flashlight, head on, sabo and other BS

[lofty glen]

and the devs tend to balance things around the best potential of either role (s tier killers and swfs), which kills weaker killers and soloq

[gray night]

the game wouldnt work if it was not inherently killer sided.

The problem comes when the magnitude of that exceeds normal levels. Ie

Blight/Kaneki/Nurse/Billy etc....

[spark valve]

those 4 man squads that try to make the game miserable for killers

[foggy verge]

do yall think krasue needs a buff

[native aspen]

"Bully squads" mean a free win because they're not doing gens. "Gen rushing", outside of rare instances (i.e. Hyperfocus), is just a lack of killer pressure.

[calm wagon]

this is extremely vague give me an example

[lost berry]

Next update killers found repairing gens

[native aspen]

She is very strong imo

[red pebble]

the run perks specifically to ruin the killers experience in the match their whle perk, item and addon loadout is made soley to piss the killer off and force a dc

[tame lagoon]

Its crazy, if I get tunneled every game its almost like theres an insane amount of second life perks, or if I get slugged constantly its like theres perks to punish slugging. But nah I gotta keep running my Sprint Burst, Fixated, and Vigil instead because I'm entitled.

[spice tulip]

We need lore accurate nemesis so i can yeet survivors across the map

[lost berry]

DEAD by daylight not fuxk you killer by daylight

[spark valve]

we need rocket launcher power

[tame lagoon]

I want my Sheva to be able to shoot a rocket launcher to stun the killer.

[proven cradle]

just because bully squads can end up as free wins, it doesn't make it any less annoying
I mean, their entire point is to piss off the killer

[tame lagoon]

She always begs for a rocket launcher in menus so just give her one already.

[spark valve]

this new PTB adds changes that makes it miserable to play as killer or survivor which is nice! good job BHVR ^-^

[calm wagon]

again this doesn't really explain a lot what makes the game inherently killer sided

[ruby dove]

I dont think we remember bully squads the same way

[gray night]

You wouldnt have a target goal of 60% kill rate if it was not killer sided

[native aspen]

That's the nature of a PvP game. Tilting your opponent is always a valid strategy

[spice tulip]

Cant wait to play FC26 and not dbd if this update goes live

[proven cradle]

and with Gen Rushing
honestly not sure how I'm supposed to pressure 3 other people who are on gens when I'm chasing the 1 person not on a gen

[restive summit]

lol so biased

[native aspen]

throwing a "?" into match chat in overwatch after you kill them and they decide to throw the game afterwards

[lofty glen]

nah its pretty good, somewhere between A and S
shes up there with blight and ghoul in terms of mobility, and i like to contrast her to kaneki in the sense that kaneki gets a free tag but then becomes an M1, and she needs to work to start her infection but then gets super strong AT the chase

[gray night]

You wouldnt beable to, at least I do even on SM (weakest killer in the game btw, win a majority of your matches.

If the game was not killer sided

[hoary bramble]

yet what killer are at 60% since rn its none of them

ok bar hag

[native aspen]

We haven't gotten stats since the go-next implementation.

[ruby dove]

Cool so me attacking one person the entire game to tilt them is also valid.

[hoary bramble]

even in current patch

[native aspen]

A lot of stats before then were skewed because of people giving up.

[restive summit]

its all about fun and troublesome strategy when its the killer role and just get good but for survivors "its a valid strategy to tilt your opponent"

[gray night]

☝️

[stray rivet]

I heard enough, nerf hag

[native aspen]

If the game lets you, sure.

[tame lagoon]

Remember the good ol' days when you had double the pallets on the map and perks like Object of Obsession just gave your team a easy win with coms, or the fun old self-care that you could heal in chase after dropping just a few pallets 😂

[hoary bramble]

which should make them boosted in the killer direction as killers give up less frenquently

[native aspen]

Sure. And it was above 60% back then generally.

[spice tulip]

Old dbd was peak

[gray night]

agreed bring back old DH

And hook grabs

And infinites

And face camping

And requiring someone to bring BT for you

[tame lagoon]

Wow, I think we need to nerf trapper first. Maybe make him only be able to have one trap set at a time so it's like russian roulette on which trap is gonna getcha.

[stray rivet]

Okay let's meet in the middle and nerf Skull merchant

[spice tulip]

shes ass

[ruby dove]

dont forget the hatch standoff

[tame lagoon]

Easy solution, lets solve all these problems.... Bring back face camping basement Bubba with Insidious.

[stray rivet]

Doesn't matter, she is rich, she must be taxed more

make her a survivor

[calm wagon]

kill rates have never been an effective way of measuring how strong/weak killers are. any killer can get 3k-4ks the problem is the conditions in which those kill rates rely on which are survivor mistakes rather than killer having the upper hand. an example would be sadako having a high kill rate but still being extremely weak, the reason is that she's entirely reliant on one survivor messing up and not tracking their condemned. taking into account how reliant these weaker killers are on survivor mistakes as a win condition doesn't make the game naturally killer sided it's the opposite of that, killer thrives off of inexperience on behalf of survivors and is almost entirely reactive (most killers atleast)

[lofty glen]

in general these changes suck in practice but they open the way to even more big macro adjustments which we definitely need to balance this game, for too long its been all about perks and meta

[spice tulip]

XD fair

[hoary bramble]

when? when was the average killer above 56%

[twilit heron]

Ik ts prolly been brought up multiple times but are most of us in agreement that PTB changes can't go live?

[lofty glen]

real

[gray night]

Well thats the game we play.

You cant discount messups thats part of pvp gameplay

Noone here, not even streamers play a perfect game

And they play this game as a career

[stray rivet]

They need a heavy rework, I honestly think all of these changes punish weaker killers more then stronger ones

[spice tulip]

Yeah its fucked rn and shoundlt go live but hey its dbd they will just do it and not care until there Revenue drops and realise it

[ripe marlin]

Anyone actually talking PTB or is this Us vs. Them chat?

[soft tundra]

yeah if they go live I think a big part of this game will crash

[hoary bramble]

since rn only 9 killers are above 55, aka datawise in a balanced state and the 2 near 60% are low pickrate knowledge check killers (hag and freddy)

[twilit heron]

The only ones I find least problematic are slugging changes.

[tame lagoon]

I mean I don't think a single player thinks the PTB as it is, is any good. There's of course a couple good changes but most of it is just blind changes trying to reward entitled survivors not wanting to run situational perks.

[native aspen]

I don't have them on hand. But it's also good to remember that the stats the devs give us are not for drawing conclusions off of, as numbers without context are worthless.

[stray rivet]

until their revenue drops
The benovelent Fnaf Part 2 chapter dropping:

[twilit heron]

The slugging changes are meh to me.

[tame lagoon]

Behavior is talented in knowing how to make the entire community agree they make bad decisions.

[spice tulip]

EA Makes better decisions then them

[stray rivet]

my problem with slugging changes, as i mentioned before is they

pressed enter too fast

give me a second

[hoary bramble]

yet i am curious how they even balance the game since they can clearly see MMR so how did this patch get made?

[tame lagoon]

Just wait till DBD follows EA and to get a new killer you have to open loot crates with less than 1% drop chance on the killer that cost $10 each.

[ruby dove]

The slugging changes are honestly whatever. I barely care, its just another free perk in rare cases

[spice tulip]

XD i would laugh so hard to seeing its downfall then

[soft tundra]

slugging changes are fine to me, like honestly whatever, but yesterday a bubba killed me at 5 hook stages and he got fucked over massively. genuinely absurd I don’t know how this is supposed to be a good thing

[stray rivet]

I think the slugging get up timer should be on a set duration (maybe less than 90) each slug instead of 90 total.
total punishes slower killers more longterm than faster killers. It just means higher tiers are even better at slugging now compared to the lower tiers than they already were.

[twilit heron]

I think Gen times need to increase again.

[ripe marlin]

Imagine they CONTINUE balancing after these changes to improve the new gameplay strategies? Geee whiz!

[ruby dove]

oh god please not again

[native aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/mind-blown-shocked-ashtonished-astounded-explosion-gif-4927161

[soft tundra]

the issue is that at its core, these mechanics aren’t good

[hoary bramble]

statiscally is simple: Low winrate and high pick reate means dilluted data by bad players, aka nurse, and thus should look towards the higher percentile for balance

[tame lagoon]

Yeah you're right. Lets make it so the killer has to loop the survivors to survive.

[stray rivet]

or you know, they could slowly introduce these changes instead of dumping like, 7 different game altering mechanics at the same time an expecting everyone and everything to test them without conflicting experiences.

[hoary bramble]

low pickrate high winrate means knowledge check, ppl dont play vs them enough to know how to beat

[native aspen]

What about the core isn't good?

[hoary bramble]

high winrtae and high pick rate means unbalanced

[ruby dove]

Wheres the design space for the antihealing? Rip sloppy butcher

[calm wagon]

yes but the issue is that, especially in this update specially, the leniency it has for survivors making bad plays whether it be healing directly under hook or even being able to die in open but still find your way to a palette while also recovering. the room for error on survivor is larger and and is getting even bigger in this update

[tough mirage]

yess i agree with this a lot

[tame lagoon]

Ain't nobody a better killer than a Sable.

[soft tundra]

not being able to regress gens if you kill someone before 6 hooks is good to you?

[spice tulip]

peak gameplay

[slim sleet]

I feel like its hard to test all this stuff at once

[tame lagoon]

Best killer in the game is a Sable at S++.

[native aspen]

What if the number was 4?

[calm wagon]

which as i said, makes killer less of a power role

[native aspen]

Also, that's not how the mechanic works btw.

[soft tundra]

yeah, if they nerfed it to 3 or 4 it would be fine, but 6 is absurd

[tough mirage]

its good for them to implement big changes like this AS LONG AS they dont implement them all at the same time like they are

[stray rivet]

I am really confused on why all of these changes are happing at the exact same time, There are way too many moving parts to test all of them cleanly I feel like, this should have been a staggered thing where they slowly add stuff over time so people can actually focus on the different parts, it's a mess currently

[soft tundra]

is it not? that’s what happened to my friends and I yesterday

[hoary bramble]

also bring back hook visibilty

[native aspen]

Blocking regression is if you hook and kill the same survivor twice in a row

[ruby dove]

its two parts

[native aspen]

The 6 hook criteeria is for the 25% gen speed boost

[spice tulip]

Just give us Old dbd back with peak gameplay that will sort everything

[tough mirage]

since these are such big decisions, they need to look at the data and feedback more carefully than just a perk number value change, so i dont understand why theyre doing so many in one update

[soft tundra]

even then it’s a bit much IMO, sometimes people just run into you and it’s not your fault

[soft tundra]

ah I didn’t know that! I was confused I will admit

[hoary bramble]

devs got tunnled too much, we all know their skill level after all

[tame lagoon]

Remember the good ol' days when Nea's would chase the killer while clicking their flashlight every time you turn your back on them.

[ripe marlin]

Shock and awe, too many things to complain about at once, maybe there won't be a united front on any in particular and everyone is just expected to adapt? Lol

[jagged gull]

just abused it lmao, i was on death hook, last hooked and saw a dredge coming up on me, so i decided to keep doing my gen so he can hook me and lose gen regression, clipped it too, its not fair lmfao

[native aspen]

So back to my point - the specific numbers not mattering, is the core of the mechanics bad?

Or do you have issue with it being 6?

[tame lagoon]

Bring back dark maps with fog offerings so I can go back to being a P3 Claudette hiding in the open.

[native aspen]

Dying on purpose is not a strong strategy and people will soon learn that

[calm wagon]

unique hooks are a really good step

[slim sleet]

I think the hook visabillity thing is whatever, making a note of where my hook is seems good enough, if you want the bonus effect you'd best just look for someone else anyway

[jagged gull]

it is when it completely says fuck you to any gen regression lol

[soft tundra]

i think the idea is there but they way they executed it is bad. yes if they brought it down from 6 it would be BETTER, but I think it’s more beneficial to incentivize unique hooks versus punishing doubles

[ruby dove]

The core of the mechanic is that while it may attempt to quell tunneling it allows the one unhooked to be extremly agressive

[hoary bramble]

yet we dont have any of that data? idk why dbd hides all the balance data then cooks a turd

[native aspen]

Ok so I just don't run any regression perks and you let me take a survivor out of the game. Then what?

[jagged gull]

you lose

[native aspen]

They've incentivized unique hooks before. It didn't work.

[native aspen]

I disagree!

[spice tulip]

que times on the PTB ar so dogshit

[ruby dove]

Was 20 yesterday. How bad is it now?

[warped sentinel]

For survivor, killer, or both?

[jagged gull]

you're wrong

[spice tulip]

so far ive been searching for 25 min as killer

[slim sleet]

I dont even wanna play it anymore, its always a pain to level everyone up with no bp :/

[tame lagoon]

I stopped playing the PtB as it feels terrible lol

[native aspen]

Currently tunneling someone out is basically a free win if you have a decent start. Now it gives a chance for the rest of the game to actually be interesting instead of a boring snoozefest.

[spice tulip]

u got everything max ?

[hoary bramble]

like first thing we need is to show us MMR, doesnt matter if we keep the cap but its important for us to see it

[jagged gull]

thats missing the point, you can not tunnel, at all, and still be hella punished simply cuz someone elses skill issue

[slim sleet]

Nope, I got the new killer/survivor and all base characters

[native aspen]

It's not even noon yet; most people are at school or work. So the people who can play are usually also queuing killer these times of day.

[hoary bramble]

there is no good reason to keep it hidden rom us

[spice tulip]

PTB gives u all the perks 99 of every addon and offering

[slim sleet]

Dunno if it supposed to, but I lose everything when I load PTB

[native aspen]

I think our definitions of tunneling are different.

[slim sleet]

Oh?

[jagged gull]

whats your definition??

[tame lagoon]

I dunno about that it'd just create dodging.

[spice tulip]

just click bloodweb on ever surv and killer and it should p3 them instantly

[native aspen]

There's a stigma around "tunneling" being some inherently negative thing. A survivor that was just unhooked taking chase and going down is tunneling, even if it wasn't your intent.

[ripe marlin]

Also how many times can you 'abuse' it before you start getting penalties for obviously leaving matches early on purpose? Or did they revert that change with the idle crow issues?

[slim sleet]

good to know

Ill try maybe when I get home

[grave pier]

Anti-tunnel is currently hot garbage doo-doo by it’s inherent design, the only way to fix it is to tune numbers down to the point where it does not do what it’s supposed to

[jagged gull]

forever basically, i wont be punished

[native aspen]

Don't spam @raven flume

[spice tulip]

30 min killer que 💀

[valid mica]

After playing the Krasue she seems pretty balanced aside from regurgitate. It's pretty easy to spam. Either slowing her a bit while charger (like Huntress with her hatchet wound up) or reducing how often you can actually regurgitate would be pretty solid.

[raven flume]

@native aspen scared of the truth?

[jagged gull]

thats nopt tunneling, tunneling is hard focusing on someone in order to kill them early, aka where it got its name "tunnel vision"

[native aspen]

No, you were spamming. I didn't even read your message.

[gray night]

"Rip Killer Update" Meanwhile pt 9

[slim sleet]

I didnt get to finish reading either lol

[native aspen]

The game can't recognize your intent.

[spice tulip]

Just dont use the . and voice ur opinion if he removes it he knows its true then

[jagged gull]

so it shouldnt try to correct it

[slim sleet]

?

[tame lagoon]

Ew. A skull Merchant.

[raven flume]

@native aspen @spice tulip you just said I told the truth

[proven cradle]

glad they're not toxic
the only people I've really gotten in chat were kind of toxic
I got called a nerd for running lightborn against a bully squad

[gray night]

💔

[grave pier]

“This system is flawed? Erm, actually, here’s my screenshot of me shitting on shitters, checkmate.”

[native aspen]

You can make your post without flooding the entire screen with dots@raven flume

[ripe marlin]

Soft 🧻

[jagged gull]

bros flexing wins against mid survivors 💔

[proven cradle]

seriously, he's doing this AGAIN?

[limpid crag]

What does this prove exactly?

[raven flume]

@native aspen I did my opinion was at the bottom where you saw and panicked

[slim sleet]

Lmao

[gray night]

That I dont see a difference between the ptb and live

[native aspen]

Post it again without the dots spam Not sure what you're missing here

[slim sleet]

Who is this guy

[limpid crag]

Also Jesus Christ you've made the same post 9 times?

[tame lagoon]

PtB is easier than live lobbies because I don't think MMR exists. If you have any compitence you will destroy most lobbies of low skilled survivors.

[raven flume]

@native aspen I already posted it and I can rest now knowing you all are scared of the truth I tell

[gray night]

And that the people collectively shitting themselves over the changes might just be a little too reliant on tunnel/slugging

Or just dont play and are making noise

[native aspen]

ok

[limpid crag]

Bro doesn't know the reply function

[grave pier]

Put some respect on Leon “The Resident” Evil

[ripe marlin]

THIS

[tough mirage]

just post it again without the dots.......? im so confused

[native aspen]

as long as it doesnt break one of our other rules

[slim sleet]

Hes not gonna, best to drop it lol

[native aspen]

so no gross imagery, nsfw, insults, etc.

[tough mirage]

true true

[grave pier]

Just to be clear we’ve already clearly established that the system does negatively affect killers who don’t tunnel, so it’s already failed design from the outset

[raven flume]

@tough mirage why are you all so eager?🤭 I already posted it but it got deleted because it was too truthful

[native aspen]

which if i remember he was being a bit gross in the message but i barely skimmed it

[gray night]

"we" have not actually

[proven cradle]

I'm mainly mad for the fact survivors have effective strategies that are left unpunished, while killers get punished for doing their own objective (especially the fact we sometimes just have to IGNORE survivors that play poorly because we'll get the whole anti-tunnel shit)

[slim sleet]

I've been followed around

[spice tulip]

Love having 30 min killer que just to get baby pussy survivors that give up on 2 hooks

[grave pier]

Weird because the most popular clip rn is Otz getting cucked despite being a perfect prettyboy for seven hooks in a row

[urban stone]

sabo is rewarded way too heavily now, so are pallet saves as i can't chase off someone in time

[native aspen]

elaborate?

[halcyon sapphire]

Yes like when will the survs get a debuf repair speed if gens get done too fast???

[gray night]

☝️

[native aspen]

if it's a bug then it's not a valid argument against the system

[gray night]

Otz did a bunch of testing yesterday from what I saw specifically around pig and sadako

[grave pier]

He gets seven yellow hooks but while patrolling the last three gens the marked survivor is doing the gen and by hooking and killing him he got his ability to kick removed lmao

[gray night]

not much "actual play"

[warped sentinel]

"Let them finish the last gen or gens are blocked forever"
🗣️ 🔥

[worn bluff]

all my teammates dced yesterday because we weren't playing against the krasue 😭 🥀

[gray night]

Link it please

Rather have this "clip that is so popular" than have someone maybe misconstrue what is actually shown

[urban stone]

lmao i had so many dcs

[grave pier]

https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/s/Gh6o1MlDK1

[tame lagoon]

All the new system does is reward survivors for not fearing the killer and not needing to run situational perks as much. It removes a lot of risk in making mistakes on a already survivor sided game.

[ruby dove]

lmao. “Tunneling”

Yeah changes are awful

[gray night]

he ... did tunnel one though what are you talking about

You forget your original message?

I actually watched the full match of this live btw

[proven cradle]

the ONLY messages this guy has sent have been about hating on the PTB
like not just in this channel, in this server entirely.

[native aspen]

he already had a survivor dead at that point in the game

[worn bluff]

Yes, I've seen survivors in 2nd hook go and get them self hit knowing if I hook them their team gets so many boosts. And gen rushing teammates have left me on hook for the boost

[desert crown]

no he didn't the guy was dead on hook and he just so happened to be cranking a gen right in his face

[grave pier]

Cool hey so the survivor was actually on the last gen doing it, hope this helps ❤️

[tame lagoon]

Mhm it removes the risk factor so you can just pop gens in the killers face without punishment more ect.

[native aspen]

leaving you on hook doesnt get the boost

[spice tulip]

still does do its bugged

[worn bluff]

exactly, that's what they don't know and I got a bit mad in endgame chat

[halcyon sapphire]

Thats even worse

[urban stone]

i usually win games when a bully squad gets too into bullying, but now i literally cannot keep up

[native aspen]

yes, there is a bug, but thats also not a valid criticism against it.

[spice tulip]

wasnt criticism