arms

[stoic trench]

pressing demolish feels terrible to me personally, maybe it's the same way you feel about bladestorm i guess, idk

[umbral badger]

so i get that hate i guess

[latent moss]

sd feels good but i wish there way a way to make it less proc reliant

[umbral badger]

but overall , all warrior specs are rellying too much on RNG nad procs even as colossus in ST you can have a very long CS or a very short CS based on how many mortal resets you got

[latent moss]

especially on st arms in general suffers like crazy from rng

u can just get no procs and starve and do 0 dmg

[umbral badger]

like as colossus i sometimes get 70k ish single target although rare just purely becuase of how many mortals resets i had during every CCS

[latent moss]

it's more to do with how many ms crit

[umbral badger]

70k in m+ build which is not easy for me as colossus at least

[latent moss]

70k as colo is really good

[umbral badger]

it's just the rng of procs so it's a theme for warriors it feels like

and it was a theme even before when we had the 20% reset

[latent moss]

also please remove prepull cringe

in m+

u can stack heroic might and imminent demise

then put the key in

[umbral badger]

you mean stacking on dummies ?

[latent moss]

and just do infinitely more dmg

ye

[umbral badger]

i mean it's not players fault that blizzard designed a class that sucks hard on opener

they wanna compensate somehow :p

zero stack demolish will always suck 😄

[latent moss]

it is their fault

why can i stack anything before key starts

[umbral badger]

why can't they give me a cd that adds 5 or 10 demolish stacks >.<

they are trying to make it so that you will feel good to use demolish on zero stacks, it does not and will not happen.

they are trying to have it both ways with their design

[stoic trench]

yeah 70k ST as colossus.... i need a hit of what you're on cause i think that's pretty sick

[umbral badger]

you can't have it both ways

[umbral badger]

tht's why i said very rarely in m+ build. you get lucky in CS window with mortal resets basically

remove ravager and give me a cd which generates 10 stacks fo colossus might 😮

[fresh spire]

Like slayer sims went from like 97 to 95.
Colossus went up from 86k to 93k

[stoic trench]

dude i gotta say, too... sorry to be a debbie downer but god i hate ravager

hit it and forget it stuff is so lame

[fresh spire]

Slayer will still be fine. Just colossus will do more damage in St now

[fresh spire]

Think it's a mutual feeling between all. It stinks. It does 0 damage and just buffs cleave

Cd line ups is trash

[soft gust]

I dont think anybody likes ravager

[fresh spire]

It has to go

[umbral badger]

i think the major reason why ravager is desiliked is that it is , unlike BS. impossible to line up with anyshit

feels aweful

if they made it weaker but line up ppl might at least appreciate it more

i honestly don't get why they keep adding desynced cds

[stoic trench]

or maybe put it with anger management at least? idk

[umbral badger]

most of the times desynced cds end up worthless , and sometimes we just end up "delaying them" to line up anyway

so why add somethign that does nto line up where ppl end up just keeping it there until cds come back ?

what's the point then ?

[shy dew]

bcs blizz likes to make warrior like this, u need a brain to play with this shit, meanwhile classes like retri or bm u just press ur head in keyboard and boom damage

[stoic trench]

is this talking ST?

[umbral badger]

yes, probably bis gear sims.

[stoic trench]

thanks, i'm dumb

[soft gust]

The ST build yeah, M+ build is going from like ~76.5k in BiS to ~82.5k in BiS

big ups

[umbral badger]

also i have to admit, i never see Colossus in raid doing ST as it sims 😄 slayer does but colossus seems unable to do so for some reaosn

[covert granite]

The game would be too easy if all cds synced
The problem with ravager its that its a buff with a damage cooldown skin

[umbral badger]

that's not the point though, the point is the desynced cds end up being put on hold until they line up anyway

[icy mulch]

If Ravager actually did some good damage, it'd be like Dragon Roar was.

[umbral badger]

we already don't use BS without CS or demo without CS for example, or ravager for that matter

[icy mulch]

It's not a great button but at least it does something.

[fresh spire]

Might see colossus on valegor pop off with .5 buffs. Ignore adds go full boss crusher

Ms sweep value going to be really good

[umbral badger]

TBH if you have demo for every add wave you don't need cleave build

as long as demo can actually hit the adds and the boss

bosses *

at the same time

[vast helm]

waiting for final blue post tuning

[worn knoll]

Game would be too easy he says, meanwhile BM hunters have a rotation of literally 1 major CD + 2 rotation buttons + a filler, and ret pala has all their CDs handled automatically by the game lul

[umbral badger]

but then again, isn't cleave build good for 2 targets anyway ?

[olive nest]

Imagine .5 ships as is.. rip fury crowd

[umbral badger]

cuz of collateral

[stoic trench]

hello, fury refugee here

[covert granite]

Yeah, thats why those specs are for droolers

[umbral badger]

again though, i don't care about the desyncing part as much as the fact that they end up being delayed to be used with cds anyway :p

if they wanna make things desync, make them worth using while desynced

when i delay something it feels shit to me

[covert granite]

If its only with cs is not that bad, but if you have to wait for avatar to be obtimal then its a problem

[umbral badger]

nah even with CS

it's bad

probably why they are making demolish line up with CS soon

on ST

[soft gust]

I believe the point he's trying to make is that having a non aligned cd where the optimal play is to hold until alignment is identical to having that ability have a longer cd that does align

in practice

[umbral badger]

bro when you play a hero taletn and you can't use your own hero skill even for 5 seconds, it feels aweful to me xd

[umbral badger]

techincally yes

[worn knoll]

Frankly they should just delete Ravager as a button. Just take the 50% cleave bonus window and spread it out into cleave's base damage, or if they want to keep the burst window a thing, add that cleave bonus into avatar or CS or even demolish idk

[umbral badger]

if anything, it's that with the added bitter taste of it

if you get what i mean

lke it is easier for me if they just made the cd longer than if they made it shorter but can't be used

cuz at least it won't feel aweful then lol

[stoic trench]

this

[umbral badger]

but yea at least we won't have that issue for demolish anymore 😄

that's so good

[minor gust]

Hope they get buffed so we don't gotta deal with all the refugees and tourists in here

[jovial hare]

hello fellow bonk enthusiasts
if i just really don't wanna use puzzlebox, what trinket should i shoot for out of the m+ pool

[soft gust]

Solarflare prism

I think

[void sigil]

Solarflare is a good option, yes.

[umbral badger]

if you are including cruicible, then solarflare

[fresh spire]

You have demo as it It. You will have demo way more often in comparison on .5

[lime owl]

i use solarflare and guidon myself, working well for me so far

[umbral badger]

prolly you still wanna get heart of ancient hunger in pugs

[umbral badger]

as sad as it sounds though cruicible is too op

even compared to hero tracks

[fresh spire]

It's pretty strong. Fine thst it's strong

Since trinkets kinds suck for variety in s1

[umbral badger]

yea just my char refuses to let me change it and i wanna get something new xd

[jade ember]

Had to take a myth Puzzy B out of my box this week. Such mixed feelings lol.

[torpid acorn]

i have a question, does bloodsurge have a ICD? or if i put rend up in AOE i have a chance to get the 5 rage multiple times when it ticks?

[umbral badger]

so here is he question mr fishy, since belo'ren egg requires bursty ST, would 12.0.5 make Colossus burst any better than it is now over the egg phase ? since at least now i was able ot maintain very good burst as colossus in EGG phase "better than slayer at least"

[wise yew]

Are you guys switching between col and slarms depending on key or just sticking to one?

[rose ibex]

I definitely think clarms is better in some keys

[jade ember]

I'm kinda schizo depends on the mood

[lime owl]

mainly col, great aoe and better overall dmg for me

[jade ember]

Slayer just easier, sometimes I feel like that

But yea Col better overalls

[rose ibex]

I try to think about the pulls and whether there will be big pulls filled with especially dangerous mobs

Those are colossus keys

Or if bosses are annoying and dangerous like agalthar

Those are slayer keys

[ionic mica]

if there are multiple bosses where you cant get extra targets i usually just slayer those keys

[soft gust]

I run Slayer in AA, NPX, SR

Col everywhere else

[ionic mica]

theres only so much ST sleeping i can do

[rose ibex]

That freakin bird in agalthar is thicker than year old oatmeal

[ionic mica]

yeah like do you really want to be sat at 10% on AA bird just waiting for it to die

its not like slayer is bad in packs so its all g

[rose ibex]

Raid damage bosses like bird and granny dragon need to die as fast as possible

[jade ember]

Yeah Slayer still owns on packs just Col is a little better at big aoe

[rose ibex]

I know you want big numbers in the tree room but colossus just doesnt cut it for the bosses

However ill take col for places like Magisters Terrace because some of the trash in that dungeon is goddamn scary

[ionic mica]

in seat you can do col until last boss and then port out at least

[rose ibex]

Seat is also for col I think. Bosses easy, trash scary

[ionic mica]

come back as fury or slayer arms and fuck up lura's day

[jade ember]

Yeah boss dam is another reason I play slarms

[soft gust]

Its also way easier to play slayer on that big pull. Safely casting demolish with those disorients coming out is rough

[rose ibex]

Not being able to heroic leap out of bs also kinda sucks but it is what it is

I honestly hate that pull on warrior

[soft gust]

I mean you can just move with BS

[rose ibex]

So much risk as a melee, for a melee

[rose ibex]

Its just annoying because circle placement can screw over your bs burst

[ionic mica]

i find i just have to look at the tank and focus on them rather than the pack, you have a decent amount of time to leave the green circles

then pray they are a walk out rather than zoom away kind of tank

[rose ibex]

Haha true

Its not a fun pull for tanks

A real butt clencher

[ionic mica]

i dont mind it so much apart from the cringe outranging bleed casts, as long as the dps is big you only need to do it once

(on brew, fuck playing weaker tanks)

[rose ibex]

My bud plays prot pally and I think he does great

But hes not knowledgeable about some things

Ive been told the best way to do the pull is to circle the room in a big sweep

My buddy is more like a chicken with his head cut off

[ionic mica]

the other tanks are good if you are good at them, but as an alt tank i cant be dealing with all that when brew is finally good and fun

[rose ibex]

He has a brew but he's pretty salty about this week's vault

His brew got nothing but capes

[vale warren]

https://tenor.com/view/capin-gif-2120514206883585924

[rose ibex]

It is kind of a shame that brew seems hand over fist better than other tanks except maybe prot war

[umbral badger]

academy first pull looks so easy in critcakes / biz videos. but their grps seem to stack on first pull for the puddles

at least in my grps is see puddles everywhere and in their vidoes i see puddles very concentrated

[rose ibex]

Its the one pull i feel I spend more effort staying alive than dpsing. Meanwhile frost mages and demo locks are just teeing up the mobs with massive dps

Also the mobs tend to spread out a lot and fall behind which isnt great for landing CS

[umbral badger]

have yet to experience a grp that stack on it to confirm that's how it looks easy for critcakes and biz :p

[rose ibex]

And because the aggro gets so spread out, you can pull from the tank if you aren't too careful

Which also sucks because the healer is working double time trying to keep the tank alive usually

Blegh. We got our 3k. We all don't care about puzzlebox. We'll probably never go back haha

[abstract sphinx]

Do you guys think I should trust crucible simming higher than Hero Puzzle? or should still use puzzle for big pulls + BL synergy? Crucible sims about 1-2% higher.

[trail lichen]

Hey guys, when do you use colossus smash in between Avatar-Bladestorm? Or when is it worth saving it ? Having a hard time dealing with that

[abstract sphinx]

Yes but u dont send avatar without colossus smash

U lose a lot of dps holding colossus smash

Unless avatar is coming up soon or a huge pull/bl is incoming

I think actual cd with colossus is something like 20 seconds? With correct rotation, so keep that in mind

[trail lichen]

So i just it whenever its up, unless avatar is rlly close?

[abstract sphinx]

Ye

[elder path]

Crucible is busted and puzzle box is really jank bc in a vacuum yes it gives a lot of dmg but in practice using that thing is gonna either get you killed or waste time if you have to move

[abstract sphinx]

Also no bladestorm without CS

[abstract sphinx]

Good point

[elder path]

And yea send CS on cooldown unless one of your other big cds is coming up within like 10 seconds or so

[nova marsh]

Guys i have a question

Do any other classes gain any notable amount of resources from skyfury

[minor gust]

Sub rogue and maybe havoc

[ionic mica]

fdk if you can find one?

if you count killing machine as resources

[shadow osprey]

Yes that is exactly what it does.

[umbral badger]

i'd like to try the first mythic boss trinket for ravager as colossus though i wonder if it's worth

at least something that lines up with ravager 🤣

[elder path]

Yea I got it it feels good

[nova marsh]

Ah yes, yet sub just has infinite energy in burst anyways

Thats hilarious

[elder path]

Cleave spam with that big haste buff and a ravager out does feel fun even if it sims less than the crit trinks

[rose ibex]

Doesnt outlaw as well?

[nova marsh]

No

Fatal flourish is tuned like ass

[rose ibex]

My bud always wants shammies

[nova marsh]

That and im not sure

But I have a suspicion that skyfury is MH only

I haven't noticed any difference on outlaw between shaman and no shaman

[rose ibex]

Whelp, I certainly wont complain about having a shammy

[nova marsh]

Oh never

Espically post aa buffs

[rose ibex]

Im thinking about spooling one up as an alt but I cant decide between that or sv hunter

[nova marsh]

Sv hunter because its probably easier to play

[rose ibex]

Or maybe warlock.... their utility is very useful

[nova marsh]

You wonna be the summon bitch?

[rose ibex]

Gate stuff is great in keys

Cookies and brez

They're great

I usually always play warlock but last expansion i wasnt feeling it and im on the fence for this one despite how strong they are

Warrior and warlock are usually my mains

[minor gust]

Warlock is the c uck class. I wouldn't be able to stand a tier of summoning and putting down cookies and gates every pull during prog

[nova marsh]

I feel like imma end up staying with warrior and rogue

But im a key Andy so it matters a bit less

[rose ibex]

I dunno. Its so fun raining down random infernals that split into smaller ones

[nova marsh]

Thats sick

[rose ibex]

Chucking big chunky meatballs

Demo doesnt get me as excited as it used to. Destro is better than ever tho

[nova marsh]

And aff?

[rose ibex]

Aff is aff

Back to seeds spam which is good

Agony is annoying tho

Too stressful to keep those plates spinning

[robust coyote]

I imagine this isn't great in all situations, only single target?

[rose ibex]

Other dot classes arent punished as much for their dots falling off

[robust coyote]

I am constantly forgetting to apply rend in combat - is there an addon or a way to make bettercooldownmanager help with this?

[brazen vale]

I have tts tell me rend is off

[robust coyote]

how do you do that

[neon shale]

cht im scare to go arms at 14+

i gna die oooing at cleave cd

looking*

[shadow osprey]

It was just an example. But you could put it over whatever you would always use it over. Or just let it replace slam like normal

[robust coyote]

that's how I prefer to do it lol

[slender sonnet]

turns out it's not worth it to farm nullaeus for crests

fast kill tho

only 5 crests for killin him

[umbral badger]

fked up someone's run so hard xd i get in they start asking weird questions and then i forgot to respec to m+ build xd

[steep escarp]

You can walk out and change talents

[umbral badger]

i did and told them don't do big pull too

but they still did biggest pull i've ever seen xd

so by the time i came back it was fked

[steep escarp]

Then that’s on them if they acknowledged you once you said something

[umbral badger]

just weird questions threw me off hard

[storm canopy]

is puzzelbox bait or is it good?:) considering dropping it for prism

[minor gust]

It's good just terrible to use. Use it if you want. Personally if you want an on use just use first boss raid trinket

[ionic fjord]

is arms actually smanging in keys? tryna pick an alt and obviously there was a lot of dooming around arms heading into the season. i dont love switching between slayer and colossus for raid, but i probs wont raid much so it might not matter

[steep escarp]

Demolish is really good for dopamine

[near schooner]

is there a way to create another line on top of my common skills? i want to have seperate bars for cds

[ionic fjord]

i do crave dopamine

[simple lintel]

Any thoughts on puzzle box interaction with potion of recklessness? Pop pot before Puzzlebox to avoid getting extra Mastery instead of Crit?

[minor gust]

You can play slayer on every boss if you wanted

[midnight mural]

Which crests does he drop ?

[midnight mural]

Arms fucks good in keys

[olive nest]

@minor gust remember when only 30 of us were playing arms week 1

[minor gust]

I was the 6th arms warrior to kill mythic Chim

[olive nest]

Amazing 👑

[rose ibex]

Arms is really good. You can play slayer in everything if it matters

There is going to be a big patch that changes things up in 12.0.5 tho

[minor gust]

For arms likely not but well see

[olive nest]

I hope they give arms more ms/op/exe damage

And some rage for execute atleast

[minor gust]

In 12.1 maybe. I feel like they are probably done with arms tuning for the rest of the tier. The spec number wise is in a ok spot

Well see tho by the time 12.05 officially released

[olive nest]

Yeah it is just not sure where it’ll be with .5 patch

[thick stump]

Shit maybe even the whole expansion xD

[slow saddle]

More rage

Is 1 wish tbh

[minor gust]

If it didn't happen in the .5 patch it ain't happening till at least 12.1

[slow saddle]

13.1

[minor gust]

But so far blizzards track record with rage shows they only touch it once per expansion

So gotta wait till 13.0 for rage buffs

[olive nest]

Such dogshit that they changed it

Exe exe op ms

Felt so good

[steep escarp]

It feels bad to have the rage economy we do now. The one good thing about old warrior design was that if you ever ran out of rage it was your own fault for pressing heroic strike too much and dumping rage.

Now you have none just from the general rotation

[minor gust]

Modern rage has just been a mess of RNG you have very little control

Procs should not cost rage

It's why rage is a pendulum. Either too much or too little

No healthy middle

[steep escarp]

I’d rather too much

Too little is garbage

[olive nest]

You can kind of show skill expression with rage economy by weaving op anytime it’s at 2 stacks and you’re below 90 rage

[minor gust]

Only goes so far. Then rng says hello and gives you no tac procs no SD procs and a ton of HS procs

And you don't Crit your autos

And it's gg rage bar

None of it in your control

[olive nest]

Yup exactly..

[nova marsh]

Please delete rage

[olive nest]

Pretty annoying that they just let it be bad

[slow saddle]

This

[minor gust]

Because fixing it requires massive redesign of the spec

[slow saddle]

U cant have both random procs

[minor gust]

And they have no idea what they want arms to be so it's stuck in this form

[slow saddle]

And slow eage

[nova marsh]

I hate that current arms with cs feels good

[steep escarp]

If they want rage to matter and not fuck it up they need an off GCD rage dump

[slow saddle]

Tbh if hs is free // send with ms

A lot would be solved

[umbral wagon]

maybe instead of buffing rage gain, give a skullspliter type skill that forces an auto attack for on demand rage in a sense

[nova marsh]

No

[slow saddle]

No no

[nova marsh]

we do not need more buttons

[steep escarp]

That’s terrible

[slow saddle]

Just make op give rage

[nova marsh]

With ravager and avatar we already have too many (espically ravager)

[slow saddle]

Tbh passive rav on avatat

[rose ibex]

Arms feels fine. I hope they give some love and attention to the more neglected specs

[slow saddle]

I dont understand why thats not a thing

[rose ibex]

Outlaw and frost dk come to mind

[slow saddle]

Would make ava feel cooler

[nova marsh]

Fdk gets fixed on the 21st

[rose ibex]

Wha? No shit?

[umbral wagon]

If op gave rage through wouldnt that just give too much? it would have to be a pretty low amount

[nova marsh]

Outlaw is just omega fucked by rng anyways

[nova marsh]

No im not joking

[slow saddle]

10?

[steep escarp]

Why does too much rage matter

[nova marsh]

Exterms become not ass with needless friction, recall dragon on ogcd, all they need is buffs to compliment it

[slow saddle]

It doesnt take a lot

[steep escarp]

I didn’t play when that was a thing

[rose ibex]

Whats changing? Trying to find the patch....

[slow saddle]

It doesnt

[umbral wagon]

it doesnt

[slow saddle]

Forum andys wanted classic

[olive nest]

Make op and rend ticks generate rage

[molten glacier]

Like WTF cut rage cost of all spels by 30% dobę have funn

[olive nest]

Make HS free

[steep escarp]

Then who cares if we have too much rage? We don’t have a rage dump it’s all just general rotational abilities

[slow saddle]

Actually rend giving a st purpose would be cool

[umbral wagon]

oh im all for rage overflow but usually when arms has that going for it, arms gets slapped

[slow saddle]

Thing is rage management is good

But then u cant have so many procs

[olive nest]

Make me and execute both refund rage when they Crit

[slow saddle]

Lll

[steep escarp]

Yeah but they give us nothing to dump rage and create the skill ceiling in managing dumping said rage

[olive nest]

Like you should not have to worry about running out of rage unless you just hur dur slam/execute spam

[slow saddle]

Exe crit refund actually cool

Doenst need 2 be 100%

[umbral wagon]

procs not costing rage with the current kit would fix a good amount of the issues. RNG would have to be terrible at that point to run out

[olive nest]

Maybe execute Crit refund would be counter intuitive with not wanting Exe spam so make EP more powerful so you don’t just Exe spam

[steep escarp]

Or just do what cata execute did

[warm fog]

Rage management plus procs plus 4 different medium length cooldowns with varying degrees of dynamic CDR

[steep escarp]

Costs 10 baseline but ate excess rage to deal more damage

And refunded 10 always

[olive nest]

Anytime I have to charge weave rage is bad
Anytime I have to charge weave and STILL rage starve rage is very omega bad

[nova marsh]

The cliff notes is:
Frost warm no longer gives exterms so frost dosent choose between haste buff + pillar extension or munching exterms
Exterms cost 1 rune again (no idea why they took it away)
And the recall dragon for apex is off the gcd

[rose ibex]

I dunno if that fixes them

They seem bottom of the barrel in terms of numbers

[nova marsh]

Yeah like I said

All they need is buffs

I was talking gameplay wise

[steep escarp]

Numbers tuning is separate from design flaws

[rose ibex]

Ahhh cool

So they just need aura buffs

[nova marsh]

More or less yeah

[rose ibex]

After the de-clunking

[slow saddle]

+this

[nova marsh]

Buff exterm to make up for less of them

[slow saddle]

If hs was free

Would also help

[nova marsh]

Outlaw needs.help im not gonna lie

But that spec is kinda cooked

[steep escarp]

Out of all specs needing design help it’s outlaw and arms the most imo

So we’re up there

[rose ibex]

I dunno what to do to help them. I dont know if they can be helped. It seems like blizzard wants to keep them being weirdly complex and conditional

Theres just so much riding on RNG in that spec

[nova marsh]

Honestly if they just kept crackshit

[hoary fossil]

outlaw was a vibe during SL s1

[rose ibex]

And even if you get good rolls a frost mage or demo lock is going to make you look weak as hell

[nova marsh]

And idk tied to ar or smth so it wasnt stealth reliant

I think law would be better....I mean

[rose ibex]

I still love the theme of outlaw. Pirates and gambling cha ching!

[nova marsh]

Also just rework blade flurry cuz its so obvious blizz cant balance it

I mean im not surprised since flurry is basically better fury ww

And blizz is notoriously shit for balancing that

[rose ibex]

Would be cool if they just added mechanics to completely make stealth unnecessary. Like a talent that turned vanish into their version of colossus smash with a significantly shorter cd (maybe rogue blasphemy)

Like a flashbang or something

Stun and weakens enemies

[nova marsh]

Honestly they basically have

At least sub and law are not stealth reliant at all

Maybe for st

For sub

But law dosent care

[rose ibex]

Needing to stealth up to fights is the most annoying thing about rogue

Some reason it doesnt bother me on feral

Prolly because they are fast

Feral druid is the funnest rogue spec tbh

So many procs. Convoke is such a fun button

Has big burst apm moments and very chill maintenance dotting moments

Blugh. Two more weeks and I can craft a mythic weapon 🙄

[nimble yoke]

sometimes in m+ dungeons we only get 4 buffs from the xalatath affix but the mobs don't have their buff. any idea why this might be?

[shy oyster]

howssit lookin' in the good fight fellas

arms st still meh whilst our aoe is... our aoe?

[warm fog]

It’s wild that arms got more complex in the pruning expansion lol

[robust coyote]

Can you make it in plater so that a unit frame blinks or something if rend isn't on it?

[minor gust]

There was a world where ravager and avatar were gone. Then the civilians complained and now they are back

[warm fog]

Avatar for thane, demolish for colossus, bladestorm for slayer

[minor gust]

That's what it could have been, but the people cried omg how is arms gonna do dmg without avatar! Omg my root break how could you! Bring avatar back!

[warm fog]

Make CS drop some ravagers for damage and a burst of rage, and cool visuals idgaf

[shy oyster]

that'd be so funny

smash floor, ravagers spinning everywhere

[warm fog]

I feel like I’m playing fking enhancement shaman as colossus

[shy oyster]

in its weakened state or-...

[barren tartan]

as an enh main i always felt like warrior's rotation felt pretty similar

both fury and arms have aspects that seem familiar

[warm fog]

Actually no enhancement has a smoother rotation and better resource feedback

[barren tartan]

that is very true

[rose ibex]

How's enh doing? Trying to decide on an alt

[barren tartan]

enh's design has been really solid lately, we are just tuned like shit

[rose ibex]

Enh has always been fun to me

Yeah tuning doesn't matter. Tuning always changes, but gameplay doesnt always

[barren tartan]

our single target is literally bottom 5 this whole raid tier

[rose ibex]

Arms players had problems like that in the start and their faith was rewarded

[barren tartan]

my issue is they gave enh a nothing buff

while many classes were gapping us by more than 15%

[rose ibex]

Now that race is over hopefully tuning gets a harder look

[barren tartan]

enhance aoe is good

we have funnel

1min cds

[shy oyster]

i dont see enhance bois around much... tho ig with elem as it is...

[barren tartan]

theres alot to like

i think the rotation scared people in the past

its really simple now

[shy oyster]

eh... even if you say enhance is pretty attractive

its rep is damaged

[rose ibex]

Most enh players i invite pump

[barren tartan]

yeah most enh players you run into are mains

imo

[rose ibex]

Yeah I love totemic. Im not really into.... the other one.... im a big ascendence hater

[shy oyster]

yeah the one enh player i tanked for was a pleasure in an 11 i did. was nervous i couldnt survive but holy shit their utility and dps was on point

its like seeing a feral dps main when they were bottom tier

[rose ibex]

My giant tauren shaman should not shrink to get stronger

[barren tartan]

i like both hero trees

tempest is a VERY satisfying button

[sand totem]

Aren't we still very much bottom bell?

[rose ibex]

If they added a glyph that just added a visual effect for ascendence instead of turning yourself into those rocky freaks I would main shaman forever

[rose ibex]

Depends if you like raid or m+

Arms pumps man

Tbh not bad in raid either anymore. Not top but not bad

[barren tartan]

uh from what ive seen arms is doing well in both raid and m+

[shy oyster]

in m+ arms be pumping, but raid still has -some- scuffs

[sacred zodiac]

in m+ you blast if you raid you technically have the edge over fury where you genuinely have a reason to be brought to 1 fight while fury has no reason to be brought anywhere

[sand totem]

M+ for sure, but ST im pretty sure we still sim the lowest or next thing tp

[olive nest]

Arms, Feral, Enh, Survival, Outlaw
All the cool people

[rose ibex]

I was fiddling with it on test dummies the other day and I cannot deny that it is

[rose ibex]

Goddammit. Thats like all the melee specs I like

[shy oyster]

enhance tempest still wins for me yeah 🤤 i love specs that build a big -smash-

i like showers, not growers 😉

[rose ibex]

Ascendence is gross tho

So much power packed into the ugliest package I cannot stomach

[shy oyster]

not even the unga bunga hairstyle skin?

[warm fog]

Enhance is actually pretty good gameplay wise, when you run out of resources it’s because you messed up glares at colossus rage gen

[rose ibex]

If I played a human sham id be cool with it

But I like my big giant tauren totem toater

Being the biggest is the best

Shrinking down for power is lame

[shy oyster]

ah thats what you mean 😂

[rose ibex]

Yeah! Its jarring

I get weirdly obsessive about things and I cant drop my issue with that haha

Luckily totemic enh doesnt have that issue

[shy oyster]

fair!

[rose ibex]

It just sucks because it would be fun to play ele sometimes or go tempest but they all use ascendence

Totemic is also super fun and with the right macros you dont even need to think about your totem

[near schooner]

elp someone

[fervent cedar]

+14 pit tank fkn died twice on the first pull 🤦‍♂️

also that dk was uh

not good

[shadow osprey]

I see some play colossus but I also see higher keys being played as slayer. Is there a preference as to one over the other for some reason?

[fervent cedar]

Slayer has better single target and priority damage, which is incredibly important in high keys

Colossus has insane aoe, possibly some of the highest in the entire game right now, but its pure ST is abysmal

So slayer is being played for the more balanced damage profile

colossus is played in specific keys or with group comps where single target isn't as problematic, or if trash can be pulled on top of bosses

[sacred summit]

how important is it for us to not be capped on rage vs carrying out our rotation?

i find that in a lot of situations (other than start of pull or during execute phase) im pretty full on rage but the only spenders are what… ms, cleave, slam/hs, and dry/non sd execute?

[fervent cedar]

Just follow the normal priority list on wowhead and realistically you shouldn't really be overcapping on rage very often at all

arms unlike fury is mostly spenders, you will drain your rage quickly by just doing your rotation

[sacred summit]

idk about overcapping but at least in aoe i found im pretty full on rage usually

except maybe the first few gcds of pull

[fervent cedar]

which is fine, as long as you are following priority for aoe thats all that matters

never press heroic strike, press cleave on cd

[sacred summit]

so i may just do rend, avatar, cs, cleave, cleave, bs, and resume using the no cd cleaves

[fervent cedar]

cleave 4x

then bs

[sacred summit]

i try to

but sometimes in opening pull i dont have rage so i gotta just bs unless i wanna wait and/or use overpower to generate then use more cleaves

ive also been told that cleave x4 then bs or bs then cleave doesnt make much difference

[fervent cedar]

you can do charge > rend > ava > cs > bs so you apply overwhelmed stacks then do cleave spam after

yeah its not too big of a difference

your aoe on slayer isn't spectacular

[sacred summit]

this has usually only been the case for me during opening (aoe or st) or execute phase st (because im having to execute twice before mortal striking)

and them dry executes are expensive

[sacred summit]

ye

[steep escarp]

You will wait for rage to have fun and you’ll like it

[sacred summit]

its not bad ngl
my burst as slayer arms seems to be higher than mt fury

provided its like a 8 or more target pull
seems to be around the same between colo, slayer arms and mt fury for 5 target

(i may be playing arms unoptimally vs fury)

[sacred summit]

smh

cuz when i was practicing on the cleave training dummies i think i was a little north of 200k dps in about a 40s? pull? no pot, no raid buffs

[fervent cedar]

for colo its just making sure you're stacking your cleave modifiers together well to do good aoe

[sacred summit]

for fury and arms

[fervent cedar]

our cds are worthless unless we have cs up

[sacred summit]

but in actual dungeon pulls ive seen that number be a bit higher
and i think i see higher numbers with bigger pulls as arms

[fervent cedar]

yes

arms aoe is ridiculous

fury is hard capped at 5 outside of clap and blast

so we excel in bigger pulls

[sacred summit]

i cant seem to beat some specs in big aoe tho

like destro lock, unholy dk

[fervent cedar]

yes those specs are built well for mass aoe too

and if you play slayer they will beat you

but as colo you can beat them

you just lose hard on st

the issue with a spec like destro tho

their prio is shit

our prio is not shit

its actually p good

[sacred summit]

yea ive been practicing slayer arms cuz ive been told colo can be hard with positioning
and my st is pure ass

pure ass

[stable fiber]

colo prob has the best prio in the video game

arcane prio is kinda shit now

[sacred summit]

and in lower pug keys like 10-13s the tank isnt pulling mobs in for funnel

[minor gust]

Slayer does not have better priority dmg it's Colo by a lot

[sacred summit]

so im just sitting there doing dobby damage

its sad

[rose ibex]

I think a lot depends on how the tank pulls too

[sacred summit]

and some bosses u cant really pull in mobs for funnel

like skyreach

[soft gust]

Col prio is nuts

[rose ibex]

Like if mobs arent bunched up colo suffers and doesnt seem as impressive

[sacred summit]

seat
first boss u can but it can be iffy to pull mobs in with

[rose ibex]

It can be awkward to aim cleaves if targets are moving around

[sacred summit]

algathar

[sacred summit]

didnt they lose their funnel/prio? or its been pretty neutered but it does just decent dam now

[rose ibex]

Yeah colossus is all about the funnel

[stable fiber]

they dont arcane blast in aoe anymore

[fervent cedar]

it is, but slayer also has slayer strikes and reap to help with funnel as well

[stable fiber]

they use arcane pulse which is a pretty big hit to their prio

and the talent that gave them funnel on arcane barrage got hit hard

[rose ibex]

Arms in general is funnel focused

[fervent cedar]

honestly

It just feels really nice to be playing something with a well defined niche

[rose ibex]

I dont think its worth comparing even. Play what is fun or best for the dungeon

[fervent cedar]

we do great mass aoe and we do solid funnel

feels good

[sacred summit]

well their prio and funnel has been based on barrage and that one talent

[sacred summit]

how does reap help with funnel? isnt reap pure aoep

[rose ibex]

When i play boomie I get bigger numbers on big pulls. Their spread damage is insane, but arms just makes sure the mobs that need to die actually die faster and I think its better for the group

[stable fiber]

a big aspect of their funnel was they had to arcane blast in ST because they didnt have a dedicated aoe button to push

[sacred summit]

yea
i forget what it was called
it got a target cap reduction and dmg reduction right?

[stable fiber]

arcane pulse

[rose ibex]

Funnel feels super important this season. There are some absolutely terrifying mobs

[stable fiber]

i believe its dmg is reduced past 8

[rose ibex]

I dont know how to deal with the spellbreakers in magister's terrace other than "lots of funnel damage" those glaves hurt like a bitch

[sacred summit]

yea but ur main funnel and prio dam came from barrage nuking that one mob and that barrage hitting SO hard cuz of the other mobs around it

[minor gust]

Reap can be a little funnel but not enough to matter. Being able to add cleaves in means more reap chances

[rose ibex]

The spellbreakers and tyrants ruin runs

[sacred summit]

so just aoe increase

[rose ibex]

Stupid anti healing

[sacred summit]

how is colo that much better at prio than slayer?
demolish?

they operate kinda the same tho

[minor gust]

CM stacks + demolish

[rose ibex]

The funnel comes from sd procs and ms being buffed

[minor gust]

Also Colo has an extra slam mod that slayer doesn't

[sacred summit]

cm?

[sacred summit]

o

[minor gust]

Colossal might stacks

[sacred summit]

oh right the dam mod to demo

[stable fiber]

cleave does 25% more damage as colo when ur hitting 5 targets

and it buffs slam by 20%

[minor gust]

Adding 2 extra targets to a boss fight for Colo just straight up doubles your boss dmg

[sacred summit]

does arms have good funnel? ik it has funnel but does that make our dmg onto the funnel target really good or just average

[stable fiber]

its the best in the video game

[minor gust]

For Colo is very good funnel

[stable fiber]

and its not close

lol

[sacred summit]

double colo st is…
average no?

[stable fiber]

thats like

120k

lol

[minor gust]

In an M+ environment no def not avg lmao

[stable fiber]

that is also the best in the video game

[shy oyster]

maisara berserkers smile as the tank walks over the hill

[sacred summit]

isnt that prio

isnt our funnel just extending cs debuff with 3+ targets and slamming the main target when cleave hits 3+

and with cs we get to cleave more than we ms so we probably are slamming the target more than we would in pure st

am i understanding it right

[minor gust]

Indeed what he was describing isn't funnel

Funnel is taking extra resources from secondary targets to increase your dmg to your primary target

[rose ibex]

Which ones are those again?

Honestly I find MC the chillest of dungeons

[sacred summit]

can we just get rid of sweeping stikes and whirldwind and make cleave when 3+ are hit apply whirlwind or something

[stable fiber]

getting rid of sweep is like the worst idea ever

[minor gust]

Cleave replaces WW already

[reef prairie]

Oh hell no

[rose ibex]

Oh yeah but you cleaving while you pressing those buttons. Sorry maybe im not familiar with the terms and im just yapping haha

[stable fiber]

that is unironically the best ability in the game

lmao

[sacred summit]

no i dont think ur saying is wrong but u might just have funnel and prio mixed up
i understand the idea tho

[nova marsh]

Exaggeration goes crazt

[unreal river]

how big is skyfury in raid as %

[stable fiber]

nah sweep owns

[sacred summit]

sweeping strikes?

[stable fiber]

yes

[rose ibex]

Whats the difference?

[stable fiber]

simple 30 second cooldown button that just doubles your dps

if you have 2t's

[sacred summit]

this @rose ibex

[sacred summit]

and this @rose ibex

[reef prairie]

I fucking love sweeping

I might kill someone if it were removed

[nova marsh]

I dont know if im on board with this version of sweeping

But I do like sweep

[sacred summit]

it just feels out of place/clunky to press as a maintenance buff when arms already has so much shit

[minor gust]

Sweeping stays only change would be to make it purely passive with just broad strokes

[stable fiber]

"clunky" and its a butotn you push every 30 seconds and forget about it

lmao

[sacred summit]

thats why i said maybe we just bake it into cleave

[rose ibex]

Ahhh so funnel is when fighting multiple mobs enhances your single target, while prio is just how effective you are at focusing a single mob in a group?

[sacred summit]

“it just feels out of place/clunky to press as a maintenance buff when arms already has so much shit”

[stable fiber]

the only out of place button right now is rend

thats it

[reef prairie]

Yea when I use sweeping i be doing broad strokes too

[sacred summit]

im like cleaving and applying rend and tryna keep track of cs and bs/demo and ravager and wait hold on my sweeping strikes rain out lemme just press that rq

[quiet bramble]

at least makes it improves st dmg

[minor gust]

Prio is just the dmg you are doing to the targeted mob while in a aoe situation.

[rose ibex]

They should just make sweeping strikes our mastery in some way

[steep osprey]

Sounds like a bad time

[reef prairie]

I dont think its that weird tbh

[minor gust]

🫢

[reef prairie]

But i could be on board with making it off gcd or fully passive

[sacred summit]

could also bake rend into cleave or someshit like how its baked into tc for fury
also fury doesnt have sweeping its just tc/ww so why cant we have it baked into something too

[stable fiber]

because you push ww every 4 gcds?

sweep is a 30 second buff...

[sacred summit]

coming from other classes that have had a lot of pruning and much less buffs to keep track of it arms feels out of place

[reef prairie]

Making sweeping an upkeep buff similar to fury wpuld be way worse

Than what it is now

I think making it off gcd is like the only thing id want

[sacred summit]

well im tracking how many stacks of it i have in aoe situations since i need it to be on
and cs applies it so sometimes i dont have to think about it/cs comes up before i have to press ss manually and sometimes i gotta

[smoky kayak]

Sweep should have been taken off the GCD at the end of BfA with everything else

it's actually crazy that it's still not

[reef prairie]

Yea

[sacred summit]

and while doing my main aoe rotation and maintaining rend its just eyeroll imo to keep track of that

im not saying ss is bad im saying theres too much shit for arms

[minor gust]

Think bolter really just wants to not have to press SS especially when something like broad strokes already exists

Which is more than fair

[sacred summit]

esp post tuning compared to other classes

[smoky kayak]

the only reason Sweep was ever put on the GCD is because everything was in BfA

• players hated it, so blizz caved to pressure and took everything back off... except Sweep for no apparent reason

[minor gust]

Half gcd for some reason

[reef prairie]

No half measures

[sacred summit]

yea it being on the gcd is def a pain
but id rather just not keep track of it 😂

[shy oyster]

oh uh the first pull, where u can stick with 4 berserkers or go mad and pull more

[barren tartan]

sweeping strikes is in the same category as old slice n dice for rogues

i see his point

its just outdated design

[sacred summit]

if that was our main thing to track then yea its fine but like whys it just 2t but we have a bunch of other shit

so lets do some actual pruning blizz pls

[barren tartan]

theres no decision making with it really

if 2 targets then press

[sacred summit]

not rlly the conscious decision making its the tracking of it among the other things i need to track as arms thats annoying

in the middle of aoe rotation

[stable fiber]

both hero talents only really track 3 things no?

[reef prairie]

I mean to keep good uptime you have to make sure youre cycling between cs broad strokes + sweeping

[stable fiber]

sweep stacks rend and then sd for slayer and demo stacks for colo

although you dont really need to track demo stacks in 90% of scenarios

[rose ibex]

Oh those are easy. We ooga til we booga on them

[shy oyster]

sometimes the booga does not come fast enough 😭

[sacred summit]

colo has more
ravager, demo stack thingies, rend, cs debuff, and slayers’ has execute proc tracking in execute phase

[rose ibex]

Always lust

[stable fiber]

the spec isnt hard because of the things we track, unholy tracks the same amount of things and is easy as fuck

[rose ibex]

Ooga harder!

Arms is chill

[sacred summit]

yea
and like i said above it seems somewhat inconsistent
where some pulls cs will come back up so i dont need to press ss separately and sometimes i do

[sacred summit]

man ur hell bent on disagreeing arent u
didnt say it was hard, didnt say ss was bad yet u assume thats what i meant 😂
just saying along with rend and other things we seem to have a lot of stuff to track and maintain compared to other classes post tuning

[stable fiber]

i like to disagree yes

[sacred summit]

which is why i suggested even just completely baking ss in
(not getting rid of it) or replacing it with smth equivalent and making it work the same like ww

[rose ibex]

I think ss is boring and feels old design wise

[sacred summit]

but why u gotta misinterpret

[stable fiber]

i think baking rend into something is fine

[rose ibex]

It feels like a legacy ability thats stuck around because its so iconic

[stable fiber]

but baking everything into cleave is lazy design

[minor gust]

Just delete rend don't even need to bake it in

[stable fiber]

^

[minor gust]

[rose ibex]

Yeah

And avatar

[stable fiber]

delete rend and make sd proc more

fixes every issue this spec has

ngl

[rose ibex]

And ravager...

[sacred summit]

doesnt have to be cleave
just seemed like the easy choice design wise since rend is baked into tc

[minor gust]

Still need rage buffs SD won't completely save us there

[sacred summit]

yea fr
tf is that? and i gotta keep in mind to cleave in st during ravager?

[steep osprey]

I think Rend should be AoE DW, which is what they might be doing with it considering they want to make DW pure ST

[sacred summit]

https://tenor.com/view/rolling-eyes-gif-22773102

[stable fiber]

it doesnt help colossus much but it fully fixes slayers xdd

[rose ibex]

It always felt out of place. We are not weapon wizards that make magical floating weapons

Magic is cringe

[minor gust]

You throw weapon really hard no magic

[sacred summit]

cant imagine having to take champions spear either along with all this lol

[minor gust]

Make it spin like a top!

[sacred summit]

also our st rotation is so complicated compared to the shit dmg we do

[rose ibex]

If ravager was like.... actually this.... like you hit the ground so hard with the weapon it creates tremors that damage things in an area... I can dig that

[sacred summit]

emphasis on comparatively

[warm fog]

Blizzard doesn’t want to waste the design dollars on the ravager graphic

[sacred summit]

and blizz is… nerfing…? our aoe (at least slayers’) in the .5 patch

[rose ibex]

Give it to blood dks

Who actually use floating magical weapons

[sacred summit]

i assume theyre gonna do more tuning and compensation but

[steep escarp]

If they don’t buff rage they can compensate dn

[sacred summit]

also for st on slayer, do u guys hold ms even when up to get the 2 execute stacks?

cuz if i dont get the sd procs and have to use execute dry twice my rage is bear empty

and between overpower proc and heroic strike proc i really dont have rage

so much easier in non execute when im just reacting to procs and its usually just
sd execute! hs! overower reset! ms! like whackamole

[rose ibex]

I think during execute phase we always want 2 stacks of executioner precision before msing

[sacred summit]

also since rend upkeep is pretty low in our st prio does that mean we let it disappear/not reapply/apply if we have sd proc, overpower proc, hs or ms up?

[sacred summit]

yea
so my rage is pretty starved in execute phase
unless i dont execute unless with sd procs
lemme check rq

[rose ibex]

Arms feels more like you send cleave in aoe, or ms in st on cooldown and try to figure out what is best to press in between

[sacred summit]

nope the prio has execute pretty low without any mention of sd or not so yea

[rose ibex]

Yeah. Resource management is definitely part of the skill. Plan ahead and use those overpowers i imagine

During execute phase anyways

[sacred summit]

i guess its just overpower until i have enough rage

[sacred summit]

yup

why is this only a thing in execute phase lmao

[rose ibex]

I dont think execute is so bad to press anymore if you have the rage

[sacred summit]

smh this spec

[rose ibex]

Execute got buffed

Biz has a great video that goes over the prio

[sacred summit]

yea it just feels bad to press cuz its expensive and without executioners precision i dont get to ms

which normally ms is very high up in prio

so its another thing i gotta always tracj

[tranquil flame]

are we just sitting there in execute then with no heroic strike or overpower?

[sacred summit]

when a boss hits execute phase and when an aoe turns st or 2t and the mob is low

[sacred summit]

wrecking throw 🙂

[rose ibex]

Anything but slam

[sacred summit]

yea get rid of slam pls

[rose ibex]

Things are kinda dependent on how much rage you have

[sacred summit]

i understand what ppl meant when they said pls get rid if slam

[rose ibex]

Also dependent on if you have op or sd procs

[sacred summit]

it feels SO weird prioritizing ms until execute and u dont press it

[rose ibex]

Will you overcap? Are you starved? Always things to consider during st

[sacred summit]

literally ms is priority number 1 outside of ur cds in st and pretty high up in aoe

[rose ibex]

But I really don't know. Im speaking mainly on things ive heard and tried

[sacred summit]

this spec is just hella complicated whackamole

[rose ibex]

Like during raid i definitely have thumb twiddling moments

Or moments where I think I should chill a second instead of wasting rage on slams to fill gcds

[sacred summit]

just play fury in raid tho

its better anyways

[warm fog]

It needed a pruning

And did not get one

[rose ibex]

Fury is too fast for my slow brain

[sacred summit]

honestly tho i prefer this instead of holding cds like some of the long cd classes like ele or smth

[rose ibex]

I have trouble especially during lust phase. I hammer the buttons too and seem to so even less damage than arms

[sacred summit]

i switched to fury/warrior this xpac cuz i wanted to play a low cd class like fury/arms/ret

playing crab build arcane in raid last season was giga turbo ass

[rose ibex]

Slayer fury is actually kinda fun, but id rather play arms

[sacred summit]

yea let me press my cds and wait for my ramp damage
oh wdym adds are up rn? oh lemme track the fight time and look at when others are starting evocation so i can like ts up

[rose ibex]

MT fury is more chill but tclap is lame

[sacred summit]

[rose ibex]

Avatar is lame

Would rather spin spin spin baby

[sacred summit]

st? or aoe?

[rose ibex]

Both I guess? I am not very experienced with fury

It seems like a blisteringly fast spec

Like the fastest I've ever played

[sacred summit]

fury is miles easier than arms in both specs
its just faster paced
which i kinda like since high apm plays to my strengths than thinking mid encounter and lining shit up

[sacred summit]

shuda tried fury during bfa nyalotha and siege kekw

[rose ibex]

I tend to like whack a mole specs that reward good decision making over pressing buttons really fast

[sacred summit]

giga secondary stat bloat made us the highest rpm spec by a mile i think

[rose ibex]

Everytime I have to press the same button 3 times in a row something inside me dies

[sacred summit]

i cant imagine the ppl playing spriest where u have to preplan movement and positioning and cd lineups

[rose ibex]

Spriest is my jam

[sacred summit]

kinda wild that ur doing less st in lust than arms tho

[rose ibex]

Piano/whack a mole is for me

[sacred summit]

fury just doesnt lose to arms in st and its not even close

[rose ibex]

I dunno. I did saladbar on heroic twice. Once as arms, once as fury. Damage was better on arms

[sacred summit]

hahahha
my friend is like that and hes really good
he made me go arcane last season and i hated it
put me back on ret/fury chief

[barren tartan]

arms is performing better in the raid than fury on ST

[sacred summit]

ur probs better at arms and more used to arms than fury

[lost zodiac]

just started warrior. is it bad to macro colossus smash into avatar?

[rose ibex]

My favorite specs seem to always be a bit pianoey

Arms, enh, spriest are prolly my favorites

[sacred summit]

no thats what we normally do

[rose ibex]

What other specs you think i might like?

[sacred summit]

if u look on archi’s wowhead guide on macros

[lost zodiac]

oh the macro section on the guide i was looking at didn't include that, but it felt like i should always CS with avatar. obviously having a button for CS separate for the inbetween cast

[reef prairie]

Its doing better on damage to bosses, thst doesn't mean its performing better on single target

Dragons 2t, paladins 3t

And fury will usually default to doing more aoe

[barren tartan]

yeah look at vorasius and saladbar

[sacred summit]

no idea
especially with the heavy changes all the specs got coming into midnight
i dont do alts and i only play 1 spec/class usually until i “master” it
but that usually takes me into mid mythic prog and im too lazy to gear up an alt by then

[reef prairie]

Arms warriors tend to sit boss, fury never does

[rose ibex]

I used to enjoy sv hunter but its super overpruned atm

But sometimes I need to play something brain off so its good for that

[sacred summit]

it does tho? theres a macro that ties in avatar and cs and when u have cs up but no avatar u just press it and it just sends ca

[reef prairie]

I do think the st between fury and arms is close, but fury is a bit better if you were to just also sit boss

[sacred summit]

uh

[barren tartan]

i just got done looking at mythic damage to bosses statistics

check it im not lying

[reef prairie]

Yes you're reading it wrong

lol

[barren tartan]

how

[sacred summit]

even my sims have a 10k dps diff

[barren tartan]

im excluding pad

[sacred summit]

slayer arms and mt fury

[rose ibex]

Ive always searched for "the one" and its nearly impossible for me. I get bored of things fast, but the pruning has actually killed my interest in a few specs so its made it easier to focus on my warrior as a main

[reef prairie]

I just explained how

[leaden drum]

question, what does everyone average in single target with m+ talents? i seem to be getting around 45k-55k, i feel like thats low?

[barren tartan]

arms sits boss and fury doesnt?

how could you know that for sure

[rose ibex]

Fury is great at blowing up adds

Arms is cooldown dependent

[olive nest]

50k avg isn’t that bad colossus does poor ST but makes up for it by having large aoe

[lost zodiac]

why do we CS before avatar instead of a vatar and then CS?

[olive nest]

You basically cast them together

[lost zodiac]

ok but in the macro order it has CS first. does that mean the CS cast isn't buffed by avatar?

[rose ibex]

If you activate cs but press ava before cs hits does the damage amp still apply to cs?

[leaden drum]

i am missing a good bit of crit in cause im missing a crit ring, im thinking once i get that it may go up a bit?

[olive nest]

I’d put avatar as the first line and cs as the second

[olive nest]

I mean sure it could, whatever sims say

[leaden drum]

ye ill sim it, thanks for the info

[sacred summit]

ngl tho if u like planning and pianoing idk if arms warrior* is the right spec for u 😂

[leaden drum]

pushing 17s rn and i just dont feel competitive in the ST department but just wondering if its a spec issue or me issue

[tranquil flame]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/46/?metric=bossdps&dataset=95 raid boss damage

[sacred summit]

r u pugging

[leaden drum]

ye pugging

[olive nest]

Request mobs on boss wherever possible

You’re damage to the primary target doubles when you have two extra enemies around it

[leaden drum]

yeah ive noticed when we pull mobs into boss i SHOOT up

okay worth trying

[olive nest]

Literally doubles not an exaggeration

[soft gust]

60% prio dps increase vs st

[sacred summit]

i get around 50-65k i think
cuz a lot of the m+ bosses have some sort of dmg buff/amp, lust, etc

[soft gust]

On the really big amp bosses you can do big dam

[sacred summit]

yea like brew said arms needs funnel or we are a dobby class 😂😂😂 if ur going that high u shud probs comm with ur tank that u need mobs for funnel

[leaden drum]

yeah i do dam on damage amps

no problem there

[soft gust]

pulled like 110k on L'ura in seat last night

[sacred summit]

what the fuck lmao

[soft gust]

myth puzzlebox, lust, battle pot on damage amp

with all cds

big

[sacred summit]

yea i dont have a “control” number cuz ive lately been doing aa and… pit? and my st seems to be around 55?

[sacred summit]

oh u meant ur peak

[soft gust]

no

end of boss

[olive nest]

Just a simple;
“Hey any funnel you can bring onto bosses would be great! If not no worries”
9/10 times good tank will do that for you they want to time the key too

A lot of people in this game only know what’s going on with their own spec

[rose ibex]

Less about planning, more like managing a priority list and reacting to procs

[sacred summit]

maybe try spriest again and… shammy?

[leaden drum]

kk thx for the info yall

[rose ibex]

Oh yeah I like those classes

Arms is fun. It has enough variance

[sacred summit]

ye esp if ur going that high id imagine u have to chain pull and pull into boss

[rose ibex]

Sd procs shake up the rotation so it doesnt feel monotonous

Things also change depending on your resources

[charred brook]

Kinda sad paladins prog is over now

Col arms was kinda fun on that fight

[rose ibex]

Its not like a basic builder spender

[sacred summit]

damn wtf is arcane doing at the bottom there

[rose ibex]

Arcane st is terrible

Its aoe is godly

[olive nest]

My teams just past 4 minutes sad that it’s over soon

[charred brook]

We got double weapon drop 🚨

So I got a fat weapon now

[olive nest]

God I hope so but only one, I think I’m literally the only 2h str weapon user in the comp

[charred brook]

Our ret pally got the other one

[lost zodiac]

rend aoe qustion:
priority says to refresh rend at 4s or less on the dot. is that on any mob? i noticed when hitting dummies my primary target's rend is always extended but some of the secondary targets arent

so do i rend again when those get low

[olive nest]

In aoe just toss a rend once in a while when cleave/ms are on cd

[nova marsh]

I still remeber the one tank who asked me when I was on law if I needed pulls broken up

Actual goat

[vapid spire]

Where update

I need to know whats going on

[nova marsh]

I think the update is were in doomer hours

[whole escarp]

On ST and AoE is it ever worth bladestorming without CS debuff on target

[nova marsh]

No

Send no cd without cs

[whole escarp]

Awesome tyty

[umbral gyro]

is arms only good with physical comp?

[nova marsh]

Ive been doing okay without

But definitely find a shammy friend for colo

[umbral gyro]

ok^^

[umbral gyro]

slayer working without? 😄

[elder path]

Both are fine without phys comp but rage starvation issues are more present in col and skyfury makes up for that big time

But I’d say arms is like A tier without phys and S tier with

[umbral gyro]

Okay ty! So I could play slayer whole time in any key?

[elder path]

Yea if you prefer it!

Both builds are solid rn and technically there’s some dungeons that are gonna prefer having the mass AOE of col and some that will prefer the ST and prio damage if slayer.
The value of both builds will also shift with your comp, if you have two other bad ST dps slayer can help shore up that weakness of the party and vice versa for aoe + col

But generally speaking both arms builds are really close in total damage and are performing really well this season

[umbral gyro]

thanks mate

[soft gust]

The amount of dps skyfury gives you is kind of disgusting

that blizz has let our rage get so bad without it is interesting

[umbral badger]

@soft gust need your assistance :p

[soft gust]

ya?

[umbral badger]

considering dreadnaught is less than 1 % of my total dmg in m+ can't i just drop it for more sweeping strike dmg for dungeons with 2 bosses ?

i feel like we are losing a lot of dmg cuz we don't ahve the 25% of sweeping

[minor gust]

The fault of all the consistent complaints of rage is meaningless and devs who just don't understand the problem with modern arms and rage

[umbral badger]

like at least on 2 target bosses it feels sadge to lose it

[soft gust]

your dreadnaught damage is less than 1%?

my last run it was like 3.1%

[umbral badger]

well, overpower overall is 4.6%

probably cuz i ma completing my 15s and 16s so things are not really surviving that long

[soft gust]

from a 14

[lucid ruin]

better to use a crit/haste 276 weapon over a haste/mastery 285 crafted weapon? i wanna give arms a try without recrafting my fury gear.

[umbral badger]

hmm are you using less mortals than me maybe ?

[umbral badger]

k gota se alter

after thsi 16

[edgy canyon]

No use the higher ilvl one

[soft gust]

we have a channel #1347646810457636974 that you can post into with your log for help

[storm canopy]

okay thanks

[delicate turret]

Does overpower not buff cleave lol?

[elder zealot]

Not anymore

[lucid ruin]

what i f i craft a mythic crit/haste cloak. should i swap to the 276 cit/haste weapon?

[elder zealot]

Pretty sure you always want the highest ilvl weapon no matter what

Use your fury weapon for Arms, it's what most people are doing

[lucid ruin]

k right now im using crafted weapon and bracers that are haste/mastery. so they are oklay to keep for arms?

[delicate turret]

does overpower atleast buff mortal?

[soft gust]

if you take martial prowess

[thick kelp]

slam buffs it too

[elder zealot]

Yes, don't recraft anything, because it'll still be your bis off hand for fury

[edgy canyon]

Ya that’s fine, you can play arms pretty well with fury stats

[soft gust]

So, when playing the slayer build you're dropping powerful momentum for deep wounds. in 2-target, dreadnaught procs on both targets so you get extra value

[inland drift]

how much crit do i need to get more procs as slayer for raid st?

[soft gust]

"Current gear" is swapping dreadnaught for powerful momentum in 2-target on my character

[inland drift]

feels like i';m not getting

[soft gust]

Sudden death procs aren't crit dependent

[inland drift]

;-;

i charge, i press bleed, collosus smash, then spin like a beyblade and no procs

[soft gust]

unlucky

[elder zealot]

Yeah if you're coming from Fury, prepare for a lot more RNG

[jovial hare]

ilvl is king

[elder zealot]

Fury is more popular cause it's generally smoother and more pug friendly

[inland drift]

funny enough

is the other way for me with arms

[umbral badger]

i might just be using too many mortal will chekc later

after this 16

just died checking my logs

rip my 200k overall

[elder zealot]

Why would you check logs mid dungeon

[jovial hare]

https://tenor.com/view/bruh-gif-17563483835665589874

[obtuse lantern]

Just got this from weekly, any good for arms with the rings or poo poo?

[umbral badger]

cuz i am a nerd lol

you get to your 30s and you still think you can still do the multitasking thing as if you were 20 :p

[worldly field]

The cantrip gloves proc it

The rings dont...

[obtuse lantern]

o

well, any good with them?#

[worldly field]

The rings do "twilight" damage for some dumb shit reason

So it doesn't count as shadow damage

The plate gloves that proc shadow damage proc it, it's like .5% dmg very tiny

[shut token]

@shadow osprey Shoutout to this guy, he told me who to fix my heroic strike macro that i have been struggling with for so long and now it finally works. I know more people are having the same issue. The fix was "Make a new macro. Put that on your bars and then log out and quit game, not exit game. This fixed it for me, hope it helps anyone else struggling with it

[umbral badger]

oh those are colossus logs though

i am doing some slayering

where can i see a slayer arms damage split

[soft gust]

14 SR run from like a week ago

have been busy so haven't been pushing too much

but dreadnaught is still close to 3%

[umbral badger]

oh ok so i am just slightly less overpower dmg overall

but more BS but then agian one log won't be enough i guess

[soft gust]

one log on a specific dungeon yeah

but, I'd say if your dreadnaught is that low then you should look into the overpower prio

and look at your sim breakdown

for MT

[umbral badger]

OMFG

WELL

that log was fking enough

lol

i can tell you my adhd multiplied with age

that's all i can say

[kind stag]

works with rings i tested it

[vapid spire]

Is the bluething out yet i cant find it

[copper swan]

i got the alleria neck with heroic cache... i guess we do not do shadow dmg ?

unless i hunt triumvirat hands xd

[worldly field]

Do you also have the gloves or another shadow damage source? 2 of us tested rings with that, different classes, 10 minutes on the dummies zero neck procs

Testing with gloves, lots of procs on neck

We only got twilight barrage or w/e which is the ring proc when testing ring + neck

[shadow osprey]

Glad i could help

[shut token]

Another question on that, would it matter if i bind heroic strike to mortal strike or overpower? Would any be better than the other?

[worldly field]

You never heroic strike during aoe, your cleaves will auto consume them

[shadow osprey]

^

[worldly field]

If you have the cleave also slams talent

Only hard cast heroic in your st rotation

[shadow osprey]

I just added mortal strike as an example. Not to say that was the way or anything

[shut token]

I mean if i want to bind heroric strike to either mortal strike or overpower, which one would be best to bind it to

[jovial hare]

twilight damage scales off ur hp tho

(tank rings)

[kind stag]

ive had without gloves but yeah rings have rly bad proc rate unless some hotfix happened recently

[worldly field]

The rings proc just fine