arms

[silk spade]

heroic rash goes hard

🫃

[dire hinge]

[molten zenith]

any reason why these are showing as int main stat on raidbots?

[silk spade]

wait did they fix it

@molten zenith does it not show as int only on the vendor anymore?

[molten zenith]

i bought them just now

[molten zenith]

I assume they were bugged?

[silk spade]

yeah they were showing intellect only

poggies

[mortal rivet]

they're bugged

[thin grotto]

Hey guys, im struggeling a bit with the interactions between Ms, Op and cleave in the colossus AoE rotation. Whats interacting with what/ what do we prioritise?

[plain latch]

anybody else find it crazy that they're making us play blunt instruments in m+?

[rare kite]

i mean they're not tho. most play warbreaker in m+

[magic canopy]

they were originally bugged and only int

[fallen nova]

i feel like im capped on rage all the time rn? what am i doing wrong

[minor gust]

nothing

[raw bison]

Season 1 repeat inc, we are flying way to close to the sun here…but ill bask in it and enjoy ever second. This is why we play warrior for the 1-2 week adrenaline high of being on top before we get our knees broken by the nerf bat.

[visual folio]

dont think blizzard cares about single target dmg specs being strong as much as they do about a spec being very strong at a specific niche that happens to be important/good in a raid tier

cause then the community perception goes "oh my gawd we need to have these specs to do this boss or its joever"

[raw bison]

I hope your right, I woulda love to not get nerfed week 1 lol

[visual folio]

for single target, eh, whatever, naturally the difference is smaller since the numbers are smaller so it doesnt affect as much

[shrewd niche]

They nerf based on raid performance so we might get hit next week hard to tell til we actually get into new raid

Set to 11.0

[silk spade]

11.0

[late badger]

ah that would do it

damn, we back

do we sit the enhance and play warrior, hoping they dont nerf us from RWF? that's the question

[vivid void]

are we really expecting a nerf? feelsbadman been on a break for months

[silk spade]

we got nerfed last week

hopefully it doesnt happen again

[vivid void]

i mean are we getting more

yeah hopefully

[mystic olive]

does bladestorm break the web link on silken court?

[meager timber]

Hrothmar weakaura?

I have mained enhance since shadowlands enhance is unfun to play right now 😦

Just my opinion but I hate hot hands

[still arrow]

is there any fights in raid where you go colossus?

[trail orbit]

for 11.1 no going to be slayer dominate

[untold pewter]

Nono, it's my own

[prime whale]

I’m assuming there is no reason to track the buff we get from Overpower, since we use Mortal Strike on cooldown outside of Execute window, so whether we have stacks of Overpower or not doesn’t affect anything. Hell it also doesn’t affect Execute rotation either. Are both of those assertions correct or am I missing something?

[dire copper]

No you overpower over MS with opportunist procs

[lean geode]

Technically you do care about Martial Prowess (the OP buff to MS) during execute

That's basically to make sure you MS every 4th global

You won't necessarily do exactly
exe exe OP MS
depending on how much rage you have at various points along there, but you do want to make sure you're doing at least 2 exes in between

So it could be
exe exe OP MS
exe OP exe MS
OP exe exe MS
exe exe exe MS
but it would never be
exe exe OP OP MS
exe OP exe OP MS

(because those are delaying your MS by an extra global)

[prime whale]

What if I don’t take opportunist?

[lean geode]

The screenshot I sent is the only time martial prowess appears in the APL

[prime whale]

Ok thank you very much. That’s a function of the cooldown on MS though, not really the buff from OP being worth delaying uses of MS

[lean geode]

MS > OP without opp

That's true both for Fierce Followthrough or if you have Opp specced but just don't have the buff

With FF though you do prio your 2nd OP charge over MS

(outside of execute)

[prime whale]

Yea idk how to read the APL, I’m not as smart as you, please explain it to me like I was a small child.

Yea I just double checked, I’m asking specifically about Martial Prowess

[lean geode]

It looks a lot more intimidating than it is, I promise

You just read it top-to-bottom like you would the prio list on the wowhead guide

The syntax is a little funky, but the highlighted line says
"use overpower if you have the winning streak buff up and 2 charges of OP, or if you have winning streak and the opportunist buff up"

[prime whale]

And whether it is worth making sure you have two stacks of it before you send a MS.

[lean geode]

and since it's above MS, you do it before you MS

[prime whale]

Or whether it is always better to send the MS regardless of MP stacks

[lean geode]

So I guess that 2 charge rule also applies whether you have FF or Opp talented

I missed that at first, my bad

[lean geode]

No, you send MS regardless of how many martial prowess stacks you have

The only thing martial prowess affects is whether you OP or exe during execute range

[prime whale]

Where is the APL sheet?

[lean geode]

(alongside how much rage you have)

[prime whale]

Very cool, thank you

[lean geode]

I lied, they are up on the simc github now https://github.com/simulationcraft/simc/blob/thewarwithin/ActionPriorityLists/warrior_arms.simc#L157-L188

But to be honest

It's WAY easier to just look at the wowhead guide https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/warrior/arms/rotation-cooldowns-pve-dps

Archi does a lot of work to translate the minor APL optimizations into being actually readable and useful

The only thing I'd personally worry about looking at the APL for is specific things like "how long is it worth delaying BS to line up with avatar"

Like the wowhead guide says ava "shortly before" or with CS - if you want to know exactly how long "shortly before" is, you can check the APL and see that the answer is 5 seconds (assuming you play like a robot ofc)
https://github.com/simulationcraft/simc/blob/thewarwithin/ActionPriorityLists/warrior_arms.simc#L176

[prime whale]

Yea this is where I came from to ask, because Martial Prowess is not mentioned in the out of execute phase and I just wanted to make sure that that was really something I didn’t need to worry about

[lean geode]

Correct, it really isn't

I also thought of another edge case, you wouldn't do
exe OP OP MS
during execute for reasons of both martial prowess and EP

So it's not strictly using MS on cd that's the main motivating factor, but it's also not strictly MP

[prime whale]

Cool, thank you

[lean geode]

🫡

[uneven talon]

what does more dps atm fury or arms?

[mortal rivet]

arms

[rancid solstice]

Gcd locked in both specs pretty much

Oh nvm I read that as apm I need to go zzz

[dire copper]

If you're not taking opportunist, it can still be smart to use overpower when at 2 stacks when at very low rage just to get the charge rolling for rage gen. Usually only applicable when the boss parries you on an AA so your rage flatlines for a second

[magic canopy]

oh shit

revvez updated his maxroll guides

time to check em out

[minor gust]

yeah hes still doing it

[uneven talon]

can you link me spec?

[dire hinge]

what kind of link are you looking for exactly?

like this?
https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/warrior/arms/overview-pve-dps

[safe island]

Why Sweeping Strikes has GCD

[clever narwhal]

Hey gamers, can anyone explain to me why the rotation guide advises to not use mortal strike during ravanger? I understand the unhinged talent makes it so one is cast every other ravanger hit, however from my brief testing it doesnt seem like putting MS on cd affects in proccing, but I could be wrong

[uneven talon]

copy talent string, type of link

[dire hinge]

it's on the guide

[uneven talon]

ty ty

[dire hinge]

quicklinks are in red on the right
https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/warrior/arms/hero-talents#raid

[woven wasp]

Because it's doing it for you so you can spend GCDs on other abilities

[dire hinge]

the big thing is during Execute Phase because you only want to use MS if you have 2x stacks of Executions Precision.

So you're basically doing:
Ravager -> Execute Execute -> (automatic MS goes off) -> Execute Execute -> (automatic MS goes off) -> etc

there's more nuance there, but just to illustrate

[magic canopy]

basically you just execute check for op proc

execute check for op proc

ms

ignore EB

[dire copper]

Yeah, basically while you CAN ms, you can just be using other globals (since it's in the opener you're rolling a bunch of CD's/sudden deaths/etx) where just weaving in the overpower buffs the free MS's coming out until you're past the CD phase. And during execute phase, exactly what hrothmar says, just going ex ex overpower sustains rage while using executioner procs for free

[dense vector]

What’s the fastest way to get weathered crests to make 629 gear?

[dire hinge]

The options are listed right on the tooltip:
Clear through delves if you're fast, spam heroic dungeons, main questline, etc.

[dense vector]

I’m not at my pc my bad

[dire hinge]

all good, mostly pointing it out so it's an easy reference when you're back ❤️

it's a spiffy change

[dense vector]

You wanna cap before you get the ones from renown right

Or do those not count towards the cap at all?

[dire hinge]

those usually bypass cap

[dense vector]

I wasn’t sure if they didn’t count on the cap or if they just let you just go beyond

[dire hinge]

admittedly i am just now sitting down for one of the first times this week so i can't directly verify bc im not there yet, but in the past rewarded crests usually dont count towards cap bc it would feel bad

[dense vector]

I’ve mostly just done the campaign and last minute zekvir ??

I think I beta him in like 3:30 with new arms damage at like 629ilvl lmao

[dire hinge]

ah, yeah that was a fun one to do at release, was real sweaty

[dense vector]

I was watching people do it last patch and it was like 9 minutes for them

[clever narwhal]

@dire copper @dire hinge Makes sense, ty for the replies!

[clever narwhal]

So, in multi target should I still be priong MS during sweeping strikes, even while ravangers up (if cleaves on cd)

[smoky kayak]

Unless Execute is available during Ravager, yes you still use Mortal Strike regularly in multitarget

[clever narwhal]

Sick, ty

[spring vale]

With bleeds doing so little compared to our other rotational abilities, is there ever a point where it's worth switching talents like Bloodletting and Bloodborne for other things?

[dense vector]

Even if no SS? Or should I try to sync them up

[lunar remnant]

Arms has been slapping hope we dodge the nerf bat

[rare kite]

we won't. but you're allowed to hope xD

[lunar remnant]

my enhance alt is 635 just incase, not making the same mistake twice haha

[neat phoenix]

how do you like the maxroll guides?

[latent moss]

written by the goat

[magic canopy]

its made by Revvez that guy might be the warrior player i respect the most

he is very knowledgeable, constantly tests, and a sick player all in one

[neat phoenix]

Okay, I just started looking at it, it looks really clean. I know other specs don't like maxroll guides.

Just wanted to see if warrior was the same but doesn't sound like it

[magic canopy]

cant speak for them, and most class discords focus on wowhead/icy veins becuase thats where the guide writers/ moderators generally put their stuff up at.

[neat phoenix]

gotcha!

[magic canopy]

Maxroll contracted Echo for guide content and i know a lot of what was written was memed on, but even on its first iteration the Warrior guides were extremely solid and i highly reccomend them

its more AoE damage and if you combo it with Ravager you do a crazy amount but you will be holding ravager a bit or sitting on avatar to do so

mainly becuase it reduces the CD on cleave itself to every other global

[rare kite]

he also recommends dreadnaught over strength of arms. it's preference honestly

[magic canopy]

alot of the time most people in M+ try to go for hybrid builds, where you try to get as much single target, AND as much aoe as you possibly can

[minor gust]

Revvez like big aoe. Realistically warlords soa just nicer for more ST

[magic canopy]

to giva an example of something i learned reading his guide tonight was preusing 1.5m cds 10 seconds before the pull on Cauldron of Carnage will line them up for every clash phase

i dont know why i didnt consider using cds pre pull but its a thing like that which could make a big differance

[rare kite]

revvez goated

[rare kite]

iirc it's somewhat the same for one armed bandit for SS. if you SS before it means you have it for 2 add sets

[neat phoenix]

interesting, I havent gotten there but makes alot of since

[minor gust]

yeah Revvez owns with his boss tips in the guide

[magic canopy]

I would highly reccomend his maxroll guide. can't understate enough how valuable it is that we actually get his pre raid prep in guide form

i will however toot my own horn as my raid prep for rik reverb was identical to his

[rare kite]

his sylvanas stance swapping to proc whatever the fuk those gems were called as well

[magic canopy]

unholy gem set pog

[latent moss]

he used game deficit

started the fight with stacks

nah but he always had the proc aligned

it was crazy

[void sigil]

https://tenor.com/view/this-gif-4354544

[hexed saddle]

you see, arms (bad) is a good spec first tier of the expansion because at that point is better than fury (bad) because fury scales better (good) as the time goes on and you get more and more stats (scaling) every tier, so at the end of an expansion generally fury is better (good) because it scales (good) better

[minor gust]

you see, arms (bad) is a good spec first tier of the expansion because at that point is better than fury (bad) because fury scales better (good) as the time goes on and you get more and more stats (scaling) every tier, so at the end of an expansion generally fury is better (good) because it scales (good) better

[quasi torrent]

stop typing the s word u cretin

[lofty elm]

Anyone know of a target dummy that will stay out of execute range? 😂

[void lily]

arms feels so good right now. im 605ilvl

[quaint otter]

💪

[swift crown]

you see, arms (bad) is a good spec first tier of the expansion because at that point is better than fury (bad) because fury scales better (good) as the time goes on and you get more and more stats (scaling) every tier, so at the end of an expansion generally fury is better (good) because it scales (good) better

[hollow plover]

this is incredibly bullshit unless there are exactly zero balance changes

[swift crown]

you are wrong

and not based

[fresh spire]

whole lotta gamers in the vc

[eager sigil]

gio finally assembled the 5 warrior key

[fresh spire]

:holy:

[daring flicker]

Capyman fury player

grab him

[swift crown]

tis true

[hollow plover]

arent the voice gamers all NA based

[eager sigil]

think so

they need to go to bed

[hollow plover]

is the @ revvez on this server the actual revvez? I wanted to mention to hims that this is now outdated in his maxroll guide

[daring flicker]

truth

[hollow plover]

based

common max W and scripe L

[reef glade]

lol what

[thick kelp]

Buff arms guys

[reef glade]

yikers

can we nerf blue spec please

[dense vector]

TRUE nerf blue guy in my heroic dungeon

[thick kelp]

wrong blue

[hollow plover]

what key is this

[dense vector]

last boss on heroic city of eechoes

[hollow plover]

yawn

gtfo

[brittle fiber]

Is that cowossus or swayer build

[thick kelp]

idk i was the enha

[hollow plover]

blue

[brittle fiber]

https://tenor.com/view/dogdiesamengodbless-gif-23866738

I did colossus the other night and it feels really good tbh

Kinda like unholy dk with a 5 target cap

[hollow plover]

bro arms m+ is not okay

needs nerf for sure

[brittle fiber]

It stomps

[hollow plover]

its not okay that you go in and press demolish congrats +30 million damage

like ?

[brittle fiber]

I wish they nerfed it but brought our cap up

Blizzard wont listen and they’ll instead nerf the bonus damage avatar gives or something stupid

[icy mulch]

https://tenor.com/view/deerseason-engaged-im-gif-19199737

Have you not seen Shaman, DK, or warlock do usually more?

[hollow plover]

i did some keys yday, one example being a dawn 13

hold on i got a screenshot somewhere

1sec

arms in m+

👍

[brittle fiber]

Then 3/4 of the dungeon you do 900k dps

[reef glade]

[hollow plover]

no ?

[icy mulch]

[reef glade]

just be like 2m minimum any pack no

30 second cds

[hollow plover]

yea

[reef glade]

80% of your peak dmg

[daring flicker]

i do 63 dps at ilvl 639

[hollow plover]

you have dmg every single pack

[icy mulch]

I see no issue with that.

[brittle fiber]

Depends how quick mini ads die tbh

[hollow plover]

if they die too quickly then you're not playing dungeon key levels high enough for the full aoe setup

[brittle fiber]

True

[hollow plover]

if you cant get the full set up rolling before shits dead

[brittle fiber]

But that was a +14 mists

[hollow plover]

dont do the full setup

[hollow plover]

yea thats like a +10

after nerfs

[brittle fiber]

Ya

What do we think we can go straight into season 2

Key wise

[hollow plover]

shrug

[brittle fiber]

Comfy 8 struggle 10?

[icy mulch]

10s

I maybe in 12+ by the end of week one.

Maybe

[brittle fiber]

I need to push +10’s first week for sure, my warrior lacking in gear badly

[hollow plover]

In season 1 we did 10s with 610ilvl to 620 ilvl depending on how good your group was iirc. Thats normal raid gear ish

so like

shrug

[eager sigil]

also no peril

helps a bit

[vague sonnet]

Full hero track I say 14s doable week 1 imo

[hollow plover]

yo lads

feels so good to have 3x 645 items

Prayge

get on

[eager sigil]

i got scammed out of 1

[brittle fiber]

Can i say that i did maybe 3 keys with a full group of people in my raid team last season?

[hollow plover]

how so

[brittle fiber]

Same 🈳

[eager sigil]

the quest in undermine didnt give veteran gear

[eager sigil]

its bugged

[hollow plover]

are u lost

its not bugged

[void lily]

how are you getting 645?

[brittle fiber]

Yea but i got the delve trinket

[hollow plover]

any 2 boxes give gear

once u have opened 2 boxes

no more gear

blud says bugged

[eager sigil]

yea mate i have opened like 4

[hollow plover]

ICANT

[brittle fiber]

I think i deleted a vetern piece accidentally thinking it was s1

[untold pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/glorp-glorpshit-mad-gif-12826934952903770254

[brittle fiber]

To item resto i go

[untold pewter]

Bro all of this becomes super irrelevant next week

[hollow plover]

the third item is from a vendor

[eager sigil]

i know

like i said if you got the chest from the undermine special worldquest you can get scammed

[thick kelp]

i got scammed

gg

[hollow plover]

cool

[icy mulch]

Sadly it will all be swapped out next week.

[hollow plover]

(it does not matter)

[icy mulch]

Good bye to all the s1 loots, back to looking like an unmogged hobo for a bit.

[hollow plover]

just mog every upgrade wdym

[latent moss]

cant wait to upgrade veteran pieces just to replace them in the first hour of m+

[untold pewter]

Rather play monster hunter wilds until next week kek

[latent moss]

real

[icy mulch]

I've been considering picking that up.

[hollow plover]

im gonna miss s1 tier set

[latent moss]

what is there to miss

[untold pewter]

S1 tier was glorpshit

Fuck lethal blows

[icy mulch]

I've wanted to play monster hunter since I first saw it back on Sega Dreamcast. Never jumped in though.

[hollow plover]

s1 tier set is okay shit, s2 tier set is complete doodoo

[latent moss]

i meant like

what is there to miss as in

it does nothing

[icy mulch]

S2 is # wise a lot better. I'd say better looking as well. Unless you like the weird Loki horns.

[latent moss]

ig it makes u press ms in exe at least it used to

pre 4set u would just spam exe anyway

[untold pewter]

It looks kinda generic imo, and I hate the claws on the feet

[icy mulch]

At least its not the Legion style massive boots.

[hollow plover]

monster energy warrior isnt real

[icy mulch]

Lol

[latent moss]

oh u are talking

transmog

[hollow plover]

nah i do mean the set pieces

but this one guy mentioend tmog

[icy mulch]

The Emerald nightmare and Nighthold boots, fuck those monster clunkers.

[latent moss]

df s3 best arms set ever

peak gameplay in aoe

[hollow plover]

is this your favorite flavor of monster?

[latent moss]

annoying on st at times

[hollow plover]

i like this flavor, personally

[robust elk]

Is there any difference between slayer and colossus MT opener?

(besides the obvious)

[hollow plover]

well colossus has demolish (the obvious)

also bladestorm works differently to ravager

[latent moss]

colossus does damage

chatting

[robust elk]

Could u be more specific?

[robust elk]

right

[hollow plover]

im not entirely sure about the exact opener for slayer aoe

do an aoe quicksim

it will show u the opener

YEP

[latent moss]

they are different

as colossus u send ravager on opener and spam cleave with mbg

as slayer u have to have op on cd and cleave on cd to send bladestorm

and sd too

this is the apl

[thick kelp]

to specify here

this is with DN talented

[latent moss]

yeah forgot to mention that

[thick kelp]

if you have SoA, you will just warbrkear cleave bladestorm

[latent moss]

and sweeping strikes up

[robust elk]

❤️ ty sirs

[icy mulch]

Does the Unhinged MS count towards collateral?

[thick kelp]

no

[latent moss]

it doesnt cleave so no

[thick kelp]

now that u mention it

let me test if the CM bug applies to it

too

[latent moss]

i actualy never checked ngl

i just saw you say no and i believe you

kino

[thick kelp]

Why is my WA bar so smol

[latent moss]

tmy moment

i need to replace atrocitys with tmys cause

bro doesnt even track tc for some reason

[thick kelp]

ok my answer is still no regarding the unhinged MS counting towards collat

[thick kelp]

Cluegi deluxe

[eager sigil]

if only there was a way to add it

[latent moss]

effort

i could use that effort and add tmys

which is better anyway

[icy mulch]

Sad, wasting time in Bladestorm with SS up.

[thick kelp]

yep but its worse to waste time inside mbg

so thats why

[icy mulch]

Fair, guess that's part of why Colossus w/ravager is better for AoE.
Though I do wish both could stand on their own, (Bladestorm and Ravager).

[daring heron]

hey wouldnt this be solved if ss was off gcd

[naive sage]

Mind blowing

[true ridge]

Don't be coming in with reasoning and ideas we are here to complain

[snow flame]

remove it!

please

[brittle fiber]

how are peeps getting weathered crests? just rares?

[hollow plover]

yea elemental shaman is human in low key

[brittle fiber]

this quest isnt friggin retroactive

[rare kite]

Theyre gonna make it a quarter gcd now

[hollow plover]

BASED

is there even a reason why ss is on the gcd when other classes have buff buttons like that which ignore gcd

[true ridge]

To create friction

[hollow plover]

man i sure love friction

[brittle fiber]

did they get rid of the weathered crest balsl

[true ridge]

I'd be fine with ss being on gcd if it had some sort or damage when pressed but is what it is

[rain cipher]

Will I lose too much if I send CS or WB before Avatar and Roar? I just used to send Reck before Avatar and Roar as fury.. I just want to maintain the same key binding

[hollow plover]

you should not think of cs/wb as the arms equivalent of reck

its absolutely a damage loss

[astral yarrow]

arms opener isnt that strict to where its gonna matter in the grand scheme of things

[junior quail]

hey this wont happen ever cuz lizzards

[naive breach]

lizards you say

[junior quail]

🦎

[naive breach]

how the FUCK do you gear alts right now

where m0

[junior quail]

world quests xD

[dense vector]

Craft 629 gear with weathered crests

[latent moss]

just get 600 and do m0s day one

or craft if u want yeah

[dense vector]

Buy old mythic boes of gold isn’t a problem for you

[inland drift]

man still undecided if arms or fury x_X did mountain fury 2 keys, arms demolisher, and both felt good idk

[steep osprey]

play both

[rotund oriole]

What's more proper sims now guys? Nightly or latest?

[thick kelp]

latest

[rotund oriole]

Nightly sims higher somehow

Almost 2 mil sheesh

[naive breach]

wait till one gets bonked, play the other

[inland drift]

xD

[junior quail]

has anyone tried champs spear in m+ ? or do u think troar will still be the go to

[dim basalt]

Spear is still bad

[junior quail]

understood

[strange perch]

question for aoe,

do you only press the bracketed ones during that 4.5 seconds of cd that cleave has then?

seeing its higher prio? Just confirming

[thick kelp]

Yes

[strange perch]

that's interesting

kinda cool how sweeping strikes is that high prio then

you'd think it'd be under cleave then

or does cleave apply sweeping strikes too

[daring heron]

cleave casts slam with fervor talented

[thick kelp]

YOu have this talent called fervor of battle

[daring heron]

which gets sweeped

[thick kelp]

what crit said

[idle heart]

https://tenor.com/view/armswarrior-warrior-warriorwow-armswow-armswarriorwow-gif-27099127

[strange perch]

oh okay thanks 🙂

im new to warrior so appreciate it

[dim basalt]

A fellow meta chaser

(war will never be meta)

[strange perch]

i tend to play something from the top classes that i think looks cool

so i checked lists and went with something i think i'll like lmao

[thick kelp]

Praying for more nrefs on reset 🙏

[dim basalt]

At least we dont get dumbasses in here that ask questions but then know better when they get an answer

Seen it happen on the hunter discord too often

[strange perch]

im too stupid to correct people that have been playing this shit for 20 years

im just a dumb ffxiv player

[empty pike]

I would like to take this opportunity to ask you if the dwarf will change in s2?

I'm bad, the more defensive the better

[eager sigil]

not that we know

[low elk]

hey guys quick question, do the mortal strikes from unhinged (ravager or BS) benefit from sweeping strikes?

[dim basalt]

no

[low elk]

cheers ty

slams from fervor do sweep tho right?

[dim basalt]

yes

[low elk]

👍

[dim basalt]

Gotta love the consistency

[low elk]

yeah i asked cus of the Fury unhinged not benefitting from whirlwind sadly

[empty pike]

danm son

I always thought so

[royal lynx]

Hey guys, in the m+ build what would the single target priority list be? Ms/op/cleave?

[thick kelp]

dont press cleave in st

[bleak fog]

What if... They sort the fucking lag?

[brittle fiber]

@hollow plover hey where'd you get carved from?

[hollow plover]

hm?

[brittle fiber]

you had 3 645's yea?

[hollow plover]

yup

[hollow plover]

it says it right there

hope that helps

[brittle fiber]

yea but it sounds better from someone else

[hollow plover]

valid

i feel u

[brittle fiber]

thanks 👍

[hollow plover]

wasnt cleave>slam during ravager?

[thick kelp]

During mbg if u wont munch MP stacks

which is realistically maybe once per fight

so i dont see a point on using mental power for that

[hollow plover]

i think its ok to mention

[snow flame]

I will do it and get a rank 1

Just for you

[violet steeple]

Sometimes people get reaaally caught up on these small .2% optimizations that realistically you're more likely to have 1 more crit do more than focusing on that

[unique aspen]

Just had a 5mio ms crit…felt good

[violet steeple]

feelsgoodman

[neat phoenix]

have there been any sims on how many ilvls the best in slots weapon on use is worth?

[brisk pelican]

you playing the game again or what fam

[wintry arch]

It’s weird pressing overpower instead of ms

Doesn’t op have a chance to reset ms

[onyx veldt]

hello, anyone able to help me with a macro?
#showtooltip!
/cast [@mouseover] Storm bolt
/cancelaura [notknown:Unrelenting Onslaught] Bladestorm
I want it to cancel bladestorm if that talent isn't known

[astral yarrow]

When would you be casting bladestorm without that talent while playing slayer

[onyx veldt]

it's more so i know how to do it i know in this case it's unlikely

[astral yarrow]

if you arent playing slayer, you'll be playing with ravager instead, so theres really no point

[onyx veldt]

never know maybe colossus starts using bladestorm eventually

[silk spade]

no

[astral yarrow]

but to answer you question: you just set it to "/cancelaura [known:<talent id you will have otherwise>] Bladestorm"

[fallen oar]

Slam instead ?

[astral yarrow]

I just have a bladestorm cancel in my charge macro

[thick kelp]

yeh

[onyx veldt]

perfect thanks! just the "notknown" isnt a function then

[astral yarrow]

not as far as i know

google "wow macro conditionals" for a complete list

the [known:<>] conditional is new with DF i think

[onyx veldt]

thanks very much!

[violet steeple]

Yesssssir

Break was needed but I missed it and I'm back

[woven wasp]

Known replaced talent with df yeah

[torpid jackal]

Im not a super frequent arms player, for M+ are yall preferring Colo or Slayer

Giving all the different setups a go across the class

[thick kelp]

Colo

[silk spade]

colo goated

[torpid jackal]

Kk ty

[olive nest]

Colo does pumpeth

[unborn canyon]

too bad we dont have a demolish emote

[olive nest]

To bad they don’t allow external emojis and ban people who send explicit ones

[gaunt owl]

proof that Demolish isnt worthy of an emote

[olive nest]

Demolish good button!

[unborn canyon]

yet this is?

[olive nest]

Just need to be able to move freely with

[fallen agate]

I'm still trying to figure out why Blizzard thought the best way to make people not spam Execute and use Hard Hitting DPS abilities was to nerf how you gain stacks of Colossal Might by removing Execute... thus slowing down how fast you get to use full stacked Demolish... You know a HARD HITTING DPS ABILITY... The brain on that dev... >_<

[olive nest]

And have infinite range

[prime bramble]

2.4m one dungeon and 1.8 the next

Small fury peanut brain is struggling with arms

[hollow plover]

RealShit

[hollow plover]

necrotic wake vs dawn?

kekW

[prime bramble]

Both 9s for farming alt gear for the homies GB then ara i believe

So just quick pulls and no tyrannical bosses

[hollow plover]

comparing the overall of diff dungeons is kinda goofy

as long as ur clapping cheeks, should be fine

[prime bramble]

Wasn't trying to 1 to 1 compare them

[hollow plover]

sounded a bit like it

[prime bramble]

More so just stating the pains of swapping from fury and my smooth velvety brain

[hollow plover]

fair

[wheat lagoon]

My brain also be a shiny smooth marble

[olive nest]

Overall is so dependent on pull size and weather or not you have CDs for those pulls

Can’t sweat it to much

[silk bloom]

How much of an overall is arms ahead of fury? In the end does it even matter what is “better”

[trim lintel]

In the end does it even matter what is “better”
play whatever u prefer

both spec r close enough

[lean geode]

Arms is about 1.5% ahead on pure single target assuming no mechanics

And that both are played perfectly

[hollow plover]

Ima be real it seems like a raid tier where both specs have upsides and downsides, as was the case in nerubar palace

[lean geode]

This is almost always true

[hollow plover]

Meh sometimes both specs do similarly

[thick kelp]

Guys whats wrong with this piece of text

[steep osprey]

fantastic single target

M+ build

choose one

[smoky kayak]

critcake makes it look excellent

[steep osprey]

Without critcake, arms wouldn't be excellent

[vast helm]

[smoky kayak]

without critcake arms would be able to in peace

[vast helm]

we pray ?

[steep osprey]

I saw a vod of him doing 1m overall than the second dps

tbh they dps could have been sandbaggin

[sweet quartz]

I’ve been reading chat did I read correctly and we use ravager over bladestorm?

[steep osprey]

with the damage they were doing

[steep osprey]

You use Ravager as colossus

Slayer has to pick BS to work

[sweet quartz]

Yea I prefer colossus idk I don’t find slayer cool

[smoky kayak]

damn, that sounds like low key one of the better specs this tier. Must have fantastic Single Target in their M+ build while also having great AoE Damage

[steep osprey]

Time to make a pasta

[sweet quartz]

I need too keep practicing just swap over too arms so let hope I git gud and out shine the dps in my guild

[steep osprey]

Arms is a spec that does incredible overall damage and is low key one of the better specs this tier. They are currently playing Colossus with [spell=436358].
They have fantastic Single Target in their M+ build while also having great AOE Damage. There have been streamers like Critcake that make this spec look excellent.

[thick kelp]

if u play colossus u wont be outshining anyone in raid

[steep osprey]

You will

stop capping

even tho colossus is worse than slayer

[smoky kayak]

maybe you won't!

[steep osprey]

it's still strong in ST compared to most specs

Arms is just busted

[wintry arch]

Is there anything I could do as an individual to help prevent another arms nerf?

[smoky kayak]

don't play Arms

[sweet quartz]

I just wana press demolition

[steep osprey]

No joke the best answer

[steep osprey]

It's Demolish, not demolition

[sweet quartz]

Oops

[wintry arch]

I’ve been arms since I started in shadowlands I am grandfathered in

[smoky kayak]

iTs dEMolisH noT dEmoLitION
stfu nerd

[sweet quartz]

Slayer for st and colossus for aoe or is it slayer all the way?

[steep osprey]

[steep osprey]

yes that is correct

[smoky kayak]

[steep osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/demolition-gif-20801919

Arms hero spec

[grizzled estuary]

https://tenor.com/view/the-office-no-michael-scott-gif-10951187

[sweet quartz]

100%

[steep osprey]

I hope they nerf MS/OP/Exe

instead of another aura nerf

so annoying

[grizzled estuary]

just rp boomy and complain everywhere pls

[wintry arch]

Just need mage or someone to find a broken interaction and all 3 devs will be distracted

[daring heron]

lmaooo where is this from

[thick kelp]

Tettless updating wowhead tierlist

[daring heron]

we can pin the future arms nerf on me, confirmed

[smoky kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/mean-girls-gif-20175104

critcake is going in the book

[thick kelp]

Every future post in updates channel which includes an arms nerf should end with "Thanks @daring heron"

[daring heron]

[olive nest]

critcake makes it look excellent

[steep osprey]

Arms is a spec that does incredible overall damage and is low key one of the better specs this tier. They are currently playing Colossus with [spell=436358].
They have fantastic Single Target in their M+ build while also having great AOE Damage. There have been streamers like Critcake that make this spec look excellent.

[olive nest]

Godking Critvald

[steep osprey]

Cringe Fury got the same nerf % as arms

[grizzled estuary]

thanks in advance @daring heron

[olive nest]

thanks in advance @daring heron

[devout pewter]

Thanks in advance @daring heron

[prime whale]

You mean, just RP a WoW player in 2025

[grizzled estuary]

true, maximum stream was hilarious, critcake was legit the sole honest guy

[steep osprey]

Xeos would disagree

[daring heron]

i watched the chat replay, a lot of people thought i was capping when i rated both specs high

[smoky kayak]

$rename 235809563490779136 Nerfcake

[grizzled estuary]

lmao

[olive nest]

[steep osprey]

oof

[daring heron]

NICE

[thick kelp]

Wtf happened for this to be the conclusion for arms in the s1 tierlist

"Slayer arms plays the full bladestorm AOE build in SIngle TArget aswell"

[olive nest]

HAH Gottem

[prime whale]

You chickened out and took Arms out of 5 big booms for no reason.

[grizzled estuary]

people are lobotimized by m+ meta, like utility and shit

[sharp wyvern]

didnt you know bladestorm is an aoe ability ?

[steep osprey]

Your chat replay or Maximum's?

[grizzled estuary]

was consistent whith the rest claimign their spec was shit imho

[daring heron]

max

[grizzled estuary]

relative ranking

[steep osprey]

So people in Max's chat thought warrior wasn't good?

let em keep thinking that

[olive nest]

Surely blizzard respects non sandbaggers!!

[steep osprey]

He didn't chicken out, there were some other variables as to why he chose to rank them lower

[devout pewter]

Inb4 they realize warrior is good and we suddenly get a huge influx of new members here

[sharp wyvern]

of course tehy do look at enhanced

[steep osprey]

We did get a bunch of people coming in here recently

asking about rotation

[grizzled estuary]

surely the guy in charge at miscrosoft is a war hater

[steep osprey]

but that always happens every patch

[smoky kayak]

idk man, it's Tettles, who knows what runs through his KFC-addled brain

[steep osprey]

I don't think he has a say in warrior development

[olive nest]

I’m looking forward to discussing the opener everyday for the next 4 months

[grizzled estuary]

idd man thats ironic lemme cope

[steep osprey]

The issue with warrior is that the devs don't know what to do with them

There are classes that are getting good changes because there's some innovation there

[smoky kayak]

buff them by 66%, that's what

[prime whale]

Heroic leap into Overpower twice to get them on cd ASAP

[smoky kayak]

That said, Warrior actually got some nice changes this tier, so idk what yall bitching about

[steep osprey]

Devs know what to do with those specs, like enha shaman

[sharp wyvern]

save a screenshot from quick sims

[smoky kayak]

balancing is (always) a little iffy, sure
but the class tree changes were good, the RA changes were well intentioned, the Colossus build changes are finally creating some diversity between it and Slayer

[full widget]

When are we getting vanilla levels of warrior class diff

All because of @daring heron smh

[devout pewter]

Warrior is fine. I always said this

[sharp wyvern]

i dont like them putting two handed weapon spec above roar

[smoky kayak]

it's a bit weird, but it works a lot better than the previous setup

[steep osprey]

I think I just want a full revamp of trees like some specs have been getting recently and anything else just disappoints me, even though we have been getting good changes

[smoky kayak]

ok but not getting what you personally want doesn't mean what you are getting is bad or that they don't know what they're doing

[olive nest]

I personally don’t care at all that spear and roar stink, I’d rather our damage come from Ms/exe/op/rend/dw

[grizzled estuary]

[steep osprey]

Fair enough

[smoky kayak]

Well this tier, that's exactly where our damage comes from LOL

Mortal Strike buffed by 66%

[grizzled estuary]

my personal fav gimmick was test of might

[olive nest]

Amen!

[visual fern]

Love Frappe Mortelle

[thick kelp]

Frappe mortelle

[smoky kayak]

ToM is fine in a vacuum, it just runs away really easily

[olive nest]

Frappe mortelle

[gaunt owl]

it took them long enough to make MS be a standalone ability

[steep osprey]

Has there ever been such a huge dps buff for any class

[visual fern]

Arms deep wounds scaling increased by 1000%

[smoky kayak]

my dude there have been like +500% buffs to various abilities in the past

66% is nothing lol

[gaunt owl]

warlock had the biggest one ever

[visual fern]

Basically made arms a dot class

[olive nest]

I’m still waiting for the +500% to brain power

[steep osprey]

tbh DW was trash

but yeah that is huge

[visual fern]

How can ToM run archi when we're all arms and no legs

[steep osprey]

That is insane

[daring heron]

1000% deep wounds!

[steep osprey]

Oh, shaman did get some big buffs but those spells weren't really good or anything

[grizzled estuary]

is dh good atm guys pls? !

gotta work on some backup i cba being ina wheelchair

[thick kelp]

yeah

havoc is very good

[steep osprey]

yep

havoc is the ultimate funnel

[grizzled estuary]

thanks

[gaunt owl]

waiting for a 2000% hamstring increase

[steep osprey]

I don't think hamstring does damage

I could be wrong

oh it does

lmao

[thick kelp]

it does sooooo much

[smoky kayak]

man yall don't even know, there was a time where Hamstring spam was a top tier rotation

[steep osprey]

Wasn't that classic

[smoky kayak]

no lol this was like WoD

[steep osprey]

what the fuck were they smoking in wod

that expansion is weird

[icy mulch]

Many things, WoD was very much one of the biggest duds of an expac.

[visual fern]

I remember offgcd hamstring in legion

[steep osprey]

First off they remove HC without any decent way to use your rage, and make slam a talent

[visual fern]

That was a vibe

[smoky kayak]

they actually nerfed hamstring damage several times to try to curb it, and I remember arguing with Celestalon that it should just not do any damage whatsoever to keep the issue from ever coming back again

[visual fern]

||It wasn't||

[steep osprey]

Who is Celestalon

[icy mulch]

Yeah, use to have it macro'd with charge in pvp.

[smoky kayak]

but he felt that if it didn't do any damage, the ability wouldn't have good feedback (which I don't agree with, I feel like damage numbers are so spammy and muddled that they're among the worst forms of player feedback, but I digress)

[gaunt owl]

the hamstring tactician proc in legion

cursed shit

[steep osprey]

I remember MoP used to have combat text when you snared something

where did that go

is it still here

[smoky kayak]

Yeah, that was less invasive than the Ignite Weapon tech though

[wintry arch]

Sounds and animations > numbers in current wow

[smoky kayak]

Ignite Weapon was a cool idea that was cursed from the very start

[finite ginkgo]

guys is ms > op even without sweeping in aoe?

[steep osprey]

What the hell is ignite weapon

[smoky kayak]

I agree, but there are also an alarming amount of people who play with no sound whatsoever so

[steep osprey]

I did not play with sound much before this zone

now i turn music up

[wintry arch]

escaped from the loony binners

[visual fern]

Human brain registers sound stimulus up to 30% faster than visual

Sound hack OP

[steep osprey]

[smoky kayak]

kinda like Heroic Strike on steroids

[thick kelp]

[smoky kayak]

instant fire attack with a lingering dot and damage buff

[steep osprey]

oh nice

[steep osprey]

Replace Slam with HC

doesn't matter if it's not the same

wait, I can just macro change it's icon

[olive nest]

No que ability for next global shit

Please no!

[steep osprey]

That's only up until Cata

after that it was off gcd button

[devout pewter]

Would have been an amazing ability for Colossus man

Replaces slam with Heroic Strike, makes it off gcd as a rage spender on 5s cd or whatever for MS like damage

[smoky kayak]

oGCD rotations do not mix well with modern haste-driven gameplay

[vast helm]

[smoky kayak]

one of two things happens:

• you have enough resources for both the on- and off-gcd rotations, which means doubling up the amount of button presses within a given timespan - greatly inflating APM
• you don't have enough resources for both, which results in empty GCDs - pressing two buttons at once and then nothing at all

[dense escarp]

HI, back on warrior after couple of years, can you suggest me some good PVE content creators? (i'm already on Critcake).

[tacit crystal]

swordish

[naive sage]

Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t see the possible APM increase as a downside

[devout pewter]

Yeah thats the sad part about it. Either too much or too little resources for it in the end. Barely balanceable.
(Make IP good again!)
But one can dream!

[devout pewter]

Its not just apm increase, youre just randomly pressing the button in your rotation, basically you could macro it to any other ability if you have too much resources constantly

[robust elk]

Is this just a problem at simbot or? In-game it shows with str

[smoky kayak]

that is very possible as well

[steep osprey]

The second point can be an issue with cata arms, usually you just use it if you're at 75 or more rage because otherwise you won't have enough resources

[smoky kayak]

cata arms is very different from modern

it also has two secondary cooldowns and an extra reduced rage costing talent devoted to Heroic Strike use

[steep osprey]

Yeah it does have Deadly Calm where u can spam it

[smoky kayak]

deadly calm, inner rage, and battle trance

[flat mulch]

it was showing only INT for me yesterday. Maybe they fixed in game and raidbot isnt up to date

[naive sage]

“if”
Considering we basically ignore the rage bar until execute phase right now, they could just tune things better

[smoky kayak]

how fast is too fast is very much a matter of personal opinion, but making Arms faster than Fury just for the sake of an oGCD would be weird

[robust elk]

Yeah, that might be true

[steep osprey]

Inner Rage isn't really ideal because you don't have enough resources to be spamming it like that

It does become better with the dragonsoul 2p

[smoky kayak]

it's still used during high rage burst cycles though, and it still results in a lot more HS use

[muted fractal]

is there a list for which bosses col or slayer is expected to be better on

[smoky kayak]

I'm very familiar with how to play Cata Arms lol

[shadow ibex]

Bring back deadly calm

[devout pewter]

I'd much rather have fury lose the 2h privilege and arms be the slow really hart hitter too

[smoky kayak]

na deadly calm has no place in the current design

they tried to add it back in DF and it was completely pointless

[smoky kayak]

in raid it's probably going to be Slayer across the board - Colossus may have some use, but it'll likely be limited

[steep osprey]

Yeah I remember that

It was in SL

[muted fractal]

thanks

[steep osprey]

I think it was used in s1 where u played condemn

[smoky kayak]

Yeah, but I was talking about Dragonflight, post talent tree revamps

[steep osprey]

of course, it doesn't make sense there

[smoky kayak]

yeah that's why I was saying, they tried to add it back to the new trees during DF development but it just didn't really have any use

it worked in Cata because of that oGCD, but unless you play at a rage deficit, there's no real need for it

[fringe moon]

It’s disappointing that they don’t buff colossus ST to be comparable to slayer.

[dusk torrent]

Hey, got a question. You guys got a viable build for raid aoe (S2) already? any changes to s1? thanks in advance

[violet steeple]

Slayer arms though man

[eager sigil]

Wowhead is updated already

[thick kelp]

WE dont do that here in arms

[violet steeple]

Demolish arms is pog

But man slayer pretty boring

[thick kelp]

it is very borin

but with Jugg being as powerful as it is

[violet steeple]

Can't help it

[thick kelp]

colossus will never be stronger

in raids

[violet steeple]

Gotta get the 5 big booms

[thick kelp]

God woulda been so great if we had a primal council type fight this tier

just for colossus

[spring vale]

It seems like if you opened the box from the Undermine special assignment before getting 2 veteran pieces from somewhere else, the adventurer piece from the undermine box counts towards the 2 veteran pieces a week limit

[eager sigil]

Yea I did

Unfortunate

[violet steeple]

As shitty as it feels, the positive is this gear legit means fuckall starting next week

[spring vale]

Same thing happened to me and judging from wowhead comments, to a lot of other people as well

[violet steeple]

You'll replace it in a few hours

[spring vale]

It's alright though, next week just doing heroics will be finee

[smoky kayak]

next week you'll be able to do M+

[thick kelp]

Legion remix confirmed

[smoky kayak]

all but confirmed, yeah

[thick kelp]

idk that recent interview

[smoky kayak]

thanks for reading my article

[smoky kayak]

I know, I wrote it lol

[thick kelp]

no problem

[spring vale]

my warrior is barely 615 so I don't think getting into M+ even M0s will be too easy 😅

[violet steeple]

xD

[thick kelp]

Swap the point from bloodborne to cleave or improved sweeping strikes depending if you need mass cleave or longer 2t

[thick kelp]

well written

[smoky kayak]

you like the color coding?

[thick kelp]

Yeah

I love the flavour

of shaman for ion and hunter for holly

[dusk torrent]

ty 4 info. 🙂

[smoky kayak]

but yeah, I wouldn't say it's outright confirmed, cause knowing Blizz nothing is ever final until it's live (and even then maybe not), but she does make it sound very likely that we'll be having a Legion Remix or something very similar

Less likely she's talking about Classic, since we'd still have MoP and WoD to go through, so that'd be pretty preemptive to reveal at this stage

although I wouldn't hate if Classic skipped straight from MoP -> Legion and forgot WoD existed lol

[olive nest]

Collecting wod mounts in a remix would be pretty cool

[tough tangle]

I feel like WoD classic would be more accepting by the community if it’s on an expedited release schedule which IIRC classic has been

The raids come out more quickly right

[empty pike]

hahaha

[steep osprey]

Finally I can get all the boss mounts

[empty pike]

I miss you, highmaul

[still arrow]

How many targets do you need for us to start pressing cleave?

[empty pike]

two

[still arrow]

Bet

[smoky kayak]

WoD could have been a good expansion

it really did have a lot of potential, and the raiding wasn't half bad, but I really didn't enjoy the class or world-activty design

[empty pike]

But Arch, in my opinion, was only bad because it lasted too long.

tanaan jungle, ashran...

the most diverse farms

[flat willow]

skipping wod, now that would be good...

[smoky kayak]

• Ashran was null if you didn't care for PvP
• Tanaan was ok, but there wasn't really any reason to do is
• WoD was actually one of the shortest expansions
• the class design was still trash tier

[flat willow]

I'm sure wod was fun (for a short time) for some classes

but damn warrior has never been worse than in wod, both arms and fury

[smoky kayak]

people only ever remember the end of things, they remember 6 months of HFC tier + Archimonde trinket, but forget the 15 months of absolutely static and stale boring gameplay that came before it

[empty pike]

I played warrior because I was born for it. But really the class was plucked after MoP

[steep osprey]

Would would have been good if they didn't mess up the class design they did in MOP

[flat willow]

wod just removed every ability, thankfully legion brought some back

[steep osprey]

So dumb

If we played WoD in MoP design classes, it would have been a good expansion

But there's still stuff like very little content

[flat willow]

heh, the content drought was still insane

[steep osprey]

but that could have been scrapped due to the bad reception

[flat willow]

but at least we could have had fun for a few months

as it is the best thing if you want to play wod classic ( for some reason ) is to play another class

maybe come back to warrior for HFC

[zealous pivot]

are we still doing the thing in ravager during execute?

spam exe to buff unhinged ms

[thick kelp]

ye

[zealous pivot]

pog

[hollow plover]

yo im highkey of the opinion that WoD classic would be one of the best classic variants for raiders because people have always said the raids were absolutely great but there simply wasnt enough content over the full timespan of the expansion, so since classic tends to shorten the expansions anyway, it might become one of the greats

[steep osprey]

Classic kind of fixes the content drought

they go through patches faster in cata rn

so there's no 10 month drought

[flat willow]

I thought cata was due for 8 months of dragon soul right now

[steep osprey]

DS just came out

[flat willow]

but yeah content drought isn't so bad in classic, you log in once a week to do you raid

[steep osprey]

and MoP prepatch is coming out in June?

[flat willow]

then you can do something else

[steep osprey]

so no

[empty pike]

July, maybe

[smoky kayak]

I'd be better, but I still don't find Arms with literally no mechanics or procs to be fun, nor do I find Fury being unable to spend rage because of Bloodsurge interesting

[empty pike]

aug

[steep osprey]

Aug is the game, prepatch is a month before

[hollow plover]

not an invalid take

but also..theres more than just warrior

[steep osprey]

so it's not even close to 10 months of DS

[flat willow]

6 or 7 months of dragon soul is still a lot

but yeah I don't really mind

in a perfect world it would be 5? something like that

[smoky kayak]

Vanilla, Wrath, Cata, and MoP Classic all greatly benefit from Classic being built off the final patch of each expansion, where most of the major class improvements happened, so the entire classic expac can be replayed with the (mostly) best version of each class

But the same isn't true of WoD - the class improvements didn't come from direct spell changes, they came from trinekts and set bonuses that are still going to be unavaiable to players for the majority of the classic expansion

[steep osprey]

oof

that is true

Arms is gonna be trash before the HFC set

even then it's not good

[hollow plover]

im biased but i think thats completely ok

[flat willow]

don't forget no colossus smash reset until archimonde trinket

[smoky kayak]

It'd be ok if WoD's baseline class design weren't absolute garbage

[flat willow]

so arms isn't actually fun until you've finished wod's content

[hollow plover]

Can't wait to farm rep and apexis crystals again

clueless~1

[flat willow]

and even with HFC tier set and archimonde trinket

[hollow plover]

yippiee flying

[smoky kayak]

Feel like a lot of people's nostalgia for HFC is going to go through a bit of culture shock when they realize that Highmaul and BRD class design was so terrible

[flat willow]

it's still not an amazing gameplay

[steep osprey]

Fury isn't that fun either

[flat willow]

just not completely horrible like baseline wod arms

[smoky kayak]

Also remember that Glad was gutted halfway through WoD, which means WoD Classic is going to start w/ its gutted state, not its goated Highmaul design

[hollow plover]

YO more important topic, tomorrow jeju island arc begins

[steep osprey]

It's not just warrior, most specs were pruned and ended up worse than they were in MoP

[hollow plover]

🔥

[steep osprey]

I think that's mainly the reason why they went so hard at class design in Legion

[flat willow]

it's mainly warrior tbh

[smoky kayak]

Warrior had it worse than others, yeah

some classes actually made good improvement in WoD

[steep osprey]

It did but others were a lot worse than MoP

[flat willow]

warlock and dk were pretty fun, I heard hunter was garbage too

every class got something removed but only warrior lost half their spellbook

[hollow plover]

shirvallah cat form was kind of goated gameplay wise

[steep osprey]

I actually don't know what most classes looked like in WoD so I take it back lol

[hollow plover]

for feral

[mighty aurora]

where to find info regarding which spec is the better one atm?

[flat willow]

demonology was really fun but since it starts on last phase it's probably going to be unplayable sadly

maybe we can convince classic devs to revert ion's nerf...

[hollow plover]

by talking to people or looking at the sim sheets.

[mighty aurora]

are we armsing by any chance?

[hollow plover]

arms slightly outperforms in ST with perfect play and full uptime

but fights mostly depend on dmg phases and intermission timings n shit

so its up in the air

hurrdurr

[mighty aurora]

ooooo the weird all-in-one arms is gone now ?

[steep osprey]

We'd rather you not play Demonology

[hollow plover]

the what?

[mighty aurora]

the hell of a mess it was last season

hopefully its playable now

[flat willow]

this is the end goal of classic wow

[hollow plover]

what are you talking about

[flat willow]

get one of the dev to say " we'd rather you play demonology "

[hollow plover]

arms is a goofy aaah conditional spec that completely depends on tuning yea

[flat willow]

BOOM 20% blanket nerf reverted

[hollow plover]

but it was solid in NP

[flat willow]

I'm pretty sure all specs depend on tuning

[hollow plover]

ofc

but some more than others

[flat willow]

unless a spec can somehow avoid blizzard nerfs

I guess that's mage

[hollow plover]

enhance

[flat willow]

enhance is good 1 season every 2 year

[hollow plover]

enhance got nerfed from S++ tier to S+ tier last season

and its looking giga rn too

clueless~1

[flat willow]

shaman is the new mage?

[hollow plover]

being blue

is enough

blue class

blue company

[flat willow]

I knew I should have rolled alliance

[smoky kayak]

that's more of a practical question than a sim one, which is something that usually shakes out in the first week or two of the tier (as various buffs, nerfs, and encounter strategy changes come down the pipeline)

So while you may get a simple answer like "Arms is a little stronger in single target right now," the real answer is "it doesn't really matter right now," especially since it's so easy to swap between specs

[devout pewter]

To be honest, does it ever matter? Just play what you enjoy the most!

[flat willow]

people enjoy being top dps

[devout pewter]

Especially with speccs they hate

[flat willow]

but no way yet to know which one will be

[devout pewter]

And then they rage

[flat willow]

they rage about being top dps? that's pretty rare

[devout pewter]

No, because they hate the class and aren't performing how they thought with a top class 😄

[smoky kayak]

people get so wrapped up in the desire to be better than one another that they forget to enjoy the video game

[last inlet]

i was at a point last expac like this, made me misrable, now i play warrior regardless cause i like the rotation.

well and the resource system

[smoky kayak]

I might actually focus Arms this tier, if Fury's rotation stays so miserable

[void bay]

Its a game at the end of the day....topping meters is fun, but if the class isnt fun why bother? Id rather by middle of the pack but enjoying the class

or spec

[clever plover]

What you find miserable about it?

[last inlet]

i 100% agree

[smoky kayak]

the rotation is an overly convoluted mess of contradicting conditionals

[slow saddle]

The optimal rotation is

[blissful bane]

with AM or RA? Feels pretty good with AM

[smoky kayak]

AM, it's fucking bad

[blissful bane]

it's def not the best lol, but better than RA

[clever plover]

AM does feel weird to play with

[smoky kayak]

they're both bad

[slow saddle]

S1 fury was bettey

[last inlet]

the bloodbath dot, ever w/ all the modifiers hits like 60k

[smoky kayak]

strictly speaking, RA is more complicated because the rotation changes during Reck, although the mid-reck rotation is actually smoother

[last inlet]

almost every tick

xD

its laughable

[smoky kayak]

outside of Reck they're basically the same though

[cloud gyro]

Noone who plays fury wants big hits lets be honest

[last inlet]

true

[smoky kayak]

for like 2 min straight though lol

[clever plover]

I do feel the arms spec as a whole feels rotationally stiff cause of one button which is sweeping

[last inlet]

ok, you got me there, thats still puts it above gushing wounds 😄

[slow saddle]

?

[slow saddle]

Pop sweep while charging

[smoky kayak]

Sweep could be better for sure, I'm also not a huge fan of the conditionals it introduces, but it's not so bad since they're pretty obvious

[naive sage]

My main problem with arms is I feel conflicted in aoe between cleave and mortal strike

[tacit crystal]

ms for prio cleave for overall

[cloud gyro]

Press both!

[charred brook]

I really don’t like this RA ill just say it

I really enjoyed last seasons RA

[last inlet]

ive honestly been pressing both MS and cleave when sweeps is up, but when down just cleave.

and OP

of course

idk if thats correct or not tho

[charred brook]

I spam as much cleave and op as I can and MS when I can’t press either of those

[naive sage]

My mind is hardwired into pressing ms whenever available, too many years spent into it

[devout pewter]

Cleave doesn't spread with sweeping, so if at all only press it during sweeping if nothing else is available.

[lone imp]

I mean, it kinda doesw

It sweeps slam

[last inlet]

does it again?

[devout pewter]

Same, can't stop myself from pressing MS during aoe without sweeping lmao

[devout pewter]

Oh right, slam gets cast there, I forgot that talent applies to Cleave as well now!

[smoky kayak]

my problem is that the arms rotation looks like this ```
rend,if=dot.rend.remains<=gcd
thunderous_roar
avatar,if=cooldown.colossus_smash.remains<=5|debuff.colossus_smash.up
colossus_smash
warbreaker
execute,if=buff.juggernaut.remains<=gcd2&talent.juggernaut
overpower,if=buff.winning_streak_arms.stack>=7&charges=2|buff.opportunist.up
mortal_strike
execute,if=buff.sudden_death.stack=2|buff.sudden_death.remains<=gcd3|debuff.marked_for_execution.stack=3
bladestorm,if=(cooldown.colossus_smash.remains>=gcd4|cooldown.warbreaker.remains>=gcd4)|debuff.colossus_smash.remains>=gcd*4
overpower
rend,if=dot.rend.remains<=8
slam

While the Fury rotation looks like this recklessness avatar,if=cooldown.recklessness.remains execute,if=buff.ashen_juggernaut.up&buff.ashen_juggernaut.remains<=gcd champions_spear,if=buff.enrage.up&(cooldown.bladestorm.remains>=2|cooldown.bladestorm.remains>=16&debuff.marked_for_execution.stack=3) bladestorm,if=buff.enrage.up&(talent.reckless_abandon&cooldown.avatar.remains>=24|talent.anger_management&cooldown.recklessness.remains>=24) odyns_fury,if=(buff.enrage.up|talent.titanic_rage)&cooldown.avatar.remains whirlwind,if=active_enemies>=2&talent.meat_cleaver&buff.meat_cleaver.stack=0 execute,if=buff.sudden_death.stack=2&buff.sudden_death.remains<7&variable.execute_phase execute,if=buff.sudden_death.up&buff.sudden_death.remains<2&variable.execute_phase execute,if=buff.sudden_death.up&buff.imminent_demise.stack<3&cooldown.bladestorm.remains<25&variable.execute_phase onslaught,if=talent.tenderize rampage,if=!buff.enrage.up|buff.slaughtering_strikes.stack>=4 thunderous_roar,if=buff.enrage.up&!buff.brutal_finish.up execute,if=debuff.marked_for_execution.stack=3 raging_blow,if=buff.brutal_finish.up&buff.slaughtering_strikes.stack<5&(!debuff.champions_might.up|debuff.champions_might.up&debuff.champions_might.remains>gcd) rampage,if=action.raging_blow.charges<=1&rage>=100&talent.anger_management&buff.recklessness.down rampage,if=rage>=120|talent.reckless_abandon&buff.recklessness.up&buff.slaughtering_strikes.stack>=3 raging_blow,if=buff.opportunist.up bloodthirst,if=target.health.pct<35&talent.vicious_contempt&buff.bloodcraze.stack>=2 rampage,if=rage>=100&talent.anger_management&buff.recklessness.up bloodthirst,if=buff.bloodcraze.stack>=4|crit_pct_current>=85 raging_blow bloodthirst rampage execute slam which is very much not (and that's without any of the extra Reckless Abandon stuff)

[lone imp]

Ye fervor applies to cleave

[devout pewter]

Yeah, i completely forgot about that lmao

[smoky kayak]

Arms and Fury both only have like 4 rotational buttons, but while Arms is a pretty simple 1 > 2 > 3 > 4, Fury is like
1 if Z > 2 if Y > 1 if B > 4 if X > 2 if C > 1 if A > 3

[cloud gyro]

Thats what gives u 500mil cleaves

[lone imp]

No that's collateral

[cloud gyro]

Yes

No to no, yes to collateral

[lone imp]

I get what you mean, that the slamming is buffing collateral

[quartz adder]

What is the best way of gearing alt chars now to 638 ish? Have a fresh toon i want to get going until next week! Any smart tips that came with the patch?