ah more nerfs
#arms
plucky zenith
sharp wyvern
yes
plucky zenith
nova marsh
next you'll tell me pugs are healthy for you
sharp wyvern
i would never do that
fossil mantle
Warrior is definetly overtuned, good job Blizz
livid cloak
sharp wyvern
TIL im out of touch
nova marsh
F tier list
fossil mantle
who thought a day would come where people would take ferals over dps warriors in keys?
At least the meta is not stale I suppose
latent moss
Warrior is definetly overtuned, good job Blizz
dont nerf enha
played with a 619 friend
5mil every pack
xd
9 nw
nova marsh
Nerf ele instead
sharp wyvern
playing with a ret that has 30s CDs
while you can only use them every 2nd or 3rd pull is cringe af
normal marsh
no one is playing arms
This is facts, you can do like 9s on every key and be top 20 arms warrior in the world on raider.io rn
fossil mantle
arms does higher overall than fury
sure but fury can pad wayy too much.
sharp wyvern
This is facts, you can do like 9s on every key and be top 20 arms warrior in the...
now i know what i will do tomorrow
fossil mantle
Dude, I was the 14th arms warr in the world 3 days ago and I am mediocre as fuck, if a spec is not played at all, there must be a reason
sharp wyvern
i mean there are alot of fury onetricks
latent moss
not even
nova marsh
Arms is a trash tier M+ spec and fury is a favorite
latent moss
its just not popular
sharp wyvern
even when arms is better there are a shit ton of fury warriors
normal marsh
now i know what i will do tomorrow
This is without a grim batol key 
kind stag
true
nova marsh
Of it being absoutle dog water
latent moss
and he is fucking cracked
kind stag
fury is just giga popular
nova marsh
kind stag
well
nova marsh
what server
kind stag
i hope my demolish starts critting
fossil mantle
colossus has wb demolish roar
apart from demolish, how can you pad with roar lol. Its a dot mate. I played fury in a few keys and on some adds you can just pop cds and top everyone
latent moss
trying his builds
sharp wyvern
ok nvm its 120th now
latent moss
apart from demolish, how can you pad with roar lol. Its a dot mate. I played fur...
what adds
sharp wyvern
i guess people started pl,aying arms
cunning sleet
How big is the roar nerf? 5 targets max seems kinda criminal imo
normal marsh
I find arms the most fun to play in keys when you just lean into the execute and boss damage
normal marsh
Still need big ST for tyrannical bosses
latent moss
a very big part of our aoe is roar
sharp wyvern
do we know what "reduced damage beyond 5 targets" means
normal marsh
Plus cleave and the likes can carry well enough for like 3.5-4m cds on trash
cunning sleet
Sad, time to start dooming I guess
sharp wyvern
like how much less is it
latent moss
same as every other softcap
fossil mantle
what adds
1st boss in Ara Kara, a lot of small mobs in Siege, webs in COT last boss. A lot of things frankly
hazy flower
I havent even specced into colossus
kind stag
gellys colossus looks interesting but no merciless bonegrinder is eeeeeeeeeeeee
hazy flower
ngl I havent done key in arms in tww
cunning sleet
well u need more than 5 targets for it to matter
kind stag
idk i like that talent a lot
fossil mantle
Dont get me wrong, I dont think Arms is bad at all in terms of DPS. However, I do think the nefs were not justified
hazy flower
only fury/prot
latent moss
ngl I havent done key in arms in tww
good
its never been this clunky
u know the curse i was playing a bit
with tom/blunt instruments
hazy flower
arms always felt kinda wack on lower keys for me
hazy flower
its fun when shit lives long and you reapply bleeds perma
latent moss
also wb isnt much worse anymore
cunning sleet
Why do you say it's clunky? What parts?
latent moss
blunt instruments
nova marsh
I honestly don't feel the clunk on slayer
The only part I fucking hate is when slayer strike procs on a target that is LITERALLY DEAD
cunning sleet
why is that clunky?
remote ledge
I guess we will be playing arms slayer without wb in keys now? Maybe not even going for roar build
nova marsh
Because it just....shouldn't?
latent moss
cause idont
nova marsh
And feels actually awful\
latent moss
want to spend half of my sweeping strikes window
fossil mantle
nah, roar will still be played. Spear is too shit
latent moss
in fucking bladestorm
normal marsh
I guess we will be playing arms slayer without wb in keys now? Maybe not even go...
We didn’t really play WB anyway fwiw
latent moss
I guess we will be playing arms slayer without wb in keys now? Maybe not even go...
as colossus u do
remote ledge
Been loving the Colo wb no juggernaut buikds
normal marsh
No juggernaut D:
unique hamlet
Been playing slayer, swapped to Colo for a key and it felt weird af. Lol
thorn tulip
17 button bleed spec🔥🔥
latent moss
i dont believe in it but ill try it in like 20 mins when im home
its very smooth i played it in an 8 need to do something higher honestly
nw
manic stirrup
i griefed that edit so hard
remote ledge
Chcoo what do you think of the nerfs
nova marsh
i griefed that edit so hard
griefing harder then I grief keys
livid cloak
what about crit thinking no jugg
latent moss
what about crit thinking no jugg
was thinking about it for low keys
manic stirrup
ptr datamining means fuckall to me
latent moss
dropping jugg for deft experience
latent moss
havent looked into then
troar odyns softcapped
to 5
"warbringer" too
they prob meant warbreaker
manic stirrup
the initial damage or all of it
latent moss
all
nova marsh
they clearly did
manic stirrup
for roar
latent moss
no one knows
rapid bronze
You know what would be funny is if they accidentally add the 3% fury aura nerf that was hotfixed in so quickly and is still on the ptr to nerf it again when the patch goes live
manic stirrup
without some sort of compensation
nova marsh
it will
manic stirrup
but again its ptr datamining
nova marsh
Because blizz hates us so much
remote ledge
They never backed on ptr nerfs tho?
latent moss
idgaf tbh
rapid bronze
It’s not ptr datamining they posted patch notes
manic stirrup
i only saw datamining posted
latent moss
etc
shadow ibex
i love that they still mistake warbringer and warbreaker
latent moss
assa
shadow ibex
i fuckin love it
manic stirrup
must’ve missed it
nova marsh
Tf even is warbringer
rapid bronze
I’m rerolling ret because it’s a well designed spec and has nice visuals
manic stirrup
charge talent
shadow ibex
pvp talent
manic stirrup
in pvp
nova marsh
LMAO
fossil mantle
i love that they still mistake warbringer and warbreaker
cause warr probably has only 1 dev and the guy probably doesnt even play wow
livid cloak
was thinking about it for low keys
thinking this not on tyrannical
sharp wyvern
cause warr probably has only 1 dev and the guy probably doesnt even play wow
He plays ret
livid cloak
not if you aren't doing 10s
latent moss
keys*
rapid bronze
Also warbringer rocked for a while in PvP we called winbringer
sharp wyvern
Since max vault is 10 now tyran is always up
livid cloak
i only have 1 (untimed) 10 rn so i'm still working my way up
rapid bronze
I remember in SL killing rogues with avatar charge while talented into warbringer
sharp wyvern
Since thats what blizz balance for
latent moss
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
PUT IT BACK ON SOA
manic stirrup
is that the stupid ass talent above dn
latent moss
LEGIT 0 PICKRATE
manic stirrup
lmao
shadow ibex
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
manic stirrup
its almost Seethe levels of shit
latent moss
8 RAGE
shadow ibex
i fucking love em man
cunning sleet
iosn't dreadnaught better for aoe?
shadow ibex
a whole talent point that only works sub 35%
manic stirrup
dreadnaught is ass
shadow ibex
lmao
manic stirrup
just go strength of arms
cunning sleet
now that's crazy frfr
manic stirrup
it just sucks in this expansion
fossil mantle
LEGIT 0 PICKRATE
fatality, battlelord,bloodsurge,storm of swords
manic stirrup
used to be good
sharp wyvern
Dreadnaught got nerfed and the DMG was put into OP initial hit
shadow ibex
a whole talent point for filler
cunning sleet
been rocking it since quite literally level 80
shadow ibex
while slayer cant even spend its rage sub 35 cuz fuckin SD procs for days
latent moss
dn is only worse on st numberswise
but
soa is probably better
less overall but
more important damage
manic stirrup
same with arterial bleed in class tree
cunning sleet
good now i have an excuse when i deal less overall dmg
manic stirrup
if no mbg you should always have bleed
remote ledge
Any class recommandation that isn't Pala nor fdk
sharp wyvern
Why do you guys carre about pickrates on talents they nerfed a talent with 0 pickrate so it clearly doesn't matrer
fossil mantle
same with arterial bleed in class tree
ive actually been using it in keys and its not bad at all
cunning sleet
just doing prio dmg, you wouldn't get it
nova marsh
REMOVE FINISHING BLOWS
good sir you have more rage then finishing blows provides in an entire fight
manic stirrup
if you use mbg you can pick the cleave one
manic stirrup
ive actually been using it in keys and its not bad at all
yeah its good
latent moss
Any class recommandation that isn't Pala nor fdk
dh idk
sharp wyvern
Monk
manic stirrup
Any class recommandation that isn't Pala nor fdk
ww is very fun imo
sharp wyvern
Rogue
manic stirrup
dh with momentum is the best spec in the game
latent moss
trickster sub is peak but
nova marsh
LOL NO
latent moss
sometimes coup de grace is giga crigne
and u have to avoid pressing it
which is fucking evil
but it doesnt happen often
sharp wyvern
dh with momentum is the best spec in the game
Not for everyone else who has to dodge the mechanic thats on you while you try to keep it up
cunning sleet
anything wrong with my talents atm? this is correct for fortified and tyrannical, yeessss?? :3
manic stirrup
thats fine yeah
cunning sleet
my friend tried to play momentum dh as his first class, it was funny to watch him dash into random shit and get people killed all the time
cool cool
remote ledge
I guess I could give ww a try or dh, hope they reverse the nerf a bit Im mad having to gear a new too form scratch
sharp wyvern
Warrior is still gonna be fine
unique hamlet
What nerf?
latent moss
What nerf?
troar odyns and wb softcapped to 5
cunning sleet
5 target softcap on roar
minor gust
how have they called warbreaker warbringer twice now
hazy flower
<@325173865175318529>
minor gust
please tell me more that no one at blizzard has ever played arms
sharp wyvern
Maybe its not a warbreaker nerf at all
restive folio
Blizz doesn't even know what our abilities are called man
latent moss
please tell me more that no one at blizzard has ever played arms
just play the spec
will ve obvious xdd
lets not bring back legion arms
manic stirrup
warbringer hitting more than 5 targets is literally only against demo warlocks
subtle ravine
I see in the update channel that Thunderous Roar and Odyn's Fury are having their softcaps reduced from 8 to 5. Is there a hidden softcap on those talents right now at 8? I'm not seeing that in the tooltip
cunning sleet
what's legion arms?
sharp wyvern
please tell me more that no one at blizzard has ever played arms
Hard to remember a talent that doesn't get picked
manic stirrup
yes
latent moss
I see in the update channel that Thunderous Roar and Odyn's Fury are having thei...
yes
cunning sleet
I don't remember anything specifically distinctive
restive folio
I'd love it if they could make Colossus playable
latent moss
way better gameplay
manic stirrup
I'd love it if they could make Colossus playable
its good in m+
minor gust
just play the spec
its just another layer of dogshit added to the pile
manic stirrup
though i assume you were talking about raid
shadow ibex
how have they called warbreaker warbringer twice now
yes
the twice its been in patch notes
they called it warbringer
restive folio
Did they do something to it in m+ that makes it not root you in place so you die to any ground one shot aoe?
manic stirrup
its like a second and you can micro adjust with leap
i havent died to it once yet
worst case you can just jump out of it to avoid dying if needed
cunning sleet
is it better than slayer in m+?
manic stirrup
either is completely viable
latent moss
slayer fucks on st
minor gust
Slayer Jugg build does indeed crank on bosses
unique hamlet
I like the chance on passive reaping from slayer when pressing MS or cleave
unique hamlet
Facts
tranquil sundial
I'd love it if they could make Colossus playable
Its better in m+
Well.. both are v close
Idk how yall can say it does no ST
If you run Gelly's lastest build that has EP & SKS it does fine dam
ST
minor gust
Colossus is very much playable in M+
restive folio
I despise the way demolish just loses its target for any movement ect tiny little range and then there goes all your damage
Unless they fixed that since beta
tranquil sundial
Jump where the mobs goes and cast it mid air
U keep the momentum
Iirc
or a bit of it anyways
restive folio
Maybe I'll have to give it another try. Does wow head have a colossus build for m+? Last time I checked I think it was all slayer
tranquil sundial
It does
Top rio arms players runs this on his keys
Can definitely recommend that one
restive folio
Thank you I'll give it a try I appreciate it
tranquil sundial
https://raider.io/characters/eu/tarren-mill/Gellyfisk?season=season-tww-1
This guy if you wanna know 😄
tender glen
We have classes with uncapped aoe, and then we have warriors 😢
near pelican
shadow ibex
We have classes with uncapped aoe, and then we have warriors 😢
5 only
no more no less
fringe moon
you all ready for the influx of fury warriors to the channel? brace yourselves..
tender glen
I just want to put rend on more than five blasted targets, in a game where the average pull in a m+ is 7-10
fringe moon
what's funny is we're going to have tanks doing more AOE damage than us
tender glen
tanks can already do more aoe dmg than us in plenty of scenarios
plucky fern
are we SPEAR GANG now? 
rapid bronze
The influx will be into the ret and dk discords not here
sharp wyvern
Wcl kinda sandbagging us
tender glen
inb4 spear capped at 3
sharp wyvern
Removing rash adds from damage is gonna cause mayhem for every aoe spec
tender glen
tbh I hate the idea of nerfing a class to get in line with others, like ffs, just buff the others to bring them up to said class
latent moss
what's funny is we're going to have tanks doing more AOE damage than us
nah
thats too far
maaaybe vengeance in insanely big pulls
like insanely
big
fringe moon
bear
tender glen
well geared bears wreck on damage
latent moss
have u seen vdh
tender glen
yeah they dump, but bears have that consistent dmg
sharp wyvern
tbh I hate the idea of nerfing a class to get in line with others, like ffs, jus...
I never understood this take
Having infinite power creep cause you don't want to nerf certain outliers is not a good thing for the long term
Nerfs are a necessary evil for games
latent moss
yeah buff other classes and raid becomes free
teal fossil
And if you buff every class
This raid is now easy
Then next raid is gonna be tuned around the new power level
Now what
It’s like they never got buffed in the first place
terse plume
it makes sense to me to nerf outliers in the way that they are outliers for sure, but I do feel alot of the tiem blizz hammers an entire spec rather then just the part of it that is offending. Not to dissuade from good targeted nerfs to crazy outlying stuff
manic river
From what I've heard from friends FF XIV was more on the "let's not nerf as much but buff a bit others" camp and they seem pretty happy with class balance, IDK how they worked it out
nova marsh
it makes sense to me to nerf outliers in the way that they are outliers for sure...
It's why I hate it when people say "WHY NERF WHEN IT'S PVE"
Cuz outlier are very bad
nova marsh
From what I've heard from friends FF XIV was more on the "let's not nerf as much...
Because ffxiv is a much simplier and more homogized game overall then wow
terse plume
yep my only gripe is blizzard getting heavy handed and hurtin a spec in ways that arent related to its outlier issue
nova marsh
It's a lot easier to tune when evrey class has the same burst window more or less
terse plume
like furys second nerf killing its ST when it was in a perfectly okay space
and its burst aoe was the massive outlier
manic river
And on top of that arms have to catch the nerf too by proxy
nova marsh
becase SQE experenced vanilla wow level unbalance in HW and said never again
Meanwhile blizz just....kinda lets dumb shit slide sometimes
terse plume
And on top of that arms have to catch the nerf too by proxy
yeah if they had just tamped down furys burst aoe and left everything else alone specs would have been in the best balanced state theyve been in years
furys stronger aoe but middling ST while arms was great ST but only decent aoe
nova marsh
Or when blizz has actual good overall balance like vault pre .7 and after .5 they gotta screw with it
tender glen
Because ffxiv is a much simplier and more homogized game overall then wow
Except it's really not, they press just as many buttons as we do, and raid fights still have all sorts of absurd difficult to plan around mechanics. It's just a different interface and visual style
white hedge
hey stupid question
anywhere to spend valorstones?
im capped and i have literally no gear to upgrade
tender glen
personally I find raiding in ffxiv harder in many cases
white hedge
harder as it's much more strick with mechs compared to heroic on wow
you get hit by a stray mech you're mostly dead
not that you cant be rezzed but eh
tender glen
small raidgroup sizes also puts more responsibility on players
losing someone can fk over the group
white hedge
depending on the gear of the raid but yea
the worst being if one healer dies just before a heavy mech, you're certainly fucked
though all in all
if you had dbm /wa in ff
you're gonna sweep the game
but the fights arent geared towards that so ye
latent moss
Except it's really not, they press just as many buttons as we do, and raid fight...
i dont recall ffxiv having sepulcher 
me when i have to do halondrus into anduin into lords (break) into rygelon into jailer
white hedge
on heroic or mythic
frigid cipher
The difficulty isn’t really comparable. I cleared the newest savage tier with my static on day 4 and we were rank like 150 world
The fights just dont scale up to be as hard as the last few bosses of a mythic raid would be
neon ocean
is there a way for me to compare all my consumable options in one raidbots sim? instead of having to swap settings and run a new one each time
latent moss
on heroic or mythic
mythic
prenerfs
demonic raid
halondrus biggest mid raid wall ever
unique warren
white hedge
yea im very certain mythic raids beat the shit out of ff raiding
abso cancer especially when pre nerf
manic stirrup
is there a way for me to compare all my consumable options in one raidbots sim? ...
there was a bigass thing u could put in in dragonflight
havent seen one posted for this expansion tho
nova marsh
Except it's really not, they press just as many buttons as we do, and raid fight...
yes it is
because wow is balancing around damage profiles and different burst windows styles and wow even has sustain classes....14 just...dosen't
You are right about buttons thou
Also wow has to balance loot....14's loot is just stat sticks
wary raft
is it common that haste is like stupid high value on arms atm? feels odd haste>crit
nova marsh
is it common that haste is like stupid high value on arms atm? feels odd haste>c...
It's normal for early xpack gearing
nova marsh
Arms loves haste
split laurel
is there a way for me to compare all my consumable options in one raidbots sim? ...
Consumable sim - paste this below your simc-dump in Advanced Sim
#Potion
profileset."Tempered_Potion"+="potion=tempered_potion_3"
profileset."Potion_of_Unwavering_Focus"+="potion=potion_of_unwavering_focus_3"
#Food
profileset."+469_Highest_Secondary_Stat_Food"+="food=the_sushi_special"
profileset."+469_Primary_Stat_Food"+="food=feast_of_the_divine_day"
#Flask
profileset."Flask_of_Alchemical_Chaos"+="flask=flask_of_alchemical_chaos_3"
profileset."Flask_of_Tempered_Mastery"+="flask=flask_of_tempered_mastery_3"
profileset."Flask_of_Tempered_Swiftness"+="flask=flask_of_tempered_swiftness_3"
profileset."Flask_of_Tempered_Aggression"+="flask=flask_of_tempered_aggression_3"
profileset."Flask_of_Tempered_Versatility"+="flask=flask_of_tempered_versatility_3"
#Weapon Stone/Oil
profileset."Ironclaw_Whetstone_x2"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:ironclaw_whetstone_3/off_hand:ironclaw_whetstone_3"
profileset."Algari_Mana_Oil_x2"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:algari_mana_oil_3/off_hand:algari_mana_oil_3"
profileset."Oil_of_Deep_Toxins_x2"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:oil_of_deep_toxins_3/off_hand:oil_of_deep_toxins_3"
profileset."Toxins+Mana_Oil"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:oil_of_deep_toxins_3/off_hand:algari_mana_oil_3"
profileset."Whetstone+Toxins"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:ironclaw_whetstone_3/off_hand:oil_of_deep_toxins_3"
profileset."Whetstone+Mana_Oil"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:ironclaw_whetstone_3/off_hand:algari_mana_oil_3"
profileset."Ironclaw_Whetstone"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:ironclaw_whetstone_3"
profileset."Algari_Mana_Oil"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:main_hand:algari_mana_oil_3"
profileset."Oil_of_Deep_Toxins"+="temporary_enchant=main_hand:oil_of_deep_toxins_3"```Thanks!
restive folio
Do we even use Slam in M+ these days or is it literally just cleave even on ST like on boss?
nova marsh
...the M+ builds don't really change the ST rotation
Unless you have a CD available from a pack, then ig you can use it in place of slam
For ST that's a waste of OP stacks that could just....go to MS and give you more damage
limber prairie
Guys, what happen with Warbraker?
restive folio
okay makes sense, ty
minor gust
whats Warbreaker? I only know Warbringer
nova marsh
Arms is primarily an ST spec for a one
nova marsh
Arms totally brings the war
Need I remind you these are the same devs that brought us....17 paragraphs for a 20% slam buff
limber prairie
we dont have a spell called Warbreaker
nova marsh
He's joking
nova marsh
Because blizz misspelt warbreaker as warbringer
minor gust
looks pretty AI generated to me
shadow ibex
fuckin clowns
minor gust
the first time they fucked up the name of Warbreaker is w/e its funny prob a typo but this has happened multiple times now and its just like wtf is this clown show
shadow ibex
cant even be asked to know what our talents are lol
yea thats what i mean
its not even the first time
nova marsh
It's because arms is the new survival
terse plume
so how bad is colossus vs slayer for ST
nova marsh
We shall soon be forgotten by blizz and they shall only remeber one dps
nova marsh
so how bad is colossus vs slayer for ST
8%. P big tbh
minor gust
like how are you making changes to a talent you don't even know the fucking name of it
terse plume
yeah that is big from a performance standpoint
nova marsh
And it does have aoe!
minor gust
Maybe they meant that 😛
if only but we all know thats not true
manic river
"More AoE Nerfs on the PTR
Odyn's Fury and Thunderous Roar are now soft capped at 5 targets instead of 8 for no apparent reason."
Does this fucking affect everyone are you serious?
nova marsh
yeah
manic river
We cannot even use roar to affect more than 5
manic river
I mean
Soft cap sorry
Softcapped to 5 now
Why, why to all the specs
Arms was suposed to be the bleeding guy (?)
shadow ibex
i love arms aoe nerfs when ret and fdk exists
minor gust
same reason why BS was nerfed for arms
they dont have them coded seperatly
$1 company
manic river
i love arms aoe nerfs when ret and fdk exists
I know dude, ret aoe is stupid but no complains from the team
manic river
We were looking very strong in pre patch
vital trout
What got needed?
crystal sparrow
Do you guys just pop transmitter on 2 prepull?
minor gust
pre patch is never a metric to look at
vital trout
Nerfed
zealous sphinx
Why would they nerf ARMS its so fucking dumb
manic river
pre patch is never a metric to look at
Ofc but I mean that at the very start of the expansion our metrics were really good
nova marsh
I mean I was enjoying the major salt from fury
nova marsh
Arms is going to be a dead last pick for the rest of the World soul saga at this rate
shadow ibex
lol you really cant make this shit up
manic river
Because Blizz apparently thinks that changing fury and arms is the same, literally not the case in any other class
shadow ibex
they should be emberassed
terse plume
arms is still the raid pick for ST its literally one of the top 5 specs right now for that
hazy flower
twice calling it warbringer
is warbringer not pvp talent?
nova marsh
Still infuriating
vital trout
Where is the list of nerfs
minor gust
its just the nerfs make no sense because they dont actually accomplish anything
hazy flower
they must've confused those
nova marsh
Blizz has been rawdogging arms since beta with the MS nerf
hazy flower
bc it does like 0 damage so there's no need to nerf
manic river
Today in our raid grup however a fury was almost getting at my lvl, IDK what exactly I do wrong
minor gust
they must've confused those
nah because this isnt the first time they have called Warbreaker Warbringer. They genuinly just don't know anything about warrior
manic river
Granted I'm not a very pro arms player
nova marsh
+nerf shadowpriest
nerf frost dk
nerf Fire mage
Nerf anyone but the warriors tryin to get by lol
shadow ibex
is warbringer not pvp talent? <:keks:936231610850897992>
thats the beauty
just straight up ignorance
not knowing
minor gust
mixing it up once is funny and whatever mistakes happen
mixing it up multiple times now is just straight up clowns
latent moss
bc it does like 0 damage so there's no need to nerf
bring back sl warbreaker
shit used to fuck
shadow ibex
mixing it up multiple times now is just straight up clowns
that + just cba to seperate arms and fury bladestorm
idk they just dont have a defensible position
but u cant take them to task on this stuff
minor gust
$1 company
minor gust
there we go better name
restive folio
Any idea why blunt instruments allows use of cleave more often? I don't see anything in the tooltip that implies that
manic stirrup
longer haste duration = more cleaves
minor gust
longer iftk duration more haste more cleaves
manic stirrup
very slightly
restive folio
Ahhh okay, I understand. Thank you
Warbreaker is just bad in general rn I assume?
Even before the apparent new nerf
restive folio
fair
Just seems very counter intuitive that warbreaker isn't a good pick even in m+
minor gust
it is an aoe gain to take Warbringer problem is the ST loss is so great its not worth it
something like a 10% ST loss for only a 2% aoe gain
not worth when the dungeons have a really big focus on ST
restive folio
SURELY this will be fixed when Warrior gets it's Ret Pally tier rework in 11.1 🙏
zinc yacht
Ayo, how do you guys feel in m+ currently? I've been meta-whoring fury lately, but I would like to try Arms again
minor gust
restive folio
If you enjoy hitting cleave 1000 times per dungeon boy do I have good news for you
zinc yacht
I enjoy big dam and topping the meters
restive folio
Frost DK server is that way ----->
fresh tide
cleave fucks 
zinc yacht
Already got my Frost DK alt lined up lmao
But will always main Warrior, fuck other classes are so boring in comparison
tawny flare
hey guys. are these talent good ?
tawny flare
lol
minor gust
builds in here if you want them https://discord.com/channels/148872210742771712/1237303208754286715
tawny flare
ty
teal fossil
where did you find this build
tawny flare
I took it from a warrior on raider io lol
latent moss
hey guys. are these talent good ?
hooooly new build? (no its awful)
vital trout
Have these nerfs been implemented yet?
lethal acorn
Arcane 
old urchin
Do you guys just pop transmitter on 2 prepull?
Yeah that's what I do
balmy kindle
Already got my Frost DK alt lined up lmao
Knowing blizzard they will likely chop BOS soon
cloud dawn
Its fucking insane arms are copping this TR nerf
manic stirrup
hey guys. are these talent good ?
no
you must have cleave
sudden death is beans
exhilerating blows is beans
manic stirrup
still need more cleave
tawny flare
I switched to this
manic stirrup
thats good
trim skiff
Thats the full aoe build, i prefer going fully into execute, but with cleave/collat/dreadnaught and thats the m+ build. Depends on how heavy your team is with aoe damage / bursts.
In my team I tend to just insanely top boss / prio damage without giving up all of the aoe options.
muted rune
Can you cancel Demolish cast?
muted rune
noice
lethal acorn
still need more cleave
I had 353 hits but I don't run the cleave-enhancing over the iss & bleed enhancing talents
I simmed 'em and it's minimal difference whether it's ST or aoe for either
manic stirrup
I had 353 hits but I don't run the cleave-enhancing over the iss & bleed enhanci...
thats fine but cleave is still too low
look at your damage breakdown on your sim
lethal acorn
thats fine but cleave is still too low
OR bleeds too high
manic stirrup
ms is too high in comparison to cleave
lethal acorn
Cleave is 3rd if you don't count the dots
manic stirrup
my bleeds always 10% each
lethal acorn
ms is too high in comparison to cleave
Not when it's stonevault and there are frequently packs of 3-4 mobs
lethal acorn
I cleave as much as I can with my 10% haste lol
shadow ibex
i want more crit
nova marsh
I have almost 30% crit
can I please have my some bloody haste
AND NO THAT DOSEN'T MEAN GIVE ME ANOTHER WEAPON GAME
dire hinge
lmao yeaaaah
shadow ibex
i crafted haste mast cuz i thought i would play fury so my crit is lacking
but i decided to just full ssend arms
dire hinge
sure would be nice if this was something like a pair of boots or cloak 
manic stirrup
i have 20007 haste buffed
nova marsh
The literal only weapon type I haven't looted is a pole arm
I'm gonna regret saying that
magic canopy
thinking about running this for M+
after all the fury nerfs might need to get used to it
prob IP angle over deep
latent moss
thinking about running this for M+
evil for slayer
should play jugg as slayer for sure
as colossu thats good
fringe moon
@smoky kayak are they making it so warbreaker only hits 5 targets in the future?
balmy kindle
PTR notes are tentative though, not sure why people are so worked up
manic stirrup
which doesnt matter at all
fringe moon
damage reduced beyond 5, I get that. But are they also making the debuff only hit 5 targets like how TC does with rend
magic canopy
but hmmge
balmy kindle
damage reduced beyond 5, I get that. But are they also making the debuff only h...
Debuff will still hit all
It only affects initial hit
fresh tide
I think they have the technology to make the debuff do less damage above 5 too, but I'm not 100% on that
manic stirrup
Not sure about jugg build
as slayer its probably the best build
smoky kayak
<@61282228017041408> are they making it so warbreaker only hits 5 targets in the...
soft cap, not hard cap
fringe moon
soft cap, not hard cap
what about the 30% damage debuff on them? will that be uncapped?
smoky kayak
soft cap
the debuff is not affected by soft cap
if it hits them, they get the debuff, the size of the debuff does not change
flint meteor
Is there a way to sim single target without execute phase included? I'm trying to practice the normal rotation on a dummy and compare to sims and I'm trying to work out if I'm just bad or if execute is really that valuable
balmy kindle
wasn't sure if blizzard felt like screwing us more
If they hard cap wb they will need to hard cap many more abilities lol
minor gust
Whats Warbreaker I only know Warbringer
shadow ibex
warbreaker? never heard of her
teal fossil
Is there a way to sim single target without execute phase included? I'm trying t...
sim target dummy
nova marsh
Remove hard caps
I want evrey spec to be able to pull an entire dungeon
I want to see 100 million dps
arctic hearth
Does gelly Twitch or YouTube ?
abstract vale
flint meteor
sim target dummy
You are so smart
paper dove
what is this?
minor gust
Lost roll on Mythic Sikran neck its all ogre
balmy kindle
Remove hard caps
Play unholy DK and enjoy the aoe dps ( you need more globals though)
dire hinge
mmm saving Mad Queen's Mandate for the dps boost phase on Mists 
edgy solstice
big
dire hinge
it's like what Demolish was supposed to do
dire hinge
what is this?
I'm unsure on this one, but there's a lot of updates to odds and ends spells that are just "cleanup" to the codebase that don't result in real gameplay impact. If it does impact Arms itself, we'll post about it over in #updates-midnight 👍
edgy solstice
grimmy b is a slayer key unforch
fleet sinew
conquered hc today mates
https://i.imgur.com/wAXerhn.png
weak wave
And what about Paladin Nerfs? They still are insane ST and MT monsters with just one spec.
peak aspen
do we still want double duskthread or dawnthread wrist/cloak?
boreal quartz
https://discord.com/channels/148872210742771712/1234949058121171069/128861442271...
Not the pala discord
weak wave
Not the pala discord
I just wanna complain a bit
balmy kindle
Imagine thinking blizz won't chop Ret and frost 
gusty oxide
I feel them, this is the guy sat in the corner who keep is getting punched
civic isle
mmm saving Mad Queen's Mandate for the dps boost phase on Mists <:gladge:9639701...
🧑🍳
Hey fam in ST are you holding sks for cs windows
Or just ripping
civic isle
Copy madlads ty
sharp galleon
trying to play arms and every time i gotta hit skullsplitter i wanna split my head open irl
fierce bobcat
How you guys play without warbreaker on slayer? With sweeps it hits only 2 targets from pack.
narrow flax
fierce bobcat
I see, slayer more st or more aoe compare to colossus?
wary dune
Hello, I see on the guides you can get 2 stacks of SD? Is that a talent or baseline? Cause I don’t see i get that
sharp galleon
its baseline
fierce bobcat
Where can i find best rotation guide? Maxroll Wowhead or Icy?
boreal quartz
Maxroll is good yep
edgy solstice
as it should
fierce bobcat
paper dove
I'm unsure on this one, but there's a lot of updates to odds and ends spells tha...
alright thx
frosty basin
Nobody is even using warbreaker and they still nerf it
Cool
Anyone playing arms in high keys 10+ that can link me their damage breakdown just to see how I comapre
untold basalt
Nobody is even using warbreaker and they still nerf it
don't want anyone getting any ideas, ya know?
edgy solstice
depends on build
thick kelp
Anyone playing arms in high keys 10+ that can link me their damage breakdown jus...
You can prolly find logs for this but for me its mostly cleave, reap, execute, ms
thick kelp
+11 Ara-Kara
frosty basin
+11 Ara-Kara
Tnx, my roar is not close to that dmg
frosty basin
this is colossus, NW 11
How does colossus feel in m+? I am afraid of demolish missing with so much movement
edgy solstice
takes a little to get used to but i prefer for the bigger pull dungeons
i run slayer jugg for the dungeons tanks never double pull much in
grimmy b, cot
siege nw ara-ara sv are colossus keys for sure
edgy solstice
not as good
but it's not bad. if colossal might drops before pulling boss tho, gl
gonna do tank dps
frosty basin
I only used it in m0
boreal quartz
but it's not bad. if colossal might drops before pulling boss tho, gl
Legit for nw
Port out go bi slayer
For last 2 bosses
edgy solstice
slate briar
hey fellas, we want to use sweeping strikes before colossus smash for aoe right?
it does cleave right or am i just bein silly
edgy solstice
cs sweeps yes
slate briar
what about demolish?
thick kelp
in aoe you want to use demolish inside sweep
plucky fern
idk is it my gear lacking haste or maybe im just bad but tried a few slayer keys after playing a week of colossus and my overall dps is just dog crap
compared to colossus dps
slate briar
in aoe you want to use demolish inside sweep
it does cleave with sweep? good to know
slate briar
heard
plucky fern
yeah demolish always with SS up
after last weeks buffs, first two hits also deal significant damage
so sweeping them is a lot of dam
slate briar
it feels good as fuck to press too, so thats nice to know that i was slightly out of sync too and it will feel better lol
plucky fern
also fellow colossus players do you run BL or warbreaker in m+ im still not sure which i want more
balmy kindle
idk is it my gear lacking haste or maybe im just bad but tried a few slayer keys...
Think Colo benefits from having a ton of haste and crit since it directly affects demo CD
slate briar
also fellow colossus players do you run BL or warbreaker in m+ im still not sure...
ive been taking warbreaker, just seems like its better for big cleave
plucky fern
Think Colo benefits from having a ton of haste and crit since it directly affect...
droptimizer tells me to wear crit mastery so my haste is like 14% rn
slate briar
but yeah what he said
plucky fern
colo with wb is griefing the key on bosses p much
yeah im losing ST dps, but damn sometimes in aoe warbreaker is VERY strong
slate briar
TLDR im just doing big aoe dam, and doing enough boss dam to make sure im not throwing
thick kelp
droptimizer tells me to wear crit mastery so my haste is like 14% rn
Yeah Colossus is big hater of haste, slayer is the opposite
slate briar
i also saw some guy on top warcraftlogs sending strength of arms instead of dreadnaut tho too
and thats helping my single target a liiiiiittle
plucky fern
i also saw some guy on top warcraftlogs sending strength of arms instead of drea...
yeah im running that as well
dreadnaught is dead
slate briar
check logs, idk why but everyone is running dread on there lol
plucky fern
SoA is just so good in ST and its kinda the weak spot of colo that we need to fix to feel good
balmy kindle
droptimizer tells me to wear crit mastery so my haste is like 14% rn
Damn maybe it's my gear
balmy kindle
dreadnaught is dead
This discord actually made me realise Dreadnaught is shit and never worth taking, SoA is just so good
edgy solstice
i havent tried it on colo yet
plucky fern
i tested a lot dread vs soa, i can tell you that you will not see any difference in your aoe dps with dreadnaught
but you will notice ST gains from soa
turbid drum
how is arms doing in keys rn?
plucky fern
im also starting to think battlelord in m+ colossus is not dead, it might be the fix for st that i still cant find, since with 4 set MS is kinda not that bad to press
slate briar
btw, i know this is big throwing, but i found my single target caught a pretty thicc buff for very little aoe loss by dropping 1 point from bloodborne, and putting that in sudden death
really really upped my boss dam on fort keys last week
plucky fern
how is arms doing in keys rn?
tough, but honestly i think colo arms is the strongest spec for dps warrior in keys right now
fury overrated
and will be dead when odyns nerf drops
balmy kindle
how is arms doing in keys rn?
To me arms is great but we do have very fierce competition
turbid drum
@plucky fern that's exactly why i'm asking lmao. I'm in the doomer camp as well
what keys are you pushing?
plucky fern
im at 9-10 rn
the only spec i havent beaten in overall dps yet is fking frost dk
its just not possible
they are on another level
balmy kindle
BoS is busted
balmy kindle
Chill lol, it's going to be nuked into orbit. When average ape can play bos it's going to be nuked
plucky fern
arms parses are heavilly brought down by people who just dont realise how to play the spec
mostly just fury enjoyers trying out arms
taking bad build from wowhead
and doing tank damage
edgy solstice
those are timed 10-13s only iirc
but ya
it's slightly skewed
i've put up 1.8m overalls but
turbid drum
it's a shame our class wasn't balanced around the fact that we have next to 0 utility compared to the top 10 specs in your list lol
edgy solstice
truth is fdk, ele, sin rogue can do close to 2.5
plucky fern
idk which ape is doing warrior balance in blizzard btw
fury is already bottom half of performance
and they nerf its only strong spot
turbid drum
it genuinely feels like every patch note is a hit piece lol
plucky fern
like odyns and roar hardcap at 5 is death sentence
turbid drum
i would love to see the insight on the changes
balmy kindle
Isn't it a soft cap
turbid drum
or at the very least a lack thereof
edgy solstice
ya it's soft
plucky fern
its from 8 to 5 softcap right
edgy solstice
ya
plucky fern
so like 60% nerf
balmy kindle
Also I doubt blizzard gonna do it
plucky fern
doesnt affects arms too much luckily
balmy kindle
If u nerf OD and TR to 5 soft cap you will likely need to hit others
plucky fern
like 3-5% aoe dps loss because of roar nerf
plucky fern
maybe time to move point from uproar to blademasters
edgy solstice
if there was a talent worth swapping sks out for, maybe
edgy solstice
ya can't wait for them to outlaw us into a samurai spec
tbh colossus should just be arms identity after this xpac
solution fell right into their lap
weak wave
fury is already bottom half of performance
Really?
edgy solstice
it's pad ethical damage
balmy kindle
Kind of like frost mage in BFA zul fight
weak wave
remove adds from parses and its bottom 5 dps
Why? Add dps matters a lot
sharp wyvern
Kind of like frost mage in BFA zul fight <:keks:936231610850897992>
you men sub rogues?
plucky fern
i mean yeah i can understand the reasoning for their nerfs
'look at the numbers wow fury so strong'
when realisticly its really just ovinax holding fury's average dps that high
rash already doesnt count adds in parses
mighty lance
Why? Add dps matters a lot
Warcraftlogs even removed the adds from rankings
balmy kindle
you men sub rogues?
Ah yes I remember that during RWF with the shuriken storm shenanigans
weak wave
Warcraftlogs even removed the adds from rankings
Which is stupid
mighty lance
Yes
mighty lance
Sheesh
balmy kindle
Fury ST is
sharp wyvern
fury nerfed cause of boss designe
this is what happens when blizz puts adds onto every boss
balmy kindle
fury nerfed cause of boss designe
Partly because fury doesn't need much globals to setup aoe, your average monkey can press OD BS
plucky fern
well im happy that fury is dead now im not forced to spec into that garbage on harder content
weak wave
well im happy that fury is dead now im not forced to spec into that garbage on h...
Me too.
sharp wyvern
you still play it on worm boy
mighty lance
Its so stupid because M+ is the content a lot of People play for
And warrior just isnt that good, unless it does crazy damage and survives
Now we have a dps spec and a survive spec
balmy kindle
Arms still decent tho on m+ and our shockwave deals with orbs quite well ?
sharp wyvern
arms on fortified is better than fury rn
edgy solstice
which it doesnt
plucky fern
this expansion really feels like blizzard ignoring m+ completely
all the changes to classes are centered around raid
mighty lance
Yes but Arms dies
plucky fern
and m+ gearing is just dead
mighty lance
We need ignore pain back on Arms, the old fashioned way
edgy solstice
dks got like 2 mil more hp than us. rets are literally invincible
balmy kindle
Idk I find myself more vulnerable taking threat as fury
plucky fern
yeah survivability in higher keys is the problem for arms
sharp wyvern
Yes but Arms dies
this is why you can use 2 health pots now
plucky fern
current IP doesnt help at all, its like 500k shield per cast
balmy kindle
dks got like 2 mil more hp than us. rets are literally invincible
True my DK at 590 has 4.5m hp while my warriors at the same on 608
edgy solstice
crit vers is the play for colo anyway
balmy kindle
Would imagine soB will get more nerfs tho , if warriors cant survive, that's alot of specs that probably cant
Still working towards 4-5 for me so ymmv
plucky fern
crit vers is the play for colo anyway
for pure dps its crit mastery (at least what sim tells me to do right now), but yeah i was thinking crit vers is the play
edgy solstice
mast vs vers is almost identical so ya, i lean vers whenever possible
- helps if you get ansurek trink
plucky fern
also im not ready to play with no haste, im currently at like 12% unbuffed and i can feel it, in a bad way
its way too slow and rage starving in st kicks in
maybe still want like 15% for comfortable gameplay idk
balmy kindle
15-20 feels like the sweet spot
sharp wyvern
on colossus even 30% feels ragestarved outside of IFTK
plucky fern
nah when i was running 20% before recrafting my gear to crit it was 0 rage problems
but it also was last week with haste affix
so maybe thats why
sharp wyvern
its crazy how not running SD can change that
plucky fern
well SD with no haste is a dead talent
balmy kindle
Kind of funny how slayer is always rage capped while Colo can actually run out of rage
When I play slayer I can just turn my brain off from the red bar
plucky fern
yeah sadly we have to deal with ragestarving
because its simply more dps to do so
sadge
balmy kindle
Time to complain to blizzard like mages d
sharp wyvern
i swear this is because people complained about having to much rage in DF
edgy solstice
hot take maybe but what's the point of a rage bar if it's perma full. idm having to manage rage
sharp wyvern
waiting for resourse isnt managing rage
plucky fern
their intentions were correct, cosmetic ragebar is bad
sharp wyvern
its being afk
balmy kindle
just swap fatality with focused rage
You know i never liked FR but this is pretty good idea
quasi torrent
i swear this is because people complained about having to much rage in DF
And yet its even more impossible to run out of rage on the good hero talent
curious
plucky fern
idk maybe if they add some rage generation in colossus hero tree it could be fine, yeah
slayer doesnt have rage issues its only colo
sharp wyvern
does arms slayer outperform colossus in m+ ?
plucky fern
no
quasi torrent
Depends on what you wanna do
plucky fern
slayer sucks
quasi torrent
If your group pipes aoe you should be slayer
plucky fern
its aoe is way lower and its even MORE squishy
i have no idea how to live keys as slayer arms
quasi torrent
of your group pipes st you should be colossussy
balmy kindle
i have no idea how to live keys as slayer arms
At higher keys it's pretty much die by sword or die 
edgy solstice
i just dont think the rage gen is that big of an issue anyway. there's occasional moments of it but it's not bad enough to take the actual decent rage gen talent we already have, bloodsurge
sharp wyvern
spell reflect stonks
plucky fern
colo at least has some damage reduction going on, and a defensive talent option
quasi torrent
i just dont think the rage gen is that big of an issue anyway. there's occasiona...
it really isnt
oh no i dont get to press a slam waawaa wee woo
(this is good)
balmy kindle
Colo also has lower cd on shockwave
plucky fern
im running 3sec shockwave tho
edgy solstice
nah knockup swave is based
balmy kindle
Not useful maybe, but I do find it very good for hitting orbs
edgy solstice
i dont gotta worry about pugs putting my shit on dr 5 secs into the pull
balmy kindle
Like pug apes don't do the mechanics
plucky fern
my tank really loves the 3s shockwave when things get real bad
but yeah for pugging probably knock is better
in organized group im totally sold on the longer stun option
visual fern
it really isnt
oh no i dont get to press a slam waawaa wee woo
When can I replace slam w/ clap
edgy solstice
rend*
visual fern
I said what I said
edgy solstice
the pinnacle of arms design. initial rend hitting harder than slam for almost a whole expansion
balmy kindle
There's warriors out there that don't even put shockwave on hotbar tho
Be making us look bad for sure
plucky fern
shockwave and spellreflect is whats keeping me alive in those keys for sure
but yeah i can see that most warriors never use those and then our class looks horrible
because of those dummies
edgy solstice
those are all furrys tho
plucky fern
true
balmy kindle
those are all furrys tho
Bingo, not everyone is crit regen
plucky fern
the pinnacle of arms design. initial rend hitting harder than slam for almost a ...
good times
im dying inside every time i cast slam
balmy kindle
I only cast slam to fish for tact procs
Thankfully we usually don't need to press slam for extended periods
plucky fern
well yeah in keys slam doesnt happen often so im cool
its more of a problem in raids
edgy solstice
not on my bars at all for keys
steep osprey
Is arms 4p bad too
edgy solstice
ya
plucky fern
colos arms uses tier the best of all specs btw
in aoe its kinda good, 20% cleave damage and crit strike
balmy kindle
For real can't wait for my 4 set , only 2 now
edgy solstice
arms on most bosses yeah
scarlet spade
colos arms yeah
pine goblet
Mmh what about m+?
plucky fern
slayer arms for raid, colo for m+
scarlet spade
i see, in raid fury m+ arms play
umbral ether
I may switch, I find the aoe rotation clunky in keys but atleast it will be easier on my soreness playing arms
soft dew
With the changes to boss logs in the raid and the nerfs fury is going to go down in rankings
pine goblet
I may switch, I find the aoe rotation clunky in keys but atleast it will be easi...
Hahahah
plucky fern
colossus definetly needs time to get used to
clunky and a button bloat is there
but its most damage a class can do
so deal with that
(in keys)
umbral ether
There’s like a 7 button rotation to set up your aoe
dawn loom
Hey joined the conversation at the perfect time was about to ask the similar esc questions. So new player if I care mostly for performing well in raid and toping the meter over my irl friends I would want to go Arms correct ? If I understand everything correctly and M+ refers to the keys correct not mythic raiding
soft dew
You would want to play ret or enhance
balmy kindle
There’s like a 7 button rotation to set up your aoe
Cant be worse than unholy DK, actually need to line up globals. It fucks hard tho on big pulls
plucky fern
Hey joined the conversation at the perfect time was about to ask the similar esc...
slayer arms in raid is strong and pretty easy
yes m+ is keys
dawn loom
Thank you greatly. For the info 🙂
vital zinc
Does roar not benefit from wb first on ST? trying to understand the rotation
plucky compass
what is the colossus spec for M+ is it just the wowhead spec that lists it as spikey dps?
dawn loom
You would want to play ret or enhance
I’m trying to make an enhance but started with a warrior and he’s 610 now so I feel invested.