arms

[untold trench]

And never the same again

[cobalt sinew]

whatd they nerf

[frigid cipher]

Overpower was colossus smash instead and made your next ms huge

Instead of colossus smash as our cd we had battle cry that gave 100% crit

[vague sedge]

If I'm capped on rage with 2 OP charges and no other rage spenders besides slam, do I slam or press OP?

[frigid cipher]

Just big CS -> MS -> CS -> MS ->… when you got resets

[balmy kindle]

I think u use op if u have tactician procs or no martial prowess stacks

[vague sedge]

Like opportunist?

[dire hinge]

Don’t worry about rage capping, it’s not a focus of the spec in current play, just follow the priority list (rotation)

[vague sedge]

gotcha that makes it easy at least

[unique hamlet]

anyone have a separate WA to track overpower stacks?

[tired fox]

Loving the random extra slash animations

Lol

Even during bladestorm

[balmy kindle]

Very goofy though

[tired fox]

During bs for sure

But I love it otherwise lol

[mortal swallow]

you're supposed to take warbreaker for m+ not csmash right

[nova marsh]

No

Take Csmash warbreaker is kinda shit atm

you loose some raw aoe, but you gain uptime on ITFK and also have better ST

[mortal swallow]

oh ok thx

[nova marsh]

Yeah it's really weird

But prio damage on big mobs is also really neat. try and sweep it always too

[wraith cave]

wait wtf? no warbraker for m + also?

paladins got more changes for 1 patch then warriors got last 4 xpacs XD

[fossil rampart]

and you could run warbreaker but cs just better with more prio damage and more uptime on haste

in these new and old dungeons, there's loads of big mobs that you gotta nuke down in packs. so having that prio damage with cs is very good

[edgy solstice]

not convinced so far tbh

it's not like you're losing the debuff in prio situations by running wb. it's just the haste buff uptime

[balmy kindle]

Warrior tuning is decent TBF, I am just rofl at the hunter Changes cause dem specs be in trouble

[fossil rampart]

sure but you have more st damage, more uptime on that st damage and therefore more uptime on iftk meaning more uptime on 10-20 haste

comparison to just more aoe damage

which is fine, wb isn't bad but cs is the obvious pick especially for high keys

[balmy kindle]

Warriors have an overabundance of cleave and aoe anyways

Both specs need more help on st

[edgy solstice]

still doubt it. historically you almost never choose st over aoe in keys

even when arms st is god awful like df s1, you're just trolling sac'ing aoe

[fossil rampart]

all wb does is make the basic cs into an aoe, comparing that to blunt instruments which gives you an additional 3 seconds of the duration, an increase in 30% damage which is huge. more uptime on iftk which means more haste uptime and that is especially good cuz you can pump out more abilities in the ss window for huge collat stacks and big cleave damage

it just synergizes well overall

[fossil rampart]

you do choose st when it clearly provides infinitely more value than simply making it aoe

[edgy solstice]

you right

i can't turn down infinite value

[fossil rampart]

ey man, whatever floats your boat. i'm already an outcast for being a colossus lover so i know that feeling

just stating the facts, ain't telling you how to play your character

[balmy kindle]

Alot has changed from DF, I was quite surprised when I came back too that war breaker is no longer taken.

[lapis adder]

are the warriro notes a late april fools joke?

ICON CHANGE?

[halcyon breach]

Just so you're aware, it's not like CS gets a 30% damage bonus to its debuff, if that's what you're referring to

If it was, you'd never use Warbreaker even in DF

[lapis adder]

balance druid list was like 10 pages

warrior got icon change...

[edgy solstice]

i get why it's a discussion but having anything that compliments burst aoe in m+ is rather important

[manic stirrup]

you dont rlly sac aoe though bc the extended haste buff

and the st you gain is significant

prio damage is the most important thing in m+

[fossil rampart]

yeah ik, it isn't a damage increase taken it's just cs does 30% increase damage

[manic stirrup]

ironically, aoe often comes second to prio damage

[manic stirrup]

which doesnt rlly matter, doesnt do significant enough damage

[lapis adder]

for m+ is th eplay arms or fury?

[halcyon breach]

Right, just looked like you referred to it being an increase to the damage debuff, but the damage itself from CS is laughably low

[fossil rampart]

it can add up to a decent amount actually, it ain't huge ofc

[balmy kindle]

Both are looking to be quite good, but I think fury is ahead because monke spec

[fossil rampart]

but main reason to just take it is becuz prio damage is solid

[manic stirrup]

either one is completely viable and theyre close overall

[fossil rampart]

bursting down those big mobs that pulse aoe or are dangerous overall has more value

[manic stirrup]

fury will probably be a bit better

[fossil rampart]

nah my bad if i phrased it like that

[halcyon breach]

My reading comprehension is also laughably bad at times so yeah

[manic stirrup]

so is ur hairline

gottem

[halcyon breach]

My hairline is sick

[uncut pasture]

i hope it gets better

[bleak cave]

so how big is the diff between diaper gnome racial to the runner up.

[uncut pasture]

less than 1%, you're better off picking based on what you think looks best

[bleak cave]

roger.

[manic stirrup]

negligible

play dwarf or nelf

[bleak cave]

i don't play alliance.

[manic stirrup]

tauren is probably the best horde race

horde races are beans though

[edgy solstice]

gnome based anyway

[bleak cave]

im goblin right now and i like my extra hop.

[edgy solstice]

fair, gobbo is up in s tier with gnome too

[manic stirrup]

stay goblin then

[bleak cave]

yeah just that goblin helmet mogs

[carmine ginkgo]

If an ability deals reduced damage past a certain number of enemies, is it completely random which enemies take the full amount of damage if there's more than the soft cap?

[bleak cave]

i can only assume its the closest ones to you.

[edgy solstice]

depends on ability

something like warbreaker, it's just proximity to your model

[balmy kindle]

Blood elf / undead for transmog

[edgy solstice]

or bladestorm rather. wb bad example

but ya

[carmine ginkgo]

Thinking about thunderous roar

[edgy solstice]

roar doesnt have a soft cap

[minor gust]

Roar is soft capped

Yes

[halcyon breach]

It does

[manic stirrup]

initial damage is

hardcapped at 20 targets for the blled iirc

unless was changed

[edgy solstice]

oh my b then, wtf

[halcyon breach]

Was sometime late Beta

[dire hinge]

was a recent-ish thing i think

[minor gust]

It's a TWW change yeah

[manic stirrup]

oh is bleed changed to 8?

[carmine ginkgo]

It's in the mined beta notes

[minor gust]

The notes today is just updating the tooltip

[boreal quartz]

Arms scales with aurabuffs

[carmine ginkgo]

Ah k

[minor gust]

Damn just whipping out the hard S word huh

[uncut pasture]

the ability deals reduced damage to all targets if it affects more than the it's soft cap
https://www.wowhead.com/news/aoe-in-patch-9-1-5-the-math-behind-aoe-soft-caps-and-square-root-scaling-324101

[carmine ginkgo]

I remember them implementing that now. Thanks for the link!

[crimson steppe]

why is ret getting a 3rd rework and arms getting an ability icon update

[manic stirrup]

bc ret is still a shit spec

[crimson steppe]

our capstones are garbage

[manic stirrup]

are they

two of them are pretty shit, three are fine imo

[crimson steppe]

Champion’s Spear icon has been updated.
Arms
Warbreaker’s radius increased to 10 yards (was 8 yards).

[tribal kindle]

Welcome back condemn

[crimson steppe]

is just funny to see

[balmy kindle]

Let's just say my friend who opted to play ret because flashy is kicking himself now

[sly venture]

Wait what, is this a joke or this is something new for hunters atm?

[balmy kindle]

Mm changes are looking good but they are still gonna be ball s on 2T cleave I think

[balmy kindle]

New, basically reworked black arrow by baking it with killshot

[sly venture]

Ok, cool!

[balmy kindle]

MM is suffering tho because blizzard in their amazing wisdom make trick shots only work on 3T +

So any low Target cleave you will end up awkwardly shooting aimed shots one 1 target at a time

[summer seal]

Damn, i wish we could extend Archi responibilities to DK/Pala discords

[weak wave]

Doesn't Aimed Shot do splash dmg with some AoE talents?

[balmy kindle]

I haven't touched MM since DF S1 but it's never worked that way.

Alot of MM aoe is centered around volley explosive shot and aimed shots bouncing in trueshot windows

You basically press a shit load of buttons only to lose to fury warriors pressing 3

Oh and MM has hard caps on aoe

[halcyon breach]

Unless it changed from Beta (haven't looked at most recent changes for 11.05), they made the Wailing Arrow replace Aimed Shot at some intervals, which did splash damage

[balmy kindle]

My bad, but wailing is not taken in m+ I believe

[halcyon breach]

Shrug wouldn't know either, haven't cared to check up on hunter yet

Just know it's a thing

I do know it was bugged in Beta, and that the bounces didn't do the splash damage

[balmy kindle]

Well let's just say hunter MM discord is just at mode now

[dry frost]

Does Armored to the Teeth scale with external armor sources?

Do we need to be like perma wog'd come 11.0.5?

[gilded stump]

Most people here would like to play Colossus but slayer is just simply better, and fury even more so

[fossil rampart]

yeah i understand that. what is the raw % difference between colossus/slayer and then arms/fury?

[gilded stump]

About 132%

[sly venture]

I've been 2hours on 5 target dummies so can't say anything about single target but here's my results:
Arms Slayer m+ build: 1.41m (4min)
Arms Slayer with SD/Battlelord/ISS: 1.21m (4min)
Arms Colossus m+: 1.32m (4min)
Arms Colossus with SD/Battlelord/ISS: 1.22m (4min)
But i'm only a 576ilvl Warr and we don't know anything. I'm doing 1.6m on Fury keksad

[halcyon breach]

Pure ST it's about a 9% difference~ between Slayer and Colossus

At proposed bis setup

For AoE idk

[gilded stump]

Me trying to explain why the 5% size increase on Colossus offsets any possible DMG gain of slayer in mythic prog

[edgy solstice]

samoa joe would never

[flat willow]

Demolish is just bladestorm but worse

Colossus arms are just slayer arms on copium

[gilded stump]

SAMOA JOE IS A FAT LOSER HE HAS NO CHANCE TO BEAT THE DPS OF A GENETIC FREAK LIKE ME. THE NUMBERS DON'T LIE AND THEY SPELL DISASTER FOR YOU AT NERUB-AR PALACE

[edgy solstice]

mount rushmore of promos tbh

[balmy kindle]

Scott Steiner doing promos 🐒

[wraith cave]

weird that on dummies x3 the warbreaker does like 70 80k less dps than blunt instruments

but sims shows WB higher byu liek 4k dps on dungone slice

[gilded stump]

His mic skills were the only reason why he was being employed for so long

[edgy solstice]

he fit the juiced bill too

[gilded stump]

But he wasn't any good without his brother

[edgy solstice]

ya idk what happened

[gilded stump]

Honestly his solo career is mostly remembered for the memes

[edgy solstice]

but he was gold in tna

him and bully ray doing segments together is peak comedy

[balmy kindle]

Scott is very polarising, he's either good at the mic or just a juice monkey depending on who you ask.

Personally I liked him because he had some very meme and candid moments.but his in ring work argh

[edgy solstice]

ya he needs to be carried in ring but i stopped caring about match quality when i exited my teen years

[gilded stump]

Like I said he was midcard talent wise but main eventer mic wise

[edgy solstice]

at this point i just hope they botch matches so it can be funnier

[gilded stump]

Every time he got the mike it was going to be good

[balmy kindle]

Not hating him tho, his segments with HHH was peak comedy for me

Juicer Vs juicer

[gilded stump]

BIG
POPPA
PUMP

[edgy solstice]

built like an action figure 00s trips was generational

[balmy kindle]

Nostalgia

[edgy solstice]

i still got a steiner soundboard of him saying he has no donuts in his pocket that i can't bring myself to get rid of

[balmy kindle]

Before the days of political correctness

[gilded stump]

Speaking about great promos

[edgy solstice]

https://tenor.com/view/vince-mcmahon-nodding-keep-it-up-john-cena-wwe-gif-17784112

even better

real ones know

[balmy kindle]

Booker T

[tropic eagle]

are they serious with those class patch notes

everyone gets ann essay we get + 2 to radius on warbreaker??

[edgy solstice]

welcome to arms

[gilded stump]

Peak WWE comedy was Angle and Austin

[tropic eagle]

getting a bit tired of this tho

[edgy solstice]

we're on life support until they give us the outlaw treatment 4 xpacs from now

[balmy kindle]

Yo Kurt was amazing, man made any persona work while still being a raid boss in the ring

[gilded stump]

Man gets a gold medal while injured and then goes on to be the butt of all jokes for years like a boss

I love Kurt

[balmy kindle]

A joke in segments but when his entrance came you know shit is going down

Amazing promos too

[edgy solstice]

kurt was too good

he's up there for most complete wrestler with hbk

[gilded stump]

The last thing enhancement talent sees after fucking up a spot on last week's show

[balmy kindle]

Ayy hardcore holly aka stiff god

[gilded stump]

The bane of rookies

[balmy kindle]

Polar opposite of undertaker

[gilded stump]

"What's that you didn't sell a finisher just the right way? Here have 3 Alabama Slams and stiff chops"

[balmy kindle]

Good ol' elitism, you had to earn his respect , just like us in wow

Mentoring newbies ? Nah gtfo

[gilded stump]

that face you make when you're a solid performer with main event energy but your idiot boss is obsessed with "blue collar job" gimmicks

[balmy kindle]

Shit lol this goes way to far back

[gilded stump]

That was his job and as a proud member of the job squad he took his job seriously

I really like hardcore holly everything from his theme to his moveset and his performance I just wish WWE had more faith in him

[balmy kindle]

TBF our numbers are pretty on point, most issues stem with play style.

Most of the heavily tweaked specs are literally in ICU status

[gilded stump]

Yeah poor mages needed the fixes real bad

[tropic eagle]

ah dont even try to make me to settle for 2 yards on warbreaker mate

[tropic eagle]

There is so much more arms couldve recieved

[flat willow]

hey man every other class getting love and work and arms getting nothing, must mean arms is perfectly designed

arms is the crab of world of warcraft

all specs will eventually become arms

[gilded stump]

Like 6 yards on WB and new icons for rend

[white anvil]

pretty sure arms is still better in raid and better with pi once raid releases

[edgy solstice]

arms will eventually become not arms

[white anvil]

so not total cope

[edgy solstice]

blademaster or some shit

[balmy kindle]

Bro fire mages tho

[gilded stump]

he thinks he will get PI as arms

🤣🤣🤣😂😂😂😂🤣🤣😂😂🤣😅😂

[flat willow]

[flat willow]

yeah shamans and frost dks needed more work put into them than arms

100% bro

[white anvil]

hey we do get a +7.7% increase compared to fury's 3,2%

not too bad

also sometimes priests troll idk

i got PI last xpac as sub rogue, given they were heroic/mythic (first 3 boss) pugs, and that is a class that wants 0% haste lol

got to remain hopeful

[balmy kindle]

I do get PI in pugs, probably do if you do a ton of dmg to the average player

[flat willow]

well if I'm allowed to be hopeful

[gilded stump]

Every guild is gonna give PI to a mage or warlock no question asked

[white anvil]

yeah exactrly

[flat willow]

can they remove PI from the game?

[balmy kindle]

Bruh 9-5 can't make raid schedule

[gilded stump]

Quit work

[edgy solstice]

i would get pi in execute if our hunter was dead

[white anvil]

rogue is bad with pi, as stated. now, if we are talking PI donkeys -- unholy DK

[edgy solstice]

which was 80% of the time

[gilded stump]

Who needs 40 grand if you have a shiny weapon that can 2 shot rag

[white anvil]

unholy DK with PI is absurd dps increase

[balmy kindle]

Then you realize work = infinite tokens

[edgy solstice]

arms was also top 5 ish pi target for most of DF in keys fwiw

[balmy kindle]

Jk please don't do that

[white anvil]

People with jobs =/= Guild raid team

[flat willow]

heh, now that unholy plays without army or gargoyle

it isn't that big

[soft dew]

PI was too good for UH, they made a lot of changes to make sure it's not as good in TWW

[flat willow]

just give it to a hunter or lock

[balmy kindle]

Haven't joined a guild since SL as I play on OCE, it just doesn't work.

[soft dew]

Just remove the ability to use it on someone else

[gilded stump]

NO PI FOR YOU COME AGAIN NEXT SEASON

[flat willow]

yes please, never add pi again

[white anvil]

true it is not as egregious, but unholy still gains +9% burst and +5% overall 5m fight ... which might seem like a small percentage, then you remember unholy dk itself is overtuned therefore 5% for unholy > 15% demo or whatever

[edgy solstice]

good news. everyone was complaining about pi so they buffed it and then made seasons and aug

[flat willow]

thanks blizzard

[white anvil]

true, my friends and i get aotc and ksm with an ingenious strategy - create a 5-8 man pug, depending on who's on, and fill the rest with randos

it's fucking hilarious the people you meet

[soft dew]

Aug 👎

[gilded stump]

Frankly just forget it even exists so you won't be depressed when you're not getting it

[white anvil]

honestly it is better in some ways

[edgy solstice]

you don't like dps externals? well here's more and yeno what, here's dps external: the spec

[white anvil]

just for the humor

[balmy kindle]

I mean too much PI = your parses don't count too

[soft dew]

I loved it when they changed the combat log triggers to make sure we would have difficulties calculating the dps an Aug brings

[flat willow]

at least on cataclysm PI is a caster problem

[balmy kindle]

Like I sweated for my parse only to find out oh too many buffs, it doesn't count

[gilded stump]

Nobody cares about cata classic

[flat willow]

true

[soft dew]

true

[flat willow]

but that's a good way to design PI

make it casters' problem

[soft dew]

^

[flat willow]

they deserve it for playing caster

[white anvil]

even worse - when you are the first to die on a raid boss, where prior you had done top dps every pull, and ofc the pull you die it finally goes down

and you parse like a 2

lol

[gilded stump]

I for one can't wait for Shadowlands classic so I can relive the epic story about the best villain in wow, the Jailer

[white anvil]

that was me on heroic raz df s1.

[soft dew]

I feel like this is my life most of the time

Perfect pulls all the time for me, then bam I die and the boss falls

[balmy kindle]

Tell me more

Oh and the drop goes to the guy who died 2nd and was dying all along

[white anvil]

my fav pug raid memory is a survival hunter doing top dps on raz, and his harpoon ability glitched him inside raz and he instadied, and once the tank raid lead (horrible mistake) saw the post-wipe dps charts he booted him 😭 and this guy was a tyrant in the pug discord so noone opposed him

never trust a pug tank raid lead

[gilded stump]

"Yeah you technically did more DPS and rolled higher then X but he's been in the guild longer so the council decided to give the item to him"

[white anvil]

bro was lowkey making survival look broken before killing himself tho

[edgy solstice]

survival is always p good

[white anvil]

cant trust a tank to look at dps charts in fight though they are too busy with their eat glue and diaper change rotation

7 min cds

[white anvil]

this feels true to me as well but i think legion just tainted survival in most people's minds

so the wow zeitgeist around survival, until it was the year of the spear or whatever in SL, was that it was just utter garbage

i think that is fading a bit though

[gilded stump]

when the druid tank talks about how hard it is to tank efficiently as a druid

[balmy kindle]

My experience in pugs is guys who play niche specs are.more often than not pretty good

[edgy solstice]

i love melee hunter. surv is fun af

[white anvil]

when ur on your niche spec and another one joins the raid group

[edgy solstice]

but the sl "just throw bombs lul" build didn't help

[white anvil]

u lose ur identity lowkey ur no longer the niche guy

[flat willow]

I'd say I'm just a little pissed paladins get another rework before arms

[white anvil]

that was me on mythic primal council when like 3 sub rogues joined in 5 mins lol

[flat willow]

just a tad

[balmy kindle]

Arms still not that niche tho, survival for a long time is like a unicorn

[flat willow]

paladin is like the most played class in the game

is it not

[balmy kindle]

Because u will get comments like : BM MM OR GTFO

Played hunter so it's part of the experience

[gilded stump]

Fuck survival were already have to many meeles

[edgy solstice]

ranged spots are hard to fill as is so it feels bad when your hunter wants to be melee, i get it

[white anvil]

true, the real niche is any rogue that is not assassination, brewmaster/mistweaver monk, devoker, surv, and, depending on the season, afflock/elemental/feral (bar times when they are broken, which is now for aff and ele)

[balmy kindle]

Oh and better hope MM is not tuned bad because otherwise it's BM

[balmy kindle]

Honestly in pugs raids, the ranged spots is just an excuse for people to slack.. mages and warlocks esp doing the bare minimum

[gilded stump]

MM or bust, it's not negotiable for me

[balmy kindle]

Meta spec doing 50% of their possible throughput

[edgy solstice]

pugging be like that

[white anvil]

i tried to play brewmaster monk for the meme in a key with my buds and i literally almost broke a +2

sht has like 50 buttons

and they all do the same thing

[gilded stump]

Just press expel harm bro

[white anvil]

drink this one to absorb 10k damage ... do this one to heal 10k damage ... do this one to take 10k damage in 5 minutes ... do this one to reset your brews ... do this one to reset roll cd ... do this one to change into a mechagnome

needs a trim

[flat willow]

I thought they removed the buttons that people had trouble with

[white anvil]

this was last season xpac perhaps it is better in tww

i have not dared try it

[gilded stump]

Monks are lame anyway

[balmy kindle]

Well hunter MM discord is like more doomer than here, blizzard doesn't know what to do with the spec.

[gilded stump]

Just stick to warrior and complain about the state of affairs

[white anvil]

i feel like once we get the logs arms is going to be fairly meta in raid and, as the case may be, inferior to fury in M+ by a negligible to sizable margin depending on target count and how long the mobs stay alive

maybe in some circumstances, it'll be better, but I won't get my hopes up for M+. raid atleast seems fine.

[flat willow]

my biggest problem with warrior is that it has the best mogs

[balmy kindle]

It's the reason why we play this game

[flat willow]

its hard to play dh or shaman because they are uglier

even if I like the gameplay better

[tropic eagle]

arms is bound to be a bleed bot again

[edgy solstice]

good design

[tropic eagle]

+yards on warbreaker was not what it needed from a patch like this

[edgy solstice]

i love playing melee affliction

[white anvil]

reasons for main changes, Shamans: ugly, DH: motion sickness, Warrior: falling asleep during rotation / carpal tunnel (spec dependent), DK: lumbering and lacks a raid buff, Monk: playing ww unironically, Paladin: 0 intellectual stimulation, Rogue: carpal tunnel

seems about right

[edgy solstice]

grip is arguably a better raid buff than any actual raid buff

[flat willow]

maybe if you play blood

[white anvil]

you can tell dks that all day, just read their forums. they want their little 0.3% crit strike raid buff or what have you so bad for the fights grip is meaningless

[flat willow]

I mean, there's usually like 1 fight per raid tier where grab is useful ( mandatory )

and the blood dk usually deals with it

[white anvil]

also, i suppose dk is the only class WITHOUT one come to think of it. so while grip is technically a raid buff, and anti-magic zone, it might be a bit unfulfilling when you have like windfury, atrophic poison, and such

hunters mark is kinda lame too even though it's a massive dps increase in raid. i just think it will be clunky in m+

need to make it passively apply or something

[plucky fern]

biggest change indeed

so fury gets buffed and arms gets a tooltip update, nice

[astral yarrow]

whoah whoah

[teal fossil]

The sub 1% damage buff

[astral yarrow]

we're getting warbreaker range

[teal fossil]

The bt changes are honestly so negligible

[plucky fern]

i mean who is even in charge for warrior charges

[teal fossil]

Especially early in the expac

[plucky fern]

this guy just randomly moves numbers i swear

[teal fossil]

Yeah def feels like it

[livid vector]

We need a tierset buff 🫠

[flat willow]

we don't need a buff

[livid vector]

Some classes with 13% inc. us over here with 2.8%

[flat willow]

we need a rework

[plucky fern]

yeah i know but still, if we ignore the weight of changes, a better performing spec is getting buffs, and a worse performing spec gets shitted on on release (removal of SS in bladestorm/ravager)

what is their logic

[halcyon breach]

Tbf while our tier is shit, our baseline is so high that we're on par, and in some cases still better, than those with a 12-15% increase from tier

[livid vector]

I mean i suppose

[teal fossil]

Ye i rather have more power in base kit

[livid vector]

Just means we’re low on tier prio 😴

[halcyon breach]

It also means you wont notice a difference between having it or not

[teal fossil]

With 13% on a tier 1 set, you are either hopelessly dependent on tier or your class is just bad

[halcyon breach]

So see it as a positive (or negative)

[teal fossil]

It also means warriors SCALE better

Holy moly

[livid vector]

See, this isn’t fair… he’s making sense. Let me be outraged 🤣

[teal fossil]

And we all know scaling is what’s important

[flat willow]

aura buffs

[prisma heart]

How is mechagnome almost 10k DPS higher than half the other races 🚼

[flat willow]

are what's important

[halcyon breach]

Because of big mainstat

[livid vector]

Main stat goes brr

[teal fossil]

Are we casually ignoring that fury is lost unhinged cleave too

[plucky fern]

did they even notice

[teal fossil]

Because flat main stat is good early in expac

[prisma heart]

Aight blizz take my $20 I'm a robot now

[plucky fern]

fury didnt need unhinged at first place their kit is already pleantyful

[teal fossil]

And 10k when you do 1 mil dps is nothing

[livid vector]

Mechagnome works out at like 1200 main stat for being in combat for longer than 40 seconds

[prisma heart]

2 late beep boop

[flat willow]

i really don't care about mechagnomes being slightly ahead

but fucking remove stoneform and shadowmeld

[teal fossil]

Fury lost more on unhinged because they can empower their unhinged easier

[livid vector]

10% of a milli isn’t 10k

[flat willow]

how do people play with all those nelves running around?

they are so fucking ugly

[halcyon breach]

how do people play orcs?

they are so ugly

[flat willow]

we play orc for the skin

people don't play nelf for the skin

[plucky fern]

i mean yeah i guess the unhinged nerf was targeting fury, and we got collateral damage from that nerf

and cuz nobody at blizz cares about arms they didnt even think about it

[teal fossil]

Who said 10%

[flat willow]

it adds to the ugliness, knowing they would never be playing the race they are playing if racials didn't exist

[teal fossil]

Also mechagnome gap closes fast ones you get gear

[wary steppe]

i saw 11.0.5 ptr with wowhead title Major Class Changes and i was like "here we go", boy was i dissapointed

[plucky fern]

yeah biggest bait ever

[halcyon breach]

I think that a lot of people like the Nelf appearances

[teal fossil]

Even at the end of the tier mecha is gonna get worse

[plucky fern]

its almost like an april fools patchnotes

[wary steppe]

yea trully haha, i give it a couple weeks then i ll doom

[plucky fern]

'huge changes' - 'tooltips updated, icon updated, +2 radius to warbreaker which we dont even play anymore'

[prisma heart]

Aren't these racial sims with fully s1 geared toons

[halcyon breach]

I personally just play the race I feel like, alternating between nelf, human or velf

They are

[prisma heart]

Say it with me: beep boop

[flat willow]

don't know about how many people actually like the skin, but def way more nelves than there used to be

one day blizzard will delete racials

[halcyon breach]

I gotta say calling it a skin is very jarring

[plucky fern]

racials are cool, it adds flavor to characters

but shadowmeld should be changed yes

[empty sluice]

LoH gives 100% armor on 30s?👀

[teal fossil]

PvP talent

Isn’t it

[weak wave]

Vanilla talent.

[empty sluice]

Even worse, Never mind

[balmy kindle]

Blood elf with their heritage chest piece and battle lord bottom is peak aesthetics

[weak wave]

My Tank reached 75% armor with this back in these days

[astral yarrow]

i'll hold off on the scaling till i can be dracthyr

[teal fossil]

Dracthyr doesn’t look like they mew

Big problem

https://tenor.com/view/mewing-cat-mewing-mewing-meme-cat-staring-cat-gif-6979404450990708267

[flat willow]

dracthyr visages 100% mew

[astral yarrow]

can we get catgirl dracthyr

[balmy kindle]

Coomers >>>

[steep osprey]

Any condemners

[thick kelp]

nahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[balmy kindle]

MM hunters at discord now surely we will be good now

[flat willow]

and condoomers

[misty barn]

Whats a good race for Arms and Prot ? I got a race change gifted so im looking for recommendations

[balmy kindle]

Aesthetics or meta

[teal fossil]

If you want meta it’s dwarf or mechagnome

[odd crest]

Dwarf alliance, tauren horde

[iron obsidian]

can go on murlok.io to see what the top 50 m+ players use for races

[teal fossil]

It’s all probably dwarf to cleanse bleeds lol

[iron obsidian]

dwarf is sexy for this seasons m+ affix

[untold pewter]

A question regarding Slayer:

How much do I care about overpower stacks when using Cleave/Mortal strike (asking because Cleave triggers reap the storm) in single target
Do I Slam instead of Cleave if Mortal Strike is on CD and I have overpower stacks so I use them with Mortal Strike instead of Cleave or just Cleave anyway because RtS would net more damage on proc?

[empty sluice]

Probably slam, keep op stacks for ms

[teal fossil]

Yes you cleave on st but try to use it without using mp stacks

[untold pewter]

That's 2 different answers kek

[teal fossil]

Those are not different answers

[untold pewter]

I get it

[teal fossil]

Smart boy

[untold pewter]

So essentially just cleave after MS

[teal fossil]

Ye

[untold pewter]

Easy enough, thanks thanks

[untold pewter]

Kek I misread it, was my bad

Hm, I find that I kind of don't have rage to do that though

[teal fossil]

Then you just skip out on the cleave

It is what it is

[untold pewter]

Ok fair enough

[teal fossil]

Ms cleave is 50 rage so yeah it can be rough

[untold pewter]

Yeah I was just wondering how much "trying to force rts procs" would play into it

[teal fossil]

Especially if you just had to refresh rend

[untold pewter]

Exactly yeah

Oh, also definitely using Rend and not Thunder Clap on single target this time yeah?

(Even if TC is talented, like in keys)

[empty sluice]

Thats minor upgrade dont bother, just send tc

[untold pewter]

It's like 2x damage no?

[teal fossil]

Look at tooltip

[untold pewter]

That's what I'm looking at

[empty sluice]

2x0 is still zero

[untold pewter]

47k for TC 87k for Rend atm

[empty sluice]

U just want the dot, But If u want extra keybind for 30k dam sure

Technicaly its better

But I personally wouldnt care in keys

[untold pewter]

Yeah that's fair, I do have a comfy spot for it here so I'll just go with it

[teal fossil]

If you like it go for it

[empty sluice]

Or u can macro it to charge

[teal fossil]

Tc can be hard on rage

Yeah I like macro to charge

[untold pewter]

It's same rage now

[empty sluice]

Yea its same

[untold pewter]

Macro to charge is nice

Good idea

Yeah that's pretty comfortable, thanks mate, very good idea

[empty sluice]

[plucky fern]

i macroed slam to charge because i cant allow having this garbage on my bars

[astral yarrow]

charge/hamstring macro is 🐐

[plucky fern]

and rend on 'shift' mod in same macro with TC

[slow saddle]

so slam slam move away charge

[untold pewter]

I hate using any kind of mod keys haha

[mortal rivet]

Just use the TC macro from the FAQ

[manic river]

What are the current best enchantments for arms?

[soft dew]

#dps-faq @manic river

[manic river]

Thanks

What do you think about authority of radiant power?

[rustic igloo]

"Huge Warrior changes on the PTR" in the news

Warbreaker gains 2 yards range

[soft dew]

Icon change for the spear!

[rustic igloo]

And dang, spear got a new icon?

[untold pewter]

Doesn't achieve what we were talking about

[soft dew]

That's a big change

[rustic igloo]

Man, hold me, I don't know if I can handle that

[untold pewter]

We're so back

[manic river]

Nice

[soft dew]

Funny because rn we don't even use Warbreaker

[rustic igloo]

I hate arms so much

Because I want to love it, but the rotation is wack

[wanton sierra]

we got buffed??? holy fuck im openin wowhead

[rustic igloo]

Everything is desync'd, SS and BS get in each other's way and Demolish is just Raging Blow followed by a scuffed Condemn

Bad visuals, terrible sound design and hits like a wet noodle unless you crit, then you pull aggro and die

[untold pewter]

Idk I dig it

[wanton sierra]

you must be new xD

[untold pewter]

kek

No I'm not xD

[wanton sierra]

im talking about gore

[untold pewter]

Ah fair

[wanton sierra]

damn we got 2 yards!!!

[rustic igloo]

Poggers

[wanton sierra]

i feel you, arms you love or you hate it... its counter intuitive spec

[mortal rivet]

Why would you rend when you can TC?

[untold pewter]

In single target, does more damage

[mortal rivet]

It’s negligible

[untold pewter]

It does more damage period kek

It's ok if you don't want to, but it does more damage

I want to

[wanton sierra]

on df tactician would 100% proc with tc... coz of 40 rage... but now its dif

[untold pewter]

Yeah exactly

At the same cost, I personally have no reason to choose to do less damage

[soft dew]

Then you need another bind

[untold pewter]

Yeah but that's fine for me

Especially macroing to Charge, that feels quite comfy

[soft dew]

You do you 😄

[untold pewter]

Indeed

[wanton sierra]

now we need to master charge weave

[mortal rivet]

*Thunder Clap/Rend (Arms) - Due to the small difference between them, there's no reason to use Rend when Thunder Clap is talented.

/cast [known:Thunder Clap] Thunder Clap; Rend```

[untold pewter]

AA timers are back baby

[mortal rivet]

Literally from the faq

[wanton sierra]

yes you are right xD love it

[untold pewter]

I literally do not understand which part of what I'm saying you don't understand
Rend costs the same as Thunderclap and does more damage, that's all there is to it

If you want to not use it, by all means, don't
I want to use it because it does more damage

It's really simple haha

[wanton sierra]

rend hahs the same rage as tc?

[untold pewter]

Yeah

20

[wanton sierra]

damn i thoght tc was still 40 rage

[tardy hare]

It’s to save a key bind if people want yo lose .5% damage let them

[untold pewter]

Yeah 100%

I'm not advocating people should use either, to be clear

[wanton sierra]

save a keybind sounds laziness

[untold pewter]

I'm just saying I have no problems with that so well, I'll use it
That was the convo before he suggested the macro and I just replied that the macro doesn't have anything to do with the convo

[mortal rivet]

And I am just saying that despite it doing more damage, the damage you’re gaining is less than the variation of a sim

[untold pewter]

Sure, I understand that

[wanton sierra]

but tbf i quite liked the 2yards range on WB... wb needed some love

[mortal rivet]

It’s 80% of your attack power every 15s

[untold pewter]

Yeah

[mortal rivet]

You do you!

[untold pewter]

EXACTLY lmfao

And just one more time to be 100% clear: I'm not saying you or anyone should use Rend, but you asked me why so I answered

[wanton sierra]

i didnt even read the changes, in my head rend did more single target dam and tc aoe dam... but before rend was 30 and tc 40? i dont quite remember, i was 10 months straith on classic era

[untold pewter]

Yeah TC had a higher rage cost and thus helped more with ToM and Tactician procs

[wanton sierra]

if you say tom 3 times you summon tom lovers

[untold pewter]

Now they have the same cost and rend does ~80% more damage so I dig it

[rustic igloo]

WW in single target enjoyers

Just for ToM buffs

[shadow ibex]

You gotta be kidding lol

[deft raft]

hi guys! which is the stat priority according to you for arms war in pvp?

Nice to meet you everyone 🙂

[woven wasp]

#pvp

[sly venture]

Well every macro and wa is because eirher blizzards laziness or ours

[wanton sierra]

yea! lol 2 yards... i belive they got it better coz ppl are takin blunt intruments ... but we are melee, warbreaker already clips everything

[gusty oxide]

When people ask me how to i gear my warrior :

"Just slap your highest item level dude."

[shadow ibex]

2 yards doesn't make it a better talent. If anything I wouldn't be surprised if it's just another tooltip update

[wanton sierra]

hey tom, how about WB also aply rend during its duration

[manic river]

I still have rend on some other buttom just for when we are fighthing a single boss, its not necessary but it's ok

[smoky kayak]

This is almost always the right answer

My top wish for 11.0.5 tbh

[shadow ibex]

I'll also take rend and tclap being merged because that is the bloatiest shit I ever seen

[woven wasp]

my night was actually ruined when i read "major class changes" and scrolled down to warrior

[tacit cedar]

Yeah that was pretty sad to see paragraphs of changes for classes and then we get 6 bullet points a 2 yard range increase, some crit on fury and a tool tip art change

That tooltip better be the coolest thing I've ever seen

[drifting apex]

so for the data mined 11.0.5 the war arms just get nerfed? or did i missed something

[woven wasp]

no changes

[tacit cedar]

Every class got like 75 changes and arms got a 2 yard range increase to warbreaker lol

And we got a cosmetic tooltip art change to spear

[dusty sorrel]

so with the season starting on tuesday is it safe to say that on our class guide our "BiS" list is up to date

[shadow ibex]

The 2yard increase is almost hilarious lol

Pretty much useless talent

[tacit cedar]

It's just sad. Talents moved, new talents, QOL stuff for everyone

[wanton sierra]

ms resetes w? you mean EB?

[shadow ibex]

Certainly not performing well as the aoe option

[tacit cedar]

"2 yard increase"

[sharp tendon]

No they going nerf embellishments special the wpn ones

[dusty sorrel]

they are nerfing them on Tuesday?

[smoky kayak]

mostly, but some guide updates this weekend

[tacit cedar]

With the pending updates, I didn't see anything anywhere about the crafted weapons. Would be still be better safe than sorry to craft 2 armor pieces with linings for both specs?

Or just go weapon and pray it dosent also get nerfed

[dusty sorrel]

yeah I also have yet to craft any pieces so I too would like to know

[smoky kayak]

#1237307555961634826 has everything you need about crafting (which is also in the guide)

[wanton sierra]

why our embelishments are double versa?

[smoky kayak]

TLDR you really shouldn't be crafting anything next week or even immediately on login on Tues unless you're racing

[wanton sierra]

good info

[dusty sorrel]

now what if I am raiding mythic and doing a fuck ton of keys. Does the crafting order change?

that's the only question that wasn't answered

[tacit cedar]

For both arms or fury yeah? I still have my spark and will have the 2nd one next week

[sharp tendon]

Just wait after first week normal raid is super easy no need to rush embellishment

[smoky kayak]

Because the profile is already gearing a ton of crit and consistent crit from gear is > inconsistent crit from embel - you could flip it if you wanted, but you'd have to change the whole gear list to accomodate and have less flexibility with Fury

[tacit cedar]

Also dosent duskthread lining drop off the raid so can't even get it yet?

[smoky kayak]

correct, but that's ok, because you shouldn't be crafting asap anyway

[tacit cedar]

I've mostly been on fury so thats why I was asking about the crafted weapon. I can ping you in the fury channel for it though

[smoky kayak]

• the very least, you should not craft anything until killing Ansurek for a free Enchanted Crest (assuming there's still a quest for one, which is as of yet unconfirmed)
• for any mid-level raiding guild or higher, you probably don't want to craft anything until killing the first boss of Mythic, assuming that's something you reasonably believe you'll be able to do on the 17th

I know everyone wants to rush and get new shiny asap, but there's really no reason to

[manic stirrup]

even if you are you wouldnt craft on tuesday, youd craft after the 20 or so splits youre doing

[smoky kayak]

most mid-level raiding guilds don't do splits

[manic stirrup]

wait until after you do heroic to send your spark

[smoky kayak]

most high level raiding guilds don't even

[manic stirrup]

i know just making the point of theres no reason to rush if youre mythic raiding

[smoky kayak]

Sure, I just kind of presume that anyone in a guild coordinated enough to be doing several splits probably already has a gameplan and isn't looking for advice in here

but you're right, the point is still the same - be patient!

[rancid willow]

What’s patience precious?

[manic stirrup]

true

[rancid willow]

https://tenor.com/view/gollum-whats-taters-precious-lord-of-the-rings-gif-16013459

[maiden moat]

where do you get it that they nerf it ?

[tardy yarrow]

do you guys find Arms fun in TWW? smooth?

[sly venture]

No in aoe clunky as hell

some ppl like that

[tardy yarrow]

aww

at least no WW right

[sly venture]

also does less dmg than Fury in aoe

less survivability, less smooth

[plucky fern]

also nobody at bliizard even knows that arms exist

thats the worst part

we got 3rd shaman rework in a month but arms zero changes

[sly venture]

Someone saw spear icon on Fury team and was like "lets change the icon" so that chage automatically happend without blizzard even knowing

[manic stirrup]

i like it

it’s really not that clunky at all

[sly venture]

isn't that's why we like Arms though

because of the clunkiness

always in the wrong gcd

[manic stirrup]

doesn’t feel clunky to me, so no

[sly venture]

1 sec too early or too late than what you would like so you have to act in the moment

define clunky, im not putting so much m(n)egativity to the word as you would think

[plucky fern]

for me clunky is when your rotation sometimes just stops because you ran our of resource or got unlucky with procs, and arms is definetly one of those specs
basically every time i press slam i feel clunky

[frigid cipher]

Still so weird to me people have an issue with slam

[tacit cedar]

Why slam cost big rage

For little damage

If slam cost big rage slam do big damage

[tardy yarrow]

for M+ which hero tree

[tiny dock]

hows arms now compared to S4 DF

i levelled fury and just stuck with it because small brain and too lazy to change

but I can feel the carpal tunnel coming

[plucky fern]

you mean fury is too hard for you?

bad news brother i dont think theres a spec easier than that

[tiny dock]

nah fury is fine, it's fun

[summer wasp]

dude yes i feel this haha, im getting old : (

[soft dew]

Even with powerful enrage?

[sly venture]

All I need is the Juggernaut build from S3 m+ and I would be happy

[tiny dock]

but I said carpal tunnel lmao

[tiny dock]

i know for sure once we get more haste as the xpac continues I'm gonna feel it

[plucky fern]

well arms is playable right now, i still refuse to play fury and will play arms but definetly needs some love from blizz

[cloud gyro]

ive tried to get back into arms for like 2 years now and this is the first patch i enjoy it

[soft dew]

Arms is ok, could be better (design wise)

[woven wasp]

arms is faster than fury right now

[sly venture]

Seriously, I love sweeping strike too much. Can't do Fury

[woven wasp]

anything you feel is due to bad keybinding

[tiny dock]

damn, arms is faster?

[sly venture]

not true

but not always wrong

[tacit cedar]

Arms is fine, it's just setting everything up In the face of fury and ret blowing up packs kinda sucks. So when raids and m+ come out it'll do a little better

[plucky fern]

arms could be very enjoyable spec with just a handful of QoL changes but seems like nobody in dev team cares

[cloud gyro]

tell that to a 4mil cleave

into aggro and death

[plucky fern]

well those monkeys usually blow all their buttons in the first pack but then do nothing for a minute

[tacit cedar]

But to get the 4m cleave don't you have to set up SS, spam single target, get stacks, and then ravager for bonegrinder?

[plucky fern]

so far i beat almost any fury in overall but thats heroics so who cares

[cloud gyro]

you dont have to spam single target, its from any ability hitting 2+ targets

[soft dew]

In the end there is low chance you'll compete with a fury in the same key anyway

or get into a key at all as a dps

[tiny dock]

i don't feel it now but every time i try fury near the end of an xpac it's way faster

[sly venture]

But when u do 5 targets dummies oin Dornogal it's impossible to compete with Fury

[tiny dock]

my keybinds are fine lmao

[plucky fern]

target dummies are never real dps

[tacit cedar]

Yeah you get the stacks off MS, OP, slam and execute to build a huge cleave that NEEDS to crit

The needing to crit feels bad

[sly venture]

It's dps

[woven wasp]

unless you actually have diagnosed carpal tunnel, then yes its an issue.

[cloud gyro]

Is it just me or are damage numbers on many arms abilities super delayed

Like execute damage doesnt show until next global

[woven wasp]

but the "fury gives me carpal tunnel" meme has been self perpetuating for a long time and its just complete bullshit

[sly venture]

Reason for carpal tunnel is because Warriors are so boring so we have to click 3-4 times extra every gcd

[tiny dock]

yeah brother i'm not actually serious about carpal tunnel, it's just a tiring spec to play

[manic stirrup]

execute is just like this idk why

pretty unsatisfying

[cloud gyro]

cleave too

sucks

[tiny dock]

but if you're saying arms is faster than fury atm i'll just stick to fury lol

[woven wasp]

ive never had this issue and wonder if its people with nameplate addons or

[manic stirrup]

possibly

[cloud gyro]

nah it just matches the animation (which is very slow)

[manic stirrup]

with powerful enrage they’re the same speed

[cloud gyro]

MS is the only one that feels responsive, even OP is slow

[tacit cedar]

My ST for both arms and fury was almost identical with arms feeling much less effort for the same damage. It just gets weird in AOE and isn't as enjoyable. st Is still fun to me though.

[tardy yarrow]

arms has slower APM right

[sly venture]

maybe this sums it up, most ppl compare them aoe wise, ST i would always enjoy arms moe

[woven wasp]

no

arms is gcd locked and plays IFTK

[tardy yarrow]

iftk?

[woven wasp]

cs gives 10/20% haste

[tiny dock]

in for the kill?

im guessing

[tardy yarrow]

oh

[sly venture]

according to sims msot often, but depends how many off gcd abilities being used also which inflates the number. Prot Warr is like top 3 apm classes, at least in amirdrassil sims

[flat willow]

arms

[oak flame]

hello everyone ! where can i found the sims ?

[sly venture]

You can download it from Origin, EA:s client

[soft dew]

I don't think anything was published by Archimtiros yet?

[soft dew]

The sims 4?

[sly venture]

Yes

[soft dew]

Noice 👍

[oak flame]

D:

[sly venture]

It's on Steam also

[oak flame]

thank you

and do you know where i can found the sims of everyclass on wow too?

[sly venture]

I would love to have sims as well tbh

I don't know

[boreal quartz]

Simulationcraft.org

[minor kraken]

the embellishments for us Arms warriors on wowhead are the most boring iteration of embellishments that we ever had

[summer elbow]

is arms worse than fury? or is ok? cause i like arms more since I LOVE execute

[plucky fern]

it seems worse but not by that much
if you are not planning to engage with the hardest content in the game you are good to go

definetly not going arms for +15 keys

or smth

[summer elbow]

in which aspec is worse? sustained dmg? st? aoe?

[plucky fern]

also few little buffs to arms might pull the spec ahead

[plucky fern]

burst dmg is lower, survivability a bit lower

on sustaned aoe arms actually better

[summer elbow]

how about mass aoe and st?

[plucky fern]

st i believe arms is a bit ahead on sims

like 2-3% better or smth

[summer elbow]

in burst? like 10% lower?

[plucky fern]

cant tell you exact numbers on burst

but if fury blows all their buttons its probably second strongest burst in game

after unholy dk

but after that fury does nothing for a minute

[young pumice]

arite, what talents we thinking for silken court arms homies

[summer elbow]

i noticed arcane mage is doing too much dmg

[summer elbow]

then arms is better for more long fights?

Cause after i burst as fury i feel slow and nothing to press

[boreal quartz]

Was double shadowflame any better

[plucky fern]

depends of the content honestly, if we are talking m+ with coordinated group, fury doesnt feel that downside

you just do big pull with all cooldowns then chill or kill boss and repeat

arms will probably be better on moderate size chain pulls

[minor kraken]

ofc not lol

[plucky fern]

cause your dmg is not dependent of cooldowns that much

[summer elbow]

so resuming arms has better st, cleave and sustained dmg in the other hand fury has better burst

[plucky fern]

you are cleaving all the time

[minor kraken]

but the vers of compainship was a good reliable embellishment

staying 80% hp to gain stats doesn't feel reliable

[summer elbow]

honestly i like to shine at bosses and doing big 1 hit number

[plucky fern]

st for all warrior specs at the moment is kinda meh

esp in faster fights

[summer elbow]

this was a h i just did

im 560 ilvl

[boreal quartz]

Just make the dingus weapon then

[cloud gyro]

I tested 5 races and only tauren (female) has a 1 second delayed cleave damage animation

[minor kraken]

that's probably what's going to happen, but it's gonna take a while to craft cuz I want to do with aspect crest

[cloud gyro]

What is going on man

[minor kraken]

some guildies are already crafting embellishments

[plucky fern]

honestly discussing damage of fury vs arms is complicated and doesnt matter that much, its very close in overall with fury pulling slightly ahead if played well
the main selling point for fury is that its much easier, more forgiving to mistakes and tankier because 10% dr and more stamina

[boreal quartz]

Some guildies are making mistakes

[minor kraken]

no doubt

[young pumice]

200% true

[boreal quartz]

Arms is ahead

Fwiw

[young pumice]

you can embellish 590 crafted gear without sparks

[boreal quartz]

I know but that's not actually long term gear so i fully disregard it

[plucky fern]

i have two warriors one arms and one fury, same 585 gear
im doing the same overall in heroics but hell fury feels like a spec for monkeys, thats how easy it feels

[minor kraken]

like I might give in and just do wep craft in wyrm crest and then just recraft it with aspects but my wallet is gonna cry lol

[young pumice]

itll help you clear normal/heroic faster...

[summer elbow]

that make me play arms XD

[boreal quartz]

I think the play is to get the turnin for HC craft after the full clear

[minor kraken]

gonna need a 3rd spark to do the armor banding on a 590

[young pumice]

you dont need sparks to embellish 590 gear

for the second time

[boreal quartz]

But i plan on looting weapon from first boss in mythic

[minor kraken]

oh shit

[boreal quartz]

Yes it's just the enchanted crests

[minor kraken]

if it drops and i had the wep crafted its gonna feel bad lol

like srsly fuck embellishments this xpac

[boreal quartz]

I mean then you play fury

[young pumice]

exactly

[minor kraken]

haven't tried it yet

[boreal quartz]

Idk crafting is weird rn

Weapon is such a heavy investment

[wanton sierra]

yuge dam dam

[plucky fern]

wdym, i crafted 590 embelished weapons for about 5k gold each

[minor kraken]

but it's the best reliable ST embellishment for raid, keyword reliable

[boreal quartz]

As in it costs 2 sparks

[plucky fern]

no sparks needed just slap a crest on a blue item

it will be 590

[boreal quartz]

It's about once raid releases

I dont give a fuck about preseason gearing

[plucky fern]

im saving sparks for later anyway

[wanton sierra]

im spending all those weak crests, since we wont be using it on the season journey

and its nice to control your valorstones cap

veteran upwards gear upgrade wont use a single weakest crest... idk the names of them i just say weakest

[pine oar]

Sounds like we'll be using a crafted 2 hander with Ascendance over any 639 mythic weapon yea?

[cloud gyro]

So cleave bug only happens if:

• You play tauren
• Play fervor of battle
• Cleave doesnt crit

[wanton sierra]

xD

[cloud gyro]

Changing model with toys does not work

[smoky kayak]

you can run your own at raidbots.com!

[old urchin]

I know this is supposed to be the play for fury. Wasn’t sure about arms though.

[pine oar]

offhand crafted for fury, yea

[smoky kayak]

I'm in the process of updating the gear guides now, but short version

• double Duskwoven is ~0.2% ahead of weapon for Arms at 70% uptime
• double Duskwoven is ~2% behind weapon for Fury
• double Duskwoven is better in Mythic+ for both

So as outlined in #1237307555961634826, you have two real choices

• wait to see if you get an early Mythic weapon
• decide whether you wanna prioritize Raid or M+, and whether you intend to play mainly Arms (duskwoven), mainly Fury (weapon), or both (your call)

[pine oar]

Thank you for the answer!

[soft dew]

Great work as always Archimtiros!

[old urchin]

Hells yeah. M+ will be main priority this season so duskwoven is looking juicy.

[soft dew]

I'm goin to play all 3 specs in M+ and raid so duskwoven is most likely my best bet

[smoky kayak]

the main advantage to crafting a weapon is the early high item level, but with the first boss dropping a weapon and the vault, there's a good chance you can get one relatively early anyway

so it's all a judgement call - see what you get, and then make the best decision at the time

worst case, you make a bad decision, oh well, two week later you can make a new one; it's not the end of the world

[tacit cedar]

Idk If it's just hopium or not but arms I think arms will pull ahead when things start living for longer than 3 executes.
Or let bleeds tick longer than 15s

[summer elbow]

so im now arms.. fuck fury

[tiny dock]

i most likely will switch back

i always do

dabble in some fury, end up maining arms until end of xpac

[tacit cedar]

Same here from fury to arms. But world content as arms hurts my soul

[fringe moon]

Yep…sitting on a 593 weapon right now. Used cheap crests for low level gearing to 588

[tiny dock]

fury is just so much more explosive

but I don't find that to be an issue with arms later in the xpac

[summer elbow]

fury is burst.. then boring

arms is.. execute, big mortal strike

[tiny dock]

one thing I'm loving right now is how much CDs align with fury

i heard thats not really the case with arms atm

at least thats what mr critcake said in his lil interview with max

[glacial moat]

I like how every class got like a whole book of changes and warrior got nothing lol.

Not that it needed it, but it's still funny

[tacit cedar]

Fury is enjoyable because you know every 1.5min you get Big dam then do decent damage out of it

[woven wasp]

warbreaker got an extra 2yds on its radius

thats a change

[tiny dock]

huge honestly

[tacit cedar]

Hopium

[glacial moat]

I just want sweeping strikes off gcd. It's all I've ever wanted

Plz blizz

[burnt stratus]

OH MY GOD yes please

[glacial moat]

Feels so clunky

[tiny dock]

too strong

blizz would never allow it

it would feel too good

[queen silo]

For real. Blade Flurry on rogues being on GCD makes sense, it does damage when you press it. I get it. SS doesn't. Don't understand why it's on GCD

[burnt stratus]

or at least make the skill acutally do something when you press it

[tiny dock]

oh man that would be so nice

hit SS and it does an aoe or something

[burnt stratus]

I feel so stupid pressing it, my orc just hold his sword up like fucking heman

[glacial moat]

Like I dunno. WW does. Just make it cast stomp or something

[tiny dock]

he's just getting ready to cleave for the next 15 seconds man

[queen silo]

they can even reuse that slayer animation for reap the storm when you press SS or something but yeah. If they insist on keeping it on the GCD it should do something like Blade Flurry does or else why even GCD

[burnt stratus]

it could be as simple as a wide swing like cleave

warriors dont have any fancy skill animations anyway

[queen silo]

yeah true. Either would work. just do something or be off GCD. this do nothing and on GCD is real cringe

[glacial moat]

I get why they don't but it'd be nice if it was like

"Strike out in an arc for y yards, all targets hit take x% of ability damage done split between them for 12 seconds" or somethibg similar

So like meat cleaver but dif I guess

[cloud gyro]

do you guys cancelaura sweeping strikes for collateral damage or do you just afk for half a global sometimes

[glacial moat]

I press sweep and then go get lunch while the gcd comes back

[burnt stratus]

lmao ss gcd is so bad it FEELS longer than normal

[glacial moat]

Because every time you press it you get annoyed it's on the gcd

[burnt stratus]

I know it's accoutned for but it also feels like you're wasting ss duration lmao

[cloud gyro]

For example if you have 2x martial prowess, cleave ready and 0.5sec on sweeping strikes duration

[glacial moat]

Just cut it's duration by a gcd and it's the exact same.

I dunno why they haven't done that

[burnt stratus]

warrior dev has been on vacation for a while

[cloud gyro]

If you cleave in that spot its giga bad, but any other global is kinda bad too

Sometimes you can thunder clap

[glacial moat]

At least SB and IP aren't gcd locked anymore for prot.

That was terrible

[burnt stratus]

that's actually a great question, I'm stealth waiting for someone to respond

[visual fern]

Target count check

Rage cap check

Prio target or mass aoe (cleave) check

If target count/prio target favor MS, and you won't cap rage -> can wait

will cap rage > can clap

If they favor cleave -> cleave

[fresh tide]

it's not even that it's on the gcd, it's that because it's on the reduced gcd it fucks up the alingment of your other abilities

so if you use it any time besides prepull you end up paying back the other .5 of the gcd anyway

[cloud gyro]

2+

The situation happens often if you play demolish

I guess you can workaround it by using MS before

[sturdy flicker]

are our sims working for arms they are like up to date etc?

[summer elbow]

so slayer is the talent tree to go, right?

[nova marsh]

Yes

Don't bother with collusus

[summer elbow]

where is warbreaker?

is really blunt instruments better than warbeaker for m+?

[grave mulch]

is the 2hd axe the best option out of the crafted 2 handers?

[nova marsh]

yes

[smoky kayak]

weapon type doesn't matter

[nova marsh]

because WB is a small multitarget gain and a big ST loss

[smoky kayak]

idk about big, it's pretty close either way

[summer elbow]

and if were a mass aoe pull?

[nova marsh]

I mean in a mass aoe pull, wb is probally the way to go

[smoky kayak]

the bigger the pull, the more WB is worth, yes

[nova marsh]

But like....how often do we get that large pulls/

[smoky kayak]

the main thing about WB is it doesn't align cleanly with Bladestorm for Slayer or Demo for Colossus

[nova marsh]

Nothing really does

Which sucks

[smoky kayak]

its great if you like CS 😛

[summer elbow]

with anger magnament how often we have CS? 30segs?

[plucky fern]

for heroics atm i guess warbreaker is better

its all large pulls and bosses dont matter

but as soon as we move into keys, blunt is definetly the play

[summer elbow]

so we have now prio dmg with blunt

lossing some burst on aoe

[wanton sierra]

the main problem for CS for me is that im used to press WB coz its aoe... cs you must melee your target

so there is sometimes im not quite in range and it doesnt throw... but its minor muscle memory that i shall attend

[summer elbow]

im noticing with blunt you have more inn for the kill uptime

[wanton sierra]

yes indeed

[plucky fern]

yes, thats the main reason why its not too bad in aoe either, they changed iftk that its same duration as CS instead of flat 10

so if you have blunt you have 13 seconds of haste

[summer elbow]

more haste, more skills to press and more dmg in general

also the st gain for blunt is too much to lose it

[plucky fern]

its still less aoe damage than warbreaker, esp in colossus if you can align fat demolish on top of warbreaker

[wanton sierra]

true, as colossus is nice to get some single target, since we got demo and cleave to carry our aoe xD

[plucky fern]

but priority/st damage is just better than minor aoe increase

[summer elbow]

i want to have massacre.. what i can remove for it?

[plucky fern]

which build are you playing

wowhead slayer?

[summer elbow]

icyveins preseason slayer

[plucky fern]

move one point from bloodborne

probably the answer

[summer elbow]

ye, you right mate, thanks saved a lot of time

[plucky fern]

either that or bonegrinder, not much options really

[summer elbow]

skullpslitter is necessary?

[tardy hare]

Bsl had a 90% health requirement and everyone was running that.

[plucky fern]

its very strong so i'd recommend not dropping it, better start getting used to sks its here to stay

[summer elbow]

never used it before

[wanton sierra]

bring old sks back

i quite like sks, but i rather the old version

that insta consumes all tics

[plucky fern]

old sks is a definition of 'clunky'

[wanton sierra]

if u got that talent that would heal you if you bleed em targets, you would heal like 10 -15% ish

fun lil burst, but they massacrated my boy

[plucky fern]

you are not picking that talent in any remotely serious content tho

ip is just too good

[wanton sierra]

yes now that sks is like this, we wont pick that talent ever more xD

[plucky fern]

its good for delves tho

i pick both ip and healing talent w/e its name is

[wanton sierra]

man i liked the ignore pain buffed by colossus... big dmg reduction

[formal verge]

I don’t think I’ve had a dopamine rush like that than to see the enemy healthcare just drain so fast from that version of sks. I miss it so much

[plucky fern]

you miss pressing rend twice in a row as well?

was never worth it for me

and ms reapply

4 button combo to use old sks

[wanton sierra]

man spear of bastion should have 1 min cd, or an talent that would cdr it... demolish with champions might would be insane

[formal verge]

The clunkyness was never fun. But being able to burst an enemy or two was fun. Allowed us agency on things like totem in BH

[plucky fern]

more casino gaming, if it doesnt crit you sad

[warped ether]

I mean you ss charge wb tc and then sks

[plucky fern]

imo spear should stay dead untill a full rework of a skill

[warped ether]

20% hp gone

[wanton sierra]

yes but if you are arms, you know that we have an rollercoaster of emotions xD

[plucky fern]

im talking more about raid single target

[wanton sierra]

demolish parry!! x.x

[warped ether]

I only remember sks being a thing s 1 dragonflight

[plucky fern]

sks is off cd, you reapply rend, you press sks, reapply rend again, then you reapply ms which will not have mastery bonus and hit like a wet noodle

nightmare

[wanton sierra]

at 35% ms also rend it

[plucky fern]

yeah i remember doing vault as arms when sks was a thing, it was that only time when i didnt bitch about going fury

for me fury was lesser evil than sks

[warped ether]

S1 shadowlands sks was ass

[wanton sierra]

i love thunderous roar, im only talking about spear of bastion to try to change a bit... i mean, every warrior that wont pvp shall dragonroar

[warped ether]

Think fury used spear most of df

[wanton sierra]

i think it might need some love to make it at least decent

oh, i dont know a thing about furryes

i know only: you build rage to trhow rampages

[warped ether]

IMO I don’t think spear should be on the tree for all warrs

[wanton sierra]

good point

[warped ether]

Should either be a prot talent or a pvp one

[plucky fern]

remove spear add condemn

[warped ether]

https://tenor.com/view/shinji-crank-that-soulja-boy-gif-3198420354555994627

[wanton sierra]

goshh no, i hate the sound of it

how about swap spear to AA? xD

[plucky fern]

what is aa

[wanton sierra]

ancient aftershock... shadowlands power borroed

[plucky fern]

ah the fae one

it will be kinda the same