arms

[wanton sierra]

colossus nerfed now we all slayers? xD

[signal marsh]

I pretty much only play m+

Sims are kinda broken rn and bloodmallet rates dreadplate really high

Havent seen anyone play it. Not call to chaos either. Mb one or two with grieftorch. However ive seen quite a few on murlok.io using pips over incarnate idol

Im curently playing OCE and incarnate idol just cause of the massive statsticks

Id be replacing idol since not alot of ppl play it. So id be pairing OCE with pips, chaos or grieftorch. I guess im asking what would pump more. Mostly keys around the 13-15 level for fun with frinds.

[quasi torrent]

@sacred zodiac bälle

[sacred zodiac]

bälle

[severe dawn]

is there a bug with ignore pain?

or is the tool tip wrong

[livid cloak]

Tooltip is misleading, you can stack it up to the amount on the tooltip

[severe dawn]

oh it stacks

[livid cloak]

But I believe each application is 25 percent of the tooltip value??

I may be completely wrong on that

But it's definitely a misleading description

[severe dawn]

you have lik 2 sec to hit it again to get the stack

[livid cloak]

1 I think lol

It's dogshit

[severe dawn]

it really is

when did they make ignore pain stackable

[livid cloak]

The button is good, but the duration for stacking it is awful, idk why they don't just increase the buff duration to 20s or something

[severe dawn]

right make the buff longer the shit is going to be gone before i you hit it again anyways

you'll take the little 100K dmg well before you can hit it again

[tropic eagle]

Hey all, wanted to ask a bit of a silly question. Im pondering on HM vs regular Tauren warrior. Which one gives better numbers on paper? the brawn 2% crit effectivness or the flat vers?

mainly Colossus side of things

[minor gust]

Sim it

[boreal quartz]

Normal tauren

Crit dam % is sick

[tropic eagle]

yeah was leaning towards that aswel

[outer holly]

in terms of colossus, you cant really deny the idea of those giant moosehorns of the HM being 5% bigger

[old urchin]

Literally my favorite part of Colossus.

[rocky dune]

I mean if you’re going to race change, might as well full send Dwarf and not cut corners

Or Human

[minor gust]

Nelf supremacy never a question

[storm prism]

Dwarf is de way. Colossus + Avatar + Stoneform + Lust = BIG DWORF

[quasi torrent]

why not just play a large race in tge first place then

[sage badge]

Fat human, bis race

[gaunt owl]

gnome is bis

[nova marsh]

Na kup tirans look DOPE

Shame it makes my dps even more trash

If it was a smelly troll I'd be bussin

[wanton sierra]

dwarf bis

[slow saddle]

YES we be spinning

Bis race is WORGEN !

[vapid furnace]

can i just not pick either one?

both look ass

[hazy flower]

Mechagnome, velf, troll

Highest simming tww races

Atm

[olive nest]

You can probably level and just never put points into either hero tree

🧠

[wanton sierra]

damn i liked colossus more... best talent is the one that increase our size xD

[slow saddle]

ah wlel

being locked into a position for 2 seconds

[wanton sierra]

this!!

[slow saddle]

and having more cds that misalign is not good game play

[gloomy mulch]

anyone have a weakaura thing to replace my very outdated afenaarWA? :D

[wanton sierra]

you need to be tatical i guess.. is it possible to cancelaura like we do with bs?

[olive nest]

It’s so bad to have to do that even if you can

I know you can leap out of it

Not sure about anything else

[wanton sierra]

i havnt tried it yet... i heard its super fun gameplay... we shall see

[slow saddle]

i mean its just horrid

[latent moss]

yeah cancel it and lose all its damage

id rather die

than cancel demo

[silk spade]

sub to revvez

[reef glade]

[mental gazelle]

whats the best spell que window or "lag tolerance" to set for arms warrior?

[boreal quartz]

400 until you have a real good reason for it not be b 400

It's a complex topic that can costs you a LOT of damage if too low

[teal fossil]

whats yours

dont say 69

[latent moss]

i wouldnt go below 100+ms

[boreal quartz]

300

Lowered it cuz blord

Had me trippin

[grand idol]

I spam my buttons way to much to have it anywhere over 200

[mental gazelle]

damn this was what i wasnt hoping for a ton of mix answers haha

but ty everyone 🙂

[hexed saddle]

adjusting lag tolerance is much like adjusting mouse sensitivity in FPS games

play around with it until you find a level thats comfortable to you

[mental gazelle]

ty

[gentle relic]

silly question, anyone know why my execute no longer glows when target is executable?

[boreal quartz]

Prepatch change

[frigid lava]

Thanks to prepatch... just went past 3200

Maybe I will get to 3250

[ebon fern]

Are blade and ravager relatively balanced?

[frigid lava]

I think so... but ravager is more versatile

[dusty summit]

Think bs is more raw dmg cause you can do w/e the fuck you want during rav

(This is just purely between the 2 abilities, not including you doing stuff during rav)

[boreal quartz]

Ravager shits on bs all content imo

Just that slayer forces bs xd

[ebon fern]

i wanted to try dance of death with ravager, but the proc condition is just so shit

[astral stream]

is it possible to make a macro like

#showtooltip
/cast [known:Cleave] Cleave; Whirlwind
``` But for ravager & bladestorm where ravager still is thrown at cursor?

[ebon fern]

Ruined talent

[boreal quartz]

Yea sev

Sec

Swaps between Ravager / Bladestorm on your bars.
#showtooltip
/cast [@cursor, known:Ravager] Ravager; [] Bladestorm

[astral stream]

tyvm!

[ebon fern]

Dance of death should just increase the duration when you cast abilities for ravager up to 3 times, that would be much easier to work with, and way more effective, it might make dance a good talent

I don't really understand why they make talents that are just clearly not well designed, it's kinda the same with some trinkets, that just seem to be there to water down the loot you can possibly get. How did they think this would work out? Ravager lasts a few seconds, you have a few seconds to extend the duration of ravager, and the condition is only when a target dies, which at the start of the pull is very unlikely, and even at the end is not that great due to ravager only lasting a few seconds

[rare kite]

That would make dance a mandatory talent

[ebon fern]

Maybe, maybe not, either way, there really isn't an argument for keeping shit talents in the game when they can be improved. Especially a capstone

[compact laurel]

I'm sure there is plenty people playing that talent in open world, blizzard has to cater to many different modes in game, there are different BiS talents for raid, pvp, m+ and open world

[boreal quartz]

Dance works well on fyrakk and tindral

Raz too

Even sark

Echo also has merit in p3

[compact laurel]

I believe op was talking m+ wise based on "start of the pull" and "end of the pull"

[boreal quartz]

It's the same type of damage as CD in m+

It exists but it's also the worst time to do damage

End of the pull

[dull siren]

[waxen elbow]

[wanton sierra]

wait, i just noticed that slayer talents dont work withh ravager

[boreal quartz]

i wanna play more tindral bro

[wanton sierra]

how slayer feels, when fully leveled... how much can we reduce bs cd

[midnight mural]

[ebon fern]

i can understand lack of dynamist being a con, but empty gcd rarely occur? How is that bad exactly? Downtime is the death of gameplay

[muted drift]

anyone know what trinkets we are thinking will be BIS from the new raid?

[boreal quartz]

(we stopped raiding 2 weeks ago)

[midnight mural]

Still though... Tindral

[boreal quartz]

I did 1 on prepatch thankfully

And like 3 on fated

Skipped all flying

Just went full bossdam and it's done

[midnight mural]

yeah that works 😄

[boreal quartz]

Dont wanna pad on that i just want it over

[dusty summit]

If the boss doesn’t die before adds spawn

[boreal quartz]

I didnt do prepatch echo cuz guild stopped playing

Cant imagine it doesnt die insta if u bl early

[lunar vessel]

You can easily kill nelth without having to take portals

Tbh it's not really harder than HC

[nimble yoke]

because rarely occurring means it does occur

rather than never occurring

[signal marsh]

Imo bis race isnt even a discussion. Earthen have a 10% armor racial. Thats a very healthy amount of strength. I tried removing my talented 10% and lost over 3k str in my current prepatch gear.

[boreal quartz]

Earthen str is mid

[signal marsh]

IF that racial interracts with the warrior talent tree the same way. I dont see why it wouldnt

[boreal quartz]

It's not as good as u think

[signal marsh]

How does a few k str outweigh nelf crit? Not disagreeing, just uninformed and wanting to learn 🙂

[boreal quartz]

Nelf crit isnt the good racials tbf

Troll haste is rlly good, critdam% is sick

Also archi vommented on earthen being decent but not BIS

[signal marsh]

I rly have a hard time grasping how having a perma str buff, and a decently sized one at that somehow being outperformed by other races.

Perma well fed is pretty neat too.

And if it gives me over 3k str having 10%more armor now before the expansion is out, where i presume the armor value will be even higher then surely its gonna be even stronger fully equipped with WW gear.

It just sounds so good but id prefer not having to play a dwarf race. Idk why but i prefer a tall, more viscious looking race for my warr dps class fantasy. I also spend more gold than i want to admit making transmog sets ans shifting them around

[dusty summit]

even without BL'ing early, boss hits immunity by the time we reach 2nd add xdd

[boreal quartz]

Str is not that good for arms in wawi

Also your str value goes up a lot

So 3k is comparatively less

[signal marsh]

Tbh i havent and wont try the beta. Havent decided on arms or fury. I play what feels best one WW is here and when i have the gear to get a good read on all specs

Im the type of guy that doesnt even watch movie trailers cause i want to let experience form opinion

Always liked the arms playstyle better though so hopefully it performs well enough to not be forced to play the less prefered spec for the sake of being competetive

[gaunt owl]

its gonna be ok

both spec are in the mediocre side of dmg for now

[untold trench]

We will be high mid, either way, so dont worry about it

[signal marsh]

I feel like warriors always has atleast one period in every expansion where they absolutley slap

[gaunt owl]

in the season where its irrelevant you mean ?

or the last tier after too many buff again

[signal marsh]

As long as the class isnt bottom tier im happy. I just love the "bruiser" playstyle in all games i play. The only other class ive had genuine fun with was when the windfury build for enh was king and a short period where survival melee was doing good

Yeah theyve been kinda rocky lately wich is why it would suck if theyre bottom tier. I dont rly find anything else as fun, and if it is, whatever its been it has felt too squishy in comparison.

Im not in the top % of players anyway. Some mythic raiding and 3k RIO is enough for me with whats needed of me in my private life 🙂

And imo u dont need to play a minmax class to achieve that

[boreal quartz]

you can be garbo and do good dam

[signal marsh]

So @untold trench claiming high mid is good enough for me not having to look for a different class to play 😁

[untold trench]

Then why worry

[signal marsh]

Ive got adhd+bipolar. Its all gas no breaks and doing everything i can do pump 😅

[signal marsh]

Cause theres a line between playing whats most fun and being somewhat competetive. Its frustrating to put in a tonne of effort only to get absolutley stomped by whatever is flavour of the month. A high-mid pocket lets me play what i enjoy most without worrying about the class i play having to be carried through content due to lack of damage

If that makes sense

[untold trench]

At the level of play you are describing, you could take the bottom tier class and be fine

[ivory quartz]

at the level you described just play what you want

wow

[untold trench]

ZugZugZone brain

[ivory quartz]

[signal marsh]

A good example is a friend of mine that loves playing warlock amd always did well, plays well but when prepatch came he just lost interest cause me and a dk friend doubled his damage.

[ivory quartz]

prepatch damage is meaningless

[untold trench]

He as a warlock got that gapped?

[signal marsh]

Im a bit the same. Its not fun feeling like yure being carried

Yeah one example was in AA. I had 1,1m overall whereas he had like 600k. But i think that was due to multiple of his talents being bugged

I think he tried demo that run

[ivory quartz]

the difference between top and bottom classes will never be that large in a real patch, prepatch is just the wild west of meaningless damage until TWW drops

[signal marsh]

Yeah ik but the concept is the same. Its not fun being giga gapped

[untold trench]

prob should bring your lock friend into higher tier keys, where he gets to shine

[signal marsh]

Aff seems decent 🙂

Havent seen alot of locks in prepatch tbh. Gonna play a bit tonight

[ivory quartz]

looking at relative bar size between classes is just a really unhealthy way to view having fun in this game, and if you value the size of your detail meter more than the fun of the class you're playing, then there's your answer right there

[signal marsh]

I like a good balance

[ivory quartz]

when it comes to relative dps output you will have good balance

but its prepatch

its not real

[signal marsh]

Oh yeah i dont take prepatch seriousley.

[lethal acorn]

I definitely prefer casting on self (@player), personally

for ravager

[boreal quartz]

it has no upsides

cursor can do the same but also elsewhere

its just objectively better

[signal marsh]

Tonight im gonna do some mid lvl keys as prot and try to make a full dmg build 😁

[lethal acorn]

If we were robots maybe

But there's been times where my cursor wasn't where I thought it was

[boreal quartz]

?`?????

[dire hinge]

such as the rafters, yes

[boreal quartz]

open eyes

have cursor weakaura

many solutions

[rare kite]

get the weakaura that has a giant circle around cursor. it's so nice

[lethal acorn]

I have the cursor weakaura but 9 times out of 10 you're in melee range

[rare kite]

what does that have to do with losing cursor?

[lethal acorn]

You don't wanna pre-cast ravager that far if you can't spend rage immediately, usually

There's several reasons why I prefer @ player over @ cursor

[dire hinge]

they're more talking about making sure ravager goes into the densest part of the pack, while you as a player may be on the edge

but yes, @-player is perfectly fine (and wont cast ravager on the ceiling)

[lethal acorn]

Yes, but you usually have a charge cd ready or in melee

[boreal quartz]

what does ravager have to do with spending rage lmao

[lethal acorn]

Why risk the buggy cast

[lethal acorn]

It generates rage "lmao"

[boreal quartz]

so?

[lethal acorn]

So you don't wanna overcap?

[signal marsh]

Assuming in conjunction with cleave

[boreal quartz]

you cant spend all ur rage pre exe anyways

you just follow prio

rage doesnt factor into ur prio before exe

[lethal acorn]

Ravager can be buggy when @ cursor too

[dire hinge]

right, that's what im saying

@cursor can have drawbacks

[lethal acorn]

I used @ cursor when I got my CE: Sire Denathrius

Never again

[boreal quartz]

never ce again u mean lmao

[dire hinge]

so combative this morning

over a preference

[lethal acorn]

Don't project!

Right?

[thick kelp]

Ravager on @ player

[untold trench]

@ cursor

[dire hinge]

duck season

[ivory quartz]

civil war

[thick kelp]

Too many spears on a random lamp inside m+

[lethal acorn]

[thick kelp]

never again

[boreal quartz]

simply do not miss

[thick kelp]

https://youtu.be/i0qQSOcUuwA?si=Q7OjqzZiJE4DaicC&t=13 clip for reference

[rare kite]

best video

[ivory quartz]

[lethal acorn]

Easier not to miss when it's not an option to begin with

Objectively

[ivory quartz]

how many misfired ravagers X would result in an overall dps loss > than the cumulative dps lost of suboptimal @player ravager placements

[waxen elbow]

Classic

[lethal acorn]

You should almost always be in melee

and it's a 1.5 min cd

[boreal quartz]

if you have movement cursor can do better

[lethal acorn]

Maybe, I'd just like to avoid the buggyness with cursor vs server lag and other factors and such

When Arms wants 97%+ melee uptime on bosses usually

[untold trench]

arms want 100% '-'

[lethal acorn]

Ideally

But I'm accounting for if you get picked for get out mechanics

[untold trench]

[lethal acorn]

You DO know what + means, right?

[untold trench]

by your logic, then you could have wrote 0.1%+

[lethal acorn]

It's 3%

[ivory quartz]

what is happening

[lethal acorn]

I don't think you understand "my logic"

I presented an opinion and reasoning and they want to fight a strawman

[dire hinge]

to illustrate:

[boreal quartz]

i want to fight a boss with @cursor ravager

[lethal acorn]

You can position inside the circle, assuming no aoe, but that makes sense

[ivory quartz]

if yall actually want to attribute objectivity to something that is preference, the interesting question is not "is @player suboptimal", - it is. Its "how many inevitable ceiling mistakes does it take to overcome the marginal suboptimal-ness?"

[dire hinge]

for sure!

[ivory quartz]

basically what hrothmar just illustrated

[dire hinge]

the answer is it doesn't matter, it's free to use either one based on what you like

[ivory quartz]

[lethal acorn]

[untold trench]

smh, you non-pvpers should be ashamed of yourself

[lethal acorn]

I did wow pvp in wod, bfa, and shadowlands but fighting games spoiled me so I stopped pvping, fighting games are balanced as hell!

[muted brook]

is nelt trinket good for arms?

[untold trench]

Not especially good, just not bad - if you want a list, just go to bloodmallet for a generic one

[sage badge]

I don't use a macro for ravager. I press button, click where I want it to be.

[lean geode]

Hello based department

[untold trench]

I would respect that

[lethal acorn]

I just don't wanna see that green immersion-breaking circle

[dire hinge]

yeah make the circle brown im not a monk

[lethal acorn]

Facts

[copper summit]

is there a massive diff from arms best hero vs fury best hero

dmg wisse

[midnight mural]

@boreal quartz fight me

[quasi torrent]

L

(also L crowder format)

[gaunt owl]

L
(also L crowder format)

[ivory quartz]

L
(also L crowder format)

[dire hinge]

i had to work on that guy's website a few times at my old job, unsurprisingly he was very rude

[smoky kayak]

it is not suboptimal whatsoever, the only question is how bad you are at positioning

[gaunt owl]

make your cursor bigger so its easier to use the @cursor macro

[smoky kayak]

Just seems like a very biased argument - if you're not positioning yourself in a way that @player will hit everything, then there's an equally likely chance that you won't aim @cursor well enough to hit everything either

[dire hinge]

48x48 is weird at first but so nice

128x128 do exist though

[gaunt owl]

with how big of a resolution we game with its nice

[silk spade]

delete this

[dire hinge]

hahaha the cursor is as big as boss frostmourne

[wheat lagoon]

Always played @cursor, just open your eyes

[smoky kayak]

I always play with @player, just be aware of your surrounding 👌

[storm prism]

Y'all prefer Call to Chaos or Puzzle Box for keys rn?

[wheat lagoon]

Call to chaos

For me

[untold trench]

What if you are rooted, and you need to throw ravager to keep healer in combat?

[smoky kayak]

both works pretty well

[smoky kayak]

#pvp is that way
also Bladestorm

[untold trench]

@ cursor gang supreme

[dire hinge]

Wabbit season

[gaunt owl]

@cursor gang assemble

[storm prism]

Yeah I read that they were comparable on wowhead. Was wondering if one is more consistent than the other

[ivory quartz]

If there is even a single situation in which @player cannot be cast in a perfectly centralized position, then it is like by definition less optimal than aiming it, no?

[smoky kayak]

idc which anyone uses, but unilaterally calling @player suboptimal because you don't know how to position your own character is a wild character

[smoky kayak]

if there is even a single situation in which @cursor can fail to hit the targets, then it is like by definition less optimal, no?

you see how the logic breaks down?

[dire hinge]

did they ever fix the issue where ravager would chase random critters

[wheat lagoon]

You also want to be near your ravager regardless for your free cast MS

[smoky kayak]

I don't think so, but it's not really an issue in instanced content

[ivory quartz]

This is not a 1-1 to one comparison - missing @ cursor is an error of execution, not the capability of your cursor, @player not hitting an entire pack is not an error of execution in many practical cases where sitting in that position could kill you

[smoky kayak]

lmao what

how is not standing in the middle of the pack to hit everything not also an "error of execution"

you're just saying words to defend your misbegotten point

[untold trench]

Fire is under the feetsies of pack of angry mobs you want to hit. You can run into fire to drop player, but cursor dont have to run into fire to DPS higher

[smoky kayak]

this is an error of execution, not a regular expection of a player macro - purposefully stopping at the edge of the mobs is just playing poorly - full stop

[dire hinge]

thankfully ravager can move after its dropped, be that by cursor or player

[smoky kayak]

that's such an obscene impracticality

[ivory quartz]

If your ravager is off cd and the position you must stand to cast a "perfectly positioned @ player" is currently taken by a swirly or frontal, then you are wasting GCDs for that perfectly positioned @ player to be available, its not an error of execution, you can skip situations like this entirely by aiming. It is a limit intrinsic to @ player

[untold trench]

Well, it was the example given

[smoky kayak]

it's a bad example

[untold trench]

Meh, I wont argue - there are no mobs in m+ with area denial under em

[smoky kayak]

• it virtually never happens on the pull with fresh packs, which is when you typically drop Ravager
• many classes want to be centrally positioned to hit multiple targets anyway
• the tank is responsible for positioning, and can always move the mobs

just making up hypotheticals to support an outlandish claim does not make it any more realistic

[long beacon]

lol, im surprised you've given that guy so much response time, good for you

[smoky kayak]

If you're just going to run through hypotheticals, then how about the issue of standing on the edges of mob packs means half the classes aren't going to be able to cleave all of them regardless?

[untold trench]

That would just make @ cursor stronger in that scenario, either way

[smoky kayak]

it would make your overall performance worse is the point

mispositioning yourself to defend making cursor stronger, when it results in worse overall performance, is not a win

[timid kelp]

There was a timeline in The past where pre-pull/mid charge ravager was an optimal opener? Only leg that his argument could stand on but he's not using it. Fml shit debaters

[silk spade]

cursor is better, it's just more work

[smoky kayak]

cursor is more flexible it is not necessarily better

[untold trench]

If we argue from the point of view of "that scenario never happens" then of course it will not be an issue to argue for.

[smoky kayak]

but again, I don't really care what anyone prefers to use, calling the other thing unilaterally suboptimal when it's based on a purposeful and unnecessary misposition is a biased argument

[untold trench]

So far, if anyone brings up an example, the go-to counter is: That never or rarely happens, as such is not to be concidered.

[smoky kayak]

when your only example isn't realistic, yeah

you brought up keeping healers in combat man, sit down lmfao

[ivory quartz]

I don't even understand what you're arguing anymore, like you're painting it as some obscure hypothetical, are you telling me every perfect warrior is standing perfectly in the center of every m+ pack or every boss + add pack so that Ravager is hitting all of them immediately from @player? Because if I can present to you even a single situation where that is not correct, it is by definition less optimal than something that can be aimed

[untold trench]

No point to argue counterlogic

[long beacon]

this entire game can't be played perfectly lmao

you guys are nuts

[smoky kayak]

I'm sorry, I'm bringing up the obscure hypothetical when yall's arguments were

• what if you're rooted and need to keep the healer in combat
  and
• what if there is a ton of fire underneath the mobs (feel free to show me an example of that btw)
  oh and don't forget
• maybe there are frontals (because obviously "stand in the relative middle of a pack = stand in front of everything")

are you actually serious right now?

[untold trench]

If I wrote an example, you would simply dismiss it

[smoky kayak]

your examples suck

get better arguments

[ivory quartz]

Actually, the examples i brought up were a frontal, or a swirly in a central position on the pack, are you claiming these two things never happen?

[untold trench]

I rest my case

[smoky kayak]

You can't make bad examples and then cry because they're rejected

[dire hinge]

im just here to be the pretty one

[smoky kayak]

you brought up PvP in an argument about PvE lmfao

[silk spade]

more options to cast it optimally and get it off faster is better no? not arguing @player is bad, i use @player personally. But I feel cursor is just superior for reasons others have already stated, if you care enough to use it properly

[smoky kayak]

you're free to feel that way if you like, I never suggested one was better than the other or said you should use XYZ

[timid kelp]

Smolderon, ravager comes off CD while Ur running out of melee circle. You throw ravager from range on The global you charge in so The first global in melee can Be a melee ability and not ravager thrown at Ur feet

[smoky kayak]

throwing ravager from range eats a tick, you really shouldn't do this

[timid kelp]

Hypothetically ofc.

[gaunt owl]

stand in fire

and yell at your healer to pump

[timid kelp]

No I mean as you charge in. Like mid charge.

[smoky kayak]

yes, it has a high potential to eat a tick that way

[timid kelp]

If you use at player macro mid charge Ur cucked

[smoky kayak]

that's exactly why Fury Warrior's stopped using it pre-charge in Season 2

[timid kelp]

Ok. Shows what I know yeha

Didn't know that at all

[silk spade]

fair

[smoky kayak]

to follow up - I never said people "should" use either/or
I simply commented that the unilateral statement that "X is suboptimal" when it's based on a purposeful and unnecessary misposition is an incredibly biased argument

if one side of the argument is based on a mistake, the other should be as well

[ivory quartz]

Example of swirly under mob: The big circles in AV, or like any circles in a pack ever

Example of a frontal: snake men frontals in HOI, any dwarf frontals in Uldaman? Like the counter take here is that the perfect position is always safe, it demonstrably is not

[smoky kayak]

nobody ever said you should be standing in front of mobs to drop ravager

[ivory quartz]

But thats not the argument, the argument is @player's is limited by positioning which is not always available

[untold trench]

(his counter is that its the tanks job to make sure those never are problems for your midpos - it already been countered)

[smoky kayak]

you're just making up scenarios

[smoky kayak]

no I said it's the tanks job to move things out of fire where applicable

if the fire is so big you can't cleave mobs, that is a tank failure

full stop

[ivory quartz]

It takes time for things to move sometimes

[smoky kayak]

I also don't know of any situation where that actually happens in M+

like I literally don't know of any area denial in M+ that's so big you can't position and cleave around it

[timid kelp]

Ok, but which one does Revvez use? Cause thats optimal

[smoky kayak]

your frontal hypothetical is also equally biased, you can move around and in between mobs without standing in front of frontals

you're acting like it's a binary condition

• outside the range of ravager to hit
  or
• in front of frontal

[untold trench]

When the flame aclhemists in Nelth, as an example, midpack, does their little AoE on the ground - is one. But you can argue the tank should've moved to counter that. We cant make an example, that isn't countered by 'it rarely or never happens, if it happens it is based on a mistake'.

[smoky kayak]

that AoE is tiny lol

[untold trench]

El sigh

[smoky kayak]

standing in a position that Ravager can hit everything does not mean standing in the exact center of mobs

[ivory quartz]

Circle spawns in AV platform -> tank starts moving out of it, your Rav is off CD, though, you move to the edge to follow and cleave and wait for the perfect @player ravager position to be available -> you cast it. That entire time is skipped with aiming

[smoky kayak]

you're literally just making up hypotheticals

you don't wanna throw ravager while the tank is moving mobs anyway

ravager does not move immediately on landing, nor does it move as fast as mobs do - you will lose ticks

[ivory quartz]

he's only moving like 3 yards to the edge

you can just aim it there immediately

[smoky kayak]

also you can run parallel and avoid the danger

[ivory quartz]

thats still waiting

[smoky kayak]

no it's not?

if you're in melee range to begin with, there's no loss

if you're not in melee range to begin with, you already lost (and you're probably not casting ravager asap anyway)

[ivory quartz]

I don't know why you keep calling my arguments biased, I use @player lol

[smoky kayak]

I don't care what you use, it was never my argument

I made one simple statement
calling the other thing unilaterally suboptimal when it's based on a purposeful and unnecessary misposition is biased

because both can be misplayed

you can use @cursor and misaim it, just like you can use @player and misposition

likewise you can use @player and position yourself in a way that it will hit everything without putting yourself in danger, just like you can use @cursor to hit multiple mobs while staying in a different location yourself

it all comes down to how cognizant you are as a player

[ivory quartz]

Again, to prove one is unilaterally suboptimal than the other is an extremely low burden for me. All i have to do is present a single situation in which a perfectly executed @player cannot do something a perfectly executed @cursor can do. There is no incongruency between execution or skill here, purely capability.

[untold trench]

Told ya - tank could in theory premoved the mob around to other side of the pack - pre AoE, to solve the problem.

Aka: There is no situation where it isnt a theoretical solution that is possible

[smoky kayak]

you go ahead and find that situation then

[ivory quartz]

I have

mutiple times

[smoky kayak]

no you haven't, you came up with a hypothetical that has its own flaws

"what if the tank is moving the mob" - move with it?

[silk spade]

[wary raft]

[untold trench]

Mob is creating the AoE field, and tank is moving it, the mobs are following, but due to how it works - you can A - Cursor, hit the mob behind and the adds following. Or B drop the rav on the mobs following.

That is how I read it.

[ivory quartz]

So your position is legitimately that it is never the case that a perfectly placed Ravager perfectly centered on all available mobs via @player is unavailable at the time of it coming off CD?

[smoky kayak]

I made my position perfectly clear, you keep trying to twist it

[untold trench]

Argument is: all the situations where @ player couldnt work just as well, is because of other misstakes that could be avoided through better play. There is no scenario where it can fail.

[smoky kayak]

I made a simple point, and yall turned it not an argument of obscene hypotheticals

[ivory quartz]

But saying I cannot find a single situation where this is the case implies you think there are no situations where this is the case

[smoky kayak]

"what if, what if, what if"

[ivory quartz]

Well yeah, hypotheticals are pretty important when discussing whether the limits of something are optimal or not lol

[smoky kayak]

if they're realistic hypotheticals, maybe

[wary raft]

Doesn’t ST opener have you throwing rav ahead of your character meaning @player is suboptimal there

[ivory quartz]

Thats why im asking you to confirm you believe there is never such a situation

[smoky kayak]

no, it happens after charge

[latent moss]

why not just have it @cursor

[smoky kayak]

throwing pre-charge has a strong tendency to eat ticks

[untold trench]

Archi stated that the situation doesn't exsist beyond where it could have been avoided.

[smoky kayak]

I didn't say that and don't put words in my mouth

[silk spade]

you need enrage tho innit

[timid kelp]

Boss spawns an add that you want to cleave with boss (AV 3rd boss) boss has a large frontal cleave ability that is spell qued to land as the tank is moving The boss to The add to get cleaved. Ravager IS off CD. You cannot position Ur self next to The add or in front of The boss. You need to follow The boss staying behind it. The walk is long. You want to aim ravager in front of The boss so it doesnt fall behind while The boss moves

[smoky kayak]

you don't technically need to enrage before throwing Ravager, but given the choice you should

[timid kelp]

I did it. Perfect example

Sorry AV second boss

[wary raft]

I just assumed we were talkin arms kek

[silk spade]

oh this is the arms channel, interesting

[latent moss]

zhai in arms channel

[smoky kayak]

Yeah Arms players finally catching up to the intricacies of using Ravager

[silk spade]

fr

[silk spade]

lmfao

[untold trench]

Counterd, boss shouldn't be moved, but add moved in. Your scenario is without a BDK or DK, as such suboptimal and could have been avoided by gripping in the add.

[olive nest]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/patch-11-0-2-war-within-launch-patch-goes-live-on-august-13th-345733?utm_source=discord-webhook

Nooooo

Gone so soon my beloved Pre patch

[timid kelp]

Ok but we extending this to creating groups around @player macro now?

Thats next level 😂

[smoky kayak]

I mean there are a lot of comments to make in that situation

• it's a "long walk", but you have charge/leap and there's no real reason to move the boss since the add should die before the boss gets there (if it's really that far away)
• do you even want to drop Ravager there?

again, this is the problem with making super specific hypotheticals to support a case - there are an equal number of other hypotheticals to bring up in response

[silk spade]

arms o7

[timid kelp]

You cant charge cause The boss cleaves. The add does not die that fast on high level. And yeah you want to ravager

[smoky kayak]

I made a very straightforward statement and yall are trying so hard to come up with the perfect scenario to disprove it

[smoky kayak]

yes you absolutely can, I do it all the time lol

you have time to insta charge the add before the cleave comes out

[silk spade]

this is some fanfiction tier level hypothesis convo ngl

[smoky kayak]

also the cleave shouldn't be pointed at the add anyway; you're asking for a lot of things to go "right" (or wrong, as the case may be) to support this hypothetical

[olive nest]

o7 Godspeed arms enjoyers

[smoky kayak]

and the WORST result of using @player in that situation is that you use Ravager one GCD later

oh no, the horror

[untold trench]

Ya wont get an inch, that is for sure

[smoky kayak]

so you've got a triple layered hypothetical and the result if you press a button 1 GCD later

[timid kelp]

Id argue Ur asking for More things to Be done "right" just so you can play optimally with a non targeted ravager in this scenario

Making targeted ravager The More optimal play. Because you eliminate The need to turn The boss or need to charge before The cleave yada yada yada

[untold trench]

Told ya, BDK and DK, Zhagura

[timid kelp]

Yeha looks like it

[smoky kayak]

Listen, I made a very simple statement, largely in response to this image

• calling something suboptimal because it's based on misplay is a biased argument, because both scenarios can be misplayed

Yall trying your damnedest to come up with hyper specific hypotheticals that prove your argument isn't helping the case

I don't really care about your arguments, because I and most other players in here have been in all those situations and found ways to play around them

[ivory quartz]

Okay but thats not really what happened is it, I made a very straightforward statement and you tried really hard to disprove it. But my statement is just so verifiably true, the counter position has to be that there is never ever any practical scenario where positioning your player for a perfectly executed @player is unavailable, and that simply aiming would overcome it. Is that genuinely what you're arguing?

[smoky kayak]

I didn't try hard to disprove it at all, I've kept to my original statement

you two are the ones getting worked up about it

[ivory quartz]

Am i?

I feel fine

[silk spade]

/r/skyhold

[smoky kayak]

your responses have become increasingly antagonistic, so yeah, it feels like you're getting worked up

[long beacon]

im more impressed how quickly archi types lol

[ivory quartz]

There's only one person in this conversation oozing a defensive and antagonistic aura here and it is not me

[smoky kayak]

you know that's the second time in about 2minutes you've used the "nu uh, you are" defense

[untold trench]

Huh?

[smoky kayak]

I said he's doing something

• he said "no you are"
  twice

[rare kite]

man makes guides and stuff for a living, makes sense

[smoky kayak]

I grew up with computers so I learned to type pretty early on

[olive nest]

@ player gang

[ivory quartz]

Idk man what am I supposed to say when the mad person pulls a u mad? at me lol

[olive nest]

[smoky kayak]

I made it clear from the get go, I don't care what anyone uses

I've always presented both as viable options

[long beacon]

im a two finger typer lol

[olive nest]

Make it 3

-and I’m in

[smoky kayak]

but making a biased argument and saying "one is worse because you can misplay it"
while ignoring the fact that the other can be just as easily misplayed
is the very definition of biased

[ivory quartz]

My original statement was in agreement with Hrothmar that its preference lol

[smoky kayak]

I don't know what your original statement was because I wasn't here for it - I responded to what I saw

[ivory quartz]

you keep misrepresenting what I've said, I've purely spoke to the limits of the initial positioning, and not execution

[olive nest]

@player works perfectly fine in raid bosses, you know the only worthy content

[untold trench]

So far I gathered:

• Scenarios where @ player is better than @ cursor; exist
• Secnarios where @ cursor is better than @ player; doesn't exist
  As scuh, @ player should be the better option

[ivory quartz]

you responded to it

[smoky kayak]

I responded to this

[vocal gust]

Is there any thoughts from the community on Whirlwind vs Cleave for TWW?

[smoky kayak]

in which you unilaterally said it's suboptimal

and I based my comment off this example, which is a biased presentation
I made both of those things very clear and have not deviated from that opening statement

[olive nest]

150% choose cleave
Whirlwind is no contest

[smoky kayak]

Cleave is better WW, only issue is whether you (hypothetically) couldn't afford to talent Cleave, but that's not currently a realistic scenario

[ivory quartz]

In a perfect execution vacuum, it is - but the latter half of this statement is that practically both can wash out and just choose what you like, like read what Hroth said 3 messages later

[frigid lava]

I hate them trees.

[smoky kayak]

Yes, I also said about an hour ago that you could play with either just fine

not that the statement really needs clarifying, since it was already pretty common knowledge

[ivory quartz]

Okay but I didn't rebuff you lol

[smoky kayak]

then why are you bringing it up? lol

[ivory quartz]

???

[smoky kayak]

I don't know where you're going with this conversation

[wary raft]

Ok but what if that “ceiling” mob is casting on your group and the cast is only stopped by damage, and it’s immune to magic damage and theres an 8yd radius of insta kill smoke and there’s no one else in your group who can stop it (with damage)

[boreal quartz]

Kinda based

[smoky kayak]

/exitgame and go play final fantasy

[untold trench]

that could been avoided by the hunter using barrage to hit it.

[wary raft]

[ivory quartz]

You said one was better than the other
No i said it was preference
i dont know what you said I didnt read it all
here is where i said its preference
i said its preference too
ok?
where are you going with this

[smoky kayak]

wait

wait

wait

[smoky kayak]

HEROIC THROW

time to shine

[zealous lava]

arms

[wary raft]

SHIT why didn’t I think of that one

[untold trench]

Its above the ceiling tho, so not in LoS

the spin just brought it in

[teal fossil]

Is this graphic on wowhead soon

[smoky kayak]

if its not in LoS you can't throw Ravager in there anyway, checkmate nerd

[untold trench]

Nah, the spot in the ceiling is in LoS

but not the mob

checkomato

Imagine if blizz made that a thing... dont give them the idea, ok?

"hidden mobs" you got to freakin' throw pets and stuff after

[olive nest]

Blizzard please add back @target so we can debate that as well

[wary raft]

They weren’t too far off with that one LOS bullshit mob in s3 BFA seasonal affix

[smoky kayak]

I literally never said one was better than the other - you did with the declaration of "suboptimal"
For the third time now, you're trying to co-opt my argument as your own, and I'm honestly over this conversation so please just stop

[smoky kayak]

if the mob isn't los, then heroic throw, ez pz

[ivory quartz]

the first statement is you telling me i said that

[smoky kayak]

No, it was not

just stop

[ivory quartz]

?

I wrote it

[smoky kayak]

it's been an hour, I'm tired of this

[ivory quartz]

bro you just @'d me i was tabbed out

[smoky kayak]

I responded to something you wrote... directed to me

[ivory quartz]

ok but like walking away from something goes both ways

[smoky kayak]

just fucking let it GO man

[untold trench]

Arm, you wont win any points, nor get an inch. Just tap out. You can argue with me instead

[pale jungle]

holy christ is this argumnt still going?!

[wary raft]

https://tenor.com/view/im-tired-of-this-grandpa-gif-23168288

[smoky kayak]

I asked the guy three times to let it go and he's keeps coming back with "well you're responding to me! I tabbed out" as if that's something I can see? lol

[gaunt owl]

this is art

[smoky kayak]

Hrothmar for Skyhold artist

he can make all our graphics from now on

[gaunt owl]

be a chad dont use @cursor or @player be natty like @sage badge

[ivory quartz]

Guy begging for something to stop just cannot live without getting the last three words

[smoky kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/beach-mirror-aesthetic-reflection-waves-gif-17768137

here we go again lmao

[ivory quartz]

Im not begging for it to stop

[untold trench]

what are you begging for, I am so lost in the sauce, as it is now a personal grudge going on

[smoky kayak]

he's just being petty

it's over

[untold trench]

5min RIP

[long beacon]

mens 200m final just finished

lyles got 3rd

[teal fossil]

No way

He can go back to playing league now

At least

[boreal quartz]

I would like to add that unhinged is generally an argument pro @ player

However i do not wish to partake in the discussion

As i wont change my mind anyway

[untold trench]

Btw, non-ironcaly, having such art available for the newer player section is a great idea.

[untold trench]

What if I paid you 10mill gold?

[gaunt owl]

give me

[untold trench]

I give it to you, and you handle Phil?

[boreal quartz]

???

[zealous pivot]

so uh

[boreal quartz]

I THOUGHT I GET THE GOLD

[zealous pivot]

question

[untold trench]

Shoot

[zealous pivot]

how do i live inundates in hoi at 20

....

[boreal quartz]

Is that the add u have to cc?

[zealous pivot]

the miniboss before last boss does it as well

[boreal quartz]

Dstance ip?

Also use notevenclose to check

[untold trench]

Might also be a dam red% flask question. What is that .io site again called, that lets you pre-calculate this?

Notevenclose, Phil da man

[zealous pivot]

damn i wanted a lazy blanket answer

[boreal quartz]

Well itll show you

[zealous pivot]

i know what it is

that requires work

fml

[boreal quartz]

Is ip + ds enough

[gaunt owl]

blame your healer for shitting the bed

each time you die

blame the healer

[boreal quartz]

Based old man

[untold trench]

Lazy answer, be at at 100% hp, IP and SR - if that failed, use the flask. If that failed, well - time to use trinky and scream for externals.

[zealous pivot]

i really might just have to play fury here huh

[boreal quartz]

Nah

Defo not

[zealous pivot]

only 1 arms warrior has timed this at 20

[boreal quartz]

Just gotta check the site

[zealous pivot]

and hes korean

i cant measure up

[boreal quartz]

So?

Lolmao

Invest the time become the first eu or na arm to do it

[teal fossil]

Is it cowfarmer

Better be

[untold trench]

Gotta be

[boreal quartz]

Your healer will not get past boss 3

[untold trench]

(they already did tho)

[zealous pivot]

we will def make it past 3rd boss on fort

stop being silly

[untold trench]

So, you checked notevenclose yet?

I am curious what ya needed to do

[zealous pivot]

no 😦

brb fml

if i wanted a job inputing data i woulda got a job or something

[untold trench]

[smoky kayak]

according to the forums, you should be putting on a shield

[latent moss]

cowfarmer is fury

[untold trench]

I am shocked, but not suprised the forums would say that

[latent moss]

🧑‍🌾

[zealous pivot]

maybe heroic leap outrange angle

who knows

[untold trench]

I trust, rally and flask at the worst

[smoky kayak]

[untold trench]

this part got me

[teal fossil]

Yeah what is it with shields and the forums

Are they just living in the early 2000s

Or what

[untold trench]

Is this SoD?

[smoky kayak]

even in SoD you don't do that shit lol

not for mitigation, anyway

[untold trench]

But he says it so confident, like... everyone does that

[smoky kayak]

Yeah it's a common trend

especially on the forums

[untold trench]

If Phy damage kills us, I dont want to know about the rest of his group at that point - gotta be dead 3 times over.

Did he come with an example? That is a brainscratcher

[zealous pivot]

notevenclose is busted

its saying ip is a 1 mil shield

thanks for the bunk resource

xd

[untold trench]

Arms IP stacks up 1.5 times?

[teal fossil]

The shield trend is common on Reddit too

[untold trench]

What redits and forum posts are you guys reading ._.

[smoky kayak]

TBF IP is busted

[zealous pivot]

mine goes 437k supposedly

[smoky kayak]

the spell's tooltip value is like 4x that of the actual shield you get

[zealous pivot]

but i had to stack it 4 times

which like is extremely unrealistic

[untold trench]

this is after 2 stacks

[smoky kayak]

I mean just look at the tooltip value and then compare it against the buff value

[zealous pivot]

3 or 4 stacks

whatever we game fuck it

[smoky kayak]

ignore the stacking behavior

this is the spell tooltip

this is the actual buff

[dire hinge]

also big red banner

[zealous pivot]

oh man i didnt see the banner >_>

[untold trench]

Damn that Ortemis

[smoky kayak]

something about IP is bugged, idk what but the actual buff you get is pretty weak

[gaunt owl]

they didnt nerf just the rage but the amount you get by half 😄

[untold trench]

The value shown is a fully stacked IP, not a single use. Kinda weird

[zealous pivot]

yeah which is lame

chances of me stacking it

are like nil

[smoky kayak]

the actual shield you get is worth barely 10% of your health (even less in TWW S1), it's just garbo atm

[hazy flower]

It says up to

[untold trench]

so it is showing the max potential, not per press

[lethal acorn]

Thank you

I'm glad you're the warrior theorycrafter, you actually said what I was trying to say, even better than I did

[livid cloak]

Just bladestorm dummies

[lethal acorn]

Colossus prefers ravager, I think I'mma go colo

[prisma heart]

can i get a woot woot

[livid cloak]

I like bladestorm a lot, I think I'm gonna go back to it

Ravager is just better but I don't like it as much

[lethal acorn]

If you go Slayer, you can take BS in single target

[dire hinge]

how dare you have fun in a video game

[livid cloak]

Oh that's nice

Good ill do that then

[lethal acorn]

Yeah if you don't enjoy ravager, there's the slayer option, I personally usually like bladestorm in pvp only

[smoky kayak]

Slayer has to take Bladestorm; Colossus can use either, but Ravager is better atm

[livid cloak]

I'm also mildly interested in powerful enrage bladestorm fury, prefer arms

So excited for slayer bs and execute

Demo looks so aggravating to play in keys

[lethal acorn]

I'll be making the sacrifice, my undead needs that 5% size increase

[livid cloak]

is it preferable to sweep before bs now?

For the ms cleave?

Or use after for dreadnought

[lethal acorn]

Better for ms cleave with unhinged

[livid cloak]

That's my gut thought

Dreadnought is a lot worse now

Which is fine

Cleave big

[lethal acorn]

Shadowlands dreadnaught, my beloved

[teal fossil]

Df dn is the most powerful iterstion

[untold trench]

... what was df dn?

[lean geode]

Strong

[gaunt owl]

broken AOE dmg

[untold trench]

Hm, expected you guys to be more classy.

[outer holly]

I was really tempted

I feel good about resisting

[gaunt owl]

🥜

[untold trench]

[lethal acorn]

Felt more powerful in SL since Arms had less aoe buttons

[teal fossil]

Sure

[dire hinge]

Overpower (and dreadnaught by proxy) have been our top damage dealing abilities all expansion 🤔

in m+

[frigid lava]

not anymore

[dire hinge]

yee, talent rework gutted it

[winged fossil]

anyone knows about that?: execution doenst show any dmg numbers atm + executioner's precision doesnt give me the 35% buff for mortal strike oO what is this?

[dire hinge]

for clarity, Executioner's Precision is not a buff you get, it's a debuff applied to the target of the Executes

the damage number thing im unsure about, i'd disable addons and see if it continues

[winged fossil]

ah ok, thanks!

[dire hinge]

no problemo! it's a weird one

[olive nest]

@smoky kayak sir I believe you intended to put 11.0.2 to match the article

#updates-midnight message

[lethal acorn]

One of the main reasons I love arms over fury, besides the heavy hits and decision-making, is also the fact that you debuff them instead of buff yourself

[smoky kayak]

I'm sure the 11.2 changes won't be any better

[olive nest]

Lmfao

Fix my spec Ion dammit!

[gaunt owl]

he should resign

[smoky kayak]

not sure Ion has anything to do with the state of Arms lol

[gaunt owl]

he was there for too long !

he cant even math anyway

[olive nest]

Bro is leadership

Leadership takes the blame

[gaunt owl]

thats his responsability to make the game good

No spec left in the dust !

[smoky kayak]

True, we could be Windwalkers

[minor gust]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1230008337517514772/1255253788365688832/761040892970139649.gif

[olive nest]

Next patch WW actually owns doesn’t it?

Been hearing nothing but positive vibes from their end afaik

[gaunt owl]

wait til tuning make them irrelevant anyway

[untold trench]

Being melee makes it all irrelevant either way

[gaunt owl]

they are like Feral gamers

[olive nest]

Can’t wait to do Mists with full melee comp

[smoky kayak]

they got some good changes yeah, though it required a whole rebuild of the entire spec after like 4 years of being in the gutter

Arms ain't never been that downbad

[devout pewter]

so, at what stage are we now? we back, or is it over?

[minor gust]

its back over

[olive nest]

Over it’s back

[devout pewter]

ayo

[gaunt owl]

https://tenor.com/view/backstreets-back-i-am-back-back-mv-backstreet-boys-gif-16284357

[frigid lava]

dah dahdah

[rare kite]

playstyle wise definetely owns. best iteration of ww ever

[terse osprey]

I love getting to use Skullsplitter

So in ST am i using Slam more or WW?

Also Ravager or BS for M+ and raid?

[rare kite]

slam, never press ww in st

[paper turret]

Hey guys, just coming back to the game is there any good youtubers you wouldreccomend

for showcasing the hero talents for war

[silk spade]

critcake

[paper turret]

Aye saw one of his earlier for arms it seemed pretty negative is that the general conensus atm

How is the state of war looking from your guys perspective

[olive nest]

scroll up until you find the

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/761040892970139649.gif?size=96&quality=lossless

[teal island]

meh wrong forum

[zealous pivot]

[silk spade]

[outer holly]

Has beta channel finally leaked in to live?

[reef glade]

only 2 weeks away

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/761040892970139649.gif?size=96&quality=lossless

[outer holly]

ugh, speaking of I only have 10 days to finish leveling 5 more toons in remix

Still need a dwarf and mechagnome to fill out my warrior selection, finally get to abandon the belf once and for all

[vast helm]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1230008337517514772/1255253788365688832/761040892970139649.gif

[dreamy egret]

It only takes like 3 hours now

[outer holly]

yeah but that's 3 hours I could be spending doing something fun instead

[silk spade]

1 hour and a half

[outer holly]

like doomscrolling tiktok

[silk spade]

they changed some xp scaling or something with the prepatch

1-70 in remix is an hour and a half

[paper plover]

is whisper worth using in m+ if your the only one using it over chromatic essence?

[summer quartz]

I use whisper in M+ and switch to OCE in raid.

not everyone uses OCE in M+

[dreamy egret]

i cant wait to say good bye

[sage badge]

[dreamy egret]

this thing has caused me like atleast 150 deaths

and im not playing colosus

[tribal cliff]

I made top 100 in the world as arms! Thanks for all the help guys!

now I'm considering making a last ditch effort for the title, but dang that seems like I'm asking for a lot.

[dire hinge]

grats!!

[tribal cliff]

ty ❤️

[latent moss]

Demolish is a 2 second channel, and the Warrior is unable to move or use other abilities while channeling, similar to Eye Beam. A Colossus player will have to think tactically about when and where is optimal to use it. This is an intentional part of the flavor of the ability.

[livid cloak]

[thick hamlet]

15% ms damage and OP 20% damage seems rough, but im assuming this is normal tuning, ya?

nothing to doom about

i'm gonna doom anyway, but i wanna know first

[grand idol]

Slayer got big buffs iirc so it compensates.

[formal verge]

I’m p sure title push ended with pre patch

[reef glade]

yea titles gone

get em next tier tho surely

[latent moss]

colossus down bad

slayer good

[hardy olive]

Boy boy boyy did we just get nerf?

https://tenor.com/view/child-9gag-gif-no-noo-gif-18262281

[latent moss]

wdym

[gaunt owl]

Frankly, that's a skill issue

https://tenor.com/view/frankly-thats-a-skill-issue-hazzikostas-ion-ion-hazzikostas-skill-issue-gif-21595688

[frigid lava]

did we just get nerfed?>

[eternal vortex]

nerf inc on 13th

[wheat lagoon]

It ain’t that bad

Will still top meters if you’re good at the spec

[boreal quartz]

and no hunter in the raid

[midnight mural]

Hunters got nerfed alot though right ?

[boreal quartz]

I dont know ive been just doing balance of power

Not much raid

I should finish prepatch tho before i forget

[strong steppe]

The arms quest for hidden artifact appearance is up today! (Not sure if it is personal or not, better to share! EU)

[remote tusk]

is it still this method?

8 Heroic Dungeons to 25
Normal MSV
6 Heroic Dungeons to 35
Normal HoF
3 Heroic Dungeons to 42
Open Mailbox
70

[thick kelp]

u can stop after normal HoF

and open mailbox

[remote tusk]

thanks

[silk spade]

You don't need hof

I did msv then dungeons to around 34 and it was enough

I loot every xp thread and leave all xp tokens in the mail

[hallow turtle]

With 11.0.2 being on the 13th bringing the nerfs to MS and overpower. Will fury take over as the ST leader then?

[swift crown]

@halcyon breach @ every one Hosen Check?!?!?!?

[quasi torrent]

@legs

[dreamy egret]

Yeah and I refuse to play eye beam warrior lol.

[halcyon breach]

hosen dismantled and unequipped

[quasi torrent]

balls hacker

[halcyon breach]

[quasi torrent]

highly defined?

[snow adder]

Ait, a little question here. I'm back on wow from break after raiding S1-3 and i have noticed that a lot of people use 2 points in Deft Experience instead of Sharpened Blades and it doesn't really make sense for me or for the sims. Prob not a big difference at all but if someone could give a simple answer it would be nice

[solid laurel]

Blood and Thunder is just gone in TWW yeah? jk -- baseline now

[solid laurel]

That should just be for multitarget afaik. Single target you do 1 point in Def and take sharpened

[solid laurel]

Question: why aren't we taking TC anymore as arms? is my answer basically "because math"? It seems odd to me because wouldn't it be a strict DPS increase in our ST rotation? e.g.

https://www.wowhead.com/talent-calc/warrior/arms/DAOBUVFRFBiEUKSUUBAOVVBRVRAlUWFUEQCRBAA

(hand waving what I dropped -- Pain and Gain and Shockwave. I'm assuming there are better things to drop, but I just took out twho non-throughput abilities for ST).

If TC would apply rend (assuming it also does the initial rend damage -- the 87% physical damage) -- isn't that just strictly better to hit?

[late nacelle]

wtf are these

https://gyazo.com/984859a411464b8b18fc994857c2a2eb

just logged back on after update and found 5 of these

i didnt write them

anybody else

[torpid tide]

Does arms pump in m+ as much as Fury?

I know the ST is much stronger on Arms.

[slow saddle]

M+ arms is pamp

mby not as much, but it is pretty close as arms has a lot of sustained aoe with cleave

[boreal quartz]

Rend onhit is more dam

[solid laurel]

So TC doesn't apply the Rend onhit as well?

[boreal quartz]

The raw damage rend does (not the tick) only happens when you press rend

[solid laurel]

gotcha, thanks -- that clarifies

[weary tangle]

Just got back from a break after 10.2. Is the current pre-patch tree already the one were gonna get for TWW? Minus some number tunings ofc

[slate rain]

on beta is fury better than arms

i dont wanna play fury

[rare kite]

yes

[old urchin]

Me neither. But I also don’t wanna play eye beam arms.

[slate rain]

eye beam?

[swift crown]

Demolish is basically Eye Beam

in terms of how it works

[slate rain]

oh lol

well there is Slayer

[swift crown]

You say this as if you'll have a choice

[slate rain]

😄

[chilly mulch]

Probably the booster that was piloting your account wrote these

[late nacelle]

ayy i aint lame enough to have anyone log on my account aight 😂

[dire hinge]

nothing here, just the ones i've made
Are there any WeakAuras or Addons you recently installed that align to the acronym of "C.M."? Otherwise you're probably safe to delete them

[silk spade]

addons can do that

[graceful echo]

Does anyone know how to get s3 items in current season so I can change it with catalyst for set buff

[echo isle]

hi, quick question regarding rotation. On WoW it says something about execute phase...
https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/warrior/arms/rotation-cooldowns-pve-dps
Does that mean you just use that rotation if you have a boss or something with a big health pool which gets under 35% ? I havent played for a while and i am just curious

i am reading more things about arms then playing the game 🙂

[olive nest]

honestly same, always at work instead of Azeroth

[echo isle]

👍

[dire hinge]

that's correct, Execute phase is whenever you have one target that you want to start casting Execute against, which should almost always be 35% Health.

it's 20% or 35% based on a talent you chose, but as far as I'm aware it'll almost always be 35% for every talent build i've seen

[echo isle]

awesome, thank you !

[dire hinge]

of course! good luck out there, folks here are usually happy to help if you have more questions

[echo isle]

thats great, thanks. Just getting back into the game and i want to level an arms warrior instead a frost DK this time 🙂

[gaunt owl]

[dire hinge]

[latent moss]

1 point in deft is more damage than sharpened blades but is not a big difference

[storm prism]

Is it worth using Cleave in ST when it's buffed by Ravager/Bladestorm?

[quasi torrent]

lore stealer

[reef glade]

Can try to compare tooltip of that vs slam but I think u want to avoid that cause you might consume overpower stacks on cleave which I’m psure won’t come close to using them on mortal strike

[cloud crag]

How do you tell?

Is there any public sims?

[smoky kayak]

its almost like the same races are always strong for the same reason

Velf/Dwarf/Mechagnome are always strong at the start of an expansion, Human always starts out mid and rises to the top after a tier or two of inflation

[olive nest]

Nelf is bis

Can’t die to aggro if you can hide

[obtuse fox]

Yeah well, but can you... checks notes ... Hearthstone out of two M+ keys right after each other? Yeah I didn't think so!

[rare kite]

dalaran hearthstone

[hazy flower]

https://mimiron.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6CcZ6ti3g5exQ3q5cGdYsu

Its fury yes but its similar for arms

Basically the same

[cloud crag]

Thanks

[fading carbon]

any help to arrange my gems what should i focus on first and second my ilvl 519

more accuracy

[sacred zodiac]

sim it

should be functional for pre patch afaik

[fading carbon]

in stats weight right?

[sacred zodiac]

no, top gear

you can pick gems and stuff

or you just accept that regemming rn is an expense that probably doesnt do a lot

unless you want the sim practice

[fading carbon]

https://tenor.com/view/thumbs-thumbs-up-kid-thumbs-up-meme-brent-ramobjust-gif-19399510

[winged fossil]

Since I'm new to arms: do we as arms have certain haste break points? If yes, what are they?

[rare kite]

we do not, well not that we care about

[winged fossil]

Thanks mate 😊

[quasi torrent]

bälle

[sacred zodiac]

2€

[swift crown]

3€

[sacred zodiac]

@swift crown what pick?

[hazy flower]

[finite grotto]

How is orc for warrior?

[hazy flower]

Its okay - there are visibly stronger picks but also there are much weaker choices

[dire hinge]

good enough, and you look cool

[reef glade]

the green one

[finite grotto]

😎👍

[zealous pivot]

why

are we getting nerfed

[swift crown]

I think top middle

[arctic iris]

Because we are doing absurdly high damage

[fierce inlet]

my 480 ilvl fresh levelled character is EASILY doing over 200k sustained dps

we just too strong rn

[dire hinge]

dont worry too much about pre-patch performance

[slow saddle]

We arent gettin nerfed tww fixes that

[hardy coral]

tryna pick a main for war within are we shit?

[hardy coral]

never mind i shouldve read first

[sacred zodiac]

making decisions off of prepatch is very cooked

[fierce inlet]

True, either level something you like early on and wait for week 1 balancing to then level up a proper main unless youre happy with your commitment

That warrior tier set looks too juicy on a dwarf tho so im set war main

[sacred zodiac]

that is also very cooked

[fierce inlet]

How so

[boreal quartz]

HC week tuning

Ppl dont know what's good on the bosses yet

As they havent been progged

[storm prism]

?!

New tier set is GARBAGE

[boreal quartz]

They are talking about tmog

[storm prism]

So am I

That shit is ugly

The shoulders just murder an otherwise cool set

[boreal quartz]

I rlly like it

Lower section is bit mid

[storm prism]

I just think the shoulders are goofy

Sweet helmet though

[boreal quartz]

They could be a little better yea

But it bears sepulcher and stuff

By a mile

[storm prism]

I still think mythic aberruss is the best set we've gotten in a while

Looks sweet on my dwarf

[copper swan]

i'm upset it looks like helmets and shoulders are created by a different desgin team each time

[fierce inlet]

Its okay mate, not everyone has taste

[late nacelle]

not that i could recall , i deleted them yesterday not long after , i think it's fine now . thanks for informing !

[storm prism]

It's okay mate, not everyone is sensible or mature enough to voice their opinion without downing others

[south merlin]

All classes are getting increased damage in the coming update.
Arms got decreased MS by 15% and Overpower by 20%
Wtf

Tbh beastmastery also is getting a bit down as well.

[storm prism]

Warriors need to be nerfed. Along with Frost DK and BM hunter.

[south merlin]

True frost also got decreased damage

Arcane mage, elemental shaman
Are massive buffed

[storm prism]

I main mage and I think Arcane did need buffs but FIRE mage needs some huge buffs. It is in the gutter right now.

[south merlin]

Fire mage is now a bit low

[storm prism]

Nah it's worse than a bit low

Pre patch cut our ST in half

[south merlin]

Even last season frost was better right?

[storm prism]

For the most part yeah

Fire had a place in higher keys for prio and cheat death. It's also not wise to play frost on sanguine weeks.

[south merlin]

Are they willing to compensate the damage lost in hero talents? Or as always warrior will be the worst class to play.

[storm prism]

Warrior has never been the worst class to play

[south merlin]

I play it cause I like it, most people plays what get buffed. So I end up at the bottom of the meter

[storm prism]

They're very strong but community perception toward them is skewed

[south merlin]

I agree

[storm prism]

I think warrior will start seeing more play in keys now that they're moving away from affixes that warrior can't handle.

[south merlin]

But for example as arms last season u can't challenge DH/BM hunter/ Shadow-priest

Always when u have any of these 3 classes in your group they will beat your overall

Lock also

[storm prism]

But the only one of those you listed that were meta are Spriests