dont listen to him
#arms
daring heron
maybe give us a silence banner that lasts 8 seconds and has 2 charges
smoky kayak
they almost added skull banner back to Wars in the .5 patch
smoky kayak
maybe give us a silence banner that lasts 8 seconds and has 2 charges
Disrupting Shout!
ionic reef
Fancy
smoky kayak
rally should be 20% in M+ at least
ionic reef
Let that man cook
latent moss
is htat its shit
hazy flower
outside of oneshots
daring heron
in 5 man parties rally could use a boost yep
latent moss
in m+
smoky kayak
raid is fine, the nerfs were nerfs but they didn't practically change anything
smoky kayak
rally still gets used as much as it did before lol
hazy flower
but m+ it's trash
I dont know when to use it legit because there's no practical use for it
very often
latent moss
sl rally was a different breed
ionic reef
rally still gets used as much as it did before lol
but you wouldnt bring another warrior for one, when before you would
hazy flower
outside of specific moments
latent moss
sl insipiring presence
hazy flower
best you can squeeze out of it is some extra hp for tank
timber lynx
sl ip was nuts
latent moss
what sucks in m+ is shit like
mage mass barrier
being 2x as good
as rally
on a lower cd
smoky kayak
but you wouldnt bring another warrior for one, when before you would
I don't know that many groups ever brought a second war specifically for rally, more like Wars were already pretty good and rally came on top
just like most groups aren't bringing an extra DH specifically for Darkness... and that's probably a good thing
ionic reef
I don't know that many groups ever brought a second war *specifically* for rally...
It came down to dmg profile, and sometimes it was similar to another spec so you would bring one warrior instead of lets say DK or Rogue
smoky kayak
after you get past the hardlocked raid buff slots + PI + Aug, there aren't a whole lot of extra raid slots left
filling them with extra rally/darkness/raid cd probably isn't healthy for the game
oak quartz
Remove Pi and aug please
smoky kayak
It came down to dmg profile, and sometimes it was similar to another spec so you...
Yeah, though I think a bigger part of that is just general class tuning
ionic reef
Yeah, though I think a bigger part of that is just general class tuning
But when tunning is close, rally was a big factor
was*
smoky kayak
no surprise they nerfed all the raid cds
ionic reef
remove all raid buffs
I dont know how i feel about that
smoky kayak
raid buffs are fine, just bring back scrolls
smoky kayak
10% BShout or 7% Scroll is balanced enough I think
smoky kayak
I don't know if we ever actually killed it a second time
I think maybe we did, one more time]
ionic reef
We never returned to it
Good thing i got trinket/legs 🙂
Still in my bank
Imagine playing shaman, your only job is to DIE on purpose
to cheese a mecanic
I wanna know how the devs wanted us to play that one
smoky kayak
I was lucky, War was shit for that fight, so I did the first few dozen pulls, sat the next hundred, then came in for the last 10 pulls and kill 😬
ionic reef
After nerfs ?
smoky kayak
because a shaman was out that week or something
I don't remember when the nerfs were, but before HOF closed
ionic reef
Cuz before you could only bring a few melee, or they had to play color/staff shit
They nerfed it so you could bring 6 melee
Melee couldnt be targeted by Void/Storm/Wind colors
I entered with that 😄
smoky kayak
Yeah I really don't remember that far back
ionic reef
🐘 memory here
smoky kayak
helps that I got to skip about a hundred pulls too
ionic reef
First one was even harder than this
as melee
play with 10% or your HP and friendly fire enable
magic canopy
oh btw @smoky kayak good article i liked it
misty goblet
How strong is the legendary axe for warrior like is it insane dps gain to have? or is it just nice to have
misty goblet
Sad times k nvm wont start the warrior up again this tier
appreciate the response sir
magic canopy
if you want to play it in S4
highly reccomend you at least start getting BLP and doing lfr
to get the lego before they update the Ilvl in S4
misty goblet
Idk how the acquirement of the axe would be for next season that's a big reason i asked i wouldnt even really play it until next season
misty goblet
highly reccomend you at least start getting BLP and doing lfr
Is blp the shit for increased odds?
magic canopy
well do you want it in 15 weeks now where you can log and do something else
or 15 weeks at the start of S4
outer holly
If raids are on a rotation that 15 weeks suddenly turns into 45
misty goblet
Yea ill prob do it idk
dapper juniper
smoky kayak
oh btw <@61282228017041408> good article i liked it
Thanks
outer holly
I perfectly timed getting my axe drop with my guild crumbling
smoky kayak
TLDR <a:chatting:1036769769543704576>
TLDR we don't know shit until we actually see it
gaunt owl
we need alpha then
because we wont have the talent tree from the rework before right ?
astral yarrow
seems fair to me
smoky kayak
they don't like it when you try to make Arms good
minor gust
Arms rework to Legs when?
boreal quartz
never
smoky kayak
Arms rework to hands 👊
But no, idk yet if they'll release a public preview of the tree before Alpha... I kinda doubt it, but they have been sharing more lately, so it's possible
boreal quartz
well colossus can be indicative of what they wanna do
minor gust
Most likely wont see till alpha rn they really just focused on hero talents
boreal quartz
or it is turbo cringe and gets reworked
smoky kayak
Most likely wont see till alpha rn they really just focused on hero talents
most likely
I do know that there are extensive Arms changes planned
minor gust
oh rly?
astral yarrow
Thank god
boreal quartz
thank fuck
hexed saddle
boreal quartz
sock**
astral yarrow
Eiyr socks
smoky kayak
but their version of extensive
and our version of extensive
are two very different things
astral yarrow
eyir socks
verbal dirgeBOT
🧦
astral yarrow
i cant spell
minor gust
I would be more than happy with a DH rework than a rogue or retpally
hexed saddle
nahhh rogue and ret pally go hard
minor gust
I do think you can make Arms tree work with certain changes
hexed saddle
or rework it
minor gust
Make BS fuck good on its own and gives us ravager as the buff bot option
smoky kayak
Looking at Colossus alone kinda tells you they need to change some stuff in Arms to make it play nicely, so it should be surprising
latent moss
smoky kayak
I wouldn't get my hopes up for incredibly extensive reworks
gaunt owl
they don't like it when you try to make Arms good
watch me 
smoky kayak
their idea of extensive reworks is "move some talents around, maybe replace a few" - think more like the X.5 patch
not "rebuild the whole spec from the ground up"
gaunt owl
if we get something like rogue
copper swan
would take too much time if they have no ideas
gaunt owl
thats what we need
latent moss
arms rework in midnight
smoky kayak
would take too much time if they have no ideas
time is part of it yeah, and they've been very vocal that they're focusing mostly on Hero talents atm
halcyon breach
Doesn't need to get to the expac to have that title
smoky kayak
that's what I'm sayin - feel like I've been playing WoW: MID for years now
hexed saddle
TLT kinda goes hard
copper swan
i feel like i'm playing legion dlc's
boreal quartz
TLT kinda goes hard
wow tilt pog
half spoke
i feel like i'm playing legion dlc's
It’s all legion DLCs
hexed saddle
tilt is good
halcyon breach
It's so good that I live in it each raid night
half spoke
tilt is good
What kind of schizo shit is going on in ur bio
hexed saddle
What kind of schizo shit is going on in ur bio
xeos post
halcyon breach
ow2 silver junkrat
smoky kayak
I mean he is a certified Warrior yapper
hexed saddle
ow2 silver junkrat
half spoke
I mean he is a certified Warrior yapper
When u taking over the prot guides too to complete your triumvirate?
minor gust
something something Slam buff
hexed saddle
prot isnt real
half spoke
something something Slam buff
I’ve got a buffed slam for you right here
smoky kayak
maybe if Glad Stance came back 😬
smoky kayak
Glad Stance was fun because it was literally 5.4 Fury
half spoke
Fresh max level glad felt fucking terrible but raids just having 8 guys that could stance swap to tank was hilarious
smoky kayak
short TLDR for those who didn't play
- Fury was pretty balls for most of MoP from a mechanical standpoint (it was getting decent in Throne of Thunder tho)
- 5.4/Siege reworked Arms and Fury both for the third time that expansion, and Fury came out amazing - guaranteed Enrage/RB procs, smooth rage spending on HS, huge 100% crit burst windows, strong ST, ridiculous cleave, and Bladestorm all at the same time
- Towards the start of the WoD Alpha, Celestalon (then the most vocal class dev) said "we have no plans to change Fury, since it's really well liked at the moment"
- WoD Alpha hits, and they completely gutted the spec to the point we were spamming Hamstring for want of something to do
strong tendon
WHen was Draught of souls with 100% crit on recklessness. that was the best
half spoke
I would rather press no buttons than hamstring
smoky kayak
Glad Stance got added and it was the same exact playstyle as 5.4 Fury, just with renamed abilities
- Shield Slam instead of BT, Revenge instead of Wild Strike, Shield Charge was reskinned Colossus Smash
- Unyielding Strikes allowed the same kind of HS spam
same rotation - only thing lost was Bladestorm, but that actually wasn't a huge loss in WoD anyway
So basically you got to play what was arguably the best version of Fury again, just while wearing a shield instead of a second weapon
gaunt owl
its incredible that they did 3 rework in MOP
hexed saddle
so basically u asked for fury and they said we have fury at home and it was gladiator
gaunt owl
and left us in the dust now
smoky kayak
its incredible that they did 3 rework in MOP
the first two weren't huge tbf, more like extensive bug fixes, the third was actually a huge amount of changes
half spoke
its incredible that they did 3 rework in MOP
Now they just let specs suffer for entire expansions
How long has DK relied on standing in death and decay
gaunt owl
like forever
smoky kayak
Arms had a really cool slam-cleave concept
MoP was a different time, Warriors ate so well
half spoke
like forever
and it’s been conceptually fucking terrible the entire time 🙂
crimson charm
5.4 Was the best version of all 3 warrior specs
smoky kayak
Especially in PvP - Charge still stunned, Intercept was a separate button that also stunned, Throwdown was a separate stun
half spoke
Charge stunning is aids
crimson charm
Thorowdown was a sun, that didn't share DR with other stuns
smoky kayak
Storm Bolt was a stun that also did giga damage in PvE
crimson charm
As it counted as a knockdown, for some reason
smoky kayak
WARRIORS HAD AN AOE INTERRUPT
gaunt owl
prot almost had it this xpac
smoky kayak
Disrupting Shout, my beloved 
latent moss
we also had
half spoke
WARRIORS HAD AN AOE INTERRUPT
They still do
latent moss
mass sr
half spoke
Just play belf
smoky kayak
and Garrosh honestly could not have been built better for Warriors
halcyon breach
Just play belf
You know Belf hasn't had an AoE interrupt in eons right
smoky kayak
like that fight was insanely fun to parse on, because everything just clicked so well for War
smoky kayak
I think BfA, but yeah
half spoke
You know Belf hasn't had an AoE interrupt in eons right
No because I swapped to alliance 3 expacs ago
😦
half spoke
and Garrosh honestly could not have been built better for Warriors
Siege was great for a lot of classes. Garrosh was also nutters for frost dk, just press AMS during his whirlwind and he gives you infinite runic for the duration
halcyon breach
If they still had it, Belf would be omega busted with how many interrupts there are in most modern dungeons
smoky kayak
yeah BfA
halcyon breach
1.5 min for an AoE interrupt is not that bad
smoky kayak
Siege was great for a lot of classes. Garrosh was also nutters for frost dk, jus...
same with Berserker Stance
Stance dancing was mega tech in MoP
half spoke
Now we only stance dance to soak damage
Igira is prob the only boss I’ve touched dstance on
lavish prawn
Quick fresh arms question here, im pretty low geared atm, not aiming for super high keys later, what stats should i go for with my 2 embelish items, i know i can sim it, but my stats are pretty rnd at the moment
gaunt owl
stance dancing is fake now
smoky kayak
well you did then too - you had Battle for dealing damage, BzS when taking non-threatening damage to increase rage, and DStance to reduce threatening damage
smoky kayak
stance dancing is fake now
Yeah you don't really dance anymore, because of the cooldown
it was "dancing" then because it didn't have a significant cooldown, so you could just pop into BzS or DS to take incoming damage, and immediately swap back to Battle
I don't really care about Classic, but I will 100% play MoP again if it starts off with 5.4 design
latent moss
they should remove the cd or remove stances completely
outer holly
Quick fresh arms question here, im pretty low geared atm, not aiming for super h...
crit/haste will generally serve you well as you gear up
smoky kayak
they should remove the cd or remove stances completely
we talked about it earlier, but the issue with removing the CD is that you end up changing stances constantly
Which is fun for sure, but also a huge apm increase
lavish prawn
crit/haste will generally serve you well as you gear up
thank you! will go crit haste for now, later when my gear is better, i will sim it then 🙂
minor gust
Agreed Stances should feel meaningful or just not exist at all
smoky kayak
keep in mind, MoP was before Haste reduced the GCD, so while it had oGCD stuff like stances and HS, that was on a base 1.5s GCD
Whereas now, we have a GCD closer to 0.75 - 1s, and adding oGCD on top of that can get hectic in a bad way
I honestly don't think 5.4 MoP's playstyle would be fun with today's design; it would be extremely fast paced to the point of exhaustion after a long raid night
even though it was really good then
outer holly
thank you! will go crit haste for now, later when my gear is better, i will sim ...
Yeah Arms seems to have pretty solid guidelines for how you want to spread your stats
Fury on the other hand looking at my sims is like "Oh you got an extra 2k haste? I can probably work with that"
smoky kayak
It took a backseat to Fury that tier, but Arms had some fun stuff in 5.4 too - ironically Slam was the priority button burst button
and it had this neat (for the time anyway) cleave aspect, so your slam would hit nearby enemies
iirc Sweeping Strikes was limited to a 2nd target like it is now, for all abilities except Slam, which would instead hit all targets; kind of wonky sounding, but it worked out really well in practice
I wonder if they could reuse that concept in TWW 🤔
outer holly
I'd settle for SS being off the GCD tbh
fresh tide
They would never do it now, but I liked having both enrage and CS window
outer holly
Throw prot a bone and include demo shout in those patch notes
fresh tide
Demo shout on the global is so stinky, I hate it
smoky kayak
I'd settle for SS being off the GCD tbh
the half GCD isn't bad, but yeah idk why they haven't bit the bullet with that one
latent moss
we talked about it earlier, but the issue with removing the CD is that you end u...
ye thats an issue i agree
wasnt glad like
130 apm
or something
fresh tide
Like I get that demo shout is technically a rage gen button with the talent, but man I wish you could press it at the same time as threat gen
smoky kayak
130 apm
I think it was more like 95 lol, but yeah but that was because of Unyeilding Strikes though
hazy flower
the half GCD isn't bad, but yeah idk why they haven't bit the bullet with that o...
yeah it's not bad but it feels shit to press it in wb + hurricane windows
in aoe
smoky kayak
I agree, the half-GCD doesn't need to exist
outer holly
Like I get that demo shout is technically a rage gen button with the talent, but...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it off the GCD in bfa and worked quite similarly?
fresh tide
I feel like it may have been off the GCD at some point, but that could be a memory hallucination
smoky kayak
130 apm
So it's actually kinda hilarious; one of the prime reasons Blizz said they killed Glad spec was because of playstyle concerns - that it was too fast
But Glad itself wasn't fast at all, it was entirely because of this talent that basically let you spam HS (off-GCD) every 1.5s
outer holly
Yeah I can't trust my memory anymore, the covid saga broke my brain
latent moss
yeah
smoky kayak
So you would think they'd just... change the talent, right? make it -1 rage instead of -5, so there's less HS spam or something
but na, they used it as the excuse to get rid of glad entirely 😬
latent moss
i played some warrior with icc gear and fury is pretty fast
due to hc spam
hs*
and just random auto attack speed increases
smoky kayak
Yeah, the spec was pretty mid for most of Wrath, until ICC itemization kicked it into high gear
they had to normalize rage generation a second time after that lol
latent moss
ye rage generation is absurd
istg i could macro hs to everything and still sit at 60+ lol
latent moss
true
smoky kayak
You should try Cata; Warrior talents were insanely good
level as Arms though, Fury doesn't get any of its good stuff till 60+
timber lynx
3% evisc nerf btw
hazy flower
I cant do that on tindral with bombs
timber lynx
really solves the problem
gaunt owl
funny part is seing those MS critting for 1.2m
but Aug is so much on you to steal those
smoky kayak
3% evisc nerf btw <:keks:936231610850897992>
excuse me, it was a 6% nerf!
fair and balanced
minor gust
6%
timber lynx
im just salty sub is just sin but better in every way now
also pressing sectech and doing 5 mil damage on smoldy is a lil goofy
latent moss
funny part is seing those MS critting for 1.2m
bb hits for like 1.4mil
no aug
:xdd:
gaunt owl
MS FUCKING SUX
minor gust
spear diff
gaunt owl
mortal stroke
minor gust
🍆
gaunt owl
the 25% crit dmg is big
boreal quartz
MS FUCKING SUX
55k hit sir
latent moss
mortal stroke
petition to rename it
to mortal stroke
gives me a stroke
seeing a 200k ms
with a 40% tom
and cs
magic canopy
when you think you did godly on Smoldy
our dps
gaunt owl
i wish they just fully rework aug
to not be a support spec
give them tank
easy
scaly and stuff
boreal quartz
i wish they just fully rework aug
remove**
minor gust
the only reason why I hate Aug
smoky kayak
after all the new shit they setup to support it (even as half assed as it is), no way they're gonna rework or remove it
gaunt owl
after they remove parry then
smoky kayak
at best they'll just nerf it to the point where everyone plays dev instead
gaunt owl
combat log still not working on half the stuff for aug 😄
dry frost
too busy spinnin
The WW build is really fun until you get to a boss and you just tickle it
smoky kayak
WW build kinda fell off after legendary came out, but it is fun
dry frost
Yeah, I use it for lower keys mostly, but the damage is just not there compared to BS
smoky kayak
if you're doing lower "just blast" keys, it works perfectly fine - arguably better than BS if you're not setting up giga pulls
dry frost
I was curious though, does warbreaker/CS make you do more damage with leggo active?
smoky kayak
no, the debuff is whitelisted to only affect class spells
dry frost
smoky kayak
pretty much all class de/buffs like Enrage, Avatar, CS, etc were changed to whitelists in BfA, specifically to stop them from working with outside sources of damage like Draught of Souls or Fyr'alath
rotund ferry
pretty much all class de/buffs like Enrage, Avatar, CS, etc were changed to whit...
DoS on Arms
dry frost
That makes sense, it would be kinda crazy pressing CS > Beacon or some shit like that
smoky kayak
there were a few that persisted (I think Monk kept most of their global buffs until really recently), but I'm pretty sure the majority work on whitelists now
dry frost
I think hunters have some silliness they can do with chakram iirc but dont quote me on that
smoky kayak
That makes sense, it would be kinda crazy pressing CS > Beacon or some shit like...
yeah, that's exactly what happened with Draught and Moonglaives in Legion - classes like Warriors could more than double the damage of big burst trinkets while others couldn't
dry frost
I only started playing in SL and playing seriously in Dragonflight so I am def lost in all the history of specs and whatnot
smoky kayak
They tried to fix it during Legion by adding global class modifiers to each trinket - by Antorus, virtually every direct damage trinket had a -40% damage modifier on it for Warriors, but
A) it was too much work for them
B) big cooldown trinkets were still too strong, since stacking up Ava + Reck + CS/Enrage + other shit added up to way more than the malleus, while high frequency trinkets would need separate tuning to not tickle
rotund ferry
Imagine 100% crit on grieftorch
smoky kayak
Yeah, I really wish they'd restore the interactions, because the unfortunate byproduct is that most classes tend to want the same trinkets now - since nothing interacts with anything anymore, it's usually just "which trinket is tuned highest?"
and so everyone uses puzzle box, or everyone uses grieftorch, or everyone uses beacon; there are a few exceptions, but not that many
dry frost
Yeah that is kinda unfortunate, I am dissapointed that the balance basically only allows for a best, a sub par, and a unusable category
In both trinkets and talents for most specs
rotund ferry
Or be Old Warrior Soul and be used in next tier regardless of 40 ilvl lower
smoky kayak
it's kind of inevitable; if all you care about is performance, then you never really have a choice since "something" is always going to be best
dry frost
Bring back feelcrafting
rotund ferry
I just want for next expansion that items be better spread around
dry frost
Acro strikes on assa even tho -3k dps
smoky kayak
but for as much as a balancing pain in the ass it was, there was a lot of fun in different classes being able to maximize different trinkets - Warriors could do insane things with Moonglaives, and even the Legion bombardment Int trinket could be really good for them in ways they weren't for other classes
this expansion actually had some decent variety, but these days it's usually "this is the ST trinket for everyone, that is the MT trinket for everyone"
latent moss
Yeah, I really wish they'd restore the interactions, because the unfortunate byp...
and then for some reason
wings give stat
when reck and other similar cds dont
rotund ferry
I'd also want if it would be possibly to scale gear depending on bosses. Early bosses drop worse stats on gear or like worse trinkets and as u go up u get better stuff
teal fossil
I'd also want if it would be possibly to scale gear depending on bosses. Early b...
they did that
people didnt like it
rotund ferry
like Eranog ring and Icon being on 1st two bosses... Then u had Essence in 2nd tier on 3rd boss and Anvil on early bosses aswell
teal fossil
early bosses had lower ilevel
smoky kayak
when reck and other similar cds dont
mostly just to try to make them feel different, even though they all pretyt much do the same thing
teal fossil
but now everything is mythic track
latent moss
ret trinket interactions are pretty crazy since they stack everything that does interact
and leggo
smoky kayak
TBF, Avatar (by way of Torment) and Reck both have substantial effects on gameplay
Reck is kind of diluted by the fact that it's up like 50%+ of the time, but you can definitely feel the difference of when you do/not have it
teal fossil
The problem is that, you don’t feel powerful when it’s up, you feel weak when it’s down
It’s like dh with their 80% meta uptime in the past
random ridge
Cdr ruined our fun
fringe moon
wished they threw in focused rage into the colossus talent tree somewhere....
gaunt owl
we have focused rage at home
smoky kayak
I think Focused Rage might be a little too "big" for a hero talent
though it could certainly find a way to fit back into the spec tree
gaunt owl
see thats where you go wrong
you want an oGCD
like we dont push enough button already
smoky kayak
Yeah, I don't see oGCD happening again unless it has a fairly long cooldown, we stop filling GCDs, or take some kind of massive drop in haste (which probably wouldn't work for technical reasons)
smoky kayak
I wouldnt mind the GCD gaps again
Blizz has tried it several times, but it's tough because the most straightforward way of doing that is by limiting resources, which generally creates a bad feeling of feedback
like I want to press something, but I can't because I'm waiting on resources
minor gust
I would hate GCD gaps even if I am doing dmg it feels like im not doing dmg if Im not pressing buttons on GCD
boreal quartz
Blizz has tried it several times, but it's tough because the most straightforwar...
And also is exteremely bad considering how execute plays rn
smoky kayak
no shit, every single time blizz has tried it, the spec felt like trash, and they ended up ramping the spec up again over a series of patches
and they've tried it like 5 times
hexed saddle
maybe this would suck ass, but you could add focused rage but make it on-gcd
smoky kayak
Yeah, it's possible
hexed saddle
if u want to retain the slow hitting, set-up stuff
gaunt owl
FR was fun for 2 weeks because it was giga broken dmg on MS
hexed saddle
but still have "gaps"
smoky kayak
though they do like the idea of buttons having immediate feedback and FR... doesn't really
and on some levels, wouldn't that just basically be what Overpower does already?
gaunt owl
kinda
hexed saddle
yeah you're not wrong
gaunt owl
but still missing the CS amping MS crit % and dmg
smoky kayak
difference being OP has direct damage, and FR would presumably have more MS damage
minor gust
Make FR give you a Super Saiyan buff animation when you press it
gaunt owl
a big part of the legion Arms was CS giving you a big MS
smoky kayak
make FR cause you to grow +5% character size 🙃
smoky kayak
that's it, no damage, just character size
hexed saddle
make FR like shattered defences
nerfed significantly obviously
but just gives u big MS on the next cast
smoky kayak
so... FR just without stacks
gaunt owl
can have like chaos bolt the 100% crit
hexed saddle
just smaller numbers + guaranteed (basically) crit
smoky kayak
hmm, probably won't happen with the current Colossus design
hexed saddle
like say 20% increased damage per stack + 10% crit chance per stack
rare kite
can have like chaos bolt the 100% crit
i know it's not what you're discussing but i want this for fatality, scale like chaos bolt. that way it doesn't scale on just vers and hate
smoky kayak
also kinda devalues crit, but I get what you're sayin
boreal quartz
The mastery and tactian % node has to go IMO
smoky kayak
would you rather 1% vers and decrease dbts by 30s? lol
boreal quartz
I would prefer to have those 2 pointers do something fun but that's hard to do if you have to make like 4
smoky kayak
Deft is probably a little too strong, but with the current Arms design, you're basically always going to path into it anyway; even if it wasn't there, I don't see a world where you don't talent down into Bloodletting (and probably Battlelord)
boreal quartz
I would prefer to have those 2 pointers do something fun but that's hard to do i...
Like charge cdr or whatever
smoky kayak
charge CDR is interesting; I've always wanted a Bounding Stride like effect that gives you movespeed after charge
charging to where the boss was and then running to catch up always sucks
hexed saddle
oh my god that shit makes me want to rip my hair out
gaunt owl
didnt we had a sticky charge before ?
hexed saddle
its so annoying playing catch up because charge stops where the boss was instead of where it is
😭
smoky kayak
didnt we had a sticky charge before ?
na, bosses just tend to move faster than they used to
gaunt owl
but it was doing the worst shit in pvp so they had to nuke it ?
smoky kayak
unless you mean charge roots, which still exists
boreal quartz
You can also make 2 pointers that do fun things in the class tree, ie 1 point grants you a 2nd charge of stormbolt and the 2nd point reduces it's CD by a bit
Though youd wanna probably chose things that also work in raid
smoky kayak
tbf most of them already have decent effects; you could probably add more onto them though
Endurance Training is kinda weak and Armored to the Teeth is kinda boring
boreal quartz
Though useful tbf
smoky kayak
Wild Strikes is actually OP though, and Cruel Strikes isn't bad
boreal quartz
You can pretend to notice the swing increase so id argue that can stay
smoky kayak
it's actually a really good thing Arms doesn't use Spear, because there's a way higher opportunity cost to dropping Wild Strikes (for something like Shockwave or the equiv to Uproar) than there is with Cruel
boreal quartz
Remove spear in TWW 🙏
smoky kayak
You can pretend to notice the swing increase so id argue that can stay
might not notice it, I just meant in terms of power, it's a disproportionately strong talent
balmy agate
how can you see what stance you were in a log? i think i may have been defensive stance in a pull or tow
fresh spire
damn curious how they gonna mix up the tree in future patches
i say patch i mean beta
astral yarrow
how can you see what stance you were in a log? i think i may have been defensive...
if you dont switch stances throughout the encounter, it wont show which stance you were in
balmy agate
ah bummer
opal folio
Augury for the ilvl clout and has more value in aoe
smoky kayak
how can you see what stance you were in a log? i think i may have been defensive...
make a big WA for when you're in D Stance
the first week of DF prepatch I spent like half a raid in D Stance without realizing it - made a WA, never an issue again lol
hazy flower
@latent moss
going rise 29
dht 29 depleto
mage pyroblasted 2 bears
unluku
tab target
prisma bobcat
shy tide
i wish for them to delete the slam talents in the general tree
and buff the slam talent in the arms tree
and make it a choice node with dreadnaught
so it goes ahead in prio of OP in ST
epic prepatch SL rotation
shy tide
Gives OP charge
pliant jetty
zamn
full widget
Slam should just be deleted from the game
proud plover
489 rezan vs 496 augury
whats ya other trinket cause augury+rezans is what im running for pure st unless the fight allows good signet brand uptimee
sudden oasis
signet it is
proud plover
augury+signet for 5+ min fights and rezans+augury for lesser fight length
my signet is only 483 tho
sudden oasis
it seems reasonable excluding signet for short fight
but i don't know why top logs all using signet for 3min fight light volcoross 😦
dusty rune
For some reason my sim keeps wanting me to use Accellarating hourglass over Augury, is Augury just big RNG on the simmies or does the haste from hourglass mean that i dont have enough haste from gear?
proud plover
sims just love haste
inner wasp
what are the chances demolish actually has a unique animation
dusty rune
i love haste too, but man, it feels weird.
proud plover
what are the chances demolish actually has a unique animation
i hope it does a big left, right, overhead with a jump animation
inner wasp
i hope it does a big left, right, overhead with a jump animation
it being a standstill channel means they could make it super unique and cool
or it could just be yknow
fyr'alath
also slayer is gonna bring back legion execute phase, bet
stack juggy to 99 again
proud plover
doubt it will be 99 stack
inner wasp
it better be
proud plover
maybe a return of condem type exeecute
inner wasp
i want slayer arms to be bottom 1 dps until execute phase where we climb to 1st
proud plover
id rather not have all my damage tied to sub 35% again as fun as it is
because as peopl gear and fight length gets faster you lose exeecute time and that sux
inner wasp
because as peopl gear and fight length gets faster you lose exeecute time and th...
not a problem if our execute is actually ridiculous
hazy flower
why
unlucky moment on tyr
and
chromie sealed the deal
some1 pinged wrong chromie
and 2 of us went there
my nameplates r trash so I trusted some1 pinged the right one
xd
nova marsh
So dumb question
latent moss
and 2 of us went there
;xdd:
latent moss
3% in exe iirc
nova marsh
Yeah
It's a lot
But I thought it was like make or break ur dps
Like the difference between complete trash and okay
ripe ember
anyone got the rotation diagram for arms?
minor gust
smoky kayak
Why is the cat so mad lol
You'd be mad too if you had to play Arms 😦
opal folio
sage badge
Arms owns
latent moss
Arms owns
olive nest
tfw you are top damage taken from aflame as dps
minor gust
you just do it
boreal quartz
how do u live even
Idk if they keybind dispell is fine
gaunt owl
You'd be mad too if you had to play Arms 😦
Im always mad
smoky kayak
You do a good job of hiding it
gaunt owl
umbral sluice
Arms players are calm and collected
gaunt owl
I dont have the anger management perk
boreal quartz
I dont have the anger management perk
Spend irl rage on (desk) slam
nocturne iris
how do u live even
in what? M+? PvP?
gaunt owl
Clinch your buttcheeks
boreal quartz
Pray ur dwarf
gaunt owl
And pray healer find their dispell
latent moss
imagine if bitter immunity worked
boreal quartz
Only vs lock rarely iirc
latent moss
xdd
gaunt owl
3min cd 
Blizzard hire me you can use the extra braincell i have
Im so scared for our rework
If they even do a real one
red nymph
don't worry. They'll buff DH instead
No weapon range increase in colossal hero talents. I'm disappointed
gaunt owl
They shouldnt extend the range and instead make the hitbox of boss not clunky as fuck
red nymph
for some reason rogues with their tiny weapons have range extension and we don't
quasi torrent
They shouldnt extend the range and instead make the hitbox of boss not clunky as...
they should remove all long arms and just make being in melee not Vietnam again
half the classes having it just made it easier to justify being hard as fuck
rotund ferry
If they even do a real one
Is this true o.o ?
i know our tree getting updates
but didn't know we 'bout to get DH treatment
Give us 5 million interrupts, class buff, battle res, lust and top dps
rare kite
We have no clue about the scope of the tree rework
obtuse copper
I have a clue (my uncle is Blizzard)
rotund ferry
I have a clue (my uncle is Blizzard)
obtuse copper
Sry nda...
gaunt owl
We have no clue about the scope of the tree rework
Thats the spookiest part
Ans their communication on it make it look like a half baked job
steep osprey
I have a clue (my uncle is Blizzard)
That one uncle you don't wanna hug
obtuse copper
steep osprey
Surely they'll show Slayer today
How many hero talents have they not showed? since they showed colossus last time, I don't think they'll show another warrior one
obtuse copper
Oh are they releasing another batch?
Doubt it'd be warr in that case since we already have 2 revealed while shaman has 0 and most classes have 1
quasi torrent
Oh are they releasing another batch?
yes today is the day to see that warrior is hopeless and u should rr
gaunt owl
Hero talents are tomorrow no?
thick kelp
Just release slayer so we can give up all hope
hazy flower
Doubt it'd be warr in that case since we already have 2 revealed while shaman ha...
what about talent review
quasi torrent
Hero talents are tomorrow no?
bro maybe, idc
hazy flower
that's a poor logic
steep osprey
Doubt it'd be warr in that case since we already have 2 revealed while shaman ha...
True
quasi torrent
slayer gonna be shit anyway, unless it comes with arms OR fury execute rework
steep osprey
yes today is the day to see that warrior is hopeless and u should rr
rr?
quasi torrent
it literally can NOT be intresting
hazy flower
it literally can NOT be intresting
doesnt have to be
steep osprey
real
hazy flower
has to hit hard
gaunt owl
quasi torrent
doesnt have to be
u missed the point
exe for fury is a generator
hazy flower
nah I get it
quasi torrent
as long as that is they have 3 options
hazy flower
exe has different meaning for all 3 specs
for arms it's part of your main rotation, for prot it's a better filler in st and for fury it's a generator
quasi torrent
a: make 2 trees bascially (choice nodes being NOT choice, but spec locked)
b: rework either fury or arms exe (i hope its fury as spender with mass procs)
c: tree is boring as shit +5% exe
hazy flower
how are they gonna combine arms and fury idk
steep osprey
I think slayer should be for both rampage and execute for fury
steep osprey
they're also gonna rework our trees so
gaunt owl
a: make 2 trees bascially (choice nodes being NOT choice, but spec locked)
b: re...
Answer D for DN
warped ether
Someone put aug in jail
quasi torrent
Answer D for DN
b for balls
gaunt owl
Tbh its gonna be some boring get that5% execute dmg and shove that juggernaut up ya ass
Why didnt they call it juggrrnaut too
quasi torrent
Tbh its gonna be some boring get that5% execute dmg and shove that juggernaut u...
yes and i may just reroll
rare kite
Doubt it'd be warr in that case since we already have 2 revealed while shaman ha...
only thing is all pala trees are revealed and 3 druid trees. so i wouldn't be that surprised
gaunt owl
Slayer is such an edgy 2k name
quasi torrent
no one gives a fuck about us at that point
steep osprey
only thing is all pala trees are revealed and 3 druid trees. so i wouldn't be th...
could be the ones with 0 hero talents aren't ready yet and warrior's are
rare kite
exactly, hopefully it will be as good as scalecommander
quasi torrent
keep coping
quasi torrent
warrior has been getting worse
for 3xpacs straight
and 2/3 of our released trees are bad
so dugh
rare kite
keep coping
on the highest dosage
abstract hornet
Bring back Shadowlands warrior
cinder dove
arms/fury/warrior/inserthereclass is always destroyed in every single expansion we are on
latent moss
and it will take more than moving around some talents in the class tree to fix it
latent moss
arms/fury/warrior/inserthereclass is always destroyed in every single expansion ...
you cant seriously look at arms and think its fine
the spec is so flawed design wise
its insane
cinder dove
not fine but not worst one anyway
latent moss
and most of it is because of df talents
cinder dove
worst move was probably remove IP from rotation without a real other button to press since it was, by design, needed
latent moss
no the worst move was adding tom in the first place
it was cancer in bfa
and it still is
boreal quartz
IP as dps was degen and bad
cinder dove
ye but since you have it and you "must" use it there was no point in removing IP middle expansion
cinder dove
IP as dps was degen and bad
agree, but still it hasn't got a real replacement
clever crag
worst move was probably remove IP from rotation without a real other button to p...
Yeah I agree
I really enjoyed that rotation, the current one just doesnt flow
And its stupid af
You dont even consider rage till 35% hp
gaunt owl
worst move was probably remove IP from rotation without a real other button to p...
Thats a shit take to think it was good
I cant smh my head
You guys wanted channel ability and cursed shit
And they start cooking that with Colossus
Cant you let me handle the spec
rare kite
i so badly want warbreaker to be separate to colossus smash
cinder dove
Thats a shit take to think it was good
I guess it's personal taste, I enjoy arms and enjoyed it since it was made faster than it was before and i like rotation
we are not meta but we are not super bad either
middle of the pack
rare kite
has nothing to do with tuning
they gave us compensation buffs for the ignore pain change, actually gave us more dps
it's about using a defensive for offensive purposes, it's garbage design
gaunt owl
Arms was not a fast spec and shouldnt be
Thats Fury
And saying we are middle of the pack its only with lego and after all the buff
Nothing to be happy about
Do people that enjoyed IP being used for Am Tom even played the spec ?
It didnt felt right
quaint otter
it felt good to proc am during bs
gaunt owl
Probably the best cursed part about it
rotund ferry
i so badly want warbreaker to be separate to colossus smash
Perma resets on smash
SMASH SMASH SMASH SMASH SMASH
mint mirage
boreal quartz
In sls2 when arms was the best melee in the game you had some GCD gaps
Not many with wft but definitely some
For reference
Also this is almost full st build and still had obscene AOE
fresh spire
Bladestorm baseline good times
boreal quartz
Wb baseline
fresh spire
When you remember just how good arms was because it wasn't an execute spec
And its base kit was much stronger that execute was just the filler
Imagine arms now on sylvanas
It would be rock bottom by a landslide
I liked execute being current slam
Ment you owned all the time. We didn't burst nor ramp but we just did solid constant damage. As fight goes on and others fall you was rising up with your stable dps
Flat as fuck profile
astral yarrow
https://youtu.be/CWcEYB0u9Mg?si=XyS44y547lxuluxa
OPC my beloved
4 boomkins and 3 warriors and still had all raid buffs 😦
boreal quartz
Tbf what would they need in df
They have druid and hunter and 2 palas
Fucking interact with mouseover keybind
With focus gateway
Oldge
astral yarrow
they'd need a rogue and evoker
arguably 2 of both because both rogue poisons are broken af
daring heron
yellow class so strong
shy tide
jailer kill comp for echo was peak
3 warriors
feelsstrongman
now there is no way to fit in 3 warriors
2 at most
halcyon breach
Why'd they do that everyone knows warrior was weak and bad in Sepulcher..
shy tide
which tbh is fine
well warrior was middle of the pack later on
but had one of the biggest dmg boosts with tier
daring heron
Why'd they do that everyone knows warrior was weak and bad in Sepulcher..
pile on carried hard
halcyon breach
pile on
clever crag
Why do we still play this class
rare kite
stockholme syndrome
boreal quartz
Rally in sl gladge
rare kite
fr tho can't find any other class close to as enjoyable as warrior. idk why
boreal quartz
4000% HP
boreal quartz
fr tho can't find any other class close to as enjoyable as warrior. idk why
Charge goated
rare kite
real
obtuse copper
only thing is all pala trees are revealed and 3 druid trees. so i wouldn't be th...
Could happen ye
Do we know when they reveal it or will it be random ish?
velvet hull
Why do we still play this class
To suffer with our strength 💪
clever crag
Give pala charge and Im swapping
halcyon breach
Do we know when they reveal it or will it be random ish?
There'll be more hero talents tomorrow
They've started making articles showing what a weekly schedule will be like if they got new stuff to show
velvet hull
Oh Pala charge in Hero Talents would be huge
halcyon breach
clever crag
They could charge in on horse
velvet hull
Which I think would be quite the mobility for a plate wearer
Granted we have a leap lol
obtuse copper
They've started making articles showing what a weekly schedule will be like if t...
Imagine being alive to see Blizzard's roadmap and unironic communication era
halcyon breach
I don't know if they've made one of these each week, but there have been a few since they started announcing hero talents
Is cozy
halcyon breach
Ye soon™️
obtuse copper
Kinda odd how it's not really mentioned much afaik yet
halcyon breach
Roadmap said early/mid spring iirc
obtuse copper
If release date is gonna be earlier than usual
obtuse copper
Roadmap said early/mid spring iirc
And xpac date?
halcyon breach
Later summer iirc?
No specific date from what I know, but prob Auggie or September
halcyon breach
Wasn't DF similar
obtuse copper
Isn't it usually 7-8 months?
Thought DF alpha started in April
Xpac launch late november
halcyon breach
DF Alpha started 14th of July
halcyon breach
Considering the overall quality of DF was good, the short-ish public testing cycle seemed fine
Just hope they keep responding to feedback and make proper changes accordingly
(Please help warrior)
obtuse copper
Yeah probably partially because designing new talents was easier than making multiple new temporary progression systems to discard 2 years later
Hero talents should also technically be easier to make than the talent trees were
halcyon breach
Ngl part of me kinda misses something to progress, at least on the side
Nothing really over the top like AP
obtuse copper
Oh for sure
halcyon breach
But just anything that'd at least entice you to login except do weekly keys
obtuse copper
I don't like the emphasis on player power tho
Feels like everything is too focused on improving throughput
daring heron
Ngl part of me kinda misses something to progress, at least on the side
can progress 5 war keys
obtuse copper
So anytime they add content devoid of it, people instinctively don't care
tardy crag
Ap but instead every level makes u 1% larger
daring heron
was so close...
obtuse copper
Nerf warrio..
quasi torrent
fuwwy wawwiow
halcyon breach
So anytime they add content devoid of it, people instinctively don't care
Yeah it's a bit sad, but also hard to strike the balance ig since if there's any power to be gained, it will be degen'd and if no power at all who cares after the first day
obtuse copper
Ya but that's the thing right
If they can have actual progression
For a cosmetic system or smth
It'd potentially be cool
halcyon breach
Add mog to M+ score mayhaps
obtuse copper
Real
halcyon breach
Add mog to clearing the raid on mythic in current season mayhaps
obtuse copper
Should do that unironically tho
Since pvp has elite set
Crazy how M+ers do the hardest pve content in the game and only get a title
daring heron
we get infinite fun content
daring heron
automatically means we became worse players
halcyon breach
so true nerfed by blizzard
obtuse copper
we get infinite fun content
Who was it that shit on high end M+ players on twitter
Gromnak?
daring heron
it was him
for me the alternative is raid logging
i get so bored with that, nothing to keep me engaged
obtuse copper
Same but I found a solution to not hate yourself when raidlogging
SUPER SECRET tech do not tell anyone
🤫
daring heron
is it quit game
obtuse copper
high end pve would be dead if not for m+
Real
finite mantle
noway
exotic kestrel
they still need to release quite alot of hero tree's right
exotic kestrel
1 for warrior, 2 for DH, 3 for shaman 2 for hunter? out of the top of my head
atleast
ah 2 for mage, 2 for dk
halcyon breach
Ngl no clue which they've shown so far only know the warrior trees and that horrid rogue trickster tree
exotic kestrel
yeh in total i think its 15 still to come, no its even more, shaman and DH have had none released
quite alot still to go tbh
sleek timber
Not sure if anyone will know this
but if you get fyralath on 2 characters
do you have to do the full questline on both
sleek timber
ah ok
exotic kestrel
im afraid to play pally or dk alt
dull siren
visual fern
automatically means we became worse players
Actually true
Don't think it was a coincidence I fell off after nya/sod
When I did keys with passion during that timeframe and 0 keys in DF outside gearing for raid
daring heron
legion critcake was clearly much better than current critcake
daring heron
antorus critcake got 100s on like evrything
visual fern
I think competition is just better now + fights are cringe to parse on if you're playing them w/ the aim to win encounter
daring heron
i just dont care as much now as i did back then i think
teal fossil
And I raise you Mechs
is this the god comp
daring heron
and yeah i did more unethical things back then for logs
visual fern
Yah that plays a part too
crimson charm
That comp is pure meme
teal fossil
i remember the old boom bot
daring heron
i havent played or watched hs bgs for a while, great game mode tho
better than normal hs to me 
teal fossil
ofc
crimson charm
It's a great casual game
teal fossil
no one plays normal hs now
tft takes too long
and requires too much skill
compared to bgs
gloomy summit
rotund ferry
dire hinge
might have to race change, these Tusks dont hit as hard on a dark iron dwarf as i thought they would
wary raft
I really like them on tauren
rotund ferry
might have to race change, these Tusks dont hit as hard on a dark iron dwarf as ...
how long did u farm them ?
i think im like 2 years into farming so far
dire hinge
infrequently for like 5 years. I did it almost every week on 4 toons throughout all of shadowlands, but only picked it up again recently. I think my Rarity addon had it at something like 450+ attempts or something
smoky kayak
might have to race change, these Tusks dont hit as hard on a dark iron dwarf as ...
could try a different shoulder for the right side
but honestly not bad... for a dorf
TBH Tusks have always been cooler on the left than the right
dire hinge
true, plus that's your charging shoulder
prisma heart
I cleared SoO on five characters a week (extending lockout strat B4 skip) for three months and then my wife started coming on her characters and looted tusks on her 10th attempt 😵💫 and traded them to me
dire hinge
hell yeah still counts!
normal bay
@daring heron Whats the cool wa for leggo u have with dam numbers?
obtuse copper
I cleared SoO on five characters a week (extending lockout strat B4 skip) for th...
Insanely based wife fr
hexed saddle
untold trench
🫡
gaunt owl
ok thats so great
if i ever wanna take out my hunter from his closet again i can go get the mount
the pet i mean
stiff glen
the Deep Wounds glyph dosent work on Arms??? Huh???
gaunt owl
nop thats a prot glyph
stiff glen
so weird, our mastery is called deep wounds, its kinda a core part of arms gameplay
gaunt owl
it wasnt when the glyph was introduced
its not really core of our gameplay
its standing there
boringly
stiff glen
yeah ig its not core, but we do apply it to everything we fighty
seems weird to not let us have he glyph too
gaunt owl
glyph got ignored and or remove back in WoD
normal bay
https://wago.io/RgMjkZaLg
Tyvm ❤️
gleaming cosmos
Probably better to run Jugger this week on something like DHT I'd imagine?
Also looking to get Pain and Gain and end training, maybe drop a point in crushing and a point in cruel strikes?
dire hinge
basically yeah, or a point from Overwhelming Rage (for Pain and Gain)
but Endurance Training sorta has to come from Cruel Strikes
gleaming cosmos
Think I'm too used to the 130 rage haha
dire hinge
it's nice, but in practice you likely wont feel it, nothing in our kit blows through 130 rage, even execute caps at slightly less than 1/3rd of that amount
gleaming cosmos
I dunno doesnt feel worth giving up 20k ST (on sim) for DHT when we will do multiple pulls that are 3-6 mobs.
gleaming cosmos
Just checked single BS is 19k for me.
BS: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/xqDkNiNx34RNyhAWM2dqyi
Jugger: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2696CXmC99jF1TkPnh6n7b
gleaming cosmos
I don't care about AoE sims that's why I'm only simming ST, just asking for advice since I've been playing this spec for three weeks.