The flavour
#arms
icy mango
snow flame
hazy flower
not moving
snow flame
so I need to think tactically when to use it
hazy flower
I almost died just now in a key
latent moss
@gaunt owl maybe not
snow flame
but It'll hit so hard I want to use it on cd???
latent moss
gonna be great
latent moss
<@229446360284397570> maybe not
slayer waiting anggle
snow flame
this whole think is contradiciting
hexed saddle
yeah fuck colossus
snow flame
get this hero talent fixed asap
hexed saddle
that shit sucks
icy mango
slayer will save us 
hexed saddle
but TREE REWORK
versed nest
2 second rooted channel. It's Joever
snow flame
How can one use it tactically but it's gonna hit so hard I wanna use it on cd?
snow flame
that's kinda contradictory
smoky kayak
How can one use it tactically but it's gonna hit so hard I wanna use it on cd?
same way you do Fyr'alath 🤷♂️
arguably though, with the way that the stacking mechanic works, there is still some value to delaying the cooldown
daring heron
i knew it
smoky kayak
that said, 2s is not a long time either; it shouldn't be hard to find regular times to use the ability
The channel starts with a quick two-strike combo leading into a big windup into a massive overhead slam that cracks the ground in the affected area.
sound familiar? 🤔
olive nest
(Sorry paw) colossus already dead to me being rooted sucks
snow flame
that said, 2s is not a long time either; it shouldn't be hard to find regular ti...
ok but no one uses fyrakk's lego tactically
halcyon hull
Doesn't that exact animation already exist in game?
nova marsh
So the reworked class tree is awesome
snow flame
they just send it
nova marsh
But....LITERALLY THE LEGO AS AN ABILITY
smoky kayak
ok but no one uses fyrakk's lego tactically
I mean that's not true at all
icy mango
have they said if it's hasted or not
nova marsh
That's just....it feels a little even more creatitivily dead
snow flame
I mean that's not true at all
I mean if you look at the logs you can send lego on pull or later
it doesnt effect your dmg at all
smoky kayak
exactly
snow flame
so that's not tactical
smoky kayak
every single recommendation for the legendary is that it doesn't really matter when you use it, just use it when it won't get you killed - hence, not strictly on cooldown, and I'd argue that falls under the concept of "tactically"
snow flame
atleast the way I understand tactical
smoky kayak
tacticaly means, in a word, "smartly"
in other words, don't just send it because you can send it
versed nest
I'm on copium for slayer to give us condemn back in a way (I'm at dangerous levels rn)
olive nest
smoky kayak
obviously using anything, even Fyr'alath, on cooldown has a greater chance of getting an extra use and will result in greater damage potential
shadow ibex
yea guys this ability we will cast as frequently as colossus smash is going to hit hard
trust us
wide pebble
Casting execute casts slam, at reduced effectiveness
latent moss
cant wait to see condemn as a capstone and the absorb when u cast it as a defensive ability in slayer
snow flame
in other words, don't just send it because you can send it
hmm idk I still don't like a 2 second cast and I don't think most people will
shadow ibex
ability with 35 second cooldown is going to hit hard promise
smoky kayak
hmm idk I still don't like a 2 second cast and I don't think most people will
I mean that's fine, but that's not really the same conversation right?
latent moss
i just cant see how a 2s cast
functions with current arms
leggo already is giga cringe to use
nova marsh
The channel was always going to be a problem and still is
smoky kayak
it's Legion Rampage
latent moss
especially in execute phase
smoky kayak
basically the same thing
latent moss
when u are hard rolling with overlaps and hitting hard as fuck
olive nest
All 3 2h classes complained about Lego rooting and they just gave us a big F U with colossus tree
shadow ibex
make sure we auto during it
snow flame
I mean that's fine, but that's not really the same conversation right?
I think they are two differnt convos but inherently leading to the same point
karmic fiber
damn I was right
snow flame
which is most people don't want this and it's bad
smoky kayak
I think they are two differnt convos but inherently leading to the same point
if the same point is "I don't like this and here are the many reasons I'm going to come up with" sure
it's easy to find reasons to bemoan something you already don't like lol
snow flame
I mean sure but I'd rather them hear it's bad now
smoky kayak
if it wasn't the channel it'd be the root, if it wasn't the root it'd be the cooldown, if it wasn't the cooldown it'd be the damage, if it wasn't the damage it'd be the name
snow flame
then get overlooked
like this xpac
or perhaps they make it even worse
like they did with op
smoky kayak
Sure, but I think you need a bit more constructive reasoning than "bad because I don't like"
latent moss
from my perspective it's not even the self root
karmic fiber
personally my gripe isn't the being rooted or the channel, it's the fact that they've pushed a channel ability out without showing us the reworked tree, and if we're still locked in to ToM/AM being forced to use a frequent ability that stops you from spending rage is just going to feel awful.
smoky kayak
explain (to them, not me) why these things are bad, not just that they are - that feedback will go right in one ear and out the other
snow flame
Well my reason is that it's a cast and typically the blizzards idea of how it should play is not how it's going to play out
fresh spire
slayer is execute bot
smoky kayak
personally my gripe isn't the being rooted or the channel, it's the fact that th...
Yeah, a lot of this will hinge on what the reworks look like
snow flame
I will be able to give more feedback during ptr
latent moss
re arrangement
fresh spire
pray for huge overhall of class tree
smoky kayak
if ToM is still a thing, then its likely there will be some delaying of Demolish to align with it
snow flame
but for now I cannot imagine it feeling good
fresh spire
so many talents should be baked into the base.
latent moss
they just said it'll be a rework
The Warrior class tree will receive a significant re-arrangement in The War Within,
smoky kayak
if it's not, then it could be different entirely
latent moss
i dont think this means rework
hazy flower
isnt that just a fancy word for rework @latent moss
smoky kayak
depends on your definition of rework
hazy flower
whatever rogue got
latent moss
yeah but rogues didnt have an arms situation
nova marsh
I think it's worse then the leho
unborn canyon
still crazy that Colossus has no interaction with Avatar, an ability who's flavor text says you turn into a colossus, or colossus smash
nova marsh
Because you gotta keep in mind it's a rooted channel with cdr
unborn canyon
karmic fiber
and like I can't personally give feedback because they don't read the eu forums. I think it'd actually be cool if it costed a shit ton of rage to cast so you get a massive chunk of CDR/ToM value from pressing it, even if it is a long channel, maybe each hit could refund a big chunk of rage so you're not just sat there waiting for auto attacks before you can press buttons again
latent moss
my issue with it
nova marsh
Meaning it's probally very easy to miss casts on that alone
shadow ibex
being rooted every 35 seconds sounds ass
fresh spire
blood and thunder baseline for arms with thunder clap.
Zerker rage baseline all specs
slam damage points bye bye make it baseline
so much wasted points on class tree rn
latent moss
is that it's a 2s long channel on an already fast spec that wants to spend every single global on a spender
fresh spire
boring points ishould say
fresh spire
armor node followed into a strength from armor node. pala gets that in one node.
smoky kayak
is that it's a 2s long channel on an already fast spec that wants to spend every...
Well, Arms doesn't really spend every global on spenders
karmic fiber
ye but let's assume it's hasted, it's going to be like a 1.4-1.6s channel in reasonable gear. I really don't think that's an issue unless you're a melee brain like me and spam adadad while doing ur rotation
hazy flower
blood and thunder baseline for arms with thunder clap.
Zerker rage baseline all ...
bounding stride removed and put baseline
smoky kayak
but again, I'd file that under "we need to see the full changes first"
fresh spire
bounding stride removed and put baseline
real
nova marsh
This is literally the lego but more often and I think it's just such an odd design choice
latent moss
the fact that arms doesn't spend every global on spenders is because our spender outside of exe phase is dogshit and overpower is overtuned
latent moss
once we hit exe phase u just spam exe / ms
smoky kayak
also if AM/ToM emphasis were lessened, we'd care a lot less about that anyway
so again, we don't know without seeing more of this alluded to rework
unborn canyon
its just odd that the tree has no interaction with the abilities related to being a Colossus, like Avatar, which says you become one in the flavor text, or colossus smash. It really feels like the person who wrote it didn't know those abilities existed
latent moss
i refuse to believe tom is still not removed
2 years
of the worst design imaginable
it only got worse in 10.0.5
shadow ibex
i dont think our spec tree gonna get much
smoky kayak
"worst design imaginable" is a bit of a stretch - clearly you never played BC Rampage 😆
latent moss
it is the worst design in df by far
tired pilot
i dont think our spec tree gonna get much
i mean any movement would be solid
smoky kayak
its just odd that the tree has no interaction with the abilities related to bein...
hard to do when you gotta design for Arms and Prot together 😦
tired pilot
cause if theyre moving shockwave that means something will have to go in its place
hexed saddle
it wouldnt be bad if arms still played slowly
unborn canyon
both have avatar
snow flame
"worst design imaginable" is a bit of a stretch - clearly you never played BC Ra...
I will come up with reasons but I am worried becuase the devs haven't shown great signs of warrior design
unborn canyon
could at least make it interact with avatar
snow flame
that's all I can say atm
smoky kayak
ye but let's assume it's hasted, it's going to be like a 1.4-1.6s channel in rea...
even 2s really isn't a problem, that's basically Legion Rampage gameplay
shadow ibex
it wouldnt be bad if arms still played slowly
i would take EP speed
latent moss
it wouldnt be bad if arms still played slowly
they fucked up big time with df and warriors
arms was so fun in 9.1
shadow ibex
er siege of daz actually
tired pilot
it wouldnt be bad if arms still played slowly
ya kinda this, if theres downtime then channel aint that bad
shadow ibex
siege of daz arms speed
smoky kayak
it wouldnt be bad if arms still played slowly
Blizz has never been able to nail that design, turns out people don't like slow gameplay lol
hexed saddle
Blizz has never been able to nail that design, turns out people don't like slow ...
yeah its a weird balance to strike
dire hinge
[wait for resources]
smoky kayak
yeah, slow is usually achieved by limiting resources, which feels horrible if you end up starved
torn osprey
even 2s really isn't a problem, that's basically Legion Rampage gameplay
What talent was that back in legion
snow flame
yeah its a weird balance to strike
I mean no one likes tom and it still exist so
hexed saddle
I mean no one likes tom and it still exist so
thats not true actually, prior to like
this tier
or dragonflight?
idk
people were begging for it
tired pilot
pooling gameplay would be very neat for arms if designed correctly
karmic fiber
even 2s really isn't a problem, that's basically Legion Rampage gameplay
ye I agree, I think people are massively blowing it out of proportion. I'm just gonna hold my opinions on it until the beta goes live at this point since I genuinely believe it'll be decent if they actually give us an alternative to ToM that doesn't suck. (or they just delete it)
smoky kayak
Yeah, this narrative that everyone hates ToM is really odd- it was pretty celebrated when it was added
hexed saddle
no one understood the only reason tom "felt good" was because u had 100% haste natty
smoky kayak
feels like a very "echo chamber" kind of sentiment
dire hinge
it's also very passive, i forget it's there half the time
fresh spire
Yeah, this narrative that everyone hates ToM is really odd- it was pretty celebr...
until you see the chaos it causes with rage spending>op early tier to doing some degen shit like IP
shadow ibex
thats not true actually, prior to like
ever since the OP changes in like 10.0.5 its been a cosmetic weak aura p much
smoky kayak
yes, some of the more vocal people in here dislike ToM and it's a popular subject among them
but I'm not really sure that equates to everyone hates it
tired pilot
tom is test of might right?
dire hinge
correct yeah
tired pilot
wasnt that talent really liked in bfa?
nova marsh
We won't see shit till maybe apirl
smoky kayak
until you see the chaos it causes with rage spending>op early tier to doing some...
TBF IP wasn't in at the start of DF either
tired pilot
i remember loving it alot actually
shadow ibex
we've had it for 2 expansions and for like 75% of them its just been a thing there that wasn't up when colossus smash was
except when it overlapped
karmic fiber
I'm indifferent to ToM, it's almost the same as FW for unholy which is what I rerolled off from abberrus, except it doesn't matter when it desyncs from your cds since you are in cs or ToM almost all the time
smoky kayak
I think it's more a matter of general unhappiness with the state of Arms overall, and trying to find something specific to blame it on
shadow ibex
i cant find a way to care about it either way because its just there and doesnt affect anything
smoky kayak
has led to bemoaning basically everything about Arms
fresh spire
I think it's more a matter of general unhappiness with the state of Arms overall...
i blame op
shadow ibex
which to me is pretty big sign of a bad talent
fresh spire
op is too op
smoky kayak
whether it's ToM, OP, Slam, Execute, Jugg, or otherwise
dire hinge
wasnt that talent really liked in bfa?
it was, i can't speak to arms in BfA as much (i was an enhance player at the time), but my understanding is that other azerite powers and a general build difference led to ToM being a main focus of gameplay in BfA, whereas in Dragonflight ToM is just sort of a byproduct of pressing whatever button is next in your priority
nova marsh
Arms needs a lot of work
gaunt minnow
Have u considered that you dont know why they dislike it cus ur not an arms enjoyer?
smoky kayak
wasnt that talent really liked in bfa?
it was beyond OP at the end of BFA, which is why people liked it
tired pilot
those are fair points
shadow ibex
it was, i can't speak to arms in BfA as much (i was an enhance player at the tim...
it was pretty much the same sitation as now only we had a way to spend rage
smoky kayak
turns out what most people dis/like usually goes hand in hand with how strong something is at that particular time
tired pilot
ya aint that the truth
shadow ibex
if ToM is up, CS probably isn't unless execute and u get the overlap
latent moss
it was, i can't speak to arms in BfA as much (i was an enhance player at the tim...
it wasnt that way until 10.2
tired pilot
unironically..
fresh spire
TOM in bfa was funny purely from stupid haste levels and lucid making it stack to stupid levels of fuckery
smoky kayak
ToM wasn't used prior to Ny'alotha, but I don't recall it being disliked, just kinda ignored
dire hinge
right, but pre-10.2 ignore pain felt like a tire patch on a balding tire
fresh spire
from just one button spamming
smoky kayak
it was taken incidentally, it wasn't the prime power
latent moss
right, but pre-10.2 ignore pain felt like a tire patch on a balding tire
tc over slam, ip and pre 10.0.5 it was slam spam into big sks
nova marsh
Idk if Tom existed in uldir
smoky kayak
it did
shadow ibex
we ran x3 ToM and you had to pick 1 trait to x3
smoky kayak
But ToM really blew up in Ny'a because of crazy haste inflation
fresh spire
when you realise we went full circle on "dreadnaught" I forgot its bfa name but its back being busted again
nova marsh
Just like fury ran 3x CBHS
smoky kayak
and suddenly everyone loved it
fresh spire
got mega nerfed early on azerite
fresh spire
shadow ibex
i remember doing m0s with it
tom has always been p much cosmetic tho. we had fun with it because it was easier to force overlap back in BFA
karmic fiber
TOM in bfa was funny purely from stupid haste levels and lucid making it stack t...
people tend to think things are fun just because they're overpowered at some point and they don't remember the negatives from it. same thing happened with garg & unholy, people remembered it being strong in legion but they don't remember all the massive rng swings it has just from it critting in its last 2-3 hits with a 500% damage amp. the people in the dk discord begged for it back and at the end of abberrus they were screeching to have damage shifted from their pets in to their kit.
shadow ibex
because we used FoB
ppl probably also had more fun because weak aura to track the increase actually worked
rapid bronze
I really like ToM gameplay loop
snow flame
thats not true actually, prior to like
I'm talking this xpac but yeah
shadow ibex
so you could see big number
tender geyser
is there an addon or a WA that warns when u're about to pull packs in keys?
cuz i feel like i just randomly pull 2-3 extra packs all the time
idk how
smoky kayak
yeah it's called Eye Mod
tender geyser
one moment im next to the tank the other im 2 km away
smoky kayak
make sure its set to "open"
tired pilot
ya people love broken things
unborn canyon
stop being dumby thicc, that ass keeps pullin
fresh spire
i was juist thinking scroll your camera out more
tender geyser
i need smth to warn me or show mob ranges
tired pilot
alot of specs "issues" seem to disappear when they get pure number buffs
smoky kayak
but no, there's no addon to show mob aggro range afaik
karmic fiber
I really like ToM gameplay loop
do u mind if I ask what you find fun about it though? cos the gameplay comes from AM, not ToM. ToM is just a passive buff u get from playing correctly.
tender geyser
then how do i not pull extra packs accidentally?
fresh spire
people tend to think things are fun just because they're overpowered at some poi...
fully agree, big damage - fun same time you had shit like condemn in fated, was funny for about 2 raids then shit was boring and all the other options sucked dick
tired pilot
anywho i hope your new channel is good and fits well into the rotation. i feel like it will
tender geyser
it happens to me all the time
smoky kayak
alot of specs "issues" seem to disappear when they get pure number buffs
yeah - I mean during Vault all people could talk about was how big their tom numbers were
people were making WAs to track the value and compare like it was a high score
now suddenly everyone hates ToM and has apparently always hated it 🤔
just feels a little... random
shadow ibex
ive been playing arms all expac and never saw that tbh
tired pilot
truly
fresh spire
think people hate it because of how good OP feels to press and yet it gives no value
smoky kayak
I'm kind of indifferent myself, I don't really care about ToM either way, though I do think its influence would be lessened if Arms rage economy wasn't whacky
smoky kayak
think people hate it because of how good OP feels to press and yet it gives no ...
OP gives no value?
OP has crazy value
shadow ibex
im not against OP feeling good to press
fresh spire
0 value to TOM
rapid bronze
do u mind if I ask what you find fun about it though? cos the gameplay comes fro...
I like the dopamine rush from generating a big buff during it especially in execute or when I get PI, during execute in particular the overlap with CS sometimes makes it feel very powerful. And I like having a damage amp outside of CS. I even enjoy it in some keys. It’s a fun interaction and mini game for me
tired pilot
i was always a fan of overpower
shadow ibex
this is probably best state OP has been in its entire lifetime
smoky kayak
Yeah, that's fair, I've said for awhile ToM would be better if it just counted casts instead of Rage
karmic fiber
I like the dopamine rush from generating a big buff during it especially in exec...
I see
shadow ibex
just need other buttons to rise to that
smoky kayak
just need other buttons to rise to that
issue is that Arms has a real problem with leapfrogging
you can't really make Slam as good as OP or it just replaces OP
fresh spire
is it bad to think if we just had a hardcore button to just hardcore rage dump that wasnt called rampage would shit feel better
like execute in classic just consumes everything etc
smoky kayak
Arms has flipped on that three times this xpac alone
unborn canyon
Just obliterate slam from the game so there are no more debates, and make op count as 20 rage spent for AM or something
tired pilot
yall get slayer as well right?
pseudo crystal
Wouldn't reverting FoB to work st fix the rage dump issue
tired pilot
unborn canyon
tired pilot
we prayge for its return
fresh spire
<:Condemn:742631092279967785>
nonoonno
unborn canyon
execute time
latent moss
Wouldn't reverting FoB to work st fix the rage dump issue
with sos most likely not
shadow ibex
reverting fob would accomplish same thing as increasing cost of slam
fresh spire
i wouldnt be against being able to press execute 100-80 if it had a locked CD
shadow ibex
we really just need a look at the rage economy of a good way to spend it
shadow ibex
right way we have neither
nova marsh
Yeah, that's fair, I've said for awhile ToM would be better if it just counted c...
I think if Tom ended up like collateral it'd be great actually
fresh spire
i dont want to be pressing one button for 55% the fight again
shadow ibex
our rage economy is insane and we have no good way to spend. if it wasnt crazy or if we had a good way to spend it would be ok
but rn we have worst of both worlds
smoky kayak
i wouldnt be against being able to press execute 100-80 if it had a locked CD
that's basically the WoD Alpha design I've brought up several times - Execute usable any time but costs significantly more rage outside of the Execute phase
livid cloak
That sounds interesting
smoky kayak
but it's tricky to get right, because if it's too strong then instead of using it to spend extra resources, you just don't spend any resources until you can Execute
fresh spire
i question if blizzard concerns for buttons like that is people will brick themselves
fresh spire
we used to be
latent moss
and then wait for execute rage
fresh spire
there was a time where like arms was something like 30% waiting
smoky kayak
Exactly, it works both ways
shadow ibex
thats just tuning thing right. if there are talents tied to othera bilities you would want to press them
smoky kayak
so how do you encourage one without the other?
livid cloak
Would it be dumb if ms just scaled up to X rage
shadow ibex
if we just had slam execute OP and math turns out execute is best to use we eschew slam thats a problem but now we have massive talent trees and places for a talent to make slam worth pressing at X moment
etc etc
nova marsh
I honestly think half of arms's problem is still a trash spec tree
shadow ibex
there was a time where like arms was something like 30% waiting
pre corrupt BFA had a good bit of waiting
fresh spire
waiting isnt a bad thing
shadow ibex
we charge weaved a lot in bfa
fresh spire
but when your waiting toooooo often it feels boring
shadow ibex
or you could at least
fresh spire
i like pressing things
nova marsh
I think keeping down sitting there isn't good
snow flame
atleast they confirmed slyer will be around execute
nova marsh
is good
shadow ibex
i dont mind waiting tbh
snow flame
surely they cannot fuck that one up
smoky kayak
Would it be dumb if ms just scaled up to X rage
same issue really
unborn canyon
i dont mind waiting if i can go turbo mode in execute still
shadow ibex
i like swing timers and playing floaty with rage
using a slam and spending too much but trusting auto crit
unborn canyon
i like the machine gun execute
nova marsh
I don't mind waiting but it depends on how long and how much of the fight were waiting
nova marsh
Like 30-40% of the fight not pressing shit is bad
nova marsh
Litterally the easiest fix and will probally be done in alpha
shadow ibex
its a shame colossus doesnt do anything with avatar tho. make room for spiteful obviously
nova marsh
That also feels silly
shadow ibex
yea i can understand why not on CS
unborn canyon
and they can just tune for that
shadow ibex
cuz then every cast would be 10 stacks from WB alone
unborn canyon
CS isnt in prot ye
shadow ibex
oh yea forgot prot
nova marsh
Full stacks on cs would be silly
shadow ibex
prot would just be demo shout grants max stacks
unborn canyon
shadow ibex
avatar granting max stacks is good tho, any on CS would just mean every cast is max stacks auto because we'd probably generate enough to make up the difference before the cast
even if CS gave 5 that would be too much we'd get 5 naturally before CS is up
nova marsh
4 secs of ava instead of recklessness....
shadow ibex
i still want reck to be crit amp/crit chance
and not rage gen
but rage gen feels good
at least for arms only idc what fury does give me more crit amp
i want my crits to do 200% more dmg
why stop at 120
prisma heart
what hero tree makes slam a good rage dump + has lucid dreams for the capstone? if the answer is none im switching specs in tww
deft girder
quasi torrent
yeah no one gave a fuck about the passive
the active press execute 22 times in a row
was what mattered
shadow ibex
the active press execute 22 times in a row
almost do that now
rage kinda od in exe with that avatar reck and CS
nova marsh
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787509029836554282/1214727641895010334/image.png?ex=65fa2a46&is=65e7b546&hm=afaac720472c8fdc190b17802a2300579f44d47357b78ad2853a3625f4dfd911& What is my paladin's luck
inner wasp
that blue post makes demolish sound hype
brand new animation???
or will it be a jank combo animation
either way sounds cool
nova marsh
Not really
rare kite
can be cool, depending on visual/sound and strength. if they nail all 3 then people will like it
nova marsh
Being rooted is just no
inner wasp
i wonder if they'll finally make fury execute good
inner wasp
Being rooted is just no
i LOVE being rooted
rare kite
i wonder if they'll finally make fury execute good
its good rn
outer holly
gooder
inner wasp
its good rn
its "good" if u take literally every talent associated w/ it and go purely single target
otherwise its just filler xd
desert crane
Im glad colossus gets 7 boring flat dmg buff talents and a 2 second root channel. VERY FUN BLIZZ. Meanwhile locks get a triple demon + imp meteor
rapid bronze
I’m holding out hope for condemn in slayer
prisma heart
I want something like give 1% mastery for each % of bosses health missing under 35%
inner wasp
people who dont like rooted channels r people who are incapable of thinking 2 sec ahead
nova marsh
I mean tbh
Just making fyr'noth 2, eletric boogalo....as a spec
Is kind of just....dissapointing
prisma heart
Or like after 10 executes you gain 3% mastery stacking perma
inner wasp
Just making fyr'noth 2, eletric boogalo....as a spec
mans cant even spell fyr'alath
s m h
strong tendon
how can there be so much Sod tuning
like literally one tuning change a week, sometimes twice a week. on something where everything will change with the enxt level cap raise. and live is pretty much ignored
prisma heart
Ok wat about while boss under 35% health, mortal strike causes your next slam to do 50% increased damage, stacking up to 6 times hitting boss with giga slam causes next execute to hit for 50%-300% dam depending on how many stacks were consumed
slow saddle
so basicly ARMS is going execute .. coz our execute is strong we want more of it
fathom steeple
is it normal that a 489 rezan's eye is simming much higher than a 489 augury?
slow saddle
at mit is
atm it is
and id say its prob not as much ass, as BB is very strong
i mean execute is prio to keep up
to 5 stacks if u have the talent up
fathom steeple
yes
does a 489 rezan's actually outperform a 489 augury tho? I'm seeing augury played much more than rezans on fyrakk but that could just be because not many have a 489 rezans
slow saddle
ramp - bb
latent moss
u cant keep that 2 button rotation for long
slow saddle
my point is saying its ass when it actually adds dmg to our execute part
prisma heart
Simple damage proc trinkets 
inner wasp
an execute ability adding dmg in execute phase is the bare god dam minimum
doesnt make it good
rare kite
its not good
ye i meant execute phase, not execute itself
slow saddle
execute phase fury is good ye
and fury cant get more execute power than now tbh
if anything fury needs more overall dmg
latent moss
move the power
slow saddle
not execute
latent moss
away from bb and to execute
slow saddle
that will happen naturally next season ^_^
slow saddle
does a 489 rezan's actually outperform a 489 augury tho? I'm seeing augury playe...
the thing is augery is gooder for aoe parts if it procs and has a higher variance of dmg
latent moss
next season we will have shit execute again
slow saddle
also keep in mind augery has seconday stat while rezan has main
fathom steeple
ye thats why it's hard for me to figure out
molten crane
so wait. what is recklessness and how much is it reduced for us with our capstone?
i can't find it anywhere in warrior / arms / talents
slow saddle
Warlords torment uwu
nova marsh
Gives us 100% rage gen increase and some crit
slow saddle
everytime u CS u get reck for like 4 sec
nova marsh
We get it from warlord's torment off of CS and Ava
molten crane
Gives us 100% rage gen increase and some crit
ahh nice, ty
must be a fury thing then i guess
slow saddle
ye thats why it's hard for me to figure out
but that is the sole reason it sims higher and tbh i suspect rezan in gen is better
but augery just can proc silly high, and can be rly good in aoe if procced correctly purely st i usually just use rezans on my arms.
slow saddle
i mean its almost top simming
latent moss
on st that is
slow saddle
my rezans is like 500-600dps more
and augery has a big variance which is reflected in sims ^_^
nova marsh
Tbh
slow saddle
so go high proc go for the win
nova marsh
I'd bet it's better then mirrior overall
slow saddle
welll easy way to c warrior has no burst is
Might of the ocean isnt that good in st
if we had proper burst might would be a top trinket but because of tom its shit
fuck tom
latent moss
tom makes it better than it is
latent moss
since tom takes all ur strength and buffs it
slow saddle
which is then not compensated in gen
so if tom didnt exist. we would play cs burst - and have an general aura buff or allocated dmg more in another way
latent moss
arms cant burst anyway
slow saddle
which would mean a higher burst in the interval we use roar - avatar
latent moss
not on st
nova marsh
Tbh I genuinely don't think us being a sustain class is a bad thing
nova marsh
It's not as if those just can't exist in wow
Worse as a meele? Yes. yes it is.
But dosen't mean it can't work
slow saddle
theres a big difference between sustain
and flat dmg curve
flat dmg curve is never fun
we get spike dopamine in execute phase
nova marsh
That's fair yeah
slow saddle
only thing that keeps arms going
nova marsh
I just think we REALLY need to see an arms rework and I'm okay if we stay as a sustain class of sorts.
prisma heart
Ok how would u all feel about this hero talent captone: after 30 executes, the CD on avatar resets and avatar becomes a new ability called slayer which for the next 30 seconds increases damage done by 50% + gives 2k mastery + stores the damage dealt by execute during this time and hits the boss for that much at the end of the buff + clears roots n snares
nova marsh
ToM needs to be either reworked or just thrown out. It's not great
slow saddle
it brings nothing fun, and keeps dmg curve flat
latent moss
which isnt interesting
nova marsh
I think if you remove ToM from rage like archi suggested it could work
latent moss
on top of being very cringe without blunt instruments
slow saddle
nah it just globals
prisma heart
Still waiting on KFC
slow saddle
its flat buff
nova marsh
But as is hell no
slow saddle
still cringe
slow saddle
like tom basicly means AFTER BURST WINDOW, here u go another burst window
latent moss
arms is tuned around tom
slow saddle
= flat dmg curve
slow saddle
ye
100%
which again shouldnt be a thing tbh.
i mean im afraid arms isnt gettin a rework
latent moss
the thing keeping our st from being good in m+
slow saddle
all i saw was rework of class tree not spec tree's
slow saddle
yup
slow saddle
i mean its not even that imagine if execute wasnt tuned around tom
shadow ibex
AM in class tree
slow saddle
and u got iftk Huge Claps with mega speed
slow saddle
that to
and kill tom
only way i wanna keep tom is if we can get CS overlaps consistently from a proc like we had in SL ^_^
that way i guess i could live with it, flat dmg curve but proc luck makes smile anyways
nova marsh
Fyra but kind of worse lol
smoky kayak
kinda better too
shadow ibex
beinr rooted once every 3 mins is bearable every 30-40 second not so much
nova marsh
Kinda better kinda worse. I mean to be fair, we don't even know if Coll will be good
slow saddle
beinr rooted once every 3 mins is bearable every 30-40 second not so much
ngl i fuckin hope slayer is going to be bis in raid for arms
smoky kayak
beinr rooted once every 3 mins is bearable every 30-40 second not so much
shorter roots are more bearable as well
slow saddle
2 sec channeliing my god we gonna die so much in mythic raids
and M+
and we cant interrupt while either
smoky kayak
Though I'm still curious to see how they'll tune it
nova marsh
Assuming Demo even hits multiple targets.
smoky kayak
it does
sacred zodiac
same root duration as rn no
latent moss
it does
slow saddle
so basicly we bladestorm into demo ^_^
nova marsh
Oh I can't read.
restive sorrel
actually one of the worst possible outcomes lul. If the ability doesnt do broken levels of damage, the ability and tree is garbage(unless slayer somehow manages to be worse)
latent moss
same root duration as rn no
at our haste levels i think so
leggo could be slightly slower
nova marsh
Slayer being worse would just be a tree based around condemm
smoky kayak
same root duration as rn no
right now it's 3s hasted, which is 2s with 50% haste
slow saddle
hmm, i mean leggo hasnt killed me yet
smoky kayak
which is possible but not that common for Arms
and yeah, I mean... legendary should not be killing you very often
unless you just have zero awareness
slow saddle
but being stuck is kindda cringe and not what i was hoping for at all
smoky kayak
still got slayer!
slow saddle
if it was 2 seconds + what ever we hasted
shadow ibex
2 sec channeliing my god we gonna die so much in mythic raids
i just dont see the value really
restive sorrel
there are plenty of times i know if I press lego on certain bosses/pulls in a key that theres a pretty good chance youll die...doesnt feel great. And it will feel even worse when youre having to do that far more frequently with this shit ability
nova marsh
Tbh after both thane and Coll being....mid....I kinda doubt slayer will be interesting
shadow ibex
what gain do we have in being rooted beyond whatever roleplay reasons
smoky kayak
they didn't specify whether the 2s was hasted, if it is, then the root is a big who cares
slow saddle
i just dont see the value really
i mean if we can time it with knockbacks and shit
and game mechanics
shadow ibex
i mean if we can time it with knockbacks and shit
it can still do that while not rooting
see death's advance
smoky kayak
the "can't be rooted and knocked back" thing is more for PvP than PvE
shadow ibex
i just dont see the value in it
smoky kayak
it's so other players can't stop you from using your big ability
nova marsh
I mean if we get like mythic hurricane wing again, I guess demolish could be good
shadow ibex
its unique sure but why
we can already cheese those fairly well with leap/charge/intervene
smoky kayak
not during abilities you can't
slow saddle
ok NGL
shadow ibex
or respond to them is better than cheese i guess
slow saddle
if the animation looks great ^_^
its prob a win anyways
if it looks and feels like rampage .-.
smoky kayak
- in PVE, no the anti-kb doesn't matter because you can easily time the ability around those mehcanics
- it's more for PvP, so other players can't stop you from using the ability
nova marsh
I honestly think slayer will just end up as condemm: the talent tree
nova marsh
- in PVE, no the anti-kb doesn't matter because you can easily time the ability ...
Yeah that's true. This isn't 14 where knockbocks are a constant actual threat
shadow ibex
well in pvp they can just out range ability
not only that giving cc immunity doesnt require rooting
smoky kayak
well in pvp they can just out range ability
harder if they're also rooted/slowed/etc
shadow ibex
like bladestorm doesnt root us
smoky kayak
also Fyr'alath has a pretty big range, I expect this will too
restive sorrel
ye I just dont see why the ability has to be channeled and root you, for an ability youl lbe casting quite often its pretty obvious that root is going to be dangerous far more often than it will be beneficial for the stun/knock immune. And not being able to kick/use stops/anything during the channel on top of BS is just adding insult to injury.
smoky kayak
Even Rampage has a much larger range than you'd think
shadow ibex
ye I just dont see why the ability has to be channeled and root you, for an abil...
my main issue is just "why"
beyond thematic reason
restive sorrel
ye idk
shadow ibex
we have cc immunity abilities that dont root us
prisma heart
Sry 🫡
slow saddle
i mean its 100% thematic
shadow ibex
what does it add to the hero spec
slow saddle
i mean we get a new power button to push i guess...
slow saddle
i would be fine with more passive powers ngl
im kindda simple
Bring back ancient aftershock instead ^_^
shadow ibex
most of them are passive in that tree
smoky kayak
its the same reason EM forces you to stand in Spear - to make you think about how you use it
shadow ibex
they either buff dmg on ms/crits or make the on use better
smoky kayak
so people don't qq that the gameplay is just braindead button mashing
slow saddle
Which makes spear something u couldnt use in this raid half the time
smoky kayak
it's pretty usable this tier
latent moss
its very usable this tier
smoky kayak
you can express yourself by picking another hero class
shadow ibex
if the root is hasted and thus so fast to not matter then why root?
nova marsh
I think my #1 fear in WW
shadow ibex
if its hard 2 seconds why for
smoky kayak
you can't "express yourself" and only want to play what's best though - you never could
nova marsh
Is if blizz designs tier sets around these trees
smoky kayak
wow is not that game
latent moss
didnt they say they arent gonna be doing that
shadow ibex
you say that while arms has multiple m+ builds
so idk
deswind has been expressing himself p well in m+ as arms
slow saddle
Is if blizz designs *tier sets* around these trees
i mean my god they kidnda hve to though ? unless they go all booring season 1 buffs for tier
smoky kayak
which all use the same basic rotation lol
shadow ibex
imo
restive sorrel
"differently" you mean forces you to engage in an actively worse playstyle that has numerous potential ramifications for using it(i.e: missing a kick/stop because youre channeling in a high key, getting a ground based effect that spawns under yo uafter you start channeling etc.)
nova marsh
didnt they say they arent gonna be doing that
I don't remeber seeing a statement on it
smoky kayak
Arms "multiple M+ builds" this tier is like 1 button difference between them
You press BS or you don't
slow saddle
coz like imagine if ARMS gets something dmg wise buffed from tier that isnt demo, and now demo isnt prio to push
smoky kayak
you press WW or you press MS
smoky kayak
it's not exactly the height of expression lol
slow saddle
"build"
nova marsh
i mean my god they kidnda hve to though ? unless they go all booring season 1 bu...
Not nessisarily. You can just....ya know, make a set that interacts with the base kit
smoky kayak
Also hero talents inherently have multiple options as well - you have Colossus and you have Slayer
slow saddle
Not nessisarily. You can just....ya know, make a set that interacts with *the ba...
true but doesnt that reduce the value of their new shiny dmg button
shadow ibex
ive seen you here say arms is unique and cool because it has multiple builds
now they are all the same
latent moss
they said they will try to balance them
smoky kayak
I literally never said that
latent moss
however they said the same thing about covenants
smoky kayak
In fact I have repeatedly cited that Arms biggest problem is its lack of variety
latent moss
so idk
smoky kayak
and the fact that every build takes basically the same talents and has the same gameplay
so whatever you think you read was deadass wrong lol
shadow ibex
i think its possible to get the root looked at tho
nova marsh
true but doesnt that reduce the value of their new shiny dmg button
Not really, depends on how you look at it
shadow ibex
at least hasted if it isnt
slow saddle
Not really, depends on how you look at it
im only thinkin like blizzard ^_^
shadow ibex
because rn 2 seconds is just about a fyra channel and thats kinda meh
slow saddle
1.5 sec ?
smoky kayak
Fyr'alath is 3s, 2s with 50% haste (which is possible, but not super common atm)
nova marsh
God it'll be a shitstorm if they do that
slow saddle
prob true, well lets have some faith then
this expansion has had good tiers imho
with season 1 being booring but none special
nova marsh
People are already complaining that this is making the same mistake as covenants in locking animations and shit behind player power
slow saddle
so i forgive
YEAH the aug part is what fucked all
pre aug i had so much fun un season 2
restive sorrel
1.5s still plenty long to end up killing you because a swirlie spawns under you or something. I mean can you imagine using Demolish on xavius in DHT this season? Youd literally just rolling the dice half the time hoping a swirlie doesnt spawn under you
shadow ibex
i hated that tier set
slow saddle
1.5s still plenty long to end up killing you because a swirlie spawns under you ...
yeah, im pretty certain demolishes biggest issue will be in M+
slow saddle
Ancient aftershock !
i say it again it was fun
Reward for standing in flowers
but if u couldnt.. u still go the dmg part at least
nova marsh
And the rage
nova marsh
Fury with AA was fun ngl
slow saddle
that was AA r?
slow saddle
^_^
nova marsh
Yeah flowers was AA
latent moss
personal pi
shadow ibex
i like that they said they are removing shockwave dmg talent but we have node in hero spec tree that boosts shockwave dmg per target struck
competing with bleed dmg increase of course
hazy flower
last minute gaming
latent moss
slow saddle
or if SPEAR just was a Good Haste bufff inside it
i would prob like it more
and it just did more dmg on its own
or grabbed mobs in a tight pile if u threw it down
i mean in theory if arms wasnt build around tom.... we would prob like spear more in st ^_^
restive sorrel
I really love how theyre so proud to announce "and we are pleased to confirm that it is possible and easy to take Storm Bolt and Shockwave at once." As if that will really change almost anything about warriors issue of being nearly completely useless utility wise, especially if the classes that already have great utility are going to get more/buffs to their current utility in TWW
latent moss
shockwave was easy to take anyway
slow saddle
warrior doesnt have bad utility as much as in, we just cant deal with affixes
shadow ibex
well obviously TR and AA would be mutually exclusive
one is more burst/more rage and CC but otherwise i think one makes other redundent
slow saddle
one is more burst/more rage and CC but otherwise i think one makes other redunde...
one is uncapped the other had a 5 target cap
latent moss
no one wanted it
shadow ibex
i would take less dmg increaes like crushing force and more cool utility/self buff nodes
nova marsh
Just make spear a grip
latent moss
spear was interesting in sl because of mikanikos
nova marsh
At least it'd be kinda cool
slow saddle
exactly mika made spear gucci
slow saddle
ye throw grip and u charge into ya own spear
nova marsh
Make spear old binding shot
nova marsh
Idc about it's damage
slow saddle
if it first did a big dmg, and then u also got the dmg buff when standing in it
it would feel better
restive sorrel
warrior doesnt have bad utility as much as in, we just cant deal with affixes
no...it objectively has one of the worst, if not the worst utility in m+. And even if incorp/afflicted didnt exist, theres always dungeons where having various dispels are necessary anyway. Almost every class these days has at minimum a ST or aoe stun, and theres numerous that have both, so warrior getting "Easier access" to taking stormbolt/shockwave will change exactly nothing.
slow saddle
i mean we have 3
slow saddle
its not terrible
if they are cheaper to get
if they made rally do what aug does
stronger in smalller groups
20-25% in m+
slow saddle
its 10 now r?
shadow ibex
i think rally has room for a node to grant party a ton of leech/heal party based on dmg war deals
slow saddle
yeah or that
shadow ibex
or just be stronger in 5man
nova marsh
that would be the most broken as fuck defensive in the entire game probally
slow saddle
i mean tuning would be needed ofc but something that makes Rally good in M+ again
it was good before coz it was broken in raid ^_^
smoky kayak
doesn't need tuning, it could just scale in smaller content
nova marsh
I mean also I feel like warrior absoutlely NEEDS a more consistant incorp counter
slow saddle
exactly but if u wanted a choice node it would need to be tuned
restive sorrel
except...so many classes have aoe stuns/ST stuns(that are longer in duration than stormbolt) that DRing mobs is a real issue. Warrior isnt gaining any value at all by getting easier access to stuns. The class quitel iterally needs numerous new utility abilities if the spec isnt goign to be completely worthless in keys again in TWW(or potentially, in an even worse position due to other classes getting more/buffed utility).
smoky kayak
i think rally has room for a node to grant party a ton of leech/heal party based...
Vampiric Embrace? lol
latent moss
except...so many classes have aoe stuns/ST stuns(that are longer in duration tha...
i want colossus shockwave talent
to be baseline
that it knocks
smoky kayak
except...so many classes have aoe stuns/ST stuns(that are longer in duration tha...
DRing mobs isn't usually a big issue in M+, because stuns are mostly used as pseudo-interrupts, more so than actual stuns
like yes it can happen, but it's not all that common that it actually matters
latent moss
up enemies
slow saddle
DRing mobs isn't usually a big issue in M+, because stuns are mostly used as pse...
this
its just a stop
restive sorrel
DRing mobs isn't usually a big issue in M+, because stuns are mostly used as pse...
??? what lol
smoky kayak
!!! what I said lol
restive sorrel
if you DR the mob...guess what? You cant use it as a stop. Ive had it happen numerous times playing havoc/arms/ret/MW this season
nova marsh
Like isn't rogue's blind which is just....kinda mid
slow saddle
i cant remember a pack ending up being DR immune killing me ^_^
usually packs be gone by then, or interrupts are backj uop
smoky kayak
it takes like 5(?) stuns within 18s to fully immune a pack? that's incredibly unlikely
slow saddle
and if all ppl send at start well.. its kindda deserved then ?
restive sorrel
its like...3
nova marsh
So?
restive sorrel
I mean ive literally had it happen this season plenty of times, and we sure as shit did not send 5 stuns in a pack/mob before it got fully DR'd
smoky kayak
checking, actually I think it's four, still not very common
nova marsh
Genuinely....is the mob dead or close to dead by then? Are ints back up by then?
hexed saddle
was about to say im pretty sure its 4
shadow ibex
first cast is full, second 50%, third 25
smoky kayak
first is full, second is 50%, third is 75%, fourth is immune
nova marsh
The answer is probally yes
smoky kayak
feels like if that's the case, you're probably overlapping stuns
restive sorrel
yeah like I said...3 before the mob is DR'd
restive sorrel
nope
smoky kayak
like yeah if you throw everything at the same time, that might happen, but that's wasteful
restive sorrel
there are plenty of packs that have numerous casters that literally spam cast lol
smoky kayak
interrupt more
restive sorrel
thanks 
smoky kayak
but I mean, what four aoe stuns are you using in quick succession?
slow saddle
dno u expect to just push aoe stuns to win ?
smoky kayak
double shockwave, double chaos whatever?
slow saddle
or if u want warrior to have something else?
smoky kayak
idk within 18s I don't feel like you should be hitting hard DR that often
slow saddle
and there isnt that much thematic utility we can have. i mean a lust would be nice and could be tuned in
restive sorrel
I mean like I said...when youre playing a comp that has a lot of stuns(which are also the primary means of stopping a cast outside of kicking) like havoc/arms/ret/MW its not nearly as uncommon as you think. But the point I was making is that access to ST/AoE stuns these days is extremely common, and when theyre making packs that spam cast so often, warrior having better access to stuns(that also happen to be our only real way to stop things) doesnt really do much to fix the utility issue.
slow saddle
if u want all that just go ret my m8
shadow ibex
ive always enjoyed aspect of warrior utility that is you have CDs for every pack and so are always killing things to remove threats but last time that felt super true was fury s2 with reck every damn pull/x2 times a pull
slow saddle
ye shorter cds were deffo our thing
i think reason why ret feels so good in m+ now is 1 tuning but also same cds
smoky kayak
well first and foremost, Warrior doesn't have any issue accessing stuns
that's the biggest non-issue there never was
smoky kayak
situation might be better, might be worse - depends on what the new tree looks like
shadow ibex
wonder what new capstone could be
slow saddle
something reused
smoky kayak
something worse 🙃
slow saddle
^_^
shadow ibex
if they throw a hailmarry and "transform shockwave into ancient aftershock"
nova marsh
They'll remove avatar
shadow ibex
i would have so much respect
smoky kayak
Jus sayin, right now you give up less damage taking shockwave as a "capstone" than you would if it were in the 1st or 2nd talent tiers
nova marsh
Imagine that in a key oh my god
smoky kayak
maybe they put something awesome in its spot
maybe they just remove that leg entirely 🤷♂️
restive sorrel
how about get this...ancient aftershock but it also acts as an aoe silence like VDHs sigil of silence.
smoky kayak
yeah right
nova marsh
That'd be neat but....we ain't getting that
smoky kayak
Warrior doesn't have too little lockdown, VDH just has way too much
the goal should not be moving everyone up to VDH levels, but to nerf their ridiculous amount of lockdown
shadow ibex
if they put ancient aftershock there i would have so much respect for them lol
shadow ibex
like yea you want shockwave but you can have this also but no more shockwave 
slow saddle
and range pala
smoky kayak
also remake ALL melee chars actual melee
I never minded DK's ranged stuff, but Ret feels egregious I agree
idk about Rogue
latent moss
incorp and afflicted shouldnt exist in the first place
restive sorrel
good thing even if warrior had a sigil of silence type ability, it still wouldnt be anywhere remotely close to VDH level lul
smoky kayak
Yeah, Ret can do most of its rotation from range
nova marsh
incorp and afflicted shouldnt exist in the first place
Incorp and afflicated should just be outright thrown in the bin and sit there next to skittish and teeming
shadow ibex
so we can kick during it
nova marsh
Let blizz accept them as a comical failed attempt to make DPS interact with affixes, which is exactly what they are
slow saddle
I never minded DK's ranged stuff, but Ret feels egregious I agree
Ye coz dks doenst do that much dmg
restive sorrel
Warrior quite literally needs multiple significant, impactful pieces of utility given to it if the spec isnt going to be a near complete void of utility out of the DPS slot for keys in TWW. It needs something borderline OP.
slow saddle
Nah
nova marsh
Hard disagree on something borderline OP
slow saddle
Just geif dmg
nova marsh
Like no. We don't need to just sudden become vengance
restive sorrel
ok lol
slow saddle
Its that simple
restive sorrel
go try to pug high keys on dps warrior right now, let me know how many hours you spend before you get an invite.
slow saddle
Ye but if fury did 10%more dmg
nova marsh
We don't need something "op"
restive sorrel
no you wouldnt
slow saddle
Ye u would
restive sorrel
it would have to do 10% more damage than EVERY other spec
nova marsh
We just need an incorp counter, one more aoe stun maybe, and rally to be decent
slow saddle
Dmg is king
slow saddle
We have the stuns and ccs. Imho incorp o agree we should be able tp counter
nova marsh
Yeah warrior needs a single hard stun that isn't ass or on a fuckin 3 minute cd
slow saddle
If sb could lock incorp we gucci
nova marsh
Storm bolt dosent have to be that counter. In fact I think we just need another shout or make int shout our counter
slow saddle
Not more buttons 1 aoe fear 1 aoe stun 1 st stun is enough
shadow ibex
i also just wanna know what they mean by demolish hits hard because its being cast every 30-40 seconds
cuz thats a lot of casts thru a fight
restive sorrel
same
restive sorrel
I mean I said its going to have to do a fuckton of damage to not be a dogshit tree/for people to feel its worth playing even if they really dislike the ability.
nova marsh
Demolish is gonna be arms's wake
shadow ibex
so do i want to use it on cooldown asap or do i want to think carefully about where to put it
like wat
idk thats the shit that pisses me off
slow saddle
3 seconds not spendin rage. Or outside cs windows menace
restive sorrel
It doesnt have potential, it just might be potentially numerically strong enough to warrant playing despite terrible gameplay implications, and extremely uninspired, bland talents. And if it isnt tuned to be super strong, why would you ever want to play the tree in any meaningful content?
rare kite
honestly the channel is fine as long as test of might doesn't exist
slow saddle
It doesnt have potential, it just might be potentially numerically strong enough...
It has if it looks cool
Its basicly what we wanted a burst
shadow ibex
they said how they wanted it to look
2 quick attacks and a third overhead smash
my money is on overhead smash just being the s3 proc effect p much
overhead execute with tclap ground crack
restive sorrel
idgaf if it "looks cool" if it feels terrible to play
shadow ibex
just saying they already gave their idea for it
slow saddle
But it wont if tom isnt an issue