not even close to 17cpm IP
#protection
sick sentinel
lofty widget
so why is that? you clearly have the rage to press it, seeing as you wasted 2.6k
lusty tiger
How do I see wasted rage in logs?
grand glacier
You check you resources against your pressed buttons. When you have max rage and press anything but a spender you wasted rage.
jagged pier
i mean i found a log from yesterday do u want me to run through the stuff your doing wrong?
sick sentinel
um well, i should have 1 log up now, unless people are loading on my be-half, i moved everything over to another account because the old one displayed my name
so, i deleted all the logs except LFR
and this should be only one i've uploaded
blazing condor
How do I see wasted rage in logs?
resources > your name > pick "rage" on the drop-down thats on the left side over the table
blissful ether
Wanted to get into tanking for m+ and have minimal expierence tanking is prot warrior a good tank to start tanking with?
sick sentinel
so, sure i guess, i'm just curious how if im not logging it another pops up
there is no escaping the maze is there?
jagged pier
Wanted to get into tanking for m+ and have minimal expierence tanking is prot wa...
probably not its the hardest to play tbh
but if u find it the funniest then u might as well
because no point playing something u find unfun
blissful ether
Other options would be prot pal or blood dk. the other tanks looks boring af
blazing condor
pwarr is fun when you know how to play it
because thats also when it feels strongs
play it improperly and you gonna have a bad time
blissful ether
So pugs are gonna love me the first few weeks
narrow fog
Warrior talents today
Tbf, I looked into Frost DK yday, talents are 9/10
Only thing missing would be some sort of raid buff if you wanna meta it
topaz field
and a turbo for his wheelchair
narrow fog
and a turbo for his wheelchair
For fdk?
I think their ST won't be S tier, but their cleave should be impressive
narrow fog
Ahahahah
Man I am just giving my prediction
Why do you hate me so much
What do you guys think prot will be, talent-wise
Or more of the same that is existant now?
sweet summit
if i could choose i'd want the synergy of bfa talents with spear and a heavily buffed last stand + talents interacting with block/crit block
narrow fog
if i could choose i'd want the synergy of bfa talents with spear and a heavily b...
So, talents that increase mastery in certain situations?
Because fdk had a talent like that
It would increase your mastery by 4% for each enemy hit.
sweet summit
no not like that
narrow fog
For x amount of seconds i don't remember the exact amount
lusty tiger
resources > your name > pick "rage" on the drop-down thats on the left side over...
Perfect I found it
narrow fog
So just %block chance increased?
sweet summit
no we have shield block for that
narrow fog
Because you said block/crit block
sweet summit
yes?
narrow fog
So, what do you mean
sweet summit
talents that affect shield block uptime
narrow fog
X stat of block/crit block
dawn canyon
sweet summit
and talents that add additional effects to crit block/make crit block something we can play around
not just another rng element to the spec
sweet summit
yes
narrow fog
For x amount of time
narrow fog
I would love if prot got some big anti magic dmg talent
sweet summit
we have spell reflect
narrow fog
we have spell reflect
Yes. But something that is better for long ticking dots or something
Continuous magical dmg.
sweet summit
indomitable?
lusty tiger
Reverse magic
narrow fog
Doesn't have to be dots
We all know Devastator is gonna be a talent
Unavoidable at this point
Probably 2-3 tiers down in prot tree
sweet summit
how is it unavoidable
narrow fog
Well, if prot keeps most of its toolkit, imagine having to press devastate
Wouldn't it be too much?
sick sentinel
my idea is something more along the lines of why the hell are we spamming ignore pain which does no damage, and critical block resets SS, no minimum on charge
lofty widget
we didnt spec devastator in bfa
sweet summit
^
lofty widget
you just didnt press devastate
narrow fog
Kek
sweet summit
but it's not something super integral to the identity of the spec
narrow fog
If it's an easy option many people may end up taking it
Or if it's an easy way to go deeper into the tree
sweet summit
¯_(ツ)_/¯
lofty widget
doesnt sound "unavoidable"
cobalt seal
Whats the problem with spamming IP?
sweet summit
pretty sure we'd be fine if it was not a talent
narrow fog
But it very likely may end up being that you do, depends on where it is situated and what you can gain from dropping it
cobalt seal
Just be hopeful you get a tree like rogue
And not like hunters
Where you have multiple nodes with 2/3 points
narrow fog
Where you have multiple nodes with 2/3 points
Do you mean the base tree or spec tree?
cobalt seal
Both
narrow fog
The real cuck is needing to take 2/2 to progress deeper
cobalt seal
Hunter is a clusterfuck
cobalt seal
Hunter is literally dead in high keys
narrow fog
Example, FDK has 2/2 talent to progress down to BoS, or 1/1 ERW that does some thing
cobalt seal
If it stays like that
sweet summit
they still haven't given hunter a defensive have they?
narrow fog
In base tree
narrow fog
And having 2 charges in a BoS build is not good
narrow fog
Does the hunter tree have raid buffs?
cobalt seal
Doesnt really matter
narrow fog
Or should I say utilities, like rogue?
sweet summit
what utilities did rogue get
cobalt seal
Usual Hunter utility
sweet summit
that are viable options over the dps talents
narrow fog
It has some cool stuff that reduces
cobalt seal
Nothing new
narrow fog
Cooldowns of others in raid
sweet summit
ah ok
narrow fog
I forget tbh I read it yday
vestal moat
It’s a party buff not raid buff.
narrow fog
Thats broken
Yes haha
vestal moat
Like wind fury.
narrow fog
It’s a party buff not raid buff.
Yes my mistake
Still sounds good for m+
Like really good
cobalt seal
Sounds like 1 rogue mandatory
narrow fog
Exactly
cobalt seal
And 4 people that abuse it
cobalt seal
That talent is meta shaping on its own lol
cobalt seal
so happy for warlocks and mages
No matter how broken Hunter is
Its dead on high keys
Because its gonna fucking die to anything
narrow fog
Warlock has been in the upper tier of damage dealers since TBC
Longer than some classes have existed.
How people complain about locks, when atleast one of their specs is either A or S tier
Is beyond me
narrow fog
No joke
They were shitty in vanilla/classic
But since then
Lel
And the argument that it is a pure dps class doesn't work
Mage and hunter are also pure dps, as well as rogue
And they have had dips thru the years.
Bobby Kotick plays a Warlock
You should see the shadowbolt he casts
Look at that Shadow Bolt
No floor PoV for Bobby
mortal brook
Or should I say utilities, like rogue?
hunter has utility. and then a talent that makes them disregard the utility of the utility for damage gains
sick sentinel
.... no
paladin too, original hero class, free mounts
bubble 100% hp gain, wear best armor and a shield, do all 3 jobs
bright trail
What about Druid, they have 4 specs!
chrome falcon
i don't know what outlaws CD does but
if it generates combo points
5 outlaws could be pretty memes
or even just 2
2 outlaws+3 huge burst classes
sweet summit
Increases your Energy regeneration rate by 60%, your maximum Energy by 50, and your attack speed by 20% for 20 sec.
dawn canyon
this but rage
sweet summit
based
chrome falcon
yeah if UF had increases our max rage as well as rage gen
that would have been big QOL
median tulip
The worst thing about playing a healer alt is how judgy I get about Warrior tanks
sick sentinel
The worst thing about playing a healer alt is how judgy I get about Warrior tank...
then stop playing hpal if u have judgement problems
i'm very okay with it if u judge the boss, i think there is something like if the hpal judges, group get a heal on attack while debuffs up
?
they’re saying they judge other warrior tanks
nothing to do with the ability
median tulip
I think Yogi is trying to be funny
But I play Resto shaman so IDK about Pallys anyway
toxic pewter
holy pally is super fun
median tulip
I've bounced off levelling pally a couple of times. The levelling process for it is sucky
drifting juniper
guys
an irrelevant question
is anyone an expert on bfa content here?
i need few questions
i won't spam this channel tho
chrome falcon
well you can just google that
which i just did
and yes, you can
and no, they don't
drifting juniper
yeah but the back, how did you guys level it back in the day
chrome falcon
that's also a google question
drifting juniper
i want to farm the back pack transmog i wanna see how much time it takes
chrome falcon
^
sweet summit
you just need the cloak
chrome falcon
you might need some levels in cloak but tbh since you just 1 shot everything you might be fine
sweet summit
if you do a full run of stormwind you get up to 5.2k mementos and in orgrimar it's 4.8k iirc
drifting juniper
can you level it without killing nzhoth?
sweet summit
yes, that was a catchup mechanic added later
the original way of leveling it was through visions
so you just complete visions to get an item to use to increase the level of the cloak
drifting juniper
ah so the hard part is doing many quest lines to reach the cloak
sweet summit
there's not really any hard parts in doing it, it's all just time-consuming
drifting juniper
i am talking about a character that hasnt been in bfa tho
do i need to skip anything or do i have to do it all?
chrome falcon
the 8.3 stuff is totally independent
you only have to do 8.3 stuff
nothing from 8.2
chrome falcon
i'm sure no-one minds answering your questions
but like
i haven't known the answers to anything you've asked off the top of my head
and just googled them to answer you
sweet summit
you can also use echoes of nyalotha to buy the vessel (i think you get echoes from doing visions)
drifting juniper
ok thanks and sry, i think i got what i needed
verbal hill
you can also use echoes of nyalotha to buy the vessel (i think you get echoes fr...
And then you started getting them from m+
That was peak BFA
chrome falcon
i wanna say that "peak BFA" was when it ended
but then we had shadowlands after so
that's not necessarily true
sweet summit
🙂
hasty zinc
anyone know if there is a way to use banner before pull and keep it?
chrome falcon
on raid bosses? no
hasty zinc
lame. just taunt then banner i guess
strong forum
all buffs combatbuffs get removed when a boss gets pulled
hasty zinc
ah that makes sense. ty
drifting juniper
🙂
i just realized i can do 3 runs per week and in order to buy back pack i need at least 40 runs XD
takes 2 or 3 months
toxic pewter
watching mdi
would be so badass to see a prot warrior come out of nowhere
alas bdk just too powerful
sick sentinel
Prot has been mostly in the shitter this expansion
toxic pewter
Lol i think i saw a chinese team do it
lofty widget
hey, we were there earlier
viral arch
if they show up, anywhere, it'd be TGP
strong forum
we've seen pwar in s1 and s2 for specific dungeons
toxic pewter
a bit ago
viral arch
or very specific cases for dungeons
jagged pier
Prot has been mostly in the shitter this expansion
strong forum
in s3 youre just trolling tho
viral arch
on MDI, there's literally no chance this season
sick sentinel
https://tenor.com/view/no-bugs-bunny-nope-gif-14359850
Vdh was s1
toxic pewter
yeah true
Just so boring seeing the same group comps I hope next time they can be more varied
toxic pewter
gotta see that variation
sick sentinel
Has brew been run at all in the mdi this expansion?
strong forum
brew was never in mdi
jagged pier
brew in mdi KEKW
toxic pewter
I dream of a varied mdi
strong forum
well keep on dreaming
toxic pewter
One day
strong forum
cuz unless perfect balance is achieved
jagged pier
meta slave or u loose
strong forum
it just aint gonna happen
toxic pewter
it can get so close that variation occurs though imo
lofty widget
i mean you could see varied comps if each spec had a niche in specificdungeons
toxic pewter
I can see that happen
lofty widget
like pwar in top earlier
strong forum
which wouldnt mean variety
sick sentinel
Mdi is cringe 
toxic pewter
I guess it is just human nature
lofty widget
right, i guess variety could also mean "this tank in one dungeon, that tank in another"
strong forum
i would count variety as "same dungeon, different comp"
lofty widget
yeah
sick sentinel
Triple stack bm hunters 
toxic pewter
not really complaining i just think it would be more entertaining with competing comps
lofty widget
thats unlikely to happen
toxic pewter
yeah I acknowledge that
sick sentinel
Gotta love the variety in this ToP
Lmao that's funny
Pulls every single trash mob in gorechop wing with no bloodlust
sweet summit
nuts
toxic pewter
why naow playing panda
ohhhhhhhhhhhh right
ingenious tbh lmao
never thought i would see pandas with all this dwarf meta
ya
sick sentinel
sweet summit
kinda isn't good enough against echo
that's a cool damage/healing graph
love that
<@&257983573498265600>
sick sentinel
Bruh
sweet summit
:/
toxic pewter
muted nexus
i have gotten like 7 one handed weapons trying to hunt a pair of non-236 legs to tier 
sweet summit
next run for sure
muted nexus
toxic pewter
Why is nagura wearing sun glasses
minor helm
dawn canyon
wasnt funny anyways
toxic pewter
wasnt funny anyways
no u
distant crystal
so did someone upset Echo yet
lofty widget
+80% is pretty good
fathom stag
😦
ionic fern
60% banner uptime in M+ is pretty good right?
Solid, but plenty of room for improvement.
Remember that it's not all up to you. If your group is bad your banner uptime will suffer.
verbal hill
Any tips for stacking mobs when you're doing a big pull, mine are always parted like the red sea
For example first pull in halls
sweet summit
kick casters so they run to you and slowly backpeddle/wiggle a bit to group them better in melee
distant crystal
can't you line on that little architecture at the top of the stairs
lofty widget
there's a few
there's a small hole you can los in at the 2nd shard, but thats not as useful
distant crystal
that'd be a kinda cool button to give a tank
where you just like hide and become LoS'd from everything
basically slow motion gorefiends
distant crystal
when the turtle race/class comes out
that will be big class fantasy
just hide in your shell
agile pumice
Give us some black dragon ability to put a rock down for los
meager quail
where you just like hide and become LoS'd from everything
Make shield wall work like the frost mage ice wall pvp talent.
agile pumice
And we can troll casters with it
narrow fog
Give us some black dragon ability to put a rock down for los
Casters will never recover.
marsh aurora
Hi, so i've been playing warrior as an alt in season 2, left the game for a few months, and i'm coming back and everyone is straight up spitting on prot warriors, is it fine for key pushing as it is now ? How do you think season 4 will affect it ? thanks
idk if i should go all in on it, if it's just community perception, or if the spec is actually in a bad spot
lofty widget
we're one of the best tanks atm (only below dk), all the spitting is just a combinatin of bad community perception and underrepresentation
it is also the hardest tank tho, but learning it is super rewarding!
sick sentinel
key turned to 18 halls, i don't think i'm gunna be able time this one
chrome falcon
idk if i should go all in on it, if it's just community perception, or if the sp...
as chimmi said, it's a hard tank + bad community perception + no-one plays it
basically the only people who play prot are really good at it, or really bad at it
and there are more of the latter
so most people only get exposed to the bad ones, and not the ones in here doing 14k dps in 20s+
when played well we're basically unkillable and do very respectable damage
marsh aurora
so i'd assume being good at it is mostly having shield block up time and managing rage decently enough to spend it on IP or on revenge / execute ?
and well like any other tanks use big cds when going into big pulls
sweet summit
managing rage as in not overcapping
you generate a metric fuckton of rage with tier+double lego
but yeah
marsh aurora
well IP is capped isn't it ?
sweet summit
you ignore the cap
marsh aurora
if you ignore cap you end up using revenge only with reprisal procs i'm assuming ?
assuming you're actually taking damage obviously
sweet summit
no you still need to pump out a lot of revenge seeing as it is your main damage source and offensive rage spender
tldr you spend excess rage on ignlre pain to avoid overcapping
maintain shield block wheb takibg blockable damage
pump out revenges
oump executes on 1-2 target pulls/on a prio target
holy shit phone typing xd
marsh aurora
do you generate enough to have clsoe to 100 uptime on IP assuming no magical damage is involved ?
cause iirc the dungeons getting re-released for season 4 are very physical
sweet summit
idk never checked ip uptime
lofty widget
you probably can, but it's a pointless metric
drifting fable
IP is a rage dump, not a defensive
marsh aurora
Absorbing all incoming damage sounds defensive enough
sweet summit
but it is tuned poorly
drifting fable
it goes away in like 1-2 melees unfortunately
sweet summit
and is stinky poopoo on its own
lofty widget
it's only good as a defensive atm because we can spam it
marsh aurora
OK so you don't consider it a defensive, but the amount of rage you generate makes it good
lofty widget
but thats not the reason we pressit
marsh aurora
OK makes sense
drifting fable
exactly
sweet summit
and it is only a 50%(55%?) absorb
lofty widget
55 yh
drifting fable
rage spender tho, not generator
sweet summit
and the rage spent heals you through indomitable
there are a lot of synergies within the spec which makes rage management extremely valuable
marsh aurora
I meant the amount of rage you generate from other sources makes it spammable and good cause spammable
chrome falcon
OK makes sense
Ignore pain should basically be treated as "heal for 3.5% max hp, reduce the CD on avatar/SW, get one stack of your tier"
drifting fable
ah yes, that is correct
chrome falcon
You don't press ignore pain for ignore pain
You press it because it's an off-gcd rage dump
And, well, there's nothing else to spend the rage on
drifting fable
good ol stop overcap rage button 
sweet summit
marsh aurora
Revenge spam no good I assume
lofty widget
it is for the most part
chrome falcon
Revenge spam is basically how you play
sweet summit
gcd exists
chrome falcon
But you're underestimating your rage generation
sweet summit
so not alwaya
cinder storm
As long as you have defensives up yeah
marsh aurora
Wait do you generate that much
chrome falcon
It's literally over 1k per minute if you play right and have CDs
sweet summit
yes
lofty widget
you should avg 1-1.2k rage/min in m+ at least
marsh aurora
Uuuh OK
marsh aurora
Yeah if i spammed revenge or ip in season 2 I'd be rage starved outside of cds
So I just didn't
sweet summit
good thing you can almost always have cds now
couple people here reaching insane banner uptime
and that leads to insane avatar uptime too
etc
cinder storm
I mean, after I saw Tatt doing 87% (during spiteful) on ToP, 90%-97% on m+ seems pretty realistic for those top tier warriors
drifting fable
does that guy still play codex
lofty widget
this is one of my personal bests 
cinder storm
He does, his choice
drifting fable
lofty widget
he's just playing on hardmode
cinder storm
this is one of my personal bests <:gladge:963970137701109820>
top tier king
marsh aurora
What's codex
lofty widget
gotta respect it
cinder storm
we dont talk about codex
marsh aurora
I'm completely lost on new items
sweet summit
tank trinket from streets
drifting fable
trinket. pretty bad for pwar. check pins to see why
marsh aurora
That's not the damage reflect is it
dawn canyon
What's codex
not worth thinking about
sweet summit
that people thought was good
drifting fable
it is indeed
cinder storm
hell, even bdk discords advices people to not run it
sweet summit
for some reason
drifting fable
its good for vdh iirc
dawn canyon
codex is like a low ilvl shield, playable but kinda shit
drifting fable
and them only
marsh aurora
I got it on my vdh 278 first Vault but
I thought it was absolute bis run this + scale and you're a god blabla
cinder storm
You can run high keys with it, again, Tatt is a great example of it, its not bad but there are better things for sure
marsh aurora
Thought it was the new scale + cheat death combo
sweet summit
nah
marsh aurora
From season 1
cinder storm
old warrior soul
sweet summit
scale is alright
lofty widget
phial + aegis atm is prob bis for the season
assuming you need a def trinket
which most ppl dont
sweet summit
would not touch any other tank trinket from current cobtent though
marsh aurora
I would need 3 if I could tbh
cinder storm
You can safely pug your way to 22s with dps trinkets only
sweet summit
why is that you think
marsh aurora
The ip spam might compensate for the PF dots
cinder storm
magic dmg was busted, they fixed several adds cast times, HoA season 1 was terrible for pwar
sweet summit
20 sec sr
lofty widget
last boss top in shambles
sweet summit
marsh aurora
last boos ToP was actually fun to play iirc
just because of the SR damage
the rest of the dungeon makes me wanna kms on a regular basis but that last boss was satisfying
dawn canyon
top good
sweet summit
ToP is a great dungeon for us wdym
dawn canyon
top fuck good
marsh aurora
oh i don't mean for prot war specifically
i just don't like the dungeon itself but taht's just personal taste
marsh aurora
i feel like i''m running around more than i'm actually playing
dawn canyon
dos
cinder storm
dos is okayish with wo now
distant crystal
dos should give perma wo buff w hen you're on the ring
cinder storm
blizz takes into account walkback for dungeon time, but what if, they just did shorter dungeons like mists
distant crystal
cause running fast is fun
cinder storm
its not fun to run around for 40 mins
dawn canyon
halls with proper graveyards would be so cool
cinder storm
I wanna pull someday mobs behind the first boss in halls
all those mobs there and no one has ever cared to do them
aside from mdi format
distant crystal
the upstairs?
distant crystal
killed those plenty in s1 when everybody's route sucked
not missing much lol
but prob p fun for the uncapped boys
marsh aurora
the small ones are really fun to kill 😄
dawn canyon
this is so sad
languid carbon
Why? 🤔
dawn canyon
codex
sweet summit
+15 agility
drifting fable
no int enchant? smh
open bluff
Whats the socket in the helm?
mastery
marsh aurora
Oh reprisal has moved from legs to feet
drifting fable
ye. better for tier
marsh aurora
If I'm not mythic raiding can I keep unity on waist and reprisal on legs?
And still get my tier
cinder storm
unity on head for socket or chest
sweet summit
but unity on head/chest will be more stats
open bluff
but unity on head/chest will be more stats
head/chest/legs have the same stat budget
cinder storm
reprisal on feet, bc you gotta charge fast
marsh aurora
Do you guys run mostly haste or mostly vers?
sweet summit
oh shit ur right actually
drifting fable
haste is preferred
sweet summit
doesn't really matter in this case
open bluff
what matters is getting tier really, if you can get it without using legs, then yeah keep reprisal on legs
sweet summit
only factor then is secondary stats on tier if you care
marsh aurora
I'll recraft if I gets legs before the other tier pieces
open bluff
also keep catalyst converter in mind
sweet summit
legs are haste crit, chest is crit mastery(?) and head is haste vers
open bluff
can convert your m+ gear and still upgrade it if it's not already 278
marsh aurora
Huh chest sucks
sweet summit
doesn't suck
marsh aurora
can convert your m+ gear and still upgrade it if it's not already 278
That's what I'll do, I just have't started yet, camebaxk to my druid first cause it's just easier
drifting fable
secondaries are kinda whatever for us anyways
open bluff
legs are haste crit, chest is crit mastery(?) and head is haste vers
chest is haste/mastery actually, gloves are the piece without haste
marsh aurora
i like vers cause i'm bad
drifting fable
you can succeed without desperately min maxing them
sweet summit
i was so close
stuck crown
so with first tech being poop for us whats a good setup trinket wise these days? scale + dps trinket?
stuck crown
oh yeh duh, m+
sick sentinel
if you don't do raids, scale and your choice trinket, (probably phial or something)
blazing condor
depends on what keys you do but if you're trying to push high then aegis/scale + RDM/OWS/whatever dps really
drifting fable
high apm spec 
grizzled lotus
M+ is kind of eluding me; at high key levels how much Ignore Pain are you guys needing to press in order to feel tough? I'm 278 ilvl and I feel like if I mash Revenge in an 18 I die
drifting fable
IP is not whats is going to save you
SB is
if youre getting rolled you probably have bad blocked hits%
grizzled lotus
yeah my uptime is near 100% with mashing intervene/charge/leap out charge etc
I guess that's a good question too, how often are you having to hardcast Shield Block? most rage is going towards IP or Revenge?
drifting fable
you should only have to cast SB in melee
otherwise yes revenge spam is where its at
you should view IP as a way to not overcap rage
grizzled lotus
hrmmm okay
grizzled lotus
so yeah during the pepega Banner times you can mash it to stay under maximum
stuck rock
You are probably already doing it but always use outburst on shield slam
grizzled lotus
Yeah, I'm using Last Stand conduit, Booming Voice etc so I can spike my rage really hard
Yeah
drifting fable
put IP on a very easy to spam key
grizzled lotus
Yeah it is haha
drifting fable
grizzled lotus
mmk more practice then
drifting fable
only way to see what else might be amiss is a log
stuck rock
In a 18 its probably casters that hurt you without even realizing it
grizzled lotus
Yeah this group I was in was garbage
like 7.4k dps BM hunter, 100 dps Holy Priest
trying to Shockwave/Reflect the casters in part 2 of Gambit etc
drifting fable
those guys do chunk tbf
grizzled lotus
I only did 10.6k but I feel that's probably way way lower than I should be getting even with a group that bad
but maybe not
stuck rock
Its probably just the casters in a pull with more melee damage and less casters youre health just doesnt go down in a 18
grizzled lotus
felt like I couldn't spam Revenge so if I can fix those other things then maybe I can get closer to that
drifting fable
remember to use SR too :D
grizzled lotus
yup, SR is my favorite button in maybe the whole game
it's agony telling people to stop kicking Aleez
stuck rock
That satisfying sound when the reflects go off
grizzled lotus
wa-bash
drifting fable
haha alot of classes dont really realize you have it tbh
the number of times the healer wouldnt dispel on 4th boss NW because im standing there 
grizzled lotus
oh crap that works? so they can dispel your melee friend who has the debuff and you're chillin
drifting fable
yup
stuck rock
Btw I got told in a key you can sr muezhalas slams
grizzled lotus
I play mostly Fury so I knew about the "leap so you don't go down" hack
stuck rock
Is that a thing?
drifting fable
you sure can
stuck rock
Does it reflect damage or you just dont take damage?
drifting fable
it should reflect iirc????
grizzled lotus
Document says Deflect
but you can also Deflect Soulcrusher so that's likely better
but maybe not since you are already blocking the hit (Soulcrusher does dot damage based on how hard it hit you)
stuck rock
Like in 3rd boss DoS when you reflect the explosion you dont take damage but dont deal any back to the boss
grizzled lotus
Yeah the Reflectable doc says Master of Death is "deflectable" which means no damage happens anywhere
vs. Reflecting Mordretha's Reaping Scythe which is a true reflect
stuck rock
But do you deal damage to him back with it
grizzled lotus
no
stuck rock
Oh I see
stuck rock
Which bosses are reflectable like top last boss?
grizzled lotus
stuck rock
Thanks
drifting fable
one of my favorite SR interactions is that if you engage 2nd boss SD by yourself with the rest of your party a little behind, he will castigate you only and you can SR it
for the 1st one anyways
grizzled lotus
Yeah
oh I guess another actual prot question
does Indomitable just carry our self-healing? or do we require more maintenance healing than other tanks
coming from BDK/VDH/Brew it seems like maybe yes?
stuck rock
IP carries hps
drifting fable
indom carries for sure. our up front mitigation is the best ofc so it only makes sense that if you play correctly you technically wont need alot of healing
grizzled lotus
the best, ok
then yeah I gotta do better then
I feel hilariously tough on the other three but fragile on my most geared character
so definitely me messing up somewhere
drifting fable
logs
stuck rock
Opposite is true for me banner prot is insanely tanky for some reason
Compared to my brew and bear
grizzled lotus
Brew is my main so it's probably a comfort thing
drifting fable
well banner gives 20%+ str while active
grizzled lotus
idk about bear/paladin
drifting fable
so it does make you pretty tanky
stuck rock
Plus the mastery
drifting fable
pwar is certainly the hardest tank to play well in this xpac
grizzled lotus
Yeah if the 4piece gave us a 200 rage maximum or something it would help a lot lmao
stuck rock
Im looking forward for s4 for the ilvl boost, with more strength the banner boost is going to be even bigger
drifting fable
scaled up OWS and Aegis 
grizzled lotus
"no excuse" to not be full 272 equiv lel
Yeah the worst part about Valor capping is being "afraid" that you will rip that slot in vault and waste 2 weeks of effort
so you feel like you can't spend it unless it's a Tuesday and then you're still worried
stuck rock
Not a prot question but does anyone know how the raids are going to work? Do you need a guild or you can sort of queue/pug? I only want the tokens for the trinkets
grizzled lotus
I think you can do LFR for dinars
they said they were gonna lower the amount of bosses needed per week to get a dinar down to 5 or something
drifting fable
that is true
grizzled lotus
but then to actually upgrade the items you need to do heroic/mythic raid
I think mythic raid bosses let you upgrade the base shitter version to mythic, etc
open bluff
so you feel like you can't spend it unless it's a Tuesday and then you're still ...
meh, only time i don't spend valor is monday, and even then if i'm worried about replacing a given slot i just upgrade rings since i have both crit/haste rings and the odds are against me getting those at 278 with sockets 
stuck rock
I hope its not to hard to upgrade as a guildless tank
drifting fable
if they dont change the tuning you should be able to pug all HCs no issue
SOTFO is a joke atm
stuck rock
Yeah
Its just that I have a hard time finding decent guilds in need for a tank and I dont enjoy playing dps. So I felt I was losing out in keys in s2 by having no guild by missing out on domination shards etc
drifting fable
eternal tank struggle
stuck rock
open bluff
I hope its not to hard to upgrade as a guildless tank
i'm 260 two weeks into working on my prot warr without a guild
just gotta forge ahead with keys and not be afraid to run your own
stuck rock
I meant for the raid trinkets in s4
Im more than used to the pug life
I really want ows
odd tree
so almost nothing is blockable/reflectable for the jailer?! helping out the guild by subbing in for a heroic jailer kill and looking over Sense's spreadsheet.
lofty widget
even if it's not reflectable you still get 20 % magic dr from SR
odd tree
good point
lofty widget
and youre blocking his melees which is the biggest chunk of your damage taken
dawn canyon
more prot loggery in #449510248579858432
jagged pier
sick sentinel
i was just very happy that i had a vault from like a month ago before i started again, and it still let me choose something (someone talking about vault earlier
mighty valley
My banner conduit has been underleveled this whole fuckin time...
I guess I should just close out 20s but I'm confused that I haven't seen it drop from this many pantheon kills, thought it was basically guaranteed
chrome falcon
i went kyrian to pad and that was the only time i saw the cov conduit drop 🙂
balmy canyon
I had the banner conduit drop the day before I finished my 3k, its way more rare than it should be
sick sentinel
hey I was wondering when doing high keys do you always need a ww monk? i get it for mob control to bring one, but was curious was all if it was a must to bring one.
mighty valley
definitely don't need a ww monk
shut summit
nop
lime urchin
Bring a friend instead!
modern brook
Imagine having friends
sick sentinel
pushing to get to 25 keys
monks are good for mob control but also because they’re the only necro in the meta comp
assuming you’re playing necro you definitely don’t need one
but they do good dam anyway
dawn canyon
You can get away with an arcane mage if theyre good lmao
urban portal
hey I was wondering when doing high keys do you always need a ww monk? i get it ...
You don’t NEED any spec until 30s
Critcake does 26s with enh shaman and ret pal back in 9.1
hasty zinc
beyond like 35% haste unbuffed, how valuable is haste for longer banners and survival? I rerolled to pwar for mjailer 🤦♂️ and I'm curious whether im inting by putting on dps trinkets.. my banner uptime is low (50-70%) but increasing as me and the raid become more familiar with the fight. my options rn attached. maybe i soleah crit or something. I looked through a bunch of logs and people seem very divided.. like all stats are good, but what will get in the way of the cooldown frequency I need to get through p2 blasts without much external help. I could also swap to the wall, but lower sb uptime feelsbad. Only a handful of attempts in p2, so not much to compare with personal exp.
verbal hill
Whats better a socket or avoidance stat?
median tulip
Whats better a socket or avoidance stat?
If you have a reasonable possibility of getting a socket onto the item from a future Vault, then avoidance is irreplaceable
chilly brook
beyond like 35% haste unbuffed, how valuable is haste for longer banners and su...
Keep going haste
You’re not inting on haste until past 40% unbuffed
strong forum
beyond like 35% haste unbuffed, how valuable is haste for longer banners and su...
Haste itself isn't that relevant when it comes to banner uptime but More is always better
chilly brook
And we’re talking without ITF
strong forum
Itf makes more haste even better
lethal tapir
Were there any changes to Prot Warrior recently or why are there so many Prot Warriors recently?
cobalt seal
Because people stopped being blind?
open bluff
the hivemind realized they were wrong
cobalt seal
lethal tapir
In what regard? xD
sweet summit
prot good
open bluff
prot been good, prot just better with 4p
lethal tapir
hmmm 😄
open bluff
but requires more effort than other tanks
kind veldt
Is there any good source about tips with Reprisal legendary? In raid, I feel like I never get any value out of it except for charging right before tank swap.
open bluff
set co-tank as focus, intervene on cd if it won't case you to waste any rage
more use for you, less damage taken for them
median tulip
Is there any good source about tips with Reprisal legendary? In raid, I feel lik...
Learn how far you can be from each boss and still be in melee with them. Some bosses are surprisingly large, and players tend to stand inside their hit boxes, which make charge weaving harder
kind veldt
Oh...simple solution.
I'm normally arms, just helping out, maybe switching for s4. Hope that's an legit excuse xD
Thank you!
open bluff
also don't be afraid to leap out and charge back in if it won't mess up positioning
charge and intervene are on separate cds
devout heron
Were there any changes to Prot Warrior recently or why are there so many Prot Wa...
most tanks play dk anyway, i see prot warriors as much as i see other non meta tanks
open bluff
honestly brm and prot pal seem to be the most common non-bdk tanks out there in my laps around oribos
median tulip
And learn which mechanics the boss does will make them stop whilst casting; those are good moments to charge weave
jagged pier
Is there any good source about tips with Reprisal legendary? In raid, I feel lik...
charge before u taunt, charge during move away mechanics, intervene co tank while your tanking
u can even leap and charge back while your tanking
if your fast enough
chrome falcon
Is there any good source about tips with Reprisal legendary? In raid, I feel lik...
which bosses specifically are you thinking about? there are only 1 or 2 where reprisal is actually awkward
toxic pewter
what everyone favorite tank spec other than prot warr if you had to pick
sweet summit
probably naowh, he's really good
toxic pewter
tank spec
sweet summit
bdk
sweet summit
also that
chrome falcon
it's a pity that the only time prot has been best in m+
was when it had zero skill expression
sweet summit
was very fun
chrome falcon
yeah would just be cool to see what naowh and guys like that could do on prot atm
sweet summit
oh for sure
strong forum
Andy said that pwar gets unfair representation and that they could easily get 4k
Which is true
But it's just too hard to play
jagged pier
median tulip
what everyone favorite tank spec other than prot warr if you had to pick
I hate DK, I've bounced off Pally several times, and I got a Druid to 60 only to realise I hated all 4 specs... I do have Monk and DH both at 60, and of the 2 I would (narrowly) say DH
But Protection Warrior is the best
toxic pewter
Yah I think my 2nd favorite is vdh... followed by bear and brew
i hope vdh can play without having to use spirit bomb in df.. i do not like spirit bomb personally
kind veldt
which bosses specifically are you thinking about? there are only 1 or 2 where re...
atm we are only talking Rygelon HC. Still doing progress there (yeah, we ain't that prolevel :-D)
chrome falcon
yeah so on that boss you just run out and charge/IV whenever you're not tanking
same for basically every boss
the only ones where it's kind of hard/annoying are pantheon and lords
marsh aurora
Bear is really fun but going back to 3 minutes Incarn without uhr is gonna suck
topaz field
writing how fun bear is in prot war discord is like telling picasso that graffiti is art
toxic pewter
Graffiti is art
lusty tiger
It’s like saying the way your shit fell into the toilet is an artpiece
narrow fog
It’s like saying the way your shit fell into the toilet is an artpiece
I had a giant artpiece this morning then 🙂
toxic pewter
One man’s work of art is another man’s work of shit
sick sentinel
I can't believe i read that entire story, what a shitty story
toxic pewter
MDI final championship day starting
narrow fog
MDI final championship day starting
I don't have time to watch it sadly
It is probably very interesting to watch, seeing what 5 great players together can do
With no stragglers
drifting juniper
guys
something weird, on my dh when i shapeshift
night fae one
i get silenced, i can't cast any spells, it says i'm in shapeshift form, i have to dispel it with right click
so weird
toxic pewter
What you guys think of Nerf’s prot warrior DF wishlist
chrome falcon
absolutely terrible
vocal bison
<3
chrome falcon
there are 2 or 3 things on that list that aren't fucking stupid
vocal bison
We need 2 hander and shield for prot for flavor
toxic pewter
Ya I agree I don’t like his wishlist at all to be honest
vocal bison
I want mass spell reflect back for pvp
chrome falcon
literally just a long winded way of saying "i miss when prot was broken"
hazy edge
meh, no, meh, yes, yes, meh, meh, no, sure but no shot they do that, no just make indom 2%, sure
chrome falcon
the unstoppable force playstyle was giga lame
hazy edge
legit 3 okay things in there
sick sentinel
i think the more importanter thing to take away here is that we want also to have critical shield block feels good, and also that slam doesn't feel like a wet noodle without CD's
drifting juniper
Reprisal baseline is legit
toxic pewter
Does anyone actually want reprisal to return?
chrome falcon
no
lofty widget
meh
chrome falcon
fuck reprisal
drifting juniper
i do, i like it a lot
lofty widget
was fun while it lasted
sick sentinel
charge no minimum
chrome falcon
name one other tank
who has to work as hard
for basic mitigation
monk doesn't even have to press buttons for their mitigation
toxic pewter
Like we all agree reprisal is fine and all but we are ready to move on. At least I am
dawn canyon
I love reprisal and I do not want it in 10.0
mobility for dam/defensives is shit
drifting juniper
yeah but this game has gotten so easy that you can play any class, so why not there ba think that is more involved
drifting juniper
there should be a diffrence between gdruid and warrior
chrome falcon
very very very rare exceptions
drifting juniper
if you want more involvment in a tank there shouldb e a class
blood dk heart strike spam is meh
sick sentinel
i don't want to hit IP on repeate
hazy edge
I'd be okay if they added rage gen to intervene baseline, but that's about all I'd want
dawn canyon
20 rage on int is cool
sick sentinel
thats my number 2 gripe behind class fantasy
drifting juniper
i myself only came to play warrior only because of the active playstyle
lofty widget
leech during avatar sounds interesting, or if not that some other type of defensive benefit from it
drifting juniper
i learned it here, so 3 weeks
toxic pewter
I think they should merge last stand and bolster and make it baseline.
sick sentinel
impending victory base line
toxic pewter
Yeah reprisal gotta go. It was fine/whatever while it lasted
dawn canyon
leech during avatar sounds interesting, or if not that some other type of defens...
put it on LS instead
lofty widget
or that yeh
hazy edge
impending victory base line
it'd need to be nerfed slightly but agree
drifting juniper
yeah but mattacate, you should realize your main is going to be alt for some people and they have to consider flavor in their game,
5 diffrent tanks, diffrent dps
sick sentinel
heal on CD since we have no external heal garunteed
chrome falcon
?
nah that's dumb
classes should be designed to be fun for the entire expansion
not fun for people who play them for a few weeks at the end
hazy edge
leech on LS or Avatar is 100% good
vocal bison
2H + shield, make it badass, we're just stronger than the scrawny prot pallies.
drifting juniper
i didn't say that, i said classes should be diffrent, i don't think prot warrior had the spotlight anywhere in shadowlands which sucked for the players that mained it, but i tried all tanks and none of them was as much fun
dawn canyon
ok but regardless of spotlight or nto
dawn canyon
playing the same thing for 2 years
toxic pewter
Apparently crafted 2h weapons take up 2 slots each. May see fury warriors going back to 1h perhaps
dawn canyon
is a tad boring at some point
drifting juniper
and don't forget bringing reprisal as talent means you can either play it or not
specially with new talent system
sick sentinel
Apparently crafted 2h weapons take up 2 slots each. May see fury warriors going ...
thats fair
dawn canyon
its one of those "not really a choice" points like the kick for dk
vocal bison
I hope we keep spear going into next expac
dawn canyon
sick sentinel
how you gunna have a dude running around with 2 legendary crafted swords, + helmet, chest shoulders
chrome falcon
3 months
now it's just fucking exhausting
yeah uh
maybe you can choose whether you want to or not
if reprisal is the best talent
it's not a choice
not if you're doing serious content
if we have gaps in our block uptime
taking block talents will be mandatory
sick sentinel
it could be 1.5 legos worth? so u take 3.0 slots worth by doing titan grip
sick sentinel
then u get 2 weapons, and 2 legos
toxic pewter
I think remove reprisal and give us bolster baseline. Will help solve shield block gaps
chrome falcon
the best suggestion on there is putting LS back on AM and re-adding bolster
lofty widget
it was very cool
chrome falcon
that was pretty much the only skill that BFA took
was figuring out how close you were to bolster
lofty widget
SB>SB>SB>LS>SB>SB
drifting juniper
reprisal is a way of play and it won't be removed imo, maybe they put it in a branch you can skip
toxic pewter
the best suggestion on there is putting LS back on AM and re-adding bolster
Yeah exactly. I really think bolster is key to shield block issues when reprisal goes away. Or if they go a diff way entirely
sick sentinel
nerfed pvp dragon charge is clearly thematic and class fantasy
its too OP as it is
chrome falcon
yeah i dunno everyone in here who played reprisal for the entire last year
absolutely hates it
if we have to play it for another 2 years i'm just rerolling i think
lofty widget
kinda same for banner
drifting juniper
i saw mm hunter talents, each unique playsytle that it had all over shadowlands
is available
chrome falcon
yeah chimmi same
vocal bison
reprisal was literally created as a bandaid
chrome falcon
^
toxic pewter
I think even blizzard realizes reprisal is not really a carry forward legendary. It was added just to get prot warrior to a playable state… it was a bandaid legendary
vocal bison
i hope they don't make that the permanent way of dealing with shield block
hazy edge
Honestly, my only wish for the DF tree is that we can keep SB up w/o a ton of work
chrome falcon
yeah
hazy edge
if they do that I'll be like 80% happy
drifting juniper
meh, might aswell make shield block cooldown green
lofty widget
it is? assuming you mean hasted
sick sentinel
i would want to play reprisal + HR
hazy edge
meh, might aswell make shield block cooldown green
it is
toxic pewter
sick sentinel
that seems like fun
toxic pewter
Reprisal is not even fun it’s become a chore
chrome falcon
if reprisal was just a dps increase
of some kind
it'd be very fun
but yeah
only smart thing i've ever seen apb say
it's a chore
toxic pewter
Reprisal is a band aid legendary to begin with. It has no carryover potential
hazy edge
Honestly, if they just reduce SB base cd from 16sec to like 12sec and kept it hasted that'd be enough
chrome falcon
nah honestly i think just make it so we can take HR
without losing our most important talent
hazy edge
^
urban portal
Yeah that works too
hazy edge
that works too
toxic pewter
I agree the last stand back into AM and bolster felt better to me
urban portal
Though I don’t feel like shield block should have 100% uptime
hazy edge
Also devastator needs to be easy access
urban portal
Shield block is the only active mitigation that does anything
hazy edge
if it isn't imma riot
vocal bison
or what if they tied shield block as an effect of shield slam like a beefy heavy repercussions, makes shield block fun
chrome falcon
well yeah hek i think that might be part of the problem
like
shield block is so strong
but we're so pathetic without it
drifting juniper
main problem is they made the spec bland, it doesn't have a build that can like sacrifice some tanking and do serious damage like paladin, or insane self healing, or some proc like dh legendary on neck
drifting juniper
even if oyu do the numbers, gets a bit predictable
toxic pewter
Shield block has always been most fun to be able to reach or get close to 100% with good and proper play. I think that spirit of the ability should carry forward.
sick sentinel
heroic strike for rage dump dps pump
drifting juniper
devestator talent baseline, does it even make sense to cast that ability