yeah but not needed
#protection
lofty widget
shut summit
play AM
lofty widget
and you can get 90+ without anyway
stuck kite
What is the stronginess of AM
lofty widget
30-40 sec cd on avatar, 1 mincd on wall
lofty widget
it's preference
stuck kite
ok
hearty perch
Yeah i know, but i cant use it on wow analyser
lofty widget
Yeah i know, but i cant use it on wow analyser
its just a bug probably. delete your combatlog file and restart logging
just from a glance tho youre wasting quite a lot of rage, and also not pressing your buttons on cd. if youre gonna overcap on rage just slam IP even if the shield is already maxxed
forest fern
Hello, my guild prog on Heroic Tygelon. I wonder what kind of cd you guys use to soak the orb (Unstable Core) downstairs phase?
dark lark
Shield Wall, Fleshcraft
lofty widget
Hello, my guild prog on Heroic Tygelon. I wonder what kind of cd you guys use to...
SW is enough
forest fern
even im not full hp?
lofty widget
well you should be. is your cotank taunting the boss when you soak?
forest fern
yes, im soak the first one... so i tank the boss until he cast the corrupted strikes. then my cotank taunt him and move him to second orb
lofty widget
well SW should technically be enough but if youre in doubt just call for externals or FC on top
forest fern
ok, thank for answer my question!
celest glade
when taking damage isn't an issue at all (15's full geared) and it's tons of cleave, is revenge leggo better?
lofty widget
i think it's marginally better, but you have to really play around it, ie pull mobs on bosses and huge pulls etc
and banner uptime gets more difficult as well since you dont have the rage from reprisal
celest glade
i haven't tanked at all this tier but the set bonus looks cool af and necro being best is awesome
was curious how things have changed
lofty widget
yup we're in a very good spot atm
grave crane
Yeah I SW and pop a hearthstone if I’m low or FC each one for rygelon
safe thistle
Hello, my guild prog on Heroic Tygelon. I wonder what kind of cd you guys use to...
its physical dmg a shield wall and IP work fine
cinder nova
sick sentinel
yeah this is pretty much just a farm baby keys for valor week for me
still need a haste belt, but that involves DOS for bis one.... bleh... or streets would do, dungeon decanter or afe/phial i'd farm out, could use a 2h weapon or 2 i guess
pallid quiver
Yeah I SW and pop a hearthstone if I’m low or FC each one for rygelon
I know you meant healthstone, but I can't help but imagine just, "'Aight, you all wanna play this game? Then fuck it, I'm outtie 2000, later nerds" and bam, just hearth out like a Paladin who had someone target them for at least 0.025 seconds
sick sentinel
heartening out of a keystone is reserved for only the worst keys possible
like, uh, anomaly keys that is huge giant fuck up, 2 ppl left on first pull something
or like you wipe 7 times to final boss or any boss really
I call those things lock stones or cookie or Crack rock
thorny sierra
Anima Field Emitter vs Codex of The First Technique, which one is better provided both of it is the same iLvl?
robust rover
AFE
thorny sierra
Yeah, huge STR loss when I equipped Codex
ionic fern
sick sentinel
Why is it so hard to interrupt
Tfw ele shaman has less interrupts than the warlock
zenith path
how do you intervene your focus target with a macro? i tried substituting spells with tricks/md and it didnt help
i meant i had a tricks/md macro that worked on focus target before but when i tried substituting intervene it didnt work
sly pike
I just left click the party frame , have intervene set to that
ionic fern
Why is it so hard to interrupt
DPS don't get smacked if they don't interrupt..so they don't do it.
If casts were going off on random targets people would interrupt more to save themselves.
ionic fern
how do you intervene your focus target with a macro? i tried substituting spells...
I haven't looked into macros in a while but something like...
#showtooltip
/cast [target, help, exists] Intervene
/cast [target=focus] Intervene
So if you have a friendly target it intervenes them. If no friendly target it intervenes your focus target.
zenith path
exactly what i needed thanks mate
sick sentinel
DPS don't get smacked if they don't interrupt..so they don't do it.
I wouldn't mind so much if most adds were just casting on me, but dungeons like spires, ToP, sanguine depths ain't no joke with the mobs in there
ionic fern
I don't mind mobs casting on me either..IF DPS'ers actually interrupted.
That's why i liked my paladin.
Just do everything yourself.
sick sentinel
One of the reasons why I like paladins, they have a lot of utility for keys
But I cant forsake my warrior
lavish oracle
2 stuns and a fear honestly feels like huge utility in pugs when people just refuse to kick anything :P
Though, I guess pally is unbeatable when it comes to interrupts
The fact that the shaman of all people had the least kicks irritates me
onyx vessel
seismic + spear 
onyx vessel
Oops, wrong discord
lavish oracle
I think most people don't have spear anymore
lavish oracle
I still run spear on fort tho because my necro needs work
lavish oracle
Won't I get trucked when SB is down
lavish oracle
Lol
lavish oracle
Might be doable with druid if I just call for bark to fill in the mitigqtion gaps :P
onyx vessel
+3 it so 
ionic fern
Might be doable with druid if I just call for bark to fill in the mitigqtion gap...
You can do it without any issues...
onyx vessel
🙈
onyx vessel
spear + seismic is amusing tho
lavish oracle
There's still sb downtime
onyx vessel
onyx vessel
unless HR is used
ionic fern
unless HR is used
From the class design pov.
lavish oracle
Sure, but it's few and far between with reprisal
onyx vessel
not BDK which gets spooned 80% parry 40% str prema
lavish oracle
Or bolster
lavish oracle
Could kite during mitigation downtime but I'd rather do less damage than kite every other pack tbh
onyx vessel
kiting 
ionic fern
I mean
I did a +18 Mists
With 62% SB up-time
And i barely went below 50% hp...
I legit just spammed Revenge 24/7
lavish oracle
I'm sure its doable, I just don't like playing squishy, generally
onyx vessel
uptime doesnt matter when you run with people who use there whole kits
aka cc/interrupts
ionic fern
But you aren't "squishy"...just use your other defensives.
You got DS/SW/IP spam+mastery from Banner/Glory...
onyx vessel
i basically use rally off cd
jagged pier
i mean if u play way u dont need a second leggo
onyx vessel
free hp
jagged pier
did 21 Halls without unity because it bugged
onyx vessel
glory all you need
jagged pier
still timed with 7 mins left
lavish oracle
I'm sure you could complete a reasonbly high key with 0 leggos
I also don't want to do that
onyx vessel
probably still had better banner uptime then me
gonna have to learn for next xpac
when they give us no borrowed power
lavish oracle
They're gonna bake some of them into our talents, for sure
onyx vessel
unbalanced
lavish oracle
They already did it with mannoroth's bracers
ionic fern
when they give us no borrowed power
Nice one.
lavish oracle
I imagine TGV will end up as a talent
ionic fern
Borrowed power isn't bad per-se..borrowed power becomes bad if it is the "backbone" of the class to work properly.
onyx vessel
nerfed version could work aint that strong
lavish oracle
I'm interested to see if BFA warrior comes back in full force next xpac
onyx vessel
give us BFA warrior minus the mastery bonus from avatar
just the AM
never gonna happen tho
lavish oracle
I imagine one of the components will be part of a choice node if they want to keep it from coming back
lavish oracle
AM/Bolster in the same node or something
onyx vessel
art > sounds > gameplay > class balance
onyx matrix
Dps prot bahahaha
jagged pier
highest dps tank on ST so yes
onyx matrix
Dps prot warr pvp in dragonflight
stuck kite
Is this a macro that skip the placement of ravager
like just placing it on us or directly on mouse position
pallid quiver
i'm half asleep so i'm not sure if it's a shitpost or not, so I'll just ask
Are you asking for a macro for Ravager that either drops it at your feet or your cursor?
pallid quiver
Was gonna say, I think it only works if you abuse the macro system
I remember reading something like that
If you are being serious, you can also combine the two functions into the same macro with the mod:(modifier key here) option
/cast [mod:alt,@cursor][@player] Ravager```something like that would cast it at cursor if you hold alt to press, at your feet otherwise
zenith path
how do you rotate cds for spires 3rd boss?
verbal hill
Pop them all on pull to not waste uptime
blazing condor
i assume he meant defensives for orb-soaking
lofty widget
how do you rotate cds for spires 3rd boss?
use a trinket/demo+LS and ravager when you start soaking so you have rage to spam IP, then when you have 10 stacks with 8 sec left on duration pop SW, with 5 sec left pop SR as well
torpid gull
How do you play ToP / SD this week (also routewise)? So fu bad with inspiring
verbal hill
i assume he meant defensives for orb-soaking
Me too
lofty widget
How do you play ToP / SD this week (also routewise)? So fu bad with inspiring
you can nuke inspired in most cases, but if you cant just cc and play with the next pack or take it s olo after
it sucks but thats inspiring
no need to change routes imo
jagged pier
i literally both of those yersterday at like 20 and 21 and did my normal route
was no issue
torpid gull
i literally both of those yersterday at like 20 and 21 and did my normal route
With CC or bursting the mob? Dunno, but in 21 SD the ticks infront of the first Boss just fucked us up
jagged pier
didnt cc anything
theres 1 pack a consider ccing and thats the first pack in mists maze if u have to go straight as there are 2 tenders
topaz field
@sick sentinel its super fine only 2 tender dont work as jakey said
other times the tender is always inspired and u jsut have to make sure to purge the shaper
and ofc on higher keys its not a thing to let the cats through as they oneshot eventually
sick sentinel
need to farm more valor, got a 249 phial last night, dk in the group was very quick to ask if i needed it lol
grave crane
Hell yeah dude congrats I’m still using anima decanter I think
sick sentinel
2000 valor to upgrade this trinket to full
strong forum
I spent 4k valor on decanter just for the fuck of it
And then I got opc like 1 day later
jagged pier
minor helm
sick sentinel
I was spending valor on viscera because i needed a str trinket for arms or fury lost like 300dmg or dps on mastery from going to random str trinket to bombs
and now the phial has dropped, kinda glad AFE didnt drop just now or id be wastin points on that too...
chrome falcon
yogi really likes viscera
minor helm
robust rover
Can we get some more prot war sux videos/comments?
That last buff to exe was not enough 😉
jagged pier
well looking over a week isnt very representative
lucky i already did this last week so we knew already
👍
robust rover
Just matching the wowhead graphs, except withtanks 🙂
grave crane
Lol don’t show that to anyone. We’re still on life support I’m still ripping threat from VDH Co-tank
grave crane
Bro I heard some YouTubers say prot is bad so we prolly need a fat buff and execute feels bad too
bleak scroll
How dependant should I be on my healer? I started tanking on my warr recently (2 hours ago) and I feel very reliant on my healer, even more than on my monk with high stagger
robust rover
Jailer looks even funnier
LOLZ!
jagged pier
well, u cant really heal yourself, but u should be mitigating far more than any other tank
so kinda but also not really
🤷
if you really struggling your probably playing incorrectly
robust rover
How dependant should I be on my healer? I started tanking on my warr recently (2...
IDK, I have such a low EHRPS that I can live a long time without heals under normal circumstances. Most healers I know love healing me because I'm so easy.
grave crane
Which is understandable as playing correctly requires a bit of getting used to. Press SB use charge and intervene on CD
sick sentinel
i should practice on some low dos keys for my 17 in bag
bleak scroll
Good luck with the shadowcores when noone is focusing the inspiring mob
bleak scroll
What leggo do you run?
strong forum
Only when like 1 mechanic went off that shouldn't, you get like 1 heal or smth and then chill from there on out again
Well reprisal ofc
You don't play anything else
cinder storm
If we all cry like dks did maybe they will over buff us, just let them keep thinking that we sux
sick sentinel
started a +5 streets, told them i was updating (which was true, windows and game) and so OF COURSE, i didn't wait long enough and nvidia updates while the key starts, so i lose 2 minutes to that, get back in, first trash pack already dead, warrior dies on next packs, 4 man it, basically solod it
i just, zoned into the dungeon portal before it updated, shoulda waited the 10 seconds and he start the key due to he sees me zone in lol, oh well
strong forum
I don't
sick sentinel
in a perfect world that sounds correct to me
strong forum
All the healing from druids is efflo adaptive swarm and wild growth
All of those are group heals
strong forum
Swarm bounces around
lofty widget
it jumps
strong forum
Back and forth
jagged pier
yer but they put it on tank first
ionic fern
sick sentinel
if your tank playing correctly should basically never take dmg, so, your just spot healing the dps who got hit with something with like a chain heal that hits the tank and then you got the rain puddle thing and poop shield helping them
i believe i understand what nome saying
strong forum
right.
ionic fern
That's just wrong expectations to people lurking.
jagged pier
I SOMETIMES get dirct heals
sick sentinel
don't shit on druid healers, druid healers make big many fast green numbers,
- brez and soothe
strong forum
Druid is literally the best healer for us
sick sentinel
priest (either) can be good for us too PI
strong forum
I don't like priest
sick sentinel
i don't mind priest when it works
lofty widget
LOL at priests giving us PI
tried explaining to a friend priest that he should PI me in execute phase, he just laughed 😦
sick sentinel
then did u laugh when he did it and u show him u flexicute
strong forum
Druid throws out a couple hots and you're Gucci for atleast 15sec, have that 1min bark external and a swiftmend on short cd which is basically a lay on hands
lofty widget
he never did it
strong forum
Rest they can just dps away
grave crane
Swift mend can consume the 2pc Druid heal so if that’s on you it’s kinda ass but with that and soul of the forest and natures swiftness that instant regrowth is a Lay on hands
sick sentinel
well, its better than the feral in my something PF that told me "u should take ITF because haste is ur best stat"
grave crane
I mean haste is good but for keys I like ravager
strong forum
"I NEVER get direct heals".
So I should say I only need a direct heal 10% of the time?
sick sentinel
on whatever tank has the biggest HP pool, (monk dk i think) i wonder if it would be worth to put on the enchant proc to make you get heal for more
ionic fern
Wild Growth,Reju,lifebloom,swiftmend,regrowth,cenarion ward can all be counted as "direct heals". Also,i am fairly sure i can pull a random log with a non druid healer who'se toolkit would better suit your definition of "direct heals"..
sick sentinel
then you only have to be healed 5% directly
i just, i wish that enchant didn't suck for everyone is all
strong forum
Wild Growth,Reju,lifebloom,swiftmend,regrowth,cenarion ward can all be counted a...
I wouldn't classify wildgrowth as a direct heal
sick sentinel
i was enchanter on rogue for many years and new enchants make me sadge
strong forum
And the others mentioned are literally less combined healing than efflo
ionic fern
sick sentinel
BFA enchants were good, few stands outs for leveling, but most of them just crapola enchants, used to be you could enchant damn near everything except trinket
strong forum
These are all direct heals except cloudburst and healing rain
ionic fern
Just..don't talk in absolutes to confuse people thinking "fck,i shouldnt need a healer at all!!!
ionic fern
These are all direct heals except cloudburst and healing rain
Exactly. And all them are done on you.
strong forum
Cuz it's a shaman they don't really have a choice
sick sentinel
Rshaman has it rough in alot of ways
they are super valuable, but they just get fucked over lots
grave crane
But if that’s the case any hot that goes in you from Druid is a direct heal except for efflo and tranq
sick sentinel
if i see the 2 green/yellow swirlies around me i know druid attempting to heal me
and the noise
strong forum
It was a meme key
With jakeys 210ilvl enha shaman gone resto
Or 240 or w/e it was
With 2 tanks aswell and an another Alt
sick sentinel
its also like, nomer is never going to stand in any mechanic, and even more so than that, he already knows how to negate maximum value from that attack, and to place it in such a way it has 95% chance not to as easily corner players with XYZ mechanics
so, thats a mega carry already
jagged pier
With jakeys 210ilvl enha shaman gone resto
that aint mine dude it number 1 is an ele shamman and its NF
not venthyr
strong forum
:sus:
jagged pier
i also see anima exhaust in there
strong forum
When habe I done a key with an rsham that wasn't you
jagged pier
i dunno but thats not me
ionic fern
You ok yogi?
What i'm saying is that stating "i never get direct heals" is incorrect and misleading to people lurking and reading. Especially if only later you clarify that "oh,but i count xyz as a passive heal from druids".
ionic fern
When habe I done a key with an rsham that wasn't you
Was some random NW(?) I found this season. On phone so diddnt bother checking names etc.
Traffic jams.
strong forum
Ah found it
That was from before I had 4pc iirc
With jakey on his monk
Ya was 2pc with 262 ilvl
This was last week top 16 with pulling trash onto bosses
But top is cheating so there's that
strong forum
The 19 was ultra meme
jagged pier
i would have been spinning
ionic fern
Tbf, like 90% of your keys are ultra meme.
strong forum
The other tank didn't know I was tank until the 2nd boss
ionic fern
😂
strong forum
Ofc they are
Anything else isn't fun
This 16 we boosted 2 alts who did less than healer dmg
I soloed xav
(almost)
strong forum
Had to res 3 people in that fight cuz catha kept dying and gripping people into mechanics
So I wouldn't get sent down and reset the boss
grave crane
Imagine a boss opposite to General Kaal..where the whole fight is in Execute pha...
The dream
sick sentinel
what are you supposed to do about forsworn giants with the no interupt affix?
grave crane
focus down the inspired mob i imagine
grave crane
oh yeah that makes more sense
urban portal
You cannot one shot a mob before the first fist comes out
Unless baby keys
Or it’s on a bird
kind spruce
is nerco better with 2 set or wait till 4 set for M+
kind spruce
i mean ive already got 2/4 from +10s im a big runner of M+ its one of my last tanks
grave crane
if you know what your doing go for it lol youll just notice a decent bump when you get 4pc
tulip harness
Does anyone have a definitive answer on how the avoidance stat works/behaves? what exactly does "are of effect" mean in this setting, and what effects does avoidance reduce the damage of? For example last boss in NW, does avoidance reduce the damage taken from comet storm since it effects "an area", or is it restrictive to things like the pulse from the shield on the same boss that pulses damage that you cant actually avoid, but also isnt targeting players like the comet storm does?
strong forum
Basically any kind of groupwide dmg or ground effects are affected by avoidance
tulip harness
Even if the spell targets a specific player, avoidance will reduce the damage of it as long as it affects an area instead of only specificly the player?
strong forum
Even if the spell targets a specific player, avoidance will reduce the damage of...
But generally yes
tulip harness
I see, so comet storm and spells like it will be affected by avoidance then?
strong forum
Yes
tulip harness
Cool, thanks man, appreciate it
sick sentinel
avoidance isn't that big overall though, lots of stuff that triggers it is stuff you can side step anyways
bleak scroll
The thing that 1shots dps at high-end keys isn't gonna 1shot a tank anyway. So stacking avoidance doesn't really help much imo
Like xav leap
tulip harness
Nah I know, just wondering what it actually works again, its actually just a discord conversation more than using the info ingame tbh
wild hemlock
hey i heard we dont need healing
hardy ridge
Correct
sick sentinel
The thing that 1shots dps at high-end keys isn't gonna 1shot a tank anyway. So s...
you'd very likely see more DR and better yet, at the same time more dps, through versa or something
its just a nice to have if its an option
sick sentinel
You cannot one shot a mob before the first fist comes out
not quite baby keys but valor keys, 5-13's something i can pound out in 20 minutes and it doesn't matter if the mage dies to bombs
chrome falcon
5-13s are baby keys
grave crane
15-27s are regular keys and 28+ is adult keys
sick sentinel
i'd say below 10 is baby, 15 normal, 20 hard 21+... why?... what are you trying to prove?
echo egret
i'd say below 10 is baby, 15 normal, 20 hard 21+... why?... what are you trying ...
why not ?
mighty valley
key elitism helps no one
sick sentinel
why not ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_qJW2Nkkpc few missed interrupts later on a +22 and this is your keystone
mighty valley
if someone comes in here and says "yayyy i did a 15" no one should be saying "damn, key for children"
sick sentinel
thats why
and the key usually ends pretty much that violently too
you think.... everything is gunna be fine... then... IT'S HAPPENING!!!
echo egret
And yet eventually suceeding at something that looked difficult, is a great reward...
surreal pollen
Just a quickie, not sure if anyone can offer me a reasonable answer as I know its totally subjective. I'm just finishing up levelling my 2nd warrior, alliance dark iron dwarf this time around and im playing with the idea of playing prot instead of fury. I've played almost every class and spec in the game at max level this exp and I was wondering how fun prot warrior is before I invest heavily in it. I've enjoyed Prot pala, found BDK average and didnt have much fun playing guardian druid. how does it compare to those?
Ive done a couple of dungeons whilst levelling as prot and it seems ok. but obviously i dont have legos or set bonus
vestal moat
I play 5 tanks , all except druid and warrior is the most fun to play in my opinion out of all of those.
surreal pollen
aight cool, what is it that makes it enjoyable for you? i know at the moment they arent seen as the best tanks but that doesnt really matter to me cos im not gonna be pushing 30s
surreal pollen
i like a class where theres always something to press
strong forum
the feedback loop of generating and spending rage is heavily rewarded
odd tree
I play monk, dk, war, druid, and dh.
War is definitely the most hectic, dk feels very fluid (like I can kinda get into a rhythm and just glide through keys). Druid is boring, really really boring. Monk I have yet to bring to keys, but I enjoy the toolkit. And DH I hated the last 2 seasons due to the need to kite (they just feel squishy), though I've heard the new build with tier and double leggo has made them tanky.
War is my go to if I'm running keys with friends
safe thistle
true thats why i love dk its so damn fluid like you said i couldnt describe it right until i saw your description, and i play dk /war/dh
and ya now DH can facetank pack of fortified
vestal moat
What I like that's different from what's been said is the unparallelled mobility. Being able to zoom around. A monk comes close but still imho is behind a warrior in moving. I don't like being slow and immobile like a dk or pally.
odd tree
Yes, and no
safe thistle
you cant just spam HS though like saying warrior is only spam revenge 😛
odd tree
Gotta refresh boneshield and BB every once and a while
strong forum
point still stands
safe thistle
its more spam than a warrior but way less than a druid with trash
if i would situate it
i think druid is so stupid right now and once they lose that leggo most of them wont know how to play good
odd tree
I fear the same for most classes
safe thistle
lol true i saw a 20+ key druid tank turn his back on mobs......
strong forum
other tanks dont care as much about turning your back to mobs as pwar
cuz for them it only means losing parry/dodge
safe thistle
parry/dodge/block cant be applied but do they crit more from the back ?
strong forum
nothing crits in pve
safe thistle
ahhhh
strong forum
that mechanic is long gone from pve
dark lark
Just stack +defense 4Head
safe thistle
and here i though it was still there for showing the back
its liike crushing blow
lol
strong forum
which is also gone for atleast 8 years
safe thistle
to be hoenest im not bad with warrior but i think the playstyle with necro became too quick for me atm 😛
so i prefer dk
already at 61ish CPM on warrior and its not fast enough
vestal moat
whats a good cpm number in a key now
strong forum
70++
safe thistle
im old 
odd tree
I was looking at one of Sense's logs the other day, 90 cpm... was some toy he had macroed into his buttons, haha.
Accounted for nearly 20 cpm
safe thistle
rygelon doesnt have the taunt immunity i guess haha
jagged pier
he does
strong forum
he does but you just taunt alot more frequently than anywhere else in the game
safe thistle
then how come we taunt swap everey 2 stacks and its fine
ebon wren
hey guys whats your opinion on Fae as prot warrior for mythics, because I hate being necro. I hate the theme, I hate maldraxxus, it's all ugly af. I kind of refuse to play them. I dont really tank above +20 anyway
strong forum
NF is perfectly fine for those levels
ebon wren
Fae has paladin like interrupting, and still gets mastery boost
safe thistle
i still play kyrian on mine for key cause i lkove the spear too much
spear revengeeeeee crit
jagged pier
i mean u dont need to even go to maldraxxus to be necro
safe thistle
yah you can even go to zereth mortis for the soulbind
grave crane
i'd say below 10 is baby, 15 normal, 20 hard 21+... why?... what are you trying ...
I was memeing
ebon wren
suppose. but then you have to carry this ugly ass banner around the whole dungeon on your back. be cool if there's a glyph to delete it
jagged pier
i dont even notice it tbh
safe thistle
theres a button to have a perma banner out as necro
dawn canyon
<@653287531038900236> hates tanks, he hates us!
i hate tanks in pvp
ebon wren
I hate it Jakey. Refuse. I think my prot will forever be limited in key success by his inability to join them
dawn canyon
^
onyx matrix
i hate tanks in pvp
You hate tanks in general, admit it!
dawn canyon
no
safe thistle
tank can do as much dmg than a dps in arena but got wayyyy too much defensive cd
dawn canyon
i hate tanks who queue pvp or lose threat
strong forum
as a former pvper, i 100% stand by when i say, tanks dont belong in arena
safe thistle
i know there were issue with prot pally healing as much as a healer but been unkilleable
strong forum
its like seeing a bad car driver, or a person walking very slowly infront of you
for one, yea guardian druid and prot pally acting as 2nd healer
and for the rest, its mostly people being useless
ionic fern
If people want to be useless in arena..let them.
strong forum
or in some cases broken like BDK in Legion
ionic fern
strong forum
where youd just face 3 BDKs and you couldnt kill any of them
safe thistle
were they more broken than Monk ?
wild hemlock
I play 5 tanks , all except druid and warrior is the most fun to play in my opin...
i rolled a bldk and its literally not fun at all lmao. i thought it would be a blast with 4p. you just spam heartstrike until your health dips
strong forum
i dont recall ever seeing a brew in arena
jagged pier
sco does it
safe thistle
well a WW
jagged pier
for rating gear at start of progs
strong forum
If people want to be useless in arena..let them.
its just tedious to fight, theyre dragging out the inevitable, its like a rogue just running away when he starts to lose
very aggravating
get over here and fight like a man
ionic fern
I don't really PvP so i can't honestly speak to any competitive side to it but when i do end up in arena as a tank it's fun af.
For me atleast.
strong forum
no honor
onyx matrix
I don't really PvP so i can't honestly speak to any competitive side to it but w...
Its fun and its fun to be annoying
ionic fern
Agreed.
onyx matrix
A pain in the ass
strong forum
disagree
but theres 1 thing i hate more, its people engaging combat, but then running away when theyre starting to lose
you started the fight, atleast fight it out with honor
safe thistle
happen all the time in world pvp
safe thistle
hahaha
ionic fern
It was funny as a tank.
strong forum
i never engaged fights in wpvp
i never touch anybody unless im being touched
then i kill them 1v3
ionic fern
oh man
safe thistle
so Mwahi you like annoying ppl !! 😛
ionic fern
I just aggrod everyone
ANd just kited them into low NPC's
And VR reset
24/7
Healing myself
safe thistle
pure evil
ionic fern
Jeah
I sucked at pvp
so i couldn't kill anyone
But they couldn't kill me either.
😂
safe thistle
i feel you, thats why i dont pvp haha
prop to those good at it i dont have time to know every damn class ability,cd to know how to counter them
safe thistle
well lucky the game got m+ cause it would be so damn boring
strong forum
ya m+ saved wow
100%
the issue is, its not treated as such
its still considered a mini game just like pvp
short herald
As pvp player
idk how u guys spend ur time as pve players
I feel like m+ get bored of so fast
safe thistle
m+ is compareable to arena/bg games
short herald
and it’s easy to do waht u need to do at first
Then waht should I do now? Repeat all of I did?
short herald
I don’t hate pve it just I never tried it a lot so idk how it’s work
strong forum
as a former pvp only player for 5 expansions, m+ took over for me
safe thistle
you even face the same team sometime 😛
short herald
Just repeating all of you just did.
no man new player new minds
strong forum
just like m+
safe thistle
diferent affix new game
ionic fern
Well, that's on your willingness to learn..and improve.
safe thistle
as a tank m+ is very fun
short herald
At the end
My question is how u guys spent ur time if u play alot
short herald
just repeat all m+?
ionic fern
Do more m+
short herald
hmm
strong forum
m+ is all about perfecting your play
safe thistle
try to push your key higher
strong forum
and its extremely group dependant
short herald
m+ is all about perfecting your play
I don’t feel like u can play super good or smth like that
It’s just easy limit to reach and done
strong forum
pve is easier than pvp, i stand by that
short herald
Yea I don’t mean pve is bad because of this
strong forum
but the rotational capabilities and min maxing in pve is alot higher than pvp
in pvp its all about countering and predicting
short herald
well
strong forum
in pve its all about perfect CD usage, routing, correct button mashing
grave crane
yeah pvp is harder i think, you have to fight against other people and even boosters absolutely demolishing you whereas pve its just pugs ruining keys
short herald
Maybe I should spend moreee time in pve to feel how ist like
strong forum
cuz i guarantee you
if you as a pvp player go into m+
and you dont have experience in how to do DPS
not just burst, but actual DPS
youll do less damage than the tank
short herald
wew
strong forum
yes
grave crane
theyre pretty good at that
strong forum
pvpers know how to actually use their class utility and how to survive
mechanically theyre alot better than raiders
but their rotational abilites are awful
short herald
Well I’m kinda new player that’s why I didn’t play pve a lot
grave crane
lets not get too wild lol ive seen plenty of pallys die without bubble and many warrs not intervene the kidney shot
strong forum
i prefer a good pvper over a good pve'er
short herald
So if I’m good at pvp doesn’t mean I will be good at pve?
grave crane
i think pvp definitely gets people using more of thier class though
strong forum
not at all
strong forum
^
short herald
Forget about the dungeon and how the boss work
grave crane
BM hunter in my raid didnt know what intimidation stun was. like bud
strong forum
pvp skillset translates better into pve, teaching somebody how to deal dmg is easier than trying to teach somebody about using their entire classes skillset
short herald
being good at m+ doesn't even mean you're good at raiding
Damn I never played any raid ever
strong forum
i have boosted a few pvpers through m+
short herald
pvp skillset translates better into pve, teaching somebody how to deal dmg is ea...
Yea that’s waht I thinked about
strong forum
and their dps is just awful
short herald
yup same as me
strong forum
cuz pvp is about bursting, lining up stuff with your party to deal 100k dmg in 1 global, but not deal 20k dps over 30 minutes
ykno
grave crane
also cc chains and kicking healers
strong forum
yea
short herald
Even in key 3
They where really toxic
That’s why I stoped pve for while
grave crane
its like anything bud you gotta put in the practice to get better. people will be toxic just kick from group and move on
strong forum
like in pve the skill gap of players is staggering
short herald
Like tank is the highest damage🫠
strong forum
in pvp ofc aswell
grave crane
Boosters in pvp are a bigger issue than pve
short herald
in pvp ofc aswell
Well not much especially on bg
grave crane
and that makes people not want to pvp
short herald
Well not much especially on bg
Unless*
strong forum
well in BGs ....
chrome falcon
i think that being good at pvp will help you more in m+ than raiding tbh
grave crane
BGs are a crapshoot no matter what
short herald
Sorry I mean bg is highest not lowest
short herald
BGs are a crapshoot no matter what
BG is bullshit tbh
as pvp player for now
I really hate it
short herald
id take any 3k rated pvper over a 3.5k m+er
Yea true
strong forum
cuz to get to 3k rating you actually have to be good at the game and know what youre doing
as a dps in m+ you can get 3.5k fairly easily without using half of your kit
short herald
3k in pvp is impossible
short herald
not impossible
But so damn hard
grave crane
theres inflation that allows that to happen
strong forum
ye
short herald
At the end
grave crane
but the only people tht get there are like rank1 pushers
grave crane
prot warr
strong forum
whatever you like
grave crane
unironically what you like though
strong forum
dont start with tanking if youve never done m+
strong forum
you need a giga thick skin to play tank
cinder storm
But many pvpers I've encountered also use their CDs not on CD, but they are godlike when it comes to cc kicks, probably a habit of using their bursts on short specific windows
strong forum
cuz somehow its socailly accepted to abuse the tank
short herald
whatever you like
So nothing is bad in pve?
strong forum
kek
grave crane
i started tanking raid with my guild first, then dipped my toes inot m+ last season this season im 2750
strong forum
you can do up to +26 keys with literally any spec
if youre good
which is comparable to like glad
id say
short herald
I see
grave crane
if you do want to start tanking do it with a guild group that your chill with and let them know. most people would rather find a tank to learn and teach than pug randos
short herald
I guess il start for mage
short herald
if you do want to start tanking do it with a guild group that your chill with an...
Yea of course
Tanking looks fun in m+ tbh
but I need to try all of it
And know everything
grave crane
i enjoy it more than dps
strong forum
if you play mage, i recommend arcane cuz frost and fire only deal dmg if youre ACTUALLY good
fire is by far the hardest mage spec
arcane probably the easiest
short herald
i enjoy it more than dps
It could be dps😗
short herald
arcane probably the easiest
Damn
strong forum
the difference between a good and a great fire mage is literally like 7k dps
cinder storm
Arcane never clicked for me, then again I only tried it like twice when I was learning, fire was the easiest for me
strong forum
playing a good combust in keys is not easy
grave crane
frost is ike blizzard and frozen orb and frost bolt isnt it?
hello yes i would like one comet storm pl
short herald
playing a good combust in keys is not easy
Even I got high rank in pvp?
strong forum
absolutely not
short herald
Not high but not bad
short herald
ahh
strong forum
you have like 9 different ways of playing combust
grave crane
every minute i convoke. thats it. where my dps?
strong forum
and you need to perfect every single one and know which situation youre in
throw in urh into the mix and combust gets even more complex
short herald
and you need to perfect every single one and know which situation youre in
I tough that’s m+ for all class
grave crane
realistaically find a class you enjoy and people you enjoy playing with. boom easy youll learn the rest
strong forum
I tough that’s m+ for all class
nah, alot of classes are alot simpler in their dps rotation
and you dont just learn m+ in a few keys
grave crane
i feel like frost DK is easy, you just walk up and frost strike and abom limb and do nutty damage passivly from your frost dot
strong forum
destro lock is the easiest rn
grave crane
oh yeah they do big dam
grave crane
nah they gotta build shards to rain dont they? like incinerate then rain
strong forum
nop
short herald
destro lock is the easiest rn
Even they did nerf it?
grave crane
does it generate its own shards?
strong forum
yes
grave crane
oh well there ya go
grave crane
tough but fair
strong forum
but even there you have differences between good and bad destro locks
big differences
short herald
damn I wish I have every class lvl 60 so I can pick easily and don’t need to lvl up
jagged pier
i had a demo warlock in my 21 this week
short herald
I’m new player that’s why
strong forum
try whatever looks fun
and go from there
class doesnt matter below like 25s
maybe even higher
as long as you as a player play well
toxic pewter
Diablo IV looking pretty dark i like it
onyx matrix
Diablo IV looking pretty dark i like it
I agree
toxic pewter
Actually reminds me of Diablo / Diablo II when I watch the videos
tardy sequoia
can i buy an item level 291 sabatons from the AH and directly craft a legendary with it?
echo egret
Yes
tardy sequoia
it is the maximum level right?
surreal pollen
is wow just broken tonight
cant zone into maldraxxus at all
other zones seem laggy
grave crane
Anyone else have trouble loading into the pirate zone in gambit?
surreal pollen
assume its same issue im having
chrome falcon
nah
surreal pollen
cant zone into stormwind, garrison
wild hemlock
so do we need healing or no
sick sentinel
only 10% direct healing
lime urchin
We need tender love and care
sage yacht
a dollar
blazing condor
a dollar is what i need
mighty valley
agreeing with nom that fire mage is v hard to do well in keys
it's like the definition of really simple but very deep
and mild fuckups make your damage garbo
chrome falcon
fire mage fun as hell tbh but yeah the difference between decent and master is cavernous
mighty valley
yeah i love it personally. the other other hardest part is doing perfect movement inbetween combusts. to speed you up to the next combust.
sick sentinel
imma need about 3 fitty
modern brook
This is some classic mage propaganda
sick sentinel
what i really need is a shit load of valor, like, 6k or more and the DOS belt and afe
alot less valor if its 15's loot, yeah right
sick sentinel
bringbackinfested
blazing condor
pallid finch
is Verse that much better than Mastery or does it not really matter?
chrome falcon
they're both pretty bleh
blazing condor
your secondary stats really dont matter that much period
chrome falcon
anyone telling you vers is a good stat on prot warrior has no ideo what they're talking about
blazing condor
theyre all very equal
pallid finch
how about for leggo? what's the advice on missive? Haste + ..... ?
blazing condor
haste vers
chrome falcon
crit for dam vers for tankiness
blazing condor
vers is a good stat but you wont care about certain thresholds and stuff
chrome falcon
vers is generally the call
yeah i meant good as in like
"you need x vers"
like some healers seem to think
pallid finch
do you generally just gem/enchant haste?
pallid finch
thank you!
celest glade
i noticed in simc (just for damage sims) ignore pain is macro'd to shield slam, is that a normal thing to do? macro them together?
sick sentinel
is Verse that much better than Mastery or does it not really matter?
you don't have to be a versa poindexter nerd, or you can if you want, totally up to you for like up to 21 keys
celest glade
yeah i just saw every time shield slam is used, ignore pain is used too in sims haha
blazing condor
Yeah probably because of outburst rage gain will make it very plausible you overcap when you use SS
so you need to dump with IP
sick sentinel
just, i wouldn't run around with literal 0% versa tho
blazing condor
but you still shouldnt macro it
hazy edge
i noticed in simc (just for damage sims) ignore pain is macro'd to shield slam, ...
It isn't macro'd, it's just called a lot and it's off the gcd so it looks like it is.
celest glade
for sure, thanks
pallid finch
fresh alt 60. is there a way to get all the followers at once via a "skip" or do i have to go get these guys the same way with my main?
distant crystal
just macro shield block + ip + shieldslam 
drifting fable
fresh alt 60. is there a way to get all the followers at once via a "skip" or do...
do you mean like the command table followers? or soulbinds
pallid finch
command table
drifting fable
dont use that thing very often but there one dude who stands near it gave me a ton of quests for followers at one point
not sure if thats what youre looking for
i was on an alt as well
pallid finch
ya, i currently have 0 followers, so am just wondering if there's a skip to get them all together
drifting fable
hmm perhaps you need to up your renown
i swear i started my warrior in necrolord fresh this season, no other toons there, and the dude gave me all the followers at SOME point (not the torgie ones i think)
previously i had only been kyrian on a DK
celest glade
does ignore pain mitigate dot damage like necrotic stacks?
sweet summit
yes, but it also gets reduced by necrotic
ebon wren
im wondering if its possible to stack crit + mastery to get 100% melee mitigation (block+parry+dodge). like old school warrior.
celest glade
sorry meant grievous
sweet summit
im wondering if its possible to stack crit + mastery to get 100% melee mitigatio...
in retail no
you already have very high blocked hits
sweet summit
sorry meant grievous
still yes, it absorbs any damage type
blazing condor
not relevant
you use IP to dump rage so often it'll always be up at cap anyway more or less
Just see IP as a rage dump button
drifting fable
yup IP kinda sucks as an ability itself
blazing condor
just free rolling damage reduction
drifting fable
but man is it good for 35 rage
sweet summit
What is ignore pain cap? still 2.5x?
2x
rain ember
Mastery or crit for prot?
rain ember
yeah cool cool I only have a crit/vers and mast/vers shield atm
deciding which one would be more worth until I get a haste one
lofty widget
if theyre both same ilvl then crit/vers
rain ember
yeah both 272
lofty widget
👍
rain ember
Appreciate it
woven lance
Do we pull the gargons with the big shard pull in HoA or is the bleed too spicy in high keys?
balmy canyon
Think he's talking about the dogs not the gargoyle
tawny maple
Why does my hand hurt after playing this class before 4p owie
shut summit
tawny maple
We are A tier tank now
Can you send me the link to this pls
Also do we still ravage it up /w 4p?
toxic pewter
Also do we still ravage it up /w 4p?
Hell yeah we do
tawny maple
I might actually have to use my foot pedal for IP then geez
toxic pewter
Yeah dude
You playing arguably fastest paced spec in the game
You must … ignore the pain…
That u now
tawny maple
I thought my hand hurt in BFA but this requires you to be built diff
oblique garnet
toxic pewter
I live and die by subcreation
I was f tier the other day
Now I am reborn
I am A
tawny maple
Wait why is your pinky on A
tawny maple
You mean your pinky doesnt naturally doesnt place itself on shift? lmao
mighty valley
my shift keybinds are only for long cds so it doesn't need to be there full time
tawny maple
Fair I guess I just never thought about it
Thats where mine sits but I have shift modifiers on everything so
mighty valley
everything that's main rotation or similar frequency I gotta have without modifiers
sick sentinel
MY PRECIOUS!!!
potent anvil
urban briar
hello prot warriors hows u? is mythic halondrus still bugged?
chrome falcon
yep!
they fixed the invisible beams
but not the invisible bombs
which are 10000% worse
sick sentinel
they fixed something in Theater of Pain
Fixed an issue that could prevent Putrid Butcher’s Devour Flesh from being cast.
whatever that means
chrome falcon
probably means exactly what it says
sick sentinel
that shit heals him for 300% of the dmg it hits for, huge inting if your not DR'ing that guy apparently, its a 2second cd so he'd just be healing for 100k every few seconds, good to know
mighty valley
stun it
sick sentinel
if it was me, i would just block and +% dr it, heals for 300%, x 3 of hits for 500 is fuck all heal, 1500
cobalt seal
chrome falcon
if it was me, i would just block and +% dr it, heals for 300%, x 3 of hits for 5...
that would be very wrong 🙂
just stun it 🙂
and just because it has a 2 second CD doesn't mean he casts it every 2 seconds... do you not watch mob cast bars
you would notice if a mob was healing for 100k every few seconds
because it would literally never die
alpine shard
lmao this guy is still going on about subcreation
toxic pewter
lmao this guy is still going on about subcreation
Hello fellow a tier
dreamy wedge
How good is the weird mode switch shield from Sepulcher? I cannot get a shield to save my life to the point I'm debating trying to hop into a pug to fish for it
scenic mural
its fine, throw it in defense mode and forget it
chrome falcon
How good is the weird mode switch shield from Sepulcher? I cannot get a shield t...
take ilvl
278 regular shield > 278 weird shield > 275 regular shield
hardy ridge
Weird shield gang
nova rover
Necro still solid for raids as well?
hardy ridge
Yes necro is bis
chrome falcon
Necro still solid for raids as well?
Necro bis for everything
potent anvil
How do pugs obtain a +20 key to begin with?
hazy edge
How do pugs obtain a +20 key to begin with? <:deadge:900279927138578432>
because they get tanks to +2 their keys like this
shell shale
How is prot war on mythic Jailor
shut summit
comfy
shell shale
nice!
shut summit
helps to focus on not wasting block, i blocked 43/44 hits this recent rekill, getting hit without it can catch you super offguard
like 60-80k+ chunk
hazy edge
comfy
I've been tempted to swap to my warrior cause getting meleed for 120k on average on my bdk isn't good for my health. Then I go look at your average melee's and it's like 35k 
shut summit
potent anvil
Sense owns
shut summit
brittle owl
I've been tempted to swap to my warrior cause getting meleed for 120k on average...
can't play bdk with a weak butthole
bleak scroll
Gotta love how healers pop every externmal when you drop to 5% as a bdk
Meanwhile you top off with 1 button
Speaking of one button, how often should I be using ignore pain?
pallid quiver
Speaking of one button, how often should I be using ignore pain?
Only to prevent capping rage, which translates to pretty often
As a mitigation button, it's probably actually worse than just fishing for SS resets with Revenge
but it's on its own CD, so you can use it to prevent overcap, since wasted rage is wasted damage/mitigation/literally everything
bleak scroll
Aye, found myself spamming it a bit too often, but it makes sense
empty burrow
Makes Sense do what?
strong forum
blazing condor
yes
strong forum
I'm right here
strong forum
☁️ 🕶️
blazing condor
ye but thats cus she's ballin
wild hemlock
warrior tree today. i can feel it
ionic fern
No.
jagged pier
in hot guys club
ionic fern
No.