same
#protection
drowsy scarab
i see ppl playing haste > vers, why that D:
jagged pier
😮
strong forum
It feeds into rage gen
drowsy scarab
for the shield block uptime?
vernal vale
1p is better than. 0p
strong forum
More rage = more abilities = more dmg = more CDs = more survivability
high raptor
Do you play with brutal vitality as conduit?
jagged pier
no
strong forum
No
jagged pier
well as a 4th endurance
strong forum
high raptor
Fine?
strong forum
Pretty much perfect
jagged pier
yes
civic torrent
Last stand***
solid granite
oh, right.. not kleia anymore for m+ this week... weeeee!
jagged pier
even before the nerfs necro ment nothing
solid granite
i was because of 8sec immune
ionic fern
I honestly diddn't even notice Necro last week.
strong forum
Well yeah but you really didn't need it
ionic fern
I swear it dropped off randomly like 20 times.
high raptor
Allright
civic torrent
Yeah it was weird randomly droppin
strong forum
Necro basically doesn't exist anymore, outside of ultra pulls
jagged pier
yer its got no duration anymore
solid granite
if you pull like me, you do 😛
high raptor
And Talents are fine too? This will be the first dung with AM ^^
strong forum
And Talents are fine too? This will be the first dung with AM ^^
I've never not played AM
civic torrent
I like bounding stride because of reprisal over the thunder clap one
jagged pier
someones been looking at top warrior and not understanding why they are doing what they are doing
high raptor
jagged pier
told ya
high raptor
Sure, i checked subcreation
strong forum
You only played HR if you weren't confident in your abilities or did 26+
high raptor
and went for this
civic torrent
Tbf I think HR is better for new prot warriors
As they get used to defensive usage
And damage intake
jagged pier
not really it causes them to not play correctly tbh
solid granite
do not look at any top rated warrior and copy what they do.
jagged pier
if u are copying top warriors without knowing why they are taking things, u should just flat out not be copying them
solid granite
some warriors are buffbots for Demolocks and can basically pick talents at random
strong forum
My take is that new prot warriors shouldn't play HR because it can lead them to learn poor SB uptime Management
jagged pier
☝️
strong forum
Which is your first priority
civic torrent
not really it causes them to not play correctly tbh
I can see that, but it's building blocks imo, my logic is that it's easier to learn the surroundings around SB uptime
Yeah true I guess, different strokes
jagged pier
yer but with HR u dont need to press SB or charge or intervene half the time
so thinking about block isnt a thing
which is something u have to do without it
civic torrent
For sure
high raptor
I give it a try now ^^
strong forum
So then once you dont play HR you have to relearn prot entirely
civic torrent
Not entirely, but yeah I get your guys' point
My point was mostly that for us, we've played it for years now and it's second nature to react with correct usage of spells
jagged pier
yes which is what ppl need to learn and they wont if they take HR
civic torrent
For newer woyers that stuff has to be thought about
strong forum
I get that point kinda, but it's like teaching somebody to drive automatic instead of stick
jagged pier
like u even get more consistant rage with HR so rage mangement is less
civic torrent
But it's kinda the tutorial before the main event
You get the base level building block
Then use that to expand
Both work, but some people's brains might respond to different learning styles is all!
strong forum
Anywho. I just don't like that you'd potentially run into territory of potentially maybe running HR again in ultra keys
strong forum
Even with 4pc
strong forum
It's a huge rage and dmg loss to play HR with tier now
But I can still see HR being needed in like +30 tyr keys
For bosses
And I hate that prospect
But maybe necro + omega avatar uptime can make up for that fact
steel mist
hey guys when do I switch to anger management ? when i have the two piece or 4 piece of the set?
chrome falcon
civic torrent
Haha
jagged pier
hey guys when do I switch to anger management ? when i have the two piece or 4 p...
literally without tier set
civic torrent
You can play AM off rip
strong forum
You can manage up to 85% blocked hits in m+ with proper play
HR is just for those last 10-15%
steel mist
im just a beginner warrior so i feel like hr can save my skin sometimes but i know that AM is quite good for the damage,avatar and shield wall cd red
strong forum
We literally just had a discussion about it
civic torrent
Haha yeah
chrome falcon
we were still having the discussion when you asked actually you could probably just scroll up to get any answers you need
civic torrent
My 2c, try both at equivalent key levels and see how they feel
strong forum
HR can lead you into false safety, it's not illegal to play and will make your block management omega easy
AM will give you more CDs to work with and teach you SB and Reprisal management in a tougher but more effective way
civic torrent
AM is overall better
chrome falcon
i mean if you're scared you can play HR if you're more comfortable as long as you're aware that it's not the right play overall
strong forum
That's as well as I can put it
civic torrent
HR can lead you into false safety, it's not illegal to play and will make your b...
Very well put
blazing condor
HR is the pwarr training wheels but you will never learn how to actually ride a bike if you never take them off
steel mist
I see, alright ill give it a bash this week
urban portal
Plka always advocates HR for new tanks tho
It's also not griefing the other 4 ppls time
craggy pilot
what enchant is best for raid and m+? Sinful Revelation?
urban portal
Celestial>lightless>sinful
Sinful is only good for omega damage parse st
Celestial is the midground
craggy pilot
for both raid and m+?
urban portal
And gives you survival
Lightless is good for pure m+ dam
Celestial is the only one that gives survival
lime urchin
That depends on how long you are slapping stuff ST compared to MT in your m+ runs.
vernal vale
I have one weapon for raid with celestial on it and another for m+ with lightless
Then I just swap weapon as needed.
pallid fox
what is the PPM on lightless?
chilly brook
Plka always advocates HR for new tanks tho
ehhhh imho if you're a new tank I don't think HR actually helps you that much
arguably you're missing shield slam casts to begin with and you can literally tank 15s without touching shield block
granted you obviously shouldn't
urban portal
I died more than I should this week cuz of bolster
10k through shield block
The k value was not powerful enough
pallid fox
Just starting to look into tanking again for the first time since WOD. Bolstering can be blocked??
urban portal
Well
Bolster makes mobs do big dam
Blocking the big dam is still big dam
Just less big dam
pallid fox
derp, I should have realized that. Sorry, need more coffee
craggy pilot
I have one weapon for raid with celestial on it and another for m+ with lightles...
i only have one 278 wep lol
chrome falcon
scroll up
chrome falcon
yep we saw you coming
uncut notch
yep we saw you coming
But i closed the curtains this time?
chrome falcon
😳
craggy pilot
But i closed the curtains this time?
👀
anyone using any hover macros for M+?
like hover taunt fx?
west walrus
🤔
craggy pilot
isnt that a bit low? 😄
blazing condor
free gold
sick sentinel
how worth is it to use a 239 set piece vs a 278 non set piece if i'd get the 2p with it? the 2p feels okayish but i'm not sure if it's worth that huge stat loss
tropic linden
My DPS went up by almost 50% when i got 2pc
west walrus
Going to ToP, should I bring Kevin ? 🤔
sturdy sable
Top has enough champion style mobs plus the covenant bonus that i run NL when im there
lofty widget
i bring kevin to all my keys 
west walrus
Kevin Pog champ
strong forum
how worth is it to use a 239 set piece vs a 278 non set piece if i'd get the 2p ...
It's insanely worth
sick sentinel
thanks
craggy pilot
anyone using any hover macros for M+?
like hover taunt fx?
strange cloud
Which covenant would you play in raid ?
west walrus
i love seeing people pulling, and waching them die :D
tropic linden
anyone using any hover macros for M+?
like hover taunt fx?
I use hover for taunt and execute
craggy pilot
or is it just tankier
its the uptime of banner from Tier + Unity
strange cloud
you can keep the banner up for what 90% :???
sick sentinel
anyone using any hover macros for M+?
like hover taunt fx?
charge/intervene and heroic throw. i used to have a taunt mouseover until i messed up terribly sartharion and other bosses because of how big their hitboxes were (wotlk)
strong forum
you can keep the banner up for what 90% :???
Close to 100%
sick sentinel
why is venthyr warrior not seen competitive enough now that 2/4p is a thing? with double legendary and anger management the uptime on avatar is very very high, especially in m+ where there are always plenty of targets to choose from
blazing condor
venth sucks cus its as rage spender and not a rage generator
not to mention condemn is incredibly lackluster
strong forum
Its the only cov which makes you spend more rage instead of generating it
Condemn hits weaker than execute
The soulbinds are trash
blazing condor
with tier its very important to generate as much rage as possible so you can spend as much as possible
strong forum
It sucks in aoe
blazing condor
and get AM rolling
strong forum
The cov leggo is quite bad
sick sentinel
well, draven is good
urban portal
I love standing still
vernal vale
i only have one 278 wep lol
I have 272 weapons vault hates me.
sick sentinel
10% less damage when below 40% is huge in m+
sturdy sable
Lol
chrome falcon
no it's not
craggy pilot
I have 272 weapons vault hates me.
2 of them? 😮
urban portal
You are dead
chrome falcon
if you're below 40% as prot you're below 1%
strong forum
Below 40% as any tank is literal death
sick sentinel
depends, with sb and ip up either healers don't heal you or keep you topped, there is no in between
craggy pilot
did anyone test the new Streets?
strong forum
Plka ran venthyr for a while in keys
urban portal
This guy's names kinda relevant
blazing condor
what in like s1 lol
strong forum
You wanna know how much uptime he had on the buff
urban portal
Eyah
sick sentinel
so that 10% doesn't hurt, plus the 4p it's 20% which isn't bad
urban portal
what in like s1 lol
He had to DPS for guild
strong forum
Less than 1%
chrome falcon
20% DR below 40% does not help you
blazing condor
He had to DPS for guild
yeah and cus group needed vent
strong forum
He had less than 1% uptime on the draven buff
And that was in top tier keys
Its literally dogshit
blazing condor
i mean no one's gonna stop you if you wanna go vent but its objectively the worst cov you can play as a pwarr
sick sentinel
yeah i tried basically all covenants, i'm just trying to theorycraft comething with the new changes, double legendary and set
strong forum
Doesn't hurt to try, but venthyr ain't it
sick sentinel
cause on paper you can have a huge avatar uptime with it
blazing condor
the theory now is go necro if raid and kyr/nf/(necro) in m+
strong forum
It's +10% uptime on Avatar
chrome falcon
you already have huge avatar uptime
blazing condor
avatar uptime is way up already due to tier
chrome falcon
you wanna know how to get good avatar uptime
generate rage
with any other covenant
and reduce the CD with AM
strong forum
Ye, the rage gen from necro is gonna trump the measily extension from venthyr all day of the week
vernal vale
2 of them? 😮
Just got my arms warrior buddy to roll prot with me to help me with shield and weapon. Technically the second isn't upgraded but ill throw Valor at it eventually.
urban portal
not to mention uptime doesnt matter
craggy pilot
throwing valor at weapons 
urban portal
you want more hard casts
strong forum
And that
blazing condor
valor costs are dumb
urban portal
highest venth prot war key done this tier is 17
strong forum
That being said, in ST venthyr is only 2k dps behind necro!
sick sentinel
meanwhile guardian druids...
vernal vale
throwing valor at weapons <:copium:839076283467431956>
If drops hate you and your not spending Valor anywhere else why not.
craggy pilot
why not spend it anywhere else? literally everything is cheaper than weapons
sturdy sable
Naw i think upgrading a shield is a valid option
craggy pilot
shield is best to use valor
sturdy sable
Not alot of ppl raid mythic and the shield off first boss is pretty meh
urban portal
Not alot of ppl raid mythic and the shield off first boss is pretty meh
its actually pretty good
craggy pilot
but maybe dame has sick gear 😄
vernal vale
Jewelry and trinkets are always Valor priority for me.
urban portal
a 278 vigilante shield is like a 285 regular shield
strong forum
meanwhile guardian druids...
You mean blood dk
craggy pilot
i have 272 shield and 272 Phial from Valor
urban portal
on the 40% dr
craggy pilot
and upgrading my Sac to 272 now also
urban portal
HUGE
strong forum
You mean 10% DR
vernal vale
My weapon drops hate me so after a while I just throw the Valor at it.
urban portal
and 35% uptime on the stand still shit
chrome falcon
i mean the actually relevant thing is how much damage you took while under 40% that didn't kill you
strong forum
Not rly
Since its opportunity cost associated with it
And boy
It ain't looking good in that department
urban portal
people are timing much more keys with nadja
the real question is that is theotar better than draven
jagged pier
i leave for an hour and theres 178 missed messages is this alpha?
shut summit
ornate magnet
the grounskeeper from halls, do they bolster? i forget
gray iris
hey guys at what angle do you usually keep your shield block up?
i mean is there a maximum radius?
chrome falcon
gotta be honest i think that's the first time i've seen that question
you can block/dodge/parry anything with 180degrees right
median tulip
Yeah AFAIK the game just has "front" and "back" as facings
chrome falcon
sb gives you 100% block chance and you can only block/dodge/parry things that you could also hit with a single target ability like shield slam
which means within your front 180 degrees
jagged pier
yes block doesnt stop damage
chrome falcon
block is a 30% DR so
jagged pier
just reduces it
no
block is based off your block chance
the higher your shield the more damage block reduces
gray iris
oh okay i thought it blocks everything that is melee
jagged pier
thats why shield is top prio for loot
gray iris
alright thanks
ebon geyser
i leave for an hour and theres 178 missed messages is this alpha?
Welcome back. We need your positive energy
@jagged pier
jagged pier
:/
shell shale
What kind of route do you guys do in your street keys? left or right?
rugged mural
Tried both left and right last week, both at 18. Left felt significantly easier and faster. They changed trash packs this week though and I’m not sure how that impacts it.
shell shale
Yeah i was under the same opinion the first few weeks
not sure what anything is like
chrome falcon
if we're killing anduin in 6 mins should i just first sigil the intermission, or the pull and execute
probably the latter right
stray gazelle
What’s are y’all’s trinket combos you using atm
mighty valley
where you lusting?
mighty valley
hmmmmm
for parsing probably intermission, for making the kill safe probably pull & execute
jagged pier
brah its a 6 min kill its already safe
mighty valley
idk my guild starts acting like dumbasses when shit's on farm
waxen orbit
Someone talk me out of getting a tattoo of Shalamayne
waxen orbit
Varian Wrynn best warrior in WoW lore
blazing condor
if hes so good then how comes hes dead
waxen orbit
Broxigar #2
dawn canyon
But why Tattoo him on u
waxen orbit
if hes so good then how comes hes dead
Because warlock OP
waxen orbit
He died to Gul’dan
radiant magnet
he didnt pop his NL banner in time
radiant magnet
bad rage management
mighty valley
you can get a tattoo of anything you're into so long as the art style is interesting enough that it looks good even after you're into the thing
sturdy sable
You going pre or post disenchantment?
dawn canyon
shalamane isn't Varian tho
And i thought that was some nelf
Weird name for a sword
Of a human
west walrus
It's a combination of two night elven blades
Weird, as Night Elves were (re)discovered while fleeing to Kalimdor 🤔
blazing condor
ye
limpid lion
fae plays niya?
ebon geyser
if we're killing anduin in 6 mins should i just first sigil the intermission, or...
And I'm here wiping on normal
limpid lion
Kyr is more dps cuz the legendary is better
understandable
ebon geyser
Varian Wrynn best warrior in WoW lore
Hands down
Also who's this hykon that dethrone sense??? Let's get him
waxen orbit
Broxigar #2 warrior
Garrosh #3
Also I’ve officially taken a break from WoW.
Got TH last season and burnt myself out + had an overbearing raid lead and bad raid team this patch that didn’t understand tanks or logs so didn’t feel like looking for a new one + got a girlfriend + finally writing music again
strong forum
Nothing to dethrone
He's still 3k dps behind sense on skolex
He just got there early.
;)
Hidden tech to get good log
Be the only one there
ebon geyser
I have been watching some sense stuff and his hp don't move lol
waxen orbit
Be the only one there
Fax
waxen orbit
I used to but my raid lead and team inhibited it this patch
Didn’t feel like ramming my head into a wall
Or looking for a new group
jagged pier
Not getting 99s on reclear
rank 3 is a 98 atm in mythic
strong forum
rank 3 is a 98 atm in mythic
Git gud
ebon geyser
^ We’re a dying breed
Not dying is that ppl rather play face roll classes than actually using their brain. So that why most play monk/dk. But when u need to use you brain like warrior ppl abandon ship
strong forum
waxen orbit
Not dying is that ppl rather play face roll classes than actually using their br...
Yea basically
Also high skill ceiling + high effort = low reward output as opposed to other tanks being lower effort = higher reward
Simply the way it is
One tank always gonna be back of the pack
ebon geyser
Just aim to be better than sense.
waxen orbit
My honest take is just be the best you can be
Corny but yeah. Nothing wrong with min-maxing, even if a sizable portion of the community villainizes people for it
If you like prot warr stay prot warr
ebon geyser
I am dying to play warrior
chrome falcon
i think i would have beaten him on my vigilant guardian rekill but i fucked up my first sigil which is 26 ilvls behind his
waxen orbit
Try it. With 4pc and necrolord it’s a lot of fun
chrome falcon
and still have neither of the fucking dps trinkets
waxen orbit
Not as powerful as other tanks but pretty engaging
chrome falcon
still 1k off his dausegne, not too sure how i can push that harder
strong forum
Click harder
ebon geyser
But mwahi don't play so I have no purpose
chrome falcon
i don't know why i can't stop myself
shut summit
strong forum
ebon geyser
I'm here also for @jagged pier positivity
ebon geyser
<:Execute:592471626533306378>
Coach me to greatness
chrome falcon
if hit its for 40k you can't just press the key for it yknow
gotta show some respect and click it
waxen orbit
Sense doesn’t your group kill Daus in like
2.5 min
Or something nutty?
Or am I trippin
shut summit
on heroic yea, we arent clearin heroic anymore though
waxen orbit
Reasonable
vernal vale
someone explain that for me
Because most of us are scrubs.
wet pine
What are your guys thoughts on into the fray vs ravager in m+ as necro
opal pawn
I'd always say ravager. But I've yet to gain tier.
jagged pier
ravager
cold zealot
Damn you @chrome falcon . Thought i had #5 on guradian then your log came in on reload. 😄
chrome falcon
are you clearing the raid
pallid fox
on heroic yea, we arent clearin heroic anymore though
Was looking over some of your YT videos, do you have Heroic Throw macro'd to Charge?
chrome falcon
also i am rank 3 on guardian sir
got outdps'd by someone running the wall
bleurgh
jagged pier
@chrome falcon rank 4
craggy pilot
are you clearing the raid
yes, well on normal only atm
we stuck on Halondrus HC
only missing Helmet / Chest
got 6 items in vault since start
and still only 3/4
shut summit
Was looking over some of your YT videos, do you have Heroic Throw macro'd to Cha...
no
chrome falcon
this bug where if you SS the instant out get outburst it doesn't get the extra damage but still consumes the buff
IS REALLY FUCKING COOL
low kindle
I had like 2 instances where IP consumed my outburst
lime urchin
What is this outburst and tier y’all talking about. Sounds like tusks to me.
They don’t exist
chrome falcon
80 energy is when we switch to it
@strong forum https://gyazo.com/975a4f2139f3c802381a6c3b72f4bf44
shield slam with outburst up, outburst consumed, SS hits for 5k
that's the log
mighty valley
that sucks
i've also had a bug a couple times where i'm somehow on 8 stacks and still need to spend rage to get outburst?
possibly a weakaura bug but pretty sure the WA should just reflect buff status
chrome falcon
nope that's also either a bug or a weird interaction
from the tooltip there's no reason we should be able to have "8 stacks"
mighty valley
yeah
chrome falcon
pinging @ionic fern since i think he's the bug guy but not sure he's here
radiant magnet
@chrome falcon I was seeing the same thing last night, but not consistently. I'm fairly sure it's some sort of overlap issue w/ the free IP proc, but havent had a chance to test it yet.
chrome falcon
yeah it's only happening when you get outburst MILLISECONDS before you SS
but i mean if you're playing optimally, that's kinda how it should be anyway in some spots
radiant magnet
The couple of times I saw it, I had rage spent into a max IP just before (we have undergeared heals). My theory was that the 'bad' Outburst boosted SS was because the free IP was seeing the cap and somehow failing.
chrome falcon
yeah maybe
i've definitely only seen this specifically when i ss/tc the instant i get the buff though
strong forum
well we cant do much more than report it aswell
radiant magnet
I have a WA w/ sound, so I'm popping mine on proc pretty much
unless moving or dealing with something else ya know
chrome falcon
how did i charge AND SS the same mob at the exact same milisecond
oh i guess that's the charge hitting not me casting it
errant wagon
Could anyone point me to some sims that compare Kyrian / Nightfae prot warrior for M+?
I'm trying to understand where one shines better than the other, or if they are just completely equal.
I see here in the pins and FAQ's it mentions they are all pretty equal, that's cool, but I like knowing what one does better than the other...
Single target, 3-target, big multi target?
Or how one should play the other differently, if at all. The covenant ability seems like they sorta tend to play the same.
mighty valley
afaik they're close enough that which one wins will probably change based on a whole bunch of tiny factors of gear, dungeon, etc
you can try simming yourself on 1 target patchwerk, more target patchwerk, dungeon slice etc
with the two covs as options
errant wagon
Oh yeah, duh I kinda forget those are options in raidbots. ha
Is there a reason why the vast majority of prot warr's are Kyrian according to stats sites like subcreation?
Just because it overlaps with Fury/Arms?
chrome falcon
no it's because kyrian is less punishing than NF
not fun having shit run out of your AA
mighty valley
phial is a freebie dispel too, easier to get high value out of than soulshape
errant wagon
Ok, gotcha. Good points, sorta the thing I was looking for 🙂
urban portal
but theres the upside of stuff like
mighty valley
also it seems like there are still more NF specs than Kyrian, so you're more likely to be filling a slot for dungeon mechanic
urban portal
almost 2x the spear casts vs AA casts
the tether
the knockdown
phial vs soulshape
etc etc
a lot of it is basically unquantifiable
errant wagon
I'm honestly trying to just convince myself to go NF because I'm doing prot/fury both on this toon, and I'm frustrated having to go back to homebase to swap conduits around in mikanikos tree everytime I flipflop haha
I think this is good enough ammunition to do that 😛
lime urchin
Isn’t kyrian fury big damage too?
errant wagon
Yea it's great!
So was looking to swap the Prot over to NF and just keep my mikanikos tree configured for fury
vernal vale
I'm honestly trying to just convince myself to go NF because I'm doing prot/fury...
I've played NF all expac and have felt solid both as fury and prot.
Kyrian, has more dps potential in most m+ from what I've seen so far.
But the knockdown from AA feels super good on caster packs for surviving since dps have no idea what an interrupt is.
errant wagon
lol! that's great input, thanks
craggy pilot
i fucking love how some people who played raid for only 2 weeks in my guild have full tier alrdy, and i played full raid, full M+ for all weeks since start, and still only have 3 pieces :<
why is this RNG so fucking ridiculous
it doesnt even feel good to loot other items, it just feels wasteful
like "oh now i got a weapon, instead of a tier, so useless"
vernal vale
i fucking love how some people who played raid for only 2 weeks in my guild have...
I have a pair of LFR legs as my only tier.
craggy pilot
ouch 😦
errant wagon
i fucking love how some people who played raid for only 2 weeks in my guild have...
man, I'm this far in and have a big fat goose egg 0 after running Normal raid, LFR and M+ vault every week. It can be worse.
I've just accepted it at this point
craggy pilot
ye rip
had someone try to explain to me why this system is good last week
still dont buy it
mighty valley
yeah it was better in the old days!!! when it was worse
chrome falcon
tier is good
craggy pilot
there is also a very high chance of getting useless stuff from the Vault anyway
any gear in tier spots is waste usually
mighty valley
you can turn it into tier in 6 days
craggy pilot
still feels horrible being as active as this, and not getting Tier set before the fucking Catalyst
like wtf
chrome falcon
creation catalyst is way too late but tier is still overwhelmingly a good system that makes the game better
craggy pilot
i filled all my vaults, cleared as much Raid as possible
ye tier is great
but when its this important, it shouldnt be RNG in this scale
in my opinion 😦
all M+ grps asking for Set as well now
jagged pier
they have been since like week 2
mighty valley
yeah, there's some tuning they can do, but people started complaining that getting tier was too slow and too rng almost immediately
craggy pilot
because it was visible imediately i guess?
the people who cleared HC week 1 should obv get it faster, but that was still not the case, some still only got full after what like 3+ weeks?
or insane amounts of splits (like in RWF)
mighty valley
why is 3 weeks too long
craggy pilot
if you are clearing both HC and Normal from week 1, it should be optainable in 2 weeks tbh
1 piece from each difficulty on avg pr week
but thats just my 2 cents
mighty valley
players want things faster always, but the game is more engaging when there are still exciting drops to get
just want people to acknowledge that designing these systems isn't easy
craggy pilot
im not saying it should be faster to get
im just saying currently theres some people spending 8 weeks and getting nothing
and some people getting entire set in 1-2 weeks
should avg it out when it is such an important part of the patch
errant wagon
Question for M+ er's....
What would you say is bad/OK/good/perfect shield block uptime % in M+ keys? Both with and without heavy repercussions talent?
I know it will vary from key to key, but just in general? I'm trying to gauge my performance and how much room I have to grow.
I'm consistently hitting around 50% and 70% uptime with/without heavy repercussions. What's the average ceiling here?
Assuming reprisal lego
mighty valley
using reprisal + AM, which you should be, 85% is good
craggy pilot
you counting uptime with Details?
errant wagon
I'm looking at uptime from wowlogs
craggy pilot
you should log, and check % hits blocked instead
check your attacks blocked
more accurate
errant wagon
ooh, okay. where would I find that number in wowlogs?
craggy pilot
as Shield Block uptime doesnt matter if the boss is not hitting you
damage taken -> click on you -> hover on "hits" of melee
craggy pilot
but i think 85-90% uptime of SB without HR, and 100% with HR
HR is overkill anyway
errant wagon
can I ask you to contextualize that a bit?
I log all my runs and other prot warriors struggle to even hit 40%
When we say 85-90, is that like, REALLY GOOD? or just like "meh, you're decent"
cus trying to figure out the player skill divide here, haha
chrome falcon
that would be really good
errant wagon
ah I was looking at a fury run by mistake... okay I see blocked hits
ok cool, didn't know about that stat
errant wagon
yea that seems like a better metric to go by, cus Uptime includes dead walking time and RP in dungeons
craggy pilot
i think it only includes time in combat, but youre right
errant wagon
appreciate it 🙂
craggy pilot
but either way, dont run HR
just do AM and get used to Charge + Intervene + Shield Block
and dont overcap SB
errant wagon
really now? okay
craggy pilot
then you will get the block rate up ez
shell shale
for necro keys what conduits people use?
lofty widget
something like this
strong forum
instead of AJ you can also use SoF
its actually not ultra dog dps in weekly keys
for tyr keys AJ owns tho
ebon geyser
they have been since like week 2
isnt nightime where u at
craggy pilot
do people actually go BV in M+ after getting Tier?
just saw it mentioned in Wowhead guide
lofty widget
been playing around with it some today and it feels pretty good
lofty widget
only necro, but i imagine you'd play it for kyrian as well
since the goal is to churn as much rage as possible for the tier
craggy pilot
does the SS really add that much more dmg from Tier?
in M+?
isnt Revenge still higher dmg in Keys?
strong forum
its the rage.
craggy pilot
ye but the rage is for more Revenge?
chilly brook
I mean more rage spent is more damage period
strong forum
more outbursts means more revenges
chilly brook
doesn't necessarily mean just more revenge damage
strong forum
and more avatars
chilly brook
more avatars go brrr
craggy pilot
sometimes i get so much outburst that i end up spending all of it in IP because i might overcap
and then when i spent all, i get in a low period
and havce no rage left for revenge
chilly brook
we arms now
strong forum
if you have an outburst SS lining up, use IP if youre above 55 rage
craggy pilot
if only we had Cleave or Heroic Strike like in Classic 😄 with the "on next attack"
strong forum
if you have demo shout coming up, use IP if youre above 60 rage
craggy pilot
if you have demo shout coming up, use IP if youre above 60 rage
do you go BV in M+ tho?
strong forum
if you have avatar coming up, use IP if youre above 70 rage
technically you should
but its very hard to judge
craggy pilot
and should i do Demo+Avatar at the same time? or layer them out for less Rage into IP?
oblique garnet
No
strong forum
id have to do some sims to figure out what is the bigger gain
austere forum
Wait only SS over 60 rage?? Damn I’ve been slapping that ish like a madman ..
strong forum
choppy
lofty widget
dont
strong forum
read again
craggy pilot
Wait only SS over 60 rage?? Damn I’ve been slapping that ish like a madman ..
how did you get to this lol
austere forum
don't press slam unless >60 rage
craggy pilot
don't press slam unless >60 rage
slam from classic is what he meant i think
austere forum
Ohhh 😂
craggy pilot
or from Arms i mean
chilly brook
From arms
TLDR arms you don't spend rage on anything other than MS or Rend when below 60 rage
So you're "pooling"
Now prot kinda does the same thing
austere forum
Ahhhhh ok
chilly brook
Only it's fluid at the point of where you spend the rage depending on what's about to happen
craggy pilot
TLDR arms you don't spend rage on anything other than MS or Rend when below 60 r...
ye, except as Prot we getting like 40-60 rage at a time :<
oblique garnet
Now prot kinda does the same thing
craggy pilot
and abilities are free like all the time
oblique garnet
Maybe i really am washed up now
chilly brook
you've always wanted enough rage to shield block obviously
chilly brook
Maybe i really am washed up now
no
craggy pilot
but man my rotation feels so much better when i can Execute
oblique garnet
Idk i just press buttons
strong forum
hm
chilly brook
"pool" probably wasn't the right word
strong forum
in my ULTRA OMEGA scuffed sim, on 5t 5min, BV is 600dps less than BSC
chilly brook
the point is that you have thresholds where spending rage is extremely important but you also don't want to overspend
austere forum
So . I tend to hit TS a lot… like .. prolly too much.. it’s not an on cd thing right?
craggy pilot
So . I tend to hit TS a lot… like .. prolly too much.. it’s not an on cd thing r...
yes
use it on CD
lofty widget
with 4pc you pretty much just hit tc when there's nothing else to press
craggy pilot
but only if SS is also on CD
oblique garnet
"pool" probably wasn't the right word
You kinda end up holding out few globals if you want to maximize st damage with outbursts
Incase you have proc already lined up but no SS
craggy pilot
Incase you have proc already lined up but no SS
ye holy shit that feels SO bad
the proc proccing from TC is ridiculous
just remove TC from the Tier set 
austere forum
Ok cool -
Ands it ok to have a few seconds here and there with no button presses right?
chilly brook
somewhat
craggy pilot
Ok cool -
Ands it ok to have a few seconds here and there with no button presses...
heroic leap + charge
chilly brook
depends on the context
lofty widget
not really
chilly brook
but sometimes you do run into periods of time where something isn't available to press but it's extremely rare
lofty widget
the only time i really have nothing to press is when i have outburst proc and SS on cd with <20 rage
chilly brook
usually you have at least revenge
oblique garnet
I generally dont play around the tier set as much as i could
austere forum
For M+ it’s like I’m typing a 5000 word essay. In raid it’s like I’m typing a work email.
oblique garnet
In m+ especially its so ingrained in musclememory that whenever i see SS pop up i press it
craggy pilot
BV into every Spear? 🤔
strong forum
craggy pilot
but how was this not better in the last Patch then?
strong forum
5 target 300sec
chilly brook
I generally dont play around the tier set as much as i could
neither do I
strong forum
and its super NOT optimised
craggy pilot
BSC was better last season also? did we cast more Revenges last season than this? 🤔
oblique garnet
You arent getting hit?
craggy pilot
Nome you ok bruv? 😄
oblique garnet
but how was this not better in the last Patch then?
Your rage gen was lower
craggy pilot
but lower rage gen would mean more dmg from spear vs revenge?
and then BV is better than BSC no? 🤔
strong forum
it didnt use revenge at all
craggy pilot
it didnt use revenge at all
oblique garnet
chilly brook
i had a little oopsie
I expect nothing less from Nom
oblique garnet
but lower rage gen would mean more dmg from spear vs revenge?
Last patch you only had one option if you wanted to do dam as tank and that was seismic which also has synergy with bsc
craggy pilot
ye but also with Reprisal
strong forum
5t 300sec, with prio of SS if below 60 rage
craggy pilot
5t 300sec, with prio of SS if below 60 rage
ye ok this makes more sense
oblique garnet
5t 300sec, with prio of SS if below 60 rage
5t with glory + seismic🤔
Do one like that
chilly brook
hmmmm
strong forum
hmm interesting, apparently 100sec 5t necro is more dmg than kyrian for some reason
strong forum
*thats with first sigil tho
lofty widget
necro is really fun
strong forum
and optimised for necro
chilly brook
*thats with first sigil tho
I have first sigil
craggy pilot
hmm interesting, apparently 100sec 5t necro is more dmg than kyrian for some rea...
👀
craggy pilot
the only thing I don't have is 4pc
same brother
got 3 so early
now didnt get anything for 2 weeks
oblique garnet
the only thing I don't have is 4pc
Got my 5th tier piece today 
hard vessel
How good is 4pc compared to no set? Do you guys feel a lot tankier and did you notice a big dmg increase?
chilly brook
Got my 5th tier piece today <:deswind:533073964096946176>
hopefully I'll get 4pc tonight
strong forum
seismic 5t 100sec
craggy pilot
sheeeesh
chilly brook
so tired of losing to other DPS in the raid and knowing I'd be pumping way more if I had it
oblique garnet
seismic 5t 100sec
chilly brook
How good is 4pc compared to no set? Do you guys feel a lot tankier and did you n...
I mean it's sizeable
10% damage and DR during avatar and adding an extra outburst every 40 seconds-1m is large
austere forum
Wait what is BSC??
strong forum
best served cold, talent
austere forum
Oh
chilly brook
austere forum
Like leftovers ..
hard vessel
10% damage and DR during avatar and adding an extra outburst every 40 seconds-1m...
K this sounds really strong, how often do we can proc outburst with 2 pc? Like every 30 sek?
chilly brook
K this sounds really strong, how often do we can proc outburst with 2 pc? Like e...
something like that
depends on how much rage you're generating at the time and covenant
strong forum
so it does appear to be that BSC is still the go-to, and necro, atleast according to my scuffed sim, even wins on multitarget perma cleave
strong forum
atleast in raw dps
chilly brook
They killed my Necro Fury
mighty egret
"scuffed sim"
strong forum
well yeah, i call it scuffed cuz i didnt bother fully optimising multitarget APL
its literally just "rav on CD > shield slam if below 60 rage > revenge > TC"
das it
vernal vale
I had fun with necro in a few keys.
It doesn't burst stupidly but boy is it solid generally.
mighty egret
same
vernal vale
And my sorry ass has 0 tier still.
mighty egret
it feels comfy
craggy pilot
isnt it only good if you can do 90%+ Banner uptime? 🤔
on raid bosses im still only like 60% uptime, cus im focusing 50/50 on rotation, and calling mechanics
mighty valley
m+ banner uptime is more in your control, not as many forced gaps
vernal vale
General play its okay most likely. Optimaly tier is going to make it better.
I also don't push stupid high keys.
After being forced to dps for way longer than I'd like I'm relearning how to prot properly.
ebon geyser
what would be a good horde class to play that is not a cow
craggy pilot
i rather hammer my nutz than play a panda
take that back 😦
craggy pilot
panda best race
ebon geyser
i gonna throw up
craggy pilot
look at those toes
ebon geyser
🤢
i mean if alliance was any good i would play human but we all know horde is masterfaction
craggy pilot
anyone have a good Sword+Shield xmog that fits well together similar to The Skull of Ruin + Slayer of the Lifeless?
craggy pilot
what would be a good horde class to play that is not a cow
goblin is the best tank class i guess
chilly brook
ebon geyser
zoom zoom race
Why be zoom zoom when I can be zug zug
chilly brook
Saves you in raid when people decide to knock you around
lofty widget
anyone have a good Sword+Shield xmog that fits well together similar to The Skul...
thunderfury+aegis of aggramar?
strong forum
what would be a good horde class to play that is not a cow
🦊
strong forum
Orc gives you nothing
ebon geyser
We still following bloodmallet
median tulip
Vulpera have the best racial in the game: 4 more bag slots
chilly brook
literally the most useless mitigation in the game
strong forum
Literally the best
chilly brook
"let's get rid of the damage when I'm most tanky"
median tulip
The major disadvantage of Vulpera is that all of their transmogs look like ass
chilly brook
Sorry my bad
radiant magnet
I would have thought vulperas biggest issue is being crotch high to every other horde race. Dont see a lot of soap or showers in Org ya know.
strong forum
Again, it's gonna be over 1mil with actual gear
chilly brook
with actual gear
strong forum
Most of that dmg is even below the max threshold it can absorb cuz it's from a 13
strong forum
Yeah so you absorb more
strong forum
It's gonna be more you're right
strong forum
It's 5% of your max hp, which is what, 6k at 120k
chilly brook
idk
strong forum
Hardly anything hits for 6k after SB
chilly brook
Hardly anything hits for 6k after SB
?
strong forum
Besides bosses
ebon geyser
orc is mid pack in bloodmallet
chilly brook
in a 19 mists
ebon geyser
vulpera is bottom
chilly brook
vulpera big cope
strong forum
Right so what would you take
chilly brook
holy shit
strong forum
If not the free mitigation
strong forum
In my 13
With 250 ilvl and a 252 shield
The average melee hit me for 2k
Sometimes only 300
In this 22 fort mists from erga, the average melee hit he took was 7k
So yeah, it would eat an entire melee attack per mob
strong forum
orc is mid pack in bloodmallet
Simming for racial dmg is irrelevant for tanks, and generally for dps besides casters aswell
You pick it for aesthetics > utility > damage
In that order
strong forum
Small characters are infinetley better than big ones
chilly brook
ebon geyser
no, their feet look like if im wearing clown shoes
chilly brook
Look at this drip
chilly brook
Drip or drown fam
strong forum
Can't click shit
ebon geyser
thats why i dont want a tauren
ebon geyser
tauren is like playing a fridge
sage yacht
😎
ebon geyser
and feet
chilly brook
Also ugly ass animations
Panda objectively best animations
chilly brook
Female tauren is allowed
This is some real furry shit
ebon geyser
pandas dont exist in my wow
strong forum
You can't tell me otherwise
strong forum
Vulpera also has great animations
chilly brook
sage yacht
chilly brook
Zand has dogshit animations
Actually true
ebon geyser
i already have a unded monk
chilly brook
Biggest reason why I don’t play zandalari or nightborne
strong forum
Same
strong forum
Same as worgen have god awful animations
chilly brook
Goblin animations are very sterile
strong forum
Too many races with bad animations actually unreal
ebon geyser
im trying to evolve in the horde ok , 90% of my toons are BE or VE 
strong forum
im trying to evolve in the horde ok , 90% of my toons are BE or VE <:dandy:80970...
9.2.5
I can finally play the objectively best race again
Dorf
ebon geyser
dude c mon we know 9.2.5 is gonna release in 2027
strong forum
Bis tmog
Bis animations
Bis abilities
chilly brook
I can finally play the objectively best race again
You’d have to play first
Also dwarf animations are kinda bad
strong forum
They're goated
ebon geyser
dwarf are bad
strong forum
Shut mouf
ebon geyser
is like they bonk a human
chilly brook
Bro
ebon geyser
armor looks like if it was shrink in paint
strong forum
They're literal peak fantasy race in every game
chilly brook
The half hearted half spin back hand???
chilly brook
It’s so bad
strong forum
Spin back hand?
chilly brook
Everything else is fine
strong forum
That's devastate
chilly brook
Minus the spin backhand
strong forum
Who presses that
ebon geyser
if u wanna play alliance go human now THATS the chad class