I mean
#protection
mighty valley
You want to put out max dps
And the start of the pack is when aggro is usually tightest if people start blowing CDs
mellow bridge
Against a good WW, every point of dps counts 
tardy sequoia
Yup that’s why I blow avatar and ravager and spam TC and revenge
ionic fern
If you only TC you will lose aggro pretty fast to any competent DPS players. 🙂
There is nothing wrong with the scenario you are describing of just pushing 2 SB stacks out instantly(unless the pack dies before or there are casters etc in it) but there really isn't a need for it.
Use the extra rage on Revenge instead.
As there are 2 stacks of SB you are not really wasting any of them unless you are actively sitting on 2 stacks.
tardy sequoia
Cause today afternoon I asked why when tanking an initial pull of a dungeon (e.g. first pack of DoS or whole first floor of SoA) I almost instantly get obliterated outside of my cds window (SW and LS mostly)
I know one must look at logs to understand but in meantime I can’t sort this out and it’s driving me crazy
ionic fern
It really shouldn't drive you crazy.
It's always DoS that's giving people problems.
The answer is simple.
DoS outer ring packs have a ton of magic/nature damage that needs to be handled or you will get wrecked.
-Casts going through will wreck you
-You standing on the purple crap on the ground will wreck you
-Bone Strike will wreck you
tardy sequoia
Ok maybe I exaggerate, I’m not English mother tongue so sometimes I exaggerate
I try to explain without logs what sometimes happen (sometimes yes sometimes no, depending on the group, I play mostly PuG)
tardy sequoia
Usually I charge in, pick up aggro of the mobs (health suddenly dropping low after one interrupt and spell reflection cast)
ionic fern
Your DPS players should be actively interrupting (pug's unfortunately don't really do that)
What you can do is properly using your CD's - SW/DS/LS . You can also dump more rage into IP if you feel too squishy.
tardy sequoia
So I cast LS and I survive the pull sometimes
ionic fern
Remember to SR and not stand on the purple crap on the ground.
ionic fern
Charge->DS for the first one then
And dump more rage into IP.
Granted it's not a great ability but it does help against magic attacks.
tardy sequoia
The general feeling when tanking initial pull of these dungeon (de other side, spires of ascension and halls of atonement) is that I’m a bit shaky
ionic fern
All of these dungeons have one thing in common on initial pulls:
A lot of magic damage.
tardy sequoia
I see my HP going low reeeally fast outside my main cooldown window
ionic fern
You can't solo everything - that's not the tank design.
You are reliant on your DPS'ers having a brain and interrupting.
tardy sequoia
In worst case scenarios sometimes has happened that I’ve died in the first 3 seconds (luckily not always)
Ok that could be
ionic fern
Well, 3 seconds sound excessive..be sure to keep your defensives up o.o
tardy sequoia
Ok maybe excessive.. 10 seconds then XD
Sometimes I feel like starving on cooldown and I mean it’s the first pack what can I do now?
I die and everyone leaves the key
Even rallying cry has been used!
ionic fern
Well, i can't help you any further than what i already told you.
If you wish any more precise help we would need to see some logs.
tardy sequoia
Of course, and your help has been much appreciated, sometimes I am redundant
I will record some logs next time I’ll be playing
ionic fern
mellow bridge
Struggling as a tank in the first soa pull sounds weird
I get dos/hoa but spires is pretty chill I feel like
It's usually the rest that dies to the random casts
Only thing I can think of is the burden cast going through and not being dispelled
tardy sequoia
Also you know where I struggle? In plaguefall, in the part between the first boss and the second, the zone with the slimes and the doctor that put those nasty debuffs at you
I don’t know how sense or Plka are able to do more than 2 mobs at a time without dying XD
Obviously not talking of the plagueroc or the abomination one
deft vortex
Anyone else actually hating the new set bonuses so far on ptr? My rotation feels extremely clunky once I start getting to 6 or 7 stacks. And then sometimes I just cast thunderclap out of instinct not meaning to, wasting an outburst.
Also keeping track of the stacks is a pain in the ass even on a dumby
ionic fern
Pretty sure everyone is hating it. 🙂
deft vortex
Oh good glad it's not just me then lol
mighty cairn
all tank sets are equally powerful 🙂
ionic fern
deft vortex
mellow bridge
Also you know where I struggle? In plaguefall, in the part between the first bos...
There are several things you need to keep track of there
That part can be very hard or very easy
Plagueborer casts destroy you but they can be reflected, stunned without being recasted or pre immuned by freedom
Slimeclaws hurt and their debuff needs to be dispelled
If you have high stacks, you can't facetank
Dodge/stun purple blob jump
And interrupt or get dispelled on the dot from the green ones
Basically any relevant dmg in that part has direct counterplay available
Actually I might be wrong on the plagueborer cast not being recast, has been a while since I pushed lol
But you can def sync them up and reflect several at the same time and use a defensive otherwise
royal lodge
I pull the red slime onto first boss for haste buff. This helps reset your cooldowns for the pack near the stairs. On tyrannical week the slime is well worth the time. On fortified weeks, it is iffy. It really spends on the interrupts on how long it takes.
Anyone have any good info on that shield that has the click on effect? One version it adds more block value and the other gives a brambles effect?
mellow bridge
Getting red slime is always worth
It helps a lot with CD timing usually as well
At least if you skip the start
sick sentinel
Your DPS players should be actively interrupting (pug's unfortunately don't real...
All to common, All pugs I run end up with me doing 3x the amount of everyone's interrupts.
I just came to realize that I have to play around knowing what I can pull within my limits while undermining my dps's ability to interrupt
Generally speaking in most places that don't require a lot interrupts ill pull big
Pretty weird running with 2 shamans and somehow manage to outinturrept both of them
robust rover
Just watched a Druid tank a 19 NW like it wasn’t fort/necrotic. I don’t think I could do that on a 16. iLvl wasn’t that different from me. Maybe I need to find some prot tank streams again.
sand pebble
Just watched a Druid tank a 19 NW like it wasn’t fort/necrotic. I don’t think I...
Yeah did some alt keys and tank jumped on 250 bear, nw 15 pulls the first 3 packs hit 99 stacks and still didnt need healing
sick sentinel
If they continue to make dumb balance things like people will get fed up and quit
waxen orbit
all tank sets are equally powerful 🙂
What in the copium
teal swift
If they continue to make dumb balance things like people will get fed up and qui...
No they won't lmao
mighty valley
"i hate this game. i'm going to quit if another thing makes me mad" - wow player who's been subbed since they were born
jagged pier
If they continue to make dumb balance things like people will get fed up and qui...
no i'm fed up and im too addicted to quit
oblique garnet
no i'm fed up and im too addicted to quit
I will jump ship as soon as there is game where the pve is as good with game engine that is as good as wow
jagged pier
^^
sweet summit
i feel this clip so much
lime urchin
I like this game a lot!
teal swift
no i'm fed up and im too addicted to quit
If i could find a legitimate better MMO that isnt worse than WoW
for the things i hate
i'd swap
teal swift
WoW is kinda my life ngl
everything else is bleak and hopeless. Its why I try so hard to get better every single day.
gaunt dawn
get into fitness
gaunt dawn
would say hold a plank for 30s
gaunt dawn
😓
jagged pier
for every depleted key do 20 push ups
No because i only do keys with @ionic fern thenhe baits me into a 20 key
blazing condor
"haha wouldnt it be fun if we tried a 20 lol maybe see if we can get a portal or something lol imagine if we did that!!"
"jk.... unless 😏 "
jagged pier
Not my fault you thought i was joking.
I could have equiped matrix or aegis or both
ionic fern
😂
oblique garnet
I could have equiped matrix or aegis or both
I thought i taught you better
We dont play with defensive trinkets here 
jagged pier
Matrix isnt really a defesnive trinket tbh
oblique garnet
It has a defensive effect
jagged pier
But it does the same if not more damage than my 246 phial depending on key lvl
blazing condor
sweet kayak
sweet summit
blazing condor
🥀
sweet summit
⚰️
rotund thicket
did anyone of you test the tierset?
rotund thicket
tc slow goes up by 100% instead of 200% for some reason
sick sentinel
What in the copium
The copium factory, shifty, ms paint I quickly cobbled together few weeks ago
oblique garnet
id assume <@!238357283996696576> did
Good one
ionic relic
Is each layer of twisting corridor 18 floors?
sweet summit
yea
ionic relic
daymn
blazing condor
clear ur schedule
ionic relic
I only want layer 3 to get my leggo 😦
but not even done layer 1!
Is it account wide?
so if I log my DK and plast it
blast it*
then log warrior to get the leggo?
oblique garnet
Yeah it is
blazing condor
gl!
oblique garnet
I actually did jeah. 😦
Woah really?
blazing condor
devilish
oblique garnet
No, i lied - i made all the feedback and bugs up.
the way it should be
ionic fern
Tbh it would probably be like 50/50 considering how many bugs there are. 😂
sick sentinel
if i get an everlastingob-leggo that changes covenants shouldn't i just craft many other spec ones i didn't craft finish yet?
get 4 per spec, there has to be some good interaction between 2 leggos somwhere
was considering doing mage/rogue something else
tropic gorge
kinda sucks how dead af alliance lfg is
its currently dead af hours anyways, but even during the day its fucking dead 😦
cloud dagger
Anyone know if there is an icd for outburst? noticed it wasnt stacking mid way through combat
i assume there is some form of one
ionic fern
It's really bugged right now
Sometimes randomly stops and then doesnt even start again etc.
I haven't noticed any behaviour that would indicate a icd tho.
lime urchin
can anyone recommend a nice weakaura for necrolord protection warriors? I think I saw Plka play with something that showed wich characters would get the buff etc
sweet summit
can anyone recommend a nice weakaura for necrolord protection warriors? I think ...
not 100% accurate
but better than nothing i guess
lime urchin
ok ok ill give it a try
ionic relic
hate this game. Got to floor 18
then faced patrician cromwell
couldn't kill him
On layer 1 btw
blazing condor
blazing condor
honestly could be worth
if you can find some well geared peeps it'd make it more fun and faster probably
TC is a bit weird though considering it's been p much untouched since launch
so idk how it plays now in 9.1.5
waxen orbit
couldn't kill him
What level of TC and what item level?
smoky wave
Surprised you had issues that low but it's defo more fun with friends. Shamans are fun giving lust whenever they drop a totem.
lime urchin
so I tried a mists run with seismic
and I am ashamed to admit I really needed to adjust to the shieldblocking again 😮
jagged pier
🤔
modern brook
hate this game. Got to floor 18
Why are we doing tc in 2021
modern brook
To layer 18???
blazing condor
yes
modern brook
Good edit btw
blazing condor
cus u can only get it at l3^
modern brook
When did thay happen
somber sky
could somene tell me if the 200% more effective thing actually affected the additional thingies like slows?
strong forum
yes it does
blazing condor
autophial 
distant crystal
but muh potency
sweet summit
aaf>sof
strong forum
^
strong forum
🙂
distant crystal
wasn't in my list
sweet summit
no lmfao
strong forum
game good
distant crystal
talking bout tr
sweet summit
oh
distant crystal
you have every conduit at 226 except the 2 new generics i guess
and you have to buy 252 from vendor
strong forum
if youre just going for banner cant you just copy over your live character
should make it easier
distant crystal
no
strong forum
F
distant crystal
you have to go from template
plus my live warrior is decked out in nyalotha gear
😏
strong forum
and
strong forum
hes running 4 endurance
:pepega: waat
so yeah, hes either forced to run fbv or bv
distant crystal
it's too late you already pepega'd Plka i seent it
strong forum
ill pepega him
all day
ive done it live on a podcast
and ill do it again
nobody is safe
distant crystal
sweet summit
👍
distant crystal
hidden kindle
Does the tier set affect only damage or also slow, rage gen etc?
sweet summit
all of the above
hidden kindle
Sounds insane?
hidden kindle
How often do you get 8 stacks ish?
sweet summit
very buggy atm
but give me a sec
ok my brain is not working very well atm
i have forgotten how to do basic math
hidden kindle
😅
strong forum
should be every 30-40sec
excluding the procs of avatar
and fyi
its not worth it to ever press TC or IP with outburst buff
the only reason to use it on TC would be for the slow of TC, otherwise youre losing dmg
sick sentinel
not even m+?
strong forum
well in raid you will NEVER use outburst TC lol
legit NEVER
and yes in m+ its not worth it to use empowered TC ever outside of wanting the slow
the extra rage from SS will grant you 2 revenges, and those 2 revenges will do just as much dmg as the empowered TC
but you got the benefit of a 20k shield slam
sick sentinel
i still don't understand what an outburst stack is really supposed to be besides something you stack to 8
sounds like it does legit nothing till 8
sick sentinel
they could make it 1 or .5% (haste, or str, or armor) for 3 seconds when you get an outburst
clearly what the play is to get 8 stacks IP, avatar and then IP again
can't die with all that absorb
plush tendon
yea, but what if I use show of force and UF
plush tendon
O:
ionic fern
What
plush tendon
patent osprey
and yes in m+ its not worth it to use empowered TC ever outside of wanting the s...
PFft ill fight you
def worth to use Empowered TC first GCD in a pack when u charge avatar
^.^
Initial threat is still nice
plush tendon
ionic fern
def worth to use Empowered TC first GCD in a pack when u charge avatar
When you charge Avatar you really can't use much else due to overcapping rage.
😂
ionic fern
👀
patent osprey
TC hits like nothing :(
ionic fern
That's new.
patent osprey
like talking about first 3 seconds of a pull
cause TC hits so little
any ability pulls off
ionic fern
That's why we got Revenge. 😦
patent osprey
yeah but first 3 seconds in large pulls ur usually still grouping
revenge isn't relative till they are grouped
but that's when WWs are setting up their stacks and dhs fel rush -_-
ionic fern
😦
patent osprey
compared to like avengers shield
ionic fern
Do what i do - play lower keys so you can almost solo-carry unless the DPS are doing 4k in a +19
patent osprey
ww hits 100k mid pull dps and complain they pulling aggro -_-
ionic fern
But jeah, i get that TC hits further and realistically using your Outburst stack with it as you enter the pack is a solid play to gather them but outside of that it's still a wet noodle.
😦
strong forum
be TC
get a conduit that buffs your dmg
get a set bonus that buffs your dmg by 200%
still hit less than kegsmash hits baseline
ionic fern
mellow gorge
lads
i have a question
i'm running kleia cause i don't want necrotic
but i only have one potency
do i use adaptive or cov spear
strong forum
spear
mellow gorge
alright
sick sentinel
you dont need to but bounding makes necrotic slighly easier and is my default choice for that row
TC is kinda ass damage now and only ever used to fish for ss and rotation
if you have people you know you can reliably count on to do slows, you can just run crackle
lime urchin
Who are you answering? Or am I misreading
sick sentinel
responding to what vespa says
i haven't tried but necrotic is supposed to be nerfed to hell i heard, going to have to specificy between necrolord and necrotic all this week now instead of necro lol
lime urchin
I am trying necrolording too!
Best class hall!
But pressing banner is a bit boring so far, except my friend the WW keeps sending me gifts now
sick sentinel
everybody loves the banner, i put on the fake one at dungeon entrances and in oribos get people come stare at it for a second
i ran some torghast and ragnaros dude in party cheer me like 100 times
echo cairn
Hello! is kyrian the best covenant for Prot warrior for raiding ?
and what legendary should i be crafting first ?
lime urchin
Reprisal and kyrian
echo cairn
thank you!
lime urchin
A longer answer can be found in the pins and on the wowhead-guide!
sick sentinel
phial is pretty good
blazing condor
it is
sick sentinel
opening the dungeon journal to see what the spell did that killed me was about:
verbal rapids
Why would one log show 40 casts of Shield Slam generating 920 rage vs another log showing 48 casts of Shield Slam only generating 747 rage?
verbal rapids
I would expect the first to be at 1000 rage then
ionic fern
Oh, 40.
920 / 40 = 23 which means The wall + HR
747 / 48 = 15 which means nothing.
ionic fern
Well, it's 15.5..so could be some schenanigans with logging.
ionic fern
Are you checking total rage ?
verbal rapids
Looking at slam only
ionic fern
From logs?
verbal rapids
Ya
ionic fern
Okay, then probably as i said before - some log schenanigans.
verbal rapids
Other rage generation made sense… that one threw me
ionic fern
You mean the IV guide?
Jeah, it will be updated for 9.2
sick sentinel
i think i attempted to get on the ptr but got nebulus error messages
IV as in part 4 or oh god no
icy vien lol nvm
sick sentinel
also don't forget to take into consideration rage boosters primarily last stand increases rage you get by a %
formal raven
trying to hunt down the reprisal leggo pattern. anyone had luck resetting twisting corridors or do we just have to wait for the wing to come up?
mighty valley
yeah, you can reset it
nova rover
Will making Reprisal on a cloak hinder me?
my legs are 250+ is why I ask, and replacement cloak is a 239
nova rover
Ya know... some days I am amazed I can get out of bed , thank you Erga
nova rover
lol
As you said it I realized immediately what you ment and remembered all legos are tied to the x and y slots
blazing condor
Thank u Erga for enabling us to get out of bed
brittle owl
bed was warm and comfy doe 
hasty fjord
Ok yall I need some input or help...I really dislike the weeks with the necrotic affix, I struggle with knowing when to leap away at X # and allow the team to "suffer" withoit me... What is a number I should aim for to leave the group? 10, 20, 25...this will help me attempt to be better at our tanking craft. Thank all yall.
blazing condor
first of all if you're kyrian you can use Kleia as bind to instantly remove necrotic with your phial and give you immune to necro for 7 seconds. Good QoL
Other than that pwarrs are pretty good for necro because we don't rely on healing as much since we mitigate damage instead. Because of this you can easily (if played correctly) go up to 50 stacks without needing to jump away
but it's a lot of preference in what you feel comfortable tanking
personally i let it get to around 40 before i start thinking about reseting but you can go higher and lower
however if you feel like you need to reset as not to die at 20 stacks then you're probably playing improperly
hasty fjord
Hmmm interesting, I will note that I did run two different +10 keys. In one I was staying a live pretty well (ToP), then in (MoTS) we couldnt even get to first mini? One of the players in MoTS was commenting on my stacks so I thought may be I better inquire some more.
blazing condor
As long as you have aggro it shouldnt be a big concern if you need to reset. A good shockwave > leap usually does the trick
then you can kinda just wait it out
if you got decent pugs (good joke right) then they should help you as well if they notice you're out tryna reset
with CC etc
But yeah you shouldnt struggle with stacks especially if its below 40
hasty fjord
Thank you for the input and reassurance I wasnt all screwed up, lol
blazing condor
🙂
The more experience you get with necrotic the easier it'll feel to handle it
so just gotta put urself out there
sick sentinel
I'm not at pc and drat on routes aren't the best but I did find a wa for necrotic on raider in site>routes>necrotic and then it take me to wago
blazing condor
i just look at my debuffs tbh
maybe im old fashioned but its kinda weird to over-WA your UI but each to their own
especially when the default UIs provide what you need in those aspects anyway
blazing condor
whatever works 🙂
inland raft
Its nice to have some debuffs always be in same spot rather then on a bar that is constantly moving icons around
sick sentinel
you should change the message on it cuz it says "fuck this shit run" which is technically reportable
noble prism
any video war prot 9.2 tier set testing?
jagged pier
as its buggy as all hell no i doubt it
sick sentinel
good news is i got a 239 scale last night(236 and haven't yet, but will, put points into today)
blazing condor
why not 246 
sick sentinel
was a drop from 16 dos, we didnt time it lol
blazing condor
doesnt matter if you upgrade
sick sentinel
im also 1800-1900 IO, probably never get KSM SL, so 242 is the most i can upgrade it to atm
i'm a shitter and it took TDev for me to get it haha
mellow bridge
If you're 1900 you can easily get ksm
It's just 100 points
And some good weeks are coming up
mellow bridge
yea
like to get 1900, you def already have some 14s/15s timed
just need to get the rest
ionic relic
hey all, me again
So I've farmed layer 1 and 2 on Twisting corridor with my main
so now I can go into layer 3 with my warrior and reset until I get UR right? for my leggo
strong forum
Yup
ionic relic
ty
how do I know if I am in the upper reaches? when I enter TC it just says TC Acend the floors
blazing condor
It has a specific layout
you know like the fire place has a bunch of fire and shit
there's probably a yt vid on how it looks if youre uncertain
jagged pier
shouldnt it say on the minimap
ionic relic
and it should be like that from floor one yah?
ah yeah it does!
I am in fracture chamber
thanks!
ionic relic
It's done!
Leggo obtained! I would like to thank my mother, my father, odin and of course, this discord
blazing condor
ionic relic
craft them on legs ya
sick sentinel
go craft on legs haste versa or second option is haste crit
ionic fern
Gratz.
sick sentinel
262 is best if you can do it but 235 is just fine for alts
ionic relic
thanks
rotund thicket
our raidlead called the day after our arms warrior did this: https://gyazo.com/a647f6f627f94652f521cdfbd52b0f45
mellow bridge
happens to the best
mellow bridge
i did the same thing once tbh
in the intermission I'm always chained to the same pack of chains
one time I somehow got chained to another one and didnt realize
didnt end well
rotund thicket
well we finally reached plattform 4 this evening so we took it with humor 😄
mellow bridge
soon kill pog
somber sky
our raidlead called the day after our arms warrior did this: https://gyazo.com/a...
lmao i did that too
mine was in a heroic tho :v
blazing condor
thinking about it i dont think i ever charged my own chain
ive been damn close though when they've been grouped
strong forum
I've only died once to chain cuz I didn't know they killed you when you're too close
blazing condor
like hedgehogs
waxen cradle
How we feeling about our 2Pc/4Pc too good and its getting nerfed or are they gonna let us enjoy 9.2 as beasts
strong forum
We're gonna do alot better ST dmg compared to now
M+ gonna be neat dmg buff
But nothing amazing
waxen cradle
Wondering if they are going to let the Holy Pally Set bonus go live as it is, the uptime on wings is insane
sick sentinel
are there other legendaries with extend effect like banner
sick sentinel
for other classes?
strong forum
No
Then venthyr druid ravenous frenzy
The more casts you do the longer the buff still be and the stronger it will get
sick sentinel
i just can't do druid
waxen cradle
Is the VDH set bonus going to be that OP I thought it just effected Immolation Aura ?
strong forum
Yes
waxen cradle
Or has it been updated on PTR
strong forum
Vdh currently does like 20k dps
sick sentinel
never have been able to never will be able to roll druid and take it serious
strong forum
And the vdh set bonus is so fucking bugged that you can get over 1400% vers
waxen cradle
OH wow
blazing condor
how much vers do i need to run a 25 as a vdh
strong forum
All of it
blazing condor
i said 700% damage reduction 😡
strong forum
Is the VDH set bonus going to be that OP I thought it just effected Immolation A...
Like legit, vdh is going to be the most dmg tank by far if they don't change smth
Even without the bugs
Cuz they will have infinite immo aura uptime, and through the conduit growing inferno immo aura will ramp up to do 10x of its normal dmg
Meaning they will absolutely destroy dmg meters
sick sentinel
you can lead a tank to a dungeon entrance, but you can't make him re-roll druid/paladin/dh
or tank the dungeon
waxen cradle
@strong forum Holy shit they will have to change that, it will be 9.1 all over again where no one wants anything but DH
sick sentinel
i dunno, i think there is a weird elephant in the room regarding class design and how druid is so greedy it took a full spec away from DH so it could have a 4th spec, only class in game with 4 specs
waxen cradle
I may be partial but I personally feel kind of shit on by Blizzard when classes that can literally do nothing but tank or dps set on the bottom as far as damage done is considered
sick sentinel
and then they are still mostly overpowered some how after 3 full expansions, turbo OP in legion what i heard, obviously, great dps in bfa and good tanks in SL
strong forum
Eh
sick sentinel
i fpr whateber reason am not capable of leveling dh
strong forum
Bfa was pretty dogwater for vdh
sick sentinel
cuz i'm dumb enough that i'd fit the "dumb DH" trope
waxen cradle
Does not feel great when you can only do 2 things really well, and one of them pretty much 95% of the other tanks do better
strong forum
Vdh is gonna do huge dmg, but they're still gonna be bad defensively
sick sentinel
no, bfa dps dh (i don't play any dh so only terms i know are meta and dark) was good, but if they attacked early into fight they bursted, got aggro and died
they were fantastic at blowing up priority adds
didn't see any DH tanks when i did dps classes
sturdy sable
I got ce as veng in uldir it was trash garbage
sick sentinel
whatever i did for my hunter, i got the magic stars aligned whenever the city of nyalotha came out, for whatever reason i just, had the right gear and talents got invited to some normal nyalotha
did some absurd dps like well over 20-30k, too much that they didn't want to kick me, but i had no clue about any mechanic at all
just tunneled boss
made it all the way to n'zoth and did like 2-3 pulls someone left and it had been like, all day raid, so i left raid, didn't get him till like almost pre-patch SL
tardy sequoia
What’s the correct usage of LS? is it to be used reactively or proactively? Is it a health boost or healing cooldown?
I know it can be both but what’s the most effective usage of it?
cinder fern
As an offensive cooldown with the conduit, no?
blazing condor
I use LS proacticely for things i know i will need it for. E.g. certain pulls in m+ or mechanics in raids
Other than that i use if i get an ”uh oh” moment
If i know i wont need it for defense then i use it with execute phase if i can
Because of the rage gain from conduit
Id argue its best to use it proactively than reactively though
As with most CDs
sick sentinel
urban portal
Meaning they will absolutely destroy dmg meters
the true meta is 3 vdh 1 boomie for bosses and some random healer
ocean yoke
i have decided to now deny that old warrior soul exists its the only explanation
fringe copper
Is there a proper way to sim using raidbots as a prot Warrior? It says it sims for DPS and I’m not sure if I’m using it properly
For gear choices
Do I just go with ilvl hope?
And*
teal swift
Vdh is gonna do huge dmg, but they're still gonna be bad defensively
Bfa vdh was basically unkillable S4.
brittle owl
Bfa was pretty dogwater for vdh
2/4 patches were aight
chilly brook
Is there a proper way to sim using raidbots as a prot Warrior? It says it sims f...
Yes that's how sims work, they only exist for damage. If you're going to survivability equip ilvl and in the case of trinkets you can feel free to ask.
Ilvl>haste>vers>crit>mastery
For survival
lime urchin
Do I just go with ilvl hope?
Ilvl and then haste. Never mention versatility here.
lime urchin
That was fun indeed
teal swift
I miss S4 VDH
Was the first season i pushed past ksm lol, it was so much fun
sweet summit
buff ftd
ionic fern
Logs on
Tries spec
Logs off
Quits blizzard because they see what they have unleashed
jagged pier
sick sentinel
I should never pitched the idea for reprisal leggo,, it was too powerful
forest meadow
I quite enjoy the zoom zoom play style though!
lime urchin
Yes, too bad it’s a borrowed playstyle..
ionic fern
Watch them nerf it and place it as a talent instead of AM.
ionic fern
yeah am goes baseline
Knowing them it would more likely go like:
-Reprisal replaces AM as a talent, no longer provides free Revenge proc or Rage
-AM moved to baseline, only reduces SW CD
sweet summit
mellow gorge
no no
AM forces you to pay 500gold per hour
for AM classes lessons for your character
lime urchin
Y u talk such scary stuff Mawhi, this day started so nice 
Maybe some nice stuff will happen!
ionic plank
jagged pier
lime urchin
forest meadow
I think it'd be cool if the just leave the 20 rage on intervene. I feel like it's such an unused button otherwise
ionic fern
👀
You should be utilising Intervene even without it.
If you add the Rage onto it baseline most people will just use it as a "rage gain" button killing the initial purpose of the ability..might as well just change the tooltip to : "Press it to gain 20 Rage".
It's already like that tbh with Reprisal.
jagged pier
as much as i liked the Tos teir set it did change zerker rage into that
forest meadow
Yeah that makes sense. But SL season 1 I just played healer mostly, and I don't really ever remember seeing prot warriors use intervene except to get away from necrotic stacks.
Now I'm using it to get extra charges in, to move around, to get rage/SB, and for the DR from conduit.
lime urchin
Intervene in bfa was incredibly strong. Or was it called safeguard then or smt?
ionic fern
Safeguard made Intervene a really solid low CD external.
It should/can also be used for all the people that go:
"X player is ripping threat off me and dying!!!!"
Ok..you know he's ripping threat, just intervene him if you're too lazy to fix your own play.
forest meadow
Ah true, a melee DPS grabbing agro. I haven't had much agro problems in SL. Maybe my DPS players are too gentle lol
jagged pier
u shouldnt have any
unless @sweet summit or @ionic fern use BS .1 secs into pull when u havent even grouped the mobs up yet
forest meadow
Shoulda ravager'ed -1secs into the pull haha
jagged pier
i got so pissed off in a 15 yesterday on my monk had a mage that constantly pulled the next pack, i had to exlpain to him its not about aggro its about grouping the mobs and him hitting one if very fucking annoyin
jagged pier
monks fine just as fast as warrior
forest meadow
*mage: dies
tank: "sorry my doorbell rang"
jagged pier
but far easier to play
ionic fern
Intervene in bfa was incredibly strong. Or was it called safeguard then or smt?
It was "Intercept" then iirc. Charge/Intervene in 1 button.
It wasn't that good...only took ONE hit.
Safeguard was a talent redirecting 30% damage taken by them to you.
blazing condor
Why did they remove intercept though
jagged pier
i've left keys over that before because they push my luck like your not going to do anything
blazing condor
like
jagged pier
Why did they remove intercept though
because with the unpruning we got intervene back
blazing condor
yeah if someone pulls ahead of me i just let them tank it until they die then i take it
ionic fern
unless <@!165864577760755712> or <@!238357283996696576> use BS .1 secs into pull...
Don't put my name in the same sentence as Erga's when talking about DPS please, makes me feel depressed.
blazing condor
⛽ 
forest meadow
Yesterday I had a healer pulling the next pack into us. It was actually kinda nice lol. If he's prepared to heal it, I'll allow it haha
ionic fern
i got so pissed off in a 15 yesterday on my monk had a mage that constantly pull...
See, that's when i let them die.
😂
blazing condor
at the same time if i play dps then it's kinda aids with tanks that constantly underpull
especially when we all got cds up
but you cant really be mad at them i guess? it just sucks
3 mobs per pull with full cds
forest meadow
We +2'ed a 15 for vault, so we were rippin' anyways
blazing condor
ionic fern
I had a DH dashing around in the ToP+19 yesterday causing him to pull all types of random crap we diddn't want.
😦
I diddn't even know they still play the dashy build.
forest meadow
momentum build in the lich wing ftw
ionic fern
but you cant really be mad at them i guess? it just sucks
100%. I just assume they are new and/or not familiar with the spec.
I honestly don't care if we +1 it or +3 it as long as we time it.
blazing condor
Yeah i'm not gonna force someone who's not comfortable with tanking to do even more uncomfortable stuff
by pulling extra
but damn
ionic fern
I don't like depleted keys. 😒
That's why i got tilted by this:
Spriest doing 5k overall.
blazing condor
sadge
ionic fern
👍
brittle owl
why are y'all doomers today
blazing condor
its monday
ionic fern
^
brittle owl
mondays are great wdym
ionic fern
Never.
brittle owl
always
blazing condor
i have the entire week off
brittle owl
see
blazing condor
but i got an exam im supposed to be writing this week
brittle owl
this guy knows how to monday
ionic fern
Smh
blazing condor
problem is i laid in bed til 12pm and now i ahven't done jack shit with my day
ionic fern
My day started horribly. 😦
brittle owl
how so
blazing condor
i'm a good boy and actually i've done 3/4 assignments 
ionic fern
blazing condor
thats a lot of bird-poop
ionic fern
I'm not going to work again this week because of it.
Cba cleaning the car every morning.
blazing condor
what country you in?
ionic fern
Estonia.
blazing condor
Place here in sweden had -41c last night
brittle owl
time to use the rug beaters for pullups
blazing condor
brittle owl
Place here in sweden had -41c last night
at that point people living there are asking for it tbh
blazing condor
yeah stupid people
forest meadow
I'd heard in here that the tier set bonus was kinda clunky trying to use the buff on SS but it not being off CD or whatever. Has anyone played it enough to see it play smoother? Wondering if it's gonna be something we just passively consume or actually use it on the ability we want.
blazing condor
not much to gain from testing it a lot rn considering its buggy asf
forest meadow
ah
ionic fern
I'd heard in here that the tier set bonus was kinda clunky trying to use the buf...
1)It's buggy as hell
2)Even if it weren't buggy it's something you have to actively track (especially during high rage income sessions like when using CD's with Unnerving) so you don't press the wrong button. .the wrong buttons being TC/IP. 🙂
It's a nice illusion of choice tho.
ionic fern
I mean the gain is solid.
ionic fern
15k+ damage and 45 rage.
blazing condor
with actively play around it i mean as in consciously using abilities in a way to gain the most uptime on it
compared to pressing buttons normally and then just dumping into the proc SS
ionic fern
Well, currently it goes like this:
1-6 stacks use what ever abilities you want to dump rage
6-8 stacks only use Revenge/SB to dump rage
8 stacks = use SS
blazing condor
forest meadow
I feel like there's gonna definitely be times when you overcap rage so you don't "buff" an IP
ionic fern
If you use IP at 6+ stacks it auto consumes the buff in like 90% of the time.
brittle owl
just press revenge if you overcap rage
blazing condor
just press revenge.
ionic fern
So we have to play around the stacks like that..AND if you really wanna min-max you also gotta pay attention to when you're using Avatar...if you're on 6 stacks and Avatar is off CD and you use Avatar you just wasted 6 stacks.
😂
jagged pier
just let it stack to 10 or 16 so we dont have to minmax
brittle owl
idk man it doesn't seem that mindbreaking to min max
jagged pier
🙏
brittle owl
sure it's a new thing to keep track of
ionic fern
Or..make them separate buffs.
One for the "buffs your next blabla"
And another one for the "counts stacks".
Currently it just transforms.
brittle owl
but it's not as mindbreaking as say using double on use in bfa
blazing condor
have we gotten info if taz is getting m+'d in 9.2?
smoky wave
Yeah it is
smoky wave
🤭
jagged pier
inland raft
I fid it as arms when first came out so ive seen the fights once but dont really know the mechanics, but dont think gonna translate well to m+ if they dont adjust some of the fights, plus sooo much trash
mellow bridge
well
forest meadow
Yeah PUG on the fight with the 4 runes is gonna be impossible M+. And even very early in 9.1 we were 5 DPSing multiple bosses cause it was significantly easier.
mellow bridge
the question is, did you do it on hardmode or normal mode
I only watched lower tazavesh but it looked fine overall tbh
since it's normal mode fights
only mailroom fight looked annoying
strong forum
They have to do the mechagon treatment
Nerf everything by 80%
Otherwise it's unplayable
mellow bridge
oh yeah I'm not talking about tuning
it's obv massively overtuned rn on the ptr
like I was thinking soleah or w/e her name is would be really hard in a pug
but I forgot I only did the HM version and the NM one is a joke lmao
forest meadow
On hardmode, comparing it in my head to the current 8 dungeons, I'd say Taz is way harder mechanically.
blazing condor
still probably is a bit too overtuned in NM
if you compare a m0 to NM taz
taz is tuned harder
mellow bridge
it's obv massively overtuned rn on the ptr
yes
but that's smth that will be changed
blazing condor
yes
strong forum
Gotta take it like this, the hard mode versions are already tuned like a +12 without affixes
forest meadow
basically every one of the 8 dungeons are: dodge the stuff, kill the right target at the right time. You don't actually have to DO anything. But in Taz there's like actually stuff you have to do.
mellow bridge
ngl the only issues I've seen so far are
mailroom boss is just annoying as hell when you cant burn the boss in 30s
jagged pier
yer hardmode was just zerg it down before the mechanics happen
mellow bridge
and the event to get the password is annoying
1st boss is easy af mechanically once people learn they have to move away from him if they get targeted
soleah is a joke on nm
and menagerie is w/e
havent seen the upper bosses tho since you cant make your own key..
strong forum
Once people have done the key once or twice it'll just be like any other dungeon
With like "just dodge this or kill this"
mellow bridge
cant wait for mailroom wipes because no one wants to throw away the bombs
strong forum
The tricky part will be pulling the entire boss room + boss
To abuse the haste fields
And stop the chickens
mellow bridge
tbh I dont remember the trash in that room
ionic fern
I've done it once and i don't want to do it anymore.
forest meadow
sooooo many stupid chickens
ionic fern
strong forum
Chicken make tank disoriented
The elementals spawn haste fields a la Nighthold
The haste fields don't last very long so you have to kill them with boss
But +50% haste is kinda worth to min max
blazing condor
i never liked mega-dungeons
bad taste from getting VoP in mechagon
having to do that shit
blazing condor
idk what you mean
strong forum
Normal?
blazing condor
i honestly dont remember but i wasn't as """""good"""" so i was probably inting
strong forum
I liked it
strong forum
Did like 7 hard mode clears for the mount
And had vop r4 basically the week1 of it being possible
AND THEN IT WAS A FUCKING USELESS COSEMTIC
blazing condor
based fashioncraft
strong forum
No
It doesn't even do anything
That's the sad part
It literally does nothing
R3 and R4 are the same
I wanted it to have a cool cosmetic
But it literally does nothing
strong forum
Major
blazing condor
if i wanted to torture myself for a solid weekend so i could play the game better i'd play OSRS
plush tendon
if i wanted to torture myself for a solid weekend so i could play the game bette...
100%
There should have been no reason why BoTE was locked behind battlegrounds
jagged pier
well i was dps in nya
plush tendon
IDK who thought that should be the battleground essence;
jagged pier
🤷
jagged pier
🤔
mellow bridge
ngl
deciding to fuck my dps offspec and never get bote was the best decision of my wow career
jagged pier
i mean it was fine tbh
and that ment i was never benched for prog
cause i could bring ele shammy if we needed range
actually did all of illy prog as shammy then they swapped me to warrior the day we killed it
KEKW
jagged pier
but i liked having 2 i dunno i went around and helped other ppls guilds with prog as well when we cleared
was fun
jagged pier
i got it as fast as u could
mellow bridge
idr how long it took me
i had 1.8k
but I only did it in S4 as I skipped S3 and I think it was faster at that point?
jagged pier
then i helped a dh friend get it on my paladin as dh paladin healer was busted
blazing condor
it was wonky
pull everything before 1st boss
skip skip skip skip
after 2nd boss if you were doing high keys literally TP out and change talents
then skip skip
mellow bridge
it was pretty cool in S4 imo
sick sentinel
I had like 2 routes for it
mellow bridge
but before that...ehhhhhhhhh
kiting like 5 of the big robots without dying was exciting tho
mellow bridge
idk what the low key strat was for that
but in high keys you got several of them at the same time and just kited during their lightning buff
sick sentinel
First route I did was pull left to first right to third and right side to final
mellow bridge
was pretty scary
blazing condor
only played m+ in 8.0 and 8.2
never really any high keys
highest was probably like an 18
mellow bridge
I mained VDH at that time
2 hits with lightning buff procced me
at like +25/26
spooky
lime urchin
yall tonked in 8.4? mah tiddies depleted every piece of trash before the dps could touch em
nothing to tonk!
sick sentinel
I only 4ejoined in 8.0 launch and I had friends at that time which was reason I could do +10s
blazing condor
uldir was ass but i have good memories of it 🙂
i made my own raid-groups to get AoTC and NM kills
sick sentinel
Wasn't more till like 8.1 buti did at least like 3 dungeons with the worm affix
blazing condor
ghuunies were fine
but could easily kinda fuck you
pull a pack --> cant stop the worm --> it infectst 2 more --> you wipe
now you kinda fucked
sick sentinel
Cuz I remember our group in voice freaking out about it being on the hard AD gold boss pull
No 8dea if it timed or not
sick sentinel
Correction AD was fun till 8.2 or 8.3
One of the seasons fucked that dungeon completely and it went from easiest to hardest to time
sick sentinel
8.0 was worms, I don't remember 8.1 but .1 or .2 was the dead ghosts
I don't remember the 8.2 8.3 affixed for 10 besides start of luitenants
mellow bridge
8.1 was reapening
that's the ghosts
8.2 was the shitty emmissaries = skipped that seaon
8.3 was the obelisks that you used to skip packs
sick sentinel
Hey you guys remember pre nerf underrot and at very start both sides is one 9f those wipe emissaries
That was terrible while it existed
inland raft
Imagine if we had inspiring+infested 
jagged pier
well as seasonal affixes dont get effected by other affixes thats fine
sick sentinel
I know it would be evil but I'd like to see the mdi have like all 4 affixed are lvl10 ones final keys
inland raft
Id like to see a variation on reaping brought back somehow
mellow bridge
well as seasonal affixes dont get effected by other affixes thats fine
fire guy actually gets affected by inspiring tho
which sucks quite a bit
blazing condor
why have they not just fixed that
i cant imagine it being like that on purpose
incredibly inconsistent
odd tree
fire guy actually gets affected by inspiring tho
yea, learned that the hard way in an NW, pulled some trash onto him and couldn't interrupt his cast. fun stuff.
mellow bridge
happened to me in SoA when inspiring was new
there's that one inspired guy in the goliath pack right in front of the 1st boss
gotta cc him so you can kick goliath, thought we could just kill him with fire guy afterwards
sick sentinel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXb_PgV460 an accurate recreation of doing my 15 with 4 pug ragnaros, timed the 14 later that day/next day though
chilly brook
8.2 was the shitty emmissaries = skipped that seaon
Legit the worst season
Like I'd take ghuunies over it
chilly brook
It was literally blizz being like "we dont like how you've been playing these dungeons, play them the way we want you to play them"
sweet summit
rude
chilly brook
sweet summit
sick sentinel
8.2 was fine because i was GM leader of some guild
and until 8.3 i had paladin and dk do whatever content we wanted, wow life was fantastic
that, really really made life easy and probably contributing factor why i ain't quit yet
brittle owl
hes pee and youre poo
peepee caca
echo canyon
how much haste is good for prot ...
sick sentinel
from stats alone aka from gear, and most trinket procs, conduits what the fuck ever 40% 990=30% around 1100 or 1200 for 40%
blood lust and other effects that increase your hate by a % amount, don't get hit by "stat tax" which is the 990, and 1100 number for 30% 40% i was talking about
30%+ haste, you only get 90% effective haste from equipping new haste item, 80% at 40%+
so, more than 25% haste and as close to 40% as you can get without gimping yourself
after that you split rest of stat points into crit or versa
echo canyon
im on 22 atm but can swap ring for more haste bu i lose versa
sick sentinel
thats fine and normal
if you are willing to post a link to your character there or plenty of us who are active here who know alot more than i do
echo canyon
im not sure for m+ should i aim for mastery or crit?