I'm bringing people at 230 + ilvl into 12 top and we still wipe 3 seconds into teleport boss
#protection
mellow gorge
the ilvl don't matter
you need to wait a bit and check the rio
I'd help you out but you're US afaik
inland raft
Honestly on alliance all i did was look for a healer that looked half competent and then took pretty much whatever, a good healer/tank combo carry hard
ionic fern
Okay, so seeing as our written advise for you is not working i would strongly suggest you to stream for one of us on Discord so we can see on-the-go what is going on.
sick sentinel
First time I ran top 13 last night healer runs to avoid tornadoes on timy platform, right into bone spear and gets gibbed
Second time we get to boss and I think guy saying they aren't dispelling
I know I make lots of mistakes but that can't be me
inland raft
Ya we can give general advice all day long but without seeing specifics noone gonna be able to tailor the advice
mellow gorge
yogi you're a US player right?
sick sentinel
I can upload to YouTube maybe if I can remember to keep browsers window open
Canada technical but yes
mellow gorge
ah, then I can't help with keys 😦
jagged pier
yogi we've been through your videos and written to u things to do better
ionic fern
Literally..just stream for us on Discord and we will pinpoint what's going wrong.
You don't even have to speak, just listen.
sick sentinel
That's what I mean there's some key factor that I'm clearly not able to understand and it limits me from carrying harder and not minding other players making mistakes
So it makes me ask wtf I'm doing
With time
ionic fern
Mate, simple yes or no question:
Are you willing to stream on Discord or not?
inland raft
As mwahi said stream on discord
ionic fern
Seems like this is the only way going forward.
As we've written a lot about what can be improved from watching your videos.
inland raft
Or even if i have time later today dependint on family id double tank with you and guarantee still time even with pugs and double tank
ionic fern
Great. Just ping me when you're up for it and we can set it up.
mellow gorge
If possible, I'd like to view aswell
sick sentinel
I just feel like giving up on this is all maybe not meant to be
Started o n a rogue last night
mellow gorge
a bit early to give up my man
some live coaching will give really good persspectives
blazing condor
man did 3 quests then handed in the towel
mellow gorge
my biggest drawback was stopping in the first season just before i got ksm
needed 1 more dungeon but gave up
all cause of constant pugging
if i actually had went with guild runs or tried to group people, it would've been over and done with
sick sentinel
Logged into warrior to buy enchants for looms, was distracted by going to run top 13, then 12
ionic fern
Logged into warrior to buy enchants for looms, was distracted by going to run to...
Wanna stream today? I'm available in like 30m
sick sentinel
Then I mailed to rogue and had to get to org cuz dunno mail box
So by time I got back only did like 3 quests
vocal geode
I'm bringing people at 230 + ilvl into 12 top and we still wipe 3 seconds into ...
this was a 17 top, and the mage was 247 ilvl, active throughout the whole dungeon
ilvl doesnt matter
we still timed it with 2 minutes left xd
inland raft
Do the stream for mwahi, listen and youll improve in no time
lime urchin
y u censor names?
inland raft
I always bully those i out dps
vocal geode
but idrc
inland raft
If im doing 10 they better be doing 12 or they get bullied
lime urchin
I aint scared to share my name with 5.7 overall dps
inland raft
We zug zug
lime urchin
with all these 10k pumpers here
inland raft
Gotta stop playing defensive and go pure offense
vocal geode
I havent tanked anything higher than an 18 I think
lofty widget
tbf i dont think anyone pulls 10k in "push keys"
vocal geode
I sit at like 6k as prot if I spam revenge
sick sentinel
5.8 would probably be good for me but I'd have to check
tame jasper
Do the stream for mwahi, listen and youll improve in no time
Can confirm!
lime urchin
a push key is very relative
inland raft
And ya the high dps is in low keys 20 and below generally
tame jasper
I sit at like 6k as prot if I spam revenge
Same herr
mellow gorge
I sit at like 6k as prot if I spam revenge
same
lofty widget
yea exactly, if you find the key challenging you wont be doing 10k or higher
sick sentinel
I feel like a push key for me right now is a God damn +4
mellow gorge
i run 20s and i get 6-7k
sick sentinel
I feel like idiot
mellow gorge
I feel like a push key for me right now is a God damn +4
my man, m+ runs is a team effort
you as a tank can only do so much
vocal geode
depends on pull size ofc
mellow gorge
if the 3 dps screwed up
vocal geode
I havent tanked anything higher than an 18 I think
inland raft
Just take deep breatg, relax, and stream for mwahi
mellow gorge
the key is dead, if the healer screwed up, the key is dead
ye
just stream for mwahi and get a breath of fresh air
lime urchin
this thing is absolutely bonkers
vocal geode
this thing is absolutely bonkers
tame jasper
I never want to tank anything higher than a 17
Until youve done 17
vocal geode
wtb
mellow gorge
this thing is absolutely bonkers
o ye
vocal geode
I have aegis at least
inland raft
Just reach your personal goals ignore everything else
strong forum
Idk why you'd put so much pressure on yourself.
I started living by the credo of "don't do things you don't want to do"
Works wonders
inland raft
I barely play anymore so i did my portals and never went higher
sick sentinel
The best key I ever did was 2 chest junkyard 16
inland raft
This season
sick sentinel
That was the best I'll ever do
vocal geode
still need 3 dungeons for portals
inland raft
Was top dps in my 20 runs though 
inland raft
Only reason i did was the portals
strong forum
Cuz I simply don't care
inland raft
So could be lazier when guildies asked me to do something
sick sentinel
I'd just like to be able to do 15s without double legendary and tdev and shit but I'm just too dogshit
tame jasper
I love m+ with players I knoe, bit without grp it was some pain to pug 20ties, but in the end I got them
inland raft
Nah you just need to take the time to learn, your literally getting a live coach session offered
mellow gorge
^
vocal geode
I love m+ with players I knoe, bit without grp it was some pain to pug 20ties, b...
I have done the 20s I have as arms, and most of my failed runs were tanks who died at the worst timing possible 
inland raft
Thats why i dont give up that tank spot
mellow gorge
yeah i've timed 20s w my group
vocal geode
And you never know what you get when you pug. You can invite a high rio warlock and expect him to do 10k+ but then he is a 7k andy.
mellow gorge
And you never know what you get when you pug. You can invite a high rio warlock ...
had a brewmaster monk main playing as WW pull for me on NW, very fun.
these puggers man
lime urchin
the only reason I play this game and do some keys is because its with good ole friends and we goof around on discord
mellow gorge
and on another story
had a warlock pull every tormentor for me
caused 2 entire wipes
then left
tame jasper
I have done the 20s I have as arms, and most of my failed runs were tanks who di...
I only play tank in m+ (and happy to have raidtabk slot too now)
vocal geode
raidtabk?
inland raft
I havnt raid tanked since mop
vocal geode
oh raidtank
inland raft
Well ither then like alt runs in heroic or whatever
vocal geode
I am too lazy and unorganized to actually learn tank mechanics and do them in raid
inland raft
What mechanics?
brittle owl
we don't do those here
inland raft
99% of fights is taunt when cotank takes tank hit
tame jasper
Raidtankslot (sry mobile with fat fingers)
vocal geode
I just downed painsmith and I'd probably sit in group with weapon
mellow gorge
mechanics?
lime urchin
we press revenge here sir
mellow gorge
as tank?
vocal geode
inland raft
And once enough gear you just dps and let cotank solo while you parse
vocal geode
granted I have r5 blood and full tank gear
mellow gorge
when they take 500% more suffering dmg
tame jasper
I just downed painsmith and I'd probably sit in group with weapon
Got him to 4.65% on monday (200+ tries) 🤮
vocal geode
vocal geode
Got him to 4.65% on monday (200+ tries) 🤮
we ended it at like 210 I think
spike deaths all day
mellow gorge
i'm glad i don't have run mythic
tame jasper
spike deaths all day
Same in our raid.
vocal geode
it's so easy on mythic after 100 wipes
strong forum
Imagine doing 7k as dps in 2021
inland raft
vocal geode
me on my venthyr boomie in 15s
strong forum
Like I can't fathom
vocal geode
:)
strong forum
How people do this badly
strong forum
No
inland raft
I just made paly for first time ever in 17 years ilvl 220 already doing 7k in keys though i guess thats jusy pally for you
strong forum
I wouldn't think so
mellow gorge
well i don't need to crit to have a chance to proc the effect
vocal geode
depends on ppm
inland raft
Press wings press button top of charts
mellow gorge
between those two on same ilvl
the other one would proc more often me thinks
could be entirely wrong
sick sentinel
1.5 + haste yeah? i mean, bad example but i know on my SCOrgan it gains charges of the buff up to 9 stacks (max) faster than it would without haste. and so i can't remember the math but it taks that trinket from like 2 minute to 1 minute or 45s,
so, you may get more EV from up time through more haste and its more valuable
sick sentinel
i thought i read something about trinkets that proc on their own are usually affected slightly by haste on their internal cooldown
from when the trinket activates and does thing (buff in this case) and then waits ICD + trigger and by having haste you lower that ICD
i seem to remember learning about this in vanilla/tbc because i played paladin and rogue, and someone told me or i looked it up at some point regarding a proc trinket
strong forum
Yes there are alot of trinkets that are hasted aswell
But not all proc based trinkets are afaik
ionic fern
sick sentinel
would be funny if weave was hasted , since i have it now
ionic fern
sick sentinel
it's just mind blowing to me how so many things are like, far too over explained to the point where they are exploitable, or the complete opposite where you just know.... nothing....
wooden radish
@ionic fern 
strong forum
Blizzard has gotten more and more obscure in their descriptions of what stuff actually does.
sick sentinel
and i don't think that combat should be like that or difficult to read, or as difficult, the tornadoes in TOP are good example they work perfectly, its a huge thing that stays for a few seconds befor going off and if you stand in it there is a clear and obvious effect of what you did wrong
strong forum
Without wowhead, Sims and the TCs, we'd know so much less about how trinkets or spells actually worked
And logs ofc
sick sentinel
if i got 48 fuckin red dots around me and i get an orange dot i have to put in the purple circle, that the healer has, and its not clearly layed out in dungeon guide or there is 4000 other attacks going on how the hell are we going to work that out?
its pure madness
my change would be normal and heroic mode dungeons, everything casts its spells 3x for normal, and 2x as long in heroics, and then players can understand what happened.
jade holly
I think your over exaggerating how much stuff actually goes on.
sick sentinel
hyperbolic yes, i just think that players don't actually understand whats going on in dungeon
jade holly
Because they dont care to look or read 99% of the time
The information is freely available
sick sentinel
i do think alot of these people do honestly try their best too, i just think that there is so much as a whole going on throughout all of shadowlands m+ that it would be impossible to get KSM with no addons or friends and only using the dungeon guides.
and that because of that, it just feels like work or homework, and so they don't give a fuck at all and just log
but, i also respect the mystery that has to be present too, like if you go on diablo you don't know exactly what type of monsters you will fight or loot you will get, if its all just out in the open, yeah..
inland raft
theres really not that much going on each pull, generally you have 1-2 high prio must kick spells and a handful of kick/stun as much as can filler and make sure frontals dont yeet your melee
jade holly
That is just not true. You do not need add ons to hit basic rotational buttons and interrupt mobs which is essentially all 15s are. Most people complaining about the difficulty of keys at that level cant even do that.
inland raft
once get high enough key level that the filler spells start to be serious then yes need the coordination to make sure nearly everything is kicked/stunned/etc but that isnt til super high levels
crystal iris
That platform in ToP with 2 casters and the gatekeeper do you guys cc the inspiring or just send it? xD
inland raft
i usually just send it
sick sentinel
best way to handle final teleport with trash is everyone goes at exact same time (after quaking)
i get the big guy first interupt
inland raft
sr goes brr
crystal iris
spell reflect big guy, the small ones are way more dangeour
sick sentinel
anytime there is a big elite that can cast spells is my priority, spires giants
crystal iris
thats not how it works though...
that big guys spell tickles you
if the small ones get a volley / bone spear off thats a 1 shot
inland raft
yup
sick sentinel
seems to do enough damage to group that i'd rather have it never go off lol
sick sentinel
the bone spear, thats another point it out of group thing yup?
inland raft
bone spear is an interrupt
inland raft
he targets someone and yeets them if you dont stop it
volley, spear, and withering discharge are the big kicks in top
crystal iris
on that pull specifically
let the grave spikes go off, let the big guy do whatever he wants
interuupt anything that says "volley" and bone spear
sick sentinel
outplayed is fantastic now that i learned how the clip feature works, can just take 30 second snips instead of trying to describe, still no idea how i was in that hit box
crystal iris
lot to unpack there
firstly not on you but what the actual fk was that ashen hallow haha
lime urchin
lol
inland raft
Lol
lime urchin
and you can charge back in, if you get hit by tornado
crystal iris
secondly your pummel was up when bone spear went off, you could have saved the healer
lime urchin
but you gotta be quick
crystal iris
third dont stand in the purple fear puddles
inland raft
Or leap as well
lime urchin
he tried to leap
crystal iris
i dont think thats the most help we can give, im sure he knows not to try to get hit with the htornado..
jade holly
Track group interrupts and use your own more often
inland raft
Ya tracking ints is big
lime urchin
oh dear, your spear of bastion almost went of the platform ❤️
sick sentinel
my pummel was going to go on the big guy sorta like the purple guys in DOS, pack just goes better if i get that one
jade holly
You dont need to interrupt that mob
lime urchin
Track group interrupts and use your own more often
this will help you time your spell reflects better in pugs too
inland raft
The big guy doesnt matter
crystal iris
my pummel was going to go on the big guy sorta like the purple guys in DOS, pack...
weve all told you like multiple times not to interrupt big guy
big guy spell on you will do like 1% of your HP, bone spear killed your paladin
sick sentinel
okay, and so bonespear is always on me and pointed
inland raft
But ya his damage is nothing
lime urchin
and cows are fat, play safe and stand behind the tornado, dont side step it
crystal iris
its not pointed
lime urchin
I know, because I am fat panda
inland raft
Bonespear targets random
crystal iris
its a spell
inland raft
And has to be kicked or stunned
crystal iris
If you want, i would recommend changing the name plates
I use Quazii and it shows who the spell is targetted to
sick sentinel
the one im doing now is plater and i can take any mob and turn it a certain color, (purple for casters in a pack i got for example)
inland raft
Theres also target on nameplate weakauras if you like your nameplates generally
But i think plater hs an option for target
Somewhere
crystal iris
this one is great. casters are pink, non casters purple. Red for lost aggro
you just import it into plater
normal spells are yellow, important interrupts are bigger and orange
inland raft
Ya thats how mine are super nice to not need to think about the name of cast and just have a color code
If its orange its scary if its yellow its get if can afford to
crystal iris
yo i had a WA for targetted spells and it kept dinging at me
sick sentinel
crystal iris
on dps or heals its fine but tanks everything targets you it was dinging nonstop was driving me nuts
sick sentinel
this is my WA collection that others have created
inland raft
Can edit sounds in the options
crystal iris
yeah I just couldnt find which one it was
crystal iris
i think I got it though. It was a custom code not just in the options. has a switch-case loop that i deleted the playSound part
no but on my Rsham lets say halls second boss. it puts a glowy frame around the player targetted with the leap so i can dispell easily
inland raft
Ya i have that for my pally so can bop them if no decurse in group
crystal iris
bop dont work
sick sentinel
so, i'm training myself to track things, just all of the wrong things
if i think i understand
crystal iris
Ya i have that for my pally so can bop them if no decurse in group
Tried that the other day, its not physical damage. Nature damage
unless youre using the boosted BoP
inland raft
Ya i take spellwarding in halls if no decurse i just call it bop regardless
I make oally mains mad at me
crystal iris
ahh
inland raft
Cuz i never refer to things properly
crystal iris
I started a pally the other day and was like wtf that doesnt work
inland raft
Idk im not a pally main i just made one for first time 3 days ago
17 years of wow first time touching the pink
The damage is kinda addicting
crystal iris
i had a lock the other day in a 15 run the leap out, then use his little teleport to doge IN to the adds
i was like wtff
inland raft
200 ilvl was already doing what my war was at 230
sick sentinel
17 years of wow first time touching the pink
badly worded lol
strong forum
I'll touch the pink
crystal iris
pally tanking is pretty straightforward compared to warrior
inland raft
Ya
crystal iris
from my exp at least
lime urchin
It works pretty much the same right
inland raft
Well ya all you got is shield to maintain and 2 real defensives and a bunch if utility
Its much simpler
But fun throwing that shield around
And divine toll is fun af
strong forum
Playing prot pally at a high skill level has probably more intricacies than pwar
But on an average level it's I guess easier to perform on a pally
crystal iris
above 20+ ya
inland raft
Ya the utility opens up a lot of tech
crystal iris
but starting out is much easier if you havent tanked before
that was my first tank and swapping to warrior seemed to wierd that shield block didnt do nice aoe dps, and shield slam is ST
strong forum
That I can't comment on much, I'm far too experienced in pwar nowadays to judge pwar from a fresh standpoint
Hard to pretend I don't know how to press button
inland raft
Ya same i always get told pwar is most complex tank but i dont see it personally
crystal iris
i do haha
inland raft
But ive been playing it since vanilla so idk
crystal iris
I am new to M+ in SL
strong forum
I know that pwar is more punishing because doing a mistake on pwar already has consequences on lower difficulties
crystal iris
was very casual for about a year before that no max levels bc i didnt buy BFA lol
crystal iris
main fury and wanting to learn tanking
strong forum
And press w to win
inland raft
Its less forgiving ya but def not more complex imo
crystal iris
took a while to get a feel for it. like the basics arent so bad
strong forum
Besides coordination between your team
crystal iris
but learning warr while also leaning the diffent pulls is a lot
jade holly
Dk is the only tank you have to think about playing sometimes
and even then its just holding for DS
jade holly
vdh
crystal iris
ive been finding that as warrior im okay on basics now
jade holly
hit buttons dont think
strong forum
Vdh defo does lol
inland raft
Vdh does more then others imo
crystal iris
Its just little mistakes that will mess me up
strong forum
Cuz their mitigation is so dogshit
inland raft
If you mismanage your cds you go splat
crystal iris
like ill make a small mistake once in the run and go down cause a wipe and its gg
strong forum
Vdh is just very straight forward
crystal iris
cant just word of glory/lay on hands/bubble my way out of mistakes
strong forum
But still has to think about what to use where
inland raft
I liked vdh in legion
brittle owl
every tank is punishing to similar degrees except brew and bear
inland raft
Didnt touch it at all in bfa
strong forum
Legion vdh was peak
brittle owl
pfdt
inland raft
Tried it first patch of sl and it was fineish but gutted
brittle owl
strong forum
Bfa was dogshit until 8.1, then it just became weird
And now it's just the most boring thing
jade holly
bfa vdh is ultimate cringe
strong forum
Ya but weird
crystal iris
so is @sick sentinel streaming pug hell for us?
inland raft
Only thing after making a pally that makes me a little upset is, why can pally get an interrupt built into their core rotation but they take our purge from slam?
ionic fern
so is <@456226577798135808> streaming pug hell for us?
I could have streamed the SD +19 i just did. 👀
Only 1 DPS did barely 10k.
crystal iris
id watch
crystal iris
Ive got lots to learn haha
strong forum
That's just sad
crystal iris
*in 19s
jade holly
Most of the time player's damage sucks because they hold Cds for no reason
lofty widget
sounds like a case of not pressing buttons
crystal iris
Most of the time player's damage sucks because they hold Cds for no reason
thats why i love fury
crystal iris
what is even holding CDs just send it as soon as its up
strong forum
I hate fury 
crystal iris
i try other specs and it botheres me the long CDs. Fury has all CDs every pack
inland raft
If im not prot or arms id rather play something else
brittle owl
what is even holding CDs just send it as soon as its up
most purely dps players cream at the chance of gamer moments
crystal iris
I find signet makes it really fun
brittle owl
so they edge themselves into a hole
crystal iris
the procs keep me on my toes changes my rotation. Kyrian is alright but i miss signet. looking forward to getting it back in 9.2
sick sentinel
i have my own private lobby on discord
jade holly
Signet is uh
Would rather use any other leggo but forced to use signet with DW as arms sometimes.
strong forum
If im not prot or arms id rather play something else
Same
brittle owl
you're wrong, but it's ok
crystal iris
hard to be wrong about an opinion on personal enjoyment of a spec but ok
strong forum
Fury = wet noodles without any impact
Arms = all CDs lining up for big dick impact dmg
Fury buttons don't feel like anything
Arms buttons have some weight behind them
crystal iris
first pull of a key i can do 30-35k on fury
strong forum
I don't give a fuck about numbers
crystal iris
then a pretty consistant 12k on every single pull of the run
strong forum
It's the feel of the spec that's impactless
jade holly
I mean you can do those numbers as arms
crystal iris
this is a pointless conversation haha
crystal iris
agree to disagree
ionic plank
wow I have basically the same opinion but opposite
crystal iris
on the impact stuff not about your hatred of fury. we agree you hate fury lol
crystal iris
my man
ionic plank
but basically the same reasons you dont like fury, is why I dont like arms
the buttons feel so shit to press for me
strong forum
It's so bad to hit those 35k mortal strikes :(
strong forum
And then cleaving it with sweeping strikes for a free 75% dmg increase with 50% uptime
ionic plank
that's impactless
crystal iris
I don't give a fuck about numbers
this you?
ionic plank
strong forum
Yes it is me
crystal iris
avatar is 30% more damage, if you dont look at numbers you wouldnt notice. Col smash makes you do more damage. See point a
crystal iris
fury CDs change your playstyle reck lets you use more / different abilities
strong forum
There is no difference
It's all just WW 12
And never any exciting moments
The buffs barely do anything
It's a constant flow swarm of noodle attacks
crystal iris
we are never going to convince you
strong forum
Ofc not
crystal iris
of the intricacies of great fury play
jade holly
intricacies
strong forum
I hate fury every since titan grip got introduced
jade holly
maybe the wrong word
crystal iris
there is more minmaxing to do than non fury mains realize i think
strong forum
Doesn't matter if every button feels the same
crystal iris
its not just mongo smash
jade holly
Spec is pretty straightforward and you'd have to be pretty bad not to do decent damage as fury
crystal iris
exactly
ionic plank
I dont find that every button feels the same
crystal iris
its easy to be a decent fury
crystal iris
has a higher skill ceiling than ppl give it credit for though
crystal iris
people have very low opinions of it haha
jade holly
well playing it for 2-3 tiers
strong forum
Fury is the most popular warri spec so idk how people have low opinions on it
jade holly
spec is literally the same thing every xpac
ionic plank
tbf when fury and arms are even everyone flocks to fury
crystal iris
I mean currently im getting out-dpsed on occasion since im necro but as kyrian / NF i very rarly get out damaged
strong forum
That depends entirely on the people you play with
crystal iris
spec is literally the same thing every xpac
its not, signet and cov change the rotation and playstyle dramatically
jade holly
signet is like
crystal iris
I pug a lot
strong forum
Signet changes nothing
jade holly
if at all
strong forum
Na it's pretty simple lol
jade holly
I think your definition of dramatically is a little off
strong forum
Venthyr boomkin, now that's a hard spec
crystal iris
fury in M+ is a different spec
strong forum
Especially in m+
crystal iris
not saying its hard just saying its fun!
strong forum
And fury will never be fun for me cuz it's literally ingrained into my brain from 10 years of pvp that fury is a meme spec
strong forum
Dafuq
ionic plank
fury owns
crystal iris
was exaggerating. Still learning tanking you guys helped a lot
strong forum
Playing wow at work?
crystal iris
lot of room to improve. tanked a super clean NW19 the other day with 80% melee hits blocked
*on my lunch break. I WFH
strong forum
Ah
ionic fern
Eating is for the weak.
crystal iris
any of you guys try necro?
ionic fern
Oh, a full on Twitch stream.
sick sentinel
assuming it works
crystal iris
it does
blazing condor
🍿
sick sentinel
i'm just going to close chat and let it play out mostly i think
mellow bridge
that addon probably only updates very irregularly and doesnt properly track peoples covenant
just as a warning
crystal iris
im reading up on it now ya
sick sentinel
who are we taking from list
blazing condor
mage hunter duo seems fine i guess
but i dont actually know about low keys
what's expected etc
crystal iris
necro is nice. rare to find
dude if you like the cursor leave it!
was making a joke
sick sentinel
just brez really now
crystal iris
not necessary really
jagged pier
change your stream resoultion to match your game window
crystal iris
he might not be able to stream in 1440
sick sentinel
it reccomended me 1080p
jagged pier
yer but your game isnt in that
crystal iris
no sound right? its not just me
sick sentinel
no sound?
crystal iris
its fine might just be me
crystal iris
its off center too eh?
jagged pier
your base resolution in obs has to match your games res we are getting half a screen
crystal iris
that was odd
strong forum
It's not resolution, it's just scaling
Just gotta make the wow input smaller
Like the entire window
Like youd adjust size of a regular window but in obs
crystal iris
ouf
im just writing thoughts here to not forget them. But you have to be really careful to not take those hateful strikes to the back
lime urchin
indeed
crystal iris
And tanking last boss closer to an edge of the ring helps dps avoid the charging ghost dudes
ionic fern
-Intervene more often
-You're wasting a ton of of Revenge proc's by Intervene->Charge
-Wasting a ton of Rage by using Charge/Intervene when 70+ Rage (Use IP to dump)
-Turning your back to enemies - A LOT
-Not using Revenge enough - you are sitting on 100 rage and not using either IP OR Revenge
-Why are you leaping 24/7? Just Charge
-Use Execute more
-Try to pair LS with your big rage generators like Spear/Ravager/Avatar
-You do not have SB up for important things - even tho you have Intervene off CD
-Getting hit by a lot of avoidable mechanics (stuns/disorients/frontals)
@sick sentinel
Also, are you running IV?
lime urchin
and your camera angle looks a bit wonky, same as your movement
do you turn with a keyboard of with a mouse?
ionic fern
Not triggering if you're willing to improve.
sick sentinel
so i could focus what i was doing, that was NOT intentional double pulling the add + dude
lime urchin
very brave to stream it tho, for the skyhold community, I salute it.
lime urchin
haha exactly
sick sentinel
and then you realize, people normal people really do play like that
lime urchin
well I would to try it too, if only my potato of a macbook could handle it
fringe folio
That feedback was very useful, I think some of that applies to me too. So can also use it 🙂
sick sentinel
turn with mouse
lime urchin
also, go check the pins, Sense made a fantastic list of stuff you can spell reflect and deflect
sick sentinel
before you guys got in i turned off electricity sound for reflect, becuase it would just play 4 times in 8 seconds for 3 spells i stomped that got recasted 2 of them hit healer and mage, thing
crystal iris
-Intervene more often
-You're wasting a ton of of Revenge proc's by Intervene->C...
Can you explain LS with rage gen CDs please? Usually during ravager I have more rage than I know what to do with even spamming revebge with SB and IP up I struggle to not overcap. I can’t even Ss sometimes
sick sentinel
i pooped myself on that final green death thing
lil too close for comfort
i seen what it does 10 second stun or something
and got hit by beam because watching for ghost patterns so i don't get knocked into that beam
ionic fern
Can you explain LS with rage gen CDs please? Usually during ravager I have more ...
LS by itself with the 15% increased max health is just a really-really-really lackluster defensive.
Unnerving Focus is why i suggested him to use it together with Rage generating cooldowns.
HOnestly..right now LS is a "Offensive" CD when played properly and lined up with other things while running Unnerving Focus.
IP is off the GCD so you shouldn't need to be struggling that much.
sick sentinel
i play with quake 3 arena style controls WASD strafing movement + mouse for direction, right click for auto walk if i want to type message while moving foward
(good game btw, wheres my monster energy zero?)
no, no IV, i was as necro, since you don't have kyrian potion and does similiar effect, adventures in pepegaland like i say
streaming?
did i entre alternate time line
nvm only noon kekw
lime urchin
What?
sick sentinel
i looked at windows looked a bit dark outside, thought it was already midnight, but yeah, i haven't streamed since 2013
pallid musk
LS increease your rage generate and with it you can go offensive SB/Revenge
crystal iris
LS by itself with the 15% increased max health is just a really-really-really la...
Unnerving is why i figured you suggested it, but wouldnt it be better to use LS when you dont have a bunch of rage generating CDs up? to generate more rage when you are lacking some?
ionic fern
No.
ionic fern
i looked at windows looked a bit dark outside, thought it was already midnight, ...
You streamed for us and got the feedback.
Now the hard part starts - what will you do with the feedback. .
sweet kayak
Maybe [Unnerving Focus] is good for high keys (big pulls)? I mean it's 3 min CD, I would suggest using a different conduit for low keys imo.
sick sentinel
you maybe want to watch again? doesn't have to be any time soon
lofty widget
more rage=more dam, key lvl doesnt matter
ionic fern
Unnerving is one of our better endurance conduits regardless of the key level.
sick sentinel
unnerving is almost vital
ionic fern
you maybe want to watch again? doesn't have to be any time soon
Yes, i can.
You don't have to stream on Twitch, you can just stream on discord and i (or anyone else) can provide you feedback on the go.
sick sentinel
like, i'm clearly not an expert but iknow that
my goal is to discover whats triggering the seriesi of events that is wrong
which is probably not paying attention
crystal iris
well say that was a 15, those 2 or 3 tankbusters on gorechop would have fked you up more than they did
sweet kayak
Agree ^_^
crystal iris
how do you pros deal with second boss NW
Ive been having trouble this week. I know in pugs there is only so much I can control, but any tips and tricks would help
have trouble getting them in, aggro, damage intake
sick sentinel
so you figure i just get baited too easily with focusing on some shit mechanics that mean nothing panic and then do all these terrible things rather than just wait for that one thing and SW
lofty widget
ill usually charge to one of the casters and interrupt it, then charge back to one of the warriors. that should get you aggro on 3/5 adds, then you can taunt the other caster since the crossbowman shoots at random targets anyway
crystal iris
its the crossbowman i think i should charge to because warriors come in on their own no?
sick sentinel
yes
crystal iris
sometimes i have most of them crouped then see a xbow dude far away im like shit
sick sentinel
100% correct, go to a mage first and interupt it, then charge crossbow man and sit at him near boss,
you just, have aggro on melee add to do this
lofty widget
sure you could, it's just adding more responsibility on pugs to actually interrupt
sick sentinel
im not even sure if crossbow man hurts or not
lofty widget
but yeah you should try and group everything around the xbowman
just to cleave everything efficiently
crystal iris
kk
sick sentinel
tell your dps to do the same thing
crystal iris
i panic sometimes and charge a random target after i interrupt
ionic fern
Unnerving is why i figured you suggested it, but wouldnt it be better to use LS ...
I'll elaborate on it a bit more.
The times you don't have CD's up you will get what..2 Shield Slams, couple of TC's and maybe a Charge with Reprisal in there (during the 15s window)
While it's still obviously a "ok" increase it's nothing compared to what you would gain by using it together with your bigger rage generating cooldowns. This all feeds into the AM rage circle which in turn leads to bigger damage/defensive usage.
We don't really have a lot of times where we are "starved for rage" anyways since when running Reprisal and one of the "go-to covenants" (Kyrian/NF) we have:
Avatar - 50-60s (with AM)
Ravager - 45s
Spear - 40-60s / AA - 90s
Charge/Intervene - 20/30s (with Reprisal)
You pretty much ALWAYS have something up in addition to your rotational rage generating abilities.
sick sentinel
and range interupt mages from far besides cross bow
mobs collapse inwards and you cleave so you don't get the bomb spell and wipe
lofty widget
i panic sometimes and charge a random target after i interrupt
i assume you know this but if an add isnt dead when boss is doing his cast you can stormbolt/shockwave them, that way they wont blow up on your party
lofty widget
has saved my keys a handful of times for sure
sick sentinel
cow stomp work too i wonder? curious what other ones you could do
lofty widget
any type of stun works
crystal iris
just have to get timing really right i guess
sick sentinel
one item i keep trying to promote but it never sees play is the engineer items SL, one you throw it and it either slows or throws targets in air or typhoon them
the other is a literal ghosbusters slimer trap, set it on ground and its total immune 1 minute
you can ghost busters the slime from PF and it is extremely effective at that
https://www.wowhead.com/item=172914/gravimetric-scrambler-cannon#comments
https://www.wowhead.com/spell=310493/50ul-tr4p#comments
crystal iris
honestly i might use soultrap when im DPS in ToP runs like hunters do, put it behind you so you dont get stunned lol
sick sentinel
its perfect for boss adds i'd imagine, maybe abomb guy i just fought
lofty widget
that would be a bad idea since you cant break the trap again
have to wait the full minute
sick sentinel
im reading comments and you just re-banish it (untested)
crystal iris
that would be a bad idea since you cant break the trap again
first boss
sick sentinel
- Can be used in addition to your other crowd control abilities (tested with Repentance). * Is not targeted on the ground, but placed at your feet after the cast time.
- Appears to function identical to Banish, and cannot be ended early by damage or dispel, presumably without casting another Banish.
the item is NOT CONSUMED after you use the item. It can be used infinite times as it has no charges.
chilly brook
Happy Thanksgiving frens
sick sentinel
happy thanks giving you turkies
mystic warren
imagine skipping 250 pulls on painsmith and joining on the night they kill it
strong forum
imagine joining a guild that has sylv killed when all youve done was first 3
and you just breeze through the raid
ultimate comf
mystic warren
how did you gaslight them into inviting you lol
sick sentinel
i remember this guy, and he paid for a heroic nzoth
and he was malding out cuz he didn't get the weapon AND the helmet in the same run
wow, you didn't get BOTH of the most important pieces of gear possible
strong forum
how did you gaslight them into inviting you lol
no thats not what i did, but buttloads of people get a free pass like that
because around the end of every tier guilds often struggle to find or keep their roster
so they go lower and lower on the foodchain
done that plenty of times, sometimes even taking people who have never killed a single mythic boss, we dragged them through a reclear to see how they perform (hint, the heroic andys are often better than multiple CE raiders)
ive seen it time and time again where we had raiders that had multiple CEs and orange logs, but turned out to be HOT FUCKING garbage if they didnt get hard carried 🙂
chilly brook
how did you gaslight them into inviting you lol
It's easy af rn
Recruiting pool is fucked
inland raft
People still play?
chilly brook
I went from 3/10 to like 8/10 in a week
Granted I wouldn't have even been looking if my guild didn't die originally
modern brook
ive seen it time and time again where we had raiders that had multiple CEs and o...
That's me
I'm just hot garbage though
wild sandal
which soulbind is best for necro ?
crystal iris
Im using the last one
sick sentinel
i believe this is standard necrolord conduits 2nd one is also fine, i don't think the first conduits are ran very often
waxen orbit
Deep wounds is raw sewage
Not deep wounds
I meant the uhhhh
Deep wounds heals you conduit
sick sentinel
its better than the IP one is why cuz ip one sucks cuz reasons
cuz ip is ip and ip is 50%
waxen orbit
Why running 4 defensive conduits tho
Shouldn’t have to go beyond 3 in most situations
mighty valley
That's just the path through the best heirmir traits
waxen orbit
The 20% strength conduit is big tho
waxen orbit
Yeah
mighty valley
yeah i'd think banner > ashen
strong forum
In raid you'd play 2 potency at best
urban portal
Wait for sims
wild sandal
https://www.wowhead.com/soulbind-calc/necrolord/bonesmith-heirmir/warrior/AwC-ap...
thank you
wild sandal
will do ty
sick sentinel
what i was hearing was it was because people are using it to spam execute and get free tendies from carvers eye
modern brook
Heimer tech is untested
@wild sandal
The play rn is emeni for lesd by example, or plague guy for damage
harsh sandal
What is the addon/WA for the block absorb data in the upper left corner of your UI?
urban portal
Skada
sick sentinel
its not entirely accurate, but it gives you a better picture without logging
mystic warren
no thats not what i did, but buttloads of people get a free pass like that
Had to give about 5 0-3/10mpeople a 'free pass' this month just so we had the numbers to do painsmith. Only one of them wasn't garbage
urban portal
i got a friend who scammed his way into sylv
sick sentinel
scammed my way through EP aotc + glory, never paid a dime for it
get in raid, stfu, do what told, get loot.
good system!
sick sentinel
Every raid need melee dps
urban portal
big cap
sick sentinel
Not all bosses sure, but melee is king, bash I o er the head with a stick or rock or pointy rock has been predominate way of killing for human like creatures
median timber
how are all yall sheild slammers today
remote orchid
Good tanked a +12 ToP highest ive tanked before. Just switched to prot not long ago. Before that onoy havr tanked like 6s so it was fun
remote orchid
Timed it at least. Did a 14 as fury but didn't time cuz tank was over pulling compared to dps strength
I also realized after the +12 that i was in dos conduits lol
Dps*
teal swift
Failure to time a 14
That's a lot of mistakes
Not a single person should be blamed
You can 3 man +14 keys
And time them
It's a group issue.
mighty valley
seems a lil unnecessary when someone comes in here being like "hey i did something" for people to be like "that's nothing. you should feel bad"
brittle owl
but they didnt say that
they said the opposite actually
that it's not an individual fault or mistake, but collective
and that he shouldn't feel bad because theres prob a number of factors he can't influence that contributed to the "failure"
modern brook
I also realized after the +12 that i was in dos conduits lol
Fwiw you're like barely at a disadvantage there
Prot conduits are stinky
Also grats :)
wild sandal
The play rn is emeni for lesd by example, or plague guy for damage
Thank you
strong forum
Don't start about trinkets.
I've used the same combo for weeks aswell
It's free damage
strong forum
Yes
vocal geode
if all you do is m+ scale would probably outdmg hook
sick sentinel
I am yes
sick sentinel
Hook was a 252 and I'm a doomer, wow and irl
vocal geode
didnt expect it to deal so little dmg
sick sentinel
"Decanter fucks" skyhold member
vocal geode
I guess it's meant for single target
sick sentinel
Can't get afe or scale tried, don't want to do raiding cuz reasons
vocal geode
can always hope for aegis from the weekly quest if you dont raid
actually 16 kills on guardian, never looted defense matrix
strong forum
Decanter should do like 250 dps in aoe
At 252
That's pretty good if you ask me
Spare meathook if used on CD should do like 200-250 dps, but it's on pure ST so that isn't half bad either
vocal geode
that one is pretty wack
:(
if only it was like splintered heart
but it's just a free combat ress
if you die
sick sentinel
Yeah I died inside when I saw that
vocal geode
jagged pier
not anymore 😦
jagged pier
i still need OWS and 259 shield
mellow gorge
Jakey, you need to give us the loot <3
teal swift
@jagged pier
Have you fucked up this bad before
Stupid fucking blizzard not making your spulbind choice stick between changing covs.
jagged pier
happens
compact falcon
is prot good ?
jagged pier
yer its good
compact falcon
cause i dont see a lot of ppl playing it
and im a arms warrior and want to tank a little
lofty widget
Its good, just not very popular
sick sentinel
Pwar specializes extensively in preventing melee damage and dealing melee damage
If you are good you can block almost all melee in a key vastly 4educing how much heal you need
Druid for example is like exact opposite they do low damage but big healing and magic survive
compact falcon
hmmmm
sick sentinel
Critical block which is random can take a 1k white hit basic melee to like 200
You need a lot of mastery and proper sb use to get everything block and crit block but can't see how it's not busted
sick sentinel
As it's 75% dng you take in keys, just white hits from shit being alive too many "turns"
jagged pier
please yogi stop
mastery is our worst stats
ilvl and haste is our best
prot warrior is perfectly fine and can do all content
including very very high keys
u just need to play it
thats basically it
stiff bear
Been wanting to pick up tanking a bit more again in keys.. Whats the general Covenant/Soulbind and talents now in keys? Can play Kyr/NF 🙂 and have reprisal lego crafted
jagged pier
any cov but venthyr is fine
sick sentinel
Yeah I never said it's viable to stack mastery just now, I like to think about it though
jagged pier
but the guy comes in yogi asking about warrior then u go off and talk about how druid is the opposite of warrior which it isnt
and then talk about how busted mastery is in your opinion
teal swift
is prot good ?
All 6 tanks are viable. Druid is easy and fotm rn.
strong forum
The thing to take away is.
Pwar is perfectly fine and able to do keys well into the 28s++ region
Its just unpopular
sick sentinel
No I wouldn't recommend going astery
strong forum
If there are more questions feel free to ask away
sick sentinel
It's like last night aguy asked about necro, and last time I tried it was being told to do carvers eye for execute
teal swift
No I wouldn't recommend going astery
Crit is bae
sick sentinel
That's the 9ne I linked then and other people said 2 other things,
Well ows matrix are Bae, didn't get those can't get dungeon ones
Did 242 a better haste crit shield
Yeah own matrix good so I get soulstone one weave from m+ quest, feels like giant kick in nuts
Get bladekits and gargoyle stones instead of are 3 dos trinketsor phial
mellow gorge
Crit is bae
Go back to the DK discord you traitor :(
lime urchin
I made a DK too!
lime urchin
Grip this! Grip that! Grip them all!
mellow gorge
Its all fun and games
Until it won't be gripped
And you have to slowly crawl
Like the maggot DK is
lime urchin
Cant hear you through my anti magic shell bai!
stuck scaffold
Any negativity towards blood is ineffective, they just Death strike back to full
sick sentinel
Yeah or cheat death
The biggest ignore pain of them all
You just died, what, no I didnt
Which could explain another of things about ,y playstyles, I do low dps and pretend like ,y cds don't exist for 10 minutes at a time, I walk into every pack of mobs nd I'm emo complaining often
This makes so much more sense now
Maybe I'm a dk?
blazing condor
Yeah I know jokes! <:peepoHappyFisher:838631904936591401>
good one, Nom! 
strong forum
pallid musk
There a leggo for dk that anti magic Shell duration is increease and any damage heal the dk.
Warrior got a leggo that increase Spell reflect duration with 80 %
inland raft
Leaper bis leggo for all content change my mind
sick sentinel
skyhold prot vs yogi in a nutshell :
but a conversation i'm having with myself as well
sick sentinel
Leaper bis leggo for all content change my mind <:dander:905248880910815302>
because memes, i want to try leaper glory 9.2 briefly
strong forum
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8GsktKdHrI
plush tendon
Death Knight? More like boring
crystal iris
About to tank a 20 ToP im a bit terrified
what do you guys think about pulling fire dude into the gatekeeper?
crystal iris
kk
lofty widget
what you can do is pull 3 or 4 spirits on the gatekeeper
blazing condor
yeah not really needed at all
lofty widget
if you have sub rogue /frost mage they can funnel better
blazing condor
if you can play the key properly without any time loss it's fine
no need to go for time gain
plush tendon
^
blazing condor
people should have enough dps by now to not have it be necessary for those kind of strats
plush tendon
hell, dont even need to do things like that in a 23 or 24
blazing condor
yup
lofty widget
sure, doesnt help to know how you can optimize tho
blazing condor
but i havent played in 3 months so idk
lofty widget
i mean it does help, what
plush tendon
I mean it helps, but you run risks
blazing condor
you can skip captain pack as well
but its not needed and might be hard for the key if you got bad pugs
crystal iris
its a full pug and im not the most confidant tank
blazing condor
then play it safe and steady
crystal iris
but yeah ill pull bloodhorn to the boss
crystal iris
you guys want to coach me?
inland raft
Brb pulliing all the platform and not using cds
crystal iris
I can stream for your entertainement haha
blazing condor
i gotta fix dinner cus im leaving soon so i wont have time
but i'm crossing fingers for you
crystal iris
tyty
sick sentinel
how do i set a title for my stream in future when i do it
not really interested in using cam/mic but gameplay sure
have to nail it with "pepegaland adventures"
blazing condor
do you use OBS or SLOBS?
blazing condor
if you go to your twitch stream (on twitch) there's a little pencil at the bottom right of the stream
you should be able to edit it there
sick sentinel
6 messages in chat from roirin
sick sentinel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gluVzxIm8R8 me 9.2 glory leaper BS meme build
plush tendon
lofty widget
well done man
crystal iris
used a lot of your help and advice
should have logged to checked block %
the metrics I do have access to is 4k DTPS and 2.6k HPS from me. Healer said I was very easy to heal
probably a bit too much IP but I had lots of rage to dump
lofty widget
what's your dps?
crystal iris
5.1
i was more focused on not overcapping and not making mistakes than in like a 15 where i can focus on pumping, but it would be higher
lofty widget
oh yeah definitely room for more pump
shame you didnt log it, much easier to give feedback with logs
crystal iris
one thing that still confuses me is when i had tons of rage coming in, im trying to dump it with revenge and i get a SS proc. Do I ignore SS if im trying to dump rage. So lets say IP, SB up, ravager down banner up and avatar. and I ignoring SS to just revenge?
lofty widget
SS is your number 1 prio
crystal iris
even if it overcaps me?
brittle owl
block to dump rage 
crystal iris
i have to record an example
if i go in with everything and intervene
ill have 100 rage, 15s of SB, IP maxed out and im spamming revenge, getting SS procs too
doesnt happen often but ya when ravager banner are up I have more rage than i know what to do with lol
sick sentinel
stream for advice to tank discord
talk every day here
pull elite + LT TWICE on stream +11key
crystal iris
I suppose its a good problem to have haha
inland raft
I mean every so often youll end up losing rage but 99.9% if the time you can dump fast enough if using ip and block
Ip pretty expensive, the same reason we say not to use it a lot is same reason its good in those situations, its expensive for poor return but when capping rage its serving its purpose as a dump
sick sentinel
40rage for 50% absorb
why, unsure the cap, but is a bit weird that our biggest rage dump is a bubble
crystal iris
necro is so fun