AM or ID should have been made baseline, possibly bolster
#protection
sick sentinel
i've been considering giving it a go again with the buff, i did like a 14 dos or something with it
prisma bear
im sure they could make reprisal baseline or a talent if they know we love it enough, they did it with glimmer
for new expansions of course
modern brook
im sure they could make reprisal baseline or a talent if they know we love it en...
We don't love reprisal
We use it because it statistically dwarfs every other option and bandaids all our other issues
Charge weaving while active tanking is annoying
Using a external rotationally js dumb
urban portal
i agree
ocean yoke
reprisal as a talent would be almost mandatory which always stinks
urban portal
charge weaving can actively grief your team
however they could make charge proc revenge always
as baseline
if they dont want the shield block to be a thing
modern brook
They could also just instead address the real issues we have
sick sentinel
can vs does though right?
modern brook
Instead of making us jump through hoops to maintain mitigation during a pull
sick sentinel
well, what are the "real issues" we have
urban portal
ignore pain is ass
modern brook
I can get onto it when I'm not at the drive thru
modern brook
Rn the only real issue I got is if I'm getting 2 quesoritos
sick sentinel
if they removed/made baseline ID, would NS or IV be better? your opinion
sick sentinel
yes i do for you, its called "marking bar lives" on curse
2 click raid markers and 1 click target marking, a god send for tanks/healers
https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/marking-bar-lives @violet violet
violet violet
Thank you so much!! That’s perfect
chilly brook
They could also just instead address the real issues we have
0h you mean like revert the bolster nerf and just make bolster baseline so then we actually have a good defensive CD in Last Stand? And revert the AM nerf so that we cut down shield block gaps through having a faster CD on Last Stand?
It's absolutely wild to me
That prot got all those nerfs but bear went live the way it is
teal swift
sick sentinel
press a button and "you get 30% more temporary hp" is a really bad or really good mechanic in 2022
its, just extremely vanilla
modern brook
0h you mean like revert the bolster nerf and just make bolster baseline so then ...
am nerf made the spec go from olympic swimmer to flailing while treading water
sick sentinel
why is it last stand if you can use it when you are above 50% hp
modern brook
For a tank thats all about cooldowns
Why does only avatar feel good to press
IP is dog shit for some reason, tclap is still anemic
sick sentinel
last stand implies you are wounded and sensing imminent danger, so you protect yourself
sick sentinel
from a lore perspective, because if the lore checks out it makes it more interesting
modern brook
Its literally vampiric blood, with double the CD, and does less
rage mangement has gotten less unbearable no small thanks to reprisal but like
do yall not remember like mythic Nathria week?
how fucking dog shit everything felt in keys cause you couldnt keep shieldblocks up?
none of thats changed
ocean yoke
hell last stand is more of an offensive cd now for execute phases but thatll be gone next xpac when that conduit is gone
modern brook
Like the worst part of it
none of this like means anything
Cause warriors fine right now
class is fun
ocean yoke
itll only get worse lmao
ocean yoke
last stand that is
modern brook
its just the stuff it was given for the expac
modern brook
i did boss damage
it doesnt matter once you get adamant vvaults and blessing/curses
sick sentinel
intake boss dmg or output to boss dmg
plunderer seems good, but, seems like trap one too, could get a bunch of shit white ones, +2% mastery
chilly brook
Getting the explosion in the bottom right is actually pretty good
It does a significant amount of damage
sick sentinel
it's gunna be alot to learn about other classes n shit, but i think i like this banner stuff so far
forces you to learn about other players big CD's when they are coming up so you can try to get it at good time
ocean yoke
thatll help with dungeons in general too, youll be able to tell if you can do a bigger pull if the dps have cds ready
sick sentinel
i think, it will be tempting to use it when there is "avoid or die" boss thing because party gets MS,
urban portal
Why does only avatar feel good to press
i think
warrior is the only class with a cd thats exclusively offensive
i mean prot warrior
most tanks have dfensive util on their cds also right
modern brook
i mean prot warrior
bear has berzerk/incarn
modern brook
sure but like
urban portal
so prot warrior is definitely the only tank spec with a strictly offensive cd
modern brook
if you're going to argue that avatar is a better offensive cd than incarn
urban portal
im not
im just saying that its strictly offensive
as in it has no defensive utility
modern brook
and its not even good at that 🤷
modern brook
stop agreeing with me i want to be mad 😠
urban portal
just bake last stand into avatar
why wouldnt it be
avatar in both wc3 and hots gave hp
modern brook
if the wc3 for khaz modan played every time i pressed it :chefskiss:
sick sentinel
i don't know the math, but that +5 armor is huge
something like, 20-ish is the cap in that game, used to play ladder loads
urban portal
5 armor is massive yeah
sick sentinel
avatar should give LS or more parry, or some combination of that
urban portal
should be LS
because health is more visible power
its also better in a panic
but then you may need to nerf it
so idk
just get rid of last stand
sick sentinel
mage has same problem with arcane power and circle f power
casting rune circle of power gives another AP and so its the only viable option in that row ever, like with ID
sick sentinel
it's just memes for right now but im trying new and improved IV, haven't taken it to actual content besides we did 11 torghast and got 4 stars
ocean yoke
i doubt theyd ever do it but would be cool if ignore pain was made effective specifically against dots in some way
hell even just bleeds
i am big strong warrior i want to shrug off a little blood
urban portal
the fact that it has a weird 50% absorb is so bad as a panic button
they tell me the reason is because its so healers can heal you with an absorb up
but who cares
healers go dps
sick sentinel
theres also that one conduit adds X% of dmg dealt to your IP
i dunno the reasons, but its bad
ocean yoke
IP always falls off before it helps at all
sick sentinel
Talent now also causes X ability to increase duration of your iP by y.z sec, my vote thunder clap,
ocean yoke
to replace NS?
sick sentinel
Not replace just enhance to viable
ocean yoke
IP will fall off from more damage since its so small than time, hell something like when shield block is up IP absorbs 75% of damage or something would be nice
that may well be garbage though i have no idea
sick sentinel
There's a million good changes they could add or remove to that row
sick sentinel
Maybe it's actually good and we just don't know it
Got meathook and blood punch (iv) doomslayer would be proud
No chainsaw
urban portal
theres also that one conduit adds X% of dmg dealt to your IP
its bad because you are either at a point where ip gets deleted instantly, or you overheal with IP
blazing condor
If you got CDs up in a large pack you can pretty much have a passive perma IP with the conduit
but it's kinda lack for sure
urban portal
That's the thing tho
The duration is still finite
So you either lose a ton of value
Or the IP gets popped early and you can't stack it
strong forum
Eh don't think too hard about it
blazing condor
strong forum
We don't have good conduits to use it in its stead
urban portal
That's actually true
strong forum
Assuming you're talking about the 4th endurance
urban portal
Nah not 4th
urban portal
I'm just pointing out why big ip doesn't mean shit
urban portal
I feel like if never surrender made ip absorb 100% at under 50%
It would be slightly more takeable
But then why would I not take iv for healing at that point
strong forum
It needs to be on a different row
It can't compete with Indom unless it would permanently change IP to an say 80%+ absorb
The threshold of making IP do X below 50% hp doesn't really work well for us since we rarely spend time below 50% hp, ultimately making it a wasted pick
It needs 100% value to compete with Indom
blazing condor
i remember back in BFA where people would TP out of Motherlode to put NS on
good game design
jagged pier
Does necro legendary not extend the buff for others?
nope never has
mellow gorge
So when are we gonna get leggo weapons?
median tulip
It can't compete with Indom unless it would permanently change IP to an say 80%+...
Nothing competes with Indomitable. It should be baseline.
patent osprey
27 Spires timed! 2.11M Reflect damage and 7.7k overall ^.^
urban portal
Damn that's actually game knowledge
strong forum
Reflect op!!! Nerf!!?!?! 1!
sweet summit
totem 
mellow bridge
Dirty etherdiver padder 
orchid frigate
you just move in under him with reflect up or?
mellow bridge
wait until the stomp starts before pressing SR
orchid frigate
ah
mellow bridge
sometimes the moving under him doesnt work insta
orchid frigate
kk
patent osprey
you force stomps by moving under his hit box
but there is a cd on stomp
and if he has a blast qued, he wont stomp right awya
orchid frigate
ok ty
broken mulch
😂 should i play necro on sylv prog to simp for boomies and stuff? or just better of playing kyr?
broken mulch
aii, we're 140 pulls in on p1 pretty much, and looks like i might need to swap tanking from dps so just trying to figure out what's the best =]
jagged pier
honestly kyrian
u can go wall or rep whatever u prefer
and its alot of extra rage over the fight
which really helps
broken mulch
yea lot of roster issues
strong forum
It's a 100 pull boss
broken mulch
okey man
jagged pier
i dont think its a 100 pull boss for most ppl Nome
200 is more reasonable
but yer 140 pulls in p1
is
um
yikes
broken mulch
it's ok can't really learn with 2 new ppl every week =]
jagged pier
u can
u only need most ppl to bait
thats all p1 really is
bait in the right place
broken mulch
yea i really wonder if there's something we're not doing 100% correct with baiting
strong forum
2 new people a week is still fine, I had to deal with up to 5 when I was RL 😿
Shit was awful
1 night we had to pug 2 people on slg mythic prog
jagged pier
strong forum
Cuz 6 raiders were out that night
broken mulch
yea on slg we just ended up pulling with 18 man =]
jagged pier
yer but slg was horrendous
strong forum
People not having literally every single spell in muscle memory of the boss
Is just beyond me
jagged pier
any fight were u ahve to stop damage
strong forum
After 120 pulls
jagged pier
is bad
jagged pier
People not having literally every single spell in muscle memory of the boss
yer i get this, tried the wall on slyv yesterday, can it felt disgusting because my fingers were used to cds with rep KEKW
swapped back instantly
orchid frigate
time to clean up my pc and do a fresh wow install
jagged pier
eurg
broken mulch
i always try but it never works XD always stacks up
orchid frigate
yeah same
and now its too much to deal with so i'll just throw it all out 🙂
and install what i really need
jagged pier
just delete your WAs
orchid frigate
its addons as well
and it was an old copy of wow from my old pc
felt like it would be good with a cleanup 🙂
final acorn
Hi, trying to use the search but can't find much about this. Our Warrior tank is struggling to survive on mythic Guardian. Basically he needs a couple externals every sunder+obliterate. Is this normal? how can we improve his survivavility? he's NF so going kyrian would probably be a first step
jagged pier
he should only need like 1 external every other one
or if hes wearing the wall none pretty much
strong forum
Kyrian or NF doesn't make a difference
What matters is him having up his SW + demo/IP for the combo
strong forum
He should also play AM if he isn't. Anything else is trolling
jagged pier
if u have the wall equiped u can do every one
if not u cant
and u need externals
logs will help
if u have any
final acorn
they would... but they are private, nothing i can do about that 😦
jagged pier
u can change them
mellow bridge
Hi, trying to use the search but can't find much about this. Our Warrior tank is...
tell him to use demo + SR for every single one
in addition to either SW or a strong external or scale
that's enough to live already
oh and obv shield block
jagged pier
tbh it just sounds like he aint planning cds which is bad
mellow bridge
yeah
final acorn
Well it's his OS that he rarely uses, just needed him for a couple of days to tank. Thanks for the feedback, will go by logs later with him
mellow bridge
he's probably either not planning stuff or playing a wrong setup
like not taking AM
what's your other tank class?
final acorn
DH has no trouble at all
mellow bridge
with Monk he could run the wall which with AM means he can have SW for every single combo
jagged pier
u dont need rep with anyother tank
the boss hardly melees
if u plan block correctly it doesnt matter at all
mellow bridge
guess I dont do that then 🤷♂️
jagged pier
like hot take its okay to melee'd a few times without block up
u dont have to cover everything
and he generally melees like 20 times in the fight
mellow bridge
I'd rather have 100% block and just use smth else for the non SW oblits
but I guess that's just diff priorities
jagged pier
your over valuing blocking white hits, like sure 100% is fine but u can get very high without rep and proper planning
like look at all the ppl who take HR on slyv were its useless really
pallid musk
Been playing Protection on Guardian normal with Stone Wall legendary. Used SR + DR and i took 2 sunder alone and survive
jagged pier
yer because on normal it doesnt do anything
pallid musk
In heroic he hits sunder and then Oblierate so how i can do both alone?
jagged pier
u dont
pallid musk
So hug melee is nessarcy
As Arms on Guardian heroic i used Die by the sword to party out the Oblierate from tank
jagged pier
obliterate is magic damge u cant parry it
pallid musk
Might be Spell reflect then. Did press it before hit
jagged pier
die by will help mitigate the damage as standing in obliterate will split the damage between ppl
but u cant parry it or stop the damage to the tank u can only reduce it
pallid musk
There many way to reduce the Oblierate. Die of the sword 30 % , Defensive stance 20 %, spell reflect
And ignore pain dosen’t help?
stuck scaffold
Ye but you can't take no damage without an immunity
mellow bridge
In heroic he hits sunder and then Oblierate so how i can do both alone?
Do you want to do one sunder and one obliterate solo on hc
Or both sunders and both obliterates?
Cuz you can easily solo one oblit on hc
worldly flume
kyrian is good for prot right?
jagged pier
yes
sick sentinel
yeah, i'm trying necro leveling it up, got the 262 and 73 reknown, not a huge fan atm, but its okay i guess, kyrian or NF is stronger yes
runic sparrow
filthy nonbelievers, necrogang is the only way 
😎
jagged pier
filthy nonbelievers, necrogang is the only way <:whyisthisgood:74263109222976722...
dont see u in the top 10
jagged pier
blazing condor
Uhm tanks arent supposed to deal damage jakey we’re supposed to have aggro and not die
Smh
runic sparrow
Uhm tanks arent supposed to deal damage jakey we’re supposed to have aggro and n...
lmao good joke
blazing condor
Thx
jagged pier
i will fucking time u out @blazing condor
runic sparrow
its a healer problem if we die
jagged pier
blazing condor
time out these nuts
I will never forgive that 250 ilvl bdk full turtle build on tarra
when i got all the best powers
And i got overaggrod and died cus i did 19k dps
strong forum
Tank live
No dmg
Only taunt
毛主席领导我们向前进 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是傻子 KEYS 台湾属于中国 VERS西藏属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花最好 STREAMER 打败国民党 TANK 香港属于中国
jagged pier
毛主席领导我们向前进 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是傻子 KEYS 台湾属于中国 VERS西藏属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花最好 STREAMER 打败国民党 TANK 香港属于中国
runic sparrow
brittle owl
毛主席领导我们向前进 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是傻子 KEYS 台湾属于中国 VERS西藏属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花最好 STREAMER 打败国民党 TANK 香港属于中国
strong forum
RR means it's twice as strong
brittle owl
capital letters means it's serious
strong forum
👏
blazing condor
Why do you as a man want vers?? Who are you trying to be versatile for??? Other men???
mellow gorge
Why do you as a man want vers?? Who are you trying to be versatile for??? Other ...
Why do you, as a man, want haste?? why are you trying to be hastey?? to meet other men quicker??
modern brook
毛主席领导我们向前进 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是傻子 KEYS 台湾属于中国 VERS西藏属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花最好 STR...
my tinfoil hat is this meme is chinese propaganda
strong forum
Never 🇨🇳
modern brook
毛主席是中国主席 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是中国电影理论家 KEYS台湾不属于中国 VERS 西藏不属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花的收割方式有问题 STREAMER 击败国民党 TANK 香港不属于中国
probably just got banned from china sorry tencent :/
brittle owl
毛主席领导我们向前进 VERSATILITY 郑国恩是傻子 KEYS 台湾属于中国 VERS西藏属于中国 DAMAGE REDUCTION 新疆棉花最好 STREAMER 打败国民党 TANK 香港属于中国
sick sentinel
sick sentinel
strong forum
sick sentinel
it made furries more main stream, but its a great cartoon
strong forum
https://youtu.be/5WcyVvWZJU4
I can literally sing along to this
blazing condor
nodders
empty path
@sick sentinel how is called that WA/addon for tracking party members CDs?
sick sentinel
ability team tracker, and you can set it to track practically anything (class) has
empty path
great, thanks 🙂
mighty valley
eh they're an upgrade from "grey and covered in skulls" to me
as long as you take off the stupid hats
jagged pier
not looking forward to the learning the language and stuff, unless theres no power behind it or it is just weekly capped
I FUCKING PRAY
🙏
silk edge
sick sentinel
i would love to see a set system like tier 0/0.5 in original wow dungeons
jagged pier
looks like ither different tier sets for different content, or 1 teir set but u can get it from all content
ither works for me
sick sentinel
you could get all the set pieces for all the classes by running each dungeon
so, there was always reason to bring rogue to certain place example
mellow gorge
We have a reason to bring rogues wdym
Shroud is great when you dont want to buy invis
ocean yoke
ocean yoke
hell yeah reprisal+pump leggo
patent osprey
it looks like a cov specific and reprisal XD
Ancient aftershock stopping 5 casts... hmmm
jagged pier
looks like NF or kyrian for keys and necro in raid if that happens
mellow bridge
huh
the wowhead article/quote doesnt mention the cov thing at all
there they say they're still thinking about how exactly they want to do it/theyre listening to feedback on it
mellow bridge
that makes it a lot less exciting 🤔
but I guess it's a lot more balanceable that way
median tulip
Ahh fuck, I have both Reprisal and Elysian Might on legs right now
median tulip
Have they actually confirmed that Domination Sockets are fucking off entirely?
safe thistle
tender imp
no reason to assume they stay
safe thistle
im pumped now
sweet summit
shards will probably still work
but the set bonus will not
since it is outside of the maw
mighty valley
almost certainly be made obsolete by ilvl v quickly
ocean yoke
i am already beginning to auction off my banner this will be great
median tulip
no reason to assume they stay
Every reason to doubt Bliz will get rid of them, even though they are a completely awful system
safe thistle
2 legendary + set bonus ohhh ya
tender imp
blizzard wont force people to farm an old raid
its 100% gone
stuff like this never lived for more than a tier
safe thistle
anyway the new ilvl will be > than shard since the shard set bonus wont work
jagged pier
stuff like this never lived for more than a tier
back in the day where the druid in my raid was still heaing with HFC or BRF 2 set in nighthold
it was a dumb amount of ST healing
and we didnt have a paladin
sick sentinel
GLORY + REP
brittle owl
legion was full of stuff like that
sick sentinel
that is all
brittle owl
their solution was to delet tier sets 
jagged pier
legion was full of stuff like that
i know but honestly im not against that stuff tbh
tender imp
sure maybe the gems stay but 30-40 ivll will beat those
safe thistle
we will be at the 300ish ilvl for the raid i bet
patent osprey
A whole new patch and leaper still no function :( maybe the tier set will cause an earthquake to spawn after u leap
then leaper bis
modern brook
Leaper should give a revenge proc and 4 seconds of shield block
strong forum
leaper should be deleted
modern brook
Maybe 20 rage too
brittle owl
prot warrior movement should just be charge and leap
rest of the time you just rp walk
chrome falcon
i look forward to welcoming many new brothers to the necrolords because glory+reprisal is gonna be some 100% banner uptime nonsense
chrome falcon
oh for m+ yeah our dps is gonna go nuts
mellow bridge
yea kyr guardian sounds nuts next patch
mellow bridge
Prot sounds fine with reprisl + em, just a nice dmg buff
maybe makes BV better again? More dmg into the spear window
ember token
Ok so thats only cov+normal legendary? Still fine
mellow bridge
Pally sounds real good
median tulip
Leaper should give a revenge proc and 4 seconds of shield block
They should bake the Blade of the Tideskorn Anima power into Leaper
inland raft
Ya necro reprisal will be insane
mellow bridge
idk how the DK cov legendaries are, but I think theyre pretty bad/mediocre
strong forum
Yeah they're shit
From what I know
Pally is gonna pop off
Druid is gonna pop off
inland raft
You can get insanely long banners
median tulip
The NF Monk Cov legendary is pretty good
mellow bridge
mh yeah actually the nf one is decent for aoe
chrome falcon
Glory + Reprisal is going to be fucking wild man
mellow bridge
but they dont have a single good one for ST I think
and NF is always kinda wonky in m+
chrome falcon
but yeah UFR + another legendary for guardian is like
inland raft
Not bad for aa either, 15 second lockdown on castwr packs, but glory will be better imo
chrome falcon
idk they can already pull the entire dungeon at once, maybe now they can pull two dungeons?
modern brook
Reprisal + glory sounds sick
Yeah honestly this
chrome falcon
^^^^^^^^^^
you can already hit 1:30+ banner uptime with lust, adding glory is going to push that past 2 minutes
mellow bridge
ngl, I dont even know what glory does
that's how little Necro interested me so far
chrome falcon
spending rage = longer banner duration
inland raft
And affects one more
chrome falcon
yuuuuup
inland raft
So all your dps
median tulip
Oh god. Arms is going to be able to run Elysian Might + Enduring Blow
mellow bridge
chrome falcon
yes boomkin is going to be even more bis than before
that class needs to get gutted
strong forum
You won't show up on the dmg meter
mellow bridge
do they even use boat
strong forum
It's only gonna be orange class
mellow bridge
i thought they use pulsar now
mellow bridge
think boat got nerfed hard from s1 to s2
mellow bridge
I very much hope they will tune cov legendaries before 9.2
some of them are just soooo bad
chrome falcon
oh yeah trust me
this is a terrible idea
but it's going to be great for us
the "covenant legendary" no longer really exists
it's now just extra text on the ability
and the abilities were already wildly imbalanced in a lot of places
mellow bridge
I wouldve prefered being able to wear any 2 legendaries but I guess that would have required way too much balance work
runic sparrow
lads the double legendary is nuts for necrolord. glory + wall meta incomming, im 100% certain.
strong forum
There has to be severe class and legendary tuning
mellow bridge
cov + another one is still kinda exciting at least
runic sparrow
you heard me
strong forum
That has to be a bait
jagged pier
lads the double legendary is nuts for necrolord. glory + wall meta incomming, im...
rep give more rage wtf u on?
strong forum
Not falling for that one
chrome falcon
tbf
strong forum
Nuh uh
strong forum
AM
runic sparrow
less than a minute wall cooldown, infinite banner duration
mellow bridge
you dont go bolster with reprisal
runic sparrow
chrome falcon
strong forum
Reprisal sure, but not wall
inland raft
Does necro cov leggo only affect self or does it extend time on others as well i forget
runic sparrow
only self
inland raft
Havnt played in months
strong forum
Only yours
inland raft
Damn
runic sparrow
nah nah brother, wall + glory is the way
inland raft
Atill insane
runic sparrow
just you wait
runic sparrow
reprisal overrated tbh
inland raft
Ya how would wall wver beat reprisal?
mellow bridge
oh glory doesnt extend on allies?
inland raft
Especially coupled with glory
mellow bridge
that's kinda sadge
strong forum
Yeah 80 rage per charge vs 5 rage from SS
modern brook
that's kinda sadge
Fucka ally
modern brook
I'm tryna fuck on execute damage
strong forum
What is better
chrome falcon
if glory extended on allies
p warrior would be the best class in the game not close
runic sparrow
wall also reduces wall cooldown, dont overlook that
dmg good
shield wall also good
inland raft
Can get nearly 100% uptime on banner if played well on top of 100% effective shield block
chrome falcon
why do you need reduce wall cooldown?
strong forum
You already have Am
inland raft
Gonna have insane crit block
runic sparrow
wall is cracked on progress hello?
chrome falcon
wall is fine on progress
runic sparrow
: )
chrome falcon
julor is getting the same treatment i get when i argue for glory but also is definitely trolling
with glory the extra rage from reprisal is 10x more valuable than anything wall is doing for you
runic sparrow
idk man, i ran glory / wall during progress
mellow bridge
wtf
runic sparrow
no troll
chrome falcon
doesn't change the fact that reprisal and glory SYNERGISE
wall and glory don't
reprisal makes glory EVEN BETTER
runic sparrow
just fucking remove reprisal already
that legendary is so fucking awful to play with
chrome falcon
w-
modern brook
^
strong forum
I prefer faster gameplay
Reprisal alone adds +7-10 apm to the spec
Aswell as on demand rage
modern brook
The sick apm of walk away
strong forum
Literally goated
modern brook
As pog as it gets
strong forum
The sick apm of walk away
And all the rage it grants
wicked ridge
yeah walking away so much fun. spamming utility spell on cd not for utility is fun.
woeful cypress
how come ppl pog over glory now when i got flamed for bringing it up last tier zzz
median tulip
Reprisal is great. It's just it's a bandage masking the underlying issues with the class.
modern brook
how come ppl pog over glory now when i got flamed for bringing it up last tier z...
ur a dweeb
strong forum
It's insane rage
median tulip
Yeah
wicked ridge
pressing more buttons =/= fun imo
runic sparrow
necrolord already highest apm, dont need more
strong forum
80 effective rage per charge/intervene can't beat that
median tulip
They really need to heavily buff Thunderlord
mellow bridge
how come ppl pog over glory now when i got flamed for bringing it up last tier z...
cuz you will be able to wear glory and reprisal :)
strong forum
Nobody flamed the use of glory, if you're necro you have to play it otherwise you might aswell not be necro
woeful cypress
i really dont like reprisal, its why i played pally instead of warrior this tier
strong forum
It's just that it's ass to play around
strong forum
Cuz maximum value of necro is not using it for yourself
strong forum
Reprisal takes no brain to play, need rage or block? Find a charge target / intervene a player
strong forum
Done
median tulip
It's a shame that the division is Covenant Vs non-covenant legendaries, rather than spec specific Vs general
ionic fern
Ok, so this is turning into:
"I LIKE TO PLAY X PLAYSTYLE!! SO I HATE THE PEOPLE WHO LIKE TO PLAY Y PLAYSTYLE".
runic sparrow
you cant use it at all when youre actually tanking besides intervene. melees will hate you if you keep moving the boss around because you have to super man leap out and charge in
woeful cypress
i think youre over simplifying it a bit, reprisal is deff a dramatic playstyle change, if youre into it, youre into it. but its way different
median tulip
you cant use it at all when youre actually tanking besides intervene. melees wil...
Charge weaving is actually pretty easy
strong forum
There are billions of situations that allow the use of very simple reprisal usage
runic sparrow
will definitely play it in 9.2 but i hate it zz
median tulip
As for Intervene I set focus on a melee DPS and have a macro that'll just intervene my focus target. Works great, especially when my NF Fury Warrior friend goes full burst on pull
ionic fern
While you are all serious about this stuff i'm just gonna be doing my own thing with Reprisal and Leaper.
jagged pier
you cant use it at all when youre actually tanking besides intervene. melees wil...
look no meme we should all charge weave without reprisal
safe thistle
hmmm would necrolord really be worth switching for.
jagged pier
well and defensive cause rage
strong forum
In 9.2, potentially
jagged pier
strong forum
It's just speculation right now but in raid it very well might be meta
safe thistle
i dont have much to do atm so i guess i could at least boost its renown in case
kyrian ret pally gonna destroy the meter o.O
strong forum
NF is a strong contender tho for raid
ionic fern
I'm doing all the renowns cause i'm bored and i got tilted by people doing sub 7k DPS in a +18
safe thistle
key arent relevant to do anymore at this point :/
ionic fern
Neither is raid.
safe thistle
yup
safe thistle
well i like the start of new season when theres a bit of a challenge
median tulip
TBH at the moment I just run ToP+15 4 times a week and call it a wrap
I can tank ToP+15 in my sleep
median tulip
i dont even do key. who need vaults....
I still have a slot that's only 246 :(
wooden spruce
wonder with the double lego thing now (ignoring tier bonuses) what would be better this tier, prot pally or warr, seeing how much dmg pallys pump
safe thistle
old warrior souls for me to 246 :/
ionic fern
Just stack crit and run Seismic/EM
safe thistle
if we wanna stay kyrian we will need crit ya
jagged pier
u dont need it
ionic fern
I mean..pretty sure you can play which ever of the 3 covenants and be fine.
jagged pier
its better yes
median tulip
Yeah true, tuning will happen
modern brook
fuck tuning dude my leggo cost 30k >.>
safe thistle
ddont craft any new one for now 😛
mighty valley
sell a kidney or two
safe thistle
lvl up a guardian druid they might be op if they dont tune convoke leggo and trash one
😛
sick sentinel
sinful surge + exploiter for arms
modern brook
thats just spearless EB
wooden spruce
at least i have some time to decide if im going back to my warr, keeping my pally or playing my monk haha
sick sentinel
someone try the wall + unbreakable 9.2
strong forum
That's like a budget hpal
You get to apply a 25% group dr for 8sec every 50 seconds
Too niche
It has synergy, but too niche
median tulip
I have max Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing anyway, so I don't really care about making new legendaries
modern brook
weird way to spell engineering alchemy
median tulip
Not on main :P
ocean yoke
lvl 1 enginerring and alch for teleport and double flask is the way
ocean yoke
i just bought one even on main, got lvl 1 on each alt
ocean yoke
yeah it wasnt even too much iirc
strong forum
The more you know
ocean yoke
gotta put in all the work possible to be lazy
modern brook
I thought its account bound
Wormhole shadowlands is buyable yeah
sweet summit
Wormhole shadowlands is buyable yeah
modern brook
<:dandy:809705852658253844>
sweet summit
sweet summit
yea same
mellow gorge
tbf
a 2nd lego would be interesting
i'd like a weapon lego 😦
however it'd be fun to run seisemic/reprisal
short kiln
sadly it's confirmed to be regular and cov leggos.... which is kinda pre-balanced by virtue of most of them basically sucking. I'm here for pumping with EM, but it's not as fun as Seismic and Reprisal would have been for sure
mellow bridge
eh idk if i would say that most of them suck
most classes have at least 1 good option I think
like we will run glory + reprisal probably assuming no changes
but tuning will happen 100%
the two classes with the worst cov ones rn are probably like dk and monk
short kiln
Yeah... I shifted to BDK main after taking a tank slot in raid and hitting KSM on PW already and now I feel like the red headed stepchild
blazing condor
Its confirmed?
blazing condor
In that case the ”datamine” i was talking about a month ago was real
mellow bridge
Yeah... I shifted to BDK main after taking a tank slot in raid and hitting KSM o...
I wouldnt worry too much
considering this is one of the big features of the patch
they will make sure you have at least 1 decent option
short kiln
to be fair, I think most people were saying this would be the case when the cov leggos were released
due to most of them being fine but not generally better than the existing ones
fringe marten
I'm still not seeing a compelling reason to be necrolord vs kyrian though.
modern brook
In that case the ”datamine” i was talking about a month ago was real <:peepoHapp...
Idk if the single most predictable decision really counts as proof that the data mine of data that doesn't exist yet is valid
tender imp
a near perma uptime of banner beats anything else easily tho, not even counting the buffs u give to others
u can already do 1min+ banner atm, with reprisal its gonna be pretty nutty in m+ at least
modern brook
I wouldn't be surprised if em spear spikes higher
There could be sldugefist esque fights where that is more relevent
inland raft
Near perma uptime and buff all 3 dps
tender imp
also the necro shield is 10 times better than kyrian pot etc
inland raft
Shield plus the massive mastery to further lean into our already insane physical damage reduction strength is gonna allow some nutty pulls
ionic fern
I'm also more hyped for Kyrian. 
inland raft
Kyrian seems more fun, necro seems more logical imo
ionic fern
Idk, i'm not gonna assume anything before i see if they are adjusting anything.
I'm just gonna play full crit and go Seismic/EM.
tender imp
people dont like necro cuz their personal dps is lower on details
doesnt show thebuffs u give to others
ionic fern
My take on it is:
People don't like Necro because it's not as fun to play as others.
"Oh great, a stat buff".
I'll take my big shiny spears/AA's any day for fun.
inland raft
Obviously there will likely be changes that makes things diff, just speculating for fun based on current
tender imp
well to be fair necro also requires optimal play to be good, if u randomly banner all over the place its gonna lose a lot of value
if u are pugging etc i wouldnt be necro
blazing condor
Idk if the single most predictable decision really counts as proof that the data...
U just a hater praying on my downfall fr
A man is just tryna enjoy somethin in his life
Thanks for the fucking steak
potent anvil
I'm just gonna play full crit and go Seismic/EM.
fringe marten
You won't be doing any 'nuttier' pulls than you can now; if mastery/crit block was the barrier to us being able to pull bigger we'd already be doing it. It isn't. Phial has so much value, and yes so does the shield but phial is instant, cures lots of things/etc. It isn't that Necrolord is bad..it's great. I just don't see a compelling reason to change to necrolord was my point/statement.
More than just 'looking better' on details; I consider actual gameplay to be important..HOW managing banner effects what you do, how channeling shield effects you etc. (I know where's a conduit to allow movement).
ionic fern
<:deswind:533073964096946176>
Did you break 10k yet? 👀
fringe marten
Not just from an efficacy point of view but of actually PLAYING the game, in both raiding and M+ situations I think Kyrian brings more to the table ATM (assuming I had on both Elysian Might + another leggo vs Glory + another)
fringe marten
But there's a huge chance there's some tweaks, or maybe just newer content that makes the necrolord switch actually compelling. and I mean that from a literal stand point..COMPELLING; IE it's SO good I just have to change.
potent anvil
Did you break 10k yet? 👀
Haven't tanked a key in awhile. Maybe I can this week
fringe marten
Deswind you and me both =\ I've been raid logging for some time; I do 1 15 or something for a week half the time with alts or whatever; I just don't have a reason to play WoW atm. Been doing other stuff like Pathfinder wrath of the righteous etc.
mighty valley
You can flip covenants as you wish, so like... do whatever you want
dusky mica
Venthyr Prot is the real shits
mighty valley
some people like buffing the squad, some don't, it'll all be fine
dusky mica
the buff is too small
ionic fern
Necrolord just does bad damage
I wouldn't say it does bad damage. It does pretty OK damage but it's a lot more harder to pull off compared to Spear/AA which are pretty much just shoot and forget.
tender imp
with an optimal banner usage, (eg buffing 3 dps that wants mastery) i can easily see necro outdps kyrian overall, but its hard to calculate and such
fringe marten
I can get over not doing 'great' dps and giving some of it away to group members..in fact I enjoy that idea; But it's more than just banner vs spear.
jagged pier
Necrolord just does bad damage
Its literally the best ST damage cov
fringe marten
What is 'AA" ?
ionic fern
Ancient Aftershock.
tender imp
ancient aftershock
ionic fern
I'm too stuck on Kyrian Mika now. 😦
I tried swapping to NF for some keys but i miss my 40s spears.
fringe marten
ohh yeah I always forget that night fae thing is called 'Ancient Aftershock" I always just call it "the nightfae thing.." or 'convoke the spirits' LOL~ even though I know it's not convoke.
^^
dusky mica
blue shit
fringe marten
Exactly..it's the entirety of what Kyrian has atm. Phial is a huge part of it.. If we can cross faction raid and I can go back to dark iron dwarf; it would make going to necrolord a LOT more desirable.
dusky mica
if getting stunned in m+ was a big deal, necro would be a little more popular, like it is in pvp
fringe marten
You are correct, and also wrong. You can play around it..you don't need it..it's a crutch; whatever way you want to spin it. But guess what? I don't WANT TO..I liked having dark iron dwarf cure (when I had it..now I majorly miss it) I like having a huge on demand heal + curing almost any ability on me..again it's a quality of life/gameplay issue.
dusky mica
Stoneform dispells too many things, aye. It's a little OP.
Should be just bleeds.
Could stretch to poisons I guess since you could call it a blood based affliction.
fringe marten
As someone said before a lot of this is a "I like to play this way..vs that way" debate; not necessarily what is actually 'better'. One of them is just numerically superior if ALL You want to do is take into consideration the total damage brought to the table by any of the covenant kits. One of them has the most self healing/damage mitigation...one of them has the best mobility/etc.
mighty valley
Yeah, so it's not really a debate, it's just what you like
I've been venthyr til this patch despite fully knowing it's the worst lol
dusky mica
Unless you like Venthyr.
fringe marten
But none of them have ALL of those things together; which means it becomes a 'what do I think works best for all the content I do'.
mighty valley
condemn feels sick idk what to tell you
dusky mica
it's shit though
tender imp
well i guess blizzard balanced some things right if the community cant actually decide on whats best?
dusky mica
If we had legion rage generation it might be good
fringe marten
And again; one will have more damage/survivability in..raiding and M+.. Ok: HOW much more? Do I gain ? 1% damage? a bit better sustain after I channel a shield every X minutes for X seconds.. vs just having smoother/easier method of just playing my character?
mighty valley
ok don't play necro
inland raft
In an ideal world there would be no right answer between all 4
But that’s unrealistic, we will see once its out
tender imp
well venthyr we can realistically say its the worst
but other 3 hard to say exact order
fringe marten
That's my point; it's not that it might not be great..it's 'how' much better is it? Because my group/raid members not having to worry about 'run over near the banner' itself has a value..not having to manage that; has a value to me. The phial heal/cure..has a value to me. So at the end of it I'm just trying to see what is the biggest value for me playing the game/what I do. Something is going to have to bring a lot to the table to force me off of kyrian; and it's possible there will be a patch that does it.
inland raft
Even currently i like spear for damage and aa for utility, and top pushers reflect both its a good problem to have to not be able to clearly say whats better adding necro to the list is only good
tender imp
numerically necro is best for st raid dmg, but its mega annoying to play it properly , so almost nobody runs it
inland raft
Some classes have only one option with no wiggle room which sucks
fringe marten
If the damage gain is SO substantial from banner and it also provides enough quality in just playing the class that what I lose from kyrian is 'worth' it..I'll likely end up swapping. Due to the changes in covenant swapping I may do the necro story and craft the leggo just to play with it..I feel it's at least worth a playtest.
runic sparrow
With necrolord being the best st, even disregarding the mastery buff to allies, i think its hard to argue that necro is not the top raid covenant. While giving it to boomies is ideal, most melees tend to have 2 minute cds as well making it very useful even just popping it on cooldown in melee.
inland raft
I played necro for a while, I personally really liked it if being honest but def isnt for everyone
dusky mica
I have necro and kyrian, necro is more annoying to play. The two extra buttons don't really DO anything impactful. The CD on craft is so short and the shield so small over the time period that's it's mostly just a hassle.
Banner just doesn't do enough for ME and the duration is not good.
runic sparrow
I mean it does if you play glory correctly
tender imp
u need glory leggo ffor it obivously
runic sparrow
Getting 90 second banner durations is very possible
inland raft
With the leggo you can have almost permanent uptime
runic sparrow
and fleshcraft is insanely good
runic sparrow
- damage reduction
inland raft
And dr during channel
dusky mica
Glory is trash next to reprisal unless all you want to do is farm trivial raids for a dps rank on a tank
runic sparrow
Glory is trash next to reprisal unless all you want to do is farm trivial raids ...
lmao
inland raft
Which is low key the better part of it
runic sparrow
i prog'ed the entire tier just fine with glory
dusky mica
Yeah there's going to be a lot of talk about which two for sure
inland raft
Its all kind of moot cuz almost certainly will be balance passes to either the leggos, the abilities, or both
And possibly more leggos
inland raft
Without balance passes there will be classes so insanely broken vs others it will be new levels of toxic so who knows what all will be adjusted
runic sparrow
honestly one of the strongest points of banner is not even mentioned in its tooltip, which is the rage generation you get from it.
runic sparrow
aye
runic sparrow
ye its 20
timber cloud
Fat crits
tender imp
that conduit scales with ilvl
the better ur gear is
better it gets
could be interesting
mighty valley
weird that they forgot to give venthyr a cov-specific conduit
maybe they remember this patch
tender imp
didnt they buff it this patch?
timber cloud
mighty valley
it's still just like... thanks for making it better in the situations you shouldn't use it
cool conduit
good idea
tender imp
oh well nobody plays venthyr anyway
fringe marten
I just like being lazy..I want to be as effective as possible and do as little as possible..as prot warrior we already have to do so much crap.
dusky mica
They need to make Door of Shadows castable while moving. It's really unfun to use that thing in M+.
tender imp
press 2 buttons entire fight
inland raft
Kyrian bear is gonna be cracked
fringe marten
It'd be guardian druid 100...but I mean AS prot war.
dusky mica
The bear leggo needs to be nerfed. It's promoting some real degenerate bullshit.
dusky mica
Spices what up?
fringe marten
I think that will be the BIGGEST result of 9.2..it will further solidify class gaps.
runic sparrow
this conduit is also so fucking dumb. having to use last stand as your best offensive cd is so weird
fringe marten
Prot warrior is boring..? Are we playing the same class?
mighty valley
last stand is barely defensive, i'm glad the conduit gives it more value
runic sparrow
hard agree
inland raft
If prot war is boring then mayhe its time for a wow break
tender imp
last stand without bolster feels pretty useless very sad
runic sparrow
last stand is just a boring ability
inland raft
I been on break for 4 months already so im about ready to get back into it by time this all goes live
dusky mica
It should also make you immune to death
mighty valley
last stand is just a relic of what tanking was like in the old old old days
inland raft
Last stand honestly should be a temporary death prevention with maybe some drawback after it runs out
runic sparrow
was just a weird choice to remove it from AM
fringe marten
Last stand was a "hmm..no one is really looking forward to hitting this ability; and it's not being used as a 'major defensive' a lot of the time..you can just SIT on the ability; how do we change that?"
tender imp
i miss it
inland raft
Would be more interesting then press this and i have more health for a bit
runic sparrow
thunder clap best st was pretty funny
fringe marten
AM/Bolster being on 2 different tiers seems like a distant memory../sigh
dusky mica
BFA prot without the extra shit they added was bad.
inland raft
Bring back pandaland prot
dusky mica
Bastion of Might, Neck proccing Avatar etc.
fringe marten
Bolster should not be on that final tier; it isn't strong enough to compete with the other 2 options.
dusky mica
They should add a Bastion of Might Potency conduit.
runic sparrow
bring back gladiator stance tbh
timber cloud
Bolster was nice in early m+ pushing when your haste was too low to truly capitalize on the other two options
dusky mica
glad stance hurt my fingers
timber cloud
Esp pre reprisal
inland raft
Glad stance has no chance of returning in modern class design but maybe some talent that draws inspiration from it to replace bolster
fringe marten
Meh..glad stance can stay mothballed. I just want off GCD banners back..skull banner, rallying banner? and whatever the AOE taunt banner was (they kind of gave that back but eh)
dusky mica
Letting you intervene things that are not classed as players would be a start
I dunno why they stopped you intervening totems and pets and neutral shit man
fringe marten
...skull banner.. /cry
fringe marten
That is odd..was that done for a reason? Were people intervening totems or banners 'breaking' warsong gulch (where a player target wouldn't do the same thing) etc? or were people able to exploit..anything? with it?
It seems like one of those "we're going to remove this so we just have less to worry about / code around' type of thing.
Like "Hey we have this flag on a lot of these placable player items where it 'can' be a target for intervene/whatever? Do we NEED that? Do PLAYERS need that? Why do we have that? let's remove that.." I feel that was the logic behind that change..it wasn't 'for' us, it was for the small handful of devs left.
chilly brook
thunder clap best st was pretty funny
Thunderclap was not your best single target ability
Ever
fringe marten
If you want ANYTHING back; bring back Vengeance for tanking.
"How come tank is highest dps in raid?" ..all is balanced..
Yeah in BFA Tclap was our highest damage ability overall in keys but shield slam has always outshine it single target, currently it's Execute but only 'while' execute is available. Prot needs something like our dps specs has where we can trigger execute randomly, or lower the threshold for it working as prot. We get too little execute time =(((
runic sparrow
i mean yeah per press shield slam was best
but thunderclap was number 1 over all
besides TD of course
chilly brook
I mean when you can cast it at least 2x as much sure
fringe marten
Yarp..worst thing is, whomever did the balancing on that did NOT understand what was going on (the nerf to Tclap) "ok let's remove the talent that made it good from that row..ok; now the azerite power is gone..ok ALL the synergy that made it good is gone? ok NOW also nerf it 30%" "..why?"
chilly brook
It was also a damage loss to lose shield slam casts by pressing TC and not shield slam except for Uldir
Because BV extension being uncapped
fringe marten
? I thought the booming voice extension cap was altered like half way through?
mighty valley
I wouldn't mind the idea of the damage being moved more into the rage spender, except revenge just doesn't feel strong, no good theme to the sound or vfx or anything
chilly brook
Also post nerf of TC
fringe marten
Either way..that's unfortunately a golden era we won't get back in shadowlands.
chilly brook
? I thought the booming voice extension cap was altered like half way through?
BV extension lasted all of Uldir aka 8.0
fringe marten
Harrow I greatly agree; regardless of it being our 'top' damage dealer in keys..it FEELS weak due to VFX/SFX.
Ok I knew it got nerfed early'ish matt..didn't remember when.
ionic fern
It was changed in 8.1
fringe marten
Like for rampage (in fury) you WANNA hit that key, and when you hit it you KNOW it, and it's fun to hit. The visual, the sound..regardless of the numbers it does.
The SFX for revenge is ? flat or non existant..and it's visual identity is non existant. So it just never 'feels' fun to hit that key..you just know you're dumping all your rage into it and at the end of the zone it's done most of your damage. eh.
tardy sequoia
one is the nine mythic weapons
runic sparrow
gazepiercer
chilly brook
ILVL
runic sparrow
ilvl is by far the most important
tardy sequoia
while the other is KT hc
tardy sequoia
thanks