demoralizing shout one i mean
#protection
sick sentinel
craggy pilot
oh you dont have Reprisal? 😄
lofty widget
you play bolster if you dont use reprisal, but get it asap its sooo good
sick sentinel
i could get
a 210 one
really fast
so uh...
so im asking u everything
is that bada ahhaha
craggy pilot
210 reprisal rly good
lofty widget
thats what this disc is for ^^
sick sentinel
what happens in mists 10+ keys with potential with the 4 gaurdians i guess you call them
sick sentinel
old warrior soul is 220 only (lfr_) guardian trinket is hc
tho
😄
phial is 242
is there ever any of those guys that spawn in the mists maze, and if so what do you do about that
lofty widget
no, there's 2 before first boss, one right before the maze and one after second boss
lofty widget
ows is good
sick sentinel
as m+ i mean
sick sentinel
oh, nvm i think i see now, 3 of the power things are right near the first boss
so what u pick
or alar
evne
i like alar, free cheat death
craggy pilot
alar if you know you gonna misplay
lofty widget
dont play alar
strong forum
phial + matrix
craggy pilot
but alar is not doing anything for you for 90% of the time
viscid prairie
are there any soft cap objectives we have with secondary stats? for example i think prot paladins shoot for 30% haste. anything like that for warriors?
didnt see anything in the guides
mossy peak
nope
viscid prairie
ok thanks
brisk kelp
lofty widget
something like this, you can swap between storm bolt/double time and crackling thunder/bounding stride as you want
cinder nova
You never are gonna use Storm Bolt over DT.
Reprisal is basically our best balance of offense and defense.
You're only ever gonna not use it if you're just farming low M+
sick sentinel
+11 mists, going perfect, only thing anybody mentioned is "pull 3rd miniboss", kill boss without go to maze, do 2 maze rooms, guy dies, we rez him, pull room, we wipe twice after realizing priest is DC, give up
pug life
16-17 minutes on timer at first of 2 attempts on trash.
mossy peak
if you have anyone with pets, and pets is broader than you think
you can pull that 3rd miniboss easily
sneak around the 2 dudes at the front of the boss room, kill miniboss 2
mossy peak
they do
sick sentinel
so you think the priest got upset enough over not having a 3rd buff on 1st boss and rage quit?
cinder nova
Is it a guarantee?
mossy peak
nope
as for if the guy quit over it idk thatd be dumb
i'm just telling you how to do it for next time
no real reason not to do it
sick sentinel
i'm just trying to piece it together why they left for seemingly no reason on DC, felt like a quit
mossy peak
the reason you dont kill the 2 dudes btw is they trigger the boss
if you just walk around them you can kill the next 2 minibosses safely, then kill the 2 dudes and trigger boss with all 3 powers
sick sentinel
like, is it always expected to try to pull him and people actually do get upset over this type of thing?
mossy peak
it's pretty expected at this point but i dont think someone would quit over it in an 11
he probably just dced
sick sentinel
it just makes me want to play with a dedicated group who actually understand whats going on
mossy peak
thats always the best
cinder nova
I mean you can kill both safely even if you kill the brutes.
cinder nova
It's not hard.
mossy peak
the other way takes stupid out of the equation
and i always try to leave no room for stupid
cinder nova
That's a losing battle, son.
sick sentinel
there is no such thing as escaping stupid, its a black hole
cinder nova
I've seen 2500 players still do absolutely knuckle-dragging mouth-breathing Cro-magnon shit.
mossy peak
and thats why you dont kill the 2 dudes.
cinder nova
idk man if you play with people that can't avoid walking 40 yds into boss during incinerator I feel like you're just bending over backwards to carry absolute jagaloons
sick sentinel
yeah, i'll just take an hour break or something, come back at it again, goal is simply to unlock 3rd option incase i get all vers/crit gear in vault
mossy peak
idk man if you play with people that can't avoid walking 40 yds into boss during...
that's just every day of my life across the board man
in game and out
sick sentinel
yep, trying to cure stupid in a pug is like horse to water to drink
mossy peak
can't cure it, can only give them helmets and oven mitts
sick sentinel
they won't do it unless they want to
the only comment other i saw was "target the bombs"
but i don't even think we died to them?
i did some mistakes there and tehre
and didnt knew that route, i did normal clear of it , dos 12
i used revenge to much tho
i should ignore pain more
mossy peak
nah
strong forum
Depends
strong forum
There's no clear line
sick sentinel
i know it depends tho
but big pull
and im trying to dps
instad of ignore pain
thats what i mean
mossy peak
if you're getting your ass handed to you it's better to just
sick sentinel
on the other hadn
mossy peak
dip out for a second
sick sentinel
hand*
mossy peak
usually
mossy peak
you can dip out and weave with reprisal pretty organically
sick sentinel
and then i went in and one shoted forgot the big guys gets enraged
and had like 6 bolstering
my dps wasnt to high as u see
*my friends
mossy peak
no you did a lot of dps, dont compare to people posting in here with their geared mains in 250+ stuff
you dont even have all your renown
proportionally you almost beat a dps
mossy peak
and only did 1-1.5k less than the others
sick sentinel
how do icheck
if i dps to much
well i streamed so ican check later, its saved on twitch
mossy peak
did you get your ass handed to you and die
sick sentinel
what u mean sorry
mossy peak
did the mobs pulverise you into a quivering mass of ground beef
mossy peak
then you didn't really need to ignore pain more
mossy peak
there is no reward for over-surviving
sick sentinel
oh
strong forum
Bears have to kite outside of incarn ya
Outside of incarn they're literally just normal
It's just that during incarn they're dummy broken
sick sentinel
thank you guys so much
the big suprise right now was korayn for both fury and prot
i need to practice way more to be as good tank as dps
so thank you, and i will keep practicing
strong forum
Given that you already did 4.5k dps, you're atleast doing smth right
Assuming you aren't 240+
sick sentinel
i am 240 more or less
but was with lego of demoralasing shout
uptime on that
so more dmg
despite less shield blocks
cinder nova
TL is dogshit
mossy peak
you deal a load of damage
cinder nova
Only reason you'd run TL over Rep is if you're doing big dick high keys and the extra DR from demo shout overtakes the value of 100% block uptime on pulls
strong forum
With 238 you should be able to hit 6k overalls with proper play
So there's alot of room to grow
cinder nova
And that'd be against extremely specific scenarios
mossy peak
i feel like if you are doing those high keys where thats an issue you would use the wall
cinder nova
The only reason I can see it is if the DR is the only thing keeping you from being one shot
By some specific nuke on a high key tyr
mossy peak
get more vers, use cds
sick sentinel
vers is good if u can between 2 of the same ilvl
mossy peak
no i'm not recommending vers as an important stat rte, it was just in regards to the theoretical thing laid out
strong forum
You can't physically reach levels where you as the tank would get one shot with proper play without having your group die 15 billion times on your way there
sick sentinel
oh shit mine on bank of reprisal is 190 guys xD
strong forum
Just wanna make that clear that it's an absolutely extreme level of hypotheticals
mossy peak
thats fine
mossy peak
even a 190 reprisal is better than thunderlord
sick sentinel
i dont want to do torghast 😐
strong forum
^
mossy peak
the effect matters, the stats are just stats
obviously more stats is better but the effect of reprisal is far too massive
sick sentinel
true
mossy peak
the effect itself does not scale with the level of the legendary
sick sentinel
now that u explained
strong forum
Extreme rage gain, huge block uptime
sick sentinel
i understand it better
i went from shield all the way to ignore pain all the way for no reason xDDD
mossy peak
ignore pain was busted in legion but has been pretty shit ever since
shield block is way more important
urban portal
Cuz they gave it to filthy dps 😤
sick sentinel
ignore pain on arms/fury seems op everytime im absorve a thing
mossy peak
that's because they're not tanks and don't have other options
buoyant ledge
Outside of incarn they're literally just normal
Also though that until I made a bear, they are incredibly tanky outside of incarn too xd
They are just not a prot with all cds up, but still hella tanky
strong forum
Ofc they're tanky
But you actually take dmg
You have a full heal on a 30sec CD with 2 charges + the conduit that automatically procs + bark and survival instincts with 2 charges aswell as all your regular healing and convoke
Das alotta defensives
buoyant ledge
Oh yeye for sure, just say it bc ton of ppl think they are like dhs off cds, when they are like a dh with meta up
Outside of incarn haha
Yeah and u can also count trinkets on top of that
Kinda absurd xdd
strong forum
Well dh is unique in being squishy at all times outside of meta
That's kinda their dumb design
To be forced to kite
That's why vdhs need to run scale+aegis
When it's overkill for every other tank
buoyant ledge
Yeah.. I like it though
But agree is 100% overkill even in high keys, just feels so good
strong forum
Idk whenever I run a too defensive setup I get mad
Because I don't get value out of it
So I just sit there not needing to use it and waste it
buoyant ledge
Yeah... For me was like was used to tank tyr
And with fort grievous pushed a lot and felt kinda squisy
Squishy* so took both
But ye dont think is optimal
craggy pilot
i was wondering if going HR would make me so much more passively tanky that i dont need Aegies at all 🤔
but then it would just be a "lazy" build i feel
like going Reactive Retrofitting + HR to just shield a shit ton
and then just 2 DPS trinkets, like Phial+OPC
but not sure if the extra block duration will make up for the lacking Shield Wall CD
cinder nova
HR is for extremely high keys or ST parsing
Also there's almost never a time where you should need a tank trinket unless you're doing high keys or getting one-shot.
cinder nova
It parses higher ST
craggy pilot
currently using Aegis so i have a defensive while Shield Wall is down
meaning i can use a def on almost every big pack pull
craggy pilot
but i guess most of the dmg comes in is casting or when shield block is down
jagged pier
okay
craggy pilot
lul
jagged pier
look at logs
AM is run
and does more damage
sims
its 30dps more
which is btw within the margin of error
if HR was more damage
u would see the top ppl running it
top on tarrgrue AM
top on the eye AM
i can go on
craggy pilot
so youre saying if im not able to do +20 with DMG trinkets and AM, then im playing wrong right?
like with no Aegis, no HR
people never go "nice dmg tank"
but people always blame if you die
so feel like maybe going overly hard on defensive is more rewarding than going hard on DPS
blazing condor
your primary goal is to survive
craggy pilot
ye
craggy pilot
ye ofc
but just thinking if i could ease the run for myself
to get less stressed doing +20 😄
buoyant ledge
20s are kinda easy this season, but imo up from it starts getting bit more spicy
blazing condor
we're just dps whores in here
sick sentinel
your primary job as tank is to survive and make sure others are surving through not getting beat on, if you don't need to survive, your secondary role takes over and you are obligated to help damage the boss
you only need to worry about surviving when you need to survive
patent osprey
your primary job as tank is to survive and make sure others are surving through ...
Primary Job is to Pump DPS, so if you get close to any other dps class in your key, you can flame them for doing tank damage
craggy pilot
🤣
cinder nova
i can go on
I simmed it, you right. Dunno why my parses started going 📈 with HR, but maybe I gotta comb my AM logs
sick sentinel
i can use a hunter to pull the 3rd miniboss to 1st boss mists correct
i'm going for it again and i have the group made
mellow bridge
Any class with a controllable pet can do that, ye
And plka is right, you gotta pump and flame your dps when they get beaten 
jagged pier
I simmed it, you right. Dunno why my parses started going 📈 with HR, but maybe ...
well there are factors, HR isnt bad on ST and its not bad in the raid ither, there was a big influx of HR at the start for probably the fact it makes u tanker, and ppl reading sims and not realising really what sims are telling them, remeber sims is a starting point its not a end all and be all of things, but ppl so follow it blindly. so the logs you were seeing were ither ppl just doing what the sim said and/ or higher up guilds pushing early kills etc as they need to be more tank, now they dont your seeing the AM come back except on the last 2 i presume on KT because u hold dps having all the extra block makes it really nice to keep up for all the time and on slyv she just hits really hard to having block up for everything is also really helpful there,
also remeber our sims are slightly borked atm
cinder nova
They are? Why.
jagged pier
They are? Why.
Well they are if u are simming reprisal it will only do the revenge on leap, before it used to add some charges just in and stuff
sick sentinel
mists again, i'm watching the video, rogue sapped, and then i guess had autto attack turned on while walking past group and hit it for auto attack dmg.
jagged pier
Yes but sims, and also 100% uptime dull slog so HR only sims more in that scenario if theres any movement etc AM is better and its 3 behind in a slog fest it just os better
Anyways gn
elfin nova
I'm gonna be honest I have no idea what you just said
sick sentinel
yeah, might be time to get a "no clowns allowed" group started
elfin nova
I just play HR in raid because I run nature's fury
it doing comparable damage to AM is just a bonus
elfin nova
that is definitely something that breaks shroud
blazing condor
been playing a bit with siegebreaker instead of barbs on some dungeons
must say it feels p good
doing big dam
buoyant ledge
checked the pins and didnt see it, talents for prot warrior aiming for high keys?
im seeing not everyone run the same ones
mossy peak
Depends on how high is high
buoyant ledge
idk, basically want to make me used to the build ill play and try to push the highest haha
mossy peak
The stuff they use in really high keys is specific for those situations and not really applicable or optimal beneath
buoyant ledge
yea i mean i know you can optimise for lower keys doing more dam and this stuff
mossy peak
It's not so much that as the other way around
buoyant ledge
but tbh prefer to get used to cds uptimes and this stuff while i gear my toon
lavish oracle
buoyant ledge
like i see pika and frosty use diff builds, and each one has his own for all/most keys
and both seem interesting tbh haha
graceful blaze
if i see them prot warriors, im getting hungry for it
lavish oracle
Yeah, a lot of our talents are useful in different situations, learning when and how to use them is going to serve you better than a cookie cutter build
buoyant ledge
basically im in doubt with itf/ravager
and thunder/jump one
and then, i though b.s.c was the way to go but see both going booming which i kinda like it
lavish oracle
I use ravager in keys personally, it's higher damage and good threat in AoE
I like BSC more because I hate the way you have to play around booming, surprised that plka is going booming because I remember him saying something similar, maybe logged out in raid talents?
buoyant ledge
yeah, that was the one that im the most surprised haha, seing both going with it
but was checking specific keys not the log-off talents
lavish oracle
Might be for big snap threat with spear
Either way, I don't think you have to get to deep in the weeds about it, a lot of our talents are playable, even at the highest level. I would focus more on becoming very familiar with the classes tool kit so you can make informed decisions about this stuff yourself rather than wondering why someone else uses what they use
Plka's also pretty good about answering questions when he streams so you could always ask
buoyant ledge
yeah.. just been like a lot of time without playing it and im comming again with this 2 awesome weeks
median tulip
There's nothing wrong with Booming Voiceper se, it just doesn't really have the synergy that BSC has with Reprisal
buoyant ledge
and i kinda liked prot a lot so want to get deeeper into it hahaha
lavish oracle
I think they use it because of the synergy with mik trait
You end up with like a 45s CD on spear and shout so they're easy to line up
median tulip
And unfortunately Thunderlord is dreadful because of how hard Blizz nerfed Thunderclap at the end of BfA
lavish oracle
My issue with it becomes that have to use your demo shout for damage which feels bad when you don't have it as mitigation when you want it
It felt fine last xpac because demo shout was on like a 20s CD but it just feels awkward now
graceful blaze
some one know a good youtuber who gives good guides about prot ? 🙂
median tulip
Blizz just broke the combo that made Thunderclap and Demo Shout work at the end of BfA, and have not fixed it. It's a shame that the whole playstyle got nerfed out of existence
lavish oracle
I get why they did it, it kinda locked us into one very narrow set of talents and made us waaay stronger than any other tank which made us difficult to balance
lavish oracle
DK did more AoE in BFA? That doesn't sound right but I also don't know anyone that played it
cinder nova
Dunno about AOE, but they were doing more damage in Mythic Nya by the end.
lavish oracle
Oh, sure. Full twilight dev on ST, probably
median tulip
Twilight Devastation was utterly broken
My co-tank in BfA was a DH who hit 1.7mil HP in Meta and was covered in TD. Shit was insane.
median tulip
I think Blizz could do a better job with the Thunderlord/Thunderclap/Booming Voice/Unstoppable Force build than taking it from best possible spec to utterly unusable, though
cinder nova
I think you're wishing for the world with that one, pal.
There have been talents in our tree that have been dead talents for literal years.
And they have refused to rework or swap them for something actually compelling.
NS is the biggest offender.
lavish oracle
Hard to do with the way they balance at the moment, I think
Short of like hiring class specific design leads, I don't think we're gonna get a world where all talent builds are playable
median tulip
In my opinion they should bake the effect of the Shrieking Flagon Anima Power into Crackling Thunder
median tulip
NS is the biggest offender.
Menace is worse.
cinder nova
Menace actually has use in PVP
Sorta specific use
But use.
NS has been around way longer than Menace, though.
And it's been shit from the cradle and likely to the grave.
The only time I'd see NS not being dogwater is if they turned it into a cheat death that gave us some DR and temporarily made IP absorb 100% damage instead
And even then it'd be situational
buoyant ledge
My issue with it becomes that have to use your demo shout for damage which feels...
Yea makes sense, also makes you super strong at the start of the pull in both threat/tanky which is nice
oblique garnet
The only time I'd see NS not being dogwater is if they turned it into a cheat de...
NS was used in BFA high keys on couple of specific bosses
lofty widget
still have nightmares about rixxa in ML
high folio
so if my brewmaster off tank and i are both playing well is it normal for the brew master to be smashing a prot warrior in damage
bc on our sylvanas pulls we are both parsing high 90's and my co tank is nearly doing 1k above me
mossy peak
prot's not the greatest for raid dam
high folio
oof
mossy peak
you can tell just from your parses
you're parsing about the same
so you are performing the same
high folio
damn compared to the other tanks theirs not v many prot parses
yeah we usually parse p close to eachother
damn, prot dam kinda poo poo in raid
mossy peak
a decent part of the parse # is probably less to do with prot being weak and more to do with arms being strong
if your raid is going to have 1 warrior
right now, it should be an arms war
high folio
yeah that makes sense
i was supposed to be arms but both of our tanks left so me and another person filled in
atleast our damage isnt blood dk levels of bad
mossy peak
all tanks are fine rn, and despite the damage being worse, for the most part you can see it's not as disparate as the worst dps to the best dps
high folio
well yeah, but our top end is much lower then a dps
less room for variance if that makes
mossy peak
oh theres been some variance in the tank world before
mossy peak
sure, which is why our cap in relation to dps isnt really the reason for the variance or lack thereof
there have been some busted ass tanks
high folio
right
ik bfa prot was gigga busted
heard of blood dk's soloing m+ back in legion lmao
mossy peak
i'm referring to a mechanic from i want to say mop
where damage taken translated into damage dealt
and tanks dealt dps competitive with other dps
if not even higher
mossy peak
it was hilarious and broken as hell
high folio
yeah i could see that being super imba
but anywho i was just trying to figure if i suck or if prot ST dam is just meh bc i was getting owned by our brewmaster
ty for the input friendo
mossy peak
well the other way to look at it is
you're both in the 80s parsewise
which is good
buuuuut you're not capped
so even though prot is worse than brm by a bit
high folio
well yeah, def room to improve
mossy peak
you could still improve and probably beat him
... unless he did too, at an equal rate
high folio
im just saying in a scenario of two players of relatively equal skill
ik w wow its not as simple as x is better then y at all times no questions
you have to play it to max potential first
mossy peak
if you arent yet and if theres room and if you have one
get yourself in the windfury group, for starters
high folio
we do
mossy peak
prot gains from windfury as much as arms
high folio
oh shit i forgot ab that
idk if i can talk my raid leads into it bc they like tanks in a group by themselves for UI purposes
mossy peak
i bet they'd like you dealing 8% more dps or whatever even more
high folio
and they kinda have the tendancy to get annoyed when im focusing on doing good damage
both me and my cotank focus super hard on pumping lmao
mossy peak
don't see why that should be a problem unless you're taking unnecessary damage or fucking up the fight in some way to do so
high folio
right yeah
mossy peak
there is no reward for over-surviving
high folio
exactly
they tell me to talent tankier
i tell them no i need to play better
me dying means i didnt manage rage very well and hung myself out to dry
distant crystal
windfury = more ips
tell them it's for the tankiness!
then spend it on revenge 
ebon mango
hey fellow warriors, i want to tank mythic+ abit so i am guessing Reprisal. What are our best stats after ilvl?
median tulip
hey fellow warriors, i want to tank mythic+ abit so i am guessing Reprisal. What...
Haste
ebon mango
and after that? 😄
median tulip
More Haste
orchid frigate
have heard so much about prot pala dps all expansion but never played with one. how is it compared to pwar dps (m+)?
jagged pier
more
urban portal
Their burst 5 targets is unmatched
Captain America is so op
Nerfing it in the next movie for sure
orchid frigate
a lot or a tad more?
i mean i feel like pwar isnt bad at dps compared to dps roles. prot pala most be totally bonkers then?
mossy peak
there are ways to bridge the gap but it's at the expense of using reprisal
orchid frigate
did an alt key on alliance on my druid. this was saddening
blazing condor
year of the spear
oblique garnet
NF arms owns
sick sentinel
so how's is ur rule to use ignore pain?
blazing condor
if you need to rage dump and need the extra defensives
its used to mitigate magic heavy damage
if youre fighting a pure magic only fight (not many out there) you prio IP over SB
median tulip
kyrian arms is major pumpo
When I go Arms in keys I can burst close to 20k - and I'm not even close to BiS
sick sentinel
if youre fighting a pure magic only fight (not many out there) you prio IP over ...
tyy
rage dump can be also revenge, if they melee?
blazing condor
yeah revenge is our offensive rage dump
and should be used most of the times
but if you need the extra defense
then ip
sick sentinel
thanks i using shield block and ignore pain , more even ignore pain xD
blazing condor
shield block you want to have as much uptime on as possible (unless youre only taking magic damage)
IP is more situational and "feely"
median tulip
The thing with Ignore Pain is that you don't need to be spamming it. You apply it, and it lasts 12s. There's basically no need to reapply it until right at the end of its duration, because it only refreshes to 12s anyway
median tulip
Or if your enemies eat through the HP, yeah
sick sentinel
oh i using with the wa right, and was trying to get the biggest value of it
median tulip
So the thing to do is to have a Weak Aura tracking the remaining duration for visibility
sick sentinel
so spamming it to much
the remanaing i had
i mean the wa with white yellow red thing
median tulip
The max possible absorb is twice the amount of one use
sick sentinel
i use tell me when to track everything in all char, made by me
i use wa for others ppl work xD
i didnt know that
median tulip
The fact that the max absorb is as it is basically makes it "safe" to reapply when the duration has 1s remaining
'cos it'll never overcap
sick sentinel
i have 30% haste if i get more is to much right?
sick sentinel
its BIS M+ for us because of the haste
good to know!!
i have the neck 252 tho just no prismatic
sick sentinel
The fact that the max absorb is as it is basically makes it "safe" to reapply wh...
Makes sense, so i should just worry about having it up and not so much the max
mellow bridge
Depends on the content you're doing
blazing condor
i have 30% haste if i get more is to much right?
40% is where you probably wanna look into other stats
sick sentinel
m+ as prot, i wont go raiding, even if i go its hc, so not a big thing
oh
understood
median tulip
Makes sense, so i should just worry about having it up and not so much the max
That's how I play it. YMMV ofc
sick sentinel
ymmv? xD
but i will keep stacking ignore pain, at like sd 3 boss explosion and things like that
median tulip
but i will keep stacking ignore pain, at like sd 3 boss explosion and things lik...
The most important thing on Beryllia is to use Spell Reflection for the 20% magic damage reduction.
sick sentinel
true
i use that all the time as dps
arms i dont even need balls
i go defensive stance spell reflection and one ignore pain
ty for the tip tho
mystic warren
The fact that it also immunes the dot is just crazy
sick sentinel
whats immunes the dot?
mystic warren
Spell reflect
mystic warren
We play with prot + fury so all the balls are for only 3 players, trivializes the fight
sick sentinel
sinfull revelation? for m+? or u use even lightess force
sick sentinel
We play with prot + fury so all the balls are for only 3 players, trivializes th...
for sure
mystic warren
Celestial guidance
sick sentinel
ty
mystic warren
Afaik
sick sentinel
done
i tho it was sinful
i have enchanting so i can try it out too
show of force vs adaptive armor frag?
mystic warren
adaptive
strong forum
theyre pretty much equal
sick sentinel
revenge one has more uptime?
strong forum
na not rly
cuz its only TC dmg
but adaptive increases all dmg, but by less
so it evens out
mystic warren
if only adaptive wouldn't proc when hots heal you up just after you've killed a pack 
strong forum
idk both are dogshit conduits
craggy pilot
how / when do you kill slimes on Last boss Plaguefall?
they only buff for 2min right?
sick sentinel
+1
but sometimes the time ppl are taking to gather them and stuff , u can be on the boss
well but im the few of ppl that dont find that hard to dodge it
practice made me not afraid at all xDD
strong forum
the mobs are ULTRA SLOW
sick sentinel
i guess, someone knows ebtter than me
craggy pilot
ah ok
sick sentinel
the mobs are ULTRA SLOW
that
sick sentinel
u cant even pull and bring them
strong forum
the buffs are worth it
sick sentinel
its sad
craggy pilot
but mainly because someone butt pulled Plagueroc in the start
craggy pilot
i have 103.33% route, and cant decide what i wanna skip 😄
sick sentinel
sockets are so high value even if its lower ilvl, that is mindblow
sick sentinel
rings talking
on gear we can always upgrade it 😄
despite being valor capped weeks ago 😐
craggy pilot
oof, my new haste neck gives me +5% haste 😄
sick sentinel
thats goodddd
craggy pilot
193 haste in one item daaamn
sick sentinel
crazy stuff
median tulip
It'll be pretty darn good for your Fury set too
craggy pilot
dont play fury
strong forum
you can skip on the right side ithink
strong forum
rogue can also just shroud lol
mellow bridge
nah that guy is cc immune
jagged pier
LETS GOOOOOOOOO
proven patio
LETS GOOOOOOOOO
Seismic?
sick sentinel
em and spear full of crit wrrior? /s
jagged pier
seismic
craggy pilot
Jakey just doing NW to do high dam 😄
NW so easy :>
how would you do wings in TOP Tyrannical?
and lusts?
jagged pier
that was mists
sick sentinel
average 4.4k in 15 top
u guys are amazing
and i used reprisal 190
will upgrade it today
jagged pier
potent anvil
Seismic gaming
rugged mural
You guys prefer speed or leech on cloak?
modern brook
craggy pilot
You guys prefer speed or leech on cloak?
avoidance for M+
rugged mural
Oh. Didn't even think of that
primal cape
sick sentinel
Seismic gaming <:deswind:533073964096946176>
what this means? :p
blazing condor
Gaming with the use of the Seismic Reverberations legendary
safe thistle
ya tyrannical week seismic can work i guess pack die so quick
rugged mural
If we're only pushing 17/18 atm, would it be better to gem/enchant haste over verse? I see the highest keys are using verse, but I'm assuming that's because they can get one shot more easily.
urban portal
Vers generates more defense than haste if you are one shot with block up
Which is like
Kinda impossible
hollow sun
i am a simple man, i see a socket? Haste
sick sentinel
guys averaging 4.5/6k is good enough for us prot, im 235equipped as a tank
4.5/4.6*
i know our job isnt dmg tho xD
blazing condor
everybody's job is damage 
sick sentinel
trueee
blazing condor
4,5k isnt that special but its fine
sick sentinel
tell that to my healer this key
jumping around waiting for us to take dmg
😄
then being toxic xD
pugs are fun
mists is fun
hollow sun
i mean, tank dmg is good to have but if you don't care asmuch about maximizing your dmg you will do just fine till higher keys
just flame the dps by being toxic and gg 😄
cyan onyx
Are people pulling 7k per dungeon by just doing larger pulls? I'm averaging about 5k right now and I'm not sure how to get any higher lol
jagged pier
u should be doing around 6k-7.5k with reprisal depdending on dungeon
with seismic at least 7k
rugged mural
Subcreation looks like the guys pushing 24/25 are gemming/enchanting verse, any reason why?
cyan onyx
Enough passive haste on gear probably
jagged pier
because at thoughs lvls of keys the vera might save u if an inturpt it missed
sick sentinel
but seismic is a real thing?
jagged pier
if u play it correctly yer
jagged pier
just on prot
hollow sun
someone else is playing on a laptop here?
sick sentinel
thoughs on fueled by violence guys?
jagged pier
bad
sick sentinel
ty
shrewd bronze
Guys
Is there any way to do painsmith p3 without bop/blink?
We only have 1 paladin (1 bop)
jagged pier
leap or stun immune potion
shrewd bronze
Leap doesn't kill you when the ball hits you?
jagged pier
U have to leap over them
jagged pier
Biggest issue is the tank is a monk lmao
Then why are u asking in the prot channel? He should also be able to trancedance
shrewd bronze
Then why are u asking in the prot channel? He should also be able to trancedance
Cuz it's full of tanks that would be able to answer?
I mean your "stun immune potion" already helped so it 100% worked
So thank you!
mellow bridge
barbs and bulwark
..is it called bulwark?
w/e it is that gives you perma vers and dr when you enter combart
sly heron
Bulwark is better than haste from brand then?
craggy pilot
brand doesnt give haste
lavish oracle
thoughs on fueled by violence guys?
It's an okay third choice for defensive conduits imo
For keys, I should clarify
lavish oracle
Comparable healing to condensed anima sphere in my experience
In keys
I'm sure it varies a lot depending on number of targets
jagged pier
It varies on how much u press revenge and how much uptime deep wounds have where sphere is the same all the time so its just better, your never gunna do consistant largr enough pulls to get the avlue from fueled
strong forum
Idk fueled is like 120hps for me at best
Condensed is like 300-320hps
Doesn't even come close
inland plover
is it worth to drop 13 ilvl on gloves instead of an domination socket with shard of kyr defensive wise
jagged pier
U want the dom socket
median tulip
Fueled by violence is an Arms conduit really
sick sentinel
is BDK really just giga bad
seems to be what i hear, DH, warrior bear good, paladin dk monk not really
west prairie
strong forum
reprisal
sick sentinel
you want legs over the other slot it can make cuz you get more armor and i believe tiny amount more stats
Am I the only person who doesnt like holy in m+ at all?
xDDD
only bad experiences with them
wondering
sick sentinel
i mean, healer is healer for most part to me i'll go with any of them, druid and shaman are obvious choice because of utility and brez/standee
ancient monolith
Do you guys know which legendary are the prot warriors on MDI using? Just curious
It doesn't look like Reprisal
unique shale
sick sentinel
nw is the worse?
strong forum
NW dmg is inflated because of the orbs and potential weapons you used
so its not just you doing dmg but a large portion comes just from using the tools in the dungeon
lofty widget
is there a script that removes weapon dmg similar to the one in bfa for the cannons in TD?
sick sentinel
NW dmg is inflated because of the orbs and potential weapons you used
just used one spear
strong forum
well and the goliath orbs no?
strong forum
you didnt have a kyrian?
strong forum
so you did have orbs
strong forum
?!?!
sick sentinel
the orb for the aoe
sick sentinel
@strong forum thoughs now?
strong forum
getting there
sick sentinel
i went a wier rouet maybe
sick sentinel
getting there <:deswind:533073964096946176>
eyeyey
craggy pilot
anyone have any idea why these are different? one showing "overall" the other one showing Sanguine Depths +16 (overall) segment thing 🤔
gloomy cradle
Because one double counts all the fights and the overall
One is just the overall
Or@something like that
Might be that it just double counts the last encounter
barren socket
worth for the 5 socket?
tired ice
Maybe overall counts everything and there's something involved that wasn't in the SD run?
craggy pilot
Maybe overall counts everything and there's something involved that wasn't in th...
nah, it should auto reset before every run 🤔
because then it would have the people from my previous dungeon as well
and it doesnt
strong forum
worth for the 5 socket?
unless its your 5th socket, yes
strong forum
if its a dom socket
craggy pilot
😄
strong forum
its an upgrade unless its your 5th dom socket
craggy pilot
Nome u ok 👀
strong forum
the 5th dom socket is generally not very strong
barren socket
yeah its my 5th
craggy pilot
shard of Jas?
strong forum
then dont
losing a godroll helmet for jas, is not worth
for m+ that is
for raid its defo worth
river escarp
What toys do people use for canisters in sd?
feral drift
So im looking at logs, trying to figure out who which Kyrian to Raid tank with... seems like a 3 way tie.
Could someone provide me some context or the tl;dr on the trades off of all 3? Im not particularly a fan of Miko's Forgelite filter
craggy pilot
https://bloodmallet.com/chart/warrior/arms/soul_binds/castingpatchwerk
see the sim here tbh
not sure what more there is into it for ST
feral drift
You linked Arms
feral drift
and DPS isnt what im looking for really, I mean, its one component but im not uber geared
i need to think defensively too
craggy pilot
then you shouldnt rly be comparing DPS logs 🤔
lofty widget
What toys do people use for canisters in sd?
they fixed any toys that give stacks
potent anvil
Mists+20
feral drift
then you shouldnt rly be comparing DPS logs 🤔
Youre not wrong, I dunno just gravitated to looking at what top tanks are doing
and I reduced it to my ilvl, so its like... their dps at my range factored into tankiness?
sweet summit
sick sentinel
im blaming 223 weapon and 213 trinkets for my low dps, but i know that ain't it
craggy pilot
Mists+20 <:deswind:533073964096946176>
how much shield block are you negating by this? 🤔 shamans should usually do 3k+ dps
guess hes maybe doing less dps because he has to heal more? 🤔
sick sentinel
it could be entirely possible that i just use too much block/ip or at not the correct times
craggy pilot
was talking about the shaman
for your DPS i dont know what youre doing wrong without showing maybe details or logs 😄
sick sentinel
i'm seeing 113 casts of IP for 678k total for a +8 with no wipes
potent anvil
Dunno much about shamans, but he was necrolord...so not being kyrian means he doesn't do as much damage?
Don't think healing me was an issue though
craggy pilot
hmm if he was necro with Riptide legendary then yes, but if hes using Deeptremor he should still me doing 3k overall
sick sentinel
does that sound wrong to you guys that i have more healing through IP than through indomitable
craggy pilot
yes
potent anvil
Not necessarily wrong. The safe/defensive play should have IP as your top healing.
It's basically the turtle way to play prot. You upkeep IP at 3 stacks, and only revenge with excess or if it's free.
craggy pilot
rly wanna try doing Seismic, but holy shit dont wanna spend 5k Torghast shit on it 😡
and feels like losing a shit ton of Shield Block uptime would make packs hit a ton harder
potent anvil
Shaman wasn't play a dps legendary that run. If deeptremor is the one where ele has earthquake, then it was not that.
craggy pilot
ye you usually go Deeptremor or the Kyrian Covenant one
the healing legendary is rly not needed as shaman
sick sentinel
i inivted some shaman complaining about the jump guys in spires
somehow it fucked over his earthquake
craggy pilot
they are quite hard to keep grouped, i always fuck it up myself 😄
potent anvil
I think it also depends on the healer. I'm usually not the first one to panic on my own pulls. CDs are up every 45s so every pull is relatively safe for me. Shield wall being a <2 min cd is pretty useful, too.
If things go bad, its usually because stuff lived way too long or important kicks were going off. The only problem is if me and healer decide to dps rather than building some sort of synergy.
Healer, as in the player. I'm fine with any healer if they know what to do 🤷
craggy pilot
wdym about pull being safe when you pop your 45s CDs, theyre all offensive right?
Avatar+Ravager+Spear i guess?
Shield Wall ye ofc, but i have that on 2min CD with Reprisal as well 🤔
Just feel like on a lot of packs the second my Shield Block is not up, i get meleed and HP just goes poof... Without reprisal that would just happen twice as often i guess
potent anvil
Demo shout?
Gaining rage to spend
For self healing
I mean, I've yet to feel unsafe even with an aggressive healer...so 🤷
craggy pilot
when Seismic procs double Revenge, does it proc double healing from Indomitable?
craggy pilot
hmm odd, i feel unsafe all the time even with Reprisal+Aegis, in shit like bolstered DOS+19 first/second pull
potent anvil
So a lot of melees don't seem that bad
sick sentinel
so, now that i don't run bolster, i activate last stand to help with magic damage or damage over time situations primarily?
potent anvil
My trinkets are also gland+OPC that run lol
Dunno, maybe 22+ or something I'll play a bit turtle. But I only pug
craggy pilot
was wondering to try OPC as i rarely use Aegis at this point when im rotating Shield Wall well
sick sentinel
it feels really strange to me, i can get use to it, i don't press it as much now
potent anvil
DoS is a bit different, because there are mobs that put a disease stack, etc
So like... you need to know what packs hurt
And what you need to prepare for that
craggy pilot
but for melee heavy packs, you cant really prepare too much, as you have so limited Shield Block duration
only 12-18 seconds Shield Block pr pack or so
if only legendaries were cheaper, i would try it out
to force myself to be better at rotating Shield Wall and shit
sick sentinel
well, then you can heroic leap out and then use it to charge back in when you are stable
potent anvil
Like 40% crit, 35% parry...crit kinda owns against melees
craggy pilot
whats your ilvl?
potent anvil
252
craggy pilot
yeye u mean it owns against melee, because of critblock
oh wait no
thats mastery 😄
potent anvil
No because of parry
craggy pilot
stacking crit does more for DPS than Versa?
potent anvil
I've always went crit/haste unless it was BFA corruption season where vers was op. But like, a lot of tanking m+ is just knowledge of damage profiles and personal play.
Always has
sick sentinel
oh ty
usually i sim like patchwerk as it goes
and remove raid buffs
and then switch talents or wtv for m+, but simming single target xD
potent anvil
And the thing about crit, it's technically better than vers when it comes to dmg reduction regarding any attacks that can be parried. Afaik, but like it's a % chance vs vers being a flat % reduction.
craggy pilot
wait you said Gland, do you have a 252 Gland? 😮
potent anvil
Yes
craggy pilot
ah ye, i guess that is a bit less DPS than a 252 Phial, but it has the defensive potency as well 🤔
maybe something like Gland+OWS lol
double stat stick
sick sentinel
well i simmed
but if i go like that
i have way less haste,
30% to 20%
11% to 20% crit tho
i dont think i will go for the sim xD
ancient monolith
Do you guys know which legendary are the prot warriors on MDI using? Just curiou...
anyone?
sick sentinel
i think its possible to check
in mdi website or something like that
but i think it depends
craggy pilot
I think they used Elysian Might
sick sentinel
tehre are kyrian and nf ones
craggy pilot
Thats what i heard
high folio
when raid lead wont put you in our WF group
ocean yoke
i feel the pain ive been fighting for it too
feral drift
pick a helm
sweet summit
ya that was to the conversation just above your question lol
feral drift
lol thanks
mighty egret
pick a helm
dom socket
feral drift
supporting info too, i already have 3 link for blood
feral drift
So socket the frost shard that gives you a shield
Thanks
Gearing has me not able to make up my mind these days, im sure im not alone.
regal basin
lofty widget
super strong in m+
sick sentinel
routing seems easy, but it gives me headache
latent pier
Is ows+aegis the best m+ setup for challenging stuff?
I've been blowing up 15s with sack + phial for practice
urban portal
portentous unholy vs desolate blood for prot?
definitely the unholy shard if theres no dom socket
high folio
definitely the unholy shard if theres no dom socket
i meant complete set vs complete set
potent anvil
@craggy pilot This one's for you Mists+19, trying to break that 9k overall. Soon..
blazing condor
imma have to craft seismic
@potent anvil The extra revenge procs off BSC too right?
potent anvil
Yes
potent anvil
It's just the stat I prefer. I like Crit/Haste, but you can go Haste/Vers if you like.
potent anvil
blazing condor
also i feel like Siegebreaker would have value in the seismic build if you can play around it, no?
over barbs
potent anvil
I pick siegebreaker, yeah
potent anvil
vers, you're a bit squishier so it's pretty good
blazing condor
yeah good thats what i did 
fathom turtle
hey prot guys, would u take the 230 alchemy stone as trinket or prefere decanter of endless howling on 239?
strong forum
Is ows+aegis the best m+ setup for challenging stuff?
Aegis+matrix
orchid frigate
can i just say that i find it annoying when dps start blasting before youve rounded up a pull?
