need a lot of dam to time those keys
#protection
mellow bridge
mellow bridge
You mean the 10% stam bug?
bright flax
It just shows how even tanks are and how community perception meta is a little bust
mellow bridge
tbf his group is absolutely insane
idk how they have the dmg to time those keys considering their pulls are really nothing special
mellow bridge
And also abusing a bug
and idk
when have top m+ players not been abusing bugs
kekw
strong forum
Sure it's still impressive
But he's like the lone group abusing being 10% tankier
Their damage is bonkers tho yes
mellow bridge
i guess
but it's not like other groups dont abuse bugs either
saw plenty of new toy abusing in SD last week from other groups for example 🤷♂️
strong forum
Isnt that fixed
For like
Months
Any who
The group from rare also slaps, on logs their dps players do fucking 16k overalls in halls
strong forum
Cringe
woven bear
@mellow bridge whats the bug you are talking about
mellow bridge
which one
soft loom
if you're kyrian do you switch to acendent phial this week to make it easier?
plush tendon
But then you dont have Owl Bro... which is like 50% of the reason you are Kyrian XD
plush tendon
if you're kyrian do you switch to acendent phial this week to make it easier?
The answer is a maybe; you do lose damage by going Kleia over Milk. For most keys you wont need the immunity and losing out on the Milk damage would be 😦
But obviously case by case basis
jagged pier
if you're kyrian do you switch to acendent phial this week to make it easier?
I ran kelia in the first necro week of the expansion after that i realised u do not need it
cold zealot
I got a question for mythic eye or eye in generall becaus i cant find the information i am searching.
Deathlink does physical damage and then reflects the mitigated amount onto the raid.
Does absorbed damage count as mitigated? Implying that, if i absorb the whole hit no damage get reflected onto the raid?
bright flax
All the tooltip says is a portion of the damage you actually take, your raid will also take
In fairness, full IP there + demo shout translates in little dmg taken for the raid. Its just a matter of having a cd for every deathlink
The only point I struggle with it is when we enter p3 where I usually call for external and all gucci
cold zealot
so ip and for that matter all absorb will reduce the damage the raid takes
bright flax
Yes
cold zealot
Is it realistic to get Wall wit Wall legy to arround 70s cd
bright flax
Its literally the only boss fight where the wall has really good value for the SW cdr. But reprisal also means on demand IP even though you cant block much there
*on demand rage for IP, rather not mess up words sorry 
cold zealot
sure but 50%dr (wall) every other deathlinks sounds stronger to me, i can stack ip anyway by pooling rage
jagged pier
Is it realistic to get Wall wit Wall legy to arround 70s cd
If your running bolster its 90s if your running AM it should be 60s probably less nowadays
But for the eye u dont need it
It does like no damage
cold zealot
my healers were screaming at me for using too little mitigation in our tries so im trying to max it out now...
how much damage does it realisticly do without stacks and mitigation, just armor?
tribal yacht
save demo shout for deathlink
bright flax
without mitigation? that's how I kill my frens
plush tendon
If a Blood DK can do it, so can you 🙂
cold zealot
Demo should be up every deathlink i guess? since i comes out every 45s
bright flax
its not an insta gib, but its a slow painful death for them
tribal yacht
realistically if you full IP + demo you should be fine
if you're scared use LS
ur gonna want SW for the small adds if your downing the left side right side strat
and don't forget to spell reflect the huge AOE in that add phase
cold zealot
Oh man, now i am do fucking unsure how to play it. 😄
jagged pier
I dunno maybe ts your healers i pressed IP on the eye like 12 times last yime i killed it 😆
bright flax
its a case of yes, you can use the wall there but its not needed. IP + demo shout or SW is enough. The adds are more dangerous if you're not switching up and the dot starts to stack up and you get a 2nd gaze cast
also the pattern usually is double deathlink into beam into transition
assuming you go full ip + demo shout you can have SW for adds where you might need it more
tribal yacht
if you're on Eye and you're getting blasted, you should really start practice calling for externals because you're going to actually need them later in the raid
cold zealot
Hmm, im just trying to get it as smooth as possible so we can have a easy kill. I might be overthinking too much though,
Usually i rarely have issues with cds and calling externals but i guess i was just undutilizing ip the last time and my healers are too scared.
nevertheless, i want to know what to use when or at least have a rough plan for it so i dont get overwhelmed.
So its realistic to get 2 sets of deathlink p1 and 3 sets in p2 and p3?
bright flax
for me the eye opening (lol) there was discovering only the winged adds have blockable abilities. was a shit show before that
cold zealot
i nkow i can only block the lancers^^
short kiln
We still get full credit on IP despite the number of necrotic stacks or no?
plush tendon
no
bright flax
tribal yacht
first death link + second = full IP and Demo Each, First Add phase use SW at 2 stacks and use spell reflect on Every Titantic AOE thing from the boss, 3rd Deathlink = Full IP + Last stand and Demo, Second add Phase use SW at 2 stacks and use spell reflect on Every Titantic AOE, then come back and blast the boss
bright flax
its realistic to get 2 deathlinks every phase even
plush tendon
Necrotic reduces IP effectiveness
tribal yacht
you'll be fine
short kiln
Thanks Augusto
plush tendon
short kiln
I learned last night that scale is trash with stacks but aegis is still bomb.
jagged pier
Well yes 1 is and absorb and 1 is a damage reduction
plush tendon
Need to get me one on my war
This game hates me though
giving me useless things like 252 Overwhelming Power Crystal which I didnt take cause big haste crit booties
Though did screenshot it for our arms warriors 😛
bright flax
was about to say that
modern brook
i got 3x dom sockets from my keys, and a bad ring, and two dom socket pieces i already have from my raid
so i had a pretty good box tbh
plush tendon
It was a ok week for loot boxes.... though my paladin had to be taken out back
plush tendon
after 5 weeks of no upgrades for my 230 paladin
but now we got a new pet project
Septembro the Bear!
modern brook
zzz
I'd care less about all the bear alts if bear was even remotely interesting to play
bright flax
Personally, I would play bear more often if it wasnt "meta" rn
Idk, I get a bigger kick out of playing the underdogs
Doesnt mean its smart. League annie jungle comes to mind why it isnt
modern brook
How could I not play him
modern brook
Idk, I get a bigger kick out of playing the underdogs
i vibe with that
But i dont even mind that bear is meta
Just that its literally just a numbers thing
modern brook
you could replace bear form with a microsoft .xlsx
blazing condor
bear is just no reason to pick
plush tendon
I play War and DK right now
modern brook
and it would be the exact same thing
plush tendon
Only way I get could more underdog is by playing some Brew, but that requires leveling
ToP is Prot War heaven
same with Mists
Watching MDI early last weekend was fun when you saw the different approaches: some people running the spellcleave comp with a VDH and then on the otherside you had the melee cleave group with a Prot War
modern brook
p sure thats an <@&257983573498265600> moment
fierce juniper
$pb @sick sentinel spam
stray wedge
$pb 781179113032384552 marok why
true pawnBOT
Done.
User is already banned, but I will now attempt to purge messages left behind from the user
If you are trying to escalate the ban to permanent you will need to use the command "ban" instead.
Done.
fierce juniper
2slow
modern brook
thank you :^)
blazing condor
new bullfango profile pic just dropped 
modern brook
Larry Greenman saves the day
modern brook
new bullfango profile pic just dropped <:peepoHappy:673436349805625364>
just updated the bias is all
nothing new
oblique garnet
@fierce juniper Private Marok arent you supposed to be on duty
fierce juniper
nah im off today
blazing condor
the bunny is gone 🦀
fierce juniper
oblique garnet
are you actually still a private?
fierce juniper
nah im a specialist now 
modern brook
nah im a specialist now <:EZ:540034827685068800>
u were always special
fierce juniper
bright flax
Specialist, special elitist? 
marsh aurora
are we going blood for damage purposes or survivability ?
jagged pier
GIVE HELM @craggy pilot
craggy pilot
i have 239 Dark Tormentor alrdy
jagged pier
are we going blood for damage purposes or survivability ?
No its top damage and 700 hps
craggy pilot
and i have 239 Glove also
bright flax
rip
craggy pilot
craggy pilot
Give dom helm
just go LFR 5head
real fossil
how do people decide when they use ravager vs when they use into the fray in m+?
craggy pilot
damn these tokens are even more useless
craggy pilot
how do people decide when they use ravager vs when they use into the fray in m+?
always use Ravager
not a hard choice tbh :<
ITF is for raid
modern brook
how do people decide when they use ravager vs when they use into the fray in m+?
If ravager is available you use it
Oh nvm I misread the question
I'm still right but
craggy pilot
hahahaha you thought he asked when to click it 😄
basically always use it on opener
and whenever it gets rdy after that
blazing condor
how do people decide when they use ravager vs when they use into the fray in m+?
well people who are knowledgable decide that once the extra 10% block uptime is gonna be crucial to surviving, they make the switch
aka when they reach 24+ keys
dumb people decide its time to go itf/hr when they see top players do it
craggy pilot
do you really need 10% more block uptime in high keys tho?
if you alrdy got HR to do 20% more block uptime?
blazing condor
its a very comfy build to play
but its just not worth it if youre not pushing those high keys
craggy pilot
did you base the 10% block uptime from ITF from something?
craggy pilot
yea saw a guy write 99% SB uptime the other day with Reprisal+HR
like he had similar uptime of SB and Battle Shout 😄
made me kinda wanna try HR for the ez of use
plush tendon
Another big point; if you use HR, you get less SW uses
plush tendon
Sort of gets brushed under the rug, but SW is very strong
and AM reduces that CD to something very managable
craggy pilot
anyone here actively do the Command Table?
real fossil
the timing with hr with ravager is all wonky too
AM makes avatar and ravager more in line
plush tendon
easily
jagged pier
Why have it line up ecery other play am and line it up for everytime
plush tendon
wow so smart
craggy pilot
Why have it line up ecery other play am and line it up for everytime
5head
steel mist
The trinket from tazavesh is nuts
obtuse monolith
Anybody use a cast sequence macro to put spear then Ravager on same keybind? Or a modifier key? I suppose I could change my execute keybind to put both on bar
steel mist
My DPS skyrocketed to the stratosphere
craggy pilot
Anybody use a cast sequence macro to put spear then Ravager on same keybind? Or ...
sounds like a bad habbit
analog swift
Anybody use a cast sequence macro to put spear then Ravager on same keybind? Or ...
you'd probably rather have avatar and spear macroed together btw
steel mist
Guys do you have any advice on mythic soulrender
analog swift
uhhhh demo shout when you first grab him and have blocks up
cuz you sitll have debuff
steel mist
Isn't that debuff supposed to be taunted off
analog swift
it overlaps for a few seconds
obtuse monolith
you'd probably rather have avatar and spear macroed together btw
I’ve got avatar on numpad1 for if I need it separate. On mainbar I have 1-8
SB Pummel Charge/Intervene/VRmacro SS Tclap Revenge Execute Spear in easy reach of left hand.
But I’ve also run Execute on numpad+ before so I can just move that there to get Ravager into 7 spot
analog swift
that works to but avatar and spear will be pretty close to synced up anyway and avatar is off the gcd
but whatever you prefer
sacred timber
how the heck am I supposed to play this week ;-;
sturdy sable
You run out at high stacks
modern brook
When u log in you just have to hit enter world on the char u wanna play
sacred timber
This seems like a week to level alts
ancient reef
whats fastest way to gearup now
craggy pilot
tank alrdy the role that requires the most
now you gotta do Sanguine+Necrotic in same week 😄
while dps just zugzug
strong forum
whats fastest way to gearup now
Getting boosted, and or spamming m+
craggy pilot
Getting boosted, and or spamming m+
paying for boost 😄
ancient reef
boosted as in pvp rating
craggy pilot
my guildmate paid for HC Taza boost, and still did less than my dmg as warlock
nice boost brother
craggy pilot
boosted as in pvp rating
buy Tazavesh Hardmode boost if you want gear
ancient reef
ty
ancient reef
just made a horde toon been alliance all expac
jagged pier
utter trash
plush tendon
buy Tazavesh Hardmode boost if you want gear
this exists??? Could I buy a Taz carry but ask for trinket trade?
blazing condor
big arms neck 
blazing condor
obtuse monolith
Scales blood link. Pog
craggy pilot
this exists??? Could I buy a Taz carry but ask for trinket trade?
just heard my guildie bought it
sacred timber
literally an easy week
As a new tank, I genuinely don't know how to get around necrotic, especially as a class that blocks a shit ton of it's dmg
blazing condor
if youre kyrian you can play Kleia for the immunity + phial is great
plush tendon
As a new tank, I genuinely don't know how to get around necrotic, especially as ...
I mean, you CC and walk away
or use phial if you cant do that if Kyrian
sacred timber
and then when I cc, they heal in sanguine
plush tendon
then kite earlier
plush tendon
theres no reason you cant get to like 16 stacks, packs at half health, dip out and get a reset
and using hard CC as things are dying is a misplay; youll need to think ahead to get reset on adds without having CC mobs heal
sacred timber
So basically shield block is useless this week
plush tendon
no? SB is incredibly strong
blazing condor
it wont save you from necrotic
but we're like the best tank to handle necrotic
because we mitigate instead of rely on self-heal
so we can take a million stacks without it insta-killing us
sacred timber
Ight so shockwave and intervene away
blazing condor
you can leap as well
or spear
unless shit is dyin
if you play with a druid tell him to tree late into packs
can help if needed
blazing condor
tru
plush tendon
Many Prot Warriors are
plush tendon
So AA also good and Soul Shape away
sacred timber
DoS is gonna suck this week aint it
plush tendon
Not really
sacred timber
Urns tho
plush tendon
Yea, but do things die in the urns that often for you?
blazing condor
its fortified as well
plush tendon
also, there is group utility like typhonn, ring, grip, etc.
plush tendon
or the key is so small things just fall over
The place where necrotic is a issue is Ardenweald, but there is so much space to kite and we already run away after blowing our load in there
other then that, it aint bad
worst key with necrotic is probably NW or SD
modern brook
How late are people activating urns that sanguine is a concern this big
Did a youtuber mention it or something?
dark lark
For P3 Mythic Painsmith, can prot warriors safely leap over the balls? I have to admit I've never tried leaping over during heroic
dark lark
How many ball walls will I realistically have to cross?
grave crane
I tried leaping over during normal and died so idk if it’s just iffy or I did something wrong
elfin nova
@sweet summit how much do i upgrade my jaithys
elfin nova
📈
strong forum
ez choice or
balmy coral
So I crafted the wall for Heroic Guardian so we can do a single group soak strat. Anyone else do this?
strong forum
seems like a waste?
modern brook
I think most people just stand in the soak tbh
plush tendon
Do people not do the immunity strat?
strong forum
immunities also just work ye
sweet summit
not on hc i think
plush tendon
I mean we do; granted thats what we did week 1
sweet summit
fair
plush tendon
and im not about changing strats during reclear
strong forum
guardian is like a 1 or 2 pull boss
strong forum
i want my raiders to have a brain so they can think for themselves
but thats too much to ask for
modern brook
I was doing a pug the other day and some many people just make stuff up
Like if you just use your eyes
modern brook
Instead of pretending the lines don't exist
dark lark
i want my raiders to have a brain so they can think for themselves
Just join a world first guild 4Head
plush tendon
Cause their thoughts are more often then not wrong
lament oracle
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/eu/ysondre/krâav anyone got tips?
should I get more haste?
dusky mica
Getting duplicate items from the vault feels omega bad. Don't know why I bother.
strong forum
and the rest is just, get more ilvl
lament oracle
also what should i replace my decanter with?
strong forum
generally 😄
mighty valley
what else do you have?
scarlet sparrow
guys, what is better to take? the worst trinket ever just to have a high level item (for trading trinkets to others if i have to) or a weapon a little bit higher than mine but with worst stats?
mighty valley
also looks like you could get a lotta points for doing literally any theater of pain
lament oracle
I got a big problem aswell
r we supposed to play the conduit that uses phial by itels?
tself?
cos it feels so bad w necrotic
lament oracle
but
scarlet sparrow
pick the research
XD
lament oracle
I loose a potency
dusky mica
switch to the other bind for necrotic week, kleia
strong forum
or that
dusky mica
saves you changing anything
strong forum
if you have trouble with necrotic, play kleia on right, middle left path
strong forum
and on the last row
just play the tree thats pinned
lament oracle
or tjhe shield
dusky mica
goggles
strong forum
with the goggles you get condensed anima sphere, and that thing is better than the shield
modern brook
It's literally harder to swap soulbinds than it is to click the other parh
Oh no we lose show of force
[Picture of man not caring]
tame jasper
Can anybody post me a cancel bop macro?
modern brook
/cancelaura blessing of protection
sweet summit
speed demon
modern brook
I'm on my phone
distant crystal
/cancelaura Blessing of Protection
modern brook
No need for accuracy
tame jasper
thanks @modern brook
distant crystal
(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
strong forum
┬─┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ)
modern brook
(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
🖕 🤪 🖕
strong forum
Damn this new bullfango is crazy
distant crystal
he's a menace
sweet summit
love it
strong forum
real thunder
hey, i was watching a stream and the tank had an addon that appeared to put a dashed line border around the cast bar of mobs when they were targeting him with their casted spells...at least that is what it looked like. anyone know what that is?
strong forum
Probably some fancy plater script
real thunder
k thx
urban portal
balmy coral
guardian is like a 1 or 2 pull boss
Yea so my guildies are super casual, most parse mid grey at best we despite 2 shorting painsmith we wipe a ton on soulrender still and guardian. Anything that is a DPS check we fail hard. In fact I've been 5th in DPS on guardian several times. People are stacking and die on the soak.
modern brook
whats mid grey?
strong forum
prolly like 10-15?
strong forum
modern brook
how bigs the group
dusky canopy
I feel like we could literally only push shield slam on cooldown and parse higher than grey lol
cyan onyx
Is true.
mighty valley
Yea so my guildies are super casual, most parse mid grey at best we despite 2 sh...
what's your stacking strat? is telling people to stand on a point too complicated?
blazing condor
Why cant people just be good at the game like damn
How you spend 30 hours a week playing it and still be ass
balmy coral
what's your stacking strat? is telling people to stand on a point too complicate...
We tell people to stack on 2 marks but people stay too far spread still
mighty valley
That's wild that they all got through painsmith fine but the "stand still and dps" boss is fucking with them
modern brook
We tell people to stack on 2 marks but people stay too far spread still
i mean
they're not stacking then lol
The Wall isnt going to help that
balmy coral
The Wall isnt going to help that
Right now we soak every other because shield wall I can soak myself. With the wall I can soak all of them Myself.
echo vector
hey im new to prot warrior and trying to decide a covanent. i really just want to do mythic plus and raid here and there for some gear is there a covenant i should be leaning towards?
plush tendon
Kyrian or NF
modern brook
What you like > what your group needs > kyrian = nf
lime urchin
Necrolord! Because coolest sanctum.
echo vector
im planning on running pugs cause my friends are taking a break
modern brook
just go kyrian or nf then
Necro if you really cant stand either
IF you intend on playing a DPS spec go whatever their best is
our cov really doesnt matter too much
plush tendon
IF you intend on playing a DPS spec go whatever their best is
its like a 1% difference between kyrian and nf for DPS wars
it really is whatever you prefer
modern brook
doent fury like venthyr?
or something
IDK
I only know fury stuff cause @sweet summit plays it and i learn through osmosis
sweet summit
fury likes venthyr in raid yeah
modern brook
Yeah see im a genius
plush tendon
why play fury in raid when arms spec is just a click away?
sweet summit
i play arms 😔
modern brook
T-T
strong forum
erga is playing a good spec for once
because fury sucks so much ass on sylv that hes forced into my arms
rancid ember
blazing condor
Prot day 
mellow bridge
prot day :peepoBlush:
sweet summit
Prot day
subtle iron
Prot day
mellow bridge
lament oracle
yo
into the fray or ravager in m+?
:peepoBlush: :peepoBlush: :peepoBlush: :peepoBlush: :peepoBlush:
strong forum
into the fray or ravager in m+?
Ravager
lament oracle
but I dont like ravager 😦
strong forum
How can you not like ravager
lament oracle
it feels unsafe
lament oracle
heavy repercussions or AM ?
modern brook
Dman this guy doesn't love ravager on prot day
brave jetty
Ravager is kinda sick at times, lots of useful little moments where it's nice to have a tool you wouldn't otherwise have
sick sentinel
i can specifically remember having alot more fun with necrotic, bfa, than i am in shadowlands
pastel sleet
just started logging dungeons a few days ago to be able to look at stuff after... why are logs numbers so much lower than details?
strong forum
Log counts the entire dungeon as 1 encounter, even the downtime is included
pastel sleet
ahhh
strong forum
And logs don't count overkill into dps
Details only counts combat, and it includes overkill
pastel sleet
thank you
plush tendon
What do you think they could do for Venthyr Prot to make it better?
Just sort of a thought question.
pastel sleet
also throwing this out there. avatar/booming voice/spear/ravager lineup feels nice.
plush tendon
also throwing this out there. avatar/booming voice/spear/ravager lineup feels ni...
yea... but Best Served Cold though
solemn current
hear me out... elysian might
It's only crit damage so unless you're running first strike at NF you're probably not getting a ton of value out of it.
strong forum
And you can't run it as NF
strong forum
So, yeah
strong forum
EM isn't exactly good value for prot
solemn current
And you can't run it as NF
Well shit ain't that some logic. So yea no value.
plush tendon
they did run it in MDI
strong forum
Seismic reverb will do alot more dmg over the course of a key
plush tendon
not sure why, just observation
plush tendon
yea, I have no clue
strong forum
They prolly didn't... Know? About seismic
plush tendon
Seems unlikely
strong forum
Idk
plush tendon
what a mystery
ionic fern
strong forum
@lepan why u no run seismic
blazing condor
Le pan is french bread
strong forum
I could imagine that NF and EM are maybe better because their pulls are so short lived
pastel sleet
aight so if not running reprisal. (to run siesmic) do you take bolster for sb uptime.
strong forum
That it gains value because of everything just blowing up
Bolster if not reprisal, yes
Or AM if you're big dick
pastel sleet
how much more dam is ravager over itf
strong forum
It's not just damage
Like 100 dps in m+
But it's also 60 rage on 45sec CD
And alot of threat
pastel sleet
i remember last season, last stand rage buff into ravager into revengespam with siesmic reverb was fun
strong forum
Still is
solemn current
i remember last season, last stand rage buff into ravager into revengespam with ...
Still exists. Only you don't need Siesmic Reverb and you can just take Best Served Cold with Reprisal for maximum Revenge spam.
pastel sleet
wouldnt siesmic be a buff to revenge spam over reprisal though
pastel trellis
you think it will make impending victory viable in m+?
cinder nova
No.
blazing condor
Probably not
cinder nova
You're giving up Idom
blazing condor
I liked IV in bfa tho
cinder nova
That's 10% HP + legion legendary bracers
blazing condor
It feels good to uae
pastel sleet
if prot war is at 60 percent health every 25 seconds. bad prot warrior
solemn current
You'd lose defensive value where as Best Served Cold will take advantage of the extra Revenge procs from Reprisal while giving you the most survivability. It also doesn't rely on 3 targets to get value.
pastel trellis
depends, some packs in dos (especially on fort) and some kick fuck ups, its gonna burn my arsehole lul
cinder nova
It's really not worth it.
pastel sleet
that being said impending victory on arms is friggin great and for the not 1% of the community they should be running it
pastel trellis
yeah but indom is very strong, since they reworked and put in the legion bracers leggo in
cinder nova
Like if you wanna run 23s with a dogshit talent that's your choice
But we're all telling you it's not worth it
pastel trellis
just discussing it
cinder nova
Right, but you're discussing building around poor play
novel lotus
Pugging this week 🙃
cinder nova
Which is just fundamentally not a good idea
pastel sleet
S. you are being mean
pastel trellis
wouldnt say so
strong forum
Not from my perspective
But stormbolt grants much better use in m+
And doubletime a bit more dmg
So even for arms its in a tough spot
pastel sleet
for sure. if the arms is using stormbolt effectively / and or charge weaving. they are better picks. but if they arent using stormbolt/charge weaving. then iv is mega heals over a raid or dungeon encounter
cinder nova
wouldnt say so
With that logic we should all be running heart.
strong forum
It has potential, but it's just awkward
It's a better button now
But awkward
Arms is already one of the tankiest dps in the game
pastel sleet
all my points are for arms not prot though. prot reactive healing makes me clinch my ass
cinder nova
It's not really rocket science to understand that playing under the assumption of poor mechanical execution is just going to be a mad sink
cinder nova
☝️
pastel sleet
playing around failure will get you to 15s. and if you play with friends and your friends suck. then sacrifices have to be made
cinder nova
You're wasting your time if you're doing any measure of mental gymnastics to try and justify IV in all but perhaps the most corner of cases in extremely high keys, which is basically out of the realm of common knowledge.
strong forum
Moreso
IV has its most potential in raid
Because everything is perfectly scripted
However, in raid you have 4-5 healers and externals out of your ass
So it's quite pepega
cinder nova
playing around failure will get you to 15s. and if you play with friends and you...
Playing dookie keys with dookie people using dookie talents is a deliberate choice. If you wanna do all that or a mix of the three that's your call, but it doesn't make IV suddenly worth taking.
The point is that if you come on here and ask "Is X viable now?" and the answer is a pretty resounding "No"
Then the steps go to "but muh 15s"
Like ???
severe temple
Impossible to tank low keys with alts this week
cinder nova
I mean - unless you're a bear 
severe temple
Yeah true
mighty valley
undergeared bears gotta play entirely around incarn this week... everyone else just has a clock to build threat then flee
cinder nova
kek
severe temple
People won't let us get threat before 18s
cinder nova
Just open Rav, Charge, Revenge
Stand there for like a good 6s just mashing revenge as block ticks off then leap
pastel sleet
id like to clarifty. that if you read the things ive said. i agree IV is bad for prot warrior.
was simply making the point that it has a niche case. and the niche case is your friend "greg" sucks at healing.
cinder nova
ez
novel lotus
I tried to pull that double at the start of a 19 SoA and before I could even get back to the pillar a hunter was dropping wild spirits and lighting stuff up no MD btw
mighty valley
just don't pug, simply have a large group of competent friends, easy
cinder nova
Bro if he sucks bad enough that you're considering IV then you're probably not timing that key anyway
severe temple
But when I tried tanking on my paladin and monk alts
I couldn't get threat before having to kite
As warr it was definetely easier
cinder nova
I tried to pull that double at the start of a 19 SoA and before I could even get...
Why not just triple pull and sit where G2 is? 🤔 You have you and a hunter, and presumably another kick be it caster or melee, which is enough for goliath.
That way you're not trying to LOS.
novel lotus
That is fair, even so there wasn't a lot of interrupting happening anyway - it was a clown fiesta lol
cinder nova
Sounds about right.
severe temple
Not pugging as tank this week
Tried as hard as I could but it was just a painful experience
cinder nova
My big rage-inducer is waiting for a hunter to tranq the champion/mender weapon buff.
novel lotus
Half of them dont even know they can
cinder nova
Holy fuck does that make my blood pressure skyrocket.
If my irl rage translated to in-game rage I'd be so overcapped.
It not only takes A LOT of damage off, it also gives us a lot of damage.
I can suck up people kicking my SR, it's annoying, but I'd rather people be eager to kick than too lazy to.
modern brook
My big rage-inducer is waiting for a hunter to tranq the champion/mender weapon ...
It wouldn't surprise me if you were literally the only person in the world who knows that tranq shot purges a magic effect
cinder nova
I fucking hate hunters so much.
modern brook
Lmao
novel lotus
Biggest thing on my wishlist is stable ping between US and OCE realms lol majority of my friends are OCE and it always feels bad when we try to push and someone is lagging 🙃
cinder nova
Just people in general that don't read their tooltips.
I've had to tell so many warriors to leap > taunt because they didn't know it reset the CD.
cinder nova
Biggest thing on my wishlist is stable ping between US and OCE realms lol majori...
I had a resto druid like 2 weeks back that was in a place controlled by Hezbollah - had 300+ ping and he still was one of the best healers I've had in a while.
blazing condor
tbf i dont think that was on the tooltip until recently
cinder nova
I was in awe.
cinder nova
It's been on the tooltip at least since Legion.
modern brook
Lmao really
cinder nova
Yeah.
blazing condor
well i started in cata so i don tneed to read
modern brook
Smh
blazing condor
modern brook
Hunters :pepelaugh:
mighty valley
people don't learn by reading a tooltip and then thinking "ah yes. i have absorbed all of this information now"
cinder nova
Legion Patch 7.0.3 (2016-07-19): Now also resets the cooldown of [Taunt] when used by Protection warriors.
cinder nova
I'll kill you.
novel lotus
Super crazy thinking about people starting the game more and more recently when I used to get called a Wrath baby lol
mighty valley
i've watched smart people in game design labs read new tooltips for the first time, then when asked what the abilities do later, they say extremely random shit
modern brook
I mean
I get it's hard to convey exact xoncepts
But like
It's been 6 years almost
cinder nova
I guess I just aggressively internalize tooltips and ability entries since I play a boatload of TTRPGs and just memorized tons of class abilities and feats through exposure.
modern brook
And hunters still don't know they have a purge
blazing condor
purge these nuts lol
modern brook
And it's not like purges are a uniquely [class] thing
cinder nova
You know my favorite?
Clearing Tarragrue trash and waiting for the hunter, demon hunter, priest, or shaman to dispel the DR buff on the casters.
While we beat our dicks on it for 3 damage a GCD.
It's so choice.
Can DK still purge or did they take that off of IT?
mighty valley
ilvl
cinder nova
Top one.
cinder nova
Yeah, we like haste, but it's not so far ahead that it outpaces STR/armor/stam
unique shale
no more permal bl warrior sadage
cinder nova
Our secondaries are actually really, really close together.
blazing condor
more stats > right stats
strong forum
Can DK still purge or did they take that off of IT?
Bloodelf dks can
blazing condor
novel lotus
Shoot for 90% crit
unique shale
Shoot for 90% crit <:peepoHappy:673436349805625364>
its easy just get a Elysian Might
cinder nova
Bloodelf dks can
??? Can they? Is it a belf racial? Does torrent dispel???
I haven't played Horde since Siege of Drizzle
solemn current
??? Can they? Is it a belf racial? Does torrent dispel???
AoE purge
cinder nova
That's actually pretty choice. Does it still kick?
strong forum
??? Can they? Is it a belf racial? Does torrent dispel???
It's an aoe purge since bfa
No it doesn't silence
cinder nova
Damn, I liked the kick.
strong forum
It was too OP, it was changed to purge because the silence was abused too hard in legion m+
cinder nova
Kek
novel lotus
The amount of belfs I play with that wont use their racial and probably just chose belf because google said best for m+
cinder nova
The amount of belfs I play with that wont use their racial and probably just ch...
Do people seriously never use racials? I play Worgen and SPAM Darkflight almost on CD.
It's nice for kiting and recharges.
strong forum
Alot of people don't use their racials
cinder nova
holyfuck
strong forum
You ever see a tauren use their warstomp or their bullrush?
cinder nova
I need to go walk around, you guys are killing my faith in the average player's intelligence.
modern brook
The amount of belfs I play with that wont use their racial and probably just ch...
Obviously it's for the crit 😏
cinder nova
Orc or maghar?
novel lotus
Anytime I intervene and someone is less than full I press vulpera grenade, same for the stack on KT....occasionally I use it just to do a lil damage from range 🤷
modern brook
Orc racial doesn't make them take more damage anymore
strong forum
No but 50% less healing taken
novel lotus
The mileage I get out of bullrush and warstomp is pretty high as well
solemn current
I need to go walk around, you guys are killing my faith in the average player's ...
Considering the last warrior pug I had tanking had 12% uptime on Shield Block in a 19 Halls despite 2300 IO I'm not sure where you thought intelligence was on the table to begin with.
modern brook
No but 50% less healing taken
I'm pretty sure it doesn't:(
novel lotus
Bullrush is actually sick with reprisal too because it usually puts you far enough out of range to charge back in 👏
modern brook
I dont have my spell book in front of me
but if Orc racial was a 50% mortal wounds effect
Orc would suck shit in pvp
and thats very much not the case
strong forum
Oh they changed it
strong forum
U used to take less healing
modern brook
yah in like 1993
strong forum
When using your racial
novel lotus
yah in like 1993
lmfao
modern brook
maderatur :^)
modern brook
😏
novel lotus
Honestly I'm big tired of horde
modern brook
LOL
modern brook
Honestly I'm big tired of horde
I actually really like a lot of alliance races
thats my big secret
but tis fucking september
and those bumbling idiots still wont let me pug mythic
so
fuck allies
novel lotus
lololol
median tulip
I play Mag'har. Racial more or less on Cooldown
novel lotus
I'm telling you, open up free xfers for a week and see where the playerbase shifts
median tulip
Unless it's a few seconds from lining up with Avatar
strong forum
And my god, its bad
hearty terrace
Compard to other tanks what’s our dps like in keys an raid ?
modern brook
lower
hearty terrace
I take it we’re close to middle ?
median tulip
It's just fire and forget
modern brook
Is it?
strong forum
Yes
modern brook
Yeah but they pump on aoe
strong forum
Not rly
modern brook
smh
modern brook
OH right hthey fucked Decree on them right?
novel lotus
BDK presses swarming mist and slowly clips under the floor of the dungeon
modern brook
lmao
strong forum
For raid its
Pally>monk/guardian>bdk/pwar>vdh
novel lotus
Goodbye frenz
novel lotus
Having done everything but pally tank I gotta say Monk is super satisfying to me, as is bdk
buuuuut I've mained pwar since wotlk so I always gravitate back here
fierce juniper
For raid its
Pally>monk/guardian>bdk/pwar>vdh
wrong, for everything its pwar>everything else
paper garden
I dunno about Monk... I myself do not enjoy it, it's also possible I'm just not "good" with the monk, I haven't invested a whole lot of time into it though.
strong forum
wrong, for everything its pwar>everything else
Truu
strong forum
Monk died for me when I tried to play a dungeon with it in legion after I level boosted it
It has left me scarred
obtuse monolith
SL brew feels better to me than BFA. But yeah I still don’t play mine
strong forum
I couldn't manage to even reach first boss before I quit the dungeon and never logged on to it again
novel lotus
I cant even get a pally to cap 🙃
paper garden
I can get through 15s M+ on the monk without too much difficulty, but I struggle to have decent DPS on single targets (bosses), and I don't find it as much fun as my prot warrior.
novel lotus
Though playing a paladin sounds a lot like the Berserk 16/17 sound effects lol
obtuse monolith
I took the time to get each class to 60 before I figured out what I wanted to play. BDK was actually the one I finished story on before shortcutting the rest. Then brew. Still went war.
novel lotus
I have the opposite issue Constantine on trash my warrior is beeg but on single target I feel 🚽
mighty valley
the thing that always keeps me from monk is having to keep up rushing jade wind or whatever it's called
really frequent upkeep + no satisfaction + makes my character look stinky
paper garden
on single target with warrior I'm usually pulling between 3.0-3.5 K dps - depends on how... erm... Motivated I am.
that's on single target.
novel lotus
I was just thinking about that yesterday - like you have to keep it up, and its talented....its just like...you press it, its not fun or interesting
paper garden
on AOE... some DPS hate me.
mighty valley
they should buff everything else on that row just so it's not the right choice
plz
novel lotus
to be fair, sometimes rjw is just something to press so you have something to press - otherwise you'd be waiting on kegsmash anyway
tiger palm is poopy
paper garden
if tiger palm did more damage, like.... 25% more, I think it would be better for single target, plus the cooldown reduction on brews from it is nice.
novel lotus
MonkaS
paper garden
wait what? now? is that a new update?
mighty valley
some talents, mostly nice QoL stuff
hard to imagine this will compete with indomitable but it's pretty nice in some places
novel lotus
BFA Prot Talents were the perfect storm of deliciousness
modern brook
Honestly impending victory at 40% heal seems playable
distant crystal
yo this gateway control shard
is sick
no more focus @mouseover + interact with mouseover to properly use a lock gate
just buy the shard, put it on your bars, press it when you're near a gateway
mighty valley
it's cool, in the past i definitely just refused to rely on gateways in life or death situations lol
though they made them near mandatory recently
arctic bridge
Honestly impending victory at 40% heal seems playable
Would that affect the healing conduit linked to Victory rush at all?
modern brook
Iunno
Probably. I doubt its worth it since indom still exists and is pullibng the weight of 2 talents
But iv has been sleeper good for a while
craggy pilot
wait how do i get the reward for doing Flawless Torghast? 🤔
mellow bridge
modern brook
rip arms
mellow bridge
Does this mean that ravager is gonna deal less dmg than before when hitting 6-8 targets?
modern brook
6 and 13
modern brook
yeah its an absurd nerf to anything preivously capped at 8 tbh
i expect them to either update cap before sqrt scaling goes in or to buff the damage to compensate
cause if they thinkt his is going to do anything besides make people play uncapped range more they're nuts.
mighty cairn
hi guys, my guild master told me
the 2 most popular m+ tanks are guardian and VDH
the 2 most popular raid tanks are blood and brew
the most popular tank overall is prot pal
so is there something prot warrior is good at that i can tell him or he'll make me reroll 😦
mighty valley
are you pushing top keys? in the race for world first? if no, play what you like
pine lotus
Prot saw a lot of play in mdi
primal cape
leave the guild
safe thistle
hmmm any tips for the eye and the nine tanking we did kill both but i get destroyed on the eye, seems maybe healer stop healing me while dot at 10 stacks fade away. and the nine is it a lot of magic dmg ?
first kill not used to it but if someone could help me out on this https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/r8Zpxw1RXzJDknhf/#fight=last&type=damage-taken&source=6
brave jetty
leave the guild
Seconded. That guild lead sounds like a nuclear-grade tool.
unreal sequoia
Hey guys I'm making the transition to tank for raid and not just m+. I have rank 5 unholy set, and a rank 3 blood set. Should I stick with unholy for a bit? Or is blood strait up better for raid
frosty ridge
hi guys, my guild master told me
the 2 most popular m+ tanks are guardian and VD...
if you already have a war/dh/monk, you could play any tank. war is pretty good
brave jetty
That said, there are plenty of standout features of the spec that have nothing to do with popularity. Mobility, mitigation, spell reflect, one of the better raid CDs in rally, battle shout. Prot is seeing play in MDI and saw play in RTWF - if anyone thinks they're not playable because they're not the most popular they're hopelessly deluded.
sick sentinel
Warrior, Impending Victory (Talent) cooldown reduced to 25 seconds (was 30 seconds) and now heals for 40% of your max health (was 30%).
still bad, is one of first things this discord told me when i joined
mellow bridge
@mighty cairn your gm sounds retarded
If he's actually forcing you to reroll, just leave
Like wth
frosty ridge
yea.. I'm wondering, what's their progress? sounds like they're still progressing
sick sentinel
i saw a ton of VDH go splat in mdi the other night
on key in plague fall and it was about as bad as my pf keys
mighty valley
Twitter
ok this is good to know... gonna be weird if some spells fall off after 5, others after 8, etc
uneven dagger
hi guys, my guild master told me
the 2 most popular m+ tanks are guardian and VD...
I mean is he wrong tho?
mellow bridge
https://twitter.com/WarcraftDevs/status/1435745425034645505?s=20
Thank god
That makes it so much better
mellow bridge
I mean is he wrong tho?
Yes he is
Popularity has nothing to do with usefulness
And I can almost guarantee that they don't play at a level where a small difference in performance would matter
Even ignoring the fact that prot was good enough to see play in the top 10 for SoD and won the race in Nathria
Not sure how M+ performance or popularity is any relevant to a guild master either
safe thistle
its better to play a tank well but aint fotm than playing the fotm and not knowing what you do......
mellow bridge
And why that would influence his choice
Even if prot was bad in m+, which it really isn't, how would that be relevant for a raid guild
The GM is just very.... Dumb
safe thistle
me i rerolled warrior cause we had no bshout or rallying cry aka no war at all depend of the reason
mighty valley
if that GM isn't playing a boomkin, they should kick themselves
uneven dagger
I was in a pug with App once and I think the GM was a survival hunter
nocturne sage
Is the conduit energy refresh already live?
mellow bridge
I think so
gloomy cradle
It is
obtuse prism
My 2c to the reroll thing as similar happened to me (asked to go from tank to dps in 9.0) - if you like the people you play with and if you have friends there and if you want to keep playing with the guild, aaaand if you are ok with the reroll then go for it. Otherwise add friends to friendlist, tell the gm no (and leave/get kicked) and live your life in the way you want to not how someone tells you
lament gulch
Is it best to run kleia this week as kyrian for keys?
lavish oracle
Anyone know what average rage per minute looks like?
Trying to gauge indomitable hps vs the buff IV
Even if the hps is comparable I think it's still bad because of the potential overhealing
lament gulch
if this helps my indomitable heals for about 18% of my overall healing in a key
lavish oracle
Yeah, it's like 20-30% of mine usually
Hard to tell exactly what that looks like from a raw hps standpoint, though
lavish oracle
I'll have to take a look at logs when I get home
obtuse prism
I think if you look carefully you can even see how much does indomitable heal/overheal in various ohases - so no need for calculating stuff yourself, just reading from logs
maiden ravine
fierce relic
233 OWS or 252 Shard?
cyan onyx
I tanked my first necrotic!
Gratz dude :) good shit
flat coral
Did they hotfix the Codex pulling through the Walls in Mists? Just tried it on a key and it would not work at all. Then went into a normal Mists to be able to just stand there and get hit and it still wouldn't work. To be clear, I'm targeting a mob through the wall that has spawned, while getting hit by other mobs (and taking damage) with the Codex proc active. I can see it (the codex) is doing damage, but it isn't pulling my target it seems.
sacred timber
this man literally didnt fucking heal....
I feel like there were only 2 or three places that I hit over 20 stacks
there were packs that I was at less than 4 stacks and he would have less than 1k hps????
nocturne sage
Is anyone having a weird bug on guardian where you taunt or co tank taunts but you get 2 stacks of sunder and don't die?
mighty valley
there were packs that I was at less than 4 stacks and he would have less than 1k...
If no one was dying, healer did their job
sacred timber
If no one was dying, healer did their job
no
everyone was dying
so the healer failed
sacred timber
Also that group didnt have shit all for cc
so I could get really far away and shit could catch up to me
mighty valley
If you've got room to move you shouldn't need much
drowsy venture
quick question on necrotic affix how much can u take before u must start kiting ?
jagged pier
If playing correctly 50-70 depending on defensives and trinkets etc
plush tendon
Doesnt necrotic cap out at 50?
plush tendon
Key level matters
drowsy venture
15
plush tendon
I’d say for a average player, look to kite at around 20
drowsy venture
gotcha
jagged pier
Doesnt necrotic cap out at 50?
Nope
plush tendon
Hmmm, still wouldn’t go above like 30 for most people IMO
That’s already 60% healing reduction
jagged pier
Well getting more comfortable going higher it makes necrotic affix a joke
Like with ageis and phial
U can cheese so much
plush tendon
For sure, I just know that this week is especially stressful for a lot of newer or inexperienced tanks
brave jetty
50-70 is waytoo high lol
brave jetty
i'm preparing to kite around 20 or so, and outta there around 25-30
plush tendon
AA more my speed and I like my lion soul shape 🦁
brave jetty
it also kinda depends on the pull sometimes
smaller pulls or pulls with casters that aren't just dumping stacks on you nonstop aren't gonna be treated the same as like a double pull of geists or cats or something
drowsy venture
do u need other classes to help slow while u kite btw?
warrior dont seem to have any kiting ability other than 1 leap lol
intervene not rly reliable
jagged pier
Tc slows u can just walk away, take Cracking thunder if u want more slow
blazing condor
Ct makes kiting uber easy
brave jetty
you can just shockwave and straight up walk away
otherwise leaps and intervene are usually enough
and ofc spear if you're kyrian
is as good as anything
this week is such dogshit, i can't stand it
i told my group twice before the key starts, and twice before the double obliterator pull in HoA, to not let them freecast bolts on me while i'm kiting and can't interrupt
so naturally I take 4 in about 4 seconds with my entire group save 1 having their interrupts up
brave jetty
It is though
Because normally I'm not having to kite
and can address interrupts personally
blazing condor
ok then you wouldve had 3 bolts on you
but i get what you mean
just buy better groupies
brave jetty
drowsy venture
wow its rly hard to kite i mean even after using shockwave, leap and intervene
mobs still had like half hp