protection

[sterile rapids]

And you can split the tree to basically work for both a DPS spec and prot.

[finite salmon]

The dps spec I generally do is for 3s anyway and Kleia seems to be the play for that currently

[safe thistle]

i would even say use the one you feel more confortable i guess

[sterile rapids]

Ah, talking strictly pve. pvp is its whole own beast

[odd tree]

yep, know this feeling. 5 of us (those that run 4-10 m+ a week) are ilvl 235. The rest are hovering around 224. Feels bad.

[safe thistle]

lol we had a moonking with a helmet 171ilvl in raid during council progression some are jsut so casual but its a big family i know that feeling too

[orchid frigate]

shield, right?

[gloomy cradle]

No contest

[safe thistle]

its like a choice between jennifer lopez and a girl with std

[orchid frigate]

haha

[boreal solstice]

anybody know how hard spear falls off as # of mobs increase, the tooltip says DR past 5 but what little testing ive done says pretty linear up to 9 but my testing is pretty flawed. Is there a graph around or a good resource to refer to?

[strong forum]

pretty sure its just sqrt past 5

8 targets

10 targets

so its not a big dropoff

but there is a difference of like 200-250 i guess, could just be variance

[gloomy cradle]

This man mid key, let me just update the discord real quick

Hold my beer

[tropic gorge]

Man the affixes this week are ezpz

[gloomy cradle]

What are they?

[tropic gorge]

It's a shame I keep finding pugs full of quitters

Tyrannical, sang, storming

Sang is ez, storming doesn't even hurt bad in the 10-13 I'm pushing into

[strong forum]

well tyra weeks are generally the easier weeks on low keys

once you get to 20+++ is when tyra becomes annoying

[gloomy cradle]

This

[tropic gorge]

It'll be a hot minute, if ever before I get into anything that high

[craggy pilot]

223 Phial vs 226 Decanter of Endless Howling?

[strong forum]

phial

not even a choice

[ruby oar]

harmonic crowd breaker, soul cage fragment or dreadfire vessel as 2nd trinket next to matrix for M+?

I know all these sucks but have to choose something untile I get scale

[strong forum]

i dont know what crowd breaker is

so id say soul cage frag

[strong forum]

uuuh...

sim it

according to bloodmallet, soul cage is like 0.1% better than 233 harmonic crowd breaker

[ruby oar]

😄 aight, ty!

[drifting oasis]

233 [Soul Cage Fragment], 236 [Anima Field Emitter], and 249 [Viscera of Coalesced Hatred]. Simming says the max dps is Viscera and Anima, but I'm thinking Viscrea and Soul Cage is best for the extra mastery as I'm using reprisal. I know there's no perfect answer, but ignoring the sim seems right here?

[strong forum]

no, anima field emitter is one of our best trinkets

soul cage isnt

so playing anima + viscera is 100% the better play

[drifting oasis]

defensively as well as for dps?

[strong forum]

yes

[drifting oasis]

ok, cheers, I guess the extra haste is good defensively

[royal mulch]

do you just have to constantly kite as a warrior in a sang week? I'm a new tank

[strong forum]

haste is our best stat

mastery isnt

[strong forum]

every tank has to kite out of sanguine

so the mobs dont heal

[royal mulch]

I see ROP alot

but I get what you mean

[strong forum]

whatever prevents the mobs from healing sanguine

is the correct play

aswell as avoiding standing in sanguine yourself ofc

[zenith vigil]

I kinda just shuffle sideways

"kiting" is different than managing sangweeny

[gloomy cradle]

Generally it’s enough to just strafe away when mobs start getting low

Not particularly challenging once you’ve done it a few times, easy to learn hard to master I suppose

[royal mulch]

okay, I guess I'll learn from experience.

thanks!

[gloomy cradle]

Good rule of thumb is to start moving when the first few get to <20%

But obviously depends on how quickly they’re dying

[royal mulch]

okay - one more Sangweeny question. if you pull packs into a boss, will their sanguine trigger on the boss ?

[strong forum]

yes sanguine heals bosses

[gloomy cradle]

It will heal the boss ye

[royal mulch]

thanks!

[gloomy cradle]

Definitely don’t let that happen, fuckload of health especially on tyr week

[royal mulch]

I bet. I was looking at a stitchflesh route that pulls in a few adds

With the boss mechanic I could see that getting spicy🌶️

[gloomy cradle]

That’s probably one of the easier ones to do it on just because you have a lot of room to move around

Just have to make sure they don’t die as he’s about to cast

[sharp mountain]

What's the verdict on Anima Filed Emitter? Is it pretty awful since we'll mostly just have to walk out of the ground effect? And, would it make it somewhat worthwhile if there's Leech on it? https://www.wowhead.com/item=180118/anima-field-emitter?bonus=7608:7359:41:1566:6646&ilvl=252

[blazing condor]

Ive played a lot with it and found it to be perfectly fine to use

The area it creates is big enough

And it procs often enough that it isnt really an issue if you have to move

With that said there are better trinkets to use, but it’s definitely not bad

[sharp mountain]

Thank you!! ❤️ Also as a follow up on that, do you guys value Leech at least somewhat useful? Its obv great on healers but when we're spiking for 30k hits isnt the 100-200 HPS negligible?

[cinder nova]

I mean, there's no reason to really gun for it.

If it appears on an upgrade, cool w/e

[lofty widget]

leech is a nice addition but dont drop ilvl / get subpar stats for it

[cinder nova]

But trying to prioritize leech is a meme

[blazing condor]

Any extra stats are good stats but yeah there’s no use going out of your way to get leech

It wont decide if you live or die. Thats up to you and your playstyle

[gloomy cradle]

What were the changes to leech since bfa? There was a point where you’d stack it no?

[distant crystal]

no, leech stacking was a meme in bfa

but it's always cool to have

[gloomy cradle]

Ah gotcha I didn’t play it just remember seeing some streamer being it up

[brittle silo]

Any of you bigbois tried solo tanking guardian of the first ones with offtank tanking the boss only for sunder/obliterate? Is that worth popping as prot with 100% SB uptime?

[fervent summit]

is it worth grabbing kaels trinket even in nm/hc ilvls at this point or should i get the one from the nine? D:

[vapid berry]

Isnt blood splattered scale a mandatory trinket to have on? It's the best tank trinket you can get and besides that a cheat death trinket? maybe a mythic sunking trinket? Tbh the new cheat death trinket this raid tier looks bait as fuck like you die but you can rez yourself like a soulstone and lose all your aggro bc you died

[vapid berry]

im still running heroic kael trinket and its still proccing it's saved a few dungeons for me def still a good trinket

[fervent summit]

gotcha

been spamming DoS 12-14 to get the hakkar one to no avail

;_;

[lofty widget]

aegis beats scale for m+

[vapid berry]

same but for me im after the crystal for arms in raid im at near 60 runs so far

[fervent summit]

the manastorm one?

[vapid berry]

yeah

[vapid berry]

are you unable to use abilities while channeling aegis? If so id rather scale every time tbh

[zenith vigil]

you don'

don't channel aegis

[strong forum]

Aegis is better than scale in m+

Scale is still incredibly strong

But aegis is just on another level

[vapid berry]

I see

obviously I thought it was a channel and kinda bait its nice to be wrong xd

[strong forum]

Hey atleast you understood most of the trinket

Most people only read "absorbs 17k then expires"

And think the trinket is bad.

When that's not at all how it works

[zenith vigil]

see, I completely misunderstood it and thought that

but I'm not a smoothebrain and I trust theorycrafters

so i shrugged and was like "must be good for some reason kekw"

[strong forum]

And regarding the cheat death trinkets

The new one is trash in m+ yes

Literally ankh the trinket, not at all good

And heart is just.... Meh, I never found cheat death trinkets appealing

[vapid berry]

yeah thats what I figured seeing it, sunking trinket owns

[fervent summit]

time to round up the bois and run hc/mythic kael it seems

[strong forum]

If you think you need it...

[gloomy cradle]

Yeah sun king trinket is always going to have value but outside of prog and very high keys you’re unlikely to need it

[vapid berry]

was in 15 dos a bit ago and someone ruined the lightning jumps everyone but healer and i are dead boss is like 10% hp, this is dealer btw, and my sunking trinket procs at 2% boss hp literally saved the run bc like all the dps were getting mad and probably ready to bail

[zenith vigil]

only cowards get sun king trinket for sub 20 keys

[fervent summit]

i currently got no defensive trinket sadly

[strong forum]

Imagine running defensive trinkets

Haven't used them since...

[gloomy cradle]

dis

[strong forum]

Ever

[fervent summit]

so i should forego defence and go for double dps ?

[vapid berry]

my story here is why i run D trinkets haha

[strong forum]

98% of the time mixan

[fervent summit]

[gloomy cradle]

If you get one of the good ones and you do something you find challenging you should use it

[fervent summit]

currently running phial so perhaps decanter of winds from sd

[zenith vigil]

prot paladin with OWS and Matrix

my god, goals

[vapid berry]

tbh running seismic with the new mik soulbind ur literally another dps and if not running reprisal need the defensive trinkets

[zenith vigil]

outdps actual dps

[gloomy cradle]

But I’d argue that 99% of the time it’s a solvable problem and you don’t need the trinket other than as a crutch

[strong forum]

I've used scale once in 9.1

And my god, was it wasted

[fervent summit]

thank you for releasing me from the torment of endless DoS grinds

[strong forum]

Key was way too low to get value out of the trinket

[fervent summit]

il now try and get all the dps trinkets

[vapid berry]

what kind of overalls are you getting per dungeon @strong forum ?

[strong forum]

5-6.4k, not really geared yet

Now with mikan it should be much more

[vapid berry]

awesome same, im at 236 in my tank items and my best dos overall so far was 6.6k I was running seismic and mik soulbind no dps trinkets though

[strong forum]

I should start using seismic

Didn't use it outside of torghast yet

Could prolly get up to 7.5k in mists or smth

Maybe more

[vapid berry]

seismic is sleeper good but theres some dungeons i would never use it in like ToP for example or spires

[strong forum]

Its not sleeper

[vapid berry]

too little room to kite and theres some big hitters

[strong forum]

I just don't want to give up my block uptime

And I'm doing legit top 5 world dps with reprisal anyway

[vapid berry]

I feel like it is bc a lot of warriors that I run into that ask about my damage always say it looked bad and that reprisal was the best anyways so they thought nothing of seismic

[safe thistle]

imagine 2 leggo possible to equip seismic and reprisal

[vapid berry]

dude we'd own

all the rage from reprisal it would be a massacre

[short kiln]

Instant top tank dps

[strong forum]

You're forgetting that bear will have access to luffa

[vapid berry]

TRUE but dont ruing our dreams D:

[safe thistle]

lol i hadddd a dream

[strong forum]

Nobody will be able to compete with bears once/if there is a 2 leggo system

[short kiln]

So... All of the writers saying PW is lowest dps tank... That's gotta be for raids only right?

[strong forum]

Luffa + UFR and its gg

[strong forum]

Yes

[vapid berry]

but what legacy of the sleeper? it amps ur incarn even more and reduces its cd by 30 seconds i figured that would be the go to for a 2nd slot you could incarn more often and reliably

[short kiln]

Cause in m+ we fuck

[safe thistle]

bah i prefer warrior than a bear which is so damn boring

[strong forum]

Every tank does good dmg in m+

Relatively the same actually

But in raid pwar is fighting with bdk for 5th place

[fervent summit]

but warr is just so much more fun @_@

[short kiln]

I've noticed BDK is better than it was last patch in m+, but it's not PW dps by any stretch.

[safe thistle]

BDK got buffed 2 times for 9.1

[strong forum]

They got a 6% dmg buff, that's about it

What's the 2nd buff?

[short kiln]

Admittedly, my BDK is 10 ilvl lower than PW, but it's a huge difference on the meters

[safe thistle]

ill look it up but im pretty sure

[strong forum]

Bdk does the least m+ dmg yes

[short kiln]

Fantastic utility obviously which you trade for that sadly.

[safe thistle]

bdk more ST dmg than war though

[strong forum]

Not really

They're about equal

[short kiln]

Yeah about equal. Maybe PW more burst and BDK more sustained but about the same on st in the end.

[strong forum]

1. Pally
2. Bear
3. Monk
4. Bdk/pwar
5. Bdk/pwar
6. Vdh

[short kiln]

For st for sure yes.

[strong forum]

Yes

[safe thistle]

oh ya vdh fell that low ?

[strong forum]

Vdh was always that low

[short kiln]

In ST? Always been terrible

[strong forum]

They didn't look as low in CN cuz there were a ton of multi target fights

[safe thistle]

i switched mid castle so i dont remember well

[strong forum]

But in raw ST vdh always lacked dmg

[short kiln]

Nom, I enjoy speaking with your wrinkly brain. Thanks for being present. :)

[strong forum]

Kek thanks

[safe thistle]

oh yah theres the 10% auto attack nerf in dungeon too that affect us a bit for m+ since it was were we shine no ?

[unique shale]

Reactive Defense Matrix any good ?

[strong forum]

Very good

One of the best trinkets

[unique shale]

in m+ or raid ?

[strong forum]

Both

[unique shale]

is it defensive or offensive ?

[strong forum]

Both

:)

[unique shale]

time to drop scale then

[strong forum]

It does equal amount of hps and dps

[unique shale]

bare hand chargeeeeeeeeeeeee

[strong forum]

And both those numbers are in the 250-400

[gloomy cradle]

The defensive portion have a shrinking effect on your nethers though

So best be avoided

[unique shale]

[zenith vigil]

man this just tells me how truly busted bears really are

[strong forum]

Bear has an incredibly high dmg ceiling

If you min max owl and cat weaving

Basically whenever you're not tanking, be in cat, apply dots as moonkin, go back into cat, reapply your bear dots, go back into cat

Fuck loads of min maxing that can be done as bear for dmg

Your average bear won't do that crazy high dps

[safe thistle]

most will just chill in bear form

[zenith vigil]

all I know is that paladin earned that top spot

[strong forum]

Pally was always ST King

[zenith vigil]

the damage they do in m+ is absurd too

[strong forum]

Every expansion

[zenith vigil]

their damage in general is just absurd

[safe thistle]

pally solo soaking guardian entire protocol set....

[strong forum]

Eh, haven't seen a pally do crazy m+ dmg yet

Seems pretty in the norm to me

[zenith vigil]

I've watched the guy that's #5 on rio for tanks stream

outdoes his dps sometimes

[strong forum]

Who cares about sometimes?

What matters is the overall dps

[safe thistle]

you mean every 4 minutes ? 😛

[strong forum]

He's kyrian

[zenith vigil]

^

[safe thistle]

its like saying were crazy on spear/ravager, sure

[strong forum]

Ye. His overalls are 5-6k

So nothing out of the ordinary

It averages out over the dungeon, like every tank

[zenith vigil]

monks seem to be in a nice spot too

[modern brook]

Ur forgetting the dork tax

[zenith vigil]

only 3 dk in the top 60 tho

[modern brook]

U gotta take off 2k for being enough of a dweeb to play prot pally

[distant crystal]

Last time I looked it was all specs represented in the top 6

with a bonus bear

[zenith vigil]

2 druids 2 monks pally warr

not in that order

[strong forum]

I mean yuh

Nobody is pushing

[distant crystal]

oh the chinese bdk fell a little

[strong forum]

And nothing but meta tanks are gonna see alot of play

Soon the ladder will be very orange

[safe thistle]

so the vdh fotm already fell off ?

[strong forum]

Fell off about 4 months ago

People just didn't commit to switch

[safe thistle]

so now its druid for pulling entire ardenweald room 😛

[strong forum]

Blizzard fixing cardboard assassin was just the nail in the coffin

Cuz vdh was the tank that needed that the most

[distant crystal]

i mean vdh was the meta tank before anybody used cardboard

[modern brook]

It's druid for being an unkillable circle of uncapped dots and dps cooldowns

[zenith vigil]

pls, plka will lead us to victory over the smelly bears

[safe thistle]

yahhhh i like dh cause of the meta proc off glutonny i believe in bfa and though the new fel devastation would bring it back but nope

[strong forum]

And also bugged :)

[fervent summit]

the bears might be cool but they aint got one thing that we do

[zenith vigil]

a shield

[fervent summit]

family

[vapid berry]

prot war will never die

[distant crystal]

double DR helps too

[strong forum]

:^)

[short kiln]

Revenj

[uneven mason]

Actually, it's ok if bears are the best tank for a bit, because they are literally the least "fun" to play.

[zenith vigil]

you're right

warriors are the most fun

[fervent summit]

i just wanna execute stuff but i feel like im wasting rage doing so

[uneven mason]

"Bear tanks, consistently boring as eating tofu since 2004"

[safe thistle]

i just wish we had better talent choice and not filler and obvious choice

[short kiln]

I had a healer last night actually laugh at me on comms... "did you just intervene me?" "have you never played melee with a PW?"

[sturdy sable]

Our talent tree in bfa was better

[uneven mason]

Our talent trees are as varied as they've been in the past 3Xpacs, IDK what more you could want.

[safe thistle]

i tried a build with rumbling earth and the conduit taht redeuce shockwave cd and it was fun though

[uneven mason]

Yes there is a 'Best' but the gap between "best" and "not best" is pretty negligible

[modern brook]

Smh

@uneven mason u really think you can just go away and come back and diss tofu just like that?

[uneven mason]

...yes.

[modern brook]

Phones suck btw

Tofu owns u suck at cooking >:(

[uneven mason]

Not going to argue.

But tofu by itself

is just tofu

[fervent summit]

tried once didnt like it either

[modern brook]

Smh

[fervent summit]

[safe thistle]

theres desert tofu 😛

[uneven mason]

You can like, make great things with tofu, but that's not the tofu, that's just the seasoning.

[fervent summit]

^

[modern brook]

???????????????????????

[uneven mason]

"Tofu - because we needed a really easy rotation crop that went well with corn"

[modern brook]

The fuck do you think cooking is

[fervent summit]

i say you take it to a mak'gora

[uneven mason]

Bull listen

[fervent summit]

[uneven mason]

I live in Canada now

the Tofu of all countries

[modern brook]

I'm so sorry

[safe thistle]

so your Canadian too Bull ?

[uneven mason]

Yes, you can find excitement in places (spicy tofu) but really, when you get under it all, it's still bland.

[fervent summit]

does being kyrian outweigh the dank venthyr mogs as prot btw?

[modern brook]

I bleed red white and blue

[shy coral]

do you ever use whirlwind as prot?

[uneven mason]

No.

[modern brook]

🦅

[uneven mason]

I vomited a little thining about it.

[shy coral]

so I can take it off my bars?

[modern brook]

Yes

[uneven mason]

yes

[safe thistle]

the only time you might see whirlwind is with the anima talent

[zenith vigil]

@shy coral everything you ever needed to know about prot ever is on wowhead and icy-veins guides

[uneven mason]

more IV less WowH

[zenith vigil]

i ncluding full rotations for situations

[zenith vigil]

u wanna say that to llarolds face

@ him i dare u

[uneven mason]

pretty sure i have.

[modern brook]

We simp mwahi here sir

[zenith vigil]

me too but that's because mwahi is active in chat frequently

[uneven mason]

TBH I've read them once back in beta and just kinda make my own mind up

[shy coral]

reading a list of what to do is never going to be as good as speaking to people who actually know how to play it

I have already read the guides

[modern brook]

Wronf

90% of our advice is rewordings of the guide

[uneven mason]

You think we know what we're doing

[zenith vigil]

thats why we have this emoji

[safe thistle]

i roll my face on keys

[modern brook]

Tbh our pins suck rn

[uneven mason]

I certainly don't know what I'm doing

I haven't played in like... 4 months?

[strong forum]

Uhm

[distant crystal]

my warrior is level 50 what can i help you with

[strong forum]

I'm gonna confess something

[uneven mason]

Nom has been bear since like 2006

[shy coral]

if you're playing tank at any form of current content you already know what you're doing a million times better than I do

[strong forum]

I have never read the guides

[modern brook]

You'd be surprised

[distant crystal]

time to unforge this mf

@rich bridgeors

[modern brook]

If we're being honest

[distant crystal]

wot in tarnation

[fervent summit]

@shy coral guides are a good place to start for itemizing and whatnot but i learned more for playing my low keys and grinding up to my still low 12s and 14s

that being said i never used whirlwind D:

[uneven mason]

TBH 90% Of playing prot is just keeping block up, you can about literally talk out of your ass for the last 10% we're so frigging durable

[modern brook]

Most of the guides since bfa that I've read has just been when I open then to copy and paste the paragraph that answers their question

[zenith vigil]

are we? are you sure? you didn't play in 4months maybe the whole spec changed

[strong forum]

It's true, the class colour changed from brown to pink

[uneven mason]

Pretty sure there would be a lot more 💢 and 😢 in this discord if that was the case.

[zenith vigil]

I say that as a joke but blizzard balance team kekw

[shy coral]

I haven't actually played prot at any current content so I have no real experience with it. In levelling dungeons I don't have to put any effort in at all so it's not great for learning either

[uneven mason]

Also it would be empty.

[strong forum]

I would just be here sitting, talking to myself

[empty spindle]

Is aegis better then scale ?

[zenith vigil]

you can practice the correct rotation

[uneven mason]

When prot was sleepere stonk in early BFA there was like 6 of us.

[strong forum]

Yes

[jagged pier]

100% yes

[uneven mason]

Aegis has no cap for the duartion

[modern brook]

We like shields

[empty spindle]

👀

[uneven mason]

its a value shaved vs every hit

[modern brook]

Aegis is a shield on the trinket slot

[strong forum]

Scale is still extrem good, but aegis is bonkers if there are alot of dmg events

[modern brook]

Pogpogpogpig

[uneven mason]

it's so insane

[jagged pier]

well scale is better on ST thats it

[zenith vigil]

actually out of curiosity, is max rank iLVL scale better than raid finder aegis?

[uneven mason]

aegis is the "I feel like 5 pack pull"

[empty spindle]

So scale for raid or ? 👀

[zenith vigil]

tell me that, math nerds

[shy coral]

Yeah, but it's not great for telling you how to play a tank since I can make mistakes every 2 seconds and still never come close to dying

[safe thistle]

i prefer aegis 1.5min cd to scale

[jagged pier]

im going to say no

[strong forum]

Scale for tank buster bosses, aegis for dot bosses

[uneven mason]

Welcome to being prot

[strong forum]

Aegis is huge on sylvanas for example

[modern brook]

Fwiw thats most tanks in current content

[empty spindle]

What’s a tank buster 👀

Like boss wise

[uneven mason]

TBH for raiding wouldn't vintage still beat scale?

[empty spindle]

In SOD

[strong forum]

A big fucking hit

Guardian

For example

[empty spindle]

So deathlink ?

[strong forum]

Or deathlink ye

[empty spindle]

Okay okay good

Overpower as well… from Tara

[shy coral]

when I started levelling prot around levels 1-20 I was literally dying so quickly and then around level 30-35(?) I suddenly became unkillable without even trying

[strong forum]

Well Tara doesn't count

[empty spindle]

Aegis on the nine

[fervent summit]

shouldnt we run doubles dps trinkets tho ?

[strong forum]

Generally yes

[fervent summit]

and let the healers pick up the pieces

[uneven mason]

their ability allocation for prot is rpetty wonky

[fervent summit]

[modern brook]

Yeah the sub 50 scaling is very wonky

U probably didn't even get anything

[strong forum]

Only use defensive trinkets when you actually need to

If you don't need them why use them lol

[uneven mason]

Scale is a DPS trinket

[safe thistle]

you need to be terribad to die on tarra

[strong forum]

Bro... Ikari

Stop

[uneven mason]

😛

[fervent summit]

but sims lower than other ones 🤔

[empty spindle]

Do you guys use the wall on the eye boss ? For mythic or

[strong forum]

Yes

[jagged pier]

u should

[empty spindle]

Yeah thought so

[uneven mason]

is phial still godly?

[strong forum]

Eye is a wall boss

[jagged pier]

yes

[strong forum]

Yuh

[empty spindle]

Deathlink happens so often

[modern brook]

Phial is still p good

I think there's a handful better now?

[empty spindle]

I’m NF atm but feel like I should go back to kyrian LOLZ

[modern brook]

But it's Def top 5 for sure

[strong forum]

Ye

[shy coral]

Yep it was as soon as I unlocked shield slam resets, shield block extra charge, and got indomitable when bfa dungeons went from hard to trivial

[jagged pier]

i dont know why ppl complain about deathlink so much, isnt such a big problem tbh

🤷

[modern brook]

Ah so when you were allowed to play your class lmao

[empty spindle]

I’m talking mythic eye

[strong forum]

So is he

[jagged pier]

so am i

[shy coral]

yep ultra boring until I got those abilities

[empty spindle]

Oh

[strong forum]

It's the 2nd boss of the tier

It should die in just a few pulls

[jagged pier]

i pessed IP 23 times last week on it

[safe thistle]

you only do 1 tank swap before p2 start

[empty spindle]

Is the nine harder ?

Or hard

I should say

[jagged pier]

no

[strong forum]

That's entirely subjective

[safe thistle]

you can shieldwall every deathlink

[jagged pier]

learn the overlap

boss is dead

[sturdy sable]

Well the nine atleast has blockable damage lol

[strong forum]

First 3 mythic bosses are easier than heroic sylvanas

[shy coral]

what does the cooldown on shield wall average around once you get anger management?

[strong forum]

1.5min if you have gear

[safe thistle]

thats why i see ppl with 1-2/10M and 9/10H

[strong forum]

Yup

[shy coral]

1.5min? jesus christ

[strong forum]

SW has 50-55sec CD if you play the wall legendary + am

[safe thistle]

iut was great for inerva

[modern brook]

The rule of thumb is that am and the wall will both about half the cd of wall

[strong forum]

^

[modern brook]

More or less depends on gear an uptime

More haste =more rage spending so

[shy coral]

right now my rage generation is very low

[modern brook]

More cdr

[shy coral]

unless i get shield slam procs

[strong forum]

Rule of thumb is that AM is generally 50% cool down reduction if you play well, so your avatar will also only be 45sec CD and not 1.5min

[jagged pier]

just press buttons

[strong forum]

Assuming you're max lvl and have some ilvl

[safe thistle]

your about right with the ITF buff in raid

[modern brook]

Spiffs like 40 rn

[shy coral]

47

dont have last row yet

[safe thistle]

over 50 with itf

[modern brook]

Shouldn't need it tbh

U should be at the point where your rotation starts sustaining itself

While you're not struggling with dungeons

[fervent summit]

we got any superior venthyr prots around here ?

[modern brook]

Try and focus on pushing as many casts out as you can without losing block when you need it

[strong forum]

There is nothing superior about being venthyr warrior

[safe thistle]

the issue with new warrior is wasting too much rage on revenge

[shy coral]

its fine in terms of keeping shield block up and having enough rage to use ignore pain but I don't think it's enough to half the cooldown on shield wall, but I might be wrong

[jagged pier]

no

[modern brook]

If you can log your random normal bias, checking for rage waste is a good metric at this level

[fervent summit]

iknow but they look cool dont they

[jagged pier]

most of them dont generate enough

[strong forum]

^

[safe thistle]

its not tahts they run out of rage for defensive cause of revenge spam ?

[modern brook]

Most are sitting at 46 cpm

[strong forum]

Or lower even

[ocean yoke]

usually not enough shield slams

[short kiln]

Wait what?

[jagged pier]

no they just dont have enough rage to do anything

[strong forum]

Most people generate up to 50% less rage than I do

For no reason other than not pressing buttons

[modern brook]

Rageratur

[safe thistle]

ohh i got too much rage :/

[strong forum]

[safe thistle]

i have to IP

[blazing condor]

262 Legs are 315k on AH

[true olive]

So mostly just more SS and TC?

[blazing condor]

[modern brook]

Lots of people will float rage instead of venting with ip

[strong forum]

More SS, more TC, more covenant ability, more ravager

More avatar

More charges /intervenes

[modern brook]

Or worse, use cds into a full bar

[safe thistle]

float rage ?

[strong forum]

People just don't press buttons

[jagged pier]

^^

[shy coral]

what is TC

oh thunder clap

[modern brook]

"I have 90 rage, and am not threatened and sb is up I will hold this rage for when I need it and instead shield slam oops now I burned 5-10 rage when I could've gotten ip out and maintained efficiency"

[strong forum]

Say they're rage capped or rage starved, and then they legit only generate 12k rage in a 40min dungeon

Lol

[jagged pier]

^^

[strong forum]

When a 40min dungeon should be north of 20k

[safe thistle]

im at 54.8 CPM

[jagged pier]

u can get more

[modern brook]

90cpm or bust <--- joke btw

[shy coral]

""I have 90 rage, and am not threatened" as someone who's never played tank before I would have no idea if I'm not threatened or not

[jagged pier]

64 CPM

[safe thistle]

hmm

[fervent summit]

warriors are never threatened

[chrome falcon]

If you're at 90 rage 99% of the time you should just hit IP

[strong forum]

In m+ 55-65 is aight, depending on downtime

In raid it should be minimum 60

[distant crystal]

you'll know when you were threatened a few seconds later when you're waiting for the rez

and then make a note of it for next time

[strong forum]

Feeling threatened comes with experience, or lack thereof

[modern brook]

The other big issue ppl have is mis using cds

Either wasting rage from them, not using them enough, stacking when they very clearly don't need to be stacked etc

It's unfortunate that those combine to be basically how the class keeps itself alive

[distant crystal]

wowanalyzer should just throw up stacked graphs of melees taken + shieldblock buff uptime

[fervent summit]

generally i should couple ravager with avatar yes? to make the most out of it ?

[distant crystal]

you'll see all the times you whiffed it

[modern brook]

P sure the wow analyzer guy is here

[jagged pier]

pretty sure its not maintained anymore right?

[safe thistle]

so ya like using avatar/spear at same time and overflowing you mean ? 😛

[modern brook]

If ur ever over capped on rage ever at any point ever

You could have ipd

And u made a mistake

[modern brook]

Damage cooldowns are worth stacking cause of how multipliers work

So yeah

I'm referring more to people panicking and walling + last standing after dumping rage into block ip

[safe thistle]

but then revenge aint enought to spend your rage youll need a IP there

[modern brook]

Then ip

[ocean yoke]

let it rip its some healing from indom and cdr iof using AM

[safe thistle]

in raid i realized than its best to save last stand for combining it with soul link from shaman

[jagged pier]

it best to use it in execute with ytour cds

[modern brook]

Last stand is a dps cooldown at this point tbh lmao

[safe thistle]

would you say it should be always on cd

[jagged pier]

no

[safe thistle]

its the one i cant really get it when to use it well so far

[modern brook]

I would argue it's fight depedent

Like Jake said you want it at the 20% window

And 3 minutes is awkward cd length

[main wasp]

i save Last Stand buffed by the conduit for Execute spamming

[fervent summit]

would be nice if AM affected it :<

[modern brook]

It used to T.T

[fervent summit]

good god @_@

[safe thistle]

gotta love the bolstering LS

[ocean yoke]

great now im sad again

[modern brook]

Prot warrior fun was deemed to much cause of bomb avatar uf clapping

[fervent summit]

igottta find a kyrian dps for my m+ group so that ihave a very bad excuse to roll venthyr

[modern brook]

Then they gave paladin ashen hollow and divine toll

[safe thistle]

history repeat itself

[strong forum]

Enjoy your dps loss

[modern brook]

C o n d e m

[fervent summit]

tbh i just enjoy the tether on the kyrian so much

c_c

[modern brook]

I wish I didn't have to play Mike:(

I miss kliea

[safe thistle]

just be kyrian and use arms for dps

that kyrian leggo gonna be nerfed cause of pvp

[strong forum]

:doubt:

[jagged pier]

X

[strong forum]

The game only gets balanced around raid

[safe thistle]

i use it now over seismic in keys sometime

[strong forum]

And severely overperforming outliers

[strong forum]

Seismic is alot more dps than elysian might tho

[jagged pier]

^^

[modern brook]

They've been pretty good about only nerfing broken stuff in pvp for pvp this expax tbh

Also if we're being honest

[safe thistle]

yah but its so much fun

[strong forum]

Your tether just lasts 4sec longer

[modern brook]

Warrior is not even close to the top of stupid horse shit in pvp that needs to be fixed

[strong forum]

How is that in any way noticable

[safe thistle]

but i crit !! 😛

[strong forum]

Your crits hit harder*

[jagged pier]

i mean u can crit someone for there entire Health in the opener @modern brook

[safe thistle]

shield slamming the life

[strong forum]

You do you

But It's the same dps as playing reprisal in aoe

[modern brook]

I'm not saying we don't need to be fixed

[strong forum]

[modern brook]

I'm saying there are worse offenders

Every hunter

[jagged pier]

i am keep up where we are

[modern brook]

Monks again

Rogues. Again.

[strong forum]

Venthyr warrior is crazier in pvp tbh

[safe thistle]

anyway pvp cant be as broken as legion

[strong forum]

Legion pvp wasn't broken

It was numbingly boring

[safe thistle]

monk were unkilleable

[strong forum]

Was the slowest pvp has ever been

Games were always 15min

Then the game began

[modern brook]

I like the faster pace of current pvp but it really highlights the issues with the game in that pvp is incredibly difficult to get into without a roster of pals who also want to get into it

[strong forum]

Bfa was either win in the opener or play for 20min

[safe thistle]

at least BFA ppl could say it was bad but the neck brought some nice stuff

it was like having additional talent

[strong forum]

SL pvp is the best it's been in a long while

[safe thistle]

maybe it got better now in S2 but S1 rogue were just crazy and game finished in opener

[strong forum]

That only worked on low mmr

And 1/100 games on high rating

[safe thistle]

just lucky every rogue aint skilled as pikaboo

[strong forum]

Theyd play a 1shot build, if they didn't 1shot,theyd have 0 dmg until the next go in 3min

If you lived that opener you had free play

[safe thistle]

so its a pass or fail

a bit off a flip of a coin

[strong forum]

Not if you outplay it

But yes, a coin flip for the rogue

Same with convoke

Its very easy to stop

[modern brook]

The one shot builds weren't even meta for most players cause it loses to people that know what they're doing

[safe thistle]

since 9.1 my wife complain a lot about her moonkin with reason her convoke seems to cast way more healing than previously.

[strong forum]

This

[modern brook]

Pvp this season is bare minimum a B

Honestly all of shadolwands content is b-a range

Cn was dope if way too long

[safe thistle]

i enjoy sanctum more than castle but i dont like that rng of shard socket with rng of shard drop

[modern brook]

The dungeons are alright, I don't particularly like them

Sod is pretty xool

[strong forum]

I'm just happy that my prediction from early alpha held true

[modern brook]

SL issue remains everything around the game still

All the fuckin fat no one wants

[strong forum]

That arms is gonna be nuts in pvp because of all the buttons it got with SL

[safe thistle]

yah it felt like we entered the xpac with a beta

[safe thistle]

true and lot of covenant viable for them

[modern brook]

It feels like we entered an xpax with a list of things blizzard needed to deliver and never asked if anyone gave a shit about those yhings

Shards of dom: sumb

Conduits and soulbinds

Dumb

[safe thistle]

we were supossed to see set bonus back

[modern brook]

The legendary system being tied to torghast

Dumb

Renown existing at all

Dumb

[tame sleet]

lol quit playing already then

[modern brook]

Watts

Dumb

[safe thistle]

i want set bonus back

[modern brook]

We all do they were sick

Kept rotations fresh and interesting, class centric mogs were also a huge draw

[craggy pilot]

how the fuck can i kill like 50 bosses and still miss 1 shard....

cmon blizz give me the fking shard alrdy

[safe thistle]

kill sylvanas in normal heroic

you get 2 shards

[craggy pilot]

killed Sylv 3 times normal

[modern brook]

Is it per kill? Didn't know

[craggy pilot]

first time i died, and couldnt get to the loot

[jagged pier]

u get a chance at a shard from a boss a week

[craggy pilot]

maybe i got the Shard of Jas there, but it bugged out?

[modern brook]

I'm still trying to get the pieces that let the shard sets to matter

[craggy pilot]

never got anything in the mail

[safe thistle]

now sylvanas can even drop the world boss shard

[gloomy cradle]

Doesn’t it get post mastered?

[craggy pilot]

thought so, but never got anything

[gloomy cradle]

Did for me at least

[craggy pilot]

but literally killed all bosses Normal and half of heroic 3 weeks in a row now

[safe thistle]

i have all shards now just gear with socket that lack

[craggy pilot]

3 shards from Sylv, 1 from WB, and then 3 from the rest of the 40 boss kills lul

ye only set piece i have is 213 blood set from LFR

and the blood is the only one i dont have all 3

game is laughing at me 😦

[chrome falcon]

Finished my 4th full HC clear with the guild tonight, second week in a row that zero plate set pieces dropped for the entire raid

Still chilling with my 229, 233, and 236 m+ pieces 🙂

[craggy pilot]

raid seems horrible loot wise

like wtf is even the point of raiding

[safe thistle]

im at the point that i pick the heroic socket piece off the vault over 252 gear

[chrome falcon]

I had a choice between a socketed bis neck or a 239 chest from vault today

Went for the neck under the hope I would ONE DAY get a chest from the raid but

Not happened yet

[safe thistle]

yah i took sin-stained 252 too

[craggy pilot]

+15 is so easy to do compared to getting Mythic in vault

like 239 from clearing heroic is just a slap in the face

[safe thistle]

well a lot struggle to do over 6k dps.....

in m+

[craggy pilot]

or maybe my guild is just shit cus we struggle on Remnant/Soulrender on HC

[safe thistle]

see we are good raider but my guildy sucks at m+ dps

i sometime finish over 1 dps in a +15

but its guildy 😛

[ancient monolith]

Devouring cold is not the best tank weapon is it? Has no haste

I have engorged worm smasher - which has a lot of haste

[chrome falcon]

ilvl

[safe thistle]

highest ilvl then haste

the only reason its BIS its because it can be 259 in mythic but a smasher 252 gonna last you until then or all patch if you know you wont see kethuzad mythic

[fringe marten]

The shard system is honestly pretty cool in concept, very much like the double legendary system of Legion. There's just one GIANT issue with both of those systems..and I thought they'd have learned it in Legion.

[chrome falcon]

Comparing shards to legion legendaries is pretty wild

[safe thistle]

i think the socket added with archivist should be for shard and death advance one the normal socket. and only make shard drop off raid

and rune word with 3 gem equiped not one piece of gear that activate it

[fringe marten]

The legendaries for US didn't have a giant affect on our play unless you were running the leggo that had you weave revenge/Tclap. That's not the bigger point..people complained NON STOP about legendaries in Legion until they GOT them. Same here.. the shard system itself is kind of a neat little customizable loadout system. (not super flexible..the good shards are just locked in pretty much in M+) But there's some flex like Cor shard if fight has adds? or Dyz shard if it never really does. (guardian) etc.

But the issue is..you have to get 3 pieces of armor, 1 of them a specific slot for whatever 'set' you want..or all 5 pieces of armor which I STILL don't have. then the 'right' assortment of shards which is like at least? 6 of 'em or so?

THEN you level the shards with a hard capped weekly currency..? Jesus FKN christ

[safe thistle]

it did affect world first too look at limit and echo number of shard equiped/rune word

[chrome falcon]

When you got your legendaries you had them for a whole expansion, at least. By the time I'm done with my shard grind the patch will be half over and they'll be on the way out the door again...

[fringe marten]

The 'fun' of the system only starts when you get all it's stupid lego pieces, and assemble it~

[chrome falcon]

Oh yeah if limit and echo has equal shard RNG the race probably looks different

There's no fun when you finish assembling your shards, though

It's just... relief, that it's finally over

Certainly nothing compared to legion legendaries. They weren't amazing in terms of variation for us, but it was better than... yeah. This

[fringe marten]

? it's WoW at higher play level..how much fun did you EVER think you were having? if you're here for fun..wrong game man.

[chrome falcon]

I was having fun when I got to cast Demo shout every 3 globals

More fun than I'm having doing 0.12531% more damage to mobs that i have 12.5325% more hp than, or whatever lame garbage shards give

[safe thistle]

'borrowed' power

[fringe marten]

But yes..once you finally get them..you get to have a little say in how you tune your gear for whatever you're doing. So it's got a little fun to it.. allowed me to get world #3 parse on heroic sylvanas last night, but i"m sure that's been pushed way down now that people have had a full night+ of raids.

[safe thistle]

you wouldnt notice it outside meter

[fringe marten]

^^ 100% flynn

[chrome falcon]

Nice flex on your parse I guess

[fringe marten]

That's a big issue with WoW..if you're doing any higher level content ALL you're doing is monitoring a score.

(I'm 100% sure it's not third any more..just saying..at least I got some cool items and got to have fun for a night with them)

[safe thistle]

i prefer fight with actual stuff to do than just a stand there and parse thats why i love mythic

[fringe marten]

You're either chasing a parse..chasing io score, ...because everyone at a higher level of skill is manipulating their character pretty similarly..the rest is up to your group/guild/random crits/random loot luck..etc.

[patent osprey]

I'm just looking for a good time ^.^

[fringe marten]

I do mythic as well..we'll be doing some kills and then prog tonight..but I'll be tanking in the same gear I did in heroic LOL. Maybe go a little more defensive on eye? so much magic damage there~

[safe thistle]

ya im the kinda guy that run shitty comp lol i had ret pally /frost dk and even surv hunter as dps in m+

[fringe marten]

Pika..go play Ghost of Tsushima then.

Or enjoy the story in FFXIV (it's actually as good as people say; I played it up through current xpac content like 6 months ago)

[safe thistle]

i just cant stand the amount of blabla in ff14

[fringe marten]

If you're legit enjoying yourself because you're pushing keys with a team and having a good time on stream..that's awesome. But for a lot of us..I dunno.. like..why do we do this? LOL

am I legit just hooked on hopefully opening a vault on tuesday and having 3 seconds of dopamine from finally seeing some good items in there?

[zenith vigil]

no

you're gonna get screwed again

[fringe marten]

you damn right

[blazing condor]

Wow is just a social game

[fringe marten]

honestly yes goodstuffe, if I didn't have a guild I'd been in for years here..I'd have stayed on FFxiv. I had no community there.

This weeks viable vault choices were a 252 high crit/mid versa ring...or 252 Slimy Consumptive Organ trinket.. I cried a little.

Would eat a human baby IRL for mythic 9 trinket...just sayin'

[safe thistle]

wow is like your mom food, your fed up off eating it everyday but youll always ask for it 😛

[fringe marten]

Way off topic question: has anyone seen..at all..on ANYONE ANYWHERE the leggo sylvanas bow yet?

[timber lagoon]

I have seen

It exist

[fringe marten]

like inspecting a rando?

[timber lagoon]

Ya

[fringe marten]

Dude it's like the friggin..Legion leggo trinket...it's a myth

[timber lagoon]

He linked it after sylv kill for roll to troll our other hunter lol

[zenith vigil]

false i would never get tired of my mom's cooking

[fringe marten]

I want to hear the discord reaction of the hunters though...there's gotta' be some people falling off chairs~

[safe thistle]

mashed potato and carrot together i was getting fed off it 😛

[fringe marten]

mashe..and carrots? I dunno bout that mang

[unique shale]

This or this ?

for m+

i am at 1.1k haste

[uneven mason]

I've been off my mother's cooking the instant I had a job and was able to move out, do not miss overcooked roasts and dry pork chops.

Also been off wow for a bit too, analogy checks out.

[safe thistle]

[unique shale]

[unique whale]

Just started progging Guardian heroic with my friends. Our brewmaster is able to solo soak every sunder and obliterate on his own. Im 100% able to do with first and third one soaking both alone with wall, but the second one i struggle with second one without defensives. Hows every one else spacing defensives this fight

[obtuse monolith]

Yeah I’m going to beg to differ. Finally got Rev off the WB yesterday and man I am pumped for Blood Link. Free 400 DPS & HPS and I’m not even done upgrading it yet. It’s great.

I actually really like how they did this patch. Since we’re going to be in this tier for months again the borrowed power of shards, upgraded set bonuses, empowered conduits, everyone’s going to keep getting stronger. It doesn’t stop at BIS gear, and it’s going to feel good as we go

[chrome falcon]

Cool new numbers on your screen with no gameplay, if that’s all you need for a system to be fun then that’s cool

I hope you enjoyed grinding islands for that extra HoA level for another 2 damage per shield slam

[obtuse monolith]

I guess being noticeably stronger and killing stuff faster isn’t fun for some people. Have you tried clearing the raid while naked? Might be more your speed.

[zenith vigil]

yeesh

Get a room you two

[chrome falcon]

I’ll just be over here crying into my body pillow that I’ve written every tier set bonus ever onto

[unique shale]

Are you guys getting dom sockets ?

[mighty valley]

whenever i read "Decreases the rage cost of all Warrior shouts by 35%" on the body pillow...... i cry

[subtle iron]

We had our paladins soak with me each time, so would ls the first, then sw the next time

But if you dont have any, unsure

[hollow sun]

@timber swan the first one you wall

the second one ironbark plus demo shout should be enough ( couldn't test it )

[echo cloud]

so why didnt I get a socket on my boots when crafting them ?

[sweet summit]

boots is not a socket slot

socket slots are head, neck, bracers, belt and rings

but head and braces are occupied by domination sockets

[echo cloud]

so i crafted them wrong and should have made pants

in order to get a socket ?

[sweet summit]

they should go on legs, but you still dont get a socket on them

[echo cloud]

ah

[distant crystal]

i think

the eye's hitbox is bigger than its aggro range

you can pull it with autoattack

[sweet summit]

TIL

[thorn remnant]

Assuming no shard set bonus, and a rank 3 shard of dyz... would it be better to use 226 hands w/ dom slot vs 236 no-dom hands?

Or is that just one of those "sim" it scenarios as it doesn't massively impact survivability?

[obtuse monolith]

“Sim it” but that’ll just tell you the 226+Dyz is more DPS than the 236, but you’re still losing armor, stam, and defensive value of stats, so it’s a trade-off.

Nerding out on my blood link set. Some observations:

1. Blood Link can Crit (damage & healing)
2. Blood Link is increased by Vers (damage & healing)
3. Blood Link ticks occur every 3 seconds like clockwork, so no benefit from haste

Not saying we should all-in on Crit Vers but strictly looking at raid there’s measurably more damage & healing value from them w set bonus than without.

[pallid rivet]

What soulbind are Kyrian prot warriors using for Raid? 😮

[sacred timber]

3 deaths, all from people getting hit by mechanics... Hunter leaves... my guess is because of the mage...

[plush tendon]

Spell reflect on last boss in ToP is Stonks!

[waxen cradle]

Hey guys how good is the decanter of endless howling for us as a trinket

obviously when considering the strength proc off of crits is what I am interested in

[brave adder]

guys which soul bind should i use as kyrian prot warr

m+ content

[chilly brook]

Mikanikos

[chilly brook]

Probably pelagos or klea whichever sims highest tbh

Honestly as prot just run the highest damage output soulbind

Looks like sense bounces between mikanikos and pelagos

[jagged pier]

howling 📉
decanter 👍

[jagged pier]

mik sims highest

well does for me at least

and there are a lot of fights where u can get spear reduction

[chilly brook]

I haven't simmed prot in a hot minute

[jagged pier]

[chilly brook]

I am a boy of the arms

Sometimes still tank keys tho

[jagged pier]

i wish i was, even hve KT sword, but no when doing keys with the SF boys i was the tank

[chilly brook]

Somehow I talked our raid lead into letting me go back dps

[jagged pier]

LETS GOOOOOOOOOOO

[tawdry dirge]

which single shard is actually the strongest?

[jagged pier]

i mean there isnt like a single strongest shard

and it depends on content

[tawdry dirge]

for m+ basicly

i have the blood set in raid

which is fukin crazy

lol

[jagged pier]

i would say the 5 in the pins

which are all as useful as each other

[tawdry dirge]

in that order?

cause i only hahve 3 slots

[jagged pier]

i wouldnt really say theres an order

[tawdry dirge]

and thinking of what tto use in m+

[jagged pier]

i personally would go for the 3 dps shards first

[tawdry dirge]

fair

[orchid frigate]

hmm feels like volcanic plume isn't very good with sanguine

[tawdry dirge]

does this include domination sockets?

[jagged pier]

nope

[tawdry dirge]

aka helm blocked

aah okay cool

[jagged pier]

its the normal socket one like from the catalogue guy

[brave jetty]

is there a certain haste point where it just becomes our lowest simming secondary?

[jagged pier]

crits our highest simming stat as sims are fordps

the highest amount of haste u want unbuffed is 40%

[brave jetty]

that with ITF full bonus?

or before

[jagged pier]

before

[distant crystal]

is that like DR or some kind of breakpoint?

[jagged pier]

u get taxed passed 40% so instead of getting 10 youll get 8, but buffs like ITF and food buff etc ignore this

[tawdry dirge]

isnt tthat anyways not really reachable atm

[jagged pier]

no you can get pretty close

[tawdry dirge]

i mean i have haste in almost all slots except trinkets and shoulders and boot and i am on 30%

[jagged pier]

im at 32 havnt even got haste on everything

[orchid frigate]

😦

[zenith vigil]

good

[jagged pier]

good

[ionic fern]

Good

Is that WoWAnalyzer?

[orchid frigate]

yes

i dont want another human to take a look at my logs 😦

[ionic fern]

[jagged pier]

[cinder nova]

How do I parse on KT? Everything feels all over the place.

I'm peaking around 4.8-5.1K

[tame jasper]

I get the „this specc is not supporter“ for all three warrior speccs there. So page seems to be not mainted at all atm :/

[jagged pier]

group the adds

spear the adds

get spear cd

do it again

[ionic fern]

It was supported before by our good guy @sullen valve but then some schenanigans happened and it's not anymore.

[orchid frigate]

i hate when schenanigans happens

[sullen valve]

Correct

We dislike chicanery

[orchid frigate]

if i'd like someone to look at my logs, is it here or in #449510248579858432 i post? (seen some post here so i'm not really sure)

[ionic fern]

PReferably #449510248579858432 - if no one answering there then just pop them here.

[zenith vigil]

Depends, are you kyrian or far superior night fae

gang rise up

[fringe marten]

Speaking of new covenant stuff...IF you're kyrian, running reprisal for keys..is the play Booming Voice since you can get spear to line up with demo with frequency now?

[jagged pier]

no

[fringe marten]

It's what I've been running last couple nights and I like it

Does bsc still sim better if you're lining up a good amount of spears with demo's? seems odd but not shocking

[jagged pier]

not really BSC is still better for the same reasons it is now

[fringe marten]

fair enough..wasn't sure, I just figured I'd science it in keys and see how it fealt.. doesn't shock me that bsc might still outperform it. I definitely run bsc if I use seismic in some weaker keys

[jagged pier]

u should run BSC anyways with reprisal and now the extra spears you will have so much rage tBV is kind of useless

its simming about 500 dps more for me in aoe sims i run than BV

[fringe marten]

I believe it; I didn't do any testing other than just going "hm..wonder how many spears and demos line up now..let's go play with that"

[woeful ore]

Why does WowHead say to craft Reprisal on legs when we have dom slots there? that seems dumb

[placid oar]

Pardon me but is Pelagos not the preferred soulbind for M+ tanking?

I’ve been busy and not keeping track, but is Forgelite the better soulbind or are they comparable?

[jagged pier]

we dont have dom sockets on legs @woeful ore

[jagged pier]

no

[placid oar]

I’m kinda lost when I suddenly log on and read that.

[jagged pier]

i mean we've know about mik since PTR

[placid oar]

Ah I see

So we actually swap to it due to the being renown 57?

I was too busy with work and my projects I barely kept up

[jagged pier]

should have swapped a few weeks ago tbh

[fringe marten]

Mikanikos always had the cooler tree but pelagos's mastery just beat him out; Mikanikos finally got some spicy stuff to make him better..so now he's better.

[placid oar]

I see

Thanks alot Jakey and Dadungan

[jagged pier]

@woeful ore

[lime parcel]

If I'm NF/Reprisal should I be running BV or BSC?

[jagged pier]

BSC

cov doesnt matter

[placid oar]

I was still following the icy veins guide and remained Pelagos

[fringe marten]

Mikanikos actually has an option or two are are useful/meaningful for the content you're doing which is what all of these 'trees' should have had.

[placid oar]

Shall change to the one I see on icy veins too

I thought the mastery buffs was actually better initially

[jagged pier]

well its written by @ionic fern im sure if u read it must say we go mik at some point

[fringe marten]

Also; don't get baited by Mik's top left potency slot...it'll eat your phials when you don't want them to. So unfortunately you only get to run that potency in raids really.

[jagged pier]

i run it

i never activly use pot anyways really doesnt effect me

[lime parcel]

Interesting. I've been using BV for a while now and it'll be an adjustment not having an emergency "gimme rage right now" button but I guess I'll just have to actually manage rage

[jagged pier]

u shouldnt need the rage

with reprisal and AA

also to get use out of BV u use it on cd

not save it for rage

[fringe marten]

Jakey is trying to die to bleeds...don't believe the hype LOL. Phial is too clutch to let the game burn it for you if you dip a little low on a nasty pull.

[jagged pier]

if u go low to bleeds

the auto pot removes them

so no im not going to die to bleeds

[placid oar]

Got it, I just scrolled through and did not read the text. Misunderstood it by just taking the first picture I see. Thanks for highlighting.

[fringe marten]

Bleeds, necrotic, or just needing a top off before a mechanic (they do matter in keys too) All you're doing in that slot is running AAF anyway; it's not going to be an earth breaking dps gain.

[jagged pier]

when do u use phial on necrotic

when your low and at high stack

so it will do that for me anyway

like auto phial is fine

[placid oar]

Yea I take the icy veins guidance more cos I really like Mwahi’s work. Plus he is very friendly around here and interacts occasionally when he cans.

[lime parcel]

Oh, also my guildies are telling me that icyveins is actually garbage and I shouldn't be following it are they full of shit?

[jagged pier]

not for prot

[placid oar]

Helps with understanding the spec better

[jagged pier]

wowhead is written by a guy in here as well

[placid oar]

Icy veins is really good for prot Xamuel

[lime parcel]

Cool

[fringe marten]

But you may not be 'low hp' you may get low before the stacks get high due to healer dps'ing..whatever.. Why give up such a powerful tool for adaptive armor frag or ? the Tclap bonus or whatever. (In keys) In raid? sure..you don't dip that low in raids normally.

[jagged pier]

but icy veins is written by our theory crafter so if thats bad i dont know whats good

🤷

[placid oar]

It’s the guide I’ve used since I started to learn tanking. It’s written by Mwahi here on skyhold

[lime parcel]

I think the guy who was telling me that was a prot pally so maybe their part of icyveins is worse

[placid oar]

Oh wow I did not know that

[placid oar]

Yea I guess it depends on class and spec. Like I once chanced upon a YouTube vid from a pally tank, I can only shake my head so much when he started giving the wrong info about prot warriors. 😔

[lime parcel]

They’re telling me to use Murlok.io which is basically just a data aggregator from logs of top 50 players… which seems pretty limited to me

[fringe marten]

But since I don't want my phial getting eaten auto randomly; I just run the right tree..so I'm quad defensive down mik's tree...which means I actually end up having Fueled by violence in use...feels kinda' bad? but ..oh well.

[jagged pier]

BV > fueld

[tawdry dirge]

how much ilvls is a domination socket actualy worth it in m+?

[fringe marten]

In keys you will nearly never see value from brutal vit

[jagged pier]

at max rank

all

[fringe marten]

IP gets insta consumed.

[jagged pier]

literally lfr/ normal is better than 252 pieces

[tawdry dirge]

wau okay

[jagged pier]

like that much ilvl isnt wortth 3% damage

or the 3% increase heaing recieved

[tawdry dirge]

was tthinkiing of farming normal aswell for sockets

[merry ocean]

213 ilvl domination chest is better than 252?

[jagged pier]

yes

[merry ocean]

With what socket?

[jagged pier]

the list in the pins

[fringe marten]

The caveat there is...that you have a worthwhile gem, and it's ranked up a little.

[merry ocean]

Nice I dont have any of those

😀

[fringe marten]

Although I don't think you even need them ranked much for them to overtake a 252 piece pretty quickly.

[jagged pier]

No u dont

You are locked into 6 pieces of loot

5 dom sockets and leggo

[tawdry dirge]

yeah which is awefull for greater vault loot

^^

[fringe marten]

As much as ilevel is talked about here as being the guideline for gear, people still overestimate how 'strong' more ilevel on gear is. Of course it matters but if you really LOOK at what it does for your chracter..the armor mitigation % gain, the HP gain..etc it's quite small even at 20/30 Ilevels on chest/shoulder/etc.

Like..shield ilevel is VERY impactful and like 30 ilevel gain on a shield is like... 1.5% or less armor? and like 2% block mitigation reduction. maybe slightly more but not much

and that's like a HUGELY important piece and WAY more impactful than any other armor item.

[placid oar]

With that in mind, when I take normal domination shard gear over my great vault gear. The only really value I gain is actually the 3% healing or dmg increase? Is that understanding correct?

[fringe marten]

That's why world first races to mythic clear can even occur..those guys go in with a couple heroic split clears of items, so they're moderately geared for mythic and still able to clear it. Getting up to the mythic ilevel of gear later in the tier just eases up the damage requirements and timings to push phases..but it was clearable like 15/20 ilevels ago.

[placid oar]

Cos I don’t raid often but do my weekly 15 for ilvl 252. Trying to understand the domination gear better and what I lose out

[zenith vigil]

All these people running kyrian

You disgust me!

[jagged pier]

okay blue we get it

u play NF

[fringe marten]

Vobathor look at the shards like "Cor" and uhh? Bek..etc.

[jagged pier]

dont need to remind us every 5 minutes

[placid oar]

Yea?

[zenith vigil]

when are you switching jakey

and it's been 5 hours smh

[fringe marten]

engage a new mob, get 2.5% more damage output for 20 seconds.

[jagged pier]

your loosing a lot of value

1 gem is 3% increased damage

[fringe marten]

that's ONE shard..look at the damage gain from a 226 'normal' raid piece, to a 252 piece..what is it? .5%? maybe MAYBE 1%? MAYBE?

[jagged pier]

like combining the 3 dps gems together gives u like 7% dps increase

[placid oar]

Oh wow just 1 shard?!

[jagged pier]

and the kyr shield is better than the stone ward power

[placid oar]

Okay I understand now

[jagged pier]

like shards are nutty and u get 5 of the

[placid oar]

Ahhh I see

[fringe marten]

In 'raid' and ? torghast? the set bonuses are active..and that's where the INSANE power comes from. In all other content just the base shard bonus is active...and those alone are still powerful and additive.