legit
#protection
amber herald
the tanks actually being balanced is really annoying
blizzard isn't touching anything
😔
strong forum
theyre buffing vdh
to get the equal 10% buff the others had
but yes, DH is getting nerfed the most by the cardboard fix
cuz theyre the squishiest ( funnily enough ) high key tank
out of vdh bear and war
grand drum
Is cardboard fix active in the great push or no?
strong forum
no
amber herald
nah you can buy them from the vendor haha
strong forum
they even got a vendor selling the belt enchant on great push
amber herald
blizz both endorsing it and nerfing it
sick sentinel
PF 11, time for depleted
still pagoda
the tanks actually being balanced is really annoying
Nah, it's great
Less WoW community bs to deal with
sick sentinel
the god damn legs to complete my transmog cost 6.5k on AH
really don't want to spend that much
still pagoda
the god damn legs to complete my transmog cost 6.5k on AH
That's literally free
inland raft
If only yhr tanks were balanced at a tankier level
sick sentinel
i'm livin the poor life, is my lifes savings at this point kekw
brittle owl
if only there was a testing tool
to balance tanks
like an ever increasing dtps environment
hmmm
sweet summit
brittle owl
still pagoda
strong forum
they cant balance tanks around logs they cant read
cuz they cant get there themselves
flint tiger
Twinblade having the same picture as Plka is tripping me up
strong forum
ye
sacred pollen
Hi I need an advice. For M+ this week, Gluttonous Spike vs Anima Field Emitter?
strong forum
anima field emitter is one of the best trinkets for us
spike is alright, not good, not bad
sacred pollen
the healing it provides does seem a little meh
even on big pulls like first two packs on DoS
strong forum
spike doesnt proc more on aoe than on ST
so. yeah
its better in raid than in m+, but still only mediocre
sacred pollen
so anima field emitter basically better in all situations
strong forum
yup
median tulip
I pretty much never take off my AFE and Scale
sacred pollen
thanks, doing my first 15s as a tank and kinda stressing out that healer might not keep up
sacred pollen
yeah got my scales, amazing trinket
sharp hinge
How reliable is tanknotes? I'm very very new to tanking and it has some talents for protection warrior on specific bosses in Castle Nathria and Dungeons. Would these be up to date or is there a better source?
strong forum
Tanknotes is very reliable
sharp hinge
Ok, sorry and thank you.
dull fossil
any tips for Heroic Sire? I feel like I'm dying all the time, very often just to normal melee hits (17k-18k, iLvl 215), trying to keep up shield block up obviously but that movement with the mirrors...
strong forum
Swap on 1 stack of wracking pain
Use SW or LS for going through mirrors
Or call for an external
Swap on 6-7 stacks (iirc) on p3 and you should be omega fine
dull fossil
it's mostly p2 right now that's the problem.
yeah, good points but mostly trying to do all of that if possible, except the externals
strong forum
Mirror is the ONLY time you should potentially be in danger in p2
This boss does nothing in p2
dull fossil
we kinda had so m,any people stop playing, we're mostly "we have 10 people if we're lucky"
I'm the Fury Warrior who is now the offtank.
strong forum
Sire does get easier the more people you have I think
With 10 people he's very hard
dull fossil
yes and no, we've had the best tries with 14-18
strong forum
Idk I haven't done hc sire since January
dull fossil
bit worse with 20-22, but maybe composition and first pulls. but yeah, I heard that
strong forum
:>
dull fossil
we're 9/10 since .. feb? march?
strong forum
Woah really
dull fossil
yeah, as I said, we killed normal Sire with 28ish, then there were less and less and now we can get 10 people and not cancel, if we're lucky 😦
strong forum
That's quite the long progression, but yeah, he's defo the hardest heroic boss in a good while
Much harder than any heroic boss in all of bfa
dull fossil
I hadn't raided since MoP, but yeah, I believe it now 🙂
strong forum
He's even harder than the first 3 mythic bosses
So just keep at it, what did the trick for us was skipping the 2nd adds in p2
dull fossil
but what you're saying is pretty much I and the healers just need to step up
2nd? ok, we're trying with 2 or 3 sets
strong forum
We hero'd the second we got down into p2 and pushed him to 40% before the 2nd adds spawn
dull fossil
oh, that's actually interesting
strong forum
Cuz alot of people just loved to fuck up in p2
dull fossil
yep
strong forum
Or not meet the dmg requirements on the adds
So we just skipped p2, p3 is much easier to optimise
Just get the seed and tank positioning down
And he's pretty much dead
dull fossil
yeah don't want to blame anyone here, I know I'm part of the problem, but I'd gladly go back to dps
strong forum
🤷♂️
strong forum
There's always a tank shortage
dull fossil
hehe, we've had too many until we didn't
sick sentinel
it's virtually impossible to do a keystone or raid without a tank or 2
so we get to set whatever rules we have to generally
how about that for a MDI group challenge, do a 15 with 5 dps
sick sentinel
Multiple groups have already done 15s without a tank. Not that hard this late into the patch, but the point is still there. Tanks are one of the more needed rolls.
fallow jasper
every single class added to the game has a tank spec
and yet, tank shortage is still a thing
astral whale
People try to learn to tank, get flamed endlessly by dps and healers, get blamed for everything that goes wrong but never get credit when things go right. You tell me why no one tanks.
spiral mason
Just gotta out flame the dps and healers. Let them know who's boss
toxic kelp
Just gotta out flame the dps and healers. Let them know who's boss
Agree
Tank dies to 2nd pack in DoS, everyone flames tank/heal. Yet dps did not interrupt any cast of shadowcore for example
spiral mason
Dps/healers use nothing and wonder why the tank gets 1 shot :)
median tulip
We should stop calling them "DPS classes" and call them "Interrupt classes". Might remind some people of the most important thing they can be doing.
chilly brook
People try to learn to tank, get flamed endlessly by dps and healers, get blamed...
More like blizzard makes it less and less fun to tank
sturdy sable
You dont like having most of your survival tied to other peoples play @chilly brook
?
chilly brook
Not at all
wintry vessel
You dont like having most of your survival tied to other peoples play <@13353261...
I do.. it lets me flame my healer irl
chilly brook
Fr though like there's a lot they could do to make tanks actually more appealing
wintry vessel
But fr, most tanks whining seem like they want a hyper-real time tanking system
And I'm just like, fuck that
let me be lazy
sturdy sable
Just make it legion tanking again
chilly brook
let me be lazy
You cant even be lazy rn
Like wanting to be more in control doesnt even mean more work
topaz dragon
Swapping to prot form bdk. I feel less in control lol. No idea if it's a gear thing or not
signal plover
Hmmm
The only thing you're not rly in control of as pwarr is healing yourself
But you're much more in control of mitigation
fallow jasper
did the same swap, I'm a casual so take it as you will, but the hardest thing to get used to is not having grip and grasp
my advice, get an intervene mouseover/charge macro. spec suddenly clicks when you do that
shrewd copper
How are prot warriors feelin in 9.1 so far?
sturdy sable
👍
muted arch
is victory rush still a thing at max level pve?
topaz dragon
@signal plover Troo, Its getting better as I get better haha.
Been doing 15s at 205 iLevel been fun :)
worthy karma
Does anyone have the clip that lead to the Limitmax beef with this lincoln prot pally guy?
worthy karma
he basicly disagreed with the guys oppinion, and the guy was like so a world first "Raider" didnt agree with me. how dare he
blazing condor
is victory rush still a thing at max level pve?
Yes. Free heals are always welcome : )
muted arch
right on, ive noticed in dungeons only half the mobs give it while leveling
and that it says mobs that give experience, so wasnt sure if that included mythic content
blazing condor
Yeah its a bit random when you get it but it still works. Think you need to get the killing blow which is why its random
strong forum
Does anyone have the clip that lead to the Limitmax beef with this lincoln prot ...
It's a known fact that Max hates class discords, especially the tank section and their theorycrafters
He very very much dislikes us/them
strong forum
He also says that none of his raiders are in class discords
When several of his members are even admins
So there's that.
brittle owl
brittle owl
he's a cunt when someone tells him he's wrong about something
strong forum
I don't know him personally or even close, but don't take everything he says for granted
brittle owl
stetement that can be applied to everything
strong forum
He's also the one that screamed that pwar is dogshit and nobody should play it
Before the race
And afterwards just said "yeah that was our secret weapon hihi xd"
So idk
Sounds like a bail to me
blazing condor
Good one >:^D
brittle owl
with all the good rwf has done
it also brewed a 'couch coach' mentality
in the community
blazing condor
Max is a great raid leader with great knowledge and good takes on the game usually. Doesnt mean he cant be a cunt sometimes too
strong forum
The main reason darkee played prot was because it got better loot, and in the case that atrox on his warri wouldn't be good enough on dena
Yes it was
brittle owl
imma suggest you both stop
because none of you raid at that level
to have a good take
strong forum
It's max who said it but w/e
astral carbon
Max said it several times
strong forum
I'm outy
blazing condor
maybe he meant another darkee
brittle owl
this is literally the same kind of fanboyism that people had about method
astral carbon
Prot was there to be geared so they'd have battle shout if they didn't want dps warrior
brittle owl
😒
so you're implying
limit won rwf because of tanks
or rather
that their tank choice was so impactful and thought lut
that it gave them an advantage
but they weren't squishy though?
astral carbon
I think every wf guild has said their tanks are based on bringing the buffs from classes they don't want dpsing
brittle owl
^
strong forum
It is a fact that monk is a worse pwar, but it's literally just class buffs
astral carbon
And all that mattered was ww was good, arms was meh
strong forum
Monk does alot more dmg tho
So they got that
Brm than prot*
Miss doing damage
brittle owl
i mean, they got the fact that they have really good one trick players
strong forum
Trill?
brittle owl
and avade
strong forum
Tru
brittle owl
atrocity is iirc way better on warr than other classes
strong forum
Atrox also really good on that warri, but you might not need it in the next race
Monk on average still does like 10% more than warri
20% even
Monk does 20%more dmg than pwar
Yes
Ofc
brittle owl
you'd generally take that into account in a raid setting
tank aoe is rarely if ever relevant
st damage though
strong forum
These are the standings
Druid has a theoretical advantage
Or well, practical
By owl weaving extensively druid can do even more
Colour me surprised
People are starting to learn to play pwar properly
Took them long enough
brittle owl
unless BoD like tier
brittle owl
weren't there alot of brew/pwarr combos in bod
brittle owl
shees all those bdk's progging jaina
strong forum
Ik my cotank was bdk
He was only grip bot on mekka
Literally only there to grip and reset boss stacks
I tank for 10-12 melee, he tanks for 1-4
Then he's back to gripping
On jaina he was pingponging like a MF if nobody was prepared he'd sometimes just die on 1-5 stacks on her
Meanwhile chad pwar with 15+ stacks
unique shale
These are the standings
what is this ?
urban portal
those are the tank ST dps sims
unique shale
i not sure its true
i never gotten beaten so far by any tank in ST unless it is pala or monk
unique shale
i mean its sims
well people look at sims to find meta nowadays 🤷♂️
urban portal
do tank dps really matter that much in raids tho
it matters a lot more in m+
but simming for aoe is shit
specifcially simming for m+
blazing condor
Dps is the game
unique shale
yup
blazing condor
It shouldnt be at expense of staying alive
But the more dps is made the easier the game
So yes the more dps you can do the better
urban portal
well prot paladin is top tier dps
but you dont see that being meta
and vdh is the lowest dps in sims
but we all know how that is
unique shale
its not meta in m+ cause it has bad mobility compering to others
unique shale
monks also could be meta for their dps and mobility but they have difficult time staying alive
The real problem that holding prot war back to be meta is extremely low self healing & in need of defensive lego
plus thunderclap need buff cause it still hit like a wet needle and magic damages hurt a lot
urban portal
Yeah sound about right
jagged pier
blazing condor
"dandy"
autumn pendant
monks also could be meta for their dps and mobility but they have difficult time...
But when prot was meta it wasnt cause of selfhealing
mental scarab
Prot only spec that dont need selfhealing
elfin nova
The simc list is not a good basis regardless, we don't even have sims for our best legendary and the sim is kyrian
elfin nova
And it has show of force instead of ashen juggernaut
And SLG trinket instead of something that does damage
Etc
sturdy dawn
Do I go with Booming voice when I play with wall in m+? Or is BSC always taken regardless of lego?
jagged pier
BV with the wall
daring bay
Man, i hate what they done to the lvl 15 talent row
brittle owl
But when prot was meta it wasnt cause of selfhealing
bUt iP aNd DiAmOnD iS 30% oF mY SeLf hEaLinG cRaZy GoOd
elfin surge
i used to bandage
brittle owl
yike
tbf
i always rated bandage above diamond, personally, for general purpose
but that was an extremely unpopular opinion
fallow jasper
max, I remember him saying that his big disagreement with tank theorycrafting is that his opinion is that parry is not a good stat on raids since "average" doesn't matter if a boss gets 3 hits and you die
sweet summit
And..?
drifting loom
is there any in-depth guide for prot warrior for mythic +?
fallow jasper
is there any in-depth guide for prot warrior for mythic +?
candid quail
hearing about all the "take tank debuff out of raid before it blows up" mechanics in SoD makes me think reprisal is gonna be op in those fights
sweet summit
O ok
autumn pendant
O ok <:peepostudy:617259554530656262>
thin nexus
for any ToP route where you skip first pack and pull the rager into first boss, are any of them better routes if you arent skipping prides?
sick sentinel
The only reason to do that is if you really want to skip last pride and pull those 3 mobs after last boss for 100%. If you’re not doing that it’s probably not worth the skip
allows for a bryter 3rd pride
*better
There’s a ton of routes that pull all the first pack and still get good 3rd pride. Don’t think that’s a good reason
well you get pride for the portal guardian pack and for all bosses
And you can do that 5 different ways while still pulling all the 1st pack. That’s my point
and that first pull has value as well
not so sure about that ^^
thin nexus
The only reason to do that is if you really want to skip last pride and pull tho...
thanks
tame jasper
I don't skip the first, but mostly pull the mob (at least at low hp) into the boss anyway
My route has pride and/or BL on every pull
BL only on 1st and last, pride only at 2nd and 4th, pride and BL on 3rd
Can post it later when back ingame. See that I dont have in my keystone-guru list yet
but its quite straight forward: warrior, then 2 first packs on gorechop wing, then lichking with 2x right portal so you spawn pride after trash on last plattform before lich boss, then gorechop
wintry vessel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yR2Vy52kpEQ
As a vulpera prot, I'm happy for the thumbnail
sick sentinel
but its quite straight forward: warrior, then 2 first packs on gorechop wing, th...
I like this route as well
sick sentinel
but id still argue that shroud and dragging that enrager into the boss is the play w/ a rogue
without any pride skip shenanigans
austere thistle
Noob question guys, for Pure DPS (and no survivability) should Shield Block uptime be kept up for the Shield Slam damage? or should the rage be concerved for Revenge only?
austere thistle
Ok, thanks for the info
strong forum
its worth it to use SB for the damage increase on SS
strong forum
i think its like 2 SS you need in an SB window to break with the revenge cast
in absolute pure ST
which is pretty much a given
ember quartz
hey i have a question about stats, which spread would be better
haste - 20%
vers - 13%
or
haste -26%
vers - 9%
Can't sim it cause the bot grabs my char speced for fury
its one ring difference
strong forum
bigger haste
chilly brook
hey i have a question about stats, which spread would be better
haste - 20%
vers...
Change your spec to prot in game and then grab the simc string?
If you're importing from armory you're doing it wrong
distant crystal
Maybe he's simming his char from his phone huh
chilly brook
Maybe
But theres also no reason he couldn't just run the sim when he gets home and gets on to play
distant crystal
why wait, just pm Griff your login info and he'll spec swap for ya
ember quartz
prolly doesnt even know
That
ember quartz
somewhat new to the game, deff noob in terms of siming
strong forum
and put that on raidbots
to accurately sim all your options and items from your bags
its explained on raidbots aswell
distant crystal
I believe it's SimulationCraft on the addon apps
then just /simc in game and ctrl-c
chilly brook
why wait, just pm Griff your login info and he'll spec swap for ya
I'm actually trust worthy enough to do this but I advise against doing it period
distant crystal
I had a friend give me his login info for some menial thing while he was out of town and it like insta locked his acct when i logged into it
when blizz sees an account log on to a new IP that's associated with an unrelated acct I think they lock it up and make you hit up support
fading heath
where does reprisal legendary drop
chilly brook
where does reprisal legendary drop
Torghast
sweet summit
upper reaches
chilly brook
It will tell you
fading heath
upper reaches
ty
amber herald
lavish oracle
In case anyone was wondering Indelible Victory is in fact fuckin' bad
even with Impending Victory talented
wintry vessel
Yeah
sweet summit
wintry vessel
Ily erga
sweet summit
😳
lavish oracle
like, I was pretty sure but I figured I'd try it with IV talented just to see
wintry vessel
That's a big splinter.. I'll get the pliers
blazing condor
dont you dare
wintry vessel
keen yacht
yo
shoudl we use curse of weakness on denatrhius in p3?
its 20% less attack speed but I heard that it can screw up some timers
so don't know if tanks should just suck it up and play without curse or its adviced to use it?
median tulip
In case anyone was wondering Indelible Victory *is* in fact fuckin' bad
I'm pretty certain that Blizz "balanced" it around the idea that Fury and Arms would cleave it with WW or SS, and forgot that it does shit all for us.
sick sentinel
i haven't timed all the 10's yet, so i can only upgrade it to a 207, but im happy about that
hollow edge
so
blazing condor
Grats!
hollow edge
is kyrian or necro better?
for raid/m+
cuz i thought necro was pogchampion but it seems plka goes kyrian
so im not sure
blazing condor
necro plays like ass
modern brook
Plka played ven to his position
hollow edge
with the 3 target banner?
blazing condor
it sounded theoretically really good
modern brook
Cov makes no difference
blazing condor
but its really hard to play with and around
99,9% you'll get more value from being anything else than necro
ashen elm
At what point do i stop focusing on haste and more on Verse?
jagged pier
At what point do i stop focusing on haste and more on Verse?
u dont
fallow jasper
Cov makes no difference
this
ashen elm
oh?
blazing condor
people usually sit around 20% haste at least then pump into vers but same here it doesnt really matter
modern brook
Secondary stats will not fix your gameplay
hollow edge
even with the 3 target banner it will still be bad?
chilly brook
bro
fallow jasper
like, plka says it clearly: prot warr can play w/e so is better to play something that your team doesn't have for dungeon bonuses
jagged pier
will necro be best?
unlikely u will every get the full value of it and to take that lego u loose repirsal which is why prot is really strong right now
chilly brook
even with the 3 target banner it will still be bad?
you have to make sure everyone else is pumping and making full value plays in order for it to even break EVEN with the other covenants
modern brook
ZZZZ
fallow jasper
like, on a vacuum, nf is the best. but with so many nf dps, is better to pick something else
jagged pier
oh?
stats dont matter unless u have 2 pieces the same ilvl then u go with the one that has more haste thats your thought process to gear
ashen elm
got it, thanks!
hollow edge
so basically even next tier kyrian will likely be better
jagged pier
regardless of stats
jagged pier
well and the soulbonds are good
chilly brook
Literally just play any other covenant other than necro
jagged pier
and rage gen and pot are both really good for defenisve stuff
but u can play anything u like
it hardly matters
ifu want to play necro play it
modern brook
Biggest roblem with necdo is banner on gcd
modern brook
It's fine grifda just being a baby
hollow edge
well my warrior was/if nf dps 4fun m+ toon, but my guild might be wanting me to switch from vdh>war with upcoming havoc buffs
jagged pier
lots of ppl switch with the patch then realised that its hard to get really good value and isnt actually a huge dps increase and dont play well
chilly brook
I mean.....why not just stay NF?
hollow edge
for raid wouldnt kyrian be a lot better?
hollow edge
i enjoy being optimal
chilly brook
sick sentinel
do i need a WA for IQD?
strong forum
yes
sick sentinel
says it does a whole bunch of different shit
chilly brook
I guess I'm not optimal
hollow edge
?
chilly brook
sick sentinel
okay, so whats the effect im trying to get from it then
hollow edge
are you implying tank damage matters?
chilly brook
Are you implying pot actually matters?
jagged pier
u linked logs though
chilly brook
It doesn't negate a whole lot in raid
hollow edge
you linked raid logs to flex on nothing lol
i dont get it
i was just asking a question
blazing condor
All damage matters
hollow edge
idk what i expected
blazing condor
chilly brook
You being "optimal" has everything to do with how you play
not your covenant choice
hollow edge
🤡
chilly brook
idk what i expected
You came in with an expectation that your covenant choice is going to make a huge difference. It doesn't. Sorry to shatter the bubble.
But you're right tank damage doesn't matter even in dps checks or in keys
hollow edge
lmfao
sick sentinel
Because you were in imminent danger, the Inscrutable Quantum Device created an illusory decoy to distract your nearby enemies.
does this proc if you are tank
hollow edge
idk why you're so triggered
sweet summit
Kyrian is better
chilly brook
I'm not triggered
sick sentinel
sounds useless for a tank
sweet summit
Nrcrolord is overvalued/overhyped
hollow edge
you seem very triggered i asked what the 'best' cov is
chilly brook
If I was triggered I'd be cussing you out or something
sweet summit
And does not transelate very well into real scenarios
blazing condor
sounds useless for a tank
Im sure there’s a youtube vid for it that explains it better. Basically secondary stats are always good
But idrk
hollow edge
Nrcrolord is overvalued/overhyped
thank you
sweet summit
If you already have a kyrian in your group youd ideally play night fae, since its better for damage
sweet summit
Oh
chilly brook
It's still a meme in raid
chilly brook
Maybe worth for parse runs for other people but definitely not for prog
sick sentinel
should i still defer to using my 194 scale over 207 hook and IQD
hollow edge
so, in theory, if your dps are 'better' than your healers, kyrian would be more optimal.
and vise versa with nf better 'better' if your dps are lacking but your heals pump?
sweet summit
Same thibg applies to rsids though, necrolord is good on paper. But its hard to pull off and punishibg if you cant pull it off
sick sentinel
other trinket is HOA 197 for giga haste
strong forum
Necro has potential to be good for your overall raid dps with the necro leggo given that you buff 3 people and can have the buff for 40seconds for yourself
but thats just speculation
practice could look wildly different
hollow edge
yeah for sure
chilly brook
so, in theory, if your dps are 'better' than your healers, kyrian would be more ...
It's literally just a player preference thing, phial won't be saving you if your healers are bad tbh
strong forum
currently necro is ass to play around and not worth the effort
blazing condor
should i still defer to using my 194 scale over 207 hook and IQD
If you feel like you need the scale for defensive reasons then keep it
strong forum
the overall raid dmg increase is negligible at best
blazing condor
If you dont need it play something else. Probably haste trink
strong forum
if its an increase at all
hollow edge
It's literally just a player preference thing, phial won't be saving you if your...
in theory it'd be saving you more often than no phial at all
sick sentinel
well, i was trying to run keys with hook and AM, double time, it wasn't working at all
jagged pier
its like 250 dps at best atm
chilly brook
0 x 1 is still zero
sick sentinel
so i dropped AM for bolster and that helped alot
chilly brook
jagged pier
i mean it doesnt but it lets u ignore mechanics
chilly brook
Never needed it before
hollow edge
idk man I guess you're just the greatest prot warrior to ever exist
jagged pier
its not a case of need or dont need its a case of useful or not
chilly brook
And it doesn't really help you on SLG for example where the damage increase is actually noticeable
sick sentinel
20% max hp potion off the GCD that removes almost all debuffs and doesn't affect other potion CD's, nope, not useful at all for tank
chilly brook
Since it doesn't clear the bleed
chilly brook
It was just an example
sick sentinel
there are ways around bleed
strong forum
phial is overrated, but its nice QoL
chilly brook
Because the last 2 are noticeable jumps
chilly brook
phial is overrated, but its nice QoL
this
jagged pier
its good on progress
strong forum
its nothing you plan around
you have it
and it can save you
but not as major as once presumed
strong forum
slowly but surely youre getting there!
hollow edge
well I literally dont play prot, was mostly asking for next tier as i might be switching. however if you're saying necro is hella overrated (even with 3 targets) it seems unlikely it would be worth to switch unless dps war is still mad bad
strong forum
yes
kyrian will be by far the safest pick for raiding
unless they dont fix NF
then itll be NF
sweet summit
U gotta factor in the loss of an actual legendary too in that case
sweet summit
Yeah pmuch
hollow edge
right but if you had like
idk who benefits the most from banner
but in theory 3 rets
strong forum
warlocks and boomy
sweet summit
Spriest
hollow edge
warlocks*
sweet summit
Uhdk
hollow edge
ok nvm fuck rets
modern brook
Feral
chilly brook
There's a spreadsheet
sweet summit
But then again, they wouls have to sync their cooldowns with your banner
hollow edge
yeah for sure
strong forum
if you have perfect setup for banner, you need to plan every banner use around every boss with 3 people
aswell as lose surv for yourself
and you might hold banner
sweet summit
And thats a far stretch
strong forum
and not use it on CD
hollow edge
so basically in theory banner might actually be gigabrain IF your team plays around it perfectly. but thats hard to ask
lavish oracle
do you lose all your building when you swap covenants?
strong forum
yes
blazing condor
hollow edge
yeah i mean in all actuality its rly only + 1 target and loss of lego
sweet summit
But u have to go agane on the new one
blazing condor
Idk what to believe in here anymore
hollow edge
so prolly not great now that i think about it
sick sentinel
i learned the hardway many dungeons ago though that 5 plate wearers in a dungeon simply doesn't work no matter how you slice it
blazing condor
Nop
sweet summit
Correct, cory
lavish oracle
Okay, cool, so if I swap to NF to renown cap it and then swap back for 9.1, I'll still have all my stuff>
sweet summit
Ya
lavish oracle
might swap to NF next week, then
hollow edge
aight thanks for ur guys' time/answers:)
sick sentinel
fear screwed me again, 2nd pull before hakkar
jagged pier
its nothing you plan around
u can plan around it i am on sire
sick sentinel
sent a dude right to the 4 pack, de-feared, aggro, wipe
lavish oracle
is Sinful surge still looking miles ahead for fury next patch?
sweet summit
Ya
chilly brook
lavish oracle
damn
chilly brook
@hollow edge see above if you're curious
modern brook
Turns out 4 days of recklessness is p good
hollow edge
<@!178900967977254913> see above if you're curious
thank you
lavish oracle
tru
sick sentinel
so, yeah, just keep using scale and farm it till it drops for upgrade?
jagged pier
thank you
just for reference atm necro is around a ~300 dps lose for yourself comapred to other covs so factor that in to your calcs will be less of a dps if u take the leggo next patch but dont know how much that is
hollow edge
mostly a meme
sweet summit
Fair
lavish oracle
300dps ST, I assume?
sweet summit
Ye
lavish oracle
tbh, I like the knockdown from NF more than I care about the extra damage
sweet summit
Yeah but in a raid setting thats very niche
lavish oracle
true
chilly brook
if u wanna do dmg as tank just play pally
negative, if you wanna do damage as a tank you play bear
lavish oracle
well, you play cat, really 😛
hollow edge
play bear
hollow edge
yeah
chilly brook
and bear is 30x more tanky no?
something like that
strong forum
and bear is just alot tankier
hollow edge
even with weaving i get so bored playing bear
strong forum
but to be actually tanky you also sac damage
eh but i guess cuz of druid conduit youre insane by default
for raiding
distant crystal
imagine not using BOAT for bear
strong forum
distant crystal
the dam!
strong forum
does that even work
distant crystal
ya
but it's awful
but if you don't have a bear legendary it's not nothing at least
distant crystal
40% crit for the beginning of your owlvokes
distant crystal
in legion i ran luffa + the one that buffed your affinity
my swipes were like 24yds
sphere
pullin shit through the floor/ceiling
strong forum
imagine TD
chilly brook
draught is actually pretty popular for dam
distant crystal
I already managed to do that in TD lol
distant crystal
digs though screenshots
strong forum
in TD
chilly brook
but luffa is big
strong forum
we all have pulled through ceilings and walls in TD
we once pulled last boss
from 2nd boss
through 2 ceilings
distant crystal
that's the SS i'm looking for lel
waxen cradle
Have they ever said what the Kyrian leggo for Warriors in 9.1 will be ? I mean honestly I don't really care I like The Wall and Reprisal too much to give a damn but I would like to know what it is gonna be
strong forum
Have they ever said what the Kyrian leggo for Warriors in 9.1 will be ? I mean h...
doesnt exist yet
but it would have to be giga broken
to be better than reprisal
sweet summit
Ye
strong forum
and given that fury/arms can also use it
itll prolly just be shit
cuz if it was good for us, it would be insanely broken for them
ykno
and cant have that
waxen cradle
True for me its just a matter of why are the not just slapping some gimmicky crap on a leggo like they did the rest of them for 9.1 and posting it
strong forum
cuz maybe theyre trying for once
kyrian leggo "summon the spirit of the archon - an ally that will taunt all the mobs, pulsing with damage and healing"
lul
waxen cradle
I like that Nomeratur, keeping optimistic in the face of blizzards continual showing of not deserving your optimism 
fallow jasper
cov leggos would be more interesting if you could equip regular + cov leggo
since, let's take brew. are they giving up double keg? NO
fleet river
It depends
fleet river
If it's a big group just mash it so your healer has less to worry about. If it's a single target I'd use it to cover shield block gaps
strong forum
shouldnt really have SB gaps anymore
jagged pier
should i stagger demoralizing shout with shield block
tbh u just use it on CD
fleet river
As much as you "shouldn't" have gaps, we all know they do happen
jagged pier
unless u save it for burst window dps because your using BV
muted arch
im still leveling this dude up, can someone explain why theres no gaps?
jagged pier
because of legendary
strong forum
yes and no
depends on boss
on sludge, yes if you have SW ready
others depends if you wanna take his hits or not
can always just intervene a melee dps lol
analog swift
yeah on sludge i intervene melee during chain slam
jagged pier
just have them macro cancel inteven aura into their fillers
analog swift
sus
jagged pier
works
strong forum
on sludige i intervened chainslam targets and cotank
cuz vdh too squishy
needs help from big papa prot
jagged pier
u also dont need to intervene at all on sludge, if u do it right u can still do 100% without it
but its just a lot harder work
muted arch
ur vdh bad, they can have 100% mitigation uptime for that fight
shouldnt need any help lol
strong forum
after pillar is down and reposition
he doesnt have any souls ready
takes a few globals to setup
thats when i intervened him
cuz i just SW and im immune to dmg
giving him enough time to setup
much easier for everyone involved
muted arch
he should have fiery brand up after every pillar
if you use it on CD from pull its up perfectly after each pillar
safe thistle
you should use it on pull anyway you waste the legendary if you dont keep FB on CD
muted arch
yeah, there are some instances where u hold it for 5 sec
safe thistle
as a DH switched to warrior i can tell its a joke on a dh to tank him as much as on a warrior
muted arch
warrior is physical damage god, but DH CDs line up really well on sludge
theres never any dangerous moment
safe thistle
the only one is if your not enough close to the other tank 😛
muted arch
LOL, fair but thats not DH specific xD
safe thistle
yah but it sucks not been able to use leap to get out
muted arch
yeah privilege check when bound to a wheel chair tank LOL
safe thistle
meta is a very strong cd that should be used early
muted arch
brand + fel dev before first stomp, meta after stomp
then you have it again for when you need it
muted arch
basically yeah, after that you have brand for the entire time before every 1st stop, fel dev after stomp into another brand to finish it
safe thistle
and ppl smap sou cleave when you should use it after having received dmg like a DK
spam*
muted arch
you're literally always mitigating
safe thistle
warrior is the same you have your shield block first stomp, shield wall then its up for the time youll need it
intervene your co tank with a macro that remove the intervene buff right away
muted arch
do you guys use reprisal over the wall in raid?
jagged pier
yes
muted arch
i thought i read somewhere that wall was the go to for raid
safe thistle
i started with the wall then switched to reprisal
its best to use The wall on progression
safe thistle
reprisal you need to know what gonna happen to maximize it
jagged pier
its best to use The wall on progression
wrong
ive used rep on the last 3 progress bosses
been fine
safe thistle
maybe you 😛 but the average jack 😛
muted arch
doesnt the wall give you shield wall like every minute?
jagged pier
no
sweet summit
with am yeah
jagged pier
1:30 mins with bolster which u are 50/50 to use in raid
and rep u just run AM anyway and therefore SW is around 1:30 mins cd anyway
safe thistle
on sludge you use bolster anyway no ?
jagged pier
no
muted arch
so whats the play with reprisal in raid, charge into every taunt swap?
jagged pier
yes
sweet summit
charge weave whenever possible
jagged pier
and intervene
sweet summit
intervene close melee
muted arch
yeah i just figured itd be awkward trying to charge when actively tanking lol
sweet summit
on sludge you use bolster anyway no ?
reprisal is perfect for sludge so u dont need the extra sb with bolster
safe thistle
wasnt not said just intervene during raid on cd is equal to the wall on mitigation ?
safe thistle
k
jagged pier
not really
sweet summit
+20 rage is not useless
jagged pier
as it gives u a fuck tone of rage
safe thistle
ok then on Inerva i tried both but didnt saw much a difference though shes a bitch with both legendary
jagged pier
and bosses and mobs always melee
muted arch
bruh getting an extra stack on inerva must be aids for prot war LOL
safe thistle
at least you can get rid of the add debuff
safe thistle
hes on his dh ?
safe thistle
oh
jagged pier
not going very well
safe thistle
those fucking ghost are cancer
strong forum
bruh getting an extra stack on inerva must be aids for prot war LOL
Just call for an external
Or shieldwall
Not like the boss is hard
lavish oracle
and the warrior goes back on the bench
dark plover
Guys when do you pop shield wall and stuff and call for defensives on Denny mythic ?
warm remnant
ToP probably one of my favorites
thorn knoll
Guys when do you pop shield wall and stuff and call for defensives on Denny myth...
I call for sac both times I leap away, and I make sure to have wall for the second hand after duskhollow when I have both Donnie and remornia on me. Other than that I just hold wall if I’m ever in danger in p3
hollow sun
can someone give a quick look to this log? if there is something i should improve or focus on
signal plover
outta curiosity, what was your overall DPS in details?
it seem low in logs but im psure logs counts the dungeon as one big encounter
hollow sun
mine?
signal plover
yeah
signal plover
gotcha. you blocked melee hits is decent but could be better. You're pressing IP too much imo
hollow sun
well
the healer was running tree
and the talent that reduced the cd of tranquillity
haughty sleet
Did you time it?
signal plover
in a 17 you should be able to hover in the 4k-5k overall dps range (that's details dps)
which is simply done by just pressing revenge when u have block up and aren't rly in danger
hollow sun
signal plover
veetjie's dmg is quite low
haughty sleet
Yeah I’d press revenge more and ip less
signal plover
understandable
signal plover
with double time you should be able to get 80%+ blocked hits without much issue
hollow sun
i can't go any higher
i find it difficult to use during bosses
and pride
well
not bosses
mostly pride
signal plover
just takes getting used to
with phial and scale at 222 ilvl 5k shouldn't be a problem
especially in ToP with SR memes on the last boss
hollow sun
i think i reflected pretty much every scythe i could
i would gladly take tips on how to do 5k damage
cause i am trying hard but with no results
signal plover
literally just more revenge
hollow sun
revenge spam, tried and it took me to like 4k
haughty sleet
How much do you do in mists
hollow sun
i think around 4k
signal plover
it's just prioritizing revenge over IP except for situations where you're in danger or have to rage dump off GCD
you wasted a solid chunk of rage over the run
but not terrible
hollow sun
from not using double time?
signal plover
nah just by rage capping
signal plover
239 over the course of the run it looks like
hmmm actually that might be wrong cuz in the graph you only hit 100 rage once
my bad
hollow sun
no worries, but 239 rage wasted doesn't look too bad
or it is?
cause i definetly wasted some
and i pressed ip so much cause i was often over 70
before chharging
signal plover
just something to keep an eye on but like i said, not terrible
hollow sun
how do you do 5k damage
signal plover
so imo key takeaways are:
- you're not dogshit (the core concepts are there)
- keep working that block uptime and definitely remember to use charge if you're gonna run double time. if you're sitting on that 2nd charge too much, you may as well run stormbolt and stop dangerous casts.
- improve your dps by prioritizin revenge a bit more (also, your casts of TC are quite low, improve that for more rage gain)
more revenge and more bigger pulls prolly
hollow sun
i don't cast tc that often on purpose
signal plover
i didn't look at your route tbh
hollow sun
in every dungeon?
signal plover
yeah
hollow sun
but why should i cast tc more often
signal plover
because it generates rage
hollow sun
it looks like a huge waste of gcd
signal plover
nope
hollow sun
was it like 5 rage?
signal plover
it's still rage
and aoe dmg (albeit quite low base dmg now)
there's def times where you can sit on it a bit
(usually when close to capping rage)
but it should be above IP and SB
in casts
hollow sun
thanks, i will try
signal plover
one last thing, i think you may just be missing GCDs in general. iirc your CPM should be 50+, you're at 47
bit of a nit pick cuz i dont actually have personal logs to compare to but i think Nom linked a 17/18 ToP in here the other day where he was at like 58ish CPM
signal plover
Yeah the SS proc is more important than the rage tbh, my b.
hollow sun
but if you have a proc of revenge, and SS avaliable, and you will overcap on rage by hitting SS, what do you do?
hollow sun
yeah, that was my thought too but i use ip too much from what you said
maybe i need to watch out at the rage and keep it low all the times?
signal plover
Well, if that was the only scenario that you used IP, you wouldn't cast IP too much.
IP is pretty weak ATM.
fleet river
IP is what you do with otherwise wasted rage
It doesn't do nothing, it's just weak. Wasting rage is even weaker
fleet river
maybe i need to watch out at the rage and keep it low all the times?
Don't keep it low all the time, and don't keep it high all the time. Learn damage patterns and use rage appropriately
topaz dragon
Is the only reason this expansion feels like tanks are made of paper due to the high magic dmg?
hollow sun
mhhhh i think that its just the high damage baseline
the dungeon i find myself take the most damage in is spires
distant crystal
hmm you can't see crit blocks in wcl can you
it just looks like a bigger block event?
sturdy sable
Scales pretty strong even at low ilvls
sick sentinel
yeah, that's a 210, stoneheart, lol
sturdy sable
I used my 200 one for most of mythic progress
sick sentinel
i saw 210 trinket very early in the season(vault), so i was like yeah i need that
whats interesting is you can use charge and intercept, i think leap too, but the buff is tied to the slow and if you remove the slow (like a bop macro type thing) it removes both
so, if you never need to move or have charges up, it might be fine to try, do nothing boss with melee, pop it 👍
quartz belfry
@vital turtle
jagged pier
can someone give a quick look to this log? if there is something i should improv...
So I dont know if its the log or somthing, but no enchants are showing up oon your gear so just incase u havent enchanted u want to do that haste enchants for rings strength for gloves 30 stats for chest, whichever u like for cloak and celestial or lightless on wep,
so bigger things now you should be running stalwart guardian conduit instead of brutal vitality
your shield effective shield block isnt bad u have 73% blocked hits, but that can defiantly be higher 80% is a good % to aim for with reprisal
now a really big thing, obivously from just having a quick look dont know how much your kiting so i dont know how much it has effected your CPMs
but they are low
like very low
espeically your TC casts
u should be aiming for like 10-13 CPMS of SS a min
around the same for revengj
and around 10 CPMs for TC
u have around half the amount TCs id expect
u still want to press TC its generates rage
so your missing out on a lot rage over the whoel dungeon by not pressing it
and this can contribute to the low revengj casts because u just in general have less rage
and as most ppl including me you can use LS and SW more as well
remeber they are oh shit buttons they should be used in your rotation/when your going to take huge damage
and SW usage should rise when u take stalwart guardian conduit