i've pugged up to 18s
#protection
plush tendon
yea, it just isnt the same as doing dungeons with the bois though
supple fable
I don't doubt that some people have predominately negative experiences, but I think that people tend to have 1 or 2 bad experiences that sours their attitude for a WHILE
floral pewter
why farm 14s for gear if you can run 15s and get 210s instead of 207s
plush tendon
by the time you are doing 18s though, people sort of assume if things go wrong is more like 'unlucky, better luck next time' and the group falls apart
uneven mason
why farm 14s for gear if you can run 15s and get 210s instead of 207s
because most of your gear is past the 220 upgrade cap and you just need the box to have 226s
supple fable
a lot of people are still gunnign for specific trinkets
uneven mason
yeah
plush tendon
whereas 15s or 14s people are like 'weekly key, no leaver' sort of attitude
supple fable
i know i ran theatre of pain like 20 times on my priest for the soulletting ruby
supple fable
i mean
uneven mason
If I show up with a ToP key
supple fable
i ran it like 15 times before valor
plush tendon
Ive done probably 30 ToPs for our priests and locks the last couple of weeks
supple fable
then i avoided theatre like the plague once valor was announced
uneven mason
the priest in my guild about mauls me
plush tendon
Ive sort of decided that no item is worth my sanity to farm
supple fable
i've gotten weirdly lucky in some ways and weirdly unlucky in others on my character
supple fable
for example my paladin has gotten 3 blood spattered scales in his vaults over a 5 week period
ye tbh i wasn't even trying to farm the ruby intentionally
i was farming valor and figured might as well pick a dungeon where i could feasibly get an upgrade
the ruby is a 1/11 drop
like when valor dropped i combed through each dungeon's loot tables to figure out which dungeons had the biggest chance of giving me something worth upgrading, and theatre was literally just ruby (1/11)
whereas spires was like 4/7
hot pasture
I mean I only ran DoS like 58 times before BS trink dropped for me
supple fable
big oof
plush tendon
gross
supple fable
ye idk i don't have it in me to grind
certainly not on alts
if i deserve a bloodspattered scale the rng gods will deliver it to me
side note i feel pretty drunk on cc on this warrior
plush tendon
AA+ Shockwave+ AOE fear+ stormbolt
supple fable
shockwave, ancient aftershock, intimidating shout, storm bolt
the other tanks i play are pally and monk
neither can face tank mass cc like warrior can
plush tendon
Yea but monks do have rop and paladns can throw the shield for mad interrupts
supple fable
avengers shield goes brrrr
ye ofc they have other assets
paladins can carry interrupts in a key by themselves and make everyone's lives easier, and RoP is probably the strongest cc in the game imo
extremely versatile and powerful for such a short cd
but it is endlessly funny to me to use ancient aftershock on a pack of casters and watch their casts just get bullied by knockdowns
the only thing i miss on my prot warrior is strong snap threat tools? like ravager and revenge! are good damage but they don't have the reach of something like divine toll -> shield
or double keg smash
i'm still getting used to revenge's damage zone
uneven mason
I don't think I've had issues with aggro since reprisal became a real legendary
but yeah we can't hold aggro at range on 5+ mobs
2-3 with heroic throw and taunt
I guess
We actually have to *gasp, Tank.
supple fable
ye i'm just very used to divine toll being the "all enemies are on me now" button
especially since it gives you two +150% 30yd shields of the righteous as well
to blast everything with
supple fable
personally i just wish revenge had a clearer visual. that'd help me a lot figuring out how many enemies i'm going to hit
plush tendon
and up its damage by like, idk, 50%
supple fable
is there a weakaura for that?
languid flower
Ravager can help with ranged threat, ya?
uneven mason
kinda
plush tendon
its aight
uneven mason
mobs move like 10x faster than it follows
plush tendon
its not divine toll
uneven mason
and its not a big burst
supple fable
ye avengers shield serving as a way of interrupting and getting threat on ranged enemies is just great QoL
i had similar problems on monk at first though, since keg smash is a lot more positional than avengers shield
uneven mason
Its almost like warriors used to have an ability like that
supple fable
i just need to get used to it
plush tendon
you can also challenging shout
plush tendon
4 min CD, but it helps
uneven mason
😡 Its almost like they intentionally took all ranged aggro generation away from warriors
supple fable
is there a weakaura that shows how many targets you'll hit with revenge?
uneven mason
oh, and interrupts, yeah can't have that
uneven mason
No...IDK what the point would be
plush tendon
not much a weakaura can do to help with that
uneven mason
its a 180 degree arc in front of you
as a warrior
mobs should always be in front of you
languid flower
my testing suggested it was less than 180 degrees
supple fable
revenge basically doesn't have a visual, it just looks like an auto-attack. and it feels less consistent than 180 degree cone
uneven mason
Its not a slim cone for sure
languid flower
I was thinking more like 90 degree cone
uneven mason
nah its not that tiny
plush tendon
yea, not 90
supple fable
like i thought it'd be easier to get the hang of since i play paladin with shield of the righteous
uneven mason
it'll hit stuff solidly to the side of your main target
supple fable
but it feels more narrow than that
languid flower
it's small enough that I backpedal when trying to use it
the normal monster spread when you're fighting 5 will cause them to move out of it
uneven mason
IDK I don't have an issue with revenge mostly because I'm always shifting to maximize
supple fable
i think it's just hard to get a feel for the effect of revenge when it has no real visual
uneven mason
comes automatically now
supple fable
you just see damage numbers pop up
uneven mason
WTB AA to be a PBAE
instead of a cone
because AA is a 90degree cone
and its obnoxious
languid flower
But I can agree with you - figuring out if revenge is going to hit is not easy - and I don't get feedback of whether it is or not, so it's kind of a "do your best and then hope" situation
supple fable
it looks like it should be a rectangle
based on the visual
ye revenge just has trash game feel imo
it has the game feel of a single-target filler
languid flower
AA would be a lot easier to use if the cone started behind you.
supple fable
that's probably my only big game feel issue with prot warrior
revenge should feel a lot chunkier, like the other aoe abilities tanks have like keg smash, thrash, shield of the righteous, etc.
plush tendon
yea, I just want the majority of AA to be directly in front rather then a couple of yards from you
languid flower
As it stands, I wind up circling the group to line it up, and then circling back the other way and backpedaling a bit to keep them in it.
supple fable
i'd have considered kyrian more for spears ease of use
if they had more soulbind flexibility
there's pelegos and then the two other ones
supple fable
i think if they had leaned more into the lawful neutral-ness of it
i'd have liked it more
remove the whole pretense of moral superiority
sick sentinel
spear boring
Going back to Kyrian tuesday...its crazy how boring the soulbinds are compared to nearly everything else
supple fable
i mean tbf i'd say only necrolord and night fae have well designed and diverse soulbinds
venthyr's are also garbo
fuck umbrella man
supple fable
I guess I should clarify.
Nadija is a pretty unsatisfying ability, Theotar is 100% rng and i can't imagine relying on it as a melee class, and Draven is good but only for healing/tank specs as far as i know
supple fable
but i was also venthyr on my shadow priest
plush tendon
I only have problems with the Kyrian ones
supple fable
which colors my opinion
sick sentinel
I haven't had spear since I was like 208 ilvl with a 197 weapon so I'm interested to see the damage difference now at 220 compared to AA
supple fable
idk i found that the night fae had way more actually useful soulbind abilities. i deeply appreciate that none of them were proc-based
theotar drove me insane
plush tendon
You can always get the Vers from Theotar
supple fable
and having 50% of my euphoria uptime be outside of combat was tilting as fuck
plush tendon
the umbrella is a bit annoying
plush tendon
and Euphoria is sort of feast or famine, but you can force it to proc quite a bit if things are dying aroudn you
supple fable
or maybe make thrill seeker an active ability that you can use at max stacks
and can hold
when they got rid of the cancel aura i was a bit tilted too
love getting euphoria every single danse macabre
the haste helps me dance better
feral dock
supple fable
and Euphoria is sort of feast or famine, but you can force it to proc quite a bi...
my point is that most other soulbinds aren't as variable. Either they aren't proc based or you have more agency over their activation
venthyr lacks that in their base-soulbind abilities. i think that theotar's umbrella should've been spawned by using the covenant ability personally
or that venthyr cov abilities generate stacks of thrill sekeer
kyrian is by far the worst though
Kleia and Mikaniklos's base abilities are just trash
uneven mason
So your opinion is that Venthyr is bad because you can't control the timing on their primary abilities?
I mean, don't get me wrong, First strike is whats keeping me in NF
more than anything else
Korayn for M+ PEwpew
nothing else stacks up
supple fable
I don't think they're "bad" as in unviable, I think they feel bad to use, for me personally
uneven mason
got ya, I can agree on that point
supple fable
I also think that Night Fae in particular has a lot more useful "minor" soulbind abilities
uneven mason
especially since thrill seeker triggers at obtuse times
supple fable
Niya's +20% movement speed between combats is actually excellent
uneven mason
"Oh you'r in a RP session with a boss, heres your haste buff"
supple fable
especially on my priest
like i can actually get ahead of the tank and position myself on my priest instead of chasing after them and playing catchup
Necrolord is similar imo. With the fleshcraft rework all 3 soulbinds are quite strong in different contexts
uneven mason
search for the vid where the 5 priests kill people in Orgrimmar with lifegrip
they'd invite random people to groups
supple fable
seen it, loved it
uneven mason
and just grip em into the sky
supple fable
i do wish priest had some more utility / cc
it's wild how many more tools i have on other characters in m+ than i do on my spriest
uneven mason
That is the eternal thing
supple fable
the best utility i have right now is being able to throw 20% DR on the tank for 20 seconds
with fae guardians
uneven mason
"I wish I had so and so ability on this character"
Then you play the character that has soandso ability..."Damn I really wish someotherthing that I had on my first character"
Guardian spirit?
cooldown reduction also for the other DPS?
supple fable
Fae Guardians
Oh lol you think i give up the CDR on my shadow priest
i ain't no simp
also i think that's literally only worth it for fire mages
in organized groups
lofty widget
or boomys
supple fable
not even then tbh
lofty widget
means their incarn lines up with convoke every time
lofty widget
ah
supple fable
it's back to 100% which means it's still desynced by like 30 seconds
lofty widget
just what my boomy said first week our spriest changed to NF
lofty widget
very true
lofty widget
except PI on tank ofc 😉 😉
supple fable
shadowflame prism + voidform on trash bursts higher than fire mage if they live like 20 seconds
that legendary buff was 👌
lofty widget
i unironcally think spriest>fmage
supple fable
I think shadow priest is very good but I also think it's a lot harder to play. most of the shadow priests i've invited to groups in solidarity end up being pretty bad
but that's not surprising when this is their priority
uneven mason
Yeah I have 2 Spriest, one is a 99 parser, the other.....not so much.
lofty widget
it's amazing what it can do in the right hands
uneven mason
the one dude is top 2 in our raids every time, other....well when he beats the tanks I consider it a good day
lofty widget
been playing with a priest in m+ for 2 patches now and i cant see me ever going back tbh
supple fable
You also have much less utility than mage
uneven mason
you mean you don't have 2 get out of death free cards, 2 shields, a root, and timewarp?
uh
mages are insane
supple fable
No warp, no snares and roots, no arcane int, no immunity / cheat deaths
supple fable
No insane survival with alter time, cauterize, shields...
supple fable
Eh
supple fable
Mass dispel in most scenarios is for fixing mistakes
uneven mason
vampiric on prides
big firemage soloing prides because they can't die
plush tendon
Spriest is underrated in keys
supple fable
I main spriest and I agree
uneven mason
I agree
lofty widget
TOP
plush tendon
just not fire mage in its current iteration
supple fable
But we don’t have the utility of the meta classes
lofty widget
entirety of TOP is MD heaven
supple fable
We’re meta-adjacent
uneven mason
I also think though that its massive skill ceiling is a big barrier for entry
Perforing a fire mage perfectly requires like 3 wrinkle brain
supple fable
I think if they buffed vampiric embrace and took it off the gcd that alone would be pretty huge
uneven mason
Performing Spriest perfectly require a PHD and quantum physics fingers
supple fable
Performing well as a fire mage has very little to do with you and more to do with the tank and how they’re pulli NG
lofty widget
just have it apply to all your spells like in bfa
except only ST spells which they dont use anyway in aoe situations
supple fable
Even less so now
That we don’t use void torrent
Also silence being on a 45 sec cd is kinda rude
I also think fort should be 10% stamina
Personally
It’s so woefully weak compared to any of the other group wide buffs / debuffs
lofty widget
well that just comes from nerfing all those buffs to 5 % in SL
but i agree
5 % feels so insignificant
supple fable
I mean even when they were all 10% I think they were weak by comparison
Stamina is very low impact
5% attack power is probably going to increase the tank’s defenses more than 5% stamina
Shadow priests are hella tanky though
You do like 1k hps without trying
You have the big DR of fae guardians
Focused will for another 15% dr
On the other hand, 20% of my damage taken in a dungeon comes from shadow word death so lol
I love critting shadow word death and hitting myself for 20k damage
supple fable
Yup
uneven mason
still mad about the victory rush change.
supple fable
Idk I think just tweaking vampiric embrace would go a long way
uneven mason
I think spriest is REALLY strong on its own and probably doesn't need any buffs
IDK if you noticed but most group utility got weakened
unique cloak
coughamzcough
uneven mason
ok so one got buffed
but then again, afte rthey took blood out back and shot it for keys
supple fable
Poor blood :(
Necrotic not being shellable really is tragic
Idk about group utility being weakened tho, AoE stuns, cc, etc is still extremely potent
It’s not like they made DRs more aggressive
Weaker by comparison sure, but I wouldn’t say weak
astral scarab
new prot leveling through dungeons. just got spell reflect. is their an addon or WA that anyone use's to show what I can reflect?
plush tendon
even better, theres a spreadsheet in the FAQ
😄
There will also be a test at the end of next week to make sure you know all the spells so study up
honest plinth
languid flower
general rule is if is interruptible and sounds like it targets just you, then you can probably reflect it.
plush tendon
except Stigma of pride
languid flower
so something like shadow bolt = yes, shadow volley = no
plush tendon
-_- stupid ability, let me reflect
languid flower
there's a TON of nuance
mighty cairn
dying after a halls run is over to the last few seconds of stigma of pride is a classic
uneven mason
👍
One of the easiest to time the final prideful on though?
since you know exactly how much trash is in the keep
fresh ruin
does anyone know which is better for leveling, TW dungeons, or shadowlands dungeons
strong forum
TW usually grants alot of XP
uneven mason
SL dungeons
TW is horrible
it gives like, 5600 on completioin
SL dungeons give like 50,000
floral pewter
TW experience got nerfed pretty bad after the first TW event of the expansion
it used to be comparable
it's really too bad, it was a nice way to break up the monotony of running the same 4 dungeons from 48-60
and that's my excuse for why I haven't been able to get more than 2 characters to 60 >.>
fresh ruin
well, i guess SL dungeons also give credit towards aiding
uneven mason
That's a big one
plush tendon
Aid quests you get while leveling are great
uneven mason
do the 5 TW dungeons when you hit 60
plush tendon
You can also finish them at max for free renown
uneven mason
because you'll want that 200 box
serene birch
Just getting back into my warrior, I am a bit confused - Is Reprisal or Seismic BiS for M+ now?
uneven mason
Reprisal
Seismic is fun, but not going to keep you from dying
reprisal isn't super far behind it in effective DPS output, but gives you 🛡️
mighty valley
except Stigma of pride
his worst trick is waiting til right at the end of the fight, then casting one last Stigma, so you die while the healer is looting the chest and ignoring you
serene birch
I was just looking up stats on warcraftlogs and seismic seems to be so far ahead in % of users that it got me a bit surprised
mighty valley
seismic is the legendary for pumping
serene birch
reprisal isn't super far behind it in effective DPS output, but gives you 🛡️
Thank you very much 🙂
uneven mason
his worst trick is waiting til right at the end of the fight, then casting one l...
TFW your al'ar triggers and kills the rogue because his cheat death had already triggered vs stigma
Legit fell out of my chair
laughing
sterile moss
sounds perfect 👌
floral pewter
almost as good as Kael'thas killing people when he teleports down after the fight
it's the new Golemagg window
mighty valley
oh I try and get stepped on by kael'thas every time
uneven mason
almost as good as Kael'thas killing people when he teleports down after the figh...
I warn them every time
"don't go near the chest yet"
"SLAP"
We'll really get to see the asshole side of Kael when TBC classic opens
Betting he'll be nerfed to the floor just like WoW Classic raid content was.
no more 25 minute fight
shadow flare
devout pike
hey guys, im hoping on mythic sludge next week, we are 2 prot warriors as tanks, if we intervene on each other at the same time for the reprisal leggo, does it kinda cancel the effect?
so we dont have to worry about getting the double hit
sweet summit
nah its a seperate buff
jagged pier
cinder nova
At what key number should I be stacking Vers?
I haven't bothered and I'm clearing +18s
I assume near 20 and onward?
signal plover
didn't high end warrs start stacking haste recently?
plush tendon
Yea, not sure where Vers stacking came from TBH
patent osprey
Balance is key ^.^ I run with a 26% verse ans 22% Haste
deep steppe
Yea, not sure where Vers stacking came from TBH
BFA where you could giga stack it
lofty widget
8.3 shenanigans i guess
patent osprey
Verse is really good for high keys for Magic and Bleeeedddddddddddd
plush tendon
BFA where you could giga stack it
I mean, I did that cause when you have so much of it, it was like having SW up 100%
deep steppe
deep steppe
I mean, I did that cause when you have so much of it, it was like having SW up 1...
I stuck with phat TD, but I only ever got up to 19/20's till i got tired of bfa lmao
patent osprey
At what key number should I be stacking Vers?
The key number you want more verse on is completely on how your feeling. If your getting rekted, try stacking more verse, but dont go full verse into like 6 % haste. I personally like haste > 20% and then shoving the rest into verse
cinder nova
🤔 Really? I actually checked one of your recent logged runs in M+ and you were at like sub 100 haste.
Was it a test or something?
ionic fern
I mean Haste still plays a huge role in your SB up time and considering how much of the damage is blockable you will just be gimping yourself.
You shouldn't be aiming for any certain stat percentage / goal but rather improving your own play.
After your play is near perfect and you're still getting trucked you can start looking to optimising things as needed.
I can guarantee you that most people struggling and thinking of going "full vers" are just playing poorly.
uneven mason
You really only need moar verse when you're reaching the point where spell hits are getting really close to just mercing you
AKA - if you're Plka
or Nerf
modern brook
aka if ur asking about your stat priority u aint gotta worry about it
uneven mason
☝️
inland raft
Plka i have a kyrian in group now, that nf swap looking tempting
uneven mason
only 1 spear in SoA right?
modern brook
2 i think
uneven mason
hmm
modern brook
but 1 at at ime
1 for double rebellion fist
1 for the fatty double pull after pride on 3rd platform
uneven mason
yeh
modern brook
idk if theres a different route now though
uneven mason
but 1 at a time
modern brook
that dungeons weird to do things
modern brook
smh
uneven mason
Become the potted plant you were always meant to be
inland raft
patent osprey
Plka i have a kyrian in group now, that nf swap looking tempting
if you play with a kyrian always, id go NF
sick sentinel
There are 3 spears in SoA
inland raft
Yes but you arent getting all 3 unless you want to take an international scenic flight tour
sick sentinel
Oh yea, only 2 really. For some reason i was thinking there was one at first boss but that's some shard for the larion mount
vapid tide
For NF what soulbind do you guys use in m+? I really dunno if I should go with Niya or Korayn
vapid tide
And in raids? what do you prefer?
junior spade
What if your venthyr?
plush tendon
Thats probably a sim question
plush tendon
sweet summit
no cap
plush tendon
IDK man, Nadjia pretty good
junior spade
Hmm. Okay. I've been having an internal struggle on what tank I want to play i like them all but have always played warrior
plush tendon
Play War
or DK
or DH
or whatever 😄
just not paladin
your raid will hate you until SunKing when you can blast healing into Kaelthas
uneven mason
If play warrior, then play warrior?
plush tendon
then they will hate you again after
junior spade
Lmao im going for being able to pull fast for mythic dungeons. I dont raid anymore
uneven mason
Sounds like a warrior thing
plush tendon
Yea, sounds pretty Warrior to me
junior spade
Sounds like I'm staying warrior
nimble laurel
I feel like warrior is the most mobile
junior spade
That's what I've been thinking
junior spade
Yeah but I can play different races as a warrior lol
I'm considering leveling up a vulpera just to be a fuzzy demon of doom
junior spade
Lmao im a fuckin elf at this point because I'm very unoriginal
inland raft
Gotta do the prove your worth shit since was nf before and swapped for covenant diversity but next week i will be pumping those legit excited
junior spade
So NF is the goto now? For tanking
plush tendon
NF is the fan favorite; all Covs are good
inland raft
It depends on group, if you play with kyrian its a ton of damage and utility most groups dont have one though
junior spade
Alright
inland raft
I got myself a windwalker now
plush tendon
^
inland raft
So freedom
junior spade
I was kyrian to start then got bored of it for pvp and swapped venth got my rival rating for the set and mount now I want to pve myrthics again
plush tendon
Venthyr is fine for tanking
junior spade
Just sounds weird I guess
inland raft
All of them are fine for tanking prot is probably the spec with the most flexibility for cov
But nf is fun af
junior spade
My alt warrior is night fae and yes it is fun
plush tendon
NF does big dam, Kyrian is pretty good all around, Necrolord banner needs a little work but is still viable, and Venthyr is good ST
inland raft
Tbh i care more about the 12 seconds of stops then the damage
Covers for bad plays when people distracted
plush tendon
Yea, the damage from AA is good
uneven mason
imagine being a strong enough base class that borrowed power systems don't dictate what direction you have to go.
plush tendon
but its that 10% on pull with the 25% extra crit to start a pack
uneven mason
☝️
plush tendon
NF soulbinds are all pretty good which i do like
junior spade
Never thought of that actually. Warrior doesn't really rely on burrowed power
plush tendon
at least right now
uneven mason
I mean, its because our borrowed power systems are all pretty "meh"
conduits "Meh", Legendaries "meh", covenant abilities are icing on a cake, but you could do fine without pressing them.
junior spade
If you were a demon hunter and take all the burrowed power where's that leave you?
inland raft
Vengeance is fine without it
inland raft
Havoc is the spec that literally doesnt exist without bowered power
Which is why its struggling right now
plush tendon
Havoc is fine
junior spade
I'm way out of touch with the game anymore. So my fault not looking into all information I can.
plush tendon
TBH
inland raft
And its only im a good spot in keys cuz of first strike ubc
Basically combust every 25 seconds
uneven mason
OH no, Combust is waaaaay beyond anything havoc can do
junior spade
My problem is I keep character hopping trying to find something that really stands out and I think I find one watch someone play a different one looks fun then switch and rinse and repeat. Just wish I could solely focus one toon again
uneven mason
don't try and be the unique snowflake, they melt
meta changes every patch, and only impacts the top 0.001% of players
inland raft
I always try yo keeptwo classes up to speed
uneven mason
everything else is functional at a base level
and most specs will fill a niche
but like, Prot warrior is very strong, but not overpowered
so unlikely we'll see any nerfs in 9.1
unlike VDH
who is staring down the barrel of a cannon
Won't be shocked when fire balance vengeance marksman and PI get taken out back and kneecapped
glacial skiff
Anyone know why spell reflect damage isn’t shown on wcl? On sire it’s like 1%+ of my overall damage.
uneven mason
because only 1 thing is reflectable on sire?
inland raft
I just hope havoc gets some love, though rifht now its in an awkward spot between bad for most players and super strong for good ones, 9.0.5 moved me from 7k overall on average to 9-10k overal damage depending on dungeon but most dhs dont do that ive noticed
glacial skiff
That’s not true.
junior spade
I dont like mm its not fun. I was playing survival and had fun
uneven mason
Fury is dog vomit single target DPS
Havoc is very similar
but both specs have big AE burst
junior spade
Yeah. AoE fury is good
Enhancement is fun but elemental is way more fun imo but I prefer melee anything
inland raft
Ya my dh is kinda just treading water though since started my warrior cuz just loving prot so much ut at start of expac i was top 10 world dh but havnt touched anything more then 15 keys in months now cuz warrior is just so much fun i still claim havoc is my main though even though prob isnt true anymore
junior spade
I've narrowed it down to warrior pally shaman and dh. But talking more to you guys basically making me feel more in touch with my main warrior
uneven mason
Enhancement is fun but elemental is way more fun imo but I prefer melee anything
If it has more than 5 buttons in its rotation, its horrible fucking design
both shaman DPS specs suffer from "I ran out of hotbar"
there is complex and thne there is just fucking button bloat
plush tendon
me no like complex
junior spade
Lol enhance just feels like too much downtime waiting for stormstrike procs. I hate rng systems like that in a rotation
plush tendon
also, me no like too many buttons
junior spade
Just like feral I think its cool but way too complicated for me
plush tendon
Why be a cat when you can be a bear though?
junior spade
So I'd rather play roidbear
uneven mason
Feral isn't complex in SL I feel
plush tendon
Venthyr bear is the way
uneven mason
compared to past iterations I mean
plush tendon
RAWR
junior spade
I got wearbear and ravebear skins
uneven mason
crackbur best bur
junior spade
Lol which one is that?
uneven mason
Venthyr
IDC what your bear looks like
as long as it can start doing the thrashywheel of death
every 3min just turn into a bowlingball of death
crush
mild lintel
Protection Warrior Head:
226 Wrathbark Greathelm
vs
226 Darkfrost Helmet
Notes: The Wrathbark has more Haste on it than the Darkfrost which is our best enhancement; however, Darkfrost is a Haste/Versatility Head which is our best & second place to Wrathbark's Haste/Mastery. Mastery is our weakest main-enhancement.
The question: Is more raw haste good enough to sacrifice the other enhancement or is Haste/Versatility the better pick up because of the stronger total value?
Thanks for advice & help! ~Husky 👑
uneven mason
yes
"I didn't just split hairs, I quartered them"
But the haste/vers helm will help more in the long run
mild lintel
So, you think 226 Darkfrost Helmet would be the better choice overall, right?
toxic gyro
Difference between them at the same ilvl is very minimal. Haste vers is more versatile, especially if u pvp. Vers is great to smooth out the dmg intake. #longLiveCorruption
grand sphinx
feel like im having trouble holding aggro at the start of trash pulls.. I start with charge, shield block, clap, shield slam, shout, clap, revenge... but that takes like 5 globals and i sometimes lose one or two mobs. any tips?
hot pasture
More revenge
dull zodiac
where are our bis shoulders from
junior spade
Can I make a focus macro for intervene?
lofty widget
where are our bis shoulders from
ToP or mythic hungering
dull zodiac
ty
eternal glen
How much dps should i have as a necrolord at the end of m+ 222 ilvl
dull zodiac
darkfrost helm vers haste in that order or the mists haste mastery helm?
what helm at same ilvl of those 2
would u use
lofty widget
id play darkfrost
lofty widget
How much dps should i have as a necrolord at the end of m+ 222 ilvl
im getting 4-5k depending on dungeon as kyrian, so a bit less than that?
plush tendon
probably 3.5-4.5 as Necro
dull zodiac
should i run triple endurance or one finesse for a explosive / raging week
\and if 2 endurance which one do i drop?
lofty widget
which covenant? i tend to run 2 endurance 2 potency
dull zodiac
guess ill drop the more rage last stand as im playing anger management now anyweays
kyrian
lofty widget
UF/stalwart for endurance, SoF/piercing for potency
and inspiring presence as your finesse if you wanna run that
dull zodiac
UF even with 3 min cd last stand?
eternal glen
Im close to 3.5-3.6 not more than that
balmy coral
Anyone give up pushing keys this week?
mighty valley
feel like im having trouble holding aggro at the start of trash pulls.. I start ...
Ravager before you charge is huge. Also bump up Revenge in your priority, it does roughly double the damage of TClap, and your first one is free if you're running reprisal
odd plaza
Returning to wow after returning from overseas. I’ve always been a tank and curious which to run. Currently have a Druid, warrior, and monk at level 50. Which is looking best for mythic +/ which might be best for the future?
mossy peak
for getting into the current endgame i would probably recommend druid of those choices, monk is not at its best place and while warrior is fine, druid is basically the tank that plays the most like tanks used to in keys
tanks are less tanky than they used to be in general and there's some kiting involved a lot earlier in key level than previously, but druid can sit there and eat hits better
warrior is picking up though, it's not bad
guessing based on the future is as always futile, as balance is on a patch by patch basis and revolves around tuning at that time and whatever borrowed power is added
maybe i say that bears are good now, but next patch they add some insane trinket that makes monks super good, and then in 9.2 they give us two legendaries and that puts blood dk so over the top you're wrong to pick anything else
signal plover
play warrior or be a coward
mossy peak
at the very worst it's pretty easy to catch up at the moment
there isn't a really high bar to having a few characters, albeit not at the highest level of gear
unique shale
Anyone give up pushing keys this week?
yeah no invite cause 2k rio tanks want to do 18 keys
balmy coral
yeah no invite cause 2k rio tanks want to do 18 keys
I've had so many failed keys this week.
unique shale
yeah low dps on boss = wipe and rip key
willow delta
What would be about the highest M+ key I could tank with 197 ilvl? With legendary
lofty widget
probably 15 ish?
willow delta
wait, seriously?
royal harness
you would be kiting 90% of the time but yeah should be doable, I just did a hoa 15 at 198
and i'm a first time tank player
invite a hunter/rogue for threat and u gucci
lofty widget
thats what lots of us did at start of expac
mossy peak
yeah the biggest thing is you are not gonna be able to just sit there and punch it out with the mobs
willow delta
my proficiency in kiting isnt the best... or at least I dont really trust myself to do that well enough yet. How high without kiting?
royal harness
without kiting I think like 7 max lol
mossy peak
in the game as it stands there's almost always going to be some kiting
even if you are geared enough to slug it out in the mix in a 15, some things simply must be avoided and not face tanked
royal harness
I got to 207 ilvl right now and if I stand close to mobs for too long in 15s I just get my ass kicked
willow delta
huh okay, should probably start trying to learn that now then thanks for the help
mossy peak
we're fairly good at it, we are no demon hunters, but with the new legend especially you can kind of weave small periods of kiting into the mix, as well as just get snap threat off the pull and then bail if you must
we can leap, we can intervene to get away, and you can charge to re-engage
shockwave, intimidating shout, etc are ways to get things off of you in a pinch but many/most dps have ways of helping with it
royal harness
mouseover intervene is BIS
mossy peak
and at this point everyone is pretty used to tanks having to jet, so they will just instinctively slow mobs when you leap out and run away like a little bitch
royal harness
I hope that in 9.1 tanks will feel a little bit more tanky. Warrior is definitely on the higher end compared to others
latent grotto
hey, ive been maining fury since prepatch but have been considering offspecing into prot, would someone mind answering some questions?
willow delta
yeah i'm not really keen on the kiting aspect as well... that's why I kinda kept away from it for a bit
latent grotto
ive done some research on icyveins and wowhead, but im still kind of confused when and how i should be using my different defensive abilities, other than just keeping maximum uptime on shield block
willow delta
What's some nice m+ warrior tanks I could watch on youtube? maybe twitch?
lofty widget
theres a few linked at the bottom of the faq
willow delta
oh right, forgot about that, sorry
split spear
Is there a specific boss brutal vitality drops?
hot oxide
I hope that in 9.1 tanks will feel a little bit more tanky. Warrior is definitel...
makes me sad I haft to kite as a tank. I miss the old school face days. Course, then you got your crappy dps doin 2k in a +11...
I did a +6 on my DH just for test, it was so much easier to live...
lone hearth
outer spoke
Last week i facetanked 15s, you only have to have shield block up
This week i havnt tanked cause i have no time to play, but nonfortified will be easy, but u have to take care of raging
Next week will be a nice push week again 💪🏼
mighty valley
I keep losing motivation to push after KSM... then I see that I could be the top venthyr prot warrior on the server with just a little effort...
ugh, maybe next week
mighty valley
i don't have to pug, not super worried about dps
just harder to motivate people on tyrannical weeks
unique shale
just harder to motivate people on tyrannical weeks
Motivate people ?!
mighty valley
just getting guild people to care about trying something higher than a 15 on a slightly harder week
unique shale
just getting guild people to care about trying something higher than a 15 on a s...
i feel like i better off alone since last time i tried to push 16 keys with guildy went wrong
mighty valley
that can happen... I do actually like my guild though, they're good players and good people
plush tendon
Its actually a great week for keys; affixes arent bad and bosses arent as big of a pain as they were
but its hard to break the Tyrannical dead key mindset
tender oak
Honestly its weird as fuck not actually being able to tank mobs, youre just cosplaying a greased up pig running around distracting the mobs praying to god they dont touch you or you die
plush tendon
what you talking bout?
you can facetank mobs pretty EZ now except for a couple of cases
tender oak
But then again ive never really tanked alot before but tried doing a +10 and it just felt like I was paper
short kiln
in a log, what specifically is the measure of how well you had SB up? I'm assuming it isn't raw uptime but more the % of mitigated damage?
weak dune
warriors are super duper tanky right now as long as you have SB
plush tendon
in a log, what specifically is the measure of how well you had SB up? I'm assumi...
in a log, you would go to damage taken then look at hits
from there you can see how many hits they got on you and also how many hits you blocked
plush tendon
the first one
short kiln
ok cool
plush tendon
I think the second one includes boss abilties; but its so close
short kiln
so what'
plush tendon
margin of error there is like <1%
short kiln
is "good" and what is "decent"
plush tendon
with reprisal, you can get up to like 80%
I think for most players, 70%+ is considered good*
plush tendon
short kiln
I need to intervene and charge more for sure
but it's a damn sight better this week than last
plush tendon
Intervene on CD, you can charge explosives also
robust dew
so is there another leggo prot besides reprisal ?
short kiln
I'm working with my team to help me with some chances to back out and charge in, and I also need to use our AOE stun to allow for that more
plush tendon
The wall is a option
but highly reccomend Reprisal
for M+
Seismic Reverb if the content you are doing is 'trivial' (up to you to determine what that is for you)
robust dew
well i mainly do m+ on this warrior
plush tendon
I'm working with my team to help me with some chances to back out and charge in,...
You dont always have to get very far, I think its like a min 5 yard range
short kiln
on intervene, for sure
plush tendon
so even a thunderclap slow and a quick in and out is enough
short kiln
I just find charging distance tough to gauge
plush tendon
practice
plush tendon
I wouldnt reccomend shockwaving just to get a charge in unless you really need to
plush tendon
Also, dont be afraid to just pop SW if you dont have SB up and cant get a recharge
short kiln
My group needs to work more effectively together on kicking so I don't need so many SWs... but I'm also a Tauren, so I do have stomp for that also
plush tendon
Sure itll look bad on the hits blocked, but it accomplishes the same goal; just dont tank without having anything up
short kiln
yeah
I was rage and SB charge starved much less on my runs tonight
but when it did happen both times I died
plush tendon
youll find soon that youll have too much rage to even spend XD
plush tendon
Im rage capping so much now
need more things to spend it on other then IP and Revenge XD
short kiln
IP is almost a foreign button to me rn
that's been the "oh shit charges on CD" button
plush tendon
Im still breaking my reliance on it
too used to BFA where I was smashing that button constantly
plush tendon
oo babi, you in for a ride 🙂
short kiln
I'm kinda glad I waited so long to play
since now I have so much to do
and learn
I'm completely allergic to cast times
LOL
Warrior Lit
distant crystal
short kiln
it's an acceptable exception
robust dew
i just switched to necro for prot
what is the best soulbind?
unique shale
i cannot play range classes anyone i either go to melee range or just figuring out which mob should i target 😂
unique shale
i just switched to necro for prot
what is the best soulbind?
look at guides
robust dew
i was going to but i figured i would ask first if anybody knew off the top of their head 😅
plush tendon
i just switched to necro for prot
what is the best soulbind?
Here you go my dude
Bonesmith also a option, but I would reccomend Emeni as you can stack the Strength on Banner
robust dew
i had feeling it was emeni thank you 🙂
unique shale
plush tendon
I also like being able to channel fleshcraft on the move; quality of life on point
robust dew
even got a green mog to match my shield 😄
plush tendon
and the movespeed is underrated
Yea, I loved my Necro set when I was necrolord
but now im NF, they need to do a couple of things to banner for me to go back like make it party wide rather then two people and add a damage portion to it or something
if they do that, im going back XD
unique shale
banner is really good if you have real mage and boomy pumpers
plush tendon
its just frusterating to use right now
and more trouble then its worth to get max value out of it
Nevertheless, strong party buff
and very viable in its current form
unique shale
i think they should change banner to give party bis states instead of Mastery which won’t lead into mage boomy meta camp again
plush tendon
I wouldnt mind that
party wide Prim stat buff
but alas, lets see what they decide
For now I would recommend kyrian or NF for any protty, but also to give all the covs a go and level them up right now
hot crest
hey would you guys know if NF would be good for prot and fury?
plush tendon
Yes
NF great offensive choice for prot, competitive for fury in raid and great in M+
hot crest
okay cause i was thinking of jumping back into my warrior and like to do both lol
plush tendon
NF would be the play
woven laurel
NF is awesome. The damage is great and the redirected anima for prot imo is great. Have gotten over 120k max health on pulls b4
hot crest
daaaamn alright ! lol
woven laurel
also fury benefits a ton from the burst and mastery
plush tendon
Take korayn for prot in M+
10% damage at above 75% plus 25% crit whenever you damage something first
final jackal
Necro isnt good?
plush tendon
Necro isnt good?
Viable, has some issues but if you like it no reason not to play it
final jackal
I know Kyrian is best but Im already Kyrian in two alts and want to change it up
NF second best?
plush tendon
Kyrian is the go to for prot since kyrian dungeon buffs are hard to come by
NF is equal or ahead of kyrian imo if you disregard that
But you’ll see most top players are running kyrian; phial strong and you want a kyrian in your M+ group
woven laurel
i can see what your saying about korayn @plush tendon. imo the bonus health is great for keeping enemies in the same spot so ur dps can aoe and the burrs help with kiting
plush tendon
Korayn is stonks
woven laurel
with the recent dmg buff to prot tho i feel like they doo v good dmg and if u need bonus take a power flask instead of stamina
also reprisal w BSC is amazing
plush tendon
I would argue that the extra health isn’t needed on prot unless you need EHP to survive a specific hit
In which case, maximizing damage is better
Though niya is the play in raid for prot no question
Korayn strictly M+
Cause burrs go brrrr
woven laurel
true i can see what ur saying i might need to give it a try but that max health and mastery boost is a huge defensive buff which could make prot arguably easier to play for beginners
and help dps focus aoe
plush tendon
Prot is pretty solid defensively on its own
Especially with the 10% damage reduction we got, increased SB uptime, and dungeon nerfs
Most new players I think just need to focus on getting as much SB uptime as they can and then using their other CDs accordingly
remote dawn
Guys i switched 😄
plush tendon
Magic damage is where we struggle, but no amount of health will save you when the real cure to that is proper interrupts
woven laurel
that is true
final jackal
Ughh I really wanted to go Necro cause of the fantasy but I guess NF it is
plush tendon
Guys i switched <:Aftershock:742631092326236282> 😄
Welcome to the club
woven laurel
more health does allow for slightly more error
final jackal
Anything but Kyrian
plush tendon
Anything but Kyrian
I’m with you on that. I wish necro was just a bit better cause I would love to go back
final jackal
Cant do 3 Kyrian tanks lol
plush tendon
But I’ve been NF for like 3 weeks and it’s just miles better
final jackal
Yeah i guess its also good if I ever want to DPS
final jackal
It is
plush tendon
Let’s go
plush tendon
Niya is by no means bad, but in a dungeon where you can get lots of first strike procs, he becomes incredibly strong
final jackal
Lmao I thought Korayn was just you guys misspelling Kyrian for some joke
Im assuming Koryan is the best NF soulbind for M+?
final jackal
Guys I havent played Prot since BFA and its honestly fun
woven laurel
from what im hearing abt korayn i would say if u need more dmg def go korayn if u need more defensive ability go niya
final jackal
hadnt*
woven laurel
honestly with reprisal does show of force become better than destructive reverberations fr m+?
also w recent dmg buffs
woven laurel
j came to mind after visiting forge of bonds for the first time in ages got me thinking
plush tendon
Show of force is still weak since thunderclap is such a low priority button
It’s not your BFA thunderclap that’s for sure
woven laurel
i still find myself using it off cd as a filler
plush tendon
I use it a lot
But if I’m capping rage, or get a string of SS resets that button goes untouched for quite a while
woven laurel
yes def
plush tendon
It also hits like a wet noodle
woven laurel
true
woven laurel
it is def j a filler spelli feel
plush tendon
It generates some rage and helps with aggro
woven laurel
yeah ofc that too
plush tendon
But other then that, most of our damage is tied to revenge
plush tendon
Yea, bottom of the priority list
woven laurel
thats y ive recently swapped to bounding stride so i can leap charge mroe often
plush tendon
I’m still on team cackling thunder
I use thunderclap enough where the range and slow are nice
And I don’t leave melee too often now
woven laurel
i dont leave melee too much either thats why i find range kind of pointless
woven laurel
yes def
also enjoy speed buff from bounding stride alot lmao
i like being speedy boi
plush tendon
I already feel fast enough as is XD
That’s what you get when the two tanks you play are DK and war
plush tendon
War technically my alt
woven laurel
that little speed buff is alot of excitement for me lmao
plush tendon
I’m just being oppressed by my raid team cause I’m like our last DK
And AMZ is strong
And DKs in raid are super beefy
woven laurel
true
i mostly m+ nowadays
love big pulling as blood tho
and freaking my healer out lmao
plush tendon
Blood is fun cause whether you live or die is all on you
My healers very rarely spam heal into me
Unless I ask (I don’t pug so we have coms)
Otherwise it’s a hot here and a beacon there
But then you get into situations where everything is going well and you get globaled
woven laurel
lmao i usually play blood w my friend whos learning to heal as his shaman
always scare the shit out of him😂
plush tendon
And you are sitting there like.... uh what happened
woven laurel
feel that
plush tendon
Yea, blood is not new healer friendly
woven laurel
or u run out of runic power w no runes left
plush tendon
Cause in their mind seeing that health Bar dipping so low is scary
woven laurel
def haha
plush tendon
Much easier for a new healer to heal a more traditional mitigation tank like war or bear
And more intuitive
woven laurel
yeah def
war will alwasy be my main tho
been playing prot since prob cata w many breaks in between
delicate thorn
I am gonna be sad when I get a better trinket than Vial of Caustic Liquid, because when you get it to proc right it absolutely murders groups of mobs
stiff gate
Does anyone know if you can intervene on a player's corpse? I was jw b/c I was thinking about being an engineer for my warr.
delicate thorn
(or undead)
tame jasper
Can anyone explain me difference in e.g. Damage Done between "Details" addon in WoW and Warcraftlogs.com? Ingame I'm often at 3,2-3,3k and on warcraft logs only at 2,6-2,7 😦 What is the better source?
strong forum
Wcl shows dmg done over the entire dungeon, even with downtime accounted between packs
Details only shows in-combat numbers, it doesn't include the times where you're "afk" or just running to the next pack without combat, whereas wcl does
Both sources are valid, what matters is if you draw comparisons it has to be logs vs logs or details vs details
In terms of a raid scenario, logs are the better source.
tame jasper
Details only shows in-combat numbers, it doesn't include the times where you're ...
Ah thought about something like that
tame jasper
In terms of a raid scenario, logs are the better source.
What do you suggest for m+?
strong forum
Logs aswell, they're unaltered or skewed, it's just the overall dps won't look as big
tame jasper
I'll stick to both anyway cause logs are more in detail for me, but ingame I mostly check details after a run
Makes sense yeah
strong forum
Ye after run dps check details is enough, if you wanna figure more than that out check logs
tame jasper
That's how I do it atm. Thanks for your thoughts about it, gives me some selfconfidence
rotund parcel
oi friends, mythic sires wracking pain anybody know what the range of the frontal is?
wowhead has one listed as 300yd and the second as 100yd but i think thats bullshit.
unique shale
Is it worth it to pay for pvp boost to get ilvl 233 shield or not ?
remote dawn
What will you Play keys 25+?
unique shale
What will you Play keys 25+?
no
wet gazelle
Hi, guys! Where can i read short strat for NF prot? I mean - soulbindes, conduits, talents, legs etc.
For m+ 15 keys
zealous spear
is NF the way to go for prot now?
strong forum
Way to go is still kyrian, but NF is 99.9% as good
woeful trellis
guys, 220 with haste vers + socket > 226 with ver mast or?
craggy harness
Hmm, anyone have a "high" block percentage log to look at for huntsman with reprisal?
woeful trellis
whats high for u?
craggy harness
i saw someone with 67% a couple of days ago
i failed miserably at meeting that mark in my first attempt
although the dps was nice
sorry, important, specifically tanking huntsman's shoot as opposed to bears
strong forum
Should be able to get like 70-80%
craggy harness
And that’s with AM right?
strong forum
Ye
craggy harness
Thanks. Definitely need work :/
strong forum
Can prolly get even higher since he often doesn't attacks the tank
With full tryharding naowh got 96% SB uptime I believe, but I don't remember if it was with Bolster or not
blazing condor
less uptime must equal more dps right
even with reprisal procs
granted you still intervene on cd as per usual
strong forum
Eh it goes somewhat Hand in Hand
With reprisal
As its 30% more SS dmg, and alot of rage gained from reprisal
Sense had 86% uptime on SB on his R1 kill
blazing condor
same 🙂
was just curious because i found myself not really pressing shield block much in some lower dgs i did yesterday and just revenge-spammed
strong forum
the one you like aesthetically the most > vulpera > belf/rc/hmt/tauren/troll
hallow pivot
Arigato
stable geyser
Hey
What's should my stat look in 225 ilvl
Should I go for 30 haste?
stable geyser
Even if it's only 6 ilvl?
strong forum
yes
tepid nest
What makes vulpera so good
How does block rating work? Is it just a flat amount of damage that a block removes from a melee hit?
blissful root
How do I decide whether to go Best Served Cold / Booming Voice or Anger Management / Bolster?
sweet summit
block/(block+k)
blissful root
Probably well-known information but I'm missing the info :C
sweet summit
block is block value on shield
k is k-value
depending on the content youre doing
bsc/am is more damage
bv/bolster is more defensive focused
with reprisal, you have enough rage (so u dont need BV, and high enough sb uptime so u dont need bolster) in m+
tepid nest
Yes but, the actual block value on my character sheet, or the result of that formula, is that a flat value which a block takes from a melee hit, or does that translate to a % damage reduction in a similar way to armour?
Hope that makes sense
sweet summit
% damage reduction
tepid nest
I see, thanks
blissful root
Thanks @sweet summit that's what I expected, but I still see people like Plka using Booming Voice so thought I missed something
Ah yeah, probably due to the high key factor then 😉
So anything below +20 just go bsc/am I suppose
Is taking some time to get used to charging/intercepting around for the SB uptime tho
inland raft
Its really down to personal choice between bsc and bv
Want more aoe damage bsc want slightly more st damage and a free 40 rage on demo go bv
blissful root
Probably better stick with BSC as I still have some snap agro issues on my warrior atm
Last question and I'm out of your hair; How do you guys deal with melee explosives? As we run Devastator it sometimes takes a while before I can smack it
inland raft
Not really our job, get ones you can but dont sweat it, mainly others job
sweet summit
its a team effort tbh
inland raft
Ones that spawn at range you can throw
blissful root
We usually tank+healer it so DPS can focus on smacking mobs on my main
sweet summit
just target them and hope u auto attack/use SS
tepid nest
Guys, realistically what sb uptime do you see? I hear plenty of people saying that 60%+ should be standard, with 70 possible. I rarely get above 50% but I don't feel like I am missing out on much reprisal usage
tepid nest
Yes, that's what I figured
inland raft
Only thing that matters is effective uptime
tepid nest
I'll have to log my runs and take a look then
sweet summit
i have no idea what raw uptime i have on SB
tepid nest
Raw uptime did seem a silly thing to track to me