*as long as your shield is 184
#protection
signal plover
strong wyvern
Ok, i might be able to get there before tuesday. I got LFR sheild from cov quest
signal plover
Preferably higher
uneven mason
If the rest of the raid is 215ish you can probably be carried up until SLG at 180ilvl, holding aggro off of your co tank would be the largest problem you'll encounter.
strong wyvern
yea, it will probably be prot pally and he does like 4k 😦
uneven mason
thats expecting near perfect blocking on Sludgefist tho
sub 30% he'll chunk you
Yeah, hah similar, I did a normal alt run on my 171 BDK and my co tank was a 215 pal
I was like "I'll just taunt for bite if you can stop attacking for that 2 second stretch"
BUt yeah even over 200 SLG and Sire are going to rip you apart
strong wyvern
We probably will skip sire at least. By the end of the night everyone is a bit drunk for it to work out
uneven mason
heh
strong wyvern
We take a few pulls and then call it usually
uneven mason
You've got those boys being like "hehehe I made Remornia poke you in the butt!" as they drag impale through the raid?
strong wyvern
pretty much
uneven mason
Thats ok, my raid is at that point, and they're mostly sober
signal plover
Man if venthyr weren't so butt ugly remornia would be simp city
strong wyvern
we're either all trying to pad our parses or scumbag and get people killed
lusty karma
Sire is a fun fight
Figured out his teleport and that made it a fair bit easier, but just gun in general
It's weird though, he seems to work differently depending on the race/class of the tank, no clue but I'm guessing the code is jank for teleport
chilly brook
Thanks for making me feel like I wasted a majority of my time in the last 10 weeks
timber nest
gonna be doing some pulls on inerva mythic tonight. any tips? were doing the burn strat so probably not much to say other than face the images and dont stand in the aoe circle at the end.
shut summit
Yea pretty much, go AM, can deflect big add cast when you're tanking it
ocean bloom
outer solstice
what boss we on about?
shut summit
not very important but just something to do
mild compass
What does everyone think of the shield wall change? Will Unbreakable Will perform better than The Wall now?
outer solstice
nah
I mean shield wall is not changed
it's a technical changed to set up unbreakable will
might have some niche use maybe, but you lack all the rage and CDR from the wall... that beign sad it would be a very nice intzeraction once we can wear 2 legendaries somewhere in the future
timber nest
should i be looking to use my CD's when im off tanking with stacks or during? i feel like the DoT will hit pretty hard and i dont want to divert too much healing from the other tank
shut summit
yea would only be really for some niche situation where its needed to keep squishy classes (hunters) alive
outer solstice
heck dem hunters!
waxen fiber
so thats still going ot be the best
ok
i have it, i just need to buy it etc
that makes it easy :p
arctic wasp
reprisal seems like a very nice legendary now, any thoughts??, on paper seems really awesome to start pulls in m+
outer solstice
reprisal might be very good once the patch hits....
if it hits with the current values
waxen fiber
well, that's what im thinking
shut summit
yea it'll be strong in current iteration
arctic wasp
if you think about it that will allow us 100 % uptime to blockshield
waxen fiber
i feel like you can't go wrong with wal, especialyl since im not a good player
arctic wasp
plus some extra rage
outer solstice
you get a lot of extra rage from wall
and with all the tank swaps you have very high block uptime anyway
arctic wasp
that's true
i was thinking more in m+
but yeah in raiding i think i'll stick to wall
outer solstice
yeah for M+ I think reprisal is pretty strong if it does live as is
I can see them drop the effect from intervene
waxen fiber
wall is going to be safe all around tho
was going to go wall, but wanted to make sure i wasnt going off meta for new patch
outer solstice
wall is a gamechanger shrug
arctic wasp
i already have wall 4 and thunderlord 2 but with this new change i'll wait to get thunderlord 4 because if it goes lives like that i will totally get reprisal
waxen cradle
OMG so many declines for being a Warrior tank trying to do keys, I have a very itchy reroll finger guys, it might just happen until 9.1, hate to do that to my Warrior, but it might be something I am about to do
outer solstice
on what level you're trying?
strong forum
dont be a bitch
waxen cradle
15's
outer solstice
we're 100% fine for 15s, I'd say even better than other tanks as we can facetank nearly everything in 15s
but delices are often not because of ourselves, but maybe because someone else signed up
waxen cradle
15's and up mainly, I am just tired of getting declined for keys because people want DH's or Monks or anything but a Warrior
strong forum
try to find people to play with, dont pug
outer solstice
I am sooo bad at M+ and somehow we still timed mists 15 after the raid xD xD
finding ppl to talk to and have fun with makes M+ 500 times better
vestal peak
question pls guys, when tanking Sludgefist is there any benefit on making prot warriors be the main target of the boss or the dps is distributed the same between both tanks?
waxen cradle
Yeah that's the tough one too, finding enough people that trust a Warrior tank to make a group and run with it each week when they could just run with another friend who plays a Monk or DH. That and honestly I do not feel the leggo changes in 9.0.5 will make enough of a difference to reshape the community's opinion of us sadly
flint cliff
I heard ppl talking in a friends dc that prot warrior might become (S/)A-tier tanks for m+ with next patch. This all bc of the reprisal changes and synergy with double time/intervene and overall higher SB uptime or what is it all about?
outer solstice
question pls guys, when tanking Sludgefist is there any benefit on making prot w...
nah it's a misconception that was on tanknotes
strong forum
question pls guys, when tanking Sludgefist is there any benefit on making prot w...
distributed between both, doesnt matter who takes what
both get hit for 42k or w/e
before mitigation
outer solstice
yeah 100% the same hits
strong forum
there is no Zaqul shared dmg
or main target dmg mitigation lowers 2nd target dmg
its both same damage
vestal peak
so the "main tank" didnt mitigate the dmg, will i be taking the same dmg as him or my mitigation will negate that?
outer solstice
I heard ppl talking in a friends dc that prot warrior might become (S/)A-tier ta...
for coordinated groups it's a lot due to the pending necrolord changes
strong forum
its seperate
you get meleed he gets meleed
neither one has to do with the other one
completely seperate
vestal peak
make sense guys, thanks alot for your help
thorn viper
just dont piss into the wind
strong forum
open mouth if you do
outer solstice
that's general good advice
@flint cliff besides the necrolord changes reprisal is very good for M+ I guess, but wouldn't bet on everything going live as is on PTR rn
cinder nova
I love doing a 15 HOA and having the feral druid not specced Mass Entangle on a Griev/Fort week
Then complain that I should've told him to spec it.
cinder nova
Yeah really holy fuck.
"Why would I ME it's sang"
???
Just don't ME them when they're in sang
outer solstice
0 self-responsibility I hate that
cinder nova
I'm so tired of failing keys from shitty DPS that think they can coast on being carried.
outer solstice
talked to my M+ guide... he said as a joke what's the role for DPS: to bring mobs to us
cinder nova
Also holy fuck Hpriest feels anemic as hell on griev/fort
Then again Hpriest always feels anemic in M+ tbh
cinder nova
She was doing like 5K HPS and I was never getting topped
outer solstice
lol xD
cinder nova
Always just barely above death
outer solstice
she used guardian spirit at all on you?
cinder nova
Yeah.
Hpal I ran with in my last run basically never had an issue and was a total chad
Hpriest always feels shit
outer solstice
I bet she was just bad
as many Hpriests that can play go voer to disc
I just refuse to play disc xD
cinder nova
Just feels like it's not a good spec for M+ tbh
outer solstice
it's abotu as unsuitable as healer as we are as tanks
viable for any normal content
not top notch for absolute top level
healers are soooo close together
cinder nova
They have so little preventative care and they don't seem to have the throughput to actually keep anything alive.
Nah
I've always had issues with Hpriest
Never had any issues with any other healer
outer solstice
well Hpriest is a reactive specc
cinder nova
Reactive play is dogshit
outer solstice
yeah as I said, probabyl because she played horrible
cinder nova
And therefore not a good parallel to prot
outer solstice
reactive healer + preventive tank works quite good
cinder nova
Have LS
That's about it
Even then, you should be using it proactively
But if for some reason you get chunked you can always slap it
outer solstice
I know...
I'm talking about Hpriest being reactive healer
and she was probably jsut shit
holy is perfectly fine for M+
do you have a log of the run?
cinder nova
If it is I've yet to find one worth the effort.
Group literally fell apart 3 pulls in
cinder nova
HoA. I only had 2 stacks of dog bleed and I was like a mile from the adds standing there waiting to get topped up
Just kept ping-ponging between 28K and 16K
cinder nova
Then all the Hpriest I've ran with suck
cinder nova
Because I've yet to find one worthwhile in M+
cinder nova
I mean, not really - most people don't even know a prot warrior lol
outer solstice
same for Holy Priest man
outer solstice
but yeah I don't bother playing holy priest in pugs either,... as ppl will just get mad before the dungeon even starts
for not playing disc
give holy a try yourself, you have like 100000 buttons to press and many of them are traps
it's very easy to mess up if you don't go deep diving into the specc
wicked lantern
I’ve never seen a Hpriest in M+
outer solstice
did it in BfA too and my friend called me a unicorn xD xD
amber herald
we synergise badly with hpriest because one of their 2 externals increases healing done which is useless for us
but pretty good for every other tank
outer solstice
it's OP on DKs though
but Hpriest heals so much they should not ahve to rely on a tanks self heal during GS...
amber herald
I imagine it's pretty awesome with pala as well
It's that it lets them forget about the tank during aoe situations
outer solstice
well paladins get spiked so hard you can't rely on them to top themselves
amber herald
so they put it on the tank and only have to heal 4 people instead of 5
but with warr it's no different
outer solstice
well you still do the same and pop epihany on the tank and then rotate flash heals
amber herald
what's ephiphany? this is all 2nd hand what my priest told me
outer solstice
it's a massive single target heal
that you reduce the 1 minute CD off by using single target spells
you barely use your group heals as holy priest in a 5 man
you mainly spam single target heals, which get replicated on the last target you casted it on as well
if you play the correct talents that is
anyway, good night ❤️
amber herald
nn
warm dirge
if im making thunderlord leggo boots. what missives should i have on it
waxen fiber
Beat piece to put “the wall” on?
gaunt dove
Shoulders for stat budget
median tulip
if im making thunderlord leggo boots. what missives should i have on it
Haste/Versa
spice yacht
Trying to balance stats are these good or do I need to switch to more haste?
median tulip
That's about the right amount of Haste
waxen fiber
what stats do people normally put on their shoulders for the wall
spice yacht
what stats do people normally put on their shoulders for the wall
haste vers
median tulip
what stats do people normally put on their shoulders for the wall
Haste/Versa
waxen fiber
ty
last mason
i think the 20 pride in spires is the hardest of any dungeon rn
literally pug annihilator
mystic zodiac
So im in the middle of rerolling from vdh to prot. Do you think its worth going necro now with the changes to 9.0.5? Tbh i feel like id have a better time with NF but necro seems really interesting too.
lavish oracle
the 20 pride? right in front of the boss?
@mystic zodiac Probably not worth it for most players, but really which covenant you choose probably won't limit the level of content you complete
chilly brook
Trying to balance stats are these good or do I need to switch to more haste?
Stop caring about stat %
You cant get enough haste
And your ilvl is the only thing that matters until you can't replace that piece of gear with something higher
mystic zodiac
literally pug annihilator
We've been ccing the mender and pulling it with the boss
mystic zodiac
<@!293647632989945857> Probably not worth it for most players, but really which ...
I think so too. Just pretty torn atm coz i like both covs and i dont have a necrolord tank yet lol. Also play with a coordinated group - hunter monk mage as dps if that makes any difference with necro. For NF i might miss out on the aoe burst threat and i guess the cc
lavish oracle
Honestly, Goliath and Mender are both fine to kill with pride
just keep it on focus for kicks and cleave it down with pride
tardy parcel
pull before ventunax has been the pug killer for me so far. have yet to have a player cc an add without it breaking immediately
spice yacht
Stop caring about stat %
see I was stacking Ilvl and had like 28% vers and only like 11% haste and it felt akward. IDK
chilly brook
see I was stacking Ilvl and had like 28% vers and only like 11% haste and it fel...
It can "feel" awkward and still be better....
mossy peak
you're not really going to "feel" a few percent of anything anyway
chilly brook
^
spice yacht
It can "feel" awkward and still be better....
okay, every thing I read made it sound like I HAD to have 20% haste
thanks for the help
chilly brook
no lmao where did you read that?
spice yacht
here lol
chilly brook
someone is peddling bullshitteroni then
spice yacht
lol kk then ill go back to the slightly higher Ilvl build
tardy parcel
tfw failed to time 4 back to back spires 15 pugs by a single minute because dps be dumb... last dungeon for ksm fml
modern brook
Just pull it
i did this
accidentally faught goregrind with a prideful
ez +1
how do ppl honestly brick keys?
idgi
lavish hare
Do you know if Vial of the Sands is usable in the Maw? I figured since its not a mount...
uneven mason
@chilly brook Well, I'm done with progression, good number to leave it at.
lavish hare
😞
mellow patio
I imagine that would have been tested berimba
uneven mason
how does one not get absolutely destroyed phase 3 Sire?
cause that boy hits like a freight train through SB
chilly brook
cause that boy hits like a freight train through SB
mythic heroic?
uneven mason
heroic
these boys
actually reviewing a bit I'm not getting hit hard, I'm just not getting healed back up
*that hard
modern brook
is R.io busted for anyone else?
I had to set my region the the us
Idk why but
Maybe it was a change pushed on an update?
wet compass
So anyone else really sad that bc is going to be on the nerf everything patch 😦 looks like I have to pray for live instead of going and chilling in bc land for a couple months
final solstice
They explicitly said raids are the most unnerfed versions
wet compass
thing is the class balance changes will naturally nerf the raids
grand drum
wet compass
Okay so the issue with putting in the rebalances is the first raids weren't tuned with them in mind which makes them an absolute joke. In classic mc and bwl were tuned with the expectation of classes doing literally half as much damage as they were doing due to later patch changes. It will be similar in bc.
Also if you have log link log 🙂
mighty valley
They would have to deliberately tune them higher than they ever were to make them difficult to today's raiders
You can probably find a private server that does that if that's what you're looking for
wet compass
I mean not make them difficult but make them the same level instead of fall over snore easy
mighty valley
MC and BWL were both easy at the time, they were cleared by tons of semi-casual guilds where over half the raiders barely knew what they were doing
wet compass
like mechanics wise they obviously won't be difficult but there is a massive difference in how a casual guild is progressing through naxx vs everything prior because the tuning of the classes in their current state was only taken into account for Naxx much like it will only be taken into account for sunwell
obviously stuff will fall over for the people going crazy overgeared full gm gear etc but even for casual guilds mc didn't used to be a fall over dead the first night which is largely due to numbers tuning doesn't have to be hard but needs to not be clear the first raid night level of easy
mighty valley
it had nothing to do with numbers tuning and everything to do with people just not knowing the game like they do now
except a few cases like release c'thun
wet compass
Dude you are just wrong lol. Classes are doing literally double the dps they did in classic wow isn't a deep game we didn't learn how to press frostbolt harder very few innovations were made outside of fury prot the majority of this is because the class balance was from the patch right before bc along with the gear rebalancing
Like imagine if bfa "classic" was released but corruption was in from the first raid tier
that's the level of difference in damage we are talking about
mighty valley
I don't know what to tell you, I was there before all of the class talent redesigns, my guild was dumb as fuck, we didn't have good raid comps, people died to random shit constantly, and we cleared BWL in a weekend
there just wasn't high pressure to have good dps
wet compass
BWL took 77 days to clear dude ....
mighty valley
we didn't do it on launch weekend, but once we'd built the stable group that got through MC, we blasted through BWL
wet compass
before or after zg came out?
mighty valley
probably after? I don't remember, our guild mostly ignored zg
wet compass
zg was a major talent rebalance and more importantly had this
The debuff limit has been increased to 16 (from 8). In addition, the client will now display all 16 debuffs.
1.8 which was dragons had more major talent rebalancing
again there are a ton of small changes throughout the life of an expac that add up to if you went back to the start with current systems you could clear stuff with half the raid hell we did that last expac in phoenix a bunch unless it was a mog run mythic uld was usually a 10 man sell and that was for legacy which is first come first served
mighty valley
yeah, of course it got easier, but even at the hardest it ever was, today's raiders would clear classic raids day 1 every time
there's just nothing to learn or have to practice to execute well
wet compass
if you took players who hadn't done the fights and didn't give them video no an average raider would not, now a ce level raider sure but an average raider is likely around 3 to 4 into heroic right now.
You have to realize that the private server guilds have done those fights hundreds of times. The other guilds that took several weeks to clear naxx is what you can expect from average raiders because those are made of average raiders
mighty valley
but that's the reality, they're classic bosses, so people will go in knowing how they work
casual guilds would struggle with heroic nathria if they didn't watch boss guides but that's not very relevant
i just think it's unrealistic for people to expect to capture the exact experience they had the first time, and also see that experience through rose colored glasses
wet compass
Not the exact experience just not fall over in one night to casual guilds
Also a lot of guilds struggled in heroic nathria I think only like 300 guilds cleared it the first week
sweet summit
Game was a lot simpler back then
You can not compare current tier to very very old tiers
Game has chaged a lot
Players have improved
Addons/WAs has improved
wet compass
sure but double the damage based off of re-balancing sure doesn't help in terms of non trivialization
sweet summit
🤷
strong forum
People rn know how to gear more properly and use voice comms, back then that was not a standard thing.
wet compass
The only raid that was released in classic actually tuned for the dungeon gear and talent re-balance was naxx it's not a coincidence that's the only one that took average guilds a couple weeks to clear. Not saying it's hard just saying tuning makes a huge difference in whether it's fall over easy or not.
chilly brook
I mean dude
Naxx got slapped in classic
And you're also talking about 40 people having to actually perform decently
It's already a struggle to get 20 people to not have their heads up their asses
wet compass
It got slapped by people who were running it for years for most casual guilds it lasted a few weeks. It was also the only one tuned with the changes in mind
So basically wait until sunwell to have something tuned half correctly
strong forum
Pretty sure regular guilds cleared it in 1 day aswell
A few hours for people that weren't private server andys
Pugs even
Tbc is gonna get destroyed the same way, so will wotlk
A couple raids won't fall in sub 2hrs in wrath, but will be cleared day1
jagged pier
its 'amazing' what years of knowing what the best specs and comps are and all the strats
dry spear
when sunwell comes out and they put in the unnerfed version of muru in. guilds still stomp that boss. sunwell was a guilddestroyer back in the days.
sterile bluff
Anyone know how necrolord protection warrior is perfoming in PTR im curius if its going to be new meta tank or not for m+
strong forum
Na i doubt that alone will make prot meta m+ tank
strong forum
Potential is there, but you're not gonna get a definite answer until top end people actually commit to rerolling and pushing
wet compass
thing is we just don't have the dh tool kit giving 400 mastery is great but it doesn't do much if you are a smear on the pavement
runic crown
Is Necrolord good for prot after the buff?
outer bronze
better for raid than in m+ i guess
sweet summit
Its not terrible anymore 
rare dagger
Is stuff not gonna limit players ? Even if it didn't seemed to be an issue for the first raids of Classic, I remember back in my BC private server, if you didn't have your hit cap as a war fury you were doing 0 damages
sweet summit
Why bring a tank when you can bring a rogue 
ionic fern
Think is 400 mastery on demand for lets say fire mage is insasne
It can have value in higher push groups which are cordinated enough to plan their pulls around it. Also has value in mythic raiding for burst windows and the Fleshcraft DR but for your average player nf/kyrian will still most likely out perform.
strong forum
thing is we just don't have the dh tool kit giving 400 mastery is great but it d...
Wdym dh toolkit, the only thing we don't have is aoe silence and instead of grip we have shockwave
Giving 400 mastery to firemage and boomy can outweigh the differences, but vdh is probably still going to be better
Cuz it simply does do more damage and gives the 5% buff
patent marlin
What do people think about the new unbreakable will legendary changes for m+ context?
jagged pier
still shit on its own
lusty furnace
400 mastery isn't even that huge for Fire. Like it's free stats but Mastery is very meh in aoe. I'd keep a much closer look to Reprisal for m+ viability than Banner
wet compass
Wdym dh toolkit, the only thing we don't have is aoe silence and instead of grip...
it's more about the sheer durability and ability to keep threat from ranged. Also I think havoc is going to start sneaking into top comps if they keep getting aura buffed. We will see though. Once we get 2 legendaries it could get very interesting
ionic fern
Reprisal is broken in m+ ..or any content where the majority of the damage is blockable..that's already known.😂
There are some dungeons that will still favour The Wall tho depending on the damage type.
sick sentinel
Yea if Reprisal goes live A LOT more Prot Warrior representation in Mythic+ will be seen lol
wet compass
I wish condemn's reduc was an aura buff on the warrior instead of on the mob would make it much more justifiable
lusty furnace
Not disagreeing with that Mwahi, I just think the discussion is more productive to keep an eye on Reprisal nerfs rather than if Banner would make Prot meta ^^
Otoh I wonder what they'll end up stripping away from Reprisal, rn it's just overloaded with effects lol
wet compass
Make Condemn an aura buff and give us sudden death as a talent and warrior becomes a very interesting pick and not overpowered imo but they won't do that
median tulip
Make Revenge! procs give free execute/condemn
surreal monolith
do hunters not have bursting shot?
median tulip
do hunters not have bursting shot?
Is that the knockback?
surreal monolith
yes
median tulip
MM only I think
surreal monolith
this mf
no interrupts, no knockbacks from anyone in the group, no nothing and I'm getting all the hate from this one mouthy hunter
median tulip
If he letting mobs stand in sanguine like a dickhead?
dry spear
how do you use LS generaly? to get the shieldblock up when on CD or for the HP increase? or just both and as holy shit button?
surreal monolith
then the hunter left and killed the key
surreal monolith
especially when they make it the tanks fault lol
I just shouldn't pug, just end up raging
strong forum
how do you use LS generaly? to get the shieldblock up when on CD or for the HP i...
As you would use SB
If you know its a bigger pull use it early to get the CD rolling on it
You can chain LS-SB-SB-SB-SB
Can probably even chain like 5or6 SB
dry spear
got u
outer solstice
Afaik war is dogshit dps in tbc, so you just don't bring warriors 👍
You bring 1 arms warrior for the debuff... And you have to do some swingtimer slam casting BS to be remotely viable with the debuff
wet compass
fury warriors with glaives could pump but they rarely got them
outer solstice
Rouges with glaives pump more
wet compass
well yeah but if you don't have rogues them going to warriors isn't bad
our gm was a rogue who missed two raids total and one glaive dropped each time when we had no rogues in the raid so they went to the warrior lols we always said he should take more days off so we could get more sets
outer solstice
Yep, but as I said, you want a good slammer over a good fury
heavy sail
I don’t think windfury abuse will be possible without spell batching
wet compass
I mean everything pre sunwell will fall over since it won't be tuned with the balance changes in mind
The real question is can hunter do the one button macro
heavy sail
Yes
outer solstice
I don’t think windfury abuse will be possible without spell batching
It's mostly about the debuff arms brings
heavy sail
Yeah you still bring them
outer solstice
You sadly wouldn't give WF to the arms
wet compass
also can't boost a shaman or paladin 😦
outer solstice
But still autohit/slam
heavy sail
Warrior is kinda dogshit in TBC.
unique shale
i rage starving in raid anybody can help me out ?
heavy sail
All around
outer solstice
That was no problem of dorll batching, it was due to an issue with the autohits
heavy sail
They have their niche in arena
wet compass
what? Prot warriors are the god of tbc sir
outer solstice
i rage starving in raid anybody can help me out ?
Got a log?
heavy sail
With mace stuns
unique shale
Got a log?
yeah
wet compass
crushing still exists in tbc
wet compass
and mechanics like sheer
outer solstice
Can someone look at angelnilias log regarding her ragegain? Still at work, can only glimpse at it
heavy sail
I don’t think tankiness is a facet that’s going to matter at all, I mean look at current classic
You bring deep fury prot
Because threat is the biggest issue
wet compass
Because you can still pop shield block while tanking shield block itself is what matters because it pushes crush off the table
heavy sail
Prot warrior is still better than feral until like
outer solstice
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/fazMhJVFvwW4rK8X
Shield slam looks a tad low but fine
heavy sail
Sunwell? Probably
wet compass
So you have 16 condemn casts and 50ish revenges not really a surprise you are running low on rage
heavy sail
But it’s not the god class of TBC by any stretch
wet compass
where exactly are the problem points specifically like you don't have rage for block or you just feel low on rage?
outer solstice
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/fazMhJVFvwW4rK8X
You seem to have quite low haste, I get around 60 CPM overall, you're at 45
jagged pier
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/fazMhJVFvwW4rK8X
your SS CPM a little low so your definatly missing procs there, your also favoruiting IP over SB which is very bad and will darin your rage a lot as your spamming IP
unique shale
You seem to have quite low haste, I get around 60 CPM overall, you're at 45
wouldn't having more then 20% haste makes it useless ?
jagged pier
u have 15 SB cassts compared to my 33
wet compass
You're constantly running your rage to 0 which isn't necessarily bad but it will make you feel like you don't have rage to spare for sure. and your sb is super low
jagged pier
you only blocked 20% hits against u
wet compass
where did this idea of more than 20% = useless comes from
outer solstice
where did this idea of more than 20% = useless comes from
Arms has a 20% Breakpoint
outer solstice
Our breakpoint is around 160% so don't bother or stop at 20%
unique shale
Arms has a 20% Breakpoint
ok thx didn't know that
wet compass
More haste is more resources which is always good
outer solstice
Happy to help
wet compass
you are spending all your resources on condemn and revenge and are taking a ton of unblocked hits
wet compass
especially in phase 3 sire will turn your into a smear on the floor doing that
jagged pier
you are spending all your resources on condemn and revenge and are taking a ton ...
i mean hes not hes spending a fuk tone on IP
heavy sail
If you’re wiping 11 times it’s probably also pertinent to stop running AM and switch to bolster
outer solstice
Yep
wet compass
jagged pier
yes cause hes favoruing IP
unique shale
wipes were progressing
outer solstice
But bolster won't fix that, need to use SB better and smartly
wet compass
he's also spending a bunch on condemn and rev it can be both 🙂
jagged pier
condemn is fine to spend it on
heavy sail
Just general advice I haven’t looked too deep
outer solstice
Or while offtanking, though
heavy sail
But when progging I would always run bolster until it’s not necessary
wet compass
while not actively tanking but not at the expense of shield block uptime
heavy sail
Except on specific encounters
wet compass
I like AM even when progging tbh only time I run bolster is if there is no downtime to regen charges
Have shield wall like every two mins is sick
outer solstice
But when progging I would always run bolster until it’s not necessary
I don't support that, bosses with regular tankswaps don't benefit that much from it
unique shale
i had another problem when i tanking nothing and i have to dodging until the sword coming out what should i do ?
heavy sail
Only fight I’d say it’s objectively not worth under any circumstance
wet compass
only times you aren't tanking on that fight are phase 1 and phase 3 you should be actively swapping one of you on sword one on boss during phase 2 if sword isn't hitting you hit boss and dodge
heavy sail
Is inerva
outer solstice
also be close to the boss when he's casting so you can take the boss aspa without teleporting
unique shale
and running through mirror were so scary since i wasn't facing boss and iwas taking too much damage
outer solstice
only times you aren't tanking on that fight are phase 1 and phase 3 you should b...
Sword is gone for quite long times though
wet compass
true but then you just dps waiting for sword to come back
outer solstice
Yep
wet compass
so yeah hit boss and dodge
but make sure to not have both boss and sword on one tank
outer solstice
It's fine just before the cast
unique shale
if i run backward i cannot make it in time
wet compass
strafe
wet compass
strafing is something you need to get used to doing as a tank
unique shale
unless we are tanking pretty close to mirror
outer solstice
You should always have him at the mirror for the hand
wet compass
strafing moves the same speed as running foward but doesn't give your back to the boss
also yeah he should always be at the mirror for hand
unique shale
how strafing moving work 
wet compass
go to your keybinds and bind whatever your current turn left turn right are to strafe left strafe right
unique shale
btw anything can you SR in sire beside pools ?
wet compass
second pin
torpid saffron
What do you guys think about the legendary buffs coming in 9.0.5 ? Do you think we will change Thunderlord and Wall from our BIS ? Reprisal looks kinda dope tbh
unique shale
second pin
i get no damage or reduces damage ?
wet compass
the second pinned link is a spell reflect cheat sheet
sweet summit
What do you guys think about the legendary buffs coming in 9.0.5 ? Do you think ...
Reprisal will get nerfed, so our lego prio stays the same is my guess
torpid saffron
Wait.. where did you see Reprisal will get nerfed ?
wet compass
Are they really going to bother nerfing the worst tank though 😛
sweet summit
Its obv too strong as it is now on ptr
torpid saffron
I don't think so.. Reprisal is the only good legendary that we could possibly have
And the only thing that could help prot stand on his feet
wet compass
I mean wall is pretty damn good we are just badly tuned
sweet summit
Ah yes 100% uptime on block is not too strong
lofty widget
what would the nerf even be? rage maybe? but even then its still strong
sweet summit
wet compass
I see no issues 😛
lofty widget
other nerf would be to just revert it to what it was, or remove shield block entirely from the leggo
unique shale
the second pinned link is a spell reflect cheat sheet
i am there but there not many things you can SR to get less damage and blood price SR is not good cause we are controlling dps in phase 1
torpid saffron
But i guess you guys agree that Reprisal is the only lego that looks surprisingly good among those 2, right ?
sweet summit
Ya
torpid saffron
Cuz Seismic is kinda meh, as for +1 charge for Shield wall.. i don't think it's that good
wet compass
I mean SR is a Magic DR so literally anything that deals magic damage can be SRed to reduce damage intake
torpid saffron
Even tho you reduce party members' damage by 50% aswell, that one looks kinda bad too
sweet summit
Seismic is a lot better at what it already is good at
wet compass
it not being eaten in some cases is positive
torpid saffron
Yeah.. farming maybe
unique shale
I mean SR is a Magic DR so literally anything that deals magic damage can be SRe...
indeed
torpid saffron
I hope you won't be right.. and reprisal won't be nerfed, cuz that's the only way we can get some love ❤️
unique shale
yeah i gtg work on that
wet compass
You are actually putting into practice what we were joking about the other day in terms of heal parsing
Which is we would never hit block and spam ip 😛
unique shale
it was my first time in sire so i was in panic mod
torpid saffron
Prot warr doesn't have many issues in raid, it's kinda a good tank
Among the best
heavy sail
I think you’re underestimating reprisal
torpid saffron
In M+ however...
torpid saffron
underestimating or overrating ?
heavy sail
Underestimating
torpid saffron
I'm not underestimating it.. i know it could add a lot of value to prot
torpid saffron
We're fine in M+
no we're not
torpid saffron
We need it
heavy sail
Like I highly doubt it goes live
torpid saffron
Have you checked the charts ? For how many prots have done +15 keys or even +20 ?
outer solstice
DH is the outlier
lofty widget
all these naysayers, what do you expect will happen to it? like whats the nerf gnna be
torpid saffron
That says a lot..
outer solstice
I do 15s regularly
sweet summit
Ok
outer solstice
Which says nothing
wet compass
I mean prot warrior is good because we bring a battle shout
our damage is kind of trash
torpid saffron
Fury and arms are good aswell if you need shout
heavy sail
You could nerf it very substantially but not make it completely useless by having it be a proc chance
wet compass
for raids
sweet summit
@lofty widget Idk tbh, there is a reason i dont design legendaries 😋
heavy sail
For one
In fact that’s exactly how I think they will nerf it
If they don’t remove the SB component entirely
outer solstice
I think they'll remove intervene from it
torpid saffron
It's not that overpowered..like it's really good, but i think you guys don't understand that some attacks are not blockable
And with that lego we can spend more rage on our ignore pain and revenge so we can dish out more heal&damage
Problem solved
outer solstice
We have spellreflect and stuns
sweet summit
Im fully aware of that mate
heavy sail
Something like “Charge/intervene give you a 50% chance of replenishing an SB charge”
Or something of that nature
torpid saffron
That would be worse in terms of balance lol :))
outer solstice
Also... Do you guys microkite in M+?
torpid saffron
Every tank has to
Doesn't matter that we can facetank for longer
After our defs go down, we gotta kite like there's no tomorrow
outer solstice
You don't know what microkiting is, do you?
sweet summit
I dont push keys so i dont have to kite 😎
lofty widget
whats microkiting?
outer solstice
It's about offsetting swingtiners after AoE stuns
To not get blown away instantly
wet compass
if I was changing prot I would start with making the rev proc thing also allow use of execute/condemn before screwing with leggos but that's just me
lofty widget
seems like too much min/max for my smoothbrain
heavy sail
I think our defensives are fine and in-line or better than most tanks
Tuning could easily solve the “balance” problem
But reprisal in its buffed state is truly absurd
outer solstice
You just move out to one since of a pack just out of range of a few mobs, so that some of them have to walk a step @lofty widget
heavy sail
And I say that as someone who simps for Prot warrior
outer solstice
I think reprisal is a lot of QoL for M+
torpid saffron
It's about offsetting swingtiners after AoE stuns
i don't offset swingtimer after aoe stuns, however i try not to waste Shield Slam procs by having my swingtimer arround and checking it to see when my auto will land
outer solstice
... I'm talking mob swingtimers
torpid saffron
I think our defensives are fine and in-line or better than most tanks
dude.. DH has best mobility, 1min CDs
That's what is perfect for M+ in the current state
outer solstice
We have 45s CDs shrug
heavy sail
^
torpid saffron
Our CD's are strong.. but the CD's are too high
outer solstice
And pretty good mobility and CC
wet compass
DH has multiple big dick cds?
sweet summit
Meta fb
heavy sail
Meta is the only one I’m referring too
wet compass
also fel dev with meta talent
torpid saffron
In it's current state DH is best tank cuz it can kite easily while also going in from time to time to maintain aggro
wet compass
and their silence sigil is stupid strong plus double leaps and keep aggro from range
sweet summit
Fb is basically sw on a way shorter cd 🤷
outer solstice
They can maintain aggro while kiting
heavy sail
Not the best mobility
torpid saffron
- very good utility
wet compass
dh has the best mobility lol
heavy sail
torpid saffron
With silence sigil, kyrian sigil for a lot of dmg
wet compass
dh's mobility is directly targeted and doesn't get stopped by a pebble on a ramp like roll can
wet compass
the jumps are also crazy short cds
heavy sail
DH meta slaving is overstated, their main allure is that they snap threat quickly and pump.
torpid saffron
Our talents got nerfed, our cooldowns got nerfed, our damage got nerfed.. and with that Reprisal buff you dare saying it'd be too OP ?
torpid saffron
We need way more love to be OP
heavy sail
Like they aren’t extremely mobile kite monsters
wet compass
a few good utility spells lols
heavy sail
I don’t know where that narrative actually comes from lol
wet compass
wtf how are they not rofl
the fact they have double jump on a super short cd and don't have sacrifice tankiness for that movement unlike druid?
torpid saffron
Some dude tried tanking with a 187 DH and said that it felt better than a 216 Prot Pally
I guess that's fair
lucid bough
prot pala feels a little squichy sometimes
heavy sail
Prot feels awful
torpid saffron
same as prot warr without CD's
heavy sail
So no surprises there
lucid bough
dh has windows of almost full imunity
wet compass
they also have a slow field though which is nice in M+ even if it does dick all in raids
torpid saffron
But guess what.. as warr you need to face mobs to block attacks
As pally you don't give a shit
Armor = OP
wet compass
of course prot pala can also do 6k dps soooo
heavy sail
Eh
Nsm
They’re kinda limp dick post nerf
Like it’s still better than warrior or guardian
torpid saffron
Still 2nd best tank in M+ however
heavy sail
But they aren’t pumping like they were early on
torpid saffron
Why are we even arguing.. prot warr is the worst tank currently and the data shows it
wet compass
2 prot pally logs on sludge are at 6k atm lol?
torpid saffron
That lego could be the thing we need to help us stand up
torpid saffron
Also.. what slot will you guys craft Reprisal on ?
wet compass
I will wait to craft until changes are actually confirmed
wet compass
I rerolled so I'm behind in soul ash will likely only get to craft one second rank 4 besides wall which is alreayd made
torpid saffron
Data needs to be gathered in order to see what actually happens
sweet summit
You know feedback is a thing ye? It doesnt havr to go live before getting changed
PTR exists for a reason
torpid saffron
Sure, let all the DH's cry out loud cuz they're afraid about getting dethroned
Mf's
sweet summit
Let the dhs have their season. Warrior had an entire xpac 👀
heavy sail
Several entire xpacs*
heavy sail
I’m down with the game going through ebbs and flows of balance.
Homogenisation makes the game boring as fuck
wet compass
I'm not down with a fucking 3k single target gap while being at the bottom in M+ as well
warrior were mediocre in raids last tier but gods in M+. Mediocre in both is even fine not shit in both
sweet summit
Warrior is very good in raid and alright in m+ atm
wet compass
Literally are though? Lowest in damage done and any tank can survive at this point it's only early on in the tier where paper tank matters
Because they didn't want to bring an arms warrior to all fights but wanted shout in the raid
World first guilds use tanks for utility largely
which is why next tier will be double banner prot to simp for the boomkins if it isn't changed
heavy sail
What’s wrong with that lmao
Tank is a support class.
Sounds like you want to play private MoP servers
wet compass
I know right how dare I want to do that
torpid saffron
Let the dhs have their season. Warrior had an entire xpac 👀
say what ?
sweet summit
What
torpid saffron
Which xpac did warriors have ?
heavy sail
Literally the last one
sweet summit
What
sweet summit
What
torpid saffron
Before that, check logs
wet compass
For literally every none top 10 guild tanks aren't a "support class" they are just dps with more jobs because you can't maximize a banner type buff when your dps like the fire cause it's hot
torpid saffron
From 8.1 till 8.3
sweet summit
We dont talk about 8.0 i didnt play prot then
torpid saffron
Every tank was viable
strong forum
Viable and kings are 2 different things
dark lark
ignore pain on gcd has entered the chat
torpid saffron
And in 8.3 still every other tank could be played aswell.. warr was just better cuz the absurd Bastion of might trait
sweet summit
Spell reflect and safeguard
sweet summit
And dam ye
dark lark
Spell reflect is still amazing
smoky wave
*ignore pain on gcd has entered the chat*
shudders
torpid saffron
And for being king in a single patch (let's not even talk about the absurdity of balance in 8.3, cuz remember fire mage/bm hunter, etc.) you dare to say that warr was king a entire expac ?
strong forum
War was king in 3 seasons
dark lark
Soul split, corroded claws, shadow claws
wet compass
No king rules forever you know except locks and fire mages
strong forum
And rogues in pvp
wet compass
I don't like that class 😦
torpid saffron
Everytime prot warr is bad, people just say: "they will scale better with gear"
strong forum
Nobody likes that class
torpid saffron
The reason they were good in 8.3 wasn't jackshit about gear
wet compass
people must because they play it 😛
sweet summit
I have never said that
torpid saffron
Was about bastion of might+avatar being turned into our best defensive talent
- spamming Thunder Clap
Oh, also Into the fray gave 3% per stack
And Anger management reduced cd of Avatar and Demo shout aswell
strong forum
You're talking several different points at the same time m8
torpid saffron
Yeah.. well that didn't have a single thing to do with the "gear" that every guy says they need to "scale better"
strong forum
Pwar was king from 8.1 onwards
heavy sail
The playstyle is so shit for keys
torpid saffron
Pwar was king from 8.1 onwards
k
strong forum
Because of the changes they made to IP, introduction of BoM and people finally figuring out how to play pwar
jagged pier
i mean it was king in 8.0 if u knew how to play it just sayin
strong forum
And getting good starting gear, pwar is fucking dogshit without a certain ilvl
Moreso than monk or bear
wet compass
Honestly I like the new warrior it's just missing some damage and one more ability to hit
strong forum
Pwar has a hard time getting started
strong forum
Same as bdk does
heavy sail
Community perception of monk is just so high I don’t think any amount of tuning is changing it lol
strong forum
Yeah it will take a bit
heavy sail
And they’re still decent right now it’s just funny how it goes
wet compass
biggest reason for the amount of monk was ww wasn't good
but ww has fallen off before so who knows
torpid saffron
WW will only be good first two patches
sweet summit
"ScAiLiNg"
wet compass
WW was amazing in uldir
then they killed swift roundhouse
and it dropped to mid tier in bod then scaling became an issue
torpid saffron
Wouldn’t be sure of that
mark my word, and tell me how they will be doing in 9.2 or 9.3
heavy sail
Aight
strong forum
It's more down to balance changes than raw stat scaling
People like to ignore that
Alot
heavy sail
All the time
Constantly
Their scaling is bad and would be bad for a game that isn’t actively balanced
wet compass
well it's more that monk favored versa by a huge amount and any time a spec favors versa as it's best stat as a dps class scaling is going to bite it hard because other classes are going to hit breakpoints
sweet summit
I think you overestimate breakpoints
wet compass
Like versa should never be the best stat for a dps class or else the other stats are not balanced well
heavy sail
I don’t think anyone would argue against monk secondaries being a design flaw
wet compass
because versa does literally nothing other than raw +dmg
heavy sail
But that doesn’t mean they’ll be bad in later tiers at all
The reason they’re good now is tuning
And that can change at any point for any reason
wet compass
We will see what happens they also don't have a gamebreaking leggo currently their best dps leggo is just a haste stat stick when they pop their cds
bold turtle
I managed to yoink a 194 hymnal. Is it any good as a defensive?
jagged pier
i still used a 168 version up until last week
just for context
in dungeons only tho its dog in raids
bold turtle
for raids I'm using a 207 IQD and a 184 flame of battle
I have a 210 anima field emitter but idk if that's worth bringing to raids
strong forum
I'd run anima + hymnal
In your case
Anima is a great trinket, iqd is quite bad and flame of battle sounds like a WQ trinket and hymnal is the best WQ trinket
karmic plinth
what is hymnals full name?
bold turtle
damn, some shithead in M+ was yelling at me for bringing anima cus it wasn't a 'tanking trinket'
I think they ddidn't know what they were talking about
crisp dragon
What trinket is Hymnal?
ionic fern
Hymnal of the Path.
crisp dragon
I use 226 Hakkar + 220 Stone legion, couldn't imagine every switching that
modern tundra
depends on the content really
crisp dragon
I want to try Hungering trinket, but I already parse top 50 in HPS and DPS on every fight
modern tundra
i'd take a 226 phial in a heartbeat if i'd see it in my chest :p
crisp dragon
I already have one of those 226, it's decent damage, but not a lot of top DPS parses use it
Even my 100 DPS parse for Sun king uses Hakkar + Legion
modern tundra
kinda true
tropic cypress
Anyone swapping to Necro if the changes remain the same? And also, when you planning on doing it for max efficiency
ionic fern
Nope.
strong forum
Potentially.
modern tundra
if it remains as is i will be swapping
crisp dragon
A lot of others would not agree Nomeratur, it is a top pick trinket for most fights
strong forum
Like I said, I wouldn't
crisp dragon
Using it on Sludgefist, is great fun, it crits for 50k during burst phase
strong forum
Dreadfire crits for more 
crisp dragon
I dont have dreadfire >.<
modern tundra
phial is such a strong pick even for aoe
jagged pier
also most used trinket on sludge
strong forum
I'll prolly just use my 226 anima + decanter for the rest of the tier
Unless I get 233 dread + herald
crisp dragon
7% vs 7% for Hakkar/Phial
strong forum
Stupid using % for trinkets
crisp dragon
I was talking about Sludge Jakey
jagged pier
and phial on about half others
crisp dragon
But yeah, I agree, Phial is potentially best, but Im on that list you have there, without using Phial
jagged pier
its the same there XD
crisp dragon
Phial probably is the strongest if u have a long last phase since u can stack it on every target + Phoenixes, but who even cares??? it's a mid tier easy fight xD
strong forum
It's lowkey easier than hungering
Cuz there is no variation or anything
Hungering has variation
Also again, sunking parse is purely pad dmg
Nothing else
modern tundra
after the nerfs to sludge it's pretty faceroll idd
strong forum
Sludge you can still fuck up through numerous ways, sunking you can only fuck up if you consistently make several mistakes
wet compass
hymnal is honestly broken single target like massively overbudget
crisp dragon
Hymnal doesn't seem very strong, isn't a very used trinket on parsing
wet compass
feels like I'm going to be chasing a new hymnal each reset
that's because they have 233 and 226 across the board
modern tundra
hymnal is only strong if you legit miss the other better single target trinkets
wet compass
a 180something hymnal is probably on level with most 213s
strong forum
Hymnal does solid dps, it's just hard to get a good one
crisp dragon
Ah, in that sense, I see
wet compass
also it's a stupid high amount of vers
strong forum
Fuck the vers
crisp dragon
I dont think you can get it past 200 ilvl
wet compass
theoretically you can get a 203
strong forum
You're losing mainstat
crisp dragon
I already have 23% vers, so even for me picking legion trinket makes me sad
wet compass
but it's from the bastion cache only
strong forum
Which is why Sims don't wanna use hymnal over most 213+
Cuz it doesn't have mainstat
bold turtle
aside from hymnal, what's a good raid trinket?
wet compass
out of?
crisp dragon
bold turtle
I don't have a lot of good choices, hold on
strong forum
Decanter, anima, spike, Phial of purification, hakkar scale if you need the defensive, heraldry
Dreadfire vessel
Those are all the good trinkets
bold turtle
my decanter is only 184, but I do have a 213 spike
crisp dragon
I just cant really recall being saved often by my heart of alar
strong forum
That's why it's not mentioned
It's only good if you're undergeard or pushing 21+ keys
crisp dragon
Yet it's used so much by literally everyone else
modern tundra
i use heart when were starting prog on a new boss and then phase it out towards the kill
crisp dragon
I try to, but it just never saves me, I feel more confident using Hakkar
wet compass
frankly that's because most tanks are lazy
wet compass
and don't swap their gear
I mean that goes hand in hand with lazy usually but not always
crisp dragon
But maybe it's because I play Prot warrior, I know I'm supposed to mitigate damage preemptively so I know when to use Hakkar
bold turtle
oki, so for M+ i'm swapping to anima field (210) and hymnal (194), and for raids I'm going to use Spike (213) and Hymnal (194)
wet compass
in a lot of raids tanks tend to be the worst players since a low damage tank is easier to hide than a low damage dps imo
look for tanks who say they focus on defense instead of offense and run way the fuck away
bold turtle
ty so much gang, I was having a lot of trouble with trinkets
crisp dragon
Honestly, fuck tanks who dont try to parse high on dps
modern tundra
the famous "if the boss is dead and i stayed alive i did well" quote
crisp dragon
I manage to be a very effective tank in all aspects, if I need to have around 70% active mitigation uptime, Ill do that, while I still log 80+ in DPS and HPS
ionic fern
80+ is just playing your rotation correctly.
dry spear
Hymnal does solid dps, it's just hard to get a good one
what is a "good" one? like ilvl wise. 200?
crisp dragon
Indeed
strong forum
what is a "good" one? like ilvl wise. 200?
Anything higher than 187 I'd say
crisp dragon
Imagine not spamming Shield slam when its off CD
karmic plinth
on the trinket discussion - unsure which of these i should be using for defense - cant tell whether emitter or spike is better
crisp dragon
First week of HC I was top 1 in the world for HPS because I had shit healers
karmic plinth
just sim for tmi or literally just whatever gives me best dps throughput?
strong forum
Dps
karmic plinth
fair enough
crisp dragon
Any tips on how to make your raid team use more defensives? It seems like people dont understand they need to use them
wet compass
You have a 220 scale I hate you
crisp dragon
226 scale says hello
strong forum
Any tips on how to make your raid team use more defensives? It seems like people...
Brutally force them to
Yell at them
Laugh at them and yell at them when they die but had defensive and healthstone ready
Nothing more you can do
crisp dragon
@strong forum Becuase I legit think, combine all their defensives during the ENTIRE raid, I use Last Stand that often
strong forum
Welcome to dps players
dry spear
tankbros
crisp dragon
Even my paladin tank partner has ardent defender vs last stand be 13-50
dry spear
what do u put onto your chest?
strong forum
Stats
dry spear
skirmish or stats?
crisp dragon
Hairs, becuase you're not a girl
dry spear
Hairs, becuase you're not a girl
no brother. because there is no gras on steel
i thought bulwark was the goto
crisp dragon
But is Skirmish a DPS increase?
strong forum
Shouldn't
crisp dragon
Exactly, that was my train of thought as well
strong forum
But could
modern tundra
i think it does but it's extremely small
crisp dragon
Obviously it depends on luck, but strength matters so little
dry spear
yeah i go with stats
crisp dragon
Secondary stats > Main stat
crisp dragon
That's at least what I've been told
crisp dragon
@ionic fern
strong forum
He didn't tell you that.
crisp dragon
nah
strong forum
I can guarantee you that
modern tundra
i mean i'd take a bis statted 220 piece over a 226 mastery crit piece any day
crisp dragon
but he might be able to help
modern tundra
in the early stages of gearing ilvl > anything
crisp dragon
But obviously taking a 220 over 226 makes no sense since the stats are much better on 226
modern tundra
but when it comes down to smaller gains i'd take proper stats over shit pieces
crisp dragon
I'd rather not lose 60 haste for 60 mastery
but if it's more than 6 ilvls, you just sometimes have to
jagged pier
^^
dry spear
so +crit ++versa same ilvl is better then +crit ++mastery right?
crisp dragon
Hmm, that's nice
strong forum
At same ilvl yes
crisp dragon
I get that rings/necks are kinda wack to switch wrong stat for upgrade since its only stam
strong forum
I get that rings/necks are kinda wack to switch wrong stat for upgrade since its...
Yup, you can drop a couple ilvl for better stats on rings
You wouldn't catch me dead using a non haste ring
Or neck
lucid bough
ya imagine using the highest stat piece with versa
strong forum
Cringe
outer solstice
Haste