but that’s just me
#protection
undone jacinth
chilly brook
Anything above 1400 is basically dummy io bevause it's such a small portion that are pushing that high
undone jacinth
hmm
limpid pawn
At 1150 io I was getting zero invites as a tank lol
Now at 1400+ I get any key I want basically
chilly brook
People's thoughts on gearing this xpac
How anyone can think gearing is good is beyond me
limpid pawn
But I feel like 1400 isn't super high, I'd say to me 15-1600+ are the real good people
undone jacinth
there are good parts about it
when I get a 226 piece it feels super good to be done
lofty widget
gearing as a whole is pretty bad
undone jacinth
not terrible imo
mixed or bad at most
I like a lot about it, just not end of dungeon m+ and obviously raid is a complete joke
raid being the worst is making it seem worse than it is I think
chilly brook
I mean, super low drop rates in raid, m+ being useless outside of filling a weekly checkmark and the only real efficient way to gear for pve is to get 2100 in pvp is retarded
undone jacinth
because raid has always been one of the best for gear
fallow mortar
Blade dancers armor kit is bad for us, right?
undone jacinth
very
chilly brook
Blade dancers armor kit is bad for us, right?
Yes
Pvp gearing isn't enough to offset all the other bad shit
mellow patio
Pvp gear is basically free bis
undone jacinth
m+ weekly is good, end of dung bad, all of raid is bad including weekly and all of pvp is good
mellow patio
An ape at a keyboard can hit 1800
undone jacinth
I would say that makes mixed
chilly brook
An ape at a keyboard can hit 1800
I guess I'm a chimp then
undone jacinth
This might be pvp week with those affixes
chilly brook
This IS pvp week
mellow patio
Rbgs are so flooded with bad players right now that you can easily pve to 1800 or even 2100
undone jacinth
but 2100 in rbgs doesn’t seem enjoyable
chilly brook
Its honor week
mellow patio
Even 2200 rbg players rn are just worse than they used to be
undone jacinth
what’s Prot pala like for rbgs
chilly brook
Spin boi
undone jacinth
I’m used to that
mellow patio
Cause their self sustain base sitting is gross
chilly brook
But why play prot pala
limpid pawn
Eh getting rBG rating isn't that easy
mellow patio
I got to 1800 in a single day
limpid pawn
You have to be very selective with groups
mellow patio
2100 in a few days after that
limpid pawn
Joining just any group isn't a freebie
mellow patio
I yolod to 1800 by choosing low cr high ilvl players and playing pve in there
limpid pawn
What spec curiously
mellow patio
On my war I was arms
mellow patio
1650
mellow patio
Unfortunately that is on my dh tho bru so don’t feel bad
limpid pawn
I also main DH tank now
midnight stone
1650 as prot?
mellow patio
I think I could main prot pretty easily... I’m just not personally a fan of the play style anymore. Wasn’t for me
cold flame
can i challenging shout with a bop on me for a ghetto bubble taunt?
chilly brook
1650 as prot?
Why not
mellow patio
1650 as prot?
Nah bro scroll up lmao
midnight stone
Sorry, just tabbed over
mellow patio
All good my man
But I think I could do 1650 as prot
Many aspects of many dungeons are easier for prot warriors
gasp
undone jacinth
is the group that will stop you not the class
mellow patio
I had a druid melt my brain yesterday in a 20 NW
Absolutely zapped it
It was melting out my ears
Don’t pug kids
undone jacinth
Having to convince a boomkin to take trees in a 20 😂
chilly brook
I had a druid tank in my 4 DoS on my pally
Fuck that noise bro
Didnt think people could be that bad
@modern brook how do outlaw pvp
mellow patio
My favorite play is base sitting on my dh and a rogue thinks he can 1v1 me
uneven mason
I Mean, if he cloaks your eyebeams what do you have left.
mellow patio
And they can basically have a perma 40% dr on you
And meta
And cheat death
Rogues just die to attrition vs them
undone jacinth
when I was super geared early on in bgs I’d just demon spikes and the melee would kill themselves on it
undone jacinth
didn’t have to do anything
mellow patio
I take it back my favorite play is 1v1 vdh combat
Just being immortal and wasting time fighting each other
mellow patio
Was that before they made paladin healing reasonable in pvp
Instead of being an hpal with triple health and damage
undone jacinth
was a few weeks ago so before whatever nerf happened recently, we were feral ww and I’m not big brained enough to know wtf we are meant to do vs bop bubble other than run away
and hope he never heals
mighty valley
226 Stitchflesh ring from the vault, hell yes
mellow patio
MUST BE NICE BRO
modern brook
<@204081428869283843> how do outlaw pvp
swap to sub
strong forum
could prolly get up to like 1.8k this week without going intensly out of my way
but like
why
haughty sleet
Everyone still high on sun king trinket?
uneven mason
haste/str proc pvp trinket
umbral kernel
hey guys I just got shattered in mist +12 as a tank on the first packs, it's my first time tanking this one in fortified, are these pack that hard this week ?
strong forum
im using scale/anime emitter + decanter
solemn magnet
If people are interrupting spirit bolt or using SR, shouldn't be hard
umbral kernel
I'm trying to figure out what happened
umbral kernel
If people are interrupting spirit bolt or using SR, shouldn't be hard
I died on the pack before the mushrooms
the two casters were quickly dead, but the two other destroyed me
like no block mastery 100=>0 in 3s haha
patent osprey
Hey guys ^.^, This is probably a bad place for it, but because I saw some people asking for videos they could see prot warrior m+, I thought I would start uploading some to youtube. Lemme know your guys thought 🙂 If I shouldn't post this here please let me know and I will delete the message >.<
Feedback welcome in dms 😄
chilly brook
Hey guys ^.^, This is probably a bad place for it, but because I saw some people...
I'm no mod but actually not a bad idea, plenty of people could benefit
And I've done that several times hasn't been an issue so I wouldn't worry about it
patent osprey
I thought i would upload the bane of Prot warrior Keys first. the plaguefall
solemn magnet
^
native coyote
^
strong forum
#promotion is the better place for this, but if its not getting spammed, moreso just mentioned its okay
vestal moat
ummm what gauntlets do you have currently lol
undone jacinth
u dont wanna prioritise dps
vestal moat
yeah armor and stam very good cause you are a tank
old flame
I figured it was going to be the gloves, I just waned someone to check my brain.
vestal moat
if you have any kind of offspec there's additional value also. just a consideration.
old flame
sure wish it was a shield or more importantly a weapon. Gotta love rocking that 187 campaign wep because fuck drops yeah
strong forum
i mean theres no choice to be had
just get gloves
biggest ilvl gain and its a main armor piece
way more important than trinkets
chilly brook
I've had good stuff every week
strong forum
want that weppy for pvp
old flame
I guess I'll do more pvp this week. because that's how we gear yeah? 😩
strong forum
yup
uneven mason
can't wait to get home and be disappointed by my vault.
sweet summit
i got a 15 on my 58 druid 
chilly brook
Wat
sweet summit
59 now actually
chilly brook
You can do a key on a sub 60?
sweet summit
oh it was a 14
vestal moat
lollll
sweet summit
you dont get exp tho so its not good for leveling
undone jacinth
youre not meant to be able to go in to mythic until cap wtf
did they change that in sl?
undone jacinth
most excellent gaming
sweet summit
ye they probably fucked it in sl
undone jacinth
mortregar is just tuned different to every other wing right
lilac bloom
heroic sire attempt .. bolster reduces cd for last stand for 2min.. can i use it when sire cast hand of destruction everytime.. will it be up everytime then?
to avoid getting smacked by hand of destruction and sire
uneven mason
its a 2min CD, how often does he cast hand of destruction?
I mean..
if its less than 2min, no not for every one
lilac bloom
thats the thing i dont know.. i'm trying to sort out how am i suppose to live through that hand of destruction and going through the mirror.. without gettting 1 shoted
uneven mason
hit spell reflect, walk through mirror
he'll TP To you, you'll bounce his dmg from the teleport
lilac bloom
i thought sp doesn't work anymore
sweet summit
it doesnt
lilac bloom
so.... how am i going to live through that
uneven mason
?
lilac bloom
spell reflect doesn't work
chilly brook
thats the thing i dont know.. i'm trying to sort out how am i suppose to live th...
Wdym
sweet summit
healer external/shield wall?
unless you have a stack or two of the tank debuff you should be fine tho
chilly brook
You go through the mirror
And ignore hand
Then go back
You out range it because of the mirror
lilac bloom
i get smacked if i turn my back to him
uneven mason
Ripppp
chilly brook
And you or your cotank should bring him towards the mirror before hand of destruction anyways
uneven mason
Good to know going into that this week ><
strong forum
Shield wall covers it
uneven mason
fun detected
strong forum
Healthstone / health pot
Sr still reduces the dmg taken from hand
Use last stand if you're low just for the heal
Ask for an external
There are alot of ways to deal with it
chilly brook
I'm just confused
Because he shouldn't be getting smacked by both
Hand is negligible because you outrange it
strong forum
Shouldn't be any issues
Just use buttons
Mirror is the only time tanks take dmg in that phase
So use buttons
lilac bloom
ok
heady gyro
heroic sire attempt .. bolster reduces cd for last stand for 2min.. can i use it...
are you taunting off Wracking pains? That increases his damage to you a shit ton.
strong forum
You should swap on every wracking pain
heady gyro
yep
strong forum
So if you have debuff you never tank him
heady gyro
the first night I tried taking two and got melee'd for like 37k or some shit lol
mighty valley
going from prot warrior torghast to mage torghast was so bad, lol
i have to like... stop moving sometimes? wtf
lilac bloom
i survived yey
but i got kicked cos i accently walked right into wrecking pain while massacre was on
uneven mason
going from prot warrior torghast to mage torghast was so bad, lol
DItto on the shaman without the earth elemental lego
once shm gets that EE lego tho
lilac bloom
i did do spell reflect.. b4 i went through mirror
i dont know if that worked.. but during that time the other tank took the boss over to mirror and i had remora
mighty valley
it's 20% magic damage reduction even if you don't bounce something
undone jacinth
p3 is where it gets fun =]
oak gulch
can prot warrior kite the stoneguard on mythic council?
oak gulch
uneven mason
i mean that has transcend/roll but intervene/leap/grips
can confirm, leaper best lego for mythic council
shut summit
can definitely do it without but would make it easier with leaper
nimble drift
The vault blessed me with a 226 155 haste ring
Current ring is 200ilvl. Thank you blizzard gods
uneven mason
The era we now live in, excited for a big upgrade to the lead impactful slot
sick sentinel
i was watching my GM on twitch on heroic stone generals, but they gave up after a few wipes kept dying to wicked blade or whatever
sick sentinel
google tank notes, you will thank me later
nimble drift
Lol im aotc its a mythic guild. Im just hoping the guild is good
sick sentinel
i say that because i don't typically raid, more focus on m+, not great at either
buoyant pasture
My vault upgrade this week has 220 vers/mast bracers with a socket.. I am deciding between the haste gem or keeping the stats high on the item and socketing a vers gem in it. Thoughts?
strong forum
Haste gem
buoyant pasture
Okay
strong forum
Always enchant and socket haste
sacred quarry
How are people prioritizing vault upgrades? I got BIS pants and WIS weapon, both 20 ilvl upgrades. Not sure if I should be patient and take the pants or get the immediate gains from the weapon
distant crystal
what does it have to do with IP size O_o
but yes weapon ilvl > anything else's ilvl
ionic fern
sacred quarry
Good call on IP, hadn't thought of that
distant crystal
am i reading it wrong? it's 0 + AP * 3.5 * (1 + vers)
or maybe wowhead is just leaving out critical info there :p
strong forum
Guess where AP comes from
sweet summit
something something weapon dps is ap?
distant crystal
strength and mastery?
strong forum
Weapun damej
distant crystal
i...
don't think that's the case?
AP gives bonus weapon dps, weapon dps doesn't give bonus ap O_o
dark lark
If I intervene someone to try and mitigate a dot, do I have to do it before dot is applied or can I do it after the fact? I.E. 2nd boss of Spires
strong forum
Either way, big dick important
Before @dark lark
But I don't think you can intervene the dot
Haven't tested it
dark lark
Would Safeguard work after the fact?
strong forum
Safeguard is raw dmg reduction
sweet summit
yes
distant crystal
safeguard would mitigate it normally after the fact
strong forum
But yes
distant crystal
i would guess you can intervene to take the bleed yourself but haven't tried
seems like an attack that you could intercept to me
tardy sequoia
quick question, does remornia need to be tanked by the off-tank?
dark lark
What's the real difference between Intervene and Safeguard this expansion? Intervene says you take all hits for your friend for 6 seconds, Safeguard conduit reduces it by a certain %. So does that mean the hits that I'm taking reduce it by 13%?
strong forum
But you barely tank her she's just moves a shitton malaachi
dark lark
Or is the 13% damage reduction applied to my friend
sweet summit
safeguard is all damage they take
strong forum
13% damage reduction on the target
sweet summit
intervene you just take whatever damage gets intervened
distant crystal
damn 6 attacks now
strong forum
Intervene also only works against physical attacks
distant crystal
wasn't it 1 in BFA?
dark lark
But, don't I have to intervene to apply Safeguard...so aren't they not taking damage anyway because I'm taking it for them?
distant crystal
that's kinda juicy
sweet summit
you do
dark lark
@strong forum OHHHH
dark lark
Okay that makes a lot more sense
strong forum
It's a buff you apply, that in itself has no interaction with intervene except the application
distant crystal
@dark lark when you intervene, the next 6 melee/ranged attacks against them will hit you instead if they're in range, if you have safeguard they'll also take reduced dmg from everything
ah and so that's a conduit now instead of talent
strong forum
Ye talent was too strong
With 2 charges, 12sec CD and 30%
(but I never played it)
dark lark
literally only time i played safeguard in bfa was in tyrannical king's rest
Low mob density so I don't need clap radius, and the dots all the bosses put on hurt
distant crystal
apparently that @targettarget spam was pretty clutch in very high keys
sick sentinel
heres where im at, 705 SA remain, havent done any torghast this week yet, know can do r3 this week, 4 in 2-3
nimble drift
So what fights do I get more damage out of ravager than In the Fray?
Like, would stone legion generals be good for that?
sick sentinel
serious talk though guys, what raid trinkets at any ilvl do i need to focus on getting
nimble drift
get the stone legion generals and the sire trinket. those are nice
sick sentinel
LFR/N trinkets
mighty valley
stone legion and vintage. kt for prog bosses/dangerous keys. but like, you can't really "focus" on getting them lol, they drop or they don;t
undone jacinth
I swear I've seen that screenshot like 10 times
go get some higher ilvl items mate stop farming trinkets 😛
solemn magnet
i think chest is obvious. i have 203 currently
undone jacinth
indeed
sick sentinel
i don't know what the ring is off hand
undone jacinth
doesnt matter
sick sentinel
i personally like the organ, but i'm told its not great chest piece probably good option
sick sentinel
i chose to go with indentical bracers 194 > 213 today
the other 2 options i had was 194 > 210 chest other wordly influence (one we talking about) identically again, and uh, something else haste mastery, want to say shoulder,
but i just crafted r2 TW shoulder anyways, and probably about to do r3 as well.
ever comes a week there is no haste prolly just take the stygia
deft vessel
I know I should wear it, but it pains me that i lose haste
;-;
str, stam and armor make up for it I'm pretty sure
nova rover
Any suggestions
deft vessel
how big of an upgrade are the pants and what are your other trinkets
deft vessel
i'd go pants
midnight stone
pants
lofty widget
pants then
nova rover
❤️
deft vessel
can I please have a fucking shield game ;-;
I've done more than 25 top/mists/NW at 12 or higher
stoic mural
Hey prot team. Do you feel like taking big hits on packs when you go for Plaguefall? +10 felt rough if they dont kick or cc correctly with me
patent osprey
Hey prot team. Do you feel like taking big hits on packs when you go for Plague...
Most of the packs do some sort of fervent or magic damage. Warriors are really bad with taking magic damage. So yeah it hits pretty hard, but almost every pull you can spell reflect those kinda hits, so use it on CD 🙂
sick sentinel
im probably going to end up protest for keys this week
just dont want to deal with pepega pugs and bolster and necrotic and all that invovles, no sir
patent osprey
But also some of the attacks are % health loss disease effects, so try to have a disease dispell ^.^
stoic mural
I always do yup. But im leveling other tanks and felt you need to do more to be as efficient as other tanks to survive
You rely less on your mates
undone jacinth
the hardest part is the bomb management and wretched phlegm, which you can immune if you have a freedom on one of your other tanks or from a group member
once you get the bombs right everything gets easier
stoic mural
Btw they totally ignored the spiderlings pop, healer died 3 times in a row. Rip xD
undone jacinth
you can stop the spiderlings yourself mostly
stoic mural
Had to use CC for maldraxxus shield one
undone jacinth
storm bolt the shield
stoic mural
Im NF but i think ill go kyrian. Better for kiting i think
undone jacinth
then fear or shockwave the spiderlings
neat dirge
@ionic fern homie
undone jacinth
would never expect anyone to do anything 😛
neat dirge
does Forgelite Filter put phial on cd?
stoic mural
Thanks bros
rich charm
if i want to craft 1 prot leggo for m+ what do i go for ?
mighty valley
If you’re ever gonna raid, The Wall
undone jacinth
wall if you dont have any
mighty valley
If you’re never ever ever gonna raid, the wall or thunderlords, whichever you like the look of
rich charm
mkay, ill look a bit into either one of those then
harsh valley
yo guys quick question, bfa talents are still unplayable for pushing?
undone jacinth
BFA talents don’t really exist but if you mean AM UF then they aren’t very good for pushing
patent osprey
yo guys quick question, bfa talents are still unplayable for pushing?
They rearranged the Talent rows so yes it is unplayable
limpid pawn
might try thunderlords again today
patent osprey
If you want to do it strictly for DPS with thunderlord legendary then its fine, but not for pushing
limpid pawn
got the wall to r4, i think r4 thunderlords today
patent osprey
just takes some getting used to 🙂 its fine otherwise
harsh valley
talent set feel horrible to me
patent osprey
it revolves alot less around avatar and more around Ravager now. Also kite meta 🙂
limpid pawn
plka how do you deal w/ the down time in mitigation
seems like it's unavoidable on prot this season
do you just stack huge huge amounts of haste to smooth it out more?
cracking up lol
mighty valley
cover them with CDs or kite?
tardy sequoia
If you want to do it strictly for DPS with thunderlord legendary then its fine, ...
The wall better for pushing?
patent osprey
plka how do you deal w/ the down time in mitigation
There are a few ways to deal with it. Depends on the mob that your fighting and if you think you can just eat the next hit or 2 with ignore pain. Typically you fill it with any defensive CD such as Last stand or shield wall. Or you can use external cds like Ring of peace, Binding shot and generally kiting. Why I like the wall is that it makes your Shield wall with the conduit around 1.5 min cooldown so you can use it every other pull to fill in those gaps. I also have probably one of the least amounts of haste of any warrior haha. I purely stack verse so I don't die to magic damage or bleeds in 20+. So in the gaps I also don't get hit as hard.
patent osprey
The wall better for pushing?
The wall or TL is just preference. I am venthyr so I get a little bit less effectiveness from TL I think. But its only a small difference. I dont have a big damage cd like spear of bastion to match with demo shout.
ionic pewter
The vault was kind today
patent osprey
Pogggers
shut summit
ocean acorn
ocean acorn
What are u wearing currntly?
mighty valley
Probably take the biggest ilvl difference, skew weapon if you ever offspec fury
waxen cradle
220 Sinsmasher and 213 Crit/Haste belt from Nathria so neither are huge
mighty valley
girdle is good stats if I remember right?
waxen cradle
yeah it is just dont like the crit/mastery on my weapon as I am a haste/vers junkie but I can live with it
mighty valley
hm yeah i'd just go with the 10 ilvls increase
pure sun
So we runnin Kleia this week for necrotic stack drops?
patent osprey
Feels Venthyr man
lapis tapir
crit/hast vs crit/vers hmm
lofty widget
ilvl
mighty valley
it's you!! you have all the shields!!
sick sentinel
shield is always
if its upgrade, doesn't even matter everything else is null weapon and shield and number 1 upgrade no matter what
mighty valley
in this case, the person was choosing between two shields lol
lapis tapir
lol hence my prob with 4 ilvl diff
paper valve
Is playing AM + "The Wall" a better combo than playing Bolster + "The Wall"?
signal plover
Offensively, in raid, yes. Defensively, in raid, usually no.
paper valve
What about m+?
signal plover
That's a bit more complicated since TL leggo is also an option there.
paper valve
Would u say TL is better for low keys and TW is better for pushing high keys?
signal plover
Imo bolster is almost always worth it in keys 10+
TL vs TW is up to personal choice imo. They're very close. But like, can change depending on affixes and dungeon
paper valve
Is TL viable for pushing high keys?
undone jacinth
Yes
ebon tide
Whelp, anyone in here care for a good laugh at me? I've been running LFR CN since mid Dec for "The Wall" only to find out that it's account wide and I unlocked it week 1 on my Alliance toon
Talk about feeling stupid
undone jacinth
haha
ebon tide
I ... don't even know where to start with how I feel right now haha. I just assumed I'd have to find it again and didn't even dawn on me to at least look
But after like 6 weeks of it not dropping and getting pissed I finally opened up the power journal
shut summit
😬
paper valve
Arent raid memories a 100% drop chance anyways? 😛
ionic pewter
RIP
ebon tide
I "believed" the drop chance increased greatly for higher M+ keys and raids. I just thought it was suppose to be "high" for raids. Idk, oh well
undone jacinth
it’s 100 lol
paper valve
At M+10 and above they become 100% drop and on raids theyre always a 100%. not sure about lfr tho
undone jacinth
happens to the best of us
ebon tide
Well, you win some and lose some. I lose some today (and the last 6+ weeks) haha.
craggy harness
I don't have the trinket yet, but--- wonder what wierd UI thing the game is seeing for the Unused +12
undone jacinth
the amount of times I’ve started keys in dps spec and run in to the first pack only to notice I don’t have any of my spells...
paper valve
Is there an addon similar to advancedtooltips that adds more information to item tooltips cuz the addon is outdated and still shows info of BFA
versed bough
Since we cant sim whats best for our spec
You guys will be my simbot
Which one should I pick
Weapon is haste/verse
patent osprey
yeah 100%
sick sentinel
Is slimy consumptive trinket any good? The stam dungeon trinket.
limpid pawn
no
patent osprey
^ Depends on your alternatives but generally no
sick sentinel
restive flax
guys uh... I got this belt from an m+ just now and... I'm not entirely sure if I should equip it
its 7 ilevel better but it doesnt have haste or a socket
mighty valley
hmm, leech ain't nothing
i'd probably go with higher ilvl
if for nothing else than getting accepted into groups easier lol
pale epoch
is Kleia the go to for m+ this week?
surreal plinth
Hey all, I've been getting trinkets out the rear this xpac and am struggling to find the optimal setup. Anyone available to take a look?
I've got a 200 gluttonous spike, 210 Bladedancer's armor kit (tempted to vendor), 200 Splintered heart of Al'ar, 194 Anima Field Emitter, 184 Blood-Splattered Scale.
I've been using the Guttonous Spike and Blood-Splattered Scale for raid but am tempted to swap one for a 197 Phial of Putrefaction, 200 Skulker's Wing or 184 Spare Meat Hook.
wet sedge
Hey any opinions on my vault? Current trinkets are a 200 blood-spattered scale and a 200 sinful gladiator's insignia of alacrity. Other option would be 213 boots (replacing 200, basically same stats), or a 213 gluttonous spike
timber compass
Leaning on taking the shield. Biggest ilvl increase and shields are harder to get. Would you agree?
lusty sun
I've got a 200 gluttonous spike, 210 Bladedancer's armor kit (tempted to vendor)...
How do you like the Gluttonous Spike? I just picked one up in tonights raid to replace my 194 ilvl Blood Spattered Scale... The gluttonous is 213
sick sentinel
do i want to take the dragon 2nd boss to archer with cross bow add or the mage add casting spells add, so that it can be cleaved down
im pretty sure crossbow as he just sits there, and the mage should come when taunt/silenced.
also, should i be moving the boss away from adds after they die so group isnt getting blown up? i think we had 2 hunters and a mage, they died to alot of things
woven burrow
what do you think is the best tank between prot war and BDK for mythic + and raids purely defensively speaking ?
i know prot war tops the bottom of the tank dps, so wondering about the other elements (tankyness, ease of play, if it forgives mistakes, utility...).
@sick sentinel
we often take boss to crossbow because dps are rushing down mages 1st and boss is not able to reach them in time before they die anyways
hot oxide
For mythics, should I upgrade my thunderlord stompers, or craft the wall legendary? I have no plans to raid, but for mythic i was wondering what the best path would be
heavy sail
@woven burrow Prot Warrior > BDK
We’re just easier to heal and more predictable overall
buoyant pasture
Both are decent in mythics imo. I crafted thunderlords first and I've been enjoying the wall and bolster in mythics
heavy sail
BDK doesn’t have to worry at all about uptime though really.
I guess that’s the difference
Warrior has big gaps in mitigation that can be hard if you’re inexperienced
But when it’s used properly we’re easy to heal and take very little damage
In reality I’d say they’re pretty much equal but I favor warriors from the perspective of healing alone. Healing BDKs is a nightmare.
deft sapphire
Bdk is squishy on pull sometimes but it has uses with utility like grip and brez for m+
Healing bdk kinda depends on what healer you play btw
heavy sail
True
sick sentinel
If you have a well geared prot warrior doing basic mitigation in a mythic + key, not standing in crap interrupts, it is like slight breeze or feather tickle you
Like I dunno % but vast majority of incoming damage is often basic melee swings because mobs alive too long...
The bosses call out exactly what they are about to do or how to beat them in voice format like its a kindergarten memory test and the bosses just repeat 3 abilities endlessly... its so easy but we find ways to screw it up
midnight burrow
dusky mica
there's no content in which you would choose the organ over better trinkets
which in most cases are Splintered Heart/Heraldry/Splattered Scale/Sanguine Vintage
fair stump
Im a venthyr arms warrior but looking to switch to Prot. am i shooting myself in the foot staying venthyr?
dusky mica
a little bit in m+, raiding not really
fair stump
Forgot to add, only swtiching to prot for raiding purposes
dusky mica
fine to stay vampire for raid
fair stump
okay and i was looking at warcraft logs and all venthyr prots still use signet
not all, vast majority
dusky mica
probably because all venthyr prots are arms warriors in disguise
fair stump
so should i craft the wall legendary anyways?
dusky mica
yeah
fair stump
and Ilvl>all right for tank gear?
fair stump
okay thank you for the info
sorry, one more thing to ask.. what is the best piece to craft the wall on?
dusky mica
shoulders
fair stump
ok ty, im really done now with the questions xd
fringe marten
bruh~ I thought the tooltips on trinkets accurately reflected the damage in prot spec. =\
If it's a DPS oriented trinket. Does Topgear take that into account? (226 shriekwing trinket)
nova vector
I have a 226 Slimy Consumptive Organ in my vault. Yay or nay? Wearing 220 anima field emitter and 184 Decanter
Other option is a 226 shoulder but I have The Wall on my shoulders currently
So seems like a no brainer but wanna make sure I’m not missing something
fringe marten
Well do you have a decent shoulder when you run Tlord lego?
do you have Tlord lego? everyone assumes we can wear 2 legos at some point...but that's next tier or later.
nova vector
I have 235 TL lego on boots
I’m wearing 213 haste/mastery shoulders
The 226 shoulders are haste/Crit
I know putting The Wall on the cloak is not recommended
mighty valley
I wasn't super impressed with the Organ
Stam alone is rarely a super relevant defensive stat
nova vector
I know as soon as I get it Hakkar will finally drop his damn trinket
And then I’ll end up replacing it anyway
The more I think about it may just go with shoulders and keep running Thunderlord
mighty valley
I think if I was in your situation I'd take the shoulders just in case there was a strong reason to switch back to TL...? Yeah
nova vector
I mostly tank m+ anyways
mighty valley
Or take the trinket just to inflate overall ilvl lol
nova vector
Yea true. 184 to 226 is a nice jump for sure
fringe marten
It's either take shoulders for legendary flexibility; or..take the trinket as something for the toolbelt. That's what trinkets are they're tools to be used for various situations. Yeah if you get hakkar you'll use that most dungeons/etc. But ..what about some time you're doing some content where you need a bunch of self healing? no armor gives that to you; Are you going to get another shot at a decent 220+ shoulder? you raid mythic?
It's definitely a choice you'll have to make for yourself..depends on what you have access to, what keys you do, etc?
What's the % of the damage we get from dps trinkets? (of the effect) is it like 75% or 60%?
the shriekwing tooltip says 12.8k and I actually hit 9.4k with it...that is 75%?
remote hawk
Soo this week is pretty cancer to be a tank i guess 😅 bolstering and necrotic. Know i atleast hated necrotic the last time lol
silver trout
remote hawk
Rip
vestal moat
What cloak enchant are people going withh ? fortified avoid or leech?
sweet summit
Avoidance personally
fringe marten
There any specific reasons why erga?
I honesty kinda' like speed, but I had to relent and use leech 'cause...well it is free healing..speed just allows easier dodging of mechanics and literal faster foot movement in dungeons. (seems minor but when you operate at 10~+% speed all the time, then lose it..you feel it)
and it's not me casting any shade, I'm legit curious why leaning towards avoidance?
mellow patio
Avoidance effective even at full hp :^)
fringe marten
RIght; but there's a tremendous amount of situations where avoidance has no effect.
Unless it's been changed; Am I wrong here? Avoidance is a reduction in AoE damage, but the ability has to be flagged as a non targeted AoE. So it doesn't work on even a lot of "AoE" abilities from mobs.
main jewel
what talents do we take for rbg
can i get to 2100 with warrior tank? im trying all my options here lmao
fringe marten
I would say though, if it works on prideful's AoE that alone might make it have more value than leech or speed IMO.
I actually survived a pull in mists 16 with literally 1 HP. In that scenario the leech on my cloak actually saved me; however any other time it has such a small amount of incoming healing that it's not really making the healers job any easier, or making me live in situations where I otherwise wouldn't. But if I can take a few % of prides damage, so the healer doesn't have to spend another global on me as opposed to someone else, I think that's worth. Because that is a situation where healers can become stressed, and it pops up with guaranteed frequency.
remote hawk
How much does the leech heal for?
fringe marten
That's just my opinion on the matter.
If ALL you have is the cloak enchant.
in a dungeon zonewide I think it's like 1.4% of healing or so?
of my own personal healing, which is not much compared to an actual healers output.
yup 30 leech is 1.43% of damage
What does the 30 avoid give?
nm I have 31 avoidance on my cloak..
actually ON the cloak as a tertiary, and it's 2.21%
So if it's linear and there's no DR scale at that low of an amount, the 30 cloak avoidance would be another 2.1~%?
Is the cloak enchant 30 avoid?
sweet summit
Its 2% avoidance
sweet summit
can i get to 2100 with warrior tank? im trying all my options here lmao
Youd probably be better off playing arms tbh
sick sentinel
Hello hivemind, couple of questions. Does /startattack act as a swingtimer reset? Also does anyone have any issues with taunt on Sire p2/p3, a few times both on my warrior and on my monk I'm taunting, see the taunt graphic above his head, but nothing happens, omen shows no change in threat, and he is stuck to the tank im taunting from?!! Annoying!
sweet summit
Start attack doesnt do anything if youre already attacking something
I have not had any issues with taunt on sire
jagged pier
Hello hivemind, couple of questions. Does /startattack act as a swingtimer reset...
your probably taunting to much if thats happening sounds like taunt DR
sick sentinel
Checked our logs and doesnt seem to be that 😦
jagged pier
its literally the only reason bosses ignore taunt
sick sentinel
The drop down start of p2, we drop, the other tank takes sire, i take remornia, we move into position, theres probably what 15 secs before we have to taunt swap from the moment we drop down, i believe the other tank only taunts on that drop down, taunt dr has a complete reset after 20 secs (from what i believe) leaving 15 secs without taunt. I taunt, nothing. 😄
chilly brook
Pretty sure its longer than 20 seconds and he could still be taunting
Did sire again tonight and haven't had any weird issues like that
It just sounds like taunt DR
sick sentinel
This is from icy veins 'There is a 20-second reset window on the diminishing returns on taunting. That is, if 20 seconds go by without a taunt being cast on a particular enemy, the diminishing returns resets.
For each taunt after the first, the duration of the taunt is two-thirds of the previous duration. The enemy is immune to a sixth taunt.
The first taunt lasts 3 seconds, the second 2 seconds, the third 1.4 seconds, the fourth 0.9 seconds, and the fifth 0.6 seconds.'
So by this logic, for it to be taunt immune, we would have to have taunted 5 times in 20 secs, with what an 8 sec cd on taunt?!
Am i reading that wrong?
Immune only on 6th taunt in a 20 sec window?
chilly brook
No with how that is worded you could have 6 taunts go off in a 50 second period and DR it
As the way its worded there needs to be a 20 second period from the last taunt for it to reset
jagged pier
if there is a taunt within 20secs of the last taunt it will add to the dr and the 20 sec will reset again
chilly brook
^
sick sentinel
ah its accumaltive
or however you spell it
still doesnt explain my situation as from the last taunt end of p1, to the first taunt in p2 theres way more than 20 secs...
chilly brook
It's the only thing that makes sense
sick sentinel
agree with that
chilly brook
He wouldn't be taunt immune otherwise
jagged pier
sounds like taunt DR but cant confirm without logs tbh
sick sentinel
Thanks for expanding on the 20 sec
drifting slate
Is there a cap for shield block time?
chilly brook
sounds like taunt DR but cant confirm without logs tbh
This
sick sentinel
where in the logs would i find out where its taunt immune, for future reference?
chilly brook
Is there a cap for shield block time?
No
drifting slate
So the shield block buff can be up for as many seconds as i want?
sick sentinel
sounds like taunt DR but cant confirm without logs tbh
where would i find this in my logs please?
jagged pier
where would i find this in my logs please?
just have to look at the casts of taunt
chilly brook
So the shield block buff can be up for as many seconds as i want?
You're never going to have more than 12 seconds of shield block right away without bolster
sick sentinel
just have to look at the casts of taunt
i have been, cant see any reference to 'imune'
can you be specific
twilit siren
I have a 207 ilvl helm from tirna with haste mastery. Vault is giving me a 223 ilvl with crit mastery. I have to choose it?
jagged pier
Cast 2 shield blocks
thats still only 12 seconds
chilly brook
You still have to wait for shield block to recharge
drifting slate
But shield block has 2 charges no?
chilly brook
Bolster will give you more shield block time
jagged pier
I have a 207 ilvl helm from tirna with haste mastery. Vault is giving me a 223 i...
depends what else you got but you dont drop ilvl for stats
jagged pier
i have been, cant see any reference to 'imune'
because it wont but youll be able to see how often its cast and see if its been longer or shorter than 20secs
chilly brook
How long you can keep it up is pretty irrelevant anyways @drifting slate
sick sentinel
because it wont but youll be able to see how often its cast and see if its been ...
ok cheers
drifting slate
I was just wondering if i woukd be wasting shield block uptime
By using bolster talent
jagged pier
i mean you shouldnt pump both your charges straight away
twilit siren
depends what else you got but you dont drop ilvl for stats
Other options are 3 trinkets (stone legion, bargast and quantum). I have already the stone legion. A 213 belt from CN I have the same at 200ilvl and boots 223 I have 213 with proper stats
jagged pier
then its helmet
chilly brook
You should be very deliberate about casting shield block
jagged pier
^^
chilly brook
You want the most effective casts you can get
For example
Sludgefist
He just stomped and is going to have a roar after you run back in
ivory valley
Guys, whats the best deffensive trinkets for us?
chilly brook
He'll likely swing just once before the roar
So you might as well skip the block cast
Because you're gonna waste a majority of it
nimble drift
Okay so for mythic shriekwing
chilly brook
Guys, whats the best deffensive trinkets for us?
Scale from DoS
Or Vintage from Denathrius
nimble drift
Its basically just hold the lantern the whole time during the intermission phase and then use healer cds to survive the dot
chilly brook
Nah
You put it down near the pillar you're gonna go to first
Let everyone dip their toes in
And have one person designated to pick it up if it needs to be moved
sweet summit
We just have our bear run around with the lantern in intermission
ivory valley
Scale from DoS
i find scale really good too, but im looking for a 2nd trink, and im thinking maybe i should have a passive one? or the stam one from PF
chilly brook
We just have our bear run around with the lantern in intermission
Ideally he'd just pick it up for movement and if need be pick it up to reapply the dot so people can see if they cant be bothered to dip their own toes in
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Otherwise it's just needless damage
Then again heal parse
ivory valley
to not spend rage on a deffensive at the start of each pull. id love to have 2 trinks to help me out 😄
chilly brook
You should have enough rage at the start of a pull to not be in a position where you're only spending defensively
tired hawk
Guys I need help, I'm prot main spec and I need to choose between shield 226 (instead of mine 200) and a ring 223 (135haste/75vers) instead of a shitty ring 187 crit mastery
heavy sail
SV is pretty solid though, tbh.
tired hawk
fck
mighty valley
you will find another ring
tired hawk
the ring is beautiful
chilly brook
Shield is better
mighty valley
shield is SO important
chilly brook
Literally your most important item
tired hawk
Ok I took it
jagged pier
you dont pass on
tired hawk
lmao last week I passed on 216 shield
chilly brook
tired hawk
I was about to do the same with 226
jagged pier
tired hawk
thank you guys
jagged pier
pass on the only piece with block on it 🤔
tired hawk
but the others pieces I have in vault are sooo big
jagged pier
not bigger than a shield
heavy sail
You passed on two shields that are higher ilvl than any ive seen drop or get from the vault the entire xpac
Or rather almost passed
tired hawk
this is the lucky alt, sorry about that :/
nimble drift
Can you still cheese shriekwing with the no lantern positioning?
chilly brook
to not spend rage on a deffensive at the start of each pull. id love to have 2 ...
At the start of a pull you have: avatar, ravager, demoralizing shout, charge, shield slam, and either spear or Ancient Aftershock. All of those things together are huge rage income.
fallow mortar
At the start of a pull you have: avatar, ravager, demoralizing shout, charge, sh...
Meanwhile the venthyr pwarrs cry
tired hawk
@heavy sail after 10 keys around 15-18, my main had 3 shitty pieces that are not even an upgrade in Vault 🙂
acoustic stratus
regardless what i run, i feel tanking is doing like 500% of the fucking work and getting barely anything out of it
heavy sail
My vault luck has been awful across the board
Also took me a month to get a single weapon upgrade
fallow mortar
Still plenty of rage
oh absolutely, there are just times where I miss extra rage gen
acoustic stratus
i have a heroic scale
chilly brook
My vault was poppin this week
acoustic stratus
thats it
heavy sail
I basically just do my weekly keys and bounce
acoustic stratus
i also have a slimy organ, which is also shit
jagged pier
got a 226 haste ver helm today cant complain but i was trying to get rip of my 203 arms wep tbh
chilly brook
226 chest, 226 haste crit ring, 220 phial, 220 stone Legion
heavy sail
I have a slimy organ too if you catch my drift
acoustic stratus
but i use it on denathrius because im shit at living
heavy sail
acoustic stratus
he just wacks me
heavy sail
SV is a fine substitute for scale at least
jagged pier
had to turn down the DoS ring for the helm 
heavy sail
Not as good, but it’s aight
jagged pier
was only 6 haste more than my other ring
acoustic stratus
i got a 226 sinsmasher, stats are eh but its 226
chilly brook
I was fully expecting a shitty vault
But it was a good one
At some point my vault is gonna be shitty
heavy sail
I think I’m going to end up maining the hpally
chilly brook
But it hasn't been yet
heavy sail
It’s the only class with PvP I enjoy right now and it’s easy to gear
chilly brook
I think I’m going to end up maining the hpally
I'm thinking I'm gonna drop tanking
heavy sail
Lmao
jagged pier
only part of the game i like tbh
acoustic stratus
how am i supposed to live during the mirror phase on denathrius, i always fucking die
heavy sail
I like tanking it’s just hard to multi-spec and have a competent arena build while tanking raids and m+
jagged pier
you turn around
chilly brook
I like tanking
acoustic stratus
sometimes i do and he still smacks me
chilly brook
I dont like tanking when blizz thinks that you need to be a wet paper machet tank that honestly has 0 outplay potential
jagged pier
i mean you need mitigation up as he does shadow damage as well
and if u dont swap on 1 stack u will be taking increased damage
heavy sail
After lockouts I find myself just sitting in oribos because I have literally 0 incentive to play m+ beyond cultivating e-peen points.
so arena is my end game rn
chilly brook
Theres just no carry potential
jagged pier
lvling alts is my end game atm
but i am 222.75 so i dont need gear anymore
will be gold making soon
spent about 2mil this expansion
need it back
chilly brook
I'm also getting annoyed at having to funnel literally all my rage into offense and still be woefully behind in comparison
heavy sail
I wonder when blizzard will realize that tank tuning is a more salient problem than M+ tuning
Probably never
jagged pier
thing is they mess with tanks in anyway you will end up with mop or legion tanks again most likely
and thats only fun for the tanks
heavy sail
True
heavy sail
MoP tanking was so fun lmao
chilly brook
Healers still have a ton to heal
Because unavoidable aoe damage on basically every fight
And legion tank dps wasn't really out of hand
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
jagged pier
yer but you could run 4 dps
jagged pier
even as prot
chilly brook
Yea but that was Legion dungeon design
chilly brook
Legion dungeon design was a lot of avoidable damage
heavy sail
I just want tanks to not suck dick
chilly brook
Which we dont have in SL
Making us suck less won't suddenly remove the need for a healer
And by us I mean tanks in general
heavy sail
Tbh, in shadowlands it could.
Depends on the dungeon ofc
But most damage is avoidable
jagged pier
i would be happy with vengance coming back not gunna lie
chilly brook
PF fucked with no healer
jagged pier
bring back legion bracers
heavy sail
SD you probably are as well
jagged pier
and we will be fine
chilly brook
SoA fucked with no hewler
heavy sail
Tarvold is a douche
heavy sail
Nah point taken I guess there are more than I was thinking
Still, a majority of damage is avoidable throughout a dungeon.
It wouldn’t obsolesce healing
But it makes it less valuable for sure
chilly brook
BFA was the same
blazing condor
Pulsating stoneheart isnt that good right?
jagged pier
its trash
chilly brook
Also healers not having insane amounts of damage to heal all the time doesnt devalue them
It just shifts their responsibility
heavy sail
To doing more DPS?
chilly brook
Yep
heavy sail
But that’s the point innit
chilly brook
ABC
M+ at the end of the day is speed running
Speed running is all about reducing things that make the run take longer
So you either intentionally take less damage in order to speed things up so your healer can do more damage OR you intentionally take more damage in order to do huge pulls
Either way
The healer is still important
heavy sail
I like the damage profile of fights giving more for healers to heal, I more just take issue with the kite or die meta.
Like damage scaling just being way out of proportion with the defensive capabilities of tanks
And that only applies to trash
chilly brook
This comes back to healers having a ton to heal anyways
Prideful
Caster lich boi in ToP
Unavoidable huge amounts of damage
Tanks being paper or being brick shit houses wouldn't take that away
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
heavy sail
Right
And I’m okay with that, if that’s how it worked.
But tanks being paper literally just complicates it further
Because they’re taking so much more priority damage in addition to those other sources
They’re just unrealistic heal checks that force the tank to dance.
Which is always going to happen I guess, at a certain point that’s just to be expected
But kite or die happening in a +13/14 shouldn’t be a thing imo
chilly brook
I just need to find a dps I like
jagged pier
But kite or die happening in a +13/14 shouldn’t be a thing imo
doesnt happen at 13/14
was face tanking 15s last week no problem
heavy sail
You’re also playing Prot with 222 ilvl
jagged pier
and? Nome did them at like 190 and felt fine
heavy sail
I literally can’t survive DoS trash on my BrM at those keys without kiting
jagged pier
BrM
heavy sail
Well it’s valid, right?
heavy sail
Every tank should be able to actually tank lmao
chilly brook
BrM isn't the same as prot
jagged pier
your comparing prot and BrM
heavy sail
No I’m not
You are
My perspective on Prot is different
This broadly applies to all tanks
jagged pier
tanks are better at different things
jagged pier
there is no broad applying
chilly brook
BrM has also always been a tank where you had to kinda dip out every so often in m+
At a certain point you just get huge stagger ticks and have not a whole lot left
It was like that in Legion and in BFA
heavy sail
Less so.
I mean in the sense that the tuning just provided you more time to actively tank
And up to higher keys
chilly brook
BrM also saw probably one of the largest shifts in how they work in a while
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
heavy sail
How so? All that really changed is how you apply a maintenance buff
heavy sail
Shouldn’t that make tanking easier in SL tho
chilly brook
No
Because CB is now much more important
You can hit it on CD
Or you can play around it
Which is a huge skill cap now tbh
jagged pier
if CB didnt have a duration it would be so busted
strong forum
Isnt it also a huge game changer to not have isb as CD reduction for other brews
Cuz you only have purify now
To reduce CDs
heavy sail
Yeah
pastel tundra
Whats better? 226 Helmet with Crit/Mastery/Leech or 223 Helmet with Vers/Haste?
chilly brook
Isnt it also a huge game changer to not have isb as CD reduction for other brews
You reduced the CDs by using abilities not by chugging brews
strong forum
Ah
heavy sail
Right
chilly brook
So no real change on that front
heavy sail
Smashing kegs and shiet
chilly brook
But CB is actually a good skill mechanic
chilly brook
A mechanic that was relatively missing imo from Legion rework onwards
heavy sail
CB is great
Lots of opportunities with it
Having other absorbs to cover CD gaps feels great
heavy sail
It’s pretty much just hold it for when the swap happens or when a big hit comes out
Pretty intuitive really
If that’s what you mean by less involved
chilly brook
Yes as in that it's usually coming back up exactly when youd need it in raid
chilly brook
Or you just hit it because it's not necessary to hold for a specific mechanic
chilly brook
Dpending on fight